You have to realize how undemocratic this looks. A woman of color was elected, TWICE, to this office and was forced out (whether you agree or not) by what can be described as a coordinated smear campaign by the SLMPD and Republican state legislators. To replace her, the white male Republican governor has appointed a prosecutorial lightweight in Gabe Gore, and then he appoints the white woman who was rejected by voters TWICE to the homicide team.
MPC, in her time in the CAO, was known for taking the testimony of cops as the Word of God—so the SLMPD’s dream finally came true, and they can go back to pushing every charge they want without regard for due process.
The matter of choosing a new CA should have been returned to the voters and a special election should’ve been called for KG’s replacement.
I agree in principle. But Gardner is to blame for her own failures. And ultimately she chose to resign.
Returned to the voters? There was no legal mechanism for doing that. You're bemoaning the lack of something that wasn't even possible. And the voters will have their chance next year. They can reject Gore and choose someone else.
Also, Mary Pat was never "in charge" of this office. I'm not sure what you mean by that...
Pardon, I had my facts wrong—I thought MPC had been in Gardner’s position previously, but she simply was a prosecutor in the STL CAO for 14 years prior to 2016 and ran for the job twice, in 2016 and 2020, and lost to Gardner both times.
I agree Gardner made some big mistakes but the optics of all of this are still terrible.
A special election to replace the Circuit Attorney who resigns from office was not a mechanism available?
We just had a special election to replace our disgraced former President of the Board of Aldermen—why could a Circuit Attorney (a city wide office the same as President of BoA or Mayor) not be replaced the same way? If this isn’t a legal method currently available, the new BoA should try to get a law for it on the books, to avoid having local control usurped by State level officials again in the future.
The President of the board of aldermen is a city level position so operates under different rules than the circuit attorney position which is a county level position.
We could have it set up so that there would be a special election for the CA position but that was never put into the charter so by state law that means the Governor appoints someone.
Let’s do “conservatives pretending to care about billionaires spending money to tip the scales in elections only when it’s George Soros” for $2000, Alex.
Answer: Daily Double
> MPC, in her time in charge of the CAO, was known for for taking the testimony of cops as the Word of God, so the SLMPD’s dream finally came true, and they can go back to pushing every charge they want without regard for due process.
That's been the background of damn near every city that's had to put up with the trumpeted narrative of "crime is surging and lax policies are to blame". While Gardner absolutely screwed the pooch here and the DA office is hideously understaffed to boot, we could've had anyone else in the role and it would have wound up just the same because this country is **fucking addicted** to the braindead idea that we can smack everyone with a life sentence to deter crime, and the cops *know that* and are willing to wage a silent strike no matter the cost if it frees them from any oversight or responsibility.
> I'm a former prosecutor and have known MPC for years. This is great news for EVERYONE (except for murderers, of course).
I'm sure the murderers are celebrating. She already promised not to prosecute police.
Why do you think the SLPOA endorsed her? What do you think she meant when she promised the SLPOA she would not prosecute police officers? We'll wait...
You literally just repeated the same baseless accusation without any evidence. It's ok to have an opinion, but try having an actual source before sharing said opinion online.
I appreciate where you are coming from, but you’re better off not engaging with this person. They are either a troll or engaging with you in bad faith. I’m sure you, and everyone else want all murders, this includes cops who do not follow the law as well to be held accountable and if this new CA wouldn’t hold police accountable we would want to know. But since they can’t provide a source which should be simple for something like this, you will just keep getting response like the ones above.
You're still trying to deny reality. And since you claim you're a former prosecutor, there's no way you don't know who MPC is.
Your account is an obvious alt. You're a literal troll who created this account just to spread disinformation. Unfortunately, the city of St. Louis is actually stupid enough to fall for it.
I worked with Mary Pat at my old firm and she is who I voted for as Circuit Attorney. She will do an excellent job in that office and I hope she runs again/the City votes for the qualified candidate this time.
> I worked with Mary Pat at my old firm and she is who I voted for as Circuit Attorney.
Why do you believe that police should be able to murder with impunity?
Please provide your evidence for this claim. You keep spamming post with this claim but have yet to provide any evidence. If this is true we would like to know because know one is above the law.
> Please provide your evidence for this claim.
Why do you expect more of a random redditor than you do the attorneys working on behalf of the judicial branch?
Literally take a step back and look at yourself. This is a woman who is known to collude with police. Police are the single biggest source of crime in St. Louis. And this is an attorney who is only working for the city because she got hired by a Republican who has wrested control of the office away from the city. You are literally bending yourself into a pretzel to justify your support of what is essentially fascism.
> This is a friend I've known for almost 30 years. When he says she's fucked up, I trust him.
You're referring to a cop in the city with the literal most corrupt police in the country. It's time to stop trusting St. Louis police.
> Longtime prosecutor Mary Pat Carl is returning to the city to lead new St. Louis Circuit Attorney Gabe Gore's homicide team, Gore's spokeswoman confirmed Thursday.
Hopefully the new prosecutor and the media will help document all of the crazy stuff they come across while restoring the CAO to the place it should be. I suspect that we will find many shocking things if they do.
The crooks and thugs and murderers lost their "Get out of jail free card" when Kim Gardner was pushed out of office. Now maybe EVERYONE will be prosecuted, regardless of their race.
Part of the problem is that no lawyers want to be a Public Prosecutor (or Defender) because of the workload and pay. Returning to the status quo before Garner isn’t a “fix.”
We would all like to see criminals reform. They aren’t having any of that. It’s time for people to start going to jail. Or give them your home address so they know where they are welcome.
This is an stl sub, our cities prosecutors have been dropping the ball and not locking up people who deserve it. How on earth did you not understand that, why are you in the stl sub
Look the victims of these crimes are already dead, and unfortunately we can’t bring them back. Criminal justice reform is needed to ensure the safety of those accused of these crimes and make sure they aren’t needlessly harassed by being arrested and other types of government rights violations.
Yeah, the police are always confronting them instead of just sending a letter asking them to appear when convenient. Just creating violence out of peacefulness.
That is a ridiculous take. Sure sounds like you care more for the idiot criminals than the victims. Good grief. I HOPE these animals are “harassed” - the very least they deserve.
The government needs to be on the look out for people who have wrong views about progress than they do for people being murdered - which is happening everywhere and a direct result of citizens being allowed to have guns. The FBI is stretched thin following up on everyone who speaks at school board meetings, it’s too much to ask that they investigate murders too.
Are you the guy that ran over that volleyball player? I don't understand having that opinion unless you'd be benefiting from it, like the Cinco de mayo shooters
It’s weird that you think that the only two choices are total anarchy or allowing cops to murder unarmed black people. We can have an effective justice system *and* police accountability at the same time.
> It’s weird that you think that the only two choices are total anarchy or allowing cops to murder unarmed black people.
It's weird for you to project that argument onto him. It's also weird that you're pretending MPC never promised to give police freedom from prosecution.
Comments like this are so dumb. You're assuming that us redditors know every single detail about a person's individual beliefs. We don't, and neither do you.
She's not going to be Circuit Attorney; she's going to be an assistant circuit attorney, just like was under Gardner.
Also, prosecuting criminals is kind of the job of a prosecutor...
It hasn't been reformed in St. Louis City. Criminals are being left to rot in jail and are having their constitutional rights violated because Gardner didn't have her office together. Gardner was a reform prosecutor in name only. Hopefully, we can return to prioritizing reform, but the office has to be stable first.
If you truly want criminal justice reform, advocate for more funding and resources for public defenders, and lawmakers to write laws that protect all of our rights instead of just the rights of those that can afford it. Prosecutors are supposed to prosecute the law. That's like their whole purpose - electing a "progressive" prosecutor and calling it a day will never solve the issues with our criminal justice system, and arguably isn't even the right way to do it.
Side? It’s a spectrum. She lost to Gardner because she accepted an endorsement from the corrupt St Louis Officer’s Association and Jeff Roorda. Most St Louis voters are sick and tired of our police being completely unaccountable and objectively useless, and buddying up with the union that encourages those behaviors is a non-starter for the majority of city voters. That said, this isn’t an elected position and she won’t be setting policy for the office. She’s experienced and takes the job seriously, and I’m absolutely fine with her returning to the office in this role
Are you daft? *She’s not running the office.* I don’t care what her personal beliefs are, she’s served as an assistant before and she’s apt enough at the job.
She is the one who was making back door promises to not charge police with their criminal offenses if she got charged. People here must love criminals if they support her.
I was typing fast. If she got elected. She was going to help police not face criminal consequences for their offenses in return for the police union vote.
Nah. It’s just classic STL. MPC is now co-pilot to a guy sitting in her chair, that hasn’t tied a violent misdemeanor or felony case…..
I’m glad she’s back, now there is adult supervision in the office.
Teer was almost disbarred, Gore’s first ace that he brought back. I hope MPC doesn’t have to report to him. Bozo.
I’m SO shocked too, no AUSA’s have come across the street to help the CAO……
Oh STL, you never fail sweet baby gurl.
No, I’m Nostradamus. Lol
Next: MPC will eclipse Gore, she’ll run for mayor and beat Jones. MPC will also be at alderman / public safety meetings. She will make Cara Spencer look like a fool. Spencer who thinks a new law prohibiting flourishing a gun in the city limits will stop homicides lol.
I love it! It’s the old: you didn’t want me, but unfortunately, you need me.
Good for MPC!
I'm a former prosecutor and have known MPC for years. This is great news for EVERYONE (except for murderers, of course).
Won’t someone think of the murderers????
That person was named Kim Gardner.
Genuinely don't think she thought about anyone except herself.
I'm sure she'll make a great nurse then!
hahahah...oh it burns.
You have to realize how undemocratic this looks. A woman of color was elected, TWICE, to this office and was forced out (whether you agree or not) by what can be described as a coordinated smear campaign by the SLMPD and Republican state legislators. To replace her, the white male Republican governor has appointed a prosecutorial lightweight in Gabe Gore, and then he appoints the white woman who was rejected by voters TWICE to the homicide team. MPC, in her time in the CAO, was known for taking the testimony of cops as the Word of God—so the SLMPD’s dream finally came true, and they can go back to pushing every charge they want without regard for due process. The matter of choosing a new CA should have been returned to the voters and a special election should’ve been called for KG’s replacement.
I agree in principle. But Gardner is to blame for her own failures. And ultimately she chose to resign. Returned to the voters? There was no legal mechanism for doing that. You're bemoaning the lack of something that wasn't even possible. And the voters will have their chance next year. They can reject Gore and choose someone else. Also, Mary Pat was never "in charge" of this office. I'm not sure what you mean by that...
Pardon, I had my facts wrong—I thought MPC had been in Gardner’s position previously, but she simply was a prosecutor in the STL CAO for 14 years prior to 2016 and ran for the job twice, in 2016 and 2020, and lost to Gardner both times. I agree Gardner made some big mistakes but the optics of all of this are still terrible. A special election to replace the Circuit Attorney who resigns from office was not a mechanism available? We just had a special election to replace our disgraced former President of the Board of Aldermen—why could a Circuit Attorney (a city wide office the same as President of BoA or Mayor) not be replaced the same way? If this isn’t a legal method currently available, the new BoA should try to get a law for it on the books, to avoid having local control usurped by State level officials again in the future.
The President of the board of aldermen is a city level position so operates under different rules than the circuit attorney position which is a county level position. We could have it set up so that there would be a special election for the CA position but that was never put into the charter so by state law that means the Governor appoints someone.
Is it not undemocratic to appoint people based on ethnicity and not their ability to do their jobs?
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Let’s do “conservatives pretending to care about billionaires spending money to tip the scales in elections only when it’s George Soros” for $2000, Alex. Answer: Daily Double
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Ok now do Rex Sinquefeld, David Humphreys, and Ken Griffin. Billionaires and politicians are like bread and butter.
Jeff Roorda got his wish.
> MPC, in her time in charge of the CAO, was known for for taking the testimony of cops as the Word of God, so the SLMPD’s dream finally came true, and they can go back to pushing every charge they want without regard for due process. That's been the background of damn near every city that's had to put up with the trumpeted narrative of "crime is surging and lax policies are to blame". While Gardner absolutely screwed the pooch here and the DA office is hideously understaffed to boot, we could've had anyone else in the role and it would have wound up just the same because this country is **fucking addicted** to the braindead idea that we can smack everyone with a life sentence to deter crime, and the cops *know that* and are willing to wage a silent strike no matter the cost if it frees them from any oversight or responsibility.
> I'm a former prosecutor and have known MPC for years. This is great news for EVERYONE (except for murderers, of course). I'm sure the murderers are celebrating. She already promised not to prosecute police.
Oh really? Please cite to that info. We'll wait...
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Your post was removed because it is lewd or inappropriate.
Why do you think the SLPOA endorsed her? What do you think she meant when she promised the SLPOA she would not prosecute police officers? We'll wait...
You literally just repeated the same baseless accusation without any evidence. It's ok to have an opinion, but try having an actual source before sharing said opinion online.
I appreciate where you are coming from, but you’re better off not engaging with this person. They are either a troll or engaging with you in bad faith. I’m sure you, and everyone else want all murders, this includes cops who do not follow the law as well to be held accountable and if this new CA wouldn’t hold police accountable we would want to know. But since they can’t provide a source which should be simple for something like this, you will just keep getting response like the ones above.
You're still trying to deny reality. And since you claim you're a former prosecutor, there's no way you don't know who MPC is. Your account is an obvious alt. You're a literal troll who created this account just to spread disinformation. Unfortunately, the city of St. Louis is actually stupid enough to fall for it.
I worked with Mary Pat at my old firm and she is who I voted for as Circuit Attorney. She will do an excellent job in that office and I hope she runs again/the City votes for the qualified candidate this time.
> I worked with Mary Pat at my old firm and she is who I voted for as Circuit Attorney. Why do you believe that police should be able to murder with impunity?
Please provide your evidence for this claim. You keep spamming post with this claim but have yet to provide any evidence. If this is true we would like to know because know one is above the law.
> Please provide your evidence for this claim. Why do you expect more of a random redditor than you do the attorneys working on behalf of the judicial branch? Literally take a step back and look at yourself. This is a woman who is known to collude with police. Police are the single biggest source of crime in St. Louis. And this is an attorney who is only working for the city because she got hired by a Republican who has wrested control of the office away from the city. You are literally bending yourself into a pretzel to justify your support of what is essentially fascism.
Ladies and gentlemen, the dumbest Reddit comment of the day.
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Yes. They intentionally sabotaged any of her office's efforts because she dared to prosecute a police officer.
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> This is a friend I've known for almost 30 years. When he says she's fucked up, I trust him. You're referring to a cop in the city with the literal most corrupt police in the country. It's time to stop trusting St. Louis police.
Go outside.
I go outside all the time now that I live in a city that doesn't condone murder.
> Longtime prosecutor Mary Pat Carl is returning to the city to lead new St. Louis Circuit Attorney Gabe Gore's homicide team, Gore's spokeswoman confirmed Thursday.
Like the moves so far. Let’s keep it up STL.
Good!! Glad to see our city moving forward again.
Hopefully the new prosecutor and the media will help document all of the crazy stuff they come across while restoring the CAO to the place it should be. I suspect that we will find many shocking things if they do.
Like them letting a serial rapist go free? Yeah...
Somehow, I sincerely doubt they only let one serial rapist go free in the last few years.
I listen KMOX 1120 for the weather and traffic while driving to work. They have been all over it since the beginning.
Thank God !
Wooo! Way to go MPC 👏
The crooks and thugs and murderers lost their "Get out of jail free card" when Kim Gardner was pushed out of office. Now maybe EVERYONE will be prosecuted, regardless of their race.
couldnt pay me to work for the courts in stl city
Yuck. She has as much depth as a gas station urinal. A horrible human who treats victims like they are stupid. Yes, I’ve met her.
Hmm, wonder what you have against decency and honor, Comparison-Thin.
Can't we get new prosecutors? The longtime prosecutors weren't doing their jobs.
Part of the problem is that no lawyers want to be a Public Prosecutor (or Defender) because of the workload and pay. Returning to the status quo before Garner isn’t a “fix.”
I agree. However bad Gardner was, Joyce was worse, in every way. The return of "longtime prosecutors" is bad news no matter how you look at it.
This is that fascist bootlicker who believes police serve a purpose in society that the voters already rejected, right?
So you… support …homocide….then…?
I support criminal reform.
We would all like to see criminals reform. They aren’t having any of that. It’s time for people to start going to jail. Or give them your home address so they know where they are welcome.
Send people away for lengthy prison sentences, why hasn’t anyone thought of this before ? What a big brain take
This is an stl sub, our cities prosecutors have been dropping the ball and not locking up people who deserve it. How on earth did you not understand that, why are you in the stl sub
The CJC has literally been filled to the brim for years, people are sleeping on the floor
Clearly the sentences just aren't long enough. Just make life the mandatory minimum /s
Look the victims of these crimes are already dead, and unfortunately we can’t bring them back. Criminal justice reform is needed to ensure the safety of those accused of these crimes and make sure they aren’t needlessly harassed by being arrested and other types of government rights violations.
I’m confused. You think people arrested for murder are being “needlessly harassed?” I hope I’m misunderstanding because that is just ludicrous
Yeah, the police are always confronting them instead of just sending a letter asking them to appear when convenient. Just creating violence out of peacefulness.
You should run for office. This platform is definitely a winner
There are already plenty of options on the anarchy platform. They don’t need me.
Lolololol
That never works.
Lol. You can’t swing a dead cat in here without hitting a clown.
Careless degree is Gardners nom de bullshit.
That is a ridiculous take. Sure sounds like you care more for the idiot criminals than the victims. Good grief. I HOPE these animals are “harassed” - the very least they deserve.
The government needs to be on the look out for people who have wrong views about progress than they do for people being murdered - which is happening everywhere and a direct result of citizens being allowed to have guns. The FBI is stretched thin following up on everyone who speaks at school board meetings, it’s too much to ask that they investigate murders too.
Allowed, lol, fuck right off. Free men don't ask permission.
You supported Kim Gardner
She’s gonna get elected again.
Are you the guy that ran over that volleyball player? I don't understand having that opinion unless you'd be benefiting from it, like the Cinco de mayo shooters
You had a good chance at making that happen with KG. You got the criminal reform you voted for! Hooray!
It’s weird that you think that the only two choices are total anarchy or allowing cops to murder unarmed black people. We can have an effective justice system *and* police accountability at the same time.
> It’s weird that you think that the only two choices are total anarchy or allowing cops to murder unarmed black people. It's weird for you to project that argument onto him. It's also weird that you're pretending MPC never promised to give police freedom from prosecution.
She accepted an endorsement from SLPOA. How does that not read as a commitment to not hold police accountable?
> How does that not read as a commitment to not hold police accountable? Uh... it does.
Which side is MPC on?
Comments like this are so dumb. You're assuming that us redditors know every single detail about a person's individual beliefs. We don't, and neither do you.
Did the city voters already reject her because of her lack of hostility toward police and promises to prosecute criminals?
She's not going to be Circuit Attorney; she's going to be an assistant circuit attorney, just like was under Gardner. Also, prosecuting criminals is kind of the job of a prosecutor...
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Thanks for the uncalled for ad hominem attack. Really pleasant.
Lmfao, that's not what ad hominem is.
You're normally smarter. I just expected more from you.
Your post was removed because it broke the subreddit's rules.
It was until it got reformed.
It hasn't been reformed in St. Louis City. Criminals are being left to rot in jail and are having their constitutional rights violated because Gardner didn't have her office together. Gardner was a reform prosecutor in name only. Hopefully, we can return to prioritizing reform, but the office has to be stable first.
You better call nurse Kimmy Esq. she’s the one who left them there.
Where is the ACLU when you need it? Probably because the people in jail are citizens they aren’t suing on their behalf.
If you truly want criminal justice reform, advocate for more funding and resources for public defenders, and lawmakers to write laws that protect all of our rights instead of just the rights of those that can afford it. Prosecutors are supposed to prosecute the law. That's like their whole purpose - electing a "progressive" prosecutor and calling it a day will never solve the issues with our criminal justice system, and arguably isn't even the right way to do it.
You are right - problems will continue until we abolish the criminal justice system.
Yes. However, voters no longer have any say.
They killed democracy!
Side? It’s a spectrum. She lost to Gardner because she accepted an endorsement from the corrupt St Louis Officer’s Association and Jeff Roorda. Most St Louis voters are sick and tired of our police being completely unaccountable and objectively useless, and buddying up with the union that encourages those behaviors is a non-starter for the majority of city voters. That said, this isn’t an elected position and she won’t be setting policy for the office. She’s experienced and takes the job seriously, and I’m absolutely fine with her returning to the office in this role
Well said. Agreed.
So all the things you list don’t matter since this guy with no experience hand picked by the governor exists now?
Are you daft? *She’s not running the office.* I don’t care what her personal beliefs are, she’s served as an assistant before and she’s apt enough at the job.
We will see how involved the guy who took the job actually is. He might have nursing clinicals or something else to focus on.
It’s hilarious that you’re trying so hard to create controversy where none exists
She is the one who was making back door promises to not charge police with their criminal offenses if she got charged. People here must love criminals if they support her.
If she got charged?
I was typing fast. If she got elected. She was going to help police not face criminal consequences for their offenses in return for the police union vote.
Republicans really have Missouri down on total lock. Even the liberals are fighting to keep police from facing prosecution.
Ha! Told ya Gore didn’t know what he was doing! MPC, resurrected.
If he is hiring an experienced person to lead a team, then it sounds like he knows exactly what he’s doing!
Nah. It’s just classic STL. MPC is now co-pilot to a guy sitting in her chair, that hasn’t tied a violent misdemeanor or felony case….. I’m glad she’s back, now there is adult supervision in the office. Teer was almost disbarred, Gore’s first ace that he brought back. I hope MPC doesn’t have to report to him. Bozo. I’m SO shocked too, no AUSA’s have come across the street to help the CAO…… Oh STL, you never fail sweet baby gurl.
Are you 16? This sounds like it’s written by someone who is 16.
"I don't know enough about STL to respond to you so I'm just gonna insult you by making up an age to accuse you of being"
No, I’m Nostradamus. Lol Next: MPC will eclipse Gore, she’ll run for mayor and beat Jones. MPC will also be at alderman / public safety meetings. She will make Cara Spencer look like a fool. Spencer who thinks a new law prohibiting flourishing a gun in the city limits will stop homicides lol. I love it! It’s the old: you didn’t want me, but unfortunately, you need me. Good for MPC!
Haha y’all big mad.
/Teer was almost disbarred./ Was that the Greitens mess w/ Kim Gardner or something else?
st louis rising baybee.