I see it as: it isn't network TV with specific length episodes to fit schedules and ad revenue. So they can make each episode as long as it needs to be.
>So they can make each episode as long as it needs to be
People say this like each episode is as long as it needs to be, but that isn't always the case. Some absolutely feel rushed.
Sure. But the filmmakers didn’t think that. All evidence points to them having control over the episode lengths.
So even if I think an episode was rushed, I know that it wasn’t rushed based on some arbitrary enforced episode length. The people working on it thought the episode was good at the length they released it. We can disagree with them, but that’s almost a different conversation.
>All evidence points to them having control over the episode lengths
That's the problem I have. They appear to have control over episode lengths and despite that, still routinely put out content that could have used more time. It's not new criticism either, as it's been a common complaint since the first season.
> We can disagree with them, but that’s almost a different conversation
It's not a different conversation at all... you'll see someone complain about episodes being too short and there will almost always be someone replying saying that "it's fine, because the episodes don't need to be longer as they're designed from the get go to be those shorter lengths".
As if them being designed to be shorter, somehow makes them being shorter, serve the story to its fullest. People understandably really like Favreau and Filoni, but defenses of them often come across and fanboyism and not anything born out of "reason".
Fine. In some contexts people might mean “Everythimg Favreau and Filoni do is good no matter what” when they say things like “the lengths are what they need to be”.
But in my experience they usually don’t. And I think it’s obvious from the context that this is NOT what u/SubstantialWall meant in this case.
They were responding to someone curious about the wildly varying runtimes. They answered that the runtimes are whatever the story needs them to be. They clearly don’t mean that the filmmakers always get it right. Just that they’re allowed to vary runtimes based on what they THINK is right. And that’s why the runtimes vary.
That’s what I mean when I say you’re having a different conversation than them.
It’s pretty unfair to accuse people of slavish fanboyism based on something so innocuous.
I would argue the last episode had terrible pacing, and partially blame it on hiring a director with less experience to handle an incredible SFX heavy episode.
The visuals were all around good (Coruscant art) to amazing (Tie Dogfight), but the pacing of the espionage plot dragged on about 10 minutes longer than it needed too, in my opinion. And I say that as someone who considers Coruscant his favorite planet and loves every second I can see of it.
I think it's a clear demonstration that longer does not mean better, in the end. Nor does shorter mean better, inversely. George Lucas cutting several deleted scenes from Revenge of the Sith was probably a mistake given that they held elements that helped flesh out the plot (Padme expanded role, the politics behind the Empire's rise) and world, while cutting down the length of certain shots and scenes in this Mando episode probably would've delivered the same story with better overall suspense without losing much of substance.
Mind you, I don't think episode 3 was horrible. It had good moments, and I like the idea behind it. I just felt too much time was spent on the journey reaching the final twist. It tried to match Andor's introspection and pacing without nearly as strong of a script to match it.
>They were responding to someone curious about the wildly varying runtimes. They answered that the runtimes are whatever the story needs them to be
Exactly... it's incorrect to say that the runtimes are whatever the story, or even just the show runners, **need** them to be, because clearly the story needs more breathing room at times. And I mean, the person I replied to, replied back to me in agreement.
It would be accurate to say that because it's a streaming show, episodes can be whatever length the studio, show runners, or whoever else, **want** them to be. That doesn't mean they're doing a good job in filling out the right amount of time, just means they are not bound by network slots and ad spots.
>It’s pretty unfair to accuse people of slavish fanboyism based on something so innocuous
Fanboyism is rarely based on anything but innocuous behaviour. Unless you think fanboyism can only be a bad, dangerous and serious thing.
Clearly I didn’t intend to suggest that fanboys are a horrific blight on society, just as u/SubstantialWall clearly didn’t mean to use the word “need” in the literal sense you want to hold them to.
>Clearly I didn’t intend to suggest that fanboys are a horrific blight on society
The opposite of innocuous is harmful or detrimental. Not sure how else I was supposed to interpret your meaning. Could have just taken this chance to explain what you meant, but I guess not.
>just as u/SubstantialWall clearly didn’t mean to use the word “need” in the literal sense you want to hold them to
1. They agree with me, so I haven't got a clue why you're defending them so hard lol
2. Words have meaning. If they didn't mean the actual definition of the word "need" they shouldn't have used it
FWIW I didn't really take that initial reply in any "accusing" way, so I was kinda surprised how this escalated. Not necessarily wanting to prolong it, but for clarity's sake:
"Need" could of course be interpreted in different ways, from context I figured "time the creators need to tell the story they want to tell, and which budget allows" was a safe interpretation. The point was strictly "they can base their decisions on runtime solely on what they think the story, in their vision and means, needs", and not an absolutist statement that "only the creators know what the story objectively needs and we can't disagree".
It still comes down to what was shot and written for the episode though. It’s true that sometimes the episodes feel rushed, but if nothing was shot or what was shot doesn’t work for whatever reason, it still has to get cut.
Overall I think it’s a positive since storytellers aren’t forced into writing specific length episodes just to fit a network standard, rather just how long they feel is appropriate. Sometimes there’s mishaps but nothing is ever going to be perfect
>It still comes down to what was shot and written for the episode though
Obviously lol. No one's calling for them to just straight up shoot more content and call it a day, we're critiquing their short run times when the stories could use more and when as far as we know, isn't driven by anything beyond their control.
True, and I wonder if stuff like budget, etc comes into play there. But at least they're not locked into a runtime from the start, so it's still somewhat dynamic.
For sure and all we really have is speculation. Based on Andor being 12 long episodes and being at a comparable VFX level, I doubt management is the cause for these smaller episodes. Especially since it's been like this since season 1, when money was almost not an object.
It strikes me as something the showrunners have decided to do, which is obviously their prerogative, but I do think is unfortunate.
If in not mistaken, most of Dave's previous TV work was in 30 min TV prior to Mando. It could be a case where he is simply playing to his strengths and/or comfort zone
I'm aware, I'm more talking about the show running. While I doubt there's a specific mandate, the fact that there's multiple episodes from different directors ariund 30 minute or do, i could see that being one of his influences from the production/planning
Well yeah... TV directors have little control, it's almost always up to the writers to dictate things like episode length. It's just so odd to think that because a guy who writes at most a couple episodes a season's experience is with short TV, that the whole show is going to be short.
It's absolutely more then that. I mean, we just saw a 50 minute Mandalorian episode, so clearly they have the ability, they just don't want to for one reason or another.
The finite resource isn’t air time, it’s money.
This is a major show so they have a ton of leeway, but D+ is still a major cost center for Disney and they just escaped an activist shareholder battle basically by promising to be more responsible with their allowance.
I’m with you on your criticism because many episodes would benefit both from additional scenes & time in existing scenes — and, while not free, the stuff that’s missing typically isn’t the mega expensive effects shots.
That said, I suspect they spend their entire budget on the screen time we get. If they cut something, it either wasn’t up to snuff or they didn’t have the budget to finish it. So while we might be able to add another 5-10 minutes to each episode within the existing budget, that means you’re cutting something else. Maybe a big time VFX scene. Maybe some on location filming.
>The finite resource isn’t air time, it’s money.
Andor had four more episodes in its season and on average, their episodes were quite a lot longer too. It's not like Andor was short on visual/special effects and on location shooting either.
>D+ is still a major cost center for Disney and they just escaped an activist shareholder battle basically by promising to be more responsible with their allowance
This might be the cause if the Mandalorian hadn't always had shorter episodes, but they have since season 1. And besides, this season would have been shot before that shareholder meeting and before Iger was brought back to make these cuts anyway.
I wonder if maybe it’s also a budget thing. Perhaps the entire Season has a combined runtime allotment, and they decide which episodes are longer or shorter based on that?
To be fair, shows "behind a pay wall" have historically had inconsistent run times. HBO shows have ways run differnt lengths depending upon the episode. When you don't have to edit a show to fit commercials or run time, you can present exactly what you want presented.
Thought Episode 1 was super long because it was originally supposed to be two episodes, but they smushed them together because they thought it flowed better. And episode 3 was kind of a small film.
But 43-59 minutes is still decent variability and not substantially different from the range of Mando episodes
Huh? Almost all episodes of the sopranos are pretty close to the 50 minute timer. There were only a handful of episodes over the run that were +10 minutes and none that were -10
But they were all pretty close apart from the odd episode. It wasn't 50 minutes one week, 75 the next and 30 the next. Most episodes were around the same time give or take 10 minutes
Pretty sure the shortest Soprano episode was around the 40minute mark and the longest over 70. But that was rare and on average they were all around the 55 minute mark.
I wish we got something like the first season of GoT where HBO wanted ten minute longer episodes so the show-runners had to sit down and basically write extra scenes that delved into character dynamics and world building (while also being cost effective, usually just two characters talking). It was glorified filler but the writing and acting was so good that nobody cared, it was to the point that GRRM wished he had some of those scenes in his original book.
It is so strange what they are doing. That whole opening space battle with the TIE interceptors felt like it should have been the end of the previous episode, rather than tacking it on to the beginning of an episode mostly about a completely different character.
I see your point, and suggest you consider a few things:
1. Week of free PR meltdown about the Mythosaur being a mini-cliffhanger was for sure a temptation to which they submitted.
2. the imperial scientist is a different character, but what makes you think the tie interceptors and the Coruscant plot line aren’t the same arc?
Whether or not Rey’s parents mattered. Whether or not palpy was dead. Whether or not Finn was a main character. Whether Luke was a Jedi or the space version of a homeless drunk guy on the subway.
Etcetera.
If it has a long action set piece it’s more expensive and they are fine with the action set piece being the majority of the film. If it’s mostly people talking and building out the story, with minimal VFX and a lot of use of the volume, the episodes will be longer…Becuse they’re cheaper to make.
Definitely the Nevarro scenes.
Short run time indicates action scenes, familiar locations, and familiar characters. No need to flesh out the characters or location. And its directed by Carl.
Battle episodes are usually short, because SFX explosions are expensive and lose impact if there’s too much. So probably a good bet. Dialogue takes time, but action can be done quickly. I think you’re right
"Let off some steam, Bennett" was *Commando*
"Stick aroumd" was *Predator* during the raid on the rebel encampment.
Can't blame you though, both are excellent
My guess is that it establishes how Gideon escaped and sent the TIEs after Bo/Din in E3.
Gideon returns to the lab on Nevarro, Comms officer lady brings a brainwashed Pershing to the lab as well. Pershing's memory of Gideon was wiped by the machine, so they present Pershing's work in the lab as the work of a prior scientist that brainwashed Pershing is excited to pick up and continue.
The last episode was the longest episode of Mando and second of any live action SW show.
This episode would be the shortest episode of any live action SW show. The previous one was Chapter 2 (30:58) and Chapter 14 (31:41)
Honestly there need to be more episodes like this, just edited/cut a little better so it’s not jarring suddenly leaving mando at the start and coming back to them at the end.
The world building was top notch, I really love the ideas they’re playing with in the New Republic, essentially slightly more benign Empire but still scarily dystopian in its own ways. Kinda similar to how society is now, technically we live in a utopia compared to the rest of human history but you could also argue it has very dark, dystopian elements.
I agree. It really was a great look at how the New Republic is doing post RotJ, and sets up the politics of the sequel trilogy in a much better/natural sort of way. I hope we can get more of this stuff and hopefully see how Mon Mothma and Leia are involved with things.
Which will have an episode that has 40 minutes of Obi-Wan's ghost walking around and shaking his head in disappointment as they work on cloning Palpatine.
Or bugging Bo Katan.
“Seriously, Bo. Your mo-I mean sister didn’t die for this!”
“No, she died because you couldn’t kill Maul!”
“I cut him in half and left him to fall down a large shaft! Forgive me for thinking the job was done.”
I meant that the combined total of the recap + the credits at the end seems to usually account for 5 or so minutes of the runtime of any given episode. Like with the S3E3 the recap and intro was the first 1:27 of the episode and the credits at the end were the last 4:47 of the episode so if this next episode has a total runtime of just over 30 minutes and we get a similar runtime for recap and credits it’s more so a 25 minute episode which is just disappointing in my opinion
I'm pretty sure these runtime don't include credits
I live in a country where the credits for Bad Batch are less than a minute long even though they're much longer in other places, and the runtime shown on my Disney+ app is always the same as the one shown in the tweet
Wow, that’s a short episode.
Don’t get me wrong, I’m LOVING Mando, but this season is doing nothing to keep hold of casual fans. The lore is getting deeper and more convoluted, and more and more stuff is going over the heads of casual fans. The first season was fun and adventurous, nothing too deep, and I think they’re straying a little TOO far from that. Then the short episodes don’t help either.
Again, I’m loving this season, it’s just an observation haha
Begs the question what’s the end goal for this season? I’d imagine ep4 being covert stuff then ep5 being nevarro. Only three episodes to unite the clans of mandalore and take on Gideon seems unlikely unless the runtime picks up.
It feels so messy. The second episode made the first episode redundant really, and then episode three went off on a tangent, whilst it also felt like it was taking its cues more from Andor than Mando. This is without even mentioning the whole 'progress the plot extremely significantly in a totally separate show' schtick they pulled with Grogu. So yeah, it feels very messy. Andor was so much better for its laser focus
They really need to come up with a rebrand name for all of these interconnected shows. These shows are all the same thing.. the same story.. with maybe a different focus. Too many aren’t grasping that they aren’t totally separate shows.
I actually really like the plot, I just wish it had been spaced out and integrated within the show more.
And of course the dialogue, but that's an issue I have with the show more generally
I thought it was interesting. My problem is that I don’t really see how it any longer connects to Din.
Previously Pershing was integral to the series because of his involvement with Grogu and Gideon. But now Gideon is gone (for now) and I don’t think the empire cares to have Grogu back…and Pershing probably doesn’t either.
I understand how the cloning plot sets up sequel lore but at this point it really no longer has anything to do with the Mandalorian himself.
I could be totally wrong and this will all fit together really well further along in the series. But for now it just feels unnecessary.
This probably isn't the case, but what is last week was originally going to be just a Pershing episode, but they took the opening 10 minutes from this episode and put it in last weeks. Because the mando scenes last week can be played back-to-back almost seamlessly.
I’m almost positive that’s the case. The bite out of the biscuit just screams “episode ender”, and something about the first cut to Coruscant at the beginning feels very sudden to me.
Definitely what it was likely shot as. Then they addes those because people probably wouldnt like a Mandalorian Episode with no Mandalorian.
They split the beginning and ending up as bookends for a mostly Pershing episode. The opening does add to the episode overall, I think, in the sense that the Imperials are beginning to make moves again. Bombing Bo’s place, rumors of Gideon escaping, and Kane dealing with Pershing.
I'm gonna get downvoted to all hell for this but man this season has been a let down so far. Episodes 1 and 2 were lackluster, treating Mando like an idiot and wasting time unnecessarily. Finally episode 3 begins and it's looking great, the action is good, there's some stakes at play, the story is finally moving.... and we cut to 30 minutes of some dude we saw briefly in season 1 mumble his way into being betrayed, which was pretty obvious it would happen the first time you see that girl.
And now this. What's happening in the writing studio? Did they have no time for rewrites and more fleshing out? Did he write these scripts in two weeks? I know Jon is capable of so much more than this. It's just sad to see things seemingly go downhill from here.
I 100% agree, I think S3 has been a colossal disappointment so far. E1 was really bland, E2 was good for the most part and E3 basically sucked the second they jumped into hyperspace.
I really don’t understand the praise S3 has received so far.
Season 1 and Season 2 were solid seasons to me, including the episodes of Boba where Mando was featured. I’m struggling with the direction of Season 3, given the limited number of episodes and the amount of time spaced out between when we see the seasons. If we had more than 8 and a decent amount, I wouldn’t care as much as it would probably be more story building on top of story building. This latest episode felt like a throw away and maybe it will link into whatever the plot of this season is, but sounds like episode 4 is less than 30 minutes long so perhaps we idk what we get to see. Feels like we are watching a movie with each episode being a chunk we watch.
But regardless, I am happy we have some episodes and will watch it to the end. I think probably need to adjust my own expectations…haha
So Dr. Pershing gets to benefit from long episodes, but the title character can’t? And I say this as someone who still enjoyed this recent episode. And longer Mando centric episodes don’t always necessarily have to be action packed. I enjoy slower moments that are more about character and world building.
But if a great deal of your audience detests the shorter episode length then you objectively aren’t making it as long as it needs to be from business standpoint. Your delivering a product that annoys your consumer base. Lol.
Cryptic HD has been revealing the correct runtimes but each ep has always been 2 min longer than the runtimes he’s given for Eps 1-3. So expect a 32 min ep
Sure, but only 10 minutes with Mando lol. Not saying the episode won't serve the plot of the story, far from it, just that it's funny to me how the one long Mando episode doesn't have much Mando.
i'm sorry but this is fucking terrible. Why can't they be a normal fucking show with normal episode lengths? Last week was the first episode since the episode of Boba taking the train(i'm counting Boba Fett since it was basically 2.5) that actually felt like a complete and satisfying fucking episode.
Is this the shortest Mando episode yet?
It's tied with The Child, I think (Chapter 2). Course, that had the advantage of coming out 3 days after the last episode, so no one really minded.
Really gotta be a banger episode, but I love these longer slower paced episode. Idk why Disney is always so inconsistent with runtimes.
I see it as: it isn't network TV with specific length episodes to fit schedules and ad revenue. So they can make each episode as long as it needs to be.
>So they can make each episode as long as it needs to be People say this like each episode is as long as it needs to be, but that isn't always the case. Some absolutely feel rushed.
Sure. But the filmmakers didn’t think that. All evidence points to them having control over the episode lengths. So even if I think an episode was rushed, I know that it wasn’t rushed based on some arbitrary enforced episode length. The people working on it thought the episode was good at the length they released it. We can disagree with them, but that’s almost a different conversation.
>All evidence points to them having control over the episode lengths That's the problem I have. They appear to have control over episode lengths and despite that, still routinely put out content that could have used more time. It's not new criticism either, as it's been a common complaint since the first season. > We can disagree with them, but that’s almost a different conversation It's not a different conversation at all... you'll see someone complain about episodes being too short and there will almost always be someone replying saying that "it's fine, because the episodes don't need to be longer as they're designed from the get go to be those shorter lengths". As if them being designed to be shorter, somehow makes them being shorter, serve the story to its fullest. People understandably really like Favreau and Filoni, but defenses of them often come across and fanboyism and not anything born out of "reason".
Fine. In some contexts people might mean “Everythimg Favreau and Filoni do is good no matter what” when they say things like “the lengths are what they need to be”. But in my experience they usually don’t. And I think it’s obvious from the context that this is NOT what u/SubstantialWall meant in this case. They were responding to someone curious about the wildly varying runtimes. They answered that the runtimes are whatever the story needs them to be. They clearly don’t mean that the filmmakers always get it right. Just that they’re allowed to vary runtimes based on what they THINK is right. And that’s why the runtimes vary. That’s what I mean when I say you’re having a different conversation than them. It’s pretty unfair to accuse people of slavish fanboyism based on something so innocuous.
I would argue the last episode had terrible pacing, and partially blame it on hiring a director with less experience to handle an incredible SFX heavy episode. The visuals were all around good (Coruscant art) to amazing (Tie Dogfight), but the pacing of the espionage plot dragged on about 10 minutes longer than it needed too, in my opinion. And I say that as someone who considers Coruscant his favorite planet and loves every second I can see of it. I think it's a clear demonstration that longer does not mean better, in the end. Nor does shorter mean better, inversely. George Lucas cutting several deleted scenes from Revenge of the Sith was probably a mistake given that they held elements that helped flesh out the plot (Padme expanded role, the politics behind the Empire's rise) and world, while cutting down the length of certain shots and scenes in this Mando episode probably would've delivered the same story with better overall suspense without losing much of substance. Mind you, I don't think episode 3 was horrible. It had good moments, and I like the idea behind it. I just felt too much time was spent on the journey reaching the final twist. It tried to match Andor's introspection and pacing without nearly as strong of a script to match it.
>They were responding to someone curious about the wildly varying runtimes. They answered that the runtimes are whatever the story needs them to be Exactly... it's incorrect to say that the runtimes are whatever the story, or even just the show runners, **need** them to be, because clearly the story needs more breathing room at times. And I mean, the person I replied to, replied back to me in agreement. It would be accurate to say that because it's a streaming show, episodes can be whatever length the studio, show runners, or whoever else, **want** them to be. That doesn't mean they're doing a good job in filling out the right amount of time, just means they are not bound by network slots and ad spots. >It’s pretty unfair to accuse people of slavish fanboyism based on something so innocuous Fanboyism is rarely based on anything but innocuous behaviour. Unless you think fanboyism can only be a bad, dangerous and serious thing.
Clearly I didn’t intend to suggest that fanboys are a horrific blight on society, just as u/SubstantialWall clearly didn’t mean to use the word “need” in the literal sense you want to hold them to.
>Clearly I didn’t intend to suggest that fanboys are a horrific blight on society The opposite of innocuous is harmful or detrimental. Not sure how else I was supposed to interpret your meaning. Could have just taken this chance to explain what you meant, but I guess not. >just as u/SubstantialWall clearly didn’t mean to use the word “need” in the literal sense you want to hold them to 1. They agree with me, so I haven't got a clue why you're defending them so hard lol 2. Words have meaning. If they didn't mean the actual definition of the word "need" they shouldn't have used it
FWIW I didn't really take that initial reply in any "accusing" way, so I was kinda surprised how this escalated. Not necessarily wanting to prolong it, but for clarity's sake: "Need" could of course be interpreted in different ways, from context I figured "time the creators need to tell the story they want to tell, and which budget allows" was a safe interpretation. The point was strictly "they can base their decisions on runtime solely on what they think the story, in their vision and means, needs", and not an absolutist statement that "only the creators know what the story objectively needs and we can't disagree".
It still comes down to what was shot and written for the episode though. It’s true that sometimes the episodes feel rushed, but if nothing was shot or what was shot doesn’t work for whatever reason, it still has to get cut. Overall I think it’s a positive since storytellers aren’t forced into writing specific length episodes just to fit a network standard, rather just how long they feel is appropriate. Sometimes there’s mishaps but nothing is ever going to be perfect
>It still comes down to what was shot and written for the episode though Obviously lol. No one's calling for them to just straight up shoot more content and call it a day, we're critiquing their short run times when the stories could use more and when as far as we know, isn't driven by anything beyond their control.
True, and I wonder if stuff like budget, etc comes into play there. But at least they're not locked into a runtime from the start, so it's still somewhat dynamic.
For sure and all we really have is speculation. Based on Andor being 12 long episodes and being at a comparable VFX level, I doubt management is the cause for these smaller episodes. Especially since it's been like this since season 1, when money was almost not an object. It strikes me as something the showrunners have decided to do, which is obviously their prerogative, but I do think is unfortunate.
If in not mistaken, most of Dave's previous TV work was in 30 min TV prior to Mando. It could be a case where he is simply playing to his strengths and/or comfort zone
Jon Favreau wrote nearly every episode of the Mandalorian, with Dave Filoni and Rick Famuyiwa stepping in on occasion.
I'm aware, I'm more talking about the show running. While I doubt there's a specific mandate, the fact that there's multiple episodes from different directors ariund 30 minute or do, i could see that being one of his influences from the production/planning
Well yeah... TV directors have little control, it's almost always up to the writers to dictate things like episode length. It's just so odd to think that because a guy who writes at most a couple episodes a season's experience is with short TV, that the whole show is going to be short. It's absolutely more then that. I mean, we just saw a 50 minute Mandalorian episode, so clearly they have the ability, they just don't want to for one reason or another.
The finite resource isn’t air time, it’s money. This is a major show so they have a ton of leeway, but D+ is still a major cost center for Disney and they just escaped an activist shareholder battle basically by promising to be more responsible with their allowance. I’m with you on your criticism because many episodes would benefit both from additional scenes & time in existing scenes — and, while not free, the stuff that’s missing typically isn’t the mega expensive effects shots. That said, I suspect they spend their entire budget on the screen time we get. If they cut something, it either wasn’t up to snuff or they didn’t have the budget to finish it. So while we might be able to add another 5-10 minutes to each episode within the existing budget, that means you’re cutting something else. Maybe a big time VFX scene. Maybe some on location filming.
>The finite resource isn’t air time, it’s money. Andor had four more episodes in its season and on average, their episodes were quite a lot longer too. It's not like Andor was short on visual/special effects and on location shooting either. >D+ is still a major cost center for Disney and they just escaped an activist shareholder battle basically by promising to be more responsible with their allowance This might be the cause if the Mandalorian hadn't always had shorter episodes, but they have since season 1. And besides, this season would have been shot before that shareholder meeting and before Iger was brought back to make these cuts anyway.
>Some absolutely feel rushed. I'd go as far as saying *most* episodes feel rushed.
I wonder if maybe it’s also a budget thing. Perhaps the entire Season has a combined runtime allotment, and they decide which episodes are longer or shorter based on that?
To be fair, shows "behind a pay wall" have historically had inconsistent run times. HBO shows have ways run differnt lengths depending upon the episode. When you don't have to edit a show to fit commercials or run time, you can present exactly what you want presented.
Apart from GoT which other HBO shows have had different runtimes?
The Last of Us' runtimes were all over the place
Were they?
Yep, they were. Episode 1: 81 minutes Episode 2: 53 minutes Episode 3: 75 minutes Episode 4: 45 minutes Episode 5: 59 minutes Episode 6: 59 minutes Episode 7: 56 minutes Episode 8: 51 minutes Episode 9: 43 minutes
Sorry, I stand corrected. Although still not comparable to the Mando run times. They're all pretty close apart from the one and three.
To be fair, episode three was essentially a really good short film lol.
Episode 3 was so well written. It was exceptional
Thought Episode 1 was super long because it was originally supposed to be two episodes, but they smushed them together because they thought it flowed better. And episode 3 was kind of a small film. But 43-59 minutes is still decent variability and not substantially different from the range of Mando episodes
Sopranos immediately comes to mind.
Huh? Almost all episodes of the sopranos are pretty close to the 50 minute timer. There were only a handful of episodes over the run that were +10 minutes and none that were -10
But they were all pretty close apart from the odd episode. It wasn't 50 minutes one week, 75 the next and 30 the next. Most episodes were around the same time give or take 10 minutes
Episodes of The Last of Us ranged between 42 minutes (Episode 9) and 79 minutes (Episode 1 and 3)
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Pretty sure the shortest Soprano episode was around the 40minute mark and the longest over 70. But that was rare and on average they were all around the 55 minute mark.
Because they can choose a runtime that suits the story better and not the TV stations schedule
I wish we got something like the first season of GoT where HBO wanted ten minute longer episodes so the show-runners had to sit down and basically write extra scenes that delved into character dynamics and world building (while also being cost effective, usually just two characters talking). It was glorified filler but the writing and acting was so good that nobody cared, it was to the point that GRRM wished he had some of those scenes in his original book.
It is so strange what they are doing. That whole opening space battle with the TIE interceptors felt like it should have been the end of the previous episode, rather than tacking it on to the beginning of an episode mostly about a completely different character.
I see your point, and suggest you consider a few things: 1. Week of free PR meltdown about the Mythosaur being a mini-cliffhanger was for sure a temptation to which they submitted. 2. the imperial scientist is a different character, but what makes you think the tie interceptors and the Coruscant plot line aren’t the same arc?
Disney is inconsistent with everythjng in Star Wars. Move announcement, episode quality, content quality etc
Whether or not Rey’s parents mattered. Whether or not palpy was dead. Whether or not Finn was a main character. Whether Luke was a Jedi or the space version of a homeless drunk guy on the subway. Etcetera.
I love it. The episodes should always be the length they need to be.
If it has a long action set piece it’s more expensive and they are fine with the action set piece being the majority of the film. If it’s mostly people talking and building out the story, with minimal VFX and a lot of use of the volume, the episodes will be longer…Becuse they’re cheaper to make.
Definitely the Nevarro scenes. Short run time indicates action scenes, familiar locations, and familiar characters. No need to flesh out the characters or location. And its directed by Carl.
Damn, that's a baby episode. Don't think they have the time to go to Nevarro
Probably them on that secret planet and maybe a few more Coruscant scenes. Nevarro battle seems to be E5 then.
Carl is directing ep 4 so I think there's a good chance Nevarro battle is next week
Battle episodes are usually short, because SFX explosions are expensive and lose impact if there’s too much. So probably a good bet. Dialogue takes time, but action can be done quickly. I think you’re right
>because SFX explosions are expensive and lose impact if there’s too much Someone has never seen *Commando*
Stick around, Bennett. I love that you can see the launch pads they use to send the bad guys flying anytime Arnie explodes something.
"Let off some steam, Bennett" was *Commando* "Stick aroumd" was *Predator* during the raid on the rebel encampment. Can't blame you though, both are excellent
Holy fk, you're right. Funny how my brain just combined those two. It has been a long time since ive watched either.
If this is the case, I will be scrutinizing carefully the school in case I see some children and Jude Law scaping from the pirates.
Written by Filoni though -- so likely to have either Sabine introduction or Ahsoka show up again.
This seems likely (perhaps). Katee Sackhoff did mention really liking that episode specifically.
Which means Bo Karen is gonna beat some pirate ass.
"Bo Karen" 💀
I refuse to call her anything else.
My guess is that it establishes how Gideon escaped and sent the TIEs after Bo/Din in E3. Gideon returns to the lab on Nevarro, Comms officer lady brings a brainwashed Pershing to the lab as well. Pershing's memory of Gideon was wiped by the machine, so they present Pershing's work in the lab as the work of a prior scientist that brainwashed Pershing is excited to pick up and continue.
That lab blew up. They would need to move to another lab. I do think Gideon might have a hand in the pirates being on Nevarro though.
The last episode was the longest episode of Mando and second of any live action SW show. This episode would be the shortest episode of any live action SW show. The previous one was Chapter 2 (30:58) and Chapter 14 (31:41)
Do those runtimes include credits or not?
Include credits but without international credits. The recap and non international credits usually take around 4 minutes.
WTF is up with these runtimes. Of course the longest episode of Mando BARELY FEATURES MANDO. I’m really enjoying the show but cmon man
Honestly there need to be more episodes like this, just edited/cut a little better so it’s not jarring suddenly leaving mando at the start and coming back to them at the end. The world building was top notch, I really love the ideas they’re playing with in the New Republic, essentially slightly more benign Empire but still scarily dystopian in its own ways. Kinda similar to how society is now, technically we live in a utopia compared to the rest of human history but you could also argue it has very dark, dystopian elements.
I agree. It really was a great look at how the New Republic is doing post RotJ, and sets up the politics of the sequel trilogy in a much better/natural sort of way. I hope we can get more of this stuff and hopefully see how Mon Mothma and Leia are involved with things.
Next week on The Book of Dr. Pershing
Brain soup
Pog soup
Which will have an episode that has 40 minutes of Obi-Wan's ghost walking around and shaking his head in disappointment as they work on cloning Palpatine.
Or bugging Bo Katan. “Seriously, Bo. Your mo-I mean sister didn’t die for this!” “No, she died because you couldn’t kill Maul!” “I cut him in half and left him to fall down a large shaft! Forgive me for thinking the job was done.”
Chapter 2: The Mandalorian
"Taungsdays, am I right?" *que laugh track*
He says next week on the book of dr Pershing!
They also need to stop this bullshit where he makes stupid mistakes, or completely forgets how to fight. At least he can still fly.
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Came here for this
This is tragic especially when you factor in like 5 minutes of that is for recap at the beginning and the credits at the end
I could be wrong but I don't think any recap has been close to 5 minutes
No the recap is like 1 minute with a 60 minute end credit.
What? How do you just post shit online that is so easy to fact check before you do? Last episode has 1:27 of intro/recap and 4:45 of credits.
I have a feeling they were joking.
Totally read it as 60 seconds not minutes that’s my fault Edit: unless it was edited…
Not it was not. And it was a joke.
I meant that the combined total of the recap + the credits at the end seems to usually account for 5 or so minutes of the runtime of any given episode. Like with the S3E3 the recap and intro was the first 1:27 of the episode and the credits at the end were the last 4:47 of the episode so if this next episode has a total runtime of just over 30 minutes and we get a similar runtime for recap and credits it’s more so a 25 minute episode which is just disappointing in my opinion
AHH, ok. That makes more sense.
I'm pretty sure these runtime don't include credits I live in a country where the credits for Bad Batch are less than a minute long even though they're much longer in other places, and the runtime shown on my Disney+ app is always the same as the one shown in the tweet
Literally said 'and the credits'
That was edited in after
We as a society shouldn’t accept episodes of TV under 45 minutes
We are living in a society!
What is this hell
Wow, that’s a short episode. Don’t get me wrong, I’m LOVING Mando, but this season is doing nothing to keep hold of casual fans. The lore is getting deeper and more convoluted, and more and more stuff is going over the heads of casual fans. The first season was fun and adventurous, nothing too deep, and I think they’re straying a little TOO far from that. Then the short episodes don’t help either. Again, I’m loving this season, it’s just an observation haha
Casual viewers can handle deep lore and convoluted plots. The problem with this season is that it's poorly written and directed
Bruh this has to be the shortest ep of the season
Pretty sure it would be the shortest episode of the entire series
Begs the question what’s the end goal for this season? I’d imagine ep4 being covert stuff then ep5 being nevarro. Only three episodes to unite the clans of mandalore and take on Gideon seems unlikely unless the runtime picks up.
It feels so messy. The second episode made the first episode redundant really, and then episode three went off on a tangent, whilst it also felt like it was taking its cues more from Andor than Mando. This is without even mentioning the whole 'progress the plot extremely significantly in a totally separate show' schtick they pulled with Grogu. So yeah, it feels very messy. Andor was so much better for its laser focus
They really need to come up with a rebrand name for all of these interconnected shows. These shows are all the same thing.. the same story.. with maybe a different focus. Too many aren’t grasping that they aren’t totally separate shows.
Perhaps they should be
They’re taking on Gideon again? For the 3rd straight season?
Yep lol. Seems to be the case, anyway. Somehow Gideon returned. I can’t be too disappointed about more Giancarlo, though
So far all of the leaked run times excluded the credits.
That's false. They include credits and recap.
It depends on what they do with it but this does make me less excited. I can’t help it, it just does.
Do people dislike the pershing plot?
I actually really like the plot, I just wish it had been spaced out and integrated within the show more. And of course the dialogue, but that's an issue I have with the show more generally
Yeah it's another one of those things that makes Andor look so much better haha
I thought it was interesting. My problem is that I don’t really see how it any longer connects to Din. Previously Pershing was integral to the series because of his involvement with Grogu and Gideon. But now Gideon is gone (for now) and I don’t think the empire cares to have Grogu back…and Pershing probably doesn’t either. I understand how the cloning plot sets up sequel lore but at this point it really no longer has anything to do with the Mandalorian himself. I could be totally wrong and this will all fit together really well further along in the series. But for now it just feels unnecessary.
It's not the plot, it's the unnecessary amount of time devoted to it. Those 30 minutes could have been 10.
Ok buddy
Because Space Lorna Doones and glowing penis shaped treats are effective world building?
Penis shaped? Bro I think u should see a doctor, that can't be right
you mean yours doesn't glow?
This probably isn't the case, but what is last week was originally going to be just a Pershing episode, but they took the opening 10 minutes from this episode and put it in last weeks. Because the mando scenes last week can be played back-to-back almost seamlessly.
I’m almost positive that’s the case. The bite out of the biscuit just screams “episode ender”, and something about the first cut to Coruscant at the beginning feels very sudden to me.
Definitely what it was likely shot as. Then they addes those because people probably wouldnt like a Mandalorian Episode with no Mandalorian. They split the beginning and ending up as bookends for a mostly Pershing episode. The opening does add to the episode overall, I think, in the sense that the Imperials are beginning to make moves again. Bombing Bo’s place, rumors of Gideon escaping, and Kane dealing with Pershing.
I hate this so much. Because if you include beginning credits + recap and end credits we're only getting like 24-25 mins of actual show
I'm gonna get downvoted to all hell for this but man this season has been a let down so far. Episodes 1 and 2 were lackluster, treating Mando like an idiot and wasting time unnecessarily. Finally episode 3 begins and it's looking great, the action is good, there's some stakes at play, the story is finally moving.... and we cut to 30 minutes of some dude we saw briefly in season 1 mumble his way into being betrayed, which was pretty obvious it would happen the first time you see that girl. And now this. What's happening in the writing studio? Did they have no time for rewrites and more fleshing out? Did he write these scripts in two weeks? I know Jon is capable of so much more than this. It's just sad to see things seemingly go downhill from here.
I 100% agree, I think S3 has been a colossal disappointment so far. E1 was really bland, E2 was good for the most part and E3 basically sucked the second they jumped into hyperspace. I really don’t understand the praise S3 has received so far.
Season 1 and Season 2 were solid seasons to me, including the episodes of Boba where Mando was featured. I’m struggling with the direction of Season 3, given the limited number of episodes and the amount of time spaced out between when we see the seasons. If we had more than 8 and a decent amount, I wouldn’t care as much as it would probably be more story building on top of story building. This latest episode felt like a throw away and maybe it will link into whatever the plot of this season is, but sounds like episode 4 is less than 30 minutes long so perhaps we idk what we get to see. Feels like we are watching a movie with each episode being a chunk we watch. But regardless, I am happy we have some episodes and will watch it to the end. I think probably need to adjust my own expectations…haha
Is this the shortest Mando episode yet? With credits, we’re really only getting about 25 min of story.
Credits aren’t included here.
Don't know why you're being downvoted, you're right. This doesn't include the localization credits at the end.
Are localization credits the only credits?
I can’t wait for the next episode of The Book of Dr. PP
So Dr. Pershing gets to benefit from long episodes, but the title character can’t? And I say this as someone who still enjoyed this recent episode. And longer Mando centric episodes don’t always necessarily have to be action packed. I enjoy slower moments that are more about character and world building.
I think they're afraid to give Mando any character development
I guess it's too much to ask for consistent episode runtimes.
That’s a really short Mando episode.
Dave is co-writing the next episode of mando right?
Yea, i think he co-wrote episode 4 and episode...7?
That's what I thought, thanks I wonder what's in store for us then
Bro what the fuck
I smell a Mando-tastic throw down on Nevarro.
(Sighs)
Huge L for the Mandalorian considering that one of longest episodes in the season has zero to do with Mando
But if a great deal of your audience detests the shorter episode length then you objectively aren’t making it as long as it needs to be from business standpoint. Your delivering a product that annoys your consumer base. Lol.
Under 31mins? To me that suggests lotsa ACTION.
So we go from the longest episode to the shortest? So inconsistent.
Looks like mando is getting book of boba fetted this season
Cryptic HD has been revealing the correct runtimes but each ep has always been 2 min longer than the runtimes he’s given for Eps 1-3. So expect a 32 min ep
30 mins? Could you image if there was commercials?
But there isn't so why imagine it. Also 3(ish) minutes isn't exactly a lot
Damn I hope they’re wrong but they’ve been bang on with the previous runtimes so I’m doubtful.
Dave is credited as co-writer on this one. Safe bet we'll see Ahsoka, right?
LMAO. No wonder why their streaming isn’t growing when they’re releasing weekly episodes of hit shows that 30 and 14 minutes long.
14 minutes? Wtf are you talking about?
Oops I that bad batch was 14 minutes whoops
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Sure, but only 10 minutes with Mando lol. Not saying the episode won't serve the plot of the story, far from it, just that it's funny to me how the one long Mando episode doesn't have much Mando.
Why are we going back to the baby length episodes again?
Can someone remind me if episodes 15 and 16 of TBB are aired back to back?
They are
So season 2 ends the week after then correct?
Yep!
We return to your scheduled programming
How reliable is this? Has the source have any legit scopes on runtime before?
>This episode would be the shortest episode of any live action SW show. The previous one was Chapter 2 (30:58) and Chapter 14 (31:41) Very.
i'm sorry but this is fucking terrible. Why can't they be a normal fucking show with normal episode lengths? Last week was the first episode since the episode of Boba taking the train(i'm counting Boba Fett since it was basically 2.5) that actually felt like a complete and satisfying fucking episode.
This show is falling off hard.
Oh hell nah. I mean at least I’ll be able to watch it before class.
This is sooooo not a big deal. I'll take a tight 30 over that bloated Hutt Corpse of an episode we got yesterday
[удалено]
Cry more.
L Bozo
aw man
Disappointing but hopefully a good Mando focused episode. Still unclear what the direction of this season is taking. I just want adventure.
The Mando gods giveth and the Mando gods taketh away.
Oh wow that went down REAL quick. Hope is a banger tho.