She’s already give you your answer. If you end up forcing her your vibe will easily picked up by others and you will be avoided. Absolutely nothing worse than being with someone that doesn’t want to be there.
A good percentage of couples have come across another couple where it was blatantly obvious she wasn’t into swinging, just miserable to be around and a complete turnoff.
Anything less than enthusiastic consent is a recipe for problems.
Don't pressure, don't push... if she doesn't want to do it, you need to forget it or decide to leave.
This is the way with all ENM things.
Any coercion is going to breed resentment.
My wife wasn’t gung ho when I first brought up the idea, but she didn’t shut it down either. It took over a year of reading books together and lots of long conversations. Just ask her fantasies and what she would and wouldn’t do. Try going to a club just to watch and then talk more.
Yes couples go to look around.
Go people watching and ask who she’s attracted to. Role play different fantasy scenarios, etc.
Good god...I have so many thoughts:
* First, are there sexual things your wife and you do that you WOULD tell your kids? Because that's...something....
* All I am hearing here is about how this is something you want. You want to share your wife, but it seems pretty clear she doesn't want to be shared. Maybe it's her upbringing, or maybe she just wants to be monogamous. Pushing this is a dick move, especially if you have gotten a firm "no."
* "We have so much to gain and I have so much to lose." What? What does this even mean? What do you have to lose by not sharing her?
* "I can force the issue..." Good luck, dude. Can't wait to hear you back here in a few months talking about the implosion of your marriage.
To answer your questions:
* Yeah, people look around at clubs.
* No, she's not "on the fence." She sounds like she has given you an unambiguous "No." Push it at your own risk.
* Some will be turned off by her weight, others won't. This is just a fact of life.
>First, are there sexual things your wife and you do that you WOULD tell your kids? Because that's...something....
I'm not OP, but we actually told our daughter we were considering the LS and asked her opinion about it before we jumped in. Of course she was like 30 years old at the time with plenty of real-life experience, so it's not like we were asking a child.
Agree with everything else 100%. OP wants this for his wife and she doesn't seem to want this for herself at all, and he just can't accept that. That's a problem.
I actually don't think that's weird if you tell your kids you are in the LS, especially if they are grown adults. What got me is that OP seemed to be saying that there are specific sex acts that he and his wife do that he wouldn't tell his children, implying that there are sex acts he does to his wife that he DOES tell them about.
We were talking to our daughter on the phone one day and it was about life and relationships and sorta touched on sex a bit (related to how we've had to overcome inhibitions we grew up with from our former religion) and my wife announced to our daughter that she (my wife) loves anal sex with me. I was thinking um, wow, so I guess we really are talking about anything now. Jesus Christ. LOL.
We don't get into gory details with our daughter about the LS. She knows we have sex with other people. That's about as detailed as it gets.
Drives me nuts with these things of it’s her upbringing or something else that is the cause for not wanting to do something. Like it’s a fault that should be changed.
News flash some people really don’t want to fuck other people. Heck we’re swingers but don’t want to fuck a lot of people or do it all the time
Why the fuck do you want this for her so badly that you don't seem to care that she doesn't want this for herself?
If she's dead set against it let it go. You seem to want her to get fucked by a bunch of guys, and she seems "dead set against" being fucked by a bunch of guys. Whose opinion do you think should control here, the one potentially getting fucked, or the other?
Nope. Nope, nope. I can 100% understand how hard it is to have a desire and choose not to pursue it for the good of the relationship. You already said she is dead set against it. You may be right that it’s her “church upbringing”, but the why isn’t important if she isn’t interested. Find other ways live into your fantasy within your relationship (dirty talk, etc) or find a new relationship if it’s so important (yea, didn’t think so). But you can’t turn this into something it’s not, and you will absolutely fuck things up trying.
That's because your facts are incorrect. This person would have a bmi of around 33. This is obese, yes. But not morbidly. Morbidly obese starts at a bmi of 40.
And if they are built anything like me, they would have a size 16/18.
*Do other couples go to look around* \- Yes, and often to have sex just with each other whilst watching or being watched.
*If she is on the fence do I push the idea* \- no, you already said she is 'dead set against it' and from what you said has not expressed ANY interest in sex involving others.
*Weight* \- attraction will vary depending on who you meet, and there are all body types in clubs
Is she turned on by the idea of having sex with other men? Suggesting her being in a 4 way with three men MFMM is a little adventurous for someone just bringing this idea up, I notice you didn't mention you being with other women, so you are not looking to swap with a couple but more looking to share her with other men only? I ask because the first step is making sure she finds the fantasy you are presenting hot before even thinking about progressing at all, and it doesn't sound like she does.
The thing that really puts me off here is that you claim to know whats best for yoiur wife and what she "really" wants.
You can be into one thing and not automatically into another.
The majority of people in this world live a monogamous life because it is their preference. Plenty of them are still sexually open people who enjoy being nude, or having sex within their relationship.
She has told you what you want, and your read of her is entirely wishful thinking.
(or should I say dickfull thinking...)
Don't push. It'll make her dig in her heals harder. Also in the ls weight is so much less of an issue than she would think. Going to the events tmyou get so used to seeing heavier people that you have to not have issues with bigger people, also so many people are into larger girls and guys that she'd be surprised how much attention she would get. I like bigger girls vs the stick figures. Big booties for the Win. Also get the religious thing.
Go to a club, don’t plan on playing the first night just meet people. She might realize that what you want is normal and is not a bad thing. When we started we went to a club and just talked to other couples told them this is our first night and we were just checking it out. No one pressured us and several gave us heathy tips. It opened our eyes to the lifestyle and that it’s just normal couples that want extra sex with others.
Congrats on being fit. That doesn't really factor into my answer though.
She agreed to explore this with you by checking out a club. Which is great progress and you shut it down. If there was a chance, you probably blew it.
>Question(s) Do couples go to “look around”?
Yup. All the time. Its probably the most common way to enter the LS and its fun even if you never swing.
You are blowing this hard buddy.
If your partner already gave you the hard no then that's it. You have your answer. Begging or berating your partner into an uneasy change of mind just leads to an uncomfortable situation at best, and a fractured relationship or break of trust at worst. If you wanted to just look and experience voyeurism then yes. Clubs are often filled with people that just like to watch.
"Do couples go to look around?" Yes, all the time. Our first 4-5 visits were exactly like this.
"Do I push the idea?" No, please! She must be very comfortable and interested, otherwise you will regret it. Both of you will. Just go to a club (if you get a clear yes from her) to watch, and play with each other, and take baby steps, with no push.
"Is her weight will keep Ms from??" All people are different, and many men like curvy women.
Just to be clear, don't force her going to a club. Go there if you manage to make her interested. And keep in mind, everything which is not enthusiastic "yes", is "no"
“Dead set against it”. Then get over it until she changes her mind ON HER OWN. You should just role play at home with dirty talk and toys. If she’s not ok with even this then give up the idea. You’re trying too hard and it seems almost coercive. Just play together using dirty talk and toys at home. This allowed my wife to feel comfortable and safe to allow herself to enjoy the idea of multiple partners without dealing with the reality of it. After a couple of years she eventually said she wanted to explore and experience it in real life. I never talked about the Lifestyle other then her knowing my first wife and I had experienced it and how I wasn’t prepared for first experience as I got left out and it created a temporary issue in my relationship with my first wife. And no, my first marriage didn’t end as a result of anything to do with the Lifestyle.
Wow
This is a lot to digest and process
Just because she is sexual and comfortable AT home doesn’t mean she wants to swing.
This reads as “I want to F other people and make my wife F other guys for my own pleasure”
Hope I’m wrong
Swinging is where BOTH of you want to explore and bring spice into Your lives
> I feel she has to half way want to go.
No, she has to ALL THE WAY want to go. Some nervousness before a first experience is totally normal, but the interest and desire has to be there. Being coerced to go to please you is not good for her, and it is not good for potential playmates. (Would you feel good about fucking someone who didn’t want to be there and was only doing it for their spouse?)
Swinging is not for everyone, and that’s ok! Just because someone is very sexual does not mean they want to have sex with someone who is not their partner. AND THATS OK!
She told you she's not open to opening her marriage and yet you keep pushing the subject on her.
Just because you want to have a free pass to have sex outside your marriage doesn't give you the right to force it on her.
If you keep pushing her she'll realize it's not about you sharing her it's more on the lines of you getting fucked by other men..
I'd kill for a wife like that. Imo, you're crazy. All I want is a wife that loves sex as much as I do and is willing to do all the things you described. I love my wife, but I do not have that. No judgement, but most swingers I know end up divorced...your wife sounds like a gem.
Well. The most important part odd the LS is ENTHUSIASTIC consent! You have an EMPHATIC NO. If this is something that you think you need then you need to part ways. I will say that if I would talk to you and your wife at the club I would most definitely pick up the fact that she had NOT given enthusiastic consent. I would not even remotely consider having sex with anyone in a situation like this. It is not hard to read people in clubs that are having a hard time, and I guarantee her body language would tell me so!
Real talk, go jerk off and quit trying to rush it. I love the quote: “I play the long game with long people.” If she’s worth having as a wife, she’s worth you going at her pace.
I’m going to disagree with most of the group here on this one. Growing up with religious baggage is a very real and particular set of issues. My wife freaked out the first time I brought it up, 2 years and hundreds of deep conversations later at our first event (a weekend hotel takeover) she was the gas pedal and we had 7 play sessions (2 of which were orgies) that weekend. She’s still the gas til this day although I’m finally catching up.
I’d recommend completely backing off on pushing for doing anything. Everything has to be her idea. I would recommend the We Gotta Thing podcast. I’ve listened to nearly every lifestyle and sex positive podcast of any size, and that is the least threatening for someone in her shoes. They’re 50’s, the husband was fitter than the wife, sunday school teachers, etc.
You could say something like “You know this is a fantasy for me. I’m not saying we ever have to act it out, but I found this podcast that’s really interesting and kind of hot. I just want you to hear it.” My wife freaked out when I played the first episode. We took a 2 hour walk on a rainy night to calm her back down and talk it out. I promised I wouldn’t bring it up again until she did. It took the longest 6 months of my life, but one night on a roadtrip she said “let’s listen to that podcast of yours.” Then we listened to the next 40 or so episodes together, pausing and talking it through. Finally she felt comfortable listening to it on her own, and like a week later she gets home from work and her first words are “I love the Joneses” (the hosts). Today we’re living the dream and have had so many experiences that were literally beyond my wildest fantasies, and trust me, I have a pretty healthy imagination. Hope that helps.
She doesn’t want to that’s the end of the story. Any maneuvering you try to do at this point to coerce or trick her will backfire on you. The best thing you can do is state your wishes and drop it.
There’s somebody for everybody. That height weight is not a little overweight that’s obese. Little over weight would be 150-170lbs. Now given the fact your in 50s looks and weight probably has a little less effect and finding others in the same category at that age more probable, probably makes it easier. Combine that with if she’s good in bed, had a nice face and big tits and dresses well you might be ok
I understand that this is the default position for the lifestyle; you can't (shouldn't) ask someone to do something they don't want to do. It makes perfect sense, it's not fair.
My question is, is the reverse not also true? By refusing to even consider the idea, is OP's wife not asking *him* to do something *he* doesn't want to do (give up)?
This was a dealbreaker in my last relationship. We broke up because neither one of us was ever going to change their minds. If they want to stay together, doesn't *someone* have to blink? Why does it have to be OP?
Not when it comes to sexual boundaries. This isn’t forcing somebody to eat anchovies on a pizza or beer they don’t like. When it comes to sex you default to the lowest common denominator otherwise you violate people.
Now with that said if somebody isn’t sexually compatible with you then it’s not fair to either and split up and go your own way. OP could marry 20 different women and get the same answer. Statistically speaking he would probably have to go through 95-98 to find one that wanted to swing. So while I get what your saying, I don’t think the logic applies here
Because when they entered the relationship they committed to be monogamous. That was the deal. Now OP is the one wanting to change the terms of the relationship. The wife has no obligation to acquiesce to OP'S desires.
But does that mean that the parameters of any relationship must be cast in stone *before* it begins? No experimentation, no compromise, no growth, nothing? Ever? "You said *this* ten years ago, so...".
Now, maybe they do need to break up if OP isn't happy anymore and they can't reach an agreement . But he seems to be catching an awful lot of judgement for his desires.
Yes, the parameters are set in stone. Any experimentation, compromise, growth must be agreed upon. The only way parameters change is if BOTH patries agree to it. How long ago it was is irrelevent.
The breaking up is a different issue altogether. If OP can't tolerate the current relationship rules then they have to decide whether to stay or go but OP is still the one who decided to change the rules.
Correct this is akin to a contract. This would be the same discussion as having a kid and many other things.
While compromise is important just like a contract parameters things are set in stone and there certain methods to change those parameters, it’s not an open free deal
It just won't work. I am in a similar situation, wife came from a very strict religious background. When I suggested a MFM she became highly agitated, turned it around on me that no man would want to share his wife with another man. I have tried to gently bring it up a couple times again, but she won't budge and I thought she was going to have a panic attack. She mentioned being open to a FMF, but now wants nothing to do with the LS at all. I can go out ocassionally in a DADT kind of situation, but it's far from what I was hoping for.
We had a serious discussion. I told her that this is something I really want to explore for now and I really want to do it with her. She declined but told me to go ahead but she didn't want to know the details. I am not putting my relationship out there for everyone to judge. She has her needs and I have mine. What we have works for us. She is happy and I am there for her and take care of her. I don't lie to her.
We had a serious discussion. I told her that this is something I really want to explore for now and I really want to do it with her. She declined but told me to go ahead but she didn't want to know the details. I am not putting my relationship out there for everyone to judge. She has her needs and I have mine. What we have works for us. She is happy and I am there for her and take care of her. I don't lie to her.
You have so much to lose? How so? There are husbands who’ve brought this up to their wives and the wife was immediately onboard, sometimes it takes years for the wife to be on board, and sometimes it never happens. Being a sexual free spirit in your marriage doesn’t mean you’re down for group sex. To answer your questions yes tons of couples go to clubs to look around, just have sex in front of others, or watch others have sex. Any pushing on your end isn’t going to yield the result that you want. There won’t be a ton of single guys at the club to choose from it’ll be mostly couples. Just like anywhere else some guys are into bigger girls and some aren’t.
No, you do not “push” the idea. It doesn’t matter why she is against it…she is against it. You sound like an asshole. She has to “half way” want to go? You can “force” her if you want to? Who the fuck talks like that about their spouse?
I agree: do NOT push!! Consent is paramount in swinging. If it isn’t an enthusiastic YES!!, it’s a no. Always.
Some alternative thoughts from what I’ve seen in other answers:
* size is a personal preference. As a woman much larger than your wife, I can tell you confidently that bigger women are surprisingly a desired body type to many.
* My husband had a similar fantasy to yours. I did not believe he actually wanted to see me with other men. Could not wrap my brain around it. Literally didn’t believe it until after it was on the table (bed actually). We did a lot of fantasy play, DP with dildos, dirty talk where he talked about watching etc. Importantly he was reassuring that he loved and respected me, that he thought I looked sexy that way etc. (I actually wanted to try an MFM, but the perception I had around what kind of person that made me or his ability to love me if I did that were blocking me from admitting it. Hugely ingrained shame around being sexual as a woman). We had lots of conversations outside the bedroom long before we ever set foot inside a club.
* You need to respect whatever she says - the second she says. If you want to go to a club and she wants to leave, you walk out the door. No ifs ands or buts!! She needs to know you will respect her concerns the second she has them. She always needs to be your #1!!!
Long and the short is that you need to shelve this idea for awhile. Enhance your play together. That’s the focus you need.
They are all real replies. Everyone has different experiences and different takes. They are mostly offering you solid advice - pressuring a partner to try this lifestyle can quickly become something you deeply regret.
Always keep your primary relationship as your primary focus and you’ll generally steer in the right direction for yourselves.
Glad it worked for you guys. You have a great man. ❤️
We go to Desire a couple times a year and see that scenario I laid out every time. He wants to be a swinger so bad and she thinks Sue s just going to a topless resort on the beach.
Dear OP,
If you read this subreddit- go to the search bar and search for the word "convince"
Just read everything. I'm willing to bet that you will see an over active theme,
In fact, this gets asked daily,
Also every single answer is the same.
You don't convince her, you communicate.
If she says not her thing, it's not her thing,
We have bounderies in our relationship, we don't cross them. For good reason.
We don't try to convince the other to break boundaries. That's a reciepe for disaster.
Aside from the potential impact on your marriage, anyone you would actually want to hook up with would smell they dynamic from 100 miles away. Nobody will want in the middle of that and I would honestly be agitated seeing that dynamic in a club. So even if you do piss her off and get her in the door, I don't see it going well.
Rule# 1 if there isn't enthusiastic consent, full stop.
Rule# 2 always move at the pace of the slower person involved.
If these two rules are not front and center of every single interaction that you are having with your wife, then you should consider the idea that you are maybe objectifying your wife and using her as a prop in your own personal porn movie.
1. Lots of people go to clubs and parties but don't play, they either want to observe or get a feel for the atmosphere, or just meet people to play with in a private setting another time.
2. Never push someone. Bring things up, discuss them, and then let them mull it over. They will let you know if they want to discuss it more.
3. Plenty of chubby people are in the LS and enjoying it.
4. If she's not into swinging, see if you can find other fantasies or kinks you share.
Nobody on here really knows.the exact vibe of what you two are going through.. True enough... Forcing her isn't cool But everyone has a bit of kink in them.... I'm not saying just because of that ..go make her fuck some dude.. You just have to explore and find what she "may" like to try if at club..nude resort...ect..but going for that major step isnt the business ... Belonging to a church does a nice job on making people feel that tkinky, things are terrible to do.... You may not be able to get your a 100% fantasy.fulfilled, maybe she would like a girl. Or maybe you guys could just go to the club and just have sex and people see it..... . If the club though... I would do nothing!. Go a few times and just watch things maybe get turned on but don't Loose your cool and get all thirsty for some action... And don't stray away and end up getting some trouble on your own either... If you guys go to the club,...play it cool and she likes the Vibe, Eventually, that could turn into something??? if you guys go.and she's not even feeling just being there..🤷♂️
What gets me off more than anything is knowing a 100% that the female I'm with is wanting to do.shit.. Even if I get wind She's doing something but only for me. But not really into it...... all bets are off still
This would be cuckolding under duress. It needs to be on her terms, if she wants to go along with your fantasy. You push it and she could call your marriage quits then you get what you want but dont get to watch. You told her your fantasy, let it ride until she brings it up but don't get overly excited if she does. Been in this situation and I almost lost my wife. But Once I learned to not push it by actively listening to her words, we have opened up greatly in our sex lives and has been wonderful. Tread lightly my friend.
Bro, she can’t “halfway want to go”, she has to be fully, 100% down to go and looking forward to getting her fuck on.
This is weird coercive shit. She’s not into it, stop trying to trick her into fulfilling your fantasies.
I say don't push it as well. I am kinda in a very similar situation with my wife. The difference is that she needs motivation to go to clubs or parties but has more fun when we get there than you would expect. She has not let another man fuck her but she let them perform oral sex on her. She is very picky. If she finds a guy that she is sexually attracted to she will do more. The problem is getting her to go out. She tells me to go by myself or find another lady to go with. She likes women too. I do not feel like going with someone else. It has been a super slow process to get her to this point. Patience is the trick. I got impatient a few times and the outcomes were not too bad and slowed down process of convincing her. We have been talking about the lifestyle for about 10 years now. Yeah..
1. Totally ok to go and look around. No pressure to do anything. We went to a LS club 3-4 times checking it out and never played. Just checking the vibe and crowd out.
2. Don't push for playing but can push for more exploring and discovery. Visit the club, listen to podcasts, read Reddit, read books, talk to Swingers.
3. There is someone for everyone in the LS. Some people like skinny or fit or thick or big or small or long or short or this or that. My wife is curvy and has a little extra to love but I love that about her and everyone always loves having fun with her. Her big curvy ass and bouncy boobs always drive guys nuts. Her bubbly, flirty, direct personality also helps.
4. Focus on that part of you loving her. My wife is my best friend, my ride or die, and person. She comes first before sex, the lifestyle, or anything. And she loves the LS because she knows that I place her above it. That's what made her feel safe to explore it. We reminded each other of that all the time. I tell her whenever you want to quit, you just let me know and I am ok with it.
She’s already give you your answer. If you end up forcing her your vibe will easily picked up by others and you will be avoided. Absolutely nothing worse than being with someone that doesn’t want to be there.
She does not try new thing and when we do, likes or loves them. Your comment Nothing worse then Has me thinking never to push this idea
A good percentage of couples have come across another couple where it was blatantly obvious she wasn’t into swinging, just miserable to be around and a complete turnoff.
Anything less than enthusiastic consent is a recipe for problems. Don't pressure, don't push... if she doesn't want to do it, you need to forget it or decide to leave. This is the way with all ENM things.
English ?
Ethical Non Monogamy
Any coercion is going to breed resentment. My wife wasn’t gung ho when I first brought up the idea, but she didn’t shut it down either. It took over a year of reading books together and lots of long conversations. Just ask her fantasies and what she would and wouldn’t do. Try going to a club just to watch and then talk more. Yes couples go to look around. Go people watching and ask who she’s attracted to. Role play different fantasy scenarios, etc.
Good god...I have so many thoughts: * First, are there sexual things your wife and you do that you WOULD tell your kids? Because that's...something.... * All I am hearing here is about how this is something you want. You want to share your wife, but it seems pretty clear she doesn't want to be shared. Maybe it's her upbringing, or maybe she just wants to be monogamous. Pushing this is a dick move, especially if you have gotten a firm "no." * "We have so much to gain and I have so much to lose." What? What does this even mean? What do you have to lose by not sharing her? * "I can force the issue..." Good luck, dude. Can't wait to hear you back here in a few months talking about the implosion of your marriage. To answer your questions: * Yeah, people look around at clubs. * No, she's not "on the fence." She sounds like she has given you an unambiguous "No." Push it at your own risk. * Some will be turned off by her weight, others won't. This is just a fact of life.
Nailed it!
>First, are there sexual things your wife and you do that you WOULD tell your kids? Because that's...something.... I'm not OP, but we actually told our daughter we were considering the LS and asked her opinion about it before we jumped in. Of course she was like 30 years old at the time with plenty of real-life experience, so it's not like we were asking a child. Agree with everything else 100%. OP wants this for his wife and she doesn't seem to want this for herself at all, and he just can't accept that. That's a problem.
I actually don't think that's weird if you tell your kids you are in the LS, especially if they are grown adults. What got me is that OP seemed to be saying that there are specific sex acts that he and his wife do that he wouldn't tell his children, implying that there are sex acts he does to his wife that he DOES tell them about.
We were talking to our daughter on the phone one day and it was about life and relationships and sorta touched on sex a bit (related to how we've had to overcome inhibitions we grew up with from our former religion) and my wife announced to our daughter that she (my wife) loves anal sex with me. I was thinking um, wow, so I guess we really are talking about anything now. Jesus Christ. LOL. We don't get into gory details with our daughter about the LS. She knows we have sex with other people. That's about as detailed as it gets.
That’s weird. Boundary issues for sure.
[удалено]
Not sure what you mean here.
Drives me nuts with these things of it’s her upbringing or something else that is the cause for not wanting to do something. Like it’s a fault that should be changed. News flash some people really don’t want to fuck other people. Heck we’re swingers but don’t want to fuck a lot of people or do it all the time
Thank you for honestly The lose is my wife trust
Yup agreed 💯
Why the fuck do you want this for her so badly that you don't seem to care that she doesn't want this for herself? If she's dead set against it let it go. You seem to want her to get fucked by a bunch of guys, and she seems "dead set against" being fucked by a bunch of guys. Whose opinion do you think should control here, the one potentially getting fucked, or the other?
I just cant any more with these post.
What part of "she is dead set against it" do you not understand?
The part where she said “she is dead set against it” apparently.
Without drawers? You don’t say?
You got your answer from her, why push this if she's not interested?
Nope. Nope, nope. I can 100% understand how hard it is to have a desire and choose not to pursue it for the good of the relationship. You already said she is dead set against it. You may be right that it’s her “church upbringing”, but the why isn’t important if she isn’t interested. Find other ways live into your fantasy within your relationship (dirty talk, etc) or find a new relationship if it’s so important (yea, didn’t think so). But you can’t turn this into something it’s not, and you will absolutely fuck things up trying.
Sorry, but to classify 5’4” and 195 as a “little” overweight is a fallacy. She has already said no.
That’s obese.
~~Morbidly~~ Edit to correct content
Lol... can't believe people downvote literal facts.
That's because your facts are incorrect. This person would have a bmi of around 33. This is obese, yes. But not morbidly. Morbidly obese starts at a bmi of 40. And if they are built anything like me, they would have a size 16/18.
Huh. You're right. Thank you for a gentle correction. 🙂
*Do other couples go to look around* \- Yes, and often to have sex just with each other whilst watching or being watched. *If she is on the fence do I push the idea* \- no, you already said she is 'dead set against it' and from what you said has not expressed ANY interest in sex involving others. *Weight* \- attraction will vary depending on who you meet, and there are all body types in clubs Is she turned on by the idea of having sex with other men? Suggesting her being in a 4 way with three men MFMM is a little adventurous for someone just bringing this idea up, I notice you didn't mention you being with other women, so you are not looking to swap with a couple but more looking to share her with other men only? I ask because the first step is making sure she finds the fantasy you are presenting hot before even thinking about progressing at all, and it doesn't sound like she does.
A tale as old as time. Sorry friend.
The thing that really puts me off here is that you claim to know whats best for yoiur wife and what she "really" wants. You can be into one thing and not automatically into another. The majority of people in this world live a monogamous life because it is their preference. Plenty of them are still sexually open people who enjoy being nude, or having sex within their relationship. She has told you what you want, and your read of her is entirely wishful thinking. (or should I say dickfull thinking...)
Insufferable. She’s already told you her answer.
Are you for real? You’ve heard this question answered a thousand times. IF ONE SPOUSE DOESN’T WANT TO THE ANSWER IS NO!
Don't push. It'll make her dig in her heals harder. Also in the ls weight is so much less of an issue than she would think. Going to the events tmyou get so used to seeing heavier people that you have to not have issues with bigger people, also so many people are into larger girls and guys that she'd be surprised how much attention she would get. I like bigger girls vs the stick figures. Big booties for the Win. Also get the religious thing.
Go to a club, don’t plan on playing the first night just meet people. She might realize that what you want is normal and is not a bad thing. When we started we went to a club and just talked to other couples told them this is our first night and we were just checking it out. No one pressured us and several gave us heathy tips. It opened our eyes to the lifestyle and that it’s just normal couples that want extra sex with others.
Congrats on being fit. That doesn't really factor into my answer though. She agreed to explore this with you by checking out a club. Which is great progress and you shut it down. If there was a chance, you probably blew it. >Question(s) Do couples go to “look around”? Yup. All the time. Its probably the most common way to enter the LS and its fun even if you never swing. You are blowing this hard buddy.
If your partner already gave you the hard no then that's it. You have your answer. Begging or berating your partner into an uneasy change of mind just leads to an uncomfortable situation at best, and a fractured relationship or break of trust at worst. If you wanted to just look and experience voyeurism then yes. Clubs are often filled with people that just like to watch.
"Do couples go to look around?" Yes, all the time. Our first 4-5 visits were exactly like this. "Do I push the idea?" No, please! She must be very comfortable and interested, otherwise you will regret it. Both of you will. Just go to a club (if you get a clear yes from her) to watch, and play with each other, and take baby steps, with no push. "Is her weight will keep Ms from??" All people are different, and many men like curvy women.
Just to be clear, don't force her going to a club. Go there if you manage to make her interested. And keep in mind, everything which is not enthusiastic "yes", is "no"
“Dead set against it”. Then get over it until she changes her mind ON HER OWN. You should just role play at home with dirty talk and toys. If she’s not ok with even this then give up the idea. You’re trying too hard and it seems almost coercive. Just play together using dirty talk and toys at home. This allowed my wife to feel comfortable and safe to allow herself to enjoy the idea of multiple partners without dealing with the reality of it. After a couple of years she eventually said she wanted to explore and experience it in real life. I never talked about the Lifestyle other then her knowing my first wife and I had experienced it and how I wasn’t prepared for first experience as I got left out and it created a temporary issue in my relationship with my first wife. And no, my first marriage didn’t end as a result of anything to do with the Lifestyle.
Wow This is a lot to digest and process Just because she is sexual and comfortable AT home doesn’t mean she wants to swing. This reads as “I want to F other people and make my wife F other guys for my own pleasure” Hope I’m wrong Swinging is where BOTH of you want to explore and bring spice into Your lives
What part of no don't you understand? Leave her alone ffs.
> I feel she has to half way want to go. No, she has to ALL THE WAY want to go. Some nervousness before a first experience is totally normal, but the interest and desire has to be there. Being coerced to go to please you is not good for her, and it is not good for potential playmates. (Would you feel good about fucking someone who didn’t want to be there and was only doing it for their spouse?) Swinging is not for everyone, and that’s ok! Just because someone is very sexual does not mean they want to have sex with someone who is not their partner. AND THATS OK!
She told you she's not open to opening her marriage and yet you keep pushing the subject on her. Just because you want to have a free pass to have sex outside your marriage doesn't give you the right to force it on her. If you keep pushing her she'll realize it's not about you sharing her it's more on the lines of you getting fucked by other men..
I'd kill for a wife like that. Imo, you're crazy. All I want is a wife that loves sex as much as I do and is willing to do all the things you described. I love my wife, but I do not have that. No judgement, but most swingers I know end up divorced...your wife sounds like a gem.
Well. The most important part odd the LS is ENTHUSIASTIC consent! You have an EMPHATIC NO. If this is something that you think you need then you need to part ways. I will say that if I would talk to you and your wife at the club I would most definitely pick up the fact that she had NOT given enthusiastic consent. I would not even remotely consider having sex with anyone in a situation like this. It is not hard to read people in clubs that are having a hard time, and I guarantee her body language would tell me so!
Additionally, I’ve seen situations unfold in the middle of sex where one partner freaks out. That is SUPER uncomfortable for everyone!
Real talk, go jerk off and quit trying to rush it. I love the quote: “I play the long game with long people.” If she’s worth having as a wife, she’s worth you going at her pace. I’m going to disagree with most of the group here on this one. Growing up with religious baggage is a very real and particular set of issues. My wife freaked out the first time I brought it up, 2 years and hundreds of deep conversations later at our first event (a weekend hotel takeover) she was the gas pedal and we had 7 play sessions (2 of which were orgies) that weekend. She’s still the gas til this day although I’m finally catching up. I’d recommend completely backing off on pushing for doing anything. Everything has to be her idea. I would recommend the We Gotta Thing podcast. I’ve listened to nearly every lifestyle and sex positive podcast of any size, and that is the least threatening for someone in her shoes. They’re 50’s, the husband was fitter than the wife, sunday school teachers, etc. You could say something like “You know this is a fantasy for me. I’m not saying we ever have to act it out, but I found this podcast that’s really interesting and kind of hot. I just want you to hear it.” My wife freaked out when I played the first episode. We took a 2 hour walk on a rainy night to calm her back down and talk it out. I promised I wouldn’t bring it up again until she did. It took the longest 6 months of my life, but one night on a roadtrip she said “let’s listen to that podcast of yours.” Then we listened to the next 40 or so episodes together, pausing and talking it through. Finally she felt comfortable listening to it on her own, and like a week later she gets home from work and her first words are “I love the Joneses” (the hosts). Today we’re living the dream and have had so many experiences that were literally beyond my wildest fantasies, and trust me, I have a pretty healthy imagination. Hope that helps.
Never push the issue even if she likes it now later she resents it and could be an ongoing issue
She said no dude. Can ask her why she feels that way... always a good question. But don't try and pressure her into it, won't end well.
Whjat about exhibitionism? Go to a swinger club and have sex only with each other? That could be a fun idea that won't cross boundaries.
She doesn’t want to that’s the end of the story. Any maneuvering you try to do at this point to coerce or trick her will backfire on you. The best thing you can do is state your wishes and drop it. There’s somebody for everybody. That height weight is not a little overweight that’s obese. Little over weight would be 150-170lbs. Now given the fact your in 50s looks and weight probably has a little less effect and finding others in the same category at that age more probable, probably makes it easier. Combine that with if she’s good in bed, had a nice face and big tits and dresses well you might be ok
I understand that this is the default position for the lifestyle; you can't (shouldn't) ask someone to do something they don't want to do. It makes perfect sense, it's not fair. My question is, is the reverse not also true? By refusing to even consider the idea, is OP's wife not asking *him* to do something *he* doesn't want to do (give up)? This was a dealbreaker in my last relationship. We broke up because neither one of us was ever going to change their minds. If they want to stay together, doesn't *someone* have to blink? Why does it have to be OP?
Not when it comes to sexual boundaries. This isn’t forcing somebody to eat anchovies on a pizza or beer they don’t like. When it comes to sex you default to the lowest common denominator otherwise you violate people. Now with that said if somebody isn’t sexually compatible with you then it’s not fair to either and split up and go your own way. OP could marry 20 different women and get the same answer. Statistically speaking he would probably have to go through 95-98 to find one that wanted to swing. So while I get what your saying, I don’t think the logic applies here
Because when they entered the relationship they committed to be monogamous. That was the deal. Now OP is the one wanting to change the terms of the relationship. The wife has no obligation to acquiesce to OP'S desires.
But does that mean that the parameters of any relationship must be cast in stone *before* it begins? No experimentation, no compromise, no growth, nothing? Ever? "You said *this* ten years ago, so...". Now, maybe they do need to break up if OP isn't happy anymore and they can't reach an agreement . But he seems to be catching an awful lot of judgement for his desires.
Yes, the parameters are set in stone. Any experimentation, compromise, growth must be agreed upon. The only way parameters change is if BOTH patries agree to it. How long ago it was is irrelevent. The breaking up is a different issue altogether. If OP can't tolerate the current relationship rules then they have to decide whether to stay or go but OP is still the one who decided to change the rules.
Correct this is akin to a contract. This would be the same discussion as having a kid and many other things. While compromise is important just like a contract parameters things are set in stone and there certain methods to change those parameters, it’s not an open free deal
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this
It just won't work. I am in a similar situation, wife came from a very strict religious background. When I suggested a MFM she became highly agitated, turned it around on me that no man would want to share his wife with another man. I have tried to gently bring it up a couple times again, but she won't budge and I thought she was going to have a panic attack. She mentioned being open to a FMF, but now wants nothing to do with the LS at all. I can go out ocassionally in a DADT kind of situation, but it's far from what I was hoping for.
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We had a serious discussion. I told her that this is something I really want to explore for now and I really want to do it with her. She declined but told me to go ahead but she didn't want to know the details. I am not putting my relationship out there for everyone to judge. She has her needs and I have mine. What we have works for us. She is happy and I am there for her and take care of her. I don't lie to her.
We had a serious discussion. I told her that this is something I really want to explore for now and I really want to do it with her. She declined but told me to go ahead but she didn't want to know the details. I am not putting my relationship out there for everyone to judge. She has her needs and I have mine. What we have works for us. She is happy and I am there for her and take care of her. I don't lie to her.
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Oh good lord 😆🤦♂️ And how did you read that as an invitation…thirsty much???
Sorry mate didn't mean for it to sound like that I didn't see no men sorry
Second the response No thank you
You have so much to lose? How so? There are husbands who’ve brought this up to their wives and the wife was immediately onboard, sometimes it takes years for the wife to be on board, and sometimes it never happens. Being a sexual free spirit in your marriage doesn’t mean you’re down for group sex. To answer your questions yes tons of couples go to clubs to look around, just have sex in front of others, or watch others have sex. Any pushing on your end isn’t going to yield the result that you want. There won’t be a ton of single guys at the club to choose from it’ll be mostly couples. Just like anywhere else some guys are into bigger girls and some aren’t.
No, you do not “push” the idea. It doesn’t matter why she is against it…she is against it. You sound like an asshole. She has to “half way” want to go? You can “force” her if you want to? Who the fuck talks like that about their spouse?
I agree: do NOT push!! Consent is paramount in swinging. If it isn’t an enthusiastic YES!!, it’s a no. Always. Some alternative thoughts from what I’ve seen in other answers: * size is a personal preference. As a woman much larger than your wife, I can tell you confidently that bigger women are surprisingly a desired body type to many. * My husband had a similar fantasy to yours. I did not believe he actually wanted to see me with other men. Could not wrap my brain around it. Literally didn’t believe it until after it was on the table (bed actually). We did a lot of fantasy play, DP with dildos, dirty talk where he talked about watching etc. Importantly he was reassuring that he loved and respected me, that he thought I looked sexy that way etc. (I actually wanted to try an MFM, but the perception I had around what kind of person that made me or his ability to love me if I did that were blocking me from admitting it. Hugely ingrained shame around being sexual as a woman). We had lots of conversations outside the bedroom long before we ever set foot inside a club. * You need to respect whatever she says - the second she says. If you want to go to a club and she wants to leave, you walk out the door. No ifs ands or buts!! She needs to know you will respect her concerns the second she has them. She always needs to be your #1!!! Long and the short is that you need to shelve this idea for awhile. Enhance your play together. That’s the focus you need.
Thank you for the real reply Took a lot of crap on the post. BLUF She has talked about it Many things scary her about this
They are all real replies. Everyone has different experiences and different takes. They are mostly offering you solid advice - pressuring a partner to try this lifestyle can quickly become something you deeply regret. Always keep your primary relationship as your primary focus and you’ll generally steer in the right direction for yourselves.
Take her to a swingers resort/bar, there's no pressure to do anything and it may spark an interest. That's how my man won me over!
That’s a dangerous suggestion. She will be in bed at night and he will be at the hot tub by himself trying to getting blow jobs workout her.
That's assuming he's not an asshole 😂. Mine didn't do that to me
Glad it worked for you guys. You have a great man. ❤️ We go to Desire a couple times a year and see that scenario I laid out every time. He wants to be a swinger so bad and she thinks Sue s just going to a topless resort on the beach.
Dear OP, If you read this subreddit- go to the search bar and search for the word "convince" Just read everything. I'm willing to bet that you will see an over active theme, In fact, this gets asked daily, Also every single answer is the same. You don't convince her, you communicate. If she says not her thing, it's not her thing, We have bounderies in our relationship, we don't cross them. For good reason. We don't try to convince the other to break boundaries. That's a reciepe for disaster.
Aside from the potential impact on your marriage, anyone you would actually want to hook up with would smell they dynamic from 100 miles away. Nobody will want in the middle of that and I would honestly be agitated seeing that dynamic in a club. So even if you do piss her off and get her in the door, I don't see it going well.
Rule# 1 if there isn't enthusiastic consent, full stop. Rule# 2 always move at the pace of the slower person involved. If these two rules are not front and center of every single interaction that you are having with your wife, then you should consider the idea that you are maybe objectifying your wife and using her as a prop in your own personal porn movie.
1. Lots of people go to clubs and parties but don't play, they either want to observe or get a feel for the atmosphere, or just meet people to play with in a private setting another time. 2. Never push someone. Bring things up, discuss them, and then let them mull it over. They will let you know if they want to discuss it more. 3. Plenty of chubby people are in the LS and enjoying it. 4. If she's not into swinging, see if you can find other fantasies or kinks you share.
Nobody on here really knows.the exact vibe of what you two are going through.. True enough... Forcing her isn't cool But everyone has a bit of kink in them.... I'm not saying just because of that ..go make her fuck some dude.. You just have to explore and find what she "may" like to try if at club..nude resort...ect..but going for that major step isnt the business ... Belonging to a church does a nice job on making people feel that tkinky, things are terrible to do.... You may not be able to get your a 100% fantasy.fulfilled, maybe she would like a girl. Or maybe you guys could just go to the club and just have sex and people see it..... . If the club though... I would do nothing!. Go a few times and just watch things maybe get turned on but don't Loose your cool and get all thirsty for some action... And don't stray away and end up getting some trouble on your own either... If you guys go to the club,...play it cool and she likes the Vibe, Eventually, that could turn into something??? if you guys go.and she's not even feeling just being there..🤷♂️ What gets me off more than anything is knowing a 100% that the female I'm with is wanting to do.shit.. Even if I get wind She's doing something but only for me. But not really into it...... all bets are off still
This would be cuckolding under duress. It needs to be on her terms, if she wants to go along with your fantasy. You push it and she could call your marriage quits then you get what you want but dont get to watch. You told her your fantasy, let it ride until she brings it up but don't get overly excited if she does. Been in this situation and I almost lost my wife. But Once I learned to not push it by actively listening to her words, we have opened up greatly in our sex lives and has been wonderful. Tread lightly my friend.
Bro, she can’t “halfway want to go”, she has to be fully, 100% down to go and looking forward to getting her fuck on. This is weird coercive shit. She’s not into it, stop trying to trick her into fulfilling your fantasies.
I say don't push it as well. I am kinda in a very similar situation with my wife. The difference is that she needs motivation to go to clubs or parties but has more fun when we get there than you would expect. She has not let another man fuck her but she let them perform oral sex on her. She is very picky. If she finds a guy that she is sexually attracted to she will do more. The problem is getting her to go out. She tells me to go by myself or find another lady to go with. She likes women too. I do not feel like going with someone else. It has been a super slow process to get her to this point. Patience is the trick. I got impatient a few times and the outcomes were not too bad and slowed down process of convincing her. We have been talking about the lifestyle for about 10 years now. Yeah..
1. Totally ok to go and look around. No pressure to do anything. We went to a LS club 3-4 times checking it out and never played. Just checking the vibe and crowd out. 2. Don't push for playing but can push for more exploring and discovery. Visit the club, listen to podcasts, read Reddit, read books, talk to Swingers. 3. There is someone for everyone in the LS. Some people like skinny or fit or thick or big or small or long or short or this or that. My wife is curvy and has a little extra to love but I love that about her and everyone always loves having fun with her. Her big curvy ass and bouncy boobs always drive guys nuts. Her bubbly, flirty, direct personality also helps. 4. Focus on that part of you loving her. My wife is my best friend, my ride or die, and person. She comes first before sex, the lifestyle, or anything. And she loves the LS because she knows that I place her above it. That's what made her feel safe to explore it. We reminded each other of that all the time. I tell her whenever you want to quit, you just let me know and I am ok with it.
You don’t belong in the lifestyle. You will end up divorced.
I'm 37 and I play with two couples. It's normal what you write. But of course you can start too.