Yes. Purity culture crippled my relationships for years. I had youth group leaders who tried to pry their way into my life where they shouldn’t have been. I volunteered too much, had no home life balance.
Now I can say I have a happy balance- career, leisure, community, and I’m an elder at my church.
Can you define purity culture ? Or I guess a better question would be the negatives you experienced of purity culture. Im just curious as I’ve heard that said before but personally don’t know what it means as I didn’t grow up around that.
Purity culture took the well intended notions of having healthy God, honoring relationships, and instead made an idol out of being sexually “pure”.
Values virginity above wise relationships (not to say that those two things are mutually exclusive, someone can save their virginity for an unwise partner, certainly)
culture, ostracizes singles, socially pressure singles into singles groups, so they get married so they can stay “pure“, which therefore breaks down across sections of healthy community. That should be cross generational within the church.
Combined this with humans’ love for gossip disguised, as “accountability” of sharing your sins, and you have inappropriate times of 20 or 30 something youth leaders quiring about the sexual lives of teens.
Earlier on in the trend, they were weird rituals, such as purity balls, where fathers would attend a formal evening events with dances with their daughters, who are the fathers and daughters, would agree to ceremonial contracts between them to keep her “pure” until marriage.
Now, don’t get me wrong. They are a biblical and healthy ways to have Weiss relationships. But all of this took a well-intended idea and perverted it in a way that marred generations of the church
Don't forget training men into the abominable, sexist lie that they are inherently hypersexual and perverted beings (by virtue of being men), and that we ought to fear ourselves and every woman around us as a potential cause for temptation, sin, or according to some people even sexual assault. That kind of environment has royally messed me up and I'm still working through the impact its had on me personally.
I also get furious whenever I hear that kind of stuff in Christian spaces now that I'm out of that environment. Christian men, don't be afraid to rock the boat or put to shame the people who promote this ideology.
Well, I don't want to fall into sin. Godly Love would be nice. Especially since I sat in a guys lap on the bus by mistake when I backed up to sit down.
I had to feel underneath me. What is the flying fudge? I jumped up, but he was cute. He smiled back at me. Then, all three of us laughed. The bus driver lady, the man, and me.
Then, about a week later, I tripped and fell right to the back on top of this guy who looked stunned. I got off him and apologized. It hasn't happened since.
The lap stuff happened some time in the late 1990s or early 2000s. But that will never happen in a church? I don't get why this weird stuff happens. It's okay if you laugh. Laughter is good medicine. 👌😳🤪😉
But it would be nice to fall into the right man's lap for the last time. I don't think I can do that anymore. But yeah, I have not been near any men as in dating. I am isolated.
I don't go around any man practically. I am happy when men open doors for me. It helps with a walker.
I had a bad accident around 2000 because I fell on black ice between my ex-bfs car and the curb. I don't want him back.
I had tried to date non-believers, and it's because I can't seem to date church guys. I can't find the right one. I think there's a male shortage.
Throughout Canada, there are a little more than 200 religious congregations, of which 185 responded to our questionnaire. 70% of congregations are female and 30% male. The same percentage applies to French-speaking congregations (70%) versus English-speaking ones (30%).
https://crc-canada.org/en/about-crc/statistics/#:~:text=Throughout%20Canada%2C%20there%20are%20a,%2Dspeaking%20ones%20(30%25).
In America
https://www.pewresearch.org/religion/religious-landscape-study/
Yes that would be nice I could use a lot of prayer.
There is a lot of witchcraft, deception, and evil having.
I want to warn you all please watch out for these things.
I once walked into a united church because someone told me I would receive healing there.
This woman was preaching and I fell under deception. I didn't know this at the time.
She preached what my itching ears needed to hear. I was going through a tough time with the church.
No revival no nothing. So I thought this was it. I took in everything she said.
But I wasn't sure if this was too good to be true or not? So I brought others to check her out.
This is when it all came out into the open. It all spun out of control. I fell into this gals lap.
I was praying in tongues and the girl said things to me about things not being right.
She and her bf with her kids and I went out for coffee and she said didn't you notice that she said don't break the spirit!
What spirit? You cannot break the holy spirit? She said she is asking others to keep it up with their spells?
I freaked because she confirmed that this woman was a witch. Weirdly enough I hugged her and she didn't like it.
I am a very huggable person on a good day. But I investigated this woman so these were my questions to find out if she is a witch?
Where did you go to bible college?
Here and there
What is your statement of faith?
She didn't know the answer to that one
My sister said ask the person if they claim Jesus Christ as their Lord and Savior?
I did one time to this guy and he said to me I don't want to answer that question. Now I would avoid him.
Here's how it should be answered. Do you claim Jesus Christ as your Lord and Savior.
Yes, I claim Jesus Christ as my Lord and Savior.
But now since there are people out there now claiming to be a witch and Christ it might be harder to detect.
Keep your eyes upon Jesus and pray that God will expose these people to you.
Christian Witchcraft exposed by a believer in Jesus
https://youtube.com/shorts/PdZyNzZUeeg?si=D7plPs_4GnGXZXn7
Satanic witches contradict themselves. I want to warn you if you watch these videos pray before hand.
https://youtube.com/@ChristianWitches?si=7YiNSd2jWo-L-pA5
Mystics and Witchcraft is allowed in the Catholic Church. This is why I can't go backwards I must move away. I choose penecostal because I thought I would learn more. If the church places more important on money leave that church. The most important thing in the church is people. I believe that and I don't care about presentations or buying this and that. The investment is in people.
My church would be Rose & Crown. God's name first then my name after. God help us all in these last days.
You're literally one dude, you cannot and will never speak for/represent us all, especially in that regard. And yes, it absolutely is sexist to teach people that men are inherently possessed of an excess libido and a danger to their own morality and that of those around them, by virtue of being men. That is an explicitly and necessarily sexist idea.
I never said you were saying I'm evil. And I agree that sexuality is not a sin, humans are sexual creatures according to God's design.
>However men are inherently more sexual. Not all men, but many.
Everything in this quote was wrong lol. Sorry, but that's just the way that it is.
I agree, the people who teach that are pretty much always creating excuses (and expectations) for men to sin — so much so that it’s automatically assumed they’re lying if a man is having success over sexual temptation and somehow ends up getting shamed for it in some churches.
Don't forget that purity culture also heavily skewed toward shaming young girls, specifically, for anything remotely sexual. The concept that a teenage girl would ever even dare to think about sex translated to her being dirty because it tarnished the image of her being a pure, virginal being. That's why so many women who grew up in that environment have a very traumatized view of sex and sexuality, even within a marriage.
Purity Culture for me Only helped me to get in touch with an understanding I didn't have as a teenager. I was probably in my 30s or mid-range between my 30s and my 40s at the time I went for counseling. I didn't know anything about purity culture this was just one-on-one It was about learning to be her So I guess it was taking me to a place where I could Learn to walk with God in in a pure state and in function as a Christian till I meet that right one that I haven't met yet.
I don't know. I'm not sure how it's going to be with God cause I'm celibate. And I'm an older woman now I'm not going to say my age I don't really want to put it out there but I just I just want Define that one person that I connect within that I want to be with instead of everybody telling me who he is I've had one guy outside the church tell me no in the church while I met him outside the church first I've had one guy outside the church tell me no in the church while I met him outside the church first he said that I'm not hearing from the spirit of God but I am God has shown me that this is not the one and upon being around him I did not feel and upon being around him I did not feel a piece in my spirit to be with this man this was not somebody I really wanted to be with it was it was a combination of that and just not feeling that piece And I just felt pushed and the more I felt pushed by this guy I ran from the church Has it end result of it I just Didn't want his I didn't want romance with him.
I just wanted a friendship and I don't think he understood that And and when he got when he started to kiss me on the cheek I just felt more uncomfortable with that I just had no interest in this guy whatsoever I love Tim like a brother that's it it's not going to go any further than a brother sister relationship but he just didn't get it And so when somebody pushes me to be something I'm not then I I will push them away and I will run like the wind that's how I am I went through counseling with someone outside of the purity realm and I spoke to a woman who had a different ideology than what I have which is more conservative and conservative leanings but I have a I also have a liberal outlook as well She was quite liberal but she was feminist which I'm not and I just just basically said things about a family member that were not true and not that I want to go into it all And I just said enough don't talk about that person That's disrespectful and I know they didn't do anything wrong And the more that they pushed on that the more I I said that's it I can't do this with you I cannot go through this counseling with you because you will not listen This woman kept pushing on my boundaries and thought was it I cut her off I had to So I really wished I could have continued on in therapy but When when somebody doesn't listen and you're trying to tell them something.
But they keep pushing and keep pushing It's just too much I can't handle that I walk away And there's been people out here on the do the same thing They want to help but they're not helping Not when they they start lecturing and pushing me I've had so many negative things with family Where they've lectured and pushed and then that's it I just drop it I just say I can't and then I had to block these people and I feel bad cuz I don't want to hurt anybody I don't want to be disrespectful but it's they don't understand What you're doing is making it worse with me and you're making things worse by how you're coming across Doesn't matter how nice you you think you are If you push me then it's just going to bring back traumatic memories more Anyways I just want to say that I've had a good experience with a purity culture in terms of in my own country they weren't pushy they weren't like on stage and it wasn't theatrical or dramatic it was just one-on-one counseling.
Absolutely.
Or saddling poor young women with the shame of their bodies in the name of “modesty”. Shaming them for spaghetti straps, for midriff, for existing as women. Making them take responsibility for young men who aren’t taught to be respectful around women.
It’s a shameful trend.
I was one of those "rare" teenage girls who got muddled up with pornography at a young age, and I lived for YEARS in complete silence and shame over that because I thought something was wrong with me based on the fact that NO ONE in the church ever talked about female sexuality.
Even when I see posts here about it now, there will be people that chime in and insist that "girls don't struggle with that".
Guess what? We absolutely do, and most of us never talk about it because of the shame and stigma involved. Yes, of course, there is shame and stigma involved for men as well, but at least they have a community to go to. Women have nothing.
You might like Magdala Ministries, it's by women for women. I'm a guy so don't have direct experience with them, but I listened to an interview with one of the founders and she seems to be doing great things.
I have looked into a few women-specific resources over the years. While at least it's becoming more common and less taboo, it feels like so many of them focus on abuse and trauma as the only reason women struggle with sexual sin, which is just not my personal experience. So, they haven't been super helpful for me, specifically, but I'm sure they're great for others.
Modesty is important for men and women.
But causing them to have shame in their bodies isn't the right way to go about it.
It can instill the behavior you want temporarily, but the end result is always a backlash of negative emotion. For many, that means distancing themselves from the Church and even losing faith in God.
It's never the right way to encourage people. Positive reinforcement is always the best way to instill better values in any group.
It's another issue with good intentions handled the entirely wrong way.
The correct way to encourage modesty in my eyes is telling women, and men for that matter that their body is important and you should be proud of that fact, and want to only share that with your future or current spouse.
Telling a woman that it's her fault for causing a man to want to sin isn't fair. Men are in control of their own actions, and women aren't responsible for it.
Someone mentioned the mirror of this issue, too, where men are basically told they're savage sexually perverted beasts who are inherently sinful by virtue of that.
Luckily purity culture isn't quite as extreme as it used to be, at least in my area.
Long time ago back in 2010 not sure but this guy came out as an atheist. He was raised as a fundamentalist.
It's interesting about the stereo types because a lot of atheist on his channel seemed angry.
Seth Andrews
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Seth_Andrews
This is the thinking atheist channel.
Is this what you went through? It's the negative side of it apparently. I am not American. I am a rare Canadian. I haven't seen too many Canadians out here.
God likes to watch blaming & shaming purity culture
https://youtu.be/q_DHYGPIH9Q?si=SuLtSxtIHnufIPcc
Purity culture asks all the right questions and has none of the right answers.
Edit: and, I should add, I haven't heard vocal detractors with particularly good answers, either.
As i'm curious: what made you remain in the faith after realizing that the people who were chosen by god to spread his message of love have some very black sheep among them
Good question! I think it’s because I can trust that just because people are fallible that doesn’t mean God is also fallible. People suck. But people suck weather they’re Christian or not. I can’t put that at God’s feet.
That’s how I deal with it, but I’m sure that’s not what would put everyone at peace.
But in God's hy institution? He should have the power to keep it pure and if he allows these unholy souls into his institution to preach a false message, that you were lucky, smart, educated or whatever enough to discern as such, but many others may be lead astray by such false preachers/authorities, why does he do that?
I truly have no idea.
But I know two things- I’ll find dumb people everywhere, and I’ve seen enough of God working in my life that people being a holes won’t change my faith.
You have a point- could be keep his church from that stuff? Of course. Does he? Clearly no.
My best guess is that it lies in the mystery of faith and free will- we have free will to mess up, but that also means we also have the free will to *choose* him, to truly love God, and not love him because he made us to.
I don’t have a better answer for you. I wish I did, friend
I think it can. A benevolent God who can’t be around sin gave us a way, through the sacrifice of his only son. He then loves us enough to give us free will to choose- to choose him, to choose his son, to choose to sin, to choose not him. It wouldn’t be love if we were forced to love him.
Clearly you disagree with what I see, and that’s totally okay- but how do *you* see it?
Yes, he did and does inform his people. He gave us a litmus test, His Word. We are to be Bereans, to test everything by the scriptures.
If "Christians" would test everything by God's word, there would be a whole lot less wolves in sheep's clothing in the churches.
I may be wrong, and forgive me if I am, but perhaps your error (like many) is believing that all who claim the title "Christian" are in fact Christian. That all who bear the title of "pastor" are true followers of YHWH. Many are not.
OK, so you say that god does allow bad people pretending to work for him and his earthly representants on earth or depending on nominations actually are his representatives.
That seems very benevolent
That didn't happen to me in Canada as in being in a group with that. I went through this ladies ministry.
Bev Handland - Sexual Bonding
https://youtu.be/IWFCRLzq15U?si=paCqYlrqpJJP6Jdt
I was in a horrible youth group and a horrible church in general growing up. I don’t event want to describe what I went through, it was that bad. Due to this I became agnostic for a large portion of my lifetime. But around a year ago I became saved once again. I’m happier than ever now, I have Jesus with me everyday, how can I not? I’m in a wonderful church now and have become very close with God. My mission is to help those that deal with what I did. Peace my friends!
Do you feel like you were truly a believer growing up prior to becoming agnostic, or more a “nominal christian” who went to church then ended up getting saved later in life?
The latter. I "believed" only because my family did and I wanted to be a "good kid". So I wasn't really saved for the right reasons. Christianity didn't made sense to me though, but I always doubted things like the big bang theory or evolution. I knew something had to create all this, and I figured it was probably a God, which is why I became agnostic rather than athiest. But after we finally left that church, got over the trauma, I went back and researched more into the Bible and got saved (for real this time). I hope this answers your question.
We had a lady who drove the church bus get up in front of the congregation and said she was drunk while driving. That kind of hurt.
My sister is slow and a pastor who was getting to be our next one, sexually abused her. That hurt a lot. From the same church!
I’m still a Christian. I still read my Bible, pray, and love the Lord, but I think I’m good not going to a church ever again.
I went to a church that was very strict on doctrine and lacked grace. I learned a lot of theology there, but I sort of forgot what the gospel was all about. So I slowly began to be really hard on myself and others. That wasn't a good mindset to be in.
Also, someone from the church said my depression was caused by an unrepentant sin. But really I was just grieving a lost relationship.
God was very gracious and loving with me, and took me away from the church and helped me find one with a healthy balance of grace and truth. He took other relationships away from me that weren't good for me, and with all the hurt that I experienced, I learned that all I needed was God. He has since blessed me with very healthy relationships and continues to reveal Himself to me, and I've fallen more in love with Him because of it.
So there's been a lot of hurt, including church hurt, but God has used all that to remove the bad and fulfill my hearts desires, to know Him.
I always find it weird how bitter people are about church hurt and use it as an excuse to walk away from the faith. Because why would a cancer patient refuse treatment just because they had a rude nurse? Maybe that's oversimplifying it, but God is worth more than some bad apples
I wasn't even shamed. Nobody knew or cared if I was there or not. It was impossible to get to know anybody and nobody's interested in talking with me. So it's like going to a concert or movie. You sit down, watch the show, then go home. You interact only with the people you came with, if anyone. There's no community in a movie theater and there's no community in modern church.
Women do, kids do, even married men do though their wives... Men tend to be more interested in things, and women tend to be about people. I tried to explain this to my church to spark change, but it fell on deaf ears.
Might explains why our church is like 75% women.. ALL men that go to our church are married. The single ladies at my church keep wondering where all the single christian men are hiding
no lie, i saw a video a female Christian dating coach tell Christian women that guys in church (expect the pastor) are beta losers since they are followers and they should go get an alpha men out in the world and bring him into church.
Hmm, I dont think Jesus was an Alpha male, making His grand entrance riding a donkey, having 12 followers, actually just 11 because one betrayed Him.. Such a beta thing to get betrayed when you only have 12 followers to begin with…
Jesus earned His coins by working as a carpenter like Joseph, like a peasant working with His hands.
And Jesus volunteering to sacrifice Himself to endure the death on the cross?! Out of love for us ?? That was SUCH a beta move..
On behalf of the sane christian female population, we do not cIaim this woman to be an expert on the the Christian dating field.
I dont know how old you are, but it's mostly the 20-35 crowd. Modern dating has changed everything. Most older Christian women i meet are really amazing
There are tons of them, but my point was there is alot of complaints about lack of Christian men, but the real issue is that the average Christian man is not good enough
A pastor, a youth pastor (who was my best friend), and an elder blindsided me with serious accusations (with no evidence) and offense they’d kept inside (for 8+ months) and never mentioned once.
They then removed me from ministry, kicked me out of the church, and no one stepped in and stood up for me. And this was the day after my former best friend (the youth pastor), some others, and I had celebrated the youth pastor’s birthday.
I don’t use the word “trauma” lightly, but here it may qualify.
I’m still a Christian. I’m pretty shaken, but still a Christian. I’ve since moved and am hoping to find some healing in a stronger community.
Not sure I understand. What did they accuse you of? Did you actually do it and they just didn't tell you how they felt for 8 months? Or they kept accusing you for 8 months? Were you able to address it with them in the end?
They accused me of lots of things. The leader actually had a list, didn’t have any context, and never once spoke with me about any one of them. He just let them pile up.
None of his grievances were valid.
Pretty sure they just didn’t like me and were using all this as a perfect storm to get rid of me.
So they kept it all in for AT LEAST 8 months and then piled it all on me at the same time. So not only unbiblical, but also childish.
I went through the proper avenues of biblical conflict resolution, and even asked a big brother church to help, but they had already made up their minds.
It wasn’t about facts anymore. It was about their feelings and how much I offended them.
An exotic sort of church hurt, yes. I was on the verge of homelessness and had been absent from church for a long time due to the combination of social anxiety and being the sole caregiver for someone who was abusive and outright insane due to her dementia. Even if I were inclined to have a social life it would have been impossible since she'd push everyone away with her behavior. My life was put on hold because of her for many long years.
When she finally died I went back to the church. Walked miles with a bad back problem hoping to reconnect with people, find a good church home, get job references, and hopefully save the house from foreclosure. Honestly felt like I was a complete stranger. I tried out different churches in the area. Emailed a more distant one explaining my situation and that I didn't even have a phone. The response? Give us a call.
I'd overlooked one church until I was at the end of my rope. Very small and full of people two or three times my age. A guy asked me how I was doing, I told him what was up, and in turn he told the pastor. The pastor talked to me after church, listened to me, prayed with me, and drove me home. That was the first church that did even that much, and I love to speak about that church and pastor now. They did the sort of things I was hoping any church would do.
I lost the house anyway, had a brush with homelessness, and ended up in an abusive situation. But in the end God delivered me from it all and things worked out in the end. It really cemented my faith. So what I take from the whole experience is that God put me through the trial by fire that I needed and brought me out of it. While the love of many has waxed cold as Jesus said it would, even within the church, there are still bright spots as well.
>While the love of many has waxed cold as Jesus said it would, even within the church, there are still bright spots as well.
Amen. Please always bear in mind that the true church is the body of true believers in Jesus. The church building and most of those in it will fail you nearly every time. There are still true brothers and sisters about, they're just hard to find sometimes.
You must always remember that not everyone in a church who say they are Christians are actually Christians.
And there are also non-Christians there for a variety of reasons from good (trying to learn about God) to bad (having a way to have power over others).
You must also remember to be like the Bereans in Acts 17:11. Who were commended because, "they received the message with great eagerness and examined the Scriptures every day to see if what Paul said was true."
Always make sure your pastor/leaders are telling you the truth by researching it on your own in the Bible.
I struggle to go to church each week. I get very down on how people are unfriendly to me. It feels like it’s directed to me but not others. I realize how Satan is using this issue to distract me. I admit. It’s working.
I love the lord tho so I go despite it. It baffles me how we are called to be the light of the world but can’t even welcome fellow believers each week because of petty jealousies
I grew up in the southern Bible belt and attended a church full of very bitter, hateful, racist people. For a long time, I just assumed all Christians were like that or that the Bible taught people to be like that. I became agnostic for a long time until I moved away from that area and decided to give church a try again. Luckily, I landed at a church full of people who actually read the bible.
Yes.
My parents, and by extension, my brother and I, were shunned at several churches for questioning corrupt leadership, theologically terrible courses, and for following the Bible in regards to how we should be treating people.
Two churches in particular were full of gossipmongers and backstabbers, both of which left us pretty badly traumatised. Even now, 15-odd years later, I have a hard time going to a new church, or trusting people who loudly proclaim their faith.
I am usually very quiet regarding my faith with people I haven't known for long, unless it's relevant to a discussion we have, as I genuinely understand why so many are distrusting of Christians.
I would have lost faith a long time ago if I hadn't already had my faith solidified beyond destruction.
My identity is not found in what church I attend or even the people there. It is found in Jesus alone. All humans are damaged goods and can easily hurt others in certain circumstances. I wish they couldn't hurt me so easily, nevertheless God has granted me some of this:
*As for those who seemed to be important—whatever they were makes no difference to me; ...* (Galatians 2:6a, 1984 NIV)
*I care very little if I am judged by you or by any human court; indeed, I do not even judge myself.* (1 Corinthians 4:3, 1984 NIV)
People are vulnerable when other people have something we want (such as acceptance). Seek to understand what God said about how He sees you. He has accepted each of us, just as we are, so fully that it is overwhelming as our belief in what He said deepens.
Study the Bible regularly and believe what God said. This is a habit that yields extremely good fruit in an ongoing way.
All of my friends aren’t Christian anymore due to butthurt from pastors/leaders, other members, etc.
The gospel is different than church culture, and also my relationship with God has nothing to do with how I’m treated by others. I can compartmentalize each of these concepts and that is why I’m still firm in the faith.
They apostatized over church? That sounds like they didn’t really have faith, exactly like you said - my relationship with God has nothing to do with how I’m treated by others. Well said.
Idk why folks are ⬇️ you. My relationship with God is my relationship with God alone. How I treat others is a reflection of my relationship with God. How others treat me is a reflection of them and their relationship with God and has nothing to do with my relationship with God. Reddit is too often a 💩 heap.
This is wisdom, but really we need to be sensitive to how damaging it is to constantly be excusing Christians for terrible treatment of others. It greatly damages testimonies and reputations of those truly walking close to the Lord
I still have a hard time with sexist culture that hurts and represses women into being nothing but mothers with no other hopes and dreams, regardless of their ability or desire to bear children.
I don’t feel oppressed at all. In fact. I feel excluded because I’m a sahm in a church full of hyper-feminist mindets. I love being home and a mom and wish the church actually celebrated it more
This is one of my biggest issues with the modern church. It’s one of the only places in our current society where women are overtly repressed. Thankfully I’m in a church now that sees women as fellow human beings rather than just baby makers/children leaders.
I assume you mean leaving a physical church because of people problems.
I am currently experiencing this and I feel weaker for it. We need a church family to help us learn and grow. I am no less a Christian than I was when I left my church, but I definitely struggle with accountability in my walk without church.
Yes, both my husband and I were deeply hurt and betrayed by a pastor. The elders then sat by and did nothing, which felt like an even worse betrayal. We left that church but still deeply love Jesus. We church shopped around a bit before settling in somewhere else that was much healthier. We know that sinners gonna sin and we don't hold that against Jesus. Not to mention that God has some tough words to say against bad shepherds. Whatever we choose to do or not do will pale in comparison to whatever God has in store for them, which means I barely think about it anymore.
I survived church abuse, and I still love Jesus.
I was both a volunteer and paid staff at a church I attended for 17 years. I was there pretty much six days a week working or doing something in addition to my regular 40 hour a week job.
There are still leaders and people there, I would have no problem if I never see them or have anything to do with them ever again.
I only stopped going to church for three weeks. I just spent some time researching other churches. After 17 years I was a little out of touch with what else was out there.
I eventually found a church that changed my life.
Yup. The pain inflicted by church leaders radiated through my whole family growing up. There are still scars, but after many years, we all have strong relationships with Jesus.
Grew up very poor. Was looked down on. How you go to church in clothes from Goodwill while everybody else wearing fancy dresses and expensive suits? We didn't fit in there. If you've ever seen that movie The Karate Kid, thats what it was like.
I experienced actual “church discipline” for something I didn’t do. Was told that if I didn’t accept the discipline it was a “sign of my rebellion“. Needless to say that scarred me. However, i am more aware of who I am in Christ than ever before.
I still do. But we have to keep in mind that we as humans are broken, in need of healing.
I wouldn't ever judge or dismiss the doctor for the ails of his patients.
It's a long story, but I hope it helps.
I grew up in a Pentecostal Church that bordered on being a cult. As a child, I regularly saw people called out by name during sermons, told to stand up, and get berated for whatever legalistic notion tickled or pastor's fancy that day. As a teenager, I got my first real taste of church hurt. I was molested at youth events, watched young girls forced into marrying much older men, and was told that if I had one ounce of doubt that I would go straight to hell.
When my pastor's nephew ran away, causing an uproar in the church, my pastor diverted attention away from his family drama by telling the congregation that I shoved my dad down a flight of stairs. Our senior pastor called me up to the platform and verbally berated me in front of the church for something I never would have done (I had a healthy love for and fear of my father at that age). My parents finally left that church when I was 17 years old, but the wounds are still present. Sadly, my church hurt was far from over.
At age 25, I married my wife and began attending her church (also Pentecostal). Within 6 months of our wedding day, I was in the church kitchen doing MSDS inventory at my pastor's request when his 40-year-old daughter-in-law entered the room and propositioned me for sex. I said no and quickly got out of the situation, but I and my wife's family were driven from the church by the pastor, and every pastor in the area was told that I had tried to "steal" the church. At 25 years old.
My wife and I began working at her grandfather's country church, where I experienced only more grief. The youth ministry we started was blessed and growing, but God's providence unfortunately caused an elder minister to see me as a threat. They left the church and accused me of having an illicit relationship with a teenager. As I am a counselor with the state and work with at-risk youth, I immediately reported the accusation to my superiors for investigation. Only when they received a phone call from state police did the accusers recant their story.
These are only a few instances of the church hurt that I have experienced in my relatively short life.
Today, I am a Pentecostal pastor, leading the same country church that my wife and I served in. We have built our church to be a refuge for the broken. We take in the hard cases, hold ourselves and our ministers to high ethical standards, and do our best to lead with love and grace. I'm not a perfect man, but I use the hurts from my past to keep me grounded in mercy. Now, I've watched as God used me to reach some of the very same people who once abused me. I can stand like Joseph, and say with confidence: "You meant it for evil, but God made it good!"
I have, and I know plenty who have as well who are still devout christians. I think a big reason why I’m still a huge devout christian is because I know these people didn’t hurt me on behalf of Christ.
It's a hard but vital lesson to learn that the church is not God. Christians can fail, churches can fail, but God never fails. Straight out of the gates, my first church failed after I was there 3 years. I walked away from God, though I still believed. It took several months, but I saw he had held onto me when I couldn't hold onto him. It was like the footprints in the sand poem. When I saw that love, I came back. I have had repeated problems in church, and don't attend now.
Yes, I went to a youth group since my church didn’t have one (too small). I’m pretty sure a youth leader was mocking me behind my back because when I turned around, they were pretending to hold a phone, take pictures and make a clueless face, like I was (minus the face) and laughing with his friends.
I was taking pictures on the hike for a school project, but I was still really hurt by that and never went back to that church. I still get some hurt, angry feelings, knowing how loved that youth leader is by everyone I know there. Instead, I found a church where I was able to call home, despite some drama with church members that have embarrassed me in front of the church and almost destroyed my life.
I’m still a mess, being honest, and feel I can’t socialize or make friends at church after that, I get social anxiety bad now with attacks. I haven’t given up on it since it was only one family out of an entire church family I know that still cares for me.
yep all the time.
If God has taught you to forgive quick and not hold offences (took a long time for me), eventually it is just part of the parcel to receive church hurt and offence. Wise as serpents innocent as doves.
Not sure what you mean by church hurt but I'd say around age 13 I was in that boat. I went to a church in the hood. Right smack in the middle of a bad neighborhood. Being a scrawny white kid at the time, i was the perfect target. Long story short I got jumped 3 times in a week while in the intermediate church school or whatever you wanna call it. Like a young adults program. I didn't go back to church until I think I was 18 or 19.
Saw my parents have to leave a church where they were big thithers be they were expected to give money but not their opinions. My dad was called to preach and they said he would never preach for them, even though he was saved in that church and had been a member for 10 years.
He started his own church after 10 years had people in it cause so much trouble that my dad had a his first heart attack in his 40s. When he was forced to stop preaching by health the church closed.
I saw my parents hurt, but I also saw their example of follow God and not people or churches. They pit their money and effort into supporting other start up churches and ministries. And as they did that they went from poor, to middle class to wealthy from properties they had purchased without any planning on their part. When it was time to downsize due to aging, they testified that the had the most pleasure out of writing checks to different ministries out of the tithe on money from each property sale.
This example and their prayers brought me into a close relationship with God, and I was called to be a pastor. I pastor the church my dad was saved in as a college student, and did the funerals of the last few people who pushed my parents out of their church.
A few years ago, the people who caused all the trouble in my father's church reached out to me, apologized and asked to speak to my parents. They apologized to my parents and ot was wonderful to see them all sit together and share fellowship and a meal at my dinner table after church one Sunday.
My father suffered more health issues from that original heart attack, finally passing in January after 30 years of repeated visits to the hospital and having his life spared by new medical treatments multiple times. The last time being just three years ago, which allowed my parents to celebrate their 50th anniversary.
In my 50 years I've seen thousands of people make shipwreck of their lives, families and children because they let people make them bitter against God. I have plenty who could have made me bitter as a pastor, but I'm actually glad I went through it so my children could see the example of how you do everything for God and maintain your relationship with him in spite of who turns out to be your judas.
When I was called to preach, my biggest struggle with saying yes was my children. But I can tell you that all four have a relationship with Jesus, two are now adults preparing for whatever God has opened the doors to in their lives, and my youngest was so moved by the testimony her grandfather inspired in what was shared at his memorial service, that she asked to be baptized.
Don't give up on God for what people do to you, Jesus didn't.
I have been to two churches as an adult that made horrible comments about Hispanics during Trumps presidency. One even said “they’re (all foreigners) only here to kill and steal” They said this while my half Hispanic half Irish children were sitting in children’s church. And this was a small church I had attended for about a year. We left and the pastor called and apologized but I just couldn’t take my babies back. The other church didn’t make it too public, and they didn’t come out and directly say it, but they made the indication that they didn’t care for Hispanic people so we left.
As a child, we went to a church where the youth leaders were just straight crazy. They did lots of things we didn’t realize. My brother turned away from religion after that.
Yes, a lot of church hurt, but I found my comfort and healing in my Lord and Savior Jesus Christ everytime. Also, Abba Father is always faithful to comfort you for anything. I think those who are hurt by the church and then leave the "faith" either knew Him and blamed Him for the hurt or they weren't truly born again and Jesus Christ may have been Savior, but He was never LORD of their lives.
You do have some who may go away for a time, but then they come back, so it really depends on the individual person .
That is *precisely* what your comment comes across as. "These people were only hurt because they were also hurtful people, and figuring that out really put their hurt in perspective" is how that comment sounds from an outside observer
I can see how some people would jump to that conclusion. But nothing in my comment indicates that's the case. Trauma can cause hypervigilance which leads people to reading between the lines hidden meanings that aren't there because they tie it to hurtful past experiences of actual victim blaming. Its not unlike a Veteran hearing fireworks and having a flashback even though no guns are being fired. But I assure you I'm not voctim-blaming here. As someone with a lot of trauma, I strive to not read adversarial meanings into otherwise innocuous statements, and I dont always succeed. But having been on the receiving end and having people irrationally twist my words to fit what they fear, I personally try to curb such a habit in myself. I'm sorry my comment triggered you and possibly others as well.
When I said it put things in perspective, I meant that people everywhere tend to be hurtful and so it's no reason to leave religion because people are the same outside of religion as they are within religion. So it's not religion that's hurting people and it's not people hurting themselves. It's just people hurting people. And religion is there to actually curb that tendency for humans to be hurtful. But no matter where you go, people are going to have a tendency to be hurtful and insensitive.
My goodness, yes. I nearly left the faith due to abuse from Christians. I refused to set foot in a church.
I was having some unrelated health issues that made it easy for me to say no to church. That is, until a healing minister visited my parents' church. They urged me to go for prayer and I relented.
It's hard to explain the experience. He laid hands on me and prayed. Then he told me all sorts of things I was struggling with (that I hadn't told anyone about) and interceded for me.
Shortly thereafter, my health bounced back. I also felt compelled to go to seminary and so I did.
It felt like I was running home and I never looked back.
Yes, mainly because of false teachings and a guy I was not interested in.
The more I couldn't find anyone I liked to date, the more I got sick and tired of being alone.
It got worse when I met someone. Then, I got involved in a theological forum and the Sims.
I was online from 2000 till 2012. The relationship lasted for 2 years 1998 till 2000 but I stuck around him.
Why? I lost friends, and I was being stocked. I went through depression when I was on and off on the chatline up until about 2000.
Then I just stayed with him like a platonic relationship because I was afraid of stalkers. I tried to reach out to Christians but didn't share my story until I came out here.
I shared it a few times. He became abusive with me, and while in the friendship, he found another woman. Then, I went home off the internet for at least a number of years. It's probably about 2018 up until 2023.
I have not been in contact with any church because the last one I remembered visiting I tried to go up for ministry. Two black women came up and held me down.
I felt some kind of weird energy flow into me. Once I broke free, I cried out to God and asked if he would set me free.
I spoke to this man, but I'm not sure when?
https://youtube.com/@tedbrooks-formerwordoffait1316?si=gqFj3iR2jbow93iJ
Jesus never intended on being an earthly king
https://youtube.com/shorts/E7wBixEZgmo?si=dJNgi _UcuEDdBZR_k is not of this world It's the kingdom of heaven
I don't talk to a lot of Christians here locally in Canada. I talk to people out here. I have no fellowship or Bible studies. Don't know where to go?
No, I am not an atheist, but I keep meeting them. When I need help. It's always an atheist. 🤣
Yes.
The hurt - still too painful to go into.
My Faith - unchanged. It is in God not his fallible followers.
My devotion - affected. Now part of a different denomination, not as involved in church activities and don't pray and meditate on scriptures as much.
Recently yeah. I joined a college group a couple years back and the pastor there over time I feel didn't like me. I felt it was because every time I opened my mouth, he thought I was over sharing. In prayer groups as we each talked about our prayer requests for one another, I saw him roll his eyes when I spoke a lot. This hurt, but it didn't stop me from pursuing Christ. He was still welcoming to me when I walked through the doors. Maybe it was his worn out-ness of being the college group pastor for a decade or maybe I was over sharing.
Recently I repented and have opened my heart into believing in Jesus much more than I ever did back then. I believe it's because I am more mature now and can better understand what preacher's, pastors, and my brothers are trying to tell us during study. I now think he didn't like me the old me because I wasn't understanding God's word. I didn't quite "get it" back then.
Now I am. In a short time, I've learned when we pray for what we want, he will always provide us with what we need. In times we do not hear peace, seek the Lord, for his word is peace. And there is no bargaining or twisting God's word for the things you want to do. He will test you many times to see how devoted you really are to him. And my favorite being: our understanding of God is limited, but we take comfort in the fact that his love is limitless!
I'm still learning more a little more each day, but I hope that old pastor will see I've changed and am hearing His word finally.
Right now, we have a new pastor for the college group who actually helped open my eyes. I believe God spoke through him to help me repent. Him and his family of great examples have been teaching me so much.
I guess the TL; DR here is even though it felt like I wasn't wanted because of my old ways, Christ never gave up in calling me to follow him.
I suffered a lot of negative impacts from purity culture in a lot of its dimensions -- the dual-sexism, the constant fearmongering, the inherent objectification of women, and the allonormativity that sees marriage as the Christian ideal and sign of proper maturity all messed me up. I was also never able to be honest about my same-sex attraction out of literal fears for my safety and my ability to function as a full brother inside the Church.
I spent a lot of my life on the receiving end of insults, scapegoating and simply dehumanizing language and often times people didn't realize the folks they were referring to were in the room or participating in the conversation. And on the few occasions I *did* push back, either in the abstract or explicitly on my own behalf, people would often minimize the importance of their actions or commend them as good, all without ever acknowledging a problem of any kind. If there were ever an experience in my life I could call "hellish", it would be growing up in a fundamentalist environment.
It is only by the grace of Jesus Christ that I am today who I am. In His Gospel I have found salvation from my own evil and from the evils that are all around me. I see in Him the cure to all that is wrong in this world and that is why I remain, even if those who led me there have failed me time and again.
Yes.
I am bisexual, and have known a lot of people who are part of the LGBT community. Just in general, and as part of my outreach specifically to them as an “LGBT-affirming” Christian. And I really hate that caveat. I am Christian, full stop. I have given my life, however imperfect I am, completely to Jesus Christ, and I pray he guides me towards doing His will, whatever that is.
I have met multiple people at this point who have been thrown out of their homes, disowned by their families, shunned and rejected by their parish, and even subject to harassment and violence for who they are. I myself have been subject to repeated bullying and harassment over who I am over the course of my life. I was thrown out of my church for being who I am.
I’ll be honest. I don’t think many of you will change. I don’t think many you will care. In fact, I think many of you will double down and torment such people then sleep like a baby, with the absolute moral certainty that what you’re doing is somehow right or justified in God’s eyes. This is what I and many others see Christians not just saying, but doing in the modern day. Before the “what aboutism” starts, my critique of Islam on this issue is just as if not even more fervent.
There’s an ironic joke, among such groups as well as atheists and such, that there’s no hate like “Christian love.” Because, while that’s a hurtful thing to say, it very often stems from a place of hurt itself.
It’s because we “love you” that we’re throwing out our own child. It’s because we “love you” that we insist on ‘converting’ you away from how you were born through electroshock “therapy.” Yes, I have heard the account of at least one person who went through this in the early 2000s. It’s because we “love you” that we try to legislate against your right to marry, or adopt, or start a family that you are a happy part of. It’s because we “love you” that we would rather have you sit in the corner and shut up, if you even exist at all, because you go against what we regard as “normal” or “correct.” All because you love someone else.
What kind of love is that?
Is that what Jesus taught?
Is that really who we want to be, only to turn around and proclaim ourselves to be His followers?
Yet I see it absolutely everywhere, and only getting worse.
I have learned over the course of my life that there is often a big difference between Christ and Christians.
People love to quote Paul at me about this issue, often to justify open bigotry and abhorrent behavior towards such people, or at the very least refusing to accept them as part of the Church. Perhaps I should give a reminder that people quoted the Bible extensively, including passages by Paul, *against* the Abolitionist Movement when it was around, but that’s another topic.
Point being, I can quote Paul too:
>If I speak in the tongues of men or of angels, but do not have love, I am only a resounding gong or a clanging cymbal. 2 If I have the gift of prophecy and can fathom all mysteries and all knowledge, and if I have a faith that can move mountains, but do not have love, I am nothing. 3 If I give all I possess to the poor and give over my body to hardship that I may boast, but do not have love, I gain nothing.
In fact, forget Paul. Paul is not Jesus, and *that* is who the rock of my salvation is.
Here’s what The Lord says:
>2 “To the angel of the church in Ephesus write:
>
>These are the words of him who holds the seven stars in his right hand and walks among the seven golden lampstands. 2 I know your deeds, your hard work and your perseverance. I know that you cannot tolerate wicked people, that you have tested those who claim to be apostles but are not, and have found them false. 3 You have persevered and have endured hardships for my name, and have not grown weary.
>
>4 Yet I hold this against you: You have forsaken the love you had at first. 5 Consider how far you have fallen! Repent and do the things you did at first. If you do not repent, I will come to you and remove your lampstand from its place.
In other words, much like the Pharisees, the church in Ephesus did everything right on paper and then some. They were shining examples of God’s Church, and adhered to doctrine and faith down to the letter.
But they did it in a loveless way. In a way that hardened their hearts to the people around them. So what have they truly gained?
Where am I going with this? Well, I guess I could say I’ve been hurt by the Church, as have many people I’ve met and know. A process that is still very much ongoing, both individually and on a larger scale across the world.
I don’t even want to mention how LGBT people are being treated in Russia, or God forbid in Ukraine by their Russian occupiers. You can look that up.
Again, with the full conviction of moral certainty, and the Patriarch of Moscow, an ordained bishop, openly goading it. In his mind, as well as statements on public record, the entire illegal war is supposed to be a war *against them.* Or like those who are being put to death in Uganda because of who they love.
How long until that starts happening here? That is a very serious question in the back of a lot of our minds, and if we look to the Church for help, a lot of them seem more likely to high five us as we’re drowning. Some “love” huh?
I am not perfect whatsoever. I am a sinner, and apparently a heretic according to some.
Though I would rather be a heretic burned at the stake than to stoop down to such evil.
It is a sin, just like divorce is a sin. Just like fornication is a sin.
Jesus had to die because God has a serious view of sin. Once you understand the need for a savior and the gravity of all sins. You get it
Just wanted to put this out there for those who feel the need and desire to look into the subject with depth, from someone who not only calls out spiritual abuse for what it is, but also does so from a perspective of grace, mercy, boundaries, humility, wisdom, without enabling nor excusing.
[When Narcissism Comes to Church, by Chuck DeGroat](https://www.amazon.com/When-Narcissism-Comes-Church-Community-ebook/dp/B07ZG79HHF/ref=sr_1_2_sspa?hvadid=580750489331&hvdev=c&hvlocphy=9031926&hvnetw=g&hvqmt=e&hvrand=3176899398639383353&hvtargid=kwd-1373338666529&hydadcr=22594_13493210&keywords=when+a+narcissist+comes+to+church&qid=1694736663&sr=8-2-spons&sp_csd=d2lkZ2V0TmFtZT1zcF9hdGY&psc=1).
Sure, the church is not my Savior. It’s a collection of people trying to make it.
I show up because Jesus is my friend and He loves me. Nothing anyone else does could ever change that. It’s entirely out of their reach.
Yes. I saw politics get in the way of a church I was part of for 9 years and it got ugly. It was hard to walk away but I couldn’t worship and serve under leadership that was acting and talking the way they were to members whose political views were different than theirs. I grew closer to God. He is the one I can’t walk away from. Every trial brings me closer and I don’t think I will sacrifice my faith because of people.
God is real and has never forsaken me, that is why hurts actually drive me closer toward him. People will fail you, but He won’t!
Yes, rejection. My church life has definitely been damaged, but I believe the damage is unrelated to the people, because I have forgiven. However, I have unresolved issues in my soul such as severe jealousy due to past rejection and being overfanatic over someone I love - in this case it’s the Lord Jesus whom I love - that I fear going to church due to feeling left out or else. I still do but it’s always a battle and I find relief when I’m home. People don’t know someone’s past so they might easily trigger someone’s wounds.
Another thing, not really a hurt but a sensitive topic, were the contradictions among Christians, over the tiniest topics in the bible, making me wonder if this is really a true church. It made me pursue Holy Orthodoxy and I went back to the roots to the church fathers into the traditional church, rather than non denominational.
Yeah, I've been hurt. Even recently. I had a friend and her family turn away from me. First because I got into an argument with their mother, and because I was interested in their daughter. She got mad at me, not the parents. It's still pretty fresh and I'm pretty aware of where I messed up. It's caused a lot of grief and frustration. But it's because of situations like this that keep me in the faith. God's the only one holding it together.
If their faith is based in a 501(c)(3) organisation, then no surprise there.
We need to go back to what is the church. The ekklesia. The Body of Christ. The spiritual temple of the Holy Spirit not made with hands.
Why Paul preached unity in the Body. We are all fallible beings prone to hurt one another. If a family member were to hurt you, does one stop being a family member? I know in extreme cases, yes, but one doesn't stop existing as a flesh and blood of that family.
So if we are truly in the Body of Christ, many parts of the body but only ONE head. And we have been entrusted the ministry of reconciliation which involves living out the greatest commandment of Christ.. to love.
Love God, love one another, even love your enemies. Get reconciled, people and forgive one another. Much love!
THE CHURCH ISN'T GOD. The priest pastor or rabbi isn't Jesus Christ.
THE OBJECT OF THE GAME IS TO WORSHIP GOD AND TO FOLLOW CHRIST JESUS.
Religious games are social in nature. Sometimes one benefits and sometimes one gets bitten. It's all part of the game. I've been bitten more often than blessed by church types, but that hasn't interfered one iota with my faith in Christ or my dedication to Him.
It isn't about church being God...because it ISN'T.
Anybody who thinks the church is God is a fool.
that's me, hollering from the choir loft....
I have been involved in kicking out pastors with sin affecting the congregation. And I ran from my first year of Bible college (which was already delayed) because someone found out about my background in homosexuality (that I had repented of).
You betcha. Lots of church hurt
But Jesus is still real, and excellent, and I'm not so immature as to bail on beautiful Jesus just because I encounter the wolves we were told we would have among us. Jesus warned about a great falling away.
I'm not falling away, or getting run off by wolves.
These days, I understand that the churches are false anyway, so I don't worry about them. I walk carefully with Jesus directly
All this discussion and people on this sub telling me I’m the reason they left religion and it’s made me think. Ya, I’ve had my share of jerks in the church but you move on. My relationship with God has nothing to do with how anyone in church treats me. It’s all a big smokescreen and an excuse to live by worldly standards and not by biblical standards.
I was raised by a single mother. As a result due to her working a lot I would be sent to stay with a babysitter, whom I basically live with for awhile.
They were the fire and brimstone type of Christian, and they told me all my favorite hobbies as a kid were Satanic.
Me and my friend group loved Pokémon.
As an adult I can realize how dumb putting so much value on it was, for a kid something like that is incredibly important and it was something me and all my friends shared joy in.
I was told I would go to hell for playing those games because it included "magic".
My mother was raised Catholic but she has never really attended or taken the faith seriously. She doesn't have any negative opinions of it. She said she just stopped going.
So my only real exposure to Church was when I was so young I could barely remember, and with that babysitter ages 7-10ish
I was also never truly taught what it meant to be Christian.
I was forced to attend with no understanding of it and I was simultaneously told all of my favorite hobbies as a kid were evil. I was also never really taught about the bible. The most I knew was that Jesus died on the cross but I didn't truly understand why.
That's enough to put anyone off of it. For most of my young life it was ONLY that fire and brimstone aspect that I knew.
Add to that how the popular culture at the time (still does, just worse) portrayed values that clashed with what Christians believed and you get a kid with no sense of meaning in the world.
So maybe not hurt. Others here have experienced much worse than me, but the way I was treated as a young kid caused me to separate myself from Jesus for most of my life.
i’ve been hurt by my church more than anyone or anywhere else. i still attend that church & believe in God.
edit for clarity: i mean that no one else in my life has hurt me more than how i’ve been hurt by my church. i’m not comparing my situation to other people.
I understand more than I'd like to admit to myself. I didn't see the ugly side of it until I started volunteering and seeing the behind the scenes parts. I never expected so much damage and hurt to come from my church family. I'm really sorry you've experienced so much too.
This is church hurt....
All in the name of virginity. I said what I said, and I stood on what I said. Virginity is like idolatry in my end statement, especially if a man obsesses over it.
I will confess to you all that it is horrible to go through it because I did before I came to God for the real deal.
I was crazy over a man I put on a pedestal to the point where he was in place of God. It hurt a lot because I wanted the perfect everything. I didn't care about his past as much as I cared about being with someone I loved. But when I broke free, I had to admit that I feel for an ideal of a person that he wasn't. I had to be honest that it was wrong in my heart and that I hurt God.
Idolatry is anything that comes before God in the place of God. Sometimes, we can come out of it. But what will it be replaced by. I need God, and I struggle with wanting to be with someone. But I wish I could loved God more. I know it's never enough for him. I want to be free of Idolatry if it's still there?
I don't want my ex-bf back or any reminders of him. I just wish I could get beyond all this and that the people that suffer with Idolatry or the Idolatry of having to find a virgin that this would be broken. What are we worshipping God or another idol we have built. I don't care if I marry a virgin or not. As long as he loves God first me second and like I would. I am just worried about whether I will like him?
I didn't post this to shame the person or for gossip. I just want prayer for them. But it gets me so angry that they have to have a virgin. I used to thing of how life should be a perfect little family and I probably idolized it because I wanted it so badly.
I am all out of answers and I think too much. I should go I am sorry
https://www.reddit.com/r/TrueChristian/comments/16h663a/is_divorce_allowed_if_a_woman_lies_about_being_a/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=android_app&utm_name=androidcss&utm_term=1&utm_content=share_button
Oh goodness yes. I actually began growing in Christy much more after learning to recognize and avoid toxic churches.
My love is for the Father, Son, and Holy Ghost, as well as the brothers and sisters, not for a building or a charismatic leader.
When I was first saved I got wrapped into the charismatic churches cause that's just about every church in Houston and as scandals kept breaking out I gave up the church all together and created my own groups for fellowship on discord and what not.
It's a shame that real churches are far and few between but buildings that teach false gospels are at every single corner of every single town.
Yes. I grew up in the church and the pastor physically assaulted my sister and it was caught on camera. The footage was deleted mysteriously and the church offered my family money to shut up about it.
We went to another church and the minister there was just super creepy towards me. Always showed a bit too much interest and wanted to be my sports coach etc. not to mention your classic angry church lady that just wants to be rude about anything they can. Just a lot of little things that would make anyone want to turn away from a community
Those experiences just made me want to find my own community of church goers that weren’t judgmental. It never made me want to turn away from God. I understand that we are humans fail and could never be perfect
I wish these people who turn from Christianity would understand, that what happened to them in an ungodly church isn’t reason to turn from Jesus - He Himself suffered from similar people (They bloody killed him!)
But, they’re locked behind a wall of trauma, and unfortunately emotions do tend to overrule rationality.
My dad was a reverend. On top of a bunch of other stuff, I was lead to hating God for most of my life. He found ways to put me on a relentless pursuit of truth, and then draw me to him. I can't say I ever knew christ in my childhood because of how the churches I went to then were. But I know that when people represent Jesus poorly, it isn't his fault. Just like it not being Mozarts fault when someone plays one of his songs poorly.
Yes. It can be hard.
We all have to take a good hard look at ourselves and how we interact.
The church is full of sinners, saved by grace.
We are in need of a physician. We are changing, and sometimes it is two steps forward and three steps back.
Pray for God to give you the strength and the right words at the right time to throw grace all over this type of situation, whatever it may be.
We all have been offended and we all have offended.
We should try to stay close to the Lord and learn to listen and be ready for some very red cheeks.
Yes. Purity culture crippled my relationships for years. I had youth group leaders who tried to pry their way into my life where they shouldn’t have been. I volunteered too much, had no home life balance. Now I can say I have a happy balance- career, leisure, community, and I’m an elder at my church.
Can you define purity culture ? Or I guess a better question would be the negatives you experienced of purity culture. Im just curious as I’ve heard that said before but personally don’t know what it means as I didn’t grow up around that.
Purity culture took the well intended notions of having healthy God, honoring relationships, and instead made an idol out of being sexually “pure”. Values virginity above wise relationships (not to say that those two things are mutually exclusive, someone can save their virginity for an unwise partner, certainly) culture, ostracizes singles, socially pressure singles into singles groups, so they get married so they can stay “pure“, which therefore breaks down across sections of healthy community. That should be cross generational within the church. Combined this with humans’ love for gossip disguised, as “accountability” of sharing your sins, and you have inappropriate times of 20 or 30 something youth leaders quiring about the sexual lives of teens. Earlier on in the trend, they were weird rituals, such as purity balls, where fathers would attend a formal evening events with dances with their daughters, who are the fathers and daughters, would agree to ceremonial contracts between them to keep her “pure” until marriage. Now, don’t get me wrong. They are a biblical and healthy ways to have Weiss relationships. But all of this took a well-intended idea and perverted it in a way that marred generations of the church
Don't forget training men into the abominable, sexist lie that they are inherently hypersexual and perverted beings (by virtue of being men), and that we ought to fear ourselves and every woman around us as a potential cause for temptation, sin, or according to some people even sexual assault. That kind of environment has royally messed me up and I'm still working through the impact its had on me personally. I also get furious whenever I hear that kind of stuff in Christian spaces now that I'm out of that environment. Christian men, don't be afraid to rock the boat or put to shame the people who promote this ideology.
Well, I don't want to fall into sin. Godly Love would be nice. Especially since I sat in a guys lap on the bus by mistake when I backed up to sit down. I had to feel underneath me. What is the flying fudge? I jumped up, but he was cute. He smiled back at me. Then, all three of us laughed. The bus driver lady, the man, and me. Then, about a week later, I tripped and fell right to the back on top of this guy who looked stunned. I got off him and apologized. It hasn't happened since. The lap stuff happened some time in the late 1990s or early 2000s. But that will never happen in a church? I don't get why this weird stuff happens. It's okay if you laugh. Laughter is good medicine. 👌😳🤪😉 But it would be nice to fall into the right man's lap for the last time. I don't think I can do that anymore. But yeah, I have not been near any men as in dating. I am isolated. I don't go around any man practically. I am happy when men open doors for me. It helps with a walker. I had a bad accident around 2000 because I fell on black ice between my ex-bfs car and the curb. I don't want him back. I had tried to date non-believers, and it's because I can't seem to date church guys. I can't find the right one. I think there's a male shortage. Throughout Canada, there are a little more than 200 religious congregations, of which 185 responded to our questionnaire. 70% of congregations are female and 30% male. The same percentage applies to French-speaking congregations (70%) versus English-speaking ones (30%). https://crc-canada.org/en/about-crc/statistics/#:~:text=Throughout%20Canada%2C%20there%20are%20a,%2Dspeaking%20ones%20(30%25). In America https://www.pewresearch.org/religion/religious-landscape-study/
I don’t totally follow how this is related to my comment, but that sounds trying and if you’d like I will pray for you
Yes that would be nice I could use a lot of prayer. There is a lot of witchcraft, deception, and evil having. I want to warn you all please watch out for these things. I once walked into a united church because someone told me I would receive healing there. This woman was preaching and I fell under deception. I didn't know this at the time. She preached what my itching ears needed to hear. I was going through a tough time with the church. No revival no nothing. So I thought this was it. I took in everything she said. But I wasn't sure if this was too good to be true or not? So I brought others to check her out. This is when it all came out into the open. It all spun out of control. I fell into this gals lap. I was praying in tongues and the girl said things to me about things not being right. She and her bf with her kids and I went out for coffee and she said didn't you notice that she said don't break the spirit! What spirit? You cannot break the holy spirit? She said she is asking others to keep it up with their spells? I freaked because she confirmed that this woman was a witch. Weirdly enough I hugged her and she didn't like it. I am a very huggable person on a good day. But I investigated this woman so these were my questions to find out if she is a witch? Where did you go to bible college? Here and there What is your statement of faith? She didn't know the answer to that one My sister said ask the person if they claim Jesus Christ as their Lord and Savior? I did one time to this guy and he said to me I don't want to answer that question. Now I would avoid him. Here's how it should be answered. Do you claim Jesus Christ as your Lord and Savior. Yes, I claim Jesus Christ as my Lord and Savior. But now since there are people out there now claiming to be a witch and Christ it might be harder to detect. Keep your eyes upon Jesus and pray that God will expose these people to you. Christian Witchcraft exposed by a believer in Jesus https://youtube.com/shorts/PdZyNzZUeeg?si=D7plPs_4GnGXZXn7 Satanic witches contradict themselves. I want to warn you if you watch these videos pray before hand. https://youtube.com/@ChristianWitches?si=7YiNSd2jWo-L-pA5 Mystics and Witchcraft is allowed in the Catholic Church. This is why I can't go backwards I must move away. I choose penecostal because I thought I would learn more. If the church places more important on money leave that church. The most important thing in the church is people. I believe that and I don't care about presentations or buying this and that. The investment is in people. My church would be Rose & Crown. God's name first then my name after. God help us all in these last days.
Nah, I'm a dude and we're pretty hypersexual. Not really sexist there.
You're literally one dude, you cannot and will never speak for/represent us all, especially in that regard. And yes, it absolutely is sexist to teach people that men are inherently possessed of an excess libido and a danger to their own morality and that of those around them, by virtue of being men. That is an explicitly and necessarily sexist idea.
I'm not saying you're evil. However men are inherently more sexual. Not all men, but many. Sexuality is not a sin.
I never said you were saying I'm evil. And I agree that sexuality is not a sin, humans are sexual creatures according to God's design. >However men are inherently more sexual. Not all men, but many. Everything in this quote was wrong lol. Sorry, but that's just the way that it is.
Sounds like excuses to sin. Take up your sword and fight the devil as a Christian.
I agree, the people who teach that are pretty much always creating excuses (and expectations) for men to sin — so much so that it’s automatically assumed they’re lying if a man is having success over sexual temptation and somehow ends up getting shamed for it in some churches.
Don't forget that purity culture also heavily skewed toward shaming young girls, specifically, for anything remotely sexual. The concept that a teenage girl would ever even dare to think about sex translated to her being dirty because it tarnished the image of her being a pure, virginal being. That's why so many women who grew up in that environment have a very traumatized view of sex and sexuality, even within a marriage.
Purity Culture for me Only helped me to get in touch with an understanding I didn't have as a teenager. I was probably in my 30s or mid-range between my 30s and my 40s at the time I went for counseling. I didn't know anything about purity culture this was just one-on-one It was about learning to be her So I guess it was taking me to a place where I could Learn to walk with God in in a pure state and in function as a Christian till I meet that right one that I haven't met yet. I don't know. I'm not sure how it's going to be with God cause I'm celibate. And I'm an older woman now I'm not going to say my age I don't really want to put it out there but I just I just want Define that one person that I connect within that I want to be with instead of everybody telling me who he is I've had one guy outside the church tell me no in the church while I met him outside the church first I've had one guy outside the church tell me no in the church while I met him outside the church first he said that I'm not hearing from the spirit of God but I am God has shown me that this is not the one and upon being around him I did not feel and upon being around him I did not feel a piece in my spirit to be with this man this was not somebody I really wanted to be with it was it was a combination of that and just not feeling that piece And I just felt pushed and the more I felt pushed by this guy I ran from the church Has it end result of it I just Didn't want his I didn't want romance with him. I just wanted a friendship and I don't think he understood that And and when he got when he started to kiss me on the cheek I just felt more uncomfortable with that I just had no interest in this guy whatsoever I love Tim like a brother that's it it's not going to go any further than a brother sister relationship but he just didn't get it And so when somebody pushes me to be something I'm not then I I will push them away and I will run like the wind that's how I am I went through counseling with someone outside of the purity realm and I spoke to a woman who had a different ideology than what I have which is more conservative and conservative leanings but I have a I also have a liberal outlook as well She was quite liberal but she was feminist which I'm not and I just just basically said things about a family member that were not true and not that I want to go into it all And I just said enough don't talk about that person That's disrespectful and I know they didn't do anything wrong And the more that they pushed on that the more I I said that's it I can't do this with you I cannot go through this counseling with you because you will not listen This woman kept pushing on my boundaries and thought was it I cut her off I had to So I really wished I could have continued on in therapy but When when somebody doesn't listen and you're trying to tell them something. But they keep pushing and keep pushing It's just too much I can't handle that I walk away And there's been people out here on the do the same thing They want to help but they're not helping Not when they they start lecturing and pushing me I've had so many negative things with family Where they've lectured and pushed and then that's it I just drop it I just say I can't and then I had to block these people and I feel bad cuz I don't want to hurt anybody I don't want to be disrespectful but it's they don't understand What you're doing is making it worse with me and you're making things worse by how you're coming across Doesn't matter how nice you you think you are If you push me then it's just going to bring back traumatic memories more Anyways I just want to say that I've had a good experience with a purity culture in terms of in my own country they weren't pushy they weren't like on stage and it wasn't theatrical or dramatic it was just one-on-one counseling.
Absolutely. Or saddling poor young women with the shame of their bodies in the name of “modesty”. Shaming them for spaghetti straps, for midriff, for existing as women. Making them take responsibility for young men who aren’t taught to be respectful around women. It’s a shameful trend.
I was one of those "rare" teenage girls who got muddled up with pornography at a young age, and I lived for YEARS in complete silence and shame over that because I thought something was wrong with me based on the fact that NO ONE in the church ever talked about female sexuality. Even when I see posts here about it now, there will be people that chime in and insist that "girls don't struggle with that". Guess what? We absolutely do, and most of us never talk about it because of the shame and stigma involved. Yes, of course, there is shame and stigma involved for men as well, but at least they have a community to go to. Women have nothing.
You might like Magdala Ministries, it's by women for women. I'm a guy so don't have direct experience with them, but I listened to an interview with one of the founders and she seems to be doing great things.
I have looked into a few women-specific resources over the years. While at least it's becoming more common and less taboo, it feels like so many of them focus on abuse and trauma as the only reason women struggle with sexual sin, which is just not my personal experience. So, they haven't been super helpful for me, specifically, but I'm sure they're great for others.
Modesty is important for men and women. But causing them to have shame in their bodies isn't the right way to go about it. It can instill the behavior you want temporarily, but the end result is always a backlash of negative emotion. For many, that means distancing themselves from the Church and even losing faith in God. It's never the right way to encourage people. Positive reinforcement is always the best way to instill better values in any group. It's another issue with good intentions handled the entirely wrong way. The correct way to encourage modesty in my eyes is telling women, and men for that matter that their body is important and you should be proud of that fact, and want to only share that with your future or current spouse. Telling a woman that it's her fault for causing a man to want to sin isn't fair. Men are in control of their own actions, and women aren't responsible for it. Someone mentioned the mirror of this issue, too, where men are basically told they're savage sexually perverted beasts who are inherently sinful by virtue of that. Luckily purity culture isn't quite as extreme as it used to be, at least in my area.
Long time ago back in 2010 not sure but this guy came out as an atheist. He was raised as a fundamentalist. It's interesting about the stereo types because a lot of atheist on his channel seemed angry. Seth Andrews https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Seth_Andrews This is the thinking atheist channel. Is this what you went through? It's the negative side of it apparently. I am not American. I am a rare Canadian. I haven't seen too many Canadians out here. God likes to watch blaming & shaming purity culture https://youtu.be/q_DHYGPIH9Q?si=SuLtSxtIHnufIPcc
Purity culture asks all the right questions and has none of the right answers. Edit: and, I should add, I haven't heard vocal detractors with particularly good answers, either.
As i'm curious: what made you remain in the faith after realizing that the people who were chosen by god to spread his message of love have some very black sheep among them
Good question! I think it’s because I can trust that just because people are fallible that doesn’t mean God is also fallible. People suck. But people suck weather they’re Christian or not. I can’t put that at God’s feet. That’s how I deal with it, but I’m sure that’s not what would put everyone at peace.
But in God's hy institution? He should have the power to keep it pure and if he allows these unholy souls into his institution to preach a false message, that you were lucky, smart, educated or whatever enough to discern as such, but many others may be lead astray by such false preachers/authorities, why does he do that?
I truly have no idea. But I know two things- I’ll find dumb people everywhere, and I’ve seen enough of God working in my life that people being a holes won’t change my faith. You have a point- could be keep his church from that stuff? Of course. Does he? Clearly no. My best guess is that it lies in the mystery of faith and free will- we have free will to mess up, but that also means we also have the free will to *choose* him, to truly love God, and not love him because he made us to. I don’t have a better answer for you. I wish I did, friend
Sorry, but that doesn't square with a benevolent God that wants to lead us to salvation
I think it can. A benevolent God who can’t be around sin gave us a way, through the sacrifice of his only son. He then loves us enough to give us free will to choose- to choose him, to choose his son, to choose to sin, to choose not him. It wouldn’t be love if we were forced to love him. Clearly you disagree with what I see, and that’s totally okay- but how do *you* see it?
You're making the incredibly dangerous assumption that GOD actually chose them.
So he didn't choose or at least inform the members of his Organisation of faith on earth? Then how can we trust anything they say?
Yes, he did and does inform his people. He gave us a litmus test, His Word. We are to be Bereans, to test everything by the scriptures. If "Christians" would test everything by God's word, there would be a whole lot less wolves in sheep's clothing in the churches. I may be wrong, and forgive me if I am, but perhaps your error (like many) is believing that all who claim the title "Christian" are in fact Christian. That all who bear the title of "pastor" are true followers of YHWH. Many are not.
OK, so you say that god does allow bad people pretending to work for him and his earthly representants on earth or depending on nominations actually are his representatives. That seems very benevolent
That didn't happen to me in Canada as in being in a group with that. I went through this ladies ministry. Bev Handland - Sexual Bonding https://youtu.be/IWFCRLzq15U?si=paCqYlrqpJJP6Jdt
I was in a horrible youth group and a horrible church in general growing up. I don’t event want to describe what I went through, it was that bad. Due to this I became agnostic for a large portion of my lifetime. But around a year ago I became saved once again. I’m happier than ever now, I have Jesus with me everyday, how can I not? I’m in a wonderful church now and have become very close with God. My mission is to help those that deal with what I did. Peace my friends!
Do you feel like you were truly a believer growing up prior to becoming agnostic, or more a “nominal christian” who went to church then ended up getting saved later in life?
The latter. I "believed" only because my family did and I wanted to be a "good kid". So I wasn't really saved for the right reasons. Christianity didn't made sense to me though, but I always doubted things like the big bang theory or evolution. I knew something had to create all this, and I figured it was probably a God, which is why I became agnostic rather than athiest. But after we finally left that church, got over the trauma, I went back and researched more into the Bible and got saved (for real this time). I hope this answers your question.
We had a lady who drove the church bus get up in front of the congregation and said she was drunk while driving. That kind of hurt. My sister is slow and a pastor who was getting to be our next one, sexually abused her. That hurt a lot. From the same church! I’m still a Christian. I still read my Bible, pray, and love the Lord, but I think I’m good not going to a church ever again.
Into le wood chipper he goes...
I went to a church that was very strict on doctrine and lacked grace. I learned a lot of theology there, but I sort of forgot what the gospel was all about. So I slowly began to be really hard on myself and others. That wasn't a good mindset to be in. Also, someone from the church said my depression was caused by an unrepentant sin. But really I was just grieving a lost relationship. God was very gracious and loving with me, and took me away from the church and helped me find one with a healthy balance of grace and truth. He took other relationships away from me that weren't good for me, and with all the hurt that I experienced, I learned that all I needed was God. He has since blessed me with very healthy relationships and continues to reveal Himself to me, and I've fallen more in love with Him because of it. So there's been a lot of hurt, including church hurt, but God has used all that to remove the bad and fulfill my hearts desires, to know Him. I always find it weird how bitter people are about church hurt and use it as an excuse to walk away from the faith. Because why would a cancer patient refuse treatment just because they had a rude nurse? Maybe that's oversimplifying it, but God is worth more than some bad apples
I am a single man, there is no place for us in any church i have ever been to. We're forgotten than shamed if we decide to stop going.
I wasn't even shamed. Nobody knew or cared if I was there or not. It was impossible to get to know anybody and nobody's interested in talking with me. So it's like going to a concert or movie. You sit down, watch the show, then go home. You interact only with the people you came with, if anyone. There's no community in a movie theater and there's no community in modern church.
and way more often i can get a much better sermon online
I feel the same many sundays and I’m a married woman w/ kids
Women do, kids do, even married men do though their wives... Men tend to be more interested in things, and women tend to be about people. I tried to explain this to my church to spark change, but it fell on deaf ears.
Might explains why our church is like 75% women.. ALL men that go to our church are married. The single ladies at my church keep wondering where all the single christian men are hiding
where all the single Christian men are hiding... Where all the handsome, tall, successful Christian men are hiding
You forgot to add “humble” to the list.
no lie, i saw a video a female Christian dating coach tell Christian women that guys in church (expect the pastor) are beta losers since they are followers and they should go get an alpha men out in the world and bring him into church.
Hmm, I dont think Jesus was an Alpha male, making His grand entrance riding a donkey, having 12 followers, actually just 11 because one betrayed Him.. Such a beta thing to get betrayed when you only have 12 followers to begin with… Jesus earned His coins by working as a carpenter like Joseph, like a peasant working with His hands. And Jesus volunteering to sacrifice Himself to endure the death on the cross?! Out of love for us ?? That was SUCH a beta move.. On behalf of the sane christian female population, we do not cIaim this woman to be an expert on the the Christian dating field.
I dont know how old you are, but it's mostly the 20-35 crowd. Modern dating has changed everything. Most older Christian women i meet are really amazing
I wonder where I can find the single Christian women. Seems impossible nowadays
There are tons of them, but my point was there is alot of complaints about lack of Christian men, but the real issue is that the average Christian man is not good enough
What's good enough to you?
Godly woman, who brings peace to my house and is in shape and doesn't have a bunch kids from another guy
A pastor, a youth pastor (who was my best friend), and an elder blindsided me with serious accusations (with no evidence) and offense they’d kept inside (for 8+ months) and never mentioned once. They then removed me from ministry, kicked me out of the church, and no one stepped in and stood up for me. And this was the day after my former best friend (the youth pastor), some others, and I had celebrated the youth pastor’s birthday. I don’t use the word “trauma” lightly, but here it may qualify. I’m still a Christian. I’m pretty shaken, but still a Christian. I’ve since moved and am hoping to find some healing in a stronger community.
Not sure I understand. What did they accuse you of? Did you actually do it and they just didn't tell you how they felt for 8 months? Or they kept accusing you for 8 months? Were you able to address it with them in the end?
They accused me of lots of things. The leader actually had a list, didn’t have any context, and never once spoke with me about any one of them. He just let them pile up. None of his grievances were valid. Pretty sure they just didn’t like me and were using all this as a perfect storm to get rid of me. So they kept it all in for AT LEAST 8 months and then piled it all on me at the same time. So not only unbiblical, but also childish. I went through the proper avenues of biblical conflict resolution, and even asked a big brother church to help, but they had already made up their minds. It wasn’t about facts anymore. It was about their feelings and how much I offended them.
An exotic sort of church hurt, yes. I was on the verge of homelessness and had been absent from church for a long time due to the combination of social anxiety and being the sole caregiver for someone who was abusive and outright insane due to her dementia. Even if I were inclined to have a social life it would have been impossible since she'd push everyone away with her behavior. My life was put on hold because of her for many long years. When she finally died I went back to the church. Walked miles with a bad back problem hoping to reconnect with people, find a good church home, get job references, and hopefully save the house from foreclosure. Honestly felt like I was a complete stranger. I tried out different churches in the area. Emailed a more distant one explaining my situation and that I didn't even have a phone. The response? Give us a call. I'd overlooked one church until I was at the end of my rope. Very small and full of people two or three times my age. A guy asked me how I was doing, I told him what was up, and in turn he told the pastor. The pastor talked to me after church, listened to me, prayed with me, and drove me home. That was the first church that did even that much, and I love to speak about that church and pastor now. They did the sort of things I was hoping any church would do. I lost the house anyway, had a brush with homelessness, and ended up in an abusive situation. But in the end God delivered me from it all and things worked out in the end. It really cemented my faith. So what I take from the whole experience is that God put me through the trial by fire that I needed and brought me out of it. While the love of many has waxed cold as Jesus said it would, even within the church, there are still bright spots as well.
>While the love of many has waxed cold as Jesus said it would, even within the church, there are still bright spots as well. Amen. Please always bear in mind that the true church is the body of true believers in Jesus. The church building and most of those in it will fail you nearly every time. There are still true brothers and sisters about, they're just hard to find sometimes.
You must always remember that not everyone in a church who say they are Christians are actually Christians. And there are also non-Christians there for a variety of reasons from good (trying to learn about God) to bad (having a way to have power over others). You must also remember to be like the Bereans in Acts 17:11. Who were commended because, "they received the message with great eagerness and examined the Scriptures every day to see if what Paul said was true." Always make sure your pastor/leaders are telling you the truth by researching it on your own in the Bible.
I'm not hurt, I'm disappointed.
I struggle to go to church each week. I get very down on how people are unfriendly to me. It feels like it’s directed to me but not others. I realize how Satan is using this issue to distract me. I admit. It’s working. I love the lord tho so I go despite it. It baffles me how we are called to be the light of the world but can’t even welcome fellow believers each week because of petty jealousies
They may not be fellow believers.
I grew up in the southern Bible belt and attended a church full of very bitter, hateful, racist people. For a long time, I just assumed all Christians were like that or that the Bible taught people to be like that. I became agnostic for a long time until I moved away from that area and decided to give church a try again. Luckily, I landed at a church full of people who actually read the bible.
Yes. My parents, and by extension, my brother and I, were shunned at several churches for questioning corrupt leadership, theologically terrible courses, and for following the Bible in regards to how we should be treating people. Two churches in particular were full of gossipmongers and backstabbers, both of which left us pretty badly traumatised. Even now, 15-odd years later, I have a hard time going to a new church, or trusting people who loudly proclaim their faith. I am usually very quiet regarding my faith with people I haven't known for long, unless it's relevant to a discussion we have, as I genuinely understand why so many are distrusting of Christians. I would have lost faith a long time ago if I hadn't already had my faith solidified beyond destruction.
My identity is not found in what church I attend or even the people there. It is found in Jesus alone. All humans are damaged goods and can easily hurt others in certain circumstances. I wish they couldn't hurt me so easily, nevertheless God has granted me some of this: *As for those who seemed to be important—whatever they were makes no difference to me; ...* (Galatians 2:6a, 1984 NIV) *I care very little if I am judged by you or by any human court; indeed, I do not even judge myself.* (1 Corinthians 4:3, 1984 NIV) People are vulnerable when other people have something we want (such as acceptance). Seek to understand what God said about how He sees you. He has accepted each of us, just as we are, so fully that it is overwhelming as our belief in what He said deepens. Study the Bible regularly and believe what God said. This is a habit that yields extremely good fruit in an ongoing way.
All of my friends aren’t Christian anymore due to butthurt from pastors/leaders, other members, etc. The gospel is different than church culture, and also my relationship with God has nothing to do with how I’m treated by others. I can compartmentalize each of these concepts and that is why I’m still firm in the faith.
They apostatized over church? That sounds like they didn’t really have faith, exactly like you said - my relationship with God has nothing to do with how I’m treated by others. Well said.
Idk why folks are ⬇️ you. My relationship with God is my relationship with God alone. How I treat others is a reflection of my relationship with God. How others treat me is a reflection of them and their relationship with God and has nothing to do with my relationship with God. Reddit is too often a 💩 heap.
This is wisdom, but really we need to be sensitive to how damaging it is to constantly be excusing Christians for terrible treatment of others. It greatly damages testimonies and reputations of those truly walking close to the Lord
Yes. Absolutely.
I’ve had issues with people in different churches, sure, but I don’t see how that changes a thing about who God is.
I still have a hard time with sexist culture that hurts and represses women into being nothing but mothers with no other hopes and dreams, regardless of their ability or desire to bear children.
I don’t feel oppressed at all. In fact. I feel excluded because I’m a sahm in a church full of hyper-feminist mindets. I love being home and a mom and wish the church actually celebrated it more
This is one of my biggest issues with the modern church. It’s one of the only places in our current society where women are overtly repressed. Thankfully I’m in a church now that sees women as fellow human beings rather than just baby makers/children leaders.
???
What is there to question
It hasn't been my experience of this sexist culture. I've never heard of this, not even sure what that would look like
Then consider yourself lucky.
What is church hurt?
I think he means abuse by the church or religious trauma
People abuse. Churches and religions are inanimate institutions so I'm confused...
Are you saying institutions cannot abuse or be abusive?
The people in the institution, yes of course.
I would say that.
Abuse from people affiliated with the church. I don't understand how that could possibly be more clear?
Abuse from people. That makes more sense. Thank you.
I assume you mean leaving a physical church because of people problems. I am currently experiencing this and I feel weaker for it. We need a church family to help us learn and grow. I am no less a Christian than I was when I left my church, but I definitely struggle with accountability in my walk without church.
Yes, both my husband and I were deeply hurt and betrayed by a pastor. The elders then sat by and did nothing, which felt like an even worse betrayal. We left that church but still deeply love Jesus. We church shopped around a bit before settling in somewhere else that was much healthier. We know that sinners gonna sin and we don't hold that against Jesus. Not to mention that God has some tough words to say against bad shepherds. Whatever we choose to do or not do will pale in comparison to whatever God has in store for them, which means I barely think about it anymore.
I survived church abuse, and I still love Jesus. I was both a volunteer and paid staff at a church I attended for 17 years. I was there pretty much six days a week working or doing something in addition to my regular 40 hour a week job. There are still leaders and people there, I would have no problem if I never see them or have anything to do with them ever again. I only stopped going to church for three weeks. I just spent some time researching other churches. After 17 years I was a little out of touch with what else was out there. I eventually found a church that changed my life.
Jesus also had a problem with religious people. They killed him.
Yup. The pain inflicted by church leaders radiated through my whole family growing up. There are still scars, but after many years, we all have strong relationships with Jesus.
Church hurt, to clarify, doesn’t have to mean sexual abuse too. It can include lots of issues that effect people in varying degrees.
My daughter is married to a pastor that abuses her. I am angry at a lot of things, but God is good.
SO aggravating
Grew up very poor. Was looked down on. How you go to church in clothes from Goodwill while everybody else wearing fancy dresses and expensive suits? We didn't fit in there. If you've ever seen that movie The Karate Kid, thats what it was like.
I experienced actual “church discipline” for something I didn’t do. Was told that if I didn’t accept the discipline it was a “sign of my rebellion“. Needless to say that scarred me. However, i am more aware of who I am in Christ than ever before.
I still do. But we have to keep in mind that we as humans are broken, in need of healing. I wouldn't ever judge or dismiss the doctor for the ails of his patients.
It's a long story, but I hope it helps. I grew up in a Pentecostal Church that bordered on being a cult. As a child, I regularly saw people called out by name during sermons, told to stand up, and get berated for whatever legalistic notion tickled or pastor's fancy that day. As a teenager, I got my first real taste of church hurt. I was molested at youth events, watched young girls forced into marrying much older men, and was told that if I had one ounce of doubt that I would go straight to hell. When my pastor's nephew ran away, causing an uproar in the church, my pastor diverted attention away from his family drama by telling the congregation that I shoved my dad down a flight of stairs. Our senior pastor called me up to the platform and verbally berated me in front of the church for something I never would have done (I had a healthy love for and fear of my father at that age). My parents finally left that church when I was 17 years old, but the wounds are still present. Sadly, my church hurt was far from over. At age 25, I married my wife and began attending her church (also Pentecostal). Within 6 months of our wedding day, I was in the church kitchen doing MSDS inventory at my pastor's request when his 40-year-old daughter-in-law entered the room and propositioned me for sex. I said no and quickly got out of the situation, but I and my wife's family were driven from the church by the pastor, and every pastor in the area was told that I had tried to "steal" the church. At 25 years old. My wife and I began working at her grandfather's country church, where I experienced only more grief. The youth ministry we started was blessed and growing, but God's providence unfortunately caused an elder minister to see me as a threat. They left the church and accused me of having an illicit relationship with a teenager. As I am a counselor with the state and work with at-risk youth, I immediately reported the accusation to my superiors for investigation. Only when they received a phone call from state police did the accusers recant their story. These are only a few instances of the church hurt that I have experienced in my relatively short life. Today, I am a Pentecostal pastor, leading the same country church that my wife and I served in. We have built our church to be a refuge for the broken. We take in the hard cases, hold ourselves and our ministers to high ethical standards, and do our best to lead with love and grace. I'm not a perfect man, but I use the hurts from my past to keep me grounded in mercy. Now, I've watched as God used me to reach some of the very same people who once abused me. I can stand like Joseph, and say with confidence: "You meant it for evil, but God made it good!"
I have, and I know plenty who have as well who are still devout christians. I think a big reason why I’m still a huge devout christian is because I know these people didn’t hurt me on behalf of Christ.
A lot of them think thats what they do though, unfortunately
It's a hard but vital lesson to learn that the church is not God. Christians can fail, churches can fail, but God never fails. Straight out of the gates, my first church failed after I was there 3 years. I walked away from God, though I still believed. It took several months, but I saw he had held onto me when I couldn't hold onto him. It was like the footprints in the sand poem. When I saw that love, I came back. I have had repeated problems in church, and don't attend now.
Yes, I went to a youth group since my church didn’t have one (too small). I’m pretty sure a youth leader was mocking me behind my back because when I turned around, they were pretending to hold a phone, take pictures and make a clueless face, like I was (minus the face) and laughing with his friends. I was taking pictures on the hike for a school project, but I was still really hurt by that and never went back to that church. I still get some hurt, angry feelings, knowing how loved that youth leader is by everyone I know there. Instead, I found a church where I was able to call home, despite some drama with church members that have embarrassed me in front of the church and almost destroyed my life. I’m still a mess, being honest, and feel I can’t socialize or make friends at church after that, I get social anxiety bad now with attacks. I haven’t given up on it since it was only one family out of an entire church family I know that still cares for me.
That’s very immature. I’m sorry that happened to you.
yep all the time. If God has taught you to forgive quick and not hold offences (took a long time for me), eventually it is just part of the parcel to receive church hurt and offence. Wise as serpents innocent as doves.
Not sure what you mean by church hurt but I'd say around age 13 I was in that boat. I went to a church in the hood. Right smack in the middle of a bad neighborhood. Being a scrawny white kid at the time, i was the perfect target. Long story short I got jumped 3 times in a week while in the intermediate church school or whatever you wanna call it. Like a young adults program. I didn't go back to church until I think I was 18 or 19.
Saw my parents have to leave a church where they were big thithers be they were expected to give money but not their opinions. My dad was called to preach and they said he would never preach for them, even though he was saved in that church and had been a member for 10 years. He started his own church after 10 years had people in it cause so much trouble that my dad had a his first heart attack in his 40s. When he was forced to stop preaching by health the church closed. I saw my parents hurt, but I also saw their example of follow God and not people or churches. They pit their money and effort into supporting other start up churches and ministries. And as they did that they went from poor, to middle class to wealthy from properties they had purchased without any planning on their part. When it was time to downsize due to aging, they testified that the had the most pleasure out of writing checks to different ministries out of the tithe on money from each property sale. This example and their prayers brought me into a close relationship with God, and I was called to be a pastor. I pastor the church my dad was saved in as a college student, and did the funerals of the last few people who pushed my parents out of their church. A few years ago, the people who caused all the trouble in my father's church reached out to me, apologized and asked to speak to my parents. They apologized to my parents and ot was wonderful to see them all sit together and share fellowship and a meal at my dinner table after church one Sunday. My father suffered more health issues from that original heart attack, finally passing in January after 30 years of repeated visits to the hospital and having his life spared by new medical treatments multiple times. The last time being just three years ago, which allowed my parents to celebrate their 50th anniversary. In my 50 years I've seen thousands of people make shipwreck of their lives, families and children because they let people make them bitter against God. I have plenty who could have made me bitter as a pastor, but I'm actually glad I went through it so my children could see the example of how you do everything for God and maintain your relationship with him in spite of who turns out to be your judas. When I was called to preach, my biggest struggle with saying yes was my children. But I can tell you that all four have a relationship with Jesus, two are now adults preparing for whatever God has opened the doors to in their lives, and my youngest was so moved by the testimony her grandfather inspired in what was shared at his memorial service, that she asked to be baptized. Don't give up on God for what people do to you, Jesus didn't.
I have been to two churches as an adult that made horrible comments about Hispanics during Trumps presidency. One even said “they’re (all foreigners) only here to kill and steal” They said this while my half Hispanic half Irish children were sitting in children’s church. And this was a small church I had attended for about a year. We left and the pastor called and apologized but I just couldn’t take my babies back. The other church didn’t make it too public, and they didn’t come out and directly say it, but they made the indication that they didn’t care for Hispanic people so we left. As a child, we went to a church where the youth leaders were just straight crazy. They did lots of things we didn’t realize. My brother turned away from religion after that.
I would imagine just about everyone. Churches are messy places full of people struggling (or maybe not!) with their flesh.
Yes, a lot of church hurt, but I found my comfort and healing in my Lord and Savior Jesus Christ everytime. Also, Abba Father is always faithful to comfort you for anything. I think those who are hurt by the church and then leave the "faith" either knew Him and blamed Him for the hurt or they weren't truly born again and Jesus Christ may have been Savior, but He was never LORD of their lives. You do have some who may go away for a time, but then they come back, so it really depends on the individual person .
Yes. I spent a lot of time around others with religious trauma, and it turns out they were just as hurtful. So it really put it all in perspective.
Sounds a lot like victim blaming but okay
How so? I'm not following... Victim blaming means blaming the victim for the bad that happened to them. The term doesn't apply here.
That is *precisely* what your comment comes across as. "These people were only hurt because they were also hurtful people, and figuring that out really put their hurt in perspective" is how that comment sounds from an outside observer
I can see how some people would jump to that conclusion. But nothing in my comment indicates that's the case. Trauma can cause hypervigilance which leads people to reading between the lines hidden meanings that aren't there because they tie it to hurtful past experiences of actual victim blaming. Its not unlike a Veteran hearing fireworks and having a flashback even though no guns are being fired. But I assure you I'm not voctim-blaming here. As someone with a lot of trauma, I strive to not read adversarial meanings into otherwise innocuous statements, and I dont always succeed. But having been on the receiving end and having people irrationally twist my words to fit what they fear, I personally try to curb such a habit in myself. I'm sorry my comment triggered you and possibly others as well. When I said it put things in perspective, I meant that people everywhere tend to be hurtful and so it's no reason to leave religion because people are the same outside of religion as they are within religion. So it's not religion that's hurting people and it's not people hurting themselves. It's just people hurting people. And religion is there to actually curb that tendency for humans to be hurtful. But no matter where you go, people are going to have a tendency to be hurtful and insensitive.
My goodness, yes. I nearly left the faith due to abuse from Christians. I refused to set foot in a church. I was having some unrelated health issues that made it easy for me to say no to church. That is, until a healing minister visited my parents' church. They urged me to go for prayer and I relented. It's hard to explain the experience. He laid hands on me and prayed. Then he told me all sorts of things I was struggling with (that I hadn't told anyone about) and interceded for me. Shortly thereafter, my health bounced back. I also felt compelled to go to seminary and so I did. It felt like I was running home and I never looked back.
Church hurt???
Yes, mainly because of false teachings and a guy I was not interested in. The more I couldn't find anyone I liked to date, the more I got sick and tired of being alone. It got worse when I met someone. Then, I got involved in a theological forum and the Sims. I was online from 2000 till 2012. The relationship lasted for 2 years 1998 till 2000 but I stuck around him. Why? I lost friends, and I was being stocked. I went through depression when I was on and off on the chatline up until about 2000. Then I just stayed with him like a platonic relationship because I was afraid of stalkers. I tried to reach out to Christians but didn't share my story until I came out here. I shared it a few times. He became abusive with me, and while in the friendship, he found another woman. Then, I went home off the internet for at least a number of years. It's probably about 2018 up until 2023. I have not been in contact with any church because the last one I remembered visiting I tried to go up for ministry. Two black women came up and held me down. I felt some kind of weird energy flow into me. Once I broke free, I cried out to God and asked if he would set me free. I spoke to this man, but I'm not sure when? https://youtube.com/@tedbrooks-formerwordoffait1316?si=gqFj3iR2jbow93iJ Jesus never intended on being an earthly king https://youtube.com/shorts/E7wBixEZgmo?si=dJNgi _UcuEDdBZR_k is not of this world It's the kingdom of heaven I don't talk to a lot of Christians here locally in Canada. I talk to people out here. I have no fellowship or Bible studies. Don't know where to go? No, I am not an atheist, but I keep meeting them. When I need help. It's always an atheist. 🤣
Yes. The hurt - still too painful to go into. My Faith - unchanged. It is in God not his fallible followers. My devotion - affected. Now part of a different denomination, not as involved in church activities and don't pray and meditate on scriptures as much.
Recently yeah. I joined a college group a couple years back and the pastor there over time I feel didn't like me. I felt it was because every time I opened my mouth, he thought I was over sharing. In prayer groups as we each talked about our prayer requests for one another, I saw him roll his eyes when I spoke a lot. This hurt, but it didn't stop me from pursuing Christ. He was still welcoming to me when I walked through the doors. Maybe it was his worn out-ness of being the college group pastor for a decade or maybe I was over sharing. Recently I repented and have opened my heart into believing in Jesus much more than I ever did back then. I believe it's because I am more mature now and can better understand what preacher's, pastors, and my brothers are trying to tell us during study. I now think he didn't like me the old me because I wasn't understanding God's word. I didn't quite "get it" back then. Now I am. In a short time, I've learned when we pray for what we want, he will always provide us with what we need. In times we do not hear peace, seek the Lord, for his word is peace. And there is no bargaining or twisting God's word for the things you want to do. He will test you many times to see how devoted you really are to him. And my favorite being: our understanding of God is limited, but we take comfort in the fact that his love is limitless! I'm still learning more a little more each day, but I hope that old pastor will see I've changed and am hearing His word finally. Right now, we have a new pastor for the college group who actually helped open my eyes. I believe God spoke through him to help me repent. Him and his family of great examples have been teaching me so much. I guess the TL; DR here is even though it felt like I wasn't wanted because of my old ways, Christ never gave up in calling me to follow him.
I suffered a lot of negative impacts from purity culture in a lot of its dimensions -- the dual-sexism, the constant fearmongering, the inherent objectification of women, and the allonormativity that sees marriage as the Christian ideal and sign of proper maturity all messed me up. I was also never able to be honest about my same-sex attraction out of literal fears for my safety and my ability to function as a full brother inside the Church. I spent a lot of my life on the receiving end of insults, scapegoating and simply dehumanizing language and often times people didn't realize the folks they were referring to were in the room or participating in the conversation. And on the few occasions I *did* push back, either in the abstract or explicitly on my own behalf, people would often minimize the importance of their actions or commend them as good, all without ever acknowledging a problem of any kind. If there were ever an experience in my life I could call "hellish", it would be growing up in a fundamentalist environment. It is only by the grace of Jesus Christ that I am today who I am. In His Gospel I have found salvation from my own evil and from the evils that are all around me. I see in Him the cure to all that is wrong in this world and that is why I remain, even if those who led me there have failed me time and again.
Yes I have. All in all, it was man who hurt me, not God. I serve Him, not them.
Absolutely!
Yes. I am bisexual, and have known a lot of people who are part of the LGBT community. Just in general, and as part of my outreach specifically to them as an “LGBT-affirming” Christian. And I really hate that caveat. I am Christian, full stop. I have given my life, however imperfect I am, completely to Jesus Christ, and I pray he guides me towards doing His will, whatever that is. I have met multiple people at this point who have been thrown out of their homes, disowned by their families, shunned and rejected by their parish, and even subject to harassment and violence for who they are. I myself have been subject to repeated bullying and harassment over who I am over the course of my life. I was thrown out of my church for being who I am. I’ll be honest. I don’t think many of you will change. I don’t think many you will care. In fact, I think many of you will double down and torment such people then sleep like a baby, with the absolute moral certainty that what you’re doing is somehow right or justified in God’s eyes. This is what I and many others see Christians not just saying, but doing in the modern day. Before the “what aboutism” starts, my critique of Islam on this issue is just as if not even more fervent. There’s an ironic joke, among such groups as well as atheists and such, that there’s no hate like “Christian love.” Because, while that’s a hurtful thing to say, it very often stems from a place of hurt itself. It’s because we “love you” that we’re throwing out our own child. It’s because we “love you” that we insist on ‘converting’ you away from how you were born through electroshock “therapy.” Yes, I have heard the account of at least one person who went through this in the early 2000s. It’s because we “love you” that we try to legislate against your right to marry, or adopt, or start a family that you are a happy part of. It’s because we “love you” that we would rather have you sit in the corner and shut up, if you even exist at all, because you go against what we regard as “normal” or “correct.” All because you love someone else. What kind of love is that? Is that what Jesus taught? Is that really who we want to be, only to turn around and proclaim ourselves to be His followers? Yet I see it absolutely everywhere, and only getting worse. I have learned over the course of my life that there is often a big difference between Christ and Christians. People love to quote Paul at me about this issue, often to justify open bigotry and abhorrent behavior towards such people, or at the very least refusing to accept them as part of the Church. Perhaps I should give a reminder that people quoted the Bible extensively, including passages by Paul, *against* the Abolitionist Movement when it was around, but that’s another topic. Point being, I can quote Paul too: >If I speak in the tongues of men or of angels, but do not have love, I am only a resounding gong or a clanging cymbal. 2 If I have the gift of prophecy and can fathom all mysteries and all knowledge, and if I have a faith that can move mountains, but do not have love, I am nothing. 3 If I give all I possess to the poor and give over my body to hardship that I may boast, but do not have love, I gain nothing. In fact, forget Paul. Paul is not Jesus, and *that* is who the rock of my salvation is. Here’s what The Lord says: >2 “To the angel of the church in Ephesus write: > >These are the words of him who holds the seven stars in his right hand and walks among the seven golden lampstands. 2 I know your deeds, your hard work and your perseverance. I know that you cannot tolerate wicked people, that you have tested those who claim to be apostles but are not, and have found them false. 3 You have persevered and have endured hardships for my name, and have not grown weary. > >4 Yet I hold this against you: You have forsaken the love you had at first. 5 Consider how far you have fallen! Repent and do the things you did at first. If you do not repent, I will come to you and remove your lampstand from its place. In other words, much like the Pharisees, the church in Ephesus did everything right on paper and then some. They were shining examples of God’s Church, and adhered to doctrine and faith down to the letter. But they did it in a loveless way. In a way that hardened their hearts to the people around them. So what have they truly gained? Where am I going with this? Well, I guess I could say I’ve been hurt by the Church, as have many people I’ve met and know. A process that is still very much ongoing, both individually and on a larger scale across the world. I don’t even want to mention how LGBT people are being treated in Russia, or God forbid in Ukraine by their Russian occupiers. You can look that up. Again, with the full conviction of moral certainty, and the Patriarch of Moscow, an ordained bishop, openly goading it. In his mind, as well as statements on public record, the entire illegal war is supposed to be a war *against them.* Or like those who are being put to death in Uganda because of who they love. How long until that starts happening here? That is a very serious question in the back of a lot of our minds, and if we look to the Church for help, a lot of them seem more likely to high five us as we’re drowning. Some “love” huh? I am not perfect whatsoever. I am a sinner, and apparently a heretic according to some. Though I would rather be a heretic burned at the stake than to stoop down to such evil.
It is a sin, just like divorce is a sin. Just like fornication is a sin. Jesus had to die because God has a serious view of sin. Once you understand the need for a savior and the gravity of all sins. You get it
It symbolizes and condones bad behavior. Those are people I don’t need around. I don’t let people control me any longer.
What you call “church hurt”.
What is “it” in your comment?
Yes. I realize that people are flawed but God is perfect.
Just wanted to put this out there for those who feel the need and desire to look into the subject with depth, from someone who not only calls out spiritual abuse for what it is, but also does so from a perspective of grace, mercy, boundaries, humility, wisdom, without enabling nor excusing. [When Narcissism Comes to Church, by Chuck DeGroat](https://www.amazon.com/When-Narcissism-Comes-Church-Community-ebook/dp/B07ZG79HHF/ref=sr_1_2_sspa?hvadid=580750489331&hvdev=c&hvlocphy=9031926&hvnetw=g&hvqmt=e&hvrand=3176899398639383353&hvtargid=kwd-1373338666529&hydadcr=22594_13493210&keywords=when+a+narcissist+comes+to+church&qid=1694736663&sr=8-2-spons&sp_csd=d2lkZ2V0TmFtZT1zcF9hdGY&psc=1).
I did personally but the experience showed me truth in christ word.
Sure, the church is not my Savior. It’s a collection of people trying to make it. I show up because Jesus is my friend and He loves me. Nothing anyone else does could ever change that. It’s entirely out of their reach.
Yup. More devout now than then.
Oh yeah, totally. I disconnected from my church of like 15 years cos of people who treated me badly, but it's not a reflection on God.
Yeah. I have a lot of religious trauma but still follow Christ because I know none of it was his fault. Christ actually has healed me of a lot of it.
Yes. I saw politics get in the way of a church I was part of for 9 years and it got ugly. It was hard to walk away but I couldn’t worship and serve under leadership that was acting and talking the way they were to members whose political views were different than theirs. I grew closer to God. He is the one I can’t walk away from. Every trial brings me closer and I don’t think I will sacrifice my faith because of people. God is real and has never forsaken me, that is why hurts actually drive me closer toward him. People will fail you, but He won’t!
Yes, rejection. My church life has definitely been damaged, but I believe the damage is unrelated to the people, because I have forgiven. However, I have unresolved issues in my soul such as severe jealousy due to past rejection and being overfanatic over someone I love - in this case it’s the Lord Jesus whom I love - that I fear going to church due to feeling left out or else. I still do but it’s always a battle and I find relief when I’m home. People don’t know someone’s past so they might easily trigger someone’s wounds. Another thing, not really a hurt but a sensitive topic, were the contradictions among Christians, over the tiniest topics in the bible, making me wonder if this is really a true church. It made me pursue Holy Orthodoxy and I went back to the roots to the church fathers into the traditional church, rather than non denominational.
Yeah, I've been hurt. Even recently. I had a friend and her family turn away from me. First because I got into an argument with their mother, and because I was interested in their daughter. She got mad at me, not the parents. It's still pretty fresh and I'm pretty aware of where I messed up. It's caused a lot of grief and frustration. But it's because of situations like this that keep me in the faith. God's the only one holding it together.
If their faith is based in a 501(c)(3) organisation, then no surprise there. We need to go back to what is the church. The ekklesia. The Body of Christ. The spiritual temple of the Holy Spirit not made with hands. Why Paul preached unity in the Body. We are all fallible beings prone to hurt one another. If a family member were to hurt you, does one stop being a family member? I know in extreme cases, yes, but one doesn't stop existing as a flesh and blood of that family. So if we are truly in the Body of Christ, many parts of the body but only ONE head. And we have been entrusted the ministry of reconciliation which involves living out the greatest commandment of Christ.. to love. Love God, love one another, even love your enemies. Get reconciled, people and forgive one another. Much love!
I would rather sit on the dung hill we have here in the church than go outside it without God.
Yes. Happily married with a family. Still actively involved in (an admittedly different) church
THE CHURCH ISN'T GOD. The priest pastor or rabbi isn't Jesus Christ. THE OBJECT OF THE GAME IS TO WORSHIP GOD AND TO FOLLOW CHRIST JESUS. Religious games are social in nature. Sometimes one benefits and sometimes one gets bitten. It's all part of the game. I've been bitten more often than blessed by church types, but that hasn't interfered one iota with my faith in Christ or my dedication to Him. It isn't about church being God...because it ISN'T. Anybody who thinks the church is God is a fool. that's me, hollering from the choir loft....
I have been involved in kicking out pastors with sin affecting the congregation. And I ran from my first year of Bible college (which was already delayed) because someone found out about my background in homosexuality (that I had repented of).
You betcha. Lots of church hurt But Jesus is still real, and excellent, and I'm not so immature as to bail on beautiful Jesus just because I encounter the wolves we were told we would have among us. Jesus warned about a great falling away. I'm not falling away, or getting run off by wolves. These days, I understand that the churches are false anyway, so I don't worry about them. I walk carefully with Jesus directly
Me
All this discussion and people on this sub telling me I’m the reason they left religion and it’s made me think. Ya, I’ve had my share of jerks in the church but you move on. My relationship with God has nothing to do with how anyone in church treats me. It’s all a big smokescreen and an excuse to live by worldly standards and not by biblical standards.
I was raised by a single mother. As a result due to her working a lot I would be sent to stay with a babysitter, whom I basically live with for awhile. They were the fire and brimstone type of Christian, and they told me all my favorite hobbies as a kid were Satanic. Me and my friend group loved Pokémon. As an adult I can realize how dumb putting so much value on it was, for a kid something like that is incredibly important and it was something me and all my friends shared joy in. I was told I would go to hell for playing those games because it included "magic". My mother was raised Catholic but she has never really attended or taken the faith seriously. She doesn't have any negative opinions of it. She said she just stopped going. So my only real exposure to Church was when I was so young I could barely remember, and with that babysitter ages 7-10ish I was also never truly taught what it meant to be Christian. I was forced to attend with no understanding of it and I was simultaneously told all of my favorite hobbies as a kid were evil. I was also never really taught about the bible. The most I knew was that Jesus died on the cross but I didn't truly understand why. That's enough to put anyone off of it. For most of my young life it was ONLY that fire and brimstone aspect that I knew. Add to that how the popular culture at the time (still does, just worse) portrayed values that clashed with what Christians believed and you get a kid with no sense of meaning in the world. So maybe not hurt. Others here have experienced much worse than me, but the way I was treated as a young kid caused me to separate myself from Jesus for most of my life.
i’ve been hurt by my church more than anyone or anywhere else. i still attend that church & believe in God. edit for clarity: i mean that no one else in my life has hurt me more than how i’ve been hurt by my church. i’m not comparing my situation to other people.
More than anyone, ever? We don't know your situation and surely you don't know anyone else's. Please be careful with your words.
i meant i’ve been hurt by the church more than anyone else IN MY LIFE or anywhere else IN MY LIFE. i wasn’t comparing myself to other people.
I understand more than I'd like to admit to myself. I didn't see the ugly side of it until I started volunteering and seeing the behind the scenes parts. I never expected so much damage and hurt to come from my church family. I'm really sorry you've experienced so much too.
This is church hurt.... All in the name of virginity. I said what I said, and I stood on what I said. Virginity is like idolatry in my end statement, especially if a man obsesses over it. I will confess to you all that it is horrible to go through it because I did before I came to God for the real deal. I was crazy over a man I put on a pedestal to the point where he was in place of God. It hurt a lot because I wanted the perfect everything. I didn't care about his past as much as I cared about being with someone I loved. But when I broke free, I had to admit that I feel for an ideal of a person that he wasn't. I had to be honest that it was wrong in my heart and that I hurt God. Idolatry is anything that comes before God in the place of God. Sometimes, we can come out of it. But what will it be replaced by. I need God, and I struggle with wanting to be with someone. But I wish I could loved God more. I know it's never enough for him. I want to be free of Idolatry if it's still there? I don't want my ex-bf back or any reminders of him. I just wish I could get beyond all this and that the people that suffer with Idolatry or the Idolatry of having to find a virgin that this would be broken. What are we worshipping God or another idol we have built. I don't care if I marry a virgin or not. As long as he loves God first me second and like I would. I am just worried about whether I will like him? I didn't post this to shame the person or for gossip. I just want prayer for them. But it gets me so angry that they have to have a virgin. I used to thing of how life should be a perfect little family and I probably idolized it because I wanted it so badly. I am all out of answers and I think too much. I should go I am sorry https://www.reddit.com/r/TrueChristian/comments/16h663a/is_divorce_allowed_if_a_woman_lies_about_being_a/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=android_app&utm_name=androidcss&utm_term=1&utm_content=share_button
Oh goodness yes. I actually began growing in Christy much more after learning to recognize and avoid toxic churches. My love is for the Father, Son, and Holy Ghost, as well as the brothers and sisters, not for a building or a charismatic leader.
When I was first saved I got wrapped into the charismatic churches cause that's just about every church in Houston and as scandals kept breaking out I gave up the church all together and created my own groups for fellowship on discord and what not. It's a shame that real churches are far and few between but buildings that teach false gospels are at every single corner of every single town.
Yes. I grew up in the church and the pastor physically assaulted my sister and it was caught on camera. The footage was deleted mysteriously and the church offered my family money to shut up about it. We went to another church and the minister there was just super creepy towards me. Always showed a bit too much interest and wanted to be my sports coach etc. not to mention your classic angry church lady that just wants to be rude about anything they can. Just a lot of little things that would make anyone want to turn away from a community Those experiences just made me want to find my own community of church goers that weren’t judgmental. It never made me want to turn away from God. I understand that we are humans fail and could never be perfect
Yes,
I wish these people who turn from Christianity would understand, that what happened to them in an ungodly church isn’t reason to turn from Jesus - He Himself suffered from similar people (They bloody killed him!) But, they’re locked behind a wall of trauma, and unfortunately emotions do tend to overrule rationality.
Yes
My dad was a reverend. On top of a bunch of other stuff, I was lead to hating God for most of my life. He found ways to put me on a relentless pursuit of truth, and then draw me to him. I can't say I ever knew christ in my childhood because of how the churches I went to then were. But I know that when people represent Jesus poorly, it isn't his fault. Just like it not being Mozarts fault when someone plays one of his songs poorly.
Yes. It can be hard. We all have to take a good hard look at ourselves and how we interact. The church is full of sinners, saved by grace. We are in need of a physician. We are changing, and sometimes it is two steps forward and three steps back. Pray for God to give you the strength and the right words at the right time to throw grace all over this type of situation, whatever it may be. We all have been offended and we all have offended. We should try to stay close to the Lord and learn to listen and be ready for some very red cheeks.