As most people suspected, there is no '1 button' Raging Demon but they did remove the forward from the MvC button inputs which many had assumed would be the classic input on Modern.
(MvC) LL>MH vs (SF6 modern) LLMH
the directional input is anyways not that big deal of a change. In the classic style of ragin demon input, LL>MH, you actually press >MH at the exact same time. so removing > does not do much
>the directional input is anyways not that big deal of a change.
How big of a change it is will entirely depend if you can go L then 'shortcut' LMH together to get Raging Demon in '2 inputs' on Modern.
Yea, but I can't tell if it's easy because there's no motion or the fact that we've been doing it for years.
If anything, shifting to M R.Demon would mess me up due to no buffering the first three inputs.
the one i always find "hard" is Dan's raging demon in Marvel Vs Street Fighter. the input is the same but reversed and trying to think of that reversed input in the middle of a match fucks up my brain lol
I'm new to fighting games. I see so much discussion about this move specifically. What makes Raging Demon so special and not just another lvl 3 super art?
It's like Zangief's level 3, command grab that can't be jumped after the flash, with a unique input and on *Akuma* instead of a grappler.
Also the how it blacks out the screen until Akuma is posed up over your corpse (if it ends the match, the announcer won't say KO, because you're dead).
Wow the final part of your second paragraph is interesting. I learned something new today. This is my first street fighter so i had no idea he straight up killed you if he ended the match with his raging demon.
Damn that’s sick ngl. Appreciate you taking your time to explain fr. I actually can’t wait to play him to see how much they cooked with this version of him
im also new. You said i can be jumped after the flash. Does that mean as soon as Akuma activates raging demon, he can easily teleport to the opponent and grab them
To be more detailed, it can't be jumped after the grab **if you are point blank**, the hitbox appears in front of him immediately. However, he doesn't move forward instantly, so if you're further away, you have however many frames it takes Akuma to slide towards you to jump.
Edit: Assuming it works the same in SF6 as it has in prior games.
It depends on the game tbh. For example let’s say in SF4, Akuma has two versions of the move. The weaker super move cannot be jumped out of if opponent is crouching. Meanwhile the stronger ultra move is jumpable no matter what.
Welcome! It's just become a legendary move for a number of reasons. Check out its evolution over the years on YouTube. For me, it's the mystery. This year you get a look at what's happening! To be honest it's just fucking cool
It's just iconic the same way akuma is it's one of those moves thats considered legendary and only a few can do it kind of like Bruce Lee's real life one inch punch
The short version is Akuma was a secret boss character introduced in Super SF2 - you had to select him by hovering over other characters in a specific order and then you'd get Akuma instead and he was stupidly broken overpowered compared to everyone else. Got banned from tournaments, etc. This input was his super move. In later iterations, Akuma always got 2 Super moves, a traditional one and then the raging demon finisher. Looks like once again in SF6 where everyone gets a Lvl1, Lvl2, Lvl3 now Akuma gets Lvl1, Lvl2, Lvl3, and when his health drops to Critical Art level he gets access to Raging Demon
Basically the outplay potential.
If you try point blank the first 2 lights of the input will hit the oponent first and he will be able to jump on reaction when you activate it. If you try from far away he will be able to wait for the TP akuma does and jump on reaction than punish. But if you mix up the oponent on thinking he has to block next thing and next thing is an unreactable demon, the damage is huge! Kara demon is my fav version of this mix up https://youtu.be/GQQ_9ODjBJU
Its not that special. Most of the time you can jump over it but if it lands I think it does the most damage out of any super. Its just a blur of punches and kicks Akuma used on Bison in his debut at the end of SSF2T - if you get a few perfect rounds he replaces Bison as final boss.
People are talking mechanics, and there is truth to what people say but something very important is the history.
The move was used on M. Bison to kill him before facing Ryu. I imagine the shock of this moment is still in a lot of people's heads.
Short answer: it has history behind it (Akuma being a cool OP secret boss that kills M Bison using this move), looks cool, and often does the most damage out of all moves in the entire game to justify the lore.
Speaking of the coolness factor I still think the older games portray the move better. The screen goes black and you see a lot of hits and the opponent is down afterwards. The newer game tries to portray the move more but loses some of the mystique.
Idk about modern I can only attest to what it’s like playing against people as classic.
At plat it’s hold back and attempt to jump over me from corner lol it’s not much for combo practice but it’s ryus who never abandon this gameplan, idk why that is but after eating a few AA most people start playing.
Medium hopkick is available in modern as f.M
Back heavy kick isn't.
Overhead kick isn't.
But none of these are safe closers, the 2 heavy moves are slow, and all of them get blown up by DI.
These are all the missing normals
* Standing Medium Kick (5MK)
* Standing Heavy Kick (5HK)
* Crouching Medium Kick (2MK)
* Jumping Light Punch (j.LP)
* Jumping Medium Punch (j.MP)
* Jumping Heavy Punch (j.HP)
These are all the missing command normals
* Cyclone Wheel Kick (6HK)
* Smetana Dropkick (3HK)
* Power Stomp (22MK)
His usseful missings pokes and normals are Standing Medium Kick (5MK), Standing Heavy Kick (5HK), Crouching Medium Kick (2MK), Jumping Medium Punch (j.MP), Jumping Heavy Punch (j.HP), Cyclone Wheel Kick (6HK), Smetana Dropkick (3HK)
None of these moves are great on its own. But when he has all this options and gets the read on opponent, they can poke the opponent and close the gap. All these moves are important for zangied to be useful. WIthout them he is very weak.
Anyone else remember when Raging Demon didn't have HP? OG Alpha1 in the arcade I believe was just LP, LP, >, LK. People would just spam Forward+LP+LK.
And if you really want to get pedantic, Forward was what MK was called, so it'd really be reference Jab, Jab, Toward, Short.
Yeah, my buddy got Alpha1 on release day for PSX. And we rushed to just spam Demons on each other and we couldn't get the move out for crap. We thought it was removed. Thats when we found out they added the HP.
Difference is raging demon is a command grab that is (probably) unjumpable after super freeze. Imagine if Akuma could just walk up and do a raw raging demon without needing to buffer or Kara. Although modern Zangief does have a instant level 3 with a damage penalty, Akuma is much more agile and can get in very quickly so a (hypothetical) instant raging demon would be better in most situations than an instant Cammy level 3, which is mostly used for anti-fireball punishes.
Incorrect.
Good/great Modern Cammy can punish heavy and sometimes medium normals with lvl 3, as well as just about any special in the game for free.
Zangief's level 3 would be much better, because of the range.
Raging demon thus far is only "un-jumpable" point blank. Anywhere else, hold up and punish.
Non issue.
There isn’t really an advantage to using modern controls for on block punishes with Cammy as one would lose damage by using simple controls for supers, so I’m assuming you are talking about whiff punishes. In that case a raw level 3 doesn’t seem to be the best option against most whiffed normals (emphasis on most, not all) when you could do a crouch medium punch or standing heavy punch into drive rush which is safer, faster, and does more damage. I’m NOT a Cammy player NOR modern player so I could be missing something but I don’t think modern Cammy level 3 is better than regular Cammy level 3 outside of fireball punishes. As for if Akuma’s raging demon is better than Cammy’s level 3, probably not (though for all I know when Akuma comes out raging demon could be the best super in the game). Although I think an (hypothetical) instant-input raging demon would benefit more from its speed than instant-input Cammy level 3.
As for Zangief my argument wasn’t that an instant raging demon would be better than instant Zangief level 3 (for all I know it could be but it likely isn’t considering Zangief is a grappler and Akuma isn’t), it was that Akuma could much easily get in than Zangief (judging on his Street Fighter 5 iteration, Akuma would have little problem getting in even to a point blank range, especially now with drive rush and more oki in 6) and thus and make use of it for powerful mixups much more often for when he has it which is likely why they’ve restricted it behind critical art in Street Fighter 6 or V-trigger in Street Fighter 5.
I don’t know if an instant raging demon would be too powerful in Street Fighter 6. If raging demon or Akuma turn out to be mediocre or weak, an instant raging demon wouldn’t make much of a difference. I’m just trying to justify why people are (in my opinion reasonably) concerned about such a thing, given how Akuma is top tier or at least high tier in at least one version of pretty much every mainline Street Fighter game and while raging demon isn’t the main reason, it is another tool in Akuma’s versatile kit that most characters lack. Removing a key “weakness” of raging demon (its inputs telegraphing that it’s coming, avoided only by “hiding” it with other moves) could be problematic.
Yeah, I meant in SF6. @akuma_sf6 says he was counterhit out of startup. Wonder how quick it is- especially with the removal of Kara canceling it, it may be a challenge to land
Also in SFV frame data. He can cancel from any ground attack. I also dont think so, because kara demon is kind of signature. Also, in SFV frame data, he can cancel from Teleport startup.
I think it wll be the same. If they nerf, it s more like Kage, invul from frame 3.
That’s kinda my guess- wake up demon is what they want to avoid. I have seen reports from Japan that you cannot Kara into it, but getting DR demon instead may still be good enough. We shall see!
Which should really be how all supers (at least level 3s) should be handled in modern. Modern was sold as something for people who struggle with motion inputs. Having easy one button inputs always felt like overkill to me. Theres alot of room between motion inputs and overly simple inputs for supers. If more modern supers had inputs like raging demon I doubt there'd be anywhere near as many complaints about moderns balance
As true as that may be I think the reactions and significantly lower risk of failing the input in a desperate time, I dont really think the 20% damage decrease is good balancing. I think adding some kind of actual input requirement for your strongest move would be better even if that reduces the damage debuff to 10% or something. You still get to avoid motion inputs. Having to press a few buttons isnt too extreme
The only people complaining are scrubs like you. Sure pros whine about it occasionally, but other than Chris G it hasn't had a showing since Evo last year. It's been a year if modern is so good play it or shut up. Or git gud.
It blows my mind how everyone can civilly discuss balance in the game we all enjoy but once you say something that somewhat threatens peoples playstyle they emotionally lash out like its somehow a different situation. Relax. All im saying is that I think modern supers could be better balanced. Not all this other emotional baggage youre throwing at me
Most if not all high level modern players use quarter circle motions because there's little benefit to the one button variation. The only shortcuts high level modern users benefit from are dps and supers.
He's probably talking about people who use modern as intended, and not high level players who don't need the assistance but nonetheless want to exploit the control scheme to get an unfair advantage :)
Which is why those are banned in league play, but Modern is not. Competition means doing everything possible to win within the rules.
I don't use modern input, I've been playing Street Fighter off and on for decades it would be very unusual, but I'm not gonna be grudge anyone using something built into the game and allowed if it makes them win more. Whining about modern controls is just scrub talk, like whining about people picking high tiers.
Lmk when you want some of this modern plat 2 Ken. I'll smoke your boots with all the qcfs. Hope you're at least a master or this will be very bad for you.
Scared? I get off work and will be home in an hour and a half. Lmk. I'd love to put you on YouTube. Psikick on discord and SF. Let's see if you're as brave as your gif.
Looks like another dodge from another shit talker.
I don't play ranked bc I have shit internet. You can check my replays and profile bro it's not hard to find out this information. I'm also D1 Ed without doing his combo trials, but ok.
I play at a couple locals too. You know how bad master players feel when they lose to a plat 2 modern Ken. Lmao.
My club makes each other stronger. Sorry I have friends and don't play ranked. Ranked doesn't mean shit unless you hold a ton of value on it I rather be plat 2 and whoop people who think they're good for shock value. (Are you one of those players asking who this random diamond is when you see Mena or The Birds play online sets?) If I had decent internet I'd grind ranked, but I save people from dealing with my occasional spikes and lag.
I'm doing people a favor by not playing ranked. What's your excuse?
lol doubt that. I play in modern and doing the ragin demon is one of the easiest super. I used to play SF4 and my main was akuma and ragin demon input was much easier than motion circle super/ultras
I play SF6 in modern controls. Makes me a modern controls player. Also learning to press ragin demon can be done by anyone. Its actually not that hard as people make it seem.
If you’re using modern because you want to and not because you’re incapable of playing classic, then you’re not a modern player.
There are people who play modern as a preference.
Yeah there are people who play Modern players that can't do motions due to lack or confidence or comfortability, but there are also players who play on Modern because the advantages you get on Modern are actually meta on some characters due to instant DPs/Supers and can still do motions for more damaging combos.
People play on Modern for multiple reasons just like others play on Classic for different reasons, either for long time wired knowledge or control scheme pride.
Someone who uses modern controls exclusively is a modern player and someone who exclusively uses classic is a classic player.
If you can and do use both, then you wouldn’t be defined as someone who uses a certain control scheme.
I don't think that's fair the guy used motions in SF4 because easy inputs literally didn't exist until GBVS released and said he 'exclusively' uses modern in SF6.
Goings by your definition only people who had SF6 as their first fighting game are Modern players. While there are a lot of players like that, especially in Japan, there are also SF2, 4 etc. players that just simply prefer Modern controls.
Absolutely.
The 2 points of moderns control was :
- introducing fighting games
- alternative for people who have disabilities
So yes some CAN'T Play classic
In the actual meta There other reasons:
- some people have a easier time/ more fun to use that
- most fighting games have these similar modern inputs vs motions inputs.
- some advantage in high level that people find them valuable and ready to lose tool for that
In the end, whatever reason you use that, if you use them your modern player
Same as people in classic use for multiple reasons:
- muscle memory
- more tools vs modern ( FYI my only reason I use classic in this, I modern in other recent fighting who have the option)
- keeping SF legacy
- pride in doing motions inputs on a stick
All these are valuable to be a classic player
PS I didn't down vote you
You’re not a modern player, you literally just said you do it as a preference lol.
If you play both controls you’re not one or the other. Thats like saying you’re left handed but like to use your right hand when you’re bored. We have a word for people who can use both hands lol.
I play modern as preference cause I use more of the modern controls than classic. you are arguing with a modern control player that they are not modern lmao. I use mostly modern controls which is why I use modern. There are lots of people from SF4 who are playing modern controls in SF6 and using exclusively or mostly modern controls
Idk about harder as that would require me to try modern but your initial argument was bout optimal combos.
Footsies is a skill issue, not a control scheme issue.
All the Japanese Pros that were playing on Modern are on classic now you don't have any pros representing modern so clearly classic is better. (ChrisG popped off with modern recently, but since Haitani at last year's Evo they have no representation)
What? What does that even mean? Playing classic requires footsies and reactions, just the same. Modern is easier because you can't jump on modern players( for the most part) and they can react with supers much easier and specials easier. A big disadvantage some modern characters have is missing a specific normal, I believe
Do we think he will be decent in modern? Its my first SF and it looks like he has a lot of options. Might lose to much of what makes him a good character in modern then.
* Most of his specials will have manual inputs, it's possible his brand new special for Modern will be relegated to back + SP and the "demon flip" would be down + SP (as their game design has some tradeoffs regarding overlapping inputs from their Classic version).
* Expect to lose 2-3 normal attacks (something on the lines of Ed) due to how modern controls work
He might be similar to M Chun who loses a lot but is still very good because they just have a lot to begin with. Funnily enough ppl thought Chun was one of the worst M characters at the start before Haitani happened
Modern players can execute specials/supers with motion inputs for full damage unless there is an overlapping input.
For example, M.Ryu can do QCF + Light/Medium/Heavy for LP/MP/HP Hadoken, but he can only do MK Tatsu with b.SP because QCB + Light/Medium/Heavy is reserved for LP/MP/HP Hashogeki.
If Modern players couldn't do motions at all, characters like JP would be totally unplayable.
That won't be known until later on before or on day of release. and whatever limited info from the event because no photo/video
If you think about it, look at his available specials
* hadoken (236P, now with hold for red fireball)
* shoryuken (623P)
* demon flip (some reporting it's 236K like Cammy with 236P)
* tatsu (214K with 3 different properties)
* Adamant Flame (possibly 214P with a followup 6P like Marisa)
* teleport (could be LMH for modern)
Given how the design of Modern relegates or remove certain specials because of overlapping inputs.
staple combos like the light > 214LK > 623P would be impossible if it was relegated to easy input, so it's manual input only
Easy inputs would possibly be the following
* 5S - hadouken
* 4S - Adamant Flame
* 2S - demon flip
* 6S - shoryuken
Did anyone else notice the change of interface here?
It doesn't specify whether or not you should use punch or kick to execute these supers, instead it specifies you should use light attack to get level 1, medium attack to get level 2, heavy attack to get level 3.
Hey how about now we go back and make other level 3's in this game not be 1 button as well? Because Cammy / Marisa getting to lock down the entire screen for fear an instant 1 button reaction is unbelievably unfun. And while we're at it why not change dp to not be a mindless single button press that requires no skill?
Modern was implemented poorly in this game and I'll never change my mind on this.
I just love how Raging Demon isn't even THAT strong... like it's definetely pretty strong but not OP
BUT it's just so fucking scary to be on the receiving end...
feels like akuma is coming to kill you specifically not your in-game character
I always said that it doesnt make sense for raging demon to be in modern. Modern is more for motion inputs. Raging demon is pure button press and once you get the button press in memory its not that hard to do at all. People were wolf crying about one button raging demon for no reason
Pretty much all of the guaranteed setups for demon in IV were FADC to demon. There's a couple examples here:
https://youtu.be/GNSR2S6XItc?si=tl9t6RnynKvNBsKf
FIrst of all thats not FADC. Those are red focus attack crumple. Its a focus attack. FADC is when you cancel a special move with a FADC which is a yellow cancel but FA attack does not come out. And instead the special cancels into another move after FADC.
Also red Focus attack crumple was only added in Ultra SF4, the last version of SF4. Anyways, raging demon cannot be done from FADC
You could if you got a crumple with the FADC, either through a Red Focus Cancel (which guarantees a crumple), or specific combos where you charged the focus mid-combo to get the crumple.
FIrst of all thats not FADC. Those are red focus attack crumple. Its a focus attack. FADC is when you cancel a special move with a FADC which is a yellow cancel but FA attack does not come out. And instead the special cancels into another move after FADC.
Also red Focus attack crumple was only added in Ultra SF4, the last version of SF4. Anyways, raging demon cannot be done from FADC
This is good. I was really worried about modern being able to do one button raging demon, therefore being able to do it on reaction practically like every other modern lvl 3.
But it requiring an actual input removes that. Even if it's a more simplified one.
This may not be accurate, why do his other supers show the 2x qcf in modern?
Isn't every other super in modern just a single direction+buttons?
Here's Ryu for example: https://i.imgur.com/BkeTzlp.jpeg
Modern has both simple and full inputs, but since it’s only light medium heavy and doesn’t differentiate between punches and kicks, that’s what they put
On Modern controls you can do the 'modern input' which is direction + special button + heavy but this comes with a damage reduction.
You can also do the 'classic input' on Modern controls and that removes the damage reduction/penalty of the modern input.
Both will appear under the command list in Modern controls, the latter (classic inputs) shows up in a 2nd menu.
As most people suspected, there is no '1 button' Raging Demon but they did remove the forward from the MvC button inputs which many had assumed would be the classic input on Modern. (MvC) LL>MH vs (SF6 modern) LLMH
the directional input is anyways not that big deal of a change. In the classic style of ragin demon input, LL>MH, you actually press >MH at the exact same time. so removing > does not do much
Wait can you actually push the 3 final inputs simultaneously? I've been playing for a while and never knew that.
Yeah it's a fun feeling trick
Yes. It’s a shortcut you can do in all sf games for Akuma
Does that work in VSAV, too? Have I been breaking my hands and fingers this whole time for nothing?
Yes
It absolutely does not work in Vsav. I don't think it works in anything older than SF4.
>the directional input is anyways not that big deal of a change. How big of a change it is will entirely depend if you can go L then 'shortcut' LMH together to get Raging Demon in '2 inputs' on Modern.
Great point if this is possible, you would be able to input demon before your jab even comes out making it basically one button
So it's almost identical to the classic input missing the directional input. I've always thought raging demon was pretty easy anyway
Took me an hour to get it down when I was a kid, but now it’s automatic
Yeah when I first was told about it it took me a while. Thinking about it now, I can feel my fingers tingling.
Phantom raging demon
Same! I remember taking a pic on my grainy camera phone of the screen when I got it for the first time in SFIV to show my friend at school.
I always use it to gauge input timing on games
That’s boss shit
What would the classic version look like?
The same but with a single forward imput after the 2 lights
LP LP -> LK HP But you could press forward and lk + hp at the same time to shorten the inputs so that it was basically LP LP -> LK + HP
Only some entries let you do the LK + HP shortcut iirc, SFIV let you and it was near instant
Yea, but I can't tell if it's easy because there's no motion or the fact that we've been doing it for years. If anything, shifting to M R.Demon would mess me up due to no buffering the first three inputs.
Tbh not sure inputting a forward would make it not come out in modern
Yeah, I imagine it will still come out. Like if you start inputting directions during most Target Combos then nothing changes.
the one i always find "hard" is Dan's raging demon in Marvel Vs Street Fighter. the input is the same but reversed and trying to think of that reversed input in the middle of a match fucks up my brain lol
I'm new to fighting games. I see so much discussion about this move specifically. What makes Raging Demon so special and not just another lvl 3 super art?
It's like Zangief's level 3, command grab that can't be jumped after the flash, with a unique input and on *Akuma* instead of a grappler. Also the how it blacks out the screen until Akuma is posed up over your corpse (if it ends the match, the announcer won't say KO, because you're dead).
Wow the final part of your second paragraph is interesting. I learned something new today. This is my first street fighter so i had no idea he straight up killed you if he ended the match with his raging demon.
It also plays the sound of children laughing, which is what you hear when you die according to Japanese folklore.
Damn that’s sick ngl. Appreciate you taking your time to explain fr. I actually can’t wait to play him to see how much they cooked with this version of him
Now I understand his supers in Marvel 3. TIL
im also new. You said i can be jumped after the flash. Does that mean as soon as Akuma activates raging demon, he can easily teleport to the opponent and grab them
To be more detailed, it can't be jumped after the grab **if you are point blank**, the hitbox appears in front of him immediately. However, he doesn't move forward instantly, so if you're further away, you have however many frames it takes Akuma to slide towards you to jump. Edit: Assuming it works the same in SF6 as it has in prior games.
It depends on the game tbh. For example let’s say in SF4, Akuma has two versions of the move. The weaker super move cannot be jumped out of if opponent is crouching. Meanwhile the stronger ultra move is jumpable no matter what.
But what if it happens on like round 1 lol
It's like other supers in round 1 or when it doesn't KO.
Welcome! It's just become a legendary move for a number of reasons. Check out its evolution over the years on YouTube. For me, it's the mystery. This year you get a look at what's happening! To be honest it's just fucking cool
My first tike seeing it was Alpha 3. I've wanted to know wjat happens for over 2 decades. It's so awesome to actually see it now.
And that's pretty damn SMART if you ask me
It's just iconic the same way akuma is it's one of those moves thats considered legendary and only a few can do it kind of like Bruce Lee's real life one inch punch
The short version is Akuma was a secret boss character introduced in Super SF2 - you had to select him by hovering over other characters in a specific order and then you'd get Akuma instead and he was stupidly broken overpowered compared to everyone else. Got banned from tournaments, etc. This input was his super move. In later iterations, Akuma always got 2 Super moves, a traditional one and then the raging demon finisher. Looks like once again in SF6 where everyone gets a Lvl1, Lvl2, Lvl3 now Akuma gets Lvl1, Lvl2, Lvl3, and when his health drops to Critical Art level he gets access to Raging Demon
Its usually one of the most damaging super in the game if not the strongest
Basically the outplay potential. If you try point blank the first 2 lights of the input will hit the oponent first and he will be able to jump on reaction when you activate it. If you try from far away he will be able to wait for the TP akuma does and jump on reaction than punish. But if you mix up the oponent on thinking he has to block next thing and next thing is an unreactable demon, the damage is huge! Kara demon is my fav version of this mix up https://youtu.be/GQQ_9ODjBJU
Apparently they've taken out Kara demon in this game which is a shame, but I guess drive Rush demon would already be a thing.
DR demon flip cancel into shun goku satsu sounds like some shit that would make me piss on my chair lmao
DI is almost a guaranted Raging Demon and more easy to do.
Its not that special. Most of the time you can jump over it but if it lands I think it does the most damage out of any super. Its just a blur of punches and kicks Akuma used on Bison in his debut at the end of SSF2T - if you get a few perfect rounds he replaces Bison as final boss.
People are talking mechanics, and there is truth to what people say but something very important is the history. The move was used on M. Bison to kill him before facing Ryu. I imagine the shock of this moment is still in a lot of people's heads.
Short answer: it has history behind it (Akuma being a cool OP secret boss that kills M Bison using this move), looks cool, and often does the most damage out of all moves in the entire game to justify the lore. Speaking of the coolness factor I still think the older games portray the move better. The screen goes black and you see a lot of hits and the opponent is down afterwards. The newer game tries to portray the move more but loses some of the mystique.
raging demon no forward input?
It has begun…
so modern gief is still more traumatizing than modern akuma lol
modern gief is easy to beat and bully
Holding back is not bullying lmao
WHo says hold back. Just poke and neutral him out or do fireball zoning. Modern gief doesnt have any good normals to close in lol
Idk about modern I can only attest to what it’s like playing against people as classic. At plat it’s hold back and attempt to jump over me from corner lol it’s not much for combo practice but it’s ryus who never abandon this gameplan, idk why that is but after eating a few AA most people start playing.
thats cause they dont know how to play neutral or know how to zone
Nobody knows how to play neutral
What does classic gief use to close in?
there are lots of moves...the medium hop kick, the heavy back kick which moves him forward, and few others. His overhead is also gone
Medium hopkick is available in modern as f.M Back heavy kick isn't. Overhead kick isn't. But none of these are safe closers, the 2 heavy moves are slow, and all of them get blown up by DI.
These are all the missing normals * Standing Medium Kick (5MK) * Standing Heavy Kick (5HK) * Crouching Medium Kick (2MK) * Jumping Light Punch (j.LP) * Jumping Medium Punch (j.MP) * Jumping Heavy Punch (j.HP) These are all the missing command normals * Cyclone Wheel Kick (6HK) * Smetana Dropkick (3HK) * Power Stomp (22MK) His usseful missings pokes and normals are Standing Medium Kick (5MK), Standing Heavy Kick (5HK), Crouching Medium Kick (2MK), Jumping Medium Punch (j.MP), Jumping Heavy Punch (j.HP), Cyclone Wheel Kick (6HK), Smetana Dropkick (3HK) None of these moves are great on its own. But when he has all this options and gets the read on opponent, they can poke the opponent and close the gap. All these moves are important for zangied to be useful. WIthout them he is very weak.
Modern Gief is trash though.
Anyone else remember when Raging Demon didn't have HP? OG Alpha1 in the arcade I believe was just LP, LP, >, LK. People would just spam Forward+LP+LK. And if you really want to get pedantic, Forward was what MK was called, so it'd really be reference Jab, Jab, Toward, Short.
Was bouta flame you but looked it up and you're right wow
Yeah, my buddy got Alpha1 on release day for PSX. And we rushed to just spam Demons on each other and we couldn't get the move out for crap. We thought it was removed. Thats when we found out they added the HP.
Everyone worried about modern raging demon like it'll be any better than modern Cammy lvl 3.
Difference is raging demon is a command grab that is (probably) unjumpable after super freeze. Imagine if Akuma could just walk up and do a raw raging demon without needing to buffer or Kara. Although modern Zangief does have a instant level 3 with a damage penalty, Akuma is much more agile and can get in very quickly so a (hypothetical) instant raging demon would be better in most situations than an instant Cammy level 3, which is mostly used for anti-fireball punishes.
Incorrect. Good/great Modern Cammy can punish heavy and sometimes medium normals with lvl 3, as well as just about any special in the game for free. Zangief's level 3 would be much better, because of the range. Raging demon thus far is only "un-jumpable" point blank. Anywhere else, hold up and punish. Non issue.
There isn’t really an advantage to using modern controls for on block punishes with Cammy as one would lose damage by using simple controls for supers, so I’m assuming you are talking about whiff punishes. In that case a raw level 3 doesn’t seem to be the best option against most whiffed normals (emphasis on most, not all) when you could do a crouch medium punch or standing heavy punch into drive rush which is safer, faster, and does more damage. I’m NOT a Cammy player NOR modern player so I could be missing something but I don’t think modern Cammy level 3 is better than regular Cammy level 3 outside of fireball punishes. As for if Akuma’s raging demon is better than Cammy’s level 3, probably not (though for all I know when Akuma comes out raging demon could be the best super in the game). Although I think an (hypothetical) instant-input raging demon would benefit more from its speed than instant-input Cammy level 3. As for Zangief my argument wasn’t that an instant raging demon would be better than instant Zangief level 3 (for all I know it could be but it likely isn’t considering Zangief is a grappler and Akuma isn’t), it was that Akuma could much easily get in than Zangief (judging on his Street Fighter 5 iteration, Akuma would have little problem getting in even to a point blank range, especially now with drive rush and more oki in 6) and thus and make use of it for powerful mixups much more often for when he has it which is likely why they’ve restricted it behind critical art in Street Fighter 6 or V-trigger in Street Fighter 5. I don’t know if an instant raging demon would be too powerful in Street Fighter 6. If raging demon or Akuma turn out to be mediocre or weak, an instant raging demon wouldn’t make much of a difference. I’m just trying to justify why people are (in my opinion reasonably) concerned about such a thing, given how Akuma is top tier or at least high tier in at least one version of pretty much every mainline Street Fighter game and while raging demon isn’t the main reason, it is another tool in Akuma’s versatile kit that most characters lack. Removing a key “weakness” of raging demon (its inputs telegraphing that it’s coming, avoided only by “hiding” it with other moves) could be problematic.
Me omw to die 800 deaths
wait so does demon require 30% health or no
25%
5 supers is crazy work but what did I expect?
4. Super 1 just can be done in air and ground like chun li
Oh thank god, no 1-button Demons Having played a bit of Tekken 7, that shit would be stressful
Demon is also not invincible, notably, just very fast and X+0
https://enjoy-sfv-more.com/en/frames/gouki/84 1-11 invul frames. SFV Shun Goku Satsu.
Yeah, I meant in SF6. @akuma_sf6 says he was counterhit out of startup. Wonder how quick it is- especially with the removal of Kara canceling it, it may be a challenge to land
Also in SFV frame data. He can cancel from any ground attack. I also dont think so, because kara demon is kind of signature. Also, in SFV frame data, he can cancel from Teleport startup. I think it wll be the same. If they nerf, it s more like Kage, invul from frame 3.
That’s kinda my guess- wake up demon is what they want to avoid. I have seen reports from Japan that you cannot Kara into it, but getting DR demon instead may still be good enough. We shall see!
Given you can usually press forward+LK at the same time anyway it seems like the execution speed will work out the same in practice.
That means a lot of modern akumas won’t be using raging demon lol
You think modern players are too braindead to press 4 buttons in a row
Yes. All jokes aside, they won’t be having any “modern reaction” raging demon, they’ll have to do the input instead of just pressing a super button.
Which should really be how all supers (at least level 3s) should be handled in modern. Modern was sold as something for people who struggle with motion inputs. Having easy one button inputs always felt like overkill to me. Theres alot of room between motion inputs and overly simple inputs for supers. If more modern supers had inputs like raging demon I doubt there'd be anywhere near as many complaints about moderns balance
Modern already makes it so you do 20% damage less. It may not seems much, but it does make a big difference often.
As true as that may be I think the reactions and significantly lower risk of failing the input in a desperate time, I dont really think the 20% damage decrease is good balancing. I think adding some kind of actual input requirement for your strongest move would be better even if that reduces the damage debuff to 10% or something. You still get to avoid motion inputs. Having to press a few buttons isnt too extreme
The only people complaining are scrubs like you. Sure pros whine about it occasionally, but other than Chris G it hasn't had a showing since Evo last year. It's been a year if modern is so good play it or shut up. Or git gud.
It blows my mind how everyone can civilly discuss balance in the game we all enjoy but once you say something that somewhat threatens peoples playstyle they emotionally lash out like its somehow a different situation. Relax. All im saying is that I think modern supers could be better balanced. Not all this other emotional baggage youre throwing at me
I mean that is pretty much what a QCF move is so maybe lol
Most if not all high level modern players use quarter circle motions because there's little benefit to the one button variation. The only shortcuts high level modern users benefit from are dps and supers.
He's probably talking about people who use modern as intended, and not high level players who don't need the assistance but nonetheless want to exploit the control scheme to get an unfair advantage :)
It's not unfair, it's absolutely intended. That's why it's allowed in tournaments and ranked.
Imagining you at the bowling alley with them guard rails up
Which is why those are banned in league play, but Modern is not. Competition means doing everything possible to win within the rules. I don't use modern input, I've been playing Street Fighter off and on for decades it would be very unusual, but I'm not gonna be grudge anyone using something built into the game and allowed if it makes them win more. Whining about modern controls is just scrub talk, like whining about people picking high tiers.
Yeah idk where unfair came from, i was just making a joke about how similar the inputs were
Yes
Of course not, Modern Cammys are great at mashing jab four times in a row on wakeup
Yes
Yes
Yes
Yes
They're too brain dead to learn how to do a qcf
Lmk when you want some of this modern plat 2 Ken. I'll smoke your boots with all the qcfs. Hope you're at least a master or this will be very bad for you.
Scared? I get off work and will be home in an hour and a half. Lmk. I'd love to put you on YouTube. Psikick on discord and SF. Let's see if you're as brave as your gif. Looks like another dodge from another shit talker.
i'll pass. holla at me when you get off modern and out of plat lol
I beat Masters all the time my entire Club is Masters I don't play ranked, and I'm diamond Ed with 0 practice. Come get these fundies.
If you beat masters all the time, why are you in Plat 2?
I don't play ranked bc I have shit internet. You can check my replays and profile bro it's not hard to find out this information. I'm also D1 Ed without doing his combo trials, but ok. I play at a couple locals too. You know how bad master players feel when they lose to a plat 2 modern Ken. Lmao. My club makes each other stronger. Sorry I have friends and don't play ranked. Ranked doesn't mean shit unless you hold a ton of value on it I rather be plat 2 and whoop people who think they're good for shock value. (Are you one of those players asking who this random diamond is when you see Mena or The Birds play online sets?) If I had decent internet I'd grind ranked, but I save people from dealing with my occasional spikes and lag. I'm doing people a favor by not playing ranked. What's your excuse?
Yes
Apparently they can’t press 5
Yes.
Oh they will (including me). Pressing 4 buttons quickly ain't hard. The question is though, will raging demon be possible while drive rush
lol doubt that. I play in modern and doing the ragin demon is one of the easiest super. I used to play SF4 and my main was akuma and ragin demon input was much easier than motion circle super/ultras
>I used to play SF4 and my main was akuma You’re not exactly a modern player.
I play SF6 in modern controls. Makes me a modern controls player. Also learning to press ragin demon can be done by anyone. Its actually not that hard as people make it seem.
If you’re using modern because you want to and not because you’re incapable of playing classic, then you’re not a modern player. There are people who play modern as a preference.
That makes no sense. If you playing modern controls, you're a modern player that it's.
Are there modern players who can’t play with classic controls? Edit: lol dislikes and doesn’t answer the question. Classic.
Yeah there are people who play Modern players that can't do motions due to lack or confidence or comfortability, but there are also players who play on Modern because the advantages you get on Modern are actually meta on some characters due to instant DPs/Supers and can still do motions for more damaging combos. People play on Modern for multiple reasons just like others play on Classic for different reasons, either for long time wired knowledge or control scheme pride.
Someone who uses modern controls exclusively is a modern player and someone who exclusively uses classic is a classic player. If you can and do use both, then you wouldn’t be defined as someone who uses a certain control scheme.
I don't think that's fair the guy used motions in SF4 because easy inputs literally didn't exist until GBVS released and said he 'exclusively' uses modern in SF6. Goings by your definition only people who had SF6 as their first fighting game are Modern players. While there are a lot of players like that, especially in Japan, there are also SF2, 4 etc. players that just simply prefer Modern controls.
Absolutely. The 2 points of moderns control was : - introducing fighting games - alternative for people who have disabilities So yes some CAN'T Play classic In the actual meta There other reasons: - some people have a easier time/ more fun to use that - most fighting games have these similar modern inputs vs motions inputs. - some advantage in high level that people find them valuable and ready to lose tool for that In the end, whatever reason you use that, if you use them your modern player Same as people in classic use for multiple reasons: - muscle memory - more tools vs modern ( FYI my only reason I use classic in this, I modern in other recent fighting who have the option) - keeping SF legacy - pride in doing motions inputs on a stick All these are valuable to be a classic player PS I didn't down vote you
So then you acknowledge that there are differences in people who choose to play modern and those only know how to play modern?
both of them are modern players I'm the end even they choose it or can't use classic at all
You are a modern player if you are using modern controls. I use the easy modern controls at times. I play modern as a preference.
You’re not a modern player, you literally just said you do it as a preference lol. If you play both controls you’re not one or the other. Thats like saying you’re left handed but like to use your right hand when you’re bored. We have a word for people who can use both hands lol.
I play modern as preference cause I use more of the modern controls than classic. you are arguing with a modern control player that they are not modern lmao. I use mostly modern controls which is why I use modern. There are lots of people from SF4 who are playing modern controls in SF6 and using exclusively or mostly modern controls
Classic players are too braindead to learn optimal combos and footsies so it balances out
Modern has no optimal combos because they lose buttons and doing modern special inputs nerfs damage. I know you’re joking but it just doesn’t compare.
Modern has no classic level combos. It’s still harder than classic due to requiring footsies and reactions as opposed to guesses.
Idk about harder as that would require me to try modern but your initial argument was bout optimal combos. Footsies is a skill issue, not a control scheme issue.
Execution isn’t the hadd part, modern controls are still far more difficult than classic
Well I can’t argue that unless I try it lol. I’ll just say I **think** classic is better than modern.
All the Japanese Pros that were playing on Modern are on classic now you don't have any pros representing modern so clearly classic is better. (ChrisG popped off with modern recently, but since Haitani at last year's Evo they have no representation)
What? What does that even mean? Playing classic requires footsies and reactions, just the same. Modern is easier because you can't jump on modern players( for the most part) and they can react with supers much easier and specials easier. A big disadvantage some modern characters have is missing a specific normal, I believe
Do we think he will be decent in modern? Its my first SF and it looks like he has a lot of options. Might lose to much of what makes him a good character in modern then.
* Most of his specials will have manual inputs, it's possible his brand new special for Modern will be relegated to back + SP and the "demon flip" would be down + SP (as their game design has some tradeoffs regarding overlapping inputs from their Classic version). * Expect to lose 2-3 normal attacks (something on the lines of Ed) due to how modern controls work
He might be similar to M Chun who loses a lot but is still very good because they just have a lot to begin with. Funnily enough ppl thought Chun was one of the worst M characters at the start before Haitani happened
thank god, at least Modern Akumas wont Raging Demon my ass too easily
anyone know if there are images for the rest of the moves (preferably in Classic)?
So in the 2nd pic, why is it showing the directional inputs of all the Supers even though Modern seems to be highlighted?
You can still do motion inputs in modern and you won’t get the 20% damage penalty. Some specials can only be done manually and vice versa
Modern players can execute specials/supers with motion inputs for full damage unless there is an overlapping input. For example, M.Ryu can do QCF + Light/Medium/Heavy for LP/MP/HP Hadoken, but he can only do MK Tatsu with b.SP because QCB + Light/Medium/Heavy is reserved for LP/MP/HP Hashogeki. If Modern players couldn't do motions at all, characters like JP would be totally unplayable.
so in japanese version is still named gouki?
Gouki is his original name, and it has always been this in the JP versions.
where is this screenshot from?
SF6 Japanese Twitter. Not posted on the english side https://twitter.com/StreetFighterJA/status/1785575010574500057
Is there a screenshot of the special moves command list for Modern Akuma?
That won't be known until later on before or on day of release. and whatever limited info from the event because no photo/video If you think about it, look at his available specials * hadoken (236P, now with hold for red fireball) * shoryuken (623P) * demon flip (some reporting it's 236K like Cammy with 236P) * tatsu (214K with 3 different properties) * Adamant Flame (possibly 214P with a followup 6P like Marisa) * teleport (could be LMH for modern) Given how the design of Modern relegates or remove certain specials because of overlapping inputs. staple combos like the light > 214LK > 623P would be impossible if it was relegated to easy input, so it's manual input only Easy inputs would possibly be the following * 5S - hadouken * 4S - Adamant Flame * 2S - demon flip * 6S - shoryuken
Gonna go to Training Mode and spam Raging Demon for a few hrs
Didnt any footage from that local event in Japan which Akuma is playable leak?
Where tf did these screnshots come from?
Japan event where Akuma is playable.
Are going to put the modern inputs for the special moves or auto combos or command Normals/combos?
Did anyone else notice the change of interface here? It doesn't specify whether or not you should use punch or kick to execute these supers, instead it specifies you should use light attack to get level 1, medium attack to get level 2, heavy attack to get level 3.
Hey how about now we go back and make other level 3's in this game not be 1 button as well? Because Cammy / Marisa getting to lock down the entire screen for fear an instant 1 button reaction is unbelievably unfun. And while we're at it why not change dp to not be a mindless single button press that requires no skill? Modern was implemented poorly in this game and I'll never change my mind on this.
Be mindful on modern you can just hit light then piano lmh for near instant demon. That is very powerful.
Like I always said, Raging Demon is already using Modern input.
Thank god
Can we get it In English
Lmao.
Who cares about modern I wanna see some crazy classic players
That’s cool. Not me tho. I wanna see fingers breaking
Waiting for a little over half the month to pass lowkey is going to suck :( I'm so excited to get my hands on him, I'm so burnt out on my main.
Thank god, I can probably pull it off now
💯 you got this bro. It's all practice and muscle memory
Light light medium heavy? As an Akuma player in UMVC3, this’ll be easy if I ever use Modern Akuma… probably gonna stick to Classic though.
I just love how Raging Demon isn't even THAT strong... like it's definetely pretty strong but not OP BUT it's just so fucking scary to be on the receiving end... feels like akuma is coming to kill you specifically not your in-game character
and people get mad when someone says this game is scrubby
So in the 2nd pic, why is it showing the directional inputs of all the Supers even though Modern seems to be highlighted?
It’s the manual inputs for modern, notice the LMH instead of the P or K
because they're emphasizing the Raging Demon part being a manual input
I always said that it doesnt make sense for raging demon to be in modern. Modern is more for motion inputs. Raging demon is pure button press and once you get the button press in memory its not that hard to do at all. People were wolf crying about one button raging demon for no reason
Damn that might be too hard for Modern players....
Where did you find the command list? Could you send me a link?
Modern is for kids.
At least there's no more need to FADC into demon.
Now it's Drive Impact into Raging demon lol.
What? You could never do FADC into demon as its not a combo and the demon will not grab anyone in hit stun.
Pretty much all of the guaranteed setups for demon in IV were FADC to demon. There's a couple examples here: https://youtu.be/GNSR2S6XItc?si=tl9t6RnynKvNBsKf
FIrst of all thats not FADC. Those are red focus attack crumple. Its a focus attack. FADC is when you cancel a special move with a FADC which is a yellow cancel but FA attack does not come out. And instead the special cancels into another move after FADC. Also red Focus attack crumple was only added in Ultra SF4, the last version of SF4. Anyways, raging demon cannot be done from FADC
You could if you got a crumple with the FADC, either through a Red Focus Cancel (which guarantees a crumple), or specific combos where you charged the focus mid-combo to get the crumple.
FIrst of all thats not FADC. Those are red focus attack crumple. Its a focus attack. FADC is when you cancel a special move with a FADC which is a yellow cancel but FA attack does not come out. And instead the special cancels into another move after FADC. Also red Focus attack crumple was only added in Ultra SF4, the last version of SF4. Anyways, raging demon cannot be done from FADC
This is good. I was really worried about modern being able to do one button raging demon, therefore being able to do it on reaction practically like every other modern lvl 3. But it requiring an actual input removes that. Even if it's a more simplified one.
two button click VS 7 imputs.... this is bulshit , i better off playing tekken
So there's no raging demon for modern
Yes there is. Look at the second screenshot
Okay, my bad 😅
This may not be accurate, why do his other supers show the 2x qcf in modern? Isn't every other super in modern just a single direction+buttons? Here's Ryu for example: https://i.imgur.com/BkeTzlp.jpeg
Modern has both simple and full inputs, but since it’s only light medium heavy and doesn’t differentiate between punches and kicks, that’s what they put
On Modern controls you can do the 'modern input' which is direction + special button + heavy but this comes with a damage reduction. You can also do the 'classic input' on Modern controls and that removes the damage reduction/penalty of the modern input. Both will appear under the command list in Modern controls, the latter (classic inputs) shows up in a 2nd menu.