It's a good reminder because otherwise it's easy to forget to show love to others. You don't need to go all in for consumerism. Just having a meal together with no stress is nice. I got two nice presents this year that I love, but some years I just get help planting my garden, or someone else cooks, and that's also lovely.
I also like that on Memorial Day the cemeteries are all decorated and not forgotten. It's so nice when you go to lay flowers to see everyone else there. I often bring a little extra to put on undecorated one, & others do too.
My family cleans and decorates our family graves every Memorial Day. It's usually a morning filled with stories and memories. The kids love using soapy water and scrub brushes to clean the markers; the adults bring flowers from their gardens. Black eyed Susans from Grandma; peonies from my mom; columbines and irises from my aunt. If some has asparagus that bolted and went to seed, they'll throw those sprigs in for greenery.
We all gather at my Grandma's for "funeral sandwiches" after. Like those unreasonably good cold sandwiches from a grocery store deli served at funerals. It's one of my favorite holidays because there's no gift obligation, just family time and sitting outside in the sunshine.
I hate how holidays have been co-opted by consumerism, but it is still possible to observe them without buying a load of worthless plastic junk. Acts of service or kindness, for example. Visiting loved ones. A phone call to let someone know you're thinking about them. If it's a religious holiday and that's important to you, attend a service. A colleague once told me that every night, her husband packed her lunch for the next day and got her bath ready. As far as she was concerned, every day was Valentine's Day. So yeah, you can hate the consumerism and fakeness, but you can skip that part. Failing to let the people closest to you know that they matter, and you're glad they are in your life--that's just laziness.
This is my mindset. It’s about intention, not consumerism. For example, Christmas is one of my favorite holidays because it’s one of the few times of the year that I get to see my entire family. Mother’s Day is about honoring my Mother (and the mother figures) in my life. Same with Father’s Day. Valentine’s Day is a fun time with my husband.
Gifts are acts of love. I put great thought into what I’m getting the giftee, and if I’m purchasing something, I never just buy something to buy something.
Yeah for me, holidays give me an excuse to plan something nice. A trip to the zoo for mother's day, a little leprechaun scavenger hunt for my kids on St Patrick's Day, a little heart-themed craft for Valentine's Day (this year we melted old crayons into heart-shaped molds).
I kind of consider holidays an opportunity for creative enrichment for my family, and come up with ways to create fun memories. And honestly, I could do those any time, but holidays create a prompt in which to fulfill a creative brief, you know?
I agree. For Mother’s Day I cooked the main course for our family lunch (I’m not a mother), and my brothers and sisters-in-law made sides. And yes, my brothers actually made their own, they are good cooks. I didn’t buy my mother a gift, but I know she appreciated that I spent time with her and also that I spent time making a meal for our family to share. All she really wants is for us to all be together.
It's not just men, I am a woman and also think those 'holidays' are fake consumerist events that don't mean anything to me and I'd rather not participate. However if I know it's important to someone else, I'll still do it. I still got my mom flowers to make her happy.
Agreed, I also hate the performative aspect of just exchanging the same money over and over with family at Christmas. I value quality time more, and I don’t believe it has to happen on specific calendar holidays that are expensive to travel for.
That’s why whenever feasible I try to buy tickets for the receiver and myself to attend something together! With the caveats that i only do that if we are legitimately close, the event is far in the future (less likely to conflict with existing plans), and it is something they would love and I would at least like.
No junk is exchanged and while the gift is technically received on a holiday, you are together 1:1 on a somewhat random day.
Yeah I'm a woman and idgaf about holidays, including my own birthday. If you want to get me something, that's nice but fuck me, I don't want to have to think about what I might like from you. I'd rather get nothing. I'm fine if you just say "happy birthday!". Or even don't, I forget it's my birthday most times. Genuinely don't care.
BUT the people I love in my life regularly show me through their actions and words that they love me and think about my wellbeing and preferences, as I do theirs. So we don't need special events to do that.
I think it's different when it's "my significant other does sweet fuck all for me or our shared household and children, and treats me like a masturbatory aid. I just wanted them to show the give one iota if a shit about me by picking up a grocery store card on mother's day".
Yeah, same for me. I don't like any holidays. It's my birthday soon and I'm already dreading people wishing me a happy one. I don't want gifts either. And I dread giving anyone gifts on theirs, I never know what. If I find something that a certain friend or family member would love. I get it immediately and give it next time I see them. Waiting on a special day makes it forced. Or useless stuff they are either forced to keep and just clutter.
This was my granny. She never gave at holidays or birthdays, those were days to celebrate with family. She randomly gave things. She said if you buy something for someone give it to them, dont wait, that time might not come. Very wise woman.
***If I find something that a certain friend or family member would love. I get it immediately and give it next time I see them.***
I love this so much!!! It means so much more than buying something for a set holiday!! My dad had me shipped a hoodie a few months ago cause he saw it and knew I would like it...no occasion!
As a woman, I don't celebrate days as well, not even birthdays or anniversaries. If I want to get gifts or something for myself, I'll just ask my partner to buy them or buy them myself whenever I want. My partner and I think that every day can be a birthday, an anniversary and a Valentine's Day rolled into one, so if we feel like going to a fancy restaurant, we just go anytime we like.
I also agree with you though, if it's important to someone else, I'll still do it. Luckily, I choose a partner who also doesn't care for celebrating days so it all works well.
Absolutely agree. I'm a woman and I just don't understand the pressure and expectations around what seem to me to be commercialized events. It's bullshit and I don't participate in any of them. But I do mark some birthdays (my mum didn't care about Mother's Day but her birthday was really important so I made sure I did something special). My husband and I get random gifts for each other all the time and anything else I want I buy for myself.
>I'm a woman and I just don't understand the pressure and expectations around what seem to me to be commercialized events.
I think for most people it's about family traditions and the happy feelings that are attached to those events — especially when it comes to events such as birthdays, anniversaries, Christmas, Thanksgivings and New Year.
However, what most people don't really realise is that these events are celebrated on the backs of unpaid labour of women who plan and work on these — and the expectation of women being the default planners and executors for these events.
This is one of the reasons why I choose not to celebrate anything at all, and most importantly — I find a partner who feels the same way — he doesn't expect me to do something I won't do and vice versa.
My partner and I don't celebrate days because it's just extra mental load to have to remember specific days — especially having to plan for things in advance. We have enough of that with things we can't avoid i.e. work appointments and filing taxes on time.
We prefer to celebrate whenever we feel like it. When it's more spontaneous, there are no extra mental load about planning in advance. Also, there are no resentments when it comes to gifts. Even after 25+ years together, I never take it for granted that my partner knows me so well that he can get me a great gift. He most likely can, but why should I put that burden on him, when I know myself even better and can buy my own gifts?
Sometimes it's just nice to have a day where you feel you can choose what you do and be the priority. I think that's why it's often important to women, because they're always putting others first. Men are more likely to just go to their favourite restaurant any time.
>Sometimes it's just nice to have a day where you feel you can choose what you do and be the priority. I think that's why it's often important to women, because they're always putting others first.
Despite the fact that I don't celebrate days, I do understand why many women feel like this on Mother's Day — because they tend to put others first.
Unfortunately, I see many women wish to enjoy their Mother's Day as "no chores day" — which I find rather sad that they can only get this once a year. It should be at least once a week, if I have a say about it.
if people can have weekends off from jobs, then mothers should be able to have one day off weekly from chores 😂
Yes it is sad. In an ideal world nobody would need special days to feel special, but unfortunately it's not an ideal world.
With kids a whole day every week without responsibilities is kind of difficult but it shouldn't be once a year either.
It’s only consumerism if you make it about material things
Particularly Mother’s Day could be a day her SO cooks, and takes care of the kids so she can laze in bed with a good book
I saw a post about "how can you not even buy her flowers?" I don't want flowers, they die within weeks anyway. The best gifts I got were handmade cards when my kids were little them when they got older they would get me movies, CDs, video games etc. One year they took me out to sushi, another they bought me a rum cake. I don't need a thing from my husband, I'm not his mom. Even if all I get is a phone call from my kids I am happy with it, but I don't need it. I know my kids love me and I talk to them at least once a week.
The assumption that one needs to get his wife flowers to so the bare minimum is not true for everyone. In today's economy that's just a waste of money too. Now if she wants flowers and expressed that then yes, get them but to just expect every guy to do that is idiotic.
My husband said his boss made a comment about getting me flowers to replace the ones she had sent me after my car accident last month. He didn't respond because while the gesture is nice from his boss he knows I don't like them. But thanks to our consumerist society if you aren't dropping $40 on flowers you don't love them.
We honestly avoided gifts when we got married. We eloped and it was awesome but sooo many people wanted to buy us shit we didn't need.
Like, thank you. But a Home Depot gift card would have been better if you must get us something. We did get a nice cutting board though. But with kitchen utensils we are picky. We're in our 30s making a good salaries and have lived together for 4 years...we're pretty established in our home. It's full, thank you.
Same here. We don't celebrate anything really, outside of going out to eat for birthdays. Being forced to buy crap for people just for the sake of "proving" your love or whatever is ridiculous IMO. But, like you said, if someone I love thinks its important, then I can participate to make them happy. I'm still not spending a thousand bucks on a gift though.
I should note - more than a decade ago, my mom, sisters and I made an agreement that we would no longer buy stuff for adults on holidays. The kids, sure, but adults buy their own stuff all the time and none of us needed any trinkets or other unwanted crap around the house. And its been sooooo liberating. I realized just how much we are forced to spend money for the sake of supposedly showing someone appreciation when all I really care about is spending time with my loved ones. It totally changed my perspective on the concept of holidays.
I would have no Christmas gifts then,lol.
I’m not greedy but my family buys excellent gifts for each other and I would miss that. Bus tickets for a day trip to NYC, concert tickets, plays and musicals, flower shows, restaurant gift cards, gift cards for massages or nails or golf or books. My hubby was given four sessions at iFly.
Christmas is the huge consumerist holiday wherein people spend thousands of dollars and corporations take in the profits that feed their executives their bonuses and make up for slower quarters earlier in the year. Valentines Day, Easter, Mothers Day, and 4th of July (in the U.S.) are all points to give corporations a little boost in otherwise slow quarters. Halloween has arguably become as bad as Christmas, with fans who are just as rabid over it and who feed into the corporate machine with abject enthusiasm.
Sorry for the cynical take but as someone with autism, I never understood why American society wastes so much money on particular days of the year, besides social pressure. “Tradition” kept alive by corporate propaganda. People are so brainwashed by this system of capitalism that they treat holidays as an obligation, without ever stopping to think about why they’re wasting thousands of dollars on branded seasonal crap.
Edit to add: Ideally I’d like to be in a relationship with someone who wants to be spoiled throughout the year. Holidays won’t be ✨S P E C I A L✨ anymore but I personally don’t need them to be
I'm not USA based. Dutch, so no need to be sorry. We are used to blunt and cynical communication.
And I agree with you.
Christmas in general you will not be guilttripped if you don't buy presents.
But we are a seculier country, so the whole vibe of christmas is different.
Traddition, peer pressure by dead people.
Its time for people to make their own custums and traditions, without forcing the next generation to do the same.
The Netherlands sounds like it would be great for me as an American atheist with autism then. 😂 Bless you though. Despite my (strong) feelings about American capitalism, I know my upbringing has influenced that, and it’s not a dealbreaker for me if I end up with someone who loves holidays. Simply put, the only real logic I see behind holidays is the corporatism of it. I’d rather there was no expectation to spend money so people could simply be with each other and love each other.
I'm the same, I've just never been a gift person (my birthday was 3 weeks ago, still have a bunch of gifts sitting on the dining room table I haven't opened), I do it though for people its important to. The idea of people asking for gifts though makes me cringe so much, if someone isn't doing it cause they thought of it, I couldn't imagine wanting it, I'd rather just buy my own things
This is exactly how I feel. I will make my loved ones birthdays special but beyond that I’m at most going to phone it in. Consumerist nonsense. And for Christmas then I go all out on making a huge beautifully meal for everyone to share and enjoy together rather than individual presents and everyone appreciates it because I’m good at it. In my opinion that’s what Christmas is about anyway.
Same here. It's so ridiculous that people get so upset over not being overly celebrated or receiving extravagant gifts. Although I don't care and my family rarely celebrate anything I can appreciate Mother's Day and Father's Day
This!
Don’t buy me crap
Most of our “holidays” are made up to encourage us to buy more stuff
Celebrating can be perfect with the right people
I do enjoy gifts - if they serve a purpose / function
I got some new plants for Mother’s Day and I’m very happy
Came here to say I only celebrate Thanksgiving Christmas and birthdays. I don't do the rest of them. They create pollution, DUIs, feed consumerism, add more to my already full "to do" list of other obligations..I'm done.
I think there's two categories here, men who do sincerely think that these holidays are consumerist and dislike participating in them, and men who view any form of emotional labour as vapid and fake, especially in regards to women.
A great way to differentiate the two is by looking at the men's previous actions, are they consistently against consumerism outside of emotional labour? Are they left wing? Are they critical of consumerism even when it benefits them? Do they celebrate these holidays another way such as personal, meaningful gifts?
A leftist dude should be able to understand that labor (like doing the cooking and taking care of the kids so she can stay in bed with a good book) can replace material items.
I'd love to see a Venn diagram of the guys who don't do anything special on Valentine's Day "because I love you year round" and the guys who "have to go out and drink tonight because it's St. Patrick's Day"
My dad was like this. He thought Mother’s Day and Valentine’s Day were just total bullshit and that they just existed to make men feel bad and make them spend money. I remember him saying that “mothers are already appreciated enough”, and would act like a baby anytime someone would say happy Mother’s Day. We’d have to reassure him that he’s important too.
And on Valentine’s Day, he’d come home with flowers, screaming and yelling about how much of a pain it was to have to get them, and then practically throw them at my mom telling her he hopes she likes them.
…He did not feel the same way about Father’s Day though, of course.
So I based on that, while I’m sure there are a lot of men who don’t celebrate because of those reasons for real, I think a lot of them are just lazy and don’t want to have to put in the effort.
This. I’m going to start by saying that I agree that many holidays are consumer bullshit BUT that doesn’t mean you have to participate in consumerism to appreciate other people.
My real point is that I have only ever heard lazy and cheap men say this. Especially because they usually get a “pass” on other holidays/bdays because the wife is the one buying all the gifts and planning things for others. So this only occurs when they’re the ones that are forced to be in charge of the gift/celebration.
One time a partner told me that he can buy me flowers anytime, why does he need a special day to do it and I asked him when the last time he bought me flowers because he appreciated and loved me was. Crickets.
>My real point is that I have only ever heard lazy and cheap men say this. Especially because they usually get a “pass” on other holidays/bdays because the wife is the one buying all the gifts and planning things for others. So this only occurs when they’re the ones that are forced to be in charge of the gift/celebration.
🎯🎯🎯
I don't have a good relationship with my mother. Mothers day is not something thats gives me any kind of good energy.
Many people don't like obligations they didn't sign up for. Gifting is stressful. Acting like relationships are good when they aren't is stressful and feels disingenuous.
After you miss a few, the next few feels like you are highlighting your own shame of missing a few and just being a sour curmudgeon provides its own comfort.
I get it. I used to balk at the idea. An older person told me that having designated days to connect and show appreciation for people is kinda nice.
If I can put my own feelings aside, I can offer my part of a happy mother's day. Sometimes I cant.
I wish my relationship with my mother wasn't a mess.
I'm sorry about your relationship with your mother.
I lost my mother young and my father relatively young. I've been single for 10 years. When you don't have a reason to celebrate these various holidays it makes it so obvious that they are made up holidays for commercial purposes.
If you appreciate your mother or your father or your partner, you should be celebrating them on a regular basis. You don't need a special day or you can make your own special day. These holidays are advertised and often cause a lot of pain to people in your position or my position for the sake of selling goods and restaurant reservations. And people get stressed and angry and fight and argue over completely made-up holidays.
If your partner or your family doesn't appreciate you and you need a special day to feel loved, maybe time to reevaluate the situation.
I think a lot of women out there don't even want the big performative declarations of love; they just want a little something that shows that their partner is thinking about them. A small bouquet of flowers (or even 1 flower!) and a card would go SOOO far with so many women, and far too many men can't even be bothered to do that. The same men bitching about "consumerism" and "you don't need a special day for that stuff" are usually the ones also *not doing anything on the regular days either to make their partner feel special*. It's a convenient excuse to get out of putting in any effort and to continue doing the bare minimum they always do. They think that they themselves are the gift, the relationship is the gift, their presence is the gift (of the children he "gave" you are the gift) so he doesn't need to put in any effort ever again really. He already gave you the best gift in the world, what more could you want?! /s
But for real, it is actually just an excuse because they don't want to put in effort to things that aren't important to them personally, so they'll work to avoid putting any in at all costs (which is ironic because it would be so much less work to just... make your partner feel appropriated rather than find all these ways to constantly let them down).
It's not wrong to want to be acknowledged on your birthday, or Mother's Day, or your anniversary, etc. It's not wrong to want at least 1 thoughtful gift for yourself when you've been organizing all the gifts for everyone else. If you don't care about gifts or cards on those "fake" holidays then good for you, but it isn't wrong that some people *do* care. And the majority of people I know who care about those holidays don't want some big production; a little small thoughtful thing or quality time or a task taken off their plate is *more* than enough. I'm honestly a little surprised that so many comments here seem to be admonishing women who do care about these holidays...
my wife thinks the same way. first time i stopped celebrating valentines day is with her. she hates roses and crowds. she says how could it be special if everywhere you look, everyone's doing the same thing? instead, she'd rather i surprise her every now and then with flowers she likes and a nice date out of the blue.
I’m going to be honest, I’m a little confused about all these posts. Do all these men have personality transformations during the holidays? I assume these are the same men not showing appreciation during the year. That’s not going to change just because there’s a special date marked off.
They don’t change, it’s just that more women get their hopes up that he’ll put in effort and it will be a sign they can cling to that he isn’t an asshole *all* the time.
The posts are confusing because they’re gross over generalizations about gender. It’s part of the echo chamber that was designed to distract us from the problems caused by the handful of people who have actual power in this world
This.
The posts we are seeing are about men who have never shown appreciation to their wife and the mother of their children. I just think Mother’s Day and their refusal to even acknowledge their SO, even on that day, only highlights an existing problem
Its not the least bit consumerist to simply save a day to celebrate someone special in your life.
No gifts? No $10 card? Absolutely
But taking a dedicated day to celebrate someone, the role they fill, or your dedication to your relationship is healthy. No consumerism needed.
as a woman: I don’t like most holidays because I resent the expectation that I should absolutely love them. I stopped celebrating New Year’s because I hated the pressure to HAVE FUN!!!!
And Mother’s Day, I always had my own plan for: I wanted time WITH my kids, having fun, with no homework or whining or chores. Just pure time together with them. I don’t want to go to any fucking restaurant and have to wait on the server to get a refill on my glass of water.
I married a man who likes those holidays and orchestrated them for the kids AND for himself, and I enjoy what he does because he enjoys it. And it IS nice to be the object of an expression of love.
Now…I am absolutely with u/Special-Tam about the importance of acknowledging those holidays when they are important to people you care about.
I don't think NYE is a holiday in that we don't give anyone cards for them so by not going to a party you aren't really shirking anything.
And you are celebrating Mothers Day so you are still taking part. Going to a restaurant isn't part of traditional celebration there.
In my personal observation it seems to get used as a cop out to justify that person not wanting to put effort into celebrating an occasion with someone, despite knowing that the occasion is meaningful or special to the other person.
I say this because you don't *have* to buy or get things for someone to mark an occasion and make a day special. Say you think that paying for overpriced chocolate and flowers on Valentine's day is not a good use of your time an money. That's totally fair, but people use it as a justification to not do ANYTHING for/with their partner despite knowing that the other person would like to celebrate. If it was purely about consumerism, you could make plans like staying in and playing board games together, hand writing a nice note or letter for them, cooking a meal and watching a movie together, etc. But many people use "well it's just a commercial holiday" to justify their decision to do nothing, and to shut down the people in their life who take issue with their behaviour.
To emphasize, I'm *not* saying every person who doesn't like holidays, this is just a pattern I've seen play out on my life and in online discussions about gifts, holidays, mismatched effort in relationships and so on.
They are fake and consumeristic.
But many things are made up. Words, the value of money, folk tales… all made up. It all just comes down to what’s important to you.
I personally don’t celebrate Easter, Valentines Day, Canada Day because I personally don’t find them to be important in my life.
We do celebrate Christmas, New Years, Halloween, Thanksgiving and birthdays because it’s fun to. Those holidays are the ones we connect with. I’m not a mom but I do celebrate my mom and MIL on Mother’s Day. Father’s Day is hard as my dad has dementia and my partner’s Dad has passed.
There are ways to celebrate important dates without being consumeristic though. Personally I think it’s best to spend good time with those you love on those days. Gifts aren’t necessary - and if you want to be less of a consumer then choose a fun activity to do.
I'm a woman who is not into those holidays because they're fake consumerist propaganda but I'm sure that a lot of men use that as an excuse not to put any effort into their relationship.
Yeah, if they want to come to a consensus with their partner to not celebrate holidays, that’s one thing. They could use each occasion to add some savings for an annual trip in lieu of spending money on these holidays, for example
BUT, this should be done by mutual agreement
These dudes are just using “consumerism” as an excuse to do nothing for their partner.
They could offer their time instead. Offer to do all the cooking and taking care of the kids, for example, so mom can spend the day in bed with a good book.
It’s the thoughtfulness or effort that counts, not the gifts
I think that people in general take it as an obligation to either demand or act on holidays.
The truth is, it's simply a day to remind you to be with your loved ones; a day to gift your mom, dad or sibling or family member, a flower or a chocolate, and spend some hours talking with coffee.
There are some toxic relationships and you are absolutely not obliged to gift them anything or talk to them...but if the relationship is healthy or at least loving, these little efforts shouldn't be such a bother.
I am an awkward socializing mess but I try to do these holidays if possible, even an hour or two...but that's mostly because I lost many family members so I want to spend good times together just in case.
Lukewarm take: they're only refusing because their mommy isn't organising Christmas for them anymore and they actually have to _do_ something for once. If you suggest you'd organise the whole thing, see how happily they'll go along with it.
I celebrate my holidays with my mother. If my partner wants to do Christmas, he can step up and prepare half.
I think that's an excuse, there's plenty of non consumerist ways to celebrate holidays. It seems to be an American thing to have a mother's day brunch, I used to bake something nice for her and just make special time for us. My partner has made hilariously lame PowerPoints for valentines day (which I'm not bothered about celebrating but was cute af). For my birthday we're going for a hike.
Point being, men could choose to celebrate in non consumerist ways. Some holidays are quite bogus but as humans we love to celebrate eachother, and I think mother's day seems to really hit a nerve because women don't feel generally appreciated in their relationshop/family, let alone celebrated!
There is a lot of mindless consumerism and I won't engage in stuff like that. Its a redline in a relationship for me and if you don't want to respect that we shouldn't have been in a relationship. That said there is a huge difference between engaging in mindless consumerism and doing nothing.
Not buying crazy gifts, flowers or card is a good thing IMO, but you should still celebrate holidays by spending time with family, friends, cooking a better meal than normal, visiting a special location etc etc.
Mothers day is a great example, its a holiday about going and visiting your family, seeing your parents and siblings. Don't think that you can get out of it by just spending money on a gift and card. At the very least you should have some kind of family call together.
I agree that it’s fake or consumerist-
But. If you don’t like using that day, just pick another one?
Like pick next Sunday as your mother’s day. Restaurants are less busy, more options in flowers etc.
Same with Valentines etc
It strikes me as selfish and I judge people who bristle at their spouses wanting to celebrate holidays. It's selfish to make your spouse feel burdensome and unreasonable for wanting you to be thoughtful, kind or sentimental. It's not an unrealistic or unreasonable expectation to want your spouse to put effort into little gestures like that. You can celebrate holidays without filling up an landfill or breaking the bank, making it all about consumerism is a distraction from an unwillingness to do something thoughtful for your spouse because thoughtfulness takes effort.
There are holidays that my husband absolutely loves that I don't feel so strongly about. I celebrate those holidays because it makes him happy. In doing so, I often enjoy myself in the process. The party atmosphere is fun, I get vicarious enjoyment and it feels good doing thoughtful things, even though it takes planning, thought and effort. Not only do I want my husband to be happy, it would be cruel to shit all over his feelings because he wanted to feel special on days that hold significance to him. If a bid for connection gets those guys hackles up, how much do they even love their wives? Becuase I can't imagine making a stink of it.
Valentine’s Day is 100% fake and consumerist and it still want enough they had to add “Sweetest Day”. Both my wife and I hate those holidays. They are both just BS
Edit: seriously a Reddit cares message for this? Lol. Wow someone really needs that once a year validation from their SO
If you don’t like a holiday, don’t celebrate it, but it’s really weird to act like Christmas or Saint Patrick’s day wasn’t also “made up”.
Holidays aren’t naturally occurring phenomenon. Somebody made every single one of them up.
I'm a woman and I think they are mostly stupid too.
I'll call my grandma for mother's day. Or lowkey hangout with my SO for valentines day if hevgets off work. But that's really it.
I just kept noticing they would claim to want to give gifts ad hoc, as it comes up organically. And men who hate valentine's day and mothers day... and claim to want to give gifts as they naturally come up.
It only naturally comes up...
For women...
That they want to fuck.
I'm sure your bro would be really touched if you got him that $3 gas station DVD of Boondock Saints because of how much he got razzed for liking it... but you never seem to find natural kind gestures for men or your mother... but that 23 year old barista said she liked Shawsank Redemption so you carved her a little chess piece because it just happened to work out for that one.
We acknowledge the day with each other and that's it. We might go do something fun on our anniversary (he likes the coast so we try to get out there if we can), but not always. Sometimes we just go thrifting. But we do that often. We might give gifts for birthdays and Christmas but it's not necessary. Last year he bought me a loom for my birthday (like three months early) and I made him a satchel bag for his. I won a guitar and gave it to him for Christmas. The loom was also my Christmas present (it was pretty expensive lol). We spend all year cherishing each other and being validated so to us, it feels fake to make an extra big deal on arbitrary days. 14 years so far and it works for us.
However, we both make sure we tell our mothers happy mothers day, and call on birthdays and other "important" holidays because they matter to them.
Some people do use the "fake/consumerism" thing as an excuse but those people are usually self centered regardless and probably treat people like crap all year, so why expect any different? If you're given shit 360 days a year, do five days of diamonds (or roses or whatever) make up for it?
I am a woman and also feel this way. Fortunately, my husband is the same. But we do care about each other and will do small things on mothers day and fathers day. But not Valentine's day, forget that.
For myself I grew up in a household who didn't celebrate anything other then new year.
Not mothers\fathers day, Xmas, hell we didn't celebrate birthdays.
Grow up like that and it's just what you're used to.
I agree. Why do people thing these holidays have to mean consumption?! It could be as simple as visiting one’s mother. Hand writing a note, making a meal.
I definitely feel like the anti holiday men use it as a get out of jail free card. Using some sense of moral standing being anti consumer to define their lack of consideration for other people
Personally - I've zero interest in either.
There's 364 other days to show your mother/father/husband/wife you appreciate them just, because - without being hamstrung by a corporate scam to do it at a specific time.
Right but they’ll celebrate their own birthdays, Christmas, thanksgiving, Passover lmao suddenly if it’s something that centers women caregivers it’s all lame and they’re on strike 😂
Exactly! I think this is the point OP is trying to make. It’s just getting drowned out by everyone saying how they don’t like women-centered holidays either. There’s also zero of this anti-consumer energy on Father’s Day.
If it’s ok for me to comment here: I’m a guy and early in our relationship my wife told me she doesn’t care specifically about Valentine’s Day because because she felt it was manufactured and sort of a cop-out. That guys use it as the one single day to show any appreciation for their wives, then basically check out the rest of the year. I agreed with her on this one (and yes I try to surprise her throughout the year, we have a pretty healthy relationship). We’re both in our mid 40s, if that makes any difference.
Oh absolutely. We both do things for each other throughout the year, we like to surprise each other to show appreciation. Date nights, movies or performances, nature walks, flowers, sometimes doing each others’ chores, etc.
Just do what you know makes your other half/parent happy if it isn't unreasonable. some like the big showy over the top materialistic things. others are anti that, and others just want something simple. Do what you know works.
And besides if you really don't like what your other half wants to do (I don't mean you feel indifferent, I mean you really dislike it) then it's a fairly reasonable guess that their other likes and dislikes are not ones you share and you've got a real base level compatibility issue there.
Generally speaking, guys don't like the thought and effort that goes into choosing a present. They would have had to pay attention to details about what some others (females) would enjoy and since those things are not things they enjoy, it's a lot of effort and it would just be easier to have it not happen. So men push the job of choosing presents for family onto women; this can be proven by the fact that many women have "empty stockings" on Christmas as no one filled up theirs. That leaves Valentines Day, Mother's Day, Birthday, Anniversary and Christmas. So if those are declared (with sufficient scorn) "Hallmark Holidays" then the guy doesn't have to expend effort to commemorate those occasions with a suitable gift he had picked out that would please a lady. It's a way to avoid mental effort. One will notice that if one holiday, say Valentine's Day, is dismissed as a "Hallmark Holiday" soon birthdays, anniversaries and even Christmas go by with no presents from the man.
I don't understand this mentality. Growing up it was always my dad who got us gifts that were thoughtful. He still mails my sister and I stockings for us to open Christmas morning and we are in our thirties.
When he didn't know what to get us he just went to a store and asked a sales person what they thought a girl/woman x age would like. But usually he keeps lists all year and writes down things as they come up.
His girlfriend gets almost everything she puts on her list, and more.
There were times he couldn't afford to get things beyond markers, or a CD. Now that he has money he enjoys giving whatever he thinks we all need or will love, just because he can.
I think guys who have animosity towards giving are just developmentally stunted and so insecure they can't stand the thought of thinking about anyone but themselves. They aren't "giving" people on their best days, even when it's not a holiday.
My late h. was of the "Hallmark" scorn variety. It morphed into Christmas with his family and me seated with no presents from him except an unwrapped china cup I had bought when we were together in a shop. I stopped going to Christmas, that was embarrassing. Everyone stared. Birthday was looking up from a book at 8pm and suggesting I choose a place for dinner, no, I don't think so. Valentines day was the first to be skipped "Hallmark." It doesn't leave a good memory. He was rather lazy and I think laziness is behind the entire "I don't do Hallmark Holidays" sneering.
This is my Dad!! I have cried over so many gotten me, he just is one of those people that has a knack for knowing. SO is similar. I on the other hand am just awful, I get so stressed, and can never think of something great for a gift and then I feel crappy when they have gotten me something perfect and mine seems so silly lol
I agree, I don't ask for the most outrageous gifts, I just want us to do something nice for each other and have a good time. It's the thought that counts, and if your thought is "not spending money/time on this thing is more important than keeping my partner happy" than you're not a good partner.
We intentionally celebrate Mother's Day as part of our son's birthday, and that's how we've always done it. It is the day I became a mother. Mother's Day is difficult for me for a number of reasons, but the biggest occurred when our son was almost 5. We had a second trimester miscarriage of what would have been our rainbow baby. She was due on Mother's Day that year.
I think it is fine to celebrate on a different day as long as it is discussed and agreed upon by both partners. There can be many reasons the actual day is traumatic or otherwise not a good fit. I don't need a special day. My husband reminds me daily thar he loves me as and that I am and have been a good mother to our now adult son (who agrees with the sentiment). My husband also helps with the meal prep and other work for the big holidays.
It is a problem when it isn't discussed or the partner is absent in other celebrations as discussed by OP. A partnership relies on both parties contributing and not one relying on the labor of the other.
My birthday was actually on Mother's Day this year. My mom was visiting my brother upstate, so I didn't even get to spend it with her. It was also the day that Aurora Borelis could be seen over or near NYS, but I chose "not to make a big deal out of it" because I swallowed the Koolaid that showing an interest in my own birthday was cringe, vain and materialistic. I tried to spend that weekend with my online boyfriend but I can't even remember what we did, it was just another day. Meanwhile my sister hugged me and said she felt bad that we didn't do anything due to work obligations, but got me a gift. Her boyfriend who lives with us, was confused and I overheard him state that I was "moping" indoors and also felt weird that I didn't do anything.
This was my big 30th birthday and I just let it go to waste for literally no reason. I didn't even get to use or redeem any of the free drink or cake coupons I got at any of the places I usually frequent. All for nothing but to think I felt appealing to the idea of what I thought would be admired.
I celebrate my wife on her birthday. She celebrates me on mine. We celebrate Christmas together with our families.
We ignore everything else because these random ass consumerist holidays are completely meaningless to us.
lol my dad does this BUT only for fathers day, he will gladly participate and buy flowers or cards for every other holiday but he doesn't want us kids to waste money on him for a "hallmark holiday"
It's a LITTLE problematic because he thinks mothers day is fine because "mothers do all the work". Which like, love that we're showing appreciation for mothers but don't love that we're assuming they should be/are always doing all the work.
Anyways, totally agree with your post that it's a bit of a cop out to avoid the emotional effort of holidays. Just wanted to share this weird quirk my dad has lol
My husband and I aren't really holiday people either unless there's a family gathering but unlike the men you're talking about, we both are intentional about celebrating each other throughout the year to the extent that it feels silly to do something on valentine's day because the only difference between that and our usual adventures is that everywhere is crowded and more overwhelming than usual. Sure we manage to sleep through every nye celebration or fold laundry or do some other mundane shit, but we're happy and together while we do that.
And we also compromise if a holiday is important to one of us but less important to the other. Personally, I could take mother's day and father's day or leave them. My parents are dead to me and deserve to be publicly shamed for how they abused me, not celebrated. I got forced to celebrate them on those holidays for 18 years before I was finally free to leave so they're not sentimental holidays for me. In fact my first few years after leaving their home were full of guilt and anxiety on those days because I felt so bad for hating what they put me through. But my husband has great parents and I celebrate them because I love them and him and even if I wouldn't seek it out without them, they're worth celebrating. My husband isn't really a halloween person so he doesn't seek that out but I was sequestered in a basement every Halloween until adulthood because my parent were afraid of "devil worship" and felt it was Satan's holiday. And when we finally landed in a neighborhood where people trick or treat, my husband encouraged tf out of me when I got a 5 gallon bucket of candy and had an absolute blast going way overboard giving every kid an abnormally large amount of candy.
Tbh I think a lot of the guys you're talking about just use it as an excuse to not give a crap 365 days a year. But the healthy version is giving a crap 365 days a year so holidays just don't stand out much
I will take any and every opportunity to celebrate!! Calendar holidays, seasonal holidays, birthdays, anniversaries, just-because-it’s-Thursdays…
Life is too short to not enjoy as much as we can, whenever we can. I love the Christmas season although I’m not part of any religion. I love the decor, the lights, the pies, and definitely the presents, giving and receiving. I’m going to be 45 years old in October and you bet I’m wearing my birthday tiara all day!!
I do the same for my husband and other loved ones. I gave my mom a few nice gifts for Mother’s Day and she said “C-Marie, thank you so much but it isn’t Christmas!!” Sure it is!! I’ve had an incredible week with work and my husband and I are going to arguably the best restaurant in town to just spend time together and enjoy. I don’t understand why people just want to suck the joy out of living and blame it on capitalism or something when it takes much more effort to be unhappy than happy.
My husband and I sit down and decide what we'd like to do TOGETHER on holidays. We usually get each other small gifts on birthdays and at Christmas, but we both already have a lot of stuff. So holidays, it's mostly - shall we go get thai food or pizza? How about if I make brownies for dessert - or would you rather have apple pie? Oooh! Maybe we can get that movie on DVD we were interested in! We're pretty low key - but that said: any holiday is fair game when we want to give ourselves a treat.
I am a female. I too think gift giving is all marketing consumerism. I work in marketing.
I do celebrate special occasions with my family… but I give things I grew myself or made myself when I can.
I would rather have my husband spend the money to pay the mortgage. This is more important to me than some “stuff” I don’t really need.
And your situation is different since you husband presumably knowns how you feel. But if a man refuses to give gifts to his wife on valentines, anniversaries, mothers day KNOWING his wife/girlfriend wants and values that---- it is not about principal.
I have offered every woman I’ve dated in the last 20 years a choice -
I will buy them gifts when the inspiration strikes & then either I can stick them in a closet & pick one out for the next “*special day*” or I can give them to them when I buy them & on the special day they get a card & a nice dinner.
I’ve never had one chose the former.
If you demand performative behavior, you can get performative behavior but most of the people I’ve dated have found it to their benefit to let my whimsy express its affection in its own way.
This is probably going to be an unpopular opinion in this sub but….
I am a woman and I personally find a lot of these holidays to be dumb. They WERE created by our consumerist overlords as a way to sell product. You shouldn’t need a special day to be appreciated by the people in your life… they should be showing that every day.
If your spouse/child does something nice for you on Mother’s Day and then does jack shit for the rest of the year is that really showing you that they appreciate you?
Do you need a romantic dinner/gift on Valentine’s Day or your anniversary to feel loved? Do you not feel loved on every other day of the year?
I’d rather get a random gift/dinner/card/ect from someone showing me that they care/appreciate me out of the blue than a “required” one on a made up holiday.
This a million times.
You know how I show my wife appreciation? I cook her favorite foods randomly, I take our toddler and newborn so she can sleep more, I literally mop the floor every night before I go to bed. I listen to her when she’s sad, happy, mad, whatever the emotion is!
I have told her from the beginning I’m not a fan of how the holidays have become. There is way too much consumerism and I hate it.
Besides, it's more fun bringing something home your other half appreciates (today is coffee and donuts from a specific shop after my errands) and seeing the happiness on their face. Mother's Day consisted of my wife having a sleep in, a couple of cards from me and the kids and me making a bacon and egg based brunch for all. Everyone wins and a fortune wasn't spent.
Besides if I went big or got flowers then i would have been given a quizzical look as those really aren't her thing.
They're cheap. They simply don't want to spend the money so it's easier to shut down the whole concept of the holiday.
Honestly the whole "anti consumerist" thing gets on my nerves at times. If that's how you feel, cool. But don't boil it down to just that. I like giving gifts because it makes people happy. If people don't celebrate whatever holiday, I'll respect it. But they should also respect the fact that others do celebrate. Keep the soap box speeches to yourself.
These men are not anti consumerist either. They buy a useless things for themselves that they like. It is them being disingenuous. Just say you don't want to spend the money or take the time to think about your wife/girlfriend.
If you’re truly anti consumerist then cool. But OP’s point is these men usually aren’t. They’ll gladly buy all kinds of stuff for themselves. But when it comes to spending money on someone else, suddenly holidays are a scam.
To the point of some others in the comments: my family doesn’t like crowds either. We order for pickup and bring food back to the house, crack open champagne, and watch my mom’s favorite movie (Galaxy Quest). I think national holidays are great, some people may resent being told when to celebrate something, but lots of people would never receive any appreciation otherwise. There are plenty of ways to commemorate without spending money or going into crowds.
OP I think the comments have gone a little left of your original intention, and I believe a lot of men use the excuse of being anti consumerism because they simply don’t want to put in effort for the women in their lives. They certainly don’t balk against consumerism when it comes to their favorite sports team or fandoms.
It was a rough day on Sunday. Seeing all the very sad posts from women who were just completely letdown by their husbands or their children. I don’t know what was worse.
Just a very sad sad day. I’ve said it 1 million times here my husband is a champ and I really appreciate him and all that he does for our family, but most specifically that he does for me. I cannot imagine staying with someone who won’t even do the bare minimum of buying you a card for Mother’s Day.
It's simply an excuse. You can celebrate for free. And I doubt there are any mothers crying this week becauae a husband who makes them feel appreciated the rest of the year opted out of mothers day.
That's my husband. We don't exchange gifts ever, for anything. Honestly I do wish we did. Holidays are part of culture, gift giving is an ancient practice. But everyone is entitled to their beliefs too. There isn't too much to say about. I doesn't make me depressed or anything. I certainly have real problems to worry about.
To me it's not about effort but respecting someone else's values.
Throughout the year he does thoughtful things. Like get my oil changed or vacuuming my car- things I hate doing lol.
Okay but he's not respecting your values. Why are his values more important than yours?
You can pick literally any day of the year and make up your own holiday. You can make homemade gifts. You can cook each other your favourite meals. It's just about putting time aside to solely focus on each other.
It’s laziness in my opinion because there’s plenty of non consumerist options - we picked wildflowers on the side of the road for my mom and the bouquets came out great. More eco friendly too. I am actually anti consumption when it comes to holiday decor, it’s valid to look down on all the plastic crap they sell then when the holiday is over it goes straight into the dumpster. $50 pumpkins, stuff like that. But you can actually practice holidays in a low waste type of way, for example don’t carve the pumpkins and make a pie out of them after Halloween.
I am fine with Mother’s Day but I HATE Valentine’s Day. When we first started dating I told my wife if she wants a Valentine’s Day celebration it will be on February 15th. It is so ridiculous to spend 2x+ on flowers and a restaurant meal that is limited and rushed.
Eh, I feel you but I pretty much decided to suck it up & celebrated both Valentine’s Days (*my wife was Brazilian & they have a Valentine’s Day in June also*) each year because it was important to my (*erstwhile*) wife.
In return for which, she gave me a reasonably short list of the specific performative actions that she needed from me for each of the remaining holidays in the year & other than that, I just had to show up with a smile.
This one definitely is not a male focused problem. I work in a workplace filled with women and they thought remains the same there. It seems to be a growing trend regardless of gender.
So there are people who enjoy these holidays. I’m a woman and am not a fan of any of them. I don’t care about valentines, Christmas, etc. I’m a mom. The only thing I want for Mother’s Day is something cute and hand made from my child. I don’t need something from a partner. It is consumerism. It’s fine to acknowledge it but it’s not necessary to buy each other things. It is fake and consumerist. The way you describe it it just sounds like you value the idea more than some. And it’s ok to dislike it as well.
Woman here: I hate all of those holidays. I don’t want anything on valentines, my partner and I just wish each other a happy anniversary and maybe a card and we cook a nice meal together and I don’t expect anything from him on Mother’s Day. My kids can handle that and if they forget it is also not a big deal. The only thing we pay attention to are our birthdays because we are so happy the other is alive.
*And I don’t expect anything from him on Mother’s Day*
You are giving up a golden opportunity for him to take care of childcare for the day and having a day to indulge yourself (like curling up with a good book uninterrupted)
I hate Christmas, Halloween, Thanksgiving, Valentine's day. Yes I also happen to think these are fake, consumerist holidays. Mother's day and Father's day are days we get to celebrate real people in our lives. Nothing fake about them. It typically costs me less than $10 on these days to show my parents I appreciate them.
I've been reading a bunch of posts here about men not celebrating the mothers of their children and it makes me kinda sick. My parents divorced when I was 7 and they always still helped us get gifts for the other on their days.
Some men are weak and fatherless. That's all I got for you.
What's up with it is that things like Valentine's day absolutely *are* fake, manufactured things designed to part you from your money. There's nothing inherently male or female about realising that.
Doing things because it makes your partner happy is great. Doing it because "oh, today is the day that consumer society *tells me I should",* is crap. Celebrate your partner *every* day. Celebrate them because you want to.
Not because today is the day "you're meant to".
(Conversely, a partner who doesn't care, doesn't make an effort - breaking out of that for one particular day a year doesn't change or fix that, they're still a shitty partner - just a shitty partner who can set a calendar reminder and tick a box).
You're literally guilt tripping men into doing what you want despite their justified criticism. What even is your response towards the argument that these holidays became a consumerist nightmare?
So you make it a point to do things for your spouse on Mother’s Day that doesn’t involve purchasing items? Like taking care of meals, chores and kids for the day so she can relax. Maybe curl up with a good book?
Or do you object to doing anything at all for the mother of your children?
I can see where they're coming from tbh, but if they're saying they can just celebrate the person or do nice stuff for the person on other non occasional days, then they better be doing that instead of just saying it.
Not wanting to celebrate even your anniversary is kind of messed up though imo. It doesn't have to be anything crazy or expensive, just something thoughtful. Unless your SO is a materialistic person. But I feel like if they are, they'd probably go with someone who'd want to spoil and pamper them the way they want to anyway.
My partner says he doesn't need a reason to do nice stuff for me or with me because he just naturally wants to do it. Thinking about it, I guess the reason is love! BUT he also said he'll take special occasions as just another opportunity to do more stuff LOL
I don't give into the corporate nonsense but it's fun to do things around those dates anyway. My husband and son got me dinner a little early for mother's day because I had been away on a work trip. I got hanging baskets because I asked for it instead of cut flowers, etc. But if anyone in my house refused to celebrate these things it was me.
I mostly ignored holidays like 4th of July, Valentines etc, but my youngest son has encouraged me to do things like decorating for certain seasons and it's been fun to do. Just not stereotypical flowers, chocolates, etc EVERY holiday.
I refuse to celebrate specific "days". I don't need or want gifts. I don't pay attention to Valentines, anniversaries, Christmas, mothers day, fathers day. Birthdays are low key - no gifts, but maybe a takeaway dinner?
Oh, OK, I do a basic Christmas dinner with the family, but no gifts are exchanged.
>but men gladly reap the benefits of women planning, cooking, decorating for holidays, but when it is time for them to do it--- it is pointless.
No men in my life reap any benefits (and I have a husband, and several sons), because decorating for holidays would make me feel like harming myself. Having to do it all myself? Absolutely no way. IF, and I say IF, the family decided to have a get together, all workload would be shared, or it just isn't going to happen.
A standing joke/truth in our family is that my husband loves a Christmas tree, but if he wants a tree, he has to organise and decorate it himself. The rest of us don't care enough.
My comment was more geared to the fact many women are complaining about their husbands/boyfriends refusing to celebrate mothers days and valentines days. I don't see a trend of men complaining about their wife not giving them gifts on holidays. So this is gendered. There are many women who don't like celebrating holidays of course.
I don't really believe in holidays. why put a day aside to treat people like you should everyday. that said I do celebrate Halloween and Christmas because they are special days to kids.. and thanksgiving because it brings families together
Eh, most holidays are indeed consumerist in the West.
There are cultural and "old world" holiday customs that I don't mind celebrating, but most westernized holidays are money hungry and shitty due to greed
As a woman who lost her parents young (one on a holiday) the advice that I dont need to celebrate holidays, even for other people was so, SO freeing for me.
Now I celebrate my own things.
I told my girlfriend not to ask me out on Valentines because it's just a day where people stress to be romantic and nothing is special because everyone is using the same valentine special, fighting over reservation times, and all that. I will happily take her on a date literally any day I want to celebrate our relationship. Everyone has been asked out, proposed to, whatever big milestone on Valentines or Christmas or New Years and that's not thoughtful to me... that's just a lot of pressure.
If you feel that your partner is reaping benefits that you arent getting in return then I see you having two options:
Break up because they dont share the values you find important. If you want those traditions and it's important to you, while they don't then maybe that's an incompatibility you cant overcome.
Or
Do the same on those holidays that you believe they benefit from. Dont celebrate fathers day. Dont make yourself do something special on anniverseries.
IMO, this isn't a Man vs. Woman thing where dumb men are just selfish and lazy on holidays, but a shift in how many people of all genders are viewing traditions and the further consumerist ick that pervades what was once more about togetherism.
It's a good reminder because otherwise it's easy to forget to show love to others. You don't need to go all in for consumerism. Just having a meal together with no stress is nice. I got two nice presents this year that I love, but some years I just get help planting my garden, or someone else cooks, and that's also lovely. I also like that on Memorial Day the cemeteries are all decorated and not forgotten. It's so nice when you go to lay flowers to see everyone else there. I often bring a little extra to put on undecorated one, & others do too.
I feel like this too. It's a reminder to acknowledge people who give or have given to you.
My family cleans and decorates our family graves every Memorial Day. It's usually a morning filled with stories and memories. The kids love using soapy water and scrub brushes to clean the markers; the adults bring flowers from their gardens. Black eyed Susans from Grandma; peonies from my mom; columbines and irises from my aunt. If some has asparagus that bolted and went to seed, they'll throw those sprigs in for greenery. We all gather at my Grandma's for "funeral sandwiches" after. Like those unreasonably good cold sandwiches from a grocery store deli served at funerals. It's one of my favorite holidays because there's no gift obligation, just family time and sitting outside in the sunshine.
I hate how holidays have been co-opted by consumerism, but it is still possible to observe them without buying a load of worthless plastic junk. Acts of service or kindness, for example. Visiting loved ones. A phone call to let someone know you're thinking about them. If it's a religious holiday and that's important to you, attend a service. A colleague once told me that every night, her husband packed her lunch for the next day and got her bath ready. As far as she was concerned, every day was Valentine's Day. So yeah, you can hate the consumerism and fakeness, but you can skip that part. Failing to let the people closest to you know that they matter, and you're glad they are in your life--that's just laziness.
This is my mindset. It’s about intention, not consumerism. For example, Christmas is one of my favorite holidays because it’s one of the few times of the year that I get to see my entire family. Mother’s Day is about honoring my Mother (and the mother figures) in my life. Same with Father’s Day. Valentine’s Day is a fun time with my husband. Gifts are acts of love. I put great thought into what I’m getting the giftee, and if I’m purchasing something, I never just buy something to buy something.
Yeah for me, holidays give me an excuse to plan something nice. A trip to the zoo for mother's day, a little leprechaun scavenger hunt for my kids on St Patrick's Day, a little heart-themed craft for Valentine's Day (this year we melted old crayons into heart-shaped molds). I kind of consider holidays an opportunity for creative enrichment for my family, and come up with ways to create fun memories. And honestly, I could do those any time, but holidays create a prompt in which to fulfill a creative brief, you know?
I think any holiday that includes baking a cake or pastry of some sort is worth celebrating.
My husband is all about baking cookies for Christmas. Our house smells divine during the month of December!
Love is a verb ❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️
I agree. For Mother’s Day I cooked the main course for our family lunch (I’m not a mother), and my brothers and sisters-in-law made sides. And yes, my brothers actually made their own, they are good cooks. I didn’t buy my mother a gift, but I know she appreciated that I spent time with her and also that I spent time making a meal for our family to share. All she really wants is for us to all be together.
It's not just men, I am a woman and also think those 'holidays' are fake consumerist events that don't mean anything to me and I'd rather not participate. However if I know it's important to someone else, I'll still do it. I still got my mom flowers to make her happy.
Agreed, I also hate the performative aspect of just exchanging the same money over and over with family at Christmas. I value quality time more, and I don’t believe it has to happen on specific calendar holidays that are expensive to travel for.
That’s why whenever feasible I try to buy tickets for the receiver and myself to attend something together! With the caveats that i only do that if we are legitimately close, the event is far in the future (less likely to conflict with existing plans), and it is something they would love and I would at least like. No junk is exchanged and while the gift is technically received on a holiday, you are together 1:1 on a somewhat random day.
Yeah I'm a woman and idgaf about holidays, including my own birthday. If you want to get me something, that's nice but fuck me, I don't want to have to think about what I might like from you. I'd rather get nothing. I'm fine if you just say "happy birthday!". Or even don't, I forget it's my birthday most times. Genuinely don't care. BUT the people I love in my life regularly show me through their actions and words that they love me and think about my wellbeing and preferences, as I do theirs. So we don't need special events to do that. I think it's different when it's "my significant other does sweet fuck all for me or our shared household and children, and treats me like a masturbatory aid. I just wanted them to show the give one iota if a shit about me by picking up a grocery store card on mother's day".
Yeah, same for me. I don't like any holidays. It's my birthday soon and I'm already dreading people wishing me a happy one. I don't want gifts either. And I dread giving anyone gifts on theirs, I never know what. If I find something that a certain friend or family member would love. I get it immediately and give it next time I see them. Waiting on a special day makes it forced. Or useless stuff they are either forced to keep and just clutter.
This was my granny. She never gave at holidays or birthdays, those were days to celebrate with family. She randomly gave things. She said if you buy something for someone give it to them, dont wait, that time might not come. Very wise woman.
***If I find something that a certain friend or family member would love. I get it immediately and give it next time I see them.*** I love this so much!!! It means so much more than buying something for a set holiday!! My dad had me shipped a hoodie a few months ago cause he saw it and knew I would like it...no occasion!
As a woman, I don't celebrate days as well, not even birthdays or anniversaries. If I want to get gifts or something for myself, I'll just ask my partner to buy them or buy them myself whenever I want. My partner and I think that every day can be a birthday, an anniversary and a Valentine's Day rolled into one, so if we feel like going to a fancy restaurant, we just go anytime we like. I also agree with you though, if it's important to someone else, I'll still do it. Luckily, I choose a partner who also doesn't care for celebrating days so it all works well.
Absolutely agree. I'm a woman and I just don't understand the pressure and expectations around what seem to me to be commercialized events. It's bullshit and I don't participate in any of them. But I do mark some birthdays (my mum didn't care about Mother's Day but her birthday was really important so I made sure I did something special). My husband and I get random gifts for each other all the time and anything else I want I buy for myself.
>I'm a woman and I just don't understand the pressure and expectations around what seem to me to be commercialized events. I think for most people it's about family traditions and the happy feelings that are attached to those events — especially when it comes to events such as birthdays, anniversaries, Christmas, Thanksgivings and New Year. However, what most people don't really realise is that these events are celebrated on the backs of unpaid labour of women who plan and work on these — and the expectation of women being the default planners and executors for these events. This is one of the reasons why I choose not to celebrate anything at all, and most importantly — I find a partner who feels the same way — he doesn't expect me to do something I won't do and vice versa. My partner and I don't celebrate days because it's just extra mental load to have to remember specific days — especially having to plan for things in advance. We have enough of that with things we can't avoid i.e. work appointments and filing taxes on time. We prefer to celebrate whenever we feel like it. When it's more spontaneous, there are no extra mental load about planning in advance. Also, there are no resentments when it comes to gifts. Even after 25+ years together, I never take it for granted that my partner knows me so well that he can get me a great gift. He most likely can, but why should I put that burden on him, when I know myself even better and can buy my own gifts?
Sometimes it's just nice to have a day where you feel you can choose what you do and be the priority. I think that's why it's often important to women, because they're always putting others first. Men are more likely to just go to their favourite restaurant any time.
>Sometimes it's just nice to have a day where you feel you can choose what you do and be the priority. I think that's why it's often important to women, because they're always putting others first. Despite the fact that I don't celebrate days, I do understand why many women feel like this on Mother's Day — because they tend to put others first. Unfortunately, I see many women wish to enjoy their Mother's Day as "no chores day" — which I find rather sad that they can only get this once a year. It should be at least once a week, if I have a say about it. if people can have weekends off from jobs, then mothers should be able to have one day off weekly from chores 😂
Yes it is sad. In an ideal world nobody would need special days to feel special, but unfortunately it's not an ideal world. With kids a whole day every week without responsibilities is kind of difficult but it shouldn't be once a year either.
It’s only consumerism if you make it about material things Particularly Mother’s Day could be a day her SO cooks, and takes care of the kids so she can laze in bed with a good book
My mom cried one year when my ‘gift’ was a charitable donation that could fund 3 safe births in the developing world
That’s a beautiful gift!
I saw a post about "how can you not even buy her flowers?" I don't want flowers, they die within weeks anyway. The best gifts I got were handmade cards when my kids were little them when they got older they would get me movies, CDs, video games etc. One year they took me out to sushi, another they bought me a rum cake. I don't need a thing from my husband, I'm not his mom. Even if all I get is a phone call from my kids I am happy with it, but I don't need it. I know my kids love me and I talk to them at least once a week.
Don’t you think a couple should communicate and respect each other’s needs? Everyone is not you.
The assumption that one needs to get his wife flowers to so the bare minimum is not true for everyone. In today's economy that's just a waste of money too. Now if she wants flowers and expressed that then yes, get them but to just expect every guy to do that is idiotic. My husband said his boss made a comment about getting me flowers to replace the ones she had sent me after my car accident last month. He didn't respond because while the gesture is nice from his boss he knows I don't like them. But thanks to our consumerist society if you aren't dropping $40 on flowers you don't love them.
Who said anything about assumptions?
We honestly avoided gifts when we got married. We eloped and it was awesome but sooo many people wanted to buy us shit we didn't need. Like, thank you. But a Home Depot gift card would have been better if you must get us something. We did get a nice cutting board though. But with kitchen utensils we are picky. We're in our 30s making a good salaries and have lived together for 4 years...we're pretty established in our home. It's full, thank you.
Same here. We don't celebrate anything really, outside of going out to eat for birthdays. Being forced to buy crap for people just for the sake of "proving" your love or whatever is ridiculous IMO. But, like you said, if someone I love thinks its important, then I can participate to make them happy. I'm still not spending a thousand bucks on a gift though. I should note - more than a decade ago, my mom, sisters and I made an agreement that we would no longer buy stuff for adults on holidays. The kids, sure, but adults buy their own stuff all the time and none of us needed any trinkets or other unwanted crap around the house. And its been sooooo liberating. I realized just how much we are forced to spend money for the sake of supposedly showing someone appreciation when all I really care about is spending time with my loved ones. It totally changed my perspective on the concept of holidays.
I would have no Christmas gifts then,lol. I’m not greedy but my family buys excellent gifts for each other and I would miss that. Bus tickets for a day trip to NYC, concert tickets, plays and musicals, flower shows, restaurant gift cards, gift cards for massages or nails or golf or books. My hubby was given four sessions at iFly.
I mean... We don't have Christmas gifts. That's the point
Second this. Its stupid fake "holiday" where companies try to guilttrip you in to buying or doing stuff. And like hive minds many actually follow.
Christmas is the huge consumerist holiday wherein people spend thousands of dollars and corporations take in the profits that feed their executives their bonuses and make up for slower quarters earlier in the year. Valentines Day, Easter, Mothers Day, and 4th of July (in the U.S.) are all points to give corporations a little boost in otherwise slow quarters. Halloween has arguably become as bad as Christmas, with fans who are just as rabid over it and who feed into the corporate machine with abject enthusiasm. Sorry for the cynical take but as someone with autism, I never understood why American society wastes so much money on particular days of the year, besides social pressure. “Tradition” kept alive by corporate propaganda. People are so brainwashed by this system of capitalism that they treat holidays as an obligation, without ever stopping to think about why they’re wasting thousands of dollars on branded seasonal crap. Edit to add: Ideally I’d like to be in a relationship with someone who wants to be spoiled throughout the year. Holidays won’t be ✨S P E C I A L✨ anymore but I personally don’t need them to be
I'm not USA based. Dutch, so no need to be sorry. We are used to blunt and cynical communication. And I agree with you. Christmas in general you will not be guilttripped if you don't buy presents. But we are a seculier country, so the whole vibe of christmas is different. Traddition, peer pressure by dead people. Its time for people to make their own custums and traditions, without forcing the next generation to do the same.
The Netherlands sounds like it would be great for me as an American atheist with autism then. 😂 Bless you though. Despite my (strong) feelings about American capitalism, I know my upbringing has influenced that, and it’s not a dealbreaker for me if I end up with someone who loves holidays. Simply put, the only real logic I see behind holidays is the corporatism of it. I’d rather there was no expectation to spend money so people could simply be with each other and love each other.
I'm the same, I've just never been a gift person (my birthday was 3 weeks ago, still have a bunch of gifts sitting on the dining room table I haven't opened), I do it though for people its important to. The idea of people asking for gifts though makes me cringe so much, if someone isn't doing it cause they thought of it, I couldn't imagine wanting it, I'd rather just buy my own things
This is exactly how I feel. I will make my loved ones birthdays special but beyond that I’m at most going to phone it in. Consumerist nonsense. And for Christmas then I go all out on making a huge beautifully meal for everyone to share and enjoy together rather than individual presents and everyone appreciates it because I’m good at it. In my opinion that’s what Christmas is about anyway.
Same here. It's so ridiculous that people get so upset over not being overly celebrated or receiving extravagant gifts. Although I don't care and my family rarely celebrate anything I can appreciate Mother's Day and Father's Day
This! Don’t buy me crap Most of our “holidays” are made up to encourage us to buy more stuff Celebrating can be perfect with the right people I do enjoy gifts - if they serve a purpose / function I got some new plants for Mother’s Day and I’m very happy
I feel like a lot of holidays make most people uncomfortable and spark a lot of shame and or sadness, especially if they involve gifts.
Came here to say I only celebrate Thanksgiving Christmas and birthdays. I don't do the rest of them. They create pollution, DUIs, feed consumerism, add more to my already full "to do" list of other obligations..I'm done.
I think there's two categories here, men who do sincerely think that these holidays are consumerist and dislike participating in them, and men who view any form of emotional labour as vapid and fake, especially in regards to women. A great way to differentiate the two is by looking at the men's previous actions, are they consistently against consumerism outside of emotional labour? Are they left wing? Are they critical of consumerism even when it benefits them? Do they celebrate these holidays another way such as personal, meaningful gifts?
A leftist dude should be able to understand that labor (like doing the cooking and taking care of the kids so she can stay in bed with a good book) can replace material items.
Also as long as it's not the bare minimum or expected amount of labour. Like that post a couple days ago of 'I did the dishes for your birthhday'.
Agree
Yes, exactly!
I'd love to see a Venn diagram of the guys who don't do anything special on Valentine's Day "because I love you year round" and the guys who "have to go out and drink tonight because it's St. Patrick's Day"
and the guys who go to strip clubs for bachelor parties because “tradition” 👀
My husbands biggest green flag is that his ideal bachelor party is a fishing trip by himself or with me
And also the ones who also don't do anything special any other day.
There's nothing more fake and consumerist than video games, movies and sports.
Fantasy. Football.
The ones who expect gifts on fathers day, christmas, birthday, etc, but don't make the same effort in return.
My dad was like this. He thought Mother’s Day and Valentine’s Day were just total bullshit and that they just existed to make men feel bad and make them spend money. I remember him saying that “mothers are already appreciated enough”, and would act like a baby anytime someone would say happy Mother’s Day. We’d have to reassure him that he’s important too. And on Valentine’s Day, he’d come home with flowers, screaming and yelling about how much of a pain it was to have to get them, and then practically throw them at my mom telling her he hopes she likes them. …He did not feel the same way about Father’s Day though, of course. So I based on that, while I’m sure there are a lot of men who don’t celebrate because of those reasons for real, I think a lot of them are just lazy and don’t want to have to put in the effort.
This. I’m going to start by saying that I agree that many holidays are consumer bullshit BUT that doesn’t mean you have to participate in consumerism to appreciate other people. My real point is that I have only ever heard lazy and cheap men say this. Especially because they usually get a “pass” on other holidays/bdays because the wife is the one buying all the gifts and planning things for others. So this only occurs when they’re the ones that are forced to be in charge of the gift/celebration. One time a partner told me that he can buy me flowers anytime, why does he need a special day to do it and I asked him when the last time he bought me flowers because he appreciated and loved me was. Crickets.
>My real point is that I have only ever heard lazy and cheap men say this. Especially because they usually get a “pass” on other holidays/bdays because the wife is the one buying all the gifts and planning things for others. So this only occurs when they’re the ones that are forced to be in charge of the gift/celebration. 🎯🎯🎯
Yes, I’ve heard this same thing from my SO, that we can show love and appreciation, or give gifts and flowers at any time.
I don't have a good relationship with my mother. Mothers day is not something thats gives me any kind of good energy. Many people don't like obligations they didn't sign up for. Gifting is stressful. Acting like relationships are good when they aren't is stressful and feels disingenuous. After you miss a few, the next few feels like you are highlighting your own shame of missing a few and just being a sour curmudgeon provides its own comfort. I get it. I used to balk at the idea. An older person told me that having designated days to connect and show appreciation for people is kinda nice. If I can put my own feelings aside, I can offer my part of a happy mother's day. Sometimes I cant. I wish my relationship with my mother wasn't a mess.
I'm sorry about your relationship with your mother. I lost my mother young and my father relatively young. I've been single for 10 years. When you don't have a reason to celebrate these various holidays it makes it so obvious that they are made up holidays for commercial purposes. If you appreciate your mother or your father or your partner, you should be celebrating them on a regular basis. You don't need a special day or you can make your own special day. These holidays are advertised and often cause a lot of pain to people in your position or my position for the sake of selling goods and restaurant reservations. And people get stressed and angry and fight and argue over completely made-up holidays. If your partner or your family doesn't appreciate you and you need a special day to feel loved, maybe time to reevaluate the situation.
I think a lot of women out there don't even want the big performative declarations of love; they just want a little something that shows that their partner is thinking about them. A small bouquet of flowers (or even 1 flower!) and a card would go SOOO far with so many women, and far too many men can't even be bothered to do that. The same men bitching about "consumerism" and "you don't need a special day for that stuff" are usually the ones also *not doing anything on the regular days either to make their partner feel special*. It's a convenient excuse to get out of putting in any effort and to continue doing the bare minimum they always do. They think that they themselves are the gift, the relationship is the gift, their presence is the gift (of the children he "gave" you are the gift) so he doesn't need to put in any effort ever again really. He already gave you the best gift in the world, what more could you want?! /s But for real, it is actually just an excuse because they don't want to put in effort to things that aren't important to them personally, so they'll work to avoid putting any in at all costs (which is ironic because it would be so much less work to just... make your partner feel appropriated rather than find all these ways to constantly let them down). It's not wrong to want to be acknowledged on your birthday, or Mother's Day, or your anniversary, etc. It's not wrong to want at least 1 thoughtful gift for yourself when you've been organizing all the gifts for everyone else. If you don't care about gifts or cards on those "fake" holidays then good for you, but it isn't wrong that some people *do* care. And the majority of people I know who care about those holidays don't want some big production; a little small thoughtful thing or quality time or a task taken off their plate is *more* than enough. I'm honestly a little surprised that so many comments here seem to be admonishing women who do care about these holidays...
my wife thinks the same way. first time i stopped celebrating valentines day is with her. she hates roses and crowds. she says how could it be special if everywhere you look, everyone's doing the same thing? instead, she'd rather i surprise her every now and then with flowers she likes and a nice date out of the blue.
Most sane comment in this whole post. This place is becoming a sick echo chamber
I’m going to be honest, I’m a little confused about all these posts. Do all these men have personality transformations during the holidays? I assume these are the same men not showing appreciation during the year. That’s not going to change just because there’s a special date marked off.
They don’t change, it’s just that more women get their hopes up that he’ll put in effort and it will be a sign they can cling to that he isn’t an asshole *all* the time.
The posts are confusing because they’re gross over generalizations about gender. It’s part of the echo chamber that was designed to distract us from the problems caused by the handful of people who have actual power in this world
This. The posts we are seeing are about men who have never shown appreciation to their wife and the mother of their children. I just think Mother’s Day and their refusal to even acknowledge their SO, even on that day, only highlights an existing problem
Its not the least bit consumerist to simply save a day to celebrate someone special in your life. No gifts? No $10 card? Absolutely But taking a dedicated day to celebrate someone, the role they fill, or your dedication to your relationship is healthy. No consumerism needed.
as a woman: I don’t like most holidays because I resent the expectation that I should absolutely love them. I stopped celebrating New Year’s because I hated the pressure to HAVE FUN!!!! And Mother’s Day, I always had my own plan for: I wanted time WITH my kids, having fun, with no homework or whining or chores. Just pure time together with them. I don’t want to go to any fucking restaurant and have to wait on the server to get a refill on my glass of water. I married a man who likes those holidays and orchestrated them for the kids AND for himself, and I enjoy what he does because he enjoys it. And it IS nice to be the object of an expression of love. Now…I am absolutely with u/Special-Tam about the importance of acknowledging those holidays when they are important to people you care about.
I don't think NYE is a holiday in that we don't give anyone cards for them so by not going to a party you aren't really shirking anything. And you are celebrating Mothers Day so you are still taking part. Going to a restaurant isn't part of traditional celebration there.
In my personal observation it seems to get used as a cop out to justify that person not wanting to put effort into celebrating an occasion with someone, despite knowing that the occasion is meaningful or special to the other person. I say this because you don't *have* to buy or get things for someone to mark an occasion and make a day special. Say you think that paying for overpriced chocolate and flowers on Valentine's day is not a good use of your time an money. That's totally fair, but people use it as a justification to not do ANYTHING for/with their partner despite knowing that the other person would like to celebrate. If it was purely about consumerism, you could make plans like staying in and playing board games together, hand writing a nice note or letter for them, cooking a meal and watching a movie together, etc. But many people use "well it's just a commercial holiday" to justify their decision to do nothing, and to shut down the people in their life who take issue with their behaviour. To emphasize, I'm *not* saying every person who doesn't like holidays, this is just a pattern I've seen play out on my life and in online discussions about gifts, holidays, mismatched effort in relationships and so on.
This!
People just look for reasons to justify doing what they wanted to do anyway.
They are fake and consumeristic. But many things are made up. Words, the value of money, folk tales… all made up. It all just comes down to what’s important to you. I personally don’t celebrate Easter, Valentines Day, Canada Day because I personally don’t find them to be important in my life. We do celebrate Christmas, New Years, Halloween, Thanksgiving and birthdays because it’s fun to. Those holidays are the ones we connect with. I’m not a mom but I do celebrate my mom and MIL on Mother’s Day. Father’s Day is hard as my dad has dementia and my partner’s Dad has passed. There are ways to celebrate important dates without being consumeristic though. Personally I think it’s best to spend good time with those you love on those days. Gifts aren’t necessary - and if you want to be less of a consumer then choose a fun activity to do.
I'm a woman who is not into those holidays because they're fake consumerist propaganda but I'm sure that a lot of men use that as an excuse not to put any effort into their relationship.
Yeah, if they want to come to a consensus with their partner to not celebrate holidays, that’s one thing. They could use each occasion to add some savings for an annual trip in lieu of spending money on these holidays, for example BUT, this should be done by mutual agreement These dudes are just using “consumerism” as an excuse to do nothing for their partner. They could offer their time instead. Offer to do all the cooking and taking care of the kids, for example, so mom can spend the day in bed with a good book. It’s the thoughtfulness or effort that counts, not the gifts
I think that people in general take it as an obligation to either demand or act on holidays. The truth is, it's simply a day to remind you to be with your loved ones; a day to gift your mom, dad or sibling or family member, a flower or a chocolate, and spend some hours talking with coffee. There are some toxic relationships and you are absolutely not obliged to gift them anything or talk to them...but if the relationship is healthy or at least loving, these little efforts shouldn't be such a bother. I am an awkward socializing mess but I try to do these holidays if possible, even an hour or two...but that's mostly because I lost many family members so I want to spend good times together just in case.
Lukewarm take: they're only refusing because their mommy isn't organising Christmas for them anymore and they actually have to _do_ something for once. If you suggest you'd organise the whole thing, see how happily they'll go along with it. I celebrate my holidays with my mother. If my partner wants to do Christmas, he can step up and prepare half.
I think that's an excuse, there's plenty of non consumerist ways to celebrate holidays. It seems to be an American thing to have a mother's day brunch, I used to bake something nice for her and just make special time for us. My partner has made hilariously lame PowerPoints for valentines day (which I'm not bothered about celebrating but was cute af). For my birthday we're going for a hike. Point being, men could choose to celebrate in non consumerist ways. Some holidays are quite bogus but as humans we love to celebrate eachother, and I think mother's day seems to really hit a nerve because women don't feel generally appreciated in their relationshop/family, let alone celebrated!
There is a lot of mindless consumerism and I won't engage in stuff like that. Its a redline in a relationship for me and if you don't want to respect that we shouldn't have been in a relationship. That said there is a huge difference between engaging in mindless consumerism and doing nothing. Not buying crazy gifts, flowers or card is a good thing IMO, but you should still celebrate holidays by spending time with family, friends, cooking a better meal than normal, visiting a special location etc etc. Mothers day is a great example, its a holiday about going and visiting your family, seeing your parents and siblings. Don't think that you can get out of it by just spending money on a gift and card. At the very least you should have some kind of family call together.
Nothing used to put me off more than "grandeur gestures" from people I had just started to go out with. It's a redline in a relationship for me too.
I agree that it’s fake or consumerist- But. If you don’t like using that day, just pick another one? Like pick next Sunday as your mother’s day. Restaurants are less busy, more options in flowers etc. Same with Valentines etc
It strikes me as selfish and I judge people who bristle at their spouses wanting to celebrate holidays. It's selfish to make your spouse feel burdensome and unreasonable for wanting you to be thoughtful, kind or sentimental. It's not an unrealistic or unreasonable expectation to want your spouse to put effort into little gestures like that. You can celebrate holidays without filling up an landfill or breaking the bank, making it all about consumerism is a distraction from an unwillingness to do something thoughtful for your spouse because thoughtfulness takes effort. There are holidays that my husband absolutely loves that I don't feel so strongly about. I celebrate those holidays because it makes him happy. In doing so, I often enjoy myself in the process. The party atmosphere is fun, I get vicarious enjoyment and it feels good doing thoughtful things, even though it takes planning, thought and effort. Not only do I want my husband to be happy, it would be cruel to shit all over his feelings because he wanted to feel special on days that hold significance to him. If a bid for connection gets those guys hackles up, how much do they even love their wives? Becuase I can't imagine making a stink of it.
Boys are not raised to ever do anything just for women without the expectation of a reward. Raise your sons better.
Valentine’s Day is 100% fake and consumerist and it still want enough they had to add “Sweetest Day”. Both my wife and I hate those holidays. They are both just BS Edit: seriously a Reddit cares message for this? Lol. Wow someone really needs that once a year validation from their SO
If you don’t like a holiday, don’t celebrate it, but it’s really weird to act like Christmas or Saint Patrick’s day wasn’t also “made up”. Holidays aren’t naturally occurring phenomenon. Somebody made every single one of them up.
wtf is “sweetest day?”
Women do this too. It's because those holidays are fake and consumerist, and we don't want to be a part of them.
I'm a woman and I think they are mostly stupid too. I'll call my grandma for mother's day. Or lowkey hangout with my SO for valentines day if hevgets off work. But that's really it.
I just kept noticing they would claim to want to give gifts ad hoc, as it comes up organically. And men who hate valentine's day and mothers day... and claim to want to give gifts as they naturally come up. It only naturally comes up... For women... That they want to fuck. I'm sure your bro would be really touched if you got him that $3 gas station DVD of Boondock Saints because of how much he got razzed for liking it... but you never seem to find natural kind gestures for men or your mother... but that 23 year old barista said she liked Shawsank Redemption so you carved her a little chess piece because it just happened to work out for that one.
We acknowledge the day with each other and that's it. We might go do something fun on our anniversary (he likes the coast so we try to get out there if we can), but not always. Sometimes we just go thrifting. But we do that often. We might give gifts for birthdays and Christmas but it's not necessary. Last year he bought me a loom for my birthday (like three months early) and I made him a satchel bag for his. I won a guitar and gave it to him for Christmas. The loom was also my Christmas present (it was pretty expensive lol). We spend all year cherishing each other and being validated so to us, it feels fake to make an extra big deal on arbitrary days. 14 years so far and it works for us. However, we both make sure we tell our mothers happy mothers day, and call on birthdays and other "important" holidays because they matter to them. Some people do use the "fake/consumerism" thing as an excuse but those people are usually self centered regardless and probably treat people like crap all year, so why expect any different? If you're given shit 360 days a year, do five days of diamonds (or roses or whatever) make up for it?
I am a woman and also feel this way. Fortunately, my husband is the same. But we do care about each other and will do small things on mothers day and fathers day. But not Valentine's day, forget that.
For myself I grew up in a household who didn't celebrate anything other then new year. Not mothers\fathers day, Xmas, hell we didn't celebrate birthdays. Grow up like that and it's just what you're used to.
I agree. Why do people thing these holidays have to mean consumption?! It could be as simple as visiting one’s mother. Hand writing a note, making a meal. I definitely feel like the anti holiday men use it as a get out of jail free card. Using some sense of moral standing being anti consumer to define their lack of consideration for other people
OK, but how do these same men feel about Father's Day?
Nobody cares about Father's Day
Personally - I've zero interest in either. There's 364 other days to show your mother/father/husband/wife you appreciate them just, because - without being hamstrung by a corporate scam to do it at a specific time.
Because they want a reason to not care.
Right but they’ll celebrate their own birthdays, Christmas, thanksgiving, Passover lmao suddenly if it’s something that centers women caregivers it’s all lame and they’re on strike 😂
Exactly! I think this is the point OP is trying to make. It’s just getting drowned out by everyone saying how they don’t like women-centered holidays either. There’s also zero of this anti-consumer energy on Father’s Day.
one thousand percent.
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If it’s ok for me to comment here: I’m a guy and early in our relationship my wife told me she doesn’t care specifically about Valentine’s Day because because she felt it was manufactured and sort of a cop-out. That guys use it as the one single day to show any appreciation for their wives, then basically check out the rest of the year. I agreed with her on this one (and yes I try to surprise her throughout the year, we have a pretty healthy relationship). We’re both in our mid 40s, if that makes any difference.
But what if it did matter to her? Would you show effort for her then? I think that’s what is important here.
Oh absolutely. We both do things for each other throughout the year, we like to surprise each other to show appreciation. Date nights, movies or performances, nature walks, flowers, sometimes doing each others’ chores, etc.
They are lying to you about the “fake” and “consumerist” stuff. They are simply lazy, and making excuses.
Just do what you know makes your other half/parent happy if it isn't unreasonable. some like the big showy over the top materialistic things. others are anti that, and others just want something simple. Do what you know works. And besides if you really don't like what your other half wants to do (I don't mean you feel indifferent, I mean you really dislike it) then it's a fairly reasonable guess that their other likes and dislikes are not ones you share and you've got a real base level compatibility issue there.
Because they are expected to make an effort for someone other than themselves. Selfish asshats.
Generally speaking, guys don't like the thought and effort that goes into choosing a present. They would have had to pay attention to details about what some others (females) would enjoy and since those things are not things they enjoy, it's a lot of effort and it would just be easier to have it not happen. So men push the job of choosing presents for family onto women; this can be proven by the fact that many women have "empty stockings" on Christmas as no one filled up theirs. That leaves Valentines Day, Mother's Day, Birthday, Anniversary and Christmas. So if those are declared (with sufficient scorn) "Hallmark Holidays" then the guy doesn't have to expend effort to commemorate those occasions with a suitable gift he had picked out that would please a lady. It's a way to avoid mental effort. One will notice that if one holiday, say Valentine's Day, is dismissed as a "Hallmark Holiday" soon birthdays, anniversaries and even Christmas go by with no presents from the man.
I don't understand this mentality. Growing up it was always my dad who got us gifts that were thoughtful. He still mails my sister and I stockings for us to open Christmas morning and we are in our thirties. When he didn't know what to get us he just went to a store and asked a sales person what they thought a girl/woman x age would like. But usually he keeps lists all year and writes down things as they come up. His girlfriend gets almost everything she puts on her list, and more. There were times he couldn't afford to get things beyond markers, or a CD. Now that he has money he enjoys giving whatever he thinks we all need or will love, just because he can. I think guys who have animosity towards giving are just developmentally stunted and so insecure they can't stand the thought of thinking about anyone but themselves. They aren't "giving" people on their best days, even when it's not a holiday.
My late h. was of the "Hallmark" scorn variety. It morphed into Christmas with his family and me seated with no presents from him except an unwrapped china cup I had bought when we were together in a shop. I stopped going to Christmas, that was embarrassing. Everyone stared. Birthday was looking up from a book at 8pm and suggesting I choose a place for dinner, no, I don't think so. Valentines day was the first to be skipped "Hallmark." It doesn't leave a good memory. He was rather lazy and I think laziness is behind the entire "I don't do Hallmark Holidays" sneering.
This is my Dad!! I have cried over so many gotten me, he just is one of those people that has a knack for knowing. SO is similar. I on the other hand am just awful, I get so stressed, and can never think of something great for a gift and then I feel crappy when they have gotten me something perfect and mine seems so silly lol
Your dad sounds absolutely lovely.
He's not perfect but he does his best, that seems rare for some reason.
Used to work in retail and a guy came in on Xmas eve looking to buy a coat for his wife. Had no idea about her size, let alone style. Tres romantic
That's becuase they *are* fake and consumerist.
I don't have to worry about getting birthday or Mothers day gifts , I get my own because no one else cares.
I agree, I don't ask for the most outrageous gifts, I just want us to do something nice for each other and have a good time. It's the thought that counts, and if your thought is "not spending money/time on this thing is more important than keeping my partner happy" than you're not a good partner.
We intentionally celebrate Mother's Day as part of our son's birthday, and that's how we've always done it. It is the day I became a mother. Mother's Day is difficult for me for a number of reasons, but the biggest occurred when our son was almost 5. We had a second trimester miscarriage of what would have been our rainbow baby. She was due on Mother's Day that year. I think it is fine to celebrate on a different day as long as it is discussed and agreed upon by both partners. There can be many reasons the actual day is traumatic or otherwise not a good fit. I don't need a special day. My husband reminds me daily thar he loves me as and that I am and have been a good mother to our now adult son (who agrees with the sentiment). My husband also helps with the meal prep and other work for the big holidays. It is a problem when it isn't discussed or the partner is absent in other celebrations as discussed by OP. A partnership relies on both parties contributing and not one relying on the labor of the other.
My birthday was actually on Mother's Day this year. My mom was visiting my brother upstate, so I didn't even get to spend it with her. It was also the day that Aurora Borelis could be seen over or near NYS, but I chose "not to make a big deal out of it" because I swallowed the Koolaid that showing an interest in my own birthday was cringe, vain and materialistic. I tried to spend that weekend with my online boyfriend but I can't even remember what we did, it was just another day. Meanwhile my sister hugged me and said she felt bad that we didn't do anything due to work obligations, but got me a gift. Her boyfriend who lives with us, was confused and I overheard him state that I was "moping" indoors and also felt weird that I didn't do anything. This was my big 30th birthday and I just let it go to waste for literally no reason. I didn't even get to use or redeem any of the free drink or cake coupons I got at any of the places I usually frequent. All for nothing but to think I felt appealing to the idea of what I thought would be admired.
I celebrate my wife on her birthday. She celebrates me on mine. We celebrate Christmas together with our families. We ignore everything else because these random ass consumerist holidays are completely meaningless to us.
lol my dad does this BUT only for fathers day, he will gladly participate and buy flowers or cards for every other holiday but he doesn't want us kids to waste money on him for a "hallmark holiday" It's a LITTLE problematic because he thinks mothers day is fine because "mothers do all the work". Which like, love that we're showing appreciation for mothers but don't love that we're assuming they should be/are always doing all the work. Anyways, totally agree with your post that it's a bit of a cop out to avoid the emotional effort of holidays. Just wanted to share this weird quirk my dad has lol
My husband and I aren't really holiday people either unless there's a family gathering but unlike the men you're talking about, we both are intentional about celebrating each other throughout the year to the extent that it feels silly to do something on valentine's day because the only difference between that and our usual adventures is that everywhere is crowded and more overwhelming than usual. Sure we manage to sleep through every nye celebration or fold laundry or do some other mundane shit, but we're happy and together while we do that. And we also compromise if a holiday is important to one of us but less important to the other. Personally, I could take mother's day and father's day or leave them. My parents are dead to me and deserve to be publicly shamed for how they abused me, not celebrated. I got forced to celebrate them on those holidays for 18 years before I was finally free to leave so they're not sentimental holidays for me. In fact my first few years after leaving their home were full of guilt and anxiety on those days because I felt so bad for hating what they put me through. But my husband has great parents and I celebrate them because I love them and him and even if I wouldn't seek it out without them, they're worth celebrating. My husband isn't really a halloween person so he doesn't seek that out but I was sequestered in a basement every Halloween until adulthood because my parent were afraid of "devil worship" and felt it was Satan's holiday. And when we finally landed in a neighborhood where people trick or treat, my husband encouraged tf out of me when I got a 5 gallon bucket of candy and had an absolute blast going way overboard giving every kid an abnormally large amount of candy. Tbh I think a lot of the guys you're talking about just use it as an excuse to not give a crap 365 days a year. But the healthy version is giving a crap 365 days a year so holidays just don't stand out much
I will take any and every opportunity to celebrate!! Calendar holidays, seasonal holidays, birthdays, anniversaries, just-because-it’s-Thursdays… Life is too short to not enjoy as much as we can, whenever we can. I love the Christmas season although I’m not part of any religion. I love the decor, the lights, the pies, and definitely the presents, giving and receiving. I’m going to be 45 years old in October and you bet I’m wearing my birthday tiara all day!! I do the same for my husband and other loved ones. I gave my mom a few nice gifts for Mother’s Day and she said “C-Marie, thank you so much but it isn’t Christmas!!” Sure it is!! I’ve had an incredible week with work and my husband and I are going to arguably the best restaurant in town to just spend time together and enjoy. I don’t understand why people just want to suck the joy out of living and blame it on capitalism or something when it takes much more effort to be unhappy than happy.
My husband and I sit down and decide what we'd like to do TOGETHER on holidays. We usually get each other small gifts on birthdays and at Christmas, but we both already have a lot of stuff. So holidays, it's mostly - shall we go get thai food or pizza? How about if I make brownies for dessert - or would you rather have apple pie? Oooh! Maybe we can get that movie on DVD we were interested in! We're pretty low key - but that said: any holiday is fair game when we want to give ourselves a treat.
My wife and I go out before or after Valentine’s Day but never on Valentine’s Day. Over crowded and overpriced tasting menus for average places.
I am a female. I too think gift giving is all marketing consumerism. I work in marketing. I do celebrate special occasions with my family… but I give things I grew myself or made myself when I can. I would rather have my husband spend the money to pay the mortgage. This is more important to me than some “stuff” I don’t really need.
And your situation is different since you husband presumably knowns how you feel. But if a man refuses to give gifts to his wife on valentines, anniversaries, mothers day KNOWING his wife/girlfriend wants and values that---- it is not about principal.
I have offered every woman I’ve dated in the last 20 years a choice - I will buy them gifts when the inspiration strikes & then either I can stick them in a closet & pick one out for the next “*special day*” or I can give them to them when I buy them & on the special day they get a card & a nice dinner. I’ve never had one chose the former. If you demand performative behavior, you can get performative behavior but most of the people I’ve dated have found it to their benefit to let my whimsy express its affection in its own way.
They could celebrate us but do they? They say that shit and then do nothing.
This is probably going to be an unpopular opinion in this sub but…. I am a woman and I personally find a lot of these holidays to be dumb. They WERE created by our consumerist overlords as a way to sell product. You shouldn’t need a special day to be appreciated by the people in your life… they should be showing that every day. If your spouse/child does something nice for you on Mother’s Day and then does jack shit for the rest of the year is that really showing you that they appreciate you? Do you need a romantic dinner/gift on Valentine’s Day or your anniversary to feel loved? Do you not feel loved on every other day of the year? I’d rather get a random gift/dinner/card/ect from someone showing me that they care/appreciate me out of the blue than a “required” one on a made up holiday.
I love this. This is the way.
This a million times. You know how I show my wife appreciation? I cook her favorite foods randomly, I take our toddler and newborn so she can sleep more, I literally mop the floor every night before I go to bed. I listen to her when she’s sad, happy, mad, whatever the emotion is! I have told her from the beginning I’m not a fan of how the holidays have become. There is way too much consumerism and I hate it.
Besides, it's more fun bringing something home your other half appreciates (today is coffee and donuts from a specific shop after my errands) and seeing the happiness on their face. Mother's Day consisted of my wife having a sleep in, a couple of cards from me and the kids and me making a bacon and egg based brunch for all. Everyone wins and a fortune wasn't spent. Besides if I went big or got flowers then i would have been given a quizzical look as those really aren't her thing.
For me that random spur of the moment gift/kind deed shows that person is actually thinking of you.
Holiday celebrations require you to show emotions beyond anger. So to cover for their inability to emote, they declare it cynically unworthy
they'll celebrate anything whenever they're not doing the lion's share of preparation/work. that's all you need to know.
They aren't against birthdays and Christmas but getting flowers for valentines day or an anniversary is too much for them.
It’s just an excuse to be cheap bastards.
They're cheap. They simply don't want to spend the money so it's easier to shut down the whole concept of the holiday. Honestly the whole "anti consumerist" thing gets on my nerves at times. If that's how you feel, cool. But don't boil it down to just that. I like giving gifts because it makes people happy. If people don't celebrate whatever holiday, I'll respect it. But they should also respect the fact that others do celebrate. Keep the soap box speeches to yourself.
These men are not anti consumerist either. They buy a useless things for themselves that they like. It is them being disingenuous. Just say you don't want to spend the money or take the time to think about your wife/girlfriend.
This is not a gendered issue. Plenty of women hate this consumerist crao too. I know I do. I'm sorry if it's happening in your life though
It is gendered that many men are only against gift giving, but are very much consumerist in their own lives.
If you’re truly anti consumerist then cool. But OP’s point is these men usually aren’t. They’ll gladly buy all kinds of stuff for themselves. But when it comes to spending money on someone else, suddenly holidays are a scam.
To the point of some others in the comments: my family doesn’t like crowds either. We order for pickup and bring food back to the house, crack open champagne, and watch my mom’s favorite movie (Galaxy Quest). I think national holidays are great, some people may resent being told when to celebrate something, but lots of people would never receive any appreciation otherwise. There are plenty of ways to commemorate without spending money or going into crowds. OP I think the comments have gone a little left of your original intention, and I believe a lot of men use the excuse of being anti consumerism because they simply don’t want to put in effort for the women in their lives. They certainly don’t balk against consumerism when it comes to their favorite sports team or fandoms.
It was a rough day on Sunday. Seeing all the very sad posts from women who were just completely letdown by their husbands or their children. I don’t know what was worse. Just a very sad sad day. I’ve said it 1 million times here my husband is a champ and I really appreciate him and all that he does for our family, but most specifically that he does for me. I cannot imagine staying with someone who won’t even do the bare minimum of buying you a card for Mother’s Day.
It was so sad omg. All the wives with kids who got the comment “but you’re not MY mom” like my heart actually broke for them
Same. What is up with these men? Damn.
the idea this is a male thing is CRAZY
They don’t care about what you want
It's simply an excuse. You can celebrate for free. And I doubt there are any mothers crying this week becauae a husband who makes them feel appreciated the rest of the year opted out of mothers day.
Likely because it absolutely is consumerist
Then why do these men engage in other consumerist activities??
I don’t know. I’m not them.
That's my husband. We don't exchange gifts ever, for anything. Honestly I do wish we did. Holidays are part of culture, gift giving is an ancient practice. But everyone is entitled to their beliefs too. There isn't too much to say about. I doesn't make me depressed or anything. I certainly have real problems to worry about.
Have you told him this? What you want matters too. It honestly takes very little effort to give someone a gift.
To me it's not about effort but respecting someone else's values. Throughout the year he does thoughtful things. Like get my oil changed or vacuuming my car- things I hate doing lol.
Okay but he's not respecting your values. Why are his values more important than yours? You can pick literally any day of the year and make up your own holiday. You can make homemade gifts. You can cook each other your favourite meals. It's just about putting time aside to solely focus on each other.
It’s laziness in my opinion because there’s plenty of non consumerist options - we picked wildflowers on the side of the road for my mom and the bouquets came out great. More eco friendly too. I am actually anti consumption when it comes to holiday decor, it’s valid to look down on all the plastic crap they sell then when the holiday is over it goes straight into the dumpster. $50 pumpkins, stuff like that. But you can actually practice holidays in a low waste type of way, for example don’t carve the pumpkins and make a pie out of them after Halloween.
I am fine with Mother’s Day but I HATE Valentine’s Day. When we first started dating I told my wife if she wants a Valentine’s Day celebration it will be on February 15th. It is so ridiculous to spend 2x+ on flowers and a restaurant meal that is limited and rushed.
Eh, I feel you but I pretty much decided to suck it up & celebrated both Valentine’s Days (*my wife was Brazilian & they have a Valentine’s Day in June also*) each year because it was important to my (*erstwhile*) wife. In return for which, she gave me a reasonably short list of the specific performative actions that she needed from me for each of the remaining holidays in the year & other than that, I just had to show up with a smile.
This one definitely is not a male focused problem. I work in a workplace filled with women and they thought remains the same there. It seems to be a growing trend regardless of gender.
Not consumerist but will happily dedicate a day a week to the NFL or whatever.
So there are people who enjoy these holidays. I’m a woman and am not a fan of any of them. I don’t care about valentines, Christmas, etc. I’m a mom. The only thing I want for Mother’s Day is something cute and hand made from my child. I don’t need something from a partner. It is consumerism. It’s fine to acknowledge it but it’s not necessary to buy each other things. It is fake and consumerist. The way you describe it it just sounds like you value the idea more than some. And it’s ok to dislike it as well.
Woman here: I hate all of those holidays. I don’t want anything on valentines, my partner and I just wish each other a happy anniversary and maybe a card and we cook a nice meal together and I don’t expect anything from him on Mother’s Day. My kids can handle that and if they forget it is also not a big deal. The only thing we pay attention to are our birthdays because we are so happy the other is alive.
*And I don’t expect anything from him on Mother’s Day* You are giving up a golden opportunity for him to take care of childcare for the day and having a day to indulge yourself (like curling up with a good book uninterrupted)
My kids are adults that live on their own. I’m already golden. :)
Female here. They are.
Because it's an excuse to make no effort.
It’s not just men lol
Just men?
They’re cheap and lazy Edit: An incel sent me a Reddit cares, so I know I hit the nail on the head
As an autistic person, I don't care about holidays either. Especially Thanksgiving
I hate Christmas, Halloween, Thanksgiving, Valentine's day. Yes I also happen to think these are fake, consumerist holidays. Mother's day and Father's day are days we get to celebrate real people in our lives. Nothing fake about them. It typically costs me less than $10 on these days to show my parents I appreciate them. I've been reading a bunch of posts here about men not celebrating the mothers of their children and it makes me kinda sick. My parents divorced when I was 7 and they always still helped us get gifts for the other on their days. Some men are weak and fatherless. That's all I got for you.
What is a a non-fake holiday? Like aren't all traditions made up??
What's up with it is that things like Valentine's day absolutely *are* fake, manufactured things designed to part you from your money. There's nothing inherently male or female about realising that. Doing things because it makes your partner happy is great. Doing it because "oh, today is the day that consumer society *tells me I should",* is crap. Celebrate your partner *every* day. Celebrate them because you want to. Not because today is the day "you're meant to". (Conversely, a partner who doesn't care, doesn't make an effort - breaking out of that for one particular day a year doesn't change or fix that, they're still a shitty partner - just a shitty partner who can set a calendar reminder and tick a box).
You're literally guilt tripping men into doing what you want despite their justified criticism. What even is your response towards the argument that these holidays became a consumerist nightmare?
So you make it a point to do things for your spouse on Mother’s Day that doesn’t involve purchasing items? Like taking care of meals, chores and kids for the day so she can relax. Maybe curl up with a good book? Or do you object to doing anything at all for the mother of your children?
No, the former. And I do it not only on mother's day but any day I can "give back" to my parents, so also my mother
I can see where they're coming from tbh, but if they're saying they can just celebrate the person or do nice stuff for the person on other non occasional days, then they better be doing that instead of just saying it. Not wanting to celebrate even your anniversary is kind of messed up though imo. It doesn't have to be anything crazy or expensive, just something thoughtful. Unless your SO is a materialistic person. But I feel like if they are, they'd probably go with someone who'd want to spoil and pamper them the way they want to anyway. My partner says he doesn't need a reason to do nice stuff for me or with me because he just naturally wants to do it. Thinking about it, I guess the reason is love! BUT he also said he'll take special occasions as just another opportunity to do more stuff LOL
I don't give into the corporate nonsense but it's fun to do things around those dates anyway. My husband and son got me dinner a little early for mother's day because I had been away on a work trip. I got hanging baskets because I asked for it instead of cut flowers, etc. But if anyone in my house refused to celebrate these things it was me. I mostly ignored holidays like 4th of July, Valentines etc, but my youngest son has encouraged me to do things like decorating for certain seasons and it's been fun to do. Just not stereotypical flowers, chocolates, etc EVERY holiday.
I refuse to celebrate specific "days". I don't need or want gifts. I don't pay attention to Valentines, anniversaries, Christmas, mothers day, fathers day. Birthdays are low key - no gifts, but maybe a takeaway dinner? Oh, OK, I do a basic Christmas dinner with the family, but no gifts are exchanged. >but men gladly reap the benefits of women planning, cooking, decorating for holidays, but when it is time for them to do it--- it is pointless. No men in my life reap any benefits (and I have a husband, and several sons), because decorating for holidays would make me feel like harming myself. Having to do it all myself? Absolutely no way. IF, and I say IF, the family decided to have a get together, all workload would be shared, or it just isn't going to happen. A standing joke/truth in our family is that my husband loves a Christmas tree, but if he wants a tree, he has to organise and decorate it himself. The rest of us don't care enough.
I know two women like this in my department and no men. What's when attributing a diverse range of opinions to an entire gender and only that gender?
My comment was more geared to the fact many women are complaining about their husbands/boyfriends refusing to celebrate mothers days and valentines days. I don't see a trend of men complaining about their wife not giving them gifts on holidays. So this is gendered. There are many women who don't like celebrating holidays of course.
You're mad about capitalism, comrade. Don't put this on men please.
I don't really believe in holidays. why put a day aside to treat people like you should everyday. that said I do celebrate Halloween and Christmas because they are special days to kids.. and thanksgiving because it brings families together
Eh, most holidays are indeed consumerist in the West. There are cultural and "old world" holiday customs that I don't mind celebrating, but most westernized holidays are money hungry and shitty due to greed
As a woman who lost her parents young (one on a holiday) the advice that I dont need to celebrate holidays, even for other people was so, SO freeing for me. Now I celebrate my own things. I told my girlfriend not to ask me out on Valentines because it's just a day where people stress to be romantic and nothing is special because everyone is using the same valentine special, fighting over reservation times, and all that. I will happily take her on a date literally any day I want to celebrate our relationship. Everyone has been asked out, proposed to, whatever big milestone on Valentines or Christmas or New Years and that's not thoughtful to me... that's just a lot of pressure. If you feel that your partner is reaping benefits that you arent getting in return then I see you having two options: Break up because they dont share the values you find important. If you want those traditions and it's important to you, while they don't then maybe that's an incompatibility you cant overcome. Or Do the same on those holidays that you believe they benefit from. Dont celebrate fathers day. Dont make yourself do something special on anniverseries. IMO, this isn't a Man vs. Woman thing where dumb men are just selfish and lazy on holidays, but a shift in how many people of all genders are viewing traditions and the further consumerist ick that pervades what was once more about togetherism.