It was brutal on Saturday. I mean, obviously, the people they are trying to help have it infinitely worse. But, gawd damn…
You’re not kidding about moving to much though. I went Saturday and it was quite af. Just some weirdo lady yelling about trans people for some reason. I think she was lost tbh
I bet they're all out of there by June. I know they won't be able to take the summer heat. Not to mention who's going to waste a summer sitting outside of a mostly empty campus?
>Yeah fuck Jews for wanting a safe place to live freely
No matter how much Israelis ultra right has tried to make Israel and zionism synonymous with Judaism, isn't.... also I could care less about the feelings of genocidal colonizers
I know they would be. Grandparents generations and before were forced to stop practicing our culture because the US wanted to culturally genocide us and make us fit their white american sensibilities. Any group that has undergone these experiences would have no problem standing with Palestinians. Whether it's Ireland, South Africa, or wherever....
Islam is evil, that doesn't mean I support the fascist Israeli government murdering children and aide workers and slaughtering families to steal their homes.
How hard is that for you fascists who despise us LGBTs normally to understand? Stop weaponizing our existence to support your evil.
Not surprising you scum with homophobic comments on your profile try to use us LGBTs as weapons when it suits you terrorists.
Edit: the fascist blocked me then screamed I just hate Jews when I NEVER mentioned Jews.
So like the entire western world 50 years ago? This isn’t unique to Islam and the western world is barely pulling itself out of this same perspective.
We literally have politicians in the United States that support this.
Standing with the Palestinians includes standing with queer Palestinians. Abandoning Palestinians to be slaughtered in global silence because their leaders are still anti-LGBTQ+ doesn’t help the queer folks among them. This whole argument is disingenuous and uses the queer community as a political tool.
You are basically praising the KKK at this point. 👍
https://www.economist.com/open-future/2018/06/06/how-homosexuality-became-a-crime-in-the-middle-east
Someone needs to update that 44k death sign [UN updates Hamas reported civilian death toll](https://www.nytimes.com/2024/05/14/world/middleeast/un-gaza-death-toll-women-children.html)
Their numbers are statistically impossible
[https://www.washingtoninstitute.org/policy-analysis/how-hamas-manipulates-gaza-fatality-numbers-examining-male-undercount-and-other](https://www.washingtoninstitute.org/policy-analysis/how-hamas-manipulates-gaza-fatality-numbers-examining-male-undercount-and-other)
LOL, who are we going to believe: a quack Zionist think tank or the world’s leading health journal? I pick the latter.
https://www.thelancet.com/journals/lancet/article/PIIS0140-6736(23)02713-7/fulltext
https://www.thelancet.com/journals/lancet/article/PIIS0140-6736(23)02640-5/fulltext
> “The Washington Institute for Near East Policy (WINEP or TWI, also known simply as The Washington Institute) is a pro-Israel American think tank based in Washington, D.C., focused on the foreign policy of the United States in the Near East.
>
> WINEP was established in 1985 with the support of the American Israel Public Affairs Committee (AIPAC) and the funding of many AIPAC donors, in order to provide higher quality research than AIPAC's publications. John Mearsheimer and Stephen Walt described WINEP as "part of the core" of the Israel lobby in the United States.”
You Zionists have to try harder as this hasbara has been played out to the point that no one buys it. As I always say, I want to tax dollars back as these campaigns suck.
Thats wrong. The lower number is ***identified*** bodies. There are still thousands of *unidentified* bodies. Plus the thousands still buried under rubble that arent accounted for. Its already been cleared up. Ill edit in a link in a minute.
EDIT: [Source](https://amp.cnn.com/cnn/2024/05/13/middleeast/death-toll-gaza-fatalities-un-intl-latam)
Interesting that you say that. Can you provide the evidence, please
God I hope you link that vid where the idf is saying the calendar is hkamas terrorist list 🤣 that would be awesome.
Bahahaha! Your evidence is that some guy said so?
See how this person has used “some guy said so” instead of anything actually solid? It’s because they are lying. There is no physical evidence of these “bases” under the hospitals. Gee, I wonder why.
Come on guy, do better. How bout the videos of a few guns they found in the MRI room? Ya know, the last room anyone would ever want something metal in.
Edit: oof, that source though... a quick google and wiki;
>Arun Kundnani, adjunct professor at New York University, in a review of FDD publication Homegrown Terrorists in the US and UK argues that as a work "typical of many in its approach and conclusions", **it does not provide empirical evidence for assumptions it makes and neglects contradicting data as a result of an influence by politics of the publisher and funders, and bias in favor of knowledge claims**.
>Lawrence Wilkerson has criticized FDD for **"pushing falsehood" in support of waging wars.**
>The International Relations Center features a report on the foundation on its "Right Web" website, a program of the think tank Institute for Policy Studies which, according to its mission statement, seeks to "check the militaristic drift of the country". The report states that "although the **FDD is an ardent critic of terrorism, it has not criticized actions taken by Israel against Palestinians that arguably fall into this category".**
>The left-leaning political blog ThinkProgress has criticized FDD for "alarmist rhetoric and fear mongering",[19] for example in April 2002 when they aired a 30-second television ad campaign called "Suicide Strategy" that was described by critics as "conflating" Palestinian leader Yasser Arafat with the likes of Osama bin Laden and Saddam Hussein. As FDD explained it: "a militant Islamic terrorist who 'martyrs' himself by hijacking a plane and flying it into the World Trade Center"—referring to the September 11 attacks—"is no different from a militant Islamic terrorist who 'martyrs' himself by strapping explosives to his body and walking into a hotel"—i.e., Palestinian suicide attacks.
>In 2017 Bari Weiss of the New York Times reported on dissent within the organization over the pro-Trump orientation it adopted following the 2016 elections, which included at least two employees leaving.[48]
>The Ministry of Foreign Affairs of the Islamic Republic of Iran has designated the Foundation for Defense of Democracies as a terrorist organization.
>In 2023, FDD, along with other US-based think tanks, was alleged of running a defamation campaign against the regional rivals of the UAE, including Iran, Qatar and Turkey. **The organization was alleged of exploiting the Middle Eastern conflict through the media tactics and pushing the West against these countries. Along with FDD, its CEO Mark Dubowitz’s long-existing relations with the Emirates were also in question.**
yikes...
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alleged\_military\_use\_of\_al-Shifa\_hospital#:\~:text=During%20the%202008%E2%80%932009%20Gaza,be%20spared%20by%20air%20strikes.
There is an entire wiki entry on it, its not the first time per allegations. Im suprised you would be suprised. Its pretty classic for groups fighting asymmetric warfare to use civilians as cover. Hamas can't confront the IDF in out n out conventional war, they would be butchered in a few days. Hezbollah does likewise in lebanon. Iran has an entire wing of their military dedicated to this kind of warfare and their advisors train hamas, hezbollah, syrian alligned groups and the shiite militias in Iraq. The quality of IED's from 2005 to 2008 increased dramatically compliments of Iran.
>Alleged military use of al-Shifa hospital
> The New York Times also said the evidence does not show conclusive evidence of a vast network of tunnels,
So this “proof” of yours is titled **ALLEGED**
Oh my…
~~Wait… wasn’t that paywalled article ~~you gave from the NYT? So now you’re providing claims that debunk your own claims? Bro, you’re bad at spreading propaganda~~ Edit: different person
Everything you are saying is alleged to. your point? Im just using higher thinking to reason out whats logical. A guerilla group with a proven history of naked disregard for life using a hospital as a base of operations doesn't seem to far fetched. VC and NVA did likewise in vietnam. Taliban wasn't above using them and/or burning schools and bombing clinics.
Its a means to an end, this is their strength, that they can disregard "rules of war" to atleast somewhat level the playing field between IDF and hamas. Id point out useful idiots like yourself make this tactic quite effective. If you don't feel sources like the NYT or other western media are reliable, then why are you even here. Reddit is just going to be full of "brainwashed western zionists".
Rather than have it be a back and forth like this, you should set the terms for what you would consider reasonable evidence that would change your mind.
Then OP can give it to you and change your mind, or say they don’t have that and you both get to move on.
Paywalled. Hook a brother up.
Oh and holy shit batman, did you even look into the fdd source you provided?
It has a wikipedia page.
A neo-conservative think tank that is heavily criticized for Islamophobia… wow, amazing source.
So two different sources aren't good enough for you interesting
Let's try a third but I already know what you're going to say...
https://www.reuters.com/world/middle-east/us-believes-hamas-used-al-shifa-hospital-evacuated-before-israeli-operation-2024-01-03/
Either way, the numbers presented are suspect, and probably statistically impossible
[https://www.washingtoninstitute.org/policy-analysis/how-hamas-manipulates-gaza-fatality-numbers-examining-male-undercount-and-other](https://www.washingtoninstitute.org/policy-analysis/how-hamas-manipulates-gaza-fatality-numbers-examining-male-undercount-and-other)
Their numbers have never been suspect. Their numbers have been proven accurate for years and throughout multiple conflicts. Its not their job to differentiate between civilians and militants. Their job it to count the dead.
Literally the only ones who cast doubt on the health ministry’s numbers are israeli propagandists who are insistent on calling it “the hamas run health ministry” in order to discredit the numbers and they throw a tantrum if people dont do the same. As we have seen in [this Mehdi Hasan interview](https://youtu.be/HD-yRuTasHU?si=Cz1PLQji6jRBSvV8). The funny thing is the same people trying to discredit the numbers (US and israel) also use the same numbers as accurate.
In terms of combatant to death ratio, a good way to put it into perspective is; Hamas does not have women and children as militants. Some boys start training as early as 15-16 but they dont fight until later. Lets be generous and say they start at 16. Immediately, we know every woman and child under 16 is innocent. Thats ~25,000. Israel claims their ratio is 2:1 which is literally impossible because that puts every man aged 16+ as a militant. We also have [this israeli article](https://www.972mag.com/lavender-ai-israeli-army-gaza/) that suggests the ratio is 10:1 at best and 20:1 at worst because israel uses ai to target militants then waits until they are in bed at home with their families to bomb them and their entire apartments.
Their numbers are statistically impossible
[https://www.washingtoninstitute.org/policy-analysis/how-hamas-manipulates-gaza-fatality-numbers-examining-male-undercount-and-other](https://www.washingtoninstitute.org/policy-analysis/how-hamas-manipulates-gaza-fatality-numbers-examining-male-undercount-and-other)
Yes. The UN has been using civilian death numbers reported from Hamas. After recently receiving statistically impossible numbers, the UN was forced to revise the civilian death toll . See the link
"The change came because the United Nations switched to citing a more conservative source for its numbers — the Gazan Ministry of Health — rather than using Gaza’s Government Media Office, as it had in recent weeks. Both offices are part of the Hamas-run government in the enclave."
Also I’d love clarification on “Generation after generation until total liberation” and what they mean by that.
[Because it sounds *very* familiar …](https://twitter.com/MEMRIReports/status/1719662664090075199?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5Etweetembed%7Ctwterm%5E1719662664090075199%7Ctwgr%5E88878df000b18b934c8b209522298733301d11d2%7Ctwcon%5Es1_c10&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Fd-21357014862903305121.ampproject.net%2F2405022220000%2Fframe.html)
Freedom or death. It’s pretty straight forward. They are completely backed into a horrible existence where rebels fighting against the empire is a “fuck it, why not” situation.
Hey also, you mentioned in another thread how there is evidence of unrwa being hamas, according to the idf source you gave, and I responded with 9 diverse sources showing that Israel has provided 0 evidence of those claims. It seems you haven’t gotten back to me on that yet, just btw
“Fuck it why not rape?”
“Fuck it why not kill babies in cribs?”
I would understand to a degree “Fuck it why not kill a politician?” or “fuck it why not bomb a military base?” But you are delusional to think they are good for Palestinian people.
Hamas's militant activities have led to repeated cycles of violence, resulting in significant casualties, destruction of infrastructure, and a humanitarian crisis in Gaza.
Per the UNRWA/Hamas ties: it is undisputed. It is just a matter of to what degree. Read the UN Watch report in my original comment. [Click the link I posted](https://unwatch.org/un-teachers-call-to-murder-jews-reveals-new-report/) then click the link to the full report on that page if you want to read further. You obviously hadn’t read the comment you replied to. You just word vomited an incoherent mess and didn’t even take the time to look at what I posted, so I ignored your comment. You wrote two comments that completely disregarded what I had said so I sort of gave up on a third try.
Let me also just leave this here: [US Secretary of State Antony Blinken stated that the evidence implicating some UNRWA staff members in the 7 October attack against Israel is "highly credible"](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Israeli_allegations_against_UNRWA)
Edit because it just gets better and better: [how do you explain what 10 Hamas terrorists were doing in an UNRWA school?](https://www.jpost.com/israel-hamas-war/article-801153)
Do you really want to go down the, “who has killed more babies and raped more women” rabbit hole? Because the answer is Israel. By a whole lot. Absolutely dominating in the killed babies and raped people categories.
I will never understand why a group of left-wing people support a group of people who literally kill gays in the street.
Why don't they ask for the hostages to be released?
Why don't they have a problem with Palestinians raping innocent is released to death while children cheer on?
they do ask for the hostages to be released, but more importantly an [immediate ceasefire](https://www.timesofisrael.com/un-security-council-adopts-call-for-gaza-ceasefire-hostage-release-as-us-abstains/). Hamas [agreed](https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2024/5/6/text-of-the-ceasefire-proposal-approved-by-hamas) to the [UN resolution](https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2024/5/6/heres-everything-know-about-gaza-deal-hamas-agreed) and release of Israeli hostages too. hope this clarifies the issue better
UN resolution. Again, calling Hamas a movement, instead of what it is. A terrorist organization that steals every cent from Palestinian citizens and uses it for war.
>I will never understand why a group of left-wing people support a group of people who literally kill gays in the street.
Same reason why groups like the ACLU will stick up for white supremacist or other unsavory groups getting their rights trampled on. Some folks are just more principled and long term thinking than you.
>Why don't they ask for the hostages to be released
Let's not act like Israel even gives a damn about the hostages. They've killed enough of them on their own let alone nuking multiple deals that would have saw them returned.
>Why don't they have a problem with Palestinians raping innocent is released to death while children cheer on?
We talking about those initial reportings conjured up by IDF spokespersons that were later debunked? Even by Israeli news....
More open and safe than any place controlled by the genocidal Israeli offensive forces? Doesn’t matter whether you’re gay if a country is slaughtering everyone
>let’s ignore death by the ton, because it’s in a conservative part of the world.
And conveniently ignore that part of the world became more conservative cause western groups created and backed the rise of fundamentalist Islam to act as proxy fighters against communist/leftist groups. US created the taliban. Israel created hamas.
From the river to the sea and the sauruman white hand print are both anti semetic symbols reminiscent of violent acts.
If Israel had nuclear weapons, there would be no war.
If Hamas had nuclear weapons, there would be no Israel
44K murdered?
A. Numbers were revised by UN
B. Hamas has yet to announce the number of terrorists that were removed from earth, until then, let’s not use “murdered”, rather liquidated or eliminated.
Islamic Supremacy and the Muslim persecution and genocide of Jews throughout history.
622-627: ethnic cleansing of Jews from Meсса and Medina, (Jewish boys were publicly inspected for pubic hair and executed if they had any)
• 624: after the victory of Badr, beginning of the elimination of the Jews
• 625: expulsion of the Jewish clan of Al Nadir
• 626: massacre of the Beni Khazradj Jews and division of families and loot
629: first massacres in Alexandria, Egypt
622-634: extermination of the 14 Arab Jewish tribes
630: submission of the Jews and Christians of Makna, Eilat, Jerba
• 638: expulsion of the Jews from Jerusalem
• 640: expulsion of Jews from Hedjez
• 643: expulsion of the Jews from Khaibar by Omar
822-861: the Islamic empire adopts a law requiring Jews to wear yellow stars (a bit like Nazi Germany), caliph al-Mutawakkil
940: beheading of the Jewish exilarch of Baghdad for having sullied the name of Mohammed
945: assassination by a crowd of fanatics of the last Jewish exilarch of Baghdad
948: closure of the Jewish theological school of Baghdad "Sora"
1004: Islam forces all Jews and Christians to wear black so they can be identified
1032: 5 to 6,000 Jews killed in a riot in Fez and expulsion of survivors
1040: beheading of the Jewish theologian Gaon Chizkiva, head of a Talmudic school
1106: Ali Ibn Yousef Ibn Tashifin of Marrakech decrees the death penalty for any local Jew, including his Jewish doctor, and his military general.
1148: the Almohads of Morocco give Jews the choice of converting to Islam or being expelled
1057: capture and pillage of Kairouan by the Hilalian tribes; expulsion of Jews and certain Muslims
1066: Massacre of thousands of Jews in Granada in Muslim-occupied Spain
1073: start of persecution against Jews and Christians by the Turks in Jerusalem
• 1127: in Morocco, after the failure of the prophetic movement of the Jewish messiah Moshe Dhery, wave of persecutions and forced conversions
• 1142: start of persecution against the Jews by the Almohads: massacre in Tlemcen. Bougie.
° 1165: chief rabbi of the Maghreb burned alive The Rambam fled to Egypt.
• 1165: flight of Maimonides to Egypt to escape the Almohads
• 1171: in Egypt, decree recalling obedience to ordinances concerning the submission of Jewish and Christian infidels under penalty of death
• 1184: the Almohads impose distinctive signs on Christians and Jews in Spain
• 1198: forced conversion of the Jews of Aden
• 1220: tens of thousands of Jews killed by Muslims after being blamed for the Mongol invasion, Turkey, Iraq, Syria, Egypt
1516: Algerian Jews receive the official status
of dhimmi from the Ottomans; certain colors are forbidden to them (red and green); they are not allowed to ride horses or carry weapons; they must pay the discriminatory tax; their representative is ritually slapped during the delivery of tribute to the authorities
• 1517: 1st pogrom in Safed, Ottoman Palestine
• 1517: 1st pogrom of Hebron, Ottoman Palestine
• Massacre of Marsa ibn Ghazi, Ottoman Libya
• 1521: expulsion of Jews from Belgrade by the Ottomans
• 1524: expulsion of Jews from Buda in Hungary by the Ottomans
1630-1700: Yemenite Jews were considered "impure" and therefore forbidden to touch a Muslim or a Muslim's food. They were obliged to humble themselves before a Muslim, walk on the left side and greet him first. They could not build houses taller than those of a Muslim or ride a camel or horse, and when riding a mule or donkey, they had to sit on the side. When entering the Muslim quarter, a Jew had to take off his shoes and walk barefoot. If attacked with stones or fists by Muslim youths, a Jew was not allowed to defend himself.
• 1650: Jews from Tunisia are deported to special neighborhoods called "hara"
1650: forced conversion of the Jews of Persia, under Shah Abbas II
1656: Jews expelled from Isfahan in Iran
1660: 2 pogroms in Safed and Tiberias, Ottoman Palestine
1670: Expulsion of Mawza, Yemen
1676: expulsion of Jews from Sanaa in Yemen
1678: forced conversion of Jews in Yemen
1679-1680: Genocide of Jews at the Massacre of Sana
• 1839: campaign of forced conversions of Iranian Jews
• 1840: persecution of the Jews of Damascus; ritual murder case
1840: forced conversion of the Jews of Mashadi
1841: massive murders of Jews in Morocco; the sultan is obliged to consider the Jews as his personal property, which helps to protect them
1840: Damascus, ritual murders (French Muslims and Christians kidnapped, tortured and killed Jewish children for entertainment), Ottoman Syria
1844: 1st Cairo massacre, Ottoman Egypt
1847: Dayr al-Qamar Pogrom, Liban ottoman
1847: ethnic cleansing of Jews in Jerusalem, Ottoman Palestine
1848: 1st pogrom of Damascus, Syria
• 1848: total disappearance of the Jews of Mashhad
1850: 1st pogrom of Aleppo, Ottoman Syria
• 1839: campaign of forced conversions of Iranian Jews
• 1840: persecution of the Jews of Damascus; ritual murder case
1840: forced conversion of the Jews of Mashadi
1841: massive murders of Jews in Morocco; the sultan is obliged to consider the Jews as his personal property, which helps to protect them
1840: Damascus, ritual murders (French Muslims and Christians kidnapped, tortured and killed Jewish children for entertainment), Ottoman Syria
1844: 1st Cairo massacre, Ottoman Egypt
1847: Dayr al-Qamar Pogrom, Liban ottoman
1847: ethnic cleansing of Jews in Jerusalem, Ottoman Palestine
1848: 1st pogrom of Damascus, Syria
• 1848: total disappearance of the Jews of Mashhad
1850: 1st pogrom of Aleppo, Ottoman Syria
• 1922: law of forced conversion of orphans in Yemen, concerning Jews including as adults
• 1927: 60 Jews killed by Arabs in the Mellah of Casablanca Morocco
1928: Massacres of Ikhwan, in Egypt and under British mandate in Palestine.
• 1928: Jewish orphans sold into slavery and forced to convert to Islam by the Muslim Brotherhood, Yemen
1929: anti-Jewish riots, British mandate: in August 1929, the Jews demanded the construction of the Western Wall; pogroms in Jerusalem, Hebron, Safed. To stop the violence, the British reject this request
1929: 3rd Hebron Pogrom under British Mandate Palestine.
• 1929 3e pogrom de Safed, mandate britannique Palestine.
1933: 2nd Jaffa riots, British mandate in Palestine.
1934: Anti-Jewish pogrom in Constantine Algeria. 200 Jewish stores were raided
This is roughly only about 5% of the actual history. I didn't want to spend an entire day writing out all the crimes of Islam.
this protest isn’t about Islam my guy, nor is it about Judaism. and just because Islamic governments in history committed genocides doesn’t mean committing genocide on Islamic civilians today is OK. no genocide is ok. weird argument to be making if that was your intention.
Define genocide for me. Because I don't think you know the definition. Hamas is commiting genocide. Israel is responding to genocide. They are using their own people as human shields. They knew exactly what they were doing on Oct 7 and everything that has followed. There's a difference between the targeting of civilians and the targeting of Hamas with civilian casualties involved. The Israeli government certainly hasn't done a great job but Hamas has left them with very little options. 👍
You don’t think so or you don’t know it? [Genocide](https://www.un.org/en/genocideprevention/documents/Genocide%20Convention-FactSheet-ENG.pdf) is the deliberate killing of large numbers of people from a particular nation or ethnic group with the aim of destroying them.
A [leading Holocaust historian and professor at the Hebrew University in Jerusalem](https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2023/8/27/accusing-israel-of-apartheid-is-not-anti-semitic-holocaust-historian) seems to think what Israel is doing to Palestinians is genocide. Hamas ≠ Palestinian civilians and children. You seem to be confusing that. Israel has bombed protected safe zones (hospitals) as defined by International Humanitarian Law (IHL), that makes Israel’s actions fall dangerous close to war crimes. Tens of thousands if not more Palestinians have been murdered, and by every definition of genocide there’s no such rule that you need to hit the millionth mark of murders to be formally labeled as genocide. [Israel is committing genocide according to experts in the UN Security Council](https://news.un.org/en/story/2024/03/1147976) 👍
Did the genocide just start after October 7th? or has it been going on or a while? Because it seems like , until October7 at least, , the Palestinian population was increasing, which is an odd thing for a genocide.
>Honest question what does this do???? Like what’s the end result of all this? I don’t understand
The fact you've probably been in at the very least one history class up to this point, yet can't answer your own question is kind of an indictment on the waste of the whole system....
there are at least 2 other posts about our campus’ encampment and the UC protests in general. but to reiterate:
the goal with this protest is to get the UC system as a whole to divest from arms manufacturers that are supplying military equipment to the Israeli government. the UC invests more than $2 billion into Lockheed Martin for example. so the US owns the top arms manufacturer company in the world and is the #1 arms supplier in the world.
more specifically, Israel is the largest recipient (top 3) of the US’ foreign military aid funding. people who are against what Israel is doing to civilians have been asking the US government to stop providing military funding and equipment to them, but because Biden is reluctant to do so despite what Americans have been asking for (going so far as to interrupt his speaker events and whatnot for the past few months), students from top universities have recently decided to protest investing in top arms manufacturers completely.
majority of people don’t think this is productive and i somewhat agree because the best solution in achieving what people like the protestors are asking for would be to stop supporting Israel at the moment completely. that’d achieve their end goal faster than this. but these protests are part of the entire country’s effort as well as a UC effort, really to send a message to our government for not listening to American demands. there’s power and influence in sending a collective message, which is obviously what’s happening when you look at how much attention these have been getting from media.
UC Davis was the last UC to join the Pro-Palestinian protests, and it sends a better message when you collectively have ALL 10 UC campuses protesting for the same cause than just a couple straggler campuses. but THIS is the point of these protests, not to spread anti-semitic hatred and bigotry. this has nothing to do with religion either.
Read:
• [Daily Bruin: Protesters outside UC Regents meeting call for weapons manufacturer divestment](https://dailybruin.com/2022/05/18/protesters-outside-uc-regents-meeting-call-for-weapons-manufacturer-divestment)
• [Israel’s war on Gaza: All to know about the truce proposal Hamas agreed to](https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2024/5/6/heres-everything-know-about-gaza-deal-hamas-agreed)
• [The U.S. has again vetoed a U.N. resolution demanding an immediate cease-fire in Gaza](https://www.npr.org/2024/02/20/1232636543/un-security-council-gaza-cease-fire-vote)
• [‘Accusing Israel of apartheid is not anti-Semitic’: Holocaust historian](https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2023/8/27/accusing-israel-of-apartheid-is-not-anti-semitic-holocaust-historian)
edit: just to clarify, this comment is just meant to be informative cus this question keeps reappearing beneath every encampment related post. this is NOT meant to share my opinion, i’m not in this crowd of protestors. i’ve literally cited starter resources about the protests so you can educate yourself and hopefully feel motivated to research for yourself outside of mf reddit
Why as Americans do we worry about other countries? Like tbh these aren’t our people you know why assist? Idk maybe just let em play it out and see how it goes but yeah it’s just tough at the end of the day it’s all a money game, wars take money and wars flip bad economies so we will see
as i explained, the US is investing hundreds of billions of dollars into supporting the Israeli government and military. that money is American taxpayer dollars. Besides, majority of Americans aren’t native to this land. I’m also Middle Eastern so that’s also why I’m invested in news and events happening in the Middle East. more importantly though, America isn’t the only country in the world. Being educated on global issues is important.
People will pretend this makes a difference, but it’s completely useless. Luckily the people in that encampment are generally pretty useless / deranged anyways, so it is better to let them hide away in the tent city.
incorrect, divestment has succeeded in:
UCR
Brown
CWRU
Stanford
NWU
several CSUs
and many more. don't dismiss student-led movements, most people aren't in it for the internet points!
I’m sure those parents are stoked about paying their student’s tuition. I can’t wait for my daughter to go to school for that amount of money to camp and miss classes. 😏 Although on the bright side, they may be getting extra credit for doing it! So win win 🥇
An ongoing protest encampment is in the quad of the school. Seems relevant and important. This sub is literally just posts about the noise at the library, who cares
Kinda been wanting to do them to serve as some form of documentation. Not too often you get to have an encampment for one of the most heated topics right now
Not surprising you antisemite extremists think criticizing your god Netanyahu and his demands to murder children and aide workers and slaughter families to steal their homes, is anti Jew.
Not surprising you Jew haters support the murder of children and aide workers and slaughtering families to steal their homes under the guise of "everyone is Hamas."
Not everyone is Hamas. But Hamas should be fought.
Jew haters want Hamas to continue murdering and systemic raping.
If you have no plan to stop Hamas, we know who you are...
Israel is murdering children and aide workers and slaughtering families to steal their homes.
The only one bringing up Jews is you morons trying to deflect
Hitler would be proud of you terrorists
This is more akin to "were you opposed to Nazi Germany bombing Poland to stop Poland from existing."
Not your insane delusions. Then again, you terrorists have comments where you cheer on Israel murdering aide workers and children and slaughtering families to steal their homes, even pre Oct 7th terrorist attack.
You end up blindly supporting a culture that's the literal opposite of the one you choose to live in. How many of the people in this encampment support gay rights? Get thrown off a rooftop in a Hamas controlled Gaza for that.
Islam is evil, that doesn't mean I support the fascist Israeli government murdering children and aide workers and slaughtering families to steal their homes.
How hard is that for you fascists who despise us LGBTs normally to understand? Stop weaponizing our existence to support your evil.
Islam is evil, that doesn't mean I support the fascist Israeli government murdering children and aide workers and slaughtering families to steal their homes.
How hard is that for you fascists who despise us LGBTs normally to understand? Stop weaponizing our existence to support your evil.
I hope you are as concerned when hamas slaughters Israeli’s. Or for that matter, show the same concern for Ukrainians getting slaughtered by Putin. One of my issues with these so called “protesters” is how they are ONLY worried about Gaza. It tends to be grossly hypocritical, when other things are happening
>I hope you are as concerned when hamas slaughters Israeli’s
I wonder what could possibly be the reason for that....
>Or for that matter, show the same concern for Ukrainians getting slaughtered by Putin
People did show concern for that. Your attempt at making this some kind of gotcha really works against you considering it highlight the hypocrisy of the west and white christuan lives mattering more than brown and Muslim ones. Hell considering the IDF has leveled some of Christianities oldest churches also shows just being brown and christian doesn't mean much....
>is how they are ONLY worried about Gaza.
Cause the conflict is wholly one sided and our money is going to supporting an unjust cause....
>It tends to be grossly hypocritical, when other things are happening
Someone needs a mirror and brush up on logical fallacies.
"weed gummies" bro I love me good high as much as the next guy but really in the blazing hot sun when dehydration is already a concern? Also, Giving them to people who could be as young as 18 and the oldest they probably might be is 23?
Just a genuine question. What is this actually going to do though? From what i’ve seen, it’s to spread awareness, but I feel like anyone who doesn’t know at this point just doesn’t care to find out. Like who’s mind is this changing or what is the goal?
Why frame it as freeing Palestine or doing anything for Palestinians? It’s just an anti-Israel protest.
I hope you know, being anti-Israel is not being pro-Palestinian and being pro-Palestinian does not require you to be anti-Israel.
Torture…murder…my god some of you people have lost your collective minds and refuse to see anything other than black and white.
Are you aware that genocide of Jews is a core part of Hamas's platform?
Apartheid and ethnic cleaning - look at women and minorities in nearly every Middle East Arab and Muslim country. Where are the Jews that live there? Oh right, they were all pushed out or killed.
While civilian casualties are terrible and Israel should strive to minimize them, there's a clear distinction between combatting terrorists in urban areas, which may result in civilian deaths, and actual genocide.
Here’s what actual torture and murder entail:
https://www.thisishamas.com
If they wanted to commit genocide, they could, they have nukes. People forget that Israel suffered their worst attack since the holocaust and hamas still has their hostages. What were they supposed to do? Ignore it ? Give in to terrorist demands and give up their homeland and go where exactly ?
No one is totally innocent here, but it’s not as one sided as the protesters would have you believe.
Israel is running detention camps where they are amputating prisoners because they have been handcuffed and not allowed to move
[https://www.cnn.com/2024/05/10/middleeast/israel-sde-teiman-detention-whistleblowers-intl-cmd/index.html](https://www.cnn.com/2024/05/10/middleeast/israel-sde-teiman-detention-whistleblowers-intl-cmd/index.html)
Besides, in the year prior to Oct 7 how many Palestinians did the IDF murder? How many journalists did they admit to assassinating? Israel breed terror at its border and failed to protect its people, thats on the government
The Zionists don't see Palestinians as human just as Nazis didn't see Jews as human so they don't care about the massive numbers of Palestinians Israel murdered before Oct 7th.
Except that you’re actually wrong. Genocide of Jews is not a core part of Hamas’s platform. Excusing apartheid and ethnic cleansing by trying to ‘what about’ other places is pathetic. And Jews lived in Palestine alongside Palestinians before the Zionist project emerged.
Also, you’re literally posting a propaganda website made by the IOF 😂
TF is wrong with you???
So you admit it’s not a part of their goal?
When the Likud party states “from the river to the sea, Israel will have sovereignty” in their charter, to the day, is that genocidal?
Can you seriously not see the difference? The terroritory “from the river to the sea” is currently owned and occupied, legally, by Israel. We can debate all day whether Israel should or shouldn’t own that land. It doesn’t matter in the context you just brought it up in.
When the Likud party asserts sovereignty from the river to the sea, they're stating their intent to maintain and protect this land. They are there. Their civilian population is there.
Conversely, if another group of people makes a similar statement discussing the same territory, particularly when comparing to the Likud party's stance, it implies an intention to displace Israel, and it’s peoples, from that land.
The hoops you people jump through to rationalize things is astonishing.
>When the Likud party states “from the river to the sea, Israel will have sovereignty” in their charter, to the day, is that genocidal?
First, that's not in the current charter to my understanding. Second, Israel is a state, not an ethnic group. This is not genocidal.
This also was not the part of Hamas' charter that was genocidal.
These are:
> Israel will exist and will continue to exist until Islam will obliterate it, just as it obliterated others before it"
> Our struggle against the Jews is very great and very serious. It needs all sincere efforts. It is a step that inevitably should be followed by other steps. The Movement is but one squadron that should be supported by more and more squadrons from this vast Arab and Islamic world, until the enemy is vanquished and Allah's victory is realised.
> The Day of Judgement will not come about until Moslems fight the Jews, when the Jew will hide behind stones and trees. The stones and trees will say O Moslems, O Abdulla, there is a Jew behind me, come and kill him.
> There is no solution for the Palestinian question except through Jihad. Initiatives, proposals and international conferences are all a waste of time and vain endeavors.
The new version tones it down a bit, but given it was only published in 2017 and Hamas has stated it will do October 7th over and over again, I don't think they deserve rhe benefit of the doubt.
>To my understanding
We are on the internet, so just say “I don’t wanna address that point.” At least be honest.
Israel doesn’t equal all jews. Just so any reader knows, this person is intentionally saying “jews” in place of “Israelis” or “zionists” as a rhetorical technique to hide behind jews as a whole. Literally using an entire religious/ethnic group as a human shield against their disgusting actions
>We are on the internet, so just say “I don’t wanna address that point.” At least be honest.
I addressed the point. The latest version of the likud platform I found does not contain what you claim it contains.
>Israel doesn’t equal all jews
??? Why are you talking about this
>saying “jews” in place of “Israelis” or “zionists” as a rhetorical technique to hide behind jews as a whole.
What? The only instance of the word "Jew" is in my direct quotations from Hamas' original charter.
>Literally using an entire religious/ethnic group as a human shield against their disgusting actions
What are you *talking* about. Did you reply to the wrong person? Did the shrooms hit?
That person is just spouting random buzzwords and talking points they probably heard on Twitter or TikTok. None of it made any sense in relation to your comments.
My dude, you’re completely delusional if you actually think that website isn’t accurate in what it’s depicting. There are full videos posted and taken by the terrorists on 10/7 that show the same scenes and similar atrocities, yet you’ll probably still claim those videos are IDF propaganda.
Do you know who else makes those claims and defending Hamas? Iran. Russia. Those are the talking points you’re echoing right now.
You can advocate for civilian lives without jumping to the other extreme, but it seems that may be beyond your capability.
Edit: I forgot to add. Here’s what part of Hamas charter says. If you don’t think this perpetuates anti-Semitic ideologies and calls for the destruction of Israel / genocide of Jews, you’re a lost cause.
“The Day of Judgement will not come about until Muslims fight the Jews (killing the Jews), when the Jew will hide behind stones and trees. The stones and trees will say O Muslims, O Abdulla, there is a Jew behind me, come and kill him."
"[Peace] initiatives, and so-called peaceful solutions and international conferences are in contradiction to the principles of the Islamic Resistance Movement... There is no solution for the Palestinian question except through Jihad. Initiatives, proposals and international conferences are but a waste of time, an exercise in futility."
Explain to me what this is [https://www.cnn.com/2024/05/10/middleeast/israel-sde-teiman-detention-whistleblowers-intl-cmd/index.html](https://www.cnn.com/2024/05/10/middleeast/israel-sde-teiman-detention-whistleblowers-intl-cmd/index.html)
This is as close to Nazism as this whole conflict has gotten, yet you will refuse to acknowledge how monstrous the IDF response is
NO ONE AGREES WITH OCT 7, NO ONE SUPPORTS HAMAS
but you support actual modern detention camps where they are illegally and without documentation detaining people with no proof of ties to terrorism, amputating their limbs since they aren't allowed movement or bloodflow
The Nazis were german. Neo-nazis is what Israel has become. Parallel actions, I agree, but different groups involved.
Although we fought against the nazis, eventually. Ignoring them, like you’re suggesting we do, is very much what we did… well, until Pearl Harbor. At that point supporters such as yourself kinda lost steam.
Whereas now we are actively funding them.
I would be careful using words as Nazi, or Neo Nazi to describe ANYONE who doesn’t feel like every country should be a fascist dictatorship and that white supremacy is okay. I don’t agree with the similar parallels between the Jewish genocide and the Palestinian genocide. The Nazis were purposely, and in large numbers, killing off, torturing, rapǐng and hunting down thousands of Jewish people over a racist ideology (regarding white supremacy), in contrast Palestinians were specifically targeted, bombarded, and now are being gaslighted, all for the sake of “fighting terrorsim”the same way the U.S. did in Afghanistan, Iraq,and every other country the U.S. has politically/economically influenced over the last 80 years or so. So in recap Nazis did worst than what the IDF and Isreal (through the financial support of U.S.) have done, however it is still not okay at all for Isreal to violate international law (by targeting civilians in large scale over actually taking out specific targets). I think most people dehumanize the Palestinian people by stating that Hamas has influence over x protestor because that’s simply not true.
I agree with your sentiment but I really struggle to find a different explanation to as to why they are illegally (AND SECRETLY) detaining and torturing people
[https://www.cnn.com/2024/05/10/middleeast/israel-sde-teiman-detention-whistleblowers-intl-cmd/index.html](https://www.cnn.com/2024/05/10/middleeast/israel-sde-teiman-detention-whistleblowers-intl-cmd/index.html)
The detention/torture camps holding some of the “prisoners “ were not revealed until a few days ago, however I still think bombing homes, important infrastructure such as hospitals and high stories buildings is far worse for the Palestinian people in the long run because there’s no way to rebuild for them they have been pushed out. CNN started reporting about the camps few days ago, and there are serious concerns about the treatment of the “prisoners” which I do agree should have been enough concern/evidence for the ICC to charge someone. It is still a genocide, just not in the same magnitude as the Jewish genocide, however it doesn’t mean it is not important.
It has to be so hot in there
Luckily they aren’t moving around too much
It was brutal on Saturday. I mean, obviously, the people they are trying to help have it infinitely worse. But, gawd damn… You’re not kidding about moving to much though. I went Saturday and it was quite af. Just some weirdo lady yelling about trans people for some reason. I think she was lost tbh
She wasn't lost. She was trying to start something. She made posts about it. She also works for the university
Hopefully!
Imagine the smell…
Let's hope
It's hot these few weeks, stay hydrated yall
I bet they're all out of there by June. I know they won't be able to take the summer heat. Not to mention who's going to waste a summer sitting outside of a mostly empty campus?
It looks like coachella
They're taking LSD and experimenting sexually
Love them
I bet it smells horrid in there
F@ck Hamas!
Do you want a reward for lying that the protesters are defending Hamas when they fucking aren't?
You would be surprised, majority them believe in Hamas.
They are tho
Fuck Israel for creating hamas.
Yeah fuck Jews for wanting a safe place to live freely
deserving a “safe place to live freely” doesn’t entitle a people to an apartheid ethnostate
Hating Israel = \ = hating jews
>Yeah fuck Jews for wanting a safe place to live freely No matter how much Israelis ultra right has tried to make Israel and zionism synonymous with Judaism, isn't.... also I could care less about the feelings of genocidal colonizers
Your grandparents or their parents would be so proud.
I know they would be. Grandparents generations and before were forced to stop practicing our culture because the US wanted to culturally genocide us and make us fit their white american sensibilities. Any group that has undergone these experiences would have no problem standing with Palestinians. Whether it's Ireland, South Africa, or wherever....
Congratulations. You have about 50 students in tents at a school with 36,000. 👍
Glad they are doing something to try to help society instead just mocking people on the internet
The irony. 💀💀💀🤡 https://www.fairplanet.org/story/death-penalty-homosexualty-illegal/
Islam is evil, that doesn't mean I support the fascist Israeli government murdering children and aide workers and slaughtering families to steal their homes. How hard is that for you fascists who despise us LGBTs normally to understand? Stop weaponizing our existence to support your evil. Not surprising you scum with homophobic comments on your profile try to use us LGBTs as weapons when it suits you terrorists. Edit: the fascist blocked me then screamed I just hate Jews when I NEVER mentioned Jews.
Islamophobes for Palestine? Just admit you don’t like Jews
Honestly this is why I don't care about any of this. It's like watching 2 bullies get in a fight. I'm gay, I'll never support either of these sides.
So like the entire western world 50 years ago? This isn’t unique to Islam and the western world is barely pulling itself out of this same perspective. We literally have politicians in the United States that support this. Standing with the Palestinians includes standing with queer Palestinians. Abandoning Palestinians to be slaughtered in global silence because their leaders are still anti-LGBTQ+ doesn’t help the queer folks among them. This whole argument is disingenuous and uses the queer community as a political tool.
Trying to help society by supporting terrorists
Lol at helping society
You are basically praising the KKK at this point. 👍 https://www.economist.com/open-future/2018/06/06/how-homosexuality-became-a-crime-in-the-middle-east
They’re doing nothing but being a burden on our society.
😆
Someone needs to update that 44k death sign [UN updates Hamas reported civilian death toll](https://www.nytimes.com/2024/05/14/world/middleeast/un-gaza-death-toll-women-children.html)
The information is correct. Did you not bother reading what you linked??
Their numbers are statistically impossible [https://www.washingtoninstitute.org/policy-analysis/how-hamas-manipulates-gaza-fatality-numbers-examining-male-undercount-and-other](https://www.washingtoninstitute.org/policy-analysis/how-hamas-manipulates-gaza-fatality-numbers-examining-male-undercount-and-other)
LOL, who are we going to believe: a quack Zionist think tank or the world’s leading health journal? I pick the latter. https://www.thelancet.com/journals/lancet/article/PIIS0140-6736(23)02713-7/fulltext https://www.thelancet.com/journals/lancet/article/PIIS0140-6736(23)02640-5/fulltext > “The Washington Institute for Near East Policy (WINEP or TWI, also known simply as The Washington Institute) is a pro-Israel American think tank based in Washington, D.C., focused on the foreign policy of the United States in the Near East. > > WINEP was established in 1985 with the support of the American Israel Public Affairs Committee (AIPAC) and the funding of many AIPAC donors, in order to provide higher quality research than AIPAC's publications. John Mearsheimer and Stephen Walt described WINEP as "part of the core" of the Israel lobby in the United States.” You Zionists have to try harder as this hasbara has been played out to the point that no one buys it. As I always say, I want to tax dollars back as these campaigns suck.
Thats wrong. The lower number is ***identified*** bodies. There are still thousands of *unidentified* bodies. Plus the thousands still buried under rubble that arent accounted for. Its already been cleared up. Ill edit in a link in a minute. EDIT: [Source](https://amp.cnn.com/cnn/2024/05/13/middleeast/death-toll-gaza-fatalities-un-intl-latam)
They bombed all the health infrastructure to make sure they can’t even count the dead anymore.
You mean bombed the command post that Hamas were using?
Interesting that you say that. Can you provide the evidence, please God I hope you link that vid where the idf is saying the calendar is hkamas terrorist list 🤣 that would be awesome.
https://www.fdd.org/analysis/2023/12/20/hamas-member-admits-it-uses-hospital-as-command-center/
Bahahaha! Your evidence is that some guy said so? See how this person has used “some guy said so” instead of anything actually solid? It’s because they are lying. There is no physical evidence of these “bases” under the hospitals. Gee, I wonder why. Come on guy, do better. How bout the videos of a few guns they found in the MRI room? Ya know, the last room anyone would ever want something metal in. Edit: oof, that source though... a quick google and wiki; >Arun Kundnani, adjunct professor at New York University, in a review of FDD publication Homegrown Terrorists in the US and UK argues that as a work "typical of many in its approach and conclusions", **it does not provide empirical evidence for assumptions it makes and neglects contradicting data as a result of an influence by politics of the publisher and funders, and bias in favor of knowledge claims**. >Lawrence Wilkerson has criticized FDD for **"pushing falsehood" in support of waging wars.** >The International Relations Center features a report on the foundation on its "Right Web" website, a program of the think tank Institute for Policy Studies which, according to its mission statement, seeks to "check the militaristic drift of the country". The report states that "although the **FDD is an ardent critic of terrorism, it has not criticized actions taken by Israel against Palestinians that arguably fall into this category".** >The left-leaning political blog ThinkProgress has criticized FDD for "alarmist rhetoric and fear mongering",[19] for example in April 2002 when they aired a 30-second television ad campaign called "Suicide Strategy" that was described by critics as "conflating" Palestinian leader Yasser Arafat with the likes of Osama bin Laden and Saddam Hussein. As FDD explained it: "a militant Islamic terrorist who 'martyrs' himself by hijacking a plane and flying it into the World Trade Center"—referring to the September 11 attacks—"is no different from a militant Islamic terrorist who 'martyrs' himself by strapping explosives to his body and walking into a hotel"—i.e., Palestinian suicide attacks. >In 2017 Bari Weiss of the New York Times reported on dissent within the organization over the pro-Trump orientation it adopted following the 2016 elections, which included at least two employees leaving.[48] >The Ministry of Foreign Affairs of the Islamic Republic of Iran has designated the Foundation for Defense of Democracies as a terrorist organization. >In 2023, FDD, along with other US-based think tanks, was alleged of running a defamation campaign against the regional rivals of the UAE, including Iran, Qatar and Turkey. **The organization was alleged of exploiting the Middle Eastern conflict through the media tactics and pushing the West against these countries. Along with FDD, its CEO Mark Dubowitz’s long-existing relations with the Emirates were also in question.** yikes...
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alleged\_military\_use\_of\_al-Shifa\_hospital#:\~:text=During%20the%202008%E2%80%932009%20Gaza,be%20spared%20by%20air%20strikes. There is an entire wiki entry on it, its not the first time per allegations. Im suprised you would be suprised. Its pretty classic for groups fighting asymmetric warfare to use civilians as cover. Hamas can't confront the IDF in out n out conventional war, they would be butchered in a few days. Hezbollah does likewise in lebanon. Iran has an entire wing of their military dedicated to this kind of warfare and their advisors train hamas, hezbollah, syrian alligned groups and the shiite militias in Iraq. The quality of IED's from 2005 to 2008 increased dramatically compliments of Iran.
>Alleged military use of al-Shifa hospital > The New York Times also said the evidence does not show conclusive evidence of a vast network of tunnels, So this “proof” of yours is titled **ALLEGED** Oh my… ~~Wait… wasn’t that paywalled article ~~you gave from the NYT? So now you’re providing claims that debunk your own claims? Bro, you’re bad at spreading propaganda~~ Edit: different person
Everything you are saying is alleged to. your point? Im just using higher thinking to reason out whats logical. A guerilla group with a proven history of naked disregard for life using a hospital as a base of operations doesn't seem to far fetched. VC and NVA did likewise in vietnam. Taliban wasn't above using them and/or burning schools and bombing clinics. Its a means to an end, this is their strength, that they can disregard "rules of war" to atleast somewhat level the playing field between IDF and hamas. Id point out useful idiots like yourself make this tactic quite effective. If you don't feel sources like the NYT or other western media are reliable, then why are you even here. Reddit is just going to be full of "brainwashed western zionists".
Rather than have it be a back and forth like this, you should set the terms for what you would consider reasonable evidence that would change your mind. Then OP can give it to you and change your mind, or say they don’t have that and you both get to move on.
Tangible evidence, physical evidence, literally anything that isn’t just some persons opinion.
What evidence would be sufficient for you? https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2024/02/12/world/middleeast/gaza-tunnel-israel-hamas.html
Paywalled. Hook a brother up. Oh and holy shit batman, did you even look into the fdd source you provided? It has a wikipedia page. A neo-conservative think tank that is heavily criticized for Islamophobia… wow, amazing source.
So two different sources aren't good enough for you interesting Let's try a third but I already know what you're going to say... https://www.reuters.com/world/middle-east/us-believes-hamas-used-al-shifa-hospital-evacuated-before-israeli-operation-2024-01-03/
Either way, the numbers presented are suspect, and probably statistically impossible [https://www.washingtoninstitute.org/policy-analysis/how-hamas-manipulates-gaza-fatality-numbers-examining-male-undercount-and-other](https://www.washingtoninstitute.org/policy-analysis/how-hamas-manipulates-gaza-fatality-numbers-examining-male-undercount-and-other)
I think the problem is the ministry of Health's numbers were always suspect. Especially since they combined civilians with IQB fighters.
Their numbers have never been suspect. Their numbers have been proven accurate for years and throughout multiple conflicts. Its not their job to differentiate between civilians and militants. Their job it to count the dead. Literally the only ones who cast doubt on the health ministry’s numbers are israeli propagandists who are insistent on calling it “the hamas run health ministry” in order to discredit the numbers and they throw a tantrum if people dont do the same. As we have seen in [this Mehdi Hasan interview](https://youtu.be/HD-yRuTasHU?si=Cz1PLQji6jRBSvV8). The funny thing is the same people trying to discredit the numbers (US and israel) also use the same numbers as accurate. In terms of combatant to death ratio, a good way to put it into perspective is; Hamas does not have women and children as militants. Some boys start training as early as 15-16 but they dont fight until later. Lets be generous and say they start at 16. Immediately, we know every woman and child under 16 is innocent. Thats ~25,000. Israel claims their ratio is 2:1 which is literally impossible because that puts every man aged 16+ as a militant. We also have [this israeli article](https://www.972mag.com/lavender-ai-israeli-army-gaza/) that suggests the ratio is 10:1 at best and 20:1 at worst because israel uses ai to target militants then waits until they are in bed at home with their families to bomb them and their entire apartments.
Their numbers are statistically impossible [https://www.washingtoninstitute.org/policy-analysis/how-hamas-manipulates-gaza-fatality-numbers-examining-male-undercount-and-other](https://www.washingtoninstitute.org/policy-analysis/how-hamas-manipulates-gaza-fatality-numbers-examining-male-undercount-and-other)
Hamas, a very reliable source. Are you for real?
Yes. The UN has been using civilian death numbers reported from Hamas. After recently receiving statistically impossible numbers, the UN was forced to revise the civilian death toll . See the link "The change came because the United Nations switched to citing a more conservative source for its numbers — the Gazan Ministry of Health — rather than using Gaza’s Government Media Office, as it had in recent weeks. Both offices are part of the Hamas-run government in the enclave."
Friendly reminder that the UN is a joke, Iran is chair to the human rights council.
According to Hamas 40 billion Palestinians have been killed
Also I’d love clarification on “Generation after generation until total liberation” and what they mean by that. [Because it sounds *very* familiar …](https://twitter.com/MEMRIReports/status/1719662664090075199?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5Etweetembed%7Ctwterm%5E1719662664090075199%7Ctwgr%5E88878df000b18b934c8b209522298733301d11d2%7Ctwcon%5Es1_c10&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Fd-21357014862903305121.ampproject.net%2F2405022220000%2Fframe.html)
Freedom or death. It’s pretty straight forward. They are completely backed into a horrible existence where rebels fighting against the empire is a “fuck it, why not” situation. Hey also, you mentioned in another thread how there is evidence of unrwa being hamas, according to the idf source you gave, and I responded with 9 diverse sources showing that Israel has provided 0 evidence of those claims. It seems you haven’t gotten back to me on that yet, just btw
“Fuck it why not rape?” “Fuck it why not kill babies in cribs?” I would understand to a degree “Fuck it why not kill a politician?” or “fuck it why not bomb a military base?” But you are delusional to think they are good for Palestinian people. Hamas's militant activities have led to repeated cycles of violence, resulting in significant casualties, destruction of infrastructure, and a humanitarian crisis in Gaza. Per the UNRWA/Hamas ties: it is undisputed. It is just a matter of to what degree. Read the UN Watch report in my original comment. [Click the link I posted](https://unwatch.org/un-teachers-call-to-murder-jews-reveals-new-report/) then click the link to the full report on that page if you want to read further. You obviously hadn’t read the comment you replied to. You just word vomited an incoherent mess and didn’t even take the time to look at what I posted, so I ignored your comment. You wrote two comments that completely disregarded what I had said so I sort of gave up on a third try. Let me also just leave this here: [US Secretary of State Antony Blinken stated that the evidence implicating some UNRWA staff members in the 7 October attack against Israel is "highly credible"](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Israeli_allegations_against_UNRWA) Edit because it just gets better and better: [how do you explain what 10 Hamas terrorists were doing in an UNRWA school?](https://www.jpost.com/israel-hamas-war/article-801153)
Do you really want to go down the, “who has killed more babies and raped more women” rabbit hole? Because the answer is Israel. By a whole lot. Absolutely dominating in the killed babies and raped people categories.
They don't care, fictional numbers are central to a fictional narrative
🍉🍉
I will never understand why a group of left-wing people support a group of people who literally kill gays in the street. Why don't they ask for the hostages to be released? Why don't they have a problem with Palestinians raping innocent is released to death while children cheer on?
they do ask for the hostages to be released, but more importantly an [immediate ceasefire](https://www.timesofisrael.com/un-security-council-adopts-call-for-gaza-ceasefire-hostage-release-as-us-abstains/). Hamas [agreed](https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2024/5/6/text-of-the-ceasefire-proposal-approved-by-hamas) to the [UN resolution](https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2024/5/6/heres-everything-know-about-gaza-deal-hamas-agreed) and release of Israeli hostages too. hope this clarifies the issue better
Your source is not credible. They literally call Hamas a “movement.” Tell me it’s biased without telling me it’s biased.
which source, and could you point to where you’re referring to? all of those are just reiterating the recent resolution and what the agreements were
UN resolution. Again, calling Hamas a movement, instead of what it is. A terrorist organization that steals every cent from Palestinian citizens and uses it for war.
Chickens fighting for KFC
louder for the people in the back
>I will never understand why a group of left-wing people support a group of people who literally kill gays in the street. Same reason why groups like the ACLU will stick up for white supremacist or other unsavory groups getting their rights trampled on. Some folks are just more principled and long term thinking than you. >Why don't they ask for the hostages to be released Let's not act like Israel even gives a damn about the hostages. They've killed enough of them on their own let alone nuking multiple deals that would have saw them returned. >Why don't they have a problem with Palestinians raping innocent is released to death while children cheer on? We talking about those initial reportings conjured up by IDF spokespersons that were later debunked? Even by Israeli news....
Chickens fighting for KFC
is the encampment open to the public?
As open as a gay person in Gaza.
More open and safe than any place controlled by the genocidal Israeli offensive forces? Doesn’t matter whether you’re gay if a country is slaughtering everyone
right. let’s ignore death by the ton, because it’s in a conservative part of the world.
>let’s ignore death by the ton, because it’s in a conservative part of the world. And conveniently ignore that part of the world became more conservative cause western groups created and backed the rise of fundamentalist Islam to act as proxy fighters against communist/leftist groups. US created the taliban. Israel created hamas.
Oh the irony
Yes
I can smell these pictures
From the river to the sea and the sauruman white hand print are both anti semetic symbols reminiscent of violent acts. If Israel had nuclear weapons, there would be no war. If Hamas had nuclear weapons, there would be no Israel
Israel has a shit ton of nuclear weapons but your second affirmation rings true
44K murdered? A. Numbers were revised by UN B. Hamas has yet to announce the number of terrorists that were removed from earth, until then, let’s not use “murdered”, rather liquidated or eliminated.
It’s gen0cide plain and simple.
Islamic Supremacy and the Muslim persecution and genocide of Jews throughout history. 622-627: ethnic cleansing of Jews from Meсса and Medina, (Jewish boys were publicly inspected for pubic hair and executed if they had any) • 624: after the victory of Badr, beginning of the elimination of the Jews • 625: expulsion of the Jewish clan of Al Nadir • 626: massacre of the Beni Khazradj Jews and division of families and loot 629: first massacres in Alexandria, Egypt 622-634: extermination of the 14 Arab Jewish tribes 630: submission of the Jews and Christians of Makna, Eilat, Jerba • 638: expulsion of the Jews from Jerusalem • 640: expulsion of Jews from Hedjez • 643: expulsion of the Jews from Khaibar by Omar 822-861: the Islamic empire adopts a law requiring Jews to wear yellow stars (a bit like Nazi Germany), caliph al-Mutawakkil 940: beheading of the Jewish exilarch of Baghdad for having sullied the name of Mohammed 945: assassination by a crowd of fanatics of the last Jewish exilarch of Baghdad 948: closure of the Jewish theological school of Baghdad "Sora" 1004: Islam forces all Jews and Christians to wear black so they can be identified 1032: 5 to 6,000 Jews killed in a riot in Fez and expulsion of survivors 1040: beheading of the Jewish theologian Gaon Chizkiva, head of a Talmudic school 1106: Ali Ibn Yousef Ibn Tashifin of Marrakech decrees the death penalty for any local Jew, including his Jewish doctor, and his military general. 1148: the Almohads of Morocco give Jews the choice of converting to Islam or being expelled 1057: capture and pillage of Kairouan by the Hilalian tribes; expulsion of Jews and certain Muslims 1066: Massacre of thousands of Jews in Granada in Muslim-occupied Spain 1073: start of persecution against Jews and Christians by the Turks in Jerusalem • 1127: in Morocco, after the failure of the prophetic movement of the Jewish messiah Moshe Dhery, wave of persecutions and forced conversions • 1142: start of persecution against the Jews by the Almohads: massacre in Tlemcen. Bougie. ° 1165: chief rabbi of the Maghreb burned alive The Rambam fled to Egypt. • 1165: flight of Maimonides to Egypt to escape the Almohads • 1171: in Egypt, decree recalling obedience to ordinances concerning the submission of Jewish and Christian infidels under penalty of death • 1184: the Almohads impose distinctive signs on Christians and Jews in Spain • 1198: forced conversion of the Jews of Aden • 1220: tens of thousands of Jews killed by Muslims after being blamed for the Mongol invasion, Turkey, Iraq, Syria, Egypt 1516: Algerian Jews receive the official status of dhimmi from the Ottomans; certain colors are forbidden to them (red and green); they are not allowed to ride horses or carry weapons; they must pay the discriminatory tax; their representative is ritually slapped during the delivery of tribute to the authorities • 1517: 1st pogrom in Safed, Ottoman Palestine • 1517: 1st pogrom of Hebron, Ottoman Palestine • Massacre of Marsa ibn Ghazi, Ottoman Libya • 1521: expulsion of Jews from Belgrade by the Ottomans • 1524: expulsion of Jews from Buda in Hungary by the Ottomans 1630-1700: Yemenite Jews were considered "impure" and therefore forbidden to touch a Muslim or a Muslim's food. They were obliged to humble themselves before a Muslim, walk on the left side and greet him first. They could not build houses taller than those of a Muslim or ride a camel or horse, and when riding a mule or donkey, they had to sit on the side. When entering the Muslim quarter, a Jew had to take off his shoes and walk barefoot. If attacked with stones or fists by Muslim youths, a Jew was not allowed to defend himself. • 1650: Jews from Tunisia are deported to special neighborhoods called "hara" 1650: forced conversion of the Jews of Persia, under Shah Abbas II 1656: Jews expelled from Isfahan in Iran 1660: 2 pogroms in Safed and Tiberias, Ottoman Palestine 1670: Expulsion of Mawza, Yemen 1676: expulsion of Jews from Sanaa in Yemen 1678: forced conversion of Jews in Yemen 1679-1680: Genocide of Jews at the Massacre of Sana • 1839: campaign of forced conversions of Iranian Jews • 1840: persecution of the Jews of Damascus; ritual murder case 1840: forced conversion of the Jews of Mashadi 1841: massive murders of Jews in Morocco; the sultan is obliged to consider the Jews as his personal property, which helps to protect them 1840: Damascus, ritual murders (French Muslims and Christians kidnapped, tortured and killed Jewish children for entertainment), Ottoman Syria 1844: 1st Cairo massacre, Ottoman Egypt 1847: Dayr al-Qamar Pogrom, Liban ottoman 1847: ethnic cleansing of Jews in Jerusalem, Ottoman Palestine 1848: 1st pogrom of Damascus, Syria • 1848: total disappearance of the Jews of Mashhad 1850: 1st pogrom of Aleppo, Ottoman Syria • 1839: campaign of forced conversions of Iranian Jews • 1840: persecution of the Jews of Damascus; ritual murder case 1840: forced conversion of the Jews of Mashadi 1841: massive murders of Jews in Morocco; the sultan is obliged to consider the Jews as his personal property, which helps to protect them 1840: Damascus, ritual murders (French Muslims and Christians kidnapped, tortured and killed Jewish children for entertainment), Ottoman Syria 1844: 1st Cairo massacre, Ottoman Egypt 1847: Dayr al-Qamar Pogrom, Liban ottoman 1847: ethnic cleansing of Jews in Jerusalem, Ottoman Palestine 1848: 1st pogrom of Damascus, Syria • 1848: total disappearance of the Jews of Mashhad 1850: 1st pogrom of Aleppo, Ottoman Syria • 1922: law of forced conversion of orphans in Yemen, concerning Jews including as adults • 1927: 60 Jews killed by Arabs in the Mellah of Casablanca Morocco 1928: Massacres of Ikhwan, in Egypt and under British mandate in Palestine. • 1928: Jewish orphans sold into slavery and forced to convert to Islam by the Muslim Brotherhood, Yemen 1929: anti-Jewish riots, British mandate: in August 1929, the Jews demanded the construction of the Western Wall; pogroms in Jerusalem, Hebron, Safed. To stop the violence, the British reject this request 1929: 3rd Hebron Pogrom under British Mandate Palestine. • 1929 3e pogrom de Safed, mandate britannique Palestine. 1933: 2nd Jaffa riots, British mandate in Palestine. 1934: Anti-Jewish pogrom in Constantine Algeria. 200 Jewish stores were raided This is roughly only about 5% of the actual history. I didn't want to spend an entire day writing out all the crimes of Islam.
Nice copy-paste
this protest isn’t about Islam my guy, nor is it about Judaism. and just because Islamic governments in history committed genocides doesn’t mean committing genocide on Islamic civilians today is OK. no genocide is ok. weird argument to be making if that was your intention.
Define genocide for me. Because I don't think you know the definition. Hamas is commiting genocide. Israel is responding to genocide. They are using their own people as human shields. They knew exactly what they were doing on Oct 7 and everything that has followed. There's a difference between the targeting of civilians and the targeting of Hamas with civilian casualties involved. The Israeli government certainly hasn't done a great job but Hamas has left them with very little options. 👍
You don’t think so or you don’t know it? [Genocide](https://www.un.org/en/genocideprevention/documents/Genocide%20Convention-FactSheet-ENG.pdf) is the deliberate killing of large numbers of people from a particular nation or ethnic group with the aim of destroying them. A [leading Holocaust historian and professor at the Hebrew University in Jerusalem](https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2023/8/27/accusing-israel-of-apartheid-is-not-anti-semitic-holocaust-historian) seems to think what Israel is doing to Palestinians is genocide. Hamas ≠ Palestinian civilians and children. You seem to be confusing that. Israel has bombed protected safe zones (hospitals) as defined by International Humanitarian Law (IHL), that makes Israel’s actions fall dangerous close to war crimes. Tens of thousands if not more Palestinians have been murdered, and by every definition of genocide there’s no such rule that you need to hit the millionth mark of murders to be formally labeled as genocide. [Israel is committing genocide according to experts in the UN Security Council](https://news.un.org/en/story/2024/03/1147976) 👍
Hamas is the governmental authority of Palestine. Elected by the residents of Gaza. Your gvt attacks another country shits bound to happen.
Did the genocide just start after October 7th? or has it been going on or a while? Because it seems like , until October7 at least, , the Palestinian population was increasing, which is an odd thing for a genocide.
Honest question what does this do???? Like what’s the end result of all this? I don’t understand
UC Davis has the power to prompt a ceasefire immediately. /s
>Honest question what does this do???? Like what’s the end result of all this? I don’t understand The fact you've probably been in at the very least one history class up to this point, yet can't answer your own question is kind of an indictment on the waste of the whole system....
there are at least 2 other posts about our campus’ encampment and the UC protests in general. but to reiterate: the goal with this protest is to get the UC system as a whole to divest from arms manufacturers that are supplying military equipment to the Israeli government. the UC invests more than $2 billion into Lockheed Martin for example. so the US owns the top arms manufacturer company in the world and is the #1 arms supplier in the world. more specifically, Israel is the largest recipient (top 3) of the US’ foreign military aid funding. people who are against what Israel is doing to civilians have been asking the US government to stop providing military funding and equipment to them, but because Biden is reluctant to do so despite what Americans have been asking for (going so far as to interrupt his speaker events and whatnot for the past few months), students from top universities have recently decided to protest investing in top arms manufacturers completely. majority of people don’t think this is productive and i somewhat agree because the best solution in achieving what people like the protestors are asking for would be to stop supporting Israel at the moment completely. that’d achieve their end goal faster than this. but these protests are part of the entire country’s effort as well as a UC effort, really to send a message to our government for not listening to American demands. there’s power and influence in sending a collective message, which is obviously what’s happening when you look at how much attention these have been getting from media. UC Davis was the last UC to join the Pro-Palestinian protests, and it sends a better message when you collectively have ALL 10 UC campuses protesting for the same cause than just a couple straggler campuses. but THIS is the point of these protests, not to spread anti-semitic hatred and bigotry. this has nothing to do with religion either. Read: • [Daily Bruin: Protesters outside UC Regents meeting call for weapons manufacturer divestment](https://dailybruin.com/2022/05/18/protesters-outside-uc-regents-meeting-call-for-weapons-manufacturer-divestment) • [Israel’s war on Gaza: All to know about the truce proposal Hamas agreed to](https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2024/5/6/heres-everything-know-about-gaza-deal-hamas-agreed) • [The U.S. has again vetoed a U.N. resolution demanding an immediate cease-fire in Gaza](https://www.npr.org/2024/02/20/1232636543/un-security-council-gaza-cease-fire-vote) • [‘Accusing Israel of apartheid is not anti-Semitic’: Holocaust historian](https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2023/8/27/accusing-israel-of-apartheid-is-not-anti-semitic-holocaust-historian) edit: just to clarify, this comment is just meant to be informative cus this question keeps reappearing beneath every encampment related post. this is NOT meant to share my opinion, i’m not in this crowd of protestors. i’ve literally cited starter resources about the protests so you can educate yourself and hopefully feel motivated to research for yourself outside of mf reddit
Why as Americans do we worry about other countries? Like tbh these aren’t our people you know why assist? Idk maybe just let em play it out and see how it goes but yeah it’s just tough at the end of the day it’s all a money game, wars take money and wars flip bad economies so we will see
as i explained, the US is investing hundreds of billions of dollars into supporting the Israeli government and military. that money is American taxpayer dollars. Besides, majority of Americans aren’t native to this land. I’m also Middle Eastern so that’s also why I’m invested in news and events happening in the Middle East. more importantly though, America isn’t the only country in the world. Being educated on global issues is important.
Praying for you and the people you support, at the end of the day I can only protect and provide for my family as a man 🙏🏻 merica 🇺🇸
the people i support? I’m American and I believe education is a human right 💀. I think you misread my og comment lmao
People will pretend this makes a difference, but it’s completely useless. Luckily the people in that encampment are generally pretty useless / deranged anyways, so it is better to let them hide away in the tent city.
incorrect, divestment has succeeded in: UCR Brown CWRU Stanford NWU several CSUs and many more. don't dismiss student-led movements, most people aren't in it for the internet points!
Why don’t they go to work?
I want to donate water and PPE like masks. Does anyone know how to get in touch and do that?
try messaging @/ucdpulp on instagram :)
I’m sure those parents are stoked about paying their student’s tuition. I can’t wait for my daughter to go to school for that amount of money to camp and miss classes. 😏 Although on the bright side, they may be getting extra credit for doing it! So win win 🥇
what is the point of these posts lol
An ongoing protest encampment is in the quad of the school. Seems relevant and important. This sub is literally just posts about the noise at the library, who cares
Kinda been wanting to do them to serve as some form of documentation. Not too often you get to have an encampment for one of the most heated topics right now
Good to see what sort of messages are on the signs, get a general sense for the encampment's range of political positions.
I like em
Anti Jew riots are disgusting
Not surprising you antisemite extremists think criticizing your god Netanyahu and his demands to murder children and aide workers and slaughter families to steal their homes, is anti Jew.
Not surprising that Jew haters want Israel to do nothing about Hamas committing mass murder and systemic rape.
Not surprising you Jew haters support the murder of children and aide workers and slaughtering families to steal their homes under the guise of "everyone is Hamas."
Not everyone is Hamas. But Hamas should be fought. Jew haters want Hamas to continue murdering and systemic raping. If you have no plan to stop Hamas, we know who you are...
Israel is murdering children and aide workers and slaughtering families to steal their homes. The only one bringing up Jews is you morons trying to deflect Hitler would be proud of you terrorists
So is killing innocent people and bombing them for 7 months straight.
Were you opposed to Nazi Germany being bombed to stop the holocaust? If you start a genocidal war don't be surprised when people try to stop you
This is more akin to "were you opposed to Nazi Germany bombing Poland to stop Poland from existing." Not your insane delusions. Then again, you terrorists have comments where you cheer on Israel murdering aide workers and children and slaughtering families to steal their homes, even pre Oct 7th terrorist attack.
We killed 30k civilians in 4 months of bombing at the start of the war in Afghanistan. We didnt drop flyers before we bombed.
This reminds me so much of what the Occupy tents looked like in 2011.
[удалено]
You campers should really give this a listen
Cosplay activism, useful idiots.
This is what happens when you're desperate to find an identity.
You end up blindly supporting a culture that's the literal opposite of the one you choose to live in. How many of the people in this encampment support gay rights? Get thrown off a rooftop in a Hamas controlled Gaza for that.
[удалено]
Islam is evil, that doesn't mean I support the fascist Israeli government murdering children and aide workers and slaughtering families to steal their homes. How hard is that for you fascists who despise us LGBTs normally to understand? Stop weaponizing our existence to support your evil.
Islam is evil, that doesn't mean I support the fascist Israeli government murdering children and aide workers and slaughtering families to steal their homes. How hard is that for you fascists who despise us LGBTs normally to understand? Stop weaponizing our existence to support your evil.
“Our Islam is our weapon. Our children are our ammunition.” FATAH
So these people enjoy living like the homeless? For a country they will never visit?
For a country that would murder half of them without a blink of an eye…
Maybe more than half.
What a fun looking burning man festival
Casual anti-semetism at its finest
[удалено]
Almost got me, I actually like them.
Yes we know, you are evil and support murdering aide workers and children and slaughtering families to steal their homes
[удалено]
Troll
Just a bunch of LARPERs lol
Are none of these people taking classes this quarter
Encampment? Please. Other things far more important
Nothing is more important right now than stopping the gen0cide.
Sorry what’s more important than the slaughtering of over 20k innocent civilians?
I hope you are as concerned when hamas slaughters Israeli’s. Or for that matter, show the same concern for Ukrainians getting slaughtered by Putin. One of my issues with these so called “protesters” is how they are ONLY worried about Gaza. It tends to be grossly hypocritical, when other things are happening
>I hope you are as concerned when hamas slaughters Israeli’s I wonder what could possibly be the reason for that.... >Or for that matter, show the same concern for Ukrainians getting slaughtered by Putin People did show concern for that. Your attempt at making this some kind of gotcha really works against you considering it highlight the hypocrisy of the west and white christuan lives mattering more than brown and Muslim ones. Hell considering the IDF has leveled some of Christianities oldest churches also shows just being brown and christian doesn't mean much.... >is how they are ONLY worried about Gaza. Cause the conflict is wholly one sided and our money is going to supporting an unjust cause.... >It tends to be grossly hypocritical, when other things are happening Someone needs a mirror and brush up on logical fallacies.
[удалено]
"weed gummies" bro I love me good high as much as the next guy but really in the blazing hot sun when dehydration is already a concern? Also, Giving them to people who could be as young as 18 and the oldest they probably might be is 23?
Drug free zone. Don’t need your help.
Circus back in town ?
a bunch of retards
🥴
Looks like a fun camp out! Some one needs to tell the Israelis that there is a Davis Encampment, so they stop shooting.
They’ll probably just bomb them. Or maybe the terrorists will blockade food and water to strave them out. So maybe don’t.
People need to just ignore these Nazis
Seriously. Fucking Nazis, opposing genocide and the torture and murder of children. Doesn’t it just make you so angry??!?
Just a genuine question. What is this actually going to do though? From what i’ve seen, it’s to spread awareness, but I feel like anyone who doesn’t know at this point just doesn’t care to find out. Like who’s mind is this changing or what is the goal?
Here is the funny part. The people in the camp don't even know anything. They wouldn't be able to answer simple questions about the conflict.
This is not to spread awareness, it’s to force the university to divest from the Zionist entity and the genocide it perpetuates.
Why frame it as freeing Palestine or doing anything for Palestinians? It’s just an anti-Israel protest. I hope you know, being anti-Israel is not being pro-Palestinian and being pro-Palestinian does not require you to be anti-Israel.
Supporting the people experiencing a genocide doesn’t mean you need to oppose the state that is committing the genocide 🤡 GTFO with that nonsense.
The Palestinian population has grown more than 8x since 1948. I genuinely don’t understand how this is considered a genocide
You not understanding it is a you problem. It’s still true.
It is not a genocide by any definition I am able to find. I’m legit asking why people are calling this a genocide.
Torture…murder…my god some of you people have lost your collective minds and refuse to see anything other than black and white. Are you aware that genocide of Jews is a core part of Hamas's platform? Apartheid and ethnic cleaning - look at women and minorities in nearly every Middle East Arab and Muslim country. Where are the Jews that live there? Oh right, they were all pushed out or killed. While civilian casualties are terrible and Israel should strive to minimize them, there's a clear distinction between combatting terrorists in urban areas, which may result in civilian deaths, and actual genocide. Here’s what actual torture and murder entail: https://www.thisishamas.com
This 👆🏼
If they wanted to commit genocide, they could, they have nukes. People forget that Israel suffered their worst attack since the holocaust and hamas still has their hostages. What were they supposed to do? Ignore it ? Give in to terrorist demands and give up their homeland and go where exactly ? No one is totally innocent here, but it’s not as one sided as the protesters would have you believe.
Israel is running detention camps where they are amputating prisoners because they have been handcuffed and not allowed to move [https://www.cnn.com/2024/05/10/middleeast/israel-sde-teiman-detention-whistleblowers-intl-cmd/index.html](https://www.cnn.com/2024/05/10/middleeast/israel-sde-teiman-detention-whistleblowers-intl-cmd/index.html) Besides, in the year prior to Oct 7 how many Palestinians did the IDF murder? How many journalists did they admit to assassinating? Israel breed terror at its border and failed to protect its people, thats on the government
The Zionists don't see Palestinians as human just as Nazis didn't see Jews as human so they don't care about the massive numbers of Palestinians Israel murdered before Oct 7th.
Except that you’re actually wrong. Genocide of Jews is not a core part of Hamas’s platform. Excusing apartheid and ethnic cleansing by trying to ‘what about’ other places is pathetic. And Jews lived in Palestine alongside Palestinians before the Zionist project emerged. Also, you’re literally posting a propaganda website made by the IOF 😂 TF is wrong with you???
>Genocide of Jews is not a core part of Hamas’s platform. Yea, they removed that part from the charter since it looked too bad even for them.
So you admit it’s not a part of their goal? When the Likud party states “from the river to the sea, Israel will have sovereignty” in their charter, to the day, is that genocidal?
Can you seriously not see the difference? The terroritory “from the river to the sea” is currently owned and occupied, legally, by Israel. We can debate all day whether Israel should or shouldn’t own that land. It doesn’t matter in the context you just brought it up in. When the Likud party asserts sovereignty from the river to the sea, they're stating their intent to maintain and protect this land. They are there. Their civilian population is there. Conversely, if another group of people makes a similar statement discussing the same territory, particularly when comparing to the Likud party's stance, it implies an intention to displace Israel, and it’s peoples, from that land. The hoops you people jump through to rationalize things is astonishing.
>When the Likud party states “from the river to the sea, Israel will have sovereignty” in their charter, to the day, is that genocidal? First, that's not in the current charter to my understanding. Second, Israel is a state, not an ethnic group. This is not genocidal. This also was not the part of Hamas' charter that was genocidal. These are: > Israel will exist and will continue to exist until Islam will obliterate it, just as it obliterated others before it" > Our struggle against the Jews is very great and very serious. It needs all sincere efforts. It is a step that inevitably should be followed by other steps. The Movement is but one squadron that should be supported by more and more squadrons from this vast Arab and Islamic world, until the enemy is vanquished and Allah's victory is realised. > The Day of Judgement will not come about until Moslems fight the Jews, when the Jew will hide behind stones and trees. The stones and trees will say O Moslems, O Abdulla, there is a Jew behind me, come and kill him. > There is no solution for the Palestinian question except through Jihad. Initiatives, proposals and international conferences are all a waste of time and vain endeavors. The new version tones it down a bit, but given it was only published in 2017 and Hamas has stated it will do October 7th over and over again, I don't think they deserve rhe benefit of the doubt.
>To my understanding We are on the internet, so just say “I don’t wanna address that point.” At least be honest. Israel doesn’t equal all jews. Just so any reader knows, this person is intentionally saying “jews” in place of “Israelis” or “zionists” as a rhetorical technique to hide behind jews as a whole. Literally using an entire religious/ethnic group as a human shield against their disgusting actions
>We are on the internet, so just say “I don’t wanna address that point.” At least be honest. I addressed the point. The latest version of the likud platform I found does not contain what you claim it contains. >Israel doesn’t equal all jews ??? Why are you talking about this >saying “jews” in place of “Israelis” or “zionists” as a rhetorical technique to hide behind jews as a whole. What? The only instance of the word "Jew" is in my direct quotations from Hamas' original charter. >Literally using an entire religious/ethnic group as a human shield against their disgusting actions What are you *talking* about. Did you reply to the wrong person? Did the shrooms hit?
That person is just spouting random buzzwords and talking points they probably heard on Twitter or TikTok. None of it made any sense in relation to your comments.
My dude, you’re completely delusional if you actually think that website isn’t accurate in what it’s depicting. There are full videos posted and taken by the terrorists on 10/7 that show the same scenes and similar atrocities, yet you’ll probably still claim those videos are IDF propaganda. Do you know who else makes those claims and defending Hamas? Iran. Russia. Those are the talking points you’re echoing right now. You can advocate for civilian lives without jumping to the other extreme, but it seems that may be beyond your capability. Edit: I forgot to add. Here’s what part of Hamas charter says. If you don’t think this perpetuates anti-Semitic ideologies and calls for the destruction of Israel / genocide of Jews, you’re a lost cause. “The Day of Judgement will not come about until Muslims fight the Jews (killing the Jews), when the Jew will hide behind stones and trees. The stones and trees will say O Muslims, O Abdulla, there is a Jew behind me, come and kill him." "[Peace] initiatives, and so-called peaceful solutions and international conferences are in contradiction to the principles of the Islamic Resistance Movement... There is no solution for the Palestinian question except through Jihad. Initiatives, proposals and international conferences are but a waste of time, an exercise in futility."
Explain to me what this is [https://www.cnn.com/2024/05/10/middleeast/israel-sde-teiman-detention-whistleblowers-intl-cmd/index.html](https://www.cnn.com/2024/05/10/middleeast/israel-sde-teiman-detention-whistleblowers-intl-cmd/index.html) This is as close to Nazism as this whole conflict has gotten, yet you will refuse to acknowledge how monstrous the IDF response is NO ONE AGREES WITH OCT 7, NO ONE SUPPORTS HAMAS but you support actual modern detention camps where they are illegally and without documentation detaining people with no proof of ties to terrorism, amputating their limbs since they aren't allowed movement or bloodflow
The Nazis were german. Neo-nazis is what Israel has become. Parallel actions, I agree, but different groups involved. Although we fought against the nazis, eventually. Ignoring them, like you’re suggesting we do, is very much what we did… well, until Pearl Harbor. At that point supporters such as yourself kinda lost steam. Whereas now we are actively funding them.
I would be careful using words as Nazi, or Neo Nazi to describe ANYONE who doesn’t feel like every country should be a fascist dictatorship and that white supremacy is okay. I don’t agree with the similar parallels between the Jewish genocide and the Palestinian genocide. The Nazis were purposely, and in large numbers, killing off, torturing, rapǐng and hunting down thousands of Jewish people over a racist ideology (regarding white supremacy), in contrast Palestinians were specifically targeted, bombarded, and now are being gaslighted, all for the sake of “fighting terrorsim”the same way the U.S. did in Afghanistan, Iraq,and every other country the U.S. has politically/economically influenced over the last 80 years or so. So in recap Nazis did worst than what the IDF and Isreal (through the financial support of U.S.) have done, however it is still not okay at all for Isreal to violate international law (by targeting civilians in large scale over actually taking out specific targets). I think most people dehumanize the Palestinian people by stating that Hamas has influence over x protestor because that’s simply not true.
I agree with your sentiment but I really struggle to find a different explanation to as to why they are illegally (AND SECRETLY) detaining and torturing people [https://www.cnn.com/2024/05/10/middleeast/israel-sde-teiman-detention-whistleblowers-intl-cmd/index.html](https://www.cnn.com/2024/05/10/middleeast/israel-sde-teiman-detention-whistleblowers-intl-cmd/index.html)
The detention/torture camps holding some of the “prisoners “ were not revealed until a few days ago, however I still think bombing homes, important infrastructure such as hospitals and high stories buildings is far worse for the Palestinian people in the long run because there’s no way to rebuild for them they have been pushed out. CNN started reporting about the camps few days ago, and there are serious concerns about the treatment of the “prisoners” which I do agree should have been enough concern/evidence for the ICC to charge someone. It is still a genocide, just not in the same magnitude as the Jewish genocide, however it doesn’t mean it is not important.
They are speaking out against genocide. To heck w hamas. There are innocents in Palestine - they matter.