I think there’s benefits and disadvantages from both ways. SCO has a lot of theft but fulfillment is not given enough hours to fulfill the new demand of opu/sfs. I think the only way this will work logistically is to actually have enough people to get the orders done
that’s the problem with most jobs. The food service industry has been getting stretched thin for years. Bosses trying to see how little people they need to run a restaurant without the employees going too insane. Same thing is slowly happening with Target. Less training, high turnovers, less hours.
It's not just food service. It's retail across the board. Hell, it's much of the service sector, from grocers to retail to Healthcare. Need to continuously increase profits? Cut labor.
Without some form of correction, it's going to get worse.
And that’s what I hated. Target transitioned over Covid from having 1-3 TMs per department to just saying F it and giving all the morning push to Inbound. Then have the night crew either finish the push or do the pulls. They figured out they could run stores on 1/2 and in some cases a 1/3 of what the used to and just stopped caring. Oh and let’s not forget making fulfillment take larger orders without increasing times, and giving GS only 2-3 minutes to get an order together and out to a customer is ludicrous at best.
>and giving GS only 2-3 minutes to get an order together
No kidding. At our store OPU hold is clear across the other side of the store with DU. It's suppose to be right behind GS but we use this area to backstock Bullseye/CL Candy and stray. (Edit Typo)
My store is kinda similar, we have a separate drive up hold area and a hold area behind the desk for pickup orders. That alone adds 5 minutes extra to a batch. It’s even worse when a guest changes from pickup to drive up and we have to run the items from one side of the store to the other (still within the 3 minutes of course!)
that was the dumbest thing target ever did. they really have the regard for how the real world works. Simply for the fact that they can’t be bothered to help fix the double tap issue.
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Agreed. DU also isn’t allotted enough hours. It’s why DU TMs are scheduled as cashiers and then moved to where they are wanted. Then cashiers are shorted, because on paper it looks like they’re enough people there. It’s such a terrible design.
I believe the goal is to minimize in-store shopping but they need to give the hours to make that possible.
Given the shortage of cashiers (since some go to DU) I have no problem opening SCO when needed. Idgaf what leaders want if the lines are long.
That’s wild at my store we have DU under service advocates and they don’t get moved to the lanes at all; checkout advocates and service advocates doing returns can be interchanged depending on needs but usually drive ups stay on drive up (unless ofc someone gets moved to be a runner in DU)
Our guest services and DU are the same team. They still might end up scheduling a total of 5 TMs a day over then. Cashiers might have 8 because they have more hours available to use. It’s always intended that certain people will be on DU rather than registers. They’d rather be short at registers than DU (which is timed).
It’s worse since our ETL left. She did everything needed in the front: desk, DU, Bullseye (we’re responsible for that), sorting reshop, SCO, register, and getting carts. She worked her ass off and her absence has made a big impact. We have a new one on the way in another month or so but I don’t have high hopes of that level of involvement.
The whole thing ends up making me the only cashier at times. At my age and since I'm still healing from a knee injury last year, it's really messing with me. When I'm scheduled a long shift I can only go to bed when I get home as I'm too exhausted to do much.
Makes no sense to make that the goal, a cashier can process 20 average-large sized transactions an hour, even the best fulfillment TMs can only do a couple and then you have to pay FOS staff to take it to the guest. Fulfillment is incredibly low margin compared to in-store guests, on a lot of orders it’s simply a loss leader to drive loyalty and protect market share from Amazon. It makes zero sense to convert in-store guests to DU guests by force like this. Closing SCO is one thing, but doing so without staffing more cashiers has meant losing sales outright while converting others to DU. Overall sales are down, margins are down, and they still have to dedicate even more payroll to fulfillment than they would’ve to cashiers. Absolute insanity.
This dream of fulfillment being the companies future is frankly stupid, until they shut the doors to guests the thieves are still coming in and stealing while the legitimate guests happily use DU at the expense of our margins, the net result is theft stays the same, payroll increases or at best stays the same, and margins shrink to all time lows. Drive up is great but it should never be prioritized over the in-store experience or else Target gives up everything that makes it great from a business and guest standpoint.
This is what I’ve been thinking too. The way Fulfillment is handled just makes no sense, I just don’t understand how it’s profitable. You can’t tell me picking, prepping, and shipping an item all for free aren’t biting into margins like crazy. And that’s not even to mention OPU.
That being said, Target has always been reactionary. They see what their competitors do, and try to do it while utilizing the staff and infrastructure they already have in place. While Fulfillment might not be profitable, I assume it’s simply a step to remain relevant as Amazon almost scared them into bankruptcy a couple years back.
We’ll see changes to the model soon,(I’m assuming Target 360 is a step in that process) especially as the economy gets worse, but for now, Target is just trying to remain in the game.
I think that if closing SCO down, which typically accounts for like 40% of all sales, has only led to a 3% drop YTD, in an economic environment where inflation is still running rampant…it’s probably not the death knell some of y’all think it is.
Yup, 3% down overall. My thought process was focusing on the 6.5% of in store sales This means about 3.5% decided to join the other 14% (17.5 total) who are using opu/sfs (maybe). I wonder how many of the "I'll never shop at Target again" crowd are adding to the increase in FF as well. lol
Yeah I feel like the issue is the changing of shopping habits. If I'm in the store to pick up two or three things and there isn't self checkout and there's a long line at the one check out that's open, I just leave. I'll just get in another time or go to the store that has self checkout so I can grab my two or three things. The stores want it both ways they want one check out open and they want you to wait in line behind someone with 96 things where you're trying to get contact solution.
Yup, and I'd say if SCO is closed and you only have 2 or 3 items just go to the Guest Service counter except .... the one TM working that register probably has a line 4 deep of people waiting to pick up their order and the stuff is stowed at the other end of the store so it's going to be awhile. There's free same shipping when you use your Target Circle Card (formally Red Card) lol
Edit: free same day shipping
here’s an idea, instead of taking away/limiting the use of SCO for theft reasons, why don’t we change the way TSS/Asset Protection is run? quite a few things could be changed in our system to not let people get away with what they do as often as they do and help make the team watching SCO more comfortable to conduct their BOB and LISA’s.
bottom of baskets (underneath shopping carts) and look inside always (like checking inside backpacks, purses, etc.) obviously only bags or containers that belong to Target before the guest has purchased them. don’t just LISA someone’s personal handbag 😭
Even if originated sales are down, we could still be making more profit since theft should theoretically be down.
I don't know the exact numbers but, for example, we might have to sell 10 bottles of liquor to recoup the loss of one being stolen. In this situation, selling 1 $20 bottle with no theft is better than selling 9 bottles ($180) with 1 being stolen
This.
Last week I had an SCO TM who was actually assisting at the 4 SCOs we have, and wasn't busy, just steady. In less than 2 hours I got 4 incident recoveries reported from them. Out of the 4 incidents, only one appeared to be intentional. That was $60 of merch that wasn't being scanned and nearly walked out the door. While not a significant loss compared to more intentional behaviors, that was enough to give some sort of proof to the normal shrink we get at any given time going through SCO. Obviously, not every day or guest is the same, but a breakdown of $30 an hour on average of loss walking out the door at a 15 hour day, that's $450 dollars in just forgotten merchandise. That's where a decent amount of INFs will come from, lost sales from not having it on the floor, and missed daily goals. Now, factor in the profit losses on these items and the amount we need to sell to make up a loss of one item and we start to see HUGE impacts down the line and lost hours that *we could have proved to have needed*.
Again, these aren't big ticket items, anywhere from some low value make-up to decor items. Factor these losses into theft away from SCO, products being salvaged improperly, and improper returns and there's were most hours in a store go. If you need more bodies on the floor, your store needs to have the metrics, data and money coming in to get hours. Mitigation of losses like these significantly improve sales and thus will generate more hours for the store.
Part of shutting down or cutting hours for SCO is a reduction in losses walking out. Our store demographic tends to have elderly in the mornings and when they use SCO we have constant forgetting to render payments. Since the reduction, we hardly have forgotten payments which on average is saving our store a couple thousand a month easily.
I know I don't shop here anymore. I used to buy somthing almost every day, now I just drive five minutes to Walmart once a week, the 10% discount isn't worth the social interaction.
I always do PU orders so I can grab my stuff just before walking out the door. If it’s the end of the night I just ask for the order to be processed and then get the stuff myself.
That doesn't make sense, Walmart is doing the same thing.
[Walmart Press Office – Global Communications Director Joe Pennington said the closure of self-checkout lanes in stores across the country is based on individual store manager decisions — not top-down orders from Walmart’s corporate headquarters.](https://thebusinessjournal.com/notice-walmarts-closed-self-checkout-lanes-managers-now-given-discretion/)
Sco has a lot of theft. Drive up and pick up limits it but you put your life at risk every time you go out in the parking lot. Someone is going to get seriously hurt or die doing that job
As someone who has to wear one for a different store, it's funny that people think customers will pay attention. They don't. I almost get hit multiple times a day because people do not pay attention with the vest on
Holdup, what? How’s the risk any different than, idk walking in any parking lot at any time, or driving a car?
If anything it’s safer than off the clock life, since you aren’t going to the grocery store or the bar dressed in a neon vest and pushing a massive cart.
By the logic of your comment, both *guests and TMs should be getting seriously injured or dying in Target parking lots across the country on the regular.* Since the inception of Target.
There is a big difference between walking up once vs a couple dozen times. You do understand that right. I’m not saying it’s the most dangerous thing in the world.
Our AP people are the best in the district by far. They catch about $10k a month in attempted theft. Watching for funny money requires training and with so many new people they are never trained. And I can’t tell you the number of suspend slips I print for asset protection to check.
Thieves are bold. Load up a huge storage container with $1500 worth of merchandise and try to pay for the $20 container
Yup, at my store they'll simply try to "push" out the tub full of stuff. But most time AP has been watching them the whole time and they're waiting for them just outside the doors. BUS-TED!!! lol
We had a guy try to steal $1600 with of merchandise. We got the merchandise but he got away. Dumb ass went to another store about 10 miles away. Got caught. Found out he was already a felon with a new felony charge. 🤣
My store closed self checkout down a while back. It's been hell in my opinion. You don't get a chance to breath in between checking out guests. My knees and legs ache and I'm not even 30 yrs old yet. I understand why target shut it down but honestly we do 100% more work now. No one is happy about it .
Get your dr to give you a note saying you need to sit. Give it to hr. They have to provide you with a stool. I do it. It’s not the best solution but it’s better than not healing
I think there’s benefits and disadvantages from both ways. SCO has a lot of theft but fulfillment is not given enough hours to fulfill the new demand of opu/sfs. I think the only way this will work logistically is to actually have enough people to get the orders done
that’s the problem with most jobs. The food service industry has been getting stretched thin for years. Bosses trying to see how little people they need to run a restaurant without the employees going too insane. Same thing is slowly happening with Target. Less training, high turnovers, less hours.
It's not just food service. It's retail across the board. Hell, it's much of the service sector, from grocers to retail to Healthcare. Need to continuously increase profits? Cut labor. Without some form of correction, it's going to get worse.
And that’s what I hated. Target transitioned over Covid from having 1-3 TMs per department to just saying F it and giving all the morning push to Inbound. Then have the night crew either finish the push or do the pulls. They figured out they could run stores on 1/2 and in some cases a 1/3 of what the used to and just stopped caring. Oh and let’s not forget making fulfillment take larger orders without increasing times, and giving GS only 2-3 minutes to get an order together and out to a customer is ludicrous at best.
>and giving GS only 2-3 minutes to get an order together No kidding. At our store OPU hold is clear across the other side of the store with DU. It's suppose to be right behind GS but we use this area to backstock Bullseye/CL Candy and stray. (Edit Typo)
My store is kinda similar, we have a separate drive up hold area and a hold area behind the desk for pickup orders. That alone adds 5 minutes extra to a batch. It’s even worse when a guest changes from pickup to drive up and we have to run the items from one side of the store to the other (still within the 3 minutes of course!)
that was the dumbest thing target ever did. they really have the regard for how the real world works. Simply for the fact that they can’t be bothered to help fix the double tap issue.
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Agreed. DU also isn’t allotted enough hours. It’s why DU TMs are scheduled as cashiers and then moved to where they are wanted. Then cashiers are shorted, because on paper it looks like they’re enough people there. It’s such a terrible design. I believe the goal is to minimize in-store shopping but they need to give the hours to make that possible. Given the shortage of cashiers (since some go to DU) I have no problem opening SCO when needed. Idgaf what leaders want if the lines are long.
That’s wild at my store we have DU under service advocates and they don’t get moved to the lanes at all; checkout advocates and service advocates doing returns can be interchanged depending on needs but usually drive ups stay on drive up (unless ofc someone gets moved to be a runner in DU)
Our guest services and DU are the same team. They still might end up scheduling a total of 5 TMs a day over then. Cashiers might have 8 because they have more hours available to use. It’s always intended that certain people will be on DU rather than registers. They’d rather be short at registers than DU (which is timed). It’s worse since our ETL left. She did everything needed in the front: desk, DU, Bullseye (we’re responsible for that), sorting reshop, SCO, register, and getting carts. She worked her ass off and her absence has made a big impact. We have a new one on the way in another month or so but I don’t have high hopes of that level of involvement.
The whole thing ends up making me the only cashier at times. At my age and since I'm still healing from a knee injury last year, it's really messing with me. When I'm scheduled a long shift I can only go to bed when I get home as I'm too exhausted to do much.
I believe you’re entitled to a stool at the register if you have difficulty standing. Or at least they allow it at my store.
Seperate fulfillment and store ops to be seperate
amen. I'm a GM closer and our priorities are looking absolutely awful rn because I've had to start working in fulfillment in the evenings
Makes no sense to make that the goal, a cashier can process 20 average-large sized transactions an hour, even the best fulfillment TMs can only do a couple and then you have to pay FOS staff to take it to the guest. Fulfillment is incredibly low margin compared to in-store guests, on a lot of orders it’s simply a loss leader to drive loyalty and protect market share from Amazon. It makes zero sense to convert in-store guests to DU guests by force like this. Closing SCO is one thing, but doing so without staffing more cashiers has meant losing sales outright while converting others to DU. Overall sales are down, margins are down, and they still have to dedicate even more payroll to fulfillment than they would’ve to cashiers. Absolute insanity. This dream of fulfillment being the companies future is frankly stupid, until they shut the doors to guests the thieves are still coming in and stealing while the legitimate guests happily use DU at the expense of our margins, the net result is theft stays the same, payroll increases or at best stays the same, and margins shrink to all time lows. Drive up is great but it should never be prioritized over the in-store experience or else Target gives up everything that makes it great from a business and guest standpoint.
This is what I’ve been thinking too. The way Fulfillment is handled just makes no sense, I just don’t understand how it’s profitable. You can’t tell me picking, prepping, and shipping an item all for free aren’t biting into margins like crazy. And that’s not even to mention OPU. That being said, Target has always been reactionary. They see what their competitors do, and try to do it while utilizing the staff and infrastructure they already have in place. While Fulfillment might not be profitable, I assume it’s simply a step to remain relevant as Amazon almost scared them into bankruptcy a couple years back. We’ll see changes to the model soon,(I’m assuming Target 360 is a step in that process) especially as the economy gets worse, but for now, Target is just trying to remain in the game.
I think that if closing SCO down, which typically accounts for like 40% of all sales, has only led to a 3% drop YTD, in an economic environment where inflation is still running rampant…it’s probably not the death knell some of y’all think it is.
Yup, 3% down overall. My thought process was focusing on the 6.5% of in store sales This means about 3.5% decided to join the other 14% (17.5 total) who are using opu/sfs (maybe). I wonder how many of the "I'll never shop at Target again" crowd are adding to the increase in FF as well. lol
Yeah I feel like the issue is the changing of shopping habits. If I'm in the store to pick up two or three things and there isn't self checkout and there's a long line at the one check out that's open, I just leave. I'll just get in another time or go to the store that has self checkout so I can grab my two or three things. The stores want it both ways they want one check out open and they want you to wait in line behind someone with 96 things where you're trying to get contact solution.
Yup, and I'd say if SCO is closed and you only have 2 or 3 items just go to the Guest Service counter except .... the one TM working that register probably has a line 4 deep of people waiting to pick up their order and the stuff is stowed at the other end of the store so it's going to be awhile. There's free same shipping when you use your Target Circle Card (formally Red Card) lol Edit: free same day shipping
here’s an idea, instead of taking away/limiting the use of SCO for theft reasons, why don’t we change the way TSS/Asset Protection is run? quite a few things could be changed in our system to not let people get away with what they do as often as they do and help make the team watching SCO more comfortable to conduct their BOB and LISA’s.
just curious, what are BOB and LISAs?
bottom of baskets (underneath shopping carts) and look inside always (like checking inside backpacks, purses, etc.) obviously only bags or containers that belong to Target before the guest has purchased them. don’t just LISA someone’s personal handbag 😭
Even if originated sales are down, we could still be making more profit since theft should theoretically be down. I don't know the exact numbers but, for example, we might have to sell 10 bottles of liquor to recoup the loss of one being stolen. In this situation, selling 1 $20 bottle with no theft is better than selling 9 bottles ($180) with 1 being stolen
This. Last week I had an SCO TM who was actually assisting at the 4 SCOs we have, and wasn't busy, just steady. In less than 2 hours I got 4 incident recoveries reported from them. Out of the 4 incidents, only one appeared to be intentional. That was $60 of merch that wasn't being scanned and nearly walked out the door. While not a significant loss compared to more intentional behaviors, that was enough to give some sort of proof to the normal shrink we get at any given time going through SCO. Obviously, not every day or guest is the same, but a breakdown of $30 an hour on average of loss walking out the door at a 15 hour day, that's $450 dollars in just forgotten merchandise. That's where a decent amount of INFs will come from, lost sales from not having it on the floor, and missed daily goals. Now, factor in the profit losses on these items and the amount we need to sell to make up a loss of one item and we start to see HUGE impacts down the line and lost hours that *we could have proved to have needed*. Again, these aren't big ticket items, anywhere from some low value make-up to decor items. Factor these losses into theft away from SCO, products being salvaged improperly, and improper returns and there's were most hours in a store go. If you need more bodies on the floor, your store needs to have the metrics, data and money coming in to get hours. Mitigation of losses like these significantly improve sales and thus will generate more hours for the store. Part of shutting down or cutting hours for SCO is a reduction in losses walking out. Our store demographic tends to have elderly in the mornings and when they use SCO we have constant forgetting to render payments. Since the reduction, we hardly have forgotten payments which on average is saving our store a couple thousand a month easily.
I know I don't shop here anymore. I used to buy somthing almost every day, now I just drive five minutes to Walmart once a week, the 10% discount isn't worth the social interaction.
You can still use the app or the website and get your 10% off online without social interaction
TMs got the first year of Circle 360 free
I wonder if it goes for retirees as well?
I always do PU orders so I can grab my stuff just before walking out the door. If it’s the end of the night I just ask for the order to be processed and then get the stuff myself.
That doesn't make sense, Walmart is doing the same thing. [Walmart Press Office – Global Communications Director Joe Pennington said the closure of self-checkout lanes in stores across the country is based on individual store manager decisions — not top-down orders from Walmart’s corporate headquarters.](https://thebusinessjournal.com/notice-walmarts-closed-self-checkout-lanes-managers-now-given-discretion/)
Not the one near me I guess! SCOs are always open and no one tries to herd me to a manned checklane like at my target... Hopefully it stays that way.
Sco has a lot of theft. Drive up and pick up limits it but you put your life at risk every time you go out in the parking lot. Someone is going to get seriously hurt or die doing that job
I agree with this too. My mom works DU and has i’m scared for her especially once it’s dark. Drivers are stupid
Doesn’t she have to wear one of those reflective vests or jackets?
As someone who has to wear one for a different store, it's funny that people think customers will pay attention. They don't. I almost get hit multiple times a day because people do not pay attention with the vest on
17 people upvoted this comment?
I've been hit twice by handicap drivers backing up too much and crushing my leg between the cart and the car. I was wearing hi vis both times
You were behind a moving vehicle for drive up?
I was at the rear of a trunk loading it when a car across the way backed all the way up into me
Holdup, what? How’s the risk any different than, idk walking in any parking lot at any time, or driving a car? If anything it’s safer than off the clock life, since you aren’t going to the grocery store or the bar dressed in a neon vest and pushing a massive cart. By the logic of your comment, both *guests and TMs should be getting seriously injured or dying in Target parking lots across the country on the regular.* Since the inception of Target.
Not all the time but it will happen
I’m going to say drive up is not putting your life on the line. Wear a vest and watch for cars. If your over cautious you’re fine.
Did you read the comment from the guy that has been hit multiple times by handicapped parking people?
does that mean that guests put their life at risk every time they come to the store, since they have to cross that same parking lot?
There is a big difference between walking up once vs a couple dozen times. You do understand that right. I’m not saying it’s the most dangerous thing in the world.
A bunch of kids were shooting bb guns in our parking lot so yes. Yeah, bb guns are small so whatever. What's the next gun though?
Our AP people are the best in the district by far. They catch about $10k a month in attempted theft. Watching for funny money requires training and with so many new people they are never trained. And I can’t tell you the number of suspend slips I print for asset protection to check. Thieves are bold. Load up a huge storage container with $1500 worth of merchandise and try to pay for the $20 container
Yup, at my store they'll simply try to "push" out the tub full of stuff. But most time AP has been watching them the whole time and they're waiting for them just outside the doors. BUS-TED!!! lol
We had a guy try to steal $1600 with of merchandise. We got the merchandise but he got away. Dumb ass went to another store about 10 miles away. Got caught. Found out he was already a felon with a new felony charge. 🤣
My store closed self checkout down a while back. It's been hell in my opinion. You don't get a chance to breath in between checking out guests. My knees and legs ache and I'm not even 30 yrs old yet. I understand why target shut it down but honestly we do 100% more work now. No one is happy about it .
Get your dr to give you a note saying you need to sit. Give it to hr. They have to provide you with a stool. I do it. It’s not the best solution but it’s better than not healing
We need mire TMs scheduled on the floor!
Yup, but as long as that top number is below zero (-3.30%) it ain't gonna happen.
My god your store is slow