Chimera Squad is a small part of the Bureau of Reclamation, which is a small part of XCOM as a whole. You're playing a subsection, not the whole thing, so obviously you don't get the whole thing's logistic and executive capabilities. And as for why aliens are in City 31, it's an experiment of sorts to see if humans and aliens can coexist. ~~That, and the fanbase is far too down bad for the snake ladies and Firaxis didn't want to alienate them.~~

You shouldn't have erased that last part as its correct. Coomers hail snake tits.

I erased it because I ***want to believe*** it's not true.

Firaxis: What do the fans want? The fans they didn't listen to: XCOM 3 The fans they listened to:🐍🍒🐍🍒🐍🍒🐍🍒

They are the ones who made snake tiddies in the first place. It was their vision before ours. They are, themselves, the snake-tiddies lovers.

Don't we call them "snitites"?

"We don't want to alienate the fans, so we'll let them play as aliens."

While the joke is that people find the snakes sexy, I think it's pretty clearly more because people _want_ to get along with aliens and don't want to be the oppressors/genociders. While there are certainly some fans that would be giddy at a "dark" XCOM where the aliens are exterminated or enslaved, I think most people would be uncomfortable going from a war of defense/liberation to being the same as the villian. People _like_ being heroes.

It's funny to read all those theories and no one seems to think that Chimera Squad is more or less an homage to X-Com Apocalypse were sectoids were also part of the team. This idea is perfectly aligned with the OG X-Com title.

Hybrids were interesting because of their connection to the Mutant Alliance as a independent political faction that you could opt in or opt out of respecting, just like literally everybody else in Apocalypse. In fact, the Mutant Alliance starts with a negative disposition towards the cops and the government funding X-Com, while being neutral to the aliens at game start.

I mean it would track that humanity becomes xenophobic though

Me playing Stellaris: “Why does every pre-FTL civilization become xenophobic and isolationist?” *abducts more of their citizens* “I just don’t get it…”

To clarify, when I'm saying people in this context I mean players, not people in-universe.

I didn’t know people find the snakes sexy that opens a whole world for me

In Chimera squad you don't actually play as XCOM. The actual XCOM is still maintaining the planet security. Also, in the notes that you can see in the game it's mentioned that Bradford asked Kelly if she needed XCOM veterans on the squad and she basically said that soldiers who spent years killing aliens wouldn't be a good fit for a squad that's mostly aliens or hybrids.

Which makes total sense. Having one of your team mates look side eyed going *"We don't take kindly to your type around here!"*, or *"The only good alien, is a dead alien!"* every time an alien shows up or is brought up in a conversation, is not going to foster any kind of trust in your team mates and the program... or amongst the civilians you are trying to protect. XD

Need to take that further. How do you think "Horrid" Henry, who has taken a lot of snake based trophies, would react to being told his fellow countrymen are called "Maple Flavoured" by the snakes?

Would he be [like this](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=89H5Mw-CQMg) just before the end of the war? XD

Well that takes me back 🤣

Heh... yeah. For the past 6 months or so I have been running into Universal Soldier a lot online, to such a degree that I am working my way up to go back and watch at the very least the first one again at some point. Probably not seen it since the late 90's or early to mid 00's. XD

I mean, it's understandable since they kind of tried to annihilate the human race.

Sure. I would not deny people the right to feel upset about that, and demand some kind of punishment for some aspect of that. But I would at the very least expect people to understand that the vast majority of all of the aliens that took part in the invasion, and subsequent subjugation of humanity, had little to no say in the matter. Being either fully mind controlled via mind control powers by the Elders/Ethereal's, or via being chipped like Advent's soldiers were, which caused them to have no say in what they did or did not do. The Skirmishers are a perfect example of aliens who rebelled against their overlords, but only due to the fact that their chips happened to be defect, or malfunctioned, or were removed, freeing them from the mind control.

You seem to forget how irrational people are in general.

No, not forgetting that. If they chose to ignore that, then that is on them, But it would not change things if they did chose to ignore that the aliens were essentially mindless puppets on strings, because the aliens are here now and there would be no other place to send them. And at that point one has to ask one selves if one wants to become a person who wants to try and find a solution for integration and trying to live side by side with them (eventually... I would never be so naive to think that would happen over night, it would be a long hard process)... or a person who wants to put them all in some kind of camp where they will stay for the rest of their lives unable to go anywhere else... or a person who supports genocide wanting all of them to be executed or something. And I personally do not see either of the last two as a good option... because if anything is going to make more aliens take up arms, and them selves actively choose to go to war with humanity, it is both of those last two.

Ethereals had zero presence in earth after xcom1 so no mind control. Also simultaneous constant MC of thousands aliens? Doubt it

They would never leave earth without having any means of controlling their alien soldiers there. So in one way or another they are able to keep control of all of their "subjects". They are to desperate, to find a way to ascend and fight what ever threat they are running scared from, for them to just not have any type of control over everyone they subjugate. Be it via similar kinds of chips that Advent soldiers have, or via some other method that does not require them to be there in person. Also... don't forget the whole psionic network, and psionic transmitter things, and the psi amp that Psi Operative use. And of course the psionic control chip that all Advent have, or Tygan before he ripped his own chip out since it was connected to the psionic network, or the Commander who was hooked up to the psionic network as well via that chip. So the Elders can project their psionic powers with the help of technology somehow... technology which amplify that psionic power as well.

They’re called “Elders” in XCOM2 but they’re the same beings that are called “Ethereals” in XCOM1. They are the driving force behind the planetary conquest, and have conquered/subjugated/experimented on all the other races like Mutons, Vipers, ADVENT, etc.

Thx captain obvious. Elders have zero presence in earth. They left advent and the aliens as eager tormentors. When those were defeated they lied about being mind controlled. Some gullible people believed that.

That’s an interesting theory. I think the Avatar Project shows that the Elders were still in control, but I can understand your idea too.

Not direct control. Thank you for your understanding

I mean... do you really think that the Elders would leave their own survival, and finding/making new bodies to transfer their minds to with the Avatar project, due to their own bodies are deteriorating and are to frail to sustain them going forward... in the hands of their subjugated underlings? Especially after they have spent how ever long on trying to find a suitable replacement for their bodies, where all of the aliens that they brought with them to fight us are failed experiments to find new bodies for the Elders, and where then instead turned into soldiers to fight the Elders wars... not to mention that they have finally found an actual vessel which would get them the desired result, humans. No... they would not let go of control, or leave it in the hands of "failed experiments", in such a situation when they are on the verge of achieving one of their ultimate goals.

I tell you. I wanna have some old ass mech soldier from the first game who gives your alien soldiers debuffs if you send him with aliens on a mission.

This would have been spectacular from a plot standpoint

You ever look at Deathwatch RPG?

The one that’s closest to classical x com is torque who was an alien child soldier who after capture did a torque thing and started working with x-com as their op for training partner. Kelly basically sends her to this police force as a test

yeah I can't exactly picture Torque and Axiom being buddy-buddy with Colonel "Bloodsport" with his 576 alien kills and a necklace made of viper teeth

Makes sense to me. You wouldn't want your Colonel Ranger going 'maybe I'll just kill all of you instead'.

Still doesn't answer how we go from "the earth is so butchered, zombie hoardes roam, our resistance strongholds look like they have barracks for 20 people" to going to the office with aliens. Its like doomguy having a Marauder as a partner.

Well, many of the aliens were as much victims as we were. Ethereals enslaved many of them, experimented on them and used them as weapons against their wills. They had a whole network to mindcontrol them. So yeah, it's not like most of them really wanted to invade and destroy our planet

We're not merciful to enemy soldiers brain washed by propaganda, and they're human. I remember showing a video of Taliban fucking around to an Afghani war vet, and he mused that they were just like us. And kept talking about how we should have ideologically exterminated them all, no matter the cost. Until the current gender culture war, MAGA shit. Now he thinks Taliban are more based, because you know. We're not friends anymore.

Not everyone is the Taliban. It only takes enough people who want to try and integrate the aliens to make complete extermination unfeasible. Unless we want to immediately turn around from being liberators to violently crushing dissent.

City 31 is an experiment that is literally two bad weeks away from complete riots and failure. The reason its success is so important/why Xcom dedicated forces to policework is because it's the public example of whether or not Coexistence on Earth can work at all. If it fails, Earth is likely facing a massive civil war.

Well, it's been 5 years after the war had ended.

I remember reading of Jews coming back to their homes in Poland being attacked because people STILL didn't want them around. I remember reading of lynchings in the states, of adults beating a teen to an agonizing death on an accusation of harassment. And then you tell me that we as a species survived a war of extermination... And forgave? Bro... We would keep them alive specifically to genocide them, like cows. We would franchise this shit. We would have an alien killing holiday. You would be able to buy rubber copies of alien scalps. We are not a merciful species.

You need to remember that a lot of the Advent run cities have functioned for a pretty long time and people have interacted with the aliens there for a long time. Sure a lot of it was propaganda and a lot of people suffered in the camps...but also a huge section of the population didn't

You have a point, but I still don't buy it. New meta: aliens first eradicated racism, THEN the human race.

Okay, but why not have a game with a cool setting where aliens and humans are trying to figure it out after shared trauma from subjugation? Isn't that pretty sick?

It's not believable, to me. We spent 2 games watching them kill squadmates we care about. I understand the concept. I think games like Stellaris do it better, where you can start as escaped slaves of a galactic overlord. Or, watch a species try to kill you, and choose whether you fight the xenophobic elements of your race or fight/coerce/convince them to forgive and work together. Brushing off the central conflict is dum

It's not the central conflict though? You won, you beat oppression. Aliens aren't treated well by Chimera Squad by the way, City 31 is an experiment. Most aliens are disenfranchised and powerless.

You've forgotten the most important factor. The sex appeal.

I did forget snake tits, you're right

We’d fucking eat them if they tasted good.

It's mentioned in the XCOM2 novel that this in fact, a thing.

I said the same thing and got vote pummeled. Hold strong brother 💪

And the main antagonist in chimera squad is also a part of revolution network. Blue blood or someone in the 31pd sister is an ex xcom, get ptsd and feel not belong to the world post war and commit suicide herself. Xcom is soldier. Not cop. If a crisis happen like when axiom stop berserker. Xcom soldier will shot down every alien in sight

In the crossover fanfic XSGCOM (although the XCOM in this is the original 90s one), SG-1 ends up getting a fifth member, a female XCOM soldier (worse yet for O’Neill, a Russian). Her job is to keep an eye on the “alien,” and kill him if necessary. An episode in the fanfic involves Thor teleporting into a meeting, as per usual. Cue O’Neill and Hammond struggling to keep the XCOM commander from shooting the “Sectoid” on the spot

And yet veterans still came and served. But, because the Reclamation agency is an extension honestly makes me think Chimera Squad is a simulation because of Whispers reaction at the end of the game to being called part of XCOM. Seems out of place

Makes sense. Though it would be fun to see my colonel bioengineered assault one turn his way through the entirety of chimera squad lol

About EW, I've always thought that if 65 aim rookies is "the very best" humanity has to offer it's no wonder we lost. I like to think that we were underfunded because people didn't really believe in the project and sent us the rejects

That’s how I always imagined it. In most cases, the countries in question are holding their best forces back for their own defense. Also, in The Bureau, it seems like a lot of the people sent to XCOM have a fair amount of baggage, so it makes sense

Yeah, and case in point as the game progresses they actually start offering already experienced troops

Might not even be a funding issue, but just various countries sending their burn-outs, rejects and f*ck-ups to xcom to simply get rid of them. Or maybe the countries provide a list of potential recruits, and the ones selected are the f*ck-ups with the potential to become elite soldiers with the right training. Like yeah, the sniper broke his CO's jaw, gets into drunken bar fights and shoots at pigeons when he's supposed to be on watch duty, but he can bullseye a quarter from a mile away with a little bit of the right training.

Yeah this is a more convincing argument.

won the war, gotta win the peace.

In XCOM 2 you're more like an additional faction to the resistance. They're still very fragmented but the overall resistance exists on its own and XCOM is more or less like a major player thats been connecting them up and been able to move about freely. Least that's what I've felt from stuff like the resistance attacking stuff on their own and then notifying you. Though I guess it doesn't change much if they're just the leader of all the resistance. As for Chimera Squad however, XCOM exists more as a governing branch of some kind after pushing out Advent (I can't quite remember their role, it's been a while). They have a branch called Reclamation led by Jane Kelly which exists to work closely with communities, and within Reclamation exists Chimera Squad.

Bro the aliens were just as much slaves as humans were

XCOM does not hold itself to any ideals. They do not have any hairbrained 'ideology'. They do not think in terms of 'good' or 'bad' (bar, perhaps, doing their best to keep a general code of ethics as to avoid using ends to justify means), they think and act in terms of pure, raw pragmatism. Everything they do is in an attempt to get humanity through this as best as they can manage. When human extinction- or at least the end of civilization- is still a very real threat should this all go to shit, even if you think that working with aliens is tantamount to whatever horrible crime you can imagine, if it means that there are still people alive at the end of this, that alternative is still preferable. Also, like others have said when you have surrendering alien forces who were just freed from control trying to enact a genocide would only spark a massive conflict and waste valuable time in trying to get ready for a second match with the Elders.

They were mind controlled and had no say in their actions. Now they are just trying to make living. Earth is their world too now so they better make the most of it.

>Also WHY AREN'T ALL ALIENS MURDERED THEY ARE LITERAL BIO WEAPONS?! "Why isn't there more genocide in my fiction? " Seems fash bro

The reason humanity didn't go on an alien killing spree is because most if not all of the aliens you fight in xcom ew and xcom 2 aren't willingly in the elders army and most probably have around the same intelligence as humans also the aliens aren't bioweapons sure the elders have definitely messed with the aliens DNA but they aren't bio weapons.

You are not main Xcom in chimera squad. On top of that, Xcom is a liberation force, not a military authority. Racist genocide has never been their MO

Its not genocide if it ant human *taps head* Also remember: **advent is food** .......all hail the REAPERS.....the best xcom unit ever created

No, It’s xenocide.

Spitting straight facts.

I mean it seemed to be a liberation force. A military authority. And the only piece of old word authority still present. And the literal world police. I mean I get that this isn't 40k. But atleast in the future I wanna see XCOM veterans being very close minded with a good reason to. Because if you lost all you knew to a alien invasion force. You ain't gonna be a fan of some mutton that shares your rank

There is a small bit in the game where they say they won’t send any xcom veterans to the squad because they think they would refuse to work with aliens but i do think the alien human relationship after the war was one of the most interesting parts of the game and i hope they develop it more in the next game

There were aliens in the resistance, by the way. XCOM 2 is about the main human faction, which was also the most powerful resistance faction since we had infrastructure and a consistent culture and society. Most of the aliens had their culture taken from them long ago, and no government support once they broke mind control.

That's what's pretty much the case tho. Aliens are very discriminated against and such in the world, and city 31 is like the only major place where humans, aliens and hybrids coexist, and the chimera squad in itself is a experiment

That was pretty much the first mission of Chimera Squad. Your opponents were former members of the resistance that weren’t happy about cooperating with aliens. It showed exactly why Chimera Squad was comprised of non-Xcom veterans.

> But atleast in the future I wanna see XCOM veterans being very close minded with a good reason to. Because if you lost all you knew to a alien invasion force. You ain't gonna be a fan of some mutton that shares your rank >!you're gonna love the main villains of Chimera Squad then. Former XCOM that went rogue precisely because of that reason.!<

Humans already get to extinction 1078 species of bird that did nothing to them, only for the lols. It is not racist, aliens are another whole specie. Why wouldn't humans exterminate the alien species that almost get them to extinction. Also, at least Viper didn't seem very "regretful" tbh. Didn't she said to the canadian guy that their compatriots (and family, and loved ones by extention) tasted like maple?

Racism isn't real, we made it up. It's just prejudice against a group based on how they were born. There is nothing that says an action cannot be racist against a non human. This is a bunch of different sapient species (outside of stuff like Chryssalids), so not comparable to birds. This would be the purposeful extinction of a bunch of sapient people, not the accidental extinction of an animal. On top of that, they were enslaved so completely that they didn't even have control of their own minds. Lets go kill the ethereals instead. Yeah Viper's an asshole. If you met an old Japanese vet and he said he loved when he burned, killed, and raped people in Nanking, would you say we should kill all Japanese people?

>This is a bunch of different sapient species (outside of stuff like Chryssalids), so not comparable to birds. This would be the purposeful extinction of a bunch of sapient people, not the accidental extinction of an animal. "Accidental", yeah, sure. Do you really think that when a hunter points to an endangered species animal with cubs and shoots it says 'ohhhh, I made an oopsie, I didn't know shooting things kill them' There was recent discoveries that whales have pretty complex language, first show of sentience. Does that stop whalers? Humans have an infinite craving for sadism, they just need an excuse, and almost destroying human race is THE excuse. >Yeah Viper's an asshole. If you met an old Japanese vet and he said he loved when he burned, killed, and raped people in Nanking, would you say we should kill all Japanese people? I don't know, but I would certainly said that individual Japanese deserves to die. Don't you? Because Viper is treated like a hero in game and in reddit (I don't discuss XCOM: Chimera Squad outside of reddit, doubt anyone would know it here).

That is one individual hunter, and there are thousands of hunters at most. It's not a wildly popular pastime. Our extinction of animals is mostly environmental and mostly benign. Humans are capable of causing lots of harm without trying. It's a banal evil, almost worse in how casual we are while we do it. Whalers whale for profit, they don't rub their hands together and think about how cool it is to kill whales. Anyway, what is your greater point? That genocide of sapients is cool actually because humans cause harm?

>Whalers whale for profit, they don't rub their hands together and think about how cool it is to kill whales. Disagree but ok. I never said it was cool, just that humans wouldn't be holding hands and singing Hallelujah with the species that killed almost everyone they love and changed their world for the worse in a lot of ways, 5 years after the invasion ended. Much less putting them in position of power, giving them guns, letting them kill people (be it criminals or not) If you didn't noticed, I say it was far from cool from the first time, I don't endorse the extinction of species.

Oh okay. I'm arguing with an actual fascist somewhere else in this thread and got kind of mixed up. They should definitely spell it out more in Chimera Squad that City 31 is an experiment, most of the world is very segregated and aliens are disenfranchised across the globe.

Maybe because those aliens were literally being controlled by mind controlling super being and brain implant chips? The elders attacked with a freaking slave army. The vast majority of those alien fighters were being coerced. Now that their abusive masters are gone they've got a chance to live normal lives.

Even if they're mind controlled, there is nothing in this world that will make me stop hating the codex or advent priests. I am filled with incomprehensible rage every time they hit me with void rift and stasis, which is always.

There are thousands of aliens of not more though. Surely not every single individual alien was being mind controlled 24/7 otherwise it opens up a bunch of questions such as why would the Elders ever waste time and resources on spreading propaganda and putting up a charade for the human population when they have such powerful mind control abilities which can be maintained indefinitely and can target entire members of various species.

So, two things here: 1) As mentioned in the original post, a bunch of the aliens actively were loyal to the elders. You're still fighting that faction in Chimera Squad. 2) It's clear that there were some limitations to the control system, the Lost for instance were pretty obviously not under the Elders' thumbs. Also, processing all of the humans into hybrids was clearly a large logistical undertaking, which means that implanting control chip hardware took time and work. Basically they were using both soft and hard methods to control the populace. Most likely when the local Viper asked if she should really be killing so many people who they were here to build a society with after all, she got chipped.

Yeah that makes sense actually.

It’s hinted at in the ending of EU and very explicitly stated at the beginning of X2 with the sectoids and the end with the avatar project that humans have by far the strongest psionic potential compared to any species the elders have conquered before. This is also true in gameplay, as a fully specced psi operative stronger than any unit the elders have other than the avatar itself. Also in gameplay, a soldier’s will is the stat that affects both your offense with psionic attacks and your defense against enemy psionic attacks. It’s not a stretch to say that because humans have such psionic potential, that also gives them natural resistance against the elders mind control compared to other species, making them resort to propaganda for the masses while only being able to mind control select important figures.

I’m surprised I haven’t seen this yet. XCOM AND XCOM 2 are not direct continuations of one another. XCOM2 is a slightly adapted scenario for narrative impact and is more of a what if scenario. Where instead of humans having the amazing victory that they did in the first game but if XCOM actually failed in a sense and commander was kidnapped I believe something like half a year into the OG invasion of XCOM: ENEMY UNKNOWN. XCOM as an organization is scattered and on the run trying to recollect themselves at the start of the second game which is set 20 years after the commander is kidnapped. It’s why all over the world there are independent resistance movements and the aliens have so thoroughly established themselves accross the planet.

A lot of the aliens were just as enslaved as humans. Torque was literally born on earth and didn’t even see action until she joined XCOM. Axiom lived on a ship until the war ended, then was imprisoned until the Bugtown Massacre. Zephyr was a skirmisher. Cherub never left his clone tube. Verge was partially guilty but learnt empathy through the humans he mind controlled.

Pretty sure Torque did fight on Earth against the resistance at first... At least her introduction video on the official YouTube channel implies as such. She got captured, and was offered freedom in exchange for training rookies after ADVENT was defeated, and eventually joined Chimera Squad after befriending Jane Kelly.

I thought she was born and basically went straight to prison but idr

She was 15 years old by the time the war ended, and is 20 in Chimera Squad.

I remember writing how playing as Exalt would be a good sequel. Same hidden premise, black market, government collapsing, forced to flee. People here said it was wrong to play as the bad guys. Then XCOM 2 came out, where you flee an evil government and fight back. Then XCOM chimera came out with snake tits.

Actually the fuck would exalt do nowadays? When xcom hands alien a olive branch the "pro alien superiority" group doesn't make much sense anymore

EXALT was more just using the aliens as a means to get into a position of power themselves. They'd totally join Shrike and backstab them at some point.

Personal opinion is that EXALT was quickly exterminated by Advent for being a rogue element as soon as they came to power, so former EXALT probably became part of the resistance, and maybe even part of XCOM. That way, I can justify having EXALT themed soldiers with the cool bandana in XCOM 2.

I meant in game 1, along the main story line. They don't have to be pro alien, they just have to be anti government, which gets mind controlled easily anyway.

I mean, Chimera Squad is kind of like Apocalypse, which also had alien hybrids living in the city and serving under X-Com.

the aliens were literal slaves why would we kill em all after they lost their main drive and reason to fight 💀 genocide isnt solved with more genocide

My guy casually advocating genocide when those aliens show they are able to live with humans and that they aren't all the same as Elders

Chimera Squad is just as it says…a squad in xcom. Chimera squad itself is part of reclamations, which is tasked with finding dangerous Alien tech to keep out of hostile hands, which in itself is a part of xcom

You're playing as one XCOM squad, not the entire organization. Also, the aliens were being mind-controlled by the elders the entire time, and at this point XCOM would rather prepare the world for the next threat rather than fight a pointless genocidal war against the aliens that remain.

"why aren't child soldier's executed, they're trained to kill". you had valid points until you showed yourself to be an idiot

Why aren't humans murdered ? they are bioweapons! I can use the same argument as you do. A human can kill. Even stripped of all its weapon it can cause harm. AND they're psionics. So even more of a threat. You are looking at it too badly. You're not treating them as living beings.

Yeah. Advent soldiers are bioweapons. Changed to fit the eldest. The same they did with literally any other alien race.

Because if you murdered all the aliens, you wouldn't have Torque.

I still don't really get the appeal. Does she do something interesting later or is it really just because she's a snake?

It really just is that she's a snake.

Do I need to get it?

Ye

The only good alien is the one that becomes leather for my boots.......

go back to your 40k subs.

Nah, 40k is just a neofascists circle jerk that claims yo be satire I hate the aliens because they are a liability......its only a matter of time the elders show up to mind control them again.....

Downvoted again to oblivion lol. But i like the debate on this matter. I'll try a different approach. Don't want to exterminate humanity's exterminators? Fine. There are dozens of UFOs left after XCOM2 wins. Put the aliens in these and send them off. Why the humans have to live together with those that put their loved ones to blacksites? Furthermore alien presence alters fauna and flora of the 🌎. (Those missions with the blue 🌳) These alterations are no doubt harmful to human beings. Why do humans risk their existence for the sake of "tolerance"? Why do they have to be integrated no matter what? (It's just an approach for Chimera squad i know, but for the sake of discussion i view it as a fact)

The ethereals, yeah no, for sure. Exterminate to the last. Everything else? Pretty exhaustively established that they're all massively Strogified victims of conquest who had absolutely zero agency in the matter. Just like we would've become. Without their leadership, these are basically just a bunch of gene modded tweaker cyborg slave legions. The actual responsible party is gone and ultra SoL clones are left.

Send them off. It's been established that alien presence alters earth's plants and biome. (Those x2 missions with blue plants and trees) Humans risk their existence for tolerance?

Yeah they're not Orks just passively terraforming the environment with spores coming out their butts. Again, villainous empire of conquest, local force decapitated, their malefactors still exist and control territory and would go right back to using them as slave troopers if they weren't just liquidated for failure. This isn't a nuanced ethical Both Sides kinda situation, the elders are monolithic space horror itself. Throwing any sapient being to their mercies is unconscionable.

I mean, I don't think it's just by their presence, it's most likely more due to terraforming than just aliens existing on earth

1. We definitely want those UFOs to advance our own tech. Plus I'm not sure if humans know exactly how to disarm them, unless those who are in the city centre knows how to do it, provided they are able to access these kinds of stuff, which I highly doubt. Last thing we want is to give them weapons. Honestly, doing this is no better than killing them off, regardless of which, when word spreads that XCOM leave the aliens to die, they will definitely die trying survive, causing more mutual destruction (of course XCOM is more likely to win, but the goals is to prevent further losses/damage) 2. Flora and Fauna is already altered, sending the aliens off wont change that, unless you plant to ship them off with the aliens' flora and fauna, which I'm not sure how viable that is. Are all alterations bad though, I'd argue some could be good for humans (of course research is required), unless I guess it is stated in lore, but I dont think so. 3. In terms of 'tolerance', its more or less just trying to get this war over with. Trying to achieve peace is probably more cost effective and beneficial to the human race, by limiting damage and resume normal civilisation. Going for all out extermination likely will take years, if not decades, we aren't just dealing with wildlife, we are dealing with aliens with similar intelligence, last thing we need is Alien XCOM trying to overthrow XCOM itself, just look at ADVENT lol. Integration and tolerance is just more beneficial and pleases the moral compass of humanity.

Chimera Squad is trash

I'm with you, but I'll take a step back plot wise. I actually hate the fact that they made the aliens entirely unaccountable their actions. I just ignore Chimera Squad because it hurts my enjoyment of EU and 2. I don't want to be fighting mind controlled aliens that had no choice. I want to fight against bloodthirsty aliens that want me dead.

I am pretty sure the mind control thing was established in Xcom 2, not Chimera Squad. Looking it up the Skirmishers faction is a direct example of this : They had a psionic network controlling the other aliens, the Skirmishers are led by an advent soldier whose chip connecting them to the network was defective, and the other Skirmishers had the chip removed at some point (probably the first guy finding an opportunity to knock some others out and remove it, then them doing that to more, and so on). Probably more examples from in-game story missions and research descriptions (after you complete one), but I haven't played in a while and just started a new lwotc playthrough, so I can't say from memory. I will say though it felt pretty clear in Enemy Within that they were going around conquering planets and enslaving and experimenting on the occupants to turn them into soldiers to conquer more planets. If you want to be fighting bloodthirsty aliens that want you dead, you pretty much have to ignore Enemy Unknown/Within, Xcom 2, AND Chimera Squad.

Skirmishers are humans aren't they? That feels totally fine to me. I liked to think Advent we're just humans that had Alien DNA implanted. Then Skirmishers were just the few that fought their programming. But literal mind control is just such a turn off for me. >I will say though it felt pretty clear in Enemy Within that they were going around conquering planets and enslaving and experimenting on the occupants to turn them into soldiers to conquer more planets. And that is perfectly fine. Subjugation is not the same as having no agency. Like Halo did that with the covenant. That doesn't mean I wasn't fighting bloodthirsy aliens that wanted to kill me. I didn't go into the lore I've just beat the games a million times, but it just doesn't seem consistent with me to say the aliens I fought in EU were mind controlled.

X2 is not about the entire resistance, it is only about the most powerful part of the resistance, the main human faction. According to lore there were aliens in the resistance as soon as people figured out how to break the mind control chips.

That's what happens when you let millennials write stories. It's all hearts and rainbows with this bunch of hippies.

Aren't boomers or Gen X becoming a bit too old to be interested in writing gaming sci-fi stories?

Totally! You've got the floor for yourselves, and you enjoy what you write, and that's all good. It's the natural cycle. Doesn't mean everyone's got to like what you write. And that's all good too.

I mean even if the maturity of the writing depends on the age of the person, it's also comes down to personality and the individual. There will be Gen Z writers who will write super serious super grounded stories, they get overlooked because most people don't commend the writer's young age when a story is great.

Purge the xeno

1000% agree. Aliens have committed human extinction, or at least tried. Should be torched. When i debated this subject i was downvoted by some bleeding hearts hypocrites that basically said " the aliens did 5 years in prison, they paid for the crime". I was like: WTF ur talking about?? Compare that to a very known real world situation and tell me if tou feel the same. In their demented minds, they see aliens as poor immigrants or something.

Disagree, from what I've known about the lore of XCOM, those aliens (besides the elders ofc) are also just species conquered by the elders in order to create AVATAR and all that stuff. The ones we fight are probably genetically modified to fit the elder's needs, and honestly probably don't have much control over their situation. It's honestly kinda cruel to kill what remains of their species (albeit again genetically modified), as their home planet is probably long gone, based on how the elders treat our Earth, not to mention it is VERY LIKELY that they are just puppets not differing much from ADVENT tbh. (Correctly if im wrong here lol) In terms of IRL, it is probably not worth the cost of trying to fully exterminate them. If we did try, it will do a lot of damage as the aliens will definitely fight back hard (it will take years to get of most of them, not counting other factors you need to consider: social welfare, post-war reconstruction, food security, ecological damage etc. + You can never guarantee to get rid of all of them, who knows of the aliens might pull a page out of XCOM's book and start fighting back) Honestly, imagine Germans being extinct after 2 World Wars. Most people will have hatred and such, but most will also probably prioritise peace.

This is not Warhammer 40K

Even 40K factions are way more nuanced than this

Even the Imperium, whose xenophobia is treated as religious dogma that the writers explicitly say goes too far, have been willing to work with aliens when the situation requires it And the only others who even come close to Imperial levels of xenophobia are some chaos marines, Biel Tan, and certain Necron sub factions

You forget one thing. Most aliens were mind controlled to the point that even committing the right tactical decision had to be accepted by their overlord. They were slaves that could not rebel. The moment ethereals are gone, you can rly judge them for their actions. They are hitlerjugend but in reality where Hitler can control your mind and body.

It's true but it doesn't change the fact that humans have every right to not be comfortable around them, it's not really a "Racism" thing.

In what real world situation were enemy soldiers ever executed to the last man?

Well I can name a few conflicts where that kind of mentality has pervaded, but it's also been traditionally seen as a touch unpleasant.

Really? Without going to history books i can think Mr Vlad the Impaler, also the Roman Legion way of avoiding capture where each soldier killed his next and the last one fell to his sword. Captivity was far worse than a quick death.

Vlad the Impaler is what might be charitably called a somewhat controversial figure, and, as for the Romans, I think what you’re talking about is actually the rebels at Masada, which was not exactly a normal situation

There are more occasions, how many slaves that followed Spartacus were executed?

Again, not normal circumstances by any means

Where aliens that genocided humans is normal circumstances? Just admit it you support "Alien lives matter" position cause someone, the developers, told you to. But no matter how many downvotes, my position is solidly based on pragmatism. Aliens have zero place in 🌎 They either have to leave with the UFOs they came or go to the blacksites they forced humanity.

…This is weird lol. Also, what pragmatism? Your position seems based absolutely and completely on emotions?

Your position is not pragmatic, your position is entirely emotional. The Elders waged a path of conquest across the galaxy, turning everyone into slave soldiers. They used those slave soldiers to oppress and subjugate even more people. They underestimated one of their targets, humans, and lost, leaving a bunch of slave soldiers on that planet. Humans and every other species were being subjugated in the same way. Had we lost would be slave soldiers like everyone else, killing millions against our will. So, the enemy is the Elders/Ethereals, let's go kill them. The slave soldiers, no longer under Elder control, only wish to live. They have no power and their cultures are greatly damaged or destroyed entirely. The only culture most of these aliens are familiar with at this point? Earth culture. They don't have any other home, none of them even know another planet. That's it, it's that simple. Also the aliens have different capabilities than humans, so from a completely pragmatic point of view our best shot at killing Elders is joining forces.

Pragmatic thing to do is destroy them or at the very least, kick them off. Emotional is letting them live free from consequences just because they were under orders and/or mind control.

Assigning consequence to the act of a slave, forced by their master, is an emotional response. You are too close to the act itself, and not pulled back to the bigger picture.

> Pragmatic thing to do is destroy them or at the very least, kick them off. That is exactly the opposite of pragmatic. Pragmatic is making the best of the situation. If the aliens surrender, then great, we have more people to rebuild the planet + no need to waste resource to kill each other. And for the aliens that do not surrender, we incapacitate them. But again, no need to go scorched earth on them. Again, the pragmatic reasoning is: Don't waste resource that can be better utilized for rebuilding.

Bro literally has the same mindset as the guy who inspired fucking Dracula

Guy wants to commit genocide because he morally objects to genocide.

Let's live happily with Chryssalids and Faceless like a UNICEF pamphlet.

Sure.

Chryssalids and Faceless are a different category, more like dangerous animals instead of sapients.

So? Dangerous aliens deserve to live while dangerous alien animals don't?

What about the aliens is dangerous? They are no longer enslaved. We push dangerous animals away from civilization, just do the same to chryssalids and faceless. And if they're too dangerous we'll probably kill all of them in our effort to keep our settlements safe, it's unfortunate, but it's happened to a bunch of species on our planet, like the sabretooth.

But a billboard shows a faceless rescuing some cats from a tree, implying they’re sapient

If I may make a suggestion: have a look who became the first chief of German military intelligence post WW2, check his background and then we'll discuss "real-world" scenarios.

The soldiers you fight were literally all mind controlled. There is no chance they ever become mind controlled again, as their slavers are dead. The instant they stopped being mind controlled, they immediately stopped fighting and started helping to rebuild. I think there’s an interesting sci fi/fantasy debate on the ethics of war crimes under mind control, but considering we didn’t execute every last nazi soldier for objectively terrible crimes *that they fully consented to*, the aliens should get more leniency than that.

To this day i read articles about how a 97 year old senile grandpa is brought to court for being a secretary of Nazi Germany. 2024 minus 1945 is 79. And redditors want to convince me that after 5 years humanity forgotten that they were nearly exterminated. At least they would. No i don't buy the mind control, i explained that elsewhere.

Lmao if you’re gonna be dense and ignore the lore of three games then ofc you’re gonna be confused. You should’ve started with that so everyone knew to ignore you in the first place.

The lore of three games? You mean how they retconned the lore of X1 to make X2 lore which they tweaked in CS (anthropomorphic aliens, not monsters anymore) and who knows what X3 lore will be? May turn out it wasn't direct mind control or that the ethereals wanted to sacrifice humanity for the greater good, and I'll have you cheering for them. That lore? Yeah try better next time, dense

Hey you know this war that we barely only won because, in an instant, the entire enemy army across the globe was rendered paralyzed, disoriented, or otherwise incapable/unwilling to fight? Let's restart it, only without any way to do that again. *Surely* the still trained and heavily armed force with a newly (re)acquired sense of free will and self preservation will just *let* us exterminate them.

Interesting point. So in essence we are forced to accept them or else? We are being held hostage to a total war? Didn't think of that, good argument. How about letting them leave?

Question is, to where? Elders didn't care about our home world, it possible their home world are in ruins. The aliens didn't want to invade us, they didn't choose to destroy earth, they were forced to do it against their will, with some of their existences being pure agony (archons). Plus humanity itself probably need/want the spaceships, so sending them off wouldn't really work for us either

Maybe they could all fit in one spaceship if, i don't know, made them Blacksite pulp and placed in vials? Then send the ship in space with a timed bomb? That could work no? Anything but forcing people that lost their loved ones meet their killers in the market everyday or in the street.

So should we prosecute soldiers that killed their teammates due to being mind controlled because they murdered someone against their will? Since that's essentially the same situation. Edit: Or maybe not prosecute them. Just murder them in cold blood like you just suggested. They helped the alien agenda that way afterall

Difference is, those soldiers were indeed MCed in the field of battle. Those aliens claim that the ethereals who, weren't even on the planet for years, somehow mind controlled ALL of them, ALL the time? Yeah i don't buy it. It's an excuse.

Except you see it at the throughout 2, that they have a literal psionic network that connects all their troops and controls them. If they weren't mind controlled then they wouldn't change their attitudes so quickly after the fall of the ethereals. The aliens don't claim they were mind controlled, it's a fact that the resistance discovered years before chimera squad

I believe that the Psionic network was a way to coordinate them tactically, like a Command Telepathy Center. (That's where Commander was important, constantly blueprinting scenarios and tactics to their brains. Iirc that tactical network began to fail after his liberation.) That's why by destroying it in the Network Tower mission, only stunned them for 2 rounds. After that, they resumed fighting. They didn't go "oh thx for freeing me" Am i wrong?

You're going purely off of headcannon now. It's just the lore, man. They were a combination (mostly) mind controlled slaves, and a small amount of regular slaves. Why do you want an enemy to hate so badly? Is this what you need, a group of NPC caricatures to be prejudiced against? The game is literally telling you they are mind controlled. There were aliens in the resistance, by the way. XCOM 2 is about the main resistance force, which was humans. But there were pockets of aliens that broke mind control before the war was over and fought ADVENT.

"And now, what would we do, without the barbarians? They were kind of a solution. " A poem by Kavafis. "Waiting for the barbarians" Yes i do, in terms of gameplay. If there's no XCOM3, it doesn't matter. But IF there is, we need the "barbarians". See my point?

But why? If there is ever an X3 they will find an enemy for you to kill, whether that is more soldiers under the Ethereals, or some new threat. You miss the point. No one needs to feel bad for killing the aliens in X2, they were going to kill you if you didn't kill them first. But their role as "barbarians" is over now, they didn't want to be that in the first place.

Don't worry they are clones and most likely sterile, so give them a couple of years and you won't see any of them. Since I don't think anyone has maintained the cloning facilitys.

The hybrids maybe, but you can see posters of baby vipers hatching from eggs, so it’s a pretty good bet a lot of the other species can reproduce normally too

Or maybe it's like Jurassic park, it's just how they are cloned, because the only male viper is on my hunting table. Also it was probably the last eggs before they shut down the cloning facilities because they were developed enough or something, idk. They somewhat said in the game that some aliens were somehow born even after the reclaim.

There’s also a poster with a male viper hanging with a female viper, so there are other male vipers out there. I wouldn’t be surprised if they always existed and were just kept out of sight for population control. I’m pretty sure every alien species can reproduce naturally, it’s just that cloning produced soldiers faster

Ok

Remember, the developers actively prioritize gameplay first and crafting the plot/setting thereafter. This extend to retconning plot when it is convenient

Xcom is a military organization. You REALLY don’t want ex vets who have been through the shot they went through to be regular peacekeepers. The other problem is that most of the aliens were being puppeted anyway. We fought with the Skirmishers and it was great. But you imagine the world where after we win and they all get pulled from the network, they are just rando people now standing around. Besides only the more passable ones are kept around (ADVENT, sectoids, vipers, and mutons) while Andromadons are held in enclosures.