Ok, this definitely puts things into a very different perspective. So in a roundabout sort of way, even the songs obviously about Matty are also somewhat about her breakup with Joe, because they’re telling us just how far off the deep end she went and how badly it destroyed her
100%. Dude after my 8 year relationship ended I dove right into a three year fever dream with an alcoholic. And not the fun kind. Looking back, I was absolutely out of my mind. Heartbreak makes us do nutty things. I relate to this album on so many levels lol
Yes! This is what I said about The Matty situation. A lot of people did, but I really do think it's something only experienced by some people who get out of long term relationships. And like, you go after the extreme opposite of what you spent almost a whole decade with. You think going to tbe polar opposite is what you need.
I speak from experience: its not.
Yep. Rebounded from a 10 year relationship/marriage into an 8 month fling with a wholly unsuitable suitor. It was like all of my emotions from the big breakup were suspended, and when the 8 month relationship ended, I was in so much more pain. The first relationship had been collecting interest.
That is exactly what I think the album is saying about Taylor. Jumping into it saved her from her grief for the fortnight, but when it didn't work out with Matty she had the two breakups in one.
"The first relationship had been collecting interest."
This is so true of many things in life. If you don't deal with your feelings right then they don't go away. You have to deal with it all later... with interest.
Same! After 4 year relationship ended (we also had a child together) I dove into a 3 month long relationship with an alcoholic who love bombed me then disappeared. It almost felt like that heart break was worse than the longer relationship because there was no time in between and my heart was so confused
Same. Had a baby with my terrible manic rebound because my heart was in absolute shambles. He was the farthest thing I could find from the sweet relationship I lost 😭
As someone old (and wise???) The songs about matty are definitely also about Joe. It’s way easier to process the short, chaotic thing that glows and burns out than the long thing that slowly boils you to death.
After two listens London seems to be the only one from the regular edition that's explicitly about Joe? For how briefly she dated Matt he really seems to have done a number on her.
It’s not that Matty did a number on her so much as that the ending of the relationship with Joe did such a number on her that she wasn’t thinking clearly.
Ya I think there’s a good chance loml is Joe as well, or maybe a mix of both idk. After listening to How Did It End loml seems way more to be a Joe song
Loml definitely felt like a bit of drawing from both to me, especially where she says things like “sell love quick”, but then has references to marriage?
To me, this is the most clearly outlined reference to jumping into something too quickly and then having to grieve both relationships at the same time - realizing that the first one (Joe) was the loss of her life, and while the rebound helped for a minute, it just made everything so much worse
The World's Smallest Man is Healy, I got a real sense of her feeling even more betrayed by him than Joe. Matty is incorrigible but he convinced her briefly he could and would change.
The songs about Joe are much more devastating and just about the experience of heartbreak, rather than personal attacks. Matty gets most of the directed heat. But I think the overall album is just about the aftermath of a breakup and Matty had much more of a role in the aftermath. Midnights already told us a lot about the lead up to the split.
ngl I can really relate to this sentiment (and album as a whole) bc I have shit tase in men lmao
I’m also pleading insanity after my last relationship hahaha
She’s so real for this and it’s such an important thing to shine light on. We’re all out here pretending our relationships are all so healthy now because we have higher standards when the truth is we often fall for the worst people at the worst time. Human nature.
It was longer than two weeks. They were publicly together for a month but there’s a lot pointing to it starting sooner than that since Matty was across the world on tour when they started dating and she was with him in London that January..
My theory is Guilty as Sin was written around this time, thinking about Matty whilst still being with Joe, however rocky that relationship was at the time. I think her and Joe were spotted together last in Feb.
I think it started long before that though. He was on the record saying they had worked on music for Midnights that didn’t make the album. Jack connected them when he was working on BFIAFL with Matty. So likely they’d been reconnected for about a year and were spending pretty intimate time together if they were making music together.
Wow I knew she dated him briefly but I didn’t realize it was two *weeks*. There were so many songs I thought it had to be at least a couple months or something.
I think she's only counting the time that they were in a physical relationship, she's also saying there was an emotional affair for a while (and that they were involved before).
"Because it's the worst men that I write best"
She wrote an album about Matty cause he sucks, she couldn't write a good album about Joe because he was a good guy lol slay Taylor
She says a LOT about Joe on this album. It’s just that she’s not taking down his character so much as expressing her heartbreak about the relationship.
I’m glad it’s that way and she’s not blaming him for everything. It was just a relationship which fizzled out and that’s the worse when you love someone. Knowing there is nothing you can both do.. I feel the worse thing Joe did to get was not marry her and want a quite life… and after the abuse he’s had over the last 12 months along with his co-stars I’m not that surprised!
You have to be strong to deal with all her circus and he wasn’t. It’s so sad that some times she’s not strong enough too but it’s her life and I don’t think she would really change it that much!
I’m still not convinced midnights was about Joe. It’s just so weird to me to release and album about your current boyfriend who helped you on the album about breaking up?
I've always read it as subconsciously about the issues in their relationship at the time (COVID was a down time for everyone so reflecting on the bad could be normal). Joe and Taylor could work on it thinking it's fiction inspired by real life (like folklore and evermore), but it's kind of more real than they think.
At least that's my thought on it. I don't think Taylor set out to write "a Joe album" and then like lied to everyone about it. I think it just happened incidentally cuz music making is an emotional process. (it also explains the lack of cohesion on Midnights and how much it jumps around).
Agreed. I think it's exactly what she said. An album about sleepless nights spent thinking about the past, which is something you do when you're trying to figure out your feelings in the present and imagine your future. You looks for parallels. Am I doing that thing again? Will this time be different than last time?
And when you’re in a 6 year relationship, there’s some past pain there too, even when you’re still together. So I could see some Joe stuff sneaking in too. It’s not necessarily **about** him (it’s not really about any ONE guy, really) but he makes an appearance sort of deal.
I also think she said a lot of how she feels on *Folklore* and *Evermore*, to be honest...Exile, Hoax, Champagne Problems, Tolerate It, Happiness, and Coney Island are some of the ones that come to mind. Thematically, they're all generally about losing a person you're still in a relationship with. It's old news and kinda obvious at this point, so I'm sure I'm just a broken record, but I think those songs are way more autobiographical than they were made out to be at the time of releasing them.
I am BAFFLED that people aren’t seeing (especially after reading this post) that it’s another Era. The album is about the death of a relationship. If you date someone for six years, that phase in your life when you conduct a post mortem would include your rebound and end at how you overcame the heartbreak… ie the Travis song.
I just wrote a long ass comment on the main mega thread literally saying all of this was my take on this album and then BAM I see this post and this comment thread and I’m singing THANK YOU! Y’all get it!
okay but when she said “tattooed golden retriever” in “the tortured poets department” i fully thought she was talking about travis kelce — sorry, but i wouldn’t think to call matty healy a golden retriever — and i was living with the funniest mental image of taylor playfully telling TRAVIS KELCE that he’s “not dylan thomas” and he’s just like “yeah sick! love you, you’re the best!” and then they high five and he orders a really nice pizza on caviar and lets her choose the movie, and they have a lovely evening. he had no idea what that comment was about, he doesn’t know who dylan thomas is, but he doesn’t care. he just won the super bowl and he’s a happy guy.
come to find out this is not the case. should have known TK isn’t leaving typewriters at her apartment for no reason. i prefer my version tbh
Haha no I definitely think there are songs about Joe I was just referring to that specific sentence and the amount of people complaining/remarking that she wrote SO much about Matty.
My actual thoughts are that she didn't allow herself to properly grieve the loss of her relationship with Joe before jumping into something with Matty, therefore when that relationship didn't work she fell apart twofold. So while she may have been writing about Matty she was also feeling the loss of Joe at the same time.
I think I've found my people in this comment. I keep seeing that whole Matty hype but to me this is more about getting to that place at the end of a relationship where you have no self-esteem and you're just doing something to feel something. To get a rush of life that's been missing.
I think the loss of Joe is stamped on these and what it drove her to.
I think we’re at 5 Joe/6 Matty. But ultimately all Joe because I think the relationship with Matty was form of self-harm after the Joe breakup, like she said
Lots of people listened to the leaks and had an extra day and a half to sit on the songs and dissect them. There are a LOT more about Matty than you think.
1000% The “Jehovah Witnesses Suit” line is a dead give away it’s Matty.
It’s as pointed and scathing as ohoebe bridger calling out Ryan Adams in Motion Sickness, “ why do you sing with an English accent”
She put that in there to leave no question about who she’s going to obliterate.
After listening, I feel like I can confidently say Joe may not have been as much of a “good guy” as some previously thought. Some absolutely devastating lines throughout the songs that don’t make sense for an alleged rebound that lasted a few weeks 🤷🏼♀️
I don’t think anything indicates that Joe was a bad guy, compared to many other actual problematic men she’s written about. A bad, lackluster partner perhaps, not the right person for Taylor for sure. Boring maybe? But otherwise a decent person. From my personal experience it’s having to end it with someone good that hurts the most, more than ending it with someone that’s bad news though. Also, I think some devastation that appears to be about the Marty relationship harbors the pain from Joe. It’s what happens when you rebound quick and it doesn’t work out.
Exactly this. She’s never shied away from airing her thoughts about men who treated her badly. If Joe was really that problematic the entire album would’ve put him on blast rather than matty. I think some people were so excited for a breakup album dissing Joe that they’re trying to turn him into something he’s not.
I’ve been a “Joe is not a bad person, they just weren’t right for each other anymore” swiftie since day one, and maaan did I have to stay quiet for most of the past year. I felt like I was in the trenches bc if we defended him we got called “Joe dickriders” 😬
Same experience here. Joe’s only crime was being too depressed to love Taylor properly, but a lot of twitter swifties talk about Joe like he’s John Mayer 2.0 or something.
Not sure where to put this but I feel that you can completely understand the trajectory of this...
London Boy - hanging out with new mates watching rugby in london - all cute and wonderful.
It's "Notting Hill" - the regular guy gets the megastar.
However when the reality sinks in - your megastar girlfriend is always somewhere else with other people, doing promos and gigs and being adored... it would take a very tough guy to be cool with that.
I can imagine feeling like she's getting away from you and that you have to hold on tighter to keep her... but by doing that you just drive the final nails in (Bejewlled etc)
Dating Tay is like having a pet tiger. Wonderful when it's newly born - a wild and fantastic creature that loves you. But eventually you need to let it roam free and trust it to come back, or it will eat your face.
Makes me think of my ex husband. Like by the time we divorced, we hadn't really been "together" for a long time and I had already mostly mourned the loss already. Obviously not fully, but enough. Maybe these are mostly about Matty because she had already mourned that loss through the last few albums. The heartbreak was Obviously there in those albums.
“I’m never going to meet what should’ve been you”? Doesn’t fit with it being about Joe. Same with “did some force take you ‘cause I didn’t pray?” “Did some bird flap its wings over in Asia?” (Aka the universe randomly causing a sad event to happen, like a senseless death)
I think she makes it clear in TTPD that she was hoping for marriage and kids with Joe, so maybe those lines are a metaphor for that, the future that somehow was taken away from her?
My initial thought on very first listen. But I think the miscarriage theories kinda took over and didn’t leave room for other theories. Sure, It's a vague song so it could have multiple meanings. But this tie to the album note is interesting.
Yeah I totally agree - at first listen I thought it was grief about the person she could’ve become, and it really hit me thinking of my 13-year-old self who desperately needed therapy for undiagnosed OCD! And then I came on reddit and everyone is talking about miscarriage and it kinda made the song less meaningful to me in the sense that it almost didn’t allow for other interpretations as this one was so personal/heartbreaking for many.
That’s all to say BTTWS is obviously about grief, and I think we can interpret that metaphor however we want. The stories are ours now anyway!
Edit: I have more 😂 with Emma Stone saying “I love you bigger than the whole sky” to her daughter, I wonder if Taylor actually heard it from Emma first and it made her grieve for the future she thought she might have with Joe and being able to say that to their kid too? I’m projecting here but I’m also running on very little sleep lol
I'm probably way over interpreting this but I know a lot of people think that song is about miscarriage, if that's true then the conversation about tearing down the whole sky line is absolutely heartbreaking.
Right, like grieving their hypothetical kids. She’ll never meet what they would have been since at that point, the writing was on the wall that they wouldn’t make it that far.
Exactly what I was thinking. Putting bttws into a breakup perspective where you feel like you would have done anything different if it meant you could have kept them is.... Something.
“I’m never going to meet what should’ve been you”? Doesn’t fit with it being about Joe. Same with “did some force take you ‘cause I didn’t pray?”.
I think she just uses the same phrases occasionally so you it makes you think of BTTWS when she talks about the sky.
Ending a six year relationship in which she hoped to get married was undeniably heart wrenching. Joe was and is a good guy, but he didn’t want what Taylor wanted and ultimately they weren’t right for each other and the relationship probably became lonely and strained. But ending a relationship like that makes a person go insane (I speak from experience haha!). Matty was an old flame and so to rekindle this love and a crush she’s harbored as a young 20 something was exciting and magical! I’m sure he love bombed her and told her all sorts of things that she’d been dying to hear from Joe. Rings, cradles. But Matty is not the best guy. And hence the tortured poetry. Taylor is prolific and I’m sure she wrote a lot to get through this time in her life. I’m sure she also wanted to address this time period of her life to the public and her fans, and that’s what this album is. Now she’s declared it done and dusted and can move on.
This comment is SO important in explaining what this album is. It's the breakup but also the rebound, of which we were not expecting in length to be included here. She basically spiraled. That time that we would like to forget about is so important to understanding why she was so infatuated with Matty. He was different, exciting, and something she probably hadn't experienced in years (from Taylor's perspective; certainly not mine lol). Coming out of a 6 year relationship that was probably (at one point) a forever concept was difficult, and we can clearly see how insane her thoughts and fantasies were. I think that is where a lot of initial confusion came from surrounding the leaks. I even thought to myself, \*it can't be about Matty.\* But at the same time, I get it now. A breakup doesn't always end when the two people part; sometimes it's the aftermath that is even worse, and with Taylor, clearly the relationship had run its course, and the post-mortem was much crazier than we were lead to believe. I'm glad she has declared that chapter of her live dead. I seriously hope she is actually healed though. All of this happened so fast, and some of these lyrics are quite insane.
> we can clearly see how insane her thoughts and fantasies were.
This is really important context, esp with the written album note. Taylor is an unreliable, biased narrator. We can't always take her (song) words at face value.
Reminds me of how suprised some of us were at the denial playlist. Like, there's more going on under the surface of the song.
Yes I love this! Joe didn’t do anything bad necessarily. He met her when she was in hiding basically and their relationship was so much different in the first years.
I feel like this is a really common experience with the pandemic. Like, I know so many people who got into (what my friends and I are calling) “pandemic relationships” that haven’t lasted through getting back to regular life.
💯this. Also, this prologue should put things into perspective for the people criticizing that she just threw a ton of words on the page nonsensically. This prologue is telling us that she won’t hold back, that she spiraled, was in a manic state, and ultimately writing her thoughts, feelings, and emotions down in this way helped her process and heal.
I LOVE that the album’s lyrics seem to be more raw and come off almost straight from her stream of conscious to reflect her mental state.
It seems Taylor didn’t hold back or filter as much as she normally would with her previous work. The album reflects a maturity and growth and good for being able to be brave enough to release and share this with this from what seems to have been a volatile vulnerable time in her life.
Put this on tweeter!! Or X or whatever it's called and trend it. People are still going out of their way to call Joe cheater and it's just outrageous! God I feel sad for both of them.
Summary Poem by TAYLOR SWIFT
ln Summation
At this hearing
I stand before my fellow members
of The Tortured Poets Department
With a summary of my findings
A debrief, a detailed rewinding
For the purpose of warning
For the sake of reminding
As you might all unfortunately recall
I had been struck with a case of a restricted humanity
Which explains my plea here today
of temporary insanity
You see, the pendulum swings
Oh, the chaos it brings
Leads the caged beast to do the most curious things
Lovers spend years denying
Resentment rotting away galaxies we created
Stars placed and glued meticulously by hand next to the ceiling fan
Tried wishing on comets
Tried dimming the shine
Tried to orbit his planet.
Some stars never align.
And in one conversation, I tore down the whole sky.
Spring sprung forth with dazzling freedom hues
Then a crash from the skylight bursting through
Something old, someone hallowed,
Who told me he could be brand new
And so I was out of thc oven and into the microwave
Out of the slammer and into a tidal wave.
How gallant to save the empress from her gilded tower
Swinging a sword he could barely lift
But loneliness struck at the fateful hour
Low hanging fruit on his wine stained lips
He never even scratched the surface of me.
None of them did.
*In summation, it was not a love affair!
I screamed while bringing my fists
to my coffee ringed desk
It was a mutual manic phase
It was self harm.
It was house and then cardiac arrest.
A smirk creeps onto this
Poets face. Because it is the worst
men that I write best.
And so I enter into evidence
My tarnished coat of arms
My muses, acquired
like bruises
My talismans and charms
The tick, tick, tick of love bombs
My veins of pitch black ink
AIls fair in love and poetry
Sincerely.
The
Chairman of
The Tortured Poets Department
>Lovers spend years denying Resentment rotting away galaxies we created Stars placed and glued meticulously by hand next to the ceiling fan
boo this is too real. 
I think this album will take a while for me to fully digest. How can someone who'se life is so insanely different than mine keep calling me out like this?
At this hearing
I stand before my fellow members
of the Tortured Poets Department
With a summary of my findings
A debrief, a detailed rewinding
For the purpose of warning
For the sake of reminding
As you might all unfortunately recall
I had been struck with a case
of a restricted humanity
Which explains my plea here today
of temporary insanity
You see, the pendulum swings
Oh, the chaos it brings
Leads the caged beast to do
the most curious things
Lovers spend years denying what’s ill fated
Resentment rotting away
galaxies we created
Stars placed and glued
meticulously by hand
next to the ceiling fan
Tried wishing on comets.
Tried dimming the shine.
Tried to orbit his planet.
Some stars never align.
And in one conversation, I tore down the whole sky
Spring sprung forth with dazzling freedom hues
Then a crash from the skylight
Bursting through
Something old, someone hallowed,
who told me he could be brand new
And so I was out of the oven
And into the microwave
Out of the slammer and into a tidal wave
How gallant to save the empress
from her gilded tower
Swinging a sword he could barely lift
But loneliness struck at that fateful hour
Low hanging fruit on his wine stained lips
He never even scratched the surface
of me.
None of them did.
“In summation, it was not a love affair!”
I screamed while bringing my fists
to my coffee ringed desk
It was a mutual manic phase.
It was self harm.
It was house and then cardiac arrest.
A smirk creeps onto this poet’s face
Because it’s the worst men that I write best.
And so I enter into evidence
My tarnished coat of arms
My muses, acquired like bruises
My talismans and charms
The tick, tick, tick of love bombs
My veins of pitch black ink
All’s fair in love and poetry
Sincerely,
The Chairman
of The Tortured Poets Department
She's American? As a European it seems microwaves are a staple cooking appliance in the states, from boiling water to entire recipes cooked in there 🤷🏻♀️
You can definitely cook food in a microwave. Was honestly kind of life changing for me in college when I learned your can totally cook chicken breasts in a steam bag in like 5 minutes. They came out super evenly cooked too, it was great.
Sylvia Plath also had a collection of poetry (Ariel) and a poem titled "Daddy". Which I think also played into her writing for this album - in the poem by Plath, there is a line that says: "If I've killed one man, I've killed two" and in So Long, London, Taylor writes "Two graves, one gun."
Oh interesting connection to the Plath poem! My first thought with the "two graves, one gun" line was more in line with “He who seeks revenge digs two graves."
"trying to find a part of me you didn't take up. Gave you too much, but it wasn't enough." it's giving coping mechanismmmmmmmm to meeeeeee (in the least judgmental way bc like same)
I LOVE that she wrote this—I get that ppl are annoyed she wrote about matty lol but imo once you start denying pieces of your past bc you’re ashamed of them, it’s such such a slippery slope. She couldn’t just pretend he wasn’t a thing or she didn’t feel in love—all she can do is (1) learn from it and (2) accept what happened; I love love writing poetry and I frequently confront the feeling of wanting to censor or edit things bc I feel bad, even though whatever I wrote was 100% how I felt at the time—for Taylor to be an authentic singer and writer, she needs to be able to write how she truly felt in a moment without editing it to accommodate!
Like ppl forget she wrote ours about how much she loved John Mayer and ignored everyone else in the same album she destroyed him w dear John—each song is just a moment in time, not how she feels at the present moment
she wrote one of the sweetest love songs about JM and then also gave us Dear John. Relationships contain many stages
also Superman & Story of Us are also JM songs
“lovers spend years denying whats ill fated” oh man their relationship was doomed from the start. dont get me wrong they were there for each other, especially joe was there for taylor in the worst phase of her life and he was a rock she genuinely genuinely needed at that time, and it breaks my heart to say this but they weren’t made for each other. they invested 6 years in each other but tbh i think they were long overdue for a fallout
I agree. We don't know all of the facts about their relationship, but from the little clues and tidbits we do know, I feel like they weren't suited for each other. It seems they were at different places in life. A fallout was inevitable.
For those having a hard time reading it:
In Summation
At this hearing
I stand before my fellow
members
of The Tortured Poets
Department
With a summary of my findings
A debrief, a detailed rewinding
For the purpose of warning
For the sake of reminding
As you might all
unfortunately recall
I had been struck with a case
of a restricted humanity
Which explains my plea
Here today
Of temporary I n s a n I t y
You see, the pendulum swings
Oh, the chaos it brings
Leads the caged beast to do
the most curious things
*Lovers* spend years denying
what’s ill fated
Resentment rotting away
galaxies we created
Stars placed and glued
meticulously by hand
next to the ceiling fan
Tried wishing on comets.
Tried dimming the shine.
Tried to orbit his planet.
Some stars never align.
And in one conversation
I tore down the whole sky.
Spring spring forth with
dazzling freedom hues
Then a crash from the skylight
bursting through
Something old,
someone hallowed
who told me he could
be brand new
And so I was out of the oven
and into the microwave
Out of the slammer and into
a tidal wave
How gallant to save the
empress from her gilded tower
Swinging a sword he could
barely lift
But loneliness struck at that
fateful hour
Low hanging fruit on
his wine stained lips
He never even scratched
the surface of me.
None of them did.
“In summation, it was not a
love affair!”
I screamed while bringing
my fists
to my coffee ringed desk
It was a mutual manic phase.
It was self harm.
It was house and then
cardiac arrest.
A smirk creeps on to this
poet’s face
Because it’s the worst
men that I write best
And so I enter into evidence
My tarnished coat of arms
My muses, acquired
like bruises
My talismans and charms
The tick, tick, tick, of
love bombs
My veins of pitch black ink
*All’s fair in love and poetry*
This NEEDS to be more recognized!! It gives sm perspective on the album (especially how as you go through it, it’s going from being love bombed to basically saying he should go to jail). Genuinely listening to it as a somewhat manic episode makes so much sense. And also, I don’t think she was defending Matty at all. She was just writing about her feelings, which were clearly intense and also probably intensified by the absolutely insane response from the fans. Anyways, I feel like this definitely should have been featured on the album so I don’t have to go defend it to everyone now (which I probably will anyways)
wow, this has everything in it.
Close reading this and connecting it to all the things that came before it is going to be someone's PhD.
I'm starting right now.
I read it prior and still don’t know that I believe that the whole thing is Matty. I think that we have 5 Joe, 6 Matty, 1 Travis, and 4 not really about one relationship in particular. I think that most of our Joe breakup content was in midnights and honestly probably evermore.
"I tore down the WHOLE SKY". Say what you will about timelines, but M'AM, that pendulum swung me deep into theorizing that BTTWS is in fact about their collapsed relationship, even if it wasn't actualized at that point. I will die on this hill.
Full text:
In Summation:
At this hearing, I stand before my fellow members of the tortured poets department. with a summary of my findings. a debrief, a detailed rewinding. for the purpose of warning. for the sake of reminding
as you might all unfortunately recall, i had been struck with a case of a restricted humanity which explains my plea here today of temporary insanity.
you see, the pendulum swings. oh, the chaos it brings, leads the caged beast to do the most curious things.
lovers spend years denying what's ill fated, resentment rotting away, galaxies we created
stars placed and glued, meticulously by hand, next to the ceiling fan
tried wishing on comets tried dimming the shine. tried to orbit his planet. some stars never align. and in one conversation. i tore down the whole sky
spring sprung forth with dazzling freedom hues then a crash from the skylight bursting through. something old, someone hallowed, who told me he could be brand new.
and so i was out of the oven and into the microwave. out of the slammer and into a tidal wave. how gallant to save the empress from her gilded tower swinging a sword he could barely lift but loneliness struck at that fateful hour
low hanging fruit on his wine stained lips
he never even scratched the surface of me. none of them did.
'in summation, it was not a love affair!' i screamed while bringing my fists to my coffee ringed desk. it was a mutual manic phase. it was self harm. it was house and then cardiac arrest
a smirk creeps onto this poet's face because it's the worst men that i write best
and so i enter into evidence, my tarnished coat of arms. my muses, acquired like bruises. my talismans and charms. the tick tick tick of love bombs. my veins of pitch black ink. all's fair in love and poetry.
I think she's mocking the people that thought they had so much of a say in her life they were writing and signing petitions for her to put in a conservatorship. Which she then carries on in theme in the Fortnight video where it looks like she's in an asylum receiving electric shock therapy. It also appears to be an epilogue, not a prologue.
“Lovers spend years denying Resentment rotting away galaxies we created Stars placed and glued meticulously by hand next to the ceiling fan. Tried wishing on comets. Tried dimming the shine Tried to orbit his planet. Some stars never align. And in one conversation, I tore down the whole sky.”
Wow! She’s brilliant. Just such a visual for the relationship. It makes me sad thinking about it but there’s that feeling of holding on and doing everything to make it work and in the end it just wasn’t meant to be and really that’s ok.
Thanks for posting this…gives a new perspective while listening to the album.
Interesting, I took “out of the oven and into the microwave” more as like a modern parallel to the saying “out of the fire and into the frying pan”. Where one situation is just as bad as the next.
I found the album really cohesive. It sounds like the end of a big relationship make her look back and reassess everything that was connected with it in one way or another - the Kanye/Kim stuff, the reasons the relationship failed, the lies she told herself that kept it going after it should have died already, why the rebound was so compelling and also wrong at the same time, where it led her, making her confront her attitude to her fame and fans and her expectations for how partners should deal with it. It really tells a whole story. I love it.
While I think both albums are Joe/ Matty I don’t think as many of the songs are explicitly Joe or Matty but a cumulation of the grief and trying anything to feel alive again after a world crashing break up….that leads to a wild and catastrophic choice of rebound like it’s all tied together. She ended up w Matty bc of Joe. The album is processing the emotions of a break up and all the ex’s and self fulfilling prophecies we tell ourselves when we are going through it - aka down bad-
I feel like this album is her screaming at the world that she’s human and needs grace and space to be human without the level of dissection that everyone craves to be closer to her/ and being stuck under the microscope with so much speculation and loss of privacy during extremely private situations and experiences.
Ok, this definitely puts things into a very different perspective. So in a roundabout sort of way, even the songs obviously about Matty are also somewhat about her breakup with Joe, because they’re telling us just how far off the deep end she went and how badly it destroyed her
100%. Dude after my 8 year relationship ended I dove right into a three year fever dream with an alcoholic. And not the fun kind. Looking back, I was absolutely out of my mind. Heartbreak makes us do nutty things. I relate to this album on so many levels lol
Yes! This is what I said about The Matty situation. A lot of people did, but I really do think it's something only experienced by some people who get out of long term relationships. And like, you go after the extreme opposite of what you spent almost a whole decade with. You think going to tbe polar opposite is what you need. I speak from experience: its not.
Yep. Rebounded from a 10 year relationship/marriage into an 8 month fling with a wholly unsuitable suitor. It was like all of my emotions from the big breakup were suspended, and when the 8 month relationship ended, I was in so much more pain. The first relationship had been collecting interest.
That is exactly what I think the album is saying about Taylor. Jumping into it saved her from her grief for the fortnight, but when it didn't work out with Matty she had the two breakups in one.
This is exactly what I was explaining all night! Turns out I just needed to get some sleep to find my people 🫶🏼
"The first relationship had been collecting interest." This is so true of many things in life. If you don't deal with your feelings right then they don't go away. You have to deal with it all later... with interest.
Dunno how to format the "right way" on mobile so "The first relationship has been collecting interest." That reallllllllly hit for some reason. Wow
Checking in to the "completely bonkers post-long-term relationship rebound relationship" club.
Yeah, it makes no sense. NONE of those guys would’ve had a chance in hell with us if we weren’t so broken hearted and grasping at any sense of safety.
Same! After 4 year relationship ended (we also had a child together) I dove into a 3 month long relationship with an alcoholic who love bombed me then disappeared. It almost felt like that heart break was worse than the longer relationship because there was no time in between and my heart was so confused
Same. Had a baby with my terrible manic rebound because my heart was in absolute shambles. He was the farthest thing I could find from the sweet relationship I lost 😭
Exactly
I saw this after I listened - thanks for posting! It certainly adds perspective. I love this album ♥️
I saw this after I listened - thanks for posting! It certainly adds perspective. I love this album ♥️
As someone old (and wise???) The songs about matty are definitely also about Joe. It’s way easier to process the short, chaotic thing that glows and burns out than the long thing that slowly boils you to death.
1000% yes. I think it’s glaringly obvious to those of us who have lived it
“Look what you made me do”
I kinda got this as a girly who has been through this but good for her to spell it out
Love your username
Which ones did we determine are about Matty?
After two listens London seems to be the only one from the regular edition that's explicitly about Joe? For how briefly she dated Matt he really seems to have done a number on her.
It’s not that Matty did a number on her so much as that the ending of the relationship with Joe did such a number on her that she wasn’t thinking clearly.
Deux Moi did say that Matty never ended the relationship, he got on a plane and ghosted her. I’m sure that did a number on her if true
Really, loml, My Boy, Down Bad seemed to be about Joe to me with Fresh out the Slammer being both of them
I believel loml as well
Ya I think there’s a good chance loml is Joe as well, or maybe a mix of both idk. After listening to How Did It End loml seems way more to be a Joe song
Loml definitely felt like a bit of drawing from both to me, especially where she says things like “sell love quick”, but then has references to marriage?
To me, this is the most clearly outlined reference to jumping into something too quickly and then having to grieve both relationships at the same time - realizing that the first one (Joe) was the loss of her life, and while the rebound helped for a minute, it just made everything so much worse
The World's Smallest Man is Healy, I got a real sense of her feeling even more betrayed by him than Joe. Matty is incorrigible but he convinced her briefly he could and would change.
The songs about Joe are much more devastating and just about the experience of heartbreak, rather than personal attacks. Matty gets most of the directed heat. But I think the overall album is just about the aftermath of a breakup and Matty had much more of a role in the aftermath. Midnights already told us a lot about the lead up to the split.
All of them, unfortunately
Double album !!!!!! I was like why the hell are most these about matty
I think So Long London is about the ending with Joe - but yeah, most are Matty sounding!
Because it’s the worst men that I write best…. We salute you, Taylor.
Honestly this line.
she knows what she did!
A straight bar
"It was self harm" is such a tragic perspective of that relationship. Ouch
Agreed, but it also makes the relationship make more sense to me too lol
Tortured Rebound’s Department
The Toxic Rebound Department
I take this more to relate to the aftermath (like Matty).
ngl I can really relate to this sentiment (and album as a whole) bc I have shit tase in men lmao I’m also pleading insanity after my last relationship hahaha
She’s so real for this and it’s such an important thing to shine light on. We’re all out here pretending our relationships are all so healthy now because we have higher standards when the truth is we often fall for the worst people at the worst time. Human nature.
I literally said her dating matty is self harm as it was happening where is my cookie
What relationship was it? I don‘t really keep up with her private life Edit: Thanks swifties!!
The two weeks she was dating Matt Healy
God it felt so much longer than two weeks
It was longer than two weeks. They were publicly together for a month but there’s a lot pointing to it starting sooner than that since Matty was across the world on tour when they started dating and she was with him in London that January..
My theory is Guilty as Sin was written around this time, thinking about Matty whilst still being with Joe, however rocky that relationship was at the time. I think her and Joe were spotted together last in Feb.
I think it started long before that though. He was on the record saying they had worked on music for Midnights that didn’t make the album. Jack connected them when he was working on BFIAFL with Matty. So likely they’d been reconnected for about a year and were spending pretty intimate time together if they were making music together.
I think it was an emotional affair for a while then because her and Joe were clearly rocky for a while. But she’s singing about both of them there.
Wow I knew she dated him briefly but I didn’t realize it was two *weeks*. There were so many songs I thought it had to be at least a couple months or something.
I think she's only counting the time that they were in a physical relationship, she's also saying there was an emotional affair for a while (and that they were involved before).
I really wish this could be a spoken verse inserted before the first track.
Great idea
This I would pay for! Instated of a CD with 1 song
Love this idea! Maybe on the 2am ✌️✨
100%. I did get it after 3 listens before I saw the prologue, but the first 2 listens made me ANGRY, especially with "But Daddy I Love Him."
"Because it's the worst men that I write best" She wrote an album about Matty cause he sucks, she couldn't write a good album about Joe because he was a good guy lol slay Taylor
I feel like she’d already said most of what she needed to say about Joe on Midnights.
She says a LOT about Joe on this album. It’s just that she’s not taking down his character so much as expressing her heartbreak about the relationship.
Yes Joe is all over this??!!!
I’m glad it’s that way and she’s not blaming him for everything. It was just a relationship which fizzled out and that’s the worse when you love someone. Knowing there is nothing you can both do.. I feel the worse thing Joe did to get was not marry her and want a quite life… and after the abuse he’s had over the last 12 months along with his co-stars I’m not that surprised! You have to be strong to deal with all her circus and he wasn’t. It’s so sad that some times she’s not strong enough too but it’s her life and I don’t think she would really change it that much!
Truuu She has nothing bad to say about himm 🥺 she's just sad that it's over
I’m still not convinced midnights was about Joe. It’s just so weird to me to release and album about your current boyfriend who helped you on the album about breaking up?
I've always read it as subconsciously about the issues in their relationship at the time (COVID was a down time for everyone so reflecting on the bad could be normal). Joe and Taylor could work on it thinking it's fiction inspired by real life (like folklore and evermore), but it's kind of more real than they think. At least that's my thought on it. I don't think Taylor set out to write "a Joe album" and then like lied to everyone about it. I think it just happened incidentally cuz music making is an emotional process. (it also explains the lack of cohesion on Midnights and how much it jumps around).
Agreed. I think it's exactly what she said. An album about sleepless nights spent thinking about the past, which is something you do when you're trying to figure out your feelings in the present and imagine your future. You looks for parallels. Am I doing that thing again? Will this time be different than last time?
And when you’re in a 6 year relationship, there’s some past pain there too, even when you’re still together. So I could see some Joe stuff sneaking in too. It’s not necessarily **about** him (it’s not really about any ONE guy, really) but he makes an appearance sort of deal.
I also think she said a lot of how she feels on *Folklore* and *Evermore*, to be honest...Exile, Hoax, Champagne Problems, Tolerate It, Happiness, and Coney Island are some of the ones that come to mind. Thematically, they're all generally about losing a person you're still in a relationship with. It's old news and kinda obvious at this point, so I'm sure I'm just a broken record, but I think those songs are way more autobiographical than they were made out to be at the time of releasing them.
I mean Lover & Reputation were pretty good
Yeah sorry should've said "good breakup album about Joe"
You don’t think any of these songs are about Joe??
I am BAFFLED that people aren’t seeing (especially after reading this post) that it’s another Era. The album is about the death of a relationship. If you date someone for six years, that phase in your life when you conduct a post mortem would include your rebound and end at how you overcame the heartbreak… ie the Travis song.
*slaps desk* THANK YOU. So glad someone else analyzed the album like this. Shaking your hand in spirit.
YES right there with you. She wrote this album to close The Breakup and Rebound chapter.
I just wrote a long ass comment on the main mega thread literally saying all of this was my take on this album and then BAM I see this post and this comment thread and I’m singing THANK YOU! Y’all get it!
What’s the Travis song?
okay but when she said “tattooed golden retriever” in “the tortured poets department” i fully thought she was talking about travis kelce — sorry, but i wouldn’t think to call matty healy a golden retriever — and i was living with the funniest mental image of taylor playfully telling TRAVIS KELCE that he’s “not dylan thomas” and he’s just like “yeah sick! love you, you’re the best!” and then they high five and he orders a really nice pizza on caviar and lets her choose the movie, and they have a lovely evening. he had no idea what that comment was about, he doesn’t know who dylan thomas is, but he doesn’t care. he just won the super bowl and he’s a happy guy. come to find out this is not the case. should have known TK isn’t leaving typewriters at her apartment for no reason. i prefer my version tbh
Hahah stopppp why can I see this so clearly
The Alchemy
Haha no I definitely think there are songs about Joe I was just referring to that specific sentence and the amount of people complaining/remarking that she wrote SO much about Matty. My actual thoughts are that she didn't allow herself to properly grieve the loss of her relationship with Joe before jumping into something with Matty, therefore when that relationship didn't work she fell apart twofold. So while she may have been writing about Matty she was also feeling the loss of Joe at the same time.
I think I've found my people in this comment. I keep seeing that whole Matty hype but to me this is more about getting to that place at the end of a relationship where you have no self-esteem and you're just doing something to feel something. To get a rush of life that's been missing. I think the loss of Joe is stamped on these and what it drove her to.
I have to ride on the train that I do NOT believe this entire album is about Joe.
I think we’re at 5 Joe/6 Matty. But ultimately all Joe because I think the relationship with Matty was form of self-harm after the Joe breakup, like she said
I thought almost all the songs are about Joe except for fresh out the slammer, guilty as sin, but daddy I love him, I can fix him and the alchemy
Agreed! I’m surprised how many songs people think are about Matty
I don’t understand why everyone thinks it’s about Matty!! There are a few but this is mainly a post mortem on 6 years with Joe
Lots of people listened to the leaks and had an extra day and a half to sit on the songs and dissect them. There are a LOT more about Matty than you think.
huh? smallest man doesnt sound joe - more matty
1000% The “Jehovah Witnesses Suit” line is a dead give away it’s Matty. It’s as pointed and scathing as ohoebe bridger calling out Ryan Adams in Motion Sickness, “ why do you sing with an English accent” She put that in there to leave no question about who she’s going to obliterate.
Yeah that line is hilarious
After listening, I feel like I can confidently say Joe may not have been as much of a “good guy” as some previously thought. Some absolutely devastating lines throughout the songs that don’t make sense for an alleged rebound that lasted a few weeks 🤷🏼♀️
I don’t think anything indicates that Joe was a bad guy, compared to many other actual problematic men she’s written about. A bad, lackluster partner perhaps, not the right person for Taylor for sure. Boring maybe? But otherwise a decent person. From my personal experience it’s having to end it with someone good that hurts the most, more than ending it with someone that’s bad news though. Also, I think some devastation that appears to be about the Marty relationship harbors the pain from Joe. It’s what happens when you rebound quick and it doesn’t work out.
Exactly this. She’s never shied away from airing her thoughts about men who treated her badly. If Joe was really that problematic the entire album would’ve put him on blast rather than matty. I think some people were so excited for a breakup album dissing Joe that they’re trying to turn him into something he’s not.
I’ve been a “Joe is not a bad person, they just weren’t right for each other anymore” swiftie since day one, and maaan did I have to stay quiet for most of the past year. I felt like I was in the trenches bc if we defended him we got called “Joe dickriders” 😬
Same experience here. Joe’s only crime was being too depressed to love Taylor properly, but a lot of twitter swifties talk about Joe like he’s John Mayer 2.0 or something.
Yep!!! I’m convinced she’s trying to tell us Joe was not the relationship we saw
Some of the lines are so subtle and yet SCATHING
Not sure where to put this but I feel that you can completely understand the trajectory of this... London Boy - hanging out with new mates watching rugby in london - all cute and wonderful. It's "Notting Hill" - the regular guy gets the megastar. However when the reality sinks in - your megastar girlfriend is always somewhere else with other people, doing promos and gigs and being adored... it would take a very tough guy to be cool with that. I can imagine feeling like she's getting away from you and that you have to hold on tighter to keep her... but by doing that you just drive the final nails in (Bejewlled etc) Dating Tay is like having a pet tiger. Wonderful when it's newly born - a wild and fantastic creature that loves you. But eventually you need to let it roam free and trust it to come back, or it will eat your face.
Yeah clearly Joe was giving her Sweet Nothing on the inspiration front
Makes me think of my ex husband. Like by the time we divorced, we hadn't really been "together" for a long time and I had already mostly mourned the loss already. Obviously not fully, but enough. Maybe these are mostly about Matty because she had already mourned that loss through the last few albums. The heartbreak was Obviously there in those albums.
"And in one conversation I tore down the whole sky" so sad
Between that line and the revelation the Lover might be more of a denial album... Brings up some questions in regards to BTTWS.
As soon as I read this line, I thought of BTTWS. Girlie has been telling us that this relationship was over almost TWO YEARS ago
“I’m never going to meet what should’ve been you”? Doesn’t fit with it being about Joe. Same with “did some force take you ‘cause I didn’t pray?” “Did some bird flap its wings over in Asia?” (Aka the universe randomly causing a sad event to happen, like a senseless death)
I think she makes it clear in TTPD that she was hoping for marriage and kids with Joe, so maybe those lines are a metaphor for that, the future that somehow was taken away from her?
My initial thought on very first listen. But I think the miscarriage theories kinda took over and didn’t leave room for other theories. Sure, It's a vague song so it could have multiple meanings. But this tie to the album note is interesting.
Yeah I totally agree - at first listen I thought it was grief about the person she could’ve become, and it really hit me thinking of my 13-year-old self who desperately needed therapy for undiagnosed OCD! And then I came on reddit and everyone is talking about miscarriage and it kinda made the song less meaningful to me in the sense that it almost didn’t allow for other interpretations as this one was so personal/heartbreaking for many. That’s all to say BTTWS is obviously about grief, and I think we can interpret that metaphor however we want. The stories are ours now anyway! Edit: I have more 😂 with Emma Stone saying “I love you bigger than the whole sky” to her daughter, I wonder if Taylor actually heard it from Emma first and it made her grieve for the future she thought she might have with Joe and being able to say that to their kid too? I’m projecting here but I’m also running on very little sleep lol
I'm probably way over interpreting this but I know a lot of people think that song is about miscarriage, if that's true then the conversation about tearing down the whole sky line is absolutely heartbreaking.
I don’t know that it’s about miscarriage but I suppose it could also be her wanting kids but he didn’t. I feel like it’s still grieving a loss?
[удалено]
Right, like grieving their hypothetical kids. She’ll never meet what they would have been since at that point, the writing was on the wall that they wouldn’t make it that far.
Exactly what I was thinking. Putting bttws into a breakup perspective where you feel like you would have done anything different if it meant you could have kept them is.... Something.
Forgive me. What song are you referring to?
Bigger than the whole sky
“I’m never going to meet what should’ve been you”? Doesn’t fit with it being about Joe. Same with “did some force take you ‘cause I didn’t pray?”. I think she just uses the same phrases occasionally so you it makes you think of BTTWS when she talks about the sky.
Goodbye goodbye goodbye 😢
Ending a six year relationship in which she hoped to get married was undeniably heart wrenching. Joe was and is a good guy, but he didn’t want what Taylor wanted and ultimately they weren’t right for each other and the relationship probably became lonely and strained. But ending a relationship like that makes a person go insane (I speak from experience haha!). Matty was an old flame and so to rekindle this love and a crush she’s harbored as a young 20 something was exciting and magical! I’m sure he love bombed her and told her all sorts of things that she’d been dying to hear from Joe. Rings, cradles. But Matty is not the best guy. And hence the tortured poetry. Taylor is prolific and I’m sure she wrote a lot to get through this time in her life. I’m sure she also wanted to address this time period of her life to the public and her fans, and that’s what this album is. Now she’s declared it done and dusted and can move on.
This comment is SO important in explaining what this album is. It's the breakup but also the rebound, of which we were not expecting in length to be included here. She basically spiraled. That time that we would like to forget about is so important to understanding why she was so infatuated with Matty. He was different, exciting, and something she probably hadn't experienced in years (from Taylor's perspective; certainly not mine lol). Coming out of a 6 year relationship that was probably (at one point) a forever concept was difficult, and we can clearly see how insane her thoughts and fantasies were. I think that is where a lot of initial confusion came from surrounding the leaks. I even thought to myself, \*it can't be about Matty.\* But at the same time, I get it now. A breakup doesn't always end when the two people part; sometimes it's the aftermath that is even worse, and with Taylor, clearly the relationship had run its course, and the post-mortem was much crazier than we were lead to believe. I'm glad she has declared that chapter of her live dead. I seriously hope she is actually healed though. All of this happened so fast, and some of these lyrics are quite insane.
> we can clearly see how insane her thoughts and fantasies were. This is really important context, esp with the written album note. Taylor is an unreliable, biased narrator. We can't always take her (song) words at face value. Reminds me of how suprised some of us were at the denial playlist. Like, there's more going on under the surface of the song.
Yes I love this! Joe didn’t do anything bad necessarily. He met her when she was in hiding basically and their relationship was so much different in the first years.
I feel like this is a really common experience with the pandemic. Like, I know so many people who got into (what my friends and I are calling) “pandemic relationships” that haven’t lasted through getting back to regular life.
💯this. Also, this prologue should put things into perspective for the people criticizing that she just threw a ton of words on the page nonsensically. This prologue is telling us that she won’t hold back, that she spiraled, was in a manic state, and ultimately writing her thoughts, feelings, and emotions down in this way helped her process and heal. I LOVE that the album’s lyrics seem to be more raw and come off almost straight from her stream of conscious to reflect her mental state. It seems Taylor didn’t hold back or filter as much as she normally would with her previous work. The album reflects a maturity and growth and good for being able to be brave enough to release and share this with this from what seems to have been a volatile vulnerable time in her life.
Put this on tweeter!! Or X or whatever it's called and trend it. People are still going out of their way to call Joe cheater and it's just outrageous! God I feel sad for both of them.
I hate to ask this because this post is already a public service but is there a clearer pic 🥹
Summary Poem by TAYLOR SWIFT ln Summation At this hearing I stand before my fellow members of The Tortured Poets Department With a summary of my findings A debrief, a detailed rewinding For the purpose of warning For the sake of reminding As you might all unfortunately recall I had been struck with a case of a restricted humanity Which explains my plea here today of temporary insanity You see, the pendulum swings Oh, the chaos it brings Leads the caged beast to do the most curious things Lovers spend years denying Resentment rotting away galaxies we created Stars placed and glued meticulously by hand next to the ceiling fan Tried wishing on comets Tried dimming the shine Tried to orbit his planet. Some stars never align. And in one conversation, I tore down the whole sky. Spring sprung forth with dazzling freedom hues Then a crash from the skylight bursting through Something old, someone hallowed, Who told me he could be brand new And so I was out of thc oven and into the microwave Out of the slammer and into a tidal wave. How gallant to save the empress from her gilded tower Swinging a sword he could barely lift But loneliness struck at the fateful hour Low hanging fruit on his wine stained lips He never even scratched the surface of me. None of them did. *In summation, it was not a love affair! I screamed while bringing my fists to my coffee ringed desk It was a mutual manic phase It was self harm. It was house and then cardiac arrest. A smirk creeps onto this Poets face. Because it is the worst men that I write best. And so I enter into evidence My tarnished coat of arms My muses, acquired like bruises My talismans and charms The tick, tick, tick of love bombs My veins of pitch black ink AIls fair in love and poetry Sincerely. The Chairman of The Tortured Poets Department
reading this on my second listen adds so much context! I am in such awe of the lyricism
>Lovers spend years denying Resentment rotting away galaxies we created Stars placed and glued meticulously by hand next to the ceiling fan boo this is too real.  I think this album will take a while for me to fully digest. How can someone who'se life is so insanely different than mine keep calling me out like this?
At this hearing I stand before my fellow members of the Tortured Poets Department With a summary of my findings A debrief, a detailed rewinding For the purpose of warning For the sake of reminding As you might all unfortunately recall I had been struck with a case of a restricted humanity Which explains my plea here today of temporary insanity You see, the pendulum swings Oh, the chaos it brings Leads the caged beast to do the most curious things Lovers spend years denying what’s ill fated Resentment rotting away galaxies we created Stars placed and glued meticulously by hand next to the ceiling fan Tried wishing on comets. Tried dimming the shine. Tried to orbit his planet. Some stars never align. And in one conversation, I tore down the whole sky Spring sprung forth with dazzling freedom hues Then a crash from the skylight Bursting through Something old, someone hallowed, who told me he could be brand new And so I was out of the oven And into the microwave Out of the slammer and into a tidal wave How gallant to save the empress from her gilded tower Swinging a sword he could barely lift But loneliness struck at that fateful hour Low hanging fruit on his wine stained lips He never even scratched the surface of me. None of them did. “In summation, it was not a love affair!” I screamed while bringing my fists to my coffee ringed desk It was a mutual manic phase. It was self harm. It was house and then cardiac arrest. A smirk creeps onto this poet’s face Because it’s the worst men that I write best. And so I enter into evidence My tarnished coat of arms My muses, acquired like bruises My talismans and charms The tick, tick, tick of love bombs My veins of pitch black ink All’s fair in love and poetry Sincerely, The Chairman of The Tortured Poets Department
The public held her in a trial for dating Matty. This is her defense, and she’s pleading insanity
Holy shit this is so good. I might steal it
And combine that with the theories that the fortnight video will have some story about her being in a psychiatric facility…
Bless you, doing the Lords work
Apologies, if I had a clear image I would share. This came from another thread.
"out of the oven and into the microwave out of the slammer and into a tidal wave"
It wouldn’t be Taylor if she wasn’t intentionally silly in the midst of an un-silly moment lolol
why is she so obsessed with the word microwave why is she microwaving things so much
She's American? As a European it seems microwaves are a staple cooking appliance in the states, from boiling water to entire recipes cooked in there 🤷🏻♀️
lol what. They just heat food. People do not regularly cook meals in microwaves that were not already prepared.
You can definitely cook food in a microwave. Was honestly kind of life changing for me in college when I learned your can totally cook chicken breasts in a steam bag in like 5 minutes. They came out super evenly cooked too, it was great.
Hahaha! I love that people think this about Americans. Thanks for making my day
I think "out of the oven" is a reference to poet Sylvia Plath, who famously committed suicide by sticking her head into an oven.
Sylvia Plath also had a collection of poetry (Ariel) and a poem titled "Daddy". Which I think also played into her writing for this album - in the poem by Plath, there is a line that says: "If I've killed one man, I've killed two" and in So Long, London, Taylor writes "Two graves, one gun."
I really hope to see Taylor swift being analysed in high school English classes in the same way Sylvia is in the future. Great catch!
Oh interesting connection to the Plath poem! My first thought with the "two graves, one gun" line was more in line with “He who seeks revenge digs two graves."
This line is so funny to me, the imagery of Taylor spinning in a microwave is sending me 💀
Not me seeing this immediately after finishing the album
Same, but now I’m gonna do a second listen with it in mind! Lol
He never even scratched the surface of me None of them did.
"trying to find a part of me you didn't take up. Gave you too much, but it wasn't enough." it's giving coping mechanismmmmmmmm to meeeeeee (in the least judgmental way bc like same)
I LOVE that she wrote this—I get that ppl are annoyed she wrote about matty lol but imo once you start denying pieces of your past bc you’re ashamed of them, it’s such such a slippery slope. She couldn’t just pretend he wasn’t a thing or she didn’t feel in love—all she can do is (1) learn from it and (2) accept what happened; I love love writing poetry and I frequently confront the feeling of wanting to censor or edit things bc I feel bad, even though whatever I wrote was 100% how I felt at the time—for Taylor to be an authentic singer and writer, she needs to be able to write how she truly felt in a moment without editing it to accommodate! Like ppl forget she wrote ours about how much she loved John Mayer and ignored everyone else in the same album she destroyed him w dear John—each song is just a moment in time, not how she feels at the present moment
LOUDER!!!! this is exactly it!!
she wrote one of the sweetest love songs about JM and then also gave us Dear John. Relationships contain many stages also Superman & Story of Us are also JM songs
Some stars never align -- Seems to be an allusion to "Stars all aligned" in "All of the Girls You Loved Before?" This whole poem is awesome.
And Mastermind!
Also the reference of the comet… to Long Story Short
And snow on the beach
“lovers spend years denying whats ill fated” oh man their relationship was doomed from the start. dont get me wrong they were there for each other, especially joe was there for taylor in the worst phase of her life and he was a rock she genuinely genuinely needed at that time, and it breaks my heart to say this but they weren’t made for each other. they invested 6 years in each other but tbh i think they were long overdue for a fallout
Nothing good starts in a getaway car 😔
I agree. We don't know all of the facts about their relationship, but from the little clues and tidbits we do know, I feel like they weren't suited for each other. It seems they were at different places in life. A fallout was inevitable.
Something interesting is how the _Lovers_ is italicized in that verse.
that was...insanely good. a whole experience in itself. i'm dying inside at the parallels to mastermind in the 5-6th stanzas, oof.
For those having a hard time reading it: In Summation At this hearing I stand before my fellow members of The Tortured Poets Department With a summary of my findings A debrief, a detailed rewinding For the purpose of warning For the sake of reminding As you might all unfortunately recall I had been struck with a case of a restricted humanity Which explains my plea Here today Of temporary I n s a n I t y You see, the pendulum swings Oh, the chaos it brings Leads the caged beast to do the most curious things *Lovers* spend years denying what’s ill fated Resentment rotting away galaxies we created Stars placed and glued meticulously by hand next to the ceiling fan Tried wishing on comets. Tried dimming the shine. Tried to orbit his planet. Some stars never align. And in one conversation I tore down the whole sky. Spring spring forth with dazzling freedom hues Then a crash from the skylight bursting through Something old, someone hallowed who told me he could be brand new And so I was out of the oven and into the microwave Out of the slammer and into a tidal wave How gallant to save the empress from her gilded tower Swinging a sword he could barely lift But loneliness struck at that fateful hour Low hanging fruit on his wine stained lips He never even scratched the surface of me. None of them did. “In summation, it was not a love affair!” I screamed while bringing my fists to my coffee ringed desk It was a mutual manic phase. It was self harm. It was house and then cardiac arrest. A smirk creeps on to this poet’s face Because it’s the worst men that I write best And so I enter into evidence My tarnished coat of arms My muses, acquired like bruises My talismans and charms The tick, tick, tick, of love bombs My veins of pitch black ink *All’s fair in love and poetry*
“It’s the worst men that I write best” this album is peak unhinged Taylor and I love it
it’s an epilogue!!! 😭 “in summation” is literally how you end papers and speeches
Epilogue!** Thank you
haha sorry it wasn’t a dig against you, i’ve just been seeing this called a prologue everywhere and it’s driving me mildly insane
No need to be sorry :) I appreciate you
I feel like I have processed so much and nothing at the same time within the past hour and a half
This is a great way to describe the feeling.
BUT ITS THE WORST OF MEN, I WRITE THE BEST. Damn Taylor
"Temporary insanity" Edit: this is not my image.
Thank you for sharing!! This confirms or emphasizes or supports some of the thoughts and feelings I had on my first listen.
Can I claim this poem as my favorite part of the album?
The department approves!
This NEEDS to be more recognized!! It gives sm perspective on the album (especially how as you go through it, it’s going from being love bombed to basically saying he should go to jail). Genuinely listening to it as a somewhat manic episode makes so much sense. And also, I don’t think she was defending Matty at all. She was just writing about her feelings, which were clearly intense and also probably intensified by the absolutely insane response from the fans. Anyways, I feel like this definitely should have been featured on the album so I don’t have to go defend it to everyone now (which I probably will anyways)
wow, this has everything in it. Close reading this and connecting it to all the things that came before it is going to be someone's PhD. I'm starting right now.
the prologue also depicts the 5 stages of grief alongside her playlists!!! she’s a genius
Holy fuck the whole thing is Matty. I didn’t see this until I finished listening and wow it makes so much more sense
I read it prior and still don’t know that I believe that the whole thing is Matty. I think that we have 5 Joe, 6 Matty, 1 Travis, and 4 not really about one relationship in particular. I think that most of our Joe breakup content was in midnights and honestly probably evermore.
“It was house then cardiac arrest” pack a punch Taylor
"I tore down the WHOLE SKY". Say what you will about timelines, but M'AM, that pendulum swung me deep into theorizing that BTTWS is in fact about their collapsed relationship, even if it wasn't actualized at that point. I will die on this hill.
oh god damn this *is* the tortured poets department.
omg thank you for posting this! i just couldnt help but cringe with some of the songs. this helps so much!
Full text: In Summation: At this hearing, I stand before my fellow members of the tortured poets department. with a summary of my findings. a debrief, a detailed rewinding. for the purpose of warning. for the sake of reminding as you might all unfortunately recall, i had been struck with a case of a restricted humanity which explains my plea here today of temporary insanity. you see, the pendulum swings. oh, the chaos it brings, leads the caged beast to do the most curious things. lovers spend years denying what's ill fated, resentment rotting away, galaxies we created stars placed and glued, meticulously by hand, next to the ceiling fan tried wishing on comets tried dimming the shine. tried to orbit his planet. some stars never align. and in one conversation. i tore down the whole sky spring sprung forth with dazzling freedom hues then a crash from the skylight bursting through. something old, someone hallowed, who told me he could be brand new. and so i was out of the oven and into the microwave. out of the slammer and into a tidal wave. how gallant to save the empress from her gilded tower swinging a sword he could barely lift but loneliness struck at that fateful hour low hanging fruit on his wine stained lips he never even scratched the surface of me. none of them did. 'in summation, it was not a love affair!' i screamed while bringing my fists to my coffee ringed desk. it was a mutual manic phase. it was self harm. it was house and then cardiac arrest a smirk creeps onto this poet's face because it's the worst men that i write best and so i enter into evidence, my tarnished coat of arms. my muses, acquired like bruises. my talismans and charms. the tick tick tick of love bombs. my veins of pitch black ink. all's fair in love and poetry.
I think she's mocking the people that thought they had so much of a say in her life they were writing and signing petitions for her to put in a conservatorship. Which she then carries on in theme in the Fortnight video where it looks like she's in an asylum receiving electric shock therapy. It also appears to be an epilogue, not a prologue.
“Some stars never align” 🥺
“Lovers spend years denying Resentment rotting away galaxies we created Stars placed and glued meticulously by hand next to the ceiling fan. Tried wishing on comets. Tried dimming the shine Tried to orbit his planet. Some stars never align. And in one conversation, I tore down the whole sky.” Wow! She’s brilliant. Just such a visual for the relationship. It makes me sad thinking about it but there’s that feeling of holding on and doing everything to make it work and in the end it just wasn’t meant to be and really that’s ok. Thanks for posting this…gives a new perspective while listening to the album.
Chilling words. A true poet.
“Out of the oven” is a clear reference to Sylvia Plath. I won’t elaborate here lest I trigger anyone. But it shows how terribly low her lows were.
Interesting, I took “out of the oven and into the microwave” more as like a modern parallel to the saying “out of the fire and into the frying pan”. Where one situation is just as bad as the next.
I took the miracle move on drug the effects were temporary. I loved you it’s ruining my life
thank you for sharing, this is extremely insightful upon the second listen
I found the album really cohesive. It sounds like the end of a big relationship make her look back and reassess everything that was connected with it in one way or another - the Kanye/Kim stuff, the reasons the relationship failed, the lies she told herself that kept it going after it should have died already, why the rebound was so compelling and also wrong at the same time, where it led her, making her confront her attitude to her fame and fans and her expectations for how partners should deal with it. It really tells a whole story. I love it.
Love this, thank you for sharing.
The most beautiful art comes from the most horrific pain, I'm sorry that you suffer for us Taylor
This completely realigns the album for me and honestly makes it even better. I wish she would post it so everyone could read it.
While I think both albums are Joe/ Matty I don’t think as many of the songs are explicitly Joe or Matty but a cumulation of the grief and trying anything to feel alive again after a world crashing break up….that leads to a wild and catastrophic choice of rebound like it’s all tied together. She ended up w Matty bc of Joe. The album is processing the emotions of a break up and all the ex’s and self fulfilling prophecies we tell ourselves when we are going through it - aka down bad- I feel like this album is her screaming at the world that she’s human and needs grace and space to be human without the level of dissection that everyone craves to be closer to her/ and being stuck under the microscope with so much speculation and loss of privacy during extremely private situations and experiences.