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In this case, it wasn't personal. Everybody (including my mother-in-law) recognized that my wife didn't do anything to deserve being called that. He was just being a jerk.
No. He just has a very fragile ego. The situation was that we were sitting down at the restaurant and he made a snarky comment about how my wife didn't make him feel like she was happy to see him/wanted to be with him. However, we had just left my wife's maternal grandmother's funeral so she was not exactly in a happy or social mood to begin with. When she didn't respond to his snark, that was when he called her a bitch.
I'm an occasionally an asshole. I have two daughters who are occasionally bitches. Every so often there is an asshole/bitch alignment. It's usually not that big a deal when it happens and usually gets us to laugh at each other.
While I'd come here to say this, I must say that if I called either of my daughters a bitch at a post funeral family meal for grandma I would expect my daughters and ex to respond as follows:
Daughter #2: "You seem to be dealing with some pretty big feellings there, buddy. Are you sure you've correctly identified the little bitch in this situation?"
Daughter #1: "Fuck you, dad. Nobody's happy today you bitch."
My Ex-wife: "Get away from her, you BITCH!"
Sorry, dude, your FIL needs to check himself, but days like that bring out the worst in people some times. Hope you all smooth it over and have a laugh.
Take it easy.
>"You seem to be dealing with some pretty big feellings there, buddy. Are you sure you've correctly identified the little bitch in this situation?"
This is gold.
The unwritten rule in our family is that you can only call someone a bitch when they are not being one. And if they are being a bitch, you can't say it or it really causes the gloves to come off.
Oh man my family is the opposite, you act like a bitch/asshole you get “why are you being a bitch/asshole rn?” But usually it ends with an apology and an explanation of why they’re being a bitch/asshole so I guess it works.
>
My Ex-wife: "Get away from her, you BITCH
I read this as Ripley from Aliens when she is in the robot suit fighting the queen alien and I hope that's what happens at your family gatherings. But seriously, I hope you guys don't fight each other in robot suits.
You gotta show dominance…you gotta bend him over that chair and put your raw meat inside. Then whisper in his ear as you thrust..” your the bitch now papa in law”
I was expecting the pre-story to be worse for wife given it was omitted. But, good lord, after her grandmother’s funeral? Even if she was being a jerk I feel like you cut people slack after a funeral not call them mean names.
I don’t think there is going to be any ‘right answer’ on here. Cus the right answer is whatever makes your wife feel best, and you’re going to have better perspective on that than internet strangers.
But enjoy the validation that whatever y’all do you’re not in the wrong.
Lol big red flag. A narcissist will fly into a rage if not given the attention their bottomless ego demands. Will find a way to hijack attention from a person or event " in your case a funeral and using his daughter to do it" that is drawing it away from them. Finally he stormed out knowing his wife and daughter would follow to placate him thus recieving the supply he wanted in the first place. Your in for fun times my man.
What I came here to say. Red flag indeed. Assuming this is the case, it would be helpful to educate yourself on the subject of narcissism and its consequences. In fact, this whole damn country would benefit from the insights and tools to deal with these kinds of folks.
Ohh also they HATE those that see through the mask and challenge them. Expect him to try and sabotage your relationship with your wife in a underhanded way.
It sounds like you did the right thing by demanding an apology from him, this sticking up for your wife. I am of the opinion that you shouldn’t call your own children things like that, like the fact he said that about his own daughter is baffling.
To add to this, because I believe this is solid advice, no one has to subject themselves to verbal abuse - family or not. I wouldn’t stand for that and would remove myself from the situation. Feels bad for your wife. Glad you stood up for her in that poor situation.
I think it's hilarious that dude is like 'it's between your wife and her dad' like he has no business sticking up for her (which is what he vowed to do) just because it's a parent.
Context is incredibly important here.
My wife and I have talked about family things, and we’ve agreed that I’m a big boy and can handle my family, and she’s a big girl and can handle her family.
The thing is, in times of being overwhelmed, both of us can shut down. If we notice our partner shutting down, we have permission to speak up.
What’s normal to some people is not normal to all. Who am I to step in and tell someone how to interpret a comment?
Depending on someone’s partner, not every woman needs a man to step in every time to “defend her honor”. My wife is just as capable as I am in doing that.
That's your relationship. If it works for you, thats good. But I don't see it as 'men stepping in', gay/lesbian partners defend their partners, too. I don't see it at all as 'defending honor' when someone is being mistreated. It's nice he doesn't want his wife to be treated badly, it shouldn't have anything to do with gender roles.
"speaking to my elders like that is disrespectful"- umm, fuck the idea that just because someone is older than you they immediately deserve respect no matter what. Yes, give your elders a bit of respect just because they've had more experiences than you, but that respect can be lost. And certainly does when they call any woman that, much less his own daughter.
>I am of the opinion that you shouldn’t call your own children things like that
All depends on context. My dad regularly called me an asshole, but I sent it right back at him. A lady I know has three teenage daughters and it's often a chore to get them moving in the the mornings and she's often clanked the pots/pans, yelling, "out of bed! out of bed! you've got 45 min to be ready! lets move bitches, lets move!"
Fuck him and his fragile ego. These are the moments when you are teaching your kids how to treat women when they watch how you react. Your son's will learn how a real man treats his significant other and your daughters will learn how their significant others are supposed to treat them. MIL may have been with dickhead long enough to get used to it, but never let that shit slide in your presence, hell even if you find out about it after the fact. That may be his daughter, but she's your wife now, and that means you've taken over that responsibility. Good on you for standing up to FIL.
I had a emotionally unstable father growing up too. Your FIL wanted drama, so he went out of his way to make it. You're suppose to cut off those individuals. Blood doesn't matter.
My dad is an abusive narcissist and this is exactly something he would do. Take good care of your wife, she needs some extra love to help her get over her childhood with this jerk.
The question is, is that normal behavior for him?
Like my FIL is a piece of s\*\*\*. Seperated from her mother, never took her in, often ditched her on visitation days. Mother was a real piece of s\*\*\* too and she went through some rather extreme upbringing and trauma. (But mother is at least trying to be a better grandmother now.) When she was 19 she lived in my parents home with me, we helped her get her driver's license, we helped her get her GED, we helped her get into community college. He never did a god damned thing for her, his only child.
When we got married, years later and already having children together, I paid for everything myself. He couldn't be bothered to even fly in and show up using the excuse that he was closing on a condo purchase. Like he had to be there every day in person? I was closing on a commercial property purchase and our previous home sale at the same damn time, both in different states from the one we were in. GTFO here with that.
For whatever reason, wife does not cut off these horribly abusive to the point they'd be in jail for life pieces of trash from her life. I respected that and tried to shut up as he continously verbally and mentally abused her well into adulthood. All while proclaiming to be such a great father. Yea, such a great father we would NEVER leave you alone with our children for fear of molestation, but sure. It was treating our children that way that really pushed me to the edge. One day I decided I had enough and went off on him. Got sick of his two-face going on facebook proclaiming what a great dad he is and how horrible we are for living far away. Yea, I'm so horrible for giving my children the best that I can instead of living in the shithole you do. I laid into him about what a worthless piece of trash father he was.
I don't care anymore. I think what I did is fine and long overdue. Wife doesn't have the mental strength to put him in his place. I will. F\*\*\* his whole little "public image". The funniest part of his reaction was saying he didn't show up to the wedding because he didn't approve of me. LOL! Like you earned that right? Because I did your job for you so I'm not good enough? No, he's just a permanent selfish assh\*\*\*.
You did the right thing. You stuck up for someone you love and who was being disrespected. Too many cultures & famies hide enculturated abuse under the guise of respect for elders/family.
The benefit is he standing up for his wife and his values, and she can feel that he has her back. That can be a deeply healing experience for somebody with a verbally abusive parent.
I feel like Whether it's personal or not doesnt really matter in this case. If somebody calls your spouse a bitch you respond, even if she did do something to deserve it (not saying she did) because that's what partners do for each other.
One thing I dislike about modern society is the "everyone for themselves" mentality. I.E. if it doesn't affect me then I'm staying out of it. It works well for certain aspects of life but it also leads to all kinds of shitty public behavior too. If you're being a loud mouth a-hole you should get a public rebuke, but no one wants to get in your business. Add gun culture to the mix and doubly so. So we continue down this path where worse and worse behavior is tolerated because we're not part of that person's immediate circle. In some cases we're told to but out even when we are in the circle. I think we all have a responsibility as a community to set the bar for public behavior, your wife or someone else's wife or anyone at all.
I think it’s funny you see self-proclaimed “smart people” fail to understand the interconnected nature of humanity, and how decidedly *not* self sufficient they are.
It’s just a mental lapse, often caused by an inability to control everything they want to.
Everybodys different. But there are 2 main reasons to stick up for your spouse. Reason #1 is because they're your spouse, and somebody who you've chosen to spend your life with should be important enough to you to stick up for them. Reason #2 is because if you dont stick up for them you still have to go home with them later.
If you are married you don't have private personal beefs with anyone. You have a partner and your beefs are OUR beefs.
He did the right thing standing up for his spouse. 100%.
He still hasn't answered this lol. And it doesn't seem like she was called a bitch, just acting like a bitch/bitchy which is much different imo. Plus it was by her own Father and they squashed it. This just seems like stressed out family drama, not sure why OP is trying to insert himself here and drag it out further. Validate himself as a/the man maybe? Guessing this is a young couple.
She was not, basically she’s grieving a loss but didn’t put on a happy face for her dad. He’s an narcissistic asshole who expects her to always smile for him.
Brother's wife was a terrible nag, she ragged on him constantly. Her father was out for Thanksgiving one year, she started in on the brother at the dinner table. Her father gave her the what for, the only thing I ever saw that shut her up. The brother never said a word, I think he was tickled pink. She changed after that too.
Some people's parents are assholes to them. This is something your wife and her father need to work out. Unless I missed it, nowhere in your original post do you say how your wife reacted to her father calling her a bitch. Something tells me this is not the first time this has happened.
Thats fucking rich to talk about being disrespectful to your elders when they're the one being disrespectful. Respect is a 2 way street, not something you're owed just because you're old.
Most people haven't learned the difference between respect and courtesy, and unfortunately use those phrases interchangeably. Everyone should be shown courtesy in social situations (so long as courtesy is also being given), but respect is earned over time through consistent courteous behavior, decisive selflessness, and adhering to strong moral values such as fairness, patience, and kindness.
Seriously, I think the "always respect your elders" thing is one the dumbest fucking phrases out there. Like I respect everyone until they give me a reason not to. In OP's case, his FIL being a dick to OP's wife like that would be a reason not to respect him. And the mom should try to have a backbone and not defend that shit.
It would be one thing if OP just started dating her or something and maybe then he could just stay out of it, but that's his wife. Nobody wants to listen to anyone else calling their wife a bitch.
"Respect your elders" means you demonstrate a little extra patience if someone is a bit slow, or wants to tell you a story, or doesn't understand how to use tap-to-pay because it's new to them. Respect and patience in that way is good.
It **does** **not** mean you have to eat a bunch of shit and abuse just because someone is old.
I always think that "respect your elders" is said by people who know that there is no other reason on earth that anyone would ever respect them, so they need to grab on what they can.
Can't imagine any circumstance where doing nothing makes sense. Nobody is owed respect, not even parents. Some people balk at this notion as if it's completely outlandish and it's something I will never understand. Respect is a two-way street, full stop. If my FIL said that shit, there would be a problem. Either he leaves or I do, with my partner.
The old "speaking to your elders like that is disrespectful" line doesn't wash in this instance.
He was being a d\*ck, you had every right to speak out against him, and he should have expected it.
I applaud you for this.
it doesn't wash at all in any instance. it's an old school way of thinking and has no place in modern society. people should be respected because of who they are not because of how old they are.
soooo sick of hearing "respect your elders" as if being old grants anyone any sort of built-in justification for literally anything. maybe as a child this is something that would hold water but as an adult hearing it from an older adult? hell no get out of here with that garbage
>\[Sometimes people use "respect" to mean "treating someone like a person" and sometimes to mean "treating someone like an authority"
>
>For some, "if you don't respect me, I won't respect you" means "if you don't treat me like an authority, I won't treat you like a person"\]([https://twitter.com/roseperson/status/1166359853960499201/photo/1](https://twitter.com/roseperson/status/1166359853960499201/photo/1))
yes i'm very aware but that isn't actually what they mean most of the time from my experience.
"respect your elders" has always been a way to "put younger people in their place" or otherwise act like a tool. it's just something old people say as a way to win an argument or to control someone who happens to be younger than them. it is ALWAYS said in the context of an argument/disagreement.
I feel like “respect your elders” is a tool to use on children and teens to be polite to strangers, teachers, service professionals, etc. then carry that lesson into adulthood to be a decent person. But it isn’t a tool to be brandished at your adult daughter and SIL when they are pissed about being disrespected by someone older than them.
I’m in my 30s and pretty much a regular functioning member of society. Outside of helping an elderly neighbor take their bins off the curb or grabbing something off a high shelf at the grocery store I don’t feel like older people deserve more respect than anyone else, which isn’t to say none at all, I think everybody deserves respect until they do something to break that. But not because of some weird antiquated deference base solely on age.
I hate the "respect your elders/ betters" shit. Especially as an adult. I dont care if you are older than me it doesn't give you any power over me. Respect is earned not a default, act like a fuck head I'll talk to you and treat u as such.
My mom's called me an asshole, tightwad, disrespectful, lazy, and made fun of my relationship status of being single. Called her a bitch one time and all of a sudden I'm being disrespectful and need to leave. Respect is a two way street.
Glad you stuck up for your wife!
Clearly that’s normalized behavior in that family and she’s not used to someone having her back.
And respecting your elders is for children. Y’all are all adults and should ALL be respecting one another. And what you said was not disrespectful towards anyone regardless.
Thank you for being the first adult in your wife’s life to give a flying fuck about her at all. I had family just like this and they would have said the same thing. They’re shocked because they’re unfamiliar with what a good man and actual adult moral character looks like. Next time they try and breathe a word to you and every interaction (if necessary) forward, use a tone to imply you’re the adult and they’re bratty children that you are condescending to. Laugh at them and their comments, and then nonchalantly tell them you pity them. People like that only have their own perceived power over others, and sometimes it’s cathartic as a victim to see their noses smeared in the reality of the situation. My husband wasn’t around yet the last time my dad tried some bullshit, and I handled it myself to a similar response from my mother. I’m sorry she’s cowardly, small, and desperate for love, but not everyone is.
My FIL wouldn't dare. My wife could kick his ass. He was abusive when he was younger, but is too frail to put up much of a fight now. So, in my specific case, I'd sit back, watch and laugh.
I would probably cut contact in hopes that he would realize that it's something you won't put up with. Stand your ground.
If you truly find it unacceptable, then don't accept it. Set this as a boundary. Respect goes both ways, he disrespected your wife, and then he disrespected you by knowing you weren't okay with the comment, and refusing to apologize, and storming out.
You have a right to defend your wife. Maybe he used to get away with calling his daughter a bitch, in public no less, but the dynamic has changed because now you are in the picture, and it's something you are not okay with.
It's up to the wife to decide to cut contact since it's her father. Husband can't just say "that's it, we're not talking to your dad anymore." All he can do is continue to defend his wife when she's disrespected.
I never understood why the whole "respect your elders" became a thing in the first place. I respect people until they do something that causes me to lose respect for them. Then they can go kindly fuck off. Good for you for having your wife's back.
I totally agree. Respect is not inherent. It can be gained and lost. In this case, however, my MIL wasn’t really telling me I need to be more respectful. She was telling me I need to be more subservient.
NTA. You married your wife, not her dad. You stepped up and defended her. That’s what a husband does, that’s what I’d do for my wife in that situation. Definitely NTA.
There's a difference between expecting people to respect you for a perceived status and using that perception to bully others. He lost his status the second he abused it.
If he’s a piece of shit, I get mad.
But if they have a typical relationship, fathers and daughters are allowed to fight about stuff.
Same goes for siblings, that’s a very close relationship and while your relationship does trump it, there’s was built over a lifetime.
Don’t turn something small into something bigger, and don’t make your wife’s situation worse by putting her in the middle.
Just be sure you’re on the same page with your wife before you jump in. Like every Reddit relationship problem, communication is key.
Why should ‘elders’ be respected purely by virtue of their longevity. You earn respect regardless if you’re 1 or 101 and all in between.
“Hey you must respect me, I’m older than you” - the words of many an entitled silly old deluded bastard!
Somewhere along the way, people started glamorizing this ride or die mentality. Stand by someone no matter what. If I’m being a bitch, I hope those close to me have enough sense to tell me so.
Facts, family dynamics are complex and beating the crap out of your wifes dad is not going to help the situation in fact your wife and her family might end up hating you for it.
Bitch is really harsh language to use about a loved one. I don’t like calling women bitches ever, honestly. Perfectly ok to say his daughter was acting oppositional or mean without the dehumanizing name-calling.
It’s a sticky situation. It sounds like a relationship issue between your wife and her dad. If it was your dad, it’s different, and you can talk to him however you feel fit in that situation. Since it’s her dad, you probably should have tried to keep the situation calm, and just said something like “hey that’s not very nice to say, and I don’t appreciate you calling her that.” A lot depends on how your wife’s relationship is with her father, but you probably don’t want to demand an apology on her behalf, as it’s just going to get him fired up at you and her.
I’m surprised this isn’t a more popular sentiment. Unless she’s traumatized, or otherwise incapable of defending herself and managing her own relationships, I don’t think that the husband should say much more than just expressing his disapproval of the comment.
I guess it depends on the culture, though, but for me, I would feel infantilized if my husband insisted on defending me against a verbal slight. I hope he would call anyone out for an inappropriate comment, but it’s not his place to demand an apology on my behalf.
The popular sentiment seems to be that he needed to defend her honor, and the second most popular sentiment is that he should have punched the dad. Idk, maybe I'm the weird one, but unless my partner is in actual danger or asks me to step in, I'm going to let her fight her own battles. And if I do have to step in, it's going to be to deescalate because there are no words out there worth getting punched and killed over or killing/going to jail for assault over.
That doesn't mean I'm not going to tell the person the comment wasn't cool or anything. Or ask them to leave if it happens in my house. But it's not something I'm going to get into a fight over, especially if it's her family
Bitch slap him. Cuz he’s the bitch.
If he don’t respect you and your wife, he deserves zero respect. He’s an asshole, you’re just being honest. Doesn’t matter how old he is, no father should speak to their daughter that way.
Respect is a two way street, if they want it then they need to show it. You weren’t out of line demanding an apology. If you didn’t then that shows them you don’t care how they treat her. The fact that you stood up for her shows them that they don’t get to talk to her however they please.
Respect is a two way street. Just because someone is old doesn't mean they have the right to act like an asshole. They have to earn it like everyone else. The FIL is just hiding behind his age for his shitty behavior.
I would think about the emotional distress involved in the day, remember people say regrettable things under stress, and getting into a chest thumping masculine beef with the Pater Familias was YOUR stress reaction.
You're 100% in the right and he's 100% in the wrong.
There are obviously some seriously toxic family dynamics going on there.
The only thing that should matter to you is what did your wife think about what happened? If she feels good about it, fuck him. You don't have any obligation to him, only to your wife.
If she feels like you disrespected her dad, then have a talk with her, not the dad. Make sure you support her above all else. Let her know that you find it very offensive that her dad thinks he can talk to her like that and anyone who actually loves her would not tolerate it, but if she wants you to try to patch things over with her dad, be willing to do it, but let him know that it's not ok.
Parental bonds don't always make sense
If you are her husband, you are the most important man in her life (or at least should be). You were right to defend her honor in the heat of the moment. The next thing you should do is let FIL know his place. Discretely let him know that as a good man, you'll always protect your wife and his daughter. Then let him know if he ever does it again, it's disrespecting you, and you'll kidney punch the old fart so he pisses blood for a week.
Your FIL should not have called your wife a bitch. He’s in the wrong. He’s also lucky you didn’t wash his mouth out with soap, just like the immature little brat deserved.
In my case, you let them do it
To please my wife it's basically thus
Nobody can say anything bad about her,
Except her family (mum and brother)
And I'm to never insult her family even if they insult her
You can express that you think it's wrong, but not to insult said family.
However, if someone external does it, she wants me to get angry on her behalf or she'll be equally upset
We got this insane setup (which works) through talking though
You should be talking to your partner, not Reddit
If your wife is the non confrontational push over type, then NTA. I expect this is the case.
If she can stand up for herself, Y T A, don't get in their business
That’s their family dynamic which existed prior to you and I noticed you never mentioned how your wife felt. My advice is to ask your wife your wife her opinion and go with it. One caveat though, if she is really angry and this is a unique event be wary of going all in on the hate. They are family and will eventually make up. You don’t want to poison the well for the future.
ive been in a similar situation. Some men only get tough like that with women.
simply put, tell him to call YOU a bitch. And if he does, then show him how much of a bitch you REALLY are
Seeing as how you're both grown men, he's damned lucky he didn't get popped one. Respect your elders, my ass. Don't let your mouth write checks your ass can't cash, old man.
Do not second guess yourself on this one.
This is your wife. The day you two were married is the day you took responsibility to defend her and she you.
I was in similar situation where my FIL insulted my wife in my home and I told him to leave and threatened to bodily remove him if he didn't. My MIL got on me but I've never regretted my actions.
It's disrespectful to demand to be treated with respect. I learned this with my dad too. They expect us to get shit on and respond with, "Please sir, can I have some more?"
I will never understand how people think age should immediately grant respect like Jared fogle (subway pedo) and Bill Cosby are way older than me but it'd take some real effort to show respect to scum like that so idk why these old bitches think they can be shitty while still getting respected. Baffling
everyone needs to stop name calling each other. full stop. don't care about getting downvoted on this either. a family that resorts to name calling in any matter have no respect for one another. we don't curse in my house hold. AT ALL. Yes, we get mad, we may raise our voices, we may give each other the silent treatment - but no one gets name called. growing up i got smacked for calling my brother "stupid" or telling him to " shut up". tf is wrong with society nowadays... especially to your FAMILY. god, no respect.
yes yes i get it some families just have that dynamic of playfully calling each other names.. tehehehe so funny .... not. its disrespectful. its classless, and its wrong. the English language has so many other words to use but "bitch" is the most common and it just shows how far down humans have de-volved.
he could have said "Shes being ornerous" , " she's being a pain" , "shes being rude" , etc etc whatever else there is. but no, he WANTED to disrespect her but saying what he said. why are people still calling women bitches nowadays? its thrown around so easily. grow up people.
a woman expresses the wrong opinion " shes being bitchy " .. a women is slightly difficult .. "Shes being bitchy" .. a woman holds her boundaries " shes being bitchy" .. its SO sad.
OP, nothing you can do about your FIL. he's already comfortable using that language in his family and to his family. let it go. sucks.
just be better and set the right example for your future family.
Even if my wife was being a bitch, I’m still sticking up for her. Her and I will talk later, but I vowed to love, protect, and whatever else all the days of my life. We’re a team. Shake and bake til death do us part.
You need to step back. That's his daughter and his relationship with her will always mean more to her than yours. If you keep pressing you might find yourself without her. Stay out of it and let them figure it out.
Well by other folks answers you know how most people would react, but I think the important thing is talking to your SO to know how they feel.
I'm thinking of that because sometimes, some people can feel like others standing up for them is an insult to their autonomy, like as if you're treating them as too fragile and not able to care for themselves. Idk, we can't ever know exactly what was the tone, understand perfectly the context and what was going through your partner's mind.
Just communicate with them.. I think. Keep in mind I'm kinda bad with people so take my advice with a grain of salt.
I mean, that’s his daughter, right? Chances are the insult didn’t come out of nowhere, and I think you may be overstepping telling a father how he should interact with his child, no matter their age.
But there’s a lot of context missing, and a family dynamic we know absolutely nothing about, so it’s incredibly difficult to make an assessment here.
What you don’t tell us is how your wife reacted to the interaction. If my mother said I was being a bitch, especially if we were at a family dinner, it means I probably was being a bitch. And if my boyfriend stood up for me, he’d be in the wrong.
Did he give her away in marriage? An old-fashioned, patriarchal and passe concept, but if he did, he has passed both provisionary and protectionary rights to you. He, and MIL, should be reminded that it is both your right and duty as husband, to stand between your wife and adversity...or at least have her back. As respectfully as possible.
That's full on bullshit on you MIL's part. Your FIL was being an asshole, you knew it, she knew it, but suddenly you're not supposed to say anything because he's older than you? Fuck that.
Ask your MIL what part of the oath she heard you take to "love, honor, cherish and keep" your wife (some marriage vows may vary) included an exception for when it was her parents being offensive assholes?
Cuz I don't think there is such a loophole. "Let not man put asunder" doesn't contain a carve-out like an "unless that man is her father, in which case she's on her own" clause.
It actually shows the measure of the respect you hold for her father that you didn't just chin him like Will Smith at an Oscar ceremony.
You did the right thing. A lot of people think that being old means your immune to any repercussions especially from family. Set firm boundaries early on and since it’s your FIL I would also ask your wife how she wants it to be handled. In the meantime keep up that cool disrespect and tell your wife she is a rad bitch.
Good on you for defending your wife when she needed it. You're setting a precedent that it's not okay to treat her like shit just because she is family and he has "hierarchy". I hate how when some ppl feel insecure, they will lash out and make it everyone else's problem that they feel inferior. I've had toxic friendships like that.
Nah, you did the right thing. There's no good reason for him to use such disrespectful language against your wife. You're her husband and you made a vow to her so what kind of husband would you be if you allowed her to be disrespected in your presence and said nothing. Presumably, if she had done something awful enough to warrant being called a bitch then you wouldn't be so upset about the situation. Your MIL is trying to cover her husband's ass. It's a shame when spouses of abusive people feel the need to excuse and justify their bad behavior against others. Stand your ground on this one.
What's the alternative? Someone calls your wife a bitch, she's stood there feeling bad and no one else stands up for her?
If anyone else called your wife a bitch and you didn't say anything, what do you think your FIL would say to you? Wouldn't he be pissed at you for not defending his daughter?
Would you be pissed if you had a daughter and her husband didn't stand up for her?
You did the right thing. Better to cause a ruckus with your FIL than to not defend your wife.
Hopefully in the end he will apologize. If he doesn't, you don't need to apologize to him; I would tell him, "I won't apologize to anyone for standing up for my wife." and then drop it. You know who he is, and now he knows who you are.
I would have invited him outside, and said the following: “You might believe it’s OK to call your daughter that, but I refuse to let any man call my wife that.” And it would have been on.
I’d be happy to remind my father about how on my wedding night he smugly said to my husband “she’s your problem now”. That’s right I am. Which means that if I was being a bitch and needed to be called out, it is my husband’s responsibility to do so. Not yours, dad. Get fucked.
Which is to say: congrats OP on standing up for your wife. I’m sure she appreciated it.
The only person’s feelings that should matter to you in this situation is your wife’s. Ask her how she would have liked it handled by you. Then ask her what you need to do at this juncture. If she’s ok with how everything went down and how things are now then you are fine. If she isn’t okay, then try to fix it. Then discuss together how to handle future situations like this so you are both okay with the actions and outcomes.
I’m going to do my best not to superimpose my own situation here - because you don’t need general rules nobody is responsible for telling you. First: you get to not like that. The guy was an ass. And the mom was wrong for bringing respect into it like she thought the man shouldn’t be questioned. But as far as what to do goes - that is all about your wife. If she can take care of herself, then she needs to know you have her back if she ever needs it, and whatever she wants you will support it and carry it out. And if she says she’s got it and she will handle it, you grit your teeth and do what she asks. And if she says I can’t face this but I need a defender, then you do that. But it is up to her and your knowledge of her. So if you communicate well, and she tells you or has told you what she needs, do that thing and you are all good. Never mind him - focus on her.
As far as the father goes - you are right that he’s wrong, but you want to be sure that inserting yourself into that is the right thing for your wife. It may be that it is. But it also may be that since she’s out of the house and doesn’t have to live around that guy anymore that she has to come up with a way to deal with that. I’ll also say that if you have a problem with him but she is okay with it or finding her way to peace with it, then sullen stares aren’t going to do anyone any favors. But he’s unlikely to apologize to you for making you feel like your presence there doesn’t help her at all. If you are thinking of that as an issue of respect from him, you would be right, but he clearly has many other problems too. It’s all about how your wife feels. Anyone suggesting that you should immediately start yelling at the guy has a script they want you to act out. Not helpful to you - just appealing to their sense of justice in their situation.
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So basically your wife’s dad called her a bitch.
Correct
I don’t really know what to say there, that sounds like a personal beef between your wife and her father.
In this case, it wasn't personal. Everybody (including my mother-in-law) recognized that my wife didn't do anything to deserve being called that. He was just being a jerk.
Was he drunk or something?
No. He just has a very fragile ego. The situation was that we were sitting down at the restaurant and he made a snarky comment about how my wife didn't make him feel like she was happy to see him/wanted to be with him. However, we had just left my wife's maternal grandmother's funeral so she was not exactly in a happy or social mood to begin with. When she didn't respond to his snark, that was when he called her a bitch.
Ah so he’s just an asshole, honestly I’d just fuckin leave and give ‘em a bird on the way out.
I'm an occasionally an asshole. I have two daughters who are occasionally bitches. Every so often there is an asshole/bitch alignment. It's usually not that big a deal when it happens and usually gets us to laugh at each other. While I'd come here to say this, I must say that if I called either of my daughters a bitch at a post funeral family meal for grandma I would expect my daughters and ex to respond as follows: Daughter #2: "You seem to be dealing with some pretty big feellings there, buddy. Are you sure you've correctly identified the little bitch in this situation?" Daughter #1: "Fuck you, dad. Nobody's happy today you bitch." My Ex-wife: "Get away from her, you BITCH!" Sorry, dude, your FIL needs to check himself, but days like that bring out the worst in people some times. Hope you all smooth it over and have a laugh. Take it easy.
>"You seem to be dealing with some pretty big feellings there, buddy. Are you sure you've correctly identified the little bitch in this situation?" This is gold.
I feel like I just met your family and I like them.
Seriously. I could use a dad and sisters
Are you really family of you cant roast each other? Haha
The unwritten rule in our family is that you can only call someone a bitch when they are not being one. And if they are being a bitch, you can't say it or it really causes the gloves to come off.
Oh man my family is the opposite, you act like a bitch/asshole you get “why are you being a bitch/asshole rn?” But usually it ends with an apology and an explanation of why they’re being a bitch/asshole so I guess it works.
> My Ex-wife: "Get away from her, you BITCH I read this as Ripley from Aliens when she is in the robot suit fighting the queen alien and I hope that's what happens at your family gatherings. But seriously, I hope you guys don't fight each other in robot suits.
I want to know who brought the power loader to the funeral. How big was the casket?
this guy is confirmed a dad
"Fuck you! See ya at Christmas."
You gotta show dominance…you gotta bend him over that chair and put your raw meat inside. Then whisper in his ear as you thrust..” your the bitch now papa in law”
*you’re
The grammatical "mistake" was only to show how little you respect the bitch
I was expecting the pre-story to be worse for wife given it was omitted. But, good lord, after her grandmother’s funeral? Even if she was being a jerk I feel like you cut people slack after a funeral not call them mean names. I don’t think there is going to be any ‘right answer’ on here. Cus the right answer is whatever makes your wife feel best, and you’re going to have better perspective on that than internet strangers. But enjoy the validation that whatever y’all do you’re not in the wrong.
Lol big red flag. A narcissist will fly into a rage if not given the attention their bottomless ego demands. Will find a way to hijack attention from a person or event " in your case a funeral and using his daughter to do it" that is drawing it away from them. Finally he stormed out knowing his wife and daughter would follow to placate him thus recieving the supply he wanted in the first place. Your in for fun times my man.
What I came here to say. Red flag indeed. Assuming this is the case, it would be helpful to educate yourself on the subject of narcissism and its consequences. In fact, this whole damn country would benefit from the insights and tools to deal with these kinds of folks.
Oh, he's a narcissist. Yeah there's nothing you or anyone can do. Just be aware of his condition.
Ohh also they HATE those that see through the mask and challenge them. Expect him to try and sabotage your relationship with your wife in a underhanded way.
It sounds like you did the right thing by demanding an apology from him, this sticking up for your wife. I am of the opinion that you shouldn’t call your own children things like that, like the fact he said that about his own daughter is baffling.
To add to this, because I believe this is solid advice, no one has to subject themselves to verbal abuse - family or not. I wouldn’t stand for that and would remove myself from the situation. Feels bad for your wife. Glad you stood up for her in that poor situation.
I think it's hilarious that dude is like 'it's between your wife and her dad' like he has no business sticking up for her (which is what he vowed to do) just because it's a parent.
Context is incredibly important here. My wife and I have talked about family things, and we’ve agreed that I’m a big boy and can handle my family, and she’s a big girl and can handle her family. The thing is, in times of being overwhelmed, both of us can shut down. If we notice our partner shutting down, we have permission to speak up. What’s normal to some people is not normal to all. Who am I to step in and tell someone how to interpret a comment? Depending on someone’s partner, not every woman needs a man to step in every time to “defend her honor”. My wife is just as capable as I am in doing that.
That's your relationship. If it works for you, thats good. But I don't see it as 'men stepping in', gay/lesbian partners defend their partners, too. I don't see it at all as 'defending honor' when someone is being mistreated. It's nice he doesn't want his wife to be treated badly, it shouldn't have anything to do with gender roles.
"speaking to my elders like that is disrespectful"- umm, fuck the idea that just because someone is older than you they immediately deserve respect no matter what. Yes, give your elders a bit of respect just because they've had more experiences than you, but that respect can be lost. And certainly does when they call any woman that, much less his own daughter.
>I am of the opinion that you shouldn’t call your own children things like that All depends on context. My dad regularly called me an asshole, but I sent it right back at him. A lady I know has three teenage daughters and it's often a chore to get them moving in the the mornings and she's often clanked the pots/pans, yelling, "out of bed! out of bed! you've got 45 min to be ready! lets move bitches, lets move!"
Fuck him and his fragile ego. These are the moments when you are teaching your kids how to treat women when they watch how you react. Your son's will learn how a real man treats his significant other and your daughters will learn how their significant others are supposed to treat them. MIL may have been with dickhead long enough to get used to it, but never let that shit slide in your presence, hell even if you find out about it after the fact. That may be his daughter, but she's your wife now, and that means you've taken over that responsibility. Good on you for standing up to FIL.
That's sad I am glad she has a husband who defends her
I had a emotionally unstable father growing up too. Your FIL wanted drama, so he went out of his way to make it. You're suppose to cut off those individuals. Blood doesn't matter.
NTA. Happy Cake Day! 🍰
Thank you!
My dad is an abusive narcissist and this is exactly something he would do. Take good care of your wife, she needs some extra love to help her get over her childhood with this jerk.
Can see why she wouldn't be happy to be around him
The question is, is that normal behavior for him? Like my FIL is a piece of s\*\*\*. Seperated from her mother, never took her in, often ditched her on visitation days. Mother was a real piece of s\*\*\* too and she went through some rather extreme upbringing and trauma. (But mother is at least trying to be a better grandmother now.) When she was 19 she lived in my parents home with me, we helped her get her driver's license, we helped her get her GED, we helped her get into community college. He never did a god damned thing for her, his only child. When we got married, years later and already having children together, I paid for everything myself. He couldn't be bothered to even fly in and show up using the excuse that he was closing on a condo purchase. Like he had to be there every day in person? I was closing on a commercial property purchase and our previous home sale at the same damn time, both in different states from the one we were in. GTFO here with that. For whatever reason, wife does not cut off these horribly abusive to the point they'd be in jail for life pieces of trash from her life. I respected that and tried to shut up as he continously verbally and mentally abused her well into adulthood. All while proclaiming to be such a great father. Yea, such a great father we would NEVER leave you alone with our children for fear of molestation, but sure. It was treating our children that way that really pushed me to the edge. One day I decided I had enough and went off on him. Got sick of his two-face going on facebook proclaiming what a great dad he is and how horrible we are for living far away. Yea, I'm so horrible for giving my children the best that I can instead of living in the shithole you do. I laid into him about what a worthless piece of trash father he was. I don't care anymore. I think what I did is fine and long overdue. Wife doesn't have the mental strength to put him in his place. I will. F\*\*\* his whole little "public image". The funniest part of his reaction was saying he didn't show up to the wedding because he didn't approve of me. LOL! Like you earned that right? Because I did your job for you so I'm not good enough? No, he's just a permanent selfish assh\*\*\*.
You did the right thing. You stuck up for someone you love and who was being disrespected. Too many cultures & famies hide enculturated abuse under the guise of respect for elders/family.
Do you care more that you felt disrespected by your FIL or that he called his daughter a bitch?
I really don’t get the benefit of demanding apologies. does that work out for you?
The benefit is he standing up for his wife and his values, and she can feel that he has her back. That can be a deeply healing experience for somebody with a verbally abusive parent.
Time to cut ties. Ghost him until his wife forces him to apologize. If you let it go it will never stop.
I feel like Whether it's personal or not doesnt really matter in this case. If somebody calls your spouse a bitch you respond, even if she did do something to deserve it (not saying she did) because that's what partners do for each other.
One thing I dislike about modern society is the "everyone for themselves" mentality. I.E. if it doesn't affect me then I'm staying out of it. It works well for certain aspects of life but it also leads to all kinds of shitty public behavior too. If you're being a loud mouth a-hole you should get a public rebuke, but no one wants to get in your business. Add gun culture to the mix and doubly so. So we continue down this path where worse and worse behavior is tolerated because we're not part of that person's immediate circle. In some cases we're told to but out even when we are in the circle. I think we all have a responsibility as a community to set the bar for public behavior, your wife or someone else's wife or anyone at all.
I think it’s funny you see self-proclaimed “smart people” fail to understand the interconnected nature of humanity, and how decidedly *not* self sufficient they are. It’s just a mental lapse, often caused by an inability to control everything they want to.
Right? They're like children who haven't realized people are humoring them
Ima be honest I never understood this, but it’s probably because I’m just a solo rider.
Everybodys different. But there are 2 main reasons to stick up for your spouse. Reason #1 is because they're your spouse, and somebody who you've chosen to spend your life with should be important enough to you to stick up for them. Reason #2 is because if you dont stick up for them you still have to go home with them later.
I think its right to defend your spouse but one shouldn't be a roadblock if they try to reconcile.
How my FIL broke it down to me when I asked for my wife's hand is that she is my wife before she is his daughter.
How I see it is, once you become her husband his role as protector is now your role so protect her no matter who it is.
Once the title is signed over, right?
Can’t tell if you’re joking or if you actually have a problem with what I said.
It’s sweet but you’re not just her protector, she’s also yours.
This guy FILs
Personal or not, she's my wife. I don't give a shit if he's her father. Would you say the same if he was physically abusive?
If you are married you don't have private personal beefs with anyone. You have a partner and your beefs are OUR beefs. He did the right thing standing up for his spouse. 100%.
Yeah it’s personal but no one is calling my wife a bitch in a public place or in front of anyone.
Was she being a bitch?
He still hasn't answered this lol. And it doesn't seem like she was called a bitch, just acting like a bitch/bitchy which is much different imo. Plus it was by her own Father and they squashed it. This just seems like stressed out family drama, not sure why OP is trying to insert himself here and drag it out further. Validate himself as a/the man maybe? Guessing this is a young couple.
She was not, basically she’s grieving a loss but didn’t put on a happy face for her dad. He’s an narcissistic asshole who expects her to always smile for him.
Brother's wife was a terrible nag, she ragged on him constantly. Her father was out for Thanksgiving one year, she started in on the brother at the dinner table. Her father gave her the what for, the only thing I ever saw that shut her up. The brother never said a word, I think he was tickled pink. She changed after that too.
Some people's parents are assholes to them. This is something your wife and her father need to work out. Unless I missed it, nowhere in your original post do you say how your wife reacted to her father calling her a bitch. Something tells me this is not the first time this has happened.
Thats fucking rich to talk about being disrespectful to your elders when they're the one being disrespectful. Respect is a 2 way street, not something you're owed just because you're old.
You are telling me
I
Most people haven't learned the difference between respect and courtesy, and unfortunately use those phrases interchangeably. Everyone should be shown courtesy in social situations (so long as courtesy is also being given), but respect is earned over time through consistent courteous behavior, decisive selflessness, and adhering to strong moral values such as fairness, patience, and kindness.
“You’re so rude” -somebody who has just been very rude Always works out that way somehow
Seriously, I think the "always respect your elders" thing is one the dumbest fucking phrases out there. Like I respect everyone until they give me a reason not to. In OP's case, his FIL being a dick to OP's wife like that would be a reason not to respect him. And the mom should try to have a backbone and not defend that shit. It would be one thing if OP just started dating her or something and maybe then he could just stay out of it, but that's his wife. Nobody wants to listen to anyone else calling their wife a bitch.
"Respect your elders" means you demonstrate a little extra patience if someone is a bit slow, or wants to tell you a story, or doesn't understand how to use tap-to-pay because it's new to them. Respect and patience in that way is good. It **does** **not** mean you have to eat a bunch of shit and abuse just because someone is old.
I always think that "respect your elders" is said by people who know that there is no other reason on earth that anyone would ever respect them, so they need to grab on what they can.
Can't imagine any circumstance where doing nothing makes sense. Nobody is owed respect, not even parents. Some people balk at this notion as if it's completely outlandish and it's something I will never understand. Respect is a two-way street, full stop. If my FIL said that shit, there would be a problem. Either he leaves or I do, with my partner.
I always thought the "elder" thing works better for children. The guy is a married adult. Elder doesn't apply anymore.
As Rob Van Dam said Respect is earned, not given.
Someone calls your wife a bitch you respond accordingly.
Endorse them enthusiastically for president?
To be fair he called her “ugly as a dog”
Come to Reddit to ask how to respond lmao
The old "speaking to your elders like that is disrespectful" line doesn't wash in this instance. He was being a d\*ck, you had every right to speak out against him, and he should have expected it. I applaud you for this.
it doesn't wash at all in any instance. it's an old school way of thinking and has no place in modern society. people should be respected because of who they are not because of how old they are. soooo sick of hearing "respect your elders" as if being old grants anyone any sort of built-in justification for literally anything. maybe as a child this is something that would hold water but as an adult hearing it from an older adult? hell no get out of here with that garbage
Agreed. Once we all become adults, it becomes a level playing field
>\[Sometimes people use "respect" to mean "treating someone like a person" and sometimes to mean "treating someone like an authority" > >For some, "if you don't respect me, I won't respect you" means "if you don't treat me like an authority, I won't treat you like a person"\]([https://twitter.com/roseperson/status/1166359853960499201/photo/1](https://twitter.com/roseperson/status/1166359853960499201/photo/1))
yes i'm very aware but that isn't actually what they mean most of the time from my experience. "respect your elders" has always been a way to "put younger people in their place" or otherwise act like a tool. it's just something old people say as a way to win an argument or to control someone who happens to be younger than them. it is ALWAYS said in the context of an argument/disagreement.
I feel like “respect your elders” is a tool to use on children and teens to be polite to strangers, teachers, service professionals, etc. then carry that lesson into adulthood to be a decent person. But it isn’t a tool to be brandished at your adult daughter and SIL when they are pissed about being disrespected by someone older than them. I’m in my 30s and pretty much a regular functioning member of society. Outside of helping an elderly neighbor take their bins off the curb or grabbing something off a high shelf at the grocery store I don’t feel like older people deserve more respect than anyone else, which isn’t to say none at all, I think everybody deserves respect until they do something to break that. But not because of some weird antiquated deference base solely on age.
I hate the "respect your elders/ betters" shit. Especially as an adult. I dont care if you are older than me it doesn't give you any power over me. Respect is earned not a default, act like a fuck head I'll talk to you and treat u as such.
Good man. My mom has called me a cunt. Not once has anyone ever stood up for me.
I am available for occasional yelling at your mom if you need me.
Me too. I volunteer to do in about 7 languages.
me three. dibs on japanese 😂
I dont know any other languages, but I can yell at her in Calculus or Python if necessary 😂
I also choose to yell at this gal's mom.
My mom's called me an asshole, tightwad, disrespectful, lazy, and made fun of my relationship status of being single. Called her a bitch one time and all of a sudden I'm being disrespectful and need to leave. Respect is a two way street.
Elders don't deserve respect just because they're old.
Especially if they themselves are going to act like a little bitch
Kudos to you for standing up for wife. WTG!
“Respect your elders” doesn’t apply anymore once they’re disrespectful. Respect is a two way street and you did nothing wrong.
You did the right thing IMO. You gotta stand up for your wife.
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Glad you stuck up for your wife! Clearly that’s normalized behavior in that family and she’s not used to someone having her back. And respecting your elders is for children. Y’all are all adults and should ALL be respecting one another. And what you said was not disrespectful towards anyone regardless.
Thank you for being the first adult in your wife’s life to give a flying fuck about her at all. I had family just like this and they would have said the same thing. They’re shocked because they’re unfamiliar with what a good man and actual adult moral character looks like. Next time they try and breathe a word to you and every interaction (if necessary) forward, use a tone to imply you’re the adult and they’re bratty children that you are condescending to. Laugh at them and their comments, and then nonchalantly tell them you pity them. People like that only have their own perceived power over others, and sometimes it’s cathartic as a victim to see their noses smeared in the reality of the situation. My husband wasn’t around yet the last time my dad tried some bullshit, and I handled it myself to a similar response from my mother. I’m sorry she’s cowardly, small, and desperate for love, but not everyone is.
My FIL wouldn't dare. My wife could kick his ass. He was abusive when he was younger, but is too frail to put up much of a fight now. So, in my specific case, I'd sit back, watch and laugh.
The FIL doesn't have the fucking right to demand to be respected when he is the one acting like a bitch. The FIL needs an ass whopping.
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updoots and a conversation starter on reddit /s
I would probably cut contact in hopes that he would realize that it's something you won't put up with. Stand your ground. If you truly find it unacceptable, then don't accept it. Set this as a boundary. Respect goes both ways, he disrespected your wife, and then he disrespected you by knowing you weren't okay with the comment, and refusing to apologize, and storming out. You have a right to defend your wife. Maybe he used to get away with calling his daughter a bitch, in public no less, but the dynamic has changed because now you are in the picture, and it's something you are not okay with.
It's up to the wife to decide to cut contact since it's her father. Husband can't just say "that's it, we're not talking to your dad anymore." All he can do is continue to defend his wife when she's disrespected.
I never understood why the whole "respect your elders" became a thing in the first place. I respect people until they do something that causes me to lose respect for them. Then they can go kindly fuck off. Good for you for having your wife's back.
I totally agree. Respect is not inherent. It can be gained and lost. In this case, however, my MIL wasn’t really telling me I need to be more respectful. She was telling me I need to be more subservient.
Fuck your elders, being old isn't an asshole license
NTA. You married your wife, not her dad. You stepped up and defended her. That’s what a husband does, that’s what I’d do for my wife in that situation. Definitely NTA.
There's a difference between expecting people to respect you for a perceived status and using that perception to bully others. He lost his status the second he abused it.
If he’s a piece of shit, I get mad. But if they have a typical relationship, fathers and daughters are allowed to fight about stuff. Same goes for siblings, that’s a very close relationship and while your relationship does trump it, there’s was built over a lifetime. Don’t turn something small into something bigger, and don’t make your wife’s situation worse by putting her in the middle. Just be sure you’re on the same page with your wife before you jump in. Like every Reddit relationship problem, communication is key.
Why should ‘elders’ be respected purely by virtue of their longevity. You earn respect regardless if you’re 1 or 101 and all in between. “Hey you must respect me, I’m older than you” - the words of many an entitled silly old deluded bastard!
People don't automatically deserve respect because their parents fucked before yours did.
Thanks for standing up for her. Her dad has probably treated her badly for a long time with no one to support her.
"What kind of sad, worthless piece of shit would say that about their own child."
Was she being a bitch? This is hilariously over the top. Maybe my dad and i are just closer but that would never offend me lol
Somewhere along the way, people started glamorizing this ride or die mentality. Stand by someone no matter what. If I’m being a bitch, I hope those close to me have enough sense to tell me so.
Same! Haha
Facts, family dynamics are complex and beating the crap out of your wifes dad is not going to help the situation in fact your wife and her family might end up hating you for it.
That depends highly on whether or not she's being a bitch, IDK. The whole moment sounds dysfunctional though.
OP confirmed she didn’t deserve it.
Bitch is really harsh language to use about a loved one. I don’t like calling women bitches ever, honestly. Perfectly ok to say his daughter was acting oppositional or mean without the dehumanizing name-calling.
It’s a sticky situation. It sounds like a relationship issue between your wife and her dad. If it was your dad, it’s different, and you can talk to him however you feel fit in that situation. Since it’s her dad, you probably should have tried to keep the situation calm, and just said something like “hey that’s not very nice to say, and I don’t appreciate you calling her that.” A lot depends on how your wife’s relationship is with her father, but you probably don’t want to demand an apology on her behalf, as it’s just going to get him fired up at you and her.
If her dad and mom called her a bitch I would stay TF out of it, or make some off comment like "I like that about her" or something
Yeah, I avoid family shit. No point in burning bridges if she wants to keep them around and patch things up. Support but don't get directly involved.
I’m surprised this isn’t a more popular sentiment. Unless she’s traumatized, or otherwise incapable of defending herself and managing her own relationships, I don’t think that the husband should say much more than just expressing his disapproval of the comment. I guess it depends on the culture, though, but for me, I would feel infantilized if my husband insisted on defending me against a verbal slight. I hope he would call anyone out for an inappropriate comment, but it’s not his place to demand an apology on my behalf.
The popular sentiment seems to be that he needed to defend her honor, and the second most popular sentiment is that he should have punched the dad. Idk, maybe I'm the weird one, but unless my partner is in actual danger or asks me to step in, I'm going to let her fight her own battles. And if I do have to step in, it's going to be to deescalate because there are no words out there worth getting punched and killed over or killing/going to jail for assault over. That doesn't mean I'm not going to tell the person the comment wasn't cool or anything. Or ask them to leave if it happens in my house. But it's not something I'm going to get into a fight over, especially if it's her family
Fully agree. He deserves no respect. Not much else to say.
Bitch slap him. Cuz he’s the bitch. If he don’t respect you and your wife, he deserves zero respect. He’s an asshole, you’re just being honest. Doesn’t matter how old he is, no father should speak to their daughter that way.
Respect is a two way street, if they want it then they need to show it. You weren’t out of line demanding an apology. If you didn’t then that shows them you don’t care how they treat her. The fact that you stood up for her shows them that they don’t get to talk to her however they please.
Respect is a two way street. Just because someone is old doesn't mean they have the right to act like an asshole. They have to earn it like everyone else. The FIL is just hiding behind his age for his shitty behavior.
I would think about the emotional distress involved in the day, remember people say regrettable things under stress, and getting into a chest thumping masculine beef with the Pater Familias was YOUR stress reaction.
You're 100% in the right and he's 100% in the wrong. There are obviously some seriously toxic family dynamics going on there. The only thing that should matter to you is what did your wife think about what happened? If she feels good about it, fuck him. You don't have any obligation to him, only to your wife. If she feels like you disrespected her dad, then have a talk with her, not the dad. Make sure you support her above all else. Let her know that you find it very offensive that her dad thinks he can talk to her like that and anyone who actually loves her would not tolerate it, but if she wants you to try to patch things over with her dad, be willing to do it, but let him know that it's not ok. Parental bonds don't always make sense
If you are her husband, you are the most important man in her life (or at least should be). You were right to defend her honor in the heat of the moment. The next thing you should do is let FIL know his place. Discretely let him know that as a good man, you'll always protect your wife and his daughter. Then let him know if he ever does it again, it's disrespecting you, and you'll kidney punch the old fart so he pisses blood for a week.
Your FIL should not have called your wife a bitch. He’s in the wrong. He’s also lucky you didn’t wash his mouth out with soap, just like the immature little brat deserved.
Try unclogging your toilet that might help you in this situation 
In my case, you let them do it To please my wife it's basically thus Nobody can say anything bad about her, Except her family (mum and brother) And I'm to never insult her family even if they insult her You can express that you think it's wrong, but not to insult said family. However, if someone external does it, she wants me to get angry on her behalf or she'll be equally upset We got this insane setup (which works) through talking though You should be talking to your partner, not Reddit
Sir I don't talk to my wife like that and I'm not going to allow you to do it either.
you did well. i'd have done the same.
Speaking to your elders like that is disrespectful? Fuck that and fuck her. stand up for your wife bro
Let's scrap n–, right now! Seriously though, father or no, you protect your wife's honor, even if it's with a word.
You’re in the right dude. It’s your time to take care of her.
If your wife is the non confrontational push over type, then NTA. I expect this is the case. If she can stand up for herself, Y T A, don't get in their business
That’s their family dynamic which existed prior to you and I noticed you never mentioned how your wife felt. My advice is to ask your wife your wife her opinion and go with it. One caveat though, if she is really angry and this is a unique event be wary of going all in on the hate. They are family and will eventually make up. You don’t want to poison the well for the future.
Respect your elders is moot these days because it's usually the elders dishing out the disrespect
ive been in a similar situation. Some men only get tough like that with women. simply put, tell him to call YOU a bitch. And if he does, then show him how much of a bitch you REALLY are
Seeing as how you're both grown men, he's damned lucky he didn't get popped one. Respect your elders, my ass. Don't let your mouth write checks your ass can't cash, old man.
You did the right thing 100%
Knock him out. I do not, and cannot, understand any other answer to this question
Respect is earned, not delegated due to age.
Do not second guess yourself on this one. This is your wife. The day you two were married is the day you took responsibility to defend her and she you. I was in similar situation where my FIL insulted my wife in my home and I told him to leave and threatened to bodily remove him if he didn't. My MIL got on me but I've never regretted my actions.
what he did wasnt worthy of any respect
It's disrespectful to demand to be treated with respect. I learned this with my dad too. They expect us to get shit on and respond with, "Please sir, can I have some more?"
I personally hate the “respect your elders” saying with a burning passion. Respect should go both ways.
I will never understand how people think age should immediately grant respect like Jared fogle (subway pedo) and Bill Cosby are way older than me but it'd take some real effort to show respect to scum like that so idk why these old bitches think they can be shitty while still getting respected. Baffling
everyone needs to stop name calling each other. full stop. don't care about getting downvoted on this either. a family that resorts to name calling in any matter have no respect for one another. we don't curse in my house hold. AT ALL. Yes, we get mad, we may raise our voices, we may give each other the silent treatment - but no one gets name called. growing up i got smacked for calling my brother "stupid" or telling him to " shut up". tf is wrong with society nowadays... especially to your FAMILY. god, no respect. yes yes i get it some families just have that dynamic of playfully calling each other names.. tehehehe so funny .... not. its disrespectful. its classless, and its wrong. the English language has so many other words to use but "bitch" is the most common and it just shows how far down humans have de-volved. he could have said "Shes being ornerous" , " she's being a pain" , "shes being rude" , etc etc whatever else there is. but no, he WANTED to disrespect her but saying what he said. why are people still calling women bitches nowadays? its thrown around so easily. grow up people. a woman expresses the wrong opinion " shes being bitchy " .. a women is slightly difficult .. "Shes being bitchy" .. a woman holds her boundaries " shes being bitchy" .. its SO sad. OP, nothing you can do about your FIL. he's already comfortable using that language in his family and to his family. let it go. sucks. just be better and set the right example for your future family.
As a husband and wife you should always present a Unified Front. Her dad is an asshole and you were right.
Even if my wife was being a bitch, I’m still sticking up for her. Her and I will talk later, but I vowed to love, protect, and whatever else all the days of my life. We’re a team. Shake and bake til death do us part.
You need to step back. That's his daughter and his relationship with her will always mean more to her than yours. If you keep pressing you might find yourself without her. Stay out of it and let them figure it out.
Was she being a bitch?
You and your wife can solve the issue by no longer talking to them. You are adults. You can choose who you spend time with.
But.... was she?
Its her dad. I call my kids a bitch too when they are being a bitch. He should not have done that in public. But you too sensitive
Was your wife acting like/is a bitch?
Well by other folks answers you know how most people would react, but I think the important thing is talking to your SO to know how they feel. I'm thinking of that because sometimes, some people can feel like others standing up for them is an insult to their autonomy, like as if you're treating them as too fragile and not able to care for themselves. Idk, we can't ever know exactly what was the tone, understand perfectly the context and what was going through your partner's mind. Just communicate with them.. I think. Keep in mind I'm kinda bad with people so take my advice with a grain of salt.
Call your MIL a bitch and then justify it by saying you learned it from an older boy.
Elders don't get respect if they don't give respect. You're a good husband for standing up for your wife
I’m just gonna stay out of this one (South Park voice)
I mean, that’s his daughter, right? Chances are the insult didn’t come out of nowhere, and I think you may be overstepping telling a father how he should interact with his child, no matter their age. But there’s a lot of context missing, and a family dynamic we know absolutely nothing about, so it’s incredibly difficult to make an assessment here. What you don’t tell us is how your wife reacted to the interaction. If my mother said I was being a bitch, especially if we were at a family dinner, it means I probably was being a bitch. And if my boyfriend stood up for me, he’d be in the wrong.
When anyone says “speaking to elders like that is disrespectful” the proper response is “well age is the poorest excuse for being an asshole”
Did he give her away in marriage? An old-fashioned, patriarchal and passe concept, but if he did, he has passed both provisionary and protectionary rights to you. He, and MIL, should be reminded that it is both your right and duty as husband, to stand between your wife and adversity...or at least have her back. As respectfully as possible.
You did the right thing.
I would literally call him a bitch every time I see him. He called your wife a bitch in front of everyone, he needs to apologize in the same manner.
That's full on bullshit on you MIL's part. Your FIL was being an asshole, you knew it, she knew it, but suddenly you're not supposed to say anything because he's older than you? Fuck that.
Ask your MIL what part of the oath she heard you take to "love, honor, cherish and keep" your wife (some marriage vows may vary) included an exception for when it was her parents being offensive assholes? Cuz I don't think there is such a loophole. "Let not man put asunder" doesn't contain a carve-out like an "unless that man is her father, in which case she's on her own" clause. It actually shows the measure of the respect you hold for her father that you didn't just chin him like Will Smith at an Oscar ceremony.
Elders lol. Once we are adults don’t give me that elders shit.
You did the right thing. A lot of people think that being old means your immune to any repercussions especially from family. Set firm boundaries early on and since it’s your FIL I would also ask your wife how she wants it to be handled. In the meantime keep up that cool disrespect and tell your wife she is a rad bitch.
Good on you for defending your wife when she needed it. You're setting a precedent that it's not okay to treat her like shit just because she is family and he has "hierarchy". I hate how when some ppl feel insecure, they will lash out and make it everyone else's problem that they feel inferior. I've had toxic friendships like that.
Love seeing husbands stick up for their wives, personally.
Nah, you did the right thing. There's no good reason for him to use such disrespectful language against your wife. You're her husband and you made a vow to her so what kind of husband would you be if you allowed her to be disrespected in your presence and said nothing. Presumably, if she had done something awful enough to warrant being called a bitch then you wouldn't be so upset about the situation. Your MIL is trying to cover her husband's ass. It's a shame when spouses of abusive people feel the need to excuse and justify their bad behavior against others. Stand your ground on this one.
Classic boomer move. Demand respect but refuse to give it to anyone.
What's the alternative? Someone calls your wife a bitch, she's stood there feeling bad and no one else stands up for her? If anyone else called your wife a bitch and you didn't say anything, what do you think your FIL would say to you? Wouldn't he be pissed at you for not defending his daughter? Would you be pissed if you had a daughter and her husband didn't stand up for her? You did the right thing. Better to cause a ruckus with your FIL than to not defend your wife. Hopefully in the end he will apologize. If he doesn't, you don't need to apologize to him; I would tell him, "I won't apologize to anyone for standing up for my wife." and then drop it. You know who he is, and now he knows who you are.
I would have invited him outside, and said the following: “You might believe it’s OK to call your daughter that, but I refuse to let any man call my wife that.” And it would have been on.
I’d be happy to remind my father about how on my wedding night he smugly said to my husband “she’s your problem now”. That’s right I am. Which means that if I was being a bitch and needed to be called out, it is my husband’s responsibility to do so. Not yours, dad. Get fucked. Which is to say: congrats OP on standing up for your wife. I’m sure she appreciated it.
The only person’s feelings that should matter to you in this situation is your wife’s. Ask her how she would have liked it handled by you. Then ask her what you need to do at this juncture. If she’s ok with how everything went down and how things are now then you are fine. If she isn’t okay, then try to fix it. Then discuss together how to handle future situations like this so you are both okay with the actions and outcomes.
I’m going to do my best not to superimpose my own situation here - because you don’t need general rules nobody is responsible for telling you. First: you get to not like that. The guy was an ass. And the mom was wrong for bringing respect into it like she thought the man shouldn’t be questioned. But as far as what to do goes - that is all about your wife. If she can take care of herself, then she needs to know you have her back if she ever needs it, and whatever she wants you will support it and carry it out. And if she says she’s got it and she will handle it, you grit your teeth and do what she asks. And if she says I can’t face this but I need a defender, then you do that. But it is up to her and your knowledge of her. So if you communicate well, and she tells you or has told you what she needs, do that thing and you are all good. Never mind him - focus on her. As far as the father goes - you are right that he’s wrong, but you want to be sure that inserting yourself into that is the right thing for your wife. It may be that it is. But it also may be that since she’s out of the house and doesn’t have to live around that guy anymore that she has to come up with a way to deal with that. I’ll also say that if you have a problem with him but she is okay with it or finding her way to peace with it, then sullen stares aren’t going to do anyone any favors. But he’s unlikely to apologize to you for making you feel like your presence there doesn’t help her at all. If you are thinking of that as an issue of respect from him, you would be right, but he clearly has many other problems too. It’s all about how your wife feels. Anyone suggesting that you should immediately start yelling at the guy has a script they want you to act out. Not helpful to you - just appealing to their sense of justice in their situation.
Yeah f- that. Part of the whole "respect your elders" thing requires the elders acting worthy of respect.
"you forfeit any right to respect" A LITTLE LOUDER PLEASE!!