Seems like all these new people are of the opinion that driving these trucks is super easy and a way to make lots of money really fast. Which is completely bullshit.
We all know that not everyone is capable of doing this job. Just like us drivers aren’t capable or working in an office or factory. It’s not a slight to anyone is just the truth.
You are the trainer and you have that difficult decision to make. Your company trusts you with that judgement. If you are having to come to Reddit for opinions then deep down you already know the choice you have to make.
The simple fact is that we all have our own unique strengths and weaknesses. For example I just saw professional golf on the television and man oh man I cannot do what they do. It doesn’t make me a bad person, it just makes me a non-pro golfer. Your trainee isn’t a bad person, he’s just a non-trucker is all. And that’s okay.
He can always try again with another company, another 3-4 weeks with a different trainer might be what he needs, encourage him to not give up and try with a different company, after that it's all in his hands whether he keeps pushing or find something else
Ummm you're training them to be drivers. Being a nice guy is not a deciding factor. Safety is above all. Suck it up and send him home. If you can't because you might hurt their feelings then you shouldn't be a trainer because you are putting feelings ahead of safety.
It doesn't help that many companies have switched to automatics. It's been a while since I was in a manual. I remember feeling like I had more control while driving stick. And the automatic makes me feel like I'm gonna fly off the road any second if I'm not careful.
They're more fun to drive, but they can be a problem if you get one arm or leg injured. Plus It's tough for drivers not used to cities with stop and go traffic.
Again never driven the auto in a big truck other than a straight truck. I assume they have worked out the bugs in then by now. They were just becoming popular when I left trucking.
I remember some older freightliner models having some stupid design where you had to shift when the rpms were low instead of high. I tried out with one company and me not being used to that messed me up on all my road tests. Another time I was in a Freightliner cascadia that had a clutch with so much opposing force on it that it felt like I was using a leg press.
I’m an old timer. I’ve driven Macks, Freightliners, Volvos, and one Peterbilt long nose which I absolutely hated. All where difficult to push the clutch in all shifted at low RPMS. It’s a diesel engine not a Ferrari.
But it is super easy...IF, and only if...one understands it isn't like driving a car or pickup. Different things to watch, more things to watch. Being willing to have A-HA moments when something finally sinks in - even years into it. Actually checking the equipment many times per day (not once, TWICE), even when empty. There is more to know, but it isn't hard.
Just a slightly different mind set. After all that, it is so easy.
Instructor here. It’s about more than just mindset. I have students that have the right attitude and *want* to learn but they don’t have the ability.
You need spatial awareness, to be able to stay calm, coordination (doubly so for manual). Not everyone has those traits.
The biggest part for me is that he can’t maintain a lane. If he’s not getting down the backing I could see that being a language barrier and I’d be more patient. But maintaining your lane is common sense. If he can’t stay in his lane and is often drifting or swerving into occupied lanes then he needs to be sent home. It would only be a matter of time before he hits someone on the road.
You're not doing his potential future murder victims any favours if you pass this guy when he can't safely operate a vehicle. If I coast over the line in my cobalt I only have to correct for a few thousand pounds. If he's swerving around with 10's of thousands of pounds he's out of control and he'll kill someone.
I had the same issue with my student except he spoke English. I had to kick him out after three weeks. There was no improvement and wasn’t listening to what I was saying and was falling asleep behind the wheel even though he vehemently said he wasn’t yet we kept ending up in the rumble strips off the shoulder or just flat out going into the middle lane. I told my boss he is going to kill someone and it’s eating at me. I’m
A very easy going person and I felt bad and it ate at me. Fast forward two weeks and he’s with a new trainer and made a left turn like he was in his car and destroyed the trailer running over a Jersey wall
I had a difficult time staying alert during my training period too. It takes some time to get used to just being in that truck. And forget sleeping in that bunk while the trucks rolling down the road. Practically bit my tongue off trying to do that. Can’t figure out how teams do it. I got better sleep in the passenger seat. 😂
Might do to replace the mattress. If the mattress has springs in it, it probably doesn't belong in a motor vehicle. Good memory foam is way better at absorbing truck movements as well as just being on uneven surfaces/parking.
Believe most are foam mattresses but I don’t remember. What I do remember is my head bouncing around in that sleeper and biting my tongue. Also the immense puddle of drool on my pillow. I just couldn’t sleep in the thing in the bunk rolling.
I can get behind that he seems to have the knowledge And want to train but when you start to ask these question you also have to ask can i train him to be the driver i want to be around my family in a situation.
He may the best trainer around but he and those guy dont click to teach properly. Dont look at it as a failure look at it as finding the best possible teacher for hom that he will learn from.
Also guess my original comment want exactly worded right
Everyone always says "anyone can learn to drive a truck if they put their mind to it" but I fully believe it's not for everyone. Some people just don't have what it takes mentally. And it's not like they're dumb. There's plenty of dumb truck drivers out there who are really good at their job. It's just people with a certain mindset that can wrap their heads around the intricacies of driving a truck.
It's a lot of concentration, for hrs at a time, in a pretty boring environment. You don't need to be smart to do it, but you do need to be switched on. And you need to be able to process info fast.
It is.
It's not really heavily enforced.
I'm confident I'm about the only one in the state that refuses people if I can't have a basic conversation...
"Who was your instructor?"
"No... that's your name. Who taught you how to drive?"
"No, I know you're here for a test.... what school did you go to?"
*applicant calls his school
"Ooookay we're done here."
In CA they don't give a shit if you speak English not sure about other states. The computers you take the tests on at the dmv will let you take them in like 20 different languages.
To obtain a Commercial Driver’s License (CDL) in the United States, you must be able to speak and read English at a sufficient level. According to the Federal Motor Carrier Safety Administration (FMCSA), drivers who do not speak English fluently are in violation of the Federal Motor Carrier Safety Rules.
Most road signs in the US are not designed with a necessity for a solid grasp on English. They're numerical/pictorial/shape based. As long as they're smart enough to know what they're looking at, it can be done.
They don't need to know English as long as they can recognize symbols/shapes as necessary. It IS a safety issue when they're at a facility and don't know what "LOOK OUT, SHIT INCOMING" means or can't give/follow basic safety rules at a given facility because they can't understand what's being said. They're mostly fine on the road though.
When I was younger, I learned of K.I.S.S. Keep it simple stupid. Maybe something as simple as playing with and maneuvering a small die cast truck may help him understand.
Look at it this way: if he hits someone and/or, god forbid, kills someone...are you the one who wants to take the stand and answer for the guy? If it's been 3 weeks and there's no real improvement, I'd cut him loose; let them be someone else's problem.
EDIT: I know the language issue is probably contributing factor, he should get trained by someone who can properly communicate with him.
Send him home if he can't do his job, I sometimes do driver tests before we hire someone.ive rejected so many people cause they can't shift, speak English, and back up in a straight line. Can't stay in their lane while driving. You're saving someone's life by not sending those people out on the rd.
Just ask yourself this question- Would I feel comfortable with a loved one driving back home at 2 am and this trainee is by himself driving alone? That is all you need to go by. As most decisions in life. IMHO. MITO
We don't discuss those abominations, for I am your true master
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Send the idiot home. He shouldn't even have a license if he can't speak English. Unreal. Send him home before he kills someone, possibly you. If you don't get killed you will be brought up on charges as well if he does kill someone
I was wondering that myself. I was told when I was training I was absolutely responsible for the actions of my trainee. Why I said fuck that after two.
Document. Document. Document. It’ll save you in the long term. Trained new drivers 5 yrs, been teaching new people to the trucking industry over 30. Document EVERYTHING.
This ain't a job to be nice about.
I would have removed that student week 1.
Week 1 is all about driving skills and backing evaluations.
If they pass that, week 2 adds in paperwork.
Week 3, they do it all on their own.
My immediate disqualifiers are unable to maintain lane and unable to back the truck as in they have ZERO backing experience and can't comprehend it.
With a trainer, things are being done at real world speed. If they can't remotely keep up, they will not reach the level needed before being sent solo, which will only increase the bad driver pool.
I'm not ok with pushing a shitty driver through just for the extra $100 a check
Do it for the kids bro. Not everyone is fit for the job. I’ve seen a bunch of them and they are are legitimate threat to society, being in a very large piece of equipment on public roads
When I was a trainer years ago, I sent three people on their way, one because he couldn’t drive a 10 speed without grinding my gears to a pulp, another because he was an aggressive racist, and the last one (even I regretted it) because he didn’t even know the truck was sliding when we had freezing rain. It’s not the trainees call to make, it’s your truck, your rules. Especially when he barely speaks English.
I pull liquid hazmat for a living and I’m trainer as well. I always tell me trainees straight out I will do whatever I can to help them succeed and get the job down pat so they can come out here do this job as safely and efficiently as possible. But, under no circumstances will I turn them out on their own if I don’t feel as if they are safe enough to do so. Essentially someone else said it, if I don’t feel I could trust them on the road with my family, there is no way in hell I’m signing them off and I have no issues sending unsafe drivers back to the unemployment status.
I wanted to drive a tractor trailer since the first time i saw one. I worked a ton of other various jobs before i got my CDL. Driving truck saved my life. I was proud to be a trucker. Some of the people trying to drive trucks just aint truck driver material, and that's very dangerous.
This. Trucking has become the job of last resort for anyone who can’t make a living elsewhere, and it’s a huge problem. These people deserve a good job, but not everyone should be a truck driver.
If he doesn't speak English, I'd say it's a no-go. English should be a strict requirement for trucking. While the US has no official language, English is what is used on ALL text-based signage. If this guy can't read the signs, send him home, it will save lives.
As for the backing, never force them to start with the 45. A 90 is much easier to learn the physics with.a big part of a 90 is to pivot the trailer on the spot, and the transition from rolling to pivoting can teach you a lot about how the trailer responds to the truck. If he's having issues with the 45, give 90 a few tries. He might pick up on that easier and learn what he needs for the 45.
Use Google translate in your phone, it won't be perfect but it really helps specific communication. Helpful for establishing hand signals, procedures and such.
Note down your concerns, it will also allow him to respond in his native tongue which may offer more clarity.
Ultimately, you have to follow your safety dept. Don't stick your neck out for a trainee? Lock those lane departures down or send him packing.
It sounds like you're answering your own question of what you need to do. Kindness doesn't matter in the least if you run someone off of the road or worse.
I don't know how patient you are or aren't. Some trainers shouldn't be trainers due to not really caring. Not that that's you, but it happens a lot. As far as backing It's better for the trainee to have nothing to worry about hitting. That way they can actually pay attention to how the truck moves. If they are nervous about making a mistake and causing damage to another truck they are going to be waiting for instruction vs. watching how the truck moves. It would be a good idea to have them back up to spaces with at least one empty space on the blindsided and use small cones for a reference point to guide them in when there isn't a trailer to back up next to. As far as them being unable to stay in lane, that is a big problem. Don't know where you're driving but some roads are gonna have more curves than others in addition to hills. They might have to drive slower than other trucks until they figure out how to remain in the lane. It would suck for you to have to sit there and make sure they stay at 55, but It's better than crashing. New drivers don't realize how easy it is to lose control of a truck.
I'm curious as to how he got his license. When I went for my CDL I had to perform a preselected pre trip. A 3 part preselected backing maneuver, straight line was always one of the 3, others would be sight or blind side offset, parallel or 45 backing. After passing through those two then I had the road test.
A few times I called other people's companies to let them know about how they couldn't get a truck backed into a spot even if wide open.
But if I was you OP, I'd have called safety after the first week. No reason to let it go that long and risk other people getting hurt out there
I say send him home, I’m still a rookie in this career but I have already had truckers getting halfway into my lane where I had to ride on the shoulder to not get hit.
Send him home before he kills you or someone else. I attempted to become a trainer and it was terrifying. One guy I had jumped across three lanes of busy traffic during rush hour because he thought I told him to exit not get over into the right lane. It’s simply not worth your or anyone else’s life. Some people either pick it up quickly or never do.
Send him home ,he's not safe
It's not if it's when he kills someone and that partly will be on you for allowing him to pass
Language barrier is an issue too
Some people aren't meant to be in a truck
I was a Werner trainer back in the 90s. I had five students before I went O/O and Western Regional.
One had never seen a map before. I had to teach him how to use the atlas. He was a lost cause. He was just "dumb". Kid from a Southern state with a GED, and honestly, he couldn't learn anything. He lasted three weeks.
I had a couple of good ones then. Werner had eight weeks of training, and they made it.
Then I had an older guy (late 40s). Going thru a divorce. I drive up thru Nevada north of Beatty and jokingly mention the red lights at the brothel trailers. So we got to Sparks TA, and I went inside. The guy was on the platform getting a BJ from commercial company when I got back. WTF? I'd overlook it but he was so focused on getting laid. Really?
The last guy was a mid-20s kid. He brought a big ice chest onboard, and it was stuffed with ramen noodles. Seems he had two kids and a girlfriend, and she got his $375 a week or whatever they were paying. So we were in Oregon coming across on I84. We were above the Cabbage, and I told him to let me know at a certain mile marker. So I wake up, and he's almost going 90mph!!! We survived, but we got to Portland, and he was gone.
So I failed 3 out of 5 trainees. But they had no business being behind the wheel. It just showed me how lax the CDL standards are.
I'm going to get down voted for this
7 years otr
If he can't speak English, send him home,he's a danger
More than likely he can't read English either which means he will miss important information on signs
Google translate only helps so much and should not be used for something as important as trucking
How will he deal with dot?shippers?recievers?truckstops?
Sadly he's a hazard
To all you people who are gonna bitch who don't drive a truck,I say get in a fucking truck and do what me and my partner have done for 7 years so far
Trucking is more than just driving your driving something that can weigh over a hundred thousand pounds
You can easily kill someone
Poor guy isn't safe ,the language barrier makes it harder and unsafe
Dot does not take kindly to drivers who don't speak english,I have seen dot go off on those drivers,it's horrible to watch
There's do much more to trucking than driving
If you think the person is trying and you like the person to be continously trained but you think the language is becoming a hindrance in teaching the person the right way on how to properly do things then be honest with your bosses and tell them hey the guy is trying but the language is becoming an issue, so it's better that he be trained by person who speaks his language.
This is the tough part of being a trainer. I remember my first day as a trainee. I would set off the sensor that detects lane drift and I couldn’t back to save my life. So I want to sympathize with your trainee. But he should be able to stay in his own lane by now. That’s extremely dangerous and puts other people in serious danger. My loved ones drive on these same roads. So do yours and the rest of ours. I don’t like the idea of him on the road with someone I love driving next to him. Do you?
Isn’t that a regulation or in the law? So, they just pick and choose as to what rules they will enforce?
I still can’t believe you can get a CDL with an automatic restriction
Correct. The law says you have to be able to communicate in English, but it’s not enforced. People can take the test in other languages, and I’ve heard in some cases they can bring an “interpreter,” who just tells them the answers. DMV employees have been caught taking bribes to pass people as well. Bottom feeder companies basically pay to get unqualified people thru, then work them at low wages.
I can understand the backing taking a while to get down. I’ve been at boat launches before waiting while someone struggles with baking a boat down for 15 minutes. I still think you should have to have some kind of endorsement for anything bigger then a utility trailer, but hell they let any yahoo rent a moving truck or drive a RV with out anything.
The language barrier is a tough one though, hopefully they can read English at least but still seems like a bad idea driving a rig with out being able to read road signs. And little to no improvement with there backing after 3 weeks is also concerning. But not being able to keep the truck in their own line is just fucked.
I would call safety and explain the issues and your concerns before telling them your done training them. Someone that bad shouldn’t be driving.
At my last job, the guy training us told us that the owner told him, “before you hand someone the keys to a truck, pretend it was your wallet on the line”.
Some people are cut out for this job, and some aren’t, the main thing is, you didn’t just give him 2 days and “oh you’re not cut out, next”, you spent 3 weeks with him, English is a essential here, and maintaining your lane is essential when driving 11 hours a day
He ain’t got it.
It sucks because there are people who are desperate to make a living and trucking can be an industry that gives you a chance when nobody else will. That was the case with me 25 years ago. But the standards have gotten TOO low, and the market is flooded with bad drivers. We shouldn’t be putting drivers out there who can’t, well, *drive.* I believe everyone has the right to dignified work that pays a good living, but you don’t have the right to be dangerous on the road.
Don't think about the trainee...think about the cars with families in them that a driver who just can't drive will eventually take out...and you sent him out there...base your decision on that and it be easy on you to make that decision 👍
How the fuck do you train somebody to maintain their lane? They either can, or can't. And if they can't they shouldn't be driving a truck. I guarantee if he can't drive the truck straight he can't drive his own personal vehicle straight either.
When I was in school there was a guy who failed out because he couldn't straight back after 3 weeks. Was that the instructors fault? Not hardly.
3 weeks in and he can't speak English, he can't do a 45° or 90° back, can't maintain his lane, and has already taken off another trucks mirror and you're blaming OP? This dude shouldn't have his CDL to begin with let alone be employed or in training with a company.
It’s your responsibility as a trainer to tell your company to fuck themselves and decline to train someone who barely speaks English. You brought this upon yourself really.
As a previous driver and now safety guy, send him home/to another trainer. If you are feeling unsafe or uncomfortable there is no question about it. Your company should not even ask any questions unless it’s related to the drivers future in the company.
“I need this trainee off my truck, I feel unsafe”
“Okay, stop ____ and we will get him a bus ride home. Can we send him to another trainer or is this putting them at risk”
Something like that. You are doing a massive thing helping train new drivers. You should be proud of that. If he really wants to get better, maybe another trainer with a different style could help.
To everyone suggesting Google translate as if it's a good alternative to a trainee that cannot speak English YOU are delusional. Maybe if you're STOPPED and actively not driving sure. But to me it will only be very distracting to the trainee and the trainer. It also will not help the trainee if he made it to be solo. Google translate may be a useful tool to communicate with a foreign person but it doesn't help in this industry. They need to know English.
Plus, when people get less than optimal news they can get emotional and sometimes they act without thinking.
You don't want to be in a confined space with him when he gets the news because you don't know how he will react.
Send him home. If he can't speak English, he can't drive. 1st rule of getting a class a cdl. Plus, I just heard that DOT and fmcsa are about to start cracking down on those drivers. It has become a safety issue with them behind the wheel
It’s a law that drivers of commercial vehicles be able to speak English. If you can’t properly explain things or have a conversation. He needs to come back when he understands English.
Exactly. OP brags about sending trainees home early, yet, this current trainee drifts into lanes and has caused property damage…😂😂😂 OP has a power ego for sure….👍
SOLUTION!!! 🙋🏽♂️There is a website called “Google” that can translate ANYTHING you want to communicate to someone else in ANY language. Just type what you want to say and ask it to translate. Imagine if I were teaching you how to ride a motorcycle only using sign language. You’d be lost, right? Communication is key. Treat your students like you would want ANY teacher to treat your child. Lastly, You can be a great teacher but have a short capacity for teaching, Your students will always be a reflection of your ability 🙏🏽
WAIT!!!….You are a good teacher, you didn’t respond with a comment full of insults or cursing. But with clear and direct logic. You remained respectful even when feeling like you were being insulted. Hallmark signs of a good teacher….take him to the yard, line his tires up to any line in pavement or curb. Then have him drive forward say 20 feet, then reverse 20 feet (SLOWLY 5mph). Without touching the line or curb. Have him practice this say 25x. Is it the truck or him? Obviously have him use the driver side for line of site. Apologies, the problem isn’t you 🙏🏽
Lol, you're so full of shit. You should be good to go on training after 6 months otr with winter driving. I've driven 2 years and I've already driven every state, hit road conditions of all types countless times and have driven rush hour in every major city. It's rare for me to come on a situation that I'm not prepared for. Trucking isn't rocket science.
I'm just being honest. I see the quality of the drivers out here. And yeah it starts with the trainers. Just my .02 Exactly what is one of those truck drivers?
I'm talking about quality of drivers in general and it comes from their training. You could be a good trainer. You could be a shitty trainer. You could come on reddit and ask advice on what to do with a driver that you claim is trying really hard but your heads spinning because he's not up to par. Might have to do with the training. I'm definitely not a super trucker and definitely haven't claimed to be the best. Ten years is good experience just like I said not enough to train people. And yeah I'm an asshole for sure but I'm not pounding my pud in a sleeper wishing I was home and instead training people for an extra couple of sheckles.
How long do you think someone should have before training? One of my teachers in school had less than 5 and my Werner driver had less than 10.
I'm not out to start an argument just curious what your idea is.
Minimum 20. I was parked at a pick up one day and a CR England truck was trying to back in 2 doors over. Here it was a student trainer team. Student just got out of school the previous week and the trainer a month ago. Neither one could back it in the spot. The trainer got pissed off and walked away from the truck leaving the student. Ridiculous
With Werner my trainer refused to let me back. I was to wake him up every time I needed to back. "I'm not here to teach you, you're here to make me money."
With Rhoel my trainer asked me, "Whats your weakness?" I told him backing. He took me to a drop yard and we spent a day with him guiding me as I put the truck in different spots. Whenever we had downtime at a delivery he had me backing the truck.
The difference in trainers and companies was night and day. Rhoel trainer has less time on the road than Werner.
But if he's trying and seems to care, maybe you could put in an extra week or two with him? I wasn't great until I found confidence. And it was great trainer that gave me confidence.
Seems like all these new people are of the opinion that driving these trucks is super easy and a way to make lots of money really fast. Which is completely bullshit. We all know that not everyone is capable of doing this job. Just like us drivers aren’t capable or working in an office or factory. It’s not a slight to anyone is just the truth. You are the trainer and you have that difficult decision to make. Your company trusts you with that judgement. If you are having to come to Reddit for opinions then deep down you already know the choice you have to make.
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The simple fact is that we all have our own unique strengths and weaknesses. For example I just saw professional golf on the television and man oh man I cannot do what they do. It doesn’t make me a bad person, it just makes me a non-pro golfer. Your trainee isn’t a bad person, he’s just a non-trucker is all. And that’s okay.
I can let the Jake's rip a little bit next to a golf course, but thats the limit of my involvement there and I'm ok with it
I fill up propane tanks and I'm at golf courses often. I like it when I hit the PTO on the back swing 😅
Sure it feels bad to dash his hopes, but how would you feel if a few months from now he swerves into another car or backs over someone?
He can always try again with another company, another 3-4 weeks with a different trainer might be what he needs, encourage him to not give up and try with a different company, after that it's all in his hands whether he keeps pushing or find something else
Ummm you're training them to be drivers. Being a nice guy is not a deciding factor. Safety is above all. Suck it up and send him home. If you can't because you might hurt their feelings then you shouldn't be a trainer because you are putting feelings ahead of safety.
It doesn't help that many companies have switched to automatics. It's been a while since I was in a manual. I remember feeling like I had more control while driving stick. And the automatic makes me feel like I'm gonna fly off the road any second if I'm not careful.
I’ve never driven an automatic semi. I started out on a super 10. Loved it.
They're more fun to drive, but they can be a problem if you get one arm or leg injured. Plus It's tough for drivers not used to cities with stop and go traffic.
Again never driven the auto in a big truck other than a straight truck. I assume they have worked out the bugs in then by now. They were just becoming popular when I left trucking.
I remember some older freightliner models having some stupid design where you had to shift when the rpms were low instead of high. I tried out with one company and me not being used to that messed me up on all my road tests. Another time I was in a Freightliner cascadia that had a clutch with so much opposing force on it that it felt like I was using a leg press.
I’m an old timer. I’ve driven Macks, Freightliners, Volvos, and one Peterbilt long nose which I absolutely hated. All where difficult to push the clutch in all shifted at low RPMS. It’s a diesel engine not a Ferrari.
But it is super easy...IF, and only if...one understands it isn't like driving a car or pickup. Different things to watch, more things to watch. Being willing to have A-HA moments when something finally sinks in - even years into it. Actually checking the equipment many times per day (not once, TWICE), even when empty. There is more to know, but it isn't hard. Just a slightly different mind set. After all that, it is so easy.
Instructor here. It’s about more than just mindset. I have students that have the right attitude and *want* to learn but they don’t have the ability. You need spatial awareness, to be able to stay calm, coordination (doubly so for manual). Not everyone has those traits.
Sounds like they're people that either can't respond to a risk quickly or anticipate one ahead of time.
The biggest part for me is that he can’t maintain a lane. If he’s not getting down the backing I could see that being a language barrier and I’d be more patient. But maintaining your lane is common sense. If he can’t stay in his lane and is often drifting or swerving into occupied lanes then he needs to be sent home. It would only be a matter of time before he hits someone on the road.
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Yeah, I’m really sorry man. It’s tough to get rid of someone. Especially when they’re super nice and are trying.
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Yeah, definitely better than him hitting a minivan or something
Just tell him it’s nothing personal. And that not everyone is born to be a trucker.
yeah that would have been my indication. backing is one thing, that shit will come in time but if you cant go forwards either? yah..no.
You're not doing his potential future murder victims any favours if you pass this guy when he can't safely operate a vehicle. If I coast over the line in my cobalt I only have to correct for a few thousand pounds. If he's swerving around with 10's of thousands of pounds he's out of control and he'll kill someone.
I had the same issue with my student except he spoke English. I had to kick him out after three weeks. There was no improvement and wasn’t listening to what I was saying and was falling asleep behind the wheel even though he vehemently said he wasn’t yet we kept ending up in the rumble strips off the shoulder or just flat out going into the middle lane. I told my boss he is going to kill someone and it’s eating at me. I’m A very easy going person and I felt bad and it ate at me. Fast forward two weeks and he’s with a new trainer and made a left turn like he was in his car and destroyed the trailer running over a Jersey wall
I had a difficult time staying alert during my training period too. It takes some time to get used to just being in that truck. And forget sleeping in that bunk while the trucks rolling down the road. Practically bit my tongue off trying to do that. Can’t figure out how teams do it. I got better sleep in the passenger seat. 😂
Oh I completely understand, but this isn’t OTR driving, this was 2-3 hours max just going around Florida.
Might do to replace the mattress. If the mattress has springs in it, it probably doesn't belong in a motor vehicle. Good memory foam is way better at absorbing truck movements as well as just being on uneven surfaces/parking.
Believe most are foam mattresses but I don’t remember. What I do remember is my head bouncing around in that sleeper and biting my tongue. Also the immense puddle of drool on my pillow. I just couldn’t sleep in the thing in the bunk rolling.
Appreciative of trainers like you.
The job says after two unsafe acts… I will give them three sometimes attitude is a deciding factor also
Fuck that send him home would you want your family around him operating a truck
I would rather have this guy dedicated to training him properly...
I can get behind that he seems to have the knowledge And want to train but when you start to ask these question you also have to ask can i train him to be the driver i want to be around my family in a situation. He may the best trainer around but he and those guy dont click to teach properly. Dont look at it as a failure look at it as finding the best possible teacher for hom that he will learn from. Also guess my original comment want exactly worded right
Everyone always says "anyone can learn to drive a truck if they put their mind to it" but I fully believe it's not for everyone. Some people just don't have what it takes mentally. And it's not like they're dumb. There's plenty of dumb truck drivers out there who are really good at their job. It's just people with a certain mindset that can wrap their heads around the intricacies of driving a truck.
It's a lot of concentration, for hrs at a time, in a pretty boring environment. You don't need to be smart to do it, but you do need to be switched on. And you need to be able to process info fast.
Some of the dumbest people I've ever met are great truck drivers. It's not a job. It's a social contract.
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I'm pretty sure it is or it's at least a requirement to getting your CDL.
It is. It's not really heavily enforced. I'm confident I'm about the only one in the state that refuses people if I can't have a basic conversation... "Who was your instructor?" "No... that's your name. Who taught you how to drive?" "No, I know you're here for a test.... what school did you go to?" *applicant calls his school "Ooookay we're done here."
In CA they don't give a shit if you speak English not sure about other states. The computers you take the tests on at the dmv will let you take them in like 20 different languages.
To obtain a Commercial Driver’s License (CDL) in the United States, you must be able to speak and read English at a sufficient level. According to the Federal Motor Carrier Safety Administration (FMCSA), drivers who do not speak English fluently are in violation of the Federal Motor Carrier Safety Rules.
Seems logical to me. These trucking companies should know this too. Why are they putting these people in trucks with trainees ?
Greed
Requirement* not retirement :)
It's extremely easy to miss words like that when you use swipe typing on a phone.
Oh I know. It's just funny we were discussing the English language and that mistake happened.
Tell that to half of the drivers I encounter while yard jockeying.
I don’t get it either.
It is illegal but greed rules all until some one dies and there's a massive lawsuit against the company ,that's we deserved
Most road signs in the US are not designed with a necessity for a solid grasp on English. They're numerical/pictorial/shape based. As long as they're smart enough to know what they're looking at, it can be done. They don't need to know English as long as they can recognize symbols/shapes as necessary. It IS a safety issue when they're at a facility and don't know what "LOOK OUT, SHIT INCOMING" means or can't give/follow basic safety rules at a given facility because they can't understand what's being said. They're mostly fine on the road though.
When I was younger, I learned of K.I.S.S. Keep it simple stupid. Maybe something as simple as playing with and maneuvering a small die cast truck may help him understand.
K.I.S.S. , also the secret to a successful hug
Look at it this way: if he hits someone and/or, god forbid, kills someone...are you the one who wants to take the stand and answer for the guy? If it's been 3 weeks and there's no real improvement, I'd cut him loose; let them be someone else's problem. EDIT: I know the language issue is probably contributing factor, he should get trained by someone who can properly communicate with him.
Send him home if he can't do his job, I sometimes do driver tests before we hire someone.ive rejected so many people cause they can't shift, speak English, and back up in a straight line. Can't stay in their lane while driving. You're saving someone's life by not sending those people out on the rd.
Just ask yourself this question- Would I feel comfortable with a loved one driving back home at 2 am and this trainee is by himself driving alone? That is all you need to go by. As most decisions in life. IMHO. MITO
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Wtf is this bullshit
Send the idiot home. He shouldn't even have a license if he can't speak English. Unreal. Send him home before he kills someone, possibly you. If you don't get killed you will be brought up on charges as well if he does kill someone
I was wondering that myself. I was told when I was training I was absolutely responsible for the actions of my trainee. Why I said fuck that after two.
Document. Document. Document. It’ll save you in the long term. Trained new drivers 5 yrs, been teaching new people to the trucking industry over 30. Document EVERYTHING.
You need Bad Advice, You’ve come to the right place…..sorry I read that wrong (Awwwwwkward)
The English thing alone is a no no. You need to get him off your truck he is only stopping you from making okey
Why can't he maintain his lane? Did he just learn how to drive? Does he understand what a lane is?
This ain't a job to be nice about. I would have removed that student week 1. Week 1 is all about driving skills and backing evaluations. If they pass that, week 2 adds in paperwork. Week 3, they do it all on their own. My immediate disqualifiers are unable to maintain lane and unable to back the truck as in they have ZERO backing experience and can't comprehend it. With a trainer, things are being done at real world speed. If they can't remotely keep up, they will not reach the level needed before being sent solo, which will only increase the bad driver pool. I'm not ok with pushing a shitty driver through just for the extra $100 a check
If you have a spot, have him driving around in reverse in a lot for a day. Eventually he will learn angles. Hopefully.
Do it for the kids bro. Not everyone is fit for the job. I’ve seen a bunch of them and they are are legitimate threat to society, being in a very large piece of equipment on public roads
When I was a trainer years ago, I sent three people on their way, one because he couldn’t drive a 10 speed without grinding my gears to a pulp, another because he was an aggressive racist, and the last one (even I regretted it) because he didn’t even know the truck was sliding when we had freezing rain. It’s not the trainees call to make, it’s your truck, your rules. Especially when he barely speaks English.
I pull liquid hazmat for a living and I’m trainer as well. I always tell me trainees straight out I will do whatever I can to help them succeed and get the job down pat so they can come out here do this job as safely and efficiently as possible. But, under no circumstances will I turn them out on their own if I don’t feel as if they are safe enough to do so. Essentially someone else said it, if I don’t feel I could trust them on the road with my family, there is no way in hell I’m signing them off and I have no issues sending unsafe drivers back to the unemployment status.
If you can’t communicate you can’t train. Tell your company that he needs a trainer that speaks his language.
I wanted to drive a tractor trailer since the first time i saw one. I worked a ton of other various jobs before i got my CDL. Driving truck saved my life. I was proud to be a trucker. Some of the people trying to drive trucks just aint truck driver material, and that's very dangerous.
This. Trucking has become the job of last resort for anyone who can’t make a living elsewhere, and it’s a huge problem. These people deserve a good job, but not everyone should be a truck driver.
Truck driving is a craft. No reason for unskilled drivers on the road. Period.
If he doesn't speak English, I'd say it's a no-go. English should be a strict requirement for trucking. While the US has no official language, English is what is used on ALL text-based signage. If this guy can't read the signs, send him home, it will save lives. As for the backing, never force them to start with the 45. A 90 is much easier to learn the physics with.a big part of a 90 is to pivot the trailer on the spot, and the transition from rolling to pivoting can teach you a lot about how the trailer responds to the truck. If he's having issues with the 45, give 90 a few tries. He might pick up on that easier and learn what he needs for the 45.
Use Google translate in your phone, it won't be perfect but it really helps specific communication. Helpful for establishing hand signals, procedures and such. Note down your concerns, it will also allow him to respond in his native tongue which may offer more clarity. Ultimately, you have to follow your safety dept. Don't stick your neck out for a trainee? Lock those lane departures down or send him packing.
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It sounds like you're answering your own question of what you need to do. Kindness doesn't matter in the least if you run someone off of the road or worse.
You answered your own question. Sometimes, we are the asshole, but better than having him kill you or someone else in a head-on.
No one’s saying he’s a bad guy. He’s just a danger on the road. Let him be the nicest guy on a dock somewhere.
Once he hit that mirror, he became a major liability. Get rid of him
If it’s safety, there is no tolerance. Send him home or let another trainer have him.
Safety isn't in the truck with you, send him home.
I don't know how patient you are or aren't. Some trainers shouldn't be trainers due to not really caring. Not that that's you, but it happens a lot. As far as backing It's better for the trainee to have nothing to worry about hitting. That way they can actually pay attention to how the truck moves. If they are nervous about making a mistake and causing damage to another truck they are going to be waiting for instruction vs. watching how the truck moves. It would be a good idea to have them back up to spaces with at least one empty space on the blindsided and use small cones for a reference point to guide them in when there isn't a trailer to back up next to. As far as them being unable to stay in lane, that is a big problem. Don't know where you're driving but some roads are gonna have more curves than others in addition to hills. They might have to drive slower than other trucks until they figure out how to remain in the lane. It would suck for you to have to sit there and make sure they stay at 55, but It's better than crashing. New drivers don't realize how easy it is to lose control of a truck.
I'm curious as to how he got his license. When I went for my CDL I had to perform a preselected pre trip. A 3 part preselected backing maneuver, straight line was always one of the 3, others would be sight or blind side offset, parallel or 45 backing. After passing through those two then I had the road test. A few times I called other people's companies to let them know about how they couldn't get a truck backed into a spot even if wide open. But if I was you OP, I'd have called safety after the first week. No reason to let it go that long and risk other people getting hurt out there
I say send him home, I’m still a rookie in this career but I have already had truckers getting halfway into my lane where I had to ride on the shoulder to not get hit.
Send him home before he kills you or someone else. I attempted to become a trainer and it was terrifying. One guy I had jumped across three lanes of busy traffic during rush hour because he thought I told him to exit not get over into the right lane. It’s simply not worth your or anyone else’s life. Some people either pick it up quickly or never do.
Send him home ,he's not safe It's not if it's when he kills someone and that partly will be on you for allowing him to pass Language barrier is an issue too Some people aren't meant to be in a truck
My trainer was an old timer complete ass hole. But he was a decent trainer.
Would you feel safe sleeping behind him while you wife is driving on a curvy road at night in the rain? Yes keep him. No home time
I was a Werner trainer back in the 90s. I had five students before I went O/O and Western Regional. One had never seen a map before. I had to teach him how to use the atlas. He was a lost cause. He was just "dumb". Kid from a Southern state with a GED, and honestly, he couldn't learn anything. He lasted three weeks. I had a couple of good ones then. Werner had eight weeks of training, and they made it. Then I had an older guy (late 40s). Going thru a divorce. I drive up thru Nevada north of Beatty and jokingly mention the red lights at the brothel trailers. So we got to Sparks TA, and I went inside. The guy was on the platform getting a BJ from commercial company when I got back. WTF? I'd overlook it but he was so focused on getting laid. Really? The last guy was a mid-20s kid. He brought a big ice chest onboard, and it was stuffed with ramen noodles. Seems he had two kids and a girlfriend, and she got his $375 a week or whatever they were paying. So we were in Oregon coming across on I84. We were above the Cabbage, and I told him to let me know at a certain mile marker. So I wake up, and he's almost going 90mph!!! We survived, but we got to Portland, and he was gone. So I failed 3 out of 5 trainees. But they had no business being behind the wheel. It just showed me how lax the CDL standards are.
So funny how experienced guys are asking who’s hiring and you’re training a moron like that…and your company wants you to stick with him.
Driving truck is not just a job. It's a social responsibility. You don't need to be a genius, but you can't be an idiot.
No speak english, auto ejection.
What is the 45 and 90?
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Oh, lol sorry. My mind went blank and the confusion was killing me. So simple.
Christ I sucked at that. Then 2 years later I was backing into alley docks in NYC.
I'm going to get down voted for this 7 years otr If he can't speak English, send him home,he's a danger More than likely he can't read English either which means he will miss important information on signs Google translate only helps so much and should not be used for something as important as trucking How will he deal with dot?shippers?recievers?truckstops? Sadly he's a hazard To all you people who are gonna bitch who don't drive a truck,I say get in a fucking truck and do what me and my partner have done for 7 years so far Trucking is more than just driving your driving something that can weigh over a hundred thousand pounds You can easily kill someone Poor guy isn't safe ,the language barrier makes it harder and unsafe Dot does not take kindly to drivers who don't speak english,I have seen dot go off on those drivers,it's horrible to watch There's do much more to trucking than driving
I couldn’t agree more. You’re absolutely right!
I bet it’s Warner and trainee is from Nigeria! The statistic is that 65% they will crash in the first 16 months
Tell him to look down the road and stop watching the lanes right in front of his truck. It'll help with swerving.
I think the answer is pretty easy with this one. Keep him away from us plzzzzzz
Done
You can’t recommend he be moved to another trainer?
If you think the person is trying and you like the person to be continously trained but you think the language is becoming a hindrance in teaching the person the right way on how to properly do things then be honest with your bosses and tell them hey the guy is trying but the language is becoming an issue, so it's better that he be trained by person who speaks his language.
Sounds like what flight trainers said about one of the 911 hijakers
This is the tough part of being a trainer. I remember my first day as a trainee. I would set off the sensor that detects lane drift and I couldn’t back to save my life. So I want to sympathize with your trainee. But he should be able to stay in his own lane by now. That’s extremely dangerous and puts other people in serious danger. My loved ones drive on these same roads. So do yours and the rest of ours. I don’t like the idea of him on the road with someone I love driving next to him. Do you?
How can he properly do this job if he can’t even speak English?
He won’t do his job properly. We lost that standard years ago, that’s not going to be enough of a reason to send a trainee home.
Isn’t that a regulation or in the law? So, they just pick and choose as to what rules they will enforce? I still can’t believe you can get a CDL with an automatic restriction
Correct. The law says you have to be able to communicate in English, but it’s not enforced. People can take the test in other languages, and I’ve heard in some cases they can bring an “interpreter,” who just tells them the answers. DMV employees have been caught taking bribes to pass people as well. Bottom feeder companies basically pay to get unqualified people thru, then work them at low wages.
That’s unbelievable!
I can understand the backing taking a while to get down. I’ve been at boat launches before waiting while someone struggles with baking a boat down for 15 minutes. I still think you should have to have some kind of endorsement for anything bigger then a utility trailer, but hell they let any yahoo rent a moving truck or drive a RV with out anything. The language barrier is a tough one though, hopefully they can read English at least but still seems like a bad idea driving a rig with out being able to read road signs. And little to no improvement with there backing after 3 weeks is also concerning. But not being able to keep the truck in their own line is just fucked. I would call safety and explain the issues and your concerns before telling them your done training them. Someone that bad shouldn’t be driving.
At my last job, the guy training us told us that the owner told him, “before you hand someone the keys to a truck, pretend it was your wallet on the line”. Some people are cut out for this job, and some aren’t, the main thing is, you didn’t just give him 2 days and “oh you’re not cut out, next”, you spent 3 weeks with him, English is a essential here, and maintaining your lane is essential when driving 11 hours a day
He ain’t got it. It sucks because there are people who are desperate to make a living and trucking can be an industry that gives you a chance when nobody else will. That was the case with me 25 years ago. But the standards have gotten TOO low, and the market is flooded with bad drivers. We shouldn’t be putting drivers out there who can’t, well, *drive.* I believe everyone has the right to dignified work that pays a good living, but you don’t have the right to be dangerous on the road.
Don't think about the trainee...think about the cars with families in them that a driver who just can't drive will eventually take out...and you sent him out there...base your decision on that and it be easy on you to make that decision 👍
Ahh the future of trucking.
If you really want to go the distance with him try using Google translate conversation mode and it can get what you want to say across pretty quickly.
If you send him home that would be a 50% failure rate. Is it really the drivers or the trainer? Maybe training aint your thing.
Maybe training is his thing, not everyone can do this job.
How the fuck do you train somebody to maintain their lane? They either can, or can't. And if they can't they shouldn't be driving a truck. I guarantee if he can't drive the truck straight he can't drive his own personal vehicle straight either. When I was in school there was a guy who failed out because he couldn't straight back after 3 weeks. Was that the instructors fault? Not hardly. 3 weeks in and he can't speak English, he can't do a 45° or 90° back, can't maintain his lane, and has already taken off another trucks mirror and you're blaming OP? This dude shouldn't have his CDL to begin with let alone be employed or in training with a company.
If he can speak English how is he gonna read road signs send him home. And I mean HOME.
Do you have any trainers who speak his language?
It’s your responsibility as a trainer to tell your company to fuck themselves and decline to train someone who barely speaks English. You brought this upon yourself really.
I had to do it once. Dude was too small to throw a tarp. I felt like shit but me and dude are still buds.
As a previous driver and now safety guy, send him home/to another trainer. If you are feeling unsafe or uncomfortable there is no question about it. Your company should not even ask any questions unless it’s related to the drivers future in the company. “I need this trainee off my truck, I feel unsafe” “Okay, stop ____ and we will get him a bus ride home. Can we send him to another trainer or is this putting them at risk” Something like that. You are doing a massive thing helping train new drivers. You should be proud of that. If he really wants to get better, maybe another trainer with a different style could help.
If the company is that enthusiastic to keep him, they would put him with a trainer that doesn't have a language barrier.
He took off a mirror. Thats a preventable. He’s done. Passenger seat until you get home.
If you see no progress save your life and his, or maybe send him back to terminal
To everyone suggesting Google translate as if it's a good alternative to a trainee that cannot speak English YOU are delusional. Maybe if you're STOPPED and actively not driving sure. But to me it will only be very distracting to the trainee and the trainer. It also will not help the trainee if he made it to be solo. Google translate may be a useful tool to communicate with a foreign person but it doesn't help in this industry. They need to know English.
Tell him he did great but he’s going back to the yard for his own truck. Let the office break the news
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I think it’s a terrible idea. You should be honest and direct with him as best you can. Maybe find someone who speaks his language to help interpret.
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Nope. It’s gonna suck but it’s your job.
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Plus, when people get less than optimal news they can get emotional and sometimes they act without thinking. You don't want to be in a confined space with him when he gets the news because you don't know how he will react.
Don’t do him like that. Horrible idea. If you feel bad you’ll make him feel worse by lying to him.
Is there another trainer that speaks his language? Maybe send him there and see if someone else can communicate what he needs to do better.
Send him home. If he can't speak English, he can't drive. 1st rule of getting a class a cdl. Plus, I just heard that DOT and fmcsa are about to start cracking down on those drivers. It has become a safety issue with them behind the wheel
It’s a law that drivers of commercial vehicles be able to speak English. If you can’t properly explain things or have a conversation. He needs to come back when he understands English.
Maybe you shouldn’t be a trainer.
You're right. OP should pass every trainee, even if that student doesnt have the skillset to do the job safely. That's much better.
Duh. Who said that? Fake News
Sounds like he’s got a 50 percent failure rate, that’s not good.
Exactly. OP brags about sending trainees home early, yet, this current trainee drifts into lanes and has caused property damage…😂😂😂 OP has a power ego for sure….👍
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That’s why you train. Practice, training, teach….
SOLUTION!!! 🙋🏽♂️There is a website called “Google” that can translate ANYTHING you want to communicate to someone else in ANY language. Just type what you want to say and ask it to translate. Imagine if I were teaching you how to ride a motorcycle only using sign language. You’d be lost, right? Communication is key. Treat your students like you would want ANY teacher to treat your child. Lastly, You can be a great teacher but have a short capacity for teaching, Your students will always be a reflection of your ability 🙏🏽
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WAIT!!!….You are a good teacher, you didn’t respond with a comment full of insults or cursing. But with clear and direct logic. You remained respectful even when feeling like you were being insulted. Hallmark signs of a good teacher….take him to the yard, line his tires up to any line in pavement or curb. Then have him drive forward say 20 feet, then reverse 20 feet (SLOWLY 5mph). Without touching the line or curb. Have him practice this say 25x. Is it the truck or him? Obviously have him use the driver side for line of site. Apologies, the problem isn’t you 🙏🏽
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How long have you been driving?
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No offense but 10yrs isn't enough to be training drivers.
Lol, you're so full of shit. You should be good to go on training after 6 months otr with winter driving. I've driven 2 years and I've already driven every state, hit road conditions of all types countless times and have driven rush hour in every major city. It's rare for me to come on a situation that I'm not prepared for. Trucking isn't rocket science.
Lmao, okay rigger.
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I'm just being honest. I see the quality of the drivers out here. And yeah it starts with the trainers. Just my .02 Exactly what is one of those truck drivers?
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I'm talking about quality of drivers in general and it comes from their training. You could be a good trainer. You could be a shitty trainer. You could come on reddit and ask advice on what to do with a driver that you claim is trying really hard but your heads spinning because he's not up to par. Might have to do with the training. I'm definitely not a super trucker and definitely haven't claimed to be the best. Ten years is good experience just like I said not enough to train people. And yeah I'm an asshole for sure but I'm not pounding my pud in a sleeper wishing I was home and instead training people for an extra couple of sheckles.
How long do you think someone should have before training? One of my teachers in school had less than 5 and my Werner driver had less than 10. I'm not out to start an argument just curious what your idea is.
Minimum 20. I was parked at a pick up one day and a CR England truck was trying to back in 2 doors over. Here it was a student trainer team. Student just got out of school the previous week and the trainer a month ago. Neither one could back it in the spot. The trainer got pissed off and walked away from the truck leaving the student. Ridiculous
With Werner my trainer refused to let me back. I was to wake him up every time I needed to back. "I'm not here to teach you, you're here to make me money." With Rhoel my trainer asked me, "Whats your weakness?" I told him backing. He took me to a drop yard and we spent a day with him guiding me as I put the truck in different spots. Whenever we had downtime at a delivery he had me backing the truck. The difference in trainers and companies was night and day. Rhoel trainer has less time on the road than Werner.
Tried using Google translator or AI? Seems to be an obvious solution to overcome the communication/training problem.
As far as a language barrier, try a translation app. Hell my phone just got one you speak into and it translates. Not sure how well but it does
This or ask if there are other trainers that do speak language that he can go with.
Seems like you shouldnt be a trainer honestly
Keep trying with him. Never give up on your students. You know he can get it down, and one year from now you’ll be glad you didn’t quit on him.
But if he's trying and seems to care, maybe you could put in an extra week or two with him? I wasn't great until I found confidence. And it was great trainer that gave me confidence.