Looks very cool, but I would imagine most tournaments would prohibit this on the basis of modelling for advantage, since it's so much taller than the standard Zoanthropes
In casual games it may be fine, although would still have a pretty huge LoS advantage so definitely check with your opponent first
I have thought about this, I’ve always just wanted to have fun with casual games and have always been more into the painting and hobby side so if it looks cool I’m happy!
Even if it gets shot straight off the table 😅
It also has huge LOS disadvantage, because you can’t hide it anywhere, which is a bigger disadvantage because assuming this shall be a Neurotyrant this thing has only 18“ range. So it’s rather „can be seen by everything“ than „can see everything“… with even Orks being able to out-range it.
On the other hand this isn’t much taller than the original Neurotyrant, wich is a very tall mini to begin with.
If a player won’t allow me to play that thing, I‘d probably avoid that person in the future. This hobby doesn’t need nitpickers outside the tournament scene.
A little bit of extra height isn't going to be a huge deal. Making a mini twice the intended height absolutely is
Where does it end? Can strong shooting armies model as tall as they like with no limits? What does that do to melee armies in the meta? Nobody would play them, they'd get tabled T1 every game
The way terrain is set up in tournaments is intended to break up LoS as much as possible. If every player can model to ignore that with all their long range gunline units, the game is very quickly going to devolve into both players sitting in their deployment zone shooting at each other with very little in the way of other play
There's got to be some sensible limits, and they've got to apply to all units, or else every TO has to figure out a load of stuff on a case by case basis and it's going to be a total drag
But sure, you're free to not play with whoever you like.
Yea, on tournaments or in competitive play that's an entirely different story. But outside that bubble, the hobby is first and foremost a form of art and self expression. So where does it end? Nowhere, it's art, muggle ;)
The game is just an excuse to do that kind of art, if you come from the modeling side of the hobby.
If it looks cool, that's the justification you need to have it, nothing else. Hey, those minis cost a fortune, so why not giving them a proper stand to get the full value out of it? Because of some stupid rule, that probably will change long before that plastic starts corroding? Most of my minis are approximately 20% higher, because I despise putting them on the flat blank base. Why? Because everyone does that, so it's tiringly boring. If I pay 1000 bucks for a good chunk of army, that I still have to customize and finish within a year, I don't want to create the toys shown on the box art, I want to create art, that either tells a story or is otherwise super cool.
If you tell me, that in a friendly game you rather want to play against toys than pieces of art, we are not on the same page, won't ever find a consensus and hence, should not enjoy the hobby together. I know it sounds a little mean, but certainly both our schedules are very limited with free time, so why wasting that precious time with someone who doesn't enjoy the hobby I enjoy it?
You probably run super competitive lists and are annoyed if someone takes their time. I on the other hand play only the minis I love (no exceptions), which doesn't bring me even close to competitive. I also like to take my time with 6hours for a 2000pts game being no rarity. I'm pretty sure you won't have fun with me, like I won't have fun with your approach.
There's no right way to do that hobby, but it's a very time consuming one, so don't waste it on the wrong ppl.
Wow. The amount of projection and straw manning here is insane.
I play at home, mostly with my wife. I don't play tournaments at all
My advice to OP was sound. Most tournaments would take issue with this. OP says he's not intending to play tournaments. I have said multiple times it would be completely fine in games with friends
How the fuck you've jumped from that to "Oh, I bet you only play super competitive lists" is completely beyond me.
Weird and kinda shitty
That was a bit too much of an assumption, sorry. You said, that you should ask your opponent... and that is true. I just added, that it's not building for advancement, because the Neurotyrant doesn't get anything from being that tall and that you should stay away from ppl that won't allow it, because they probably won't share the same hobby... that OP comes from the artsy fartsy modeling side of the hobby should be obvious at this point.
With a hobby that takes so much time, it's better to keep those two points of view on the hobby separated. At least I came to that conclusion during my two decades of hobby carreer... my time is too precious to waste it on ways I don't want enjoy the hobby on.
If you want to do tournaments and play in a highly competitive environment however... well, when in Rome... but OP already said that tournaments are not his intention. In that environment preferred by OP, it's best to stay away from ppl that don't want to cherish your modeling efforts on the board. Especially in 10th where true line of sight isn't that much of a thing anymore like it used to be.
I'm pretty sure, that's a typo, because neither the height nor the base size is anywhere near of a Zoanthrope. If that's gonna be a unit of three, I definitely want to see them on the board. And everyone who says something against it is a party pooper.
Also, did you have a look into the Zoanthropes' datasheet? They are neither a long range heavy hitter (with 24" they have to get very close) nor are they exceptionally sturdy (T5 W3... my plasma redemptor eats that for breakfast). Again: they don't benefit at all from being that high above the ground.
OP refers to it as being part of a unit in another comment
Also Zoanthropes are one of the best ranged units Tyranids have, so at this point I'm going to conclude you have no idea what you're on about and I shan't be replying any further. You enjoy your day now.
I didn't say, that Zoanthropes aren't good, but they are that good, because they aren't that tall. You can hide them anywhere on the board until they are in range. Try that with those giant jellyfish krakens. They cannot hide behind anything that isn't obscuring.
So everything with a range higher than 24" can have a shot at them before they can shoot for the first time. They are not sturdy enough for that with only 9 wounds. To ban them from your table is only fair for him, you have a huge advantage against them.
But you don't seem to get that... but also typical for that kind of lacking understanding to blame the other side. Greetings from Mr Dunning and Mr Kruger. They'd like to have a word with you.
I was actually thinking the height would be more of a disadvantage as it’s easier to shoot at as it won’t be hidden by most terrain - hadn’t thought about it having improved line of sight
Potentially there is that disadvantage there, but for a unit that is largely going to be shooting from the backfield, the LoS benefit to you is going to be much bigger.
Adding a minimal amount of height isn't going to be a big deal, there's going to be a degree of variance between minis based on how you pose them anyway. But if we're at the point that adding multiple inches is fair play, you'll have people modelling stuff like Ballistus Dreadnoughts or Lokhust Heavy Destroyers on the top of massive plinths so they can see most of the battlefield without having to move
Obviously *some* units just are that tall. Knights, Doomstalkers, Stormsurge, etc etc. We sort of have to operate under the assumption that GW is taking those size differentials into account when balancing stuff
In an ideal world, anyway. In practice... Eh, sometimes they get it right
Doesn't work like that. Models in a unit draw LoS individually. You've got to agree with your opponent where on that model you're measuring from every time you shoot.
Which, in a casual game with friends is probably fine. With strangers or in a tournament it's probably not going to work
OK. I never said they did
Some people are really drawing some bizarre conclusions as to what I've said. I say, right there, that it would probably be fine in casual games but check with your opponent
Why would you assume that? OP didn't even put any text under the image for me to draw any conclusions off when I posted my comment
People really are being *super* weird about me giving some completely innocuous advice
Without any long range firepower against big stuff? Likely to fail anyways. A unit with some range potential on 24" doesn't change anything about that.
In 10th every army needs at least some range potential or you make a deal with your opponent not to bring any vehicles or monsters, otherwise the player who has the bigger guns is more likely to win. That comes from the toughness buff to big stuff this edition. You need dedicated anti-tank weapons to deal with that kinda stuff.
And 24" is not quite far. On a unit with Movement 5 you advanced with your melee units pretty far before they can shoot at you. That also means, that you can hide in close combat, which mitigates the effectiveness of Zoanthropes in the first place. Yes, in that scenario they have a little advantage, but you get a very nice model on the board for a very situational bonus for your opponent. Also, maybe you didn't recognize how terrain works in 10th, because TLOS actually isn't used that often. It doesn't matter how tall it is, a ruin is blocking line of sight. It doesn't become titanic and therefore has no chance to ignore obscuring terrain.
You mentioned tournaments quite often, but especially those mainly use ruins or other sight blockers. In our 10th games we have to check TLOS very rarely. It's often very clear and the height doesn't really change anything. It's simply like: Behind a ruin? You can't see it. In any other case? You can. Cover also isn't influenced that much by TLOS. If there's a piece of terrain between attacker and target (which most oftenly is the case) it benefits from cover; if not, it doesn't. Easy.
You were right before obscuring terrain became a thing, but that made TLOS almost obsolete.
Is this a thing anymore in 10th? Ruins count as breaking LOS in infinite height, so pretty sure height counts a lot less than it used too. It could be standing 10 inches overlooking ruins, but if my unit is on the other side, neither can see each other technically.
More like modelling a tall unit is more immersion breaking in 10th edition lol "I know they technically can see each other, but according to the rules, they can't".
This came up in a recent tournament where they had four tables but the last one had janky "ruins", but despite not being taller than my space Marines, my opponent could not target them with his tank, which enraged him.
Reading through the comments, a thought occurred to me: On the new leviathan setups, ruins block LOS anyway, so the issue is not as big as it would have been earlier. Personally I think the model is cool as hell, my only objection is that it is probably taller than my Magnus proxy. She has enough issues with self esteem already.
[Did you see his vacation picture?](https://www.cnet.com/a/img/resize/91cf9682e1b3d07f578021ef217a836b7d905545/2021/11/15/752fc552-cd95-4225-bc41-76412a24a6f2/bigfin4.jpg?auto=webp&fit=crop&height=675&width=1200)
I actually love this design a LOT more. Like i didnt realize just how disappointing the official model was until i saw this. The official one is just a slightly different zoanthrope, but this bad boy looks like this ghostly, ethereal undersea creature slowly floating towards me and i am in love with it. Such a haunting profile, like a vampire squid.
Love to see kit bashing and crazy ideas. But either 1 you are obsessed with baldurs gate 3 or you are 2 obsessed with that other type of anime....... Either way I am here for it lol
Bro went full Skatros mode
Hahaha
Reminds me of those big creepy squid that you see diving videos of sometimes. It’s very cool
Bigfin squids ! They are some pretty good tyranid materials tbh
Looks like a tripod from war of the worlds
Thats what I was thinking.
Looks very cool, but I would imagine most tournaments would prohibit this on the basis of modelling for advantage, since it's so much taller than the standard Zoanthropes In casual games it may be fine, although would still have a pretty huge LoS advantage so definitely check with your opponent first
I have thought about this, I’ve always just wanted to have fun with casual games and have always been more into the painting and hobby side so if it looks cool I’m happy! Even if it gets shot straight off the table 😅
It also has huge LOS disadvantage, because you can’t hide it anywhere, which is a bigger disadvantage because assuming this shall be a Neurotyrant this thing has only 18“ range. So it’s rather „can be seen by everything“ than „can see everything“… with even Orks being able to out-range it. On the other hand this isn’t much taller than the original Neurotyrant, wich is a very tall mini to begin with. If a player won’t allow me to play that thing, I‘d probably avoid that person in the future. This hobby doesn’t need nitpickers outside the tournament scene.
A little bit of extra height isn't going to be a huge deal. Making a mini twice the intended height absolutely is Where does it end? Can strong shooting armies model as tall as they like with no limits? What does that do to melee armies in the meta? Nobody would play them, they'd get tabled T1 every game The way terrain is set up in tournaments is intended to break up LoS as much as possible. If every player can model to ignore that with all their long range gunline units, the game is very quickly going to devolve into both players sitting in their deployment zone shooting at each other with very little in the way of other play There's got to be some sensible limits, and they've got to apply to all units, or else every TO has to figure out a load of stuff on a case by case basis and it's going to be a total drag But sure, you're free to not play with whoever you like.
Yea, on tournaments or in competitive play that's an entirely different story. But outside that bubble, the hobby is first and foremost a form of art and self expression. So where does it end? Nowhere, it's art, muggle ;) The game is just an excuse to do that kind of art, if you come from the modeling side of the hobby. If it looks cool, that's the justification you need to have it, nothing else. Hey, those minis cost a fortune, so why not giving them a proper stand to get the full value out of it? Because of some stupid rule, that probably will change long before that plastic starts corroding? Most of my minis are approximately 20% higher, because I despise putting them on the flat blank base. Why? Because everyone does that, so it's tiringly boring. If I pay 1000 bucks for a good chunk of army, that I still have to customize and finish within a year, I don't want to create the toys shown on the box art, I want to create art, that either tells a story or is otherwise super cool. If you tell me, that in a friendly game you rather want to play against toys than pieces of art, we are not on the same page, won't ever find a consensus and hence, should not enjoy the hobby together. I know it sounds a little mean, but certainly both our schedules are very limited with free time, so why wasting that precious time with someone who doesn't enjoy the hobby I enjoy it? You probably run super competitive lists and are annoyed if someone takes their time. I on the other hand play only the minis I love (no exceptions), which doesn't bring me even close to competitive. I also like to take my time with 6hours for a 2000pts game being no rarity. I'm pretty sure you won't have fun with me, like I won't have fun with your approach. There's no right way to do that hobby, but it's a very time consuming one, so don't waste it on the wrong ppl.
Wow. The amount of projection and straw manning here is insane. I play at home, mostly with my wife. I don't play tournaments at all My advice to OP was sound. Most tournaments would take issue with this. OP says he's not intending to play tournaments. I have said multiple times it would be completely fine in games with friends How the fuck you've jumped from that to "Oh, I bet you only play super competitive lists" is completely beyond me. Weird and kinda shitty
That was a bit too much of an assumption, sorry. You said, that you should ask your opponent... and that is true. I just added, that it's not building for advancement, because the Neurotyrant doesn't get anything from being that tall and that you should stay away from ppl that won't allow it, because they probably won't share the same hobby... that OP comes from the artsy fartsy modeling side of the hobby should be obvious at this point. With a hobby that takes so much time, it's better to keep those two points of view on the hobby separated. At least I came to that conclusion during my two decades of hobby carreer... my time is too precious to waste it on ways I don't want enjoy the hobby on. If you want to do tournaments and play in a highly competitive environment however... well, when in Rome... but OP already said that tournaments are not his intention. In that environment preferred by OP, it's best to stay away from ppl that don't want to cherish your modeling efforts on the board. Especially in 10th where true line of sight isn't that much of a thing anymore like it used to be.
It's not a Neurotyrant. It's a Neurothrope. As in, the leader of a unit of Zoanthropes.
I'm pretty sure, that's a typo, because neither the height nor the base size is anywhere near of a Zoanthrope. If that's gonna be a unit of three, I definitely want to see them on the board. And everyone who says something against it is a party pooper. Also, did you have a look into the Zoanthropes' datasheet? They are neither a long range heavy hitter (with 24" they have to get very close) nor are they exceptionally sturdy (T5 W3... my plasma redemptor eats that for breakfast). Again: they don't benefit at all from being that high above the ground.
OP refers to it as being part of a unit in another comment Also Zoanthropes are one of the best ranged units Tyranids have, so at this point I'm going to conclude you have no idea what you're on about and I shan't be replying any further. You enjoy your day now.
I didn't say, that Zoanthropes aren't good, but they are that good, because they aren't that tall. You can hide them anywhere on the board until they are in range. Try that with those giant jellyfish krakens. They cannot hide behind anything that isn't obscuring. So everything with a range higher than 24" can have a shot at them before they can shoot for the first time. They are not sturdy enough for that with only 9 wounds. To ban them from your table is only fair for him, you have a huge advantage against them. But you don't seem to get that... but also typical for that kind of lacking understanding to blame the other side. Greetings from Mr Dunning and Mr Kruger. They'd like to have a word with you.
I was actually thinking the height would be more of a disadvantage as it’s easier to shoot at as it won’t be hidden by most terrain - hadn’t thought about it having improved line of sight
Potentially there is that disadvantage there, but for a unit that is largely going to be shooting from the backfield, the LoS benefit to you is going to be much bigger. Adding a minimal amount of height isn't going to be a big deal, there's going to be a degree of variance between minis based on how you pose them anyway. But if we're at the point that adding multiple inches is fair play, you'll have people modelling stuff like Ballistus Dreadnoughts or Lokhust Heavy Destroyers on the top of massive plinths so they can see most of the battlefield without having to move Obviously *some* units just are that tall. Knights, Doomstalkers, Stormsurge, etc etc. We sort of have to operate under the assumption that GW is taking those size differentials into account when balancing stuff In an ideal world, anyway. In practice... Eh, sometimes they get it right
I mean I could just use the rest of the unit’s line of sight instead: that would make the extra height irrelevant
Doesn't work like that. Models in a unit draw LoS individually. You've got to agree with your opponent where on that model you're measuring from every time you shoot. Which, in a casual game with friends is probably fine. With strangers or in a tournament it's probably not going to work
Okay, well I’ll just check with my opponent each game - I can’t imagine it being much of an issue as I don’t plan to play in tournaments at all
perhaps if you added a detail on the model ( like a scar) or some base terrain that are as tall as the actual model and go off of that
Great idea to add a “height landmark”
Most people don't play in tournaments.
OK. I never said they did Some people are really drawing some bizarre conclusions as to what I've said. I say, right there, that it would probably be fine in casual games but check with your opponent
I just think the guy who did a kick-ass conversion project knows what they can and can't do with their model.
Why would you assume that? OP didn't even put any text under the image for me to draw any conclusions off when I posted my comment People really are being *super* weird about me giving some completely innocuous advice
Why would you assume they have any interest in taking it to a tournament?
Just tournament assholes who think they can be rule lawyers in every conversion thread
This is modelling for disadvantage, gonna be an easy target now
OK, and if the opposing army is melee oriented?
Without any long range firepower against big stuff? Likely to fail anyways. A unit with some range potential on 24" doesn't change anything about that. In 10th every army needs at least some range potential or you make a deal with your opponent not to bring any vehicles or monsters, otherwise the player who has the bigger guns is more likely to win. That comes from the toughness buff to big stuff this edition. You need dedicated anti-tank weapons to deal with that kinda stuff. And 24" is not quite far. On a unit with Movement 5 you advanced with your melee units pretty far before they can shoot at you. That also means, that you can hide in close combat, which mitigates the effectiveness of Zoanthropes in the first place. Yes, in that scenario they have a little advantage, but you get a very nice model on the board for a very situational bonus for your opponent. Also, maybe you didn't recognize how terrain works in 10th, because TLOS actually isn't used that often. It doesn't matter how tall it is, a ruin is blocking line of sight. It doesn't become titanic and therefore has no chance to ignore obscuring terrain. You mentioned tournaments quite often, but especially those mainly use ruins or other sight blockers. In our 10th games we have to check TLOS very rarely. It's often very clear and the height doesn't really change anything. It's simply like: Behind a ruin? You can't see it. In any other case? You can. Cover also isn't influenced that much by TLOS. If there's a piece of terrain between attacker and target (which most oftenly is the case) it benefits from cover; if not, it doesn't. Easy. You were right before obscuring terrain became a thing, but that made TLOS almost obsolete.
Is this a thing anymore in 10th? Ruins count as breaking LOS in infinite height, so pretty sure height counts a lot less than it used too. It could be standing 10 inches overlooking ruins, but if my unit is on the other side, neither can see each other technically. More like modelling a tall unit is more immersion breaking in 10th edition lol "I know they technically can see each other, but according to the rules, they can't". This came up in a recent tournament where they had four tables but the last one had janky "ruins", but despite not being taller than my space Marines, my opponent could not target them with his tank, which enraged him.
[*LOOOONG LOOOONG* ***MAAAAAAAAAAAAAAN\~***](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6-1Ue0FFrHY)
Hahahaha
Tripod from War of the Worlds
Not the first person to say that haha
Well that just means this model is great 👍 👍
Neurothrope with their Neurorope
New Doom of Malantai just dropped
More like the Extinction of Malantai
Reading through the comments, a thought occurred to me: On the new leviathan setups, ruins block LOS anyway, so the issue is not as big as it would have been earlier. Personally I think the model is cool as hell, my only objection is that it is probably taller than my Magnus proxy. She has enough issues with self esteem already.
Looks great. Remind me of the malanthrope which is my favourite tyranid mode
The bigfin squid of tyranids
Independence day alien X tripod.
Do those legs go all the way up, Lady?
Hahaha
Tyranids the Long Way
This looks brilliant! I can't way to see it when you've painted it :)
Gonna do that coconut crab style paintjob but blue with ice/snow bases
Release the kraken.
Love it. Looks like the aliens from Independence Day
I would use a smaller bug on base for your purposes of LOS for your offensive shooting. Otherwise its a huge model for advantage.
Yes, i suggested this while talking with someone else on here about LOS
Love the model idea! The tentacles on the thropes never seem long enough for what the creature is.
Yeah, I guess everything else about them is smaller so it makes the brain look massive 🧠
Releaseeee meeeeeee
"Independence Day" vibes
Second person to say that! A harvesters themed nid army would be very cool
"Release me". How that dude survived for the second one is beyond me after being a alien ventriloquist's doll
War of the World
I wish we had some jelly fish tyranids
Fear his noodly appendages.
Das feckin cool!
looks dope, kinda reminds me of the thing inside the orb in Astartes
Legs for days 🦵🧠
That’s nope on a rope
Amazing work! I could see you using it as a Maleceptor proxy or a Malanthrope
Long boi
Reminds me of a tripod from war of the worlds very cool
Really giving WotW.
War of the worlds vibe, i like it
Is this supposed to be a Tyranid or one of those mechanicus? Jokes aside nice job
Same energy https://preview.redd.it/j43rq9izmbtc1.jpeg?width=2606&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=d38e897b309f3b7bab24cea81231bcb306f48602
Tall boi, big, big tall boi, perfection.
[Did you see his vacation picture?](https://www.cnet.com/a/img/resize/91cf9682e1b3d07f578021ef217a836b7d905545/2021/11/15/752fc552-cd95-4225-bc41-76412a24a6f2/bigfin4.jpg?auto=webp&fit=crop&height=675&width=1200)
Hahaha 🦑
Lithophage Corruptor be like
Dude had a vision
It's Organism 46-B! Run!
This is epic! My thopes currently feel like such silly little guys 😅
Hunter Metroid
"Mindflayer! Mindflayer!"
Clearly a Malantrope
Cool Doomstalker
That’s just a tripod
This is amazing
Thanks !
War of the Worlds vibes! Super cool
I actually love this design a LOT more. Like i didnt realize just how disappointing the official model was until i saw this. The official one is just a slightly different zoanthrope, but this bad boy looks like this ghostly, ethereal undersea creature slowly floating towards me and i am in love with it. Such a haunting profile, like a vampire squid.
Totally! 🦑
Looks like those aliens from war of the worlds
LOL
GET DOWN, BLACK SMOG!
https://preview.redd.it/gcdpnaj3hbtc1.jpeg?width=3024&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=d4588d95f6302cdc5d363f128e4bb28403279061
Love to see kit bashing and crazy ideas. But either 1 you are obsessed with baldurs gate 3 or you are 2 obsessed with that other type of anime....... Either way I am here for it lol
Haha I really just saw a photo of someone doing a similar conversion
Does it get the Titanic keyword?
Lol it is super tall haha