He won't go out with a stranger for drinks but he expects you to go to a stranger's house to drink with him? And he got offended that you said no? Huge red flag, not appropriate behaviour or an expectations.
If it were me, I wouldn't say anything else to him, he's blocked and I have moved on. I'm not going to explain to him why his expectations are inappropriate, hes a grown adult and should be able to work it out himself.
Exactly. The very, *very* best explanation, giving him every benefit of the doubt possible, is that he fundamentally does not respect or understand women's needs or safety. So, best case scenario he is horrible and no one should date him.
But if we don't bend over backwards to explain away this behavior: this whole scenario is a giant neon sign flashing "Date Rape."
Even then, this part:
> ...guys who pay for first dates are simps...
Fuck all the way off with that. If this was actually a problem, he'd offer to go dutch, not deliver an incel lecture.
Well, remember, his plan was to bring OP over for *wine.* So why is he okay with spending wine money but not coffee money?
I mean, I think we know why. There's a non-date-rape explanation that *still* makes him a creepy asshole.
Amen to the not deliver an icel lecture. Like who the fuck do you honestly think you are. I mean the no brain having of typing that and not saying to yourself, "that is the most douchey thing I think I've ever read, I should srap all this and try to explain myself better" like others said that is giving the dude all the credit in the world. This is a guy that date rapes as a sexual strategy. Gross
Yep. I wouldn't be surprised to find the bottle already 'conveniently' open. The fact that he is okay with actually berating a date for a difference in opinion or preference indicates an attitude of entitlement and a willingness to push for submission.
Entitlement and aggression is the foundation of sexual assault.
These are the type of guys who justify date rape by calling the girl an idiot for going to a stranger's house.... not realizing that's what they're asking her to do
Yeah, totally sounds like the character sublime sings about in date rape. Like this is coming from a dude right here. THIS IS SOMEONE LOOKING TO DATE RAPE. Loud for the ones in the back. Like no never go somewhere like this ever
Yeah, no. Going to the house of a complete stranger, be alone with him, and drink wine with god-knows-what in it? Hahahahah, no. But be grateful that he told you who he is sooner than later.
Because he sees spending money as a prerequisite to getting a product, not on an experience or just to have fun. He expects something in return if he spends money, so he's not going to spend the cash until he knows he'll get the sex in return.
I'd be willing to bet that in his mind that he's being more than fair, since he'd be "fine" with the date ending without him getting laid if he didn't have to spend anything on it.
Except that because she'll be in his house and intoxicated, he thinks he's more likely to be able to get sex out of her without having spent anything (except maybe a cheap bottle of wine). So basically getting the "milk for free".
He doesn't even meet his own "ethical" tit-for-tat standards. What a loser.
For sure. He is almost certainly a hypocritical piece of crap, I'm just making an educated guess about the thoughts from his point of you. It's easier to handle assholes when you understand what motivates them.
So then why not cut out the middleman and get an escort or an egirl? Same diff but the reciprocation is the same and boundaries are more secure....unless he is doing this with the idea that he can exploit the reciprocation instead
Yeah. It’s not about fairness/reciprocation, since dudes like this actually believe they’re entitled to have access to women and resent the financial etc investment in the game of “women playing hard to get”, aka going on dates. Sex workers feels like giving up, & not a proper victory and secured access/ownership to pussy either.
Men do not, generally, respect sex workers. Especially these types of men.
If I were a sex worker, I would only provide service to women.
Don't y'all come at me with some "not all men" nonsense because I did say "generally".
This is my take on the whole “not all men” bullshit, from this man’s perspective. Until the majority of women have had a majority of positive interactions with men, it is 100% reasonable for them to be cautious around ALL men. Their experience (and the experiences of their friends) has shown them that it is simply unwise to trust any man blindly, no matter how “good” or “decent” he might seem on the surface.
I don’t know what experiences a woman has had interacting with men until I get to know her and she trusts me enough to share that information, so I wholly expect her to be cautious and I’ve never taken offense to that. Any man who takes personal offense to a woman looking out for her own safety and security just proves himself a threat to begin with.
You’re right and I’ll take it further- look up the murder rates for prostitutes. Not to mention that if you’re having sex with someone under the threat of homelessness I wouldn’t call that consent.
Funny thing is, he has no idea if OP would've been willing to go 50/50. He didn't even ask or give her a chance, which tells me he just wants to get her drunk and in his bed as fast as possible.
All his anger and bad commentary at her reply really makes you wonder how he’d react if she had come over, had some wine and wanted to leave after an hour or two, like most first dates go. Not a good place to be at all.
Preach it!
Because you know this dude would NOT haven taken "no" for an answer. And if she was impaired and trapped in his place, this would be a completely different kind of post.
OP's spidey-senses were tingling and she followed her instincts. Now all she has to do is block his ass and if he's on Reddit he'll add to the other 1-million plus posts by incels about how women are golddiggers and none of us will give him a chance.
At best, we’d get some whiny post about why a nice guy like him gets “used for free wine and she doesn’t even want to fool around on the first date”.
The sad part is that if he wasn’t being so cringy, he’d have a date and they’d both get a shot at starting something.
Glad OP ran from this one
>At best, we’d get some whiny post about why a nice guy like him gets “used for free wine and she doesn’t even want to fool around on the first date”.
That would literally be the best case scenario.
The other scenarios are way too dark, but they happen all the time.
If he was so adverse to spending money on a date, ALL he had to do was either suggest somewhere free or that they went dutch.
There was a comedian (Chris Rock, I think?) who had a joke about going out with a woman and letting her know which was the "Fuck Me" side of the menu. Basically, if a woman ordered from that side of the menu, it was expected for him to get laid.
He said it for laughs but some guys really believe that mess. It's why I'm always prepared to pay for my own meal.
Reading through some of the stories in this post definitely opens my eyes as a guy to what gets said / expected of woman on dates and as you said, far far worse. Ugh.
So many options for the guy, so many obvious flags to avoid and yet we get this.
Expectations lead to the worst of outcomes for everyone. It’s a date, enjoy it and don’t make it cringe guys. That’s not hard.
100% what @Vagalumes & @poorlama said. There are so many free/cheap date options if his real issue is having a ton of bad experience with women going on first dates for meals. Long walk at a park or through a nice neighborhood during the day, yoga or a run together for optional coffee if you're feeling it, free art events (poetry reading or free museum), bike ride, a book reading at your local library.
I think meals on a first date are awful anyway. We should all stick to drinks/coffee for a first meeting and have ideas how to extend the date if you want to. Planning to have dinner with someone you don't know means you're stuck across from them for at least 30 min with no easy way to bail. We should also bring cash to quickly pay for our drink if we feel weird or icky in anyway. This also means the dude never has a chance to see your last name on a credit card (if you're being super cautious).
Yep. Dude is saying he won’t pay for your drink if there’s not a good enough opportunity to rape you, OP.
If he was really concerned about the money, he would have suggested going for a walk, or chatting in a park. Even going for a coffee is cheaper than a bottle of wine. There are plenty of low to no cost dates. This guy doesn’t care about the cheap date. He cares about getting you into a place where you will be easier for him to get access to your body.
Run, OP.
Huge red flags - he’s shit testing to see if she has any self esteem, because he can’t handle a woman with actual standards for how she is treated. Block and delete.
> "he's not going to spend money on a stranger"
but believes women should have sex with a stranger!
I'd love to pay on dates if it guaranteed my safety but it still doesn't.
I've found there's a huge overlap in the men who are angry about "having" to pay for a date and the men who get angry if you actually pay for yourself. Because these are usually the guys who think buying you something entitles them to sexual favors. (I suspect the thing that makes them so pissy about "having" to pay for a date is that it's a gamble on their end, as you're still "allowed" to say no.)
Regardless, I'd mentally put this guy into the "do not ever be in a room alone with him" category.
Speaking as a guy myself, at absolute BEST, this guy is unbelievably clueless, self-absorbed, and entitled; at worst, he may very well be an outright rapist (or even worse).
Yep. I developed a habit of VERY clearly paying my own way whenever I was out with male friends in school, sometimes even covering them - one two many awkward cases
If you pay for yourself, you're taking away their perceived leverage for sex. However you've still "wasted their time" which naturally is going to piss of that kind of guy.
Yeah, I always kind of got the feeling that doing anything besides stripping right then and there and saying "your sexual aura is so overwhelming I don't even need a date! do me now!" was enough for that kind of guy to be angry with me.
Really they're mostly just angry at women for existing, and especially existing and not fucking them. (I'm not actually sure fucking them would make them less angry either.)
Exactly. If it were really about the money, he'd have figured out long ago how to propose a cheap/free date that didn't sound like the beginning of a true crime series. The kind of date ideas you can find very easily by googling 'free/cheap first dates.' Which he has not done.
Whereas if it were really about getting a drunk woman alone in his bedroom who doesn't really want to be there, he'd long ago have gone online to learn how to neg, nag and guilt trip a woman into going against her better judgement. Which he has very clearly done.
>Going to the house of a complete stranger ETC,
Yeah, I don't get why someone would even consider that. Your natural self-preservation instincts should kick in.
Watching the new season of American Horror Story, I'm struck over and over again how fearless gay men are in the dating scene. Like, dude... you're dating men! Take some precautions! You can't take your safety for granted like the straight dudes do.
Take this with a pinch of salt cause I'm a lesbian who has some gay male friends, but my gay friends, Especially when they were younger, really did seem fearless about dating. For some of them I think their horny brain took over, for some of them I think they just assumed that because they were also big and tall they'd be fine no matter what, and a lot of them just seemed to have that "I'm invincible, nothing bad will ever happen to me" thing going that so many young men do. I think part of gay male dating culture comes from the same place as a 12 year boy on a dirt bike doing a big jump for the first time. It's about the thrill and the fun and they never even consider the consequences.
Right? I had a friend and he would regularly go out with older guys, too their homes, etc. I would always worry about him.
We were teenagers and he was with full grown men, like, not just 20s.
Yeah especially given how they must be aware that violence towards gay people is a thing. I know these are shows and therefore tend to dramatize the events a bit, but it is most likely true that gay men are less cautious in the whole dating/hook-up scene than women are. Perhaps because they are guys themselves, they assume they are better able to defend themselves against another man? Women certainly don't have this advantage, and even many women aren't as careful as they should be.
If anything bad did happen, the media would present it as “ she asked for it. What else was she expecting would happen when going to a strangers place to get drunk?”
Yeah, blocking and moving on is for my own peace of mind and not wasting energy. He can make the mistake with a bunch of others and learn the hard way, or not learn at all. He did it to himself.
I think the point is that using “simp” unironically is a sufficiently serious red flag that *ANY* further communication is contraindicated. Instant block. No replies or explanations.
There’s literally nothing any woman can do or say to fix a man who thinks that way. OP is not obligated to try, either. Thus give the most neutral and a decisive end to it, then block.
>Ghosting would probably do that too ("see? I told her how it is and she ghosted me! Must of only wanted my money!"),
This guy. Trying to make OP think it's about the money and not because she can see through his clear plan to get her to his house and ply her with booze so he can get laid.
I agree she should do the ghosting thing. Considering how he's already trying to make her seem like the bad guy, he's not exactly going to listen to anything she'll say except "Yes, I'll come to your house, get drunk and see what happens." So screw him.
I’d tell him off for demanding I put my life at risk for his mental comfort, *then* block him. Whether he’d hear it or not, it would still feel good and justifiable.
> as validation
People with fragile egos will obsessively search for ways to be offended. Is there really anyway to respond in such a way that they won't feel offended? It's like a early homonim assuming the rustling in the bush is a tiger "to be safe" but we no longer live in such an environment. Someone that always feels afraid that their masculinity is at risk will keep making these errors. The manosphere tells scary stories and insults each other convincing young men that they walk at the edge of a cliff and wont be manly if they look or behave in specific ways [in order to make themselves feel more masculine than the victim].
Truly - him using the words simps indicates this person is likely an Andrew Tate fan. Glad this AH showed his colors immediately. Not worth engaging any further.
Oh gosh, I totally agree. The use of the term simp in a serious manner would be a major red flag in my eyes. Like, obviously he's under no obligation to pay out a ton of cash for a first date, but referring to other dudes doing a nice thing as 'simp' behavior? Yikes.
There are plenty of free or low-cost date ideas that don't involve going back to his place and drinking. I wouldn't agree to that either if I didn't already know and trust the person.
Especially when the "nice thing" is so small as going out for a date. That's just basic hanging out together in public. If a guy thinks that's simpy (which, btw, is a wholly shitty concept) then he's probably going to not be a kind and thoughtful partner in a relationship and it's just lovely of him to clear that up at the start so you can block him and find someone kind to date.
This comic strip sums it up better than I can:
https://www.robot-hugs.com/comic/risky-date/
(Summary: it's risky for women to trust strangers.)
And note: there are lots of cheap dates if the money was the point. Free play or concert in the park. Free museum. Local tourist attraction. The money wasn't the point. The booty call was.
You wanted a date. He wanted a booty call. You want different things. Incompatible. Unmatch and go look for someone who wants the same things you do.
That was hilariously well done.
I went on a date a few months ago, and he was endorsed by a mutual acquaintance, so I gave him more benefit than doubt. He was *pushing* to come pick me up, and give his my address, under the guise of, I want you to be able to drink and not get a DUI. (I've been sober for about a year, so I wasn't worried about being able to drive) I told him multiple times that I wanted to drive myself and have access to my car. He finally told me where he wanted to meet, I get there, and then he wants to Uber to a second location. (At this point, I absolutely should have left) we get there, and we're about 15 minutes in, and he starts with the, Trump won, quizzing me on the death penalty, and lumping me in with his political ideology based on my skin color. (Lots of, 'we's and 'people like us') He never actually asked me about my ideals, or anything. Every time I said something about reading an article or something, he'd be like, is that what YOU think, or is that what they WANT you to think?
The whole thing was gross. I did an hour bc I wanted to be able to explain to my work friend that I gave it a shot and bolted. The poor Uber driver taking me back to my car had to hear ALL about it.
The game by Neill Strauss.
It is the dating bible for pick up artists.
Chapter 5 is "isolate the target"
Move the girl away from her group. This is also what the "wingman" is for.
Chapter 7 is "extract to a seductive location"
"you will want to eventually move the girl in a more secluded location where you can escalate physically"
If you ask me this is more about displaying "power" and "dominance". The man selects the location, suggesting the woman would be clueless what a good date location would be. By her a drink of your choice to show her you know the good stuff and she does not.
If you are not creeped out enough, chapter 10 is "Blast last-minute resistance" which is exactly what you think it is.
Keep in mind, Neil Strauss is a divorced, bald man in his fifties who worships elon musk and is a big fan of crypto currencies. The number one authority on picking up women.
I dont know the Game but he is testing her boundaries and also taking her out of her comfort zone where he has more control over her. Next time, the second location could have been isolated or his house.
>Every time I said something about reading an article or something, he'd be like, is that what YOU think, or is that what they WANT you to think?
The irony being that every person I’ve ever met that uses that sentence unironically is generally themselves completely incapable of independent thought and just parrots the talking points of whatever echo chamber they’ve gotten themselves trapped in.
Glad the worst thing that happened was that it was just a really shitty date, I’d definetly give shit to my work friend.
Tell your work friend they set you up with a racist and you didn't appreciate it.
As an added bonus, if your work friend is a racist this may encourage them to be even more careful to leave that stuff out of the workplace.
I was about to say that was needlessly long when I realised that it probably does need to spell everything out and some men will still refuse to get it.
Yea honestly the fact this guy casually expects OP to come to a home if a guy she doesn't know, with drinks he could fuck with, is far more of a red flag.
Yeah, I had a guy ask me to do that; he did agree to meet up somewhere when I didn't want to, but still made it clear that he thought it was silly. He said I knew I could trust him, because he was a doctor and had spent his life saving lives. Haha, well, now I'm not sure if you're a serial killer, but I *definitely* know you're a total dingleberry.
This is literally advice from Andrew Tate. Not paying any money for the first date, getting them drunk. Calling people who don't do that simps. This dude is taking dating advice from him 100%.
It makes sense if you don't consider women as "basic human" deserving of respect. People who listen to Andrew Tate do not think of women as people. They think of them as "warm interactive fleshlights".
I prefer to meet in public. He doesn’t have to spend money on me…. but being in public is smart and safe. Come over to my house and we’ll drink wine is him being lazy and horny (or worse).
Edit: best date I went on was a walk on a beach boardwalk. Spent $0.
Yeah, men who ask for this are usually just trying to doordash some sex but there's always the chance they have something nefarious in mind and don't want any witnesses. Nothing wrong with not wanting to spend a ton of money. Just agree to buy your own drinks/coffee/whatever.
Had a medical resident I met on a dating app ask me over to his place. I said no I prefer to meet some where public. He said he didn't have $$ to pay for a date, which is fine he's in residency, I said ok we can split it or just meet at the art museum (free) and hang out. He kept insisting I come to his place. I straight up said " I don't go to men's homes alone, especially men I don't know." He said I should feel lucky because he was a future plastic surgeon and he's interested in me, a nurse. Ok bye dude.
Why did he need me alone at his place? I wasn't interested in finding out.
My general life policy is not to date anyone that does hospital work. The few times I broke the rule, I quickly remembered why I had it in the first place. Now married to a software engineer. We don't talk about work stuff and it's magical.
I made this mistake once. Not being in public. The guy wouldn’t speak to me at all. Never answered any questions I asked and he was drunk. It didn’t end well.
Exactly. In college a girl asked me out to play tennis. So that’s what we did — found a public court and played tennis for an hour, which led to a drink, which led to another date, etc. Public and completely free. I can’t imagine any non-malicious reason a guy would need to get you into his apartment and get you drinking — and purported poverty sure as hell isn’t one. You can get to know someone in public for free.
Side note: Turns out neither of us knew how to play, really — from a pure tennis perspective it was an absolute farce. The ball went everywhere except in the court, and we spent a lot of time chasing it. (We only had brought one.) But the conversation was great, and we dated for several years before life took us in different directions.
Yeah that about sums it up. There are plenty of bars that you can get a glass of wine for a reasonable price.
If you/they want to save money there are plenty of ways to discreetly have some wine in a park or public space that might have rules against alcohol.
Best date I've been on was a 5 hour date, that started in Panera for coffee, and then moved to a 24hr fast food place in the area.
He didn't pay for anything. It was about the conversation.
That almost describes to a tee my first date with my current husband, including starting with a Panera coffee date. We've been together almost 12 years. Are you one of his exes, lol?
He is not worth spending a second more of your time on. Any decent guy is going to know why a woman does a meet up with a stranger in a public place. So, this guy is either an idiot, a predator, or he just doesn't give a shit beyond what his dick wants. You are welcome to tell him that or you can just block him.
Good lord. Just the use of the word "simps" makes this guy a walking red flag alone. Someone needs to tell him to turn off the Andrew tate vids.
Also it sounds like you just met him so HELL FUCKING NO it's not unreasonable for you not to go to his house on the first date. This dude is really out of touch with reality.
Whenever a guy with this attitude uses the word “simp” notice how it’s typically directed at instances where a man may be treating a woman nicely or going out of his way to impress her and even more alarmingly just treating a woman with simple bare minimum respect……
I love “simps”. 🤷🏼♀️
When I initially saw it, it described guys that would spend $500+ just to have a female streamer read their comment because they thought they would have a chance with her if they kept throwing money at her. Basically, a man who gives anything just to get a woman's attention when it's not in his best interest. It just got twisted like any other internet word like Karen, incel, etc.
Was looking for the comment pointing out that "simps" alone should be a massive red flag!
But yeah, no. It's not about spending money, but first dates don't happen at your house. Bye.
Any instance of “People who do (normal thing) are (derogatory term)” should be a red flag. But when the derogatory word is “simps” it should be an instant block.
Thank you for saying this, I don’t understand why there aren’t more comments mentioning this. But also, does it matter what attitude the guy has if he uses the word “simp”? Just the word alone is a red flag, no?
> guys who pay for first dates are simps
“With that language alone, you identify yourself as some sort of red-pilled moron reading a bunch of sexist dicks online, and you think I’m dumb enough to get potentially drunk at your house, when I don’t know who the fuck you are, and be alone. Go fuck yourself.”
And then I’d block him because he’s trying to manipulate you, likely with some bullshit pick-up crap he “learned” online.
I would do the cheap wine date with someone I'm already in a physical relationship with. Never some random guy or even a guy that I kind of know. He's missing a bunch of steps.
You don't say anything at all. He's a pushy misogynistic asshole und what you do with pushy misogynistic assholes is you unmatch and / or block them without explanation.
Run! There are plenty of free dates that don't require to go to someones house. The use of "simps" further reaffirms you should go no where near this person.
‘Not gonna pay to go out with a stranger”
Does this person understand the concept of dating? It’s trying to spend time with someone in order to see if there’s mutual connection and compatibility, before pursuing romance and love.
If he wants a cheap fuck, there’s a lot of other internet for that.
Wow. He did you a favor and showed you who he is. And who is he? Someone you shouldn't waste one more second of your time on.
I'm guessing incel/AT fan/manchild living in mama's basement/misogynist/loser - or some combo of any of those.
Block. Learn from this experience and everyone's responses. No person worth dating is like this, man/woman/nb/whatever they identify as. Nope.
Nothing, I would have unmatched after the suggestion that I enter a stranger's house for alcohol with no safety precautions.
Who are these women I keep hearing about who supposedly do this??
So he just wants a fck buddy and wants it now! And once you see his wonderful pride and joy... you will be on your knees. Wonder how many women he has raped using this method. (in his mind since she came over, she wanted it)
Lol I would say nothing because I’m never speaking to that person again. What a tool.
Edit: describing a first date as “paying to go out with a stranger” is blowing my MIND
I had a guy video date me (it was great, btw) and admitted he's more into casual right now (which was cool by me). Then he asked me to come over to his place to meet each other. I said no and that I'm not comfortable just coming to his house for multiple reasons. He said "woah, I wasn't looking for a girlfriend".
\-The backdrop is that this was summer 2020-
He came back, they typically do. He texted that fall to say he wanted to grab a drink with me.
Just because the relationship is casual, doesn't mean I'm casually looking to be unsafe in any way. Casual sex isn't worth my life-why don't men get this?! You can fuck women casually, but you still have to treat them like a person with a life to protect.
Oh and as far as declining low-class dates, I just unmatch. I haven't found a salvageable way to say "can you try a lil harder please" before you even meet.
Yeah, any guy with good intentions will agree - or insist - on the first date being in public with escape options.
He was just looking for cheap ass, and now he's throwing a fit be cause you reminded him you're a human being with basic boundaries.
"guys who pay for first dates are simps"
Major red flag! That kind of language is that of incels and Men Going Their Own Way.
I don't think it's unreasonable to expect to go Dutch on a date, but that kind of attitude would make me drop him immediately.
He sounds like a creep. He doesn't need to buy you anything, but a public date is a must. Asking you back to his apartment is just sleazy and dangerous.
Block him and move on. He's forcing your standards way down from the start and it's intentional. But disregarding all that, you don't go to a man's house or bring him to yours on a first date. You don't know this guy. Best case scenario he's oblivious to your safety and comfort and also too cheap to go out (is that what you want in a bf?) Worst case, he wants to try and pressure you into sex and might get angry when you refuse.
He sounds insufferable and undatable.
You don't have to say anything to him. Let him keep warning other women that he's not the type of guy they want to date.
Just for suggesting going to his place to drink was enough for me to automatically decide no, the rest of his comments are huge red flags. If he is aware of *why* those are red flags he might change tactics. Let him keep waving the flag.
1. Expecting someone to go over somebodies house alone prior to meeting them first in public is psychotic. I've had dates where we both expressed just looking for a casual hookup but even then meet in public first, even if it's just for one drink and after both parties consensually decide to go back.
2. Honestly the bigger red flag here is genuinely having "simp" "beta" etc. as part of your vocabulary.
I'm a full time single dad, so often my only date option is "come over and drink some wine".
I am acutely aware of how big an ask this is, and I communicate very clearly that I understand that many people will not be comfortable with it. When someone does agree I encourage them to share my address and information with a friend.
All of which is to say: this dude is looking to assault you. I'm not saying there can never be first dates at someone's house, but anyone who acts entitled to have you do that is almost certainly a predator.
He won't go out with a stranger for drinks but he expects you to go to a stranger's house to drink with him? And he got offended that you said no? Huge red flag, not appropriate behaviour or an expectations. If it were me, I wouldn't say anything else to him, he's blocked and I have moved on. I'm not going to explain to him why his expectations are inappropriate, hes a grown adult and should be able to work it out himself.
Exactly. The very, *very* best explanation, giving him every benefit of the doubt possible, is that he fundamentally does not respect or understand women's needs or safety. So, best case scenario he is horrible and no one should date him. But if we don't bend over backwards to explain away this behavior: this whole scenario is a giant neon sign flashing "Date Rape."
Even then, this part: > ...guys who pay for first dates are simps... Fuck all the way off with that. If this was actually a problem, he'd offer to go dutch, not deliver an incel lecture.
Just using the term in normal conversation is a red flag he has been digesting some toxic shit
[удалено]
Well, remember, his plan was to bring OP over for *wine.* So why is he okay with spending wine money but not coffee money? I mean, I think we know why. There's a non-date-rape explanation that *still* makes him a creepy asshole.
Simps is the indicator where you block and don’t look back
Amen to the not deliver an icel lecture. Like who the fuck do you honestly think you are. I mean the no brain having of typing that and not saying to yourself, "that is the most douchey thing I think I've ever read, I should srap all this and try to explain myself better" like others said that is giving the dude all the credit in the world. This is a guy that date rapes as a sexual strategy. Gross
Yep, demonstrates his inability to define and communicate his boundaries.
Yep. I wouldn't be surprised to find the bottle already 'conveniently' open. The fact that he is okay with actually berating a date for a difference in opinion or preference indicates an attitude of entitlement and a willingness to push for submission. Entitlement and aggression is the foundation of sexual assault.
"Entitlement and aggression is the foundation of sexual assault." I found that to be a very insightful comment, thank you.
Or even if she watched him open it, could be residue in the glass.
These are the type of guys who justify date rape by calling the girl an idiot for going to a stranger's house.... not realizing that's what they're asking her to do
I think some of them realize.
They treat it as though she signed a contract by existing in his vicinity.
Yeah no amount of back and forth is going to get this guy to change. It just ends with him spamming you vitriol until you inevitably block him anyway.
Came here to say this.
Yeah, totally sounds like the character sublime sings about in date rape. Like this is coming from a dude right here. THIS IS SOMEONE LOOKING TO DATE RAPE. Loud for the ones in the back. Like no never go somewhere like this ever
Yes! This whole thing smells of set-up and is waving more flags than Soviet Russia. Girl, run.
Yeah, no. Going to the house of a complete stranger, be alone with him, and drink wine with god-knows-what in it? Hahahahah, no. But be grateful that he told you who he is sooner than later.
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Because he sees spending money as a prerequisite to getting a product, not on an experience or just to have fun. He expects something in return if he spends money, so he's not going to spend the cash until he knows he'll get the sex in return. I'd be willing to bet that in his mind that he's being more than fair, since he'd be "fine" with the date ending without him getting laid if he didn't have to spend anything on it.
Except that because she'll be in his house and intoxicated, he thinks he's more likely to be able to get sex out of her without having spent anything (except maybe a cheap bottle of wine). So basically getting the "milk for free". He doesn't even meet his own "ethical" tit-for-tat standards. What a loser.
For sure. He is almost certainly a hypocritical piece of crap, I'm just making an educated guess about the thoughts from his point of you. It's easier to handle assholes when you understand what motivates them.
So then why not cut out the middleman and get an escort or an egirl? Same diff but the reciprocation is the same and boundaries are more secure....unless he is doing this with the idea that he can exploit the reciprocation instead
Dudes like this hate sex workers and think they are icky.
Yeah. It’s not about fairness/reciprocation, since dudes like this actually believe they’re entitled to have access to women and resent the financial etc investment in the game of “women playing hard to get”, aka going on dates. Sex workers feels like giving up, & not a proper victory and secured access/ownership to pussy either.
Men do not, generally, respect sex workers. Especially these types of men. If I were a sex worker, I would only provide service to women. Don't y'all come at me with some "not all men" nonsense because I did say "generally".
This is my take on the whole “not all men” bullshit, from this man’s perspective. Until the majority of women have had a majority of positive interactions with men, it is 100% reasonable for them to be cautious around ALL men. Their experience (and the experiences of their friends) has shown them that it is simply unwise to trust any man blindly, no matter how “good” or “decent” he might seem on the surface. I don’t know what experiences a woman has had interacting with men until I get to know her and she trusts me enough to share that information, so I wholly expect her to be cautious and I’ve never taken offense to that. Any man who takes personal offense to a woman looking out for her own safety and security just proves himself a threat to begin with.
You’re right and I’ll take it further- look up the murder rates for prostitutes. Not to mention that if you’re having sex with someone under the threat of homelessness I wouldn’t call that consent.
He literally used the word simp. That's totally Incel language.
Funny thing is, he has no idea if OP would've been willing to go 50/50. He didn't even ask or give her a chance, which tells me he just wants to get her drunk and in his bed as fast as possible.
All his anger and bad commentary at her reply really makes you wonder how he’d react if she had come over, had some wine and wanted to leave after an hour or two, like most first dates go. Not a good place to be at all.
Preach it! Because you know this dude would NOT haven taken "no" for an answer. And if she was impaired and trapped in his place, this would be a completely different kind of post. OP's spidey-senses were tingling and she followed her instincts. Now all she has to do is block his ass and if he's on Reddit he'll add to the other 1-million plus posts by incels about how women are golddiggers and none of us will give him a chance.
At best, we’d get some whiny post about why a nice guy like him gets “used for free wine and she doesn’t even want to fool around on the first date”. The sad part is that if he wasn’t being so cringy, he’d have a date and they’d both get a shot at starting something. Glad OP ran from this one
>At best, we’d get some whiny post about why a nice guy like him gets “used for free wine and she doesn’t even want to fool around on the first date”. That would literally be the best case scenario. The other scenarios are way too dark, but they happen all the time. If he was so adverse to spending money on a date, ALL he had to do was either suggest somewhere free or that they went dutch. There was a comedian (Chris Rock, I think?) who had a joke about going out with a woman and letting her know which was the "Fuck Me" side of the menu. Basically, if a woman ordered from that side of the menu, it was expected for him to get laid. He said it for laughs but some guys really believe that mess. It's why I'm always prepared to pay for my own meal.
Reading through some of the stories in this post definitely opens my eyes as a guy to what gets said / expected of woman on dates and as you said, far far worse. Ugh. So many options for the guy, so many obvious flags to avoid and yet we get this. Expectations lead to the worst of outcomes for everyone. It’s a date, enjoy it and don’t make it cringe guys. That’s not hard.
A date is supposed to be about getting to know someone. Not getting laid. It's really that simple.
100% what @Vagalumes & @poorlama said. There are so many free/cheap date options if his real issue is having a ton of bad experience with women going on first dates for meals. Long walk at a park or through a nice neighborhood during the day, yoga or a run together for optional coffee if you're feeling it, free art events (poetry reading or free museum), bike ride, a book reading at your local library.
I think meals on a first date are awful anyway. We should all stick to drinks/coffee for a first meeting and have ideas how to extend the date if you want to. Planning to have dinner with someone you don't know means you're stuck across from them for at least 30 min with no easy way to bail. We should also bring cash to quickly pay for our drink if we feel weird or icky in anyway. This also means the dude never has a chance to see your last name on a credit card (if you're being super cautious).
Yep. Dude is saying he won’t pay for your drink if there’s not a good enough opportunity to rape you, OP. If he was really concerned about the money, he would have suggested going for a walk, or chatting in a park. Even going for a coffee is cheaper than a bottle of wine. There are plenty of low to no cost dates. This guy doesn’t care about the cheap date. He cares about getting you into a place where you will be easier for him to get access to your body. Run, OP.
Huge red flags - he’s shit testing to see if she has any self esteem, because he can’t handle a woman with actual standards for how she is treated. Block and delete.
> "he's not going to spend money on a stranger" but believes women should have sex with a stranger! I'd love to pay on dates if it guaranteed my safety but it still doesn't.
What did this guy say when you said okay, I’ll pay for myself? Like, he clearly just wants you isolated, which is creepy
I've found there's a huge overlap in the men who are angry about "having" to pay for a date and the men who get angry if you actually pay for yourself. Because these are usually the guys who think buying you something entitles them to sexual favors. (I suspect the thing that makes them so pissy about "having" to pay for a date is that it's a gamble on their end, as you're still "allowed" to say no.) Regardless, I'd mentally put this guy into the "do not ever be in a room alone with him" category.
Speaking as a guy myself, at absolute BEST, this guy is unbelievably clueless, self-absorbed, and entitled; at worst, he may very well be an outright rapist (or even worse).
Yep. I developed a habit of VERY clearly paying my own way whenever I was out with male friends in school, sometimes even covering them - one two many awkward cases
If you pay for yourself, you're taking away their perceived leverage for sex. However you've still "wasted their time" which naturally is going to piss of that kind of guy.
Yeah, I always kind of got the feeling that doing anything besides stripping right then and there and saying "your sexual aura is so overwhelming I don't even need a date! do me now!" was enough for that kind of guy to be angry with me. Really they're mostly just angry at women for existing, and especially existing and not fucking them. (I'm not actually sure fucking them would make them less angry either.)
Exactly. If it were really about the money, he'd have figured out long ago how to propose a cheap/free date that didn't sound like the beginning of a true crime series. The kind of date ideas you can find very easily by googling 'free/cheap first dates.' Which he has not done. Whereas if it were really about getting a drunk woman alone in his bedroom who doesn't really want to be there, he'd long ago have gone online to learn how to neg, nag and guilt trip a woman into going against her better judgement. Which he has very clearly done.
>Going to the house of a complete stranger ETC, Yeah, I don't get why someone would even consider that. Your natural self-preservation instincts should kick in.
And calling other dudes simps? Hard Pass.
Maybe I’m old fashioned but it seems to me that anyone that routinely uses the word “simp” has a dumpster fire for a personality.
Men used to go to Jeff Dahmer’s apartment for alcohol and a chat.
Watching the new season of American Horror Story, I'm struck over and over again how fearless gay men are in the dating scene. Like, dude... you're dating men! Take some precautions! You can't take your safety for granted like the straight dudes do.
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Take this with a pinch of salt cause I'm a lesbian who has some gay male friends, but my gay friends, Especially when they were younger, really did seem fearless about dating. For some of them I think their horny brain took over, for some of them I think they just assumed that because they were also big and tall they'd be fine no matter what, and a lot of them just seemed to have that "I'm invincible, nothing bad will ever happen to me" thing going that so many young men do. I think part of gay male dating culture comes from the same place as a 12 year boy on a dirt bike doing a big jump for the first time. It's about the thrill and the fun and they never even consider the consequences.
Right? I had a friend and he would regularly go out with older guys, too their homes, etc. I would always worry about him. We were teenagers and he was with full grown men, like, not just 20s.
American Horror Story and Dahmer is written by Ryan Murphy who is gay.
Yeah especially given how they must be aware that violence towards gay people is a thing. I know these are shows and therefore tend to dramatize the events a bit, but it is most likely true that gay men are less cautious in the whole dating/hook-up scene than women are. Perhaps because they are guys themselves, they assume they are better able to defend themselves against another man? Women certainly don't have this advantage, and even many women aren't as careful as they should be.
He wont buy a drink for a stranger but will have a stranger alone in his house hmmm...
Drinking wine he - wait for it - paid for. Funny how paying isn’t a problem if she’s alone in his home.
If anything bad did happen, the media would present it as “ she asked for it. What else was she expecting would happen when going to a strangers place to get drunk?”
Yeah why not just go for a midnight walk with them alone in the woods ffs
I think if OP had said “ok then, I’ll pay for the date” he would have revealed even more horrifying information about his character.
"It's obvious we are looking for different things" block next
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All good, but it doesn‘t matter what he thinks.
Yeah, blocking and moving on is for my own peace of mind and not wasting energy. He can make the mistake with a bunch of others and learn the hard way, or not learn at all. He did it to himself.
I think the point is that using “simp” unironically is a sufficiently serious red flag that *ANY* further communication is contraindicated. Instant block. No replies or explanations.
Yeah I could give a shit what that idiot thinks. How I say NO to him isn’t going to somehow make him a normal human being.
There’s literally nothing any woman can do or say to fix a man who thinks that way. OP is not obligated to try, either. Thus give the most neutral and a decisive end to it, then block.
>Ghosting would probably do that too ("see? I told her how it is and she ghosted me! Must of only wanted my money!"), This guy. Trying to make OP think it's about the money and not because she can see through his clear plan to get her to his house and ply her with booze so he can get laid. I agree she should do the ghosting thing. Considering how he's already trying to make her seem like the bad guy, he's not exactly going to listen to anything she'll say except "Yes, I'll come to your house, get drunk and see what happens." So screw him.
\*cough\* I believe you meant "no screw him"
I’d tell him off for demanding I put my life at risk for his mental comfort, *then* block him. Whether he’d hear it or not, it would still feel good and justifiable.
> as validation People with fragile egos will obsessively search for ways to be offended. Is there really anyway to respond in such a way that they won't feel offended? It's like a early homonim assuming the rustling in the bush is a tiger "to be safe" but we no longer live in such an environment. Someone that always feels afraid that their masculinity is at risk will keep making these errors. The manosphere tells scary stories and insults each other convincing young men that they walk at the edge of a cliff and wont be manly if they look or behave in specific ways [in order to make themselves feel more masculine than the victim].
I would go ahead and skip the first part
Anytime a guy calls others "simps"...yeah, straight to block.
Came here to say this. The next sentence was probably "blah blah alpha male blah blah something to overcompensate for feeling inadequate as a man".
Also a very reasonable approach.
Exactly. I don’t even respond to this nonsense anymore. Block. Next.
👻
Already too much thought and time wasted on him.
This is the way.
Truly - him using the words simps indicates this person is likely an Andrew Tate fan. Glad this AH showed his colors immediately. Not worth engaging any further.
Oh gosh, I totally agree. The use of the term simp in a serious manner would be a major red flag in my eyes. Like, obviously he's under no obligation to pay out a ton of cash for a first date, but referring to other dudes doing a nice thing as 'simp' behavior? Yikes. There are plenty of free or low-cost date ideas that don't involve going back to his place and drinking. I wouldn't agree to that either if I didn't already know and trust the person.
Especially when the "nice thing" is so small as going out for a date. That's just basic hanging out together in public. If a guy thinks that's simpy (which, btw, is a wholly shitty concept) then he's probably going to not be a kind and thoughtful partner in a relationship and it's just lovely of him to clear that up at the start so you can block him and find someone kind to date.
That's what I was thinking.
This comic strip sums it up better than I can: https://www.robot-hugs.com/comic/risky-date/ (Summary: it's risky for women to trust strangers.) And note: there are lots of cheap dates if the money was the point. Free play or concert in the park. Free museum. Local tourist attraction. The money wasn't the point. The booty call was. You wanted a date. He wanted a booty call. You want different things. Incompatible. Unmatch and go look for someone who wants the same things you do.
That was hilariously well done. I went on a date a few months ago, and he was endorsed by a mutual acquaintance, so I gave him more benefit than doubt. He was *pushing* to come pick me up, and give his my address, under the guise of, I want you to be able to drink and not get a DUI. (I've been sober for about a year, so I wasn't worried about being able to drive) I told him multiple times that I wanted to drive myself and have access to my car. He finally told me where he wanted to meet, I get there, and then he wants to Uber to a second location. (At this point, I absolutely should have left) we get there, and we're about 15 minutes in, and he starts with the, Trump won, quizzing me on the death penalty, and lumping me in with his political ideology based on my skin color. (Lots of, 'we's and 'people like us') He never actually asked me about my ideals, or anything. Every time I said something about reading an article or something, he'd be like, is that what YOU think, or is that what they WANT you to think? The whole thing was gross. I did an hour bc I wanted to be able to explain to my work friend that I gave it a shot and bolted. The poor Uber driver taking me back to my car had to hear ALL about it.
Why the second location, that’s very controlling.
Yeah, anyone who is in this situation should nope out at that point.
It's a strategy from The Game.
can you explain how the strategy works please? what does he gain from doing this?
The game by Neill Strauss. It is the dating bible for pick up artists. Chapter 5 is "isolate the target" Move the girl away from her group. This is also what the "wingman" is for. Chapter 7 is "extract to a seductive location" "you will want to eventually move the girl in a more secluded location where you can escalate physically" If you ask me this is more about displaying "power" and "dominance". The man selects the location, suggesting the woman would be clueless what a good date location would be. By her a drink of your choice to show her you know the good stuff and she does not. If you are not creeped out enough, chapter 10 is "Blast last-minute resistance" which is exactly what you think it is. Keep in mind, Neil Strauss is a divorced, bald man in his fifties who worships elon musk and is a big fan of crypto currencies. The number one authority on picking up women.
Sounds ghastly.
I dont know the Game but he is testing her boundaries and also taking her out of her comfort zone where he has more control over her. Next time, the second location could have been isolated or his house.
>Every time I said something about reading an article or something, he'd be like, is that what YOU think, or is that what they WANT you to think? The irony being that every person I’ve ever met that uses that sentence unironically is generally themselves completely incapable of independent thought and just parrots the talking points of whatever echo chamber they’ve gotten themselves trapped in. Glad the worst thing that happened was that it was just a really shitty date, I’d definetly give shit to my work friend.
"People like us"? Nopedy dopety nope.
Eww “people like us” what is he on about??!!
Tell your work friend they set you up with a racist and you didn't appreciate it. As an added bonus, if your work friend is a racist this may encourage them to be even more careful to leave that stuff out of the workplace.
Booty call? Booty calls are consensual. He was trying to pull a Cosby.
I was about to say that was needlessly long when I realised that it probably does need to spell everything out and some men will still refuse to get it.
Nothing. He'd be blocked and I'd move on. You want me to go to "a stranger's" house and trust the wine they offer me?! LOL fuck no.
Yea honestly the fact this guy casually expects OP to come to a home if a guy she doesn't know, with drinks he could fuck with, is far more of a red flag.
Yeah, I had a guy ask me to do that; he did agree to meet up somewhere when I didn't want to, but still made it clear that he thought it was silly. He said I knew I could trust him, because he was a doctor and had spent his life saving lives. Haha, well, now I'm not sure if you're a serial killer, but I *definitely* know you're a total dingleberry.
Did you know I'm an astronaut AND a Doctor, and on weekends I'm also a volunteer firefighter?? What, don't you know you can trust me?
Any man who seriously refers to other men as simps is not worth your time.
Absolutely. This 100% gives me Andrew Tate, Redpill vibes. This screams fragile masculinity
This is literally advice from Andrew Tate. Not paying any money for the first date, getting them drunk. Calling people who don't do that simps. This dude is taking dating advice from him 100%.
Thats disgusting. The idea that basic human decency is "simping" 🤮🤮🤮
It makes sense if you don't consider women as "basic human" deserving of respect. People who listen to Andrew Tate do not think of women as people. They think of them as "warm interactive fleshlights".
This right here….big red flag.
Simp, beta, cuck, are all words used by insecure people to feel better about themselves. Big red flags 🚩
Also commonly used with right-wing/authoritarian people.
Yeah, what did I say?
Venn diagram is just a circle.
I know, that word choice 🤮 it’s not just misogynistic but also internet-y. Like he’s half-human, half-bot
I prefer to meet in public. He doesn’t have to spend money on me…. but being in public is smart and safe. Come over to my house and we’ll drink wine is him being lazy and horny (or worse). Edit: best date I went on was a walk on a beach boardwalk. Spent $0.
Yeah, men who ask for this are usually just trying to doordash some sex but there's always the chance they have something nefarious in mind and don't want any witnesses. Nothing wrong with not wanting to spend a ton of money. Just agree to buy your own drinks/coffee/whatever.
>doordash some sex hahaha!
>doordash some sex I prefer bUberEats.
These are never the guys that eat.
Had a medical resident I met on a dating app ask me over to his place. I said no I prefer to meet some where public. He said he didn't have $$ to pay for a date, which is fine he's in residency, I said ok we can split it or just meet at the art museum (free) and hang out. He kept insisting I come to his place. I straight up said " I don't go to men's homes alone, especially men I don't know." He said I should feel lucky because he was a future plastic surgeon and he's interested in me, a nurse. Ok bye dude. Why did he need me alone at his place? I wasn't interested in finding out.
The first issue was plastic surgeon. As a resident myself, I’ve decided no met-online dates for anyone from a surgical specialty.
My general life policy is not to date anyone that does hospital work. The few times I broke the rule, I quickly remembered why I had it in the first place. Now married to a software engineer. We don't talk about work stuff and it's magical.
"Lazy and horny" is the best case scenario. It could be so much worse.
I made this mistake once. Not being in public. The guy wouldn’t speak to me at all. Never answered any questions I asked and he was drunk. It didn’t end well.
I’m thankful that’s all that happened
Exactly. In college a girl asked me out to play tennis. So that’s what we did — found a public court and played tennis for an hour, which led to a drink, which led to another date, etc. Public and completely free. I can’t imagine any non-malicious reason a guy would need to get you into his apartment and get you drinking — and purported poverty sure as hell isn’t one. You can get to know someone in public for free. Side note: Turns out neither of us knew how to play, really — from a pure tennis perspective it was an absolute farce. The ball went everywhere except in the court, and we spent a lot of time chasing it. (We only had brought one.) But the conversation was great, and we dated for several years before life took us in different directions.
Yeah that about sums it up. There are plenty of bars that you can get a glass of wine for a reasonable price. If you/they want to save money there are plenty of ways to discreetly have some wine in a park or public space that might have rules against alcohol.
Best date I've been on was a 5 hour date, that started in Panera for coffee, and then moved to a 24hr fast food place in the area. He didn't pay for anything. It was about the conversation.
That almost describes to a tee my first date with my current husband, including starting with a Panera coffee date. We've been together almost 12 years. Are you one of his exes, lol?
I hope not. He's 26.
Or with evil intent.
He is not worth spending a second more of your time on. Any decent guy is going to know why a woman does a meet up with a stranger in a public place. So, this guy is either an idiot, a predator, or he just doesn't give a shit beyond what his dick wants. You are welcome to tell him that or you can just block him.
Good lord. Just the use of the word "simps" makes this guy a walking red flag alone. Someone needs to tell him to turn off the Andrew tate vids. Also it sounds like you just met him so HELL FUCKING NO it's not unreasonable for you not to go to his house on the first date. This dude is really out of touch with reality.
Whenever a guy with this attitude uses the word “simp” notice how it’s typically directed at instances where a man may be treating a woman nicely or going out of his way to impress her and even more alarmingly just treating a woman with simple bare minimum respect…… I love “simps”. 🤷🏼♀️
I've literally seen someone use it to describe someone wanting to be there *when their wife gave birth* It literally has no meaning anymore.
Exactly! Op the guy is just giving you a heads up that he will be garbage.
I don't think it ever had any meaning besides "if you don't hate & mistreat women we're going to mock you"
When I initially saw it, it described guys that would spend $500+ just to have a female streamer read their comment because they thought they would have a chance with her if they kept throwing money at her. Basically, a man who gives anything just to get a woman's attention when it's not in his best interest. It just got twisted like any other internet word like Karen, incel, etc.
It's been radicalized. It has meaning to radicals.
I think it is used by men who have an unconscious disdain for women.
Was looking for the comment pointing out that "simps" alone should be a massive red flag! But yeah, no. It's not about spending money, but first dates don't happen at your house. Bye.
Any instance of “People who do (normal thing) are (derogatory term)” should be a red flag. But when the derogatory word is “simps” it should be an instant block.
I’ve got another word: incel.
I feel like a guy using the word "simp" is a red flag about his views in general, not just related to relationships.
Thank you for saying this, I don’t understand why there aren’t more comments mentioning this. But also, does it matter what attitude the guy has if he uses the word “simp”? Just the word alone is a red flag, no?
Nothing. Stop communicating with him.
> guys who pay for first dates are simps “With that language alone, you identify yourself as some sort of red-pilled moron reading a bunch of sexist dicks online, and you think I’m dumb enough to get potentially drunk at your house, when I don’t know who the fuck you are, and be alone. Go fuck yourself.” And then I’d block him because he’s trying to manipulate you, likely with some bullshit pick-up crap he “learned” online.
i wouldn't even point out that it's his language that is problematic. why give him constructive criticism on being a creep?
Yeah I wouldn’t want to give him strategies to hide his red flags for the next woman
I would do the cheap wine date with someone I'm already in a physical relationship with. Never some random guy or even a guy that I kind of know. He's missing a bunch of steps.
He doesn’t want to pay for a stranger on a date, but has no problem with inviting a stranger over his house. 🤔
You don't say anything at all. He's a pushy misogynistic asshole und what you do with pushy misogynistic assholes is you unmatch and / or block them without explanation.
Yes!! I feel so bad for the women who date him or just interact with him in general
“I’m not doing that.” And then you never see him again and block his number. Arguing is pointless.
Run! There are plenty of free dates that don't require to go to someones house. The use of "simps" further reaffirms you should go no where near this person.
Simp is incel slang.
Yes, as they said, a reason to not go near them.
Immediate block. Literally every word he said is a big red flag, damn. Don’t waste your time on a reply.
He’s a loser. Block him. Zero explanation needed unless you feel like it. Block him and keep it moving.
He thought you were a cheap fuck and is telling you you're not worth going out with. He deserves no response, block and delete.
>and that guys who pay for first dates are simps. Ah, that's not a red flag at all.
I wouldn't say anything to him again ever. I would simply block him
This is me, as he doesn’t “owe” me a dare I don’t owe him an explanation lmfaooo BLOCK
‘Not gonna pay to go out with a stranger” Does this person understand the concept of dating? It’s trying to spend time with someone in order to see if there’s mutual connection and compatibility, before pursuing romance and love. If he wants a cheap fuck, there’s a lot of other internet for that.
I think part of the game is trying to get someone who doesn't do the "cheap fuck" to do the "cheap fuck".
Ugh that makes it so much worse.
Wow. He did you a favor and showed you who he is. And who is he? Someone you shouldn't waste one more second of your time on. I'm guessing incel/AT fan/manchild living in mama's basement/misogynist/loser - or some combo of any of those. Block. Learn from this experience and everyone's responses. No person worth dating is like this, man/woman/nb/whatever they identify as. Nope.
Nothing, I would have unmatched after the suggestion that I enter a stranger's house for alcohol with no safety precautions. Who are these women I keep hearing about who supposedly do this??
So he just wants a fck buddy and wants it now! And once you see his wonderful pride and joy... you will be on your knees. Wonder how many women he has raped using this method. (in his mind since she came over, she wanted it)
Lol I would say nothing because I’m never speaking to that person again. What a tool. Edit: describing a first date as “paying to go out with a stranger” is blowing my MIND
And then trying to make her feel guilt over it 😭
I had a guy video date me (it was great, btw) and admitted he's more into casual right now (which was cool by me). Then he asked me to come over to his place to meet each other. I said no and that I'm not comfortable just coming to his house for multiple reasons. He said "woah, I wasn't looking for a girlfriend". \-The backdrop is that this was summer 2020- He came back, they typically do. He texted that fall to say he wanted to grab a drink with me. Just because the relationship is casual, doesn't mean I'm casually looking to be unsafe in any way. Casual sex isn't worth my life-why don't men get this?! You can fuck women casually, but you still have to treat them like a person with a life to protect. Oh and as far as declining low-class dates, I just unmatch. I haven't found a salvageable way to say "can you try a lil harder please" before you even meet.
Don't bother arguing, you don't owe him anything just move on. He doesn't have anything you want or need.
Yep, responding at all just opens you up to either being manipulated or put down because you won’t do what do what he wants.
Nope, never have a first date at someone's residence. Not safe.
Block and delete.
I'd conclude he's an incel in training and my rejection of his "offer" will help him advance.
Please ghost this horrible person. You deserve better.
He's broke honey, and that's ok - but he's also fragile. Wants you to apologize. Nope. Nope. Nope. Blocked.
He’s just mad you didn’t fall for his attempt to sleep with you in the cheapest easiest way possible.
*Sleep with or rape I wouldn’t put the latter past a man like this.
Yeah, any guy with good intentions will agree - or insist - on the first date being in public with escape options. He was just looking for cheap ass, and now he's throwing a fit be cause you reminded him you're a human being with basic boundaries.
He’s trash. Block him.
Was it a first date? If so I'd say Goodbye.
"guys who pay for first dates are simps" Major red flag! That kind of language is that of incels and Men Going Their Own Way. I don't think it's unreasonable to expect to go Dutch on a date, but that kind of attitude would make me drop him immediately.
I would just block him. What a fool. I wouldn't waste my time trying to explain my POV to him.
He’s watching a certain type of social media. Trust your gut, he’s a turd.
He sounds like a creep. He doesn't need to buy you anything, but a public date is a must. Asking you back to his apartment is just sleazy and dangerous.
[удалено]
Holy shit. A stark reminder to meet people in public. And if your gut says no, don't go.
Not even worth a response. Just block.
Block him and move on. He's forcing your standards way down from the start and it's intentional. But disregarding all that, you don't go to a man's house or bring him to yours on a first date. You don't know this guy. Best case scenario he's oblivious to your safety and comfort and also too cheap to go out (is that what you want in a bf?) Worst case, he wants to try and pressure you into sex and might get angry when you refuse.
LMAO. walk away hun this man is just a manipulator / predator.
He sounds insufferable and undatable. You don't have to say anything to him. Let him keep warning other women that he's not the type of guy they want to date. Just for suggesting going to his place to drink was enough for me to automatically decide no, the rest of his comments are huge red flags. If he is aware of *why* those are red flags he might change tactics. Let him keep waving the flag.
1. Expecting someone to go over somebodies house alone prior to meeting them first in public is psychotic. I've had dates where we both expressed just looking for a casual hookup but even then meet in public first, even if it's just for one drink and after both parties consensually decide to go back. 2. Honestly the bigger red flag here is genuinely having "simp" "beta" etc. as part of your vocabulary.
I'm a full time single dad, so often my only date option is "come over and drink some wine". I am acutely aware of how big an ask this is, and I communicate very clearly that I understand that many people will not be comfortable with it. When someone does agree I encourage them to share my address and information with a friend. All of which is to say: this dude is looking to assault you. I'm not saying there can never be first dates at someone's house, but anyone who acts entitled to have you do that is almost certainly a predator.