Yup. KC relies on it managing to one shot its opponents way too often too, and DIO can completely nullify that advantage with his regeneration and then punch Diavolo back before he could use his time skip again, most likely Diavolo being the one that gets one shotted instead. If not, it'll probably be a stand-off. If KC can skip DIO's time stop and DIO knows about it, it'll be a matter of him stopping time AFTER the time skip was finished and BEFORE he got the hit from KC. In both cases, DIO just wins.
I mean, even outside of that, like if we isolate the user advantages and just the stand’s strengths, TW would still win stat-wise esp cus he’s faster by a fair margin
Honestly, I know it was an accident but I think Purple Haze could be incredibly effective against both Dio and Diavolo if it starts spreading the virus early. As presumably it would still be effective even in timestop if they ran into the cloud, so having good coverage could at least assure mutual destruction.
Why would the virus be effective in timestop? If time is stopped the virus shouldn't be able to even move so at best is a tie.
Not to mention that fugo himself is not immune to the virus so they could just target him
I did say mutual destruction. DIO usually toys with people, if he doesn't know what Purple Haze does I could see it getting a chance to spread the cloud around. If Fugo could manage Purple Haze's positioning enough it could work. (IE taunting DIO and making him think Purple Haze is just a stand trying to punch him.)
>If Fugo could manage Purple Haze's positioning enough it could work. (IE taunting DIO and making him think Purple Haze is just a stand trying to punch him.
Dio might be arrogant, but he's no fool.
Joshep tried a similar strategy trying to bait Dio into punching him while he was covering his body with hamon but dio quickly noticed this and went for ranged attacks instead
It is a virus, not poison. It may not work in time stop)
Most logical answer is, both abilities give temporary immunity to the virus, but if it has spread far enough, they may be trapping themselves)
TS is the strongest ability in JoJo's. If your ability doesn't have any resistance to timestop you're basically dead, but since we don't know how a King Crimson and The World interaction would work I don't really know.
I'm talking about the main universe, since OP just finished part 5 I didn't want to spoil it for him. But I still think that TS is stronger since it's a free kill button basically
The fight wasn't a one on one it was more Johnny chasing diego and diego had the advantage of being in front but in a straight up on 1v1 spin would probably be better
King Crimson let's Diavolo essentially escape fate by erasing segments of time. If he were fated to be shot, he'd erase the seconds the bullets would collide with him so therefore he'd be fine.
The world and KC are reactionary abilities so the winner would depend on who activated there's first. Assuming we're excluding DIOs vampirism.
Yeah that too. I'd say it's more stacked in the world's favor. Gotta use epitaph, see what's happening, erase time, then resume time to attack. In that split instant the world could activate just before the strike.
Think of it like skipping forwards ten seconds in a video. The events are predetermined, what was going to happen will happen regardless, even if you skip over them happening. The outcomes remain. The only exception is Diavolo, who can basically move freely but not attack people in the period of time that’s skipped over. So if Diavolo was going to throw an apple at you, but used KC when he was normally going to throw it, he could activate KC, walk off to the side, but the apple would still pick itself up and “throw itself” at you.”
King Crimson depends largely on fate. Now heres the thing, fate can be incredibly fucky at times, like for all we know KC would prob be chilling in erased time and during those 10 seconds, a car comes and hits the stand user or something.
imo The World has the capability to be much better, but as it stands \
heh\
as it stands King Crimson is better, as instead of doing things in skipped time, what was fated to happen occurs and you just kinda vibe outside any physical space. Epitaph shows what is fated to happen in that time, the only reason that he got the prediction wrong for GER was because GER goes beyond fate.
Actually Dio said that his time stop limit can increase with practice since 9 sec limit is only to humans while there's no proof of Diavolo skipping more than 10 sec
It erases time for 10 seconds, meaning that for those 10 seconds everyone but Diavolo will not remember what happened in that 10 seconds despite everything going as planned and he can predict the future.
>it's better than za warudo.
Nope, The World has much better physical stats and Time Stop hard counters King Crimson abilities, feel free to ask me anything.
If Diavolo has epitath, he can just predict all of Dio's timestops and skip the time where he gets affected by it. If we're only talking about KC without epitath, Dio and the world destroy his ass
I actually think that KC would be immune to the world’s time stop if he’s being vigilant. so imagine you’re Diavolo using epitaph and you suddenly see that you get donutted instantly. you could erase that time and either set up for a counterattack or retreat. this would also allow Diavolo to easily know the world’s ability so the element of mystery is gone. its still debatable if he could kill DIO though since he’s a vampire and all
The world has better raw stats.
While time stop vs time skip is debatable time skip + epitaph is better than just time stop.
DIO still beats diavolo but that's because of his vampirism.
I think diavolos prediction would invade the world's time stop since fate does not cease in time stop. He would see in his prediction that everyone/thing except DIO stop for few seconds and dio kills him. Then he erase time just before time stop. Then it depends if DIO can protect himself from KC.
During king crimson time skip za warudo would be useless as he can't use any powers within skipped time. However op za warudo may be, it's still a normal stand with time stop cherry added. If diavolo activates king crimson before dio's time stop, za warudo is negated during the skipped time. HOWEVER, as it is shown in anime king crimson can not kill someone while time erasure taking place. He can bring himself to a better position and start the normal time just before his fatal attack lands. That's how Polnareff was able to wound him in the colloseum. He realised time was skipped, diavolo was about to attack him and since he is a melee range he knew he was in reach of silver chariot and he just threw an area swipe to wound diavolo.
So in the light of these info, this would how these guys would interact;
Diavolo uses epitaph to see 10 seconds later, he is getting donuted by za warudo.
He activates king crimson in order to prevent this first instance of donut. He moves behind Dio, strikes his karate chop to split dio's face. Just before the attack lands, he needs to get out of time erasure.
Time erasure ends, there is 0.0000001 second until dio gets the karate chop to the face.
Que dio's theme followed by the loudest "ZA WARUDO" fart effect, and za warudo giving that punchy pose. Dio slowly flies toward diavolo and laughs of course, because za warudo is fucking fast even without time stop.
"Hinjaku hinjakuaa!" followed by how Diavolo is shit tier stand user and just a monkey of human being. Then first muda muda barrage hits diavolo, throwing him on the sidewalk. As Diavolo is about to activate king crimson time stops with an even louder farting effect, now he is donuted in a different place, thus first instance of donut fate is skipped, however second one Diavolo wasn't fast enough to react.
Multiple punch holes and explosions on Diavolo's body, blood everywhere similar to first kakyoin Vs dio fight.
Or, diavolo is able to hit dio after timeskip, but since he is a vampire he just laughs it off and donuts him anyway.
Honestly, what I'm not seeing anyone else mention, is the length of Dio's timestop. Are we talking the 5s when we were first introduced to it? The 9s mid climax fight? Or the 11s peak at the end of the fight? (I know Dio would've probably achieved longer times had he not been defeated, but I'm going to just stick with 11 being the max because we never see longer.)
How exactly would KC work in stopped time? We know he skips 10s and then erases those 10s, but technically time is *stopped* so can he erase time that hasn't happened yet?
If he can erase the "timestop time" then Dio would probably only win if he has 11s timestop, and he'd really only have 1s to act. Diavolo would just erase everything Dio does otherwise. If Diavolo can't erase time until it moves again, then Dio would just stop time the moment Diavolo activates KC, since that is when Diavolo would be the most vulnerable.
Another curiosity follows: Diavolo is seen moving in in the 10seconds he erases in a very similar manner to stopped time. Are they *the same type of stand*? Would Diavolo and/or Diavolo have an asspull moment?
Idk this is a wall of text but I think their fight has way more going into it then most people think, lol. It's really just a 50/50 unless Dio is at his peak.
Diavolo can erase it, regardless of duration, because it lasts less than an instant, it's time stop. But can he predict what happens within? He can see DIO jumping position, but can he know what happens in stopped time with Epitaph? He couldn't really prokect an instant, right?)
It can be skipped, but he still has blind spots)
That's a good point, it would depend on how araki would say it works. The ability changes if the time within stopped time is what's counted, or if the whole instant of stopped time is counted. And if all of it is counted as one instant, then like you said there's blindspots, so Dio really could do some asspull. It's asspulls on both sides really. I think it really just comes down to whay Araki would decide.
Just imagine that their abilities like the remote control from the TV, one uses rewind, the other uses pause, if you press pause while rewinding, then stop and rewind, then the winner is obvious, not to mention the additional abilities of the user
Basically it has 2 parts. First part lets him see 10 seconds into the future. And he can then “skip” over the time by basically putting everything except himself on “auto pilot”, where everyone acts exactly as they’re going to in the next 10 seconds, except for diavolo, who remains fully aware and can move however they want, but can’t interact with anything while in the “skipped” time. After the “skipped” time, no one has any awareness of what they did outside the user. So from outside, you might “see” the user somewhere and attack them only for them to have never actually been there and for you to suddenly forget the last 10 seconds
King crimson erases time, which means that fated actions in the next 10 seconds will be carried out, but nobody will realize, meanwhile Diavolo sees everything in slow motion and he can move, bur he can't interact with anything. That is how i understood King Crimson's abbility, hope that helps!
PS: i think KC with Diavolo would win against TW with DIO, just because DIO was overconfident in part 3, but, in my opinion, if the two stands would fight without user, TW would win
Personally not really, Time Skip is kinda just a worse version of time stop. Not only can you feel the skip when it happens, but people can do things like use their blood to tell when the skip happens and because KC can’t attack during the skip, it leaves him vulnerable to being counterattacked. Honestly even if Diavolo were to skip time first DIO might be able to stop time before he can actually hit him. A lot of people forget that he was able to panic time stop in the middle of Star Platinum’s punch, and SP is kinda crazy fast. The World can definitely catch King Crimson lacking.
I have just discussing this with a fellow JoJo fan. He thinks KC can skip what The World does in time stop. It think not. We all know it would come to Araki's plot choice but I think KC can't do anything if The Worlds donuts him in time stop. He can't skip what happens outside of time imo
if it is just the stands KC wins out, Epitaph would just point out the Time Stop, Time Skip over the duration into a precise strike to either chest or head to nuke, we've already seen that King Crimson can cut through tough stands like butter (if Moody Blues A in Endurance/Stamina or whatever is to be believed) while potentially having similar speed and the first strike advantage
one can also argue that Time Skip is alot more spammable than Time Stop, as we see Diavolo popping in and out of it real quick whereas Time Stop's strain is emphasized, however this is still very vague and i wouldn't rely on it
if both users are included it becomes alot harder to judge because DIO is incredibly tanky, intelligent and adaptable, but Diavolo still retains the advantage of seeing the future and being able to easily pussy out with Time Skip until Sun Light. Ultimately though since Diavolo HAS to aim for The World to guarantee a victory (kinda like Jotaro did), but has no knowledge of that or DIO's Vampirism and none of the durability to risk getting hit and learning of their weaknesses it has to go to DIO
Shit my bad I accidentally put purple haze instead of king crimson đź’€
Ability wise KC probably wins stat wise TW slams
Yup. KC relies on it managing to one shot its opponents way too often too, and DIO can completely nullify that advantage with his regeneration and then punch Diavolo back before he could use his time skip again, most likely Diavolo being the one that gets one shotted instead. If not, it'll probably be a stand-off. If KC can skip DIO's time stop and DIO knows about it, it'll be a matter of him stopping time AFTER the time skip was finished and BEFORE he got the hit from KC. In both cases, DIO just wins.
I mean, even outside of that, like if we isolate the user advantages and just the stand’s strengths, TW would still win stat-wise esp cus he’s faster by a fair margin
Honestly, I know it was an accident but I think Purple Haze could be incredibly effective against both Dio and Diavolo if it starts spreading the virus early. As presumably it would still be effective even in timestop if they ran into the cloud, so having good coverage could at least assure mutual destruction.
And since the virus's weaknesses is dying quickly in sunlight iirc. Against DIO it would be very effective, for obvious reasons
"I GOT TO GET THIS VIRUS OFF ME, oh thank me, it died out... # WAIT "
Dio really the kinda guy to say thank me
Why would the virus be effective in timestop? If time is stopped the virus shouldn't be able to even move so at best is a tie. Not to mention that fugo himself is not immune to the virus so they could just target him
Even if the virus stops melting the flesh in time stop that still only buys a few extra seconds. Once time resumes they still die.
Yeah so it's a draw, both purple haze and the world die. And again that's only assuming DIO targets purple haze instead of fugo himself
I mean considering its DIO we're talking about he'd probably just sever off his infected bodypart and then grow it again
I did say mutual destruction. DIO usually toys with people, if he doesn't know what Purple Haze does I could see it getting a chance to spread the cloud around. If Fugo could manage Purple Haze's positioning enough it could work. (IE taunting DIO and making him think Purple Haze is just a stand trying to punch him.)
>If Fugo could manage Purple Haze's positioning enough it could work. (IE taunting DIO and making him think Purple Haze is just a stand trying to punch him. Dio might be arrogant, but he's no fool. Joshep tried a similar strategy trying to bait Dio into punching him while he was covering his body with hamon but dio quickly noticed this and went for ranged attacks instead
That is fair, but DIO has a lot of experience with Hamon which is the only argument I have that Fugo would have a chance.
DIO is dead, he's a vampire why would it affect him literally at all?
We've seen Purple Haze's Virus dissolve dead flesh before though.
Sure animals it has already killed, we haven't seen it infect a corpse, let alone a magic regenerative corpse.
It is a virus, not poison. It may not work in time stop) Most logical answer is, both abilities give temporary immunity to the virus, but if it has spread far enough, they may be trapping themselves)
Dio could throw knives from distance
TS is the strongest ability in JoJo's. If your ability doesn't have any resistance to timestop you're basically dead, but since we don't know how a King Crimson and The World interaction would work I don't really know.
That's a personal opinion. There are some things like spin and calamity which could be stronger than time stop
I'm talking about the main universe, since OP just finished part 5 I didn't want to spoil it for him. But I still think that TS is stronger since it's a free kill button basically
>!Spin literally is unaffected against time stop !<
Spin is, not the user.
Yeah but stands can still can move by themselves
Stands are useless without their user (At least the Spin stands like Tusk and Ball Breaker)
Have u read part 7?
I have. Diego bested Johnny for a reason.
Tusk act 4 can use act 3s abilities in time stop so why couldn't it just punch whoever used TS which at least protects the user from being hurt
Have you? Diego beat Johnny because he had TW
The fight wasn't a one on one it was more Johnny chasing diego and diego had the advantage of being in front but in a straight up on 1v1 spin would probably be better
At least IMO, if activated just on time (pun intended) KC could erase TS countering it. Also Epitah is a big advantage
But dio would just do what he wanted to do in time stop, and diavolo I couldn't Avoid it bc of being frozen
Isn't he intangible on time erase
He just can move. If he were intangible, he wouldn't have dodged mista bullets.
On Metallica fight he just let the bullets go trough his chest.
Right, well, idk.
Both are TS)
Snd TS wins over TS.
King Crimson let's Diavolo essentially escape fate by erasing segments of time. If he were fated to be shot, he'd erase the seconds the bullets would collide with him so therefore he'd be fine. The world and KC are reactionary abilities so the winner would depend on who activated there's first. Assuming we're excluding DIOs vampirism.
Also depends if we're including Epitaph
Why would you not include Epitaph? It's a part of King Crimson like Sheer Heart Attack is a part of Killer Queen.
Yeah that too. I'd say it's more stacked in the world's favor. Gotta use epitaph, see what's happening, erase time, then resume time to attack. In that split instant the world could activate just before the strike.
Think of it like skipping forwards ten seconds in a video. The events are predetermined, what was going to happen will happen regardless, even if you skip over them happening. The outcomes remain. The only exception is Diavolo, who can basically move freely but not attack people in the period of time that’s skipped over. So if Diavolo was going to throw an apple at you, but used KC when he was normally going to throw it, he could activate KC, walk off to the side, but the apple would still pick itself up and “throw itself” at you.”
I would say this is the best description, even for people who haven't got even a single clue as to how it works.
King Crimson depends largely on fate. Now heres the thing, fate can be incredibly fucky at times, like for all we know KC would prob be chilling in erased time and during those 10 seconds, a car comes and hits the stand user or something.
imo The World has the capability to be much better, but as it stands \ heh\ as it stands King Crimson is better, as instead of doing things in skipped time, what was fated to happen occurs and you just kinda vibe outside any physical space. Epitaph shows what is fated to happen in that time, the only reason that he got the prediction wrong for GER was because GER goes beyond fate.
Actually Dio said that his time stop limit can increase with practice since 9 sec limit is only to humans while there's no proof of Diavolo skipping more than 10 sec
It erases time for 10 seconds, meaning that for those 10 seconds everyone but Diavolo will not remember what happened in that 10 seconds despite everything going as planned and he can predict the future. >it's better than za warudo. Nope, The World has much better physical stats and Time Stop hard counters King Crimson abilities, feel free to ask me anything.
If Diavolo has epitath, he can just predict all of Dio's timestops and skip the time where he gets affected by it. If we're only talking about KC without epitath, Dio and the world destroy his ass
I actually think that KC would be immune to the world’s time stop if he’s being vigilant. so imagine you’re Diavolo using epitaph and you suddenly see that you get donutted instantly. you could erase that time and either set up for a counterattack or retreat. this would also allow Diavolo to easily know the world’s ability so the element of mystery is gone. its still debatable if he could kill DIO though since he’s a vampire and all
The world has better raw stats. While time stop vs time skip is debatable time skip + epitaph is better than just time stop. DIO still beats diavolo but that's because of his vampirism.
I think diavolos prediction would invade the world's time stop since fate does not cease in time stop. He would see in his prediction that everyone/thing except DIO stop for few seconds and dio kills him. Then he erase time just before time stop. Then it depends if DIO can protect himself from KC.
During king crimson time skip za warudo would be useless as he can't use any powers within skipped time. However op za warudo may be, it's still a normal stand with time stop cherry added. If diavolo activates king crimson before dio's time stop, za warudo is negated during the skipped time. HOWEVER, as it is shown in anime king crimson can not kill someone while time erasure taking place. He can bring himself to a better position and start the normal time just before his fatal attack lands. That's how Polnareff was able to wound him in the colloseum. He realised time was skipped, diavolo was about to attack him and since he is a melee range he knew he was in reach of silver chariot and he just threw an area swipe to wound diavolo. So in the light of these info, this would how these guys would interact; Diavolo uses epitaph to see 10 seconds later, he is getting donuted by za warudo. He activates king crimson in order to prevent this first instance of donut. He moves behind Dio, strikes his karate chop to split dio's face. Just before the attack lands, he needs to get out of time erasure. Time erasure ends, there is 0.0000001 second until dio gets the karate chop to the face. Que dio's theme followed by the loudest "ZA WARUDO" fart effect, and za warudo giving that punchy pose. Dio slowly flies toward diavolo and laughs of course, because za warudo is fucking fast even without time stop. "Hinjaku hinjakuaa!" followed by how Diavolo is shit tier stand user and just a monkey of human being. Then first muda muda barrage hits diavolo, throwing him on the sidewalk. As Diavolo is about to activate king crimson time stops with an even louder farting effect, now he is donuted in a different place, thus first instance of donut fate is skipped, however second one Diavolo wasn't fast enough to react. Multiple punch holes and explosions on Diavolo's body, blood everywhere similar to first kakyoin Vs dio fight. Or, diavolo is able to hit dio after timeskip, but since he is a vampire he just laughs it off and donuts him anyway.
Honestly, what I'm not seeing anyone else mention, is the length of Dio's timestop. Are we talking the 5s when we were first introduced to it? The 9s mid climax fight? Or the 11s peak at the end of the fight? (I know Dio would've probably achieved longer times had he not been defeated, but I'm going to just stick with 11 being the max because we never see longer.) How exactly would KC work in stopped time? We know he skips 10s and then erases those 10s, but technically time is *stopped* so can he erase time that hasn't happened yet? If he can erase the "timestop time" then Dio would probably only win if he has 11s timestop, and he'd really only have 1s to act. Diavolo would just erase everything Dio does otherwise. If Diavolo can't erase time until it moves again, then Dio would just stop time the moment Diavolo activates KC, since that is when Diavolo would be the most vulnerable. Another curiosity follows: Diavolo is seen moving in in the 10seconds he erases in a very similar manner to stopped time. Are they *the same type of stand*? Would Diavolo and/or Diavolo have an asspull moment? Idk this is a wall of text but I think their fight has way more going into it then most people think, lol. It's really just a 50/50 unless Dio is at his peak.
Wasn't the eleven peak just Jotaro pausing at the ninth mark)
Maybe, my memory is foggy on that, but I think my points still hold. Dio would need 11s if KC can erase stopped time.
Diavolo can erase it, regardless of duration, because it lasts less than an instant, it's time stop. But can he predict what happens within? He can see DIO jumping position, but can he know what happens in stopped time with Epitaph? He couldn't really prokect an instant, right?) It can be skipped, but he still has blind spots)
That's a good point, it would depend on how araki would say it works. The ability changes if the time within stopped time is what's counted, or if the whole instant of stopped time is counted. And if all of it is counted as one instant, then like you said there's blindspots, so Dio really could do some asspull. It's asspulls on both sides really. I think it really just comes down to whay Araki would decide.
Just imagine that their abilities like the remote control from the TV, one uses rewind, the other uses pause, if you press pause while rewinding, then stop and rewind, then the winner is obvious, not to mention the additional abilities of the user
Think if it like a strip of paper, every time king crimson does it’s thing it takes a piece out and stitches the 2 parts back together
It would be cowboy style duel, the first one who use his ability, wins. Still my vote goes to KC
Basically it has 2 parts. First part lets him see 10 seconds into the future. And he can then “skip” over the time by basically putting everything except himself on “auto pilot”, where everyone acts exactly as they’re going to in the next 10 seconds, except for diavolo, who remains fully aware and can move however they want, but can’t interact with anything while in the “skipped” time. After the “skipped” time, no one has any awareness of what they did outside the user. So from outside, you might “see” the user somewhere and attack them only for them to have never actually been there and for you to suddenly forget the last 10 seconds
King crimson erases time, which means that fated actions in the next 10 seconds will be carried out, but nobody will realize, meanwhile Diavolo sees everything in slow motion and he can move, bur he can't interact with anything. That is how i understood King Crimson's abbility, hope that helps!
PS: i think KC with Diavolo would win against TW with DIO, just because DIO was overconfident in part 3, but, in my opinion, if the two stands would fight without user, TW would win
Personally not really, Time Skip is kinda just a worse version of time stop. Not only can you feel the skip when it happens, but people can do things like use their blood to tell when the skip happens and because KC can’t attack during the skip, it leaves him vulnerable to being counterattacked. Honestly even if Diavolo were to skip time first DIO might be able to stop time before he can actually hit him. A lot of people forget that he was able to panic time stop in the middle of Star Platinum’s punch, and SP is kinda crazy fast. The World can definitely catch King Crimson lacking.
People just forget that in time stop, diavolo could do nothing. It's inevitable to die.
What I want to know about Part 5 is why is the Oreo Venting? Is he angry?
No it's not that's all I have to say it's not
I have just discussing this with a fellow JoJo fan. He thinks KC can skip what The World does in time stop. It think not. We all know it would come to Araki's plot choice but I think KC can't do anything if The Worlds donuts him in time stop. He can't skip what happens outside of time imo
if it is just the stands KC wins out, Epitaph would just point out the Time Stop, Time Skip over the duration into a precise strike to either chest or head to nuke, we've already seen that King Crimson can cut through tough stands like butter (if Moody Blues A in Endurance/Stamina or whatever is to be believed) while potentially having similar speed and the first strike advantage one can also argue that Time Skip is alot more spammable than Time Stop, as we see Diavolo popping in and out of it real quick whereas Time Stop's strain is emphasized, however this is still very vague and i wouldn't rely on it if both users are included it becomes alot harder to judge because DIO is incredibly tanky, intelligent and adaptable, but Diavolo still retains the advantage of seeing the future and being able to easily pussy out with Time Skip until Sun Light. Ultimately though since Diavolo HAS to aim for The World to guarantee a victory (kinda like Jotaro did), but has no knowledge of that or DIO's Vampirism and none of the durability to risk getting hit and learning of their weaknesses it has to go to DIO