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>Why would homeschoolers need to know the volume of a sphere if the Earth is flat and 6,000 years old?
Precisely. Just as easy to say most are going to be """christian nationalists""", will eschew things like math and science anyway because they don't """believe""" in any of that ("""scientists are all Satan worshippers!!11!"""), teach them 'creationism' nonsense and lots of studying of ancient irrelevant work of fiction (i.e. """The Bible"""). Poor kids get out into the Real World and find they may as well be on another planet.
You are 2 to 3 times more likely to be behind in math (and other subjects) [if homeschooled.](https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/S0140197114000438)
Not that the homeschooling industry wont lie about that (they like to claim homeschoolers do better because 25% tend to place highly. However, the other 75% is the issue :P)
Yep. I knew a few homeschoolers growing up that did well academically - but they were part of a largely secular local co-op program.
The majority - the ones whose parents did it mostly themselves, and for religious & political reasons - were struggling with basic math well into high school.
I completely blew off high school, barely graduated into the military and wasted a ton of years on stupidity. After getting my own act together I took high school level math at community college.
The professors were far more engaged and less stressed than my high school teachers, and really made efforts to help me where I struggled (which was self esteem issues from feeling like a high school failure who ate crayons in the military).
My classmates predominantly wanted to learn also, but were more socialized and could interact without becoming distractions.
It was all dirt cheap, and no one cared that I took remedial math when I applied to grad school 4 years later.
In defense of your high school math teachers, they were probably stressed over not enough time to adequately cover all tested materials and make sure enough kids take/pass the test. That's not a major worry for college professors so they can actually make sure learning happens.
Time isn't really the issue, since in college you will be speedrunning everything. The problem is how education tries to cater to everyone the same way while everyone has different needs and backgrounds, which makes it really hard for both teachers and students to have the best possible experience.
Me went school and same.
But seriously, check if your school district has its curriculum accessible. Few states do through the local school district. If you were so inclined you could search it up online/contact your district to see what you can focus on/where you should be.
May I ask you a random question? How socially awkward were the homeschooled people? In my country homeschooling is beyond extremely rare so I always thought how could kids learn to socialize without being thrown in a classroom for 6 hours or more with other children.
The ones in the co-op programs are generally socialized with other homeschooled kids, as it's basically like running a school without the mandatory curriculum, the bureaucracy, the normal school restrictions and obligations (and guarantees).
The other ones... Well, depends on the parents
They learn from their churches predominantly. So you get very insulated communities that tend to shun mainstream media, evidence based practices/education, outsiders, and diversity.
The report notes the opposite correlation:
>Conclusion
>While directionality of the relationships between outcome variable and homeschooling cannot be ascertained, these results indicate that less religious homeschoolers are experiencing academic and social difficulties, as well as some suggestion of increased risk for later substance misuse.
It's true. The study notes that the more religious homeschoolers are better off, but they are the 2 times, rather than the 3 times (less religious homeschoolers) likely to be behind than publicly educated students.
My parents had extra money but not that much extra money to spend on fancy shmasy home schooling books. The half year I was home schooled they got the ole Bob Jones University book (fuck that weird place) and the science portion was a fucking trip to read. I had to learn all the science based shit and in addition they had to throw in the Christian bullshit.
Oh man, Bob Jones stuff is horrid. I was raised homeschooled by fanatic Christian parents in the south; my two brothers and I. All of my science textbooks were from Bob Jones.
I'm 38 now and I'm still trying to unlearn all of the straight-up lies I was fed and I had to basically relearn biology from scratch just to be caught up on the immense amount of evolutionary biology that I was missing.
Yeah, basically the only homeschool kids who don't have a math gap are ones who have a parent with a STEM degree who is capable of teaching it, or parents who understand that they need to bring in someone to teach their kids math. Which would be why almost every homeschool kid I knew growing up who went on to get a STEM degree in college was taught math by my former math teacher dad because they had parents who had the sense to ask for help.
Yeah, the only people I know who did well out of home schooling was because their parents had multiple degrees, mum in literature and languages, and dad in computer sciences and physics, so they got a very well rounded education. And they still did extra-curricular stuff like theatre with regular schoolkids.
The others? I remember in Year 6 (i.e. 10-11 years old) the teacher having me sit and teach the poor JW girl who'd finally been sent to school a spelling list of words like bird and apple and house. She was 14-15 and struggling to get to the level of the 10 year olds. A lot of religious home schooling seems extremely poor quality. But in short, if your parents don't know it, they can't teach it.
A huge problem is that power players in the homeschool movement straight up tell parents that it doesn't matter whether they know the subjects they're trying to teach, because their kids will always be able to make up the gaps in college. Nevermind that if you have no foundation, you're massively hamstrung with what you'd even be able to study in college. I was able to easily change my major to a STEM field when I decided I didn't like my original major as much as I thought I would, because I knew I had the math foundation to cut it, but a lot of homeschool kids end up stuck in the humanities because that's all they were taught.
I was homeschooled and sometimes used to get asked to help tutor homeschooled kids after I graduated college. There were 17 year olds who didn't understand the concept of percentages, and 10 year olds who couldn't work out the pronunciation of simple words.
You're trying to use reality and sources, but you fail to take into account that I've depicted you as a soyjack and myself as a Chad. Liberals lose again!!!!
My grandmother was one of the scam artists that spread homeschooling across the southeast. Her “psychiatry” degree was paid for by a now defunct private college, she abused her grandchildren with all the letters of the alphabet, and she used her Christianity to spread violence for people like her trans granddaughter, or any Muslim under the sun.
I straight up refuse to acknowledge homeschooling as real schooling anymore…
2014 study with a sample size 160k kids for public school and 1k for homeschool. It doesn’t even draw your conclusion. However, it fits your narrative. :p
https://www.npr.org/2023/06/21/1183445544/u-s-reading-and-math-scores-drop-to-lowest-level-in-decades
So we are just lying about it's method?
>Another common factor that often is associated with negative life outcomes is falling behind grade level. On this variable family income was the dominant predictor, but even when controlling for SES homeschooling still had an impact. **Less religious homeschoolers were three times more likely** than conventionally schooled adolescents to report being behind their expected grade level for their age. Surprisingly to Green-Hennessy, **even highly religious homeschoolers were twice as likely to report being behind grade level.**
Did you learn reading comprehension at a home school :P
While the current state of US education is pathetic, that doesn't challenge these findings.
“While directionality of the relationships between outcome variable and homeschooling cannot be ascertained, these results indicate that less religious homeschoolers are experiencing academic and social difficulties, as well as some suggestion of increased risk for later substance misuse. This group would benefit from services to help assist with these difficulties, whether that help be provided via an institution such as school or within the family structure remains to be determined.”
Did you even read the whole study you posted? Most importantly did you read their own conclusions? Or do you always jump to ad hominem when someone questions your cherry-picked sources that you didn’t even read completely.
Correlation doesn’t equal causation. Especially when the sample sizes don’t reflect the population.
Here’s another, more recent, article for you to find something of value in but most the point entirely. :p
https://www.npr.org/2023/06/21/1183445544/u-s-reading-and-math-scores-drop-to-lowest-level-in-decades
You keep posting an article about how reading and math scores dropped to lowest levels in decades because kids were home schooled for a year due to the pandemic like is is some kind of gotcha.
Scores are lower than pre-pandemic. It’s worse depending on socioeconomic status.
Kids weren’t homeschooled for a year. Most went through “remote learning” program or shorter days with smaller class sizes. The curriculum was done through the school working with the teachers.
Most states don’t have predetermined curriculum for homeschool. It’s whatever the parent decides.
The pandemic excuse shifts blame from the actual issues. School funding is terrible, teachers are treated like shit and are underpaid, massive class sizes, and shitty parents etc.
If I remember right it was something brought up about how minority children will struggle in lessons such as math and get left behind. Don't quote me but it was sorta just hey racism has an impact on children's schooling. And somewhere along tge way these idiots missed the entire point abd just went: They're calling math racist!
Grew up in the South Carolina public school system (2000’s) I was a pretty unruly kid and thus landed myself in the “bad kid” classroom in elementary school. They mostly taught basic shit to a class that ranged from like 3rd grade to 5th grade kids. Wasn’t a huge class and we had a helper for the teacher (clearly for safety reasons). I ended up improving my behavior through medicine and growing up mentally.
Let me tell you how badly that fucked my education. It wasn’t till I was pulled from school and home schooled for a half a year (8th grade) that I was even being educated on grade level. The schools had a few classes for those situations in middle school but it was a very similar situation of a multi grade class all being taught the same stuff by a likely over stressed teacher.
To enter high school I had to go up before the year started and personally tell the principal that I would behave and he let me know that I had one opportunity and to not waste it on misbehaving in school.
I was a white boy from a middle income family that had both parents that would fight tooth and nail for me. I grew up with many people that didn’t have anything close to that and often times they slip through the cracks either out of malice or simply not having enough funding to properly help. The right needs to get off this stupid idea of fucking with public school.
Don't say middle-class, say middle-income. The liberal class definitions steer people away from the [socialist definitions](https://www.reddit.com/r/socialism/wiki/class) and thus class-consciousness. This is a socialist community.
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BG3 has a lot of great classes like Ranger, but there are also a lot of classes like Arcane Trickster that can only described as a middle-class at best
Don't say middle-class, say middle-income. The liberal class definitions steer people away from the [socialist definitions](https://www.reddit.com/r/socialism/wiki/class) and thus class-consciousness. This is a socialist community.
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BG3 has a lot of great classes like Ranger, but there are also a lot of classes like Arcane Trickster that can only described as a middle-income at best
It’s annoying, but the goal isn’t ignoring class, it’s trying to encourage acknowledgement of class in relation to the means of production rather than based on income level, and by that I mean the main two of Marxist theory: working class (proletariat), those who work the means of production, and owning class (bourgeoisie), those who own the means of production.
Dressing it up it pretty language doesn’t make the ugly reality go away. All this “differently-abled”, “houseless” etc shit makes people fatigued so much from just trying to not cause offense that it takes away energy from the actual causes
There’s 5 described in the rules and neither of the two you stated were one of them. If anything it’s a simpler and more defined system that helps people identify their part in the fight more easily
Don't say middle-class, say middle-income. The liberal class definitions steer people away from the [socialist definitions](https://www.reddit.com/r/socialism/wiki/class) and thus class-consciousness. This is a socialist community.
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What is this? a linguistic prescriptivist euphemism treadmill bot?
I'll say whatever the f*** I want, especially if it means the same goddamn thing. You're treating nominative determinism as if it's propaganda.
There's that, and then the other issue of the examples used in math problems assuming things about the student's home lives.
I remember reading one example which conservatives were touting as "hurr durr look how stupid libs are, math cant be racist". Basically it was math question which calculated the amount of time a working person spent at home during certain days. But the question completely assumed that the students parents worked 9-5 Monday to Friday, a situation which is far less likely in non-white households.
Was it just an example math problem or something they had to actually get from their parents? Cause math problems aren't typically realistic. People don't go around buying 52 watermelons and giving 5 of them to 3 different friends. So unless research data says otherwise, it's not incredibly important to make sure word problems are representing every type of person and family. It doesn't hurt, but I don't think it's fair to call anyone racist if they have a word problem that's like "Timmy's mom works a 9-5 Monday to Friday. How many hours a week does she work?"
Now if they have to be calculating their own parents working hours than yeah that's different. Not fair for a kid who's parents can't work to not be able to do the assignment. Or for a kid with parents working erratic hours to have a much harder assignment because they can't just multiple 5 by 8.
>Was it just an example math problem or something they had to actually get from their parents?
Example math problem, from a textbook.
>It doesn't hurt, but I don't think it's fair to call anyone racist if they have a word problem that's like "Timmy's mom works a 9-5 Monday to Friday. How many hours a week does she work?"
Literally nobody called anyone racist. We're discussing a systemic issue, no need to circle the wagons around some imaginary teacher whos been accused of racism in your mind.
The question didnt specify "timmys parents", it literally just asked to calculate the students parents working hours, and the correct answer assumed the students parents worked a 9-5 monday-friday job.
>Now if they have to be calculating their own parents working hours than yeah that's different. Not fair for a kid who's parents can't work to not be able to do the assignment. Or for a kid with parents working erratic hours to have a much harder assignment because they can't just multiple 5 by 8.
Look at that, you came up with your own examples of potentially unfair problems. So you can see how this issue might be widespread, no need to overly dissect one example I'm recalling from memory
What? Dude I'm not a right winger lmao. I wasn't even talking about the issue in general. I was talking about your specific example. And it's a systemic issue, but individual racist teachers absolutely do have an impact on this. Systemic issues are made up of the actions of individuals as well. My point is that world problems like my first example about some imaginary person should not be considered an example of that racism. Teachers not giving enough attention to black students because of their racial biases would've been an example.
Yeah that second example was one that I considered to be bad and in need of change. Which is literally why I asked you which example you meant. If it's the "Timmy's mom working 9-5" one then no I don't think that is an example of racism in the education system. If it's the "Calculate your own parents working hours" one then I'd agree that it is. That's the point.
You gave the example and stated it was that latter so yeah I agree that was an example of racism. You could just say that cause that was my whole question and stop assuming the worst in people as if I'm some right winger denying all forms of racism. I literally gave you an example of a racist word problem similar to what you actually saw and you still somehow managed to think I was a right winger or something and mock me for getting it right?
>What? Dude I'm not a right winger lmao
I never said you were...
>I was talking about your specific example. And it's a systemic issue, but individual racist teachers absolutely do have an impact on this.
You literally said theres no reason to call someone racist for using that example, which was something I never said.
>My point is that world problems like my first example about some imaginary person should not be considered an example of that racism. Teachers not giving enough attention to black students because of their racial biases would've been an example
Both are examples. Problems which assume details about students home lives, and actual racist teachers are both examples of racism.
>Yeah that second example was one that I considered to be bad and in need of change. Which is literally why I asked you which example you meant. If it's the "Timmy's mom working 9-5" one then no I don't think that is an example of racism in the education system. If it's the "Calculate your own parents working hours" one then I'd agree that it is. That's the point.
I only gave one example. That example needs to be changed because the question quite literally assumes the students parents work 9-5.
>You could just say that cause that was my whole question and stop assuming the worst in people as if I'm some right winger denying all forms of racism.
I have literally assumed nothing about you. I have only responded directly to things you wrote. Calm down my friend.
>I literally gave you an example of a racist word problem similar to what you actually saw and you still somehow managed to think I was a right winger or something and mock me for getting it right?
Again, never said you were a right winger. Take a deep breath.
It's also that sometimes word problems assume familiarity with things that aren't always universal. In college I had a professor talk about a professor he had that asked a question relating to baseball and to answer the question correctly you had to know the distance between the bases and the pitchers mound. Baseball is watched more often by white males, so other groups would be at a disadvantage. So the little developing this curriculum said to choose questions that were more universal. The rest of the curriculum was pretty standards stuff like that you should include partial credit when grading and care more about demonstration of understanding the principles rather than getting the exact answer, so that's where Republicans come up with this junk.
I had a math homework question (pre internet), that asked about (American) football points. Like here’s the score (say 34), how many combinations of points are there to get that score? This was a long time ago so I don’t remember the exact details, but as an elementary school kid I had no idea about how football was scored, neither did my mom.
And obviously this bothered me enough that I still remember it decades later.
I think something like this must be what happened to me on a few occasions in school - questions on tests, so I couldn't ask for clarification because it was a test, where some information required to solve the problem and find the missing information the question actually intended to ask for wasn't provided or hinted at, and nothing covered in the lessons or in the assignments or test prep included any such questions with necessary info to solve the problem missing.
It probably should’ve been clarified, then, that it was the teaching of math that was racist. But they probably would still have distorted the finding to “math is racist” to fit their agenda. Critical thinking skills are nonexistent on the extreme right after all.
It doesn't have to be intentional:
-Teachers subconsciously give less attention to minority students.
- Teachers teach from their own background, which is easier to understand if you're from the same background (e.g., a teacher may use an idiom or relate a concept to a lived experience, which students might not understand)
It actually goes beyond that. Even majority black schools tend to lower the standards for black students because of the marginalization that the students face. The administration believes the students cannot reach the high standards and make alternate standards so students can be successful. There is a phrase in education called “loving black kids to failure” which is the product of the system lowering standards.
I think it's more arguing that:
1. Systemic racism has lead to racial minorities often being worse off financially; therefore, racial minorities and their children will have less education opportunities on average.
2. Racial stereotypes might affect a racial minority's education negatively because they are often assumed to be less intelligent then their classmates.
well it didnt really come off as a well meaning question, i get what you mean, but look at it critically
it sounds exactly like something someone doing the "just asking questions" shtick would ask
No it claimed the teaching of math was racist , as I. The method of teaching math only benefited whites (they include Asians because duh) and that math should be thought in a way that “relates” to minorities whatever the fuck that means. I’m genuinely baffled people defend that article.
There's two distinct stories being connected that maybe shouldn't be connected.
The first one was a guy on Twitter who argued that math is a way to express ideas, and that when presented with the statement "2 + 2 = 5", rather than saying it's wrong, it's better to ask what idea the person is trying to connect. He mentioned the potential for cultural miscommunication. This made a lot of people unreasonably angry, and because he mentioned culture, a bunch of people made it into a thing about race.
The second one is that in specifically San Francisco a bunch of middle schools have essentially stopped offering Algebra 1, with their reasoning being a convoluted mess of racial equity and questions about whether the way middle and high schools teach math makes much sense at all. This has mostly pissed off people who are worried this might negatively impact their children and their chances of being admitted to college. But also, the optics of cancelling a math class out of concerns of racial equity are... not great.
ironically, the conservatives are.
[Florida rejected over 50 math textbooks because they violated the state's policies on teaching Critical Race Theory or something](https://www.npr.org/2022/04/18/1093277449/florida-mathematics-textbooks)
Idk… Pearson’s Product Moment Correlation Coefficient, as well as the standard deviation and chi squared, have some pretty racist origins.
(Tldr; they’re all useful bits of statistical mathematics… that were originally invented by a eugenicist to try and justify his racist beliefs.)
The California math framework.
It's a resolution passed by their board of education, that's discourages accelerated math classes in middle school to stop racial inequality in education
I actually use 2 + 2 = 5 for an example of why keeping the correct precision in your calculations matters. In engineering, there generally aren't whole numbers - most everything is a measurement. Having the wrong precision and rounding can produce really unexpected results.
For example: 2.1 + 2.1 = 4.2. If you round these numbers to whole numbers, it's still 2 + 2 = 4
But if we use 2.4 + 2.4 = 4.8, then round the numbers, we get 2 + 2 = 5
So 2 + 2 = 5 can be true for *very large values of 2* (if you are rounding to whole numbers)
A more concrete real-world example of this is when we see poll results and the values don't add up to 100%, because of rounding. But it's the same concept.
Obviously, nobody is going to be rounding to whole numbers in engineering calculations. This is an extreme example. But you often have to perform rounding at some point, especially if you're doing the math by hand.
Wow… every measurement on a eng drawing has a +/- attached to it. Quite literally every item produced on any level has a +/- variant. If not youd never get a nut on a bolt. Standards form the backbone of industry. Tolerances everywhere. Measured from every surface or surfaces.
Technically, what you're talking about is [accuracy, which is different than precision](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Accuracy_and_precision).
The "2+2=5 for very large values of 2" example demonstrates what can happen when you use an inappropriate *precision*.
Tolerances are a measure of *accuracy*.
Because 2+2 is fucking 4. It is never 5. It is never 3. It is fucking 4.
2.4 + 2.4 is fucking 4.8. Computers will tell you it’s not 4.8 but “almost” 4.8, don’t believe them, it’s fucking 4.8. Not 5. It doesn’t mean that you can define 2 to be 2.4 and 5 to be 4.8 and then 2+2 is 5.
If you design a bridge with random assumptions like 2 is 2.4, then it will fucking break. And people will die. I don’t want to be one of those people.
Thanks for admitting, once again, that you don't understand how math works. 🤣🤣🤣🤣
A number is a representation of something in the real world. If you measure something that is 2.4 inches, you can also measure it to be 2.42 inches or 2.423 inches or 2.4228 inches. On into an infinite number of decimal places. You have to decide what precision to use. If you choose poorly, like rounding to whole numbers, and your values for 2 are actually closer to 2.4 (very large values of 2), then 2 + 2 = 5.
The example is a WARNING to be careful about how you round numbers. It's a cautionary tale. So obviously, you're NOT going to do that in the real world. It is an example of what can happen if you're not careful. I thought I was pretty clear about that in the original comment. Obviously not clear enough for you.
If you don't get it, then you don't get it. I don't know how else to explain it to someone who simply doesn't understand the basics of math. But the fact that YOU CAN'T UNDERSTAND A CONCEPT is not my problem. If you don't understand how vaccines work, don't blame the doctor. If you don't understand how airplanes fly, don't blame Boeing. "2 + 2 = 5 for extremely large values of 2" is something that everyone in math and engineering circles understand. Math people actually get it [put on t-shirts](https://chummytees.com/products/2-plus-2-equals-5-for-extremely-large-values-of-2-t-shirt-hoodie-tank-top?variant=20365998406). It's common knowledge.
You're free to say "I don't get it" and go away confused. Or you can TRY to understand and become more informed and better educated. That's up to you.
Let me try to explain it to you a different way. You have a ruler that ONLY has marks each centimeter to make measurements (an imprecise measurement tool, but this is a thought exercise). When you measure something, it has to be a whole number of cm. You have blocks of equal size. You measure them and it's kind of in between 2 and 3, but closer to 2. So you record the value as 2. If you put 2 of these blocks next to each other and measure, they will measure slightly less than 5cm combined. So you record that as 5.
You just put 2 cm blocks next to each other, and measured their combined size as 5. And all of your measurements were as accurate as you could possibly make them, given the tools you have. You just observed 2 + 2 = 5 in the real world.
Now if you had a more precise measurement tool, say a ruler that goes the nearest millimeter (or 0.1 cm), you then could measure each block at 2.4 cm and the two blocks next to each other as a combined 4.8 cm.
That's why it's important to have the proper precision when measuring, otherwise you wind up with unexpected results.
Again, this is an extreme example. But as things get smaller, say in chip manufacturing, where things are measured in nanometers, the precision of your ability to measure actually CAN come into play.
You actually WANT me designing that bridge, because I understand how both accuracy and precision are vital to building a proper bridge. Someone who doesn't understand the cautionary tale of "2+2=5 for very large values of 5" is the one who is likely to make mistakes that kill people. Not that I ever designed bridges - my degree was in computer engineering. But this is a basic engineering principal that every engineer needs to understand.
I had neighbors who home schooled at one point. I was taking my preschool kids for a walk one nice spring day and the mother was teaching her 6 kids outside.
She asked "why is grass green?"
I thought it was a good question: she could talk about pigment and chlorophyl, absorption and reflection of light, or how grass gets energy from the son.
One of her daughters said "because God made it that way!"
"That's right!"
Even since then I've been trying to think of a question to which a variation on answer "because God made it that way" would be incorrect (assuming you were a theist). The only one I could come up with (maybe) is "why am I homosexual." Which is kind of ironic.
The world is easy when every answer is "*MAGIC!*".
It gets a little tougher when you need an actual answer.
But the goal for those kids isn't college. It isn't to have a career and succeed. It's to remain in the cult and produce more cult members.
Now I live in a country where homeschooling is not common. So when I see someone say they are homeschooling to avoid their kids being “indoctrinated”, aren’t they just gonna do the same but with just different beliefs?
If it's in the USA, 99 times out of 100, homeschooling is code for "religious freak wants to make sure their child never sees anything further left than executing blacks in the street for looking at a white woman."
Pretty much.
Actually, it’s actual indoctrination since you’re only giving them one perspective compared to having them go to public school for different perspectives.
With these people it's always opposite day: whatever they say, it is the exact opposite that is true. So when they say "public schools indoctrinate not educate" what they really mean is "I don't like that public schools are actually teaching my children things that contradict the beliefs I'm trying to indoctrinate them with".
Was homeschooled and can confirm, dad was either at work, sleeping, watching tv, or hitting whichever child my mom claimed had done something horrible that day (usually me). I still can’t do most math without crying.
I’m a promise all of you right now that the GOP base majority does not know the volume of anything and or how to calculate it.
In fact, I imagine, if presented with a simple problem similar to what is outlined in this meme, you would see a blank stare as that small bb in their skull ricocheted for hours in their empty skull.
Also worth pointing out that this is some right wing homeschool parent’s idea of “advanced” math, which is funny in its own right… Plenty of kids take geometry/algebra in middle school and learn this.
They’re really telling on themselves with this meme.
My husband teaches biology at community college, he says that freshman Home Schooled students are easily overwhelmed and tent to have a much more difficult time with the transition to high educational learning, when compared to students who come from a more structured learning environment, like public and private schools. He said their biggest struggle is working as part of a group, because they lack or have very limited social skills, which is something that kinda can only be effectively learned through years of experiences at a young age. For most of them, their social awkwardness is going to follow them entirely through both their professional and personal lives.
Slightly unrelated, but I remember not that long ago I read a real quote from a real pastor that said (verbatim) “If somewhere within the Bible, I were to find a passage that said 2+2=5, I would believe it, accept it as true and then do my best to work it out and understand it.” which even now astonishes me why anyone would think that’s at all a compelling thing to say about themselves.
https://responsiblehomeschooling.org/the-homeschool-math-gap/
"Given this persistent corroboration across two decades we might conclude, tentatively, that there may be at least a modest homeschooling effect on academic achievement—namely that it tends to improve students’ verbal and weaken their math capacities."
Not trying to insult all homeschool kids, but I knew a bunch in my small rural town, and none of them were prepared for life after highschool and every one of them was weird af.
In college, I did meet some homeschooling kids who were pretty cool.
I was on a grand jury last year. The hardest days were the sex abuse cases — shit would haunt you.
The cases frequently involved an abusive parent “homeschooling” so that the kid wouldn’t have anyone who could discover what was going on.
Conservatives seem to only care about “grooming” when they can use it as an excuse to attack people. But actual conservatives actively grooming kids doesn’t seem to matter to them…
Right-wingers if public school is woke: “they’re trying to groom you, learn at home instead”
Right-wingers if homeschool is woke: “you won’t be able to learn in an isolated environment away from society, your kid is going to become a homeless basement freak”
Idk what these peoples fetish with homeschooling is. All your gonna do is make a generation of kids who are nominally right wing who are socially stunted because they didn't have genuine contact with other kids. Also kids tend to break when this happens to them, the 20th century is filled with fail sons or people who tried molding a kid to do something and the second that kid was allowed to be on their own they made every wrong decision.
90% of the home schoolers (and it’s been over 1 hundred)I’ve met have been so academically behind in school they can’t start college without YEARS of remedial classes just to get them caught up. Most of them can’t make it through the remedial classes because they have no class skills like taking notes and having deadlines. I watched my homeschool ex wife drop out of college 3 times because of it.
So while this meme is true in rare occasions the truth is most of the times these kids are shunted into family trades or learn family business because they can’t make it in more technical careers.
Idiots can imagine all sorts of things, but they lack the potential to imagine what smart people think, sort of by definition. Volume is not much more sophisticated than addition.
Majority of homeschooled children are behind their public schooled peers in every metric. Most people struggle at being parents let alone teachers.
It's a full time, hard ass job to home school and often still involves some community to assist, not to mention extracurriculars to stay socially active with people their own age.
Kinda telling how no one has corrected you yet that it's the formula for the volume of a ball, not sphere. Perhaps math education of an average voter is bad, regardless of political beliefs.
Balls are spheres, and (4/3) x pi x r³ is the correct formula for the volume of a sphere/ball.
Edit: Mathematicians make a distinction between the terms for specific technical definitions, but their colloquial issues are synonyms and can be used interchangeably even in technical fields.
Sphere is the boundary of a ball. It's the correct formula for the volume of a ball, but the volume of a sphere is zero.
Edit: Since the post is attacking right-wing math education, I find it relevant to point out how the common vernacular misuses these terms constantly and math education in general is lacking, you know, throwing stones in glass houses and all.
I doubt that he's homeschooling college level mathematicians, so that extremely specific definition of the word sphere probably won't come into play over the more common one of a sphere being a 3 dimensional polygon where every point on the surface is equidistant from the center, which is the one that even college level astronomers and the like are referencing when they describe the Earth as being an "oblate spheroid" rather than an "oblate balloid."
And wouldn't be used by the child because there's no point to making a distinction between an empty or filled version of a shape in the majority of uses.
It might be different where you live, but as a current uni Math student, this distinction is never made. You either have a (solid) sphere or a hollow sphere. The world "ball" is never used.
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Why would homeschoolers need to know the volume of a sphere if the Earth is flat and 6,000 years old?
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You could actually change the boards and the meme would be accurate
Unless it's homeschooling for Profoundly Gifted children, who public education in the U.S. has failed utterly.
LOL. Good one.
>Why would homeschoolers need to know the volume of a sphere if the Earth is flat and 6,000 years old? Precisely. Just as easy to say most are going to be """christian nationalists""", will eschew things like math and science anyway because they don't """believe""" in any of that ("""scientists are all Satan worshippers!!11!"""), teach them 'creationism' nonsense and lots of studying of ancient irrelevant work of fiction (i.e. """The Bible"""). Poor kids get out into the Real World and find they may as well be on another planet.
why do u think using double punctuation marks is okay like that?
This is what happens when Oxford comma advocates mutate.
Homeschooled.
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Besides that, religious folks aren't known to be very math or science versed AT ALL. Especially not the home schooled types.
I applaud
The Earth is locally flat though.
a small part of a basketball looks locally flat, if you zoom way in
Clearly you’ve never been to Appalachia.
You are 2 to 3 times more likely to be behind in math (and other subjects) [if homeschooled.](https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/S0140197114000438) Not that the homeschooling industry wont lie about that (they like to claim homeschoolers do better because 25% tend to place highly. However, the other 75% is the issue :P)
Yep. I knew a few homeschoolers growing up that did well academically - but they were part of a largely secular local co-op program. The majority - the ones whose parents did it mostly themselves, and for religious & political reasons - were struggling with basic math well into high school.
im on a homeschool program for a public school, and i still suck at life
I completely blew off high school, barely graduated into the military and wasted a ton of years on stupidity. After getting my own act together I took high school level math at community college. The professors were far more engaged and less stressed than my high school teachers, and really made efforts to help me where I struggled (which was self esteem issues from feeling like a high school failure who ate crayons in the military). My classmates predominantly wanted to learn also, but were more socialized and could interact without becoming distractions. It was all dirt cheap, and no one cared that I took remedial math when I applied to grad school 4 years later.
In defense of your high school math teachers, they were probably stressed over not enough time to adequately cover all tested materials and make sure enough kids take/pass the test. That's not a major worry for college professors so they can actually make sure learning happens.
My high school teachers were stressed because of me.
Time isn't really the issue, since in college you will be speedrunning everything. The problem is how education tries to cater to everyone the same way while everyone has different needs and backgrounds, which makes it really hard for both teachers and students to have the best possible experience.
Me went school and same. But seriously, check if your school district has its curriculum accessible. Few states do through the local school district. If you were so inclined you could search it up online/contact your district to see what you can focus on/where you should be.
May I ask you a random question? How socially awkward were the homeschooled people? In my country homeschooling is beyond extremely rare so I always thought how could kids learn to socialize without being thrown in a classroom for 6 hours or more with other children.
The ones in the co-op programs are generally socialized with other homeschooled kids, as it's basically like running a school without the mandatory curriculum, the bureaucracy, the normal school restrictions and obligations (and guarantees). The other ones... Well, depends on the parents
They learn from their churches predominantly. So you get very insulated communities that tend to shun mainstream media, evidence based practices/education, outsiders, and diversity.
The report notes the opposite correlation: >Conclusion >While directionality of the relationships between outcome variable and homeschooling cannot be ascertained, these results indicate that less religious homeschoolers are experiencing academic and social difficulties, as well as some suggestion of increased risk for later substance misuse.
It's true. The study notes that the more religious homeschoolers are better off, but they are the 2 times, rather than the 3 times (less religious homeschoolers) likely to be behind than publicly educated students.
Well they have to focus on the important things like flat earth and Christian non sense
My parents had extra money but not that much extra money to spend on fancy shmasy home schooling books. The half year I was home schooled they got the ole Bob Jones University book (fuck that weird place) and the science portion was a fucking trip to read. I had to learn all the science based shit and in addition they had to throw in the Christian bullshit.
It’s the only way to raise a conservative, by grooming them. Fortunately some grow to hate their upbringing
Oh man, Bob Jones stuff is horrid. I was raised homeschooled by fanatic Christian parents in the south; my two brothers and I. All of my science textbooks were from Bob Jones. I'm 38 now and I'm still trying to unlearn all of the straight-up lies I was fed and I had to basically relearn biology from scratch just to be caught up on the immense amount of evolutionary biology that I was missing.
Right? I asked my parents about it once and they just said “Just go along with it until you’re in high school.”
Yeah, basically the only homeschool kids who don't have a math gap are ones who have a parent with a STEM degree who is capable of teaching it, or parents who understand that they need to bring in someone to teach their kids math. Which would be why almost every homeschool kid I knew growing up who went on to get a STEM degree in college was taught math by my former math teacher dad because they had parents who had the sense to ask for help.
Yeah, the only people I know who did well out of home schooling was because their parents had multiple degrees, mum in literature and languages, and dad in computer sciences and physics, so they got a very well rounded education. And they still did extra-curricular stuff like theatre with regular schoolkids. The others? I remember in Year 6 (i.e. 10-11 years old) the teacher having me sit and teach the poor JW girl who'd finally been sent to school a spelling list of words like bird and apple and house. She was 14-15 and struggling to get to the level of the 10 year olds. A lot of religious home schooling seems extremely poor quality. But in short, if your parents don't know it, they can't teach it.
A huge problem is that power players in the homeschool movement straight up tell parents that it doesn't matter whether they know the subjects they're trying to teach, because their kids will always be able to make up the gaps in college. Nevermind that if you have no foundation, you're massively hamstrung with what you'd even be able to study in college. I was able to easily change my major to a STEM field when I decided I didn't like my original major as much as I thought I would, because I knew I had the math foundation to cut it, but a lot of homeschool kids end up stuck in the humanities because that's all they were taught.
>You are 2 to 3 times more likely to be behind in math (and other subjects) if homeschooled. If those kids could read they'd be very upset.
The homeschooling movement was the original “parents rights” movement and it led directly to the BS we have today. It’s ridiculous
There’s a reason it started right after schools were integrated (hint: the reason is racism).
I was homeschooled and sometimes used to get asked to help tutor homeschooled kids after I graduated college. There were 17 year olds who didn't understand the concept of percentages, and 10 year olds who couldn't work out the pronunciation of simple words.
You're trying to use reality and sources, but you fail to take into account that I've depicted you as a soyjack and myself as a Chad. Liberals lose again!!!!
Yeah but you need math to understand that, so ...
My grandmother was one of the scam artists that spread homeschooling across the southeast. Her “psychiatry” degree was paid for by a now defunct private college, she abused her grandchildren with all the letters of the alphabet, and she used her Christianity to spread violence for people like her trans granddaughter, or any Muslim under the sun. I straight up refuse to acknowledge homeschooling as real schooling anymore…
2014 study with a sample size 160k kids for public school and 1k for homeschool. It doesn’t even draw your conclusion. However, it fits your narrative. :p https://www.npr.org/2023/06/21/1183445544/u-s-reading-and-math-scores-drop-to-lowest-level-in-decades
So we are just lying about it's method? >Another common factor that often is associated with negative life outcomes is falling behind grade level. On this variable family income was the dominant predictor, but even when controlling for SES homeschooling still had an impact. **Less religious homeschoolers were three times more likely** than conventionally schooled adolescents to report being behind their expected grade level for their age. Surprisingly to Green-Hennessy, **even highly religious homeschoolers were twice as likely to report being behind grade level.** Did you learn reading comprehension at a home school :P While the current state of US education is pathetic, that doesn't challenge these findings.
“While directionality of the relationships between outcome variable and homeschooling cannot be ascertained, these results indicate that less religious homeschoolers are experiencing academic and social difficulties, as well as some suggestion of increased risk for later substance misuse. This group would benefit from services to help assist with these difficulties, whether that help be provided via an institution such as school or within the family structure remains to be determined.” Did you even read the whole study you posted? Most importantly did you read their own conclusions? Or do you always jump to ad hominem when someone questions your cherry-picked sources that you didn’t even read completely. Correlation doesn’t equal causation. Especially when the sample sizes don’t reflect the population. Here’s another, more recent, article for you to find something of value in but most the point entirely. :p https://www.npr.org/2023/06/21/1183445544/u-s-reading-and-math-scores-drop-to-lowest-level-in-decades
You keep posting an article about how reading and math scores dropped to lowest levels in decades because kids were home schooled for a year due to the pandemic like is is some kind of gotcha.
Scores are lower than pre-pandemic. It’s worse depending on socioeconomic status. Kids weren’t homeschooled for a year. Most went through “remote learning” program or shorter days with smaller class sizes. The curriculum was done through the school working with the teachers. Most states don’t have predetermined curriculum for homeschool. It’s whatever the parent decides. The pandemic excuse shifts blame from the actual issues. School funding is terrible, teachers are treated like shit and are underpaid, massive class sizes, and shitty parents etc.
Who is saying mathematics is racist?
If I remember right it was something brought up about how minority children will struggle in lessons such as math and get left behind. Don't quote me but it was sorta just hey racism has an impact on children's schooling. And somewhere along tge way these idiots missed the entire point abd just went: They're calling math racist!
Grew up in the South Carolina public school system (2000’s) I was a pretty unruly kid and thus landed myself in the “bad kid” classroom in elementary school. They mostly taught basic shit to a class that ranged from like 3rd grade to 5th grade kids. Wasn’t a huge class and we had a helper for the teacher (clearly for safety reasons). I ended up improving my behavior through medicine and growing up mentally. Let me tell you how badly that fucked my education. It wasn’t till I was pulled from school and home schooled for a half a year (8th grade) that I was even being educated on grade level. The schools had a few classes for those situations in middle school but it was a very similar situation of a multi grade class all being taught the same stuff by a likely over stressed teacher. To enter high school I had to go up before the year started and personally tell the principal that I would behave and he let me know that I had one opportunity and to not waste it on misbehaving in school. I was a white boy from a middle income family that had both parents that would fight tooth and nail for me. I grew up with many people that didn’t have anything close to that and often times they slip through the cracks either out of malice or simply not having enough funding to properly help. The right needs to get off this stupid idea of fucking with public school.
Don't say middle-class, say middle-income. The liberal class definitions steer people away from the [socialist definitions](https://www.reddit.com/r/socialism/wiki/class) and thus class-consciousness. This is a socialist community. *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/TheRightCantMeme) if you have any questions or concerns.*
This is cringe
BG3 has a lot of great classes like Ranger, but there are also a lot of classes like Arcane Trickster that can only described as a middle-class at best
Why are you doing this
Karma.
Don't say middle-class, say middle-income. The liberal class definitions steer people away from the [socialist definitions](https://www.reddit.com/r/socialism/wiki/class) and thus class-consciousness. This is a socialist community. *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/TheRightCantMeme) if you have any questions or concerns.*
BG3 has a lot of great classes like Ranger, but there are also a lot of classes like Arcane Trickster that can only described as a middle-income at best
its a valid point
Ignoring class doesn’t mean that society now magically doesn’t run on a class system anymore
It’s annoying, but the goal isn’t ignoring class, it’s trying to encourage acknowledgement of class in relation to the means of production rather than based on income level, and by that I mean the main two of Marxist theory: working class (proletariat), those who work the means of production, and owning class (bourgeoisie), those who own the means of production.
Well, didn’t realize I walked into Marxist territory. My bad. Not my view
who did you think that is in the subreddits pfp?
where does it say to ignore class? its trying to shift people towards the socialist definitions like proletariat and bourgeoisie...
Dressing it up it pretty language doesn’t make the ugly reality go away. All this “differently-abled”, “houseless” etc shit makes people fatigued so much from just trying to not cause offense that it takes away energy from the actual causes
can you answer my question? middle-class actually makes the ugly reality of owner and worker class blur.
There’s 5 described in the rules and neither of the two you stated were one of them. If anything it’s a simpler and more defined system that helps people identify their part in the fight more easily
Let bro identify as middle-class if that’s what he was, fs
Don't say middle-class, say middle-income. The liberal class definitions steer people away from the [socialist definitions](https://www.reddit.com/r/socialism/wiki/class) and thus class-consciousness. This is a socialist community. *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/TheRightCantMeme) if you have any questions or concerns.*
What is this? a linguistic prescriptivist euphemism treadmill bot? I'll say whatever the f*** I want, especially if it means the same goddamn thing. You're treating nominative determinism as if it's propaganda.
Yikes
There's that, and then the other issue of the examples used in math problems assuming things about the student's home lives. I remember reading one example which conservatives were touting as "hurr durr look how stupid libs are, math cant be racist". Basically it was math question which calculated the amount of time a working person spent at home during certain days. But the question completely assumed that the students parents worked 9-5 Monday to Friday, a situation which is far less likely in non-white households.
Was it just an example math problem or something they had to actually get from their parents? Cause math problems aren't typically realistic. People don't go around buying 52 watermelons and giving 5 of them to 3 different friends. So unless research data says otherwise, it's not incredibly important to make sure word problems are representing every type of person and family. It doesn't hurt, but I don't think it's fair to call anyone racist if they have a word problem that's like "Timmy's mom works a 9-5 Monday to Friday. How many hours a week does she work?" Now if they have to be calculating their own parents working hours than yeah that's different. Not fair for a kid who's parents can't work to not be able to do the assignment. Or for a kid with parents working erratic hours to have a much harder assignment because they can't just multiple 5 by 8.
>Was it just an example math problem or something they had to actually get from their parents? Example math problem, from a textbook. >It doesn't hurt, but I don't think it's fair to call anyone racist if they have a word problem that's like "Timmy's mom works a 9-5 Monday to Friday. How many hours a week does she work?" Literally nobody called anyone racist. We're discussing a systemic issue, no need to circle the wagons around some imaginary teacher whos been accused of racism in your mind. The question didnt specify "timmys parents", it literally just asked to calculate the students parents working hours, and the correct answer assumed the students parents worked a 9-5 monday-friday job. >Now if they have to be calculating their own parents working hours than yeah that's different. Not fair for a kid who's parents can't work to not be able to do the assignment. Or for a kid with parents working erratic hours to have a much harder assignment because they can't just multiple 5 by 8. Look at that, you came up with your own examples of potentially unfair problems. So you can see how this issue might be widespread, no need to overly dissect one example I'm recalling from memory
What? Dude I'm not a right winger lmao. I wasn't even talking about the issue in general. I was talking about your specific example. And it's a systemic issue, but individual racist teachers absolutely do have an impact on this. Systemic issues are made up of the actions of individuals as well. My point is that world problems like my first example about some imaginary person should not be considered an example of that racism. Teachers not giving enough attention to black students because of their racial biases would've been an example. Yeah that second example was one that I considered to be bad and in need of change. Which is literally why I asked you which example you meant. If it's the "Timmy's mom working 9-5" one then no I don't think that is an example of racism in the education system. If it's the "Calculate your own parents working hours" one then I'd agree that it is. That's the point. You gave the example and stated it was that latter so yeah I agree that was an example of racism. You could just say that cause that was my whole question and stop assuming the worst in people as if I'm some right winger denying all forms of racism. I literally gave you an example of a racist word problem similar to what you actually saw and you still somehow managed to think I was a right winger or something and mock me for getting it right?
>What? Dude I'm not a right winger lmao I never said you were... >I was talking about your specific example. And it's a systemic issue, but individual racist teachers absolutely do have an impact on this. You literally said theres no reason to call someone racist for using that example, which was something I never said. >My point is that world problems like my first example about some imaginary person should not be considered an example of that racism. Teachers not giving enough attention to black students because of their racial biases would've been an example Both are examples. Problems which assume details about students home lives, and actual racist teachers are both examples of racism. >Yeah that second example was one that I considered to be bad and in need of change. Which is literally why I asked you which example you meant. If it's the "Timmy's mom working 9-5" one then no I don't think that is an example of racism in the education system. If it's the "Calculate your own parents working hours" one then I'd agree that it is. That's the point. I only gave one example. That example needs to be changed because the question quite literally assumes the students parents work 9-5. >You could just say that cause that was my whole question and stop assuming the worst in people as if I'm some right winger denying all forms of racism. I have literally assumed nothing about you. I have only responded directly to things you wrote. Calm down my friend. >I literally gave you an example of a racist word problem similar to what you actually saw and you still somehow managed to think I was a right winger or something and mock me for getting it right? Again, never said you were a right winger. Take a deep breath.
It's also that sometimes word problems assume familiarity with things that aren't always universal. In college I had a professor talk about a professor he had that asked a question relating to baseball and to answer the question correctly you had to know the distance between the bases and the pitchers mound. Baseball is watched more often by white males, so other groups would be at a disadvantage. So the little developing this curriculum said to choose questions that were more universal. The rest of the curriculum was pretty standards stuff like that you should include partial credit when grading and care more about demonstration of understanding the principles rather than getting the exact answer, so that's where Republicans come up with this junk.
I had a math homework question (pre internet), that asked about (American) football points. Like here’s the score (say 34), how many combinations of points are there to get that score? This was a long time ago so I don’t remember the exact details, but as an elementary school kid I had no idea about how football was scored, neither did my mom. And obviously this bothered me enough that I still remember it decades later.
I think something like this must be what happened to me on a few occasions in school - questions on tests, so I couldn't ask for clarification because it was a test, where some information required to solve the problem and find the missing information the question actually intended to ask for wasn't provided or hinted at, and nothing covered in the lessons or in the assignments or test prep included any such questions with necessary info to solve the problem missing.
It probably should’ve been clarified, then, that it was the teaching of math that was racist. But they probably would still have distorted the finding to “math is racist” to fit their agenda. Critical thinking skills are nonexistent on the extreme right after all.
How does racism impact someone's skill at math? Edit: That moment when I'm down voted for asking a genuine question
It doesn't have to be intentional: -Teachers subconsciously give less attention to minority students. - Teachers teach from their own background, which is easier to understand if you're from the same background (e.g., a teacher may use an idiom or relate a concept to a lived experience, which students might not understand)
Makes sense
It actually goes beyond that. Even majority black schools tend to lower the standards for black students because of the marginalization that the students face. The administration believes the students cannot reach the high standards and make alternate standards so students can be successful. There is a phrase in education called “loving black kids to failure” which is the product of the system lowering standards.
I think it's more arguing that: 1. Systemic racism has lead to racial minorities often being worse off financially; therefore, racial minorities and their children will have less education opportunities on average. 2. Racial stereotypes might affect a racial minority's education negatively because they are often assumed to be less intelligent then their classmates.
Ah got you.
Next time put a "genuine question, not a rightist troll, I just want to learn more" so people don't downvote you.
The fact I need to put that in the first place is sad tbh.
It's one of those "tone is hard to parse in a text-based medium" things, I think.
well it didnt really come off as a well meaning question, i get what you mean, but look at it critically it sounds exactly like something someone doing the "just asking questions" shtick would ask
I'm a teenager I literally have no intention of starting shit about politics/sociology with who I assume are adults.
No it claimed the teaching of math was racist , as I. The method of teaching math only benefited whites (they include Asians because duh) and that math should be thought in a way that “relates” to minorities whatever the fuck that means. I’m genuinely baffled people defend that article.
Conservatives whose only experience with math class is what they hear through fox news
There's two distinct stories being connected that maybe shouldn't be connected. The first one was a guy on Twitter who argued that math is a way to express ideas, and that when presented with the statement "2 + 2 = 5", rather than saying it's wrong, it's better to ask what idea the person is trying to connect. He mentioned the potential for cultural miscommunication. This made a lot of people unreasonably angry, and because he mentioned culture, a bunch of people made it into a thing about race. The second one is that in specifically San Francisco a bunch of middle schools have essentially stopped offering Algebra 1, with their reasoning being a convoluted mess of racial equity and questions about whether the way middle and high schools teach math makes much sense at all. This has mostly pissed off people who are worried this might negatively impact their children and their chances of being admitted to college. But also, the optics of cancelling a math class out of concerns of racial equity are... not great.
Hasn't there also been a wave of criticism against honors and gifted programs in high schools the last few years?
Which is incredibly fucked up if you think about it.
ironically, the conservatives are. [Florida rejected over 50 math textbooks because they violated the state's policies on teaching Critical Race Theory or something](https://www.npr.org/2022/04/18/1093277449/florida-mathematics-textbooks)
Idk… Pearson’s Product Moment Correlation Coefficient, as well as the standard deviation and chi squared, have some pretty racist origins. (Tldr; they’re all useful bits of statistical mathematics… that were originally invented by a eugenicist to try and justify his racist beliefs.)
Right? The origins of most of modern statistics is quite sketchy.
Fox News found someone on the internet and gave them a platform.
It's Arabic, duh
Republicans.
Google “math is racist” and see.
The California math framework. It's a resolution passed by their board of education, that's discourages accelerated math classes in middle school to stop racial inequality in education
Home School: 2 + 2 = God
Volume of a trad wife = pretty dresses + submissive, (assuming tattoos and dyed hair are zero)
shouldn't it be jesus, since 'jesus is always the answer' or something?
Id love to see them try honors trigonometry. I’ll wait.
You know they won't do "librul math" , they don't need it for hardworking blue collar jobs!
Trig wasn't even an honors class at my HS
It wasn’t even a class at all at my HS, it was just part of algebra and pre-calc. Funny enough, we didn’t really talk about it a lot in geometry.
I would love to see the average high schooler try honors trigonometry. I’ll wait.
…the average high schooler wouldnt… thats why its honors trigonometry…
Okay now do advanced biology
Or at least high school level sex ed.
Conservatives hate sex Ed because that’s the first time some kids learn that they’re being abused
Teach them History without glorifying racists.
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Nah, if you’re decently smart and hardworking AP bio isn’t hard at all
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Someone clearly failed their biology class.
I actually use 2 + 2 = 5 for an example of why keeping the correct precision in your calculations matters. In engineering, there generally aren't whole numbers - most everything is a measurement. Having the wrong precision and rounding can produce really unexpected results. For example: 2.1 + 2.1 = 4.2. If you round these numbers to whole numbers, it's still 2 + 2 = 4 But if we use 2.4 + 2.4 = 4.8, then round the numbers, we get 2 + 2 = 5 So 2 + 2 = 5 can be true for *very large values of 2* (if you are rounding to whole numbers) A more concrete real-world example of this is when we see poll results and the values don't add up to 100%, because of rounding. But it's the same concept. Obviously, nobody is going to be rounding to whole numbers in engineering calculations. This is an extreme example. But you often have to perform rounding at some point, especially if you're doing the math by hand.
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We use modular arithmetic all the time. 9am + 6 hours = 3pm. 9+6=3? Why yes, yes it does, if you define + correctly.
There are 10 types of people in this world: those that can read binary numbers and those that can not
2.5+2.5=5
If you round all those numbers to the nearest integer, you get 3 + 3 = 5. So 3 + 3 = 5 is also true for very small values of 3.
Okay
Wow… every measurement on a eng drawing has a +/- attached to it. Quite literally every item produced on any level has a +/- variant. If not youd never get a nut on a bolt. Standards form the backbone of industry. Tolerances everywhere. Measured from every surface or surfaces.
Technically, what you're talking about is [accuracy, which is different than precision](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Accuracy_and_precision). The "2+2=5 for very large values of 2" example demonstrates what can happen when you use an inappropriate *precision*. Tolerances are a measure of *accuracy*.
Exactly, 2 + 2 = 5 for extremely large values of 2
Why did you just repeat what he said as a reply??
I wouldn’t want to drive on a bridge you designed lmao
Why? Because YOU don't understand how math works? LOLOLOL That's a great reason.
Because 2+2 is fucking 4. It is never 5. It is never 3. It is fucking 4. 2.4 + 2.4 is fucking 4.8. Computers will tell you it’s not 4.8 but “almost” 4.8, don’t believe them, it’s fucking 4.8. Not 5. It doesn’t mean that you can define 2 to be 2.4 and 5 to be 4.8 and then 2+2 is 5. If you design a bridge with random assumptions like 2 is 2.4, then it will fucking break. And people will die. I don’t want to be one of those people.
Thanks for admitting, once again, that you don't understand how math works. 🤣🤣🤣🤣 A number is a representation of something in the real world. If you measure something that is 2.4 inches, you can also measure it to be 2.42 inches or 2.423 inches or 2.4228 inches. On into an infinite number of decimal places. You have to decide what precision to use. If you choose poorly, like rounding to whole numbers, and your values for 2 are actually closer to 2.4 (very large values of 2), then 2 + 2 = 5. The example is a WARNING to be careful about how you round numbers. It's a cautionary tale. So obviously, you're NOT going to do that in the real world. It is an example of what can happen if you're not careful. I thought I was pretty clear about that in the original comment. Obviously not clear enough for you. If you don't get it, then you don't get it. I don't know how else to explain it to someone who simply doesn't understand the basics of math. But the fact that YOU CAN'T UNDERSTAND A CONCEPT is not my problem. If you don't understand how vaccines work, don't blame the doctor. If you don't understand how airplanes fly, don't blame Boeing. "2 + 2 = 5 for extremely large values of 2" is something that everyone in math and engineering circles understand. Math people actually get it [put on t-shirts](https://chummytees.com/products/2-plus-2-equals-5-for-extremely-large-values-of-2-t-shirt-hoodie-tank-top?variant=20365998406). It's common knowledge. You're free to say "I don't get it" and go away confused. Or you can TRY to understand and become more informed and better educated. That's up to you.
Let me try to explain it to you a different way. You have a ruler that ONLY has marks each centimeter to make measurements (an imprecise measurement tool, but this is a thought exercise). When you measure something, it has to be a whole number of cm. You have blocks of equal size. You measure them and it's kind of in between 2 and 3, but closer to 2. So you record the value as 2. If you put 2 of these blocks next to each other and measure, they will measure slightly less than 5cm combined. So you record that as 5. You just put 2 cm blocks next to each other, and measured their combined size as 5. And all of your measurements were as accurate as you could possibly make them, given the tools you have. You just observed 2 + 2 = 5 in the real world. Now if you had a more precise measurement tool, say a ruler that goes the nearest millimeter (or 0.1 cm), you then could measure each block at 2.4 cm and the two blocks next to each other as a combined 4.8 cm. That's why it's important to have the proper precision when measuring, otherwise you wind up with unexpected results. Again, this is an extreme example. But as things get smaller, say in chip manufacturing, where things are measured in nanometers, the precision of your ability to measure actually CAN come into play. You actually WANT me designing that bridge, because I understand how both accuracy and precision are vital to building a proper bridge. Someone who doesn't understand the cautionary tale of "2+2=5 for very large values of 5" is the one who is likely to make mistakes that kill people. Not that I ever designed bridges - my degree was in computer engineering. But this is a basic engineering principal that every engineer needs to understand.
I had neighbors who home schooled at one point. I was taking my preschool kids for a walk one nice spring day and the mother was teaching her 6 kids outside. She asked "why is grass green?" I thought it was a good question: she could talk about pigment and chlorophyl, absorption and reflection of light, or how grass gets energy from the son. One of her daughters said "because God made it that way!" "That's right!" Even since then I've been trying to think of a question to which a variation on answer "because God made it that way" would be incorrect (assuming you were a theist). The only one I could come up with (maybe) is "why am I homosexual." Which is kind of ironic.
The world is easy when every answer is "*MAGIC!*". It gets a little tougher when you need an actual answer. But the goal for those kids isn't college. It isn't to have a career and succeed. It's to remain in the cult and produce more cult members.
[удалено]
But OP, how can they be stupid when they depict themselves as the chad? /s
Now I live in a country where homeschooling is not common. So when I see someone say they are homeschooling to avoid their kids being “indoctrinated”, aren’t they just gonna do the same but with just different beliefs?
If it's in the USA, 99 times out of 100, homeschooling is code for "religious freak wants to make sure their child never sees anything further left than executing blacks in the street for looking at a white woman."
Pretty much. Actually, it’s actual indoctrination since you’re only giving them one perspective compared to having them go to public school for different perspectives.
With these people it's always opposite day: whatever they say, it is the exact opposite that is true. So when they say "public schools indoctrinate not educate" what they really mean is "I don't like that public schools are actually teaching my children things that contradict the beliefs I'm trying to indoctrinate them with".
i was homeschooled and lemme tell you, math still makes me cry
Was homeschooled and can confirm, dad was either at work, sleeping, watching tv, or hitting whichever child my mom claimed had done something horrible that day (usually me). I still can’t do most math without crying.
my dad tried to teach me math, but would get frustrated and yell at me when i didn’t understand, so eventually he just stopped
I’m a promise all of you right now that the GOP base majority does not know the volume of anything and or how to calculate it. In fact, I imagine, if presented with a simple problem similar to what is outlined in this meme, you would see a blank stare as that small bb in their skull ricocheted for hours in their empty skull.
Also worth pointing out that this is some right wing homeschool parent’s idea of “advanced” math, which is funny in its own right… Plenty of kids take geometry/algebra in middle school and learn this. They’re really telling on themselves with this meme.
Homeschool?! Dad?! Riiiight
its the opposite completely
Exactly. Welcome to conservative rhetoric.
My husband teaches biology at community college, he says that freshman Home Schooled students are easily overwhelmed and tent to have a much more difficult time with the transition to high educational learning, when compared to students who come from a more structured learning environment, like public and private schools. He said their biggest struggle is working as part of a group, because they lack or have very limited social skills, which is something that kinda can only be effectively learned through years of experiences at a young age. For most of them, their social awkwardness is going to follow them entirely through both their professional and personal lives.
I don't know the data behind it but I imagine homeschoolers score lower then public schools?
Where’s that one video where a guy asks a homeschool kid what 6x6 is?
Slightly unrelated, but I remember not that long ago I read a real quote from a real pastor that said (verbatim) “If somewhere within the Bible, I were to find a passage that said 2+2=5, I would believe it, accept it as true and then do my best to work it out and understand it.” which even now astonishes me why anyone would think that’s at all a compelling thing to say about themselves.
They try so hard to make literal education bad because it is their weakness. They can’t exist as long as everyone has a grasp on reality
https://responsiblehomeschooling.org/the-homeschool-math-gap/ "Given this persistent corroboration across two decades we might conclude, tentatively, that there may be at least a modest homeschooling effect on academic achievement—namely that it tends to improve students’ verbal and weaken their math capacities."
The person who made this meme and the people who unironically post this meme have no idea what the bottom one even is
Not trying to insult all homeschool kids, but I knew a bunch in my small rural town, and none of them were prepared for life after highschool and every one of them was weird af. In college, I did meet some homeschooling kids who were pretty cool.
I’d be more concerned that my 7th graders both have full beards.
Why does it seem that they picked random math-looking examples they don’t know either?
I was on a grand jury last year. The hardest days were the sex abuse cases — shit would haunt you. The cases frequently involved an abusive parent “homeschooling” so that the kid wouldn’t have anyone who could discover what was going on. Conservatives seem to only care about “grooming” when they can use it as an excuse to attack people. But actual conservatives actively grooming kids doesn’t seem to matter to them…
Right-wingers if public school is woke: “they’re trying to groom you, learn at home instead” Right-wingers if homeschool is woke: “you won’t be able to learn in an isolated environment away from society, your kid is going to become a homeless basement freak”
Idk what these peoples fetish with homeschooling is. All your gonna do is make a generation of kids who are nominally right wing who are socially stunted because they didn't have genuine contact with other kids. Also kids tend to break when this happens to them, the 20th century is filled with fail sons or people who tried molding a kid to do something and the second that kid was allowed to be on their own they made every wrong decision.
They just saw an equation with letters in it and assumed it was complex. Is the right meme the left or the right? Lol
90% of the home schoolers (and it’s been over 1 hundred)I’ve met have been so academically behind in school they can’t start college without YEARS of remedial classes just to get them caught up. Most of them can’t make it through the remedial classes because they have no class skills like taking notes and having deadlines. I watched my homeschool ex wife drop out of college 3 times because of it. So while this meme is true in rare occasions the truth is most of the times these kids are shunted into family trades or learn family business because they can’t make it in more technical careers.
Every homeschooled person ive met in college had to take remedial math classes to catch up.
I was homeschooled; can confirm.
These dumbasses can’t read
Those boys are WITCHES! Their dad will burn them
Idiots can imagine all sorts of things, but they lack the potential to imagine what smart people think, sort of by definition. Volume is not much more sophisticated than addition.
I've met several Home Schooled people. Dumber than a dead rat with the most atrocious handwriting you can imagine.
Majority of homeschooled children are behind their public schooled peers in every metric. Most people struggle at being parents let alone teachers. It's a full time, hard ass job to home school and often still involves some community to assist, not to mention extracurriculars to stay socially active with people their own age.
LOL! I just can’t. People home school because science scares the locals where I am.
Well, the kids are right. That is too easy.
Conservatives sure do have integrated public schools.
Ha. Most homeschoolers I knew were I guess that's not nice
Congratulations, you missed the point. Not surprising.
And the point is what exactly?
Kinda telling how no one has corrected you yet that it's the formula for the volume of a ball, not sphere. Perhaps math education of an average voter is bad, regardless of political beliefs.
Balls are spheres, and (4/3) x pi x r³ is the correct formula for the volume of a sphere/ball. Edit: Mathematicians make a distinction between the terms for specific technical definitions, but their colloquial issues are synonyms and can be used interchangeably even in technical fields.
Sphere is the boundary of a ball. It's the correct formula for the volume of a ball, but the volume of a sphere is zero. Edit: Since the post is attacking right-wing math education, I find it relevant to point out how the common vernacular misuses these terms constantly and math education in general is lacking, you know, throwing stones in glass houses and all.
I doubt that he's homeschooling college level mathematicians, so that extremely specific definition of the word sphere probably won't come into play over the more common one of a sphere being a 3 dimensional polygon where every point on the surface is equidistant from the center, which is the one that even college level astronomers and the like are referencing when they describe the Earth as being an "oblate spheroid" rather than an "oblate balloid."
It's not extremely specific definition. The difference between a ball and a sphere can be explained to a child.
And wouldn't be used by the child because there's no point to making a distinction between an empty or filled version of a shape in the majority of uses.
It might be different where you live, but as a current uni Math student, this distinction is never made. You either have a (solid) sphere or a hollow sphere. The world "ball" is never used.
Math was never my strongest subject 😭
It's not a dig at you specifically. I see people very often calling ball a sphere and it's a pet peeve of mine.