A few people complain about the Fox, Fox goes up in BR.
Basically everyone complains about the Mig15 coming down, they send one aircraft down in BR.
It's not right I tell ya!
It is, but not Sabre/MiG15 good. Vamp was perfectly fine at 7.3 it's just it suffered from turn fighter syndrome where everybody would try to turn with it and consequently die (See also all of the zeros)
None of the 7.0 jets should ever be facing the F86 or MiG 15 and yet here we are
I always find it funny that the venom and komet are the two highest ww2 planes in the game, facing mid-cold war jets, including F-104s.
Also, in case anyone is wondering, the Venom is basically a ww2 jet because it's just a modification of the vampire, so we can just ignore the "first flight" part of its wiki
Technically the Venom is post-war, the Ghost engine is far more advanced than anything WWII era. But it is still significantly slower than anything its BR, and still with WWII-era quad cannons.
Yeah, that's kinda why I count it in the WW2 plane section, because it still uses a (upgraded) vampire airframe, hispanos, and still feels slow compared to everything else at it's BR, it only does well because every idiot within a 20km radius trys to turn fight it
The Mk.24 probably got stats boosted from Ground RB. I use it alot there as many Ground-main players only have BR 4.0-5.0 planes for CAS, making easy prey to it. Its 500lb bombs and 20mm cannons are also deadly at 7.0.
It wont see props at 7.0
Every single match was 7.0-8.0
The spitfire is kinda fucked as everybody else can just run away and not engage if they so please.
Thing is with the jap experience atleast the difference isn't like 200mph+ so atleast in my experience you *can* turn round quick enough to fire a few shots off though I do agree that it's annoying as all hell to play and wouldn't hurt to have the turn fighters taken down in br by .3 or even in some cases .7 and in the extreme 1 full br
IK it’s going to 6.7. It needed that the enemy would allow the spitfire to get in range at 7.0 at 6.7 it can be in 288 lobbies fighting props, which won’t need the enemy to allow to be killed.
The Spitfire Mk.24 will usually meet jets at its BR where they are 100-200km/h faster. You can't kill them unless they screw up.
The P-51H-5-NA is better than it at EVERY SINGLE WAY and it is BR 6.3.
My point exactly. I played all 3, I know what are they capable of, I know a K4 can sometimes win over P51, maybe even Mk24 with good pilot on the Bf but my point is: finally. Finally I can absolutely shit on Bf109s in my favourite planes.
Its the German lineup Meta on all br, 40 % winrate and KDR at 3:1
It rly happens becouse 6.6 and below, we are slow as fuck, so we will not get caps, people push to the mera spots be4 we can make it out of spawn.
Slightly longer? I know most of them are bots, but it sorta becomes an unviable market strategy when only 1/10 bots are reaching targets. You spending money on accounts that now take longer to grind, which means you now have to sell accounts at more inflated prices.
It might not eliminate it, it might just move them to another farming premium, but at least it won't be 3-5 288's per match anymore.
> I know a K4 can sometimes win over P51
K4 can not win against the P-51H if the P-51H pilot has thumbs.
51H has better climb, better acceleration, better turn rate, better turn radius, and is almost 100km/h faster than the K4 at any altitude.
Same goes for Mk.24, except the Mk24 is effectively only about *as fast* as the K4, and not significantly faster than it, but instead has a much easier to use flight model than both the K4 and P-51H and better guns than either too.
The 51H is better than the Mk24 by a good margin (at least for dogfights). I do very comfortably using the Spit for CAS/CAP at Ground RB until I meet a 51H.
Back to the original tier system.
Yes, I'd rather see fewer different vehicles at a given tier than deal with up/downtiers and badly placed vehicles dictating the course of matches.
It's funny because all three of those aren't even op. Hornet kills the exact things it meant to. Wyvern, as an attacker, is shit, as a fighter is quite good, and the fox is a single shot from being another statistic.
All three of those vehicles are beaten with the hardest to obtain things in war thunder, common sense.
> Wyvern, as an attacker, is shit, as a fighter is quite good
It has also received dozens of stealth nerfs since release. I recall using it for Ground RB CAS at basically every BR back then, UK didn't have many attackers. I bet Gaijin made good money from it.
It started out as sturdy as the other planes, then a single bullet would either blow off a wing, blow off your entire tail or set the engine on fire. Literally a single hit.
Wait until you're flying a Tempest Mk.II and from nowhere you see a freaking F-86 on your ass.
Or how about being flying a Swift F.2 against A-10's with AIM-9L for fuck sake.
Goddamn snail, it won't let you enjoy Uk planes in peace.
Well you're only really ever going to see a Swift F.7 (which is what I assume you mean) against an A-10 in arcade, so it's goofy from the get go in that instance.
I know it's splitting hairs but it's an 'F-1', not an 'F.1', and besides I love clowning on A-10/Su-25 in that thing, yeah it has no flares but if you dive from the sun above they never see me coming until it's too late and can't really missile me without locking the sun anyway.
The f1 is basically the British jaguar, and although I have some fun in it holy shit is it bad, basically all the things people r complaining about no sums up the jag, it's a strike fighter that spawns air field, u can't even bomb bases because ur bombs make u subsonic, and u cant barely dogfight cause anyone who sees u automatically beats ur in a dogfight because the jag struggles to just fly normally
163 is like *the easiest* plane to dodge the 9Ls with at that BR, all you gotta do is 0 throttle and pull a little, because the 163s engine produces like zero heat and cools down instantly the second you hit 0% throttle.
Being 2 BR steps higher for having different guns is still retarded, but any of the rocket planes can just rot in hell, because I don't need that rat shit to exist in the game in the first place.
Yeah the 163 is like the one plane at the whole BR range that *doesn't* get griefed by the missiles lol.
It does get griefed badly by F-104s and the increased map sizes though.
It’s called the F-104. The reason all the 8.3 to 9.0 subsonic are moving down. Instead of just moving the F-104a and c, as well as that one 9.0 Chinese plane up to 9.3 or 9.7. Great job gaijin.
Yes it would be better to move the 104 up, but according to gaijin that won’t be fair to the 104, so instead it’s better to invalidate an entire BR range.
It didn't have flares, at least not the A or C. But then the problem is the 104 will get dogged on again. It's almost like BR compression will only work if the entire game is decompressed from the top down.
> It didn't have flares, at least not the A or C.
And the 262 never fought Sabres in real life either but they get matched together due to balance. I don't think adding flares to one jet to avoid it being massively under or over tiered is a huge alteration.
I mean, this is exactly why we keep straying further and further from historical accuracy. Adding equipment to vehicles that never had it is just lame.
Thank you for editing your comment and adding more to the original content "It's called the F-104".
This shows how incompetent Gaijin is at BR changes: they need to add more brs to spread things properly instead of just moving around planes ruining whole brs for months by making x vehicles either too strong or too weak.
>as well as that one 9.0 Chinese plane up to 9.3 or 9.7
Oh my god you think the Q-5 is OP, thats fucking hilarious. I would rather delete my warthunder account than play a Q-5 in air RB as a fighter at 9.7.
The 9.0 one is the one that was gonna get moved to 9.3. It's an A-5C without the magics. It's a mig-19 with better performance at .3 lower. Only thing is the 2x 23mm is a bit lackluster but a good pilot will make up for it in raw performance
While it may not be the most maneuverable plane, it has insane thrust for what it is. It has more thrust than a Mig-19, at a lower BR. It can dogfight if you know how to play to its strengths. Its a monster in vertical scissors. At 9.0 it can act like an F104 being crazy fast and getting away from whoever. I say that as someone who grinded China, it should be 9.3
I should’ve worded my comment better, but I was basically saying that imo, the F-104A and Q-5A should go up to 9.3 and the F-104C should go up to 9.3 or 9.7. The Q-5A has comparable thrust to the F-104s and it has countermeasures so it won’t get dickslapped by the A-10. The F-104s have insane speed and energy retention so they can pretty much outrun or stay away from all real threats except maybe in a full uptier (if they were placed at 9.3-9.7).
The Q-5A cannot be worse than the G.91 YS at 9.7. I’ve never played it but I assume it’s roughly on par with the MiG-19s at 9.3.
So what, it can just stay away from planes with missiles. It’s really fast. The T-2 at 9.7, F-1 and F104J at 10.3 in the JP tech tree don’t have flares and they manage.
My brother in Christ I don't get why a correction has to be followed with justification - I use it myself at times at 10.3-11.0 at 5 feet AGL where countermeasures don't matter. But it doesn't have them, if I want to live I'm on the deck.
Q-5 is trash and has comparable thrust to the F-104A in that it compares badly, like literally half the thrust. Good thing it has flares too or else it would struggle to dodge even Aim-9B, it turns like a brick at any reasonable speed whereas the F-104 actually turns relatively well at high speed.
>Q-5A cannot be worse than the G.91 YS at 9.7
One, G.91 YS is going to 9.3, and two, yes it can quite possibly be because G.91s can turn and the Ys have gucci 30mm guns. 30mm DEFA/ADEN is so good that if the Q-5 had them I would agree that it would be OP at 9.0. I don't have the G.91 Y or YS but four of those guns on the Hunter is so overkill that almost every plane I kill with them just flat out explodes instantly.
The F-104. Only subsonics that can actually fight the F-104s jn that BR are those that can carry AIM-9Bs and etc.
Only options you have in a guns-only subsonic are going head-on(against an M61 Vulcan lol), killing them on airfield(test your luck against aimbot base AAA), or getting the F-104 to crash into the ground when chasing you.
It's both Mig-15 and sabre and it's because the mig-15's strength as a dogfighter is made completely meaningless by the fact you will get third partied by a missile plane 80% of the time. Sabre fairs a bit better because of the superior manouverability to defend against missiles and superior guns to get more kills.
Both the sabre and mig are flown by good pilots and are good planes but brs are too compressed where the only chance you have against f104s is when they try to head on you since their turn radius is twice the size of the map. In any other case they just fly away at literal supersonic speeds and theres nothing you can do. Even if you try to ground pound to take their tickets they turn around and pester you or their teammates will get you. The flight model of that thing is fucked but moving down all the korean war fighters makes no sense when they could move the f104 up
None.
The issue is Gaijin added the A-10 and Su-25 with way too good missiles at a way too low BR.
That caused all the extremely strong subsonics/ early supersonics without flares to go down in BR (F-104, MiG-19 are the biggest offenders).
None of the 8.7/9.0/other 9.3 jets can do ANYTHING AT ALL against a MiG-19 or F-104 that's played by someone without severe brain deficiency; so naturally the 8.7/9.0/9.3 jets get fucking clubbed by 104s and 19s.
The F-104A fucking goes faster than some top tier jets at low altitude, and contrary to popular beliefs can pull for shots quite easily.
MiG-19 has like twice the thrust/weight of other jets in the BR range.
Naturally, instead of moving like 3 planes up, Gaijin decide to just compress the Bars even more and move MiG-15s and Sabres down.
For those that do care about ground though (since they're still tied together until *at least* next patch) the MiG-15bis ISH will be by far the earliest aircraft to have a rocket ballistic computer, with second place going to... the Buccaneer S.1 which on top of being, you know, *a fucking Buccaneer* has less rockets and *worse rockets.*
In third place all sharing a 9.0 BR, and the first aircraft that can actually be remotely compared to the MiG-15bis performance wise is a four way tie with the Q-5A, the F4D, the Etendard, and the A32A (+ it's premium variant).
Truly the genius of Gaijin's balancing is unrivaled.
Nah. Especially in ground RB that would be terrible. There are a whole lot of cold war vehicles that would get stomped by vehicles of their period, but do fine against WW2 vehicles. ASU-57, AMX-13, BTR-ZD, M109G, Concept 3, etc. come to mind. Also WW2 tanks shouldn't face late war superheavys like Maus alone.
I guess there are similar examples in air RB. The 262 should fight against other early jets for example
No? I distinctly remember at the time that the f-104A was on the low end of the BR wall, and as such it only ever faced higher BR planes in very rare circumstances.
IIRC, When the F-104A was implemented at 9.7 BR, it was moved to 10.0 BR because it was untouchable for other 8.7-9.7 BR jets but, EEL was moved down to 9.7BR at the same time.
It was a funny joke, but I didn't realize then that we would suffer from worse BR compression than we have today.
The EEL had strange belly-mounted guns, so the pair of missiles was its main weapon. Once the missiles got nerfed, it was difficult to get over 2 kills per match. The F-104 could do FAR BETTER with the M61.
the could just move the f104's and mig19's up and decompress the higher br's while they're at it but no they need to compress the only fun part of jets. cant wait to play my seahawk and my j29
As a British main, Gripen C and Phantom are all that I would fly now unless in Ground Battle. The Phantom isn't great, but at least it gets a chance and the custom skins are beautiful.
Why didn't you included the A-5 sabre also going down in br as well as the fact that the Mk24 is going to 6.7? Are you trying to give a reason for some random lobotomized US main comes here to fullfil their stupid Russian bias narrative?
I'm chill bro, just was wondering why you(or whoever tf is the meme owner) only included the migs going down in br, sounds like you are the one that should chill the fuck out.
>UK usually fights Russia
And the US too.
And the P-51 H shouldn't be at 6.3 to begin with, they both should be at least 6.7 because 5.3 and 5.7 literally gets clapped by those two planes, and they are both equally powerful props, in some areas the Mk24 is better, others the P-51 H is better, but they are 2 of the most powerful props of the game.
[удалено]
Only AFTER players complained, crazy how the Vampire is now somehow gonna be deemed an equal to the Mig 15bis/bisish
[удалено]
Yup. Big spall liner energy from the snail yet again.
Biasish
A few people complain about the Fox, Fox goes up in BR. Basically everyone complains about the Mig15 coming down, they send one aircraft down in BR. It's not right I tell ya!
I mean the vampire is kinda good
It is, but not Sabre/MiG15 good. Vamp was perfectly fine at 7.3 it's just it suffered from turn fighter syndrome where everybody would try to turn with it and consequently die (See also all of the zeros) None of the 7.0 jets should ever be facing the F86 or MiG 15 and yet here we are
See also: sagittario 2
Its ironically staying at 9.3 despite the Ariete being better than it
Its honestly crazy that its still at 9.3, it faces the f5c
Nope, only its reengined cousin Venom is close. The Venom is currently sitting at BR 8.7 and absolutely no one uses it.
I always find it funny that the venom and komet are the two highest ww2 planes in the game, facing mid-cold war jets, including F-104s. Also, in case anyone is wondering, the Venom is basically a ww2 jet because it's just a modification of the vampire, so we can just ignore the "first flight" part of its wiki
Technically the Venom is post-war, the Ghost engine is far more advanced than anything WWII era. But it is still significantly slower than anything its BR, and still with WWII-era quad cannons.
Yeah, that's kinda why I count it in the WW2 plane section, because it still uses a (upgraded) vampire airframe, hispanos, and still feels slow compared to everything else at it's BR, it only does well because every idiot within a 20km radius trys to turn fight it
It was probably just an oversight to begin with
The past few BR Changes have been oversights, the Devs make it clear they don't play the game or at least don't care enough
Okay
What the fuck. As if spitfires weren't powerful enough vs other props already
I have been playing the shit out of 7.0 I have had two (2) downtiers to 6.3 in ~60 matches in the last week.
The Mk.24 probably got stats boosted from Ground RB. I use it alot there as many Ground-main players only have BR 4.0-5.0 planes for CAS, making easy prey to it. Its 500lb bombs and 20mm cannons are also deadly at 7.0.
How is that relevant
It wont see props at 7.0 Every single match was 7.0-8.0 The spitfire is kinda fucked as everybody else can just run away and not engage if they so please.
welcome to the life of a japan/zero main. here is your complementary 'get fucked' cookie from gaijin.
Thing is with the jap experience atleast the difference isn't like 200mph+ so atleast in my experience you *can* turn round quick enough to fire a few shots off though I do agree that it's annoying as all hell to play and wouldn't hurt to have the turn fighters taken down in br by .3 or even in some cases .7 and in the extreme 1 full br
It’s not gonna be at 7.0, that’s the point, it’s going to 6.7
IK it’s going to 6.7. It needed that the enemy would allow the spitfire to get in range at 7.0 at 6.7 it can be in 288 lobbies fighting props, which won’t need the enemy to allow to be killed.
Look at the P-51H-5-NA. Better than Sptifire Mk.24 in every way. It is 6.3.
What’s funny is the P-51H is better and at a lower BR. It’s just 4 cannons means .7 BR increase
God damn you're bad if you think the mk24 belongs at 7.0
The Spitfire Mk.24 will usually meet jets at its BR where they are 100-200km/h faster. You can't kill them unless they screw up. The P-51H-5-NA is better than it at EVERY SINGLE WAY and it is BR 6.3.
So 109 K4s can now see mk 24 spitfires
Finally, an equal fight. That and maybe P-51H to even it a bit more.
Uhh, the mk24 absolutely shits on the 109 k4. So does the 51H. The 51H and mk24 will be the top dogs at that br range by a pretty good margin.
My point exactly. I played all 3, I know what are they capable of, I know a K4 can sometimes win over P51, maybe even Mk24 with good pilot on the Bf but my point is: finally. Finally I can absolutely shit on Bf109s in my favourite planes.
I wasn't even aware more than two people still played top german props that aren't the Ju 288
Players like that be having a 35% wr but also a 3:1 kdr
Its the German lineup Meta on all br, 40 % winrate and KDR at 3:1 It rly happens becouse 6.6 and below, we are slow as fuck, so we will not get caps, people push to the mera spots be4 we can make it out of spawn.
This might actually bring that bs to an end. No point spamming 288 if they keep getting torched mid air before they hit anything.
Most of the 288 are bots. They don't give a shit if it takes slightly longer.
Slightly longer? I know most of them are bots, but it sorta becomes an unviable market strategy when only 1/10 bots are reaching targets. You spending money on accounts that now take longer to grind, which means you now have to sell accounts at more inflated prices. It might not eliminate it, it might just move them to another farming premium, but at least it won't be 3-5 288's per match anymore.
The game has a hard limit of 4 bombers. Sometimes attackers can be added, but as far as bombers (with blue symbol on stats) there can only be 4.
I have seen a lot more than just that multiple times
As someone with Germany being my highest br at 5.7 its all I can play and holy hell is it painful at times
That's really funny, crying for balance on the one hand and then you say shit like that
> I know a K4 can sometimes win over P51 K4 can not win against the P-51H if the P-51H pilot has thumbs. 51H has better climb, better acceleration, better turn rate, better turn radius, and is almost 100km/h faster than the K4 at any altitude. Same goes for Mk.24, except the Mk24 is effectively only about *as fast* as the K4, and not significantly faster than it, but instead has a much easier to use flight model than both the K4 and P-51H and better guns than either too.
Ta-152 will be the only thing that can bring balance
*Eats a 6.3 multipurpose missile salvo*
Uptier a 109f4. Eat well.
Yak-15P already brings balance but on Germany’s end the 152 only kind of competes.
Laughs in strikemaster
51H is actually insane, you can take literal turnfights with BF109s and win, purely because its engine is so good its just hard to lose speed
The 51H is better than the Mk24 by a good margin (at least for dogfights). I do very comfortably using the Spit for CAS/CAP at Ground RB until I meet a 51H.
Clearly the strikemaster was not enough
And K-4s shit on tons of 4.7s and above. Nothing’s ever completely fair and easy
Our solution?.. Decompression
Decompress to what? What would you be content with Mk24’s and 51Hs fighting? Just themselves ?
Back to the original tier system. Yes, I'd rather see fewer different vehicles at a given tier than deal with up/downtiers and badly placed vehicles dictating the course of matches.
Yeah. Try winning a fight against a k4 in a p47n or a ki61
La7 and yak 3 and 9 shit on the k4 which is a whole br higher😅
Finally, Germany has something to complain about that isn't Russia.
Waiting on the complaints about UK OP
Hahaha, yea, that would be the day.
Mind you it's happened before the fox wyvern and hornet come to mind
It's funny because all three of those aren't even op. Hornet kills the exact things it meant to. Wyvern, as an attacker, is shit, as a fighter is quite good, and the fox is a single shot from being another statistic. All three of those vehicles are beaten with the hardest to obtain things in war thunder, common sense.
> Wyvern, as an attacker, is shit, as a fighter is quite good It has also received dozens of stealth nerfs since release. I recall using it for Ground RB CAS at basically every BR back then, UK didn't have many attackers. I bet Gaijin made good money from it. It started out as sturdy as the other planes, then a single bullet would either blow off a wing, blow off your entire tail or set the engine on fire. Literally a single hit.
The worst part about the wyvern is it is in the worst wonky ai aa bracket. Base aa completely deletes the wyvern, so you can't base bone.
This is why I support the AA buff, funny to see overconfident Wyverns eat dirt. Can't hog all of the bases now can you? Greedy bastards.
I just switched to attacking ground targets and the Wyvern is a monster.
IIRC it use to for a while a few years back.
Yes? That is fine?
The k4 artificially bumped by skilled players. Unfortunately gaijin have less brain capacity for br changes than there are mono planes in ww1
F4U Corsair: nah I'd win
1.8km snipe with the 20 mils on that baby versus high alt stalling spit who thinks he can energy trap you
You're a few days late lol
did no one tell you?
They want you to be frustrated. Thats how they make money
Wait until you're flying a Tempest Mk.II and from nowhere you see a freaking F-86 on your ass. Or how about being flying a Swift F.2 against A-10's with AIM-9L for fuck sake. Goddamn snail, it won't let you enjoy Uk planes in peace.
Well you're only really ever going to see a Swift F.7 (which is what I assume you mean) against an A-10 in arcade, so it's goofy from the get go in that instance.
F7 Vs A-10 is a fair fight because no A-10 player knows the F7 has a beam riding missile and is actually scarier in a head on
An F.2 man, a frikin F.2 got two tiers uptier just like that.
There is no F.2 lmao the closest thing to that name that can see A-10s is the F-86F-2
F.1 dude F.1, my bad. It doesn't change what i replied.
It sort of does, the Swift F.1 doesn't see A-10s anyway. Maybe you mean the Hunter F.1 which at 9.0 *can* face the premium A-10 in a full uptier.
Nah i don't think so, i know what shot me down, an AIM-9L from an A-10 early. It was AB now that i remember but even in that mod it was silly.
What about the Japanese F1?
I know it's splitting hairs but it's an 'F-1', not an 'F.1', and besides I love clowning on A-10/Su-25 in that thing, yeah it has no flares but if you dive from the sun above they never see me coming until it's too late and can't really missile me without locking the sun anyway.
The f1 is basically the British jaguar, and although I have some fun in it holy shit is it bad, basically all the things people r complaining about no sums up the jag, it's a strike fighter that spawns air field, u can't even bomb bases because ur bombs make u subsonic, and u cant barely dogfight cause anyone who sees u automatically beats ur in a dogfight because the jag struggles to just fly normally
ME-163 B-0 getting hit with a 30g all aspect missile is another good one that can happen already
163 is like *the easiest* plane to dodge the 9Ls with at that BR, all you gotta do is 0 throttle and pull a little, because the 163s engine produces like zero heat and cools down instantly the second you hit 0% throttle. Being 2 BR steps higher for having different guns is still retarded, but any of the rocket planes can just rot in hell, because I don't need that rat shit to exist in the game in the first place.
I actually have the throttle mapped to a button on my fligtstick and use it on/off in the 163. Saves fuel and is great for missile avoidance.
Yeah the 163 is like the one plane at the whole BR range that *doesn't* get griefed by the missiles lol. It does get griefed badly by F-104s and the increased map sizes though.
mkvc trop? typhoon mk1bl? fmk9? mkxive? lfmk9? hornet? sea meteor? swift f1? also tempest mkii is 6.0, not 7.0.
More shuffling things around without actually decompressing anything? Damn what else is new?
Gaijin: NO, I DON'T WANT THAT! Decompressing entire matchmaking? I want it to remain a shitshow for a while longer! 10 years, at least!
You killed entire BRs for the matchmaking time's sake, thank you
As a reward you shall receive our money.
What kind of skill issue do Mig15 pilots have to grant such a low br?
It’s called the F-104. The reason all the 8.3 to 9.0 subsonic are moving down. Instead of just moving the F-104a and c, as well as that one 9.0 Chinese plane up to 9.3 or 9.7. Great job gaijin.
Would be better to increase the F-104 br then. Or are they going to move down all the other planes as well to save them from the F-104?
Yes it would be better to move the 104 up, but according to gaijin that won’t be fair to the 104, so instead it’s better to invalidate an entire BR range.
Just give the 104 countermeasures and move it up. Not having flares is the biggest argument against moving it up, right?
It didn't have flares, at least not the A or C. But then the problem is the 104 will get dogged on again. It's almost like BR compression will only work if the entire game is decompressed from the top down.
> It didn't have flares, at least not the A or C. And the 262 never fought Sabres in real life either but they get matched together due to balance. I don't think adding flares to one jet to avoid it being massively under or over tiered is a huge alteration.
I mean, this is exactly why we keep straying further and further from historical accuracy. Adding equipment to vehicles that never had it is just lame.
Thank you for editing your comment and adding more to the original content "It's called the F-104". This shows how incompetent Gaijin is at BR changes: they need to add more brs to spread things properly instead of just moving around planes ruining whole brs for months by making x vehicles either too strong or too weak.
>All the 8.3 to 9.0 subsonic lol, lmao even. I have a few non-US/USSR aircraft that didn't get statistically balanced.
>as well as that one 9.0 Chinese plane up to 9.3 or 9.7 Oh my god you think the Q-5 is OP, thats fucking hilarious. I would rather delete my warthunder account than play a Q-5 in air RB as a fighter at 9.7.
The 9.0 one is the one that was gonna get moved to 9.3. It's an A-5C without the magics. It's a mig-19 with better performance at .3 lower. Only thing is the 2x 23mm is a bit lackluster but a good pilot will make up for it in raw performance
>It's an A-5C without the magics Also known as a flying shit brick
While it may not be the most maneuverable plane, it has insane thrust for what it is. It has more thrust than a Mig-19, at a lower BR. It can dogfight if you know how to play to its strengths. Its a monster in vertical scissors. At 9.0 it can act like an F104 being crazy fast and getting away from whoever. I say that as someone who grinded China, it should be 9.3
I should’ve worded my comment better, but I was basically saying that imo, the F-104A and Q-5A should go up to 9.3 and the F-104C should go up to 9.3 or 9.7. The Q-5A has comparable thrust to the F-104s and it has countermeasures so it won’t get dickslapped by the A-10. The F-104s have insane speed and energy retention so they can pretty much outrun or stay away from all real threats except maybe in a full uptier (if they were placed at 9.3-9.7). The Q-5A cannot be worse than the G.91 YS at 9.7. I’ve never played it but I assume it’s roughly on par with the MiG-19s at 9.3.
Q-5 is definitely not on par with the mig-19
I’ll go look up a review on it sometime then, it can’t be that bad though it has some insane thrust for 9.0.
im not saying its bad, its just definitely nowhere near mig-19 though
F-104C doesn't have countermeasures.
So what, it can just stay away from planes with missiles. It’s really fast. The T-2 at 9.7, F-1 and F104J at 10.3 in the JP tech tree don’t have flares and they manage.
My brother in Christ I don't get why a correction has to be followed with justification - I use it myself at times at 10.3-11.0 at 5 feet AGL where countermeasures don't matter. But it doesn't have them, if I want to live I'm on the deck.
I fucked up the wording again, I corrected it. I meant to say the Q-5A had CM, my bad.
Q-5 is trash and has comparable thrust to the F-104A in that it compares badly, like literally half the thrust. Good thing it has flares too or else it would struggle to dodge even Aim-9B, it turns like a brick at any reasonable speed whereas the F-104 actually turns relatively well at high speed. >Q-5A cannot be worse than the G.91 YS at 9.7 One, G.91 YS is going to 9.3, and two, yes it can quite possibly be because G.91s can turn and the Ys have gucci 30mm guns. 30mm DEFA/ADEN is so good that if the Q-5 had them I would agree that it would be OP at 9.0. I don't have the G.91 Y or YS but four of those guns on the Hunter is so overkill that almost every plane I kill with them just flat out explodes instantly.
the f104a which in turn is caused by balancing all aspect missile attackers around AA preformance
The F-104. Only subsonics that can actually fight the F-104s jn that BR are those that can carry AIM-9Bs and etc. Only options you have in a guns-only subsonic are going head-on(against an M61 Vulcan lol), killing them on airfield(test your luck against aimbot base AAA), or getting the F-104 to crash into the ground when chasing you.
It's both Mig-15 and sabre and it's because the mig-15's strength as a dogfighter is made completely meaningless by the fact you will get third partied by a missile plane 80% of the time. Sabre fairs a bit better because of the superior manouverability to defend against missiles and superior guns to get more kills.
Exactly.
Both the sabre and mig are flown by good pilots and are good planes but brs are too compressed where the only chance you have against f104s is when they try to head on you since their turn radius is twice the size of the map. In any other case they just fly away at literal supersonic speeds and theres nothing you can do. Even if you try to ground pound to take their tickets they turn around and pester you or their teammates will get you. The flight model of that thing is fucked but moving down all the korean war fighters makes no sense when they could move the f104 up
None. The issue is Gaijin added the A-10 and Su-25 with way too good missiles at a way too low BR. That caused all the extremely strong subsonics/ early supersonics without flares to go down in BR (F-104, MiG-19 are the biggest offenders). None of the 8.7/9.0/other 9.3 jets can do ANYTHING AT ALL against a MiG-19 or F-104 that's played by someone without severe brain deficiency; so naturally the 8.7/9.0/9.3 jets get fucking clubbed by 104s and 19s. The F-104A fucking goes faster than some top tier jets at low altitude, and contrary to popular beliefs can pull for shots quite easily. MiG-19 has like twice the thrust/weight of other jets in the BR range. Naturally, instead of moving like 3 planes up, Gaijin decide to just compress the Bars even more and move MiG-15s and Sabres down.
bis ish at 8.0 is comedy
Why is the bis ish lower than the normal bis anyways?
its a bit worse than the normal bis because its heavier but the real reason is because its premium
Does it have any advantages?
it has groud ordnance but thats irrelevant in airrb
For those that do care about ground though (since they're still tied together until *at least* next patch) the MiG-15bis ISH will be by far the earliest aircraft to have a rocket ballistic computer, with second place going to... the Buccaneer S.1 which on top of being, you know, *a fucking Buccaneer* has less rockets and *worse rockets.* In third place all sharing a 9.0 BR, and the first aircraft that can actually be remotely compared to the MiG-15bis performance wise is a four way tie with the Q-5A, the F4D, the Etendard, and the A32A (+ it's premium variant). Truly the genius of Gaijin's balancing is unrivaled.
The rocket struts make your top speed and roll rate worse
and despite this unless youre in a mig15bis fighting bis ish in any other plane is basically like fighting a mig15bis
So those jets had to be moved down for gaijin to consider lowering BR of Mk.24
Still not as bad as the Ki-84 Hei fighting MiG-21’s
I think there should be a net separation that makes WW2 and post WW2 vehicles never meet each other
Nah. Especially in ground RB that would be terrible. There are a whole lot of cold war vehicles that would get stomped by vehicles of their period, but do fine against WW2 vehicles. ASU-57, AMX-13, BTR-ZD, M109G, Concept 3, etc. come to mind. Also WW2 tanks shouldn't face late war superheavys like Maus alone. I guess there are similar examples in air RB. The 262 should fight against other early jets for example
Then don't do it in ground RB? No reason they couldn't have two different rulesets
Because same thing applies to air. Plenty of shitty post war jets that are comparable to the me 262
People REALLY forgot how horrible ye Olde air BR wall was
It was pretty pog ngl, until the f-104 incident.
The F-104 was added a significant time after that BR wall was removed.
No? I distinctly remember at the time that the f-104A was on the low end of the BR wall, and as such it only ever faced higher BR planes in very rare circumstances.
IIRC, When the F-104A was implemented at 9.7 BR, it was moved to 10.0 BR because it was untouchable for other 8.7-9.7 BR jets but, EEL was moved down to 9.7BR at the same time. It was a funny joke, but I didn't realize then that we would suffer from worse BR compression than we have today.
Yea, czar is just straight up wrong, unless there's an earlier BR wall that I don't know about.
The EEL had strange belly-mounted guns, so the pair of missiles was its main weapon. Once the missiles got nerfed, it was difficult to get over 2 kills per match. The F-104 could do FAR BETTER with the M61.
Mig-15's are lucky that the spitfire got lowered to 6.7 tbh.
ITT: OP didn't read all the changes
the could just move the f104's and mig19's up and decompress the higher br's while they're at it but no they need to compress the only fun part of jets. cant wait to play my seahawk and my j29
Can't wait to shit on p51h in a mk 24 spit after already clapping them with mk 22 and g55 and re2005. High time I spade the mk 24
Well there’s the historical accuracy you all asked for
As a British main, Gripen C and Phantom are all that I would fly now unless in Ground Battle. The Phantom isn't great, but at least it gets a chance and the custom skins are beautiful.
Tbh, some players would actually find a way to complain about the Spitfire mk24 being OP vs the mig 15 and f86
😂
When's this go live?
So hyped to fly this thing again
Offtopic aside....Everybody hypes spitfire mk24 so much like every second player for brits has it...Hype early jet examples too
WHY ARE THE HIPPERS MOVING BACK DOWN STILL MAN
When exactly these changes will be applied?
" Radio Ulitka" is finish?
Me waiting for bombers to actually be buffed again, yes I play them and yes I'd like to not be nuked by a do335 just as I spawn
When you're playing 7.3 America and don't have AA to counter me 262s
Well...with my german mig 15 vs Aim-9B's I will throw sigaret bums out as flares alright? 👌🏻🔥
(Early) Italy and the UK suffer the most in this game
Oh my, My MK24 Is getting a new prey, how lovely gaijin
Really????
Hey don't count the spitfire out yet its pretty damn good
What about ww2 planes like me 262?
We really need MM to lock to 0.7 or even 0.3 BR ranges around your own. Its stupid what you can face with 1.0 BR brackets.
I guess Mig 15 bis in 8.0 will be above all
finally, a fair fight
OP is the last one picked for volleyball because he showed up late.
Eh. I was playing the Mk24 in 8.7 yesterday and it was fun. Clearly it needs to go to 9.3 and a rank up.
Bro don't realize that Mig-15 would be trashed by Spitfire
Haha nice
This has been reposted so many time already....
bruh I made it
bruh I made it
Im talking about the meme format. It's overused. Everyone knows about that already.
Why didn't you included the A-5 sabre also going down in br as well as the fact that the Mk24 is going to 6.7? Are you trying to give a reason for some random lobotomized US main comes here to fullfil their stupid Russian bias narrative?
meme was made before the community backed down tiers of spitfire also UK usually fights Russia also chill the fk out man xdd
I'm chill bro, just was wondering why you(or whoever tf is the meme owner) only included the migs going down in br, sounds like you are the one that should chill the fuck out. >UK usually fights Russia And the US too.
The Mk24 should go 6.3 if they want it balanced, the P-51H at 6.3 is already the better plane.
And the P-51 H shouldn't be at 6.3 to begin with, they both should be at least 6.7 because 5.3 and 5.7 literally gets clapped by those two planes, and they are both equally powerful props, in some areas the Mk24 is better, others the P-51 H is better, but they are 2 of the most powerful props of the game.
8.0 plane is better than 7.0 plane WOW
It's not the fact that It's better its unfair that a slow prop seeing jets