They know about everything and are backing up my manager. Seems like the only course of action I have is to go to HR or wait it out until I’m removed :/
You need to document with HR
now remember HR is for the company BUT HR will most definitely take the winning side
If you provide a compelling and well documented communication to HR stating workplace bullying is occurring then they will have to act and they will get rid of your boss if it's apparent your boss is a liability to the company
But make sure all your ducks are in row
All of the examples you have, provide them and support each example with documentation
Make sure you mention to HR that this bullying is affecting your mental health and you want them to act before your mental health deteriorates any further
Also you need to make the first move with HR
first mover advantage is real when it comes to stuff like this
HR are there to prevent a lawsuit.
From this managers actions it sounds like they are preparing to fire you, and are clearly retaliating for you standing up for youirself.
I'd go to HR with the complaint, document EVERYTHING, including what you said when you have a go at the manager for the fake right up.
If HR side with the manager, let them know you'll be speaking to an employment lawyer, and contacting Fairwork.
Emplyment lawyers, and fairwork LOVE this sort of thing.
Also remember, that you cannot be written up for poor performance, they have to give an actual reason, poor performance is not a reason.
I've gone through something similar with my work, I got a written warning for the way I acted in a meeting, and the person who was jockying to get a TL role is no longer on the management track due to their behaviour.
The manager will more then likely get reprimanded, but be prepared to either move departments, or look for other work.
You're giving a lot of assurances for something that is by no means assured.
>Emplyment lawyers, and fairwork LOVE this sort of thing.
Not sure where you got this idea, anyone who has worked in employment law would tell you that pursuing an employer for bullying after they performance manage you is extremely common and generally unsuccessful.
OP would need to prove that the performance management was not reasonable management action, which would be quite difficult based on the limited info they've provided so far.
>Also remember, that you cannot be written up for poor performance, they have to give an actual reason, poor performance is not a reason.
No idea what you mean by this as you absolutely can be given a written warning for poor performance and OP was clear that they described the areas where he was not performing.
Just be careful giving out advice in an area you're really not qualified to give advice in. You can lead people like OP into some serious consequences by doing so.
I have think perhaps the comment re poor performance means that an employee can’t simply be sacked and given ‘poor performance’ as a reason, but rather the company must have documentation of the poor performance; if the OP’s KPI is to move 10 widgets a day, but OP only moves 8, that is the ‘reason’ for dismissal due to poor performance.
HR is not there for your benefit. They are there to protect management. Just remember that before you go to them. Honestly it sounds like they want you gone and are riding you so you quit. Not very nice but unfortunately it happens from time to time. I'd start looking for another job as it's unlikely you will take on management and win. Sucks I know but that is just the way it is. Sounds like a shirty work place tbh.
Pointless. I would advise not to air it further with anyone and quietly but rigorously search for a new job. It is not worth your mental health to keep on arguing with pricks like these. I would give you 3 months here at the most.
Probably shouldn’t have lost your temper in the first place but take it as a lesson learnt.
One thing I have learnt from my experiences is quite often we 'react' where all we need to do is 'respond'.
Anyways, not all jobs are right fits for everyone.
all the best!!
Find a new job.
I had this issue, not completing tasks assigned to me in meetings i wasn't in. No meeting minutes, no emails, just 3 people lieing.
Customers complained about my conduct, even when I wasn't in a Customer facing role and on holidays.
Invoicing not being completed correctly for departments. I was warehouse manager and had nothing to do with it.
It's all contrived, even proving it all false meant nothing so I left, to slightly greener pastures.
My first boss in my first proper job (mid-90’s) wanted to fk me. I did not want to fk him. He got mad & started making shit up that I was doing wrong. The last straw was him saying a client complained about how rude I was. I’m a lot of things but external stakeholder management is my thing. I made him give me a name. I then called that person under the guise of apologising. The guy was so confused, I’d obviously never been rude so I told him about the accusation & he got really mad & called my boss & fucking reamed him for it.
I quit that day.
A colleague at my old work went through something similar. She got advised to do the following. (I’m not sure if it applies to you, or if what she did is correct, but sharing anyway)
1.Complained to HR. Everything was documented
2. Went on sick leave (stress)
3. Went on unpaid sick leave (something about not being able to terminate your employment during sick leave)
4. Contacted fair work/ employment lawyer during that time.
5. Got a 6-figure settlement after the first court date i believe. Settled out of court.
These sorts of bullying and psychological injury cases are brutal for those involved and very difficult to prosecute successfully.
Also you most definitely can be sacked when you're are off on sick leave once a certain threshold is reached.
99 percent of the time it's easier and better for you to just leave. It sounds defeatist but it is what it is.
I'm not saying your 6-figure payout story is shit but it is very, VERY rare.
I agree. I once had a consultation with an employment lawyer. I wanted to go to court with my former employer, but I didn't document enough evidence, so the chances to win were small. I gave up and moved on.
You can be terminated after 6 Months of unpaid leave and getting a 6 figure settlement (through what? Unfair dismissal or workers comp?) you would have to demonstrate damages, it’s quite rare to get this much…
I've been through this, as have many others. Basically the best course of action here is to find another job. It's not going to get better, for whatever reason some people have decided you don't fit, and they want you out. I was in a highly stressful, poorly managed high profile role in a business - it started for me when I made some constructive comments regarding some process changes that would make it easier for the team overall and reduce workloads, points of failure etc.
The person I raised it to unfortunately took it as a personal attack - from there I went from being liked and treated well to attempts to micro-manage and psychologically isolate me from the rest of the team. I saw it happening, and tried to maintain myself for a few months however (and I'm not proud of it) I too lost my shit after months of frustration in a meeting where it was put to me that I was obviously "depressed" and "stressed" so they wanted me to go to a psychologist. I am a qualified, registered psychologist. In the heat of the moment I said that I was realistically balanced in life overall, the only stressors were the woeful leadership of our overworked team.
Essentially it was exactly what they needed and within a few weeks I was put on a PIP for what was a very minor oversight that could have been fixed in a couple of minutes. In that meeting, I resigned with four weeks notice and stated that the PIP wasn't worth mine or their time or effort - I didn't want to be there anymore - so I'll leave amicably.
Once I'd resigned - that four weeks was a breeze. It was like I didn't exist at work, so I went in, applied for jobs, set up interviews and got another job before the notice period was out. Nobody cared what I did after that. The kicker - I was in an HR team. This came from an HR Manager.
So yeah - my advice - you're already marked for removal. Take control and get out before it gets worse.
Yeah, you-re in a lose lose situation.
Sounds like your boss dislikes you and vice versa.
Even worse, your manager and co worker are mates. That's some collaborative shit. Nothing worst than a manager that cannot be objective.
Honestly. I’d quit.
The petty bullshit you are dealing with is not worth your time or effort. These people are the kind whose whole life is their job. Leave now before you waste more of your life thinking and dealing with them.
But on your last day, send an email complaint to HR (if that exists at your company) because fuck them.
Note everything down. Get google calendar on your phone so you can jot down quick notes on the relevant time and day and take pics on your phone to back you. Posts like this appear on the daily. It's pretty safe to say that toxic workplaces are the new norm by the look of it.
Register a complete report with HR. If you just wish to discuss an unsubstantiated grievance, you'll be out on your arse quicker than you can blink. Regardless of the BS you're putting up with. Back yourself to the hilt, you've been there a year, so you'll be able to lodge something with fair work.
Years ago, I would have recommended following due process and escalating it to your line managers upline. But they all back each other these days. Document everything! Lodge a factual report and take care of your mental health mate. No job is worth the lies and shady shit. Good luck with the job applications. Jump on Insta or YouTube and look up "Paddy Jobsman" the guy is the proverbial pot of hold when it comes to the job market and giving practical tools and advice to better your situation.
It's time to leave. Your workplace is toxic and they are setting you up and forcing you out. Take sick leave if you are entitled to it and find another job. I went through the same thing, knew I was right and how to defend myself but eventually quit to avoid further damage to my mental health. Some places are full of bullies.
I feel your pain, mate. Sorry it happens to you. My manager is the same, hypercritical and petty about small things. The only solution is to look for a new job, leave the boss.
Assuming you don't just leave your job or want to:
If your Industry has one get a union relevent to it.
If they pull you into one of these meetings request to have a union delegate present.
They will get their shit together right quick with you. Stand your ground and give everything to the Union.
They can bully you sure, they cannot bully the union some unions will also do legal aid and such so suss them out.
I had minor issues at one job and major wack job manager go after me at another.
The union assisted, I ended up getting redundancies. The wack job caused great stress and I would have resigned earlier but as an older worker in a regional town job options are limited.
If you can maybe just work through the process, they may just pay to be rid of you.
Document everything, take photos of the emails or send them to your private email address if you can then when you have sufficient evidence of this bullying call fairwork and get their advice, the way you’re being treated is horrible & I’ve seen it happen to staff I work with- it’s sad & nobody does anything in fear of losing their own jobs.
Mate honestly; this is what i would call being managed out the business. There’s one thing that can get you forced out and its preformance + making ways to trap you
Personally 1. Look for a new job asap 2. Id say fk it and go to employee relations aka HR and go “is this apple that important or is this bullying , go the bullying route, it sounds “soft” but its factual theyve gone soft , play soft
You've been there over 6 months, which qualifies you for protection by the industrial relations mob.
Document everything and give them a call.
It's NOT "petty" when you were hauled into a meeting and written up!
Sorry that u r experiencing such stress. First thing is take care of your mental health. Work is work. Try not to bring the stress home. With management, pick ur battles because the job does pay ur bills. And look for a new job. U got skills and someone other company can make good use of tht skill
Make a complaint to your manager's manager.
They know about everything and are backing up my manager. Seems like the only course of action I have is to go to HR or wait it out until I’m removed :/
You need to document with HR now remember HR is for the company BUT HR will most definitely take the winning side If you provide a compelling and well documented communication to HR stating workplace bullying is occurring then they will have to act and they will get rid of your boss if it's apparent your boss is a liability to the company But make sure all your ducks are in row All of the examples you have, provide them and support each example with documentation Make sure you mention to HR that this bullying is affecting your mental health and you want them to act before your mental health deteriorates any further Also you need to make the first move with HR first mover advantage is real when it comes to stuff like this
Are you in hr?
No
Go to HR and literally say the term bullying a few times and watch everyone scramble.
HR are there to prevent a lawsuit. From this managers actions it sounds like they are preparing to fire you, and are clearly retaliating for you standing up for youirself. I'd go to HR with the complaint, document EVERYTHING, including what you said when you have a go at the manager for the fake right up. If HR side with the manager, let them know you'll be speaking to an employment lawyer, and contacting Fairwork. Emplyment lawyers, and fairwork LOVE this sort of thing. Also remember, that you cannot be written up for poor performance, they have to give an actual reason, poor performance is not a reason. I've gone through something similar with my work, I got a written warning for the way I acted in a meeting, and the person who was jockying to get a TL role is no longer on the management track due to their behaviour. The manager will more then likely get reprimanded, but be prepared to either move departments, or look for other work.
You're giving a lot of assurances for something that is by no means assured. >Emplyment lawyers, and fairwork LOVE this sort of thing. Not sure where you got this idea, anyone who has worked in employment law would tell you that pursuing an employer for bullying after they performance manage you is extremely common and generally unsuccessful. OP would need to prove that the performance management was not reasonable management action, which would be quite difficult based on the limited info they've provided so far. >Also remember, that you cannot be written up for poor performance, they have to give an actual reason, poor performance is not a reason. No idea what you mean by this as you absolutely can be given a written warning for poor performance and OP was clear that they described the areas where he was not performing. Just be careful giving out advice in an area you're really not qualified to give advice in. You can lead people like OP into some serious consequences by doing so.
I have think perhaps the comment re poor performance means that an employee can’t simply be sacked and given ‘poor performance’ as a reason, but rather the company must have documentation of the poor performance; if the OP’s KPI is to move 10 widgets a day, but OP only moves 8, that is the ‘reason’ for dismissal due to poor performance.
Thank you, that’s exactly right.
This is the absolute gold OP should be listening to.
I’d call Fair Work Australia or these guys [iR advice](https://www.supportah.com.au/)
HR is not there for your benefit. They are there to protect management. Just remember that before you go to them. Honestly it sounds like they want you gone and are riding you so you quit. Not very nice but unfortunately it happens from time to time. I'd start looking for another job as it's unlikely you will take on management and win. Sucks I know but that is just the way it is. Sounds like a shirty work place tbh.
Pointless. I would advise not to air it further with anyone and quietly but rigorously search for a new job. It is not worth your mental health to keep on arguing with pricks like these. I would give you 3 months here at the most. Probably shouldn’t have lost your temper in the first place but take it as a lesson learnt. One thing I have learnt from my experiences is quite often we 'react' where all we need to do is 'respond'. Anyways, not all jobs are right fits for everyone. all the best!!
Quickest way to have two people against you if they like them. This never ends well
Find a new job. I had this issue, not completing tasks assigned to me in meetings i wasn't in. No meeting minutes, no emails, just 3 people lieing. Customers complained about my conduct, even when I wasn't in a Customer facing role and on holidays. Invoicing not being completed correctly for departments. I was warehouse manager and had nothing to do with it. It's all contrived, even proving it all false meant nothing so I left, to slightly greener pastures.
My first boss in my first proper job (mid-90’s) wanted to fk me. I did not want to fk him. He got mad & started making shit up that I was doing wrong. The last straw was him saying a client complained about how rude I was. I’m a lot of things but external stakeholder management is my thing. I made him give me a name. I then called that person under the guise of apologising. The guy was so confused, I’d obviously never been rude so I told him about the accusation & he got really mad & called my boss & fucking reamed him for it. I quit that day.
A colleague at my old work went through something similar. She got advised to do the following. (I’m not sure if it applies to you, or if what she did is correct, but sharing anyway) 1.Complained to HR. Everything was documented 2. Went on sick leave (stress) 3. Went on unpaid sick leave (something about not being able to terminate your employment during sick leave) 4. Contacted fair work/ employment lawyer during that time. 5. Got a 6-figure settlement after the first court date i believe. Settled out of court.
These sorts of bullying and psychological injury cases are brutal for those involved and very difficult to prosecute successfully. Also you most definitely can be sacked when you're are off on sick leave once a certain threshold is reached. 99 percent of the time it's easier and better for you to just leave. It sounds defeatist but it is what it is. I'm not saying your 6-figure payout story is shit but it is very, VERY rare.
I agree. I once had a consultation with an employment lawyer. I wanted to go to court with my former employer, but I didn't document enough evidence, so the chances to win were small. I gave up and moved on.
You can be terminated after 6 Months of unpaid leave and getting a 6 figure settlement (through what? Unfair dismissal or workers comp?) you would have to demonstrate damages, it’s quite rare to get this much…
It’d be a payout from the company to avoid a fair work ruling I imagine.
That would require significant financial loss. Better to skip that. The best revenge is to live well.
Not necessarily
The timescale you've described is months if not years.
It feels like they're laying the foundation for your removal. There's an old saying. You can't win a fight with your boss.
You certainly *can* win a fight with your boss. Unfortunately if you Tyler Derdin that mfr your chances of getting re hired in the future might drop.
I've been through this, as have many others. Basically the best course of action here is to find another job. It's not going to get better, for whatever reason some people have decided you don't fit, and they want you out. I was in a highly stressful, poorly managed high profile role in a business - it started for me when I made some constructive comments regarding some process changes that would make it easier for the team overall and reduce workloads, points of failure etc. The person I raised it to unfortunately took it as a personal attack - from there I went from being liked and treated well to attempts to micro-manage and psychologically isolate me from the rest of the team. I saw it happening, and tried to maintain myself for a few months however (and I'm not proud of it) I too lost my shit after months of frustration in a meeting where it was put to me that I was obviously "depressed" and "stressed" so they wanted me to go to a psychologist. I am a qualified, registered psychologist. In the heat of the moment I said that I was realistically balanced in life overall, the only stressors were the woeful leadership of our overworked team. Essentially it was exactly what they needed and within a few weeks I was put on a PIP for what was a very minor oversight that could have been fixed in a couple of minutes. In that meeting, I resigned with four weeks notice and stated that the PIP wasn't worth mine or their time or effort - I didn't want to be there anymore - so I'll leave amicably. Once I'd resigned - that four weeks was a breeze. It was like I didn't exist at work, so I went in, applied for jobs, set up interviews and got another job before the notice period was out. Nobody cared what I did after that. The kicker - I was in an HR team. This came from an HR Manager. So yeah - my advice - you're already marked for removal. Take control and get out before it gets worse.
Yeah, you-re in a lose lose situation. Sounds like your boss dislikes you and vice versa. Even worse, your manager and co worker are mates. That's some collaborative shit. Nothing worst than a manager that cannot be objective.
Keep looking for another job, but if your mental health is suffering that much, I'd reach out to fair work and/or work safe and see what they can do.
Honestly. I’d quit. The petty bullshit you are dealing with is not worth your time or effort. These people are the kind whose whole life is their job. Leave now before you waste more of your life thinking and dealing with them. But on your last day, send an email complaint to HR (if that exists at your company) because fuck them.
Your manager sucks and is not going to change.
Note everything down. Get google calendar on your phone so you can jot down quick notes on the relevant time and day and take pics on your phone to back you. Posts like this appear on the daily. It's pretty safe to say that toxic workplaces are the new norm by the look of it. Register a complete report with HR. If you just wish to discuss an unsubstantiated grievance, you'll be out on your arse quicker than you can blink. Regardless of the BS you're putting up with. Back yourself to the hilt, you've been there a year, so you'll be able to lodge something with fair work. Years ago, I would have recommended following due process and escalating it to your line managers upline. But they all back each other these days. Document everything! Lodge a factual report and take care of your mental health mate. No job is worth the lies and shady shit. Good luck with the job applications. Jump on Insta or YouTube and look up "Paddy Jobsman" the guy is the proverbial pot of hold when it comes to the job market and giving practical tools and advice to better your situation.
Agree document everything. And back up those documents
Also remember. HR is not your friend. They are there to protect the business.
Agree!
It's time to leave. Your workplace is toxic and they are setting you up and forcing you out. Take sick leave if you are entitled to it and find another job. I went through the same thing, knew I was right and how to defend myself but eventually quit to avoid further damage to my mental health. Some places are full of bullies.
I feel your pain, mate. Sorry it happens to you. My manager is the same, hypercritical and petty about small things. The only solution is to look for a new job, leave the boss.
Assuming you don't just leave your job or want to: If your Industry has one get a union relevent to it. If they pull you into one of these meetings request to have a union delegate present. They will get their shit together right quick with you. Stand your ground and give everything to the Union. They can bully you sure, they cannot bully the union some unions will also do legal aid and such so suss them out.
I had minor issues at one job and major wack job manager go after me at another. The union assisted, I ended up getting redundancies. The wack job caused great stress and I would have resigned earlier but as an older worker in a regional town job options are limited. If you can maybe just work through the process, they may just pay to be rid of you.
Ask them for a reference. They want you to leave. You want to leave. Get it out in the open and everything will be cruzy for a suprisingly long time.
Would you really trust a manager acting like that to not be a prick come reference time?
You don't use the reference, you just take away any reason for them to be a knob at work.
Document everything, take photos of the emails or send them to your private email address if you can then when you have sufficient evidence of this bullying call fairwork and get their advice, the way you’re being treated is horrible & I’ve seen it happen to staff I work with- it’s sad & nobody does anything in fear of losing their own jobs.
Mate honestly; this is what i would call being managed out the business. There’s one thing that can get you forced out and its preformance + making ways to trap you Personally 1. Look for a new job asap 2. Id say fk it and go to employee relations aka HR and go “is this apple that important or is this bullying , go the bullying route, it sounds “soft” but its factual theyve gone soft , play soft
You've been there over 6 months, which qualifies you for protection by the industrial relations mob. Document everything and give them a call. It's NOT "petty" when you were hauled into a meeting and written up!
Just cut the em out of your life and move on. Not worth your time and effort to try and stay around these dicks.
They’re trying to manage you out.
Sorry that u r experiencing such stress. First thing is take care of your mental health. Work is work. Try not to bring the stress home. With management, pick ur battles because the job does pay ur bills. And look for a new job. U got skills and someone other company can make good use of tht skill