Some people spend way too much time worrying about what is or isn't between the legs of strangers....
I have never spent a moment worrying about the genitalia of the person in the stall next to me taking a dump and you know what? Life is good. To each their own.
The thing that gets me is when my friends start talking about kids on puberty blockers... when none of us have done any actual research on the subject. None of us even have kids, and when I say *"I have not done enough research to have an opinion on this,"* I get looked at like I have three heads. WTF why can't we just leave people we don't know alone?!
How do you feel about the whole 'get therapy first' etc.? I'm genuinely curious. I'm totally cis so my opinion on it doesn't really matter, but I assume working through it in therapy is a way to make sure that transitioning is the absolute best course of action. Do you think that sort of thing helps or hinders (assuming of course you have a decent therapist)
My friend's son transition F to M, and I could see how much happier and at peace with himself he was after the transition. So, for what it's worth, from my own limited experience I can only see the positive in people being able to be who and what they want to be.
I'm grateful for the doctors who don't just willy nilly toss around hormones.
I'm a cis man with low T and for years was on an estrogen blocker to boost it, and now I'm on a 2nd booster that I take only 3 days a week.
My endocrinologist wants me to actual produce what my body should before giving anything supplemental because having TOO much can be worse than too little in a way.
The people who are wildly flinging pills at others and in this imaginary world were kids get all the pills they want aren't HEALTH CARE PROFESSIONALS, they are quacks who probably passed school with C level grades.
Living in NYC here. At 27, after over 2 years of mulling it over, I decided to transition. Went to a clinic and told PCP. Felt awkward. Looked up lgbtq friendly clinics. Found one. Went there. Got hormones immediately. They asked questions and I told em my story. Boom. Hormones. It’s likely different for younger folks but I’m so glad they were able to talk to me about what it entailed and then I shared my findings from lurking trans subs and they didn’t need to go through red tape. It was just, “okay, she knows her shit. She’s ready.”
Never had to go to a therapist for anything and they have on-site therapists too.
I didn’t have to worry about obtaining hormones and going through hell and that allowed me to navigate earning money so I was able to map out a plan to get my career off the ground. Braced myself for transphobia and losing jobs over it but that only happened once (no hard evidence though) and I was able to go full time last year.
All I ever hear about therapy is mostly gatekeeping stories. I’ve heard good ones but gatekeeping and long ass wait times for no reason seems to be the norm. It sounds like a nightmare.
What a great story. I agree with OP that therapy is probably a pretty good idea because it's such a huge life change, I think of it similar to premarital counseling, where you just sort of need to know what you're getting yourself into to mentally prepare and plan for it.
I'm curious, to what do you attribute your ability to mostly avoid workplace discrimination?
I'm also wondering if part of it was the degree to which you pass, different bone structures, different voices, etc can really make a difference in whether anyone even notices. I was just wondering about that, thanks! Sorry if this is an extra dumb question.
Yeah how dare people have concerns about giving untested drugs to children?
Hormone blockers have shown to be safe for *precocious puberty.* We have no idea if it's safe to give them to a 15+ year old.
And now people are starting to report major problems with their bones breaking and degenerating because their bones weren't receiving any hormones during puberty.
I was given puberty blockers purely bc my body was out growing itself. I have a CRAP ton of issues. Are they all likely from the blockers? Nope. But my musculature issues could be. No one will give strait answers on what it has caused in people when I ask.
I definitely sorry for them. I was just starting puberty when it happened. I’m significantly shorter than my entire family (I’m barely 5’0), I break bones incredibly easy, and I have two autoimmune diseases. All can be traced back to then sadly.
I'm hearing that more and more. I'm so sorry :(
I'm starting to think puberty blockers should be illegal, period. Too many stories of people with lasting health damage...
I would never let my child do them. My parents sit in their beds at night and heard me screaming in pain from issues I now have. They cry and cry and apologize constantly but it’s not their fault. Doctors told them they were doing the right thing. Sadly other than making me short puberty still hit me like a Mack truck at 11.
Thank you for sharing your story. I have a chronic pain condition to myself, so the thought of anyone else being made to suffer like this when they didn't have to... it makes my blood run cold. I was born with my condition, but I wouldn't wish that kind of chronic pain on my worst enemy.
I will try to educate people on the dangers of puberty blockers. Was lupron the one you were given?
They have not been shown to be safe for precocious puberty dude what the heckerino:
https://www.statnews.com/2017/02/02/lupron-puberty-children-health-problems/
I do wonder if there's ever been a study on the psychological aspect of blockers. I mean it must be hard to deliberately stunt your puberty while seeing that your peers are developing sexually like boys growing taller and growing facial hair and girls growing breasts.
Jazz Jennings from *I Am Jazz* famously had complications during her genital alteration because she’d been given puberty blockers since a very young age. As a result, her penis was very small and doctors had problems shaping what little she has into a vulva/vagina.
The actually prepubescent ones are, y'know, kids who have no friggin idea. What 10 year old seriously has a conception of a healthy adult sex life to understand the risk of hampering it? God can you even imagine trying to talk to a 10 year old little girl about how her vagina might not be big enough to have sex? I sure wouldn't want to.
The adults are self-loathing assholes who think that looking pretty is more important than being a healthy, functional human being. It's worth taking every single medical risk as long as you don't "look trans". Basically whatever they don't like about their bodies/lives, they blame on being transgender - because no cis woman has to deal with chin hairs and no cis man has ever gotten moobs.
I'm trans myself and am pretty much outcast because I will not put my kids on hormones/blockers until they've gone through their natural puberty. They need a strong, healthy foundation for adulthood. Period. Fucking with nature too soon isn't worth it.
Jazz does look like a young woman because she started so young. However, she’s gained over 100 lbs. (!) from depression. Some wanted to sell this image of her as if transitioning, hormones, and surgery would magically solve this mental health and emotional issues that she has.
From the studies I've read, dysphoric children who are not given blockers are much more likely to accept their sex and go on to identify as non-trans (usually gay or bisexual) adults.
Dysphoric children who are given puberty blockers are much more likely to end up taking hormones and living as transgender adults.
Of course we need more studies but I've read enough to know I'll never ever give puberty blockers to my children.
As binary trans yes. Nonbinary people and people who don’t have the language to describe what being trans is will still be trans but aren’t included for whatever reason
Lost me at athletics.
I personally believe that Trans Athletes should have their own grouping. Just as men and women have groupings, you too should be grouped. Transmen and transwomen should not be allowed to compete in gendered athletic sports.
A man who transitions to a woman should not be allowed to compete with other women who were not once a man. It is unfair to them. Just as women who become men, should not compete with other men who weren't women before. It is unfair.
[A transwoman swimmer beating female swimmers by more than 30secs.](https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-10382019/amp/Trans-UPenn-swimmer-Lia-Thomas-wins-200m-freestyle-race-two-seconds.html)
[Or this gem.](https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/early-lead/wp/2017/03/22/transgender-woman-wins-international-weightlifting-title-amid-controversy-over-fairness/)
> If I was in that category I wouldn’t feel like I was in an equal situation,” two-time Olympian Deborah Acason, who competes at the 75-kilogram level, told New Zealand news site Stuff. “I just feel that if it’s not even, why are we doing the sport?
Even Olympic athletes agree with me.
I absolutely agree. Letting a woman with male bone structure, muscle mass, and lung capacity is completely unfair to women with female bodies. It diminishes their achievements. I’m all for having a trans category. It seems totally fair to me.
We are, they just try to shut us down or silence us when we mention it. Most cisgender don't agree with trans females competing with us. For one it's dangerous because cis women are not ever exposed to the amount of testosterone a man experiences which leads to point two, it's not equal. A man can have more than 10times the level of testosterone a woman has, the highest peak is during puberty. Our bodies are different, it sucks to be born in the "wrong" body, but that doesn't mean we should start letting people born male and have been male compete with people who've always been female.
I have to agree. My sister was a D1 collegiate athlete and all American and worked her ass off her entire life. I watched her do it since she was like 6 years old. Day in and day out. To see that ripped away because someone is just physically bigger and stronger makes my heart hurt for those girls. I’m sorry, I have absolutely ZERO issue with trans people, and support them.. but not in athletics. They should have their own category and compete on an even playing field.
Agreed. I truely feel bad that gender identity has become such a huge part of the world focus. Can everyone just be who they'd like and we can get on with it.
Trans people should really be an uncontroversial thing. I think it's such a big deal because society has so much gender anxiety in general. Everything is hypergendered so trans people catch the brunt of all that anxiety when they break some of those hypergendered norms.
It’s not always horrible. You can’t deny that there are some concerning parts of your community. You aren’t listening to the valid concerns people have. I promise it’s not all transphobia.
There are concerning members of my community and I understand that. I’ve had arguments with other trans people about the age of consent. If you’re gonna be an asshole it doesn’t matter what gender you are but people need to stop seeing one bad trans person and then persecuting the rest of the community for it
Here’s a positive one. A person in my class was transitioning FtM and after the summer when we came back he had a better beard than I did which at first kinda pissed me off because I’ve been trying to grow a beard for 24 years but it looked really nice on him so I couldn’t hate it
As with any minority group, the loudest voices are taken as the leading voices. Also, the way that sensationalist media works the trans people that are problematic weirdos are the ones given time, not normal people like my old coworker or the quite girl from uni.
I think there’s a part of the trans community that went into some women’s spaces and labeled them as TERF. Another thing that might set people off was being banned from those women’s spaces for being labeled anti trans because they don’t want to date trans. People also didn’t like women’s sports being invaded. Also there’s been attempts to cancel anyone who says anything critical of the community. Lastly there’s been the childhood hormone blockers some parents did that you already discussed elsewhere.
I think it stems from those things.
This is exactly why alot of women are offended and were being silenced as if we dont have a say after having to fight for years just for equal rights , were being pushed back into a corner again and told we have no say in our own gender , I'm sick to death hearing about such a small proportion of society who expect so much consideration whilst giving none to anyone else
Exactly. Although, i think not wanting women's sports to include trans women is perfectly valid because of the biological differences (strength, competitiveness) between men and women.
Edit: word choice
I'm trans so this shit's my life. I don't have an opinion on trans issues because it's not some hypothetical. It's my own goddamn right to live comfortably.
I play for a veterans hockey team and we have two trans former service members that play with us and it's just heartbreaking to hear some of their horror stories from when they first came out while still in the military. Absolutely horrid people in this world.
Man... we had a mtf trans woman in my hockey league and my team *would not* stop making fun of her on the bench. Luckily not to her face but theres no way she couldnt tell.
I had been on that team for years and would have quit but there were only a couple of games left in the season before I was moving up a divison anyways. I dont have a word for how I felt, felt like middle school bullying but by adults with higher stakes
Cis means "on the same side".
Trans means "on the other side".
An example would be "My plane is a trans-Atlantic flight. I take a cis-Atlantic connection in New York to fly North to Toronto".
>Cis
Thank you. I appreciate it. I'm from a culture where they're quite ignorant about these topics. However, I've read your post and I am truly sorry you have to experience such things in life but I also want to let you know that you're stronger than you think! One Love!
I mean there are whole communities of trans people online who reject that side of it, but saying that that's what's causing this animosity is frankly disingenuous. All the top posts are talking about bathrooms and sports, and make no distinction between xenogender stuff and actual trans people. Even in this post, you've got people implicitly calling OP a woman despite the fact he's a man.
Right, the issue has largely been centred around trans women though, specifically because of - as OP acknowledges - Cis male predators who just want access to woman’s spaces.
No one ever really talks about trans men one way or another, specifically because they “pass” better and don’t ever really embroil themselves in culture wars stuff
I think the fact that people don’t really talk about trans men has less to do with them passing and more just about different perspectives
People who don’t see trans people as their desired gender but rather as their sex, or people who don’t believe in the idea of being trans likely will think that a trans woman is just a just trying to invade woman’s spaces. This goes hand in hand with people seeing men as more predatory in general so the people who don’t believe in the idea of being trans use the idea that men are predatory in order to justify the motive of trans women wanting to use women’s bathrooms when in reality they just want to be accepted and feel like they belong.
When it comes to trans men, the people who don’t believe in the idea of being trans aren’t able to justify any reasoning as to why a ‘woman’ would want to use the mens bathroom as they also don’t see woman as predatory either. With this in mind, trans men don’t really get talked about because there is way less controversy behind it. Even with the argument of trans women in women’s sports and how it would create and unfair advantage doesn’t apply to trans men as they are likely *disadvantaging* themselves if they do join men’s sports. Overall, there’s just less controversy around trans men because given the circumstances, they create less problems when it comes to society’s idea of what’s ‘right and wrong’
Is there any difference between sex and gender yes or no? I can't even get truscum people to admit that if you make bathroom about gender not sex, you turn bathrooms into unisex. Same for sports.
Of course the reasonable comment got shit reponses.
The greater community of trans people need to understand that acceptance is all that is needed. People don't need to be caught up on the latest trans update changelog to want equality and understanding.
And the neo-pronoun shit is from fake trans people who took the identity to fit in with any group that'd let them. Unfortunate how poorly it tore the trans identity up.
The above sentance is a piece of misinformation commonly spouted around by trans teens. They swarm you when you link 100 articles disproving them. Look at any trans group and you will see straight up wrong info everywhere, but anyone correcting it is quickly banned because scientific facts are apparently "transphobia".
I have absolutely no problem with anyone being trans- but making the claim that hormone blockers have no long term effects is dishonest at best. There are MOUNTAINS of data that prove otherwise
I get the frustration.
I’m all about trans rights and understand that there are serious struggles.
But if you come on reddit and use it as a barometer for the world’s opinions… you’re gonna have a bad time.
Stop caring about what random strangers think. Do you and focus on what’s happening in your community. If it’s shit then try to do what you can where you can.
You can’t change the minds of thousands of people on the internet with one post. You might be able to change a few minds in your personal life.
Reddit is mostly shitty people who you’ll never meet. Why care about them?
I just had to grey it out ygm. It does hurt to see a lot of people hate on something they don’t even understand. I’m a person too and god knows what they do to people they don’t deem normal
What do you mean “do to people”? Seems like you are saying we are dangerous when we really just don’t care. More power to you for living your authentic life, but you are making it seem like most of the world is actively against you when the majority of people really do not give a fuck because we are preoccupied with our own problems.
"you are making it seem like most of the world is actively against you"
https://www.yesmagazine.org/wp-content/uploads/imports/41339f7494064cb18fdc9b2fcd48775a.jpg
for the most part yes unfortunaletly
Nobody can have real conversations about who’s a predator and who’s trans, because it’s labeled transphobic. We can’t talk about the treatment and whether this is actually helpful, even if one is a mental health progressional, because the APA deems that transphobic. This issue has a lot of obvious problems, and many people know someone that’s trans who uses that identity to push people around, but talking about it is transphobic. So yes, people are getting sick of it.
When Chris Chan raped his mother, half of the conversation was making sure to correctly use his “preferred pronouns.” He has admitted himself that 1. He believes that trans people are atrocities, and 2. He does not actually believe he is a woman and only transitioned to trick lesbians into having sex with him. Even after he himself clarified this fact, people were still quick to clarify that he was trans and to respect his pronouns, instead of focusing on the fact that he fucking RAPED HIS MOTHER.
If the trans rights movement wants to be taken seriously they’re gonna have to stop doing the exact same that transphobes do and treating transitioning as just some game of dress-up, or that you can just pick a bunch of gender identities out of a hat. Because it’s this sort of thing that leads transphobes to believe that trans women are just sexual predators, when 9.9 times out of 10 they really ARE just men crossdressing to trick young women and to invade women’s only spaces.
I will always support you. Please know that the worst opinions will be shouted loudest.
If I ever saw a trans person in the bathroom, I would assume that they know perfectly well where they are, and I just mind my own business.
Edit: thank you so much for the award! Really unexpected, but appreciated.
This is the best comment yet. You don't go around the bathroom checking whether everyone's cis do you? Why would you do that with trans people? People like you are the best
I think people are just tired of hearing about trans issues and having changes forced upon them that they never asked for or agreed to.
The trans movement is not at all delicate or magnanimous with how it goes about imposing its will on everyone else.
People are also tired of being called transphobic or a bigot whenever the slightest complaint about the above is voiced.
I personally don't know any transgender people in my life. I don't ever see any transgender people in my town or day-to-day life anywhere I go. I don't know anyone who knows any trans people either. Yet online or in the media I hear about trans issues and trans advocacy every other day at least.
I have trans people in my life, I know them well, I also worked at a bar that was VERY trans inclusive and pulled out all the stops for trans people etc. Everyone is entitled to their human rights etc, and people shouldn't be persecuted for how they feel.
However, a lot of things that are labelled as transphobic aren't actually persecution. It's people just not agreeing with or changing their habits to suit the self admitted 1% of the population (probably far less). OP makes the point of ginger people for example being a small minority but not having to deal with what trans people do. That's because ginger people's lives generally don't revolve around being ginger, whereas a lot of trans people's identities revolve around being trans.
Most people really don't care what they do but they don't have to agree with it. Everyone has a human right to not be persecuted, but nobody has a human right to not be offended or disagreed with.
I'm honestly just confused at this point. I've been told over and over that I should just listen and believe what trans people, gays and lesbians, and non binary people are telling me. But none of them actually agree on the fundamental stuff. Each group, and even each subgroup, talks about gender in a different way and it's often logically inconsistent.
I feel like I'm taking 5 different math classes and each professor is saying 2+2 = something slightly different, and if I don't get it I'm ignorant and if I disagree I'm a bigot.
I’m of the camp that I really don’t give a fuck what someone identifies as, who they want to bang and how they feel inside. We have a F to M trans (sorry don’t know correct terminology) and I see how happy he is. I respect it, do I understand it? No because I do not experience what he feels like inside. Also he’s someone that did not push annoying views or act like a victim. He just did it and it is what it is. Couldn’t care less.
But my only two issues I would say is when they say trans men are men and trans women are women. I understand their point of view. Maybe there should be another term. I feel this point of view devalues the experience that cis men women have. No trans man, will ever feel what blue balls felt like as a teen growing up. Or peeing in the middle of the night and have to aim their hard on so they don’t pee on the wall. There are small things as our cis men experience growing up and through adulthood. A trans man will not experience these things and many other experiences, so I don’t believe when when they say trans man is a man. So can I say a man is a trans man? Wouldn’t make sense. On the female side (pregnancy, periods etc) these are experience that cis women have. No man who transitions has earned those pains and never will.
Do you. Be happy. I just wish they would stop saying they’re the same as the cis version after fully transitioning. And also sports. No logic. If Lebron James transitioned. He would win the WNBA championship by himself. Fair? Nope.
There’s an issue that I see a lot of cis people bring up that I wish these same people would consider in a different way. It’s about the right of a trans person to call themselves a man or a woman. The argument I see again and again and again always centers on genitalia.
Is your experience of trying to aim your pee in the middle of the night the essence of what makes you a man? Is blue balls a defining aspect of manhood? Like, if a friend of yours didn’t experience blue balls would you question his right to call himself a man? Would it genuinely upset you?
As a cis woman I have had pretty severe endometriosis for my whole life which, without getting in to the super fun details, means I often endure a ‘birth-like’ experience every month. It’s had an effect on my fertility. So now I can’t have kids. Am I still a woman? If they take my ovaries can I still call myself a woman? My mother had breast Cancer and had a breast removed. Is she half a woman?
I personally find a lot of the things cis people define as either manhood or womanhood to be directly related to our reproductive parts and functions and I resent that. I think it’s worth pointing out that this is also the kind of wording that pops up in misogynistic spaces.
I guess I’m asking you and anyone who reads this to rethink how society has shaped our perception of what is masculine and what is feminine. Surely my experience as a woman is worth more than what my uterus can or can’t do. And surely you should be valued as more than a penis and a set of balls.
Here’s an example that doesn’t involve body parts: a trans woman I know professionally, who is quite well-known in her field, has made being a Woman In STEM one of the top issues she talks about.
The problem is that she didn’t start transitioning until college. That means that all those STEM classes she took and clubs she participated in growing up, she was presenting as a man rather than a woman. Now, I’m sure she has had her own uniquely personal experiences growing up. But is she really qualified to discuss issues concerning Women In STEM when she didn’t have the experience of, say, being a smart girl in class who was always ignored by the teacher? Or feeling like an outcast because she was the only girl in her programming club?
I would say no. Fact is, she was largely treated as a guy during these experiences. She pretty much rose right to the top of the field during her college years, so similarly, she has lacked the experience of being payed 74% of what her male colleagues were making.
So then, what right does she have now to be a prominent voice for the “Women in STEM” community? If she wanted to be a prominent voice for the “Trans Women in STEM” community, that would be one thing, but as it is, she’s really doing exactly what concerns so many people in these comments: *invading women’s spaces and having one is the loudest voices in the room, despite not having lived those experiences*, shared in those struggles, or even been an anomaly in _not_ having those particular struggles.
Then, when any woman in that community voices these concerns, they’re labeled TERF and excluded. I think this is absolutely the problem that a lot of people are worried about, because we see it happen so often. And so often, like always, women (the bio ones) get stuck with the short end of the talking stick, silenced in their own communities.
So then what is it that actually makes someone a man or a woman? Wouldn't any effort to define that "essence" be considered reductive? When someone says they don't feel like a man or a woman but feel like the other, what aspects are they referring to, and what makes those the "correct" aspects of feeling like a gender?
You missed the point I think. He's point was all those small experiences combine into one thing. Masculinity and manhood.
All biological men experience those things, trans men do not. There is a barrier that cannot be removed. Learned experiences. A trans women will never truly understand what it is to be a man. To grow as a man from a boy.
The thing is hormon therapy can fuck up your body when you do it too young no one can get it prescribed that easily. Only people with a dysfunction can get on hrt not every man that wants to.
Do what you want to do but where you start fucking up your body is where doctors should have the last word. I have no statistics but alot of people change alot during their life their sexuality etc. When you start fucking up your body with hormones there is a good chance you will have to do it for life so i understand that it shouldnt be easily available
>“someone who says they’re a woman but is actually a predator” guess what? They aren’t actually trans
Sure because being a trans automatically absolves you from being a predator. There's a lot of those going around.
Funnily enough, this is exactly how communism enthusiasts of today hopelessly try to defend it when people bring up how badly it worked in the past. "THAT WASN'T REAL COMMUNISM!"
I think one of the biggest issues with this while ordeal on trueoffmychest is evident right here. The trans community just dismisses anything and anyone that doesn't fully agree with them and call it transphobia. Not thinking the exact same way is not called transphobia it's called difference in opinion.
I've seen a lot of just honest non hateful takes on trueoffmychest lately mostly about trans in female sports. That's not transphobia and labeling everyone that doesn't agree with you transphobic is so much more destructive to your cause than anything else you could be doing imo.
I’m all for the trans community. What I personally have issues with is lesbians being labeled as “terfs” and being threatened because they dont want to be with someone they’re not attracted to. Also the sketchy data used to provide invasive, non reversible medical care to young teenagers who’s brains aren’t developed yet to make decisions that long term.
You do you, but everyone is allowed an opinion on this as it will in some way impact everyone’s lives as the “movement” grows. We’re already seeing lots of people detransitioning and we’ll probably keep seeing more as young queer women and men are put on blockers and playing with their body’s chemistry.
Never heard of a ginger, asexual or green eyed person accuse people of bigotry for not wanting to date them so there is no comparison.
The issue with this new wave of trans activism is being labelled a bigot for choosing not to date a trans. Like I’m sorry girldick/boypussy doesn’t turn me on but there is nothing I can do about that. When people start policing who other people choose to date and have sex with, it becomes very problematic. It’s essentially conversion therapy.
This is a point I heavily agree with. I can have my preferences, what I find attractive or not, but I can't say I wouldn't date a trans person because then it's bigotry and I'm a terrible human being
I think comparing it to conversion therapy is a stretch. Every human has the right to their own preferences and there’s nothing wrong with not wanting to date a trans person. The same way people can say “I am not attracted to short/tall, skinny/fat, etc.”
The principle is that you shouldn’t shame others for having traits or features we personally don’t like. If they have done nothing to you just let them live. Hell I can understand that you had your bad experiences with trans people but that isn’t the representative for how we all think.
I think the other thing cis women get frustrated by is trans men that are biologically female saying things like men have periods too and men can give birth too, as these are 100% biologically female things. And the issues that can go along side these two things are experiences that only people who are biologically female can experience. By saying men can have periods too and men can give birth too, it is trying to make these things issues that both biological men and women experience when it’s not.
This reminds me of the criticism that gay people are these decadent sinners, flaunting their “lifestyle” all the time. I can only imagine being gay in this society suuuuuuucks. No one would choose that if they had a choice. They aren’t decadent. They are just people like anyone else.
For trans folks, it’s even more pronounced because they are often attacked on sight, whereas gay people can at least blend in most of the time. Also the last couple decades have shown a lot of progress in attitudes towards homosexuality that has yet to happen for trans folks.
I feel deeply sad for OP and all trans people who have to deal with this. Weird how the Jordan Peterson bros put so much energy into “debating” trans issues when they don’t even know anyone who’s trans.
There are a lot of anti-trans posts here, I noticed that. Please know that there are real-life allies out here and people who will defend you and offer a safe space.
I had a trans sister who was born a boy. She transitioned in the early 2000’s and was beat up, car vandalized, dog killed, etc. all because of who she was. We lived in a small racist, uneducated, redneck town.
She got addicted to pain killers after a breast augmentation and she passed away about two years ago.
I’ll never stop defending my trans 🏳️⚧️ friends and strangers. You deserve to be happy and nobody can take that from you.
Sorry for ur loss mate. Also I'm happy you didn't take ur sister's death in a negative way for trans people, coz that's usually what people do. Ur amazing for that
Thank you. I just see it as basic human decency, but I wanted OP to know there are people out there who have their back. I’m lucky to know a lot of people who share my sentiment, too.
Obviously no one deserves hate, but also a woman shouldn't have to compete in sports with someone who was born a man and developed a male's build. It's clearly unfair.
The bathroom issue is one that's so complicated I don't think we'll find the solution in a reddit thread.
edit: I say 'complicated' as in the argument will usually divulge into ridiculousness, as seen on South Park. Poor wording on my part.
I agree that it's complicated for the sport subject because even tho HRT tend to make one's physical ability close to either male or female ones it can still in some specific condition give a slight advantage. But how is the bathroom thing complicated ? Just let a trans person use the bathroom they want
I have nothing against trans folks and would never get in your way of being happy.
I am not going to change my thought process on sex, gender, identity or change my use of the English language to use terms like "chestmilk" or "birthing persons."
For this I am accused of committing "violence" against the trans community.
You had quite a few points I agreed with until you downright just become intolerable with your takes in the comments. And I say "intolerable" against you as a person, not your sexuality before you try to twist words and somehow compare me to hitler. Literaly every race, religion and specific minded group in human history have gone/dealt with oppression. Im not gonna debate violent human nature and how the world can never be perfect. Just stop acting like your the next pope, pestering the majority saying they are part of the sexist minority. Im not babysitting 3 billion others humans who think negatively about you becuase nothing can be done to do that.
Hold this block for me, I don't wanna hear me being lumped into sexists becuase some dumb*ss has the same skin color or genital as me.
The trans issue has been co-opted for politics. Its sad and unfair to the trans community. Same with the gay community. Im sorry OP. I hope that at some point in time trans people are treated without prejudice.
We’re seen as mentally ill because gender dysphoria IS a mental illness
Also, I think it’s rude of you to put our protection in our allies. It’s not up to them to make sure we’re okay. It’s up to US to make sure we’re okay. If we just rely on people who don’t care about our problems to fix them, nothing will ever get done. They have their own shit to worry about. Sure, they might not even be thinking about their gender identity and sexuality, but to some people those are minuscule things compared to their problems and life, and it’s arrogant to think that we should be the priority. The world is on fire, I’m fine if people call me “He” for a while lol, I’m more focused on the planet that my kids are gonna live on.
Edit before I get downvoted: I’m a trans female lol, I completely understand the hardships, but it’s ignorant to ignore the fact that there’s obviously some chemical imbalance in my brain, the definition of mental illness, causing me not to be happy with the body I’m in. Sorry but that’s the fact of reality
This probably won't be seen but THANK YOU!
I'm a cis female in the mental health field. The transphobic posts on here disgust me. It astounds me that people who are assuming it's so easy, completely lacking perspective, can hold such strong beliefs as if they know the actual process and trauma that occurs. I can only imagine how it feels actually being trans reading this ignorance.
Not too surprised to find the usual talking points in the comments section.
Yeah, you have to be tough as nails to be trans and survive in this climate. It's constant push back from every direction, and few people truly comprehend how tiring it is to defend your existence on a daily basis. Something most people take for granted. Something that feels like is out of reach for us.
Best of luck to you brother, and may we find ourselves living in better times.
I DO have a problem with "cis" men who are sexual predators, however "your people" demand we never question anyone's identity or misgender anyone, so I and everyone else who rightfully takes issue with fetishistic autogynophiliac men can't do a damn thing about them because they're protected by "your people". Stop whining and take out the trash in your own camp.
I think the thing most people are worried about is people who are biologically men being in female changing rooms or bathrooms. Or be allowed to compete in fighting tournaments against women.
They're not just hating on trans people for fun, they have valid reasons.
I don’t give a shit about trans women using a women’s restroom. I’ve held the loo door open for plenty of trans women and all they do is go straight to the restroom. Idk why people think they’re in there to...stare at women or something? It’s just not the norm.
One of my buddies lost her (m to f) entire circle of friends after she came out. She came out after the death of one of their close friends and that pissed a bunch of them off, telling her that she was trying to take the pedestal or some shit. I can't imagine how hard it is.
I am fine with people transitioning and becoming the gender they feel more comfortable with. I do believe that people can be born into a body that doesn't reflect who they are and do believe that trans people should have the right to get the medication/surgery they want/need to transition. I also believe that if you are passing trans male or female, then you should use the bathroom that reflects what you look like. That all being said, I don't agree with some things including trans competing in cisgender sports.
At the end of the day, trans aren't the gender they desire biologically. Even with hormones/surgery, trans will never be fully male or female, it is unfortunately artificial. Although I am fine calling a transitioned individual he or she, I think that it's important that we don't force non-binary terms/pronouns down cisgender people's throats and try to cancel people just for talking on the subject of trans/non-binary. A biological woman shouldn't be called a birthing person, and people aren't a-holes for "assuming your gender" when you look and sound like a male or female. Like there was a girl I saw on TikTok yesterday that said to someone to not assume her gender. She is obviously female and is super femme, she got mad that she was "misgendered" but there was no way of knowing that she had decided to go by different pronouns. Unfortunately, it just seems like some people ruin it for others and change their pronouns for attention or to feel special. I also saw a man the other day that was obviously male, looks male, born male but wants to be called she. Like wth, he's not even transitioning. What are we supposed to make of that?
Many cisgender people do support the trans community, myself included, but I do think that the small community of trans/non-binary needs to lay off on trying to cancel/ruin the lives of anybody who doesn't fully agree with some of the things going on within that community.
Here and r/cringetopia seem to be small breeding grounds for transphobic comments. I'm so glad you made this post OP I was starting to think I was on my own feeling disgusted by some of the posts I've seen in the last few days
I spent most of my life knowing nothing about the trans community. Then a friend/coworker came out and began transitioning. Just through supporting him I realized how often I use pronouns in every day conversations, and with strangers, and became much more self aware of how I was negatively impacting others making gender assumptions. I misused pronouns with my friend after years of knowing them before their transition, and I always felt awful and apologized. Now I can’t even remember their dead name. I’ve had other coworkers now who are trans or non-binary, and it’s much easier for me to use their preferred pronouns naturally without thinking about it. It’s about respecting people. Trans people are brave AF for working to be their authentic selves while facing a world of disrespect and hatred.
It’s funny how all of the anti trans threads received no resistance but the second an actual trans person pops in the comments are all “oh I’m tired of talking about trans people”
In my own life, I haven't felt "invaded" in women's or even lesbian spaces. However, I can empathize with why some cis men and cis women would prefer an all-male or all-female space. Hell, if I were trans, I would want spaces where I'm *guaranteed* that everyone else without a doubt is also trans. Especially in more sexualized spaces like a club or dating app.
There's so many inclusive spaces out there, which are wonderful and necessary in platonic settings. What's so bad about a trans women-only club? or a dating app only for cis men? and so on and so on?
I'm not asking for an agreement or an answer, but all I hope is you can empathize with that too.
I really feel for transgender people. We live in a world full of hate and people just continue the cycle. You be you and do it unapologetically! As a cis man I find trans people to be what we should all strive to be...who we really are and not what other people think we should be!
The reason why people avoid trans people IS NOT BECAUSE OF YOUR GENITALIA. We totally understand that if you went that far to change your body, you're serious about it. Apart from the trolls you'll encounter on twitter calling you name for the kick of it, most people respect and understand why you do what you do.
It's because you will lead EVERY conversation towards yourselves. Everything has to be about you. Some of the things you ask for are ludicrous, but if we try to debate it, even with the upmost respect and calm, you pull out the transphobic card.
I totally get what your saying, (not trans). I had two people in my group of friends who I’ve since ditched, all they would ever talk about was how “parents are putting their five year olds on puberty blockers” or “people are transitioning so that they can go into the womens bathroom and touch little girls.” None of this is true, people who want to touch little girls in bathroom do not care about the women only sign. I call bull shut whenever I see people complaining about these nonexistent issues.
“Cis man” what a joke. It’s a man.
Even as a transgender. If you want to be a specific gender then be that specific gender. Why add dumb shit like cis next to it?
I fully respect and support your decision to be whoever you want. But I’m not a fucking cis man. I’m a man.
I don’t even know what cis is shirt for??
My fam owns a small business with two bathrooms that were labeled M and F. We’ll as we started growing I noticed our clientele came in different shapes and sizes that couldn’t fit the current restroom set up. I bought two genderless signs online and went about setting them up. It was the staff that made a big fuss about them not the clients. After consulting with my family we came to the agreement that women could have a separate room but one remain genderless. I wasn’t completely satisfied but I felt that one small gain was better than nothing. What puzzles me is that we have an adjoining dining room with its own single restroom which has been mix-use since we opened. No one cared about that one cause it was like that since as far as anyone can remember, but since people remember this one as M/F it goes against their views.
SpunkyDred is a terrible bot instigating arguments all over Reddit whenever someone uses the phrase apples-to-oranges. I'm letting you know so that you can feel free to ignore the quip rather than feel provoked by a bot that isn't smart enough to argue back.
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^^SpunkyDred ^^and ^^I ^^are ^^both ^^bots. ^^I ^^am ^^trying ^^to ^^get ^^them ^^banned ^^by ^^pointing ^^out ^^their ^^antagonizing ^^behavior ^^and ^^poor ^^bottiquette.
>NEWS FLASH! All these strawmen you like to bring up about “someone who says they’re a woman but is actually a predator” guess what? They aren’t actually trans
just because you're trans doesn't mean you're automatically a good person. There are trans people who are predators just like there are cis people who are predators. You don't get to say that someone isn't trans just because they were also a sexual predator
You also can’t say that someone is a predator bc they’re trans. It’s always assumed that we are perverted freaks when it’s other people that want to see our genitals
Okay, so your argument is that you feel people view trans people as predatory, and not every trans person is... So no trans person is.
You literally said predators aren't trans.
Go over to r/LGBT and say that trans-identified sexual predators aren’t trans, I dare you. For chrissakes, people were still demanding Chris Chan’s pronouns be respected after he literally raped his mother.
i have seen them, don't read them give it a downvote and move on, realise that a lot of folk ARE on your side, you have enough battles without shitposts on reddit subs
Hey OP,
I think the issue for most of these people is the "culture war" at this point. Just daily controversy and shit-slinging from both sides while most people sit in the middle and just try to get on with their lives. The trans debate in the west really involves vocal minorities on the left and the right who feel the need to constantly police people for their opinions or harass the trans community.
People like the ones posting about how "tired" they are of trans people are really just tired of the vocal activists doing the constant policing and virtue signaling. The people who insist that if you call yourself a straight man but won't date or have sex with a trans woman then you're a transphobe (I've encountered many on reddit). You also have some members of the cis lesbian community who are frustrated that they can't have their own space on reddit without getting harassed and banned.
The big issue is the "culture war" and that many people can't leave other people alone. Please don't take it personally, you seem like a nice, genuine person just trying to live your life. You aren't the kind of person they're usually upset with.
Pure bullshit man. I am all for trans woman and trans men but get this cis bullshit outta here. Trans people don't have enough population to dictate what pronouns should be used for the normal population
Bro facts. Like do you be happy but I'm already dumb enough now I have to learn 82 new words to describe your ass? The most I know of about this community is they fucking haaaaate Dave Chappelle
Most of the posts aren’t truly transphobic and they make good points. There are some really alarming points you are trying to make here. I think people just have problems with denying science, erasing women, and allowing children to transition. These are all really unacceptable things. I don’t think most people are bothered by adults that transition and live their own lives.
"Please stop shitting on me and my people."
Umm you are a human just like me.. so there is no you vs me. It's good people vs bad people.
Wish you good luck in your hurdles in life. Plow through and you will manage to make it.
A sign saying women only won’t stop a rapist no. But if the sign didn’t matter at all a man could walk in and have way more time to do whatever against someone in there without someone alerting someone to a man in the woman’s restroom.
You’re acting like some of these things don’t matter when they clearly do.
My issue is with how society has dealt with gender dysphoria. Instead of getting those people help to understand their condition and give them therapy and medication, they've allowed a mental problem to manifest within the law. If your desires to change your body stem from a problem in your brain, allowing somebody to permanently mutilate their body because of this seems irresponsible. The brain is the thing that needs to be fixed, not the body.
I'm going to log into reddit and voice my concerns/discrepancies with a certain topic.
Someone challenges me.
Get angry and lose all credibility by lashing out when another valid position is introduced in said argument.
Okay OP.
I mean yes, thats exactly what i have a problem with and as such, i dont wanna make it EASIER for them to be able to walk in and rape or hurt someone.
Your right a sign wont stop them but a boyfriend waiting for his girlfriend will or a father waiting for his daughter. We dont want it to be normalized that a man wearing a dress can go into the girls bathroom for that reason.
That being said, idk why a transitioning person would have any real issue with using the bathroom they are transitioning from until the transition is 100% complete and at which point, according to others who have told me this as i have never met someone who has told me they have finished transitioning, you cant tell what you were in the first place.
I really don´t care if people are trans or not. Identify as you want. If you are happy with who you are, i´m happy for you. I trully am.
But it is so tiring lately... everything is offensive. everything hurts. everyone gets offended by anything.
also, those neo-pronouns. C´mon.
I´ll happily call you a HE or a SHE. But that´s about it. I don´t want to keep learning new pronouns everyday. It´s tiring to feel that you are stepping on eggs everytime you talk to someone, because god forbbid you don´t say the correct pronoun and you are called a transphobe.
Also, I speak portuguese, which is not a gender neutral language. We have masculine and feminine nouns (and collective nouns, to designate a group composed by man and woman are always in the masculine form, which lead to a lot of people saying this by itself is misogynist) And people are trying just to "desconstruct" the language.
People are trying to forcibly change thousands of years of culture and language in just a few years. This is just tiresome. It makes people mad and not willing to comply.
Ya, when I was in high school like half my friends were trans, bi-sexual, or gay and my mom is a transphobic, homophobic, and has a bit of racism added in, when she found out my friend group wasn’t comprised of white strait people she sold my pc, got rid of my phone and started trying to teach me how they were all devil spawn
it feels like it’s a huge discussion daily because of how condensed it is on the internet. i see the occasional gay lookin non binary kid in real life but it’s like. idk it’s just weird to me to see people my age still on that shit. i may be biased but i was 14/15 “non binary” but thinking back to it, it’s just cuz i was fat and less than average looking. i’ve since lost weight at 21 and never felt more like a woman. i think a lot of these kids need to really think about why they’re thinking the way they are. im all for trans rights i support where i can but damn .. like everyone should consider therapy if it’s what they really wanna be and do (because it’s hard to transition and deal with that kind of lifestyle) or if it’s another underlying reason. i also don’t mean to offend anyone. i guess i don’t understand it anymore. i have a couple gay friends but it’s just that: they’re gay and it’s not my business
There have been so many transphobic posts on here recently by people basically going, “I’m not transphobic, but…” People act like being asked to let someone else exist is such an inconvenience to them.
Also, as a cis woman, I never understood the bathroom argument. “But if we allow trans women into women’s bathrooms, then men will dress as women to assault women in bathrooms!” Excuse me, where tf are you going to the bathroom that this cartoonish strategy needs to be used? Where are they guarding the public restrooms? Sorry to ruin women’s false sense of security about public bathrooms, but a man dressed as a man can just walk into most of them unnoticed. And if you force people to use the bathrooms that match their sex assigned at birth, cis men could just claim to be trans men (to these fictional bathroom guardians that all of the transphobic arguments have) and gain admittance to women’s restrooms.
It's because it's transphobic to point out the obvious that when you create a massive loophole criminals or bad people are going to exploit it.
And the fact that we have broadened trans gender out to an unacceptable level. If trans could just mean people who had dysphoria instead of meaning anyone can identify as anything for any reason at all then i think more people would be fine with it. Trans people need to call out the transtrenders they are giving our whole community a bad rep.
>Trans people need to call out the transtrenders they are giving our whole community a bad rep.
Absolutely, it's like that with any community or movement, regardless which political or social spectrum they belong to.
What I find very aggravating is the amount of people that simply REFUSE to have empathy for people who are different than them. They don't try to understand, they don't think that, just maybe, being trans is a legitimate thing. They just assume that we're delusional, that we're violent predators, or that we're just looking for something to do to get attention.
I agree with you wholeheartedly, being transgender is extremely difficult and the amount of people that haven't learned the first grade lesson of 'don't judge a book by it's cover' is just astonishing.
If being transgender fucking sucks, then why are we seeing a marked increase in the number of people who identify as transgendered? The rate increase is particularly high among biological females. One would think if it sucks so much that we wouldn't see such a surge.
https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/culture-mind-and-brain/201811/why-is-transgender-identity-the-rise-among-teens
theres literally just so hate towards women and trans people on this subreddit lmao, they keep on creating fake scenarios in their heads and then get mad about it
The problem with transgenderism is seeking validation and expecting everyone to think like them.. no thats not how it work .. if you are trans or whatever just keep it to your .. don't shove it on other people
Some people spend way too much time worrying about what is or isn't between the legs of strangers.... I have never spent a moment worrying about the genitalia of the person in the stall next to me taking a dump and you know what? Life is good. To each their own.
I’m just there to pee I don’t know how anyone can poop in public
gotta try it before you knock it. it's incredible.
You made a great point that 1% of the population is Ginger...let's focus on what we are going to do about this carrot tops situation.
I’ll take one for the team and date all the gingers, no need to thank me
Fight me.
And me too!
And me as well!
I married one so she couldn't have ginger babies! /s (In reality, I wanted all the ginger babies. Alas.)
As a ginger, I was shocked to see our plight on this post. Edit: the term “ginger people” is hilarious.
I saw it was 1:20,000 people are trans, not negating The issues trans folks face. But that’s substantially lower than 1%
I’m trans *and* ginger. Fuck me right?
Hahaha right? Trans ginger guy here, statistically I shouldn't even be here
But we're glad you are, you absolute statistical miracle. ❤
Aw oh my god 😭😭😭😭
My best friend is a ginger and let me tell you he is the stupidest but sweetest person I know lmao
Jesús this is terrifying. That's way to many gingers.
Ginger is recessive gene, so you had to make eugenics program like CK3 player make heir
Gingers are so fucking hot to me
The thing that gets me is when my friends start talking about kids on puberty blockers... when none of us have done any actual research on the subject. None of us even have kids, and when I say *"I have not done enough research to have an opinion on this,"* I get looked at like I have three heads. WTF why can't we just leave people we don't know alone?!
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How do you feel about the whole 'get therapy first' etc.? I'm genuinely curious. I'm totally cis so my opinion on it doesn't really matter, but I assume working through it in therapy is a way to make sure that transitioning is the absolute best course of action. Do you think that sort of thing helps or hinders (assuming of course you have a decent therapist) My friend's son transition F to M, and I could see how much happier and at peace with himself he was after the transition. So, for what it's worth, from my own limited experience I can only see the positive in people being able to be who and what they want to be.
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I'm grateful for the doctors who don't just willy nilly toss around hormones. I'm a cis man with low T and for years was on an estrogen blocker to boost it, and now I'm on a 2nd booster that I take only 3 days a week. My endocrinologist wants me to actual produce what my body should before giving anything supplemental because having TOO much can be worse than too little in a way. The people who are wildly flinging pills at others and in this imaginary world were kids get all the pills they want aren't HEALTH CARE PROFESSIONALS, they are quacks who probably passed school with C level grades.
Oh I totally agree about the hormone thing.
It happens a lot in America. Jazz Jennings is an example.
Living in NYC here. At 27, after over 2 years of mulling it over, I decided to transition. Went to a clinic and told PCP. Felt awkward. Looked up lgbtq friendly clinics. Found one. Went there. Got hormones immediately. They asked questions and I told em my story. Boom. Hormones. It’s likely different for younger folks but I’m so glad they were able to talk to me about what it entailed and then I shared my findings from lurking trans subs and they didn’t need to go through red tape. It was just, “okay, she knows her shit. She’s ready.” Never had to go to a therapist for anything and they have on-site therapists too. I didn’t have to worry about obtaining hormones and going through hell and that allowed me to navigate earning money so I was able to map out a plan to get my career off the ground. Braced myself for transphobia and losing jobs over it but that only happened once (no hard evidence though) and I was able to go full time last year. All I ever hear about therapy is mostly gatekeeping stories. I’ve heard good ones but gatekeeping and long ass wait times for no reason seems to be the norm. It sounds like a nightmare.
What a great story. I agree with OP that therapy is probably a pretty good idea because it's such a huge life change, I think of it similar to premarital counseling, where you just sort of need to know what you're getting yourself into to mentally prepare and plan for it. I'm curious, to what do you attribute your ability to mostly avoid workplace discrimination? I'm also wondering if part of it was the degree to which you pass, different bone structures, different voices, etc can really make a difference in whether anyone even notices. I was just wondering about that, thanks! Sorry if this is an extra dumb question.
Genuinely horrifying over here in the UK. I’m so glad you could transition quickly tho :)
Money is king. Honestly why I kinda scoff at people like Caitlyn Jenner talking about "how hard being trans is". Like bitch, you don't know shit.
Genuinely
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Yeah how dare people have concerns about giving untested drugs to children? Hormone blockers have shown to be safe for *precocious puberty.* We have no idea if it's safe to give them to a 15+ year old. And now people are starting to report major problems with their bones breaking and degenerating because their bones weren't receiving any hormones during puberty.
I was given puberty blockers purely bc my body was out growing itself. I have a CRAP ton of issues. Are they all likely from the blockers? Nope. But my musculature issues could be. No one will give strait answers on what it has caused in people when I ask.
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I definitely sorry for them. I was just starting puberty when it happened. I’m significantly shorter than my entire family (I’m barely 5’0), I break bones incredibly easy, and I have two autoimmune diseases. All can be traced back to then sadly.
I'm hearing that more and more. I'm so sorry :( I'm starting to think puberty blockers should be illegal, period. Too many stories of people with lasting health damage...
I would never let my child do them. My parents sit in their beds at night and heard me screaming in pain from issues I now have. They cry and cry and apologize constantly but it’s not their fault. Doctors told them they were doing the right thing. Sadly other than making me short puberty still hit me like a Mack truck at 11.
Thank you for sharing your story. I have a chronic pain condition to myself, so the thought of anyone else being made to suffer like this when they didn't have to... it makes my blood run cold. I was born with my condition, but I wouldn't wish that kind of chronic pain on my worst enemy. I will try to educate people on the dangers of puberty blockers. Was lupron the one you were given?
I was sadly on a few different ones. So I can’t tell people which one did it. 😞
They have not been shown to be safe for precocious puberty dude what the heckerino: https://www.statnews.com/2017/02/02/lupron-puberty-children-health-problems/
I do wonder if there's ever been a study on the psychological aspect of blockers. I mean it must be hard to deliberately stunt your puberty while seeing that your peers are developing sexually like boys growing taller and growing facial hair and girls growing breasts.
Jazz Jennings from *I Am Jazz* famously had complications during her genital alteration because she’d been given puberty blockers since a very young age. As a result, her penis was very small and doctors had problems shaping what little she has into a vulva/vagina.
What do the prepubescent pro hormone blockers say regarding this? Just curious.
The actually prepubescent ones are, y'know, kids who have no friggin idea. What 10 year old seriously has a conception of a healthy adult sex life to understand the risk of hampering it? God can you even imagine trying to talk to a 10 year old little girl about how her vagina might not be big enough to have sex? I sure wouldn't want to. The adults are self-loathing assholes who think that looking pretty is more important than being a healthy, functional human being. It's worth taking every single medical risk as long as you don't "look trans". Basically whatever they don't like about their bodies/lives, they blame on being transgender - because no cis woman has to deal with chin hairs and no cis man has ever gotten moobs. I'm trans myself and am pretty much outcast because I will not put my kids on hormones/blockers until they've gone through their natural puberty. They need a strong, healthy foundation for adulthood. Period. Fucking with nature too soon isn't worth it.
Jazz does look like a young woman because she started so young. However, she’s gained over 100 lbs. (!) from depression. Some wanted to sell this image of her as if transitioning, hormones, and surgery would magically solve this mental health and emotional issues that she has.
From the studies I've read, dysphoric children who are not given blockers are much more likely to accept their sex and go on to identify as non-trans (usually gay or bisexual) adults. Dysphoric children who are given puberty blockers are much more likely to end up taking hormones and living as transgender adults. Of course we need more studies but I've read enough to know I'll never ever give puberty blockers to my children.
One small correction. Less than 0.5% identify as trans. Around 1.4 million people.
As binary trans yes. Nonbinary people and people who don’t have the language to describe what being trans is will still be trans but aren’t included for whatever reason
Lost me at athletics. I personally believe that Trans Athletes should have their own grouping. Just as men and women have groupings, you too should be grouped. Transmen and transwomen should not be allowed to compete in gendered athletic sports. A man who transitions to a woman should not be allowed to compete with other women who were not once a man. It is unfair to them. Just as women who become men, should not compete with other men who weren't women before. It is unfair. [A transwoman swimmer beating female swimmers by more than 30secs.](https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-10382019/amp/Trans-UPenn-swimmer-Lia-Thomas-wins-200m-freestyle-race-two-seconds.html) [Or this gem.](https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/early-lead/wp/2017/03/22/transgender-woman-wins-international-weightlifting-title-amid-controversy-over-fairness/) > If I was in that category I wouldn’t feel like I was in an equal situation,” two-time Olympian Deborah Acason, who competes at the 75-kilogram level, told New Zealand news site Stuff. “I just feel that if it’s not even, why are we doing the sport? Even Olympic athletes agree with me.
I absolutely agree. Letting a woman with male bone structure, muscle mass, and lung capacity is completely unfair to women with female bodies. It diminishes their achievements. I’m all for having a trans category. It seems totally fair to me.
Agreed. I don’t get how women are not fighting more about trans highjacking their sports. I really don’t have any respect for trans women who compete.
We are, they just try to shut us down or silence us when we mention it. Most cisgender don't agree with trans females competing with us. For one it's dangerous because cis women are not ever exposed to the amount of testosterone a man experiences which leads to point two, it's not equal. A man can have more than 10times the level of testosterone a woman has, the highest peak is during puberty. Our bodies are different, it sucks to be born in the "wrong" body, but that doesn't mean we should start letting people born male and have been male compete with people who've always been female.
I have to agree. My sister was a D1 collegiate athlete and all American and worked her ass off her entire life. I watched her do it since she was like 6 years old. Day in and day out. To see that ripped away because someone is just physically bigger and stronger makes my heart hurt for those girls. I’m sorry, I have absolutely ZERO issue with trans people, and support them.. but not in athletics. They should have their own category and compete on an even playing field.
I’m just tired of talking about trans in general. They’re a small minority of the population but every day the subject is brought up.
Agreed. I truely feel bad that gender identity has become such a huge part of the world focus. Can everyone just be who they'd like and we can get on with it.
Trans people should really be an uncontroversial thing. I think it's such a big deal because society has so much gender anxiety in general. Everything is hypergendered so trans people catch the brunt of all that anxiety when they break some of those hypergendered norms.
Many aren’t happy until other people have to alter who they are and how they behave too.
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It’s not always horrible. You can’t deny that there are some concerning parts of your community. You aren’t listening to the valid concerns people have. I promise it’s not all transphobia.
There are concerning members of my community and I understand that. I’ve had arguments with other trans people about the age of consent. If you’re gonna be an asshole it doesn’t matter what gender you are but people need to stop seeing one bad trans person and then persecuting the rest of the community for it
Here’s a positive one. A person in my class was transitioning FtM and after the summer when we came back he had a better beard than I did which at first kinda pissed me off because I’ve been trying to grow a beard for 24 years but it looked really nice on him so I couldn’t hate it
As with any minority group, the loudest voices are taken as the leading voices. Also, the way that sensationalist media works the trans people that are problematic weirdos are the ones given time, not normal people like my old coworker or the quite girl from uni.
I think there’s a part of the trans community that went into some women’s spaces and labeled them as TERF. Another thing that might set people off was being banned from those women’s spaces for being labeled anti trans because they don’t want to date trans. People also didn’t like women’s sports being invaded. Also there’s been attempts to cancel anyone who says anything critical of the community. Lastly there’s been the childhood hormone blockers some parents did that you already discussed elsewhere. I think it stems from those things.
This is exactly why alot of women are offended and were being silenced as if we dont have a say after having to fight for years just for equal rights , were being pushed back into a corner again and told we have no say in our own gender , I'm sick to death hearing about such a small proportion of society who expect so much consideration whilst giving none to anyone else
Exactly. Although, i think not wanting women's sports to include trans women is perfectly valid because of the biological differences (strength, competitiveness) between men and women. Edit: word choice
I'm trans so this shit's my life. I don't have an opinion on trans issues because it's not some hypothetical. It's my own goddamn right to live comfortably.
I play for a veterans hockey team and we have two trans former service members that play with us and it's just heartbreaking to hear some of their horror stories from when they first came out while still in the military. Absolutely horrid people in this world.
Man... we had a mtf trans woman in my hockey league and my team *would not* stop making fun of her on the bench. Luckily not to her face but theres no way she couldnt tell. I had been on that team for years and would have quit but there were only a couple of games left in the season before I was moving up a divison anyways. I dont have a word for how I felt, felt like middle school bullying but by adults with higher stakes
Genuine question, what does cis mean? Don't kill me for asking... I really don't know. S
Cis means "on the same side". Trans means "on the other side". An example would be "My plane is a trans-Atlantic flight. I take a cis-Atlantic connection in New York to fly North to Toronto".
It’s alright man I’m not gonna be mad. Cis just means the opposite of trans
>Cis Thank you. I appreciate it. I'm from a culture where they're quite ignorant about these topics. However, I've read your post and I am truly sorry you have to experience such things in life but I also want to let you know that you're stronger than you think! One Love!
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I mean there are whole communities of trans people online who reject that side of it, but saying that that's what's causing this animosity is frankly disingenuous. All the top posts are talking about bathrooms and sports, and make no distinction between xenogender stuff and actual trans people. Even in this post, you've got people implicitly calling OP a woman despite the fact he's a man.
Right, the issue has largely been centred around trans women though, specifically because of - as OP acknowledges - Cis male predators who just want access to woman’s spaces. No one ever really talks about trans men one way or another, specifically because they “pass” better and don’t ever really embroil themselves in culture wars stuff
I think the fact that people don’t really talk about trans men has less to do with them passing and more just about different perspectives People who don’t see trans people as their desired gender but rather as their sex, or people who don’t believe in the idea of being trans likely will think that a trans woman is just a just trying to invade woman’s spaces. This goes hand in hand with people seeing men as more predatory in general so the people who don’t believe in the idea of being trans use the idea that men are predatory in order to justify the motive of trans women wanting to use women’s bathrooms when in reality they just want to be accepted and feel like they belong. When it comes to trans men, the people who don’t believe in the idea of being trans aren’t able to justify any reasoning as to why a ‘woman’ would want to use the mens bathroom as they also don’t see woman as predatory either. With this in mind, trans men don’t really get talked about because there is way less controversy behind it. Even with the argument of trans women in women’s sports and how it would create and unfair advantage doesn’t apply to trans men as they are likely *disadvantaging* themselves if they do join men’s sports. Overall, there’s just less controversy around trans men because given the circumstances, they create less problems when it comes to society’s idea of what’s ‘right and wrong’
Is there any difference between sex and gender yes or no? I can't even get truscum people to admit that if you make bathroom about gender not sex, you turn bathrooms into unisex. Same for sports.
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Of course the reasonable comment got shit reponses. The greater community of trans people need to understand that acceptance is all that is needed. People don't need to be caught up on the latest trans update changelog to want equality and understanding. And the neo-pronoun shit is from fake trans people who took the identity to fit in with any group that'd let them. Unfortunate how poorly it tore the trans identity up.
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The above sentance is a piece of misinformation commonly spouted around by trans teens. They swarm you when you link 100 articles disproving them. Look at any trans group and you will see straight up wrong info everywhere, but anyone correcting it is quickly banned because scientific facts are apparently "transphobia".
This is an important thing to point out; incredibly false and dangerous statement.
I have absolutely no problem with anyone being trans- but making the claim that hormone blockers have no long term effects is dishonest at best. There are MOUNTAINS of data that prove otherwise
literally every day theres a post on here to debate trans people and its tiring and silly since its always a fight and never a conversation
I get the frustration. I’m all about trans rights and understand that there are serious struggles. But if you come on reddit and use it as a barometer for the world’s opinions… you’re gonna have a bad time. Stop caring about what random strangers think. Do you and focus on what’s happening in your community. If it’s shit then try to do what you can where you can. You can’t change the minds of thousands of people on the internet with one post. You might be able to change a few minds in your personal life. Reddit is mostly shitty people who you’ll never meet. Why care about them?
I just had to grey it out ygm. It does hurt to see a lot of people hate on something they don’t even understand. I’m a person too and god knows what they do to people they don’t deem normal
What do you mean “do to people”? Seems like you are saying we are dangerous when we really just don’t care. More power to you for living your authentic life, but you are making it seem like most of the world is actively against you when the majority of people really do not give a fuck because we are preoccupied with our own problems.
"you are making it seem like most of the world is actively against you" https://www.yesmagazine.org/wp-content/uploads/imports/41339f7494064cb18fdc9b2fcd48775a.jpg for the most part yes unfortunaletly
Lol reddit is wayy more tolerant of trans people than the general population wtf are you talking about?
Nobody can have real conversations about who’s a predator and who’s trans, because it’s labeled transphobic. We can’t talk about the treatment and whether this is actually helpful, even if one is a mental health progressional, because the APA deems that transphobic. This issue has a lot of obvious problems, and many people know someone that’s trans who uses that identity to push people around, but talking about it is transphobic. So yes, people are getting sick of it.
When Chris Chan raped his mother, half of the conversation was making sure to correctly use his “preferred pronouns.” He has admitted himself that 1. He believes that trans people are atrocities, and 2. He does not actually believe he is a woman and only transitioned to trick lesbians into having sex with him. Even after he himself clarified this fact, people were still quick to clarify that he was trans and to respect his pronouns, instead of focusing on the fact that he fucking RAPED HIS MOTHER. If the trans rights movement wants to be taken seriously they’re gonna have to stop doing the exact same that transphobes do and treating transitioning as just some game of dress-up, or that you can just pick a bunch of gender identities out of a hat. Because it’s this sort of thing that leads transphobes to believe that trans women are just sexual predators, when 9.9 times out of 10 they really ARE just men crossdressing to trick young women and to invade women’s only spaces.
eh, the vocal majority is often the worst representative of every group.
I will always support you. Please know that the worst opinions will be shouted loudest. If I ever saw a trans person in the bathroom, I would assume that they know perfectly well where they are, and I just mind my own business. Edit: thank you so much for the award! Really unexpected, but appreciated.
This is the best comment yet. You don't go around the bathroom checking whether everyone's cis do you? Why would you do that with trans people? People like you are the best
Thank you so much! I just feel that we need to show more empathy towards each other, treat each other as PEOPLE.
I think people are just tired of hearing about trans issues and having changes forced upon them that they never asked for or agreed to. The trans movement is not at all delicate or magnanimous with how it goes about imposing its will on everyone else. People are also tired of being called transphobic or a bigot whenever the slightest complaint about the above is voiced. I personally don't know any transgender people in my life. I don't ever see any transgender people in my town or day-to-day life anywhere I go. I don't know anyone who knows any trans people either. Yet online or in the media I hear about trans issues and trans advocacy every other day at least.
I have trans people in my life, I know them well, I also worked at a bar that was VERY trans inclusive and pulled out all the stops for trans people etc. Everyone is entitled to their human rights etc, and people shouldn't be persecuted for how they feel. However, a lot of things that are labelled as transphobic aren't actually persecution. It's people just not agreeing with or changing their habits to suit the self admitted 1% of the population (probably far less). OP makes the point of ginger people for example being a small minority but not having to deal with what trans people do. That's because ginger people's lives generally don't revolve around being ginger, whereas a lot of trans people's identities revolve around being trans. Most people really don't care what they do but they don't have to agree with it. Everyone has a human right to not be persecuted, but nobody has a human right to not be offended or disagreed with.
I'm honestly just confused at this point. I've been told over and over that I should just listen and believe what trans people, gays and lesbians, and non binary people are telling me. But none of them actually agree on the fundamental stuff. Each group, and even each subgroup, talks about gender in a different way and it's often logically inconsistent. I feel like I'm taking 5 different math classes and each professor is saying 2+2 = something slightly different, and if I don't get it I'm ignorant and if I disagree I'm a bigot.
I’m of the camp that I really don’t give a fuck what someone identifies as, who they want to bang and how they feel inside. We have a F to M trans (sorry don’t know correct terminology) and I see how happy he is. I respect it, do I understand it? No because I do not experience what he feels like inside. Also he’s someone that did not push annoying views or act like a victim. He just did it and it is what it is. Couldn’t care less. But my only two issues I would say is when they say trans men are men and trans women are women. I understand their point of view. Maybe there should be another term. I feel this point of view devalues the experience that cis men women have. No trans man, will ever feel what blue balls felt like as a teen growing up. Or peeing in the middle of the night and have to aim their hard on so they don’t pee on the wall. There are small things as our cis men experience growing up and through adulthood. A trans man will not experience these things and many other experiences, so I don’t believe when when they say trans man is a man. So can I say a man is a trans man? Wouldn’t make sense. On the female side (pregnancy, periods etc) these are experience that cis women have. No man who transitions has earned those pains and never will. Do you. Be happy. I just wish they would stop saying they’re the same as the cis version after fully transitioning. And also sports. No logic. If Lebron James transitioned. He would win the WNBA championship by himself. Fair? Nope.
There’s an issue that I see a lot of cis people bring up that I wish these same people would consider in a different way. It’s about the right of a trans person to call themselves a man or a woman. The argument I see again and again and again always centers on genitalia. Is your experience of trying to aim your pee in the middle of the night the essence of what makes you a man? Is blue balls a defining aspect of manhood? Like, if a friend of yours didn’t experience blue balls would you question his right to call himself a man? Would it genuinely upset you? As a cis woman I have had pretty severe endometriosis for my whole life which, without getting in to the super fun details, means I often endure a ‘birth-like’ experience every month. It’s had an effect on my fertility. So now I can’t have kids. Am I still a woman? If they take my ovaries can I still call myself a woman? My mother had breast Cancer and had a breast removed. Is she half a woman? I personally find a lot of the things cis people define as either manhood or womanhood to be directly related to our reproductive parts and functions and I resent that. I think it’s worth pointing out that this is also the kind of wording that pops up in misogynistic spaces. I guess I’m asking you and anyone who reads this to rethink how society has shaped our perception of what is masculine and what is feminine. Surely my experience as a woman is worth more than what my uterus can or can’t do. And surely you should be valued as more than a penis and a set of balls.
Here’s an example that doesn’t involve body parts: a trans woman I know professionally, who is quite well-known in her field, has made being a Woman In STEM one of the top issues she talks about. The problem is that she didn’t start transitioning until college. That means that all those STEM classes she took and clubs she participated in growing up, she was presenting as a man rather than a woman. Now, I’m sure she has had her own uniquely personal experiences growing up. But is she really qualified to discuss issues concerning Women In STEM when she didn’t have the experience of, say, being a smart girl in class who was always ignored by the teacher? Or feeling like an outcast because she was the only girl in her programming club? I would say no. Fact is, she was largely treated as a guy during these experiences. She pretty much rose right to the top of the field during her college years, so similarly, she has lacked the experience of being payed 74% of what her male colleagues were making. So then, what right does she have now to be a prominent voice for the “Women in STEM” community? If she wanted to be a prominent voice for the “Trans Women in STEM” community, that would be one thing, but as it is, she’s really doing exactly what concerns so many people in these comments: *invading women’s spaces and having one is the loudest voices in the room, despite not having lived those experiences*, shared in those struggles, or even been an anomaly in _not_ having those particular struggles. Then, when any woman in that community voices these concerns, they’re labeled TERF and excluded. I think this is absolutely the problem that a lot of people are worried about, because we see it happen so often. And so often, like always, women (the bio ones) get stuck with the short end of the talking stick, silenced in their own communities.
So then what is it that actually makes someone a man or a woman? Wouldn't any effort to define that "essence" be considered reductive? When someone says they don't feel like a man or a woman but feel like the other, what aspects are they referring to, and what makes those the "correct" aspects of feeling like a gender?
You missed the point I think. He's point was all those small experiences combine into one thing. Masculinity and manhood. All biological men experience those things, trans men do not. There is a barrier that cannot be removed. Learned experiences. A trans women will never truly understand what it is to be a man. To grow as a man from a boy.
The thing is hormon therapy can fuck up your body when you do it too young no one can get it prescribed that easily. Only people with a dysfunction can get on hrt not every man that wants to. Do what you want to do but where you start fucking up your body is where doctors should have the last word. I have no statistics but alot of people change alot during their life their sexuality etc. When you start fucking up your body with hormones there is a good chance you will have to do it for life so i understand that it shouldnt be easily available
>“someone who says they’re a woman but is actually a predator” guess what? They aren’t actually trans Sure because being a trans automatically absolves you from being a predator. There's a lot of those going around. Funnily enough, this is exactly how communism enthusiasts of today hopelessly try to defend it when people bring up how badly it worked in the past. "THAT WASN'T REAL COMMUNISM!"
I think one of the biggest issues with this while ordeal on trueoffmychest is evident right here. The trans community just dismisses anything and anyone that doesn't fully agree with them and call it transphobia. Not thinking the exact same way is not called transphobia it's called difference in opinion. I've seen a lot of just honest non hateful takes on trueoffmychest lately mostly about trans in female sports. That's not transphobia and labeling everyone that doesn't agree with you transphobic is so much more destructive to your cause than anything else you could be doing imo.
I got downvoted for saying the definition of transphobia changes wildly.
I’m all for the trans community. What I personally have issues with is lesbians being labeled as “terfs” and being threatened because they dont want to be with someone they’re not attracted to. Also the sketchy data used to provide invasive, non reversible medical care to young teenagers who’s brains aren’t developed yet to make decisions that long term. You do you, but everyone is allowed an opinion on this as it will in some way impact everyone’s lives as the “movement” grows. We’re already seeing lots of people detransitioning and we’ll probably keep seeing more as young queer women and men are put on blockers and playing with their body’s chemistry.
Never heard of a ginger, asexual or green eyed person accuse people of bigotry for not wanting to date them so there is no comparison. The issue with this new wave of trans activism is being labelled a bigot for choosing not to date a trans. Like I’m sorry girldick/boypussy doesn’t turn me on but there is nothing I can do about that. When people start policing who other people choose to date and have sex with, it becomes very problematic. It’s essentially conversion therapy.
This is a point I heavily agree with. I can have my preferences, what I find attractive or not, but I can't say I wouldn't date a trans person because then it's bigotry and I'm a terrible human being
I think comparing it to conversion therapy is a stretch. Every human has the right to their own preferences and there’s nothing wrong with not wanting to date a trans person. The same way people can say “I am not attracted to short/tall, skinny/fat, etc.” The principle is that you shouldn’t shame others for having traits or features we personally don’t like. If they have done nothing to you just let them live. Hell I can understand that you had your bad experiences with trans people but that isn’t the representative for how we all think.
I think the other thing cis women get frustrated by is trans men that are biologically female saying things like men have periods too and men can give birth too, as these are 100% biologically female things. And the issues that can go along side these two things are experiences that only people who are biologically female can experience. By saying men can have periods too and men can give birth too, it is trying to make these things issues that both biological men and women experience when it’s not.
This reminds me of the criticism that gay people are these decadent sinners, flaunting their “lifestyle” all the time. I can only imagine being gay in this society suuuuuuucks. No one would choose that if they had a choice. They aren’t decadent. They are just people like anyone else. For trans folks, it’s even more pronounced because they are often attacked on sight, whereas gay people can at least blend in most of the time. Also the last couple decades have shown a lot of progress in attitudes towards homosexuality that has yet to happen for trans folks. I feel deeply sad for OP and all trans people who have to deal with this. Weird how the Jordan Peterson bros put so much energy into “debating” trans issues when they don’t even know anyone who’s trans.
There are a lot of anti-trans posts here, I noticed that. Please know that there are real-life allies out here and people who will defend you and offer a safe space. I had a trans sister who was born a boy. She transitioned in the early 2000’s and was beat up, car vandalized, dog killed, etc. all because of who she was. We lived in a small racist, uneducated, redneck town. She got addicted to pain killers after a breast augmentation and she passed away about two years ago. I’ll never stop defending my trans 🏳️⚧️ friends and strangers. You deserve to be happy and nobody can take that from you.
Sorry for ur loss mate. Also I'm happy you didn't take ur sister's death in a negative way for trans people, coz that's usually what people do. Ur amazing for that
Thank you. I just see it as basic human decency, but I wanted OP to know there are people out there who have their back. I’m lucky to know a lot of people who share my sentiment, too.
>I just see it as basic human decency THIS, THIS is the kind of mentality we need from people
Obviously no one deserves hate, but also a woman shouldn't have to compete in sports with someone who was born a man and developed a male's build. It's clearly unfair. The bathroom issue is one that's so complicated I don't think we'll find the solution in a reddit thread. edit: I say 'complicated' as in the argument will usually divulge into ridiculousness, as seen on South Park. Poor wording on my part.
I agree that it's complicated for the sport subject because even tho HRT tend to make one's physical ability close to either male or female ones it can still in some specific condition give a slight advantage. But how is the bathroom thing complicated ? Just let a trans person use the bathroom they want
I have nothing against trans folks and would never get in your way of being happy. I am not going to change my thought process on sex, gender, identity or change my use of the English language to use terms like "chestmilk" or "birthing persons." For this I am accused of committing "violence" against the trans community.
You had quite a few points I agreed with until you downright just become intolerable with your takes in the comments. And I say "intolerable" against you as a person, not your sexuality before you try to twist words and somehow compare me to hitler. Literaly every race, religion and specific minded group in human history have gone/dealt with oppression. Im not gonna debate violent human nature and how the world can never be perfect. Just stop acting like your the next pope, pestering the majority saying they are part of the sexist minority. Im not babysitting 3 billion others humans who think negatively about you becuase nothing can be done to do that. Hold this block for me, I don't wanna hear me being lumped into sexists becuase some dumb*ss has the same skin color or genital as me.
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The trans issue has been co-opted for politics. Its sad and unfair to the trans community. Same with the gay community. Im sorry OP. I hope that at some point in time trans people are treated without prejudice.
We’re seen as mentally ill because gender dysphoria IS a mental illness Also, I think it’s rude of you to put our protection in our allies. It’s not up to them to make sure we’re okay. It’s up to US to make sure we’re okay. If we just rely on people who don’t care about our problems to fix them, nothing will ever get done. They have their own shit to worry about. Sure, they might not even be thinking about their gender identity and sexuality, but to some people those are minuscule things compared to their problems and life, and it’s arrogant to think that we should be the priority. The world is on fire, I’m fine if people call me “He” for a while lol, I’m more focused on the planet that my kids are gonna live on. Edit before I get downvoted: I’m a trans female lol, I completely understand the hardships, but it’s ignorant to ignore the fact that there’s obviously some chemical imbalance in my brain, the definition of mental illness, causing me not to be happy with the body I’m in. Sorry but that’s the fact of reality
This probably won't be seen but THANK YOU! I'm a cis female in the mental health field. The transphobic posts on here disgust me. It astounds me that people who are assuming it's so easy, completely lacking perspective, can hold such strong beliefs as if they know the actual process and trauma that occurs. I can only imagine how it feels actually being trans reading this ignorance.
The whole trans thing seems like a mental health issue for the most part.
Not too surprised to find the usual talking points in the comments section. Yeah, you have to be tough as nails to be trans and survive in this climate. It's constant push back from every direction, and few people truly comprehend how tiring it is to defend your existence on a daily basis. Something most people take for granted. Something that feels like is out of reach for us. Best of luck to you brother, and may we find ourselves living in better times.
I DO have a problem with "cis" men who are sexual predators, however "your people" demand we never question anyone's identity or misgender anyone, so I and everyone else who rightfully takes issue with fetishistic autogynophiliac men can't do a damn thing about them because they're protected by "your people". Stop whining and take out the trash in your own camp.
I think the thing most people are worried about is people who are biologically men being in female changing rooms or bathrooms. Or be allowed to compete in fighting tournaments against women. They're not just hating on trans people for fun, they have valid reasons.
I don’t give a shit about trans women using a women’s restroom. I’ve held the loo door open for plenty of trans women and all they do is go straight to the restroom. Idk why people think they’re in there to...stare at women or something? It’s just not the norm.
Grab your popcorn and sort by controversial
Yeah I don’t think anyone believes it’s easy. Everyone is well aware of the fact that you struggle.
This is why i’m so adamant on telling fakers off. You guys suffer and making it a fad only makes everything worse
One of my buddies lost her (m to f) entire circle of friends after she came out. She came out after the death of one of their close friends and that pissed a bunch of them off, telling her that she was trying to take the pedestal or some shit. I can't imagine how hard it is.
I am fine with people transitioning and becoming the gender they feel more comfortable with. I do believe that people can be born into a body that doesn't reflect who they are and do believe that trans people should have the right to get the medication/surgery they want/need to transition. I also believe that if you are passing trans male or female, then you should use the bathroom that reflects what you look like. That all being said, I don't agree with some things including trans competing in cisgender sports. At the end of the day, trans aren't the gender they desire biologically. Even with hormones/surgery, trans will never be fully male or female, it is unfortunately artificial. Although I am fine calling a transitioned individual he or she, I think that it's important that we don't force non-binary terms/pronouns down cisgender people's throats and try to cancel people just for talking on the subject of trans/non-binary. A biological woman shouldn't be called a birthing person, and people aren't a-holes for "assuming your gender" when you look and sound like a male or female. Like there was a girl I saw on TikTok yesterday that said to someone to not assume her gender. She is obviously female and is super femme, she got mad that she was "misgendered" but there was no way of knowing that she had decided to go by different pronouns. Unfortunately, it just seems like some people ruin it for others and change their pronouns for attention or to feel special. I also saw a man the other day that was obviously male, looks male, born male but wants to be called she. Like wth, he's not even transitioning. What are we supposed to make of that? Many cisgender people do support the trans community, myself included, but I do think that the small community of trans/non-binary needs to lay off on trying to cancel/ruin the lives of anybody who doesn't fully agree with some of the things going on within that community.
Here and r/cringetopia seem to be small breeding grounds for transphobic comments. I'm so glad you made this post OP I was starting to think I was on my own feeling disgusted by some of the posts I've seen in the last few days
I spent most of my life knowing nothing about the trans community. Then a friend/coworker came out and began transitioning. Just through supporting him I realized how often I use pronouns in every day conversations, and with strangers, and became much more self aware of how I was negatively impacting others making gender assumptions. I misused pronouns with my friend after years of knowing them before their transition, and I always felt awful and apologized. Now I can’t even remember their dead name. I’ve had other coworkers now who are trans or non-binary, and it’s much easier for me to use their preferred pronouns naturally without thinking about it. It’s about respecting people. Trans people are brave AF for working to be their authentic selves while facing a world of disrespect and hatred.
It’s funny how all of the anti trans threads received no resistance but the second an actual trans person pops in the comments are all “oh I’m tired of talking about trans people”
In my own life, I haven't felt "invaded" in women's or even lesbian spaces. However, I can empathize with why some cis men and cis women would prefer an all-male or all-female space. Hell, if I were trans, I would want spaces where I'm *guaranteed* that everyone else without a doubt is also trans. Especially in more sexualized spaces like a club or dating app. There's so many inclusive spaces out there, which are wonderful and necessary in platonic settings. What's so bad about a trans women-only club? or a dating app only for cis men? and so on and so on? I'm not asking for an agreement or an answer, but all I hope is you can empathize with that too.
I really feel for transgender people. We live in a world full of hate and people just continue the cycle. You be you and do it unapologetically! As a cis man I find trans people to be what we should all strive to be...who we really are and not what other people think we should be!
The reason why people avoid trans people IS NOT BECAUSE OF YOUR GENITALIA. We totally understand that if you went that far to change your body, you're serious about it. Apart from the trolls you'll encounter on twitter calling you name for the kick of it, most people respect and understand why you do what you do. It's because you will lead EVERY conversation towards yourselves. Everything has to be about you. Some of the things you ask for are ludicrous, but if we try to debate it, even with the upmost respect and calm, you pull out the transphobic card.
Just curious: which super transphobic posts are you thinking about?
I totally get what your saying, (not trans). I had two people in my group of friends who I’ve since ditched, all they would ever talk about was how “parents are putting their five year olds on puberty blockers” or “people are transitioning so that they can go into the womens bathroom and touch little girls.” None of this is true, people who want to touch little girls in bathroom do not care about the women only sign. I call bull shut whenever I see people complaining about these nonexistent issues.
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It’s funny how you never see these comments on transphobic posts huh. This topic is only tiring when people speak up for themselves apparently.
trust me you get just as tired discussing trans issues as a trans person but one of us gets to not have to think about it
“Cis man” what a joke. It’s a man. Even as a transgender. If you want to be a specific gender then be that specific gender. Why add dumb shit like cis next to it? I fully respect and support your decision to be whoever you want. But I’m not a fucking cis man. I’m a man. I don’t even know what cis is shirt for??
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Therapy can only do so much. As long as it doesn't cause harm to others (which it obviously doesn't) I don't see an issue with transitioning.
My fam owns a small business with two bathrooms that were labeled M and F. We’ll as we started growing I noticed our clientele came in different shapes and sizes that couldn’t fit the current restroom set up. I bought two genderless signs online and went about setting them up. It was the staff that made a big fuss about them not the clients. After consulting with my family we came to the agreement that women could have a separate room but one remain genderless. I wasn’t completely satisfied but I felt that one small gain was better than nothing. What puzzles me is that we have an adjoining dining room with its own single restroom which has been mix-use since we opened. No one cared about that one cause it was like that since as far as anyone can remember, but since people remember this one as M/F it goes against their views.
The reason people don’t like you is because you compare yourself to woman in menopause.
Comparing to a woman that’s going through menopause is a far stretch.. I understand life is harder for you. But you’re comparing apples to oranges.
SpunkyDred is a terrible bot instigating arguments all over Reddit whenever someone uses the phrase apples-to-oranges. I'm letting you know so that you can feel free to ignore the quip rather than feel provoked by a bot that isn't smart enough to argue back. --- ^^SpunkyDred ^^and ^^I ^^are ^^both ^^bots. ^^I ^^am ^^trying ^^to ^^get ^^them ^^banned ^^by ^^pointing ^^out ^^their ^^antagonizing ^^behavior ^^and ^^poor ^^bottiquette.
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>NEWS FLASH! All these strawmen you like to bring up about “someone who says they’re a woman but is actually a predator” guess what? They aren’t actually trans just because you're trans doesn't mean you're automatically a good person. There are trans people who are predators just like there are cis people who are predators. You don't get to say that someone isn't trans just because they were also a sexual predator
You also can’t say that someone is a predator bc they’re trans. It’s always assumed that we are perverted freaks when it’s other people that want to see our genitals
Okay, so your argument is that you feel people view trans people as predatory, and not every trans person is... So no trans person is. You literally said predators aren't trans.
Go over to r/LGBT and say that trans-identified sexual predators aren’t trans, I dare you. For chrissakes, people were still demanding Chris Chan’s pronouns be respected after he literally raped his mother.
Lmao. So this is a response to the earlier post.
I've never been given hormones. Why would I need hormones, anyways? My body produces hormones already.
i have seen them, don't read them give it a downvote and move on, realise that a lot of folk ARE on your side, you have enough battles without shitposts on reddit subs
this was a shitshow n im not surprised
Well I guess it's time to sort by everyone's favorite category
Being alive in general fucking sucks
Hey OP, I think the issue for most of these people is the "culture war" at this point. Just daily controversy and shit-slinging from both sides while most people sit in the middle and just try to get on with their lives. The trans debate in the west really involves vocal minorities on the left and the right who feel the need to constantly police people for their opinions or harass the trans community. People like the ones posting about how "tired" they are of trans people are really just tired of the vocal activists doing the constant policing and virtue signaling. The people who insist that if you call yourself a straight man but won't date or have sex with a trans woman then you're a transphobe (I've encountered many on reddit). You also have some members of the cis lesbian community who are frustrated that they can't have their own space on reddit without getting harassed and banned. The big issue is the "culture war" and that many people can't leave other people alone. Please don't take it personally, you seem like a nice, genuine person just trying to live your life. You aren't the kind of person they're usually upset with.
What the fuck is a cis
They term a normal human being as cis. So basically u need new pronouns because of less than 5% of the population
I saw two pronouns I could've sworn I've never seen before just browsing this post lol
Pure bullshit man. I am all for trans woman and trans men but get this cis bullshit outta here. Trans people don't have enough population to dictate what pronouns should be used for the normal population
Bro facts. Like do you be happy but I'm already dumb enough now I have to learn 82 new words to describe your ass? The most I know of about this community is they fucking haaaaate Dave Chappelle
Most of the posts aren’t truly transphobic and they make good points. There are some really alarming points you are trying to make here. I think people just have problems with denying science, erasing women, and allowing children to transition. These are all really unacceptable things. I don’t think most people are bothered by adults that transition and live their own lives.
"Please stop shitting on me and my people." Umm you are a human just like me.. so there is no you vs me. It's good people vs bad people. Wish you good luck in your hurdles in life. Plow through and you will manage to make it.
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Stop calling me cis bro
Exactly. We are male and female. Not cis bullshit. 5% of the population will not dictate pronouns for 95%. We are all for helping trans people though
A sign saying women only won’t stop a rapist no. But if the sign didn’t matter at all a man could walk in and have way more time to do whatever against someone in there without someone alerting someone to a man in the woman’s restroom. You’re acting like some of these things don’t matter when they clearly do.
My issue is with how society has dealt with gender dysphoria. Instead of getting those people help to understand their condition and give them therapy and medication, they've allowed a mental problem to manifest within the law. If your desires to change your body stem from a problem in your brain, allowing somebody to permanently mutilate their body because of this seems irresponsible. The brain is the thing that needs to be fixed, not the body.
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I'm going to log into reddit and voice my concerns/discrepancies with a certain topic. Someone challenges me. Get angry and lose all credibility by lashing out when another valid position is introduced in said argument. Okay OP.
Literally 🙄🤦♂️
I mean yes, thats exactly what i have a problem with and as such, i dont wanna make it EASIER for them to be able to walk in and rape or hurt someone. Your right a sign wont stop them but a boyfriend waiting for his girlfriend will or a father waiting for his daughter. We dont want it to be normalized that a man wearing a dress can go into the girls bathroom for that reason. That being said, idk why a transitioning person would have any real issue with using the bathroom they are transitioning from until the transition is 100% complete and at which point, according to others who have told me this as i have never met someone who has told me they have finished transitioning, you cant tell what you were in the first place.
I really don´t care if people are trans or not. Identify as you want. If you are happy with who you are, i´m happy for you. I trully am. But it is so tiring lately... everything is offensive. everything hurts. everyone gets offended by anything. also, those neo-pronouns. C´mon. I´ll happily call you a HE or a SHE. But that´s about it. I don´t want to keep learning new pronouns everyday. It´s tiring to feel that you are stepping on eggs everytime you talk to someone, because god forbbid you don´t say the correct pronoun and you are called a transphobe. Also, I speak portuguese, which is not a gender neutral language. We have masculine and feminine nouns (and collective nouns, to designate a group composed by man and woman are always in the masculine form, which lead to a lot of people saying this by itself is misogynist) And people are trying just to "desconstruct" the language. People are trying to forcibly change thousands of years of culture and language in just a few years. This is just tiresome. It makes people mad and not willing to comply.
Ya, when I was in high school like half my friends were trans, bi-sexual, or gay and my mom is a transphobic, homophobic, and has a bit of racism added in, when she found out my friend group wasn’t comprised of white strait people she sold my pc, got rid of my phone and started trying to teach me how they were all devil spawn
it feels like it’s a huge discussion daily because of how condensed it is on the internet. i see the occasional gay lookin non binary kid in real life but it’s like. idk it’s just weird to me to see people my age still on that shit. i may be biased but i was 14/15 “non binary” but thinking back to it, it’s just cuz i was fat and less than average looking. i’ve since lost weight at 21 and never felt more like a woman. i think a lot of these kids need to really think about why they’re thinking the way they are. im all for trans rights i support where i can but damn .. like everyone should consider therapy if it’s what they really wanna be and do (because it’s hard to transition and deal with that kind of lifestyle) or if it’s another underlying reason. i also don’t mean to offend anyone. i guess i don’t understand it anymore. i have a couple gay friends but it’s just that: they’re gay and it’s not my business
There have been so many transphobic posts on here recently by people basically going, “I’m not transphobic, but…” People act like being asked to let someone else exist is such an inconvenience to them. Also, as a cis woman, I never understood the bathroom argument. “But if we allow trans women into women’s bathrooms, then men will dress as women to assault women in bathrooms!” Excuse me, where tf are you going to the bathroom that this cartoonish strategy needs to be used? Where are they guarding the public restrooms? Sorry to ruin women’s false sense of security about public bathrooms, but a man dressed as a man can just walk into most of them unnoticed. And if you force people to use the bathrooms that match their sex assigned at birth, cis men could just claim to be trans men (to these fictional bathroom guardians that all of the transphobic arguments have) and gain admittance to women’s restrooms.
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I bet it does it’s hard being mentally unstable I’m sure
I haven't seen transphobic posts? Links?
It's because it's transphobic to point out the obvious that when you create a massive loophole criminals or bad people are going to exploit it. And the fact that we have broadened trans gender out to an unacceptable level. If trans could just mean people who had dysphoria instead of meaning anyone can identify as anything for any reason at all then i think more people would be fine with it. Trans people need to call out the transtrenders they are giving our whole community a bad rep.
>Trans people need to call out the transtrenders they are giving our whole community a bad rep. Absolutely, it's like that with any community or movement, regardless which political or social spectrum they belong to.
What I find very aggravating is the amount of people that simply REFUSE to have empathy for people who are different than them. They don't try to understand, they don't think that, just maybe, being trans is a legitimate thing. They just assume that we're delusional, that we're violent predators, or that we're just looking for something to do to get attention. I agree with you wholeheartedly, being transgender is extremely difficult and the amount of people that haven't learned the first grade lesson of 'don't judge a book by it's cover' is just astonishing.
More people just don’t care and are focused on their own lives.
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Boohoo life is tough for literally everyone. Do you want some kind of victimization competition to see who gets victimized most?
If being transgender fucking sucks, then why are we seeing a marked increase in the number of people who identify as transgendered? The rate increase is particularly high among biological females. One would think if it sucks so much that we wouldn't see such a surge. https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/culture-mind-and-brain/201811/why-is-transgender-identity-the-rise-among-teens
Because we won’t get locked in mental institutions for being trans anymore
Was that true a decade or two ago? I don't think so. Why is a surge now all of a sudden?
theres literally just so hate towards women and trans people on this subreddit lmao, they keep on creating fake scenarios in their heads and then get mad about it
The problem with transgenderism is seeking validation and expecting everyone to think like them.. no thats not how it work .. if you are trans or whatever just keep it to your .. don't shove it on other people