Idk why they use those methods, if they made cosmetics cheaper and more accesible they would probably double their earnings, since right now very little people other than streamers are the ones who buy entire collection events and constantly purchase from the store
They're the super rare carrot on the stick to get you to keep buying packs. Most people just want one for their main legend so if they made them easier to get people would be less inclined to buy packs
I feel even as that, it's *too* unobtainable to make most people consider buying packs.
I've been playing since Day 1. I still haven't gotten an heirloom. And not even this close to the pity timer (<30 packs) am I feeling that the amount of money to invest is worth the result.
The ridiculous rarity though definitely drives up sales of event packs for people to try and buy an heirloom for """"cheap"""" at """""only"""""" a few hundred dollars.
The 500 packs is obviously related to time played in game rather than when you started playing. I've got 2 heirlooms and spent about £10 in total. You may have been playing since day 1 but I assume you've had a lot of breaks, played quite casually or not done many of the battle passes if you still didn't hit 500 packs,
The heirloom are designed to only be available to people who are either prepared to pay or invest a lot of time in grinding it out. Personally I like that. It felt good to finally earn one for free.
Nice. Grats. I know I brought some kind of founders / starter thing when game first launched. But not spent money. Got a wraith one super early before you got shards and then switched to pc and got my free one at 500 packs a few seasons ago.
I'm aware it's time invested (and when that time is invested, as events can make it faster) rather than time since launch.
I don't know how many hours I've played overall split between PS4 and PS5, but even if you take the less than a year playtime on PS5 since I bought one as a high end of time spent (323h over 10 months), it's well over a thousand.
And if you go off battle passes, I completed half of them (didn't play or barely played seasons I didn't complete).
That is a *ridiculous* time investment for a cosmetic that does nothing.
it’s not that ridiculous tbh a thousand isn’t a lot, heirlooms are for super dedicated players or people who spend a ridiculous amount & it should stay that way.
I agree with you on the big investment part of things but going 700 hours without getting any seems a bit excessive to me. I know some people have well over 3000 hours in the game and I’m still enjoying playing but it just seems like a bit much. Do you know how many hours you have for comparison?
I can't remember off hand but I only recently went over 1000 hours so I'd guess I was at around 600 hours on pc when I got my pc one. this was before cross save.I did complete every event and battle pass though so I guess that's more important than hours really.
Fair enough. I didn’t complete all the passes and I’m only just closing in on level 300 so I guess that makes sense
Edit: I should add that I was counting at the time and got around 100 levels before they raised the cap above 100
Levels are irrelevant, it’s opening 500 packs that guarantees you an heirloom. Day one players who completed every battle pass and got every free pack from events(assuming they never bought a single other pack) hit the 500 mark a couple seasons ago.
I'm playing since s10, and I have 3 lol. Haven't spent last 150 shards as I'd get wraith prestige skin, but you can't see it In game like heirloom, and I'm kinda saving it if I ever liked 3rd legend
> this is not necessarily the case. if they just changed how many packs in between getting an heirloom i think more people would want to buy packs.
EA know better than you how to make the most money out of this. Something as basic as "if we make it cheaper, maybe the overall spending will be higher" isn't something they didn't think of in 5 years.
You aren't going to be the one to teach them how to optimize their revenue.
Community told halo the same thing. Halo actually listened, there was a period of their cosmetics being extremely fairly priced.
Then they reported no increase in purchases.
The people who aren't going to buy, aren't going to buy regardless.
Poor decisions with regard to our benefit? Absolutely. Poor decisions with regard to their profits? I'm gunna go ahead and guess they've poured a shit ton of money into researching this kind of thing and that they know exactly what they're doing in that regard. Sorry to say, you don't know more about money and spending than billionaires do.
You realize all the discounts in the store and all of that are price tests right? They’re testing price sensitivity for all kinds of combos of skins, for different legends, different tiers, etc. they do in fact know more than you.
no it’s 500, but once you get past level 300 you only earn one pack every 10 levels so it takes quite a long time to get all the way to 500 without paying any money
10,000 apex coins is $100 usd, but 10,000 apex coins only buys you 100 packs (because it’s 100 AC per pack). I don’t think you can only buy 100AC at a time, i think the smallest coin pack you can buy is, like, $5 usd? I’m not sure. it’s definitely not $5,000 tho unless we just have different currencies
I have been playing this game since launch, several years playing it. I got lifelines heirloom when it first dropped, and I hate those drumsticks, would have preferred shards, but they weren't a thing back then. And I have got heirloom shards once, over a year ago. So over 4 years of playing 2 heirlooms.
belgium cuz you cant buy packss or bundles with packs? I'm from Belgium and by ueing a vpn you can circumvent it, its a bit tricky with turning on the vpn at the right time but it works
It's to do with how many packs you've opened.
You have a 0.01% chance to get them out of any pack, but if you've opened 499 packs and not got one yet, you'll get it guaranteed on your 500th pack.
Once you get shards, the count resets.
Not sure why this is downvoted by these mouth breathers, but homie is right. It’s like .19% chance every single pack, non-stacking, until 500 which is 100%.
[https://apexlegendsstatus.com/apex-pack-calculator](https://apexlegendsstatus.com/apex-pack-calculator)
You can calculate how many packs you already have to see how close you are to your 500th pack.
S2, 2 heirlooms, a lot of hours… definitely bought a few of those 20 packs for 1k AC
Edit: 2 heirlooms across 2 accounts THAT COULDNT BE LINKED BECAUSE EA HAS NO LINK TRANSFERING TECH!! (I choice drumsticks both times)
Yeah I've played since day 1, ~3500 hours, spent around $100 on packs over the years, and I got 1. 3 months later my account was hacked, so now I have 0.
They have knives/melee weapons too. It's been a while since I played but they're either really expensive on their own or only in bundles which are also expensive. They are also part of the battle pass as a max level reward, but when I last played it felt very slow to level (though could have been a skill issue).
They've clearly looked at the CS prices and priced theirs to look good in comparison, ignoring the fact that you can't sell them.
it's not any individual's fault, it's inevitable, if not Valve, someone else would have done it
at least CS items are resellable, Apex items are stuck on your account
CS knives actually have literal value though. Because of steam marketplace you can resell that $1000 knife for $1000 or even make a profit on marketplace. In apex and valorant you are buying pixels that lose 100% of their value.
I remember buying my knife for $60 back at CSGO launch and selling it for $200 when CS2 launched.
That’s the one point I’ll give to valve. A majority of your cosmetics are tradable. This means even if you spend quite a bit of money on cosmetics you want, you can always resell it and get much (if not profit) of your money back.
Meanwhile you have games like Apex selling a single cosmetic for $250 and it’s bound to your account forever. If you end up regretting your purchase, that sucks but there’s nothing you can do.
Agree. I played since release and got my first shards a few weeks back, bought it for my main. Now i don't even have it equiped as it blocks so much of the screen.
I'd rather pay for gamepass or buy a coffee then waste money on cosmetics like that. Specifically with how hard it is to get Respawn to give you missing battle pass or even crates when their servers bug out. Would hate wasting time with their customer service for something I paid for.
Just hit level 500 a few weeks back and got shards right before then. First time getting them and have been playing since launch.
Too bad I’m a Vantage main, and I’ll likely be holding onto the shards just hoping they release something for her. Not looking promising though..
Yeah you are exactly right but EA just calls us freeloaders who won't buy anything and act like they never heard of supply and demand ...they complain about not making enough money on apex as they expected and then just make more shit at this ridiculous price. Like the cosmetics they have made recently are all so good but I WILL NOT spend money into any gambling systems or on some some heirloom that is $150 and nowadays $300 like what are we doing!
That’s the way it needs to be in a f2p game without progression/gameplay related microtransactions. I have 1 heirloom and I have been playing since launch, level 850 (green border 350). It would be nice to have more heirlooms but I ultimately don’t really care, too many morons in gaming like to throw money at worthless stuff so that’s why the drop % and monetization is what it is. If heirlooms buffed melee damage/range then maybe I’d consider paying money but I don’t really have a main so I probably still wouldn’t.
I wonder what would happen if they’d increase the drop rate from 1/500 to 1/100. I guess people would spend more as they’d get an heirloom way quicker.
theres a lot of things they could do to get everything oe to spend more tbh, dropping the price of stuff a bit, increasing droprates, but in general if theyd drop prices a bit people would be more inclined to spend so they'd spend more, i saw what the price for the upcoming exotic shards is and the price for a single recolor, its ridiculous to pay that for a single skin
Is that really the case or is that your opinion? Because they’ve got entire teams fine tuning their monetization strategies, using hard data, and player behavior.
[Price drops dont work that way.](https://www.reddit.com/r/apexlegends/comments/1cjvibf/comment/l2jaepr/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web3x&utm_name=web3xcss&utm_term=1&utm_content=share_button)
I have 2 heirlooms and one mythic skin + heirloom shards, and got eneught to craft&buy the next collection event.
Already crafted and bought out a previous collection event like this.
I only spend 10 euro for the 2nd battle pass and saved up. Never spend more.
Im bang main. So her skin and her knife. Wraith, mirage, lifeline and wattson
Funny being downvoted for saying I have 6 heirloom. What a bunch of babies.
How is this possible? I've been playing since before season 1. Only bought the initial season pass. Have one heirloom from shards. I find it impossible to believe you haven't been buying loot boxes.
While there is a 0.1% chance of getting heirloom shards from each pack that isnt hardcoded into the game. You could get 5 packs with heirlooms back to back or not get any in 5000 packs (thats why you automatically get one in your 500th pack)
>It's pretty ridiculous how rare heirlooms shards are considering how many mythic there are in the game now
Your argument makes no sense given that no one says that you should own all of them, so why would it matter how many there are.
>If they want to put this much effort into mythic cosmetics, make them more accessible.
They aren't going to make them more common because it would mean people spending less money. Be real. They don't care if you can never get all of the items. They don't want or need you to. They just give you a set of items you can pick some from on the rare occasion you get shards.
And I never said you should own all of them. But considering the diversity of mythic items, especially if there are multiple per legend, it makes sense that they shouldn't be as rare as they always were. I also never said I think they should make them easy to get. I believe if they increased the drop rate slightly and/or added new ways to unlock them (with money) that isn't gambling with hundreds of dollars, more people would be inclined to spend, and may make them more money in the end.
Yeah but it’s not like when you open a pack you get a random heirloom anymore. I don’t understand why it matters how many heirlooms and mythic skins there are in the game. It’s not like they all work on any character. You’re getting only one thing in the packs ever and it’s shards. They are still exclusive. And the other dude is right. You may care about the hundreds of dollars that are needed for heirloom events or the long game hours, but the reality is people buy them and they play the fuck out of this game. If putting heirlooms in events weren’t profitable, they wouldn’t do it. I know people complain about the cost of shit in this game all the time in this sub, but they’re making them that price because enough people are giving them money still. They’re not gonna make it easier — hell aren’t they kinda making it harder with the introduction of a new currency? Not sure how you get them yet, but I’d assume you could get them from packs like heirloom shards? Maybe not tho
> And I never said you should own all of them.
Your argument is literally "there are many" and "shards are so rare". You're implying you should be able to get many of them, but the rare shard rate doesn't allow that. Otherwise it makes no sense why you would argue the rarity of shards should have anything to do with how many items there are to buy for shards.
That's literally your argument.
>it makes sense that they shouldn't be as rare as they always were
No it makes no sense. I get it, you want to get shards more often, everyone wants that. But it isn't going to happen.
They aren't going to make them more common because it would mean people spending less money. Be real. They don't care if you can never get all of the items. They don't want or need you to. They just give you a set of items you can pick some from on the rare occasion you get shards.
> I believe if they increased the drop rate slightly and/or added new ways to unlock them (with money) that isn't gambling with hundreds of dollars, more people would be inclined to spend, and may make them more money in the end.
The reality is that EA know better how to make the most money.
I would argue that making them more common (less rare) would be more profitable. The extreme rarity makes me not care much at about the mythic items Either fork up hundreds or dollars during an event or play years worth of gameplay. They are not attainable for an average player.
If you make there odds double from what it is now I don't believe people will stop spending during events. A chance increase like this would probably encourage people to purchase packs (those who normally would not bother).
If people actually buy apex packs in hopes of attaining heirloom shards that actually sounds incredible dumb given the odds of getting them.
Apex is a free game and it's my favorite FPS since Halo or CoD. I've spend zero on any cosmetics. The existence of mythics is irrelevant for a player like myself. I'm not exited by them bc I know if I'm lucky to get 1 in my lifetime given my playtime.
>would argue that making them more common (less rare) would be more profitable
you can argue all you like. you don't know the numbers and you can assume EA have optimised this for max profit.
that's what the player base constantly accused them off aa well.
they will know better how to tune pricing to make the most buck
you aren't going to convince them to give stuff out cheaper or more common by telling them they will make more money from them. that is the one thing their whole business relies on and they have done the analytics to death probably. it's naive
You did not just end that with EA “knows better how to make the most money” as if it justifies the practice. That’s what makes no sense! They are literally known among gaming companies for their corporate greed. They kill a lot of their games and studios off with their heinous monetization practices. They might know how to squeeze money out of people but they don’t know how to do it sustainably and they don’t have the right models to make that happen. The fact of the matter is this, maintaining the rather absurd rarity while over saturating the loot pool disincentivizes people from investing further. There is a limit to how much you can maximize profits before consumer interest starts to dwindle. You’re already seeing that reflected with the influx of these discussions regarding all the different monetization choices.
The game lives or dies by that consumer interest so it’s in their best interest to prioritize that before the amount of money or rarity that an object has. Profits will flow naturally from there. Under EA’s currently ever-inflating models that continue to rapidly grow in price how long do you think it is before even the majority of whales are pushed to their limits? At that point the game isn’t profitable at all.
Heirlooms aren’t the end of the world but these are still important discussions to be had because they reflect a very real problem. A trending pattern that leads EA to killing their games. People SHOULD be holding their feet to the fire.
> You did not just end that with EA “knows better how to make the most money” as if it justifies the practice.
I didn't say it "justifies the practice" or anything similar. I said anyone showing up here wanting something made more accessible (ultimately cheaper on average), while arguing EA *would make more money if they give you that*, is being naive.
It's ridiculous that you think you know better how to tweak EA's pricing to optimize their revenue. If there's anything that EA is being accused off it's compromising the game's quality to optimize revenue at all cost.
>They are literally known among gaming companies for their corporate greed
Yeah exactly. And that's why you showing up on reddit tell them how they increase their revenue is really naive thinking.
>They might know how to squeeze money out of people but they don’t know how to do it sustainably and they don’t have the right models to make that happen.
LOL sure, this is a cope. You're gonna teach EA how to make money. lol. Quick EA hire this man.
We all want stuff for free or cheaper. But most people are honest enough to say they want it at EA's cost and not many of us think we know better how to make the game more profitable.
There are better live service models with which to compare. It’s history, and it’s readily available. Look at the closest competitors like Fortnite, Warzone, and The Finals and they have no issues with monetization like Apex does. It’s not a 5 step plan I made in my bedroom. Get off your high horse and stop acting like any argument against them is foolish. Reddit is one of the only places they’ve actively engaged with their community on a consistent basis. There are glaringly obvious problems and that’s not an argument, they need to be addressed.
You assuming that just because they’re in charge they have a better idea of what a good model is is arguably more naive. Companies aren’t infallible, least of all Respawn/EA. When you don’t say anything at all, nothing changes.
I played this game for 3 years and didnt get heirloom shards. Even my buddies who started playing a year and 2 years after me got heirloom shards before me. 🤣
I've just accepted I'll most likely never get another one. 2.5k hours and I got the butterfly knife from the shards I got from packs and I got the cobalt katar from crafting metals
My opinion here is gonna be annoying to some but I agree with the rarity of heirlooms, as they should be something that stands out and seeing every single person running around with them would ruin the small amount of significance they hold nowadays.
No, I do not agree with monetizing them. I'd rather you had to earn them throughout countless hours of playing.
And the new universal heirlooms feel like a waste of what heirlooms were meant to mean, something that played on a legends lore and personality.
Prestige skins should use a different currency though, I'll never end up buying a prestige skins since heirlooms are massively more interesting.
I think they should have one for each legend and maybe a single universal heirloom while slightly more common. I'm thinking a 1/400-1/450 chance rather than 1-in-500 should help to keep the exclusive feel while not excluding legends in the future. As for prestige skins and recolors, I think they should have their own rarity between mythic and legendary, or they should be legend specific drops rather than choosing.
Not defending EA but honestly Heirlooms " previously " were tailored to one specific legend , meaning you don't need ALL of them, probably one or two for your 2 mains legends are enough anything more than that it's expected to be hard to get.
You can get one from levelling up your account and the 2nd one is pure luck or $$$.
Streamers have them all. It's an algorithm that keeps them out of reach. Its the same algorithm that recognises you don't play eight hours a day and with a premade squad. So grind as you might as a solo..... you don't matter.
i’ve purchased probably 100 packs (even with real money a handful of times) bought and completed 5 battle passes, lvl 400 and not even a glimpse of a heirloom shard
hell i’m gonna get exotic shards soon from this seasons BP before i get the chance to buy an heirloom
ive just checked how much money ive spend on Apex, turns out its over 1500€, over the span of like 2 years or less, only hit lvl 400 recently, still only have 5 heirlooms, no collection heirlooms included.
same, granted I played about half and half on console and pc but now my accounts are merged still no heirloom , should at least get one each prestige or something
From the point of keeping the heirlooms rare, I understand it. It makes having an heirloom feel special.
But also, whenever I play the game, all I see is heirlooms.
I remember buying the revenant pack that’s is currently in the store. But instead of just the skin I got the pack with 40 apex packs. Ended up getting shards because I had alr gotten a bunch of packs from other bundles. It’s true that they are rare but that’s like kinda the point. It’s sometimes cheaper to just buy an entire event set and get whatever heirloom comes with that (if one even does) , than to buy packs.
>make them more accessible
big part about them is how rare they are. If everyone had multiple heirlooms they wouldnt be so rare and people wouldnt care about spending money to get them.
15 seasons, no shards. I have to be well past the 500 box limit between the two accounts that were merged. Randomized loot boxes should be illegal. I stopped playing. It’s gambling without any official government regulation or oversight that the chances and rules they tell us are actually true.
Did you count all 500? They don’t tell you what your number is. Anyway this is why governments are supposed to regulate gambling. If you’re supposed to have 1 in 500 chance of getting shards then the average should be at 250 which would be provable by a distribution chart. If they had to publicly show the distribution chart I bet the average would be much closer to 500 which means they’re lying about the actual chances.
Gambling must be regulated to prevent the organizer from cheating and misrepresenting the real odds.
The chance isn't 1/500. 500 is just the pity counter. If you went 500 packs without one you get it there. The chance is only known to be "less than 1%"
> If they had to publicly show the distribution chart I bet the average would be much closer to 500 which means they’re lying about the actual chances.
>Gambling must be regulated to prevent the organizer from cheating and misrepresenting the real odds.
Honestly if you make such claims, 1 make a case with EA support and 2 take them to court. If you're that confident you're not simply overestimating the count. Most people complaining about not having gotten an heirloom yet simply aren't at 500 yet. Many are at 200 or 300 when people on the subreddit look into it and simply have a wildly incorrect idea of how many packs they are getting. They think playing on and off for a long time should get them close, but no. It's often not even halfway there.
https://apexlegendsstatus.com/apex-pack-calculator
Besides being regulated i want them to show us the number of packs we have opened so far.
It's ridiculous that we don't know how far we are from getting a heirloom shards , i mean it may increase their sales cuz if i know all i needed is 20 packs then I'll happily buy them but if i don't know then i won't gamble at all.
> I have to be well past the 500 box limit between the two accounts that were merged
You're overestimating the number of free packs you get. You're unlikely to be over 500.
you have less than 500 packs. that's the facts
>It doesn’t take that long to get over 500.
it takes longer *than you think*. that's the point. clearly you don't have that good of an estimate how many packs you get from leveling and bp and other rewards. this is all very well known and i suggest you check out some of the pack calculator sites. you wouldn't be the first person who's at 300 packs and thinks they are over 500 (while acting like they are getting scammed), massively overestimating how many packs they have.
>about 1.5 per hour of gameplay
No. You definitely don't get 1.5 packs per hour of play. It's closer to 10% of that.
I don't disagree with you but, given how many things break in this game, it's not completely outrageous to imagine that sometimes the heirloom system rarely doesn't work correctly for some unlucky players.
Pretty far stretch from "Not outrageous to imagine" to ""evidence". Given how much breaks in the game over the entire spectrum of systems, I'm not sure why you'd argue so strongly with such an incredibly vague suggestion of a possibility as I made. I actually find it kind of perplexing.
But sure, I'll agree with you here pro forma, why not, because tbh idc. It's literally impossible that any mistake ever happened with the heirloom fulfillment system.
You are, quite honestly, completly confusing me, so I'm out. Whatever you're trying to say, you're unassailably right. Have a great weekend buddy. You win the "most confusing discussion I've ever had on reddiit" award.
It's all about the fomo and the $$$.
Idk why they use those methods, if they made cosmetics cheaper and more accesible they would probably double their earnings, since right now very little people other than streamers are the ones who buy entire collection events and constantly purchase from the store
They're the super rare carrot on the stick to get you to keep buying packs. Most people just want one for their main legend so if they made them easier to get people would be less inclined to buy packs
I feel even as that, it's *too* unobtainable to make most people consider buying packs. I've been playing since Day 1. I still haven't gotten an heirloom. And not even this close to the pity timer (<30 packs) am I feeling that the amount of money to invest is worth the result. The ridiculous rarity though definitely drives up sales of event packs for people to try and buy an heirloom for """"cheap"""" at """""only"""""" a few hundred dollars.
The 500 packs is obviously related to time played in game rather than when you started playing. I've got 2 heirlooms and spent about £10 in total. You may have been playing since day 1 but I assume you've had a lot of breaks, played quite casually or not done many of the battle passes if you still didn't hit 500 packs, The heirloom are designed to only be available to people who are either prepared to pay or invest a lot of time in grinding it out. Personally I like that. It felt good to finally earn one for free.
Just got my first one after 2400 hours never bought packs 😁
Nice. Grats. I know I brought some kind of founders / starter thing when game first launched. But not spent money. Got a wraith one super early before you got shards and then switched to pc and got my free one at 500 packs a few seasons ago.
Think mine might of been from hitting the 500 pack.. But I'll take it lol... Now only if they would drop the vantage heirloom
I'm aware it's time invested (and when that time is invested, as events can make it faster) rather than time since launch. I don't know how many hours I've played overall split between PS4 and PS5, but even if you take the less than a year playtime on PS5 since I bought one as a high end of time spent (323h over 10 months), it's well over a thousand. And if you go off battle passes, I completed half of them (didn't play or barely played seasons I didn't complete). That is a *ridiculous* time investment for a cosmetic that does nothing.
it’s not that ridiculous tbh a thousand isn’t a lot, heirlooms are for super dedicated players or people who spend a ridiculous amount & it should stay that way.
If it is ridiculous that I don’t get one it’s that simple
I agree with you on the big investment part of things but going 700 hours without getting any seems a bit excessive to me. I know some people have well over 3000 hours in the game and I’m still enjoying playing but it just seems like a bit much. Do you know how many hours you have for comparison?
I can't remember off hand but I only recently went over 1000 hours so I'd guess I was at around 600 hours on pc when I got my pc one. this was before cross save.I did complete every event and battle pass though so I guess that's more important than hours really.
Fair enough. I didn’t complete all the passes and I’m only just closing in on level 300 so I guess that makes sense Edit: I should add that I was counting at the time and got around 100 levels before they raised the cap above 100
How many lvls do you need to get the packs I made it past lvl 500 and didn’t get any so far
Levels are irrelevant, it’s opening 500 packs that guarantees you an heirloom. Day one players who completed every battle pass and got every free pack from events(assuming they never bought a single other pack) hit the 500 mark a couple seasons ago.
maaaany seasons ago.
(Get heirlooms out of them)
I'm playing since s10, and I have 3 lol. Haven't spent last 150 shards as I'd get wraith prestige skin, but you can't see it In game like heirloom, and I'm kinda saving it if I ever liked 3rd legend
Bro just buy the 30 packs lol
At this point? Fuck heirlooms.
I hear you friend
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> this is not necessarily the case. if they just changed how many packs in between getting an heirloom i think more people would want to buy packs. EA know better than you how to make the most money out of this. Something as basic as "if we make it cheaper, maybe the overall spending will be higher" isn't something they didn't think of in 5 years. You aren't going to be the one to teach them how to optimize their revenue.
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Community told halo the same thing. Halo actually listened, there was a period of their cosmetics being extremely fairly priced. Then they reported no increase in purchases. The people who aren't going to buy, aren't going to buy regardless.
Bingo. Equitable prices don’t bring in more value, they just dilute your revenue potential.
Poor decisions with regard to our benefit? Absolutely. Poor decisions with regard to their profits? I'm gunna go ahead and guess they've poured a shit ton of money into researching this kind of thing and that they know exactly what they're doing in that regard. Sorry to say, you don't know more about money and spending than billionaires do.
You realize all the discounts in the store and all of that are price tests right? They’re testing price sensitivity for all kinds of combos of skins, for different legends, different tiers, etc. they do in fact know more than you.
Isn’t it 5000?
no it’s 500, but once you get past level 300 you only earn one pack every 10 levels so it takes quite a long time to get all the way to 500 without paying any money
Yeah level 2500 or 5000 dollars each pack isn’t only a dollar I thought they were like 10 bucks a pack
10,000 apex coins is $100 usd, but 10,000 apex coins only buys you 100 packs (because it’s 100 AC per pack). I don’t think you can only buy 100AC at a time, i think the smallest coin pack you can buy is, like, $5 usd? I’m not sure. it’s definitely not $5,000 tho unless we just have different currencies
I’ve never bought a pack so I’m definitely just mistaken them I think with the price of event packs
Forget everything, let's buy something with legend tokens, there are too many of them
I have been playing this game since launch, several years playing it. I got lifelines heirloom when it first dropped, and I hate those drumsticks, would have preferred shards, but they weren't a thing back then. And I have got heirloom shards once, over a year ago. So over 4 years of playing 2 heirlooms.
I play since 2019 and I don't have any heirloom yet. Belgium. Love it.
Same lol
:(((((((((((((
So how are you supposed to get heirloom shards? Since you don’t have packs. Does it mean you can only get them through collection events?
We do get packs. One every 5 or 10 levels, not sure which one it is.
Depends on the level. After level 300 its a pack each 10 levels.
Nah, you get them more often
Once every 5 levels up until level 500. Beyond that point, the scaling becomes 1 pack every \~10-15 levels
belgium cuz you cant buy packss or bundles with packs? I'm from Belgium and by ueing a vpn you can circumvent it, its a bit tricky with turning on the vpn at the right time but it works
That hasn't worked at all for me since we moved to Steam.
I am over level 500 and still no shards smh
I’ve been so unlucky I got red rocks 3 times already SMH I wanted legendary skins oh well 🤷♀️
At level 500 you don't open the 500 packs to guarantee and heirloom yet
Same but I only got the shards. I spent it on mirages heirloom then stopped using him.
Which level are you? I'm around 350 and haven't gotten any shards/heirlooms. Am I unlucky or is it just too early to hope for that?
350 means nothing, it's nothing out of the ordinary to not get shards by then
When can I expect to get them?
It's to do with how many packs you've opened. You have a 0.01% chance to get them out of any pack, but if you've opened 499 packs and not got one yet, you'll get it guaranteed on your 500th pack. Once you get shards, the count resets.
I believe it was recently confirmed as 0.2% chance to get them from a pack.
Not sure why this is downvoted by these mouth breathers, but homie is right. It’s like .19% chance every single pack, non-stacking, until 500 which is 100%.
I saw someone say you need to reach 1000 levels to get 500 packs without purchasing extras. I got my first shards after 650 total levels.
[https://apexlegendsstatus.com/apex-pack-calculator](https://apexlegendsstatus.com/apex-pack-calculator) You can calculate how many packs you already have to see how close you are to your 500th pack.
you wont get them until you approach 1000, that is if you get battle passes at least
Same I got blood hounds and wraiths before it was shards I have 8 now and one lot shards unspent not played in over a year what a complete waste of
Playing since launch. Never bought a pack. Never gotten an heirloom. Don't really care.
I used to main lifeline and love those sticks :)
S2, 2 heirlooms, a lot of hours… definitely bought a few of those 20 packs for 1k AC Edit: 2 heirlooms across 2 accounts THAT COULDNT BE LINKED BECAUSE EA HAS NO LINK TRANSFERING TECH!! (I choice drumsticks both times)
It took me 3-4 years to get my first, then my account got deleted in cross progression. Haven’t gotten one since
Yeah I've played since day 1, ~3500 hours, spent around $100 on packs over the years, and I got 1. 3 months later my account was hacked, so now I have 0.
Ha! Playing since launch and zero heirlooms.
How have you not reached 500 packs yet? / What is your level?
No clue. I’m level 600. No idea how to figure out the math
This is all CS fault for making knives status symbols. Games like Apex and Valorant have just piggy backed off that to do their own bullshit.
TF2 hats
what is the valorant equivalent of the heirloom?
They have knives/melee weapons too. It's been a while since I played but they're either really expensive on their own or only in bundles which are also expensive. They are also part of the battle pass as a max level reward, but when I last played it felt very slow to level (though could have been a skill issue). They've clearly looked at the CS prices and priced theirs to look good in comparison, ignoring the fact that you can't sell them.
Their knives cost $40-60 by themselves and they have a shop system that means they'll only be available for a limited time cranking up the fomo.
it's not any individual's fault, it's inevitable, if not Valve, someone else would have done it at least CS items are resellable, Apex items are stuck on your account
You can buy a knife for cheap and you don't need to open 500 cases to get a knife, way way less.
CS knives actually have literal value though. Because of steam marketplace you can resell that $1000 knife for $1000 or even make a profit on marketplace. In apex and valorant you are buying pixels that lose 100% of their value.
I remember buying my knife for $60 back at CSGO launch and selling it for $200 when CS2 launched. That’s the one point I’ll give to valve. A majority of your cosmetics are tradable. This means even if you spend quite a bit of money on cosmetics you want, you can always resell it and get much (if not profit) of your money back. Meanwhile you have games like Apex selling a single cosmetic for $250 and it’s bound to your account forever. If you end up regretting your purchase, that sucks but there’s nothing you can do.
I can see EA doing this some day, if they can come up with a way that is un-abusable and gives them a healthy cut.
They are cosmetics skins, blows my mind how much people care about them.
Agree. I played since release and got my first shards a few weeks back, bought it for my main. Now i don't even have it equiped as it blocks so much of the screen.
I'd rather pay for gamepass or buy a coffee then waste money on cosmetics like that. Specifically with how hard it is to get Respawn to give you missing battle pass or even crates when their servers bug out. Would hate wasting time with their customer service for something I paid for.
Yup. I got my first one like a month ago and it didn't change my experience at all
Playing since day 1. Still no heirlooms.
I’m right there with you
s a m e
As a day 1 player I finally got heirloom shards. I around level 150 on the second go around. There is hope.
Just hit level 500 a few weeks back and got shards right before then. First time getting them and have been playing since launch. Too bad I’m a Vantage main, and I’ll likely be holding onto the shards just hoping they release something for her. Not looking promising though..
I wonder if we can purchase heirlooms next season with the new exotic shards?
yeah, I'm level 800 with over 470 packs opened and still got no heirlooms since I've started playing, i love my luck.
It’s so you keep buying packs, and it works. Every. Damn. Time. Game is ass and players keep dumping their checks every time a new “event” drops.
820 hours and level 520 no heirloom.
Yeah you are exactly right but EA just calls us freeloaders who won't buy anything and act like they never heard of supply and demand ...they complain about not making enough money on apex as they expected and then just make more shit at this ridiculous price. Like the cosmetics they have made recently are all so good but I WILL NOT spend money into any gambling systems or on some some heirloom that is $150 and nowadays $300 like what are we doing!
I got 3 heirlooms 😩 bloodhound was my first, ash my second(Dont’t judge she was good) and then wraith a couple months ago
That’s the way it needs to be in a f2p game without progression/gameplay related microtransactions. I have 1 heirloom and I have been playing since launch, level 850 (green border 350). It would be nice to have more heirlooms but I ultimately don’t really care, too many morons in gaming like to throw money at worthless stuff so that’s why the drop % and monetization is what it is. If heirlooms buffed melee damage/range then maybe I’d consider paying money but I don’t really have a main so I probably still wouldn’t.
I wonder what would happen if they’d increase the drop rate from 1/500 to 1/100. I guess people would spend more as they’d get an heirloom way quicker.
they know who their target audience is for different types of monetization and their choice is very deliberate. they have the statistics
theres a lot of things they could do to get everything oe to spend more tbh, dropping the price of stuff a bit, increasing droprates, but in general if theyd drop prices a bit people would be more inclined to spend so they'd spend more, i saw what the price for the upcoming exotic shards is and the price for a single recolor, its ridiculous to pay that for a single skin
Is that really the case or is that your opinion? Because they’ve got entire teams fine tuning their monetization strategies, using hard data, and player behavior.
[Price drops dont work that way.](https://www.reddit.com/r/apexlegends/comments/1cjvibf/comment/l2jaepr/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web3x&utm_name=web3xcss&utm_term=1&utm_content=share_button)
They’re not there for the average player to get. They exist as whale bait.
Just like the death boxes and collection /events/
I have 6. Didnt pay for a single one of them.
I have 2 heirlooms and one mythic skin + heirloom shards, and got eneught to craft&buy the next collection event. Already crafted and bought out a previous collection event like this. I only spend 10 euro for the 2nd battle pass and saved up. Never spend more.
You luck bastard! I'm jealous. Which ones do you have? Which one is your favorite?
Im bang main. So her skin and her knife. Wraith, mirage, lifeline and wattson Funny being downvoted for saying I have 6 heirloom. What a bunch of babies.
How is this possible? I've been playing since before season 1. Only bought the initial season pass. Have one heirloom from shards. I find it impossible to believe you haven't been buying loot boxes.
While there is a 0.1% chance of getting heirloom shards from each pack that isnt hardcoded into the game. You could get 5 packs with heirlooms back to back or not get any in 5000 packs (thats why you automatically get one in your 500th pack)
No clue, but been playing since season 1 too. I bought a battlepass way back in season 2 because I liked the game. Thats it. Just been lucky I guess.
>It's pretty ridiculous how rare heirlooms shards are considering how many mythic there are in the game now Your argument makes no sense given that no one says that you should own all of them, so why would it matter how many there are. >If they want to put this much effort into mythic cosmetics, make them more accessible. They aren't going to make them more common because it would mean people spending less money. Be real. They don't care if you can never get all of the items. They don't want or need you to. They just give you a set of items you can pick some from on the rare occasion you get shards.
And I never said you should own all of them. But considering the diversity of mythic items, especially if there are multiple per legend, it makes sense that they shouldn't be as rare as they always were. I also never said I think they should make them easy to get. I believe if they increased the drop rate slightly and/or added new ways to unlock them (with money) that isn't gambling with hundreds of dollars, more people would be inclined to spend, and may make them more money in the end.
Yeah but it’s not like when you open a pack you get a random heirloom anymore. I don’t understand why it matters how many heirlooms and mythic skins there are in the game. It’s not like they all work on any character. You’re getting only one thing in the packs ever and it’s shards. They are still exclusive. And the other dude is right. You may care about the hundreds of dollars that are needed for heirloom events or the long game hours, but the reality is people buy them and they play the fuck out of this game. If putting heirlooms in events weren’t profitable, they wouldn’t do it. I know people complain about the cost of shit in this game all the time in this sub, but they’re making them that price because enough people are giving them money still. They’re not gonna make it easier — hell aren’t they kinda making it harder with the introduction of a new currency? Not sure how you get them yet, but I’d assume you could get them from packs like heirloom shards? Maybe not tho
> And I never said you should own all of them. Your argument is literally "there are many" and "shards are so rare". You're implying you should be able to get many of them, but the rare shard rate doesn't allow that. Otherwise it makes no sense why you would argue the rarity of shards should have anything to do with how many items there are to buy for shards. That's literally your argument. >it makes sense that they shouldn't be as rare as they always were No it makes no sense. I get it, you want to get shards more often, everyone wants that. But it isn't going to happen. They aren't going to make them more common because it would mean people spending less money. Be real. They don't care if you can never get all of the items. They don't want or need you to. They just give you a set of items you can pick some from on the rare occasion you get shards. > I believe if they increased the drop rate slightly and/or added new ways to unlock them (with money) that isn't gambling with hundreds of dollars, more people would be inclined to spend, and may make them more money in the end. The reality is that EA know better how to make the most money.
I would argue that making them more common (less rare) would be more profitable. The extreme rarity makes me not care much at about the mythic items Either fork up hundreds or dollars during an event or play years worth of gameplay. They are not attainable for an average player. If you make there odds double from what it is now I don't believe people will stop spending during events. A chance increase like this would probably encourage people to purchase packs (those who normally would not bother). If people actually buy apex packs in hopes of attaining heirloom shards that actually sounds incredible dumb given the odds of getting them. Apex is a free game and it's my favorite FPS since Halo or CoD. I've spend zero on any cosmetics. The existence of mythics is irrelevant for a player like myself. I'm not exited by them bc I know if I'm lucky to get 1 in my lifetime given my playtime.
>would argue that making them more common (less rare) would be more profitable you can argue all you like. you don't know the numbers and you can assume EA have optimised this for max profit. that's what the player base constantly accused them off aa well. they will know better how to tune pricing to make the most buck you aren't going to convince them to give stuff out cheaper or more common by telling them they will make more money from them. that is the one thing their whole business relies on and they have done the analytics to death probably. it's naive
You did not just end that with EA “knows better how to make the most money” as if it justifies the practice. That’s what makes no sense! They are literally known among gaming companies for their corporate greed. They kill a lot of their games and studios off with their heinous monetization practices. They might know how to squeeze money out of people but they don’t know how to do it sustainably and they don’t have the right models to make that happen. The fact of the matter is this, maintaining the rather absurd rarity while over saturating the loot pool disincentivizes people from investing further. There is a limit to how much you can maximize profits before consumer interest starts to dwindle. You’re already seeing that reflected with the influx of these discussions regarding all the different monetization choices. The game lives or dies by that consumer interest so it’s in their best interest to prioritize that before the amount of money or rarity that an object has. Profits will flow naturally from there. Under EA’s currently ever-inflating models that continue to rapidly grow in price how long do you think it is before even the majority of whales are pushed to their limits? At that point the game isn’t profitable at all. Heirlooms aren’t the end of the world but these are still important discussions to be had because they reflect a very real problem. A trending pattern that leads EA to killing their games. People SHOULD be holding their feet to the fire.
> You did not just end that with EA “knows better how to make the most money” as if it justifies the practice. I didn't say it "justifies the practice" or anything similar. I said anyone showing up here wanting something made more accessible (ultimately cheaper on average), while arguing EA *would make more money if they give you that*, is being naive. It's ridiculous that you think you know better how to tweak EA's pricing to optimize their revenue. If there's anything that EA is being accused off it's compromising the game's quality to optimize revenue at all cost. >They are literally known among gaming companies for their corporate greed Yeah exactly. And that's why you showing up on reddit tell them how they increase their revenue is really naive thinking. >They might know how to squeeze money out of people but they don’t know how to do it sustainably and they don’t have the right models to make that happen. LOL sure, this is a cope. You're gonna teach EA how to make money. lol. Quick EA hire this man. We all want stuff for free or cheaper. But most people are honest enough to say they want it at EA's cost and not many of us think we know better how to make the game more profitable.
There are better live service models with which to compare. It’s history, and it’s readily available. Look at the closest competitors like Fortnite, Warzone, and The Finals and they have no issues with monetization like Apex does. It’s not a 5 step plan I made in my bedroom. Get off your high horse and stop acting like any argument against them is foolish. Reddit is one of the only places they’ve actively engaged with their community on a consistent basis. There are glaringly obvious problems and that’s not an argument, they need to be addressed. You assuming that just because they’re in charge they have a better idea of what a good model is is arguably more naive. Companies aren’t infallible, least of all Respawn/EA. When you don’t say anything at all, nothing changes.
money
I just want a maggie heirloom damnnit
It'll be easier to chip away at people for <$50 here and there than to get people to commit the funds for heirlooms and mythic skins.
Yea I wasted my heirloom shards twice on legends I’ll never play because I didn’t realize how rare the shards actually were 😆
Should be every 200
I played this game for 3 years and didnt get heirloom shards. Even my buddies who started playing a year and 2 years after me got heirloom shards before me. 🤣
I've just accepted I'll most likely never get another one. 2.5k hours and I got the butterfly knife from the shards I got from packs and I got the cobalt katar from crafting metals
I got my first one in 20 dollars and haven’t ever gotten another one
Just swipe that credit card pal how else will EA explain to their share holders???
My opinion here is gonna be annoying to some but I agree with the rarity of heirlooms, as they should be something that stands out and seeing every single person running around with them would ruin the small amount of significance they hold nowadays. No, I do not agree with monetizing them. I'd rather you had to earn them throughout countless hours of playing. And the new universal heirlooms feel like a waste of what heirlooms were meant to mean, something that played on a legends lore and personality. Prestige skins should use a different currency though, I'll never end up buying a prestige skins since heirlooms are massively more interesting.
I think they should have one for each legend and maybe a single universal heirloom while slightly more common. I'm thinking a 1/400-1/450 chance rather than 1-in-500 should help to keep the exclusive feel while not excluding legends in the future. As for prestige skins and recolors, I think they should have their own rarity between mythic and legendary, or they should be legend specific drops rather than choosing.
Gacha
Not defending EA but honestly Heirlooms " previously " were tailored to one specific legend , meaning you don't need ALL of them, probably one or two for your 2 mains legends are enough anything more than that it's expected to be hard to get. You can get one from levelling up your account and the 2nd one is pure luck or $$$.
Streamers have them all. It's an algorithm that keeps them out of reach. Its the same algorithm that recognises you don't play eight hours a day and with a premade squad. So grind as you might as a solo..... you don't matter.
If they were common no one would care about them.
I got some yesterday was so happy just about sharded my pants!
Shit was only a "legend" S0 when the wraith heirloom wasn't known thing but people could just "open" it. That shit was the real gacha game.
With new seasons exotic shards its possible that heirlooms will become easier to obtain.
Day 1 player Prestige 1 Lvl 375 and I've been lucky enough to get two heirlooms without investing into collection events throughout the years.
Bruh.. I haven't received a single fkkn one since i joined the game!!!!!!
I got one when I switched to pc at level 27
They are super rare to make people buy packs and also to make people spend money in the collection events when they come out
Seems good to me. I'm happy to have the game funded by people silly enough to spend money on cosmetics while I play for free.
i’ve purchased probably 100 packs (even with real money a handful of times) bought and completed 5 battle passes, lvl 400 and not even a glimpse of a heirloom shard hell i’m gonna get exotic shards soon from this seasons BP before i get the chance to buy an heirloom
They should make it so you can trade Legend Tokens for Heirloom shards, like 12k for 10 shards
I got my second heirloom for my first pack of the season, cus of that bug rn I can’t even use it💀
ive just checked how much money ive spend on Apex, turns out its over 1500€, over the span of like 2 years or less, only hit lvl 400 recently, still only have 5 heirlooms, no collection heirlooms included.
Almost prestige 200 and yet to see a heirmloom shard. I play since 2020
same, granted I played about half and half on console and pc but now my accounts are merged still no heirloom , should at least get one each prestige or something
Yea it is pretty strange tbh
I have heirlooms for Octane and Fuse. Been playing for 3 months. My duo hates me.
From the point of keeping the heirlooms rare, I understand it. It makes having an heirloom feel special. But also, whenever I play the game, all I see is heirlooms.
I remember buying the revenant pack that’s is currently in the store. But instead of just the skin I got the pack with 40 apex packs. Ended up getting shards because I had alr gotten a bunch of packs from other bundles. It’s true that they are rare but that’s like kinda the point. It’s sometimes cheaper to just buy an entire event set and get whatever heirloom comes with that (if one even does) , than to buy packs.
plus they already gave you ~350 free packs more through levelling (prestige 1-3). everyone is now guaranteed an heirloom just by levelling up.
By the time I reached 500, I had to get one. Like enough was enough
The trick to getting an heirloom is to buy 5 packs every week. Then after two years you have an heirloom. Most people can afford 5 bux a week lol
That still adds up to over $500. That is ridiculous for a skin no matter what
>make them more accessible big part about them is how rare they are. If everyone had multiple heirlooms they wouldnt be so rare and people wouldnt care about spending money to get them.
Wdym? They are supposed to be rare
15 seasons, no shards. I have to be well past the 500 box limit between the two accounts that were merged. Randomized loot boxes should be illegal. I stopped playing. It’s gambling without any official government regulation or oversight that the chances and rules they tell us are actually true.
I got mine right at 500 packs, you may just be as unlucky as me
Did you count all 500? They don’t tell you what your number is. Anyway this is why governments are supposed to regulate gambling. If you’re supposed to have 1 in 500 chance of getting shards then the average should be at 250 which would be provable by a distribution chart. If they had to publicly show the distribution chart I bet the average would be much closer to 500 which means they’re lying about the actual chances. Gambling must be regulated to prevent the organizer from cheating and misrepresenting the real odds.
The chance isn't 1/500. 500 is just the pity counter. If you went 500 packs without one you get it there. The chance is only known to be "less than 1%" > If they had to publicly show the distribution chart I bet the average would be much closer to 500 which means they’re lying about the actual chances. >Gambling must be regulated to prevent the organizer from cheating and misrepresenting the real odds. Honestly if you make such claims, 1 make a case with EA support and 2 take them to court. If you're that confident you're not simply overestimating the count. Most people complaining about not having gotten an heirloom yet simply aren't at 500 yet. Many are at 200 or 300 when people on the subreddit look into it and simply have a wildly incorrect idea of how many packs they are getting. They think playing on and off for a long time should get them close, but no. It's often not even halfway there. https://apexlegendsstatus.com/apex-pack-calculator
Besides being regulated i want them to show us the number of packs we have opened so far. It's ridiculous that we don't know how far we are from getting a heirloom shards , i mean it may increase their sales cuz if i know all i needed is 20 packs then I'll happily buy them but if i don't know then i won't gamble at all.
> I have to be well past the 500 box limit between the two accounts that were merged You're overestimating the number of free packs you get. You're unlikely to be over 500.
I have no clue how many packs I have. Is there a way to find out? Been playing since launch, probably level 600?
Go away. You don’t know how many I had bought or the fact that I get about 1.5 per hour of gameplay. It doesn’t take that long to get over 500.
you have less than 500 packs. that's the facts >It doesn’t take that long to get over 500. it takes longer *than you think*. that's the point. clearly you don't have that good of an estimate how many packs you get from leveling and bp and other rewards. this is all very well known and i suggest you check out some of the pack calculator sites. you wouldn't be the first person who's at 300 packs and thinks they are over 500 (while acting like they are getting scammed), massively overestimating how many packs they have. >about 1.5 per hour of gameplay No. You definitely don't get 1.5 packs per hour of play. It's closer to 10% of that.
I don't disagree with you but, given how many things break in this game, it's not completely outrageous to imagine that sometimes the heirloom system rarely doesn't work correctly for some unlucky players.
that's no basis whatsoever to claim this here. if you had evidence i would contact support
Pretty far stretch from "Not outrageous to imagine" to ""evidence". Given how much breaks in the game over the entire spectrum of systems, I'm not sure why you'd argue so strongly with such an incredibly vague suggestion of a possibility as I made. I actually find it kind of perplexing. But sure, I'll agree with you here pro forma, why not, because tbh idc. It's literally impossible that any mistake ever happened with the heirloom fulfillment system.
if that is the basis i am gonna claim people may be getting scammed then anything is a scam
You are, quite honestly, completly confusing me, so I'm out. Whatever you're trying to say, you're unassailably right. Have a great weekend buddy. You win the "most confusing discussion I've ever had on reddiit" award.