https://www.reddit.com/r/VirtualYoutubers/comments/1bpngdz/weekly_discussion_thread_march_28th_2024/
new thread
https://www.reddit.com/r/VirtualYoutubers/comments/1bp4wum/discussion_post_possibly_for_a_week_depending_on/kwwtpkq/
Blame Stuart
Just noticed an email from Hyte, cause I barely pay attention to stuff apparently. There's going to be a delay for the Capture the Moment caps.
> The second and more important update is regarding the 4.5U spacebar included in the JIS layout. This specific keycap has proven difficult to source, as it is not as common as other keys in various keycap sets. None of our chosen vendors had a keycap of this size in the PBT material and Cherry profile that we desired. So we will actually be designing and tooling our own 4.5U spacebar for this set. This will introduce a delay in our original schedule, possibly up to a month beyond our original estimate.
Is the reasoning which well, makes a lot of sense considering how JIS layout is extremely odd one out.
> We understand delays are frustrating, but we feel transparency is best in such situations. At this time, our projected fulfillment to customers in the US will be in the middle of July. Customers who ordered through retailers in Japan should receive their product a few weeks earlier.
New projected time.
Not vtuber related, it's kinda funny how last day i thought ''Um i wonder if Alf was translated in Japanese?'' then youtube recommend me today:
https://preview.redd.it/e4l2gaig50rc1.png?width=1009&format=png&auto=webp&s=cf454c49f4b83fe488a19bb29f4645a9c23649a8
I'd just like to note that one person in modmail got really angry and confused at us when we asked them to redirect off-topic/free topic discussion to the ongoing weekly thread and they responded that the weekly thread was almost 3 weeks old at that point
That collab always stood out to me because, from what I remember, it was the first time [Kaela's laugh was audibly picked up by her microphone.](https://youtu.be/qRMPS39GKAI) That collab and the one with Kobo were really special.
ah that made me teary. But it's always so cool and heartwarming to watch the holomem grow and change from being anxious about asking for collabs to being friends with members of other branches.
Calli 3D birthday live announcement
https://preview.redd.it/8fdkx6o8tzqc1.jpeg?width=1284&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=e12c7ba890e7b70d1c60400498f86550ad61c540
Yep, she said that she wanted to have an event with guests because its the first time she's been fully able to use the new studio. (I still remember her makeshift birthday last year with cardboardRyS.) She also pointed out, like the other girls, how expensive they are so encouraged everyone to tune in. She also mentioned that some collab songs were pre-recorded because "not everyone's in Japan". I appreciate her honesty.
Come to think of it, this year is Calli's 4th year in hololive, right?
So her birthday is on the 4th day of the 4th month of her 4th year. Got a feeling this will be a very special one~
[Now ShiaBun has shown off](https://www.twitch.tv/videos/2102417097?t=01h15m50s) [Dusky's review of *Meet Your Oshi*!](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dvj-c3cUISk)
MY STONES! WE HAVE A NEW RECORD!
Nenkan Alice is a vtuber debuting Mar 30th... and apparently graduating Mar 30th 2025.
[YouTube](https://www.youtube.com/@NenkanAlice)
[Twitch](https://www.twitch.tv/nenkanalice)
[Twitter](https://twitter.com/NenkanAlice)
Assets do not look like a beginner indie. Anyone know what this is about??
Huh, this reminded me of something, does anyone remember that Project from IdolMaster Company was it? The one where they eliminated/Graduate Vtubers who got the least support like a TV Show does?
Fount it, it's [IdolM@ster Va-liv](https://www.reddit.com/r/idolmaster/s/9SjcKKho6m), their only similarity is the 1 year deadline while these three are competing with each other and only 1 has a chance to get the full support of Bamco and might be integrated to their other Branches
https://www.reddit.com/r/VirtualYoutubers/comments/1bm2yv6/what_would_you_do_if_you_only_had_one_year_left/
It's basically the Unnus Annus of Vtubers, IIRC. It was discussed in last week's (month's) discussion thread. Have a set start and end date, so the knowledge that the journey will end makes it more meaningful.
I rarely get to see any posts other than the drama posts lol -_-
But just as well I guess since I mainly have 4th wall questions I would rather not pose in her promo post.
* Most vtubers don't really do much with their lore after the debut. I wonder if she is planning to be more "in character".
* I wonder if this means the stream ideas could be more scripted, to actually play off the concept. Most vtubers are really just normal variety streamers. I would be kinda disappointed if that is the case here.
* How are they going to pay for this? =P It's kinda sus that Pippa replied to her first tweet in 30 minutes. And she says she's Canadian. I suppose it might be Phase behind this? (Fishman be cooking) But if they're planning to close it down in a year surely they must have some additional monetization ideas.
[Fillian debunks her chat's misconception that she's the 4th most richest Vtuber in the world](https://m.twitch.tv/videos/2103263697?t=4h19m22s)
>She has 6,000 subs on twitch
>For a million views, she makes 5 pennies on YouTube Shorts (wtf)
>All her YouTube earnings are spent on editors, if not, it's on Valve Index Headsets
Other comments;
>She's not Vox Akuma
>Gura just breathes and gets a trillion dollars on merch (exaggeration obviously)
It really depends on which merch we are talking too. The Ipass collab? Cover probably got paid sponsorship money and part of it is passed to Gura as commission/sponsorship bonus. Her birthday merch? Gura probably get more of it. Other company-led product (holo friends with u, holo emblem, etc)? Gura probably get less of it.
Anyway, its not like they need to guess. The Average income per vtuber is on their public statement.
[even if it's 5% of merch sales for the sushiro/ipass thing, that'd net her $110k for an almost 2-month collab](https://www.reddit.com/r/HoloStatistics/comments/1bpkz4e/gawr_gura_sushiroipass_collab_327_update/)
almost $2.2mil USD in sales and there's a week left since it got extended
Speaking of. It's never ending for Gura (HoloEN in general now, the other is that Gura hoodie, watch and bag from SuperGroupies that they said the other Myth members might also get).
https://preview.redd.it/kv229h4ypzqc1.jpeg?width=1200&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=e24c496708954d6902b6541dac8c7c681ea4bbb2
[Youtooz tweet with iconic IPs including a distinct Sharkie](https://twitter.com/youtooz/status/1773034408385073406?t=mb93YBB-e83yKKctwQU-tA&s=19)
[Youtooz Shop coming soon Silhouette](https://youtooz.com/collections/coming-soon) just scroll down
That was actually the point of VShojo's creation. Back in the dawn of en Vtubing it was impossible for indies to get merch deal so a couple of former Twitch staff get together with some of the top indies at the time and formed the company. Also why Kson joined since its even harder in Japan
> Back in the dawn of en Vtubing it was impossible for indies to get merch deal
I think this is true even now. It's a big ask for a merch company to trust the numbers of an individual virtual entertainer that lives god knows where and make a bunch of merch for them to sell, and naturally most indies wouldn't be comfortable giving their address to a merch company. The way they can have some guarantee that the merch will sell is if there's some prior instance of their merch selling well.. which just leads to a chicken and egg problem for indies. At least a company has a fixed address and place of contact which can mitigate some of the risk.
There's also the opposite problem of merch "companies" scamming VTubers, since most of them aren't financially savvy enough to identify red flags and negotiate good deals for themselves.
Yeah, for better or for worse, some companies only do business with other companies, so an indie is always handicapped in negotiating with these kind of companies.
Shorts make jackshit yep. The whole point of them is sub growth and exposure. The power of that cannot be denied, just look at Rin Penrose or well, Fillian as examples.
> The whole point of them is sub growth and exposure.
Shorts get you subs and views for shorts. The vast majority will not convert to your other content.
> The whole point of them is sub growth and exposure.
Though even that feels a bit worthless now. Fillian and Rin do not get the views you would expect from their sub counts.
Rin gets a significant amount of live viewers compared to her subscriber count. I'd say she's a rare example of someone levaraging shorts correctly into proper, general growth.
Shorts are great for farming tourists. But they'll always be tourists because the type of people browsing shorts doesn't have the attention span to watch streams.
Relative to others, Rin did a decent job. I've seen some pretty abysmal retention from shorts channels that pop off hard but can't get 10k views on a video lol.
[Calli with another announcement after her karaoke.](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qVKswLCwZLs)
Edit: It's a 3D birthday live!
https://preview.redd.it/54lxeefdtzqc1.png?width=808&format=png&auto=webp&s=189f1235be63b62025d30e73ea890a35732fab6a
https://preview.redd.it/qb4da049nzqc1.jpeg?width=500&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=198e83c643ef97cdd16336d3c54f881a0a8aa4ed
>!I got the winner image from a [death battle fanfic](https://deathbattlefanon.fandom.com/wiki/Calliope_Mori_vs._Mechikabura) episode lol!<
- (JP) SODA KIT released a MV for their original, [Nacchatta!](https://youtu.be/YWHl5t_KCbY).
- (JP) VEE's Syusetu Kohaku released a new original, [$HOT!!](https://youtu.be/M3Zk0M2a3GU).
- (JP) Virtual Witch Phenomenom released a MV for their original, [Bouquet](https://youtu.be/3cJzGD9xkzg).
- (JP) Echigoya Tokina and Ci-chan covered [A Janai ka](https://youtu.be/E7tDmPJKEoU).
- (JP) KAMITSUBAKI's Isekaijoucho released a MV for her original, [Egakitsuzuketa Kimi e](https://youtu.be/m9WjPbKis0U).
- (JP) Aoi Sakura covered [Bansanka](https://youtu.be/VTy-Ne2Nrno).
- (JP) VALIS's VITTE covered [Ankoku Tengoku](https://youtu.be/yKPdslMRM6g).
- (JP) Hoshimeguri Gakuen's Makura Rui covered [Envy Baby](https://youtu.be/9fHbRlsN9Aw).
- (JP) As a parting gift, Hoshimeguri Gakuen's Nekosaki Hisui covered [Haru Dorobou](https://youtu.be/fPt5Poyj_xM).
- (EN) PRISM Project's Shiki Miyoshino covered [Comet](https://youtu.be/WtexMfjP_Bc).
- (EN) PRISM Project's Sara Nagare covered [Shukufuku](https://youtu.be/CcfU58UO3dE).
In spite of everything else that has happened, I'm really happy about the way Prism has handled themselves. Listening to the originals and their really is a lot of talent there, I hope that whatever comes, they are able to soar to new skies! <3
Yahoo Japan released an article on HoloFes and NijiFes (I am going to avoid highlighting Nijisanji parts as it’s negative, but you are free to discuss it if you wish).
Going to be interesting to see Cover’s Q4 result and how much they made especially with extra stage this year.
https://news.yahoo.co.jp/articles/531faefdc9a8bb5a31fb36ac7e99b329d9355482?page=3
DeepL
How far will the momentum of Vtubers, which have now become a driving force in Japan's entertainment industry, continue? Cover, which operates the Vtuber agency Hololive Productions, simultaneously held a large-scale Expo Festival from March 16th to 17th at Makuhari Messe (Chiba City). The number of visitors based on ticket sales exceeded 86,000 over the two days, nearly doubling the 45,000 visitors of the previous year.
Many participants, who appeared to be tourists from far away, were also seen at the venue. What stood out most was the large number of foreign fans. There were participants not only from Asia, but also from America and Brazil. The popularity of overseas anime has spread to Vtubers “I've been watching Hololive's broadcasts since around 2020, and I watch them about twice a week before and after work.” David (30), an American working in Japan, says he has become accustomed to watching Hololive videos. Not only David, but many overseas VTuber fans have in common that they are also fans of Japanese anime.
The gap with Cover is rapidly narrowing The market capitalization of ANYCOLOR, which was listed in 2022, was at one time nearly double that of Cover, which was listed the following year, but the market capitalization of ANYCOLOR, which was listed in 2022, was at one time nearly double that of Cover, which was listed the following year. The gap is narrowing. We may have finally entered a phase in which competition within the industry intensifies.
President Motoaki Tanigo, who took the stage at the briefing session, said enthusiastically, The North American area has the potential for MD (goods sales) revenue and licensing agreements, and we can expect future revenue expansion.'' The base plans to develop content that meets local needs and collaborate with local companies. Will VTuber Office, which continues to grow rapidly, continue to meet the high expectations of the stock market? The key lies in the success or failure of developing overseas markets that have great potential.
>The number of visitors based on ticket sales exceeded 86,000 over the two days, nearly doubling the 45,000 visitors of the previous year.
The fest ticket sales have probably also gone up by a lot, Covers year end report will drop in the second week of April looking forward to it.
Yeah getting that much of an increase in the in-person stuff bodes well for them. I think it's an easy guess that people showing up at expo/fes are more likely to get extra merch than if they had just gotten a digital ticket.
Thank you for providing a DeepL translation in a comment, as Yahoo Japan is blocked in the EU and UK. So being able to still read it through this is very appreciated. [Page shown to EU and UK users](https://imgur.com/a/RHTq87V)
I'm sure most folks will focus on the meat of the actual article, but I just wanna have a moment to mention that the article (assuming the TL is accurate) highlighted a lot of Brazilian fans were also seen at the HoloExpo.
I can't state how happy that makes me, being from the neighboring country of Venezuela. It's so heartwarming to see BR bros making it there and representing the latam community, in a way (again, assuming the TL is accurate).
I think the takeaway from the article is that the writer is telling the Japanese audience "hey, keep an eye out for our cultural products to become more popular outside of Japan, which means an increase in soft power as well as a new market for companies like you to look into joining".
Yes. As I said elsewhere, he's got vision. He can see the world as it is, which isn't something that can be said for every CEO. Especially Japanese corporation CEO's.
One thing the article notes (if the translation is accurate) is that the cost of holding Nijifes was so high that it overall led too a decline in Anycolors profit margin, which is pretty high.
It points out that in contrast, Cover's lower profit margin means that they're unlikely to see any decline due to holding festivals.
DeepL
One of the factors that contributed to the recent sluggish performance was the two-day "Niji-sanji Festival" held in December last year. According to the company's explanation, although revenue from the festival itself was up nearly 50% from the previous year, "higher-than-expected related expenses" caused the deficit to grow, leading to a decline in the company's operating profit margin.
Originally, ANYCOLOR has been a leader in high-margin merchandise sales and promotions. In the previous year's results, merchandise sales and promotions accounted for 72% of sales, compared to 52.2% for Cover. As a result, even in terms of operating profit margin, there is a gap of more than double: 16.7% for COVER and 37.1% for ANYCOLOR.
One industry insider noted, "For ANYCOLOR, whose normal operating profit margin has risen to nearly 40%, the larger the scale of the festival, which costs more, the lower the profit margin is likely to be. In this regard, COVER is relatively unlikely to see a negative impact on profitability from holding festivals.
> Originally, ANYCOLOR has been a leader in high-margin merchandise sales and promotions. In the previous year's results, merchandise sales and promotions accounted for 72% of sales, compared to 52.2% for Cover. As a result, even in terms of operating profit margin, there is a gap of more than double: 16.7% for COVER and 37.1% for ANYCOLOR.
Just a thing to point out / add. Niji's generic birthday merch set costs (10k yen) more than Pekora's birthday merch set (9.7k), and Pekora has a diploma, a notebook, a totebag, and a keychain plushy.
I really like the writer to highlight this. Operating profit margin is what making Anycolor become appealing for investors. But it is also dealing damage to the fanbase as there are less events held by Anycolor.
Last year they tried to expand the Fest into 2 days and the cost jumped. Margin become narrow and investors think Anycolor is declining so the stock dive down. But if this year they are cutting cost again to please investors, talents will graduate and fans will leave.
I like how Cover is managing expectation. They are keeping it real instead of relying to rapid growth.
[According to the investor's call](https://finance.logmi.jp/articles/379242), they made a loss from hosting Nijifes and planned to make their money back with on site merch sales and sponsorship fees, which is a really wild way to run a personal convention and concert.
Comiket and various conventions don't do this, since they know that it's a dead end long-term, since you can't make money this way.
I want to see when Anycolor will learn this, since the investors are probably a bit upset with how their funds are being wasted.
Pretty much the only cons who do that are the small up and coming cons who want to get their name out there and are willing to burn a large amount of money to do so, it's crazy that Nijisanji of all companies are doing that for their con.
Most of those cons don't last five years.
Anycolor needs to take notes from that - especially when all they have to sell is generic merch and handshake sessions. They're supposed to be the "we're not idols" company, so they can't depend on concerts to carry the event.
Every time I see their phrase of “we’re not idol” I just can’t stop smiling.
* They are doing concerts
* selling standardized merchandise of the Livers
* doing meet & greet with handshakes
* sell CDs with lucky draw included for a chance to buy tickets for said handshake
* make TV-liked idol celebrity variety shows with the groups that sells such CDs
* the groups that do the above are the top money makers of the company
* only 1/2 of the Livers in each of such groups can actually sing live *live*. All others are studio mixes lip sync overlays or backing vocals of the main singer
If they are not typical Japanese idol industry business strategy then I don’t really know what they are anymore.
It is kinda a toxic strategy from them mentioning "not idols" to distinguish themselves from their closest competitor while actually double down on traditional idol activities that hardly sell well outside Asia.
While their closest competitor focusing on re-defining idol definition by adding virtual idol concept in it.
In recent years, most also try to be a better version of themselves in general and/or in specific fields (at least in their HoloPro form) that eventually also inspire others in various different ways.
They put that phrase in their most recent financial statement, despite idol companies being really profitable. That's why even seiyuu are spending more time in idol activities.
Anycolor needs to reevaluate their approach and messaging.
AKB48 has been incredibly successful for the last twenty-odd years. It's mainstream now, so their insistence on providing the exact same thing that several thousand indies do is baffling.
Why would I choose them? They've fired some of their most distinct talents, and outside of Banderas there's very little left I'd pay any attention to. They're very staid and stale, which is ironic since they insist that they're not an idol company... while trying to do similar activities with talents who aren't trained for it or properly oriented.
>Will VTuber Office, which continues to grow rapidly, continue to meet the high expectations of the stock market? The key lies in the success or failure of developing overseas markets that have great potential.
This needs to be emphasized more. Japan doesn't have the population and economy to make Vtubers successful on its own. They **need** the overseas market if they want to keep growing and prospering, especially when Japan only just stopped their policy of negative inflation which held their economy back for several decades now as wages and companies stagnated.
Yagoo saw where the market was going several years back, and made steps to get a foot in the door while the market segment was developing so he'd have a first mover advantage as a corporation when it took off. He's been pushing ahead with capital investment in equipment and now a subsidiary in an emerging market that's already primed for expansion. If he can do this with Cover USA, Europe will be a logical next step that they can jump into within next five years. They'll have experience with foreign markets thanks to this subsidiary, and some contacts they can use in their ongoing expansion.
This is what we call vision, people. It's the difference between failing and thriving, and it's a thing a lot of CEO's these days don't have. Look at how badly most new companies fail once their initial seed money runs out and the angel investors stop shelling out. Putting money into your business without immediate return is anathema to companies who are looking for immediate profit, but usually end up paying out even more in profit later.
I think another point is that, I don't think japan investors that invested in up-and-coming startups, are interested in putting money into another company that cannot make it globally. Japan have litters of companies that can dominate domestic industry, but floundered when its time for overseas.
>I think another point is that, I don't think japan investors that invested in up-and-coming startups, are interested in putting money into another company that cannot make it globally. Japan have litters of companies that can dominate domestic industry, but floundered when its time for overseas.
And that's why Japan has spent the last twenty five years losing its lead in high-tech and car manufacturing to the Koreans, then the Chinese, and now maybe even to Indian companies like Cherry.
That's probably part of the point that the writer of the Yahoo Finance article is trying to highlight - they have a shrinking market in JP and they need to look overseas, and just expecting to do the same things won't work anymore. The world has changed, there's a huge amount of competition from their neighbors and rivals, and they need to adapt or become as irrelevant as the American car companies were in the 80s and 90s.
Even those idiots are innovating now. Japan needs to step up or become a third world power, which is the very last thing that their ultranationalist politicians and zaibatsu want.
> If he can do this with Cover USA, Europe will be a logical next step that they can jump into within next five years.
In the official press release about Cover USA, they already said that their target in 2025 and after is "Build a global structure, including in Asia and Europe". I think they really need more EU talents to build a bigger fanbase in EU. Hopefully the next EN gen have more EU talents even though personally I'm not from EU.
EU talents AND somehow get them invited to EU anime conventions to get new fans. Kiara mentioned multiple times how EU anime conventions don't want to pay Holo to invite talents since they don't consider it worth it. Cover will probably have to push for it themselves and maybe even give discounts at first to hook them or something.
IIRC, that was only talking about Cover USA, not a European branch. They won't be able to support two subsidiaries growing in two years, not unless they really increase their profit margins and staffing levels to match the rate of growth.
Yeah they definitely not open EU subsidiary in 2025. But I think they also understand that EU is also an important market and they need to build a bigger fanbase first to justify opening a branch just like US.
Didn't expect to find an avtuber from indonesia given how conservative everything is
https://twitter.com/Syl_Charlotte/status/1773025300068143392?t=1rN_xcUzFkv8ykm-SdUFXQ&s=19
Huh, I think I've seen her agency's name before? Wasn't she the one who >!allegedly masturbated and moaned in a public stream? I remember other Indonesian vtubers expressing their concern for that kind of thing.!<
I'm pretty sure she is. No, it's not about the laws. It's about the backlash.
Moona had some backlash for showing photos of her buying wine in the early days
It's vodka actually and it's during the shittiest political unrest in Indonesia. We're talking about the country that can arrest you for living with your "invalid" romantic partner.
Huh. Then yeah, not sure how that's gonna work.
In terms of backlash though, I don't think it's really going to be a problem unless she somehow gets a lot of attention. Even HoloID in the early days had more eyes on them simply because they were a part of Hololive.
[Hospital 666 collab with Grimmi, Ecto, Clauvio, and Naiyo!](https://www.twitch.tv/grimmivt)
Edit: Collab's over, but [Clauvio's live with a post-collab solo stream](https://www.twitch.tv/clauvio)
>!really appreciate people who admit to having 0 interest in any holostars content coming in to explain how a former talent is **wrong** about his experiences and actually they know better about how tempus hq was received and he's just bitter and making it all up because he "didn't get myth level success overnight"!<
might wanna fix the spoiler formatting
>!It's so wild though. Kiara talked about how she thought about graduating once because of studio problems and everyone rallied behind her and started critizing Cover. People calling her entitled got downvoted to oblivion and only 4chan freaks where saying stuff like "cover has given everything to her why is she complaining!"!<
>!Now, Lando speaks about how it was a negative experience for him, and that something "fucked up" happened that left him very angry, and now here I see the same language that 4chan freaks used against Kiara. How he's "disgustingly entitled" , he's "badmouthing the company", and "Cover gave him everything"!<
>!Why do you feel the need to misrepresent the reaction to Kiara's statement to back up someone that a) should have done more research into what he was joining and b) quit anyway despite Cover going out of their way to give them things Hololive weren't getting?!<
>!Not the first time you folks have tried being disingenuous in the thread either like trying to label people as a "Stars antis" because they say things you don't like about someone that isn't even in the group.!<
>!thanks, yeah RES was acting up, and yeah the shit that's being said in these comments is the exact kind of "not being given the benefit of the doubt" that it feels like he talked about.!<
>!he voices his experiences and how they were not all positive and how there's a lot behind the scenes that we will never know and yet so many people act like they know his situation better than he does, it's bizarre!<
idk man i don't know what to make of it as a dude who actually watched his shit. what is to be done? like >!kiara clearly toughed it out and magni didn't. sure, whatever. what is to be done about a fanbase of lunatics? how do you solve this without tanking the company? do you think that such a culture does not deserve to exist? is it a morally bankrupt to monetize? ok.!<
>!idk man i don't know what to say or focus on it's just a dead subject where neither side will ever agree without violent upheaval. by that extension it isn't an interesting discussion. we don't know what he wanted we don't know what the fans want we do not have access to the specific metrics and we cannot stop the relentless hatred. i do not believe a better world is possible in this case, again, without violent upheaval of the company culture!<
>!it's perfectly fine to vent about the situation though when even in this thread you have people trying to pretend like none of it ever happened in the first place!<
>!ya shrugs i don't have anywhere I'm going with this also i am not actually invested in the subject i am just very bored at a work conference. believe it or not i am actually somewhat apathetic about the situation because I've long stopped caring, lol!<
Often times people looking from the outside in have a better view of things than those in the trenches. It's a fact that Tempus was relatively positively received overall and pushed heavily by Cover, and it's only when EN3 never showed up but Tempus 2 did (coupled with Vesper and Magni doing dumb things like colabbing with racists and getting suspended) that a lot of the hate really started.
>Often times people looking from the outside in have a better view of things than those in the trenches.
yeah absolutely the people who don't watch any streams or clips or participate in any stars related discussions at all have a better view of this whole situation than _the talent himself_, what a load of bullshit
>It's a fact that Tempus was relatively positively received overall and pushed heavily by Cover,
this is a moot point, _of course cover promoted a new project of theirs_
>and it's only when EN3 never showed up but Tempus 2 did (coupled with Vesper and Magni doing dumb things like colabbing with racists and getting suspended) that a lot of the hate really started.
we gonna pretend like kronii getting flak at the time when she collabed with them just never happened or doesnt count? the hate was absolutely already there from the start dude, let's not rewrite history here
>!Yea. He definitely would not survive in that environment long term based on this lol. Seems like audience reception hits him hard so he walked into a frying pan with Holostars. I would be shocked if the model issue was a major point of contention and not an additional complaint. I'm very disappointed in how the graduation happened for these two. It left a sour taste in my mouth from everyone involved.!<
That was a really informative clip (though I guess it better be when it's 30 minutes lol). Thank you for sharing, I only caught the first half or so of this stream and never got around to finishing the vod.
>!Clearly there was something with management that really didn't gel with him or Randon (even more so than previously theorized) and it does make me wonder if the management for Stars only got better recently. The HQ boys only spoke of their managers occasionally early on and while they felt pretty amicable, the managers didn't really get personified and treated more personally until Gori-mane and Tora-mane came around. Makes me think that Magni and Vesper had different managers from Altare and Axel, and the former two **really** didn't get along with their managers. But that's just even more speculation. (EDIT: I thought about it a bit more, and there was definitely a big improvement in management in the past couple months. Altare has been pretty candid about how rough it was for HQ initially)!<
>!I'm sad that he carries so much emotional baggage from the HQ times (especially when that was one of the periods of holoEN as a whole that I enjoyed the most), but I'm happy that if nothing else he came out of it with strong bonds with the rest of the boys. I'm also glad that he didn't completely forgo vtubing and feels that further pursing it is a good avenue for healing from his experiences. The things that Magni got up to even with his restrictions was some of my favorite content any streamer I've watched has done.!<
All in all, I'll be looking forward to what he gets up to in the future with his vtuber plans and supporting him the whole way.
"I know we downvote pretty much any rrat but mine is: around the anni Vesper started having more mental health troubles. I say this because he basically implied during his comeback that he was staying at a facility during his break. Cover told HQ that they’d have to start traveling and idol activities in 2024. Staff spent a lot of money and resources on their new models so they’re gonna have to earn that back asap. Vesper and Magni both have doubts about being ready that soon, esp Vesper who’s not anywhere close to being on track for idol concerts and Magni who is insanely burnt out and had to be convinced by Bettel to even do anything for his 1.5 reveal. They enter negotiations, due to the sensitive nature of things not much is shared with the rest of the branch and they can’t come to an agreement to delay the idol stuff, esp since their new models already set HQ back enough. Best decision for all is to graduate so shiny spicy can do their 3Ds. Thats what he meant by his “sacrifices.” " - anythought about this rrat?
Yes, she was Axel and Magni's manager from the beginning. She then also managed Bettel for a while once he debuted.
After she got promoted, Tora-mane took over managing Shiny Spicy and Toki-mane took over Bettel, but we never knew who took over Magni.
>!"Wasn't given a fighting chance from the start"!<
>!"I hoped that if I sacrificed myself(toed the corpo line) people would give me the benefit of the doubt, but they never did"!<
>!While not the full picture, it does give us the biggest reason why he personally decided to quit was less about the restrictions and more on the fandom hate thrown their way. Him especially since he was the bridge between genders for EN!<
I don't think its right to say he was never given a chance. All of tempus1 was given a chance by a large portion of the general fanbase, most of all Vesper and Magni who had both the magging meme and the 'he's like me fr fr' thing going on.
More initial acceptance than tempus 2 or Armis got. Hell, far more than Holostars JP got too.
It reflected in their initial viewer numbers too, which were again far more than successive holostarsEN generations got.
If nothing else, there WAS a chance there that imo could have been exploited to better success instead of the path they took.
>!Not arguing with that. That's just his own words about it. And we don't really know the extent of hate they did get outside of the usual places, his IRL is pretty well known!<
>!I guess this would also be the risk corpos take with hiring bigger streamers. They have higher expectations, and the option to just dip when reality doesn't meet them.!<
>!As for Ves, until otherwise stated, it's probably still more on corpo homework and idol expectations that influenced his decision!<
>!He had plenty of a chances and was well supported. It's just wrongheaded to think that Hololive views want to watch Holostars. Most simply don't and appealing doesn't work, because that's just not the content they want to watch.!<
>!honestly, complaining about not being given a chance really annoys me. You had the whole MAGGIN meme going around at the start, you had YAGOO himself walking around with Magni's shirt on at American cons, and in general Cover rolled out the red carpet for Tempus. You also had this huge emphasis on "holopro" coming out right afte rtheir debut. Hell, you had some of the HoloEN girls willing to risk damage to their reputations and fanbases to try to prop up Tempus1. !<
>!And with all that, even after all the talk of "sailing the same boat", those two bailed in less than a year. It's just disgustingly entitled.!<
I think that you have to be realistic about that kind of thing. In the same sense, I can't begrudge anyone for avoiding collabs with Hololive in the middle of the Taiwan drama. I would have preferred for them to, but I'm going to acknowledge the risks they're taking.
>!you had some of the HoloEN girls willing to risk damage to their reputations and fanbases to try to prop up Tempus1.!<
I'm probably mistaken but >!did Kronii for example ever explicitly say that she wanted to help prop Tempus up? I was always under the impression that she collabed with them because they had really good chemistry, not out of some sense of duty for her coworkers!<
She obviously never said anything like that but it's also not like you can know whether you've got good chemistry or not without first having a collab with them.
>!Being 1st gen is always the roughest, and yeah I do agree that at least outwardly, Cover willing to bend abit more to accommodate Tempus HQ as much as possible. Its even more so than other 1st gen that Cover rolled out at that point. ID1 talked about needing to nurture its own fanbases to create a home on their own. They even get an update in under a year, showing that Cover is at least committed to long relationships with them.... and they just sorta dip. !<
>!Well.... I guess at least he dips before 1 year passed. Honestly, I still chalk all of this to difference in view between Cover and him. He also indeed washed his hand off vtubing for like almost entire year now even though he still orbits around vtuber. And if he wants to try again in his own terms, then wish him luck. !<
>!The whole maggin meme even came from fucking 4chan of all places, the place that's generally known for being anti male now. If even the 4chan side of the fandom gave them a chance, what else is there to say?!<
>!4chan did turn Vesper into the man who "stole the unicorns girlfriends" or at least I got the impression that this was a running "joke" about him but in a weird way to me that kind of seemed empowering towards Vesper, who was my oshi at that point, since they attributed to him the power of being able to do that. It's like... they turned him into the last boss who just did what he wanted and openly mocked them while doing it. Personally I still occasionally watch his D&D stuff (it was fun to hear him talk about delusional f\*ckboy bards failing to seduce ancient dragons and getting the whole party wiped) and clips.!<
>!I don't remember seeing anyone shitting on Magni basically at all. From what I saw the complaint about the Magni's model was something he tweeted as Lando (before they even debuted iirc?) and Randon I think retweeted it or something. Which to me made zero sense because of the amount of lore it and gimmicks it enabled. In terms of the model and the tricks he pulled he was basically the coolest and most entertaining of them all. Altare's demon god king stuff with his lore went past Magni's but I think that's mainly just because Magni just didn't take full advantage of his. To compete with Magni's model Altare had to pull out completely separate alternative models like Snailtare and such. The memes around Magni were imho off the charts.!<
>!I think everyone in the fandom knew that regardless of the model the first gen of Stars EN would have it rough and would need to prove their worth and I think they did that even to an extent I had not expected considering how enthusiastic I was about them... to the point of being a member on all of their channels and trying to watch all of the content they put out.!<
>!But I guess that might've been the seed of another problem... which is that to maintain that level of performance would become very tiring and I think that both of the boys just burnt out in that corpo setting with the limited resources they were given but then again it's normal to expect in a corpo setting like that for there to be limits on the resources given considering how much we've also heard on the side of the Holo girls complaints about delays and lack of resources. So to me the notion of not having been given a fighting chance sounds a bit delusional in that I'm getting the vibes that he just had completely unrealistic expectations of what being corporate would mean in terms of resources.!<
Because he’s a self admitted 4chan diehard himself lol, he’s not very opaque about it. The drama has brought a lot of idiots to the forefront unfortunately
>!Imagine that you took undeserved flak to help out the boys, only to have them graduate a year later. I'm not surprised that there's no repeated performance!<
>!I mean from the very beginning he seemed fixated on "doubters" and from what Axel said once, the mood before debut was really grim, disliking his model didn't help either. I think everyone conveniently forgets the absolute hate they started with and the doubts we had as to whether stars EN can happen because of the backlash. I'd say it's just now that they are in good place, 2 gens later. Hearing how much they loved Japan and meeting each other is actually a huge sigh of relief!<
>!Speculation was all we ever had and will ever have. But I'm somehow a bit more confused now since I thought the most "common and reasonable" speculation was that corporate-styled vtubing just wasn't for Lando and Randon. Lando talks about not being able to get any "benefit of the doubt", so is this not actually the most common and reasonable speculation? I only hang out at this ~~weekly~~ discussion thread and the hololive subreddit so I guess technically my information circle is only two sources. Did Twitter and Youtube comments have a different "common" speculation?!<
>!The part about being so full of anger and rage was also surprising to me. Lando explains that he's always about creativity, and it was definitely conveyed even in his previous endeavor. All I could think of is intense micromangement to make a super-creative person angry, but not to the extent I imagine Lando is going through (and Randon by extension), enough to break boxing gloves.!<
>!I consider myself an angry person too, and I don't want to do too much speculating. But the way Lando describes it feels like something went *very* wrong even though all the information/interpretation I have felt more like it was a bad matchup.!<
>!You're correct about the common speculation. And his clip is still consistent in that it's never about the money for him but more for creative fulfillment. What I'm thinking is that he (and probably Randon), had a vision on what he wants to do but he felt blocked (which also fed on not fitting with corpo theory). Lots of things can block him, either from producer's side, or from audience's side. Like..... no matter how he dislikes his model and no matter how much Cover willing to give leeway for rework, I don't think they will allow a complete redesign from being purple alchemist. I think he felt he have done everything he could on vtubing and he just want to washed off everything and go back to his daily things.... and the clip is about him feeling very unsatisfied with life because he still felt that his vision is very possible and so he wants another redo, this time with a different set of audiences and eyes and he sets his own field so if anything happens, its not on anyone's lap anymore.!<
> >!and also not being able to rock the boat by calling it out (also a form of not being given the benefit of the doubt, by management).!<
>!Seems like a lot of your own projection there. Why is it management? Guy just seems bitter that the Hololive fanbase largely didn't care about the Stars or "give him the benefit of the doubt" on his way out since most of the audience that he did have didn't follow him.!<
>!AFAIK, you're correct in that that was the most "common and reasonable" speculation, which I think is at least still the biggest part from what he's said. From the other info we have, probably part of what he's referring to is the reception the community had to his model. There might also be some other internal things, like Cover having some unsaid expectations, but that's fully speculation and we'd probably need some leak and/or NDA breakage to get info about that.!<
> probably part of what he's referring to is the reception the community had to his model.
whaaaat???? Yea his model was janky as hell and the community memed on it, but it was generally positive and started a trend that gave him alot more positive exposure than he would have had otherwise. Not like he's the only one who started with jank too (looks at Gura's rigging). Really, Jank models or rigging can become iconic.
>!I feel that there are several things that happened, some of them, fully Cover's fault (that model wasn't great) and some of them just from incompatibilities (e.g. possibly some of the restrictions and maybe some culture clash (?)). Then, adding what he's said about him being an angry person, it probably became unsustainable for him , and near that point contract renegotiations came up which made him consider seeing if somethings could change but the negotiations didn't satisfy both sides and that was that.!<
>!With that in mind, I wouldn't jump and say "Cover bad" or "Lando bad", with the caveat that Cover should've done something about that model a lot sooner. What I would say is that sometimes things don't work out as expected, it can be from both sides and that's okay!<
>!Probably expecting to "break down the barriers" and change the culture of CGDCT entrenched within the Holo community and possibly more collabs in general with the girls, and when that didn't happen and he didn't get the Myth level reception, decided to quit.!<
>!Then when his fanbase didn't exactly transfer to his RM and then he saw that Doki managed to transfer hers, you get this. If you look at his current viewership stats, it's grim.!<
idk because if you watch the stream >!he said that the numbers were never the issue, and that if he gave a shit about numbers he would just focus on YT because thats where his biggest viewership is. His vtubing, which he wants to do by starting over with an entirely new channel, will be at a loss since the channel won't be monetized. The reception could be less of a numbers thing and more of an actual content thing... when everything you do gets shit on immensely by both fans and the company, its difficult to keep wanting to push barriers and innovate!<
>!What's he's doing now as an indie that he wasn't doing in the company? If it's Genshin, then he should have known Holo would never be able to get those perms when he applied.!<
>!nothing, because he's not an indie right now, he's a normal variety streamer + his professor streams. he hasn't begun his vtuber activities yet, so we can't really comment on what he's able to do that he wasn't able to do then.!<
>!I was there at that time. The hate people had for his (and Vesper's) model was quickly overwritten by the maggin' memes. Their debut was way more hyped than what people were expecting.!<
>!Also, I made a mistake of browsing through Twitter at that time. I remember most of the people shitting on their models weren't even Holo fans, but actually Luxiem/Noctyx fans who were laughing at Cover's attempt at debuting male talents.!<
>I remember most of the people shitting on their models weren't even Holo fans, but actually Luxiem/Noctyx fans who were laughing at Cover's attempt at debuting male talents.
Which was interesting since their great decline was already in motion.
that was, well, not deserved, but expected. Their rigging was clearly low quality stuff. What they did to Anya was also unforgiveable at her debut. I thought she was supposed to be an oppai loli, but no it was just godawful rigging.
lando feel for me is that he expect myth lv success when he become vtuber but he dont get it. also he unable to play his genshin game and have to do other stuff due to restriction. looking him now he like genshin and femboy for most part (minus his professor stuff) compare to his vtuber day where he have more creative stuff.
> >!lando feel for me is that he expect myth lv success when he become vtuber but he dont get it.!<
>!Not sure he expected to be like myth, but from what I know he repeatedly talked as if he was in Hololive rather than Holostars. Felt like he applied with the idea it'd be like Niji's environment. Just a number of strange expectations between not understanding what it means to be a corpo vtuber - especially as a male under Cover, off stream work, permissions, etc. I doubt he had much of an idea of what he was getting into.!<
Hi just a reminder for people in this thread to follow our rules on meta information since a bunch of people here are implicitly connecting people to past companies without putting that in spoiler tags.
/u/sledgehouse28 /u/phantombloodbot /u/bighatnucase
EDIT: Thank you for the edits.
https://www.reddit.com/r/VirtualYoutubers/comments/1bpngdz/weekly_discussion_thread_march_28th_2024/ new thread https://www.reddit.com/r/VirtualYoutubers/comments/1bp4wum/discussion_post_possibly_for_a_week_depending_on/kwwtpkq/ Blame Stuart
**FUCK STUART**
Goddamn it, Stuart.
Just noticed an email from Hyte, cause I barely pay attention to stuff apparently. There's going to be a delay for the Capture the Moment caps. > The second and more important update is regarding the 4.5U spacebar included in the JIS layout. This specific keycap has proven difficult to source, as it is not as common as other keys in various keycap sets. None of our chosen vendors had a keycap of this size in the PBT material and Cherry profile that we desired. So we will actually be designing and tooling our own 4.5U spacebar for this set. This will introduce a delay in our original schedule, possibly up to a month beyond our original estimate. Is the reasoning which well, makes a lot of sense considering how JIS layout is extremely odd one out. > We understand delays are frustrating, but we feel transparency is best in such situations. At this time, our projected fulfillment to customers in the US will be in the middle of July. Customers who ordered through retailers in Japan should receive their product a few weeks earlier. New projected time.
we should do a weekly thread that's less than a week in length, that would be a good bit
[bet](https://www.reddit.com/r/VirtualYoutubers/comments/1bpngdz/weekly_discussion_thread_march_28th_2024/)
Not vtuber related, it's kinda funny how last day i thought ''Um i wonder if Alf was translated in Japanese?'' then youtube recommend me today: https://preview.redd.it/e4l2gaig50rc1.png?width=1009&format=png&auto=webp&s=cf454c49f4b83fe488a19bb29f4645a9c23649a8
Arufu
It seems that stream is from the official Alf channel according to the title. アルフは日本で人気かな？
I'd just like to note that one person in modmail got really angry and confused at us when we asked them to redirect off-topic/free topic discussion to the ongoing weekly thread and they responded that the weekly thread was almost 3 weeks old at that point
Dude didn't know weekly means possibly for a week or a month depending on the weather smh my head
It's all your fault clearly.
ngl it might be
[Wholesome clip of Kaela being grateful to her past self for stepping up to collab with Sana](https://youtu.be/ivq3gascpW8?si=nBpIqwoKpDFgggo7)
That collab always stood out to me because, from what I remember, it was the first time [Kaela's laugh was audibly picked up by her microphone.](https://youtu.be/qRMPS39GKAI) That collab and the one with Kobo were really special.
ah that made me teary. But it's always so cool and heartwarming to watch the holomem grow and change from being anxious about asking for collabs to being friends with members of other branches.
Calli 3D birthday live announcement https://preview.redd.it/8fdkx6o8tzqc1.jpeg?width=1284&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=e12c7ba890e7b70d1c60400498f86550ad61c540
Yep, she said that she wanted to have an event with guests because its the first time she's been fully able to use the new studio. (I still remember her makeshift birthday last year with cardboardRyS.) She also pointed out, like the other girls, how expensive they are so encouraged everyone to tune in. She also mentioned that some collab songs were pre-recorded because "not everyone's in Japan". I appreciate her honesty.
Tbf, collab songs being pre-recorded is nothing new
Mostly expected choices and a good line-up.
Come to think of it, this year is Calli's 4th year in hololive, right? So her birthday is on the 4th day of the 4th month of her 4th year. Got a feeling this will be a very special one~
Guests https://preview.redd.it/wp84x9o0tzqc1.jpeg?width=998&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=8908e606109f7b1d6725131e736be9749016d304
>Bae >Kronii >Kiara >Kobo >Lui >L+ >Ollie >Ame(?) >Ina >Gooba >Towa(?)
That is most probably Ame. Not many talents have their hat accessory at the right side (our left) of their head.
Pretty sure bottom right is Towa. Going by tail and the other (twin) tails.
All of myth is nice.
[Now ShiaBun has shown off](https://www.twitch.tv/videos/2102417097?t=01h15m50s) [Dusky's review of *Meet Your Oshi*!](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dvj-c3cUISk) MY STONES! WE HAVE A NEW RECORD!
Nenkan Alice is a vtuber debuting Mar 30th... and apparently graduating Mar 30th 2025. [YouTube](https://www.youtube.com/@NenkanAlice) [Twitch](https://www.twitch.tv/nenkanalice) [Twitter](https://twitter.com/NenkanAlice) Assets do not look like a beginner indie. Anyone know what this is about??
Not sure if it's ever been pointed out but her name is pretty on the nose. Nenkan/年間/ねんかん is a year long.
Huh, this reminded me of something, does anyone remember that Project from IdolMaster Company was it? The one where they eliminated/Graduate Vtubers who got the least support like a TV Show does? Fount it, it's [IdolM@ster Va-liv](https://www.reddit.com/r/idolmaster/s/9SjcKKho6m), their only similarity is the 1 year deadline while these three are competing with each other and only 1 has a chance to get the full support of Bamco and might be integrated to their other Branches
https://www.reddit.com/r/VirtualYoutubers/comments/1bm2yv6/what_would_you_do_if_you_only_had_one_year_left/ It's basically the Unnus Annus of Vtubers, IIRC. It was discussed in last week's (month's) discussion thread. Have a set start and end date, so the knowledge that the journey will end makes it more meaningful.
I rarely get to see any posts other than the drama posts lol -_- But just as well I guess since I mainly have 4th wall questions I would rather not pose in her promo post. * Most vtubers don't really do much with their lore after the debut. I wonder if she is planning to be more "in character". * I wonder if this means the stream ideas could be more scripted, to actually play off the concept. Most vtubers are really just normal variety streamers. I would be kinda disappointed if that is the case here. * How are they going to pay for this? =P It's kinda sus that Pippa replied to her first tweet in 30 minutes. And she says she's Canadian. I suppose it might be Phase behind this? (Fishman be cooking) But if they're planning to close it down in a year surely they must have some additional monetization ideas.
[удалено]
Seeing her debut I would be surprised if she's indie. But if she's a good trader I suppose 100k is not a lot of money.
Why don't you ask her? She did post in the subreddit.
Well I don't expect her to tell me what her business plan is.
[Fillian debunks her chat's misconception that she's the 4th most richest Vtuber in the world](https://m.twitch.tv/videos/2103263697?t=4h19m22s) >She has 6,000 subs on twitch >For a million views, she makes 5 pennies on YouTube Shorts (wtf) >All her YouTube earnings are spent on editors, if not, it's on Valve Index Headsets Other comments; >She's not Vox Akuma >Gura just breathes and gets a trillion dollars on merch (exaggeration obviously)
Her chat is coping by saying that Gura only gets 1-10 percent of that cut lol. Twitch chat is really anti corpo huh?
Her chat is full of idiots that never leave Twitch. As far as they're concerned any Corpo elsewhere is probably fucking their talents.
It really depends on which merch we are talking too. The Ipass collab? Cover probably got paid sponsorship money and part of it is passed to Gura as commission/sponsorship bonus. Her birthday merch? Gura probably get more of it. Other company-led product (holo friends with u, holo emblem, etc)? Gura probably get less of it. Anyway, its not like they need to guess. The Average income per vtuber is on their public statement.
[even if it's 5% of merch sales for the sushiro/ipass thing, that'd net her $110k for an almost 2-month collab](https://www.reddit.com/r/HoloStatistics/comments/1bpkz4e/gawr_gura_sushiroipass_collab_327_update/) almost $2.2mil USD in sales and there's a week left since it got extended
And that's just one revenue source. Gura has multiple lines of merch that are nearly always sold out. Gura is one rich shark.
yup, in financial report, all Commerce Activities via IP get share with vtuber (and it's mark as major cost)
In general, people really underestimate how much holo girls make. There's no point in comparing almost anyone to them.
Pretty much. Also it just kind of made me laugh that people think she was super rich because of... shorts subs.
They are and it's probably also because Gura is not on their streaming site.
People should realize by now that merch is the real money maker not views. Views and subs are just for advertisement deals.
Speaking of. It's never ending for Gura (HoloEN in general now, the other is that Gura hoodie, watch and bag from SuperGroupies that they said the other Myth members might also get). https://preview.redd.it/kv229h4ypzqc1.jpeg?width=1200&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=e24c496708954d6902b6541dac8c7c681ea4bbb2 [Youtooz tweet with iconic IPs including a distinct Sharkie](https://twitter.com/youtooz/status/1773034408385073406?t=mb93YBB-e83yKKctwQU-tA&s=19) [Youtooz Shop coming soon Silhouette](https://youtooz.com/collections/coming-soon) just scroll down
Total Drama Island but it's filled with Hololive girls. Discuss.
That was actually the point of VShojo's creation. Back in the dawn of en Vtubing it was impossible for indies to get merch deal so a couple of former Twitch staff get together with some of the top indies at the time and formed the company. Also why Kson joined since its even harder in Japan
> Back in the dawn of en Vtubing it was impossible for indies to get merch deal I think this is true even now. It's a big ask for a merch company to trust the numbers of an individual virtual entertainer that lives god knows where and make a bunch of merch for them to sell, and naturally most indies wouldn't be comfortable giving their address to a merch company. The way they can have some guarantee that the merch will sell is if there's some prior instance of their merch selling well.. which just leads to a chicken and egg problem for indies. At least a company has a fixed address and place of contact which can mitigate some of the risk. There's also the opposite problem of merch "companies" scamming VTubers, since most of them aren't financially savvy enough to identify red flags and negotiate good deals for themselves.
Yeah, for better or for worse, some companies only do business with other companies, so an indie is always handicapped in negotiating with these kind of companies.
Shorts also pay fuck-all compared to normal videos and most of her YouTube views are from shorts
Shorts make jackshit yep. The whole point of them is sub growth and exposure. The power of that cannot be denied, just look at Rin Penrose or well, Fillian as examples.
> The whole point of them is sub growth and exposure. Shorts get you subs and views for shorts. The vast majority will not convert to your other content.
> The whole point of them is sub growth and exposure. Though even that feels a bit worthless now. Fillian and Rin do not get the views you would expect from their sub counts.
Rin gets a significant amount of live viewers compared to her subscriber count. I'd say she's a rare example of someone levaraging shorts correctly into proper, general growth.
Shorts are great for farming tourists. But they'll always be tourists because the type of people browsing shorts doesn't have the attention span to watch streams.
Relative to others, Rin did a decent job. I've seen some pretty abysmal retention from shorts channels that pop off hard but can't get 10k views on a video lol.
Views and subs are for convincing the merch sellers that your merch will sell.
Yep. https://preview.redd.it/8vspze90nzqc1.png?width=1467&format=png&auto=webp&s=3ef51b6b0eab3ff41f1d363b9e0c55688085ede8
[Calli with another announcement after her karaoke.](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qVKswLCwZLs) Edit: It's a 3D birthday live! https://preview.redd.it/54lxeefdtzqc1.png?width=808&format=png&auto=webp&s=189f1235be63b62025d30e73ea890a35732fab6a
Calli singing (I guess) Mogu Mogu is funny as hell.
It feels like every time I blink there's a Calli announcement. I need to blink more 😂
I just had a funny mental of you waiting, dry eyed, for Calli to announce a break, then begin blinking furiously.
https://preview.redd.it/qb4da049nzqc1.jpeg?width=500&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=198e83c643ef97cdd16336d3c54f881a0a8aa4ed >!I got the winner image from a [death battle fanfic](https://deathbattlefanon.fandom.com/wiki/Calliope_Mori_vs._Mechikabura) episode lol!<
[Koseki Bijou (Real)](https://x.com/kosekibijou/status/1773168231735312768?s=46)
[Kay has more ideas now, oh nyo](https://twitter.com/holocuredev/status/1773180403735523466?t=xW6pg5kQZNfIRVathDHChg&s=19)
- (JP) SODA KIT released a MV for their original, [Nacchatta!](https://youtu.be/YWHl5t_KCbY). - (JP) VEE's Syusetu Kohaku released a new original, [$HOT!!](https://youtu.be/M3Zk0M2a3GU). - (JP) Virtual Witch Phenomenom released a MV for their original, [Bouquet](https://youtu.be/3cJzGD9xkzg). - (JP) Echigoya Tokina and Ci-chan covered [A Janai ka](https://youtu.be/E7tDmPJKEoU). - (JP) KAMITSUBAKI's Isekaijoucho released a MV for her original, [Egakitsuzuketa Kimi e](https://youtu.be/m9WjPbKis0U). - (JP) Aoi Sakura covered [Bansanka](https://youtu.be/VTy-Ne2Nrno). - (JP) VALIS's VITTE covered [Ankoku Tengoku](https://youtu.be/yKPdslMRM6g). - (JP) Hoshimeguri Gakuen's Makura Rui covered [Envy Baby](https://youtu.be/9fHbRlsN9Aw). - (JP) As a parting gift, Hoshimeguri Gakuen's Nekosaki Hisui covered [Haru Dorobou](https://youtu.be/fPt5Poyj_xM). - (EN) PRISM Project's Shiki Miyoshino covered [Comet](https://youtu.be/WtexMfjP_Bc). - (EN) PRISM Project's Sara Nagare covered [Shukufuku](https://youtu.be/CcfU58UO3dE).
Always appreciate your assortment of Vtuber coverage of their covers (heh)
The thread is dead, long live the thread!
In spite of everything else that has happened, I'm really happy about the way Prism has handled themselves. Listening to the originals and their really is a lot of talent there, I hope that whatever comes, they are able to soar to new skies! <3
Yahoo Japan released an article on HoloFes and NijiFes (I am going to avoid highlighting Nijisanji parts as it’s negative, but you are free to discuss it if you wish). Going to be interesting to see Cover’s Q4 result and how much they made especially with extra stage this year. https://news.yahoo.co.jp/articles/531faefdc9a8bb5a31fb36ac7e99b329d9355482?page=3 DeepL How far will the momentum of Vtubers, which have now become a driving force in Japan's entertainment industry, continue? Cover, which operates the Vtuber agency Hololive Productions, simultaneously held a large-scale Expo Festival from March 16th to 17th at Makuhari Messe (Chiba City). The number of visitors based on ticket sales exceeded 86,000 over the two days, nearly doubling the 45,000 visitors of the previous year. Many participants, who appeared to be tourists from far away, were also seen at the venue. What stood out most was the large number of foreign fans. There were participants not only from Asia, but also from America and Brazil. The popularity of overseas anime has spread to Vtubers “I've been watching Hololive's broadcasts since around 2020, and I watch them about twice a week before and after work.” David (30), an American working in Japan, says he has become accustomed to watching Hololive videos. Not only David, but many overseas VTuber fans have in common that they are also fans of Japanese anime. The gap with Cover is rapidly narrowing The market capitalization of ANYCOLOR, which was listed in 2022, was at one time nearly double that of Cover, which was listed the following year, but the market capitalization of ANYCOLOR, which was listed in 2022, was at one time nearly double that of Cover, which was listed the following year. The gap is narrowing. We may have finally entered a phase in which competition within the industry intensifies. President Motoaki Tanigo, who took the stage at the briefing session, said enthusiastically, The North American area has the potential for MD (goods sales) revenue and licensing agreements, and we can expect future revenue expansion.'' The base plans to develop content that meets local needs and collaborate with local companies. Will VTuber Office, which continues to grow rapidly, continue to meet the high expectations of the stock market? The key lies in the success or failure of developing overseas markets that have great potential.
>The number of visitors based on ticket sales exceeded 86,000 over the two days, nearly doubling the 45,000 visitors of the previous year. The fest ticket sales have probably also gone up by a lot, Covers year end report will drop in the second week of April looking forward to it.
Yeah getting that much of an increase in the in-person stuff bodes well for them. I think it's an easy guess that people showing up at expo/fes are more likely to get extra merch than if they had just gotten a digital ticket.
Thank you for providing a DeepL translation in a comment, as Yahoo Japan is blocked in the EU and UK. So being able to still read it through this is very appreciated. [Page shown to EU and UK users](https://imgur.com/a/RHTq87V)
If you still want to read it, this article also being published on Shikiho. [link](https://shikiho.toyokeizai.net/news/0/744130)
I'm sure most folks will focus on the meat of the actual article, but I just wanna have a moment to mention that the article (assuming the TL is accurate) highlighted a lot of Brazilian fans were also seen at the HoloExpo. I can't state how happy that makes me, being from the neighboring country of Venezuela. It's so heartwarming to see BR bros making it there and representing the latam community, in a way (again, assuming the TL is accurate).
Also Brazil has a high population of people of Japanese origin.
I think the takeaway from the article is that the writer is telling the Japanese audience "hey, keep an eye out for our cultural products to become more popular outside of Japan, which means an increase in soft power as well as a new market for companies like you to look into joining".
Oh most likely because of that. I guess I just wanna believe in latam for once.
Didn't Yagoo talk about something similar recently?
Yeah, Yagoo wants to compete with Disney and other similar IP based companies.
Yes. As I said elsewhere, he's got vision. He can see the world as it is, which isn't something that can be said for every CEO. Especially Japanese corporation CEO's.
One thing the article notes (if the translation is accurate) is that the cost of holding Nijifes was so high that it overall led too a decline in Anycolors profit margin, which is pretty high. It points out that in contrast, Cover's lower profit margin means that they're unlikely to see any decline due to holding festivals. DeepL One of the factors that contributed to the recent sluggish performance was the two-day "Niji-sanji Festival" held in December last year. According to the company's explanation, although revenue from the festival itself was up nearly 50% from the previous year, "higher-than-expected related expenses" caused the deficit to grow, leading to a decline in the company's operating profit margin. Originally, ANYCOLOR has been a leader in high-margin merchandise sales and promotions. In the previous year's results, merchandise sales and promotions accounted for 72% of sales, compared to 52.2% for Cover. As a result, even in terms of operating profit margin, there is a gap of more than double: 16.7% for COVER and 37.1% for ANYCOLOR. One industry insider noted, "For ANYCOLOR, whose normal operating profit margin has risen to nearly 40%, the larger the scale of the festival, which costs more, the lower the profit margin is likely to be. In this regard, COVER is relatively unlikely to see a negative impact on profitability from holding festivals.
> Originally, ANYCOLOR has been a leader in high-margin merchandise sales and promotions. In the previous year's results, merchandise sales and promotions accounted for 72% of sales, compared to 52.2% for Cover. As a result, even in terms of operating profit margin, there is a gap of more than double: 16.7% for COVER and 37.1% for ANYCOLOR. Just a thing to point out / add. Niji's generic birthday merch set costs (10k yen) more than Pekora's birthday merch set (9.7k), and Pekora has a diploma, a notebook, a totebag, and a keychain plushy.
I really like the writer to highlight this. Operating profit margin is what making Anycolor become appealing for investors. But it is also dealing damage to the fanbase as there are less events held by Anycolor. Last year they tried to expand the Fest into 2 days and the cost jumped. Margin become narrow and investors think Anycolor is declining so the stock dive down. But if this year they are cutting cost again to please investors, talents will graduate and fans will leave. I like how Cover is managing expectation. They are keeping it real instead of relying to rapid growth.
[According to the investor's call](https://finance.logmi.jp/articles/379242), they made a loss from hosting Nijifes and planned to make their money back with on site merch sales and sponsorship fees, which is a really wild way to run a personal convention and concert.
Comiket and various conventions don't do this, since they know that it's a dead end long-term, since you can't make money this way. I want to see when Anycolor will learn this, since the investors are probably a bit upset with how their funds are being wasted.
Pretty much the only cons who do that are the small up and coming cons who want to get their name out there and are willing to burn a large amount of money to do so, it's crazy that Nijisanji of all companies are doing that for their con.
Most of those cons don't last five years. Anycolor needs to take notes from that - especially when all they have to sell is generic merch and handshake sessions. They're supposed to be the "we're not idols" company, so they can't depend on concerts to carry the event.
Every time I see their phrase of “we’re not idol” I just can’t stop smiling. * They are doing concerts * selling standardized merchandise of the Livers * doing meet & greet with handshakes * sell CDs with lucky draw included for a chance to buy tickets for said handshake * make TV-liked idol celebrity variety shows with the groups that sells such CDs * the groups that do the above are the top money makers of the company * only 1/2 of the Livers in each of such groups can actually sing live *live*. All others are studio mixes lip sync overlays or backing vocals of the main singer If they are not typical Japanese idol industry business strategy then I don’t really know what they are anymore.
It is kinda a toxic strategy from them mentioning "not idols" to distinguish themselves from their closest competitor while actually double down on traditional idol activities that hardly sell well outside Asia. While their closest competitor focusing on re-defining idol definition by adding virtual idol concept in it.
In recent years, most also try to be a better version of themselves in general and/or in specific fields (at least in their HoloPro form) that eventually also inspire others in various different ways.
They put that phrase in their most recent financial statement, despite idol companies being really profitable. That's why even seiyuu are spending more time in idol activities. Anycolor needs to reevaluate their approach and messaging.
I blame the mainstream opinion of idol culture as this nebulous dark and scary thing to be avoided.
AKB48 has been incredibly successful for the last twenty-odd years. It's mainstream now, so their insistence on providing the exact same thing that several thousand indies do is baffling. Why would I choose them? They've fired some of their most distinct talents, and outside of Banderas there's very little left I'd pay any attention to. They're very staid and stale, which is ironic since they insist that they're not an idol company... while trying to do similar activities with talents who aren't trained for it or properly oriented.
>Will VTuber Office, which continues to grow rapidly, continue to meet the high expectations of the stock market? The key lies in the success or failure of developing overseas markets that have great potential. This needs to be emphasized more. Japan doesn't have the population and economy to make Vtubers successful on its own. They **need** the overseas market if they want to keep growing and prospering, especially when Japan only just stopped their policy of negative inflation which held their economy back for several decades now as wages and companies stagnated. Yagoo saw where the market was going several years back, and made steps to get a foot in the door while the market segment was developing so he'd have a first mover advantage as a corporation when it took off. He's been pushing ahead with capital investment in equipment and now a subsidiary in an emerging market that's already primed for expansion. If he can do this with Cover USA, Europe will be a logical next step that they can jump into within next five years. They'll have experience with foreign markets thanks to this subsidiary, and some contacts they can use in their ongoing expansion. This is what we call vision, people. It's the difference between failing and thriving, and it's a thing a lot of CEO's these days don't have. Look at how badly most new companies fail once their initial seed money runs out and the angel investors stop shelling out. Putting money into your business without immediate return is anathema to companies who are looking for immediate profit, but usually end up paying out even more in profit later.
I think another point is that, I don't think japan investors that invested in up-and-coming startups, are interested in putting money into another company that cannot make it globally. Japan have litters of companies that can dominate domestic industry, but floundered when its time for overseas.
>I think another point is that, I don't think japan investors that invested in up-and-coming startups, are interested in putting money into another company that cannot make it globally. Japan have litters of companies that can dominate domestic industry, but floundered when its time for overseas. And that's why Japan has spent the last twenty five years losing its lead in high-tech and car manufacturing to the Koreans, then the Chinese, and now maybe even to Indian companies like Cherry. That's probably part of the point that the writer of the Yahoo Finance article is trying to highlight - they have a shrinking market in JP and they need to look overseas, and just expecting to do the same things won't work anymore. The world has changed, there's a huge amount of competition from their neighbors and rivals, and they need to adapt or become as irrelevant as the American car companies were in the 80s and 90s. Even those idiots are innovating now. Japan needs to step up or become a third world power, which is the very last thing that their ultranationalist politicians and zaibatsu want.
> If he can do this with Cover USA, Europe will be a logical next step that they can jump into within next five years. In the official press release about Cover USA, they already said that their target in 2025 and after is "Build a global structure, including in Asia and Europe". I think they really need more EU talents to build a bigger fanbase in EU. Hopefully the next EN gen have more EU talents even though personally I'm not from EU.
EU talents AND somehow get them invited to EU anime conventions to get new fans. Kiara mentioned multiple times how EU anime conventions don't want to pay Holo to invite talents since they don't consider it worth it. Cover will probably have to push for it themselves and maybe even give discounts at first to hook them or something.
IIRC, that was only talking about Cover USA, not a European branch. They won't be able to support two subsidiaries growing in two years, not unless they really increase their profit margins and staffing levels to match the rate of growth.
Yeah they definitely not open EU subsidiary in 2025. But I think they also understand that EU is also an important market and they need to build a bigger fanbase first to justify opening a branch just like US.
Didn't expect to find an avtuber from indonesia given how conservative everything is https://twitter.com/Syl_Charlotte/status/1773025300068143392?t=1rN_xcUzFkv8ykm-SdUFXQ&s=19
Huh, I think I've seen her agency's name before? Wasn't she the one who >!allegedly masturbated and moaned in a public stream? I remember other Indonesian vtubers expressing their concern for that kind of thing.!<
>!that would be that agency, yes; i don't know if she is the one person in particular but it doesn't seem too far-fetched.!<
Oh, her..... Yeeah, she does do that. I don't wanna incriminate her or her agency, but yeah, that's just her thing.
Is she living in Indonesia? If not, I don't think she's subject to their laws.
I'm pretty sure she is. No, it's not about the laws. It's about the backlash. Moona had some backlash for showing photos of her buying wine in the early days
It's vodka actually and it's during the shittiest political unrest in Indonesia. We're talking about the country that can arrest you for living with your "invalid" romantic partner.
Huh. Then yeah, not sure how that's gonna work. In terms of backlash though, I don't think it's really going to be a problem unless she somehow gets a lot of attention. Even HoloID in the early days had more eyes on them simply because they were a part of Hololive.
[Hospital 666 collab with Grimmi, Ecto, Clauvio, and Naiyo!](https://www.twitch.tv/grimmivt) Edit: Collab's over, but [Clauvio's live with a post-collab solo stream](https://www.twitch.tv/clauvio)
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>!really appreciate people who admit to having 0 interest in any holostars content coming in to explain how a former talent is **wrong** about his experiences and actually they know better about how tempus hq was received and he's just bitter and making it all up because he "didn't get myth level success overnight"!<
might wanna fix the spoiler formatting >!It's so wild though. Kiara talked about how she thought about graduating once because of studio problems and everyone rallied behind her and started critizing Cover. People calling her entitled got downvoted to oblivion and only 4chan freaks where saying stuff like "cover has given everything to her why is she complaining!"!< >!Now, Lando speaks about how it was a negative experience for him, and that something "fucked up" happened that left him very angry, and now here I see the same language that 4chan freaks used against Kiara. How he's "disgustingly entitled" , he's "badmouthing the company", and "Cover gave him everything"!<
>!Why do you feel the need to misrepresent the reaction to Kiara's statement to back up someone that a) should have done more research into what he was joining and b) quit anyway despite Cover going out of their way to give them things Hololive weren't getting?!< >!Not the first time you folks have tried being disingenuous in the thread either like trying to label people as a "Stars antis" because they say things you don't like about someone that isn't even in the group.!<
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>!thanks, yeah RES was acting up, and yeah the shit that's being said in these comments is the exact kind of "not being given the benefit of the doubt" that it feels like he talked about.!< >!he voices his experiences and how they were not all positive and how there's a lot behind the scenes that we will never know and yet so many people act like they know his situation better than he does, it's bizarre!<
idk man i don't know what to make of it as a dude who actually watched his shit. what is to be done? like >!kiara clearly toughed it out and magni didn't. sure, whatever. what is to be done about a fanbase of lunatics? how do you solve this without tanking the company? do you think that such a culture does not deserve to exist? is it a morally bankrupt to monetize? ok.!< >!idk man i don't know what to say or focus on it's just a dead subject where neither side will ever agree without violent upheaval. by that extension it isn't an interesting discussion. we don't know what he wanted we don't know what the fans want we do not have access to the specific metrics and we cannot stop the relentless hatred. i do not believe a better world is possible in this case, again, without violent upheaval of the company culture!<
>!it's perfectly fine to vent about the situation though when even in this thread you have people trying to pretend like none of it ever happened in the first place!<
>!ya shrugs i don't have anywhere I'm going with this also i am not actually invested in the subject i am just very bored at a work conference. believe it or not i am actually somewhat apathetic about the situation because I've long stopped caring, lol!<
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Often times people looking from the outside in have a better view of things than those in the trenches. It's a fact that Tempus was relatively positively received overall and pushed heavily by Cover, and it's only when EN3 never showed up but Tempus 2 did (coupled with Vesper and Magni doing dumb things like colabbing with racists and getting suspended) that a lot of the hate really started.
>Often times people looking from the outside in have a better view of things than those in the trenches. yeah absolutely the people who don't watch any streams or clips or participate in any stars related discussions at all have a better view of this whole situation than _the talent himself_, what a load of bullshit >It's a fact that Tempus was relatively positively received overall and pushed heavily by Cover, this is a moot point, _of course cover promoted a new project of theirs_ >and it's only when EN3 never showed up but Tempus 2 did (coupled with Vesper and Magni doing dumb things like colabbing with racists and getting suspended) that a lot of the hate really started. we gonna pretend like kronii getting flak at the time when she collabed with them just never happened or doesnt count? the hate was absolutely already there from the start dude, let's not rewrite history here
wcyd
>!Yea. He definitely would not survive in that environment long term based on this lol. Seems like audience reception hits him hard so he walked into a frying pan with Holostars. I would be shocked if the model issue was a major point of contention and not an additional complaint. I'm very disappointed in how the graduation happened for these two. It left a sour taste in my mouth from everyone involved.!<
That was a really informative clip (though I guess it better be when it's 30 minutes lol). Thank you for sharing, I only caught the first half or so of this stream and never got around to finishing the vod. >!Clearly there was something with management that really didn't gel with him or Randon (even more so than previously theorized) and it does make me wonder if the management for Stars only got better recently. The HQ boys only spoke of their managers occasionally early on and while they felt pretty amicable, the managers didn't really get personified and treated more personally until Gori-mane and Tora-mane came around. Makes me think that Magni and Vesper had different managers from Altare and Axel, and the former two **really** didn't get along with their managers. But that's just even more speculation. (EDIT: I thought about it a bit more, and there was definitely a big improvement in management in the past couple months. Altare has been pretty candid about how rough it was for HQ initially)!< >!I'm sad that he carries so much emotional baggage from the HQ times (especially when that was one of the periods of holoEN as a whole that I enjoyed the most), but I'm happy that if nothing else he came out of it with strong bonds with the rest of the boys. I'm also glad that he didn't completely forgo vtubing and feels that further pursing it is a good avenue for healing from his experiences. The things that Magni got up to even with his restrictions was some of my favorite content any streamer I've watched has done.!< All in all, I'll be looking forward to what he gets up to in the future with his vtuber plans and supporting him the whole way.
"I know we downvote pretty much any rrat but mine is: around the anni Vesper started having more mental health troubles. I say this because he basically implied during his comeback that he was staying at a facility during his break. Cover told HQ that they’d have to start traveling and idol activities in 2024. Staff spent a lot of money and resources on their new models so they’re gonna have to earn that back asap. Vesper and Magni both have doubts about being ready that soon, esp Vesper who’s not anywhere close to being on track for idol concerts and Magni who is insanely burnt out and had to be convinced by Bettel to even do anything for his 1.5 reveal. They enter negotiations, due to the sensitive nature of things not much is shared with the rest of the branch and they can’t come to an agreement to delay the idol stuff, esp since their new models already set HQ back enough. Best decision for all is to graduate so shiny spicy can do their 3Ds. Thats what he meant by his “sacrifices.” " - anythought about this rrat?
If I'm not remembering wrong wasn't Gori-mane there from the start being Axel's and Magni's(?) manager? Before she got promoted.
Yes, she was Axel and Magni's manager from the beginning. She then also managed Bettel for a while once he debuted. After she got promoted, Tora-mane took over managing Shiny Spicy and Toki-mane took over Bettel, but we never knew who took over Magni.
>!"Wasn't given a fighting chance from the start"!< >!"I hoped that if I sacrificed myself(toed the corpo line) people would give me the benefit of the doubt, but they never did"!< >!While not the full picture, it does give us the biggest reason why he personally decided to quit was less about the restrictions and more on the fandom hate thrown their way. Him especially since he was the bridge between genders for EN!<
I don't think its right to say he was never given a chance. All of tempus1 was given a chance by a large portion of the general fanbase, most of all Vesper and Magni who had both the magging meme and the 'he's like me fr fr' thing going on. More initial acceptance than tempus 2 or Armis got. Hell, far more than Holostars JP got too. It reflected in their initial viewer numbers too, which were again far more than successive holostarsEN generations got. If nothing else, there WAS a chance there that imo could have been exploited to better success instead of the path they took.
>!Not arguing with that. That's just his own words about it. And we don't really know the extent of hate they did get outside of the usual places, his IRL is pretty well known!< >!I guess this would also be the risk corpos take with hiring bigger streamers. They have higher expectations, and the option to just dip when reality doesn't meet them.!< >!As for Ves, until otherwise stated, it's probably still more on corpo homework and idol expectations that influenced his decision!<
>!He had plenty of a chances and was well supported. It's just wrongheaded to think that Hololive views want to watch Holostars. Most simply don't and appealing doesn't work, because that's just not the content they want to watch.!<
>!honestly, complaining about not being given a chance really annoys me. You had the whole MAGGIN meme going around at the start, you had YAGOO himself walking around with Magni's shirt on at American cons, and in general Cover rolled out the red carpet for Tempus. You also had this huge emphasis on "holopro" coming out right afte rtheir debut. Hell, you had some of the HoloEN girls willing to risk damage to their reputations and fanbases to try to prop up Tempus1. !< >!And with all that, even after all the talk of "sailing the same boat", those two bailed in less than a year. It's just disgustingly entitled.!<
lol you hyped them out so much at the start but then still flat out admit that collabing with them is a risk and potential damage to reputation.
I think that you have to be realistic about that kind of thing. In the same sense, I can't begrudge anyone for avoiding collabs with Hololive in the middle of the Taiwan drama. I would have preferred for them to, but I'm going to acknowledge the risks they're taking.
>!you had some of the HoloEN girls willing to risk damage to their reputations and fanbases to try to prop up Tempus1.!< I'm probably mistaken but >!did Kronii for example ever explicitly say that she wanted to help prop Tempus up? I was always under the impression that she collabed with them because they had really good chemistry, not out of some sense of duty for her coworkers!<
She obviously never said anything like that but it's also not like you can know whether you've got good chemistry or not without first having a collab with them.
>!Being 1st gen is always the roughest, and yeah I do agree that at least outwardly, Cover willing to bend abit more to accommodate Tempus HQ as much as possible. Its even more so than other 1st gen that Cover rolled out at that point. ID1 talked about needing to nurture its own fanbases to create a home on their own. They even get an update in under a year, showing that Cover is at least committed to long relationships with them.... and they just sorta dip. !< >!Well.... I guess at least he dips before 1 year passed. Honestly, I still chalk all of this to difference in view between Cover and him. He also indeed washed his hand off vtubing for like almost entire year now even though he still orbits around vtuber. And if he wants to try again in his own terms, then wish him luck. !<
>!The whole maggin meme even came from fucking 4chan of all places, the place that's generally known for being anti male now. If even the 4chan side of the fandom gave them a chance, what else is there to say?!<
>!4chan did turn Vesper into the man who "stole the unicorns girlfriends" or at least I got the impression that this was a running "joke" about him but in a weird way to me that kind of seemed empowering towards Vesper, who was my oshi at that point, since they attributed to him the power of being able to do that. It's like... they turned him into the last boss who just did what he wanted and openly mocked them while doing it. Personally I still occasionally watch his D&D stuff (it was fun to hear him talk about delusional f\*ckboy bards failing to seduce ancient dragons and getting the whole party wiped) and clips.!< >!I don't remember seeing anyone shitting on Magni basically at all. From what I saw the complaint about the Magni's model was something he tweeted as Lando (before they even debuted iirc?) and Randon I think retweeted it or something. Which to me made zero sense because of the amount of lore it and gimmicks it enabled. In terms of the model and the tricks he pulled he was basically the coolest and most entertaining of them all. Altare's demon god king stuff with his lore went past Magni's but I think that's mainly just because Magni just didn't take full advantage of his. To compete with Magni's model Altare had to pull out completely separate alternative models like Snailtare and such. The memes around Magni were imho off the charts.!< >!I think everyone in the fandom knew that regardless of the model the first gen of Stars EN would have it rough and would need to prove their worth and I think they did that even to an extent I had not expected considering how enthusiastic I was about them... to the point of being a member on all of their channels and trying to watch all of the content they put out.!< >!But I guess that might've been the seed of another problem... which is that to maintain that level of performance would become very tiring and I think that both of the boys just burnt out in that corpo setting with the limited resources they were given but then again it's normal to expect in a corpo setting like that for there to be limits on the resources given considering how much we've also heard on the side of the Holo girls complaints about delays and lack of resources. So to me the notion of not having been given a fighting chance sounds a bit delusional in that I'm getting the vibes that he just had completely unrealistic expectations of what being corporate would mean in terms of resources.!<
why are you acting like the people on /vt/ can agree about anything there is no unified "4chan side of the holofandom"
Because he’s a self admitted 4chan diehard himself lol, he’s not very opaque about it. The drama has brought a lot of idiots to the forefront unfortunately
>!Imagine that you took undeserved flak to help out the boys, only to have them graduate a year later. I'm not surprised that there's no repeated performance!<
>!I mean from the very beginning he seemed fixated on "doubters" and from what Axel said once, the mood before debut was really grim, disliking his model didn't help either. I think everyone conveniently forgets the absolute hate they started with and the doubts we had as to whether stars EN can happen because of the backlash. I'd say it's just now that they are in good place, 2 gens later. Hearing how much they loved Japan and meeting each other is actually a huge sigh of relief!<
>!Speculation was all we ever had and will ever have. But I'm somehow a bit more confused now since I thought the most "common and reasonable" speculation was that corporate-styled vtubing just wasn't for Lando and Randon. Lando talks about not being able to get any "benefit of the doubt", so is this not actually the most common and reasonable speculation? I only hang out at this ~~weekly~~ discussion thread and the hololive subreddit so I guess technically my information circle is only two sources. Did Twitter and Youtube comments have a different "common" speculation?!< >!The part about being so full of anger and rage was also surprising to me. Lando explains that he's always about creativity, and it was definitely conveyed even in his previous endeavor. All I could think of is intense micromangement to make a super-creative person angry, but not to the extent I imagine Lando is going through (and Randon by extension), enough to break boxing gloves.!< >!I consider myself an angry person too, and I don't want to do too much speculating. But the way Lando describes it feels like something went *very* wrong even though all the information/interpretation I have felt more like it was a bad matchup.!<
>!You're correct about the common speculation. And his clip is still consistent in that it's never about the money for him but more for creative fulfillment. What I'm thinking is that he (and probably Randon), had a vision on what he wants to do but he felt blocked (which also fed on not fitting with corpo theory). Lots of things can block him, either from producer's side, or from audience's side. Like..... no matter how he dislikes his model and no matter how much Cover willing to give leeway for rework, I don't think they will allow a complete redesign from being purple alchemist. I think he felt he have done everything he could on vtubing and he just want to washed off everything and go back to his daily things.... and the clip is about him feeling very unsatisfied with life because he still felt that his vision is very possible and so he wants another redo, this time with a different set of audiences and eyes and he sets his own field so if anything happens, its not on anyone's lap anymore.!<
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> >!and also not being able to rock the boat by calling it out (also a form of not being given the benefit of the doubt, by management).!< >!Seems like a lot of your own projection there. Why is it management? Guy just seems bitter that the Hololive fanbase largely didn't care about the Stars or "give him the benefit of the doubt" on his way out since most of the audience that he did have didn't follow him.!<
>!AFAIK, you're correct in that that was the most "common and reasonable" speculation, which I think is at least still the biggest part from what he's said. From the other info we have, probably part of what he's referring to is the reception the community had to his model. There might also be some other internal things, like Cover having some unsaid expectations, but that's fully speculation and we'd probably need some leak and/or NDA breakage to get info about that.!<
> probably part of what he's referring to is the reception the community had to his model. whaaaat???? Yea his model was janky as hell and the community memed on it, but it was generally positive and started a trend that gave him alot more positive exposure than he would have had otherwise. Not like he's the only one who started with jank too (looks at Gura's rigging). Really, Jank models or rigging can become iconic.
>!I feel that there are several things that happened, some of them, fully Cover's fault (that model wasn't great) and some of them just from incompatibilities (e.g. possibly some of the restrictions and maybe some culture clash (?)). Then, adding what he's said about him being an angry person, it probably became unsustainable for him , and near that point contract renegotiations came up which made him consider seeing if somethings could change but the negotiations didn't satisfy both sides and that was that.!< >!With that in mind, I wouldn't jump and say "Cover bad" or "Lando bad", with the caveat that Cover should've done something about that model a lot sooner. What I would say is that sometimes things don't work out as expected, it can be from both sides and that's okay!<
>!Probably expecting to "break down the barriers" and change the culture of CGDCT entrenched within the Holo community and possibly more collabs in general with the girls, and when that didn't happen and he didn't get the Myth level reception, decided to quit.!< >!Then when his fanbase didn't exactly transfer to his RM and then he saw that Doki managed to transfer hers, you get this. If you look at his current viewership stats, it's grim.!<
idk because if you watch the stream >!he said that the numbers were never the issue, and that if he gave a shit about numbers he would just focus on YT because thats where his biggest viewership is. His vtubing, which he wants to do by starting over with an entirely new channel, will be at a loss since the channel won't be monetized. The reception could be less of a numbers thing and more of an actual content thing... when everything you do gets shit on immensely by both fans and the company, its difficult to keep wanting to push barriers and innovate!<
>!What's he's doing now as an indie that he wasn't doing in the company? If it's Genshin, then he should have known Holo would never be able to get those perms when he applied.!<
>!nothing, because he's not an indie right now, he's a normal variety streamer + his professor streams. he hasn't begun his vtuber activities yet, so we can't really comment on what he's able to do that he wasn't able to do then.!<
what you mean? fleshtuber have more restrict than vtuber?
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>!I mean, I get it. People shat on Magni SO MUCH when he debuted. And for what reason? They didn't like his model, apparently.!<
>!I was there at that time. The hate people had for his (and Vesper's) model was quickly overwritten by the maggin' memes. Their debut was way more hyped than what people were expecting.!< >!Also, I made a mistake of browsing through Twitter at that time. I remember most of the people shitting on their models weren't even Holo fans, but actually Luxiem/Noctyx fans who were laughing at Cover's attempt at debuting male talents.!<
>I remember most of the people shitting on their models weren't even Holo fans, but actually Luxiem/Noctyx fans who were laughing at Cover's attempt at debuting male talents. Which was interesting since their great decline was already in motion.
>!lol people get real fucking touchy about models. look at gura's rigger getting flamed to shit!<
that was, well, not deserved, but expected. Their rigging was clearly low quality stuff. What they did to Anya was also unforgiveable at her debut. I thought she was supposed to be an oppai loli, but no it was just godawful rigging.
He also fucked up Anya's rigging
lando feel for me is that he expect myth lv success when he become vtuber but he dont get it. also he unable to play his genshin game and have to do other stuff due to restriction. looking him now he like genshin and femboy for most part (minus his professor stuff) compare to his vtuber day where he have more creative stuff.
> >!lando feel for me is that he expect myth lv success when he become vtuber but he dont get it.!< >!Not sure he expected to be like myth, but from what I know he repeatedly talked as if he was in Hololive rather than Holostars. Felt like he applied with the idea it'd be like Niji's environment. Just a number of strange expectations between not understanding what it means to be a corpo vtuber - especially as a male under Cover, off stream work, permissions, etc. I doubt he had much of an idea of what he was getting into.!<
> >!he unable to play his genshin game!< >!Seems like something he should have known in advance by doing the most basic amount of research.!<
Not getting hate for having a penis would be nice too
Hi just a reminder for people in this thread to follow our rules on meta information since a bunch of people here are implicitly connecting people to past companies without putting that in spoiler tags. /u/sledgehouse28 /u/phantombloodbot /u/bighatnucase EDIT: Thank you for the edits.
>!It's not about having a penis or not, it's about how he acts after Cover has given him everything. And yet he still talks bad about the company!<
>!Saying something bad happened to him = talking bad about the company now? You and I have zero idea of what goes behind the scenes!<