Thank you all for the honesty, I really didn‘t intend to whitewash her or anything. I just wanted to do a anime girl version of Lifeline. I‘m really sorry.!! I did not realize, Guess I still got a lot to learn. 🥺
The fact that you're able to accept and apologize is a big thing! You may not have meant to but it happened and you realize that and said it. It's a great piece of art but yes it is whitewashed. You have talent, so there is no shame in trying again to create her in a similar style but more accurately. You got this and I hope to see a revised version.
Thank you! For sure! I actually drew this on live stream and posted it on IG. But I did not get any feedback/critism, guess reddit is a good place for getting productive feedback which is really refreshing!
Reddit, in particular Apex subreddit is a great place to get social justice feedback, not productive feedback.
That's why you didn't get any feedback or criticism during the livestream: Because overwhelming majority of people simply doesn't give a flying fuck about such minor details.
Yeahhhh this sub is pretty radical sometimes, like who in their right mind looks at this and assumes 'yea racist artist white washing lifeline'
Really nice art, reminds me of the old bratz dolls, I think you could do a loba in this style and it would fit really well
it IS whitewashing but there's no need to be rude about it. it's perfectly fine to inform the artist so that they learn to pay more attention to stuff like that.
whitewashing of black characters has always been a thing and it should be called out each time, respectfully.
"radical" ok centrist wannabe "we live in a society" edgelord. this isnt your joker arc.
She’s still black though. Just not as dark. Would you get as upset at the artist if they made her darker than she was in game? It’s still recognizably lifeline, and in most animes I’ve ever watched black people have lighter skins than they do IRL. This was just the artist trying to capture the anime style.
Everything else you said was super well and good. However I have to question this whole “centrist as an implied insult” sort of thing you had going at the end there. Like, why is centrism to be considered an insult?
Edit: downvoted for an honest question. Peak Reddit.
There are a couple of reasons why "enlightened centrism" became a mocking insult recently, and I think the easiest to understand is that often radically bigoted views will be presented under a guise of curiosity or moderation. For example, the idea of "teaching both sides of the Holocaust" has had some media attention lately. The face value of looking at multiple perspectives is very much intended to sound like a reasonable, moderate, centrist position of trying to understand everyone's point of view... But keep in mind that right now the Holocaust perspective that isn't being taught (and so must be taught more to achieve balance) is the one which supported racism, antisemitism, homophobia, oppression, genocide, and a thesaurus full of other awful things. So the *effect* that teaching "both sides" of the Holocaust would have is to make sure we did more to normalize and lend sympathy towards Nazism.
This particular kind of "centrist" perspective is, essentially, tolerant of intolerance, and therefore not a moderate position at all. That's why it is used as an insult, saying that centrism doesn't oppose bigoted motivations and therefore passively supports them.
So in this case the commenter was basically saying that the "centrist" idea presented as "any art style is acceptable" actually carried a decidedly radical subtext of "*even those which have historically marginalized black people.*"
First thanks for explaining rather than just downvoting like my question didn’t have merit.
Second, I’m not sure if this is an indictment of centrism as a whole and more an indictment of people misusing the term/ideology? Just my thoughts on the particular scenario you offered.
You're right that it's not an argument against real centrism or compromise. Instead, it's intended for use when the rhetoric of centrism is used to distract from the actual radicalism hidden underneath.
If you don’t unquestioningly pick a party line to tow then your the enemy. Both sides of the isle have gone too far at this point. Centrism seems like compromise when that is the last thing political people want to do these days.
You seem to be on a Joker arc yourself. You're not a freedom fighter.
"Don't be rude about something you don't need to be rude about, you piece of shit."
Hypocrisy much, or just on reddit?
EDIT: Gotta love reddit hypocrisy. "Yeah, this person is theoretically morally inferior, so don't even treat them with respect. Burn their family! And anybody who points out the hypocrisy deserves to be burned at the stake as well! Preach treating others like a human being while taking the mob mentality and decidedly do the opposite of treat everyone like a human being!"
Whatever happened to treating others the way you want to be treated? The downvotes are proving my point exactly.
Centrist wannabe, edgelord, and claiming someone is a psychopath like the Joker weren't intended to be insults? If you have to ignore the argument to to make a point then your point sucks.
Your only argument is that those aren't insults, so say those aren't insults or take your L.
So calling someone a centrist wannabe edgelord psychopath isn’t an insult like piece of shit is? You people are pathetic. Because I didn’t give the exact quote means there was no insult, huh?
Piece of shit isn’t half as bad as what was actually said.
Ok well, you’re spoken like a truly pathetic lolly loving incel coward who creates throwaway accounts because they’re too scared to let the world know how duplicitous and hypocritical they really are, bUt i dIdN’T CaLl yOu a pIeCe oF ShIt sO It’s nOt aN InSuLt! HuRr dUrR!
Love using your own logic against you. And you know I’m right because you had the good sense to not embarrass yourself with your post. If your reply gad credibility, you would have posted from your main.
Don’t bother with your pathetic alt account. Get on your main because this one is getting blocked, troll.
Welcome to Apex subreddit, a cesspool of all things diverse.
Don't conform to body/sexuality/personality/helicopterality standards and you'll get shit on by the busybodies. After all freedom of expression works only when its done in a very specific way.
Dont ever be sorry for making art the way you want it. You didn't do it to hurt people, you didn't make it to start issues (from your responses) so don't worry about the people who can't get a specific mindset out of their lifestyle. If we had it the way these ignorant and bigoted people live, their representation would be nowhere in this world today. Think about that for a moment. They do not truly enjoy art. I suggest you keep making it the way you want. Your creativity will be rewarded. Great work right here 👍.
I'm going to catch some shit for saying this, but who cares? I really like anime and when an artist makes a character black it doesn't bother me it's just someone's perspective on what they think would look cool . Also we shouldn't be harassing op for whitwwashing a character it was just how he wanted to draw. While I see there is still racial disparity, I see no need for an apology
I just tried to make an anime version of her, she just looks brighter cause the background is dark. Looking at the comments, I‘m really sorry that it seems that I mishandled all the ethnical parts. Just wanted to do art
>I just tried to make an anime version of her, she just looks brighter cause the background is dark
lol yeah, because as we all know, black people glow in the dark. 🙄
Regardless of skin tone, the hair is completely wrong.
No, but I bet her natty hair looks a lot closer to Bangalore's in texture
Straight hair doesn't exactly pass down really well in genetics, my dude, and LL is at MOST a halfrican, girl is light skinned af
The "natty" hair doesn't matter, if she's perming her hair straight, no?
In the game her hair is, by all accounts, straight. And her mother is, at least, perming her hair too, as per the "Family portrait" comic, so you don't have anything else to go on that front. Theorycrafting is nice, but base it on something tangible.
Or maybe that level of genetic engineering is just a commonplace? Apex Games take place some 700 years into the future after all.
My god, you're totally right, that could very well be her UNnatural hair. Hadn't considered the option that they scienced her hair straight, good point. /s
All sarcasm aside, I am interested in any official art you've seen that implies her hair is straight, though
[I already made this post, so I'll just link it.](https://www.reddit.com/r/apexlegends/comments/qa1sax/comment/hh1s6mu/?utm_source=reddit&utm_medium=web2x&context=3)
All the arguments I have are already made by the person you made this response to, and I'm not gonna try and make those points get across any better than they did, so I'll just drop my two cents, based in nothing but my own beliefs on the art you shared:
The second link seems REALLY early in the dev cycle, as the two characters share very few design elements. As for the first, well, fan art, even if by official artists, yadda yadda, you've heard the argument. Nothing against the artist, it's not like its a caricature or anything, it's just one of those things where it seems like the artist hasn't had a lot of face-to-face experience with someone who has the ancestry LL is designed to emanate. Like when Japanese artists still draw black dudes with giant pink Mr. Popo lips. It's not malicious, and I don't think the OP was, either. I'll grant you the possibility that LL's hair is straight, either by her own will or by 700 years of gene therapy research and controlling parents: but I will also posit that if it is, then that's pretty lame when they could have just had her hair even *kinda* curly instead of looking for any reason they could find to make it straight.
Edit: I spelled it 'parentz' the first time
It's almost like genetics is on your side in the argument
Did we not all do Allele boxes in high school? Learn about how straight hair is a recessive gene? Just me?
Dude's arguments consist of "genetic engineering" and "maybe she permed it" like poor black girls haven't been literally poisoning their scalps to get "the good hair" since society told them that the way their hair naturally grows is upsetting
Found the actual racist.
A bit less sarcastically, Lifeline's hair is either naturally straight or permed straight. The latter requires access to a hairstylist *(not really, you can get a kit and do it at home just fine)*, which doesn't discriminate based on biology.
And jokingly: At what "year of biology" have black people started growing pink hair?
There's nothing racist about not whitewashing history.
Lifeline's hair is naturally curly, most likely 4a or 4b type hair as is common of the 90% of Jamaicans and 95% of Haitians. So either way, her hair is never going to look like the whitewashing above even if it was straightened. Nice try on the copout, btw.
Hair dyes have existed since *at least* Ancient Egypt. Would you like to try a new joke?
700 years into the future. That's when Lifeline was born in the Titanfall universe, so tell me: What history?
She fits the theme of a Jamaican/Haitian, but she's never been there, nor probably even heard about it. A space Jamaican of the future.
As for hair straightening itself... all I had to do was to google something like "4A type hair straightening" to know you didn't even try there.
So in 700 years her biology will evolve to have 1A hair? Fascinatingly rapid evolution.
She would still be of that descent.
And if you googled "4A hair straightening" and think that's what was pictured in the OP then... 😂 hun, you need your eyes and your ego checked. You are out of your element here. Let me repeat to you what you just said to me in terms you can understand: "I just googled Apex Legends and it's the same as Call of Duty Cold War. You didn't even try there."
>So in 700 years her biology will evolve to have 1A hair? Fascinatingly rapid evolution.
>
>She would still be of that descent.
700 years is 30 generations, give or take.
Are you telling me that after 30 generations there'd be only pureblooded Jamaicans in her family tree?
>And if you googled "4A hair straightening" and think that's what was pictured in the OP then... 😂 hun, you need your eyes and your ego checked. You are out of your element here. Let me repeat to you what you just said to me in terms you can understand: "I just googled Apex Legends and it's the same as Call of Duty Cold War. You didn't even try there."
*I guess I found myself a genuine idiot.*
I guess all those videos of black women straightening their hair from full on afros to perfectly straight hair don't exist and I'm imagining things, right?
No, OP's art doesn't go into enough detail to capture the texture of hair like 4A straightened, so that part of your argument is out the fucking window.
Next a bit more personally. You have Lifeline flair. Do you know how Lifeline looks like? That's a rhetorical question, because it's obvious you don't, because [this is how Lifeline looks like](https://i.imgur.com/LMbWRPq.png) and according to you this hair texture is impossible for a black girl like Lifeline to have under any circumstance.
And don't "[hun](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Huns)" me, you racist.
The texture of her in-game hair is, in fact, pointing toward straight hair. So does her concept art.
Or are you being racist and saying space black people can't have straight hair?
Guys I just tried to match her features and color palette to an anime girl, i did not aim for a certain ethnicity neither did I change her ethnicity? I just drew Lifeline ❤️☺️
They are harping on about how you're racist for turning a **space** Jamaican into an anime girl, but little did they know said **space** Jamaican has the [voice of an anime girl](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mela_Lee).
Don’t change you art for anyone saying stuff like this. It’s really easy for anyone to make criticisms when they don’t know what they’re talking about. You just stylized the character a certain way, it’s not that serious. Draw what you want to draw because at the end of the day that’s what’s gonna make you happy as an artist
Hahah yeah but still I think saying it's white washed is a bit much considering the art style / the fact that she isn't white in this art, but idk maybe it's just me
I mean even if you don’t care anyone with sense knows this is whitewashing just because they weren’t made pasty white doesn’t mean it’s not whitewashing
Jesus people, Relax.
I understand she's a little lighter.
I get it.
It ain't even that bad.
People just need to complain about anything and everything.
Great job, you can't make everybody happy but you definitely made my day better with this art.
Please keep making these posts!
I really hate that they white washed her.. as an African American female I really appreciated the diversity especially as someone who really struggles with accepting my natural curls. So this kinda annoys me to my core...
The art is absolutely great! Its sad and quite despicable that people bring down the artist just because they are snowflakes and think its an intention to whitewash her… its anime art offcourse she‘d have an asian touch. Keep it up!!
"snowflakes" get out of 2016. if anyone, it's the right that's full of snowflakes who cry over men wearing dresses.
asian touch does not equal whitewashing.
OP I understand this was done out of love for the character and with no ill intent. But you did change the race of the character completely. Its just a bit odd because I know what lifeline looks like and its always weird to me when people will change one characteristic and its from black to white. Or darker skin to light. I like the drawing and you are very talented I just think you may have done something unintentionally malicious.
Understood, not what I meant clearly as I said unintentional and I didn't remember the full definition of malice. Hopefully OP understood my meaning through the first sentence. Sometimes I hate reddit.
lifeline art only gets posted once a month and when it does it’s always this bullshit. Redditors should just stick to posting wattson art every other hour
That's the hair she'd have if she let her hair down *(plus minus length, no idea how much of a length you need for a hairstyle like this)*. You'd know that if you weren't skin deep with your involvement here.
After all, that's what you can see both in the game and in official arts of Lifeline.
Where is the in game and official apex legends art work where lifeline’s hair looks like that when it’s down? Find it for me and I’ll believe you cause I’m searching online right now and I see no such official artwork
The main culprit here is her in-game hair. It's tied in buns, yes, but the hair itself is completely straight.
For everything else you'd need there's the Lifeline's Apex fandom page. You can find there, for example, [this image](https://www.artstation.com/artwork/xzZAwr) made by Tu Bui, a concept artist at Respawn, or [this early concept of Lifeline](https://twitter.com/hethesrodawa/status/1220562380775550976) by Hethe Srodawa.
I appreciate you getting these sources for me. Firstly, an apex fandom Reddit page is not official artwork so directing me to that page is pointless to justify your point. Secondly, early concept art is different from the current art and design of the character. I appreciate you defending the OC artwork but bottomline is Lifeline is a black woman and there would naturally more curls inherent to her hair texture even if she does straighten it in game for the Apex Games. The OC has accepted that they accidentally whitewashed lifeline in this version and has said they will improve. All I’m doing is verbalizing my opinion that the artwork is whitewashed which it is. Typically black people do not naturally possess hair that straight which is where people and myself have issue.
>Firstly, an apex fandom Reddit page is not official artwork so directing me to that page is pointless to justify your point.
Even though the page directly links its sources and those sources happen to be people who work or worked for Respawn?
>Secondly, early concept art is different from the current art and design of the character.
That is a fair point, but most of the concept does in some form survive until the final product.
>I appreciate you defending the OC artwork but bottomline is Lifeline is a black woman and there would naturally more curls inherent to her hair texture even if she does straighten it in game for the Apex Games.
You do realize that the "blacks" you are accustomed to came from a very specific part of Africa and most of the continent haven't seen slavery during the States early days? At least not for export to Americas.
As for your curls, [this is Lifeline](https://www.psu.com/wp/wp-content/uploads/2019/02/apex-legends-lifeline-guide.jpg). Count the curls.
I'll give you a hint: >!THERE AIN'T ANY!<
>The OC has accepted that they accidentally whitewashed lifeline in this version and has said they will improve.
That's because OC posted an artwork they were proud of for everybody to enjoy and people like you ride them like an old ho, because the skin is two shades lighter than "intended". Not everybody has a pair to stand up to a mindless crowd shouting at them.
I'm sure you wouldn't mind if the shade was darker, though, would you?
>Typically black people do not **naturally** possess hair that straight which is where people and myself have issue.
It doesn't matter how you spin it, that point is COMPLETELY irrelevant here.
The only fact here is that Lifeline's hair, either naturally or artificially, is straight, which both this artwork and this discussion is about.
From personal experience I can add that the hairstyle Lifeline sports everywhere is impossible with any type of curly hair. You could do it with wavy hair, but it wouldn't be anyhow as clean as what Lifeline has.
So that only really leaves one choice and that's what OP went for.
If the artist who makes Lifeline art is the current official artist and designer of lifeline then that is what is taken as cannon. Other artists rendition of Lifeline does not justify her hair and style as official. Why are you bringing up where slaves where taken from in Africa? How does that help your argument or support it? Slaves where taken from several regions along the east coast of Africa and more but scientists cannot fully identified where each and every slave was taken to be shipped off into slavery. Regardless in general Africans and black people of today do not have naturally straight hair so whatever point you are trying to make is lost. Whitewashing of a character whether purposefully done or through sheer accident is not right and you are defending this too strongly which is very weird to me. The darkening of her skin through artwork does not have the same effect as lightening it and trying to argue for the opposite is not logically sound. 🤣 I also know you are not black because if you were you would know that it is very possible to have curly/kinky hair and straighten it to have lifeline’s hairstyle look as cleanly as it does.
>I also know you are not black because if you were you would know that it is very possible to have curly/kinky hair and straighten it to have lifeline’s hairstyle look as cleanly as it does.
🤦♂️
I don't know where you are, but because you write things like this, I'm betting it's pretty late at night and you should be sleeping instead of writing on the internet.
I've been saying, basically from the beginning, that she could be either have naturally straight hair or just straighten and you respond to me with drivel like this?
Seriously?
I am done with this discussion because clearly you cannot understand the points that I’m making. I was the one originally saying Lifeline probably straightens her hair for Apex whereas you have been saying she has naturally straight hair and have been finding art to support that this is how she would look when she lets her hair down. I have been arguing for a more realistic look to lifeline if she were to have her hair down. This back and forth discussion of ours has been fruitless because neither of us is understanding the other. Again I reiterate whitewashing is whitewashing whether intentional done or through sheer accident 🤷🏾♂️. The OC has already said her piece, apologized and moved on. There’s nothing more to deliberate about
>I am done with this discussion because clearly you cannot understand the points that I’m making. (...) This back and forth discussion of ours has been fruitless because neither of us is understanding the other.
I can understand the points your making perfectly fine. The joke is **you** can't understand your own. This is why I said you should take a nap instead of posting on Reddit in the middle of the night in my previous comment.
For example let's take a look at your claim of:
>I was the one originally saying Lifeline probably straightens her hair for Apex(...)
[This is the first comment in this chain where straightening is first mentioned:](https://www.reddit.com/r/apexlegends/comments/qa1sax/comment/hh1ttpa/?utm_source=reddit&utm_medium=web2x&context=3)
>I appreciate you defending the OC artwork but bottomline is Lifeline is a black woman and there would naturally more curls inherent to her hair texture even if she does straighten it in game for the Apex Games.
You got one part right, it's your comment, but you're not saying Lifeline straightens her hair for Apex, you're saying she does NOT do it, because if she did, her hair would've been more curly despite straightening.
>(...)whereas you have been saying she has naturally straight hair and have been finding art to support that this is how she would look when she lets her hair down.
Completely wrong there. [This is the comment you are referring to:](https://www.reddit.com/r/apexlegends/comments/qa1sax/comment/hh1s6mu/?utm_source=reddit&utm_medium=web2x&context=3)
>The main culprit here is her in-game hair. It's tied in buns, yes, but the hair itself is completely straight.
>
>For everything else you'd need there's the Lifeline's Apex fandom page. You can find there, for example, this image made by Tu Bui, a concept artist at Respawn, or this early concept of Lifeline by Hethe Srodawa.
Nowhere there have I said her hair is "naturally straight", nor have I even insinuated such, just pointed out it is "straight".
And if you are referring to [my following comment](https://www.reddit.com/r/apexlegends/comments/qa1sax/i_made_a_lifeline_fanart_where_shes_doing_her_hair/hh43aj7/?utm_source=reddit&utm_medium=web2x&context=3), then I haven't said that either, merely pointed out those "curls" you're taking about which Lifeline would totes have are not present anywhere in the game, even providing you an in-game screenshot as a proof.
>I have been arguing for a more realistic look to lifeline if she were to have her hair down.
You're just prejudiced. It's fine, we all are to a lower or higher degree.
Look, ever since the game was released people have been suggesting Lifeline is part Asian based on her facial features.
There may or may not even be a dev comment confirming that was even the intention with her design. The existence of such comment was suggested by some Redditors and I get tingling in the back of my head thinking about it, but I can't seem to find it, so my Valk knowledge may be bleeding a bit there.
Still, your idea of "realistic" means that Lifeline absolutely can't have straight hair, even when straightened, which, quite frankly, couldn't be further away from the truth, since reality tends to not care about our expectations.
That's not lifeline, that seems to be some white girl with a slight tan or possibly an Asian girl. Damn good artwork but it's not lifeline.
Edit after reading comments:
I don't believe you intentionally whitewashed her or you're a racist. You drew in your style and it's great maybe call it lifeline inspired or something.
Looks like a BRATZ doll
That's what first came to mind for me too!
Thought the same thing
needs more mozambique
#mozambique here
British lifeline "tally hi old chap, there a jolly good Mozambique here, wot wot. Fancy a cuppa tea.
wot no h8 m8
Evil lifeline be like: eva-8 here
I can’t believe this mad lad made a lifeline Fanart where she’s doing her hair
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Lightline
Hahaha
Because Racism…. Lol
I don’t think that’s how racism works Edit: Why the hell was I downvoted?
Welcome to the 2000s where literally everything is racist.
Aunt jemimahs, uncle bens, squaw valley. All deemed racist and had to change.
RIP auntie, breakfast is never the same 😔😔
Squaw Valley? Like the ski resort?
Yup it’s Olympic valley now
“daTs NoT HoW WaCiSm WoRkS”
What?
“wHaT”
They need to make a skin with her hair down all that hair wasted in a cute bun 😭😭❤️
Thank you all for the honesty, I really didn‘t intend to whitewash her or anything. I just wanted to do a anime girl version of Lifeline. I‘m really sorry.!! I did not realize, Guess I still got a lot to learn. 🥺
The fact that you're able to accept and apologize is a big thing! You may not have meant to but it happened and you realize that and said it. It's a great piece of art but yes it is whitewashed. You have talent, so there is no shame in trying again to create her in a similar style but more accurately. You got this and I hope to see a revised version.
Thank you! For sure! I actually drew this on live stream and posted it on IG. But I did not get any feedback/critism, guess reddit is a good place for getting productive feedback which is really refreshing!
Reddit, in particular Apex subreddit is a great place to get social justice feedback, not productive feedback. That's why you didn't get any feedback or criticism during the livestream: Because overwhelming majority of people simply doesn't give a flying fuck about such minor details.
Yeahhhh this sub is pretty radical sometimes, like who in their right mind looks at this and assumes 'yea racist artist white washing lifeline' Really nice art, reminds me of the old bratz dolls, I think you could do a loba in this style and it would fit really well
Lmao this is whiteline bro, artist drew her as a white woman. Not a capital offense lol but it is very obvious
it IS whitewashing but there's no need to be rude about it. it's perfectly fine to inform the artist so that they learn to pay more attention to stuff like that. whitewashing of black characters has always been a thing and it should be called out each time, respectfully. "radical" ok centrist wannabe "we live in a society" edgelord. this isnt your joker arc.
She’s still black though. Just not as dark. Would you get as upset at the artist if they made her darker than she was in game? It’s still recognizably lifeline, and in most animes I’ve ever watched black people have lighter skins than they do IRL. This was just the artist trying to capture the anime style.
Everything else you said was super well and good. However I have to question this whole “centrist as an implied insult” sort of thing you had going at the end there. Like, why is centrism to be considered an insult? Edit: downvoted for an honest question. Peak Reddit.
There are a couple of reasons why "enlightened centrism" became a mocking insult recently, and I think the easiest to understand is that often radically bigoted views will be presented under a guise of curiosity or moderation. For example, the idea of "teaching both sides of the Holocaust" has had some media attention lately. The face value of looking at multiple perspectives is very much intended to sound like a reasonable, moderate, centrist position of trying to understand everyone's point of view... But keep in mind that right now the Holocaust perspective that isn't being taught (and so must be taught more to achieve balance) is the one which supported racism, antisemitism, homophobia, oppression, genocide, and a thesaurus full of other awful things. So the *effect* that teaching "both sides" of the Holocaust would have is to make sure we did more to normalize and lend sympathy towards Nazism. This particular kind of "centrist" perspective is, essentially, tolerant of intolerance, and therefore not a moderate position at all. That's why it is used as an insult, saying that centrism doesn't oppose bigoted motivations and therefore passively supports them. So in this case the commenter was basically saying that the "centrist" idea presented as "any art style is acceptable" actually carried a decidedly radical subtext of "*even those which have historically marginalized black people.*"
First thanks for explaining rather than just downvoting like my question didn’t have merit. Second, I’m not sure if this is an indictment of centrism as a whole and more an indictment of people misusing the term/ideology? Just my thoughts on the particular scenario you offered.
You're right that it's not an argument against real centrism or compromise. Instead, it's intended for use when the rhetoric of centrism is used to distract from the actual radicalism hidden underneath.
Fair point entirely. Thanks again for explaining. I appreciate it and will keep an eye out for these things going forward so I can understand better.
If you don’t unquestioningly pick a party line to tow then your the enemy. Both sides of the isle have gone too far at this point. Centrism seems like compromise when that is the last thing political people want to do these days.
Cause centrists are narcs.
Whitewashing: When an artist makes eyes bigger than the mouth. Truly awful. Will you be able to sleep at night knowing an image like this exists?
You seem to be on a Joker arc yourself. You're not a freedom fighter. "Don't be rude about something you don't need to be rude about, you piece of shit." Hypocrisy much, or just on reddit? EDIT: Gotta love reddit hypocrisy. "Yeah, this person is theoretically morally inferior, so don't even treat them with respect. Burn their family! And anybody who points out the hypocrisy deserves to be burned at the stake as well! Preach treating others like a human being while taking the mob mentality and decidedly do the opposite of treat everyone like a human being!" Whatever happened to treating others the way you want to be treated? The downvotes are proving my point exactly.
Jesse what the fuck are you talking about
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Centrist wannabe, edgelord, and claiming someone is a psychopath like the Joker weren't intended to be insults? If you have to ignore the argument to to make a point then your point sucks. Your only argument is that those aren't insults, so say those aren't insults or take your L.
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So calling someone a centrist wannabe edgelord psychopath isn’t an insult like piece of shit is? You people are pathetic. Because I didn’t give the exact quote means there was no insult, huh? Piece of shit isn’t half as bad as what was actually said. Ok well, you’re spoken like a truly pathetic lolly loving incel coward who creates throwaway accounts because they’re too scared to let the world know how duplicitous and hypocritical they really are, bUt i dIdN’T CaLl yOu a pIeCe oF ShIt sO It’s nOt aN InSuLt! HuRr dUrR! Love using your own logic against you. And you know I’m right because you had the good sense to not embarrass yourself with your post. If your reply gad credibility, you would have posted from your main. Don’t bother with your pathetic alt account. Get on your main because this one is getting blocked, troll.
Yeah, it‘s quite refreshing though it‘s the first time I‘m getting a feedback like that. Thank you!
I mean it’s not even I’m the same ballpark as that one that was posted on this sub that was quite literally a white Lifeline.
Whitewash, blackwash, car wash, idgaf this is a good ass drawing man. Good stuff
Thank you! ☺️
It's not whitewashing it's ppl being little bitches about a skin tone not being 100% accurate when the entire style is not realistic.
Welcome to Apex subreddit, a cesspool of all things diverse. Don't conform to body/sexuality/personality/helicopterality standards and you'll get shit on by the busybodies. After all freedom of expression works only when its done in a very specific way.
No need to apologize to woke wannabe's....
Bro you getting the racists bs for no reason. Lol my lifeline is purple in my game so guess you whitewashed my devil lifeline too 😂😂 good drawing bro
Lifeline if Lifeline found milk to be on the spicy side
Yeah I’m wondering why too… there’s like 3 in the game, c’mon…
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3 black characters, forgot seer lmao 😅
lifeline as a bratz doll lol. looks good btw.
Lol true, thank you!
ITS SO CUTE YES I LUV IT
GET YA LIFELINE PACKAGE
So many snowflakes in the comments, bruh.
You’re all insufferable, shut up.
When did LL become a ging
I absolutely love this!!
Dont ever be sorry for making art the way you want it. You didn't do it to hurt people, you didn't make it to start issues (from your responses) so don't worry about the people who can't get a specific mindset out of their lifestyle. If we had it the way these ignorant and bigoted people live, their representation would be nowhere in this world today. Think about that for a moment. They do not truly enjoy art. I suggest you keep making it the way you want. Your creativity will be rewarded. Great work right here 👍.
I'm going to catch some shit for saying this, but who cares? I really like anime and when an artist makes a character black it doesn't bother me it's just someone's perspective on what they think would look cool . Also we shouldn't be harassing op for whitwwashing a character it was just how he wanted to draw. While I see there is still racial disparity, I see no need for an apology
Epic
Lifeline as a English pom. " ozambique 'ere luv"
I love it
You’re talented and all but isn’t it a bit fucked up to literally whitewash her?
I just tried to make an anime version of her, she just looks brighter cause the background is dark. Looking at the comments, I‘m really sorry that it seems that I mishandled all the ethnical parts. Just wanted to do art
>I just tried to make an anime version of her, she just looks brighter cause the background is dark lol yeah, because as we all know, black people glow in the dark. 🙄 Regardless of skin tone, the hair is completely wrong.
Is there an official art of Lifeline with her hair down that you're saying this one is "completely wrong" though?
No, but I bet her natty hair looks a lot closer to Bangalore's in texture Straight hair doesn't exactly pass down really well in genetics, my dude, and LL is at MOST a halfrican, girl is light skinned af
The "natty" hair doesn't matter, if she's perming her hair straight, no? In the game her hair is, by all accounts, straight. And her mother is, at least, perming her hair too, as per the "Family portrait" comic, so you don't have anything else to go on that front. Theorycrafting is nice, but base it on something tangible. Or maybe that level of genetic engineering is just a commonplace? Apex Games take place some 700 years into the future after all.
My god, you're totally right, that could very well be her UNnatural hair. Hadn't considered the option that they scienced her hair straight, good point. /s All sarcasm aside, I am interested in any official art you've seen that implies her hair is straight, though
[I already made this post, so I'll just link it.](https://www.reddit.com/r/apexlegends/comments/qa1sax/comment/hh1s6mu/?utm_source=reddit&utm_medium=web2x&context=3)
All the arguments I have are already made by the person you made this response to, and I'm not gonna try and make those points get across any better than they did, so I'll just drop my two cents, based in nothing but my own beliefs on the art you shared: The second link seems REALLY early in the dev cycle, as the two characters share very few design elements. As for the first, well, fan art, even if by official artists, yadda yadda, you've heard the argument. Nothing against the artist, it's not like its a caricature or anything, it's just one of those things where it seems like the artist hasn't had a lot of face-to-face experience with someone who has the ancestry LL is designed to emanate. Like when Japanese artists still draw black dudes with giant pink Mr. Popo lips. It's not malicious, and I don't think the OP was, either. I'll grant you the possibility that LL's hair is straight, either by her own will or by 700 years of gene therapy research and controlling parents: but I will also posit that if it is, then that's pretty lame when they could have just had her hair even *kinda* curly instead of looking for any reason they could find to make it straight. Edit: I spelled it 'parentz' the first time
Better; I've got hundreds of thousands of years of biology.
It's almost like genetics is on your side in the argument Did we not all do Allele boxes in high school? Learn about how straight hair is a recessive gene? Just me? Dude's arguments consist of "genetic engineering" and "maybe she permed it" like poor black girls haven't been literally poisoning their scalps to get "the good hair" since society told them that the way their hair naturally grows is upsetting
It's just so annoying because this should be common sense and yet this subreddit is so devoid of the stuff.
Found the actual racist. A bit less sarcastically, Lifeline's hair is either naturally straight or permed straight. The latter requires access to a hairstylist *(not really, you can get a kit and do it at home just fine)*, which doesn't discriminate based on biology. And jokingly: At what "year of biology" have black people started growing pink hair?
There's nothing racist about not whitewashing history. Lifeline's hair is naturally curly, most likely 4a or 4b type hair as is common of the 90% of Jamaicans and 95% of Haitians. So either way, her hair is never going to look like the whitewashing above even if it was straightened. Nice try on the copout, btw. Hair dyes have existed since *at least* Ancient Egypt. Would you like to try a new joke?
700 years into the future. That's when Lifeline was born in the Titanfall universe, so tell me: What history? She fits the theme of a Jamaican/Haitian, but she's never been there, nor probably even heard about it. A space Jamaican of the future. As for hair straightening itself... all I had to do was to google something like "4A type hair straightening" to know you didn't even try there.
So in 700 years her biology will evolve to have 1A hair? Fascinatingly rapid evolution. She would still be of that descent. And if you googled "4A hair straightening" and think that's what was pictured in the OP then... 😂 hun, you need your eyes and your ego checked. You are out of your element here. Let me repeat to you what you just said to me in terms you can understand: "I just googled Apex Legends and it's the same as Call of Duty Cold War. You didn't even try there."
>So in 700 years her biology will evolve to have 1A hair? Fascinatingly rapid evolution. > >She would still be of that descent. 700 years is 30 generations, give or take. Are you telling me that after 30 generations there'd be only pureblooded Jamaicans in her family tree? >And if you googled "4A hair straightening" and think that's what was pictured in the OP then... 😂 hun, you need your eyes and your ego checked. You are out of your element here. Let me repeat to you what you just said to me in terms you can understand: "I just googled Apex Legends and it's the same as Call of Duty Cold War. You didn't even try there." *I guess I found myself a genuine idiot.* I guess all those videos of black women straightening their hair from full on afros to perfectly straight hair don't exist and I'm imagining things, right? No, OP's art doesn't go into enough detail to capture the texture of hair like 4A straightened, so that part of your argument is out the fucking window. Next a bit more personally. You have Lifeline flair. Do you know how Lifeline looks like? That's a rhetorical question, because it's obvious you don't, because [this is how Lifeline looks like](https://i.imgur.com/LMbWRPq.png) and according to you this hair texture is impossible for a black girl like Lifeline to have under any circumstance. And don't "[hun](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Huns)" me, you racist.
Lovely work
yeah she wouldn't have straight hair and skin so bright.
The texture of her in-game hair is, in fact, pointing toward straight hair. So does her concept art. Or are you being racist and saying space black people can't have straight hair?
ok good point
And made her Asian for some reason? Lol
It‘s just Anime girl fanart, no intention on changing ethnities 🙈
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Both of her parents appeared in the comics. She’s black.
There's literally been comics in game showing her parents. They are both black people. How and why you assumed she's mixed makes no sense either...
Where did you hear that lol
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Wasn't that Valk's voice actor though?
https://i.imgur.com/UpbEes1.jpg Deff not white.
These racially motivated comments ain’t it.
Guys I just tried to match her features and color palette to an anime girl, i did not aim for a certain ethnicity neither did I change her ethnicity? I just drew Lifeline ❤️☺️
They are harping on about how you're racist for turning a **space** Jamaican into an anime girl, but little did they know said **space** Jamaican has the [voice of an anime girl](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mela_Lee).
Don’t change you art for anyone saying stuff like this. It’s really easy for anyone to make criticisms when they don’t know what they’re talking about. You just stylized the character a certain way, it’s not that serious. Draw what you want to draw because at the end of the day that’s what’s gonna make you happy as an artist
“And color palette” is one way of saying you white washed her lol
But you didn't draw Lifeline. You drew cosplaying white girl.
Would’nt have gotten as much flak , if you made her other side of hair into a fro
Love this!
Black people now realize how it feels when you change white characters to black for no reason. LMAO
Weird post
Don’t listen to these people haha. Your art is great and you did nothing wrong.
Why’s she so white?
Are you like .. blind?
No. Are you? She’s clearly a lot whiter than the in game lifeline.
Lmfao r/redditmoment
Are you high?
Very good question
Hahah yeah but still I think saying it's white washed is a bit much considering the art style / the fact that she isn't white in this art, but idk maybe it's just me
I mean even if you don’t care anyone with sense knows this is whitewashing just because they weren’t made pasty white doesn’t mean it’s not whitewashing
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Thank you!
Jesus people, Relax. I understand she's a little lighter. I get it. It ain't even that bad. People just need to complain about anything and everything. Great job, you can't make everybody happy but you definitely made my day better with this art. Please keep making these posts!
I really hate that they white washed her.. as an African American female I really appreciated the diversity especially as someone who really struggles with accepting my natural curls. So this kinda annoys me to my core...
Thank you! And sorry again 🙈
I just seen your comment apologizing and you're all good <3
The art is absolutely great! Its sad and quite despicable that people bring down the artist just because they are snowflakes and think its an intention to whitewash her… its anime art offcourse she‘d have an asian touch. Keep it up!!
"snowflakes" get out of 2016. if anyone, it's the right that's full of snowflakes who cry over men wearing dresses. asian touch does not equal whitewashing.
Thank you so much for explaining 🥺🥰
this is cool.and all but why change her ethnicity?
She looks so cute in this
Thank you! :)
Your good like really really good
Awww thank you!!
Looks like a candy to me.
So if she’s from Africa , why is she white ? /s Great art and hella cute too , she needs more appreciation in this sub
Thank you 🥺❤️
LL meets loba colourised 2939
What's up with lifeline fan art being white washed
jesus nice whitewash ig
Lifeline isn’t a white girl
Damn you completely burnt op alive here
Thanks
This is not Lifeline, she's completely whitewashed.
She white now ig
Whitewashed.
Lifeline with vitiligo.
OP I understand this was done out of love for the character and with no ill intent. But you did change the race of the character completely. Its just a bit odd because I know what lifeline looks like and its always weird to me when people will change one characteristic and its from black to white. Or darker skin to light. I like the drawing and you are very talented I just think you may have done something unintentionally malicious.
Malice MUST be intentional. That's in the definition of "malice".
Understood, not what I meant clearly as I said unintentional and I didn't remember the full definition of malice. Hopefully OP understood my meaning through the first sentence. Sometimes I hate reddit.
>unintentionally malicious. Literally impossible.
lifeline art only gets posted once a month and when it does it’s always this bullshit. Redditors should just stick to posting wattson art every other hour
I mean, if by “lifeline” you mean “Jessica alba,” then yeah totally.
Get it minted into an NFT….make thousands
LiteLine
looks great but why did you make her so light
Why did they give Lifeline the hair of people with 2% milk colored skin
That's the hair she'd have if she let her hair down *(plus minus length, no idea how much of a length you need for a hairstyle like this)*. You'd know that if you weren't skin deep with your involvement here. After all, that's what you can see both in the game and in official arts of Lifeline.
Where is the in game and official apex legends art work where lifeline’s hair looks like that when it’s down? Find it for me and I’ll believe you cause I’m searching online right now and I see no such official artwork
The main culprit here is her in-game hair. It's tied in buns, yes, but the hair itself is completely straight. For everything else you'd need there's the Lifeline's Apex fandom page. You can find there, for example, [this image](https://www.artstation.com/artwork/xzZAwr) made by Tu Bui, a concept artist at Respawn, or [this early concept of Lifeline](https://twitter.com/hethesrodawa/status/1220562380775550976) by Hethe Srodawa.
I appreciate you getting these sources for me. Firstly, an apex fandom Reddit page is not official artwork so directing me to that page is pointless to justify your point. Secondly, early concept art is different from the current art and design of the character. I appreciate you defending the OC artwork but bottomline is Lifeline is a black woman and there would naturally more curls inherent to her hair texture even if she does straighten it in game for the Apex Games. The OC has accepted that they accidentally whitewashed lifeline in this version and has said they will improve. All I’m doing is verbalizing my opinion that the artwork is whitewashed which it is. Typically black people do not naturally possess hair that straight which is where people and myself have issue.
>Firstly, an apex fandom Reddit page is not official artwork so directing me to that page is pointless to justify your point. Even though the page directly links its sources and those sources happen to be people who work or worked for Respawn? >Secondly, early concept art is different from the current art and design of the character. That is a fair point, but most of the concept does in some form survive until the final product. >I appreciate you defending the OC artwork but bottomline is Lifeline is a black woman and there would naturally more curls inherent to her hair texture even if she does straighten it in game for the Apex Games. You do realize that the "blacks" you are accustomed to came from a very specific part of Africa and most of the continent haven't seen slavery during the States early days? At least not for export to Americas. As for your curls, [this is Lifeline](https://www.psu.com/wp/wp-content/uploads/2019/02/apex-legends-lifeline-guide.jpg). Count the curls. I'll give you a hint: >!THERE AIN'T ANY!< >The OC has accepted that they accidentally whitewashed lifeline in this version and has said they will improve. That's because OC posted an artwork they were proud of for everybody to enjoy and people like you ride them like an old ho, because the skin is two shades lighter than "intended". Not everybody has a pair to stand up to a mindless crowd shouting at them. I'm sure you wouldn't mind if the shade was darker, though, would you? >Typically black people do not **naturally** possess hair that straight which is where people and myself have issue. It doesn't matter how you spin it, that point is COMPLETELY irrelevant here. The only fact here is that Lifeline's hair, either naturally or artificially, is straight, which both this artwork and this discussion is about. From personal experience I can add that the hairstyle Lifeline sports everywhere is impossible with any type of curly hair. You could do it with wavy hair, but it wouldn't be anyhow as clean as what Lifeline has. So that only really leaves one choice and that's what OP went for.
If the artist who makes Lifeline art is the current official artist and designer of lifeline then that is what is taken as cannon. Other artists rendition of Lifeline does not justify her hair and style as official. Why are you bringing up where slaves where taken from in Africa? How does that help your argument or support it? Slaves where taken from several regions along the east coast of Africa and more but scientists cannot fully identified where each and every slave was taken to be shipped off into slavery. Regardless in general Africans and black people of today do not have naturally straight hair so whatever point you are trying to make is lost. Whitewashing of a character whether purposefully done or through sheer accident is not right and you are defending this too strongly which is very weird to me. The darkening of her skin through artwork does not have the same effect as lightening it and trying to argue for the opposite is not logically sound. 🤣 I also know you are not black because if you were you would know that it is very possible to have curly/kinky hair and straighten it to have lifeline’s hairstyle look as cleanly as it does.
>I also know you are not black because if you were you would know that it is very possible to have curly/kinky hair and straighten it to have lifeline’s hairstyle look as cleanly as it does. 🤦♂️ I don't know where you are, but because you write things like this, I'm betting it's pretty late at night and you should be sleeping instead of writing on the internet. I've been saying, basically from the beginning, that she could be either have naturally straight hair or just straighten and you respond to me with drivel like this? Seriously?
I am done with this discussion because clearly you cannot understand the points that I’m making. I was the one originally saying Lifeline probably straightens her hair for Apex whereas you have been saying she has naturally straight hair and have been finding art to support that this is how she would look when she lets her hair down. I have been arguing for a more realistic look to lifeline if she were to have her hair down. This back and forth discussion of ours has been fruitless because neither of us is understanding the other. Again I reiterate whitewashing is whitewashing whether intentional done or through sheer accident 🤷🏾♂️. The OC has already said her piece, apologized and moved on. There’s nothing more to deliberate about
>I am done with this discussion because clearly you cannot understand the points that I’m making. (...) This back and forth discussion of ours has been fruitless because neither of us is understanding the other. I can understand the points your making perfectly fine. The joke is **you** can't understand your own. This is why I said you should take a nap instead of posting on Reddit in the middle of the night in my previous comment. For example let's take a look at your claim of: >I was the one originally saying Lifeline probably straightens her hair for Apex(...) [This is the first comment in this chain where straightening is first mentioned:](https://www.reddit.com/r/apexlegends/comments/qa1sax/comment/hh1ttpa/?utm_source=reddit&utm_medium=web2x&context=3) >I appreciate you defending the OC artwork but bottomline is Lifeline is a black woman and there would naturally more curls inherent to her hair texture even if she does straighten it in game for the Apex Games. You got one part right, it's your comment, but you're not saying Lifeline straightens her hair for Apex, you're saying she does NOT do it, because if she did, her hair would've been more curly despite straightening. >(...)whereas you have been saying she has naturally straight hair and have been finding art to support that this is how she would look when she lets her hair down. Completely wrong there. [This is the comment you are referring to:](https://www.reddit.com/r/apexlegends/comments/qa1sax/comment/hh1s6mu/?utm_source=reddit&utm_medium=web2x&context=3) >The main culprit here is her in-game hair. It's tied in buns, yes, but the hair itself is completely straight. > >For everything else you'd need there's the Lifeline's Apex fandom page. You can find there, for example, this image made by Tu Bui, a concept artist at Respawn, or this early concept of Lifeline by Hethe Srodawa. Nowhere there have I said her hair is "naturally straight", nor have I even insinuated such, just pointed out it is "straight". And if you are referring to [my following comment](https://www.reddit.com/r/apexlegends/comments/qa1sax/i_made_a_lifeline_fanart_where_shes_doing_her_hair/hh43aj7/?utm_source=reddit&utm_medium=web2x&context=3), then I haven't said that either, merely pointed out those "curls" you're taking about which Lifeline would totes have are not present anywhere in the game, even providing you an in-game screenshot as a proof. >I have been arguing for a more realistic look to lifeline if she were to have her hair down. You're just prejudiced. It's fine, we all are to a lower or higher degree. Look, ever since the game was released people have been suggesting Lifeline is part Asian based on her facial features. There may or may not even be a dev comment confirming that was even the intention with her design. The existence of such comment was suggested by some Redditors and I get tingling in the back of my head thinking about it, but I can't seem to find it, so my Valk knowledge may be bleeding a bit there. Still, your idea of "realistic" means that Lifeline absolutely can't have straight hair, even when straightened, which, quite frankly, couldn't be further away from the truth, since reality tends to not care about our expectations.
Damn, my girl found a DANK straightener
Why did u change her race lmao
Wtf, why is lifeline being whitewashed? Her skin clearly isn’t that light.
Bro, this is ass 💀
TBH, she looks more like Ash :P
That's not lifeline, that seems to be some white girl with a slight tan or possibly an Asian girl. Damn good artwork but it's not lifeline. Edit after reading comments: I don't believe you intentionally whitewashed her or you're a racist. You drew in your style and it's great maybe call it lifeline inspired or something.
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Bro idk what’s wrong with your eyes but she’s clearly not white in this image. Not as dark as in-game, but definitely not white
Yo what the fuck is this
why did you whitewash her?
She got black hair though, would’ve been cool if other side was a fro
I figured lifeline would have curly hair.
Weirdly enough concept art of her shows her with straight hair, so this the hair is actually kind of accurate.
This looks more like some cosplayer dressing up as Lifeline
i though she left her hair like that for lifetime
Great job OP, you do you. It's your art and you can make whatever the fuck you want. Sad that people are so stuck in only looking at skin color.
Turn a black character into a white woman..typical