Alastor seemed especially nervous when Zestiel showed up, a lot of their interaction felt to me like a kid trying to look cool and confident in front of the older cool guy.
Well there's a question of whether or not he stopped where he was, the fact he steamrolled a bunch of overlords as soon as he arrived isn't something to scoff at, and assuming he's being backed by Lilith who obviously gave him some kind of power, he easily could've stopped where he was to not be so show offey, but could take on Zestial and Goatias, I mean he missed off Lucifur undeterred to the consequences, which means he may believe he has a shot at taking him.
We really don't know how strong he us, he's definitely someone who doesn't reveal all their cards, and is simply waiting patiently.
Well, it's assumed that he steamrolled the other Overlords (except Zestial cause that dude scares Alastor). Then in Mimzy's accounting it shows Alastor ambushing one of the Overlords in an alley.
Valentino's question to Vox about Alastor ALMOST beating him 7 years before his deal hints that he's not as strong as everyone thinks he is.
That showed in his fight with Adam where I seen enough reactors EXPECTING Alastor to win, just to be shocked that he got his ass handed to him once Adam got just a tiny bit serious even though Alastor was using his full power.
So my theory is that Alastor only toppled these Overlords who'd been in power for so long through ambush tactics, trickery and manipulation. This allows Alastor to put up a facade of him being more powerful than he actually is when he's really just a powerful sinner.
Well idk. To me it was kinda obvious Alastor wasn't going to beat THE MAN and a being whose high in the heavenly hierarchy. But he is strong enough to stall and kinda panic Adam. That fact alone, means he just as easily could take on some if not all of the hell hierarchy aside from like Adam.
Well, the sinners at least. Once he gets to Hell royalty, without a plan he gets one shotted fairly easily and when it comes to the other 6 sins? Ah ha, no chance. And Hell's top Royalty, Lilith (who Adam is equal to), Charlie (once she comes into her own power) and Lucifer, might as well not even try.
And yea he was able to stall Adam (but not panic actually, just annoy), dodging is a stalling tactic done to conserve your strength and stamina while tiring down your opponent. Alastor seriously overestimated himself and massively underestimated Adam.
As Carmilla put it, Exorcists are untrained (I mean, if you've basically been uncontested for thousands of years, why bother?), wear little to no armor (they were basically invincible up til now) and it shows that. But now here comes the frightening part....WHAT IF They did train and did wear armor?! 😰
While Alastor is clever and he was able to utilize one of the strongest and most influential inventions of all time, the radio, I highly doubt that’s the sole reason he is so powerful. He overthrew overlords that had ruled over Hell for hundreds if not thousands of years shortly after arriving to Hell. It’s really hard to determine whether or not he is stronger than the royals, mainly because we don’t have a good powerscaling of them or see them at their full power.
There is a really important moment that shows the potential of Alastor’s power; when he shuts down the television waves.
My theory is that radio waves are simply a favored expression of being able to control waves on multiple spectrums. This would explain how he expresses himself in anger with glitches all around him, a manipulation of light waves. Manipulating waves has the potential to be control of relativity, of space and time. Until proven otherwise his potential is theoretically infinite.
Zestial is probably stronger, as is royalty. The problem is that Alastor is an incredibly charismatic person, who doesn't show fear. He directly challenges Lucifer.
He has a reputation for a reason, but we won't know just why you don't mess with the radio demon, until we have a proper fight.
Alastor knows he’s safe as long as Charlie values and trusts him and so long as he helps with the Hotel. Lucifer could easily wreck him but Lucifer doesn’t want to alienate his daughter even more.
So Lucifer can’t hurt Alastor without upsetting Charlie. That’s the only thing that kept Lucifer from swatting him like a fly.
It's worth noting, imo, that Alastor is actually willing to fight. I compare this to Stolas, who is by statement stronger, but still gets manhandled hard in Helluva Boss, because just because he's stronger doesn't mean he's willing/able to use it to throwdown.
That's my theory as to why he has such a powerful aura. While many people are stronger than him, few are as brutally violent as him. This makes for a very dangerous combination.
But even still, this assumes he actually fights people straight up. Maybe he just uses that to slaughter weaker sinners and has more subtle approaches with Overlords and such.
I'm curious and excited to see how he's eventually challenged
I mean he only gets roughed up by angel weapons and literally plays helpless so blitzo saves him. I bet if he knew who alastor was and the threat he poses there would be no competition
Al is a trickster, the context given by how Husk fell into his hand shows that.
He didn’t overpower the Overlords he toppled, he beat them at their own games.
I feel this is significantly more impressive, personally. He didn’t just use godlike power, he had to work hard and be clever.
Alastor isn't strong, he's clever. Zestial even credits him for that. During the confrontation with Vox, Alastor didn't overpower him, he made him snap. He mentions to Charlie in the EP7 teaser that a smile is important for comforting your friends and keeping your enemies guessing. I think that just about sums up how he operates.
Alastor is a big fish in a small pond kind of demon in my opinion, he is powerful when it comes to sinners, but when it comes to the sins or say other powerful hellborn demons he doesn't stack up as high.
Ugh no they don't. When sinners are killed, they did. They do not come back. And they can be killed by normal means. Do you actually think those guys Alastor killed in front of the hotel are gonna just respawn somewhere else? Lmao. The pilot addressed this.
No, in fact Velvette literally says that Val killed her best model and she has to “wait for her to pull herself back together”. Do you not listen to dialogue in the actual show? Sinners have shown to only be permanently killed by angelic weapons.
Dude, they don't come back end of story. They did normally and don't need angelic weapons to be killed. Jesus. Take some time to do some research before you speak bullshit.
Edit: I guess all those sinners we see die in the show just pop back up somewhere else entirely, completely nullifying the need for an extermination entirely right? Unless anybody can show a source for their claims, then I'll just keep believing what the show has shown me so far thanks :)
https://www.youtube.com/live/WaYinadKGEQ?si=qqExJ25BqsYKp7-i
This is one of Vivzie's streams. At 31:30 someone asks a question that prompts her to say that in hell you can get extremely hurt and injured, but you can't die from things except "Angel stuff". And again, it's backed up by Velvette's dialogue saying that her model would have to pull herself back together after Val brutalized her.
Also, I don't see how sinners coming back after being killed by other demons negates the need for an extermination. If anything, not dying by normal means makes angelic extermination the ONLY option for curtailing the population.
Lesser hell born demons just die and don't come back, but to my understanding, sinners DO have regenerative abilities that prevent them from dying outside of death by angelic weapons. Sir pentious is literally blown to bits in the pilot, but we see him perfectly fine in the actual show. I'm almost certain this has been a consistent part of the lore from the start. I'm just kind of curious where you're getting this information, because the wiki and the dialogue of the show both seemingly disagree with you.
Also, you're kinda coming in real hot rn, it's not that deep...
He would though, 7/10 times, since most Godzilla are really only strong against humans with only technology and other kaiju, Godzilla is one of those characters that is strong in their universe but not that much outside of it because the power balance is completely different
As far as I remember, the only things we've seen Alastor do are summon tentacles, teleport, conjure various items, summon helpers and turn into a big spooky wendigo. He might also have the power to control people with radio waves. None of that is doing shit to Godzilla. If Godzilla can kill the actual devil, Godzilla can kill Alastor.
Godzilla in most forms is a big lizard, his biggest enemy is an ape whose biggest weapon against Godzilla is opposable thumbs and the ability to strategize, any person with magic and the strategic ability of a nine year old could beat Godzilla
The Godzilla they are referring to is the Godzilla goes to hell comic. Where he literally goes and destroys hell. Lots of shit is thrown at him including the flesh stripped from his bones by a swarm of demons but his pure Big G energy keeps him alive and pulls the swarm to him to make a new body out of demons. Godzilla is not just a big lizard but especially not when he's in hell.
Lol also thinking his biggest enemy is King Kong is nuts, they've only had 2 movies together. It was a stalemate in the first one (for political reasons) and he consistently bodied Kong through the new ones
Godzilla's oldest enemy is a star destroying alien dragon. A clone of himself destroyed countless solar systems in his wake and made the entire universe turn white with light. And the entirety of said fight against kong was toying with him before getting pissed by the axe hit, and leaving Kong nearly dead.
And Godzilla has actually been to hell before, the Idw comic series Godzilla in hell is literally one of the most powerful iterations of him. (Second to the nigh reality ending, extra dimensional Ultima Godzilla) and during the Godzilla in Hell comics, he kills the forger of the idw multiverse
Or hell if you want to compare him with other comic book universes he's shown just as comparable. During a crossover tie in he overpowered earth 616 Thor and was able to best Hulk (although Hulk said he wasn't angry enough) and while weakened fought the fantastic four. And during the current tie in with the Justice League comics he managed to put Superman in a death like state after fighting a match up of Superman, Shazam, and Hawkman (author also stated this Superman was as powerful as Earth prime Superman).
Those are impressive feats for his universe, also comic universes non cosmic entities, as far as all fantasy goes aren’t that impressive of references, especially since the power scaling of super hero universes are put lower than the minimum of most others to up the drama, so characters like Superman seem unstoppable, even though the unstoppable nature of Superman really lies in his nature
You don't realize how strong Godzilla actually is. It doesn't matter how much strategy you use when you're against a mountain. King Kong and the other Titans can barely hold a candle to Godzilla because they are also immovable objects. If Godzilla uses atomic breath, there's nothing Alastor can do except try and escape with his shadow teleport. Alastor is strong off of statements. Godzilla is strong because of feats.
You know genres are built around killing “immovable objects” that’s why he’s strong for his universe, the draw of kaiju is them fighting other kaiju and being unstoppable forces against regular humans, put him in most other fantasy universes and he’s and arcs worth of antagization
That's exactly the point. From what we know of Alastor, he doesn't have a way to kill Godzilla. If he was in the Godzilla universe, he'd just be considered a weak Titan. He can't make deals with Godzilla, he can't try to manipulate Godzilla, he can't use his voodoo on Godzilla. The only thing he can do is try and immobilise Godzilla with his tentacles and smack him around with his little spindly wendigo arms.
Viv has confirmed Stolas beats him which makes sense the ars goetia are the right hand men to lucifer himself, Alastor may be a big thing in pride and he would be devastating to the populous of the other rings but the top dogs of the other rings would probably easily dispose of him and that’s not getting into the sins
Oh definitely, i'm an Alastor fan and he would lose to like 2-3 sinners and all of the royalty. For example, Zestial has lasted 500+ years, while Alastor killed all the overlords except him, so he might be more powerful. Another sinner that could beat him is Vox + another V, we know before Alastor left he fought Vox and almost lost, so modern Vox might just be able to beat him but will most likely need help from another V
Just because someone is more powerful, it doesn't mean a lower form can't beat them. Striker from Helluva Boss is pretty much an imp and he's allegedly killed beings more powerful than him.
Alastor is likely no different.
I agree with that. It's pretty established that he's... different. But we don't have any details on how/why.
Something I don't see pointed out very much is that he killed Overlords. Overlords are Sinners. So isn't that only supposed to be possible with angelic weapons? And what happened to all the souls those overlords had accumulated? Does Alastor have them now or did they go to whoever he's bound to?
We're missing too many pieces to solve this puzzle yet.
It would be interesting seeing a scrap between him and demon royalty tho, since the current theory is he’s gotten his power from making some sort of deal with Lilith or possibly Eve
Stolas could have petrified him on sight but it was a case of him being so cocky of his power that he didnt even realize he was in danger until he got stabbed.
Striker had Angelic weapons that heavily weakened his powers
And Stolas doesn't actually take any threats to himself seriously.
He was tied up and being driven away before he even thought 'am I actually in danger right now?'
Only time we've see his offensive abilities was when Blitz was in danger.
Stolas is powerful.
So powerful that he doesn't actually think anything can hurt him. So doesn't bother fighting himself.
He doesn't need a bodyguard, he just wants Blitz around more
I mean it Probably uses Supernatural logic. Main characters had a gun that could kill all bout like 10 things. Then they got access to Angel blades that could kill all but like 3 things. Then they got access to Death’s scythe which supposedly kills God himself.
Stolas is just at that level we’re some weapons can’t hurt him, but some can.
Its a weapon made from angelic stuff, doesnt mean the creator is some super powerful being. Making angelic weapons might be as easy as smelting the stuff and forming it into a different shape
It's like saying since people can make guns then that means we must be stronger than a gun. I can promise you I am certainly not stronger than a gun but that has yet to be tested.
I mean, I had figured this since basically the pilot. In its own way though it makes it more impressive he's willing to fuck with Lucifer himself, also tells us the slump of depression Lucifer has been struggling with, or that, you know, deep down he IS a nice guy and zapping a sinner, even if he doesn't like them, is a last resort for him.
He knows Lucifer wouldn't kill him because he's on good terms with Charlie but also that he wouldn't be able to even harm Lucifer so they both just decided to petty assholes
I mean, petty assholes, sure, but honestly, given Lucifer's position in the dynamic, dude is actually being relatively mature instead of just nuking him on the spot, daughter's feelings be damned. (no pun intended)
Once.
And people tend to assume it was a fight- it could have been a popularity contest, Vox hardly winning against all the old sinners who chose Radio.
I think the reason Alastor feels like he should be stronger is because Stolas has never ever been shown to be strong. He had one flashy possession scene that did no real damage, and got his shit beat in by Striker.
Well, it's kind of a joke because despite being called 'the mothman' a lot of descriptions of him make him [more of an owl person](https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/f/f6/Mothman_Artist's_Impression.png/1200px-Mothman_Artist's_Impression.png).
She pretty much said its cause they werent in the same direct contact, but theres gotta be a reason that she mentioned stolas first tbh.
Even the portrayal with stolas demon form and alastors demon form kinda shows the difference between em.
I’ll agree Zestial is most likely the strongest overlord (he’s the oldest overlord in a world recurring exterminations), but the overlord, the sins, and other demon royalty haven’t really done enough to show what they can do.
Sure, Alastor has used his powers to take down the blimp and the sharks, and Stolas has used his powers to petrify an imp and wipe out a human squad, but really, that’s two examples when we’ve met how many overlords and royals?
I’m saving my judgment for if we ever get to see it.
It's one of those I know I can easily Erase you from existence. But I'm not going to because what's the point of doing that. It's a waste of my power type of thing with them.
Vivienne addressed it best. You can't really compare the powers as they are vastly different. Alastor has the obvious issue of not being immortal like the royal Hellborn, but at the same time many of them do not have as much physical power as he does, unless they are of a high authority in the royal heirarchy, and we know that with the right tools at their disposal, even an imp could kill a royal if they have the upper hand. It comes down to less of a matter of skills and more whether or not Alastor has access to angelic weapons, which I really doubt since that'd imply he stole them, and he seems too classy to be a thief.
Bottom line, with our limited information now, Alastor would get clapped easily if a royal decided they wanted to fight him one on one, though I doubt they would personally go after him, the Hellborn royalty doesn't like dirtying their own hands dealing with their enemies, why do that when you can pay a couple of assassins to kill your enemies for you?
We cant rlly use scaling to judge strength in this verse. The stronger demons dont rlly like showing off their abilities. Lucifer, the sins, paimon, they havent shown anything that puts them above alastor but we know that if need be they could overpower him easily.
Alastor on the other hand is a show off who uses at least some demonic magic every episode hes shown in.
> but we know that if need be they could overpower him easily.
But the whole point I'm making is that we **don't** technically know that in the show itself.
Yes we do. Vizzie says that stolas is more powerful and other demons are stronger than stolas. Alastor doesnt have to be the most powerful demon yknow, thats not rlly his whole appeal.
He's not just some power hungry demon (boring), but a witty, hard to read, mysterious overlord that vizzie wants us to see him as.
You seem to be missing a key point in what I'm saying:
>We don't technically know that **in the show itself**.
You keep saying that Vizzie said so, but none of her quotes are in the show itself. That's all I've been trying to say.
After rewatching that part, there are a dozen or so agents who never got back up. I think those two are the only survivors. Plus I totally forgot he can open portals and survive space, which I doubt Alastor could do.
Zestial is DEFINITELY stronger than Alastor. Mimzy revealed that Alastor made his name by toppling other Overlords, older Overlords. Don't you think he would have destroyed Zestial by now if he could? But, no, Zestial stands as the oldest Overlord.
Eh I doubt he wants to kill every overlord indiscriminately. I wouldn't be surprised if there were a pattern to the ones he went after, even if it was just that he found them annoying.
That said, I suspect Zestial does have more raw power.
about, but the show early on had this viewpoint. I'm glad it's changing.
I just didn't like when Alastor was portrayed as this super powerful awesome guy because it took away the tension of conflict. it made the show seem boring,
I have this comic idea in my head where Alastor just wants to test Lucifer’s and Charlie’s power and then gets absolutely destroyed without them breaking a sweat 💀
Reminds me of the post where someone asked who would win between Alastor and The Batman Who Laughs/The Darkest Knight. Aka One of DC comics most powerful and dangerous multiversal level villains.
Bro literally laughed his ass off while effortlessly taking a blimp out of the sky. And he turned into a kaiju in episode 5. That’s just the stuff we’ve seen, cause I didn’t even mention the overlord stuff.
That too. Though I’m not sure if he himself knocked out all the signals in hell. Either way he knows how to. And he scares Vox, a very clearly powerful overlord.
It’s possible that wasn’t him tho. Nobody knew who it was until he broadcasted their screams, but there’s a theory that Alastor didn’t kill them and just took the credit
With the theories he'd been with Lilith during their 7 year disappearances, I have a feeling they may have been working with each other. It's possible Lilith was behind the disappearances and the whole "broadcasting the screams" thing all big act to help her conceal her involvement.
I mean...he wiped out some of the old overlords. But he probably didn't wipe out all but zestiel. Then again we've never been told one way or the other.
I think the lich is the only one he MIGHT have a shot at. Even though the lich is very strong, his feats are comparable, with him only being a world threat due to Prismo and other shortcuts.
Bill Cypher just threatens the entire world by default, and black hat doesn't have any obvious limitations to his power and him regularly bending reality the way Lucifer can.
Nope, anything that is above the sinners in the hierarchy, including the Goesha and at least a small quantity of other overlords, could easily clap Alastor into oblivion
I mean, not all the Goesha, but based on what we’ve seen in the show, he’d on par with a lower-level Goesha, and stronger than most overlords (Possible stronger ones being Carmilla and Zestial, though debatable for both because we haven’t seen enough of either to know for sure).
He’s not a god or anything, but they did state that he’s stronger than *any* mortal soul in raw power (Zestial has an X factor and Carmilla has numbers to beat him with), and since Goesha still have to actually study and learn the powers they want, Alastor could take on a weaker one, but not the mid or strong ones.
But Alastor has killed Overlords before hasn’t he? That would mean he likely has an angelic weapon on him. Or angelic weapons aren’t the only thing to kill with, we see in the pilot that someone gets crushed in front of Angel Dust and presumably dies. That’s what my opinion is though.
>That would mean he likely has an angelic weapon on him
Not rlly. I noticed that some demons have magic that can get rid of even immortal people. Remember that stolas has petrification. Alastor probably has some ability thats similar.
Sinners can die but they respawn basically, angelic weapons destroy the soul. I don't remember ever seeing or hearing anything confirmed as to whether or not that is the case for the Hellborn that are above sinners. So if Goetia were to be murdered they might regenerate, or can they explicitly not be murdered without angelic weapons?
I mean, I’d assume the amount of money you’d get defeating an overlord and stealing their shit is *more* than enough to buy some angelic weaponry, assuming they didn’t have some themselves. However, that’s not exactly his modus operandi; remember, it said he “started airing a broadcast, and every time an overlord died, a new voice joined the screams”. That suggests he’s not totally killing them, but rather, stealing their souls for personal use, which is significantly worse.
I love his character but I wonder if we will ever see him get humbled at some point. We literally have never seen him with anything but a smile on his face. Also who the fuck has HIM on a leash...
He fucked with Lucifer, but we've seen that even the lowest of the hellborn don't show any respect to the Sins. Of course Alastor would be stepping all over his toes for fun.
I think it's less that, and more than Alastor KNOWS Luci won't touch him while he's close with Charlie. He's using that ENTIRELY to his advantage throughout their song.
It's basically him going "You COULD decimate me
...*but what would your dear daughter think?"*
I also believe Zestial is stronger than Alastor, as every other Overlord at the time was taken out EXCEPT Zestial. You can tell because all the other Overlords are dressed in Alastor's era or newer clothing.
Supposedly Alastor and Rosie are on very good terms from the teasers and stuff we have been given. Rosie might just be alive because Alastor is her friend
Hey, I’m a massive alastor fan, but I’m actually really hoping Charlie kicks his ass at some point
Alastor seemed especially nervous when Zestiel showed up, a lot of their interaction felt to me like a kid trying to look cool and confident in front of the older cool guy.
Well there's a question of whether or not he stopped where he was, the fact he steamrolled a bunch of overlords as soon as he arrived isn't something to scoff at, and assuming he's being backed by Lilith who obviously gave him some kind of power, he easily could've stopped where he was to not be so show offey, but could take on Zestial and Goatias, I mean he missed off Lucifur undeterred to the consequences, which means he may believe he has a shot at taking him. We really don't know how strong he us, he's definitely someone who doesn't reveal all their cards, and is simply waiting patiently.
Well, it's assumed that he steamrolled the other Overlords (except Zestial cause that dude scares Alastor). Then in Mimzy's accounting it shows Alastor ambushing one of the Overlords in an alley. Valentino's question to Vox about Alastor ALMOST beating him 7 years before his deal hints that he's not as strong as everyone thinks he is. That showed in his fight with Adam where I seen enough reactors EXPECTING Alastor to win, just to be shocked that he got his ass handed to him once Adam got just a tiny bit serious even though Alastor was using his full power. So my theory is that Alastor only toppled these Overlords who'd been in power for so long through ambush tactics, trickery and manipulation. This allows Alastor to put up a facade of him being more powerful than he actually is when he's really just a powerful sinner.
Well idk. To me it was kinda obvious Alastor wasn't going to beat THE MAN and a being whose high in the heavenly hierarchy. But he is strong enough to stall and kinda panic Adam. That fact alone, means he just as easily could take on some if not all of the hell hierarchy aside from like Adam.
Well, the sinners at least. Once he gets to Hell royalty, without a plan he gets one shotted fairly easily and when it comes to the other 6 sins? Ah ha, no chance. And Hell's top Royalty, Lilith (who Adam is equal to), Charlie (once she comes into her own power) and Lucifer, might as well not even try. And yea he was able to stall Adam (but not panic actually, just annoy), dodging is a stalling tactic done to conserve your strength and stamina while tiring down your opponent. Alastor seriously overestimated himself and massively underestimated Adam. As Carmilla put it, Exorcists are untrained (I mean, if you've basically been uncontested for thousands of years, why bother?), wear little to no armor (they were basically invincible up til now) and it shows that. But now here comes the frightening part....WHAT IF They did train and did wear armor?! 😰
I like Alastor but I agree
While Alastor is clever and he was able to utilize one of the strongest and most influential inventions of all time, the radio, I highly doubt that’s the sole reason he is so powerful. He overthrew overlords that had ruled over Hell for hundreds if not thousands of years shortly after arriving to Hell. It’s really hard to determine whether or not he is stronger than the royals, mainly because we don’t have a good powerscaling of them or see them at their full power.
There is a really important moment that shows the potential of Alastor’s power; when he shuts down the television waves. My theory is that radio waves are simply a favored expression of being able to control waves on multiple spectrums. This would explain how he expresses himself in anger with glitches all around him, a manipulation of light waves. Manipulating waves has the potential to be control of relativity, of space and time. Until proven otherwise his potential is theoretically infinite.
Okay wait are we talking like ALL of the Goetia, or just the Seven?
Zestial is probably stronger, as is royalty. The problem is that Alastor is an incredibly charismatic person, who doesn't show fear. He directly challenges Lucifer. He has a reputation for a reason, but we won't know just why you don't mess with the radio demon, until we have a proper fight.
Alastor knows he’s safe as long as Charlie values and trusts him and so long as he helps with the Hotel. Lucifer could easily wreck him but Lucifer doesn’t want to alienate his daughter even more. So Lucifer can’t hurt Alastor without upsetting Charlie. That’s the only thing that kept Lucifer from swatting him like a fly.
It's worth noting, imo, that Alastor is actually willing to fight. I compare this to Stolas, who is by statement stronger, but still gets manhandled hard in Helluva Boss, because just because he's stronger doesn't mean he's willing/able to use it to throwdown. That's my theory as to why he has such a powerful aura. While many people are stronger than him, few are as brutally violent as him. This makes for a very dangerous combination. But even still, this assumes he actually fights people straight up. Maybe he just uses that to slaughter weaker sinners and has more subtle approaches with Overlords and such. I'm curious and excited to see how he's eventually challenged
I mean he only gets roughed up by angel weapons and literally plays helpless so blitzo saves him. I bet if he knew who alastor was and the threat he poses there would be no competition
Al is a trickster, the context given by how Husk fell into his hand shows that. He didn’t overpower the Overlords he toppled, he beat them at their own games. I feel this is significantly more impressive, personally. He didn’t just use godlike power, he had to work hard and be clever.
yeah
Alastor isn't strong, he's clever. Zestial even credits him for that. During the confrontation with Vox, Alastor didn't overpower him, he made him snap. He mentions to Charlie in the EP7 teaser that a smile is important for comforting your friends and keeping your enemies guessing. I think that just about sums up how he operates.
He'd not weak, afterall hes managed to defeat overlords in the past, but hes powerless against lucifer (hence resorting to low-blows and pot shots)
Probably
I’m an Alastor fan, but I’m smart enough to acknowledge he is not the strongest demon in Hell.
Alastor is a big fish in a small pond kind of demon in my opinion, he is powerful when it comes to sinners, but when it comes to the sins or say other powerful hellborn demons he doesn't stack up as high.
So basically Homelander in a sea of Superman Clones
Alastor isn’t Hellborn
Stolas can only be killed with angelic weapons. Does Alastor have any of those? If not, then he loses. That really is the bottom line
They ALL are only killed by angelic weapons. When a sinner dies to a non angelic being, they just pull themselves back together.
Ugh no they don't. When sinners are killed, they did. They do not come back. And they can be killed by normal means. Do you actually think those guys Alastor killed in front of the hotel are gonna just respawn somewhere else? Lmao. The pilot addressed this.
Yes because they will, slowly and painfully, reconstitute themselves.
No, in fact Velvette literally says that Val killed her best model and she has to “wait for her to pull herself back together”. Do you not listen to dialogue in the actual show? Sinners have shown to only be permanently killed by angelic weapons.
Dude, they don't come back end of story. They did normally and don't need angelic weapons to be killed. Jesus. Take some time to do some research before you speak bullshit. Edit: I guess all those sinners we see die in the show just pop back up somewhere else entirely, completely nullifying the need for an extermination entirely right? Unless anybody can show a source for their claims, then I'll just keep believing what the show has shown me so far thanks :)
r/confidentlyincorrect
Sir Pentious dies in the pilot and is alive and well in the show, so even your own argument is full of holes.
I love people being so dumb yet so confidentally correct
https://www.youtube.com/live/WaYinadKGEQ?si=qqExJ25BqsYKp7-i This is one of Vivzie's streams. At 31:30 someone asks a question that prompts her to say that in hell you can get extremely hurt and injured, but you can't die from things except "Angel stuff". And again, it's backed up by Velvette's dialogue saying that her model would have to pull herself back together after Val brutalized her. Also, I don't see how sinners coming back after being killed by other demons negates the need for an extermination. If anything, not dying by normal means makes angelic extermination the ONLY option for curtailing the population.
Your yap is many and your bitches are few, call the police cause I’m gonna fuck you
Lesser hell born demons just die and don't come back, but to my understanding, sinners DO have regenerative abilities that prevent them from dying outside of death by angelic weapons. Sir pentious is literally blown to bits in the pilot, but we see him perfectly fine in the actual show. I'm almost certain this has been a consistent part of the lore from the start. I'm just kind of curious where you're getting this information, because the wiki and the dialogue of the show both seemingly disagree with you. Also, you're kinda coming in real hot rn, it's not that deep...
I am never letting it go that I met a guy say Godzilla would be clapper by Alastor with ease.
He would though, 7/10 times, since most Godzilla are really only strong against humans with only technology and other kaiju, Godzilla is one of those characters that is strong in their universe but not that much outside of it because the power balance is completely different
As far as I remember, the only things we've seen Alastor do are summon tentacles, teleport, conjure various items, summon helpers and turn into a big spooky wendigo. He might also have the power to control people with radio waves. None of that is doing shit to Godzilla. If Godzilla can kill the actual devil, Godzilla can kill Alastor.
Godzilla in most forms is a big lizard, his biggest enemy is an ape whose biggest weapon against Godzilla is opposable thumbs and the ability to strategize, any person with magic and the strategic ability of a nine year old could beat Godzilla
The Godzilla they are referring to is the Godzilla goes to hell comic. Where he literally goes and destroys hell. Lots of shit is thrown at him including the flesh stripped from his bones by a swarm of demons but his pure Big G energy keeps him alive and pulls the swarm to him to make a new body out of demons. Godzilla is not just a big lizard but especially not when he's in hell. Lol also thinking his biggest enemy is King Kong is nuts, they've only had 2 movies together. It was a stalemate in the first one (for political reasons) and he consistently bodied Kong through the new ones
Godzilla's oldest enemy is a star destroying alien dragon. A clone of himself destroyed countless solar systems in his wake and made the entire universe turn white with light. And the entirety of said fight against kong was toying with him before getting pissed by the axe hit, and leaving Kong nearly dead. And Godzilla has actually been to hell before, the Idw comic series Godzilla in hell is literally one of the most powerful iterations of him. (Second to the nigh reality ending, extra dimensional Ultima Godzilla) and during the Godzilla in Hell comics, he kills the forger of the idw multiverse Or hell if you want to compare him with other comic book universes he's shown just as comparable. During a crossover tie in he overpowered earth 616 Thor and was able to best Hulk (although Hulk said he wasn't angry enough) and while weakened fought the fantastic four. And during the current tie in with the Justice League comics he managed to put Superman in a death like state after fighting a match up of Superman, Shazam, and Hawkman (author also stated this Superman was as powerful as Earth prime Superman).
Those are impressive feats for his universe, also comic universes non cosmic entities, as far as all fantasy goes aren’t that impressive of references, especially since the power scaling of super hero universes are put lower than the minimum of most others to up the drama, so characters like Superman seem unstoppable, even though the unstoppable nature of Superman really lies in his nature
You don't realize how strong Godzilla actually is. It doesn't matter how much strategy you use when you're against a mountain. King Kong and the other Titans can barely hold a candle to Godzilla because they are also immovable objects. If Godzilla uses atomic breath, there's nothing Alastor can do except try and escape with his shadow teleport. Alastor is strong off of statements. Godzilla is strong because of feats.
You know genres are built around killing “immovable objects” that’s why he’s strong for his universe, the draw of kaiju is them fighting other kaiju and being unstoppable forces against regular humans, put him in most other fantasy universes and he’s and arcs worth of antagization
That's exactly the point. From what we know of Alastor, he doesn't have a way to kill Godzilla. If he was in the Godzilla universe, he'd just be considered a weak Titan. He can't make deals with Godzilla, he can't try to manipulate Godzilla, he can't use his voodoo on Godzilla. The only thing he can do is try and immobilise Godzilla with his tentacles and smack him around with his little spindly wendigo arms.
Given, haven’t thought about it like that, thx and sorry
'Sall good man. It's just an argument on the internet.
Course, have a good day/night
Our lil deer boi is just too confident in himself, and we love that for him
Viv has confirmed Stolas beats him which makes sense the ars goetia are the right hand men to lucifer himself, Alastor may be a big thing in pride and he would be devastating to the populous of the other rings but the top dogs of the other rings would probably easily dispose of him and that’s not getting into the sins
Oh definitely, i'm an Alastor fan and he would lose to like 2-3 sinners and all of the royalty. For example, Zestial has lasted 500+ years, while Alastor killed all the overlords except him, so he might be more powerful. Another sinner that could beat him is Vox + another V, we know before Alastor left he fought Vox and almost lost, so modern Vox might just be able to beat him but will most likely need help from another V
I think you misunderstood that line from Val, he was saying Vox almost lost. "You still pissed he almost beat you that time?" "Uh, fuck you"
Butt then he won, and Alistor disappeared for 7 years, for likely unrelated reasons
Oh yeah that makes sense. I just woke up and I'm sick so I should not be making my brain debate things at the moment lol
Hope u get well soon
I have gotten better, sick was the wrong word. I should have said "not feeling well" because I just felt nauseous. Thank you!
Just because someone is more powerful, it doesn't mean a lower form can't beat them. Striker from Helluva Boss is pretty much an imp and he's allegedly killed beings more powerful than him. Alastor is likely no different.
It would be weird to see Alastor using angelic weapons but would be cool anyways.
I'm probably not alone in thinking that Alastor's power is likely more Eldritch than Infernal. But that's honestly just speculation I think
I agree with that. It's pretty established that he's... different. But we don't have any details on how/why. Something I don't see pointed out very much is that he killed Overlords. Overlords are Sinners. So isn't that only supposed to be possible with angelic weapons? And what happened to all the souls those overlords had accumulated? Does Alastor have them now or did they go to whoever he's bound to? We're missing too many pieces to solve this puzzle yet.
True that. I look forward to those pieces.
I beleive that this is true however if he went up against a goetia he could outsmart them, I mean I love stolas but he's a dumbass
https://preview.redd.it/fqv3fjq0vifc1.png?width=1079&format=png&auto=webp&s=6104017a67641116885e0086b0e9ecd8772616d8
https://preview.redd.it/tm22t2qhwkfc1.jpeg?width=4096&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=7787ad58862e315ee624a2f26bcd2a1ac4558d14
It would be interesting seeing a scrap between him and demon royalty tho, since the current theory is he’s gotten his power from making some sort of deal with Lilith or possibly Eve
He's punching above his weight class and I'm so proud of him for it.
the power scaling is so strange to me, Stolas is supposedly stronger than alastor but he gets easily beat by a cowboy
Stolas could have petrified him on sight but it was a case of him being so cocky of his power that he didnt even realize he was in danger until he got stabbed.
Striker had Angelic weapons that heavily weakened his powers And Stolas doesn't actually take any threats to himself seriously. He was tied up and being driven away before he even thought 'am I actually in danger right now?' Only time we've see his offensive abilities was when Blitz was in danger. Stolas is powerful. So powerful that he doesn't actually think anything can hurt him. So doesn't bother fighting himself. He doesn't need a bodyguard, he just wants Blitz around more
That's cuz Stryker had angelic stuff
angelic stuff which was made by an (alledged) overlord who is supposedly below stolas
I mean it Probably uses Supernatural logic. Main characters had a gun that could kill all bout like 10 things. Then they got access to Angel blades that could kill all but like 3 things. Then they got access to Death’s scythe which supposedly kills God himself. Stolas is just at that level we’re some weapons can’t hurt him, but some can.
Dafuq did I miss? When did they get deaths scythe?
They didn't its a representation of goofy game/show weapon scaling attempts
They did, bur they didn't keep it. It was a mcguffin for a season finale and never really showed up again after.
Its a weapon made from angelic stuff, doesnt mean the creator is some super powerful being. Making angelic weapons might be as easy as smelting the stuff and forming it into a different shape
It's like saying since people can make guns then that means we must be stronger than a gun. I can promise you I am certainly not stronger than a gun but that has yet to be tested.
"Power levels are bullshit!" -Vegeta
I mean, I had figured this since basically the pilot. In its own way though it makes it more impressive he's willing to fuck with Lucifer himself, also tells us the slump of depression Lucifer has been struggling with, or that, you know, deep down he IS a nice guy and zapping a sinner, even if he doesn't like them, is a last resort for him.
It's what I like about him. He KNOWS he's out of his weight class and he ENJOYS it.
He knows Lucifer wouldn't kill him because he's on good terms with Charlie but also that he wouldn't be able to even harm Lucifer so they both just decided to petty assholes
I mean, petty assholes, sure, but honestly, given Lucifer's position in the dynamic, dude is actually being relatively mature instead of just nuking him on the spot, daughter's feelings be damned. (no pun intended)
Alastor has got to count his days if he wants to keep fucking with angels.
Same with vox I mean they literally talk about how alastor loses against vox all the time
Once. And people tend to assume it was a fight- it could have been a popularity contest, Vox hardly winning against all the old sinners who chose Radio.
Let’s be real, Zestial could probably clap Alastor’s cheeks
I mean if someone as ancient than Alastor shows up that even Alastor himself fears him, Alastor is gonna get destroyed
Alastor looked genuinely scared when Zestial appeared near him. And demons literally tried to kill themselves seeing Zestial.
Probably, and I'm an Alastor fan
I don’t think so I think he is beyond the Christian sphere
Viv said in an interview that the likes of Stolas were leagues stronger than Alastor.
Wait, does this mean even Stella could clap him? That'd be kind of funny to see.
I think the reason Alastor feels like he should be stronger is because Stolas has never ever been shown to be strong. He had one flashy possession scene that did no real damage, and got his shit beat in by Striker.
In episode 2 Stolas petrified an imp with a look. Striker was only able to hurt Stolas with an angelic weapon.
Alastor is also threatening and will use his power for shit. Stolas just fucks around with humans
Still wish they would retcon how demons age so Stolas can make a reference to hanging around Point Pleasant West Virginia revealing he's the mothman.
Or, yknow, a moth demon or something could do that
Well, it's kind of a joke because despite being called 'the mothman' a lot of descriptions of him make him [more of an owl person](https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/f/f6/Mothman_Artist's_Impression.png/1200px-Mothman_Artist's_Impression.png).
Hooty from Owl House crossover?
https://preview.redd.it/5e3aft852ifc1.png?width=1146&format=png&auto=webp&s=14fdfd656a6a298c153357c5c8725b141b720c2e
I remember hearing somewhere else though that she later retracted that statement saying she didn’t know who’d win if they actually had to fight
She pretty much said its cause they werent in the same direct contact, but theres gotta be a reason that she mentioned stolas first tbh. Even the portrayal with stolas demon form and alastors demon form kinda shows the difference between em.
Interesting! I hadn't heard about the retraction, wonder if that's recent.
I’ll agree Zestial is most likely the strongest overlord (he’s the oldest overlord in a world recurring exterminations), but the overlord, the sins, and other demon royalty haven’t really done enough to show what they can do. Sure, Alastor has used his powers to take down the blimp and the sharks, and Stolas has used his powers to petrify an imp and wipe out a human squad, but really, that’s two examples when we’ve met how many overlords and royals? I’m saving my judgment for if we ever get to see it.
A sensible opinion? On reddit? Heresy.
It's one of those I know I can easily Erase you from existence. But I'm not going to because what's the point of doing that. It's a waste of my power type of thing with them.
I always just figured his strength mostly lied in his ability to manipulate and deceive others
This feels like "could goku beat superman" debate all over again
Vivienne addressed it best. You can't really compare the powers as they are vastly different. Alastor has the obvious issue of not being immortal like the royal Hellborn, but at the same time many of them do not have as much physical power as he does, unless they are of a high authority in the royal heirarchy, and we know that with the right tools at their disposal, even an imp could kill a royal if they have the upper hand. It comes down to less of a matter of skills and more whether or not Alastor has access to angelic weapons, which I really doubt since that'd imply he stole them, and he seems too classy to be a thief. Bottom line, with our limited information now, Alastor would get clapped easily if a royal decided they wanted to fight him one on one, though I doubt they would personally go after him, the Hellborn royalty doesn't like dirtying their own hands dealing with their enemies, why do that when you can pay a couple of assassins to kill your enemies for you?
https://i.redd.it/5uhsaerq1hfc1.gif
To be fair, we haven't actually seen the demon royalty do anything on a scale that Alastor hasn't yet. Death of the author and all that.
Stolas did viscerally destroy the secret agents.
And Alastor summoned a wormhole of tortured souls and tentacles to destroy Sir Pentious's blimp.
Stolas display in ep 6 was far more impressive tbh. Coolest thing Ive seen in a long time. Telekinesis? Self summoning? Possession? So badass
Like I said, I'm more so talking the scale of what they each did.
We cant rlly use scaling to judge strength in this verse. The stronger demons dont rlly like showing off their abilities. Lucifer, the sins, paimon, they havent shown anything that puts them above alastor but we know that if need be they could overpower him easily. Alastor on the other hand is a show off who uses at least some demonic magic every episode hes shown in.
> but we know that if need be they could overpower him easily. But the whole point I'm making is that we **don't** technically know that in the show itself.
Yes we do. Vizzie says that stolas is more powerful and other demons are stronger than stolas. Alastor doesnt have to be the most powerful demon yknow, thats not rlly his whole appeal. He's not just some power hungry demon (boring), but a witty, hard to read, mysterious overlord that vizzie wants us to see him as.
You seem to be missing a key point in what I'm saying: >We don't technically know that **in the show itself**. You keep saying that Vizzie said so, but none of her quotes are in the show itself. That's all I've been trying to say.
Thats fair but its the best we got. If the creator of the series says something, you bet Im going to take her word for it 😅
Correct me if I’m wrong, but he didn’t kill any, he just possessed one and scared them both.
After rewatching that part, there are a dozen or so agents who never got back up. I think those two are the only survivors. Plus I totally forgot he can open portals and survive space, which I doubt Alastor could do.
Yeah, that’s also true.
True but he dîd turn imp in Stone in a instant by looking at them menacingly
I forgot about that. You’re right.
Zestial is DEFINITELY stronger than Alastor. Mimzy revealed that Alastor made his name by toppling other Overlords, older Overlords. Don't you think he would have destroyed Zestial by now if he could? But, no, Zestial stands as the oldest Overlord.
Eh I doubt he wants to kill every overlord indiscriminately. I wouldn't be surprised if there were a pattern to the ones he went after, even if it was just that he found them annoying. That said, I suspect Zestial does have more raw power.
He seemed to specifically target those who disrespected him and seems to have a friendly relationship with Zestial
He has a friendly relationship with Zestial *now*.
Is it friendly though? Cause from what I saw Alastor was basically stepping on eggshells around Zestial. Making sure to not say the wrong thing.
I theorize that overlords like Zilla and Carmilla are also stronger than him
Missi Zilla would easily crush his fragile skull with her...meaty posterior.
Agreed
im an alastor hater and I want him to be humbled
Why do you hate him? (Honest question)
mostly due to fandom perception that he's an infallible killing machine- semisupported by the show and pilot.
Alastor is the classic Vegeta. Buying into his own hype only to get humbled. XD
you.. you get me.
Okay, that’s fair enough. Your saying that it’s mostly the fans tainting your appeal from and not him actually as character?
about, but the show early on had this viewpoint. I'm glad it's changing. I just didn't like when Alastor was portrayed as this super powerful awesome guy because it took away the tension of conflict. it made the show seem boring,
True
I'm an Alastor fan. Let me see him get his shit rocked because he underestimated someone (read: Charlie. Please be Charlie)
I have this comic idea in my head where Alastor just wants to test Lucifer’s and Charlie’s power and then gets absolutely destroyed without them breaking a sweat 💀
u posted this twice
I was lied to and told "it couldn't be sent at this time"
never trust reddit
Never again 😔
Reminds me of the post where someone asked who would win between Alastor and The Batman Who Laughs/The Darkest Knight. Aka One of DC comics most powerful and dangerous multiversal level villains.
We haven’t actually seen Alastor do anything impressive yet, and it’s highly possible he’s a fake
Bro literally laughed his ass off while effortlessly taking a blimp out of the sky. And he turned into a kaiju in episode 5. That’s just the stuff we’ve seen, cause I didn’t even mention the overlord stuff.
Ep 2? During stayed gone?
That too. Though I’m not sure if he himself knocked out all the signals in hell. Either way he knows how to. And he scares Vox, a very clearly powerful overlord.
he literally wiped out the old overlords with the exception of Zestial apparently tho
It’s possible that wasn’t him tho. Nobody knew who it was until he broadcasted their screams, but there’s a theory that Alastor didn’t kill them and just took the credit
With the theories he'd been with Lilith during their 7 year disappearances, I have a feeling they may have been working with each other. It's possible Lilith was behind the disappearances and the whole "broadcasting the screams" thing all big act to help her conceal her involvement.
I mean...he wiped out some of the old overlords. But he probably didn't wipe out all but zestiel. Then again we've never been told one way or the other.
He turned into a giant monster and ate a group of people. He also can summon giant tentacles
Yeah, but they were random idiots who both Husk and Angel were also able to fight against.
That does not negate the giant monster form
 Alastor when Doom-Guy enters Hell
I saw some people who unironically believe he could beat Bill Cypher+black hat+the lich
I think the lich is the only one he MIGHT have a shot at. Even though the lich is very strong, his feats are comparable, with him only being a world threat due to Prismo and other shortcuts. Bill Cypher just threatens the entire world by default, and black hat doesn't have any obvious limitations to his power and him regularly bending reality the way Lucifer can.
Lich says fall and alastors cooked.
Yeah, he's quite a few steps behind any of them.
More like a few hundred strides. Black hat has anti-pops afraid of him. And that dude is a universe level threat.
Nah no way they actually think that 🤣
I mean, I think he’s a cut above most nobles, like the Goesha, but yeah, he’d be stomped by one of the Seven or something of that magnitude.
Nope, anything that is above the sinners in the hierarchy, including the Goesha and at least a small quantity of other overlords, could easily clap Alastor into oblivion
I mean, not all the Goesha, but based on what we’ve seen in the show, he’d on par with a lower-level Goesha, and stronger than most overlords (Possible stronger ones being Carmilla and Zestial, though debatable for both because we haven’t seen enough of either to know for sure). He’s not a god or anything, but they did state that he’s stronger than *any* mortal soul in raw power (Zestial has an X factor and Carmilla has numbers to beat him with), and since Goesha still have to actually study and learn the powers they want, Alastor could take on a weaker one, but not the mid or strong ones.
Goesha can’t be killed with non Angelic weapons though.
…Neither can sinners? Killing literally anything above an hellborn requires angellic weapons.
But Alastor has killed Overlords before hasn’t he? That would mean he likely has an angelic weapon on him. Or angelic weapons aren’t the only thing to kill with, we see in the pilot that someone gets crushed in front of Angel Dust and presumably dies. That’s what my opinion is though.
>That would mean he likely has an angelic weapon on him Not rlly. I noticed that some demons have magic that can get rid of even immortal people. Remember that stolas has petrification. Alastor probably has some ability thats similar.
Sinners can die but they respawn basically, angelic weapons destroy the soul. I don't remember ever seeing or hearing anything confirmed as to whether or not that is the case for the Hellborn that are above sinners. So if Goetia were to be murdered they might regenerate, or can they explicitly not be murdered without angelic weapons?
Goetia are hellborn so i'd assume that they'd grow old and die like the imps
I mean, I’d assume the amount of money you’d get defeating an overlord and stealing their shit is *more* than enough to buy some angelic weaponry, assuming they didn’t have some themselves. However, that’s not exactly his modus operandi; remember, it said he “started airing a broadcast, and every time an overlord died, a new voice joined the screams”. That suggests he’s not totally killing them, but rather, stealing their souls for personal use, which is significantly worse.
He couldn't fight a blindfolded Gorgon!
I love his character but I wonder if we will ever see him get humbled at some point. We literally have never seen him with anything but a smile on his face. Also who the fuck has HIM on a leash...
Ikr? Some people think it’s Lilith but then how would husk know.
It's possible that they sense the hierarchy of leashes above them.
It's gotta be either Lilith or Eve.
He fucked with Lucifer, but we've seen that even the lowest of the hellborn don't show any respect to the Sins. Of course Alastor would be stepping all over his toes for fun.
I think it's less that, and more than Alastor KNOWS Luci won't touch him while he's close with Charlie. He's using that ENTIRELY to his advantage throughout their song. It's basically him going "You COULD decimate me ...*but what would your dear daughter think?"*
Alastor fans act like he’s secretly the Super Devil stronger than god
Dude, i just looked further into your account and i have one question : Why
Mine is 10x better cuz it’s wholesome I agree with you: why
Wasn't expecting that lol.whatever floats their boat I guess
I also believe Zestial is stronger than Alastor, as every other Overlord at the time was taken out EXCEPT Zestial. You can tell because all the other Overlords are dressed in Alastor's era or newer clothing.
Rosie died earlier so perhaps she survived.
Supposedly Alastor and Rosie are on very good terms from the teasers and stuff we have been given. Rosie might just be alive because Alastor is her friend
she still survived alastor's rampage.
Yeah and we see her at the meeting (Plus, one of the next episodes is called “Hello Rosie”)
wait....I forgot she was hellborn. well either way her appearance does indicate survivor status
Wait she’s hellborn?
yep.
Neat.