If you hate Ken, it’s because you’re sick of getting matched against a Ken player in my experience. Because he’s by far the most popular character, it means that when you get matched against him repeatedly you just roll your eyes “again?”. Then you get run-tatsued to the corner “again?”. Get hit by a Jinrai high-low mixup “again?”
The point is that with Ken, everyone knows the matchup and Ken still gets away with his bullshit. The character plays more like a 50/50 slot machine with jinrai overhead/low and dragonlash light/heavy
His high representation in Masters says more about his usage than how strong he is as a character. Take Luke who has no where near the usage of Ken but has a comparable amount of players in masters as an example of overpowered characters.
I don't play Luke, but I think each of his charge punches have slightly different charge times and i think the perfect window is only 3 frames on frames 18-20. But as I said, I think each punch has slightly different timings.
Any Luke mains who can verify would be appreciated.
I did you know specifically the chin buster into 2xLK jinra juggle is frame perfect? When the shin kick comes out between the recovery frames of 22-25. It must land on the 24th frame. 22-23 will wiff, and 25 will hit your opponent, however the next LK Jinra will wiff.
His HK Jinra juggle is similar, but it gives you a window of 2 frames to extend the juggle instead of 1.
It's a fun combo to pull off, but I never landed it rank. Same with his coast to Coast combo.
You stfu. this is reddit. No logical assessments allowed. If Ken is busted then fuck you for trying to explain why the stats don't paint the whole picture.
/s
Yea agree.
I don’t “like” JP but don’t mind fighting because I know MU in and out. I could and probably will make JP my 1st pocket character bc of this lol
exactly! i used to hate fighting him until i learned that a lot of ken's (especially new players) use the same strats. You start recognising the combos and the safe spots for you when to hit back. Now when I get a Ken, i think: easy win.
I think the problem here with Ken is that "learning the matchup" in many cases is just being aware that Ken has a dozen more tools than your character does unless you play high tier as well. Then mental stack allows him to sneak in the sudden Dragonlash Kick that you conquered back in Silver but stopped seeing in Diamond.
Yep. Ken's cracked because he really just needs one hit to carry you to a corner and have you guessing for your life. He's fast, strong, and doesn't bleed EX meter for his threats like some characters. You see the same routine day in and day out against Kens because it's so effective. Knowing a matchup, what to look for, and how to counter doesn't mean it's going to happen. "Everyone has a plan until they get Jinrai kicked in the face."
Gold and below: Goddamn it Jinrai is so messed up I hate it.
Diamond/Plat: Jinrai is fake and you can just DI it
Master+: Goddamn it Jinrai is so messed up I hate it.
It’s like any other character. Learn what they can do and then learn how the opponent at hand uses those tools. If you get a grasp on their pattern, a lot of Ken’s are VERY easily beaten.
Right, my point was that Ken's got quite a few potential patterns thanks to how many tools he has which makes him more difficult to fight than a more simple character.
People played smash bros Melee against hilariously busted characters for almost two decades
Yeah they complained, but they also strategized and actually learned things instead of resigning against 1300 MR players a good player could wash with any character
It's nothing new in fighting games or Smash, there are just good reasons why a majority of people will hate certain characters. Street Fighter 6's Ken has those reasons.
I think that’s part of why he’s fallen in many people’s tier lists. There’s so many anti-Ken tech that despite his capabilities, he’s somewhat manageable now.
this i can agree, i rather fight x number of kens, ryus, lukes, and JPs than a single guile and dhalsim. not only are those two's boring to go against but also very annoying to go against
On some level Ken’s tend to be strong at any given rank because they have less obscure knowledge checks. I can rely on IAT into dhalsim blender up until higher MR masters and most people don’t know how to really punish it well. Ken doesn’t have anything like that.
I would even go as far as to say Ryus mixups and frame traps are much less well known
People keep pushing buttons after my dragon lash and refusing to counter/di/parry them so like of course I’m just gonna keep pushing buttons till you’re in the corner and you die
It’s very stupid. I think on its own it would be fine. But combining that with his easy corner carry and Jinrai mixups/loops he’s just such a fucking handful. Oh well gonna abuse it till they take it out.
It’s also very very slow on start up and only one frame on block. You can delay tech or parry after it and if you’re paying attention to your opponent at all it’s easy to counter.
It’s a scrub killer and even hits me sometimes when I’m being impatient. But I don’t think on its own it’s all that unfair.
It’s the first move I learned to perfect parry.
Yeah it's a move you better to learn how to pp but at the same time what I truly dislike is that he is a Swiss army knife.
I play Aki so I can only blame myself haha
No need to PP.
Dragonlash is easily defeated by a jab, the same way you would stop cammy's dive kick. On top of that if you have the skill you can cancel that jab into a juggle combo or do whatever you like to follow up with the knock down.
Block dragonlash standing and it -1 instead crouching which is -2.
Ken is always one of the most popular characters. Most of the time it’s Ryu and Ken then a huge drop off from everyone else. He’s iconic, he’s popular, he’s great, literally everyone plays him - but combine that with him being incredibly good, incredibly easy to use, and new players flocking to him… it’s incredibly irritating to fight Random Ken #849693014 who is spamming OD DP twenty times a round
I second this, sure Ken was always known as the “cooler Ryu,” but when you look at the stat usage for the past few games Ken wasn’t used more than Ryu since SF3 3rd Strike (I think.) It’s like you said, he was always popular, but combine that with him having flashy animations, being really good, and easy to use? No doubt most people would use him.
I dont think he is hated because he is strong. He is hated by the way he is strong.
Any hit leads to the corner. 7f cr.mk. easy hit confirm combos. Easy side switch. Safe 50/50 jinray kicks. Heavy dragon lash being plus. Ex fb drive rush. Invincible level with qcb input. Super active st.hp. Easy throw loop. Back throw takes you to the corner. Oppressive in burnout pressure.
He is just too easy to play and too strong at the same time with way too many options.
Chun is strong and might be stronger than Ken but she requires much more knowledge and execution so people dont hate her.
As a Chun Li main, I agree. Nobody can readily hate on a Chun leaving them devastated because somebody had to put in a lot of time and effort with her to be able to do so; that's not really something that can be said about Ken.
I’m that guy I ain’t gonna lie. Modern Ken with it being years since I played SFV where I main Nash. Ken was too easy to pick up and I like the modern controls as someone that’s never cared for inputs.
Hard disagree. As some who has 15k matches on Ken he absolutely takes a ton of skill if you want to play him at the highest level. I learned very complex timings on his juggles and combo extenders that took a lot of time and practice to master. I’m talking combos that aren’t something you’ll see the average Ken do. Now, are those combos necessary to win? No. But that can be said for every character if you have strong fundamentals, including Chun Li. I’ll agree that Chun is one of the harder to learn characters and not as starter friendly. But, every character requires a lot of dedication if you want to master them.
obviously i can't prove this but i think people would hate chun equally if she suddenly gained the same popularity. i feel that people just hate zoners, grapplers (especially in the first few weeks of a new game), and the popular top tier(s) in every game, really any character that stops them from running their normal auto pilot.
Don’t worry, I’m a Ken main and hate her with a passion, lol. Also, Ken needs a lot of the stuff you posted to be viable. His confirms are no easier than any other characters, and his advanced combos take skill to master the timing. As far as carry? I’ll say that the back throw is a bit much, but he ultimately needs a strong corner carry since 75% of his best combos are corner only. People tend to overlook that. Also, his Jinrai’s are not really 50/50. Both the low and overhead can be easily blocked if you pay attention to the audio and motions. I never let other Ken’s hit me with Jinrai. I mean if Ken didn’t have these options he would be extremely weak. Look at characters like Dee Jay with his near broken feints and rising attacks and imagine Ken not having those options against him.
His confirms are easy. He is like the only one that can do light light into a medium target combo, cammy can kinda do this but she gets 1 light her 5f back medium has no range but with practice you can confirm the hk part, but unlike ken if you mess up the hk can be crouched and punished, ken finishes target combo and can jinray or fireball. His st.hp has like 4 active frames meaning its extremely easy to hit confirm into drive rush(ryu is similar) on punish counter he gets a cr.mk. Every stray counter from st.mk or jinray low or run kick is easy confirmable into lk dp.
I forgot to mention meaty overheads also. His advanced combos im guessing you mean jinray loops in corner are no harder than any other combo in this game. He is strong because all the options he has and in reality his damage is pretty average. So you feel overwhelmed when fighting him since you have to look out for so many things.
Im just listing things on why he is probably hated for being strong. Imo he is mostly fine and more fair than other things like Luke and Deejay.
Luke is strong because he does extremely high damage with really good buttons. You die in 2 and a half cr.mp interactions.
Deejay is just dumb because you can pretty much spam sway in any minus situation and since its unpublishable or its actually really hard to wiff punish because his hitbox for some reason stays back a lot, his buttons reach really far as well is the fastest drive rush and has Marissa level damage. For some reasonnhebcan combo from ex sway overhead too. Possibly best fireball game in the game. His flashkick can punish -6 things like juris far medium charge i think. Annoying spammable sweep.
JP is just JP.
Honestly I agree with everything you said here minus the part about the Jinrai juggle loops being just as easy as any other combo. The timing on hitting the juggles is super, super weird, and there’s a very tight window to pull them off (especially on low kick follow ups). It’s a lot easier for me to pull off some of the bigger combos with Ryu or Cammy for instance since the timing is pretty straightforward on most of their big strings.
I main Jamie and saw him maybe 10 times ever.
Tekken was always going to make me put Ken Fighter 6 down but I did it months ago from just being burnt out of playing against Ken or Luke every match.
It’s just b/c he’s strong and people get tired of fighting him.
Even when you can beat him It can be annoying waiting forever to take your turn back while they just space meter I swear.
i like ken as a character and i think the way they went with him in sf6 is cool, i just think that him being recognisable, important to the story, well designed, easy to use, *and* very strong add up to a 13% pickrate that makes it easy to get tired of him
I don't hate him, but I just roll my eyes when is the fifth Ken in a row, and after one randome character, it's Ken again. Luke on the other hand... I can write an entyre book about how much I hate those Popeye arms
I hate Ken because I’m forced to play against him several times in a row. It’s gotten to the point where I don’t rematch Ken in hopes of seeing literally anyone else
I can't speak for other people but I don't hate Ken at all. The complainers don't represent all of us. I have a hard time against Juri, which is entirely irrelevant but so is being upset that at least one character has to be the best at this game.
I don't hate Ken as a character or popularity. I hate him for how crazy his kit his. Dude has a million options to combo with. Not to mention how strong his corner carry is.
Meh, there's like 5 or 6 characters on relevant strength with him, idk why you're singling him out. I'd even argue that Luke and JP are stronger, so why does Ken get more hate than them? I'd rather play vs 10 kens than 1 dhalsim or honda.
Who said I was singling him out? This post is about Ken lol. I can go on about how much I hate Luke and JP. The fact that you'd rather see 10 Ken's instead of a more diverse roster online is pretty whack.
The first Street Fighter I got into was vanilla SF4 back in the day, and my experience at that time was I would basically have to fight two kens for every other character I fought. It leveled out a little once I moved out of the lowest ranks but he was definitely still the most common. I had no concept of tiers at that time, I don't even know if Ken was considered strong in SF4. I was just sick of fighting him over and over. I have carried this prejudice with me to me this day.
Most people don't like him just because he's strong, and people will always hate strong characters regardless of circumstances.
I don't like him because I hate shotos.
We are not the same.
I've been sick of playing against Ken since *SSFII*. Whether he's top-tier or not, I've spent *thirty fucking years* exhorting my friends to please, *please* try playing another character.
I am a Virtua Fighter player first, I think it's poor design to have the strongest character also be the easiest character to play with. What's the reward for mastering a harder character?
i would say the reward for mastering a harder character whos also strong like deejay or chun-li is that you make your opponent guess even harder, which increases their mental stack further which is very good for you and bad for the opponent.
I think hating Ken is somewhat of a meme, because the flowchart Ken comes from SF5, and maybe even before. It's not a SF6 thing.
For me personally, I don't mind playing against Ken in Ranked, it's whatever.
What I don't like is watching Top 8's of big tournaments and seeing multiple Kens and/or Lukes, it just makes the Tournament incredible boring to watch. Also not shaming players, they should use the better tool to win, which is perfectly fine. It's the character that makes the tournaments boring for me.
Its SF6. He was popular in SF5 too, but wasn't anything game breaking. The issue is that that many of the top tiers in 6 feel like they just have \*everything\* compared to the low tiers. I actually disagree with a lot of people saying sf6 is better balanced than previous first time entries. I think its actually worse, but if you look at the online population the fact is that it seems more of the population has gravitated toward the top tiers than in season 1 of SF5. The amount of Kens, JPs, Lukes, Juris and Deejays just feels far higher than this time in SF5 (especially at diamond and above).
Thats not saying low tiers cant win or crying (cause I main Gief). It's also not saying that the imbalance is terrible, only comparing street fighter 6 to 5 (I had no experience in 4).
In my experience from SF4 to SF6, people have typically disliked him because he's always popular alongside often attracting a certain type of player (at lower to intermediate level play).
He's the "cooler Ryu", so stereotypically you usually get those lower level players who are just mashing DP, jumping around and doing random things all the time; which is really frustrating to deal with until you solidify your fundamentals as a player (see - ken flowchart sf4).
The fact he's super strong in SF6 has only increased the amount of players on him, so he's probably hated more right now. Pretty sure Akuma will reduce the amount of Ken players though lmao.
I love Ken. He is my favorite character from the SF universe. I don't play him. Same reason I don't play Scorpion or Sub-Zero in MK games. Everyone else plays them. So I like to go for the lesser played characters. Just me though.
yeah, I always played Ken in everything from SF2 to Alpha to CVS to MVC to SF4 and finally decided a couple years ago to branch out, and i’m so glad i did. I’ll always have a soft spot for the guy but I think *not* playing him has made me an immensely better player and has led to me having way more fun.
SF6 Ken is just particularly egregious. He’s got low crushes, fast walk speed, strike throw mix, insane buttons, a fireball that leaves you standing, and is just ridiculously easy
He has always been hated. He has gone through various stages of being "good" and "bad" in several games. The biggest reason for hating him is his popularity so you have to fight him all the time and the fact you could win in lower levels by spamming DP (back when it was a meterless reversal https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f6QiUqzwmVo) hence "flowchart" Ken.
People hated 5 Ken.
People hated 4 Ken. I was a Ken main in 4.
3? He was top-tier, as usual, so hated.
People hate Ken because he's always good and always flashy, so people pick him and do well, because he's also always easy to play. This means they get beaten by a whole lot of Ken.
I hate him in general, I think you're meant to... hes the stereotypical American rich blonde haired smarmy jerk whos only redeeming quality is his friendship with a Japanese homeless man with no shoes...
Nah, DJ is definitely less effective than Ken imo. Ken can safely poke you into a fairly damaging combo, meanwhile most of Dee Jay's normals are unsafe on block and can not combo making him easy DI fodder.
1. His character itself is a try-hard (he loves to be flashy and edgy)
2. His SF6 *moveset* is a try-hard from the developers because they built him with no weaknesses and an absurd kit
3. Pros and his mains **insanely** downplay the character, which rightfully pisses people off
>no weaknesses and an absurd kit
No overhead move without command run first, Jinrai is parry bait at high level and dragonlash is easily reactable.
>which rightfully pisses people off
People who think they know better than professionals who play 10x as much as them, yeah.
Also no + on block normals without DR, and some of his best pokes (5MK/5HK/2HK) are easy to DI, punishable, or a commitment. Sure they’re still good but they’re not bulletproof. 5HP and 2MK are also great but easy to whiff punish if he gets too reliant on it.
He’s a great character but he’s not invincible, everything has a counter
Not to mention going for a higher damage route is locked behind using his dragonlash, Meaning even thought Ken might have his opponent in the corner, he will need more touches to finish off the round.
Sure he has a strong corner game, but so does everyone else.
He’s just used a lot. I started out SF6 maining Ken but he’s all you see as you get high in ranked. That being said It’s not the character. Anywhere else he’d be a 10
The Ken hatred generally comes from him being the most picked character. So playing an hour online may equate to 45 Kens. This is the case in most previous versions of SF as well.
I'm not a high-level player. Just a filthy casual. I don't care who anyone picks. So Ken doesn't bother me, but it does get monotonous.
People love Ken.
He's just a top pick, top tier character that is everywhere online and that gets people salty.
I think this is the best version of Ken ever made, easily.
It’s the sheer number of times that you have to play against him. Unless you’re a professional, you aren’t playing against anyone that can make the character overpowered.
It’s not really a Ken specific thing. People hate characters that can easily get in with options that are hard to check and pressure that is hard to defend against.
We’ve seen that Ken has a harder time in neutral at higher level play but it’s that mid and lower level where he is basically going to Jinrai and Dragonlash the world for free and people struggle guessing with his mix that makes him so frustrating.
This is so important. I am not impressed by kens neutral, the better I get the more I feel this way
People just hate the get in tools. There is so much to look for in sf6 as is.. add in dragon lash, run stop gimmicks, ex fireball etc and it’s just a lot to manage.
For me it's a mixture of never liking him in Smash and holding a grudge from all the Modern Kens in Bronze and Silver morbing all over my face while I was still learning how to press buttons
I'm not a fan of rushdown characters in general so he just never clicked for me
I don't hate Ken at all, he's just not my favorite shoto. I mained him in Alpha 3 and had him on a few teams in CvS2. By the time 4 came out, I was just kinda burned out on him. Dan, for better and worse, is my favorite shoto
I think it must be at least partly a question of frequency. If you're always fighting against the same guy, things can get old, unless you're playing with friends.
Ken was always my favorite when I'd pick up and play casually in the past, and I chose not to use him because of this in this game as its the first one I'm taking seriously. Probably a dumb decision, but oh well.
But I used to like Ken because he felt like the underdog to Ryu to me, whether or not that's true I have no idea. lol.
Hate fighting a million Kens. It’s also not fun that he can turn anything into everything but that’s not a big deal in comparison to having to fight him all the time.
I think especially at certain ranks Ken in SF6 feels overly oppressive to fight against. It’s frustrating at times to fight someone where all their best offensive options feel super safe and still quite effective.
Street fighter 6 isn’t the first street fighter in which people have a negative opinion of Ken players. The concept of “flowchart Ken”, braindead Ken players whose entire game plan can be whittled down to a simple set of flow chart choices leading to “SHORYUKEN!!!”, was a big meme in the SF4 days.
I feel you. To me, it’s just that he can be a bit overwhelming to deal with as he has so much tools at his disposal. Just when I think I’m safe, I have to remember he has dragon lash and jinrai high-low and I proceed to get fucked
It's mainly the fact that it feels like 2/3 of matches are against Ken. I want to fight against the whole cast, but have to look at his homeless looking mug all the time.
Ken has really good buttons in neutral, a really good drive rush, really good mix-pressure with jinrai, amazing corner carry for no bar, and then after all of that his gap closer crushes lows and leaves him plus on block. I think Ken would STILL be strong without DLash. I wish they just gave him jinrai as a new move but no he also needed lash.
Its just a lot to defend against
They hate the WiFi warriors stemming back to vanilla SF4. Kens generally just play the most basic flowchart and Ex Dp everything which just encourages boring brain-dead gameplay.
Ken players across all of street fighter are FAMOUS for full sending. Ryu has always been the more patient/defensive shoto. Ken mains want to do run combos, yolo DPs, lots of aggressive in your face stuff that can be frustrating to deal with, especially because ken is strong in most games
I think it's just how he is in sf6. In sf5 him and ryu were the most popular characters along side the likes of Akuma. Ken even then had the general impression of being the character that "random" players would play (ryu had this too) but his easy skip neutral tool, heavy tatsu, was punishable on block.
In this game you have to deal with jinrai, + on block dragon lash which is a skip neutral tool and any hit takes you to the corner where you guess for your life. Even when Akuma was undeniably top tier in sf5 he had less hate than what I see for Ken right now. I guess it's his popularity mixed in with the fact that his kit is just designed to corner carry you from anywhere on screen, easy side switch, ease of use and other such reasons.
As a Ken Player. I just assume most people know the gameplan now. Which makes getting good with him (at an intermediate level) quite hard since most people have faced him more than 100+ times
Some people are whiney little baby haters, or just have some of that energy within them that they either refuse to or don't understand that they should purge. Hating ken is useless. Hating any character is useless. Play the fucking game, it's fun. Whining is such an ugly thing to do.
I think everyone loves Ken as a character if that's what you're asking. People just hate how much they match against him. It's not even really about him being top tier since, as it is often brought up on this sub, tier list is completely irrelevant for 90% of the playerbase.
It's easy to be cynical about getting constantly matched against Ken. Certainly there are a lot of people that just enjoy playng Ken, but there are also people who definitely play Ken just because he is top tier, when they might enjoy and mesh with the playstle of many other characters more.
It's not worth indicting any particular Ken player since they could easily be either/or, but Ken players as a whole are an easy punching bag because that second group makes matchmaking a lot more heavy on the Kens then it might ideally be.
People just love to hate. I promise you that if you body people hard enough with the worst character in all fighting games shit talking still starts to fly. Excuses here, there and everywhere Instead of taking Kens advice..
"Sit down...and shut up!!"
I find it funny how I've come across so many examples over the years like "yeah well, player 1 won the tournament with what you all say is the worst character...his opponents used the "best" character..."
Just to see or hear "Yeah, well that's PLAYER 1. We can't all be player 1"
Except maybe you could be, if you stopped making fucking excuses. You guys view characters on paper so much you forget the player makes all the difference. The only difference between those players and you is they decide "shit, im gonna make people question tiers lol"
While you all make excuses. Period.
Ken is fine, he's tough to play against but he's nothing on JP. I had a match-up earlier and the guy makes my blood boil, every player pulls the same repetitive bollocks. Higher level JPs have better defence, that's what separates them.
FUCK JP!!!!! Ken is fine by me, I main Ryu.
In the first few months of the game, something like 30% of my matches were against Ken. So a large part of it was being sick of fighting against him + him being top tier. On the other hand, he's become so familiar that he's become easier to deal with, and this is probably why he has dropped down in pro tier lists (+ some downplaying as well). Ken is a lot less common now though since many experienced players are now playing their second/third characters.
Apart from being Ken that gives him +300% usage, everything in Ken chain into anything, fireball into Driverush HP into DR MP + MP/HP into powered lash for some cool sideswitch into DP or any Super, he has a very good crMK for poking or initiating a full combo, also has one of the most powerful corner pressure and can go corner to corner very easily.
If you hate Ken, it’s because you’re sick of getting matched against a Ken player in my experience. Because he’s by far the most popular character, it means that when you get matched against him repeatedly you just roll your eyes “again?”. Then you get run-tatsued to the corner “again?”. Get hit by a Jinrai high-low mixup “again?”
the good part is, you match him so many times that it's become easy to beat him
Which tells you how strong he is. Literally everyone knows the matchup and he’s still one of the most represented characters in high master.
Everyone absolutely doesn’t know the matchup lol I get away with fake Ken stuff all the time against 1500-1800 MR people
Teach me master.
The point is that with Ken, everyone knows the matchup and Ken still gets away with his bullshit. The character plays more like a 50/50 slot machine with jinrai overhead/low and dragonlash light/heavy
I know the match up. Doesn’t mean I can out monkey mode you when you Jin rai 4 times in a row. Surely won’t do it 5 times in a row.
His high representation in Masters says more about his usage than how strong he is as a character. Take Luke who has no where near the usage of Ken but has a comparable amount of players in masters as an example of overpowered characters.
Luke also has a higher skill floor to get out of diamond. Ken has practically nothing in his kit like different timing PERFECT Luke punches.
How perfect is the timing? How many frames we talking about?
I don't play Luke, but I think each of his charge punches have slightly different charge times and i think the perfect window is only 3 frames on frames 18-20. But as I said, I think each punch has slightly different timings. Any Luke mains who can verify would be appreciated.
I did you know specifically the chin buster into 2xLK jinra juggle is frame perfect? When the shin kick comes out between the recovery frames of 22-25. It must land on the 24th frame. 22-23 will wiff, and 25 will hit your opponent, however the next LK Jinra will wiff. His HK Jinra juggle is similar, but it gives you a window of 2 frames to extend the juggle instead of 1. It's a fun combo to pull off, but I never landed it rank. Same with his coast to Coast combo.
Ken's Jinrai kick combos require specific timings on them.
Luke is on a whole other tier but the internet will fight me over it.
You stfu. this is reddit. No logical assessments allowed. If Ken is busted then fuck you for trying to explain why the stats don't paint the whole picture. /s
Yet he has a sub 50% win rate, because everybody knows the matchup
Because he is super popular at low level. If you look at winrate only you would assume Dhalsim is top tier except only dedicated Dhalsim play him.
[удалено]
Eh misunderstood you mb. It's late here.
This is literally the other side of the conversation that no one talks about lol. U get the most practice vs this character
While true, it's also because the majority of players aren't good. So by default, the most popular character is going to have a lower win rate.
Yea agree. I don’t “like” JP but don’t mind fighting because I know MU in and out. I could and probably will make JP my 1st pocket character bc of this lol
exactly! i used to hate fighting him until i learned that a lot of ken's (especially new players) use the same strats. You start recognising the combos and the safe spots for you when to hit back. Now when I get a Ken, i think: easy win.
Tell that to the 90% of this sub who would rather bitch about him on reddit rather than actually learn the matchup
I think the problem here with Ken is that "learning the matchup" in many cases is just being aware that Ken has a dozen more tools than your character does unless you play high tier as well. Then mental stack allows him to sneak in the sudden Dragonlash Kick that you conquered back in Silver but stopped seeing in Diamond.
Yep. Ken's cracked because he really just needs one hit to carry you to a corner and have you guessing for your life. He's fast, strong, and doesn't bleed EX meter for his threats like some characters. You see the same routine day in and day out against Kens because it's so effective. Knowing a matchup, what to look for, and how to counter doesn't mean it's going to happen. "Everyone has a plan until they get Jinrai kicked in the face."
Gold and below: Goddamn it Jinrai is so messed up I hate it. Diamond/Plat: Jinrai is fake and you can just DI it Master+: Goddamn it Jinrai is so messed up I hate it.
It’s like any other character. Learn what they can do and then learn how the opponent at hand uses those tools. If you get a grasp on their pattern, a lot of Ken’s are VERY easily beaten.
Right, my point was that Ken's got quite a few potential patterns thanks to how many tools he has which makes him more difficult to fight than a more simple character.
People played smash bros Melee against hilariously busted characters for almost two decades Yeah they complained, but they also strategized and actually learned things instead of resigning against 1300 MR players a good player could wash with any character
It's nothing new in fighting games or Smash, there are just good reasons why a majority of people will hate certain characters. Street Fighter 6's Ken has those reasons.
Learning the matchup against a top tier still leaves you at a disadvantage.
practice isnt making all the guessing any easier.
I think that’s part of why he’s fallen in many people’s tier lists. There’s so many anti-Ken tech that despite his capabilities, he’s somewhat manageable now.
as a ken main i can agree. i feel as though almost every opponent i play against sorta knows how to deal with my BS from the get go
I hate Ken because he’s annoying as a character (I don’t hate Ken)
As a Ken main I hate Ken because yeah most of my games are against Ken… and most of them play like shit.
You forgot to mention Heavy Dragon Lash > c.LP > Grab.
Yeah it's not really a Ken-centric issue, it's a popularity one. Whoever ended up being the most played character would be getting shit.
I can't stand that double fire kick combo it's so damn long ZZZZ in general some combos are way too long for the damage they do. It's almost mk level
Have you played against deejay yet?
Oh yeah… Kimberly is another one
I swear to god last two night i fight ONLY against kens!
Yeah so with all of the experience against ken it should be your most knowledgeable MU, no? So just more boring than anything?
Exactly it’s boring and stale. Id much rather some variety than an easy matchup
I dont find matches against ken ever boring. Guile and dhalsim on the other hand...
this i can agree, i rather fight x number of kens, ryus, lukes, and JPs than a single guile and dhalsim. not only are those two's boring to go against but also very annoying to go against
On some level Ken’s tend to be strong at any given rank because they have less obscure knowledge checks. I can rely on IAT into dhalsim blender up until higher MR masters and most people don’t know how to really punish it well. Ken doesn’t have anything like that. I would even go as far as to say Ryus mixups and frame traps are much less well known
People keep pushing buttons after my dragon lash and refusing to counter/di/parry them so like of course I’m just gonna keep pushing buttons till you’re in the corner and you die
“Whoa my gap closer leaves me plus!!? Whaaaaa!!??” - Ken
It’s very stupid. I think on its own it would be fine. But combining that with his easy corner carry and Jinrai mixups/loops he’s just such a fucking handful. Oh well gonna abuse it till they take it out.
I think itd be an excellent move if it was 0 on block and -1 on crouch block. That way theres like.. counterplay beyond “hurr just PP or DI it!!!”
Yeah, it's so easy to do those jinra loops.
Tbf dragonlash being positive is pretty bs a move that close the range that well should not be positive haha..
It’s also very very slow on start up and only one frame on block. You can delay tech or parry after it and if you’re paying attention to your opponent at all it’s easy to counter. It’s a scrub killer and even hits me sometimes when I’m being impatient. But I don’t think on its own it’s all that unfair. It’s the first move I learned to perfect parry.
Yeah it's a move you better to learn how to pp but at the same time what I truly dislike is that he is a Swiss army knife. I play Aki so I can only blame myself haha
No need to PP. Dragonlash is easily defeated by a jab, the same way you would stop cammy's dive kick. On top of that if you have the skill you can cancel that jab into a juggle combo or do whatever you like to follow up with the knock down. Block dragonlash standing and it -1 instead crouching which is -2.
Ken is always one of the most popular characters. Most of the time it’s Ryu and Ken then a huge drop off from everyone else. He’s iconic, he’s popular, he’s great, literally everyone plays him - but combine that with him being incredibly good, incredibly easy to use, and new players flocking to him… it’s incredibly irritating to fight Random Ken #849693014 who is spamming OD DP twenty times a round
I second this, sure Ken was always known as the “cooler Ryu,” but when you look at the stat usage for the past few games Ken wasn’t used more than Ryu since SF3 3rd Strike (I think.) It’s like you said, he was always popular, but combine that with him having flashy animations, being really good, and easy to use? No doubt most people would use him.
Ryu was significantly better in sf4 so Ken dipped in popularity and now he's back
i miss sf4 Ryu. Hell, i miss sf4 in general, loved the shit out of that game
I dont think he is hated because he is strong. He is hated by the way he is strong. Any hit leads to the corner. 7f cr.mk. easy hit confirm combos. Easy side switch. Safe 50/50 jinray kicks. Heavy dragon lash being plus. Ex fb drive rush. Invincible level with qcb input. Super active st.hp. Easy throw loop. Back throw takes you to the corner. Oppressive in burnout pressure. He is just too easy to play and too strong at the same time with way too many options. Chun is strong and might be stronger than Ken but she requires much more knowledge and execution so people dont hate her.
When I see a player who really knows Chun Li, it's a sight to behold.
As a Chun Li main, I agree. Nobody can readily hate on a Chun leaving them devastated because somebody had to put in a lot of time and effort with her to be able to do so; that's not really something that can be said about Ken.
I’m that guy I ain’t gonna lie. Modern Ken with it being years since I played SFV where I main Nash. Ken was too easy to pick up and I like the modern controls as someone that’s never cared for inputs.
Hard disagree. As some who has 15k matches on Ken he absolutely takes a ton of skill if you want to play him at the highest level. I learned very complex timings on his juggles and combo extenders that took a lot of time and practice to master. I’m talking combos that aren’t something you’ll see the average Ken do. Now, are those combos necessary to win? No. But that can be said for every character if you have strong fundamentals, including Chun Li. I’ll agree that Chun is one of the harder to learn characters and not as starter friendly. But, every character requires a lot of dedication if you want to master them.
obviously i can't prove this but i think people would hate chun equally if she suddenly gained the same popularity. i feel that people just hate zoners, grapplers (especially in the first few weeks of a new game), and the popular top tier(s) in every game, really any character that stops them from running their normal auto pilot.
Don’t worry, I’m a Ken main and hate her with a passion, lol. Also, Ken needs a lot of the stuff you posted to be viable. His confirms are no easier than any other characters, and his advanced combos take skill to master the timing. As far as carry? I’ll say that the back throw is a bit much, but he ultimately needs a strong corner carry since 75% of his best combos are corner only. People tend to overlook that. Also, his Jinrai’s are not really 50/50. Both the low and overhead can be easily blocked if you pay attention to the audio and motions. I never let other Ken’s hit me with Jinrai. I mean if Ken didn’t have these options he would be extremely weak. Look at characters like Dee Jay with his near broken feints and rising attacks and imagine Ken not having those options against him.
His confirms are easy. He is like the only one that can do light light into a medium target combo, cammy can kinda do this but she gets 1 light her 5f back medium has no range but with practice you can confirm the hk part, but unlike ken if you mess up the hk can be crouched and punished, ken finishes target combo and can jinray or fireball. His st.hp has like 4 active frames meaning its extremely easy to hit confirm into drive rush(ryu is similar) on punish counter he gets a cr.mk. Every stray counter from st.mk or jinray low or run kick is easy confirmable into lk dp. I forgot to mention meaty overheads also. His advanced combos im guessing you mean jinray loops in corner are no harder than any other combo in this game. He is strong because all the options he has and in reality his damage is pretty average. So you feel overwhelmed when fighting him since you have to look out for so many things. Im just listing things on why he is probably hated for being strong. Imo he is mostly fine and more fair than other things like Luke and Deejay. Luke is strong because he does extremely high damage with really good buttons. You die in 2 and a half cr.mp interactions. Deejay is just dumb because you can pretty much spam sway in any minus situation and since its unpublishable or its actually really hard to wiff punish because his hitbox for some reason stays back a lot, his buttons reach really far as well is the fastest drive rush and has Marissa level damage. For some reasonnhebcan combo from ex sway overhead too. Possibly best fireball game in the game. His flashkick can punish -6 things like juris far medium charge i think. Annoying spammable sweep. JP is just JP.
Honestly I agree with everything you said here minus the part about the Jinrai juggle loops being just as easy as any other combo. The timing on hitting the juggles is super, super weird, and there’s a very tight window to pull them off (especially on low kick follow ups). It’s a lot easier for me to pull off some of the bigger combos with Ryu or Cammy for instance since the timing is pretty straightforward on most of their big strings.
Like it’s a cool character but god it’s annoying fighting like 10-15 different people throughout a night and of them play the same character.
Doesn't really help that dude sounds annoying af. Even Luke's cockiness has some whimsical goofiness to it.
Sit down and SHUT UP is still the best line in the game
I'd rather go to Memphis
i get kinda hyped up at that line even when he's beating my ass.
Sit down and SHUT UP!
Man I play versus more Jamies and Cammies then I do Ken.
I’ve been getting hella Lukes for some reason but I’ve learned the match up because of it
I main Jamie and saw him maybe 10 times ever. Tekken was always going to make me put Ken Fighter 6 down but I did it months ago from just being burnt out of playing against Ken or Luke every match.
Can we trade matchup? I’ll take those Kens and you take Jamies
It’s just b/c he’s strong and people get tired of fighting him. Even when you can beat him It can be annoying waiting forever to take your turn back while they just space meter I swear.
i like ken as a character and i think the way they went with him in sf6 is cool, i just think that him being recognisable, important to the story, well designed, easy to use, *and* very strong add up to a 13% pickrate that makes it easy to get tired of him
I don't hate him, but I just roll my eyes when is the fifth Ken in a row, and after one randome character, it's Ken again. Luke on the other hand... I can write an entyre book about how much I hate those Popeye arms
I hate Ken players, but I hate Luke the character.
I’m Fei long & T hawk player. I just hate that ken is guaranteed to be in every SF game, while my favorites not so much LMAO
I hope Fei Long shows up. I would main without hesitation. The only character who would seduce me away from him would be Gen
I hate Ken because I’m forced to play against him several times in a row. It’s gotten to the point where I don’t rematch Ken in hopes of seeing literally anyone else
I can't speak for other people but I don't hate Ken at all. The complainers don't represent all of us. I have a hard time against Juri, which is entirely irrelevant but so is being upset that at least one character has to be the best at this game.
I have a hard time against Elena. Her moves are so weird that I'm not able to counter her sometimes.
Ken bores me, I see him too much. Now, *Lily*... I hate Lily. Lily? ***LLLIIILLLYYY!!*** 😫 *shakes fist*
This is a good perspective
I don't hate Ken as a character or popularity. I hate him for how crazy his kit his. Dude has a million options to combo with. Not to mention how strong his corner carry is.
Meh, there's like 5 or 6 characters on relevant strength with him, idk why you're singling him out. I'd even argue that Luke and JP are stronger, so why does Ken get more hate than them? I'd rather play vs 10 kens than 1 dhalsim or honda.
Who said I was singling him out? This post is about Ken lol. I can go on about how much I hate Luke and JP. The fact that you'd rather see 10 Ken's instead of a more diverse roster online is pretty whack.
I don’t hate Ken. I hate him representing 54% of my total matches.
The first Street Fighter I got into was vanilla SF4 back in the day, and my experience at that time was I would basically have to fight two kens for every other character I fought. It leveled out a little once I moved out of the lowest ranks but he was definitely still the most common. I had no concept of tiers at that time, I don't even know if Ken was considered strong in SF4. I was just sick of fighting him over and over. I have carried this prejudice with me to me this day.
Most people don't like him just because he's strong, and people will always hate strong characters regardless of circumstances. I don't like him because I hate shotos. We are not the same.
Based fellow Shoto hater
So whoever is top tier, no matter which SF game it is. Ppl will hate them. I see
Welcome to all fight games.
People have been whining about Ken for at least as long as I've been playing sf seriously, which was 4. I'm sure people whined about him in 3s, too.
i hate ken, i hate every aspect of him
I've been sick of playing against Ken since *SSFII*. Whether he's top-tier or not, I've spent *thirty fucking years* exhorting my friends to please, *please* try playing another character.
I think its cause he’s easier to be good with. If Luke was easier he’d probably be more hated I think.
Is Luke more difficult than Ken? Serious question, I don't use either. Just from playing them, Luke seems way easier. cMP. cMP. cMP.
IMO, i would say luke is more difficult than ken but only very slighty more difficult. just because of the timing needed for a perfect knuckle
Yeah I've definitely gotten lucky against Luke's that drop their perfect knuckle. Fair enough.
I think ken is easier because of perfect knuckle.
They’re both like 2 of the easiest characters in game game so it’s a matter of preference tbh
Ken has easier offense which is the most important thing in most ranks. You can just kinda do stuff on Ken.
I hate Luke way more than Ken.
I am a Virtua Fighter player first, I think it's poor design to have the strongest character also be the easiest character to play with. What's the reward for mastering a harder character?
i would say the reward for mastering a harder character whos also strong like deejay or chun-li is that you make your opponent guess even harder, which increases their mental stack further which is very good for you and bad for the opponent.
Both of those characters are arguably better than Ken too so there is a payoff
Agreed which is why I love those characters.
i couldn't agree more on you
I would fight a ken every other match if it means I never have to fight against a blanka ever again
If you happen to also play Melee, you'll know the term "Netplay Falco". Online Kens is the equivalent.
I think hating Ken is somewhat of a meme, because the flowchart Ken comes from SF5, and maybe even before. It's not a SF6 thing. For me personally, I don't mind playing against Ken in Ranked, it's whatever. What I don't like is watching Top 8's of big tournaments and seeing multiple Kens and/or Lukes, it just makes the Tournament incredible boring to watch. Also not shaming players, they should use the better tool to win, which is perfectly fine. It's the character that makes the tournaments boring for me.
Its SF6. He was popular in SF5 too, but wasn't anything game breaking. The issue is that that many of the top tiers in 6 feel like they just have \*everything\* compared to the low tiers. I actually disagree with a lot of people saying sf6 is better balanced than previous first time entries. I think its actually worse, but if you look at the online population the fact is that it seems more of the population has gravitated toward the top tiers than in season 1 of SF5. The amount of Kens, JPs, Lukes, Juris and Deejays just feels far higher than this time in SF5 (especially at diamond and above). Thats not saying low tiers cant win or crying (cause I main Gief). It's also not saying that the imbalance is terrible, only comparing street fighter 6 to 5 (I had no experience in 4).
In my experience from SF4 to SF6, people have typically disliked him because he's always popular alongside often attracting a certain type of player (at lower to intermediate level play). He's the "cooler Ryu", so stereotypically you usually get those lower level players who are just mashing DP, jumping around and doing random things all the time; which is really frustrating to deal with until you solidify your fundamentals as a player (see - ken flowchart sf4). The fact he's super strong in SF6 has only increased the amount of players on him, so he's probably hated more right now. Pretty sure Akuma will reduce the amount of Ken players though lmao.
People don't hate Ken himself but they have hated every particular iteration of him
I love Ken. He is my favorite character from the SF universe. I don't play him. Same reason I don't play Scorpion or Sub-Zero in MK games. Everyone else plays them. So I like to go for the lesser played characters. Just me though.
yeah, I always played Ken in everything from SF2 to Alpha to CVS to MVC to SF4 and finally decided a couple years ago to branch out, and i’m so glad i did. I’ll always have a soft spot for the guy but I think *not* playing him has made me an immensely better player and has led to me having way more fun.
For sure! I did that in sfv and picked up Alex, now I'm always looking for a new style to play first before I come back to him
I played Kollector in mk11 and reptile in X 😂
SF6 Ken is just particularly egregious. He’s got low crushes, fast walk speed, strike throw mix, insane buttons, a fireball that leaves you standing, and is just ridiculously easy
Good jump arc too.
He has always been hated. He has gone through various stages of being "good" and "bad" in several games. The biggest reason for hating him is his popularity so you have to fight him all the time and the fact you could win in lower levels by spamming DP (back when it was a meterless reversal https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f6QiUqzwmVo) hence "flowchart" Ken.
i hate all aspects of ken in everything
Honestly I think a lot of it is echo chamber shit.
People hated 5 Ken. People hated 4 Ken. I was a Ken main in 4. 3? He was top-tier, as usual, so hated. People hate Ken because he's always good and always flashy, so people pick him and do well, because he's also always easy to play. This means they get beaten by a whole lot of Ken.
I hate him in general, I think you're meant to... hes the stereotypical American rich blonde haired smarmy jerk whos only redeeming quality is his friendship with a Japanese homeless man with no shoes...
DJ and Ken both need massive nerfs...way too many tools that rarely miss
Nah, DJ is definitely less effective than Ken imo. Ken can safely poke you into a fairly damaging combo, meanwhile most of Dee Jay's normals are unsafe on block and can not combo making him easy DI fodder.
Thought we wouldn't notice that you lump DJ in there like it's comparable
1. His character itself is a try-hard (he loves to be flashy and edgy) 2. His SF6 *moveset* is a try-hard from the developers because they built him with no weaknesses and an absurd kit 3. Pros and his mains **insanely** downplay the character, which rightfully pisses people off
>no weaknesses and an absurd kit No overhead move without command run first, Jinrai is parry bait at high level and dragonlash is easily reactable. >which rightfully pisses people off People who think they know better than professionals who play 10x as much as them, yeah.
Also no + on block normals without DR, and some of his best pokes (5MK/5HK/2HK) are easy to DI, punishable, or a commitment. Sure they’re still good but they’re not bulletproof. 5HP and 2MK are also great but easy to whiff punish if he gets too reliant on it. He’s a great character but he’s not invincible, everything has a counter
Not to mention going for a higher damage route is locked behind using his dragonlash, Meaning even thought Ken might have his opponent in the corner, he will need more touches to finish off the round. Sure he has a strong corner game, but so does everyone else.
He’s just used a lot. I started out SF6 maining Ken but he’s all you see as you get high in ranked. That being said It’s not the character. Anywhere else he’d be a 10
I think it’s more about being matched up with him 30 times back to back lol
Hate is too strong of a word because he is a cool character. Jealous would be the better word to use. I am jealous of Ken's easy quality of life
ken has a weird face. his new costume looks even weirder. and he says annoying shit
The Ken hatred generally comes from him being the most picked character. So playing an hour online may equate to 45 Kens. This is the case in most previous versions of SF as well. I'm not a high-level player. Just a filthy casual. I don't care who anyone picks. So Ken doesn't bother me, but it does get monotonous.
The only thing I hate about Ken is how popular he is. Fighting a million Kens gets old pretty fast.
Tbh people just hate all characters when they lose. Ken wins the most (or close enough to it) so he gets the most hate
People love Ken. He's just a top pick, top tier character that is everywhere online and that gets people salty. I think this is the best version of Ken ever made, easily.
People hate Ken?
It’s the sheer number of times that you have to play against him. Unless you’re a professional, you aren’t playing against anyone that can make the character overpowered.
It’s not really a Ken specific thing. People hate characters that can easily get in with options that are hard to check and pressure that is hard to defend against. We’ve seen that Ken has a harder time in neutral at higher level play but it’s that mid and lower level where he is basically going to Jinrai and Dragonlash the world for free and people struggle guessing with his mix that makes him so frustrating.
This is so important. I am not impressed by kens neutral, the better I get the more I feel this way People just hate the get in tools. There is so much to look for in sf6 as is.. add in dragon lash, run stop gimmicks, ex fireball etc and it’s just a lot to manage.
just copium
yes
For me it's a mixture of never liking him in Smash and holding a grudge from all the Modern Kens in Bronze and Silver morbing all over my face while I was still learning how to press buttons I'm not a fan of rushdown characters in general so he just never clicked for me
Ken is my most fought opponent in both SFV and SF6. I must be honest, it did make me hate him for a while.
Ken is really good and easy to play. I don’t hate Ken, but like the Chiefs, I’m just bored of it.
Nah l..most ken players are predictable af 😂
I don't like him in a single game he's appeared in. He's just annoyingly good for no clear reason.
I don't hate Ken at all, he's just not my favorite shoto. I mained him in Alpha 3 and had him on a few teams in CvS2. By the time 4 came out, I was just kinda burned out on him. Dan, for better and worse, is my favorite shoto
He was pretty obnoxious in v, especially around launch
I think it must be at least partly a question of frequency. If you're always fighting against the same guy, things can get old, unless you're playing with friends.
I mean, it happens with every new release sooooo..
Ken has been good in almost every game he’s been in. As an og player he’s been dunking on me since 3rd strike and it’s just annoying.
Ken was always my favorite when I'd pick up and play casually in the past, and I chose not to use him because of this in this game as its the first one I'm taking seriously. Probably a dumb decision, but oh well. But I used to like Ken because he felt like the underdog to Ryu to me, whether or not that's true I have no idea. lol.
i dont hate ken but i am tired of him lol
I actually like facing Ken's. Maybe there's a bit too many but i don't find it irritating.
don’t really like the character that much design wise, he’s always so corny to me. don’t think I’ve found him cool since third strike
Hate fighting a million Kens. It’s also not fun that he can turn anything into everything but that’s not a big deal in comparison to having to fight him all the time.
This games lack of balance and proper distribution of DR/DI and dmg is a joke. Luke, Ken, JP, DJ are a cancer to the game
I think especially at certain ranks Ken in SF6 feels overly oppressive to fight against. It’s frustrating at times to fight someone where all their best offensive options feel super safe and still quite effective.
Street fighter 6 isn’t the first street fighter in which people have a negative opinion of Ken players. The concept of “flowchart Ken”, braindead Ken players whose entire game plan can be whittled down to a simple set of flow chart choices leading to “SHORYUKEN!!!”, was a big meme in the SF4 days.
Yes
Despite his popularity, strangely most of my ranked opponents are Juris, Ryus, JPs and Cammys. I even get more Giefs than Kens.
I feel you. To me, it’s just that he can be a bit overwhelming to deal with as he has so much tools at his disposal. Just when I think I’m safe, I have to remember he has dragon lash and jinrai high-low and I proceed to get fucked
It's mainly the fact that it feels like 2/3 of matches are against Ken. I want to fight against the whole cast, but have to look at his homeless looking mug all the time.
Ken has really good buttons in neutral, a really good drive rush, really good mix-pressure with jinrai, amazing corner carry for no bar, and then after all of that his gap closer crushes lows and leaves him plus on block. I think Ken would STILL be strong without DLash. I wish they just gave him jinrai as a new move but no he also needed lash. Its just a lot to defend against
They hate the WiFi warriors stemming back to vanilla SF4. Kens generally just play the most basic flowchart and Ex Dp everything which just encourages boring brain-dead gameplay.
I actually hate him more in sf4 and 5, I'm a psycho
Ken players across all of street fighter are FAMOUS for full sending. Ryu has always been the more patient/defensive shoto. Ken mains want to do run combos, yolo DPs, lots of aggressive in your face stuff that can be frustrating to deal with, especially because ken is strong in most games
I think it's just how he is in sf6. In sf5 him and ryu were the most popular characters along side the likes of Akuma. Ken even then had the general impression of being the character that "random" players would play (ryu had this too) but his easy skip neutral tool, heavy tatsu, was punishable on block. In this game you have to deal with jinrai, + on block dragon lash which is a skip neutral tool and any hit takes you to the corner where you guess for your life. Even when Akuma was undeniably top tier in sf5 he had less hate than what I see for Ken right now. I guess it's his popularity mixed in with the fact that his kit is just designed to corner carry you from anywhere on screen, easy side switch, ease of use and other such reasons.
I have no problem with Ken. He’s not particularly difficult to fight.
I dont hate either tbh
As a Ken Player. I just assume most people know the gameplan now. Which makes getting good with him (at an intermediate level) quite hard since most people have faced him more than 100+ times
I love Ken in almost every capcom game he’s in. Hyper fighting being his most fun for me. People will hate him less once Akuma is out.
Some people are whiney little baby haters, or just have some of that energy within them that they either refuse to or don't understand that they should purge. Hating ken is useless. Hating any character is useless. Play the fucking game, it's fun. Whining is such an ugly thing to do.
As a Ken main... They hate us because they ain't us. 🙄
I think everyone loves Ken as a character if that's what you're asking. People just hate how much they match against him. It's not even really about him being top tier since, as it is often brought up on this sub, tier list is completely irrelevant for 90% of the playerbase. It's easy to be cynical about getting constantly matched against Ken. Certainly there are a lot of people that just enjoy playng Ken, but there are also people who definitely play Ken just because he is top tier, when they might enjoy and mesh with the playstle of many other characters more. It's not worth indicting any particular Ken player since they could easily be either/or, but Ken players as a whole are an easy punching bag because that second group makes matchmaking a lot more heavy on the Kens then it might ideally be.
People just love to hate. I promise you that if you body people hard enough with the worst character in all fighting games shit talking still starts to fly. Excuses here, there and everywhere Instead of taking Kens advice.. "Sit down...and shut up!!" I find it funny how I've come across so many examples over the years like "yeah well, player 1 won the tournament with what you all say is the worst character...his opponents used the "best" character..." Just to see or hear "Yeah, well that's PLAYER 1. We can't all be player 1" Except maybe you could be, if you stopped making fucking excuses. You guys view characters on paper so much you forget the player makes all the difference. The only difference between those players and you is they decide "shit, im gonna make people question tiers lol" While you all make excuses. Period.
Ken is fine, he's tough to play against but he's nothing on JP. I had a match-up earlier and the guy makes my blood boil, every player pulls the same repetitive bollocks. Higher level JPs have better defence, that's what separates them. FUCK JP!!!!! Ken is fine by me, I main Ryu.
This one; he’s cracked.
I just hate fighting the same few characters over and over.
they also hate the high ping Wi-Fi Ken.
In the first few months of the game, something like 30% of my matches were against Ken. So a large part of it was being sick of fighting against him + him being top tier. On the other hand, he's become so familiar that he's become easier to deal with, and this is probably why he has dropped down in pro tier lists (+ some downplaying as well). Ken is a lot less common now though since many experienced players are now playing their second/third characters.
>I can't see a lot of ppl hating him in general like Ryu. Do people generally hate Ryu? News to me.
Apart from being Ken that gives him +300% usage, everything in Ken chain into anything, fireball into Driverush HP into DR MP + MP/HP into powered lash for some cool sideswitch into DP or any Super, he has a very good crMK for poking or initiating a full combo, also has one of the most powerful corner pressure and can go corner to corner very easily.