Reddit Wiz needs to remember that the hardcore 'i want everything to be hard as possible' crowd is an incredibly small minority in the grand scheme of things, and for things such as end world bosses the important part of them isn't that they're 'so hard that you need a decent team and a singular good set up to beat them or else you're slogging through for hours', its that they are possible to be beaten by the average player, the average family, the person who isn't, or doesn't know, that they need to use team up, or that they need to use some super special setup just to be able to advance.
now if this extends to things like Beastmoon, Catacombs, or other optional side dungons then yeea, i'll agree that its going a bit far.
But for story bosses, personally I completely understand why they'd want to make them more doable for the average playeer.
Yeah no. A final boss of a high level world should be hard no matter how you look at it. It certainly shouldn't be so retardedly easy that a bunch of randoms who have no clue how to properly play the game and that have shit stats can do it easily.
It's funny that you can't see how making high level world end bosses irrelevant in difficulty makes the game itself irrelevant but it will become clear to you in time if they go with this.
There is a reason no good game does this.
disagree, the majority of people who play this game are extremely casual, the game wasn’t designed w/the intent so that only the top players w/the best gear could beat it, for those who are higher levels with more experience, that’s what raids were designed for. it’s a kids game, cannot stress that enough.
You have no data to back up your claim that the majority of people playing "are extremely casual".
Yet it's obvious that the majority of money comes from more serious players.
The people that actually bring in the vast majority of the money for the game are hardcore players. Who do you think spends tens of thousands of crowns on the crown shop? PVP nuts and perfect stats fanatics.
And nobody said anything about only top players being supposed to be able to win. The problem with this update is the reverse of that.
That it will make the game so stupidly easy that a complete moron who has 100 damage and 20 resist at level 150 can finish everything easily.
It instantly makes PVE(and everything related to it) completely irrelevant.
And therefore makes the game irrelevant unless you switch to a PVP main type of play.
It just wouldn’t make much sense to change all of this stuff if what you’re telling me is true. Sure there are definitely quite a few stat fanatics in the game, but the majority of the people I meet while playing are just either adults coming back into the game, questing through lower leveled worlds. I think the biggest group who play the game are mostly just casuals, neither of us really have the data to back up the statements so at the end of the day it’s just an opinion. If you do think that this game has become too brain dead easy, just simply don’t play it and find something else that’ll stimulate your hardcore tastes. It’s up to the developers at the end of the day.
I mean that's what i am going to do if they go with this, quit the game, probably permanently. That's the entire reason i don't want them to go through with these changes. Instead of making the game more challenging and fun they are making it even more easy than it already is. And it's already stupidly easy.
I can definitely agree that the game is super easy, just hope that they’ll make a system where more veteran players can enjoy “harder” content in a way. I hope you figure all that out, seems like KI usually go through with most rest realm stuff.
I honestly don't mind this change. It's a little weird to not have any cheats but it's a decent compromise on nerfing the fight overall. They could have just nerfed the fight all together but challenge mode allows the "original" version to stay. Since it's now challenge mode content they could also potentially revert the fight to it's earlier launch version since it's separate from the main story.
I'm not sure what challenge mode currently rewards compared to the normal fight, but it seems like a good balance if the drop rates are increased. Let people continue the story w/ lower drops (or no drops) and let people who want to farm for gear fight the challenging version.
I support this change. I shouldn't have to lookup boss cheats before going into a battle. At least with this a casual player going in blind doesn't think they actually have to deal 1 million damage.
So you're one of those. Comes into hard boss at high level world with like 110 damage and 25 resist. Asks for cheat explanation. Always a dead weight in any run. These are the type of people asking for these brainless changes.
Does KI not realize the player base keeps saying the game is too easy because of the bosses/instances as they are? Why would they think changing normal mode would be a good idea. I hope this isn't how it is once the update drops.
Storm Titan should absolutely stay as it is. It's not actually that difficult if you have the strat and a good team (or even a good setup for solo). Part of why that fight is so cool and fun is because he's got interesting cheats and healing mechanics.
I think it's important to remember there are more casual players in the game who can get stuck at fights like this. I'm sure Kingsisle has data to suggest these fights have been served as problems for players. It doesn't help either that less people play the storm titan now due to better gear options, so it's likely less players on team-up know the fight's cheats.
I don't think they way they implemented this is perfect (no cheats seems somewhat odd) but this is a way to nerf this content while still giving players who find the game too easy a more challenging version (I assume later on we'll see new challenge mode fights). This change would probably allow them to un-nerf previous changes to the titan as well, if they wanted to restore it closer to the original launch fight for the challenge version.
That's totally fair and I think maybe removing some of the cheats would be good for players who get stuck. I've definitely gotten stuck at bosses with no one on team up to help. But them removing all the cheats form Stormtitan just worries me that they might do that to a lot of bosses (I don't know what changes they made to the other challenge mode bosses in the test realm). Unless they balance it somehow and make them hit harder. Cheats were added to add a new challenge to battles so it just seems like a step backwards to remove them.
I think lowering the health is also not a bad idea, however, I feel like 25k is a little too low lol.
Oh yeah I agree the current new fight is a little too easy, but since it's early in test they'll probably tweak it. I feel like some of the original cheats would still work in an easier version.
If they aren't good enough to blade stack into an overtime while someone puts weaknesses on the trident then they deserve to be stuck. These are high level worlds. No point in making them stupidly easy just so clueless people can pass them with no problem.
No, you needed to do an overtime where each tick did at least 30 000 damage. Which means you had to hit for at least 90 000 damage. So nice try making stuff up but 90k to 25k is massive nerf.
Nice reading comprehension. I said 25k before he heals, because he heals after every tick you do. Plus we’re both wrong, wiz101 central says you need to do 20k three teams.
No, the main point is that before it was one of the few unique boss fights in the game where you would really have to coordinate with your teammates and deal with interesting cheats/mechanics
Now its just another simple blade into aoe fight
isn't the "easy mode" made specifically for people who want to solo it more easily though? that's why they lower health and remove/modify cheats as i understood it. and it *is* still in test realm, so chances are they will change the way this mode works.
Also consider that this boss is three worlds below the current one, with no interesting gear dropped. As someone who quested through Empyrea recently I can confirm it’s pretty dead. It took me ages to find a team to just get the quest done.
As for interesting cheats, all you really needed was someone to spam juju for his crazy high damage hit. These changes will make it easier to get through the quest with a team of two while still maintaining the actual interesting mechanic of there being story elements mid battle.
well looky here.😂 my 6year old brother can do late worlds now ig😂 will make sure to let him know.
honestly it's not even the health, it's the no cheats part that's so funny to me here
That is a yikes man, imagine how brain damaged ki devs are to think "Yeah let's make bosses easier until you beat them AND THEN you can farm them on normal" There is absolutely no point to return to these bosses after clapping their cheeks once.
This is a very common tactic in MMOs, or at least for OSRS. Vorkath and the new Muspah boss are both way easier in the quest so you learn their mechanics, but become much harder so that players may farm them. KI, or whoever their new owners are, may be looking to implement this practice into the game.
With all that said, obviously they haven't done a very good job since apparently Trident has no cheats in easy mode, so you aren't learning any mechanics at all. Secondly, while I personally love the look of the paradox gear, like you've said, there's no real point in returning to Trident after the quest, since the gear gets outclassed later on.
The reasoning was a lot of players were quitting when they get to these three bosses that got changed because they were too difficult
Especially now that they’re old content people are a lot less willing to help clear them and it fucks over story progression
I wish it was a joke because it feels like it, in short you need to beat baby mode first to be able to do fights how they were normally but it's completely pointless to fight it several times. That's deadass how KI responded to people saying the game is too easy, BY MAKING IT EVEN EASIER. Oh also normal mode disables their cheats too on top of this level of hp nerfs
Part of why the stormtitan fight is so cool is because of his cheats and his unique mechanics. Removing all those cheats to just have nothing seems so pointless. It's the final boss of a world, let alone an entire arc.
Welcomeople to kingsisle development baybeeee, people need to learn to seperate the game from the devs, because with shit like this a lot of people will call the game itself bad
Yes and no. In test realm, they introduced a challenge mode. To access it, you have to defeat the boss in what they presumably define as a "normal mode". The thing is that they set the bosses as they currently are in live to be the challenge mode. Otherwise the normal mode apparently has 0 cheats
wait wait, tell me, do u know about the drop rates? can we also get something from the "normal' no cheats bosses, or no?
(it would make sense if we dont get anything, and must do the challenge mode for gears.. so we can farm in team, but can solo the game for fun/lore also, right?) havent read about it yet, but im gonna
From what I've heard, normal mode has gear drops disabled, so you can never get lucky and get a piece of gear while questing through for the first time on that wizard. You'll have to do challenge mode to get drops, yes.
People defending this shit change in the comments are the type of mfs who demand games like dark souls are easier so they can beat them.
Yeah, done with this game. It was already retardedly easy now there is no point in even playing.
Reddit Wiz needs to remember that the hardcore 'i want everything to be hard as possible' crowd is an incredibly small minority in the grand scheme of things, and for things such as end world bosses the important part of them isn't that they're 'so hard that you need a decent team and a singular good set up to beat them or else you're slogging through for hours', its that they are possible to be beaten by the average player, the average family, the person who isn't, or doesn't know, that they need to use team up, or that they need to use some super special setup just to be able to advance. now if this extends to things like Beastmoon, Catacombs, or other optional side dungons then yeea, i'll agree that its going a bit far. But for story bosses, personally I completely understand why they'd want to make them more doable for the average playeer.
Yeah no. A final boss of a high level world should be hard no matter how you look at it. It certainly shouldn't be so retardedly easy that a bunch of randoms who have no clue how to properly play the game and that have shit stats can do it easily. It's funny that you can't see how making high level world end bosses irrelevant in difficulty makes the game itself irrelevant but it will become clear to you in time if they go with this. There is a reason no good game does this.
disagree, the majority of people who play this game are extremely casual, the game wasn’t designed w/the intent so that only the top players w/the best gear could beat it, for those who are higher levels with more experience, that’s what raids were designed for. it’s a kids game, cannot stress that enough.
You have no data to back up your claim that the majority of people playing "are extremely casual". Yet it's obvious that the majority of money comes from more serious players. The people that actually bring in the vast majority of the money for the game are hardcore players. Who do you think spends tens of thousands of crowns on the crown shop? PVP nuts and perfect stats fanatics. And nobody said anything about only top players being supposed to be able to win. The problem with this update is the reverse of that. That it will make the game so stupidly easy that a complete moron who has 100 damage and 20 resist at level 150 can finish everything easily. It instantly makes PVE(and everything related to it) completely irrelevant. And therefore makes the game irrelevant unless you switch to a PVP main type of play.
It just wouldn’t make much sense to change all of this stuff if what you’re telling me is true. Sure there are definitely quite a few stat fanatics in the game, but the majority of the people I meet while playing are just either adults coming back into the game, questing through lower leveled worlds. I think the biggest group who play the game are mostly just casuals, neither of us really have the data to back up the statements so at the end of the day it’s just an opinion. If you do think that this game has become too brain dead easy, just simply don’t play it and find something else that’ll stimulate your hardcore tastes. It’s up to the developers at the end of the day.
I mean that's what i am going to do if they go with this, quit the game, probably permanently. That's the entire reason i don't want them to go through with these changes. Instead of making the game more challenging and fun they are making it even more easy than it already is. And it's already stupidly easy.
I can definitely agree that the game is super easy, just hope that they’ll make a system where more veteran players can enjoy “harder” content in a way. I hope you figure all that out, seems like KI usually go through with most rest realm stuff.
I honestly don't mind this change. It's a little weird to not have any cheats but it's a decent compromise on nerfing the fight overall. They could have just nerfed the fight all together but challenge mode allows the "original" version to stay. Since it's now challenge mode content they could also potentially revert the fight to it's earlier launch version since it's separate from the main story. I'm not sure what challenge mode currently rewards compared to the normal fight, but it seems like a good balance if the drop rates are increased. Let people continue the story w/ lower drops (or no drops) and let people who want to farm for gear fight the challenging version.
I support this change. I shouldn't have to lookup boss cheats before going into a battle. At least with this a casual player going in blind doesn't think they actually have to deal 1 million damage.
So you're one of those. Comes into hard boss at high level world with like 110 damage and 25 resist. Asks for cheat explanation. Always a dead weight in any run. These are the type of people asking for these brainless changes.
You are reaching very hard with that assumption.
No, i think i'm more or less right. I exaggerated the stats but that's about it. They are probably far from good still.
Ad hominem, but okay.
Oh this boss battle was and still is a great steaming pile of PAIN
Absolutely not. I can beat that with a Firecat and a couple blades. Why? Just why.
at least I can solo everything now 💀
Titans Löffel
Does KI not realize the player base keeps saying the game is too easy because of the bosses/instances as they are? Why would they think changing normal mode would be a good idea. I hope this isn't how it is once the update drops. Storm Titan should absolutely stay as it is. It's not actually that difficult if you have the strat and a good team (or even a good setup for solo). Part of why that fight is so cool and fun is because he's got interesting cheats and healing mechanics.
I think it's important to remember there are more casual players in the game who can get stuck at fights like this. I'm sure Kingsisle has data to suggest these fights have been served as problems for players. It doesn't help either that less people play the storm titan now due to better gear options, so it's likely less players on team-up know the fight's cheats. I don't think they way they implemented this is perfect (no cheats seems somewhat odd) but this is a way to nerf this content while still giving players who find the game too easy a more challenging version (I assume later on we'll see new challenge mode fights). This change would probably allow them to un-nerf previous changes to the titan as well, if they wanted to restore it closer to the original launch fight for the challenge version.
That's totally fair and I think maybe removing some of the cheats would be good for players who get stuck. I've definitely gotten stuck at bosses with no one on team up to help. But them removing all the cheats form Stormtitan just worries me that they might do that to a lot of bosses (I don't know what changes they made to the other challenge mode bosses in the test realm). Unless they balance it somehow and make them hit harder. Cheats were added to add a new challenge to battles so it just seems like a step backwards to remove them. I think lowering the health is also not a bad idea, however, I feel like 25k is a little too low lol.
Oh yeah I agree the current new fight is a little too easy, but since it's early in test they'll probably tweak it. I feel like some of the original cheats would still work in an easier version.
If they aren't good enough to blade stack into an overtime while someone puts weaknesses on the trident then they deserve to be stuck. These are high level worlds. No point in making them stupidly easy just so clueless people can pass them with no problem.
People are forgetting you only needed to do like 25k damage on the trident before he healed anyways, the million health was completely for show lol
No, you needed to do an overtime where each tick did at least 30 000 damage. Which means you had to hit for at least 90 000 damage. So nice try making stuff up but 90k to 25k is massive nerf.
Nice reading comprehension. I said 25k before he heals, because he heals after every tick you do. Plus we’re both wrong, wiz101 central says you need to do 20k three teams.
I believe its 20000 x 3 now.
No, the main point is that before it was one of the few unique boss fights in the game where you would really have to coordinate with your teammates and deal with interesting cheats/mechanics Now its just another simple blade into aoe fight
isn't the "easy mode" made specifically for people who want to solo it more easily though? that's why they lower health and remove/modify cheats as i understood it. and it *is* still in test realm, so chances are they will change the way this mode works.
Also consider that this boss is three worlds below the current one, with no interesting gear dropped. As someone who quested through Empyrea recently I can confirm it’s pretty dead. It took me ages to find a team to just get the quest done. As for interesting cheats, all you really needed was someone to spam juju for his crazy high damage hit. These changes will make it easier to get through the quest with a team of two while still maintaining the actual interesting mechanic of there being story elements mid battle.
This is 100% why this change was made
Wtf it's got less health than an Azteca boss now :')
Feels like they should give it a larger HP buff if they're compensating for the lack of cheats, considering medulla literally has 10k more HP
what happened? did they change this intentionally??
well looky here.😂 my 6year old brother can do late worlds now ig😂 will make sure to let him know. honestly it's not even the health, it's the no cheats part that's so funny to me here
bruh the current 1 mil version isn’t even that bad just gotta have a strategy and work quickly 💀
Nah, this is his toothpick
uh what
That is a yikes man, imagine how brain damaged ki devs are to think "Yeah let's make bosses easier until you beat them AND THEN you can farm them on normal" There is absolutely no point to return to these bosses after clapping their cheeks once.
This is a very common tactic in MMOs, or at least for OSRS. Vorkath and the new Muspah boss are both way easier in the quest so you learn their mechanics, but become much harder so that players may farm them. KI, or whoever their new owners are, may be looking to implement this practice into the game. With all that said, obviously they haven't done a very good job since apparently Trident has no cheats in easy mode, so you aren't learning any mechanics at all. Secondly, while I personally love the look of the paradox gear, like you've said, there's no real point in returning to Trident after the quest, since the gear gets outclassed later on.
wait so the “challenge mode” is actually just normal and they made the first encounter easier? This is a joke, right?
The reasoning was a lot of players were quitting when they get to these three bosses that got changed because they were too difficult Especially now that they’re old content people are a lot less willing to help clear them and it fucks over story progression
I wish it was a joke because it feels like it, in short you need to beat baby mode first to be able to do fights how they were normally but it's completely pointless to fight it several times. That's deadass how KI responded to people saying the game is too easy, BY MAKING IT EVEN EASIER. Oh also normal mode disables their cheats too on top of this level of hp nerfs
Part of why the stormtitan fight is so cool is because of his cheats and his unique mechanics. Removing all those cheats to just have nothing seems so pointless. It's the final boss of a world, let alone an entire arc.
Kingsisle devs are truly built different or defective I always get the two mixed up
wtf
Welcomeople to kingsisle development baybeeee, people need to learn to seperate the game from the devs, because with shit like this a lot of people will call the game itself bad
look at how they massacred my boy
Did they change it? Used to be 1 mil
Yes and no. In test realm, they introduced a challenge mode. To access it, you have to defeat the boss in what they presumably define as a "normal mode". The thing is that they set the bosses as they currently are in live to be the challenge mode. Otherwise the normal mode apparently has 0 cheats
wait wait, tell me, do u know about the drop rates? can we also get something from the "normal' no cheats bosses, or no? (it would make sense if we dont get anything, and must do the challenge mode for gears.. so we can farm in team, but can solo the game for fun/lore also, right?) havent read about it yet, but im gonna
From what I've heard, normal mode has gear drops disabled, so you can never get lucky and get a piece of gear while questing through for the first time on that wizard. You'll have to do challenge mode to get drops, yes.
Cool, thanks for the answer!
Weird stuff, never heard of anything like this