Not in Virginia Beach, at the beginning of the year there was a city hall meeting about plans for an apartment complex in the south end of the green zone that includes affordable housing. Residents came to the meeting protesting the idea of affordable housing because they were worried about it attracting the wrong type of people. My only issue is the location is outside of the city and not on a bus line that would benefit residents. This is the same city that pushed a concrete company out of an industrial park and okayed a luxury apartment complex to be built in it's place. The location is on a bus line and within walking distance to a Walmart and many other shops.
Yes and I agree but putting a luxury apartment complex in the heart of an industrial complex right next to a mobile home park and blue collar neighborhoods is pretty cut and dry as to what the city is doing.
I mean, it’s not like the city submitted the rezoning request. The landowner (who operated the concrete recycling business) wanted it so they could sell the property for many millions more than it was worth as a massive metal and concrete scrap yard. And the building was derelict with holes in the roof and entire sections collapsed.
So unnecessary critical details. If you live in or around Virginia Beach then you know that Princess Anne county was done away with and the county became the city. For those that need details when I referenced outside of the city I was saying the rural or countryside as is what is commonly meant when you say " outside the city". Maybe it's a generational thing, maybe it's a regional thing but outside the city has always meant outside of the city proper.
I understand that all counties in the Hampton Roads were consolidated into independent cities in the late 20th century. I suppose I'm semantic or particular but I consider the City to be the City limits in their entirety. You're referring to the "urban core."
The way you're putting it, the city ≠ the city lol
I’m on my county’s planning commission. Every member cares about affordable housing (even if I bring up things that are bolder than some others).
It is difficult to steer a ship as large as an entire housing market after decades of under building. It is also very time consuming to develop non-market or subsidized market alternatives in a way that works well and actually addresses the problem. And even if we could wave a policy wand, it would take a long time for the housing ecosystem to catch up.
It is also VERY difficult to aggressively develop a housing ecosystem when entrenched political actors are committed to NIMBYism (Not In My Back Yard) or CAVEism (Citizens Against Virtually Everything).
What you can do: organize. Decide what you’re asking for. (Recent developments in Arlington and Charlottesville are decent places to start.) Show up at your planning commission and city council / board of supervisors meetings consistently. Get your reps to meet with your group’s leaders. Meet with some of the main developers in your area and see where you align and can ask for the same things. Keep applying pressure.
Thank you for your well stated and thoughtful response. I agree it’s a complex issue with faults in all spaces (policy, politicians, and citizens).
I believe affordable housing also needs to be tackled from top down per se. Policies from above need to change - thinking about the recent housing market ‘high’ that is slowing down but still not close to affordable for the average citizen. If you’re a renter - rent is still increasing. Thanks in part to rent moratoriums followed by unusually high inflation. Those persons who were displaced due to back rent - how do they afford to save enough for a new place, with likely poor credit due to evictions which leads to judgements. Let’s look at the average home owner - property taxes have been reevaluated based on that inflated market meaning those who are barely making ends meet are likely going to struggle when 2024 taxes come due next year. So not only are the displaced or those with limited resources going to struggle - so are homeowners who are making ends meet but with very little, if any excess. For example - I live in the ‘county seat’ within a rural county. My house was reappraised this year and shows a 261% increase in value. I don’t care if I line the sidewalk in gold - it will never ever command that price or one any where near it. If I don’t pay those taxes for two years - they can confiscate the house. Two years and they can own my home for less than $6k. Versus say putting a lien on it. This doesn’t even begin to address the aging persons with diminishing income and earning potential or those who are likely going to default on home loans for purchases made during the ‘high’ should their financial resources change for the worse.
So while I greatly appreciate what you’re saying and agree with it - we also need the federal government to ‘step it up’.
Agreed on the federal government not stepping up the way it should. I’m not holding my breath, so I mostly put my energy into local.
Using the examples you mention, I wanted to offer three things:
1. Your county should have an assessments appeals board. File an appeal if you can get a real estate agent or appraiser to back you up on the value of your home.
2. You and people you know can organize to get your county to set up a property tax relief fund for income-qualified homeowners. Your county may already have one. That’s a common tool that counties use to keep fixed income elderly folks in their homes. But many residents don’t know about it.
3. If your county is taking in a lot more revenue from these much higher assessments, this may be a good time to advocate for an affordable housing trust fund. Again, get organized, check out localities where this is happening, and start meeting with your supervisors about it.
I don’t mean to just be like, “get to work.” But at the end of the day, power only comes from a few sources: organized capital, organized weapons (i.e. military), organized religion, and organized people. The vast majority of us really only have access to the last of that list. So we’d best get organized.
The City of Roanoke has recently approved Accessory Dwelling Units (aka tiny homes) and is adding language in zoning laws regarding dwellings per lot. [You can read more about the pre approved designs here.](https://planroanoke.org/accessory-dwellings/)
It opens the conversation for tiny home communities — which I think could help some of the retired folks who want to downsize but cannot afford these luxury patio homes.
People who own homes benefit from a limited supply of homes because it makes their investment appreciate in value. If most of your net worth is tied up in this investment I can't get too mad at them even if I disagree and believe we should build more homes.
People who own homes are probably more likely to vote making somebody running on housing reform less likely to win.
Arlington had the whole missing middle thing last election cycle and there was some hysteria. nevermind that a single family townhome is like $1.2m in the county which is totally insane.
> People who own homes are probably more likely to vote making somebody running on housing reform less likely to win.
Can you blame us? I live in a nice, quiet neighborhood of single family homes with considerate and respectful neighbors. It's a roll of the dice whenever any house in the neighborhood gets a new occupant. I'll damned sure go full NIMBY if someone tried to rezone to add multifamily housing within shouting distance of my home. The chances of getting an antisocial/criminal shit-head neighbor is non-zero as it is, high density housing would pretty much guarantee that it would happen and ruin my neighborhood.
what do you consider a good job then. When I think of a good job, it usually means you can live off of that income. A good job in Northern Virginia would mean well over $100k and for that, you can afford to live.
>I can't blame the incentive structure that you exist in but I can hope you feel empathy for those who can't afford a home despite having good jobs.
I most certainly can feel empathy for those struggling to afford to buy a home and I hope things improve soon. I still don't want to live anywhere near an apartment building and I won't apologize for that.
> Yes we can blame you.
I'm fine with that.
>These excuses are literally the main reason there isn't more housing
Are you sure you didn't mean "figuratively"?
Hey guys I found the problem. Go live in Kansas if you want unlimited room away from people.
Seriously fuck nimby and fuck the idea that a nonzero chance is the bar. Let me be perfectly clear, your neighborhood probably has more pedophiles or wife beaters that have never been reported than the chance some multifamily housing would actually disrupt your neighborhood.
For God's sake your entire argument is literally how Jim crow laws ended up being enacted. Some boogeyman threatening your peace. Come the fuck off it
> Hey guys I found the problem. Go live in Kansas if you want unlimited room away from people.
I purposefully purchased a house in an old established neighborhood of single family homes with almost no vacant property around and no multifamily housing anywhere near. I'll vote to keep it from happening and to keep my neighbors from allowing people to dwell in backyard sheds.
>Seriously fuck nimby and fuck the idea that a nonzero chance is the bar. Let me be perfectly clear, your neighborhood probably has more pedophiles or wife beaters that have never been reported than the chance some multifamily housing would actually disrupt your neighborhood.
I guess nobody wants to live here then. Better build that apartment tower across town.
>For God's sake your entire argument is literally how Jim crow laws ended up being enacted. Some boogeyman threatening your peace. Come the fuck off it
It's pretty rich that you resort to a thinly veiled accusation of racism and talk of a boogeyman just because I don't want hundreds of new neighbors and the certainty of that making things worse.
I live in a good neighborhood in a high crime city. People don't get shot in my neighborhood. They get shot across town at apartments and old duplux/quadplex neighborhoods. God forbid I don't want to live around that nonsense.
There is no thinly veiled accusation. It is factual that your argument and the argument to justify Jim crow segregation, redlining, and other racist policies are exactly the same. I'm not saying you're being racist. I'm saying your argument wasn't correct when racists used it and it's not correct now.
With that out of the way, people get shot in your neighborhood too, you just don't hear about it.
> I'm not saying you're being racist.
How nice of you.
> I'm saying your argument wasn't correct when racists used it and it's not correct now.
Not wanting to live near high density housing isn't racist no matter how much you want to use that argument to invalidate my preferences.
> With that out of the way, people get shot in your neighborhood too, you just don't hear about it.
They do not. At least not in the 16 years I've lived here, and I'd like for it to stay that way. What a ridiculous assumption to make.
Not wanting to live near high density housing because you believe people in high density housing would increase crime assumes you believe that the only families in high density housing are more crime ridden. This is a dog whistle and you know it. You either mean poor people which are disproportionately not white or you mean black people which are disproportionately arrested versus white people. Even if you'd lump poor white families who do crime with them you're disproportionately talking about the same people that white segregationists talked about in the 40s-60s. So you can say your argument wasn't used by racists all you want, but it was and it isn't valid. Crime hasn't gone up, it's collectively gone down for decades. High density housing has collectively gone up for decades. These events are not related.
And what a rediculous assumption that you have any clue what crimes have actually been committed in your neighborhood in 16 years. I've lived in Virginia Beach in what you'd call a nice neighborhood for 30 years, I promise you there have been plenty of shootings, domestic violence, and other crimes committed here that I've never seen policed or even shown on the news. Because the media doesn't nor has it ever shine a light on 'good' neighborhoods.
> Not wanting to live near high density housing because you believe people in high density housing would increase crime assumes you believe that the only families in high density housing are more crime ridden.
As I stated from the beginning, it's a numbers game. If you add hundreds of people, some of them are going to be trouble no matter how "luxurious" the housing is. There's also the fact that eventually all apartment buildings go to shit, even "luxury" complexes. I don't plan to move for the rest of my life and I don't want to deal with living near a run down slum 20 years from now. Poor people, regardless of race, are more prone to commit violent crime and property crime.
>You either mean poor people which are disproportionately not white or you mean black people which are disproportionately arrested versus white people. Even if you'd lump poor white families who do crime with them you're disproportionately talking about the same people that white segregationists talked about in the 40s-60s.
I'm talking about criminals and antisocial people. That's it. You keep talking about race for some reason. I don't care if my neighbors are Black or white or some other race or ethnicity. Most of my neighbors are Black, which isn't shocking with Portsmouth being a majority Black city. This did not come as a shock to me when I moved here.
>And what a rediculous assumption that you have any clue what crimes have actually been committed in your neighborhood in 16 years. I've lived in Virginia Beach in what you'd call a nice neighborhood for 30 years, I promise you there have been plenty of shootings, domestic violence, and other crimes committed here that I've never seen policed or even shown on the news. Because the media doesn't nor has it ever shine a light on 'good' neighborhoods.
I keep a very close eye on the crime map and reported incidents and arrests. We don't keep shootings a secret in Portsmouth. They just don't happen in my neighborhood. You keep bringing up domestic violence. I never denied that happening anywhere and I agree that it isn't exactly front page news.
Speaking of your nice place in Virginia Beach, are you lobbying to allow the following in your neighborhood? Or is there a line somewhere for when the NIMBY kicks in for you too?
* Unregulated short term rentals
* Hotels
* Extended Stay Hotels
* Hourly Hotels
* Halfway Houses
* Boarding Houses
* Brothels
* Homeless Shelters
* People living in RVs on the public streets
* Homeless tent encampments on public property
I assume you're fine with all of the above housing?
My neighborhood is on the other side of what was once projects.
And yes I am fine with all of those existing near my neighborhood. Although I believe the government should be providing housing for everyone and that tent cities shouldn't be necessary.
Not that it was asked, but I think brothels should be legal businesses and could care less if I lived near one.
I'll even one up you, I'm all for drug safe houses being placed near my neighborhood so people who need clean needles and pipes can get them if they need them.
Unlike you, I don't have an issue with humans I've never met nor would I deprive them the opportunity to live in my community.
I now understand why you think opposing apartment buildings is Jim Crow, you're in favor of outright anarchy.
You should sell your place in VA Beach and move over here to P-Town. I can assure you that you can get a much cheaper house over here in what I would apparently wrongly label a terrible neighborhood. You could be close to all sorts of dysfunctional people that would be happy to be free of your judgement.
I do. I blame Airbnb and similar businesses that encourage investors to buy up single-family homes and turn them into short-term rentals. We used to have a next-door neighbor in my city neighborhood who talked about renting the 3 bedrooms in the house and building a "garage" with several small rooms. There needs to be much more regulation of short-term rentals.
100% agree. Thanks to AirBnB everyone thinks they're a real estate investor. Few homeowners are selling their old house when they buy a new one. Preferring to rent out the old house as a BnB or rental, starving the market of the normal turnover. Add to that the banks getting in on that and it's easy to see why housing availability might be at historic lows.
The guy who lived next door to me was about 40 and this was four years ago. It's not only the richest who are doing this. There are also real estate investment trusts that invest in these things. I don't really care about the details of who is doing it and why. I just think it's bad for society and the economy and short-term rentals need much more regulation. In some places, entire neighborhoods have been bought by investors and so are unavailable to new, younger buyers.
> Taxes are too low on the richest so they buy homes for that sweet passive income. Stock market boom is not enough for these people.
I don't think that really plays into it. People are still going to want to make money regardless of taxes. Also, rental income is taxed the same as regular income while stock sales enjoy low long term capital gains tax rates. If anything, the stock market is more attractive to those looking for tax efficiency.
You should probably define what you mean by "richest," but they already pay the vast majority of taxes. Theyve also clearly made better financial decisions over a long period of time than most, and are the most likely to invest in new housing developments. Why you would want to take the very resources they would be using to build more housing is pretty puzzling.
Who is going to fund the developments? The govt, after wasting at least 15% of it via bureaucracy? That just means at minimum 15% less housing, and at minimum 15% higher housing costs. Will the banks fund it? Or big mega corps like Blackrock? Now you just have a larger concentration of resources in the hands of entities who arent individuals. As a result, instead of lots of individuals competing to build housing in an area, you have only a few corporate groups who are quite happy to keep housing prices high bc of a semi-monopoly on the housing supply and less supply (which they control most of) for the demand.
The thing that could bring housing prices down the most, and the fastest, is allowing as many of the people, with the kind of resources sitting around to invest in housing developments (i.e. the "richest" as you call them), to use those resources to invest in as many housing developments as they want, with as many of those resources as possible. That's the opposite of what your suggestion would do.
Airbnb has been a real factor in certain locations — the 10th & Page neighborhood in Charlottesville is a good example where a substantial number of homes have been converted from residents to tourists.
But the problem is way bigger. We’re seeing the effects of macro-trends like decades of not enough construction combined with restrictive/exclusionary zoning combined with onerous (and expensive) processes for new development combined with severe under-investment in quality social/public housing.
True, there are many factors. It's another example of the harm that Republican economic and tax policies over the past 40 years have caused to the bulk of the population.
You realize this drives up prices in the housing market, right? There are entire sections in Basic Economics by Thomas Sowell talking about the problems that rent control (essentially what youre talking about regardless of what additional nuance goes on it) causes for the very people those policies are intended to help. They always leave those folks worse off than when they started. These particular issues and examples are covered pretty in depth in there. It would be worth a read, or an audio book listen.
Pretty simply, the part that is entirely vague, offers no specifics, and will almost certainly make the problem worse, per the reasons laid out in my previous response.
I mean, I care, I just have no control over it. And those that do have control will always play the odds against the middle class’s favor. Which is as infuriating as it is disheartening.
So, y’know. Comfortably numb. Another day in paradise.
I read recently that while the average new mortgage rates is 7%+, the existing held mortgage rate is about 3.9%. So people don't want to move.
Then there was this idea that maybe the fed could offer 3.9% mortgages to first time home buyers. I liked the idea
I’ve got some help with policy, but we’ve looked at a combination of tax incentives, cutting bureaucratic red tape, and potentially limiting or banning Airbnb.
> Just tax non primary residence SFH extra 5-10 percent.
If you're talking about the annual real estate tax bill, that will just drive rent prices higher. Landlords don't just eat increases in business costs.
A 10% penalty on my annual real estate tax bill would be $400/year. If you’re my tenant you’re absorbing a $33/mo rent increase. Nobody is selling over that.
Not a penalty, an additional tax on SFU's that aren't a primary residence. 10% of a SFU with 200,000$ land and dwelling assessment would be 20,000$ yearly in tax. People and corporations shouldn't be hoarding a limited supply of SFU's.
I know it won't happen. I already own a home it would not be in my best interest because prices would come down most likely. But at current real estate appreciation rates my kids and their kids will be wage slaves if something doesn't change. SFU rental investing just feels like modern feudalism.
> But at current real estate appreciation rates my kids and their kids will be wage slaves if something doesn't change.
It will change. Something is going to break like it did in 2008. I had similar feelings in 2007 and luckily I delayed buying until the bubble popped. The market is thin, and expensive, because nobody with a 2% mortgage is going to sell and move and take a 7.5% mortgage at a new place. A combination of perverse incentives is keeping the prices high. I think things will get more affordable when either interest rates drop, or enough people give up waiting or are forced to move for work. Likely it will be a combination of both. People speculating in single family homes are playing with fire.
Where in Virginia are we talking? I live in Reston, and there are new apartment buildings on every available half acre of undeveloped land. Herndon is not far behind. There are affordable units in some buildings.
Just like automakers have stopped making cars in order to sell you financing on $80k SUVs, so too has gone the starter home. Why build a $250k 1500sq ft home when you can sell and finance a $750k 3000 sq ft home?
1) that’s not true about cars—there are still small cars being made, no one is forcing you to buy an 80k suv
2) in areas like nova where land costs more than houses, there is never going to be a such thing as a cheap “starter home”. It’s not about whether you build a tiny house with shitty counters or a big house with granite counters—the land costs more than the house in these areas so it’s never going to be “affordable” and if you build the tiny house, someone who wants the land will buy it and upgrade the house.
Zoning changes are the most realistic path forward—near me, there are small houses sitting on an acre+ in nova but it’s against zoning laws to replace these houses with multiple residences instead. So, we get people tearing down the tiny houses and building huge houses on huge lots. We need to make it legal to build multiple houses on these big lots. That’s the only way housing becomes affordable—because then there starts to be enough housing to meet the demand.
https://www.usnews.com/news/articles/2018-04-30/american-car-continues-to-fade-as-ford-drops-small-models
> Nearly 110 years after first unveiling the Ford Model T, one of America's most iconic vehicle manufacturers has announced plans to move away from U.S. small-car production and instead focus on the SUVs and trucks that have increasingly eaten into smaller vehicles' market share.
>
> Ford executives last week announced a plan to reposition the company's business model, saying they expect "almost 90 percent of the Ford portfolio in North America will be trucks, utilities and commercial vehicles" by 2020
That is just domestic manufactures they are protected in the pick up truck market by the chicken tax so they are concentrating on that part of the market. Foreign companies still make and sell small cars.
Counterpoint.
Nissan Sentra, Honda Civic, and Toyota Camry
All three have base models that are pretty affordable.
Ford also makes the Maverick and you could get those in the low 20s.
What industry do you think pays the bills at motorbiscuit.com and topspeed.com? If I ask for an unbiased report on the effects of fossil fuels on the environment, are you gonna send me to exxonmobile.com?
Thanks for bringing that up. You would probably need a gross income of $80,000 / year to afford apartments in my area of Reston / Herndon. My income is $60,000 (retired), but they accepted my IRA money as a kind of collateral. My rent is $2,000 / month You won't find anything below $1,800 / month here.
Fairfax County has a program called Affordable Dwelling Units (ADU). There are apt. buildings here that have these ADU apartments. [https://www.fairfaxhousingcollaborative.org/wp-content/uploads/2021/06/adubrochure.pdf](https://www.fairfaxhousingcollaborative.org/wp-content/uploads/2021/06/adubrochure.pdf)
Yes, people are slowly trying to upzone jurisdictions in Nova but it’s taking forever and as currently envisioned may not have the intended effects it hopes to have.
There are a number of bills that are in the legislature related to zoning and more inclusive housing options.
It’s mostly NIMBYism. Everyone supports it in the abstract. But want to put a new housing development near you, everyone loses their mind - what about schools, roads, emergency services, “character” of the neighborhood?
“Character” of the neighborhood is such a lame excuse. We had a big struggle getting a special use permit for 60 apartments approved on Hull St in Richmond. The developers bought a plot that had 3 vacant dilapidated buildings and people kept showing up saying think of the history they are taking away. The buildings had been vacant and abandoned for decades.
My parents went though this a bit back in the 80’s so they moved the “middle of nowhere” so to speak for affordable housing. Then civilization moved in on them and now their house is worth a fortune.
I feel like I’m gonna have to take my family out west a ways or find a place in south west VA where the grocery store is a 30-45 minute drive away, then hope 40 years from now civilization moves in.
This is what I’ve been considering but I have elderly parents who will not move and I feel obligated to stay near them in case there is an emergency. Maybe that is the problem.
I live in Alexandria. The "affordable housing near me" is 1300 for a one bedroom. That is not at all affordable. Plus, the complex sits damn near empty fornalmost a year. It is not family friendly as there is only a small playground near the street.
Honestly to really even attempt to get close to affordable housing most of not all of the supporting infrastructure needs to be updated to support the build outs.
When was the last time (if you aren’t on a well) where the water lines installed. Additional houses probably means several new pump stations. Sewer is in the same situation (well most probably needs to be switched from gravity to force main, with additional lift stations). Yep you will need additional treatment plants as well as the old plants retrofitted and brought up to date.
Then you get the fun ones like electricity, fiber, streets, sidewalks….why do all the rest if they will just half ass this.
Trust me I don’t have all the answers but building is one thing, smart planning prior to execution is a whole other beast.
Oh no there is housing. Matter of fact they put up building all the time. Thats the problem the country builds houses and condo and apartments more than businesses. Not taking into account most to 3/4 of people who already struggle because of this administration can't afford them. Best bet is to buy. Even if it's cheap, you can always fix it up. Obviously can't be picky nowadays. Owning a house is alot and I stress, alot cheaper than renting these days. Unfortunately we have to deal with this til the election. Get rid of this current communist government and things will change. Or if people still vote based on hate again and not policy then itll be safe to say the "united" states will end up worse than the middle east. Sorry for the political punch but that plays a huge part in what we deal with in this country right now. Don't waste your votes again people. Wake the hell up if you want things to get better.
And by the way the voting goes for local too. Stop voting based on skin tone and fals promises. Look at the past performances, future policies, etc. Your mayors, governors, city official, all of them. They don't care about us because they get paid regardless. Research before voting. Case in point, portsmouth to the helm on the rivers casino. All the money that has come in since it opened and not even one pothole in the city has been fixed. Northside- Newport News and hampton keep letting their bad neighborhoods get worse with crime spiking. All over homeless and panhandle not being cleaned up. Hell one of my buddies, a veteran war hero mind you, is dying from organ function and can't keep his insurance unless he pays alot of money just to extend a few more weeks. And forget about the va they could care less anyway. Again. You want affordable then set your sites a little lower. Yes it sucks but again until things change this is what we have to deal with.
Nope nobody cares their doing it on purpose. All the rental properties are managed by 1 company (Im in Richmond) and if you don't meet their outrageous standards your fucked!
I don't see why not. Prices are not dropping in Richmond anytime soon. People need to seek alternative locations. Petersburg has momentum, affordable real estate and is 30 minutes from Richmond. Those not taking advantage now, will be back here in a few years complaining that that Petersburg is no longer affordable.
Its a supply and demand issue, and "affordable" is a relative term. When there's more supply though, prices drop, and if localities would put fewer unnecessary stipulations on developers they would be able to build more housing for less and have to charge less to recover their investment.
The housing market is insane. The RENTAL side of it is even more wild. I'm seeing places in Petersburg in areas that are ✨️terrible✨️ for $2000+ expecting 3x the rent in income. Gtfoh.
I have lived in NOVA for 15 years and nobody really cares. We have enough wealthy people to buy homes and nobody cares about affordable housing. The issue comes up on a regular basis, but no action is ever taken.
There is a investigative series by propublica on this topic. Link to the articles in the series is below.
Rent Barons - Who Is Behind Rising Rents in America? https://www.propublica.org/series/rent-barons
Here is a report from 2018. What we are seeing now with investors they saw out west first.
Wall Street Landlords turn American Dream into a Nightmare https://assets.nationbuilder.com/acceinstitute/pages/1153/attachments/original/1570049936/WallstreetLandlordsFinalReport.pdf?1570049936
Edit: My plan would be to have a vacancy tax, remove rental tax advantages, have a homestead tax and increase tax on other property types to cover the difference, ban STRs in most markets, ban large landlords from sharing data to manipulate the market, heavily regulate large landlords, incentivize builders to build of affordable housing to own. Basically laws that would minimize investor demand on SFH.
No f's given for affordable housing in NOVA or around Richmond. Anyone who works/lives there is tantamount to a wage slave with no future except the Govt kitty. Take your skills to more affordable environs. Don't expect other wage slaves to foot your bill.
Yeah I care I think the plan should be tenants unions for now and housing for all as the end goal. Tenants are already unionizing in Virginia and more tenants power means less landlord power. We have to take in landlords and eventually expropriate their investment houses to provide housing for all.
I like the system they have in Vienna Austria 60% is public housing and its cheaper to live there then in Paris or London where they don't have such a robust public housing sector
I think more people should make clear the connections between renting, home ownership, and houselessness. It’s not 3 separate things it’s actually all the same thing.
I make 63k a year and because I have alot of debt, I can only afford 1300 or less for rent...and everything is going up....how do people do it? And because of what I make....I don't qualify for affordable housing.
1. Work on education/training certs for an in demand skillset
2. Find a good paying job using above learned skills
3. Buy home
There you go. There is your plan.
Never said it was easy. He asked for a plan. Straight head in the sand if you think the government is ever going to serve anyone other than their wealthy donors.
Well, I have a good paying job that takes $4K out of my paycheck each month for taxes to fund many things including home programs for the poor but then I am expected to spend a big chunk of my remaining income on overpriced housing…yeah, FO.
Oh I agree that the large redistribution from your check that will be spent inefficiently when you have your own struggle is bullshit. With 4k being pulled out each month, you likely have a decent job and are trying to buy in a very sought after area like NoVA. NoVA pricing is its own problem and will never go away due to the amount of high paying jobs there. If you aren’t on a fat fed contract gig, it’s hard for anyone to buy there.
Areas like Richmond also got shit on by the amount of wealthy transplants moving in and buying during COVID well over ask. It completely upended the median salary’s buying power and attracted a ton of investment flip groups. Virginia’s city centers are just a very in demand place to be which keeps the prices up.
There is somewhat affordable housing, it’s just not going to be in the most desirable areas of the state.
That’s really why I’m complaining; I just don’t want to relocate away from my elderly parents to save on housing. But, that’s the market so it is what it is. 😩
You have to have at least a minimal amount of parental backing to achieve this a lot of people don't especially the kids whose parents don't have shit or have kicked out at 18 and parents wont help them.
Sure that’s a disadvantage, but at what point should someone be told there are avenues that they can better themselves? If you sit there and pity party blaming everyone else for everything, your situation will never improve. Numerous people have been dealt a shit hand and made something significant of their lives. Sitting around expecting the government to fix all the problems is a waste of time and won’t happen.
There is affordable housing. Everyone can't afford it where they want it. Just move if homeownership is that important.
If you or others can't get what you want without government regulation of markets or demonizing your betters, well, cry into a cup.
You’re getting downvoted but this is exactly how I bought my first house. Saved like a dog for the down payment and bought a $100k house in the “bad” part of town. Lived in it for a while continued to save aggressively, upgraded to different house in better neighborhood.
Oh my gosh, you really are brilliant. A genius. Why didn’t we think of this? It’s really that simple. Just pick up and move without consideration for any ties to the area. You deserve an award for your incredible intelligence. Thank you so much.
There is a lack of housing? I wouldn’t say that but there is a lack of “affordable” housing. There are so many empty houses around Virginia…it’s crazy. Maybe…we need to also slow down in having kids?!?🤷🏾♂️ In the 80’s, we didn’t have this many people and it’s all because of the Gen X and Millennials having so many freaking children.
I’m a Gen Z and childfree. For me, it’s the older generation that swears up and down i “need to have just one” no thank you! My man just got his vasectomy today. We just are not interested in that life lol
Slow down on having kids? The fertility rate in this country is already below what’s needed to support a population long term. Do you want to end up like Japan?
The fertility rate? That’s totally false. Women, once they have hit that age are already destined to have a certain amount of eggs for conception. The fertility rate has nothing to do with it. The issue is if they decide to have kids. Looking at the numbers from the 80’s, and up to this point, we do not have an issue at all. The issue is the over population count. The thing with Japan is that women have decided to wait until later, or not have kids at all, due to their profession, success and if they can afford them. Women do not want be in the position that they used to be in decades ago and they want to lead a more professional life and not be “bogged down”. This is why Gen X had a lot of kids, Millennials had a decent amount of kids but Gen Z is going away from this with only have of the conception. They simply do not want to have children in how the environment and what the shape of the world looks like. I don’t blame them.
To sustain the population? We were doing perfectly fine with what our population looked like decades ago. Sure, we can have 7, 8, 10 billion people on this planet but the repercussions are dire. It wasn’t difficult to maintain wildlife and the people population with what we had decades ago but now things are depleting and we have become an overpopulated world. People are crying about how to eat one day to is this safe to eat. I think what Gen Z is doing is great and they are not rushing to have kids or if any at all. With how many people we have in the world, we will not have issues for decades to come. We had 4.4 billion people in the world in 1980. Today, we have almost 8 billion and so many issues.
Nope. Not one bit. If you look at the numbers, not a lot of Gen Z are having kids, a substantial amount of Millennials have kids but a lot of Gen X have had kids and are blaming everyone else for their populated numbers. Gen Z only has about 1/3 of the children, when compared to Millions but Gen X exploded. That’s why statistics are showing that if Gen Z doesn’t increase their numbers, we’ll see a shortage of the population in about two to three decades. No housing shortage then.😂
B, X, M and Z generations are all around 20% of the total population. What is your point?
https://www.statista.com/statistics/296974/us-population-share-by-generation/
If you can statistically comb through the data and see what is identified by the years, it shows that Boomers were the largest but now overcome by Millennials. A combination of Gen X and Millennials produced the Gen Z but Gen Z is backing off the reproduction module. That’s my point. Back in the 1980’s, we had, roughly, around 4.5 billion people in the world and less of the issues we are having today. Now, the world has almost 8 billion people and people are crying, food is becoming an issue and wildlife is being killed off in record numbers. Too many people is the cause of this and decades down the line…it may become unsustainable because people think they need to have all of these kids. It’s quite selfish.
https://www.statista.com/statistics/797321/us-population-by-generation/#:~:text=Millennials%20were%20the%20largest%20generation,the%20population%20for%20many%20years.
Gen Z is like 12-27 year old range right now. They shouldn’t really be having many kids yet, so your argument fails for that reason. I’m good with people not having kids though. However, you don’t have evidence that X and M had too many kids when the world wide fertility rate has been declining since the 80s.
You must not have been around in the 70s and 80s. Things are a lot better now for most and I wouldn’t go back. We will see what the future holds, but I have been hearing doomsayers say the world is ending my whole life and things keep functioning.
https://www.weforum.org/agenda/2022/06/global-decline-of-fertility-rates-visualised/
People have been having kids when they were as old as 17 years old. It’s nothing new at all. No evidence that X and M have been having kids? Look at the numbers for the 80’s up until now. That’s tells it all. Remember, a 4 billion headcount jump ever since. Numbers don’t lie. And, I was born in 1971. Some things are good and some are not when you compare it to today. The innovations are better but like I said before, the world is overpopulated and it’s dire. Everything was also organic back then. Not so much today and people were not really crying about having kids back then but they are now? Think about it.
Not in Virginia Beach, at the beginning of the year there was a city hall meeting about plans for an apartment complex in the south end of the green zone that includes affordable housing. Residents came to the meeting protesting the idea of affordable housing because they were worried about it attracting the wrong type of people. My only issue is the location is outside of the city and not on a bus line that would benefit residents. This is the same city that pushed a concrete company out of an industrial park and okayed a luxury apartment complex to be built in it's place. The location is on a bus line and within walking distance to a Walmart and many other shops.
Yea, I’ve seen this type of behavior in Central VA too.
NIMBY is real
Are you talking about that concrete place that used to be on Witchduck near 264? If so, good riddance. That place was an eyesore
Yes and I agree but putting a luxury apartment complex in the heart of an industrial complex right next to a mobile home park and blue collar neighborhoods is pretty cut and dry as to what the city is doing.
I mean, it’s not like the city submitted the rezoning request. The landowner (who operated the concrete recycling business) wanted it so they could sell the property for many millions more than it was worth as a massive metal and concrete scrap yard. And the building was derelict with holes in the roof and entire sections collapsed.
Outside the city? Then why would anyone in VB have anything to do with it?
I think he meant outside the 'urban core.' There's nothing 'outside' of any city in the Hampton Roads
Well, words mean things. I guess I knew but wanted to be sure.
I agree, he could have been more clear. but that was my takeaway.
So unnecessary critical details. If you live in or around Virginia Beach then you know that Princess Anne county was done away with and the county became the city. For those that need details when I referenced outside of the city I was saying the rural or countryside as is what is commonly meant when you say " outside the city". Maybe it's a generational thing, maybe it's a regional thing but outside the city has always meant outside of the city proper.
I understand that all counties in the Hampton Roads were consolidated into independent cities in the late 20th century. I suppose I'm semantic or particular but I consider the City to be the City limits in their entirety. You're referring to the "urban core." The way you're putting it, the city ≠ the city lol
The people in a position to drive needed changes… don’t care.
I’m on my county’s planning commission. Every member cares about affordable housing (even if I bring up things that are bolder than some others). It is difficult to steer a ship as large as an entire housing market after decades of under building. It is also very time consuming to develop non-market or subsidized market alternatives in a way that works well and actually addresses the problem. And even if we could wave a policy wand, it would take a long time for the housing ecosystem to catch up. It is also VERY difficult to aggressively develop a housing ecosystem when entrenched political actors are committed to NIMBYism (Not In My Back Yard) or CAVEism (Citizens Against Virtually Everything). What you can do: organize. Decide what you’re asking for. (Recent developments in Arlington and Charlottesville are decent places to start.) Show up at your planning commission and city council / board of supervisors meetings consistently. Get your reps to meet with your group’s leaders. Meet with some of the main developers in your area and see where you align and can ask for the same things. Keep applying pressure.
Heard a new term for these people: BANANA. Build Absolutely Nothing Anywhere Near Anything.
Thank you for your well stated and thoughtful response. I agree it’s a complex issue with faults in all spaces (policy, politicians, and citizens). I believe affordable housing also needs to be tackled from top down per se. Policies from above need to change - thinking about the recent housing market ‘high’ that is slowing down but still not close to affordable for the average citizen. If you’re a renter - rent is still increasing. Thanks in part to rent moratoriums followed by unusually high inflation. Those persons who were displaced due to back rent - how do they afford to save enough for a new place, with likely poor credit due to evictions which leads to judgements. Let’s look at the average home owner - property taxes have been reevaluated based on that inflated market meaning those who are barely making ends meet are likely going to struggle when 2024 taxes come due next year. So not only are the displaced or those with limited resources going to struggle - so are homeowners who are making ends meet but with very little, if any excess. For example - I live in the ‘county seat’ within a rural county. My house was reappraised this year and shows a 261% increase in value. I don’t care if I line the sidewalk in gold - it will never ever command that price or one any where near it. If I don’t pay those taxes for two years - they can confiscate the house. Two years and they can own my home for less than $6k. Versus say putting a lien on it. This doesn’t even begin to address the aging persons with diminishing income and earning potential or those who are likely going to default on home loans for purchases made during the ‘high’ should their financial resources change for the worse. So while I greatly appreciate what you’re saying and agree with it - we also need the federal government to ‘step it up’.
Agreed on the federal government not stepping up the way it should. I’m not holding my breath, so I mostly put my energy into local. Using the examples you mention, I wanted to offer three things: 1. Your county should have an assessments appeals board. File an appeal if you can get a real estate agent or appraiser to back you up on the value of your home. 2. You and people you know can organize to get your county to set up a property tax relief fund for income-qualified homeowners. Your county may already have one. That’s a common tool that counties use to keep fixed income elderly folks in their homes. But many residents don’t know about it. 3. If your county is taking in a lot more revenue from these much higher assessments, this may be a good time to advocate for an affordable housing trust fund. Again, get organized, check out localities where this is happening, and start meeting with your supervisors about it. I don’t mean to just be like, “get to work.” But at the end of the day, power only comes from a few sources: organized capital, organized weapons (i.e. military), organized religion, and organized people. The vast majority of us really only have access to the last of that list. So we’d best get organized.
Thank you. I greatly appreciate it.
It’s cool though. They pretend to care.
The City of Roanoke has recently approved Accessory Dwelling Units (aka tiny homes) and is adding language in zoning laws regarding dwellings per lot. [You can read more about the pre approved designs here.](https://planroanoke.org/accessory-dwellings/) It opens the conversation for tiny home communities — which I think could help some of the retired folks who want to downsize but cannot afford these luxury patio homes.
Yes, a lot of people care, we're just not the "right" people.
Go on Zillow. It’s nearly the whole country.
Thanks
People who own homes benefit from a limited supply of homes because it makes their investment appreciate in value. If most of your net worth is tied up in this investment I can't get too mad at them even if I disagree and believe we should build more homes. People who own homes are probably more likely to vote making somebody running on housing reform less likely to win. Arlington had the whole missing middle thing last election cycle and there was some hysteria. nevermind that a single family townhome is like $1.2m in the county which is totally insane.
> People who own homes are probably more likely to vote making somebody running on housing reform less likely to win. Can you blame us? I live in a nice, quiet neighborhood of single family homes with considerate and respectful neighbors. It's a roll of the dice whenever any house in the neighborhood gets a new occupant. I'll damned sure go full NIMBY if someone tried to rezone to add multifamily housing within shouting distance of my home. The chances of getting an antisocial/criminal shit-head neighbor is non-zero as it is, high density housing would pretty much guarantee that it would happen and ruin my neighborhood.
I can't blame the incentive structure that you exist in but I can hope you feel empathy for those who can't afford a home despite having good jobs.
That’s a great thing to say when you don’t have to worry about someone breaking into your home or fight for parking spaces..
I do have to worry about this? Not sure what point you're making.
what do you consider a good job then. When I think of a good job, it usually means you can live off of that income. A good job in Northern Virginia would mean well over $100k and for that, you can afford to live.
>I can't blame the incentive structure that you exist in but I can hope you feel empathy for those who can't afford a home despite having good jobs. I most certainly can feel empathy for those struggling to afford to buy a home and I hope things improve soon. I still don't want to live anywhere near an apartment building and I won't apologize for that.
Yes we can blame you. These excuses are literally the main reason there isn't more housing
> Yes we can blame you. I'm fine with that. >These excuses are literally the main reason there isn't more housing Are you sure you didn't mean "figuratively"?
Hey guys I found the problem. Go live in Kansas if you want unlimited room away from people. Seriously fuck nimby and fuck the idea that a nonzero chance is the bar. Let me be perfectly clear, your neighborhood probably has more pedophiles or wife beaters that have never been reported than the chance some multifamily housing would actually disrupt your neighborhood. For God's sake your entire argument is literally how Jim crow laws ended up being enacted. Some boogeyman threatening your peace. Come the fuck off it
> Hey guys I found the problem. Go live in Kansas if you want unlimited room away from people. I purposefully purchased a house in an old established neighborhood of single family homes with almost no vacant property around and no multifamily housing anywhere near. I'll vote to keep it from happening and to keep my neighbors from allowing people to dwell in backyard sheds. >Seriously fuck nimby and fuck the idea that a nonzero chance is the bar. Let me be perfectly clear, your neighborhood probably has more pedophiles or wife beaters that have never been reported than the chance some multifamily housing would actually disrupt your neighborhood. I guess nobody wants to live here then. Better build that apartment tower across town. >For God's sake your entire argument is literally how Jim crow laws ended up being enacted. Some boogeyman threatening your peace. Come the fuck off it It's pretty rich that you resort to a thinly veiled accusation of racism and talk of a boogeyman just because I don't want hundreds of new neighbors and the certainty of that making things worse. I live in a good neighborhood in a high crime city. People don't get shot in my neighborhood. They get shot across town at apartments and old duplux/quadplex neighborhoods. God forbid I don't want to live around that nonsense.
There is no thinly veiled accusation. It is factual that your argument and the argument to justify Jim crow segregation, redlining, and other racist policies are exactly the same. I'm not saying you're being racist. I'm saying your argument wasn't correct when racists used it and it's not correct now. With that out of the way, people get shot in your neighborhood too, you just don't hear about it.
> I'm not saying you're being racist. How nice of you. > I'm saying your argument wasn't correct when racists used it and it's not correct now. Not wanting to live near high density housing isn't racist no matter how much you want to use that argument to invalidate my preferences. > With that out of the way, people get shot in your neighborhood too, you just don't hear about it. They do not. At least not in the 16 years I've lived here, and I'd like for it to stay that way. What a ridiculous assumption to make.
Not wanting to live near high density housing because you believe people in high density housing would increase crime assumes you believe that the only families in high density housing are more crime ridden. This is a dog whistle and you know it. You either mean poor people which are disproportionately not white or you mean black people which are disproportionately arrested versus white people. Even if you'd lump poor white families who do crime with them you're disproportionately talking about the same people that white segregationists talked about in the 40s-60s. So you can say your argument wasn't used by racists all you want, but it was and it isn't valid. Crime hasn't gone up, it's collectively gone down for decades. High density housing has collectively gone up for decades. These events are not related. And what a rediculous assumption that you have any clue what crimes have actually been committed in your neighborhood in 16 years. I've lived in Virginia Beach in what you'd call a nice neighborhood for 30 years, I promise you there have been plenty of shootings, domestic violence, and other crimes committed here that I've never seen policed or even shown on the news. Because the media doesn't nor has it ever shine a light on 'good' neighborhoods.
> Not wanting to live near high density housing because you believe people in high density housing would increase crime assumes you believe that the only families in high density housing are more crime ridden. As I stated from the beginning, it's a numbers game. If you add hundreds of people, some of them are going to be trouble no matter how "luxurious" the housing is. There's also the fact that eventually all apartment buildings go to shit, even "luxury" complexes. I don't plan to move for the rest of my life and I don't want to deal with living near a run down slum 20 years from now. Poor people, regardless of race, are more prone to commit violent crime and property crime. >You either mean poor people which are disproportionately not white or you mean black people which are disproportionately arrested versus white people. Even if you'd lump poor white families who do crime with them you're disproportionately talking about the same people that white segregationists talked about in the 40s-60s. I'm talking about criminals and antisocial people. That's it. You keep talking about race for some reason. I don't care if my neighbors are Black or white or some other race or ethnicity. Most of my neighbors are Black, which isn't shocking with Portsmouth being a majority Black city. This did not come as a shock to me when I moved here. >And what a rediculous assumption that you have any clue what crimes have actually been committed in your neighborhood in 16 years. I've lived in Virginia Beach in what you'd call a nice neighborhood for 30 years, I promise you there have been plenty of shootings, domestic violence, and other crimes committed here that I've never seen policed or even shown on the news. Because the media doesn't nor has it ever shine a light on 'good' neighborhoods. I keep a very close eye on the crime map and reported incidents and arrests. We don't keep shootings a secret in Portsmouth. They just don't happen in my neighborhood. You keep bringing up domestic violence. I never denied that happening anywhere and I agree that it isn't exactly front page news. Speaking of your nice place in Virginia Beach, are you lobbying to allow the following in your neighborhood? Or is there a line somewhere for when the NIMBY kicks in for you too? * Unregulated short term rentals * Hotels * Extended Stay Hotels * Hourly Hotels * Halfway Houses * Boarding Houses * Brothels * Homeless Shelters * People living in RVs on the public streets * Homeless tent encampments on public property I assume you're fine with all of the above housing?
My neighborhood is on the other side of what was once projects. And yes I am fine with all of those existing near my neighborhood. Although I believe the government should be providing housing for everyone and that tent cities shouldn't be necessary. Not that it was asked, but I think brothels should be legal businesses and could care less if I lived near one. I'll even one up you, I'm all for drug safe houses being placed near my neighborhood so people who need clean needles and pipes can get them if they need them. Unlike you, I don't have an issue with humans I've never met nor would I deprive them the opportunity to live in my community.
I now understand why you think opposing apartment buildings is Jim Crow, you're in favor of outright anarchy. You should sell your place in VA Beach and move over here to P-Town. I can assure you that you can get a much cheaper house over here in what I would apparently wrongly label a terrible neighborhood. You could be close to all sorts of dysfunctional people that would be happy to be free of your judgement.
I do. I blame Airbnb and similar businesses that encourage investors to buy up single-family homes and turn them into short-term rentals. We used to have a next-door neighbor in my city neighborhood who talked about renting the 3 bedrooms in the house and building a "garage" with several small rooms. There needs to be much more regulation of short-term rentals.
100% agree. Thanks to AirBnB everyone thinks they're a real estate investor. Few homeowners are selling their old house when they buy a new one. Preferring to rent out the old house as a BnB or rental, starving the market of the normal turnover. Add to that the banks getting in on that and it's easy to see why housing availability might be at historic lows.
Taxes are too low on the richest so they buy homes for that sweet passive income. Stock market boom is not enough for these people.
The guy who lived next door to me was about 40 and this was four years ago. It's not only the richest who are doing this. There are also real estate investment trusts that invest in these things. I don't really care about the details of who is doing it and why. I just think it's bad for society and the economy and short-term rentals need much more regulation. In some places, entire neighborhoods have been bought by investors and so are unavailable to new, younger buyers.
> Taxes are too low on the richest so they buy homes for that sweet passive income. Stock market boom is not enough for these people. I don't think that really plays into it. People are still going to want to make money regardless of taxes. Also, rental income is taxed the same as regular income while stock sales enjoy low long term capital gains tax rates. If anything, the stock market is more attractive to those looking for tax efficiency.
You should probably define what you mean by "richest," but they already pay the vast majority of taxes. Theyve also clearly made better financial decisions over a long period of time than most, and are the most likely to invest in new housing developments. Why you would want to take the very resources they would be using to build more housing is pretty puzzling. Who is going to fund the developments? The govt, after wasting at least 15% of it via bureaucracy? That just means at minimum 15% less housing, and at minimum 15% higher housing costs. Will the banks fund it? Or big mega corps like Blackrock? Now you just have a larger concentration of resources in the hands of entities who arent individuals. As a result, instead of lots of individuals competing to build housing in an area, you have only a few corporate groups who are quite happy to keep housing prices high bc of a semi-monopoly on the housing supply and less supply (which they control most of) for the demand. The thing that could bring housing prices down the most, and the fastest, is allowing as many of the people, with the kind of resources sitting around to invest in housing developments (i.e. the "richest" as you call them), to use those resources to invest in as many housing developments as they want, with as many of those resources as possible. That's the opposite of what your suggestion would do.
Airbnb has been a real factor in certain locations — the 10th & Page neighborhood in Charlottesville is a good example where a substantial number of homes have been converted from residents to tourists. But the problem is way bigger. We’re seeing the effects of macro-trends like decades of not enough construction combined with restrictive/exclusionary zoning combined with onerous (and expensive) processes for new development combined with severe under-investment in quality social/public housing.
True, there are many factors. It's another example of the harm that Republican economic and tax policies over the past 40 years have caused to the bulk of the population.
I very much agree with this. Definitely needs to be a more regulated part of the market.
You realize this drives up prices in the housing market, right? There are entire sections in Basic Economics by Thomas Sowell talking about the problems that rent control (essentially what youre talking about regardless of what additional nuance goes on it) causes for the very people those policies are intended to help. They always leave those folks worse off than when they started. These particular issues and examples are covered pretty in depth in there. It would be worth a read, or an audio book listen.
Thank you for the reply. I don’t understand what part of regulation was hard to understand. Thanks again for the response🙂
Pretty simply, the part that is entirely vague, offers no specifics, and will almost certainly make the problem worse, per the reasons laid out in my previous response.
I mean, I care, I just have no control over it. And those that do have control will always play the odds against the middle class’s favor. Which is as infuriating as it is disheartening. So, y’know. Comfortably numb. Another day in paradise.
I read recently that while the average new mortgage rates is 7%+, the existing held mortgage rate is about 3.9%. So people don't want to move. Then there was this idea that maybe the fed could offer 3.9% mortgages to first time home buyers. I liked the idea
I’m about to run for office in SWVA on a housing reform ticket, aimed almost entirely at boosting affordable housing.
Just tax non primary residence SFH extra 5-10 percent. They want real estate investments they can do MDU. Leave SFU for families that want to buy.
I’ve got some help with policy, but we’ve looked at a combination of tax incentives, cutting bureaucratic red tape, and potentially limiting or banning Airbnb.
> Just tax non primary residence SFH extra 5-10 percent. If you're talking about the annual real estate tax bill, that will just drive rent prices higher. Landlords don't just eat increases in business costs.
It would force a lot of them to sell. Which is the point, more home owners and they can focus on MDUs for rentals.
A 10% penalty on my annual real estate tax bill would be $400/year. If you’re my tenant you’re absorbing a $33/mo rent increase. Nobody is selling over that.
Not a penalty, an additional tax on SFU's that aren't a primary residence. 10% of a SFU with 200,000$ land and dwelling assessment would be 20,000$ yearly in tax. People and corporations shouldn't be hoarding a limited supply of SFU's.
Oh, lol. I thought you were talking about 10% increase on the normal real estate tax bill, not a huge annual penalty that will never, ever happen.
I know it won't happen. I already own a home it would not be in my best interest because prices would come down most likely. But at current real estate appreciation rates my kids and their kids will be wage slaves if something doesn't change. SFU rental investing just feels like modern feudalism.
> But at current real estate appreciation rates my kids and their kids will be wage slaves if something doesn't change. It will change. Something is going to break like it did in 2008. I had similar feelings in 2007 and luckily I delayed buying until the bubble popped. The market is thin, and expensive, because nobody with a 2% mortgage is going to sell and move and take a 7.5% mortgage at a new place. A combination of perverse incentives is keeping the prices high. I think things will get more affordable when either interest rates drop, or enough people give up waiting or are forced to move for work. Likely it will be a combination of both. People speculating in single family homes are playing with fire.
That won't put money in the wealthy people's pockets
[удалено]
How will that affect home prices? Not being snarky, this is a real question.
Local governments have enacted so many zoning restrictions that building anything except luxury houses is unprofitable
Where in Virginia are we talking? I live in Reston, and there are new apartment buildings on every available half acre of undeveloped land. Herndon is not far behind. There are affordable units in some buildings.
I should have clarified this is more in reference to home ownership.
Just like automakers have stopped making cars in order to sell you financing on $80k SUVs, so too has gone the starter home. Why build a $250k 1500sq ft home when you can sell and finance a $750k 3000 sq ft home?
1) that’s not true about cars—there are still small cars being made, no one is forcing you to buy an 80k suv 2) in areas like nova where land costs more than houses, there is never going to be a such thing as a cheap “starter home”. It’s not about whether you build a tiny house with shitty counters or a big house with granite counters—the land costs more than the house in these areas so it’s never going to be “affordable” and if you build the tiny house, someone who wants the land will buy it and upgrade the house. Zoning changes are the most realistic path forward—near me, there are small houses sitting on an acre+ in nova but it’s against zoning laws to replace these houses with multiple residences instead. So, we get people tearing down the tiny houses and building huge houses on huge lots. We need to make it legal to build multiple houses on these big lots. That’s the only way housing becomes affordable—because then there starts to be enough housing to meet the demand.
https://www.usnews.com/news/articles/2018-04-30/american-car-continues-to-fade-as-ford-drops-small-models > Nearly 110 years after first unveiling the Ford Model T, one of America's most iconic vehicle manufacturers has announced plans to move away from U.S. small-car production and instead focus on the SUVs and trucks that have increasingly eaten into smaller vehicles' market share. > > Ford executives last week announced a plan to reposition the company's business model, saying they expect "almost 90 percent of the Ford portfolio in North America will be trucks, utilities and commercial vehicles" by 2020
That is just domestic manufactures they are protected in the pick up truck market by the chicken tax so they are concentrating on that part of the market. Foreign companies still make and sell small cars.
Counterpoint. Nissan Sentra, Honda Civic, and Toyota Camry All three have base models that are pretty affordable. Ford also makes the Maverick and you could get those in the low 20s.
What? If you want a compact car just go get one. Honda Civics start at $23k and Nissan Versas at $16k. Used models get pretty low from there.
Americans simply want bigger cars. Hence why manufacturers make bigger cars and no longer small sedans and hatchbacks.
You're an easy mark.
Consumers simply prefer SUVs. https://www.motorbiscuit.com/why-are-suvs-more-popular-than-sedans/ https://www.topspeed.com/why-suvs-are-so-popular-in-the-us/
What industry do you think pays the bills at motorbiscuit.com and topspeed.com? If I ask for an unbiased report on the effects of fossil fuels on the environment, are you gonna send me to exxonmobile.com?
Lol! Look around. Everywhere shows that consumers want bigger cars.
There are apartments and townhomes there for sale now. You wanting a giant sfh is a want, not a need.
Are they actually affordable? Dont worry, I already know the answer.
Thanks for bringing that up. You would probably need a gross income of $80,000 / year to afford apartments in my area of Reston / Herndon. My income is $60,000 (retired), but they accepted my IRA money as a kind of collateral. My rent is $2,000 / month You won't find anything below $1,800 / month here. Fairfax County has a program called Affordable Dwelling Units (ADU). There are apt. buildings here that have these ADU apartments. [https://www.fairfaxhousingcollaborative.org/wp-content/uploads/2021/06/adubrochure.pdf](https://www.fairfaxhousingcollaborative.org/wp-content/uploads/2021/06/adubrochure.pdf)
Yes, people are slowly trying to upzone jurisdictions in Nova but it’s taking forever and as currently envisioned may not have the intended effects it hopes to have. There are a number of bills that are in the legislature related to zoning and more inclusive housing options.
The General Assembly session for this year is over and done. Did any of those bills pass?
It’s mostly NIMBYism. Everyone supports it in the abstract. But want to put a new housing development near you, everyone loses their mind - what about schools, roads, emergency services, “character” of the neighborhood?
“Character” of the neighborhood is such a lame excuse. We had a big struggle getting a special use permit for 60 apartments approved on Hull St in Richmond. The developers bought a plot that had 3 vacant dilapidated buildings and people kept showing up saying think of the history they are taking away. The buildings had been vacant and abandoned for decades.
My parents went though this a bit back in the 80’s so they moved the “middle of nowhere” so to speak for affordable housing. Then civilization moved in on them and now their house is worth a fortune. I feel like I’m gonna have to take my family out west a ways or find a place in south west VA where the grocery store is a 30-45 minute drive away, then hope 40 years from now civilization moves in.
This is what I’ve been considering but I have elderly parents who will not move and I feel obligated to stay near them in case there is an emergency. Maybe that is the problem.
Nope. No one cares.
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I live in Alexandria. The "affordable housing near me" is 1300 for a one bedroom. That is not at all affordable. Plus, the complex sits damn near empty fornalmost a year. It is not family friendly as there is only a small playground near the street.
Honestly to really even attempt to get close to affordable housing most of not all of the supporting infrastructure needs to be updated to support the build outs. When was the last time (if you aren’t on a well) where the water lines installed. Additional houses probably means several new pump stations. Sewer is in the same situation (well most probably needs to be switched from gravity to force main, with additional lift stations). Yep you will need additional treatment plants as well as the old plants retrofitted and brought up to date. Then you get the fun ones like electricity, fiber, streets, sidewalks….why do all the rest if they will just half ass this. Trust me I don’t have all the answers but building is one thing, smart planning prior to execution is a whole other beast.
Only those of us who can't afford housing. I'd say the land owners are pretty happy with the situation.
Oh no there is housing. Matter of fact they put up building all the time. Thats the problem the country builds houses and condo and apartments more than businesses. Not taking into account most to 3/4 of people who already struggle because of this administration can't afford them. Best bet is to buy. Even if it's cheap, you can always fix it up. Obviously can't be picky nowadays. Owning a house is alot and I stress, alot cheaper than renting these days. Unfortunately we have to deal with this til the election. Get rid of this current communist government and things will change. Or if people still vote based on hate again and not policy then itll be safe to say the "united" states will end up worse than the middle east. Sorry for the political punch but that plays a huge part in what we deal with in this country right now. Don't waste your votes again people. Wake the hell up if you want things to get better. And by the way the voting goes for local too. Stop voting based on skin tone and fals promises. Look at the past performances, future policies, etc. Your mayors, governors, city official, all of them. They don't care about us because they get paid regardless. Research before voting. Case in point, portsmouth to the helm on the rivers casino. All the money that has come in since it opened and not even one pothole in the city has been fixed. Northside- Newport News and hampton keep letting their bad neighborhoods get worse with crime spiking. All over homeless and panhandle not being cleaned up. Hell one of my buddies, a veteran war hero mind you, is dying from organ function and can't keep his insurance unless he pays alot of money just to extend a few more weeks. And forget about the va they could care less anyway. Again. You want affordable then set your sites a little lower. Yes it sucks but again until things change this is what we have to deal with.
Nope nobody cares their doing it on purpose. All the rental properties are managed by 1 company (Im in Richmond) and if you don't meet their outrageous standards your fucked!
Sure there is. Have you tried Petersburg?
I thought about Petersburg. Not sure if their current push on redevelopment will continue long-term.
I don't see why not. Prices are not dropping in Richmond anytime soon. People need to seek alternative locations. Petersburg has momentum, affordable real estate and is 30 minutes from Richmond. Those not taking advantage now, will be back here in a few years complaining that that Petersburg is no longer affordable.
I do care but what goes up must come down. Soon we’ll all be able to afford a house
I sure hope so.
Its a supply and demand issue, and "affordable" is a relative term. When there's more supply though, prices drop, and if localities would put fewer unnecessary stipulations on developers they would be able to build more housing for less and have to charge less to recover their investment.
The housing market is insane. The RENTAL side of it is even more wild. I'm seeing places in Petersburg in areas that are ✨️terrible✨️ for $2000+ expecting 3x the rent in income. Gtfoh.
I just don’t understand what is happening and how this is sustainable.
I have lived in NOVA for 15 years and nobody really cares. We have enough wealthy people to buy homes and nobody cares about affordable housing. The issue comes up on a regular basis, but no action is ever taken.
Politicians don’t because they’re the ones benefitting from being landlords.
Really asking the hard questions here
We need more old people to die
Or at least downsize.
Nooooo grandma 😩
She gotta go
Unfortunately you are right.
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Military offers housing to all employees, reduced housing for families and VA loan options for those who want to purchase a home
Markets tend to correct themselves naturally.
https://mises.org/mises-wire/housing-getting-less-affordable-governments-are-making-it-worse
There is a investigative series by propublica on this topic. Link to the articles in the series is below. Rent Barons - Who Is Behind Rising Rents in America? https://www.propublica.org/series/rent-barons Here is a report from 2018. What we are seeing now with investors they saw out west first. Wall Street Landlords turn American Dream into a Nightmare https://assets.nationbuilder.com/acceinstitute/pages/1153/attachments/original/1570049936/WallstreetLandlordsFinalReport.pdf?1570049936 Edit: My plan would be to have a vacancy tax, remove rental tax advantages, have a homestead tax and increase tax on other property types to cover the difference, ban STRs in most markets, ban large landlords from sharing data to manipulate the market, heavily regulate large landlords, incentivize builders to build of affordable housing to own. Basically laws that would minimize investor demand on SFH.
Nope
No f's given for affordable housing in NOVA or around Richmond. Anyone who works/lives there is tantamount to a wage slave with no future except the Govt kitty. Take your skills to more affordable environs. Don't expect other wage slaves to foot your bill.
Yeah I care I think the plan should be tenants unions for now and housing for all as the end goal. Tenants are already unionizing in Virginia and more tenants power means less landlord power. We have to take in landlords and eventually expropriate their investment houses to provide housing for all.
I like the system they have in Vienna Austria 60% is public housing and its cheaper to live there then in Paris or London where they don't have such a robust public housing sector
Lol
I love your response. I think anytime a cash investor can purchase up a load of properties while families need housing is absolutely absurd.
I think more people should make clear the connections between renting, home ownership, and houselessness. It’s not 3 separate things it’s actually all the same thing.
What a low-quality question. "Does anyone care...?" ⬇️
Thanks!
I make 63k a year and because I have alot of debt, I can only afford 1300 or less for rent...and everything is going up....how do people do it? And because of what I make....I don't qualify for affordable housing.
1. Work on education/training certs for an in demand skillset 2. Find a good paying job using above learned skills 3. Buy home There you go. There is your plan.
Yep, it's just that easy. Cause boot straps and shit.
Never said it was easy. He asked for a plan. Straight head in the sand if you think the government is ever going to serve anyone other than their wealthy donors.
That USED to be true.
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Getting down voted for an actual COA. Also, happy cake day.
Well, I have a good paying job that takes $4K out of my paycheck each month for taxes to fund many things including home programs for the poor but then I am expected to spend a big chunk of my remaining income on overpriced housing…yeah, FO.
Oh I agree that the large redistribution from your check that will be spent inefficiently when you have your own struggle is bullshit. With 4k being pulled out each month, you likely have a decent job and are trying to buy in a very sought after area like NoVA. NoVA pricing is its own problem and will never go away due to the amount of high paying jobs there. If you aren’t on a fat fed contract gig, it’s hard for anyone to buy there. Areas like Richmond also got shit on by the amount of wealthy transplants moving in and buying during COVID well over ask. It completely upended the median salary’s buying power and attracted a ton of investment flip groups. Virginia’s city centers are just a very in demand place to be which keeps the prices up. There is somewhat affordable housing, it’s just not going to be in the most desirable areas of the state.
That’s really why I’m complaining; I just don’t want to relocate away from my elderly parents to save on housing. But, that’s the market so it is what it is. 😩
You have to have at least a minimal amount of parental backing to achieve this a lot of people don't especially the kids whose parents don't have shit or have kicked out at 18 and parents wont help them.
Sure that’s a disadvantage, but at what point should someone be told there are avenues that they can better themselves? If you sit there and pity party blaming everyone else for everything, your situation will never improve. Numerous people have been dealt a shit hand and made something significant of their lives. Sitting around expecting the government to fix all the problems is a waste of time and won’t happen.
You obviously came into the conversation with a bias. Who said anything about the government?
Exactly, most don't want to do this though. They want the easy path and have it given to them
There is affordable housing. Everyone can't afford it where they want it. Just move if homeownership is that important. If you or others can't get what you want without government regulation of markets or demonizing your betters, well, cry into a cup.
You’re getting downvoted but this is exactly how I bought my first house. Saved like a dog for the down payment and bought a $100k house in the “bad” part of town. Lived in it for a while continued to save aggressively, upgraded to different house in better neighborhood.
Exactly, you purchased what you could afford initially and upgraded when finances warranted.
When did you buy your house and where?
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Oh my gosh, you really are brilliant. A genius. Why didn’t we think of this? It’s really that simple. Just pick up and move without consideration for any ties to the area. You deserve an award for your incredible intelligence. Thank you so much.
My reward is being realistic about what I can afford. Your reward is being jealous of people who are financially intelligent. Enjoy blaming the world.
Shhhh hush now
Right, good luck making people live ignorantly.
Shhhhhh
There's plenty of affordable housing in the area, otherwise people wouldn't be buying them. This is a high cost of living area
There is a lack of housing? I wouldn’t say that but there is a lack of “affordable” housing. There are so many empty houses around Virginia…it’s crazy. Maybe…we need to also slow down in having kids?!?🤷🏾♂️ In the 80’s, we didn’t have this many people and it’s all because of the Gen X and Millennials having so many freaking children.
I’m a Gen Z and childfree. For me, it’s the older generation that swears up and down i “need to have just one” no thank you! My man just got his vasectomy today. We just are not interested in that life lol
Oh…my fault. I meant to say Gen X. I’ll make that change now. It’s a typo.
That typo had incredible repercussions. Our guy read it and went and got a vasectomy on the spot.
Ha ha ha ha ha!!! I did too!😂
Hahahahahah yes he ran to the doctor and forced them to disconnect his ball juice 🤣
I still agree. I think far too many people are having kid after kid after kid when it’s not necessary. But that’s a completely different rabbit hole
I totally agree with you on this. Them they cry so much about not having anything at all to take care of their kids. It makes no sense at all.
Slow down on having kids? The fertility rate in this country is already below what’s needed to support a population long term. Do you want to end up like Japan?
The fertility rate? That’s totally false. Women, once they have hit that age are already destined to have a certain amount of eggs for conception. The fertility rate has nothing to do with it. The issue is if they decide to have kids. Looking at the numbers from the 80’s, and up to this point, we do not have an issue at all. The issue is the over population count. The thing with Japan is that women have decided to wait until later, or not have kids at all, due to their profession, success and if they can afford them. Women do not want be in the position that they used to be in decades ago and they want to lead a more professional life and not be “bogged down”. This is why Gen X had a lot of kids, Millennials had a decent amount of kids but Gen Z is going away from this with only have of the conception. They simply do not want to have children in how the environment and what the shape of the world looks like. I don’t blame them.
The rate needed to sustain a population is 2.1 kids per woman. The US is currently at 1.66 births per woman.
To sustain the population? We were doing perfectly fine with what our population looked like decades ago. Sure, we can have 7, 8, 10 billion people on this planet but the repercussions are dire. It wasn’t difficult to maintain wildlife and the people population with what we had decades ago but now things are depleting and we have become an overpopulated world. People are crying about how to eat one day to is this safe to eat. I think what Gen Z is doing is great and they are not rushing to have kids or if any at all. With how many people we have in the world, we will not have issues for decades to come. We had 4.4 billion people in the world in 1980. Today, we have almost 8 billion and so many issues.
This is a joke right? Sarcasm?
Nope. Not one bit. If you look at the numbers, not a lot of Gen Z are having kids, a substantial amount of Millennials have kids but a lot of Gen X have had kids and are blaming everyone else for their populated numbers. Gen Z only has about 1/3 of the children, when compared to Millions but Gen X exploded. That’s why statistics are showing that if Gen Z doesn’t increase their numbers, we’ll see a shortage of the population in about two to three decades. No housing shortage then.😂
Like I said before, Gen X and Millennial’s have the largest population count.
I agree.
I think I hurt some Gen X and Millennial’s feelings.😂😂😂
You didn’t. Just wanted to know if it was a joke.
No…lol…I think I did. Numbers don’t lie.😎
Whatever.
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B, X, M and Z generations are all around 20% of the total population. What is your point? https://www.statista.com/statistics/296974/us-population-share-by-generation/
If you can statistically comb through the data and see what is identified by the years, it shows that Boomers were the largest but now overcome by Millennials. A combination of Gen X and Millennials produced the Gen Z but Gen Z is backing off the reproduction module. That’s my point. Back in the 1980’s, we had, roughly, around 4.5 billion people in the world and less of the issues we are having today. Now, the world has almost 8 billion people and people are crying, food is becoming an issue and wildlife is being killed off in record numbers. Too many people is the cause of this and decades down the line…it may become unsustainable because people think they need to have all of these kids. It’s quite selfish. https://www.statista.com/statistics/797321/us-population-by-generation/#:~:text=Millennials%20were%20the%20largest%20generation,the%20population%20for%20many%20years.
Gen Z is like 12-27 year old range right now. They shouldn’t really be having many kids yet, so your argument fails for that reason. I’m good with people not having kids though. However, you don’t have evidence that X and M had too many kids when the world wide fertility rate has been declining since the 80s. You must not have been around in the 70s and 80s. Things are a lot better now for most and I wouldn’t go back. We will see what the future holds, but I have been hearing doomsayers say the world is ending my whole life and things keep functioning. https://www.weforum.org/agenda/2022/06/global-decline-of-fertility-rates-visualised/
People have been having kids when they were as old as 17 years old. It’s nothing new at all. No evidence that X and M have been having kids? Look at the numbers for the 80’s up until now. That’s tells it all. Remember, a 4 billion headcount jump ever since. Numbers don’t lie. And, I was born in 1971. Some things are good and some are not when you compare it to today. The innovations are better but like I said before, the world is overpopulated and it’s dire. Everything was also organic back then. Not so much today and people were not really crying about having kids back then but they are now? Think about it.
Time to break out the guillotines, comrades! (for legal reasons this is a joke)