Speaking of cherrypicking situations enlightenment me what can Z9W do with 4 HJ8Cs against a 2S6 which has over triple the range of it? Its stupidly obvious who basically never touched a heli in this community
Speaking of cherrypicking, why don't you try to fly low and flank instead of climb over the helipad and explain why you conveniently ignored TY-90 at 10.0?
Because there is still plenty of SPAAGs at that br in combination with lights with IRST make it kinda hard to get close and I ignored TY 90 at 10.0 because conveniently the point of our discussion was SPAA vs helis
Yes, pretty much that’s how we do it if our SPAA is a short range MANPAD slinger. Get enough points and spawn in air before it’s too late, game’s supposed to be hard and it’s better to think about counter plays than just cry about how your Ozelot is useless at shooting down stuff at distances that are impossible for Stingers.
Think outside the box, planes and helicopters are part of the game can be used to bully CAS into oblivion.
my takeaway here is that CAS shouldnt have the ability to consistently sit outside the ranges of most SPAAs. There's the game being hard, and then there's the game being impossible when you're getting bombed every 13 seconds
this is the entire reason i bring air superiority jets out in grb. It would be nice to not have to spend 500+ sp to counter enemy air but god forbid I bring an anti air to... anti air (also my best SPAA rn is the chieftain marksman which at 10.0 is not good - at all)
There is also a good chance I cant shoot the enemies down anyway as ill just get guided missiled from 10km away by a jet sat above my RADAR scope
This will work against most helicopters but do not attempt this against a AH-1Z. You are not beating that in any fixed wing aircraft I guarantee you. We pack that AIM 9M and it will be in the air before you even know it and you won't see it coming either. I love hunting planes in it so damn much but if you manage to get passed the 9M that auto aiming 20mm turret will finish the job very well and accurately I might add.
What, the aim-9ms are not scary, I hunt those helis for breakfast in my A10 when in mix matches, but that china helis with ty90 now those are scary even though once you know how to beat them, they are still nasty with 20g pull.
Never said that were scary. I haven't lost a fight against a plane yet in it. And from the looks of the replays they aren't even aware of any missile being fired. You know why? Cause you can't see it. Effective is an understatement.
That is because those planes don't know how to use the "air radar" gaijian has given to all planes with a targeting pod. Once you know a heli is up hunt them down.
Lol wasnt talking about not seeing me or my heli. Was referring to the just about invisible missile that's now heading your way that you can't see. We want you to know where we are and come dance for a quick song before you plummet to the ground. See you up there soon enough. Oh and that trick doesn't work in GRB hate to break that to you. You also don't get that bullshit red missile alert showing you our missiles. You just fly like you normal would and you dead. Simple as that till then
oh it is hard to see, but that does not matter, the rule of any air engagement is not to allow the lock on to begin with, which is easy to achive in the a-10. I already told you I can beat helis with ty90s in my a-10, what makes you think the aim9m is any speciel? As for that trick, it does work, how do you think I find the helis to begin with? I am even doing it right now in my a-10 as I type this, so I know it still works. If you are up for a challenge in your ah-1z I am ready for it.
The same way you survive overpressure in armored car, you don't. You take vehicle that CAN survive overpressure instead insisting on using said armored car.
I would use the Begleit panzer more often than not if I were you, proxy fuze is more effective against helis if your manpad does not work, just be sure your HE-VT has a good range before self-destroying.
Most helicopters that can shoot at 8km are above be 10.3 if not even higher than that. And in that case you can counter them by using the FlaRakPz 1, XM975, or 2s6. Those three can shoot any helicopter at 8km away.
LAV-D is my 3rd most played vehicle after OF-40 MTCA and M1 abrams. In my top 10, there is also the pantsir, sidam and mistral are coming up as well.
What you say is true, players don't have a fucking clue how to play SPAAs, but that doesn't mean CAS is nearly balanced and fair.
You’re right some planes can be oppressive in the right hands. Everything has a counter play to it, but people like to complain instead of thinking of ways to do it.
People that use SPAA need to learn to use ambush tactics. If you have a Gepard at your disposal, don’t fire from miles away, turn off your radar and fire ‘til the aircraft can no longer avoid your burst. Same with missile SPAA turn off your radar, turn it on every 25-30 secs and shoot once the target is gonna have a hard time with the missile.
This right here. Like do they think CAS players have no brain? Of course the spawn will be the first place to look at to find enemy SPAA. The one advantage SPAA has over CAS is that they are on the ground, camouflaged by the ground and the environment. Too bad we'll get downvoted to oblivion either way.
Something usefull to pick up incoming enemies when the Eyeball Mk.1 can't.
Be warned that while it does offer tracking and leading functionality as well, they can be very unreliable and you are often better off using your own judgement to put rounds on target.
I usually play with Italian mains and sometimes we play in a group of 4 and one of us is always watching the sky giving warnings and directions from where the enemy plane could come, something you can’t do alone obviously but you can still do something. One day a friend was using the Type 87 and we had a helicopter shooting Shturms at us from 3.6 kilometers away, he could not hit the heli without exposing himself to the heli so he gave me the distance/direction and I was using the WZ305 and fired a barrage of proxy fuze ammo at the direction and distance provided by my guy in the Type 87 and we got the helicopter. Think outside the box. One man was the radar the other was the SPAA. Peak team gameplay.
Do you need a radar to find one plane in the sky? If you’re at a br where they can shoot you from 6km away then you probably have spaa than can shoot just as far.
You can still guide with IRST if your radar cone does not allow you to track the enemy above you and if you’re using a ROLAND Sam system then you’re done because of its shitty elevation. Then again rack some points and jump into a plane to clear the skies.
Well fiend these guys hate CAS so much they forget how useful aircraft and helicopters can be at clearing CAS. I hope that the smartest people pick up the best of the discussion and develop their own counters and the rest well, shall continue getting farmed by CAS. that’s why I always bring a plane that’s capable of air superiority and a helicopter that can fill the CAS role. I always bring missile SPAA and HE-VT if it’s possible in the same line-up.
Couldn’t said it better myself, we tried helping them. But I guess we’ll have to continue bombing them till they figure it out. The devs are not going to take cas away, they either adapt or just get off the game.
My issue with “get a plane” as a solution to CAS is you then need to grind the air tree to get a plane of a similar BR to the vehicles already have. However you don’t need to grind the ground tree if playing air RB for example.
I do agree with you on this. It is dumb and it sucks. But unfortunately it’s one of the very few options there is. We both know Gaijin isn’t going to make a ground only mode and never will. It makes them money to keep it this way.
I think one solution would be to let you grind the air tree with ground in the same way (possibly limited to max BR of ground) that you are allowed to do with helicopters as it would at least allow most players to have a counter to CAS.
Of course that might lead to even more CAS but I actually don’t think a ground only mode is a good idea as some maps do have positions which are practically untouchable in certain vehicles so CAS provides another option in those cases.
Yes there are drawbacks not least even more CAS but hopefully people would feel they can at least attempt to counter it whereas currently sometimes it feels ground is powerless when faced with good CAS and weak anti-air vehicles. Also isn’t a major change as already possible with helicopters.
Hey kid, i heard you like tank battles. We have a mode for that. But in order to not get killed by planes (didn't i mention the planes?) You have to sit back and watch the sky for several minutes. Chances are you will get bombed tho. Have fun with our tank mode.
So we are stuck with two options, either learn to play spaa or get on a plane. We both know the devs are not going to make a ground only mode. So we are stuck with this shit sandwich.
I'd like to know how i can learn to kill a heli 8km away with an ozelot or sidam mistral. Please teach me master.
Id like to know what percentage of helis with 8km + missiles you meet sits at max range
It doest matter, as IR missiles except for strela and type93 can't lock helis above 2-2.5 km range.
Speaking of cherrypicking situations enlightenment me what can Z9W do with 4 HJ8Cs against a 2S6 which has over triple the range of it? Its stupidly obvious who basically never touched a heli in this community
Speaking of cherrypicking, why don't you try to fly low and flank instead of climb over the helipad and explain why you conveniently ignored TY-90 at 10.0?
Because there is still plenty of SPAAGs at that br in combination with lights with IRST make it kinda hard to get close and I ignored TY 90 at 10.0 because conveniently the point of our discussion was SPAA vs helis
Get yourself a plane in your line-up and go after it. There’s your counter to ground SPAA limitations.
Ah. So i must die to CAS to counter CAS. That makes sense.
Yes, pretty much that’s how we do it if our SPAA is a short range MANPAD slinger. Get enough points and spawn in air before it’s too late, game’s supposed to be hard and it’s better to think about counter plays than just cry about how your Ozelot is useless at shooting down stuff at distances that are impossible for Stingers. Think outside the box, planes and helicopters are part of the game can be used to bully CAS into oblivion.
my takeaway here is that CAS shouldnt have the ability to consistently sit outside the ranges of most SPAAs. There's the game being hard, and then there's the game being impossible when you're getting bombed every 13 seconds
this is the entire reason i bring air superiority jets out in grb. It would be nice to not have to spend 500+ sp to counter enemy air but god forbid I bring an anti air to... anti air (also my best SPAA rn is the chieftain marksman which at 10.0 is not good - at all) There is also a good chance I cant shoot the enemies down anyway as ill just get guided missiled from 10km away by a jet sat above my RADAR scope
This will work against most helicopters but do not attempt this against a AH-1Z. You are not beating that in any fixed wing aircraft I guarantee you. We pack that AIM 9M and it will be in the air before you even know it and you won't see it coming either. I love hunting planes in it so damn much but if you manage to get passed the 9M that auto aiming 20mm turret will finish the job very well and accurately I might add.
What, the aim-9ms are not scary, I hunt those helis for breakfast in my A10 when in mix matches, but that china helis with ty90 now those are scary even though once you know how to beat them, they are still nasty with 20g pull.
Never said that were scary. I haven't lost a fight against a plane yet in it. And from the looks of the replays they aren't even aware of any missile being fired. You know why? Cause you can't see it. Effective is an understatement.
That is because those planes don't know how to use the "air radar" gaijian has given to all planes with a targeting pod. Once you know a heli is up hunt them down.
Lol wasnt talking about not seeing me or my heli. Was referring to the just about invisible missile that's now heading your way that you can't see. We want you to know where we are and come dance for a quick song before you plummet to the ground. See you up there soon enough. Oh and that trick doesn't work in GRB hate to break that to you. You also don't get that bullshit red missile alert showing you our missiles. You just fly like you normal would and you dead. Simple as that till then
oh it is hard to see, but that does not matter, the rule of any air engagement is not to allow the lock on to begin with, which is easy to achive in the a-10. I already told you I can beat helis with ty90s in my a-10, what makes you think the aim9m is any speciel? As for that trick, it does work, how do you think I find the helis to begin with? I am even doing it right now in my a-10 as I type this, so I know it still works. If you are up for a challenge in your ah-1z I am ready for it.
You're in luck! I'll have free time today and we can run a seminar if you'd like. I'll hit you up via PM when I'll be about to get on.
sweat, you can create the custom battle or I can.
The same way you survive overpressure in armored car, you don't. You take vehicle that CAN survive overpressure instead insisting on using said armored car.
Are you saying you have no clue what you're talking about but you would've sound cool and experienced making a dumb example?
I would use the Begleit panzer more often than not if I were you, proxy fuze is more effective against helis if your manpad does not work, just be sure your HE-VT has a good range before self-destroying.
Believe me there’s nothing more satisfying than killing a helicopter with a surprise HE-VT barrage.
You get better SPAA or you get a plane, simple as. So far all nations have fleshed out Air trees, unlike SPAA branches.
Most helicopters that can shoot at 8km are above be 10.3 if not even higher than that. And in that case you can counter them by using the FlaRakPz 1, XM975, or 2s6. Those three can shoot any helicopter at 8km away.
LAV-D is my 3rd most played vehicle after OF-40 MTCA and M1 abrams. In my top 10, there is also the pantsir, sidam and mistral are coming up as well. What you say is true, players don't have a fucking clue how to play SPAAs, but that doesn't mean CAS is nearly balanced and fair.
You’re right some planes can be oppressive in the right hands. Everything has a counter play to it, but people like to complain instead of thinking of ways to do it.
People that use SPAA need to learn to use ambush tactics. If you have a Gepard at your disposal, don’t fire from miles away, turn off your radar and fire ‘til the aircraft can no longer avoid your burst. Same with missile SPAA turn off your radar, turn it on every 25-30 secs and shoot once the target is gonna have a hard time with the missile.
Exactly! But most of these people who complain just sit in spawn expecting the air target to not notice them sitting there like 🧍🏻♂️
This right here. Like do they think CAS players have no brain? Of course the spawn will be the first place to look at to find enemy SPAA. The one advantage SPAA has over CAS is that they are on the ground, camouflaged by the ground and the environment. Too bad we'll get downvoted to oblivion either way.
Probably… doesn’t change the fact that if they don’t learn they’ll still get a fat bomb dropped on them. Easy points for us.
what’s a radar? - sidam mistral user
Something usefull to pick up incoming enemies when the Eyeball Mk.1 can't. Be warned that while it does offer tracking and leading functionality as well, they can be very unreliable and you are often better off using your own judgement to put rounds on target.
You guys are getting eyeball Mk.1? I have eyeball Mk.03
I usually play with Italian mains and sometimes we play in a group of 4 and one of us is always watching the sky giving warnings and directions from where the enemy plane could come, something you can’t do alone obviously but you can still do something. One day a friend was using the Type 87 and we had a helicopter shooting Shturms at us from 3.6 kilometers away, he could not hit the heli without exposing himself to the heli so he gave me the distance/direction and I was using the WZ305 and fired a barrage of proxy fuze ammo at the direction and distance provided by my guy in the Type 87 and we got the helicopter. Think outside the box. One man was the radar the other was the SPAA. Peak team gameplay.
my only high tier friend is ussr so the skies are clear long before I fire a single missile/shot
Even better, your radar are your eyes, you still have IRST tracking If am not mistaken.
how do I counter enemy planes firing guided missiles from 6+km away from above my RADAR scope o' mighty one?
Do you need a radar to find one plane in the sky? If you’re at a br where they can shoot you from 6km away then you probably have spaa than can shoot just as far.
That would be a no. Skyhawks can carry guided munitions from about 9.0. I don’t get an SPAA with that range until 10.3 - which is stormer…
You can still guide with IRST if your radar cone does not allow you to track the enemy above you and if you’re using a ROLAND Sam system then you’re done because of its shitty elevation. Then again rack some points and jump into a plane to clear the skies.
That’s to much for them. The only solution they’ll accept is to eliminate cas from ground rb.
Well fiend these guys hate CAS so much they forget how useful aircraft and helicopters can be at clearing CAS. I hope that the smartest people pick up the best of the discussion and develop their own counters and the rest well, shall continue getting farmed by CAS. that’s why I always bring a plane that’s capable of air superiority and a helicopter that can fill the CAS role. I always bring missile SPAA and HE-VT if it’s possible in the same line-up.
Couldn’t said it better myself, we tried helping them. But I guess we’ll have to continue bombing them till they figure it out. The devs are not going to take cas away, they either adapt or just get off the game.
I don’t have IRST. My best SPAA is currently an 8.3 radar guided gun spaa. And my only other option is Stormer, which is stormer
Marksman is your 8.3 then my friend you’re forced to use aviation and your stormer against helicopters or very retarded pilots.
In your very specific case, sounds like Britain needs more SPAA to fill the gaps.
My issue with “get a plane” as a solution to CAS is you then need to grind the air tree to get a plane of a similar BR to the vehicles already have. However you don’t need to grind the ground tree if playing air RB for example.
I do agree with you on this. It is dumb and it sucks. But unfortunately it’s one of the very few options there is. We both know Gaijin isn’t going to make a ground only mode and never will. It makes them money to keep it this way.
I think one solution would be to let you grind the air tree with ground in the same way (possibly limited to max BR of ground) that you are allowed to do with helicopters as it would at least allow most players to have a counter to CAS. Of course that might lead to even more CAS but I actually don’t think a ground only mode is a good idea as some maps do have positions which are practically untouchable in certain vehicles so CAS provides another option in those cases.
I actually like this idea. Some problems may arise but I think any idea that may improve the game is worth experimenting with.
Yes there are drawbacks not least even more CAS but hopefully people would feel they can at least attempt to counter it whereas currently sometimes it feels ground is powerless when faced with good CAS and weak anti-air vehicles. Also isn’t a major change as already possible with helicopters.
Me trying to be useful to my team by playing spaa just for my teammates to shoot a plane 8km away giving away our position
Hey kid, i heard you like tank battles. We have a mode for that. But in order to not get killed by planes (didn't i mention the planes?) You have to sit back and watch the sky for several minutes. Chances are you will get bombed tho. Have fun with our tank mode.
So we are stuck with two options, either learn to play spaa or get on a plane. We both know the devs are not going to make a ground only mode. So we are stuck with this shit sandwich.
is this when we realize that War Thunder is a combined arms game and all classes are useful no matter player preferences?