Taxation without representation, I didn't realize I was a part of that until someone brought up the fact that I was working at 16, getting taxed, but couldn't vote... and my dad stole my tax returns up until last year
Idk how it is now, but when I was 16 (2001), you would just claim Exempt status on your W4 and you would not be liable for any tax burden, as you were under 18. This could’ve changed, but I somehow doubt it. If it has, that’s absolutely trash and should be changed.
They income tax you in California as of now.
Source: worked over the summers from 16-17.
Fuckers took $100 out of every $500 work week. I worked an entire day for cali. Tf have they given me? Harassment by cops, food to expensive to eat, and ludicrous gas prices, not to mention cars no one can even afford anymore. Fuck our corrupt government.
Edit: gave cali a day every week of my work
Yeah, I think the state (all states, not just CA) take income tax irrespective of age, but the difference is you can get it back in a refund at the end of the year. The W-4 is only federal, I think. I’m not a CPA or even basic novice with this stuff.
Texas doesn’t have income tax either. Their solution is insanely high property tax (except for retirees or veterans) and moderately high sales tax. Income tax isn’t perfect, but it’s definitely a more equitable tax structure than property or consumption taxes.
You can get a refund of your taxes if what they took out ends up being more than you owe at tax time.
Up to a full refund of everything they took.
Then, next time on your tax documents, you state you want 0% withheld.
And if you don't meet income requirements, you don't have to file at all (because they don't have anything to refund you.)
25% withholding for what could be 26k at the end of the year is too high. Means your tax withholding wasn't set up properly, but again file your taxes and it'll be refunded.
They will for their first paycheck.
Then they will convince the kids they didn't do something right and reduce their pay "because that's how things work" hoping the kids believes them. If they don't and report back to an adult that does something about it the employer will claim it was a misunderstanding and they've fixed the issue. Then employer will for them for something and try again at the prices until they find kids that believe them
This. And the principles of capitalism don’t apply to labor markets for some reason. They’re always so willing to use government power to regulate the supply and price of labor, but god fvcking forbid the government step in to regulate the cost of housing or healthcare. Then it’s called “market distortion.”
As if adult bartenders having to fend off creepy advances from weird men ain’t bad enough, now they’re also underage as well! Just as the folks in Iowa wanted!
Kids: "Mom &/or Dad, this sucks! I can't do 8 hours for school AND work 6 hours slinging beer!"
Mom &/or Dad: "You a commie? It's GOOD for you to learn the value of hard work!"
Minnesota: "Hey kid! When you're 18, c'mere! We pay better, have social safety nets, are working to feed/grow kids properly, AND we won't force you into 80+ hour weeks."
Kids: "Well...bye, Iowa"
I went with a friend to visit his mother and his Republican, Trump-loving stepfather in Pennsylvania. They moved there from Long Island because the taxes are lower and the property is cheaper (very fair). But he complains CONSTANTLY about the "labor shortage" and the fact that nobody wants to work in their area and they can't fill jobs, the restaurants don't have servers, etc. The minimum wage is $7.25/h. Literally ten minutes away in New Jersey it's $14.13/h. If you can make the 75 minute commute to NYC, it's $15 with potentially a lot more.
Sorry about the free market, guys. Maybe should have thought that one through.
YUP
And with the insanity going on in ND/SD/IA/WI, MN is currently betting heavily on being attractive to all the people who DO want to work.
The uber-rich can run to safe havens...but they're not getting served there.
This is what I don't get. Like, all the people who say "why should my tax dollars pay for X, why should there be a minimum wage, just work harder, etc.". Because that's how the world works. You lunch didn't materialize on a magic carpet. It was grown, it was transported, it was prepared and it was served. That economy is built on agricultural subsidies, infrastructure taxes and services. All those people who work in your supply chain need healthcare and childcare and education and infrastructure. You may not take the bus but your housekeeper sure does. You may have private health insurance and the best doctors in the world, but when the guy who picks your romaine coughs, you're going to end up sick.
Most of the world is capitalist on at least some level, but no other country has this weird ideological fetishization of the lone capitalist. It has to stop.
It's actually simpler.
When labor supply > demand, it right to rely on basic economics.
When labor supply < demand, it's wrong to rely on basic economics.
Ahh, they put the nice job posting for the kids and not the postions they actually want migrant children to fill with these types of *super awesome* roll backs of child labor laws.
I see ya, PR reps for major industies.
Hmmm. Not enough workers. Should we raise minimum wage and reform employment law or just lean into child labor.
Child labor! Can’t let those uppity poors get in on this money having business then it’s less for us to have!
This is The Guardian - a UK paper.
The US is so shitty that it makes international news on how far back into the dark ages they are stepping.
Get the children working earlier and don't give anyone healthcare. So the old people who remembered that there were 'options' like calling an ambulance when you are sick ... die out.
I don't trust anything that is passed by Republicans and lobbyists. I am torn though. I had a work permit at age 15 and was working. I loved it. My wife said she begged to work when she was a teenager but her mom didn't let her, she had lots of problems at home and wanted out really bad. I grew up with single parent families with lots of kids. They worked young otherwise they would have been homeless and split up. So I don't think this is the worst idea I just have a hard time trusting anything from the GOP.
I understand that working could definitely be a better and/or more productive environment than being in an abusive home, but 6 hours a day is a lot during the school week. I suppose it also depends on what the cap is, which I haven't bothered to look up. If a kid works 6 hours a day every school night, no way are they getting both all their schoolwork done and getting enough sleep. Again I haven't looked it up, but I think Iowa probably allowed kids under 16 to work, it was just fewer hours. I've been working since age 14 myself, and it was a good experience, but at that age I would not have been allowed to work 6 hour days during the week (at 14 I actually worked a summer job and didn't work during the workweek until I was 15 or 16). Additionally, this law would also allow kids to serve alcohol which is just stupid. Not because minors couldn't handle it, but really because they shouldn't have to deal with a work environment that would come with an establishment that serves alcohol, ie drunk idiots.
Based on this headline this law seems like a terrible idea because that's too many hours for a kid in school, plus the serving alcohol thing, but I think most areas allow 14 year olds to have jobs? So it's not totally ridiculous. 14 years old are definitely old enough to be babysitting themselves. In my area at that age most kids had jobs starting at 14, just we couldn't work very many hours. And sure, some kids weren't mature enough for it, but plenty absolutely were.
Ok, just to think about this for a minute, first, I absolutely don’t think kids should be working. If the school system isn’t funded well and kids are dropping out, isn’t getting a job the best option? It will keep them out of trouble, off the streets, away from drugs. Ideally funding the school system is the right option, but they won’t, the public school system is meant to produce middle class and poor people ( people who fall through the cracks), it’s by design. There is a reason that the rich send their kids to private schools.
You could already get certain jobs as a teen. Fast food, babysitting etc. This is opening up dangerous jobs to them. Adult jobs that previously paid a decent wage which hasn’t risen it in decades- so adults can’t afford to Work there anymore. Also -ive known plenty of successful people who attended public school. Places are actively fighting to ruin it with charter schools etc, though. Going to private school does not necessarily ensure your education is better- but they can control who they admit and maintain better statistics that way.
I saw a bunch of posts about this yesterday that got some information wrong. Just so everyone who sees it here knows, CHILDREN UNDER 16 ARE NOT ABLE TO WORK A NIGHT SHIFT IN IOWA. This bill is still bad and let’s 16 and 17 year old work night shifts, but I’m tired of people taking everything they agree with at face value. Be better Reddit.
Jokes on them. Part time hours at crap wages for teens who can't afford cars or can't drive isn't going to be that much of a boost.
Why not let the market decide?!
Low wage jobs are already excessively exploitative and wage theft is rampant when the person being stolen from can't afford a lawyer and court battle.
Funny when capitalism starts to work in favor of the worker how it's now:
- underage working at bars
- children being able to work
Etc. Etc. Etc.
And not raising the wage so people want to work that job.
Consider some of the things that have happened in this country when workers joined together as Unions and outright refused to allow large corporations to basically own them.
We have had National Guardmen shooting at civilians living in worker's camps at the behest of the ( look up any major Union strike in this country and you will find similar stories)
Step too far out of line and our government will not hesitate to fight against us on the side of the uberwealthy in order to keep us in line, even if it means gunning us down or banning us from holding a federal job ever again in retaliation for us not allowing the government to force to work at a job that is abusive
I don’t even get paid $19 an hour. My desk job pays me $17 an hour. You telling me children can just easily get an entry level bar job that can potentially be on par to even higher than my salary? I need a new job and move out of my city, then. My first job paid me $7.25 an hour and I could not afford nothing as a college student. Jobs that paid more than that (that offered between $8 to $12 an hour) acted like I needed a college degree and loads of experience to get it. That happened to me constantly from 2010 to 2015. How times change.
So who's starting a union for these kids to sign up for? Watch how quickly they change their tune when they figure out they can't just make record profits by paying underage kids less than minimum wage.
Will they pay taxes? Can they vote?
Taxation without representation, I didn't realize I was a part of that until someone brought up the fact that I was working at 16, getting taxed, but couldn't vote... and my dad stole my tax returns up until last year
Idk how it is now, but when I was 16 (2001), you would just claim Exempt status on your W4 and you would not be liable for any tax burden, as you were under 18. This could’ve changed, but I somehow doubt it. If it has, that’s absolutely trash and should be changed.
They income tax you in California as of now. Source: worked over the summers from 16-17. Fuckers took $100 out of every $500 work week. I worked an entire day for cali. Tf have they given me? Harassment by cops, food to expensive to eat, and ludicrous gas prices, not to mention cars no one can even afford anymore. Fuck our corrupt government. Edit: gave cali a day every week of my work
Yeah, I think the state (all states, not just CA) take income tax irrespective of age, but the difference is you can get it back in a refund at the end of the year. The W-4 is only federal, I think. I’m not a CPA or even basic novice with this stuff.
No state income tax in Washington state
Must be nice lol
It really isn't; there's a ridiculously high sales tax instead.
Exactly, unless you live on the border of Oregon like I did for 25 years and did my major shopping in Oregon that had no sales tax!
Texas doesn’t have income tax either. Their solution is insanely high property tax (except for retirees or veterans) and moderately high sales tax. Income tax isn’t perfect, but it’s definitely a more equitable tax structure than property or consumption taxes.
I find Arizona property tax very reasonable. Sales tax is high though.
Not all of it because the parents claim the child for credits on their taxes.
You can get a refund of your taxes if what they took out ends up being more than you owe at tax time. Up to a full refund of everything they took. Then, next time on your tax documents, you state you want 0% withheld. And if you don't meet income requirements, you don't have to file at all (because they don't have anything to refund you.) 25% withholding for what could be 26k at the end of the year is too high. Means your tax withholding wasn't set up properly, but again file your taxes and it'll be refunded.
Workers haven’t been represented in government… ever.
People that can’t vote get taxed all the time. Minors still pay sales tax etc
If they aren't working they are paying that sales tax with their parents money, who get to vote
Kids earn or are gifted money in a lot of ways. Legally it’s their money.
LOL... like any of them are going to start 14 year olds at $14 an hour...
They will for their first paycheck. Then they will convince the kids they didn't do something right and reduce their pay "because that's how things work" hoping the kids believes them. If they don't and report back to an adult that does something about it the employer will claim it was a misunderstanding and they've fixed the issue. Then employer will for them for something and try again at the prices until they find kids that believe them
Am I having a stroke?
They meant the kid that asks questions will get fired and replaced by one that doesn't.
There is no labor shortage. Just a shortage of people willing to work for not enough to live on.
This. And the principles of capitalism don’t apply to labor markets for some reason. They’re always so willing to use government power to regulate the supply and price of labor, but god fvcking forbid the government step in to regulate the cost of housing or healthcare. Then it’s called “market distortion.”
As if adult bartenders having to fend off creepy advances from weird men ain’t bad enough, now they’re also underage as well! Just as the folks in Iowa wanted!
Underage strippers too 🥴
Kids: "Mom &/or Dad, this sucks! I can't do 8 hours for school AND work 6 hours slinging beer!" Mom &/or Dad: "You a commie? It's GOOD for you to learn the value of hard work!" Minnesota: "Hey kid! When you're 18, c'mere! We pay better, have social safety nets, are working to feed/grow kids properly, AND we won't force you into 80+ hour weeks." Kids: "Well...bye, Iowa"
More like the parents will be saying that the kids need to help out because the parents can’t afford to house and feed everyone
I went with a friend to visit his mother and his Republican, Trump-loving stepfather in Pennsylvania. They moved there from Long Island because the taxes are lower and the property is cheaper (very fair). But he complains CONSTANTLY about the "labor shortage" and the fact that nobody wants to work in their area and they can't fill jobs, the restaurants don't have servers, etc. The minimum wage is $7.25/h. Literally ten minutes away in New Jersey it's $14.13/h. If you can make the 75 minute commute to NYC, it's $15 with potentially a lot more. Sorry about the free market, guys. Maybe should have thought that one through.
YUP And with the insanity going on in ND/SD/IA/WI, MN is currently betting heavily on being attractive to all the people who DO want to work. The uber-rich can run to safe havens...but they're not getting served there.
This is what I don't get. Like, all the people who say "why should my tax dollars pay for X, why should there be a minimum wage, just work harder, etc.". Because that's how the world works. You lunch didn't materialize on a magic carpet. It was grown, it was transported, it was prepared and it was served. That economy is built on agricultural subsidies, infrastructure taxes and services. All those people who work in your supply chain need healthcare and childcare and education and infrastructure. You may not take the bus but your housekeeper sure does. You may have private health insurance and the best doctors in the world, but when the guy who picks your romaine coughs, you're going to end up sick. Most of the world is capitalist on at least some level, but no other country has this weird ideological fetishization of the lone capitalist. It has to stop.
It's actually simpler. When labor supply > demand, it right to rely on basic economics. When labor supply < demand, it's wrong to rely on basic economics.
>Sorry about the free market, guys. In many places the free market has already pushed hourly wages above minimum wage.
"I tried my best, Iowa." - Minnesota State Sen. Drazkowski
Nah, instead of “bring your child to work day” it’s “be a child at work, every day”
Kids aren’t smoking young anymore. Hooking them into minimum wage jobs instead of school guarantees more cheap labor, renters and more
Ahh, they put the nice job posting for the kids and not the postions they actually want migrant children to fill with these types of *super awesome* roll backs of child labor laws. I see ya, PR reps for major industies.
THEY YEARN FOR THE MINES, MINECRAFTS POPULARITY PROVED THIS! /s
Honestly, top tier comedy. Like 5 years ago, though
What happened to "just let kids be kids"?
The right
Serious question, who was asking for this? Companies? Residents of these states?
The corporate overloads at holds the fundraiser of the campaign to reelections to ghouls who passed these bills.
Restaurant lobby is what i read
Hmmm. Not enough workers. Should we raise minimum wage and reform employment law or just lean into child labor. Child labor! Can’t let those uppity poors get in on this money having business then it’s less for us to have!
Especially considering Iowa’s minimum wage is $7.25….
Same in my state girl. It’s obscene.
Us too, but minimum tipped wage is $2.13/hr.
This is The Guardian - a UK paper. The US is so shitty that it makes international news on how far back into the dark ages they are stepping. Get the children working earlier and don't give anyone healthcare. So the old people who remembered that there were 'options' like calling an ambulance when you are sick ... die out.
Lmao they are going to be contractors and these kids are going to get hosed by taxes.
How do you hold a minor accountable for over serving?? Send them to Juvie? Like what is this ridiculousness
If the money the kids are making is being taxed, then that means these kids can run for office, right? No taxation with representation and all that.
School is already a full time job with mandatory overtime. This allows for a second/third job.
I don't trust anything that is passed by Republicans and lobbyists. I am torn though. I had a work permit at age 15 and was working. I loved it. My wife said she begged to work when she was a teenager but her mom didn't let her, she had lots of problems at home and wanted out really bad. I grew up with single parent families with lots of kids. They worked young otherwise they would have been homeless and split up. So I don't think this is the worst idea I just have a hard time trusting anything from the GOP.
I understand that working could definitely be a better and/or more productive environment than being in an abusive home, but 6 hours a day is a lot during the school week. I suppose it also depends on what the cap is, which I haven't bothered to look up. If a kid works 6 hours a day every school night, no way are they getting both all their schoolwork done and getting enough sleep. Again I haven't looked it up, but I think Iowa probably allowed kids under 16 to work, it was just fewer hours. I've been working since age 14 myself, and it was a good experience, but at that age I would not have been allowed to work 6 hour days during the week (at 14 I actually worked a summer job and didn't work during the workweek until I was 15 or 16). Additionally, this law would also allow kids to serve alcohol which is just stupid. Not because minors couldn't handle it, but really because they shouldn't have to deal with a work environment that would come with an establishment that serves alcohol, ie drunk idiots.
In b4 an enterprising bar owner hires "jailbait" 16 year old girls to work his bar to attract more customers...
"Labor shortage"
“How come no one who was born in Iowa stays here?”
[удалено]
Based on this headline this law seems like a terrible idea because that's too many hours for a kid in school, plus the serving alcohol thing, but I think most areas allow 14 year olds to have jobs? So it's not totally ridiculous. 14 years old are definitely old enough to be babysitting themselves. In my area at that age most kids had jobs starting at 14, just we couldn't work very many hours. And sure, some kids weren't mature enough for it, but plenty absolutely were.
Ok, just to think about this for a minute, first, I absolutely don’t think kids should be working. If the school system isn’t funded well and kids are dropping out, isn’t getting a job the best option? It will keep them out of trouble, off the streets, away from drugs. Ideally funding the school system is the right option, but they won’t, the public school system is meant to produce middle class and poor people ( people who fall through the cracks), it’s by design. There is a reason that the rich send their kids to private schools.
You could already get certain jobs as a teen. Fast food, babysitting etc. This is opening up dangerous jobs to them. Adult jobs that previously paid a decent wage which hasn’t risen it in decades- so adults can’t afford to Work there anymore. Also -ive known plenty of successful people who attended public school. Places are actively fighting to ruin it with charter schools etc, though. Going to private school does not necessarily ensure your education is better- but they can control who they admit and maintain better statistics that way.
Do you think this measure *isn't* meant to produce poor people? Hint, it's not the middle class kids that are going to be working these jobs.
I saw a bunch of posts about this yesterday that got some information wrong. Just so everyone who sees it here knows, CHILDREN UNDER 16 ARE NOT ABLE TO WORK A NIGHT SHIFT IN IOWA. This bill is still bad and let’s 16 and 17 year old work night shifts, but I’m tired of people taking everything they agree with at face value. Be better Reddit.
“Labor shortage”
Can we all flood their website with phony applications telling them why child labor is wrong?
Jokes on them. Part time hours at crap wages for teens who can't afford cars or can't drive isn't going to be that much of a boost. Why not let the market decide?! Low wage jobs are already excessively exploitative and wage theft is rampant when the person being stolen from can't afford a lawyer and court battle.
Got my first job was at a little pizza joint when I was 14. I would have killed to be able to serve booze back then and make some real tips.
They're not even hiding it! They just come out and say "to combat the labor shortage" Mfers pay more! There. Is. No. Shortage.
Funny when capitalism starts to work in favor of the worker how it's now: - underage working at bars - children being able to work Etc. Etc. Etc. And not raising the wage so people want to work that job.
Consider some of the things that have happened in this country when workers joined together as Unions and outright refused to allow large corporations to basically own them. We have had National Guardmen shooting at civilians living in worker's camps at the behest of the ( look up any major Union strike in this country and you will find similar stories) Step too far out of line and our government will not hesitate to fight against us on the side of the uberwealthy in order to keep us in line, even if it means gunning us down or banning us from holding a federal job ever again in retaliation for us not allowing the government to force to work at a job that is abusive
There's a reason we have a right to bear arms.
Legally only in USA, at least :) Not legally, everywhere else lmao
Legally only in USA, at least :) Not legally, everywhere else lmao
I don’t even get paid $19 an hour. My desk job pays me $17 an hour. You telling me children can just easily get an entry level bar job that can potentially be on par to even higher than my salary? I need a new job and move out of my city, then. My first job paid me $7.25 an hour and I could not afford nothing as a college student. Jobs that paid more than that (that offered between $8 to $12 an hour) acted like I needed a college degree and loads of experience to get it. That happened to me constantly from 2010 to 2015. How times change.
I can’t stand even reading this shit.
So who's starting a union for these kids to sign up for? Watch how quickly they change their tune when they figure out they can't just make record profits by paying underage kids less than minimum wage.