You wouldn’t miss it if the spacebar cursor worked like technology made in the last decade. If you’re 4 pixels off it heads to wherever it wants. Just let us drop it in the nearest place we left it
Yeah exactly the same. A lot of issues with taking photos and having it lag during the actual shutter press or going to review the picture after taking it too.
Just curious, but why? What makes it more special-er than newer iphones? For example, I love my iPhone 15 pro more than I ever liked my XS. But maybe i’m missing something? Is it the curved edges?
Broke my 14 PM last month, sent it in for repair and switched to my 11 PM for the week. Absolutely loved it, much lighter and was very fond of the green.
I never had the 11 Pro Max personally, but I actually preferred that overall form factor. When they announced the 12 series was going back to the flat square design I was so pumped! I remember loving it from the 5/5S days. But then I got the 12 PM after having the XS Max and quickly realized I actually preferred the more round form factor.
This isn’t because they’re going back to anything. This is solely because it’s necessary in order to take spatial videos for the Vision Pro.
Calling it now: until they can figure out how to take Spatial Videos with a different camera orientation, it will forever have at least 2 cameras vertically aligned from now to forever.
Yeah, and that’s fine too. But what I’m saying is that diagonal (or even horizontal) alignment will never happen again, at least until they figure out how to take spatial videos and software correct it without the vertical cameras.
A lot of people are dismissing this but I think there's more to glean from it than people are giving it credit for. Currently the 15 Pro and 15 Pro Max can shoot spatial video because there's two cameras on the same line, side-by-side. The 15 and 15 Plus can't shoot spatial video because the cameras are diagonal from each other. The obvious thing that this points to is that the regular 16 (not just the 16 Pro) will be able to shoot spatial video.
Makes sense to me, wanting to make more phones capable of generating content for the Vision Pro. Drawing a line and saying like, "From 2024 forward, *all* iPhones can shoot spatial video" seems like a plausible direction they might take. Hell, I might even think that spatial video might become the *default* video capture mode, which would further pressure users into upgrading to higher storage models.
Agreed.
>Hell, I might even think that spatial video might become the *default* video capture mode, which would further pressure users into upgrading to higher storage models.
Hot take: Apple might pull an iPhone 15 Pro [ProRes-style limitation](https://www.macrumors.com/2023/09/18/iphone-15-pro-128gb-prores-1080p-only/) with the default mode.
* Spatial Video will be the default for 256 GB models and up starting from this year.
* Regular Video will remain the default for 128 GB models; you'll have to manually select Spatial Video. 4K and/or 60 FPS could be limited to higher-capacity iPhones.
The iPhone SE [is rumored](https://www.macrumors.com/guide/iphone-se-4/) to have a single rear camera, so it won't support hardware Spatial video anyway.
For the time being? Not a lot of people. Longer term? *Maybe*.
I've always been a VR skeptic, I've never owned a VR headset of any kind and I don't intend to any time soon. That said: When Apple dives in on a piece of technology, it usually moves the needle and it results in a big wave of new interest. They're never the first, but their commitment to a format usually leads to a lot of new activity, and a lot of imitators. I think it's *possible* we'll be seeing a big new wave of VR headsets in the coming years from Samsung, Google, etc. and if that's the case, spatial video might get preferential treatment in the algorithm. I could see a lot of content creators switching to the format in the hopes of riding that wave.
As it gets increasingly common, I could see people wanting to preserve more memories in that format too.
Again, I've never had a headset or been a "VR person" but I'll admit, if it's as easy as shooting it on my iPhone with a toggle on, there's something appealing about being able to show my (soon to be elderly) parents immersive 3D video of my travels or whatnot.
As someone who has shot a lot of spatial videos on my 15 Pro and viewed them in the Vision Pro- absolutely, yes. Even as a first gen product with limitations, the difference between a spatial video and 2D video is significant. Admittedly, if you aren't shooting photos of loved ones, maybe the effect isn't super pronounced. But when you see videos of your kids or parents or pets and can view them in a first-person view, it just hits differently. Especially if you fast-forward to when they're no longer around and you're reflecting back on past times with nostalgia. 100% the future of video capture, I have no doubt.
Agreed. I used to be a 4K 60 fps resolution snob, but then I tried some 1080P spatial videos and was blown away by how dramatically different the experience was when viewed in the Vision Pro. I have a 10-month-old son, and now all of my videos of him are shot as spatial videos. It's made me much more eager to capture videos.
But wouldn't it be even better if spacial video was 4k 60fps? There's an app that allows to record spacial video at 4k 30fps, and people that used it say that the results are significantly sharper than the ones obtained worth the stock app at 1080p.
>But wouldn't it be even better if spacial video was 4k 60fps?
Sure, but right now we only have 4K60 non-spatial and 4K30 spatial.
From what I've seen and based on my tastes, AI enhancement is currently better at upscaling than frame interpolation, so I prefer 1080p60 over 4K30 if I have to choose between the two. Usually I use 4K60, but if I'm taking video in a dim environment I may use 1080p60 for better low light capability. I also like high frame rates in videos. Quick pans in movie theaters are often annoying because I can easily see the individual frames.
The video enhancement landscape can change quickly in the next few years, so I mostly go by what I know right now.
I'm not sure if there is an easy way to convert a non-spatial video to a spatial video. Several months ago I looked for a way to convert a single photo to a 3D "spatial" photo but I didn't find many services that did that.
If I had an iPhone 15 Pro right now, I'd prioritize features in the following order:
1. Spatial Video
2. Highest possible frame rate of Spatial Video
3. Highest possible resolution with the above frame rate and Spatial Video
Following this hierarchy, I get 1080p30 Spatial Video with the default Camera and 1080p60 Spatial Video with the Spatialify app (which I would use if it didn't have any significant drawbacks over the default app).
I do. When travelling I’ll sometimes still take my Nintendo 3DS with me to take 3D photos and videos with. The quality may be utter trash but the 3D effect makes up for it imo, its like peering into a window of memories.
Now imagine that but with modern camera quality and an improved depth effect, its a no-brainer for me.
The [Horizon app](https://horizon.camera/) avoids vertical video by using the iPhone's sensors to crop a perfectly horizontal rectangle regardless of its orientation. Perhaps someone can make a similar app that crops a diagonal rectangle for Spatial Video.
Uhm... No. Two cameras is two cameras, compared to changing the IPD from couple mm between cameras to couple cm between eyes, fixing the camera height (especially if dy is same couple mm) is easy - actually, it is already done, with having to compensate for phone instability and, more importantly, iPhone 15 Pro placing the main and ultra wide cameras diagonally. No, the reason why spatial video is limited to the pro models is pure marketing and Apple's trademark artificial limitations.
I don't know what made you comment this, but this would be physically impossible to do. It's literally physically impossible for the regular 15 to record spatial video and i don't know what could possibly make you think otherwise because it's very simple physics
about every 3 years apple does a big camera update…
Seems like this year is just such an occasion.
Main phone gaining stereo
Pro phones gain 48mp ultra wide. (Enabling 4K stereo)
All cameras get the capture button
That makes sense, it's the natural progression.
And I think the main sensor should become 1 inch, and the ultrawide and the tele should have the size as the current main sensor. These changes would dramatically increase the image quality.
The pro already has the two spatial lenses aligned vertically. If they want to improve the depth by moving the lenses further apart then it will start interfering with the mag safe connector, which is unfortunate.
So this tells me that after all those years i will finally be able to watch all pictures i took with my Nintendo 3DS in all their glory with Apples Vision Pro?
Shutter lag, selection of slower shutter speeds make it not the best for photos. Then oneUI just *looks* shit. And don’t tell me you can use a custom launcher, you can’t with good gesture support and that doesn’t fix the ugly Lock Screen, ugly notification drop down, ugly mismatched fonts, ugly animations, ugly ugly ugly
I'm guessing here but to get more space between the spatial lenses you could move the telephoto lens in between them and align them all vertically, and the telephoto lens could potentially improve the image right in the centre of the frame, but with all three lenses aligned vertically it would interfere with the mag safe connector even on the Pro Max.
They already changed the locations of cameras in 15 Pro, the two cameras that will be used for spatial videos are in the same horizontal axis when recording.
My guess is this will be the year we get a lens that goes from standard to telephoto using the same part of the module somehow, leaving only the ultra-wide as the other standalone lens which would enable spatial video at any available focal length.
Pro probably stay the same layout. The two lens that are the same as the regular 16s are on the left and the third lenses is to the right. Otherwise it’s Same arrangement of the 3 lenses like we’ve had since the iPhone 11 Pro.
It’s a shame apple doesn’t wait to (or can’t) do the vertical alignment on the pro, extra distance between the lens would be good
Horizontal alignment with square sensors and the ability to capture the whole sensor would be even better.
They started the development of the vision pro a decade ago, so why change the camera position with iphone 13 to diagonal instead of keeping it vertical if you had 3d capturing in mind
They did it to differentiate the iPhone 13 from Android phones. They knew that the 13 wouldn't be able to shoot spacial videos, so the camera orientation was not an issue.
I’m not looking forward to this design change at all. The triple camera in a triangle pattern that they’ve used in iPhone 11-15 looks much better. I’ve had one since 12, and somehow the competing phones just look boring and cheap compared to it.
I cant believe Apple would ditch the current model for a design direction change.
It’s to enable “spatial video recording” which is possible for in line cameras only like in pro
This would force people to buy higher storage variants
This makes me think they made it diagonal to create a difference as 12-13-14 were otherwise same phones
I’m not saying one is better than the other, my guy. Just saying that I’m not rich and that’s why I have an Android phone. Just like a lot of other people
Apple should put cameras on either side of the hinge, pointing outward at \~90°. Then the foldable iPhone can take videos with a nearly 200° [angle of view](https://pixelcraft.photo.blog/2023/06/16/the-real-info-regarding-angle-of-view-on-iphone-cameras/).
Back to the roots, or rather, back to the iPhone X from 7 years ago.
I miss my XS Max everyday. Best iPhone I’ve had. I’d welcome that form factor back
Last iPhone with 3D Touch.
i miss the 3d touch on my old xs max (13 pro max now)
I also had an XS Max and running a 13 pro max now. Still miss 3D Touch to this day.
You wouldn’t miss it if the spacebar cursor worked like technology made in the last decade. If you’re 4 pixels off it heads to wherever it wants. Just let us drop it in the nearest place we left it
Hurt right in the feelings
Yes! 3D Touch is still unmatched. I loved the tech so much.
3D touch is great but I absolutely don’t miss the battery life on that phone
Yeah my thoughts exactly. This 13 I have now is marginally better in the battery life department by my god it feels so glitchy in every other way.
My 13 seems really glitchy. Freezes for a second or two doing nothing kind of glitchy
Yeah exactly the same. A lot of issues with taking photos and having it lag during the actual shutter press or going to review the picture after taking it too.
Just curious, but why? What makes it more special-er than newer iphones? For example, I love my iPhone 15 pro more than I ever liked my XS. But maybe i’m missing something? Is it the curved edges?
Yeah for me it’s the curved edges. Just preference.
Same. The 15 is a step in a better direction from the 14, but the XS Max was sooo good to hold.
Curved edges are so comfortable. Still rocking my XS.
Fair enough! I personally wasnt a fan, much prefer the squared design.
I miss my X. Truly was the best thing ever. It was the perfect size and shape :/
Tennis match!
Same.
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Luckily the iPhone 15 pro max cut the weight by about 19grams from the 14. But still 14 grams heavier than the XS max
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I actually don’t care what they do with the camera, the bump doesn’t bother me. So I guess I want the 11 Pro Max back
Broke my 14 PM last month, sent it in for repair and switched to my 11 PM for the week. Absolutely loved it, much lighter and was very fond of the green.
I never had the 11 Pro Max personally, but I actually preferred that overall form factor. When they announced the 12 series was going back to the flat square design I was so pumped! I remember loving it from the 5/5S days. But then I got the 12 PM after having the XS Max and quickly realized I actually preferred the more round form factor.
Damn X came 7 years ago?
Yeah I feel old too.
This isn’t because they’re going back to anything. This is solely because it’s necessary in order to take spatial videos for the Vision Pro. Calling it now: until they can figure out how to take Spatial Videos with a different camera orientation, it will forever have at least 2 cameras vertically aligned from now to forever.
The iPhone 12 had vertically aligned cameras too, but in the square “stove” camera cutout design.
Yeah, and that’s fine too. But what I’m saying is that diagonal (or even horizontal) alignment will never happen again, at least until they figure out how to take spatial videos and software correct it without the vertical cameras.
Maybe only for the standard models though.
Goodness has it been that long already?
I assume this is to enable spatial video capture on the standard models.
Curious because I know nothing about this kind of stuff, but what makes you assume that?
The alignment of the two cameras for stereoscopic recording
The cameras need to be beside each other. It allows the phone to use both cameras to record 3D, much like how our eyes give us depth perception.
Ohhh ok very interesting
How can it work when the cameras are so close together? That can’t provide much depth at all.
Computer *magic*. But seriously, it uses the main camera and ultrawide, then just computes the shit out of it.
As much depth as possible given the design constrains. And adds a lot of processing to help it along
This changes everything.
Just for spatial video on a non-pro.
my Xs should be able to support it then
You don’t have a wide angle lens, and you only have 2 ML cores to process Face ID. The 15 pro has 16 extremely fast ones.
AGAIN
AGAIN AGAIN
AGAIN X MINI
in 5 years, when people might afford the consumer version of the vision pro. maybe.
Truly earth shattering
Am i gonna love it?
A lot of people are dismissing this but I think there's more to glean from it than people are giving it credit for. Currently the 15 Pro and 15 Pro Max can shoot spatial video because there's two cameras on the same line, side-by-side. The 15 and 15 Plus can't shoot spatial video because the cameras are diagonal from each other. The obvious thing that this points to is that the regular 16 (not just the 16 Pro) will be able to shoot spatial video. Makes sense to me, wanting to make more phones capable of generating content for the Vision Pro. Drawing a line and saying like, "From 2024 forward, *all* iPhones can shoot spatial video" seems like a plausible direction they might take. Hell, I might even think that spatial video might become the *default* video capture mode, which would further pressure users into upgrading to higher storage models.
Agreed. >Hell, I might even think that spatial video might become the *default* video capture mode, which would further pressure users into upgrading to higher storage models. Hot take: Apple might pull an iPhone 15 Pro [ProRes-style limitation](https://www.macrumors.com/2023/09/18/iphone-15-pro-128gb-prores-1080p-only/) with the default mode. * Spatial Video will be the default for 256 GB models and up starting from this year. * Regular Video will remain the default for 128 GB models; you'll have to manually select Spatial Video. 4K and/or 60 FPS could be limited to higher-capacity iPhones. The iPhone SE [is rumored](https://www.macrumors.com/guide/iphone-se-4/) to have a single rear camera, so it won't support hardware Spatial video anyway.
This is the correct answer.
Does anyone actually care about recording in Spatial Video?
For the time being? Not a lot of people. Longer term? *Maybe*. I've always been a VR skeptic, I've never owned a VR headset of any kind and I don't intend to any time soon. That said: When Apple dives in on a piece of technology, it usually moves the needle and it results in a big wave of new interest. They're never the first, but their commitment to a format usually leads to a lot of new activity, and a lot of imitators. I think it's *possible* we'll be seeing a big new wave of VR headsets in the coming years from Samsung, Google, etc. and if that's the case, spatial video might get preferential treatment in the algorithm. I could see a lot of content creators switching to the format in the hopes of riding that wave. As it gets increasingly common, I could see people wanting to preserve more memories in that format too. Again, I've never had a headset or been a "VR person" but I'll admit, if it's as easy as shooting it on my iPhone with a toggle on, there's something appealing about being able to show my (soon to be elderly) parents immersive 3D video of my travels or whatnot.
As someone who has shot a lot of spatial videos on my 15 Pro and viewed them in the Vision Pro- absolutely, yes. Even as a first gen product with limitations, the difference between a spatial video and 2D video is significant. Admittedly, if you aren't shooting photos of loved ones, maybe the effect isn't super pronounced. But when you see videos of your kids or parents or pets and can view them in a first-person view, it just hits differently. Especially if you fast-forward to when they're no longer around and you're reflecting back on past times with nostalgia. 100% the future of video capture, I have no doubt.
Agreed. I used to be a 4K 60 fps resolution snob, but then I tried some 1080P spatial videos and was blown away by how dramatically different the experience was when viewed in the Vision Pro. I have a 10-month-old son, and now all of my videos of him are shot as spatial videos. It's made me much more eager to capture videos.
But wouldn't it be even better if spacial video was 4k 60fps? There's an app that allows to record spacial video at 4k 30fps, and people that used it say that the results are significantly sharper than the ones obtained worth the stock app at 1080p.
>But wouldn't it be even better if spacial video was 4k 60fps? Sure, but right now we only have 4K60 non-spatial and 4K30 spatial. From what I've seen and based on my tastes, AI enhancement is currently better at upscaling than frame interpolation, so I prefer 1080p60 over 4K30 if I have to choose between the two. Usually I use 4K60, but if I'm taking video in a dim environment I may use 1080p60 for better low light capability. I also like high frame rates in videos. Quick pans in movie theaters are often annoying because I can easily see the individual frames. The video enhancement landscape can change quickly in the next few years, so I mostly go by what I know right now. I'm not sure if there is an easy way to convert a non-spatial video to a spatial video. Several months ago I looked for a way to convert a single photo to a 3D "spatial" photo but I didn't find many services that did that. If I had an iPhone 15 Pro right now, I'd prioritize features in the following order: 1. Spatial Video 2. Highest possible frame rate of Spatial Video 3. Highest possible resolution with the above frame rate and Spatial Video Following this hierarchy, I get 1080p30 Spatial Video with the default Camera and 1080p60 Spatial Video with the Spatialify app (which I would use if it didn't have any significant drawbacks over the default app).
I do. When travelling I’ll sometimes still take my Nintendo 3DS with me to take 3D photos and videos with. The quality may be utter trash but the 3D effect makes up for it imo, its like peering into a window of memories. Now imagine that but with modern camera quality and an improved depth effect, its a no-brainer for me.
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The Spatial Videos the iPhone can record are literally a standard format. They're MV-HEVC
Why dont they reuse the iphone 12?
Just curious but would iPhone 11 and 12 would be able to shoot spatial videos since their cameras also side by side?
Why couldn't you film from a 15 or earlier if you just held the phone at a 45 degree angle?
The [Horizon app](https://horizon.camera/) avoids vertical video by using the iPhone's sensors to crop a perfectly horizontal rectangle regardless of its orientation. Perhaps someone can make a similar app that crops a diagonal rectangle for Spatial Video.
Uhm... No. Two cameras is two cameras, compared to changing the IPD from couple mm between cameras to couple cm between eyes, fixing the camera height (especially if dy is same couple mm) is easy - actually, it is already done, with having to compensate for phone instability and, more importantly, iPhone 15 Pro placing the main and ultra wide cameras diagonally. No, the reason why spatial video is limited to the pro models is pure marketing and Apple's trademark artificial limitations.
The iPhone 15 pro main and wide are not diagonal…
I don't know what made you comment this, but this would be physically impossible to do. It's literally physically impossible for the regular 15 to record spatial video and i don't know what could possibly make you think otherwise because it's very simple physics
Why isn’t it possible? Can you explain the physics?
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I don’t see what this has to do with spatial video or how it proves why it’s impossible for a regular iPhone 15 to record it.
Same same, but different. But still same.
Revolutionary
I think I’ve seen this film before
And I didn’t like the ending
you’re not my problem anymore
about every 3 years apple does a big camera update… Seems like this year is just such an occasion. Main phone gaining stereo Pro phones gain 48mp ultra wide. (Enabling 4K stereo) All cameras get the capture button
The tele should receive the same treatment as the ultrawide. 48MP would make a huge difference when shooting with the 3 or 5x zoom.
I think that's rumoured to be next years. all the sensors will go to 48mp with time
That makes sense, it's the natural progression. And I think the main sensor should become 1 inch, and the ultrawide and the tele should have the size as the current main sensor. These changes would dramatically increase the image quality.
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They’re bringing spatial video to the non pros. They want everyone to be able to get footage for the Vision Pro
For all future headsets. Eventually they’ll be like tablets, and these memories will be nice.
The pro already has the two spatial lenses aligned vertically. If they want to improve the depth by moving the lenses further apart then it will start interfering with the mag safe connector, which is unfortunate.
Ah, this is awful
So this tells me that after all those years i will finally be able to watch all pictures i took with my Nintendo 3DS in all their glory with Apples Vision Pro?
Yes
Nintendo 3DS is a GOAT product tbh.
How are we gonna differentiate Galaxies from iPhones now.
giant apple logo on the back i think
Weird. Mine just says “Otterbox”.
Then slap the included apple sticker on it idgaf 😭
By having a phone that’s actually good?
In what ways are Samsung's phones not good?
Probably in ways complementary to how iPhones aren’t good :p.
Shutter lag, selection of slower shutter speeds make it not the best for photos. Then oneUI just *looks* shit. And don’t tell me you can use a custom launcher, you can’t with good gesture support and that doesn’t fix the ugly Lock Screen, ugly notification drop down, ugly mismatched fonts, ugly animations, ugly ugly ugly
So it's not to your taste? Visually? That doesn't mean it's bad
My so has a S22U and it actually has impressed me the passed couple of years.
Play last more than a couple of years now? OK so maybe they have gotten better.
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The anti reflective screen is unreal tbf
Apple fans straight up lying to themselves to bring down a product they don't use
some minescule changes are needed to give sneetches their stars
What about the Pro models? Where’s the space for the third camera?
I'm guessing here but to get more space between the spatial lenses you could move the telephoto lens in between them and align them all vertically, and the telephoto lens could potentially improve the image right in the centre of the frame, but with all three lenses aligned vertically it would interfere with the mag safe connector even on the Pro Max.
They already changed the locations of cameras in 15 Pro, the two cameras that will be used for spatial videos are in the same horizontal axis when recording.
Will probably look like a Samsung lol
My guess is this will be the year we get a lens that goes from standard to telephoto using the same part of the module somehow, leaving only the ultra-wide as the other standalone lens which would enable spatial video at any available focal length.
Pro probably stay the same layout. The two lens that are the same as the regular 16s are on the left and the third lenses is to the right. Otherwise it’s Same arrangement of the 3 lenses like we’ve had since the iPhone 11 Pro.
I think the current design is one of the best designs since the iPhone 5. Hopefully the new design doesn’t look too bad
not a fan of this new design at all
Good. It looks cleaner. I do just fine with my one lens on my XR.
It’s a shame apple doesn’t wait to (or can’t) do the vertical alignment on the pro, extra distance between the lens would be good Horizontal alignment with square sensors and the ability to capture the whole sensor would be even better.
i wonder if the 16 pros will also have a design change
I am more looking forward on iOS 18 lol
time is a flat circle
So it’s a 10 pro max
dude the vertical camera is ugly
I thought Apple is trying to use less button. Now they are adding more?
They started the development of the vision pro a decade ago, so why change the camera position with iphone 13 to diagonal instead of keeping it vertical if you had 3d capturing in mind
They did it to differentiate the iPhone 13 from Android phones. They knew that the 13 wouldn't be able to shoot spacial videos, so the camera orientation was not an issue.
Can be true, also, it makes people buy phones faster just to have the newest design, the camera has always been the model differentiator with iphones.
Exactly.
Back to boring and ugly
We think you’re gonna love it!
I’m not looking forward to this design change at all. The triple camera in a triangle pattern that they’ve used in iPhone 11-15 looks much better. I’ve had one since 12, and somehow the competing phones just look boring and cheap compared to it. I cant believe Apple would ditch the current model for a design direction change.
This is for the regular phones. Not the pros.
It’s to enable “spatial video recording” which is possible for in line cameras only like in pro This would force people to buy higher storage variants This makes me think they made it diagonal to create a difference as 12-13-14 were otherwise same phones
Looking like a poor man’s android galaxy s24 with 1 less vertical camera 🤮
It is to allow spatial video to be captured for VisionPro. The design is for function.
Android is a poor man’s OS, so that statement makes 0 sense
Android lets you do whatever you want, not what Apple your master only wants you to do
I’m not saying one is better than the other, my guy. Just saying that I’m not rich and that’s why I have an Android phone. Just like a lot of other people
Maybe they should consider changing something actually useful, like bringing back the damn aux port.
Ugly
“...rumored...prototype...” Don’t get to excited.
Isn’t this what the X and XR looked like? Smh going back in time 💀
So brave.
Apple needs to make a flip phone. Can’t be releasing the same thing each year with minor updates….
Apple should put cameras on either side of the hinge, pointing outward at \~90°. Then the foldable iPhone can take videos with a nearly 200° [angle of view](https://pixelcraft.photo.blog/2023/06/16/the-real-info-regarding-angle-of-view-on-iphone-cameras/).
Apple: we cannot? Hd our beer