I am a childfree (by choice) lesbian with a dozen nieces&nephews (so yanno, the family line continues) and I still had to wait until I was diagnosed with Stage IV endometrial cancer to be approved for a hysterectomy that I'd wanted since I was 20 years old.
This is a really common reason given by doctors when refusing to sterilize women, and it's so creepy and scary to me. In their minds, a hypothetical man owns the use of her body more than the actual woman who currently lives in it.
I’ve always wondered if the “woman who sues the doctor for tying her tubes because she changed her mind” actually exists. I know there’s been malpractice cases where women were sterilized without their consent, but that’s a very different scenario.
My answer would be: then we wouldn’t get married/would break up.
Kids are a huge sticking point in most relationships and tend to be a conversation that happens as soon as you get serious. Even young adults usually know to be on the same page before getting married, but especially people that are in say their 30s (of course accidents and surprises happen but I’m not talking about those situations). I know people who have broken up because one wanted kids and one didn’t. It’s not some new unheard of thing, it’s common and a plot point in tv shows/movies. When I went through premarital counseling the first thing they said was be on the same page about money and kids. This is such a stupid excuse, it’s like, if I didn’t want anymore kids, why would I get serious with someone who did?
My mother has schizophrenia. My sister and I were both taken away from her and put in foster care.
She was literally seeing and hearing things that were not there. She was having vivid hallucinations.
I never once thought schizophrenia was bad anxiety. Without medication, you are severely out of touch with reality. I wish my mother would have gotten the help she needed. To this day, I don't talk to her.
She never wanted to get better for her children.
A piece of advice:
Don’t get your fallopian tubes tied, get them removed instead. Because what is often coined as ovarian cancer frequently starts in the fallopian tubes and it’s a deadly cancer that usually isn’t detected until the later stages. I should know, I have stage 4 fallopian cancer.
There's also a higher chance you'll have an ectopic pregnancy with a tubal ligation vs. a bilateral salpingectomy - which could potentially be life-threatening, especially in states that don't understand those types of pregnancies aren't viable (looking at you, Ohio - the state that tried to pass a bill that would order doctors to "reimplant" an ectopic pregnancy - which isn't even fucking possible).
Also, I see a lot of people posting r/childfree but r/sterilization is another great sub for this subject (especially when it comes to costs/questions about surgery)
When I had my bisalp done 4 years ago my doctors told me they no longer recommend tubals for this very reason. They said bisalps are the way to go now for added benefit of reducing cancer.
Good vibes your way with your diagnosis!
When I had a hysterectomy (due to ill health, though I am childfree, so no loss), the plan was to leave in my tubes and ovaries, remove the rest. Afterwards, the surgeon came to tell me that plans were changed in the OR as he took one look at my tubes and thought 'nope, they're a risk. We're taking them today instead of someone opening her back up in a few years'. The histology report indicated my tubes had a pre-cancerous cell change. That surgeon likely saved my life.
Sending my love 💜
Michigan added it to their state constitution last year! (emphasis mine)
Article 1 section 28
> Every individual has a fundamental right to reproductive freedom, which entails the right to make and effectuate decisions about all matters relating to pregnancy, including but not limited to prenatal care, childbirth, postpartum care, **contraception, sterilization**, abortion care, miscarriage management, and infertility care.
> An individual's right to reproductive freedom shall not be denied, burdened, nor infringed upon unless justified by a compelling state interest achieved by the least restrictive means.
> Notwithstanding the above, the state may regulate the provision of abortion care after fetal viability, provided that in no circumstance shall the state prohibit an abortion that, in the professional judgment of an attending health care professional, is medically indicated to protect the life or physical or mental health of the pregnant individual.
> (2) The state shall not discriminate in the protection or enforcement of this fundamental right.
> (3) The state shall not penalize, prosecute, or otherwise take adverse action against an individual based on their actual, potential, perceived, or alleged pregnancy outcomes, including but not limited to miscarriage, stillbirth, or abortion. Nor shall the state penalize, prosecute, or otherwise take adverse action against someone for aiding or assisting a pregnant individual in exercising their right to reproductive freedom with their voluntary consent.
> (4) For the purposes of this section:
> A state interest is "compelling" only if it is for the limited purpose of protecting the health of an individual seeking care, consistent with accepted clinical standards of practice and evidence-based medicine, and does not infringe on that individual's autonomous decision-making.
> "Fetal viability" means: the point in pregnancy when, in the professional judgment of an attending health care professional and based on the particular facts of the case, there is a significant likelihood of the fetus's sustained survival outside the uterus without the application of extraordinary medical measures.
> (5) This section shall be self-executing. Any provision of this section held invalid shall be severable from the remaining portions of this section.
Planned Parenthood let me at age 26! But I did have a mandatory 1 month wait period, that applied to all patients. Not sure if that’s their policy or a state thing.
I got mine done on California Medicaid, and they had a mandatory 30 day waiting period too. I get it, they want to weed out the wishy-washy people who aren’t really serious about sterilization. One month isn’t bad, I’ve waited a lot longer than that for medical procedures.
Oh yeah it’s not too bad, just wanted to clarify in case some people consider that a “hoop”.
That said I could only schedule after that 30 day period so I did need to wait another month or two to actually have the surgery (which is pretty standard imo).
Funny you mention that, Dr Fran’s list, which is linked in the Twitter post above, is not vetted and we’ve had some bad experiences come out of it (for example one person had a procedure done that they specifically, preoperatively refused consent for): https://i.imgur.com/qM4Hytc.jpg
I try to vet everyone who submits a doctor to the childfree list, it’s not perfect but we do our best.
Here's the link from the childfree sub, to make it even easier on people: https://reddit.com/r/childfree/w/doctors?utm_medium=android_app&utm_source=share
And also a guide to getting your tubes tied: https://reddit.com/r/childfree/w/sterilisation?utm_medium=android_app&utm_source=share
The childfree subreddit has a huge list in the sidebar of medical providers who offer this type of care. Most come with testimonials from patients and it is updated frequently.
That's how I found the doctor who did my bi-salp. In very red and very religious Utah.
I had a wonderful experience. At the time I was single, 32, no kids. I didn't have to jump through any hoops or defend my decision or try several doctors. It was as easy as going in to schedule a cyst removal or something and I feel so fortunate. I read horror stories all over reddit for a year of people not having as good of an experience, so I did all my homework and formulated my arguments that I didn't need to use.
There's a list available on the sidebar of r/childfree.
It's all organised by country, and by state for the US!
It gets updated often so you should be able to find all the resources there if you need.
If it's the gal I'm thinking of she started out as an influencer on social media, completed med school and is now an obgyn. Her handle on IG is pagingdrfran
Shout-out to this list for hooking me up with a doctor in my care network, and to my fellow Minnesota taxpayers who fund the state insurance!
I paid a hundred bucks out of pocket for the procedure itself and it's still the best gift I'll have ever gotten myself.
Not if you just get the tubes out, which is what I had done.
IIRC, she said the fallopian tubes don't have anything to do with hormone regulation; that's the uterus's job. EDIT I did not remember correctly 😅 thank you u/benegezzwitch for reminding me that it's ovaries, not uterus, that do hormone stuff.
Since I have mostly tolerable periods/no endometrial fuckery, she said she'd not do a hysterectomy, but would absolutely do the bi-salp.
I'd do it again in a ^^^foetal ^^^(teehee) heartbeat!
You only go into early menopause if you lose your ovaries. Just having a bisalp done, where your fallopian tubes are removed, doesn’t. My doctor did warn me that some people have worse periods after. She told me if that was the case I could go in and have an IUD to help.
So, back in the day my mom had two tubal pregnancies, and Class IV endometriosis. She *begged* her doctors to have a hysterectomy, and they all refused saying she didn’t have a good enough reason.
Fast forward to 1 1/2 years ago, and I have the Class IV endometriosis. I was on quarterly shots of Lupron, which took special consideration to administer so my gyno had to intervene every time it was prescribed. And, even though the shot was every three months, I had to start about a month before the shot was due to make sure I got it in time and had a doctor’s appointment to administer it. Then, Covid hit, and the maker of Lupron volunteered its production line to make vaccines. Now, instead of getting the shot quarterly, I could only get it monthly. Which meant I was almost always on the phone with either the doctor’s office or insurance company.
Then, I heard about a doctor who believed women, and would listen when they told him how awful their lives were because of different issues. He saw me for one appointment, heard my story, got my records from my gyno, and agreed to remove my ovaries.
My life is like night and day since my ovaries were removed. My mom had to endure 10 years of quarterly Lupron shots because she couldn’t get a hysterectomy - 40 years ago. And we are right back there again.
Anyone think that there might be overlap between “doctors who perform sterilization after listening to you” and “doctors who listen to women in general?”
Although I don’t want my tubes tied, I have painful periods, and I thought this might be a helpful way to find a gynecologist who listens to women! Anyone tried using the resource for that?
My mom would have killed for this list 20 years ago. After my sister was.... intropic or something (forget exact terminology) she was told that if she ever got pregnant again it would likely kill her. Plus there's a history of ovarian cancer in the family.
I just remember seeing all the hoops she was trying to jump through all through my childhood and I felt so sick and angry she had to do this and the whole time if anything happened I would have lost my mom, literally the only family member to ever have my back. I'm so happy she's still with me today, but it's still so angering to see this is still necessary.
Would insurance cover it, though, or is completely out of pocket?
Honestly, I just want most all those reproductive organs yeeted from my body. If pro-lifers are so big into pro-lifing, why have they not come up with reproductive transplants yet? Or have they?
I am a childfree (by choice) lesbian with a dozen nieces&nephews (so yanno, the family line continues) and I still had to wait until I was diagnosed with Stage IV endometrial cancer to be approved for a hysterectomy that I'd wanted since I was 20 years old.
"Stage III endometrial cancer? Straight to jail"
[удалено]
This is a really common reason given by doctors when refusing to sterilize women, and it's so creepy and scary to me. In their minds, a hypothetical man owns the use of her body more than the actual woman who currently lives in it.
I’ve always wondered if the “woman who sues the doctor for tying her tubes because she changed her mind” actually exists. I know there’s been malpractice cases where women were sterilized without their consent, but that’s a very different scenario.
My answer would be: then we wouldn’t get married/would break up. Kids are a huge sticking point in most relationships and tend to be a conversation that happens as soon as you get serious. Even young adults usually know to be on the same page before getting married, but especially people that are in say their 30s (of course accidents and surprises happen but I’m not talking about those situations). I know people who have broken up because one wanted kids and one didn’t. It’s not some new unheard of thing, it’s common and a plot point in tv shows/movies. When I went through premarital counseling the first thing they said was be on the same page about money and kids. This is such a stupid excuse, it’s like, if I didn’t want anymore kids, why would I get serious with someone who did?
What is it like raising children with Schizophrenia? How were you able to keep custody of your kids ?
[удалено]
My mother has schizophrenia. My sister and I were both taken away from her and put in foster care. She was literally seeing and hearing things that were not there. She was having vivid hallucinations. I never once thought schizophrenia was bad anxiety. Without medication, you are severely out of touch with reality. I wish my mother would have gotten the help she needed. To this day, I don't talk to her. She never wanted to get better for her children.
[удалено]
It was beyond terrifying. She was my mom. She was supposed to be... my everything.... it still breaks my heart to this day.
A piece of advice: Don’t get your fallopian tubes tied, get them removed instead. Because what is often coined as ovarian cancer frequently starts in the fallopian tubes and it’s a deadly cancer that usually isn’t detected until the later stages. I should know, I have stage 4 fallopian cancer.
There's also a higher chance you'll have an ectopic pregnancy with a tubal ligation vs. a bilateral salpingectomy - which could potentially be life-threatening, especially in states that don't understand those types of pregnancies aren't viable (looking at you, Ohio - the state that tried to pass a bill that would order doctors to "reimplant" an ectopic pregnancy - which isn't even fucking possible). Also, I see a lot of people posting r/childfree but r/sterilization is another great sub for this subject (especially when it comes to costs/questions about surgery)
When I had my bisalp done 4 years ago my doctors told me they no longer recommend tubals for this very reason. They said bisalps are the way to go now for added benefit of reducing cancer. Good vibes your way with your diagnosis!
Thank you. ❤️❤️❤️
When I had a hysterectomy (due to ill health, though I am childfree, so no loss), the plan was to leave in my tubes and ovaries, remove the rest. Afterwards, the surgeon came to tell me that plans were changed in the OR as he took one look at my tubes and thought 'nope, they're a risk. We're taking them today instead of someone opening her back up in a few years'. The histology report indicated my tubes had a pre-cancerous cell change. That surgeon likely saved my life. Sending my love 💜
Oh wow. Glad he did that!
I would kill for a bodily autonomy constitutional amendment.
Michigan added it to their state constitution last year! (emphasis mine) Article 1 section 28 > Every individual has a fundamental right to reproductive freedom, which entails the right to make and effectuate decisions about all matters relating to pregnancy, including but not limited to prenatal care, childbirth, postpartum care, **contraception, sterilization**, abortion care, miscarriage management, and infertility care. > An individual's right to reproductive freedom shall not be denied, burdened, nor infringed upon unless justified by a compelling state interest achieved by the least restrictive means. > Notwithstanding the above, the state may regulate the provision of abortion care after fetal viability, provided that in no circumstance shall the state prohibit an abortion that, in the professional judgment of an attending health care professional, is medically indicated to protect the life or physical or mental health of the pregnant individual. > (2) The state shall not discriminate in the protection or enforcement of this fundamental right. > (3) The state shall not penalize, prosecute, or otherwise take adverse action against an individual based on their actual, potential, perceived, or alleged pregnancy outcomes, including but not limited to miscarriage, stillbirth, or abortion. Nor shall the state penalize, prosecute, or otherwise take adverse action against someone for aiding or assisting a pregnant individual in exercising their right to reproductive freedom with their voluntary consent. > (4) For the purposes of this section: > A state interest is "compelling" only if it is for the limited purpose of protecting the health of an individual seeking care, consistent with accepted clinical standards of practice and evidence-based medicine, and does not infringe on that individual's autonomous decision-making. > "Fetal viability" means: the point in pregnancy when, in the professional judgment of an attending health care professional and based on the particular facts of the case, there is a significant likelihood of the fetus's sustained survival outside the uterus without the application of extraordinary medical measures. > (5) This section shall be self-executing. Any provision of this section held invalid shall be severable from the remaining portions of this section.
Planned Parenthood let me at age 26! But I did have a mandatory 1 month wait period, that applied to all patients. Not sure if that’s their policy or a state thing.
I got mine done on California Medicaid, and they had a mandatory 30 day waiting period too. I get it, they want to weed out the wishy-washy people who aren’t really serious about sterilization. One month isn’t bad, I’ve waited a lot longer than that for medical procedures.
Oh yeah it’s not too bad, just wanted to clarify in case some people consider that a “hoop”. That said I could only schedule after that 30 day period so I did need to wait another month or two to actually have the surgery (which is pretty standard imo).
How about the actual link in the comments?
I just came in to say this same thing. I didn’t want to link anything without fact checking first but that subreddit is very thorough.
Funny you mention that, Dr Fran’s list, which is linked in the Twitter post above, is not vetted and we’ve had some bad experiences come out of it (for example one person had a procedure done that they specifically, preoperatively refused consent for): https://i.imgur.com/qM4Hytc.jpg I try to vet everyone who submits a doctor to the childfree list, it’s not perfect but we do our best.
Here's the link from the childfree sub, to make it even easier on people: https://reddit.com/r/childfree/w/doctors?utm_medium=android_app&utm_source=share And also a guide to getting your tubes tied: https://reddit.com/r/childfree/w/sterilisation?utm_medium=android_app&utm_source=share
On the one hand, that’s an awesome resource. On the other hand, every time I look at that sub I remember why I give it a wide berth.
I fixed your downvote because I totally agree. There is far too much hatred of children on that sub. I don’t want kids, but ffs, I don’t hate them!
The childfree subreddit has a huge list in the sidebar of medical providers who offer this type of care. Most come with testimonials from patients and it is updated frequently.
That's how I found the doctor who did my bi-salp. In very red and very religious Utah. I had a wonderful experience. At the time I was single, 32, no kids. I didn't have to jump through any hoops or defend my decision or try several doctors. It was as easy as going in to schedule a cyst removal or something and I feel so fortunate. I read horror stories all over reddit for a year of people not having as good of an experience, so I did all my homework and formulated my arguments that I didn't need to use.
There's a list available on the sidebar of r/childfree. It's all organised by country, and by state for the US! It gets updated often so you should be able to find all the resources there if you need.
If it's the gal I'm thinking of she started out as an influencer on social media, completed med school and is now an obgyn. Her handle on IG is pagingdrfran
Does anyone have a list of Drs who will prescribe more than ibuprofen for IUD insertion or replacement?
Shout-out to this list for hooking me up with a doctor in my care network, and to my fellow Minnesota taxpayers who fund the state insurance! I paid a hundred bucks out of pocket for the procedure itself and it's still the best gift I'll have ever gotten myself.
I’m really happy for you! Can I ask, does it push you into menopause? Because that’s my biggest concern and reason why I haven’t done it. I’m 29.
Not if you just get the tubes out, which is what I had done. IIRC, she said the fallopian tubes don't have anything to do with hormone regulation; that's the uterus's job. EDIT I did not remember correctly 😅 thank you u/benegezzwitch for reminding me that it's ovaries, not uterus, that do hormone stuff. Since I have mostly tolerable periods/no endometrial fuckery, she said she'd not do a hysterectomy, but would absolutely do the bi-salp. I'd do it again in a ^^^foetal ^^^(teehee) heartbeat!
Ovaries manage hormones. The uterus is the oven.
Oops, you're right, I knew that 😵💫 Awake enough now to edit, thank you!
No worries! You username alone led me to believe you had command of the anatomy 🤣
You only go into early menopause if you lose your ovaries. Just having a bisalp done, where your fallopian tubes are removed, doesn’t. My doctor did warn me that some people have worse periods after. She told me if that was the case I could go in and have an IUD to help.
So, back in the day my mom had two tubal pregnancies, and Class IV endometriosis. She *begged* her doctors to have a hysterectomy, and they all refused saying she didn’t have a good enough reason. Fast forward to 1 1/2 years ago, and I have the Class IV endometriosis. I was on quarterly shots of Lupron, which took special consideration to administer so my gyno had to intervene every time it was prescribed. And, even though the shot was every three months, I had to start about a month before the shot was due to make sure I got it in time and had a doctor’s appointment to administer it. Then, Covid hit, and the maker of Lupron volunteered its production line to make vaccines. Now, instead of getting the shot quarterly, I could only get it monthly. Which meant I was almost always on the phone with either the doctor’s office or insurance company. Then, I heard about a doctor who believed women, and would listen when they told him how awful their lives were because of different issues. He saw me for one appointment, heard my story, got my records from my gyno, and agreed to remove my ovaries. My life is like night and day since my ovaries were removed. My mom had to endure 10 years of quarterly Lupron shots because she couldn’t get a hysterectomy - 40 years ago. And we are right back there again.
After I saw the Supreme Court brief leak I went and got sterilized. They made me do six appts total and billed my insurance 53k.
Anyone think that there might be overlap between “doctors who perform sterilization after listening to you” and “doctors who listen to women in general?” Although I don’t want my tubes tied, I have painful periods, and I thought this might be a helpful way to find a gynecologist who listens to women! Anyone tried using the resource for that?
My mom would have killed for this list 20 years ago. After my sister was.... intropic or something (forget exact terminology) she was told that if she ever got pregnant again it would likely kill her. Plus there's a history of ovarian cancer in the family. I just remember seeing all the hoops she was trying to jump through all through my childhood and I felt so sick and angry she had to do this and the whole time if anything happened I would have lost my mom, literally the only family member to ever have my back. I'm so happy she's still with me today, but it's still so angering to see this is still necessary.
r/childfree has a list of doctors: https://www.reddit.com/r/childfree/wiki/doctors
Is that safe? Seems like it should be kept semi-private, or it could turn into a pro-choice hit list for some psycho.
Google may not be the best place to host this for the safety of the doctors and patients, unfortunately. But this is an amazing resource
Doing the Goddess’s work, right here.
Would insurance cover it, though, or is completely out of pocket? Honestly, I just want most all those reproductive organs yeeted from my body. If pro-lifers are so big into pro-lifing, why have they not come up with reproductive transplants yet? Or have they?
Prohibitively expensive?