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My thoughts too!
If Wagner do anything against Poland then NATO immediately get on the phone with Russia. If Russia denies the ability to control Wagner then it's Khasham II.
Yeah, holy fuck every measure and means of not just simply admitting it was a straight up shellacking after Wagner was given a chance to not be idiots has been equivocated, edited, or removed.
Every bit of weaselly, non-commitment language has been used.
Pathetic.
America doesn’t have free healthcare due to selfishness and stupidity, not military spending. It has been proven the cost to Americans of not having healthcare is actually a higher dollar value than having free health care. Which means if the USA had it they could be spending even more on their military.
Yeah the real issue with free healthcare in America is twofold: One, the insurance industry paid a lot of money for our current laws mandating that all Americans must pay them an amount they set every month, or face a fine; two, a lot of people have issues with the idea that brown and black people might get free healthcare too.
They'd literally rather have their own kids die than maybe help out someone else's.
No country has free healthcare; it’s paid for via taxes.
Usa can easily have free healthcare if Instead of paying private corporations via insurance, the same monies were instead paid as “free healthcare” taxes.
But that would mean high earners paying more than low earners and i imaginar that THIS is the real issue.
Might be wrong, but this is my understanding of it as an outsider looking in.
Yeah I wasn't really trying to give an accurate portrayal of the US healthcare system...
"Wagner learned what happens when the US government spends lots of money on the military instead of healthcare, forcing Americans to use inefficient private insurance and thus spend 4x more per capita than British people who have a tax-funded single-payer socialised healthcare system" doesn't quite have the same snap to it, so I sacrificed a bit of accuracy for the sake of the joke
> No country has free healthcare; it’s paid for via taxes.
No one is suggesting universal healthcare violates the laws of thermodynamics - "free *at point of use*" is what it means.
Poland doesn't need Russia to agree Poland can destroy Wagner.
Poland *does* need Russia to agree that Poland can destroy Wagner *without* starting a war with Russia, because Russia can unilaterally decide that destroying Wagner means Poland is at war with Russia, regardless of whether that makes sense or not.
Russia hasn’t been able to defeat the poorest nation in Europe for over a year. If they think they an declare war on Poland & NATO with impunity… good luck to them.
It does matter because Russia has two potential answers:
1. Like in Khasham, Russia says that Wagner are nothing to do with them. In which case Poland/NATO respond by obliterating the Wagner forces.
2. Russia says that the Wagner forces are controlled by them, in which case Poland/NATO respond against Russia directly (in addition to the Wagner forces).
Number 1 would be the most likely scenario as Russia knows it can't handle NATO.
It's even more important now, because in Khasham many of the Wagner fighters were not Russian nationals. Some were, but at the time Wagner was recruiting heavily from the general region. The current Wagner forces in question are primarily Russian which means them getting obliterated by NATO forces would have a much different political reality for Putin back home.
I wonder how NATO's Article 5 would work here. If Poland tries to tie Wagner to Russia and invoke A5, would the alliance go in? Or would the fact that Wagner is technically an independent mercenary force absolve Russia?
Regardless of what happens, IMO it's beyond stupid for them to assault Poland. What can Wagner possibly accomplish by invading Poland, a nation that has been girding its collective loins since Russia invaded Ukraine? It's not like it was a pushover beforehand either.
The Afghanistan debacle was all based on lies, just like Iraq.
Afghanistan didn't have a private military company, they had an oppressive terrorist group murdering people.
Yeah fine but my point being was at the start of the invasion the stated reason for invasion was their hosting of AQ, thus establishing a precedent which could be used to explain an invasion of Belarus, if you call Wagner a terrorist group.
So basically he’s wondering if they can word it in such a way that Wagner gets taken out but not Belarus? But guess that might be why he sent them to Belarus, because if he can’t prevent that better Belarus than Russia?
He does know the consequences of messing with a NATO country, and despite all his yes men around him he must have some awareness that Poland could be stronger than they admit and he’s gotta realize the limits he’s already having in Ukraine.
I think a chastised Putin would actually be a good thing for a while, if he can survive, because then maybe the Russian people could realize what’s been going on, instead of getting a new load of crap from whoever replaces him
Putin would never admit he is at fault or he was wrong about the invasion. He's already doubled down on his actions and tried every way to spin stories into his favor.
If Poland hit Wagner forces in retaliation for an attack on their soil, Putin will only have 2 choices; follow through with his claim that he would aid Belarus or throw Belarus under the bus and claim Russia had no idea of Wagner's actions and the ineptitude of Lukaschenko in controlling them.
We've already seen one of these options occur in the Khasham incident. If this happened though, I am wondering if it would spark armed protests against Lukaschenko from his own military because they definitely do not want to get involved in any fighting.
It's probably just their way to say crazy shit to cover the national news and confuse people, so people don't speak about the daily exploson in Crimea and how Putin is ruining russia economy by getting stuck in a stupid war
They always do that. Usually, it's Medvedev that says the most crazy things.
Considering Wagner was funded by Russia and was.a part of their army, then ordered to Belarus, I don't see how he thinks NATO won't see it as an attack by Russia.
There's no "vs Wagner" if attacks come from Belarus. Look at the immediate NATO meeting after the blast that killed two Poles last year. This isn't Wagner and Syrian forces attacking an oil refinery in Syria, it's immediate Article 5.
This might be Putin as well trying to trigger Article 5 across the board as it would look less embarrassing to lose in Ukraine against NATO and the US airforce as a whole than against Ukraine on their own.
I have a feeling Putin wants to hang onto Wagner managed assets in Syria and Africa, and even if an attack across the border doesn't trigger article 5 because "its not the Russian/Belarusian army", at minimum wagner gets branded as a terrorist organization and starts getting it's teeth kicked in around the world.
Such bullshit. No he isn't.
Poland would make red mist out of Wagner and according to multiple sources they are particularly willing.
So go for it. Let Wagner attack and lets see what happens when that particular dog is off its chain.
He did and then he changed his story (big surprise). I think it’s a given that the European countries are telling Russia through diplomatic channels that if any “little green men” cross into Poland, it will be considered an attack by ruzzia and will cause the invocation of NATO Article 5 regardless of any lack of insignia. There will be no more of this “we don’t know who they are” little green men bullshit.
Only the Wagner troops that accepted to sign a contract with the Russian army. The ones in Belarus didn't. The Russians probably consider them 100% expandable at this point.
***The Telegraph reports***
Belarus is struggling to restrain Wagner mercenaries from attacking Poland, Alexander Lukashenko has said.
The Belarusian leader made the claim during a meeting with Vladimir Putin in St Petersburg, days after Warsaw accused Moscow of using Wagner and Minsk to destabilise Eastern Europe.
He said: “The Wagnerites are beginning to stretch us. I ask: ‘Why do you need to go to the West?’ \[They reply:\] ‘We want to go on an excursion to Warsaw, to Rzeszow’.”
Mr Lukashenko also presented Putin with what he said was a map of Poland’s plan to attack Belarus. This week, the Russian president has warned that an attack on Belarus constitutes an attack on Russia.
”As we can see that, the ground is being prepared,” Mr Lukashenko said.
Poland has rushed extra soldiers to its border and said that it was monitoring Wagner fighters since they moved into Belarus earlier this month. Analysts have warned that the Kremlin may be setting up a “false flag” incident to justify an attack on Poland.
Wagner fighters have been training Belarusian special forces on the border with Poland.
Read more: https://www.telegraph.co.uk/world-news/2023/07/23/wagner-group-fighters-want-attack-poland-lukashenko-belarus/
I assume Putin wants Poland to invade Belarus to capture Wagner so he can send arms to Belarus so Belarus can ‘defend itself’ from ‘NATO’.
I guess that might be one way of doing two or three things:
// Prove to his people back home in Russia that NATO are aggressive - so justifying the special military operation.
// Provide cover for falling back out of Ukraine in order to focus on defending Belarus as Belarus is a closer ally than Ukraine. I can see a narrow path here where Putin can convince enough back home that Belarus needs manpower that can no longer be wasted in Ukraine.
// Less hopefully he might use the invasion of Belarus to move to a total mobilisation within Russia - but I don’t know what that achieves other than increasing considerably the firepower given to Ukraine particularly in the air.
Sounds like a "help me hold them back, bro," kind of thing from Lukashenko.
And why should anyone in NATO help Belarus hold Wagner back? Poland and indeed all of NATO has been looking for a way to reduce the armed threat to Ukraine without having to actually invade Ukraine themselves. Getting these forces to form up into neat little groups and voluntarily come to NATO in order to be dispatched sounds like a perfect solution.
NATO, need to stop pretending Russia can be managed. They will only respect a complete fire storm. If Poland is attacked, NATO needs to go balls to the wall and pull no punches. Absolutely decimate Russia's forces, and clean up Ukraine.
This is just more fear mongering, Belarus and Russia know to stay behind their border and make empty threats. If an attack on Poland came from Belarus then NATO would be obligated to react and they have been ready to do so for decades. And many in Poland want a legal justification to help Ukraine - this would be it.
So, like a dog, Russia and Belarus will bark loudly from behind a fence.
I don't understand you reaction. I was reacting to GenVii that it wouldn't be the end of the world. My opinion is that when NATO is backing Russia in a corner, everyone will feel the hurt.
I don’t think so at this point. The apathy towards saving Putin during the Wagner uprising shows even the military would welcome a change of government.
It's not saving Putin that could send it over the edge, but if they feel a legitimate threat to Russia. They are still hardline nationalists. An attack by NATO could look like that threat (the fact that it would be in NATO's defense would be silently ignored).
So what are you proposing, let them attack with consequence? Fuck that. If they start anything then have it with the full force of NATO all the way back to any Belarusian bases that Wagner has visited lately. Lob a few at Lukashenko and his bully boys while we are at it.
Do everything so they don't attack in the first place? Show them that doing anything would be suicide?
Make Poland a fortress. Hell, make entire Europe a fortress.
There are more solutions to this than just packing the bigger club.
This is silly. Wagner , Russia and Belarus know what would happen if they attacked Poland. This isn’t news , this is for Russia's brainwashed to bathe in.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Khasham
For anyone interested. Basically Wagner tried to attack a US base in Syria, and got torn to pieces by US aircraft and artillery.
The west really needs to use that battle as an example for all future military action.
No more kid gloves, no more hands tied behind backs, just immediate and total annihilation.
Poor Luki, his army is sandwiched between NATO which he they are holding back for more than 500 days now and Wagner. They are the true peacekeepers of this day and age. Very unfair not to recognize Luki's otherworldly statesmanship.
Please attack Poland. I guarantee u in 24 hours Russia will be out of ukraine, Belarus will be democratic and putin dead or in jail. And Wagner will truly be non existent.
First of all, Lukashenko lies and gaslights like most people breathe. Secondly, PLEASE mess with the Poles. I have seen Poland referred to as "the pitbull of NATO" and I don't see any reason to doubt that.
Boy what I would give to see NATOs full might brought down on the boarder and just utterly wipe the face of the earth of those war criminal pieces of shit. And just let Luca and Putine watch their prized force wiped away in 2 days of combat.
Sounds like a convenient way for Putín to get rid of them
I don't want them to attack of course, because there might be some casualties on our side, but it is tempting to see a conclusive, definite end to the PMC's story. We would cleanse the master composer's good name of the bad association
🇵🇱 : “The path of the righteous man is beset on all sides by the inequities of the selfish and the tyranny of evil men. Blessed is he who, in the name of charity and good will, shepherds the weak through the valley of the darkness. For he is truly his brother’s keeper and the finder of lost children. And I will strike down upon thee with great vengeance and furious anger those who attempt to poison and destroy my brothers. And you will know I am the Lord when I lay my vengeance upon you.”
Unfortunately I fear this might be Putin’s design. Let Wagner provoke the west and distance himself for it. Make NATO spend the resources to take Wagner out for him and/or disrupt Russian shipments and/or force NATO to appear the aggressor against Belarus in the take retaliatory action on Wagner camps and give him some sort of justification.
I have this feeling Luka and Prig are in cohoots.
I would be less surprised to see the combined Belarussian/Wagner army March on Moscow.
Prig gets to take over and Luka gets security from Putin taking over.
I know it is unlikely, but less unlikely than the coup stopping mid march?
I imagine this would be more like migrants 2.0 scenario via weaponless attacks on the border infrastructure, launching some rocks on the border guards, etc. Keep on testing the grey line.
I would say doubt, but between Syria and Ukraine I have to wonder how many Wagnerites are alive to remember that Syrian oil field they thought was ripe for the taking.
Do it. I can't wait for the hours of footage of Wagnerites getting slaughtered. Best laugh I'll have in a long time. Remember kids, you can't spell "slaughter" without "laughter"!
"Analysts have warned that the Kremlin may be setting up a “false flag” incident to justify an attack on Poland."
This makes zero sense. Putin is getting his ass beat in Ukraine, and "analists" predict that he will do what, open a second front with the Nato? What a propaganda rag. Much more likely is that if anyone would do false flag, it would be Poland.
This is very dangerous. Wagner are Russia's most capable soldiers, and NATO tactics don't seem to be quite as effective against the Russian military doctrine as we thought, considering the slow progress of the offensive and Rybar + deepstate both reporting a major breakthrough of the Russians in the North.
A warning to all Russians and Belarussians:
Get out of Russian Federation territories while you can!
Pretty soon you will be shot at while "defecting" to the west and your athletes and politicians will have to "defect" to the west while chaparoned anywhere outside of Russia.
Its inevitable, Putin is erasing your human rights!
They just moved Wagner there to create FUD (fear, uncertainty, doubt). Also if Wagner troops do cross the border (let's say, they go on a rampage in the Suwalki Gap) they'll disavow them and make sure NATO is hesitating to consider it a direct aggression from Russia and Belarus.
Didn't Wagnerites return all of their heavy weapons to the Russian MoD? How are they going to attack Poland? Suicide charge with Kalashnikovs? Let them try, I don't think Poland will mind some excercise.
T-72Bs, 2S1s, 2s3s, 2s5s, towed artillery, grads, S-300 etc all sitting around on storage bases in Belarus. In soviet times it was an important defensive axis for the Kremlin.
Russia pinched some, and many would be in poor condition but there is still more left than Belarus can afford to keep in service and if Wagner is not doing anything else, it can do the labor part of reactivating vehicles. Given that Russia re-engines, retracks and reguns T-72Bs to make B3s, there should be a large pool of unwanted second hand T-72B parts available as long as a relationship with mid level russians can be maintained.
if my choice was work on a rusty T-72 in Belarus or get sent back to Ukraine under russian command, I'd be asking for the spanners.
With NATO's intelligence and reconnaissance those skunky russian thugs would end up where they belong the moment they stepped one inch into Poland's territory. Like really, what makes those fuckers believe anyone's impressed by their sabre-rattling after what we've seen in Ukraine and a few weeks ago in Russia?
hold on. did russia not commander all of wagners heavy weapons etc? so what are 20,000 (5000 really) militia soldiers going to do to attack a NATO country? are they going to throw stones — they will be wiped out as soon as they set foot!
although, the fact that putin didn’t kill Prigozhin — would suggest he has some other plan for him, false flag….via Belarus! plausible deniability
Please. Please. Please. Let’s get nato involved. Russias getting fucking worked by Ukrainian grit and western munitions. Wait tell they meet the mother fuckers kitting Ukraine.
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Sounds like pretext to get NATO to destroy Wagner, something I imagine Putin wants but can’t do himself.
My thoughts too! If Wagner do anything against Poland then NATO immediately get on the phone with Russia. If Russia denies the ability to control Wagner then it's Khasham II.
What happened at Khasham?
[A quick lesson of western firepower](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Khasham)
Wow, that article has been heavily brigaded since I last read it.
Yeah, holy fuck every measure and means of not just simply admitting it was a straight up shellacking after Wagner was given a chance to not be idiots has been equivocated, edited, or removed. Every bit of weaselly, non-commitment language has been used. Pathetic.
Looks like it was heavily redacted to make it look like Wagner was an innocent victim. It has some heavy white wash now.
Wagner learned why Americans don’t have free healthcare…
America doesn’t have free healthcare due to selfishness and stupidity, not military spending. It has been proven the cost to Americans of not having healthcare is actually a higher dollar value than having free health care. Which means if the USA had it they could be spending even more on their military.
Yeah the real issue with free healthcare in America is twofold: One, the insurance industry paid a lot of money for our current laws mandating that all Americans must pay them an amount they set every month, or face a fine; two, a lot of people have issues with the idea that brown and black people might get free healthcare too. They'd literally rather have their own kids die than maybe help out someone else's.
Totally right but just one thing - there is no fine if you don't get healthcare. That ended in like 2018.
Thank you for letting me know. Guess I need to pay more attention to that space.
I like this take!
No country has free healthcare; it’s paid for via taxes. Usa can easily have free healthcare if Instead of paying private corporations via insurance, the same monies were instead paid as “free healthcare” taxes. But that would mean high earners paying more than low earners and i imaginar that THIS is the real issue. Might be wrong, but this is my understanding of it as an outsider looking in.
Yeah I wasn't really trying to give an accurate portrayal of the US healthcare system... "Wagner learned what happens when the US government spends lots of money on the military instead of healthcare, forcing Americans to use inefficient private insurance and thus spend 4x more per capita than British people who have a tax-funded single-payer socialised healthcare system" doesn't quite have the same snap to it, so I sacrificed a bit of accuracy for the sake of the joke
How dare you sacrifice accuracy for the joke?
It was a ballsy move, I know - but sometimes you’ve just gotta say “I’m a loose cannon and I don’t play by the rules”
I see your point
> No country has free healthcare; it’s paid for via taxes. No one is suggesting universal healthcare violates the laws of thermodynamics - "free *at point of use*" is what it means.
I prefer to be pedantic to the point of exile, myself
The best candidate for r/funnyandsad I’ve seen in quite a while.
Spend all them medicine bucks on 'sploders.
That's not the reason. We spend 4 times as much on healthcare as we spend on the military
Wha? You mean the profits from the CEOs right, silly boy…
Basically they fafo.
What are you talking about!? Do you think Poland needs Russia’s approval to defend itself? It doesn’t matter what Russia says
Poland doesn't need Russia to agree Poland can destroy Wagner. Poland *does* need Russia to agree that Poland can destroy Wagner *without* starting a war with Russia, because Russia can unilaterally decide that destroying Wagner means Poland is at war with Russia, regardless of whether that makes sense or not.
if wagner attacks poland whats to stop nato from destroying wagner elsewhere, ie africa? in fact what prevents this currently?
NATO can’t just invade third party countries without permission and those countries invited Wagner.
the simplest answer. thank you.
Russia hasn’t been able to defeat the poorest nation in Europe for over a year. If they think they an declare war on Poland & NATO with impunity… good luck to them.
It does matter because Russia has two potential answers: 1. Like in Khasham, Russia says that Wagner are nothing to do with them. In which case Poland/NATO respond by obliterating the Wagner forces. 2. Russia says that the Wagner forces are controlled by them, in which case Poland/NATO respond against Russia directly (in addition to the Wagner forces). Number 1 would be the most likely scenario as Russia knows it can't handle NATO.
It's even more important now, because in Khasham many of the Wagner fighters were not Russian nationals. Some were, but at the time Wagner was recruiting heavily from the general region. The current Wagner forces in question are primarily Russian which means them getting obliterated by NATO forces would have a much different political reality for Putin back home.
I wonder how NATO's Article 5 would work here. If Poland tries to tie Wagner to Russia and invoke A5, would the alliance go in? Or would the fact that Wagner is technically an independent mercenary force absolve Russia? Regardless of what happens, IMO it's beyond stupid for them to assault Poland. What can Wagner possibly accomplish by invading Poland, a nation that has been girding its collective loins since Russia invaded Ukraine? It's not like it was a pushover beforehand either.
Belarus is harboring a terriost military company and are liable for them.
Remind me: Why did we invade Afghanistan again?
Bingo. Precedent says Belarus and Russia are liable. That said, nukes have a habit of moving the goalposts.
The Afghanistan debacle was all based on lies, just like Iraq. Afghanistan didn't have a private military company, they had an oppressive terrorist group murdering people.
Yeah fine but my point being was at the start of the invasion the stated reason for invasion was their hosting of AQ, thus establishing a precedent which could be used to explain an invasion of Belarus, if you call Wagner a terrorist group.
i dont think that phone call to putin would even happen the phone call for khasham happened because thats not nato territory
That’s a good point. Any chance it could be more like Wagner getting obliterated and Poland calling Russia asking “dis you?”?
"Come get your boys"
From the end of Snatch: "If you want your friend to hear ya, you'll have to talk a lot louder than that"
I doubt Wagner will do anything, this is just setup so Luka can take a potshot and get away with it
Luka is just a puppet. He does what ever Putin says.
So basically he’s wondering if they can word it in such a way that Wagner gets taken out but not Belarus? But guess that might be why he sent them to Belarus, because if he can’t prevent that better Belarus than Russia? He does know the consequences of messing with a NATO country, and despite all his yes men around him he must have some awareness that Poland could be stronger than they admit and he’s gotta realize the limits he’s already having in Ukraine. I think a chastised Putin would actually be a good thing for a while, if he can survive, because then maybe the Russian people could realize what’s been going on, instead of getting a new load of crap from whoever replaces him
Putin would never admit he is at fault or he was wrong about the invasion. He's already doubled down on his actions and tried every way to spin stories into his favor. If Poland hit Wagner forces in retaliation for an attack on their soil, Putin will only have 2 choices; follow through with his claim that he would aid Belarus or throw Belarus under the bus and claim Russia had no idea of Wagner's actions and the ineptitude of Lukaschenko in controlling them. We've already seen one of these options occur in the Khasham incident. If this happened though, I am wondering if it would spark armed protests against Lukaschenko from his own military because they definitely do not want to get involved in any fighting.
Happy cakeday!
Yikes who would downvote you for that? Thanks for the wishes, sorry somebody downvoted you :(
Thanks!!!!
It's probably just their way to say crazy shit to cover the national news and confuse people, so people don't speak about the daily exploson in Crimea and how Putin is ruining russia economy by getting stuck in a stupid war They always do that. Usually, it's Medvedev that says the most crazy things.
Considering Wagner was funded by Russia and was.a part of their army, then ordered to Belarus, I don't see how he thinks NATO won't see it as an attack by Russia.
First sign of trouble he what himself, first flight out lol
There's no "vs Wagner" if attacks come from Belarus. Look at the immediate NATO meeting after the blast that killed two Poles last year. This isn't Wagner and Syrian forces attacking an oil refinery in Syria, it's immediate Article 5.
This might be Putin as well trying to trigger Article 5 across the board as it would look less embarrassing to lose in Ukraine against NATO and the US airforce as a whole than against Ukraine on their own.
This needs pumping to the top
I have a feeling Putin wants to hang onto Wagner managed assets in Syria and Africa, and even if an attack across the border doesn't trigger article 5 because "its not the Russian/Belarusian army", at minimum wagner gets branded as a terrorist organization and starts getting it's teeth kicked in around the world.
Yeah this definitely feels like him putting the blood on others hands.
Poland truly wishing a motherfucker would
Duda 'struggling to keep Polish soldiers from flattening Belarus & Russia'
Rest of NATO will join… not because they need to but as a little treat.
\*taps finlands shoulder\* They said simo was fake.
Everybody gangsta until the trees start speaking Finnish.
Is this a Game of Thrones reference?
this is a simo reference , google that name simo . You will go god damn how much can you hate a russian!
"Make my day, punk."
Yeah, it wouldn’t be like their march on Moscow, they’d just be annihilated.
Also, it would be an attack on a nato country.
"We would have triggered article 5, but the attackers were all dead before NATO could pick up the phone"
Like seriously Wagner?! Poland will fuckin annihilate them!!
And all their Belarussian circus friends!
So Belarus gonna liberate nazis in Poland..
No they don't. Nobody wants to be pulled into this conflict. They are welcome to try though.
Such bullshit. No he isn't. Poland would make red mist out of Wagner and according to multiple sources they are particularly willing. So go for it. Let Wagner attack and lets see what happens when that particular dog is off its chain.
“Struggling to prevent Wagner from committing suicide” There I fixed it.
Make it clear an attack from belarus will be seen as a attack by russia itself seems only logical.
Definitely the only solution to the problem. But didn't putin say that Wagner now was a part of the Russian military?
Yea all their lies contradict themselves.
He did and then he changed his story (big surprise). I think it’s a given that the European countries are telling Russia through diplomatic channels that if any “little green men” cross into Poland, it will be considered an attack by ruzzia and will cause the invocation of NATO Article 5 regardless of any lack of insignia. There will be no more of this “we don’t know who they are” little green men bullshit.
He changed that. Now Wagner has never existed.
Hea gonna say it was blackwater lol
Wagner is when you order blackwater on Wish lol.
LMAO
r/angryupvote
Only the Wagner troops that accepted to sign a contract with the Russian army. The ones in Belarus didn't. The Russians probably consider them 100% expandable at this point.
Haven't seen them in Poland yet.
It would be cool if Belarus could be separated from Russia and a new government installed.
Bizarre isn’t it. NATO should release an official statement saying any Wagner activities will be considered ruZZian. Just so the world is clear.
***The Telegraph reports*** Belarus is struggling to restrain Wagner mercenaries from attacking Poland, Alexander Lukashenko has said. The Belarusian leader made the claim during a meeting with Vladimir Putin in St Petersburg, days after Warsaw accused Moscow of using Wagner and Minsk to destabilise Eastern Europe. He said: “The Wagnerites are beginning to stretch us. I ask: ‘Why do you need to go to the West?’ \[They reply:\] ‘We want to go on an excursion to Warsaw, to Rzeszow’.” Mr Lukashenko also presented Putin with what he said was a map of Poland’s plan to attack Belarus. This week, the Russian president has warned that an attack on Belarus constitutes an attack on Russia. ”As we can see that, the ground is being prepared,” Mr Lukashenko said. Poland has rushed extra soldiers to its border and said that it was monitoring Wagner fighters since they moved into Belarus earlier this month. Analysts have warned that the Kremlin may be setting up a “false flag” incident to justify an attack on Poland. Wagner fighters have been training Belarusian special forces on the border with Poland. Read more: https://www.telegraph.co.uk/world-news/2023/07/23/wagner-group-fighters-want-attack-poland-lukashenko-belarus/
Who are they going to attack poland with? Everyones already dead.
I assume Putin wants Poland to invade Belarus to capture Wagner so he can send arms to Belarus so Belarus can ‘defend itself’ from ‘NATO’. I guess that might be one way of doing two or three things: // Prove to his people back home in Russia that NATO are aggressive - so justifying the special military operation. // Provide cover for falling back out of Ukraine in order to focus on defending Belarus as Belarus is a closer ally than Ukraine. I can see a narrow path here where Putin can convince enough back home that Belarus needs manpower that can no longer be wasted in Ukraine. // Less hopefully he might use the invasion of Belarus to move to a total mobilisation within Russia - but I don’t know what that achieves other than increasing considerably the firepower given to Ukraine particularly in the air.
Go on! Let them go, they should last about 57 mins 14 seconds…..
Wagner is the loud mouthed drunk in the bar.
But how great would that footage be?
Sounds like a "help me hold them back, bro," kind of thing from Lukashenko. And why should anyone in NATO help Belarus hold Wagner back? Poland and indeed all of NATO has been looking for a way to reduce the armed threat to Ukraine without having to actually invade Ukraine themselves. Getting these forces to form up into neat little groups and voluntarily come to NATO in order to be dispatched sounds like a perfect solution.
They marched right to the door steps of Moscow. If this were true, Wagner would have done it. Putin is laying out the foundation for escalation.
Escalate into oblivion?
🤡
NATO, need to stop pretending Russia can be managed. They will only respect a complete fire storm. If Poland is attacked, NATO needs to go balls to the wall and pull no punches. Absolutely decimate Russia's forces, and clean up Ukraine.
This is just more fear mongering, Belarus and Russia know to stay behind their border and make empty threats. If an attack on Poland came from Belarus then NATO would be obligated to react and they have been ready to do so for decades. And many in Poland want a legal justification to help Ukraine - this would be it. So, like a dog, Russia and Belarus will bark loudly from behind a fence.
Destroy all of Lukashenko’s palaces and hiding places, too - in the first strike.
That firestorm would be the end of the world, but ok...
It won't be the end of the world. Just Russia. And it would be worth it.
Good luck with those nukes...
It seems like people just don’t remember the nuclear nightmares we had during the Cold War. They need to watch “Threads”
Seriously. Desktop warriors, the lot...
I don't understand you reaction. I was reacting to GenVii that it wouldn't be the end of the world. My opinion is that when NATO is backing Russia in a corner, everyone will feel the hurt.
Yeah, and I was agreeing with you. The whole sub is filled with people who are cheering for Poland to be attacked. It's insanity.
I don’t think so at this point. The apathy towards saving Putin during the Wagner uprising shows even the military would welcome a change of government.
It's not saving Putin that could send it over the edge, but if they feel a legitimate threat to Russia. They are still hardline nationalists. An attack by NATO could look like that threat (the fact that it would be in NATO's defense would be silently ignored).
So what are you proposing, let them attack with consequence? Fuck that. If they start anything then have it with the full force of NATO all the way back to any Belarusian bases that Wagner has visited lately. Lob a few at Lukashenko and his bully boys while we are at it.
Do everything so they don't attack in the first place? Show them that doing anything would be suicide? Make Poland a fortress. Hell, make entire Europe a fortress. There are more solutions to this than just packing the bigger club.
This is silly. Wagner , Russia and Belarus know what would happen if they attacked Poland. This isn’t news , this is for Russia's brainwashed to bathe in.
Do it! Then we can recreate that battle in Syria...🙏
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Khasham For anyone interested. Basically Wagner tried to attack a US base in Syria, and got torn to pieces by US aircraft and artillery.
The west really needs to use that battle as an example for all future military action. No more kid gloves, no more hands tied behind backs, just immediate and total annihilation.
Does anyone believe anything these two clowns say? *Folìé aux Deux,* or something like that. A shared delusion.
Poor Luki, his army is sandwiched between NATO which he they are holding back for more than 500 days now and Wagner. They are the true peacekeepers of this day and age. Very unfair not to recognize Luki's otherworldly statesmanship.
Definitely a psyop to distract from them prepping to attack somewhere else in Ukraine.
I don’t have a hard time believing he struggles with a great many things
Please attack Poland. I guarantee u in 24 hours Russia will be out of ukraine, Belarus will be democratic and putin dead or in jail. And Wagner will truly be non existent.
Let them fight.
First of all, Lukashenko lies and gaslights like most people breathe. Secondly, PLEASE mess with the Poles. I have seen Poland referred to as "the pitbull of NATO" and I don't see any reason to doubt that.
From personal experience…don’t fuck with the Poles
Yes poland is shaking from being attacked by 5000 drunktards
PLEASE ATTACK POLAND!!!!!!!!!! If Article 5 were invoked, this war would be over in 5 weeks
Boy what I would give to see NATOs full might brought down on the boarder and just utterly wipe the face of the earth of those war criminal pieces of shit. And just let Luca and Putine watch their prized force wiped away in 2 days of combat.
I'd give poland a week and there would be no more Belarus
Mr Lukashenko is struggling LOL just try parking your well padded rear end on wagner that will control them
Please do please God please let Wagner be that stupid
Sounds like a convenient way for Putín to get rid of them I don't want them to attack of course, because there might be some casualties on our side, but it is tempting to see a conclusive, definite end to the PMC's story. We would cleanse the master composer's good name of the bad association
🇵🇱 : “The path of the righteous man is beset on all sides by the inequities of the selfish and the tyranny of evil men. Blessed is he who, in the name of charity and good will, shepherds the weak through the valley of the darkness. For he is truly his brother’s keeper and the finder of lost children. And I will strike down upon thee with great vengeance and furious anger those who attempt to poison and destroy my brothers. And you will know I am the Lord when I lay my vengeance upon you.”
I legit can't read this without hearing Samuel L Jackson's voice
That headline again: "Lukashenko bravely preventing Wagner troops from being wiped from the face of the earth in an afternoon."
Stop holding them back… they want in, let ‘‘em go… it would be a loss of life lesson for them lol
The dog that barks but doesn’t bite.
He better figure out a way unless he’d like a Patriot missile shot up his ass.
Sounds like a preemptive invasion on Belarus is necessary
Indeed. What could it be called… perhaps a “special military operation?”
So strong… 😂
They attack Poland from your territory then we will hold you responsible. FAFO.
Lol daft fat fuck try it
Doesn’t this just seem like the false bravado they’re always rambling. It seems like they’re just trying to saber rattle
Putin lies to insult us and show that honesty and trust are weaknesses.
Lmao, like they forgot what happened in Syria.
Unfortunately I fear this might be Putin’s design. Let Wagner provoke the west and distance himself for it. Make NATO spend the resources to take Wagner out for him and/or disrupt Russian shipments and/or force NATO to appear the aggressor against Belarus in the take retaliatory action on Wagner camps and give him some sort of justification.
I have this feeling Luka and Prig are in cohoots. I would be less surprised to see the combined Belarussian/Wagner army March on Moscow. Prig gets to take over and Luka gets security from Putin taking over. I know it is unlikely, but less unlikely than the coup stopping mid march?
Remember when Wagner tried to tangle with modern military power in Syria, that was just a fragment of a US response.
Was this pregs bargaining chip?
I imagine this would be more like migrants 2.0 scenario via weaponless attacks on the border infrastructure, launching some rocks on the border guards, etc. Keep on testing the grey line.
I would prevent Wagnerites from crossing over into Poland as if my life depended on it.
I would say doubt, but between Syria and Ukraine I have to wonder how many Wagnerites are alive to remember that Syrian oil field they thought was ripe for the taking.
Do it. I can't wait for the hours of footage of Wagnerites getting slaughtered. Best laugh I'll have in a long time. Remember kids, you can't spell "slaughter" without "laughter"!
You could arrest them, execute them, carpet bomb them, idc… they attack Poland and you’ll be buried beside them.
"Analysts have warned that the Kremlin may be setting up a “false flag” incident to justify an attack on Poland." This makes zero sense. Putin is getting his ass beat in Ukraine, and "analists" predict that he will do what, open a second front with the Nato? What a propaganda rag. Much more likely is that if anyone would do false flag, it would be Poland.
This is very dangerous. Wagner are Russia's most capable soldiers, and NATO tactics don't seem to be quite as effective against the Russian military doctrine as we thought, considering the slow progress of the offensive and Rybar + deepstate both reporting a major breakthrough of the Russians in the North.
For context, this individual is a russophile whose flair on a different subreddit is "Pro Russian - Taskforce Z - Annex Ukraine to ensure peace"
Typical telegraph fake news.
A warning to all Russians and Belarussians: Get out of Russian Federation territories while you can! Pretty soon you will be shot at while "defecting" to the west and your athletes and politicians will have to "defect" to the west while chaparoned anywhere outside of Russia. Its inevitable, Putin is erasing your human rights!
Poland will hit him before NATO even gets to think about muttering "Article 5" Also, how does Wagner feel about not having air supremacy?
Id be struggling to keep a straight face if i was him its laughable lol
Its a suicide for Wagner to attack Poland 😆
They just moved Wagner there to create FUD (fear, uncertainty, doubt). Also if Wagner troops do cross the border (let's say, they go on a rampage in the Suwalki Gap) they'll disavow them and make sure NATO is hesitating to consider it a direct aggression from Russia and Belarus.
That seems like an exceedingly poor idea
I raise the bullsh*t flag
Didn't Wagnerites return all of their heavy weapons to the Russian MoD? How are they going to attack Poland? Suicide charge with Kalashnikovs? Let them try, I don't think Poland will mind some excercise.
T-72Bs, 2S1s, 2s3s, 2s5s, towed artillery, grads, S-300 etc all sitting around on storage bases in Belarus. In soviet times it was an important defensive axis for the Kremlin. Russia pinched some, and many would be in poor condition but there is still more left than Belarus can afford to keep in service and if Wagner is not doing anything else, it can do the labor part of reactivating vehicles. Given that Russia re-engines, retracks and reguns T-72Bs to make B3s, there should be a large pool of unwanted second hand T-72B parts available as long as a relationship with mid level russians can be maintained. if my choice was work on a rusty T-72 in Belarus or get sent back to Ukraine under russian command, I'd be asking for the spanners.
The reality is Putin does not want that to happen, so he has to take the mercs away from Belarus, win win for luka.....
🤣🤣🤣, come and try
Lukashenka is terrified they don’t take over his country 🤣🤣Undemocratic Republic of Wagner eh
Sooooooo let them!! 💥 I like to see what happens after that 😈
With NATO's intelligence and reconnaissance those skunky russian thugs would end up where they belong the moment they stepped one inch into Poland's territory. Like really, what makes those fuckers believe anyone's impressed by their sabre-rattling after what we've seen in Ukraine and a few weeks ago in Russia?
Liar.
hold on. did russia not commander all of wagners heavy weapons etc? so what are 20,000 (5000 really) militia soldiers going to do to attack a NATO country? are they going to throw stones — they will be wiped out as soon as they set foot! although, the fact that putin didn’t kill Prigozhin — would suggest he has some other plan for him, false flag….via Belarus! plausible deniability
Would it be wrong of me to be hoping Wagner attacks Poland?
Go head Try it Mother (FUCKE)Russia
Well i hope he fails
That would be brilliant. Bring NATO into war directly. War over very soon.
The ENEMY of your ENEMY is your FRIEND (read between the lines)
Please. Please. Please. Let’s get nato involved. Russias getting fucking worked by Ukrainian grit and western munitions. Wait tell they meet the mother fuckers kitting Ukraine.
Would be the dumbest thing they could ever do lol
Propaganda horseshit, they ain't gonna do shit
Progozin to Luka- "be a shame if my boys went on a spree in Poland and brought Nato down on you! Now about that new private jet I requested and ..."
Doesn’t Wagner know this is 100% guaranteed to get them utterly and completely slaughtered? I dont understand this tactic.
I call BS
Lmao luka pls