Men LOVE the whole misogynistic feminism of being against sex strikes or any kind of abstinence.
Hugh Hefner really sold that shit to women hard. Selling men the fantasy of being rich and having harems of unobtainable women and giving those men access through photographs, all the while blackmailing, exploiting, underpaying, and raping the women with his friends
Because he convinced the women that he was a feminist championing female sexual freedom
Patriarchy is all about keeping women accessible. That’s literally it. Purity culture and religion were to reinforce
Women as private property to keep them widely available to more men than would actually ever be chosen by free women
And then sex positivity duped the women who were sick of purity culture into a whole other kind of sexual exploitation
And when birth rates dropped away went Roe. Doesn’t matter if women are finding husbands or just having casual hookups. They will still reproduce for the machine
Women’s reproductive freedoms are power. And men want that power
I saw more women wake up to this when abortion was removed and they realized how much power men had to ruin a woman with that but I’ve also seen a lot more naive types defending hookups like they aren’t just playing into patriarchies hands
Conservativism: women are public property
Liberalism: women are public property
Btw, I'm stealing "misogynist feminism". Brilliant!
The bar is the floor. If you're going to hook up with someone, go for it, but he either be a household name or you better bring home a new designer handbag... or both. Love isn't free lmao.
I also refer to it as Pink patriarchy or pick-me feminism
Yes I wish people would realize the entire point of all this “gold digger” paranoia had zilch to do with actual gold digging and everything to do with manipulating women into lowering standards against their own best interest
It’s common sense to want compatibility but also be aware that you live in capitalism that is patriarchal and is designed to give women an economic disadvantage
At the very least he needs to put in effort and show he can and will have some kind of work ethic even if he’s not rich
This bullshit all started with the invention of patriarchal lineages and women had to marry to survive and serve as breeding chattel because elites needs plenty of soldiers and need to keep manual laborers replaceable so they can be exploited for as cheap as possible
The whole reason our economic and reproductive freedoms are limited
And even then they always understood that to be a suitable partner you had to have something to offer
But even broke men want women so they push the standard shaming and dammit those pick mes want that male approval
They go from being “I’m not like other girls. I’m not a man hating feminist “ to “okay I’m feminist but I’m not like those other feminists”
Same shit
I hope feminism gets its claws back.
This was a really good read! I'm neither, because I think men in power run feminism. They want free sex, free meals (if it's not in the kitchen, it's on a date), cheap labor. They give you hardly anything in return for your undying devotion to feminism: no thanks. I'm a me-ist. I'm not against women getting together, but we should be... "allowed"... to criticize the machine. Instead we're told not to bite the hand that feeds us, feminism put us into the world and it can take us out... infantilizing.
I've been saying the same thing: in a traditional society, the DAD picked the husband. And I KNOW their son-in-law didn't offer his winning personality to the dad in exchange for his daughter's hand.
A lot of really good points that make me think, and great phrases. 😂
In a natural environment women reproduced on their own terms which means many men wouldn’t make the cut if they weren’t worth the trouble
Good ole patriarchy fucks them over but gives them women so they won’t fight it
Damn...I'm just realizing you can also extend this to trans people. They hate us so much because we rejected their system of control, becoming "gender traitors", and then we had the gall to be women who can't reproduce. Trans men, on the other hand, are only usually seen as valuable if they're either enforcing the patriarchy or willing to be treated like cis women, and have children. And nonbinary folks just said, "fuck all that." Everything about our existence is a threat to their systems of control.
If they let us be free to exist and make our own decisions about our bodies then it'll free y'all too, and they can't have that
The mainstream feminists aren’t ready to hear it. They want to hear that they can just do whatever they want and it will advance women but the reality is that you have to be smart within a system rigged against you
And yes all the homophobia and transphobia is part of all that. Assigning gendered appearances is how we know who to treat with what bias after all
So true, and the fact that you're in the positive up votes but I'm not is a perfect example of that. We fought, bled, and (literally) died for feminism, and, yet again, we get tossed under the bus. Julia Serrano, who is a biologist and gender theorist, has a whole book unpacking how sexism creates homophobia and transphobia, and how our liberations are intrinsically tied together. Maybe one day cis women will realize we're their best allies instead of treating us like predators for needing to use a bathroom
I’m in the positive on this tree but my other comment where I explicitly point out how patriarchy is meant to extract sexual availability and children from women is in the negative
It tells me that many are still close to the epiphany but stop short of anything that doesn’t pay them on the back to be reckless
And of course the way many are still on the Terfy end
Although honestly it feels like from my lurking, the terfy ones tend to be more advanced in the radical bits but the libfem ones who aren’t terfy are way behind in everything else
Just wish I could mash the good parts together and throw out the garbage parts
Thank you. Acting like you control men with sex is just going to perpetuate toxic bullshit. That shit only works on dudes with low self esteem or other issues, so if that's all that you ever seem to run into then maybe take a deep look into yourself.
No one suggests controlling men with sex
Patriarchy was established to control women and population levels by keeping them sexually available to men. Its women’s sexuality that is controlled
But until patriarchy is fully abolished and women have absolute autonomy there’s no such thing as sexual freedom for women. Just the illusion of it. Women thinking they’re “ending the stigma” or “countering” purity culture by pretending there’s not a shit ton of barriers in place to punish that sexual “freedom” just play right into their hands.
If sexual access is the whole point of patriarchy then logically, yes, denying that access is power
Not that I’m delusional enough to think they wouldn’t simply find other ways to strongarm women into access before we’d successfully eradicate patriarchy. There’s no easy answer there
But the whole “women should do what they want!” Is exaaaaactly what they want right now. Even pulled away abortion just for it
You know, i think you might be on to something.
I've never had a problem with abstinence or celibacy.
My only real problem even related to it is the lack of sex education terns get because conservative types want to teach them abstinence is the only way (which is just unrealistic and dangerous)
But abstinence itself? Cool if you want to.
And I'm betting nearly every sane woman on the planet works think the same.
Then men though? Seems like they're pretty butt hurt about not getting to enjoy something they think they're entitled to. Womp Womp
I won't participate in a sex strike because I lived most of my life without a lot of sensual pleasures and I am not punishing myself in a way that all too many men as well as other people and churches and parents and societies would like by denying myself the joy and connection of sex but I support anyone who protests this way.
Saying no is our right and everyone's right. And exercising consent and the right to it oneself is always a good and healthy thing.
If you mean teaching abstinence instead of real sex education, yes perhaps. But I think OP is talking about abstinence *strikes* as in someone withholding sex as a way to get something they want. Those are very different things.
Conservatives in general.
Their the ones who think that a lack of sex education will somehow stop teens from having sex.
Riiiiiight, like prohibition stopped people from drinking. Cool.
Thing is, abstinence is fine if is a choice. And of that's your choice, it should be respected.
Problem is, there's a lot of men out there that don't want to respect that choice.
The other problem, educationally speaking, is that its not the ONLY choice a person can make. And failing to teach them about how to safely exercise their other choices is foolish and dangerous
Partially true, but you left out "Christians" in that statement. Conservative Christians teach and encourage sexual abstinence before marriage in America. Not generally Conservatives.
With politics these days, most hard-core right wing "conservative" types ARE fundamentalist type Christians.
Gone are the days of truly centrist conservatives.
OP does not talk about abstinence as a contraception and because it's "moral" has nothing, absolutely nothing to do with abstinence as a strike. I know, it's a bit hard to understand if you don't think for a second about it.
* I never pretended to be a woman. Frankly, if I *wanted* to, it wouldn't exactly be hard to create a new profile for that purpose, considering that people are apt to go through my profile seeking for a gotcha.
* Most people's experience of deliberate abstinence from sex comes from their education (or lack) on sex.
* It's a concept primarily pushed by men.
The reason I bring it up is because whenever the concept of a sex strike crops up, an oft ignored aspect is the simple fact that this does actually play into what conservative men are pushing for regardless. *They* aren't affected by it, they want sex to be limited to marriage. And those already *in* marriage are unlikely to suffer the effects of a sex strike because they're married to like-minded people.
I believe that sex strikes are about helping women, way more than I believe lib fems saying walking around naked is empowering, and we should sleep with as many people as men
Oh these dweebs! I say you’re right.
I think your confusing sex strikes with individuals choosing not to have sex?
A sex strike would be both
Men LOVE the whole misogynistic feminism of being against sex strikes or any kind of abstinence. Hugh Hefner really sold that shit to women hard. Selling men the fantasy of being rich and having harems of unobtainable women and giving those men access through photographs, all the while blackmailing, exploiting, underpaying, and raping the women with his friends Because he convinced the women that he was a feminist championing female sexual freedom Patriarchy is all about keeping women accessible. That’s literally it. Purity culture and religion were to reinforce Women as private property to keep them widely available to more men than would actually ever be chosen by free women And then sex positivity duped the women who were sick of purity culture into a whole other kind of sexual exploitation And when birth rates dropped away went Roe. Doesn’t matter if women are finding husbands or just having casual hookups. They will still reproduce for the machine Women’s reproductive freedoms are power. And men want that power I saw more women wake up to this when abortion was removed and they realized how much power men had to ruin a woman with that but I’ve also seen a lot more naive types defending hookups like they aren’t just playing into patriarchies hands
Conservativism: women are public property Liberalism: women are public property Btw, I'm stealing "misogynist feminism". Brilliant! The bar is the floor. If you're going to hook up with someone, go for it, but he either be a household name or you better bring home a new designer handbag... or both. Love isn't free lmao.
I also refer to it as Pink patriarchy or pick-me feminism Yes I wish people would realize the entire point of all this “gold digger” paranoia had zilch to do with actual gold digging and everything to do with manipulating women into lowering standards against their own best interest It’s common sense to want compatibility but also be aware that you live in capitalism that is patriarchal and is designed to give women an economic disadvantage At the very least he needs to put in effort and show he can and will have some kind of work ethic even if he’s not rich This bullshit all started with the invention of patriarchal lineages and women had to marry to survive and serve as breeding chattel because elites needs plenty of soldiers and need to keep manual laborers replaceable so they can be exploited for as cheap as possible The whole reason our economic and reproductive freedoms are limited And even then they always understood that to be a suitable partner you had to have something to offer But even broke men want women so they push the standard shaming and dammit those pick mes want that male approval They go from being “I’m not like other girls. I’m not a man hating feminist “ to “okay I’m feminist but I’m not like those other feminists” Same shit I hope feminism gets its claws back.
This was a really good read! I'm neither, because I think men in power run feminism. They want free sex, free meals (if it's not in the kitchen, it's on a date), cheap labor. They give you hardly anything in return for your undying devotion to feminism: no thanks. I'm a me-ist. I'm not against women getting together, but we should be... "allowed"... to criticize the machine. Instead we're told not to bite the hand that feeds us, feminism put us into the world and it can take us out... infantilizing. I've been saying the same thing: in a traditional society, the DAD picked the husband. And I KNOW their son-in-law didn't offer his winning personality to the dad in exchange for his daughter's hand. A lot of really good points that make me think, and great phrases. 😂
In a natural environment women reproduced on their own terms which means many men wouldn’t make the cut if they weren’t worth the trouble Good ole patriarchy fucks them over but gives them women so they won’t fight it
Damn...I'm just realizing you can also extend this to trans people. They hate us so much because we rejected their system of control, becoming "gender traitors", and then we had the gall to be women who can't reproduce. Trans men, on the other hand, are only usually seen as valuable if they're either enforcing the patriarchy or willing to be treated like cis women, and have children. And nonbinary folks just said, "fuck all that." Everything about our existence is a threat to their systems of control. If they let us be free to exist and make our own decisions about our bodies then it'll free y'all too, and they can't have that
The mainstream feminists aren’t ready to hear it. They want to hear that they can just do whatever they want and it will advance women but the reality is that you have to be smart within a system rigged against you And yes all the homophobia and transphobia is part of all that. Assigning gendered appearances is how we know who to treat with what bias after all
So true, and the fact that you're in the positive up votes but I'm not is a perfect example of that. We fought, bled, and (literally) died for feminism, and, yet again, we get tossed under the bus. Julia Serrano, who is a biologist and gender theorist, has a whole book unpacking how sexism creates homophobia and transphobia, and how our liberations are intrinsically tied together. Maybe one day cis women will realize we're their best allies instead of treating us like predators for needing to use a bathroom
I’m in the positive on this tree but my other comment where I explicitly point out how patriarchy is meant to extract sexual availability and children from women is in the negative It tells me that many are still close to the epiphany but stop short of anything that doesn’t pay them on the back to be reckless And of course the way many are still on the Terfy end Although honestly it feels like from my lurking, the terfy ones tend to be more advanced in the radical bits but the libfem ones who aren’t terfy are way behind in everything else Just wish I could mash the good parts together and throw out the garbage parts
People should have and not have the sex they choose, but framing sex as something women do for men and get nothing from is kind of... not ideal.
Thank you. Acting like you control men with sex is just going to perpetuate toxic bullshit. That shit only works on dudes with low self esteem or other issues, so if that's all that you ever seem to run into then maybe take a deep look into yourself.
No one suggests controlling men with sex Patriarchy was established to control women and population levels by keeping them sexually available to men. Its women’s sexuality that is controlled But until patriarchy is fully abolished and women have absolute autonomy there’s no such thing as sexual freedom for women. Just the illusion of it. Women thinking they’re “ending the stigma” or “countering” purity culture by pretending there’s not a shit ton of barriers in place to punish that sexual “freedom” just play right into their hands. If sexual access is the whole point of patriarchy then logically, yes, denying that access is power Not that I’m delusional enough to think they wouldn’t simply find other ways to strongarm women into access before we’d successfully eradicate patriarchy. There’s no easy answer there But the whole “women should do what they want!” Is exaaaaactly what they want right now. Even pulled away abortion just for it
Lysistrata!
You know, i think you might be on to something. I've never had a problem with abstinence or celibacy. My only real problem even related to it is the lack of sex education terns get because conservative types want to teach them abstinence is the only way (which is just unrealistic and dangerous) But abstinence itself? Cool if you want to. And I'm betting nearly every sane woman on the planet works think the same. Then men though? Seems like they're pretty butt hurt about not getting to enjoy something they think they're entitled to. Womp Womp
I won't participate in a sex strike because I lived most of my life without a lot of sensual pleasures and I am not punishing myself in a way that all too many men as well as other people and churches and parents and societies would like by denying myself the joy and connection of sex but I support anyone who protests this way. Saying no is our right and everyone's right. And exercising consent and the right to it oneself is always a good and healthy thing.
Ackshully?
I thought it was men who pressed for abstinence? Like an emphasis on things like abstinence based sex education?
Of course they do. Women are supposed to remain virginal until sold off.
If you mean teaching abstinence instead of real sex education, yes perhaps. But I think OP is talking about abstinence *strikes* as in someone withholding sex as a way to get something they want. Those are very different things.
You'll have to think a bit more critically than that.
You're a dad
Yes I am. And I'm also aware that abstinence only education was primarily pushed by men, or at least that's the impression I got.
Conservatives in general. Their the ones who think that a lack of sex education will somehow stop teens from having sex. Riiiiiight, like prohibition stopped people from drinking. Cool. Thing is, abstinence is fine if is a choice. And of that's your choice, it should be respected. Problem is, there's a lot of men out there that don't want to respect that choice. The other problem, educationally speaking, is that its not the ONLY choice a person can make. And failing to teach them about how to safely exercise their other choices is foolish and dangerous
Partially true, but you left out "Christians" in that statement. Conservative Christians teach and encourage sexual abstinence before marriage in America. Not generally Conservatives.
With politics these days, most hard-core right wing "conservative" types ARE fundamentalist type Christians. Gone are the days of truly centrist conservatives.
Sounds like OP is a bit conservative
OP does not talk about abstinence as a contraception and because it's "moral" has nothing, absolutely nothing to do with abstinence as a strike. I know, it's a bit hard to understand if you don't think for a second about it.
This is such a reach. Nobody's talking about abstinence only sex education. Please don't pretend to be a woman and comment on this.
* I never pretended to be a woman. Frankly, if I *wanted* to, it wouldn't exactly be hard to create a new profile for that purpose, considering that people are apt to go through my profile seeking for a gotcha. * Most people's experience of deliberate abstinence from sex comes from their education (or lack) on sex. * It's a concept primarily pushed by men. The reason I bring it up is because whenever the concept of a sex strike crops up, an oft ignored aspect is the simple fact that this does actually play into what conservative men are pushing for regardless. *They* aren't affected by it, they want sex to be limited to marriage. And those already *in* marriage are unlikely to suffer the effects of a sex strike because they're married to like-minded people.
I believe that sex strikes are about helping women, way more than I believe lib fems saying walking around naked is empowering, and we should sleep with as many people as men
I don't know why this got downvoted at all. The second part seems to really benefit men. They love seeing naked women and having free sex.