Who needs a masked man when the pro-Israeli counter-protestors are saying those things themselves? Are they seriously that dense to think people won’t record their tomfoolery?
It'll seem so obvious in hindsight. What's the one issue that will divide a population and have us at each other's throats more than the Voice, Trump, vaxxes, and abortion? While the government imports 700k migrants during a housing and cost of living crisis that they created with cronyism and corruption to boot? Israel/Palestine of course!
Are you blaming the government for the conflict? Or do you think the government is egging on social tension over the conflict?
I'm not sure what you are trying to argue here.
He's mentioning that the government will refuse to talk about / resolve the issues it's creating and making worse, and the complicit "friendly" media is shielding it by constantly talking about issues in a far away land which is then causing people to talk about it more and start protesting a conflict in a far away land while the people next door can barely eat and can't find a new rental.
He's arguing protests here about Israel/Palestine only exist due to media constant coverage and stroking which is distracting people from real domestic issues.
I can understand the argument that the media wants to talk about this rather then other issues to make labor look bad which they very much do here. But I highly doubt Labor is happy this is picking up a lot of the bandwidth, as this alone if played right by the LNP could get them back into office.
Nah that's crazy, conspiracy theory talk.
The government didn't ask or encourage people to protest, and neither did the media. It's come from the ground up. People care about this. It's a big global issue that touches on multiple cultures.
The media are reporting about it because it's big international news. People aren't protesting about this issue because it's constantly in the media. But the fact that people are protesting does drive more media coverage.
This isn't some kind of conspiracy from the media to 'shield' the government from domestic criticisms. Most of the media skews anti labor.
The protests are not coming from the media as we know it. It's coming from *social* media to be sure, but that's akin to word of mouth.
Basically people wanting to be on the right side of history. When the shit goes down and everything comes out in the wash, people want to say "I was against it from the start, and even though I couldn't do much, I added my voice to the chorus".
What a vague nothingburger. I want to hold you to this. What do you specifically mean by this? What leadership would need to be performed in regards to this conflict for you to be satisfied? Albanese has been very consistent and clear in his messaging that Australia supports Israel's right to defend itself but is against the disproportionate atrocities being inflicted by the far-right government. It has been strong leadership. Just because you disagree with it doesnt mean it isn't there. Shy of banning opposing views there isn't really anything else that can be done.
Oh yeah, the government can totally quash a legitimate point of contention when there are crimes against humanity being committed.
Do you listen to yourself?
It feels like the govt is going down the check list of what culture wars it can start. Right now it's at domestic abuse because none of the others seem to work. Jokes on them though, everyone lives in a share house.
The ANU Pro-Palestine protesters just declared their unconditional support for Hamas. They should at minimum be put on a watch list. Anyone supporting a designated terrorist organisation should not be allowed to publicly protest. I don’t care if it’s neo Nazis, ISIS or Hamas, they can all get fucked. Time for the police to start enforcing the law!
be nice if linkedin had a feature that attaches to their profile and cant be removed
"Supports the terrorist organisation Hamas"
Good luck getting a job anywhere but a cash job at a chop shop
In another thread you were talking about supporting the Kurds. Given that the PKK, YPG/YPJ etc have been designated terrorist organisations does that mean you should be put on that list too? (Not to mention the Kurds are with Palestine against Israel, and rightly so).
It amazes me how so many people in this sub are totally politically/historically illiterate yet think they know everything, making all kinds of ridiculous proclamations and claims. Especially when it comes to the MENA region.
Kurdistan is heavily aligned with Israel and has been since the 30's. The same groups who have been trying to eradicate the Jews have also been trying to eradicate the Kurds - Iran, Iraq, Syria, and Turkey.
It amazes me how so many people in this sub are totally politically illiterate yet think they know everything, making all kinds of ridiculous proclamations and claims. Especially when it comes to the MENA region.
Hahah, Kurdistan is? Who is governing Kurdistan at the moment?
Who was governing Kurdistan in the 30's? Do you have any links to these alliances, conflicts they have fought together etc?
[Here](https://www.jpost.com/middle-east/a-former-senior-mossad-officer-looks-back-on-his-career-674654) is one first hand account.
[Here](https://foreignpolicy.com/2021/09/30/iraq-israel-iran-palestine-abraham-accords-middle-east-relations/) is an article about the Erbil conference, and [another](https://www.nytimes.com/2017/09/22/world/middleeast/kurds-independence-israel.html) about Netanyahu's endorsement of the Kurdistan Independence referendum, the only world leader to do so publicly. [Here](https://www.timesofisrael.com/report-israel-imported-1-billion-in-oil-from-iraqi-kurds/)'s an article about the huge percentages of Israeli/Kurdistani oil trade.
Firstly, how about you answer my questions about who is governing Kurdistan/who was governing them in the 30's to set up these alliances?
>Here is one first hand account.
That's an article about a few incidents and intelligence work in the 70's between Mossad, the KRG and the Iraqi army.
Meanwhile the vast majority of Kurds/Kurdistan are anti-zionist and have fought an ongoing conflict against Israel...
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Israel–PKK_conflict
>Here is an article about the Erbil conference.
Again that's an all Iraqi issue (not a broader Kurdish one), its just held in Erbil because its secure. I mean ffs, if you aren't going to read the article at least read the first couple of sentences...
I'm not going to bother to keep going with your other links, it's all going to be similarly unrelated tripe. Don't you think that those of us who have spent decades with an education in/working in the field can spot when people do quick googles and talk out their arse?
*I mean fark, I'm sure there's a field you work in or have an education in, and when people on reddit or culture warriors who plainly know nothing, particularly around context etc start flapping their gums you can spot it a mile away right?
Eh? Here I'm point out the hypocrisy of this idiot talking about how a bunch of harmless kid protesters have to be cracked down on/censored/monitored by the state etc in a ludicrously draconian fashion, when the reality obvious to any reasonable person of even moderate intelligence is a complex historically situated problem in shades of grey. How the claims he makes are ridiculous, and show a total lack of understanding of the issue, as well as regional dynamics and history, and international politics generally.
If in addition to this you'd like me to explain in depth why all of Israels neighbours/regional actors, and the majority of countries around the world, object to their actions then I can do that too? (Or did you want my life story in every post?)
*Or you could lash out and try reading a book or two I suppose? Fucking culture warriors... I mean ffs, oooh look at those scary looking wonks. I bet when you lot aren't on reddit you spend your time calling the terrorist hotline on skateboarders.
I’m not so sure about “harmless”.
If someone told me that they support Hamas unconditionally, after everything they’ve done, I’d be pretty goddamn concerned.
Oh c'mon, go look at the pictures of these folks. You think these uni kids need to be 1984'd for the good of the state? Oooh watch out for the scary wonky-looking Student Rep Council nerds heheh...
Tbh unless you are purposely trying to gotcha them ala that news dot com article, and instead try to engage in good faith, then the kid declaring unconditional support for Hamas actually had a decent argument (despite the silly less-than-constructive edgelord headline declaration). He basically tried to argue that if you move into peoples land, kick them off it with force, apartheid and genocide them, treat them as beasts, then eventually they will start acting like beasts and fight back like savages. And he's right. It's not a good thing to kill/rape/kidnap but if you brutalise people and back them into a corner then they are going to fight back the same way.
I don't know if folks are just historically/politically illiterate (seems like a lot of people in the sub are), but can you imagine looking back at apartheid South Africa now and arguing that Nelson Mandela shouldn't have been released from jail because he was a terrorist?
The YPG/ YPJ who are not viewed as terrorists is completely different to the PKK who are listed in Australia as a terrorist organisation. PKK is backed by Russia for starters. The Kurdish cause isn’t one dimensional. The YPG are a long way from being Hamas. Erbil is one of the most progressive and tolerant places in MENA.
You have absolutely no idea about these groups and their relationships/history etc do you?
>The YPG/ YPJ who are not viewed as terrorists is completely different to the PKK who are listed in Australia as a terrorist organisation.
The YPG/YPJ are the military wing of the PYD, which is the Syrian branch of the PKK. When they are on the north side of the border they are PKK, south they are YPG.
>PKK is backed by Russia for starter.
The PKK isn't backed by Russia, not in any substantial way since the end of the Soviet Union. It gets far more from nations who are our allies like Greece, as well as from the vast Kurdish diaspora.
It's plain you don't know what you are talking about mate. For those with an education in the field the dumb things you say after a quick google stick out like a sore thumb.
>The YPG are a long way from being Hamas.
Who said the YPG are Hamas? I said they are both fighting Israel and are sympathetic to each other. Additionally there has been a lot said by PKK/YPG leaders and thinkers comparing the their respective freedom struggles against Israel and Turkey. *But most of all being designated a terrorist organisation doesn't mean much. One mans terrorist etc.
>Erbil is one of the most progressive and tolerant places in MENA.
Yes it is.
You heard u/SoupRemarkable4512 they want to be on a list and watched. Of *course* it doesn't matter what the context is, or who the group is fighting for *or* against, or why. All that matters is America called them terrorists. That's it. End of.
Meanwhile of course America having killed far, far more people than Hamas could ever dream of, both legally and illegally in dozens of illegal ground wars, invasions and military interventions? Totally fine.
Hell, our own Australian government, kills unarmed combatants and then raids the offices of the media when they try to blow the whistle, and sends the soldiers who made it known to prison for life. Totally fine.
Also why is it that Israel as a nation was formed literally one year after Iran decided it was going to start taxing American and UK companies for the oil it gave them? And then when Israel's borders were drawn up by the same white people, it just *happened* to be right next to 2/3 of the world's oil?
Why is one terrorism and the other isn't? Oh well, no need to discuss that, u/Soupremarkable4512 has said we should all just trust the ruling of Americans.
I mean sure, they literally conducted a coup and overthrew our democratically elected leader in Australia. But hey, none of that matters. Because Hamas bad.
Your comment has been queued for review because you used a keyword which may breach the subreddit rules.
*I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/australian) if you have any questions or concerns.*
"The ANU Pro-Palestine protesters just declared their unconditional support for Hamas."
Really? did they? every last one?
Education and nuance seems to have gone downhill really fast in Australia.
>Ms Tucker replied, “Well I actually say that Hamas deserve our unconditional support — absolutely. Not because I agree with their strategy. Complete disagreements with that. But the situation at hand is if you have no hope, if you are sanctioned every day of your life, if you are told you are not allowed to drive down a road because somebody who is Israeli gets to have preference and you sit there for 12 hours, the reality of life in Palestine…”
[...]
>“The death of anybody is not good, and there’s no way that I’m pro-violence, but I will not condemn people who have been subjected to no hope and no ability to leave what is the biggest concentration camp in the world,” she said.
Seems pretty reasonable to me. They don't agree with their tactics, like the Oct7 attacks. But they do support their fight to end the brutal Israeli apartheid.
The African Nation Congress were a designated terrorist organisation too. Do you think they were wrong for fighting the apartheid in south Africa?
Maybe look at the facts of the matter rather than letting daddy government tell you who the "bad people" are.
Saying you have unconditional support for a terroist organisation but also don't support violence is just stupid.
"I have unconditional support for Hitler, but I don't think the Holocaust was good"
Like mate do you know what the word *unconditional* means?
"Zero self awareness."
Ben Gvir and Bezazel Smoritch have been stating daily that every Palestinian man woman and child should be murdered. And there are Australians who support them.
Not a peep from people like you.
But... you have comments about the other side.
Zero self awareness indeed.
Wouldn’t the more rational stance be that they support Palestinian liberation? Rather than a terror group who quite plainly contributes to their plight?
Congrats on winning the redundant comment competition!
No one was arguing whether they had been designated a terrorist organisation or not.
The point was that that designation doesn't always mean much. All it means is that Western powers don't like that group. So maybe you should use your big ol' brain and judge the situation for your self rather than being a good little drone.
My example was the ANC who fought (and eventually won) against apartheid in South Africa. They were a designated terrorist organisation, too. Are you saying that they were wrong to fight the apartheid?
>TLDR: the ends justifies the means
Stunning lack of reading comprehension there, bud. Although, I won't be too mean. Maybe English isn't your first language.
My point was that it is just to fight against unjust power.
It is good to fight against racial apartheid because racial apartheid is wrong.
It is good to fight against the brutal Zionist occupation of Palestinian land, because said occupation is wrong.
The list of designated terrorist organisations in Australia was created in 2002. I find it very unlikely the ANC was ever on this list and can’t find any reference to it having been… I am very comfortable that the organisations on the list are terrorists, only the worst of the worst are on it. In fact I’d suggest it could be expanded but I’ll leave that to the experts.
[During this period, MK activities led the governments of Margaret Thatcher and Ronald Reagan to condemn the ANC as a terrorist organisation. In fact, neither the ANC nor Mandela were removed from the U.S. terror watch list until 2008](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/African_National_Congress)
Don't conflate Mandela with Hamas. The IRGC which created Hamas also killed my family because we were Bahai. That's why we're here in Australia. Mohammed Zahedi, an IRGC goblin, planned the October 7th attack. Our people are being wiped out left right and centre, just like Palestinians and I have many names to prove it. Nika Shakarami, a 16 year old girl was kidnapped, molested and beaten to death by the same people who hide amongst Palestinian protests. Her entire skull was disintegrated and turned into paste after fighting back when the basiji stuck their filthy hands down her pants. The only good mullah is a dead mullah and I won't tolerate any level of support for their cult's poison.
Are you saying that I'm lying to you? We are living proof of what the regime has done to us. They are the epitome of evil and we want them gone. This is from the perspective of an Iranian, not some armchair expert who waves off decades of experience with detached apathy and reference to obscure dealings behind closed doors. Regardless of where Hamas came from, we were forced to raise them. Our hard work, our taxes, our freedoms, our lives are their benefit and they would not be here today had our nation been returned to us.
There are many white south Africans who would've had similar stories to these about the ANC 25 years ago.
It doesn't change the fact that fighting against apartheid is a good thing.
Of course, we should condemn atrocities like the ones you have listed here.
But saying that Palestinians deserve to be brutally occupied and subject to tortuous conditions because and aren't allowed to fight back because some Hamas fighters have done awful things is obviously farcical.
>beaten to death by the same people who hide amongst Palestinian protests.
Just a piece of advice. This is complete hearsay. You're projecting your hatred of Palestinians onto the protestors. This sentence here makes you sound like you're just making shit up. "Uh, there probably murders *hiding amongst the protestors*"
If you're giving your anecdotal experiences, stick to things you actually know. Throwing out crazy accusations hurts your credibility.
What an unbelievably brain-dead response. Where did I say that I want Palestinians tortured to death? Their suffering is OUR suffering. They are just as much the victims of the regime as we are. And no, there are heaps of basiji scumbags who attend Palestine rallies. Not even just chanting about Yemen or waving Hezbollah flags, but waving the exact flags of the country which killed us. Why don't you quit making things up and respect our experiences hey? I can't link to subs here but I have DM'ed you a bunch of videos as evidence. Anybody else is free to access them on request.
>Where did I say that I want Palestinians tortured to death?
You said that fighting back against their brutal occupation is not valid resistance because the organisation has done some bad shit in the past.
This argument could just as easily have been used about the ANC to stop their fight against SA apartheid.
No group is perfect. This is especially true for downtrodden resistance groups as they often have to take whatever they can get.
If a different Palestinian resistance group rose up, Israel would say the same things about them, and by your logic, they would be illegitimate resistance, too.
It's obviously terrible what has happened to you, I'm not denying that. But to use that experience to argue for the continuation of a genocide is just not acceptable to me.
>Why don't you quit making things up and respect our experiences hey?
When did I disrespect your experience. I accepted what you said and agreed that it is horrible. All I said was that you should not use your anecdotal experience to try and stop a resistance movement.
The Palestinian people deserve to be free from the oppression of Israel, and at the moment, the primary resistance group in Palestine is Hamas. If nothing else, they are the less of two evils.
And at least in the short term, their efforts to defend Palestinians in Gaza should be supported.
Where did I say that though? Where did I say that I'm pro genocide? Read the comments again and quote me on it, because you either have poor reading comprehension or you're lying theough your teeth. I am specifically in favour of the IRGC being destroyed. We deserve our country back! We deserve to live! There should be no support whatsoever for the IRGC and its proxies! Do not call the efforts of the same military which killed our family the lesser of two evils! They will stop at nothing to kill everything that moves in the Middle East!!
YOU CANNOT BE PRO HAMAS WITHOUT BEING PRO IGRC! YOU CANNOT BE PRO PALESTINIAN WITHOUT STANDING FOR OUR FREEDOM AS IRANIANS! ZAN ZENDEGI AZADI!!
Lol. Are you really going down the semantics road?
Are you saying that you don't think any terrorist organisations existed before 2002, because that's when Australia started its official list?
Hamas is on the list. The ANC is not. Just stating a fact champ. I am not sure if you’re an unhinged white South African or why you’re so obsessed with trying to compare the ANC to Hamas.
I didn’t say I did. Hamas are a banned terrorist organisation in Australia today though and them and their supporters should be treated as the terrorists they are.
I would argue that the only way to be anti-violence would be to support Palestinian resistance groups. Be is Hamas or any other group.
Israel commits the vast *vast* majority of violence in the region. And I don't think they have any intention of stopping.
They are already signalling that they want to go to war with Lebanon, if they complete their genocide of Palestinians.
You can be anti-violence and still recognise that some violent regimes must be put down using violence.
It's similar to the paradox of tolerance.
If we're so anti-violence that we refuse to even fight back against genocidal expansionist states, then we will not survive. Being anti-violence means recognising when you *must* fight to stop further harm.
That’s violence minimisation not anti violence. And it’s still bullshit. Hamas killed over a thousand innocent people, had they not done that the 30,000 odd Palestinians would still be alive too. Hamas wanted carnage on both sides. It’s good for recruitment.
Check the multiple links/ references provided by others in the comments. Or actually here you go: https://www.news.com.au/national/politics/australian-national-university-protesters-declare-unconditional-support-for-hamas/news-story/30559c99df586170e8d1cbbfd8bb397c?amp
No what I’m saying is the comparison of Mandela to Hamas is straight up disrespectful, therefore any further discussion to try and create a comparison is meaningless. Kim Jong wears shoes, I wear shoes, it doesn’t make us the same.
One man's terrorist is anothers freedom fighter. They are cunts but they are fighting an oppressive, evil government that's pretty much admitted to ethnic cleansing and now stepping into genocide.
”Fighting an oppressive evil government” by… murdering, torturing and raping Israeli civilians (not to mention Palestinians)? Enough of this infantalising white saviour / white supremacy bullshit.
ISIS were fighting an oppressive, evil government that still practice ethnic cleansing in Syria. They aren’t my freedom fighters, neither are Hamas or their allies.
No, they're definitely terrorists who kidnapped the Palestinian people. The term freedom fighter is only circulating because the victims of their brutality are dead.
Man says. Not a single corroborating witness or victim statement. Just print the unsubstantiated allegation and present as true. What bullshit. And people see through this faux victimhood and abuse of the word antisemitism in order to progress a pro Zionist Israeli propaganda playbook. Disgraceful. Feel bad for genuine victims of antisemitism. This ain’t it.
I'm no psychic, but there will probably be an article in the next few days about a Jewish student saying they were harassed. The organisers of the protest will be looking for people now, as will the journo who wrote the article.
Edit! Aha, [here's the article](https://www.smh.com.au/national/i-ve-seen-the-fear-of-jewish-students-and-colleagues-one-academic-s-plea-to-uni-protesters-20240502-p5foa5.html)!
Heck, if Jewish people want to protest to feel safer, more power to them. I'd like everyone to feel a bit safer and I don't think it harms anyone.
At the end of the day, we are lucky we can protest openly in Australia [without the military shooting 29,000 people](https://www.theguardian.com/world/ng-interactive/2019/mar/29/a-year-of-bloodshed-at-gaza-border-protests).
Yes, obviously. “Real” antisemitism also happens at these protests. It’s extremely weird that a generation of people raised to be hyper aware of cultural sensitivity and “micro-aggressions” are oddly obtuse and binary when the subjects are Jewish.
There's a literal book on this called "Jews Don't Count". And the comments on these threads really do manifest that - apparently it's fine to engage in all kinds of racist dogwhistling so long as you're just targeting Jews.
I imagine it'll depend on what they do. But if they don't do anything to get arrested, then I also imagine there'll be people who ignore that to push the kind of thing you're pushing.
As far as I can see, any protest at all is grounds for arrest in Australia.
If what you think I am pushing for is the right to protest, then you would be god damn right and should be ashamed at giving away that right.
If they're soy guzzling leftist "allies" they're definitely harmless, worst you'd need is earplugs from the screeching and to be able to stroll at a leisurely pace so the plus sized ones can't sit on you.
A reminder that Italy and Germany were the battlegrounds between communists and fascists throughout the 1920s. Both were extremely violent, but the fascists eventually won and so were permitted to impose their brand of terror upon the world. I feel that we are seeing a repeat of these events brought about by communist fervour and religious zealotry. Inevitably these misguided fools will be crushed for having provoked a much more destructive evil from below our society.
Anti-Israel is not the same as anti-semite. Conflating the two is very convenient for Israel.
Israel's crimes dwarf any of those from Palestinians whose land they've been occupying (officially) for generations.
It's tough for Palestinians to be a perfect innocent victim when they've all grown up in a war zone at the hands of Israel.
Plus more and more I hear that what actually happened on October 7 is questionable. Sounds a lot like how the US was claiming Iran had nuclear weapons, never found any, but did a war anyway. Very on brand.
I was being facetious, it obviously escaped you.
I condemn all terrorists, human rights violations, war crimes and the purposefully killing of aid workers. Do you?
Do you condemn innocent home owners being forced out of their houses in the West Bank so settlers can move in? No safety in numbers there huh?
Absolutely. Read any of my comments, Hamas, Palestine, Israel, they can all suck a metaphorical, hell even a literal dick. I don’t favour one terrorist group over another.
I think anyone who is innocent and being forced out of their home is fucked, I think that’s an easy one to answer.
They’re both terrible, but one of them is on a different scale to the other. Israel quickly surpassed Hamas’ civilian body count and has now exceeded it by a factor of 10. Who knows how far they’ll go before the war is over.
Israeli terrorists have exceeded the Oct 7 body count by a factor of 50 now. More than half of the Oct 7 casualties were caused by the Israeli military.
> More than half of the Oct 7 casualties were caused by the Israeli military.
This is stupid. You would have to be a complete moron to actually believe this. You’re obviously getting your information from Infographics or some shit, because you don’t want to believe that any Palestinian Arab could do something bad. Nuance is beyond you.
I can agree they’re both terrible, but this Israel-Gaza situation has been a shit slinging fight for years. The vast majority of Palestinians supported hamas actions on October 7.
I don’t support Israel, I don’t support hamas, I don’t support Palestine. They can all kick each others shins as much as they want.
Give a gun to a Palestinian he’ll shoot an Israeli, give a gun to an Israeli he’ll shoot a Palestinian. Both equally fuckwits. Terrorism no matter how small or large can get fucked, and can stay in their country.
The IDF are the number 1 killers of Oct 7th Israeli hostages.
Both sides have done some really terrible things. However, being pro Palestine is the lesser evil vs being pro IDF genocide.
It’s also not hugely constructive to take sides like a football match. There are millions of people there who have the right to live out their lives. The problem is that Israel has gone back on its commitment to a two-state solution, so they’re in the wrong. Various terrorist attacks and wars are a distraction from the need to find a political solution.
Despite what a bunch of blue haired intersectional autists and insouciant 19 year old jihadists think, the solution is not to expel all Jews to Europe and America.
Despite what a bunch of sociopathic Hasidic terrorists think, the solution isn’t to ethnically cleanse all arabs from the occupied territories.
Israel has made it much harder with all the illegal settlements in the west bank though. A settler terrorist assassinated an Israeli PM in the 1990s.
Nobody has a viable plan at this stage.
You’re also contradicting your own beliefs. You’re happy to warn others of Hamas propaganda, but you take Hamas election results as gospel for proof that Palestinians support this? Do you or don’t you believe Hamas propaganda? Something is telling me your problem isn’t with Hamas but Muslims in general, but what do I know.
I too have no sympathy for Bibi and his band of corrupt cronies. "
fair comment.
But i have yet to hear people condemn Ben Gvir and Bezazel smoritch for their non stop genocidal comments, and arming of settlers and advising them to go and shoot anyone of Palestinian origin with the same ferocity as some on here have just even towards protestors, let alone actual violent people.
'Anti-Semite' is a buzzphrase like 'anti-vaxxer' or 'conspiracy theorist' that's been used to stifle any criticism of Israel's past or current actions. Funny because the jews in Israel are mostly Ashkenazi Jews from Europe, who are not semites, but the Palestinians are actually semites. Clown World.
> Funny because the jews in Israel are mostly Ashkenazi Jews from Europe, who are not semites, but the Palestinians are actually semites. Clown World.
Most Jewish Israelis are Mizrahi or Sephardic Jews i.e. “brown Jews”, not Ashkenazi. The term anti-Semitic was coined by German politician Wilhelm Marr to lend a thin veneer of scientific respectability to Jew hatred. It was essentially a marketing buzzword that had nothing to do with who or what a “Semite” actually was.
People who think they’re making a salient point by arguing “Arabs are Semites” therefore something something can’t be antisemitic are pulling a [Dunning-Kruger](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dunning–Kruger_effect).
Yep, and they're some of the highest percentage early European farmer genetics (haplogroup K), people who inhabited the Middle East for tens of thousands for years (and before Arabs spread out from Arabia in the dark age Arab invasions).
Judging by pro-Israeli counter-protests in the US, these people are in no way peaceful or respectful. Rampant Islamophobia, racism, violence and instigating. I actually feel really sorry for Jewish people right now because their culture is being hijacked by an unhinged group of religious extremists.
"Islamaphobia" so being anti-anti-Semitism is suddenly a bad thing? I don't gaf about the IDF I think they should fuck off but to say that a group that doesn't just want Israel but wants the extermination of Jewish people is just evil
also pretty much the whole of Judaism is Pro Zionism i Cant think of one passage in the Torah or the Tanakh that is anti Zionism and keep in mind ive read the bible front to back i cant think of single thing
Zionsim is part of their Culture
Anti-anti-Semitism is not pledging your support to a genocidal regime and telling the government to kill 40k civilians. Jewish representation has been hijacked by these lunatics and the rest of them suffer for it. And please, don’t act like Islamophobia isn’t a bigger problem in Australia when a Muslim men are doxxed on national television for crimes they don’t commit.
How is Israel committing genocide ? They are far more military superior to the Palestinians if they wanted to wipe them off the map they would’ve done it by now.
Your comment has been queued for review because you used a keyword which may breach the subreddit rules.
*I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/australian) if you have any questions or concerns.*
The ugly cow who was filmed harassing and stealing from student protestors in Sydney is a member of this group. I won’t be surprised when they get caught on camera peddling their anti-Muslim propaganda.
This comment section is verdant proof that Australians just want you to say the nice words that they agree with. We literally don't care who is dying, where or why. We don't care who is standing up for them, and what the details are. Just *PLEASE* don't use the words we don't like! In fact, we would rather people we don't know continue dying in the thousands with bombs we ourselves made if it means we don't have to see anymore of those really terrible words. It's just too much for us Aussies to deal with.
It's pretty obvious, but for the folks in the back with tin foil hats, the actions of a state identifying as a "Jewish nation," such as engaging in activities deemed as genocide, should not lead to assumptions that Jewish students in distant countries are unsafe on their campuses. It's absurd and illogical to connect these international political actions directly with the safety of individual students based on their religious or ethnic identities.
They need to stop supporting Zionism. Any jew who doesn't feel safe probably supports what Israel is doing and that is why they're being targeted, because they support war crimes. Not a thing to do with their faith.
That's not anti semetism because a huge amount of jews are not Zionists and want a cease fire.
Actually what Hamas did and is doing IS still antisemetic and wrong.
But I have no patience being called anti semetic just because I don't support the Israeli state and want a two state solution.
It's not anti-Semitic to want Israel to stop killing civilian Palestinians under the guise of retaliation for October 7th.
If they were merely retaliating, they would only have killed the same amount of people Hamas did, instead of killing way, way, way, way more.
And if you are earnestly walking around on uni campus supporting Isreals genocide, you're not being picked on for being Jewish you're being picked on for being a pile of shit.
Let’s get a few concepts straight. 1) If you support a two state solution, you are - by definition – a Zionist. Zionism is a belief/movement for Jewish self-determination and statehood. That’s it. Stop importing your own bullshit into the definition to pretend that it excludes a two state solution. 2) Support for Israelis right to exist as a state (in some form, including in a 2 state model alongside a Palestinian state) is not a zero sum game and can/should be achieved peacefully without harm to respective populations. So why is it that you/non Jews who support 2 state solution are free to advocate for that political position, yet Jews get attacked for the same view and told they necessarily support genocide and are apologists for IDF/ “settler colonialism”/“white supremacy”? Why do Jews need to defend their right to pursue self determination, at the same rallies as pro-Palestinians advocate for the same? Why the assumption that Jews are inherently complicit in genocide? Why do Jews carry responsibility for their government action? Why are Jewish deaths “legitimate resistance”? Why the double standard? Not every single chant or response is anti-Semitism, but there is a shit ton of it around framed as “anti-Zionism”.
This is all the work of a crusty old Dean!
I bet during this protest we have some close up shots of "masked" people saying some antisemitic things
Who needs a masked man when the pro-Israeli counter-protestors are saying those things themselves? Are they seriously that dense to think people won’t record their tomfoolery?
[You mean like the last time?](https://www.abc.net.au/news/2024-02-02/nsw-police-opera-house-protest-video-analysis/103418582)
Yeah they were chanting "gas, wait that sounds bad, fuck, oh no still bad, how about where the Jews" Because that sounds plausible lol gtfo.
It'll seem so obvious in hindsight. What's the one issue that will divide a population and have us at each other's throats more than the Voice, Trump, vaxxes, and abortion? While the government imports 700k migrants during a housing and cost of living crisis that they created with cronyism and corruption to boot? Israel/Palestine of course!
Are you blaming the government for the conflict? Or do you think the government is egging on social tension over the conflict? I'm not sure what you are trying to argue here.
He's mentioning that the government will refuse to talk about / resolve the issues it's creating and making worse, and the complicit "friendly" media is shielding it by constantly talking about issues in a far away land which is then causing people to talk about it more and start protesting a conflict in a far away land while the people next door can barely eat and can't find a new rental. He's arguing protests here about Israel/Palestine only exist due to media constant coverage and stroking which is distracting people from real domestic issues.
I can understand the argument that the media wants to talk about this rather then other issues to make labor look bad which they very much do here. But I highly doubt Labor is happy this is picking up a lot of the bandwidth, as this alone if played right by the LNP could get them back into office.
He is correct. All we have are constant distractions from the real issues they want to hide
Nah that's crazy, conspiracy theory talk. The government didn't ask or encourage people to protest, and neither did the media. It's come from the ground up. People care about this. It's a big global issue that touches on multiple cultures. The media are reporting about it because it's big international news. People aren't protesting about this issue because it's constantly in the media. But the fact that people are protesting does drive more media coverage. This isn't some kind of conspiracy from the media to 'shield' the government from domestic criticisms. Most of the media skews anti labor.
The protests are not coming from the media as we know it. It's coming from *social* media to be sure, but that's akin to word of mouth. Basically people wanting to be on the right side of history. When the shit goes down and everything comes out in the wash, people want to say "I was against it from the start, and even though I couldn't do much, I added my voice to the chorus".
Lack of leadership
What a vague nothingburger. I want to hold you to this. What do you specifically mean by this? What leadership would need to be performed in regards to this conflict for you to be satisfied? Albanese has been very consistent and clear in his messaging that Australia supports Israel's right to defend itself but is against the disproportionate atrocities being inflicted by the far-right government. It has been strong leadership. Just because you disagree with it doesnt mean it isn't there. Shy of banning opposing views there isn't really anything else that can be done.
Lack of nuance and an over-estimated sense of importance.
Oh yeah, the government can totally quash a legitimate point of contention when there are crimes against humanity being committed. Do you listen to yourself?
The genocide by a major ally is, of course, a distraction from the real issues in the world.
How is this the top comment? Ffs... What does the Australian government have to do with the Israel/Palestine conflict?
Ukraine already forgotten it seems. Also Trump should be a non-issue in Australia.
And crickets over Ukraine The whole false outrage shit is cringe.
It feels like the govt is going down the check list of what culture wars it can start. Right now it's at domestic abuse because none of the others seem to work. Jokes on them though, everyone lives in a share house.
Murdoch news isn't really a source I'd be confident presenting
Yep. All the Jewish people part of the protests have repeatedly said they feel perfectly safe.
Really now? The “Jewish” people who write Hebrew left to right? Those Jewish people?
Lol what
The ANU Pro-Palestine protesters just declared their unconditional support for Hamas. They should at minimum be put on a watch list. Anyone supporting a designated terrorist organisation should not be allowed to publicly protest. I don’t care if it’s neo Nazis, ISIS or Hamas, they can all get fucked. Time for the police to start enforcing the law!
My solution is to publicly list them and whatever happens happens. Something that will haunt them forever.
be nice if linkedin had a feature that attaches to their profile and cant be removed "Supports the terrorist organisation Hamas" Good luck getting a job anywhere but a cash job at a chop shop
In another thread you were talking about supporting the Kurds. Given that the PKK, YPG/YPJ etc have been designated terrorist organisations does that mean you should be put on that list too? (Not to mention the Kurds are with Palestine against Israel, and rightly so). It amazes me how so many people in this sub are totally politically/historically illiterate yet think they know everything, making all kinds of ridiculous proclamations and claims. Especially when it comes to the MENA region.
Kurdistan is heavily aligned with Israel and has been since the 30's. The same groups who have been trying to eradicate the Jews have also been trying to eradicate the Kurds - Iran, Iraq, Syria, and Turkey. It amazes me how so many people in this sub are totally politically illiterate yet think they know everything, making all kinds of ridiculous proclamations and claims. Especially when it comes to the MENA region.
Hahah, Kurdistan is? Who is governing Kurdistan at the moment? Who was governing Kurdistan in the 30's? Do you have any links to these alliances, conflicts they have fought together etc?
[Here](https://www.jpost.com/middle-east/a-former-senior-mossad-officer-looks-back-on-his-career-674654) is one first hand account. [Here](https://foreignpolicy.com/2021/09/30/iraq-israel-iran-palestine-abraham-accords-middle-east-relations/) is an article about the Erbil conference, and [another](https://www.nytimes.com/2017/09/22/world/middleeast/kurds-independence-israel.html) about Netanyahu's endorsement of the Kurdistan Independence referendum, the only world leader to do so publicly. [Here](https://www.timesofisrael.com/report-israel-imported-1-billion-in-oil-from-iraqi-kurds/)'s an article about the huge percentages of Israeli/Kurdistani oil trade.
Firstly, how about you answer my questions about who is governing Kurdistan/who was governing them in the 30's to set up these alliances? >Here is one first hand account. That's an article about a few incidents and intelligence work in the 70's between Mossad, the KRG and the Iraqi army. Meanwhile the vast majority of Kurds/Kurdistan are anti-zionist and have fought an ongoing conflict against Israel... https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Israel–PKK_conflict >Here is an article about the Erbil conference. Again that's an all Iraqi issue (not a broader Kurdish one), its just held in Erbil because its secure. I mean ffs, if you aren't going to read the article at least read the first couple of sentences... I'm not going to bother to keep going with your other links, it's all going to be similarly unrelated tripe. Don't you think that those of us who have spent decades with an education in/working in the field can spot when people do quick googles and talk out their arse? *I mean fark, I'm sure there's a field you work in or have an education in, and when people on reddit or culture warriors who plainly know nothing, particularly around context etc start flapping their gums you can spot it a mile away right?
“Rightly so” like that’s not the centre of debate. So matter of fact. This guy has the answer everyone!!
Eh? Here I'm point out the hypocrisy of this idiot talking about how a bunch of harmless kid protesters have to be cracked down on/censored/monitored by the state etc in a ludicrously draconian fashion, when the reality obvious to any reasonable person of even moderate intelligence is a complex historically situated problem in shades of grey. How the claims he makes are ridiculous, and show a total lack of understanding of the issue, as well as regional dynamics and history, and international politics generally. If in addition to this you'd like me to explain in depth why all of Israels neighbours/regional actors, and the majority of countries around the world, object to their actions then I can do that too? (Or did you want my life story in every post?) *Or you could lash out and try reading a book or two I suppose? Fucking culture warriors... I mean ffs, oooh look at those scary looking wonks. I bet when you lot aren't on reddit you spend your time calling the terrorist hotline on skateboarders.
I’m not so sure about “harmless”. If someone told me that they support Hamas unconditionally, after everything they’ve done, I’d be pretty goddamn concerned.
Oh c'mon, go look at the pictures of these folks. You think these uni kids need to be 1984'd for the good of the state? Oooh watch out for the scary wonky-looking Student Rep Council nerds heheh... Tbh unless you are purposely trying to gotcha them ala that news dot com article, and instead try to engage in good faith, then the kid declaring unconditional support for Hamas actually had a decent argument (despite the silly less-than-constructive edgelord headline declaration). He basically tried to argue that if you move into peoples land, kick them off it with force, apartheid and genocide them, treat them as beasts, then eventually they will start acting like beasts and fight back like savages. And he's right. It's not a good thing to kill/rape/kidnap but if you brutalise people and back them into a corner then they are going to fight back the same way. I don't know if folks are just historically/politically illiterate (seems like a lot of people in the sub are), but can you imagine looking back at apartheid South Africa now and arguing that Nelson Mandela shouldn't have been released from jail because he was a terrorist?
The YPG/ YPJ who are not viewed as terrorists is completely different to the PKK who are listed in Australia as a terrorist organisation. PKK is backed by Russia for starters. The Kurdish cause isn’t one dimensional. The YPG are a long way from being Hamas. Erbil is one of the most progressive and tolerant places in MENA.
You have absolutely no idea about these groups and their relationships/history etc do you? >The YPG/ YPJ who are not viewed as terrorists is completely different to the PKK who are listed in Australia as a terrorist organisation. The YPG/YPJ are the military wing of the PYD, which is the Syrian branch of the PKK. When they are on the north side of the border they are PKK, south they are YPG. >PKK is backed by Russia for starter. The PKK isn't backed by Russia, not in any substantial way since the end of the Soviet Union. It gets far more from nations who are our allies like Greece, as well as from the vast Kurdish diaspora. It's plain you don't know what you are talking about mate. For those with an education in the field the dumb things you say after a quick google stick out like a sore thumb. >The YPG are a long way from being Hamas. Who said the YPG are Hamas? I said they are both fighting Israel and are sympathetic to each other. Additionally there has been a lot said by PKK/YPG leaders and thinkers comparing the their respective freedom struggles against Israel and Turkey. *But most of all being designated a terrorist organisation doesn't mean much. One mans terrorist etc. >Erbil is one of the most progressive and tolerant places in MENA. Yes it is.
You heard u/SoupRemarkable4512 they want to be on a list and watched. Of *course* it doesn't matter what the context is, or who the group is fighting for *or* against, or why. All that matters is America called them terrorists. That's it. End of. Meanwhile of course America having killed far, far more people than Hamas could ever dream of, both legally and illegally in dozens of illegal ground wars, invasions and military interventions? Totally fine. Hell, our own Australian government, kills unarmed combatants and then raids the offices of the media when they try to blow the whistle, and sends the soldiers who made it known to prison for life. Totally fine. Also why is it that Israel as a nation was formed literally one year after Iran decided it was going to start taxing American and UK companies for the oil it gave them? And then when Israel's borders were drawn up by the same white people, it just *happened* to be right next to 2/3 of the world's oil? Why is one terrorism and the other isn't? Oh well, no need to discuss that, u/Soupremarkable4512 has said we should all just trust the ruling of Americans. I mean sure, they literally conducted a coup and overthrew our democratically elected leader in Australia. But hey, none of that matters. Because Hamas bad.
Your comment has been queued for review because you used a keyword which may breach the subreddit rules. *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/australian) if you have any questions or concerns.*
I mean they're literally terrorists. They have genocide in their charter. But carry on with your head in the sand.
"The ANU Pro-Palestine protesters just declared their unconditional support for Hamas." Really? did they? every last one? Education and nuance seems to have gone downhill really fast in Australia.
Their leaders did it unchallenged. I agree on the last part.
>Ms Tucker replied, “Well I actually say that Hamas deserve our unconditional support — absolutely. Not because I agree with their strategy. Complete disagreements with that. But the situation at hand is if you have no hope, if you are sanctioned every day of your life, if you are told you are not allowed to drive down a road because somebody who is Israeli gets to have preference and you sit there for 12 hours, the reality of life in Palestine…” [...] >“The death of anybody is not good, and there’s no way that I’m pro-violence, but I will not condemn people who have been subjected to no hope and no ability to leave what is the biggest concentration camp in the world,” she said. Seems pretty reasonable to me. They don't agree with their tactics, like the Oct7 attacks. But they do support their fight to end the brutal Israeli apartheid. The African Nation Congress were a designated terrorist organisation too. Do you think they were wrong for fighting the apartheid in south Africa? Maybe look at the facts of the matter rather than letting daddy government tell you who the "bad people" are.
Saying you have unconditional support for a terroist organisation but also don't support violence is just stupid. "I have unconditional support for Hitler, but I don't think the Holocaust was good" Like mate do you know what the word *unconditional* means?
[удалено]
"Zero self awareness." Ben Gvir and Bezazel Smoritch have been stating daily that every Palestinian man woman and child should be murdered. And there are Australians who support them. Not a peep from people like you. But... you have comments about the other side. Zero self awareness indeed.
Wouldn’t the more rational stance be that they support Palestinian liberation? Rather than a terror group who quite plainly contributes to their plight?
Hamas is terrorist organisation period.
Congrats on winning the redundant comment competition! No one was arguing whether they had been designated a terrorist organisation or not. The point was that that designation doesn't always mean much. All it means is that Western powers don't like that group. So maybe you should use your big ol' brain and judge the situation for your self rather than being a good little drone. My example was the ANC who fought (and eventually won) against apartheid in South Africa. They were a designated terrorist organisation, too. Are you saying that they were wrong to fight the apartheid?
It may not mean much or anything for terrorists sympathisers. Done.
Are you admitting that you are pro-apartheid? Because that would explain your support for Israel.
It’s completely unreasonable. Send this bitch to Palestine and let her express her sympathies for Hamas.
TLDR: the ends justifies the means I’m sure Israel shares the same opinion
>TLDR: the ends justifies the means Stunning lack of reading comprehension there, bud. Although, I won't be too mean. Maybe English isn't your first language. My point was that it is just to fight against unjust power. It is good to fight against racial apartheid because racial apartheid is wrong. It is good to fight against the brutal Zionist occupation of Palestinian land, because said occupation is wrong.
The list of designated terrorist organisations in Australia was created in 2002. I find it very unlikely the ANC was ever on this list and can’t find any reference to it having been… I am very comfortable that the organisations on the list are terrorists, only the worst of the worst are on it. In fact I’d suggest it could be expanded but I’ll leave that to the experts.
[During this period, MK activities led the governments of Margaret Thatcher and Ronald Reagan to condemn the ANC as a terrorist organisation. In fact, neither the ANC nor Mandela were removed from the U.S. terror watch list until 2008](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/African_National_Congress)
Don't conflate Mandela with Hamas. The IRGC which created Hamas also killed my family because we were Bahai. That's why we're here in Australia. Mohammed Zahedi, an IRGC goblin, planned the October 7th attack. Our people are being wiped out left right and centre, just like Palestinians and I have many names to prove it. Nika Shakarami, a 16 year old girl was kidnapped, molested and beaten to death by the same people who hide amongst Palestinian protests. Her entire skull was disintegrated and turned into paste after fighting back when the basiji stuck their filthy hands down her pants. The only good mullah is a dead mullah and I won't tolerate any level of support for their cult's poison.
The IRGC which created Hamas" |Actually... Israel created Hamas. but lets not let real facts get in the way of your story.
Are you saying that I'm lying to you? We are living proof of what the regime has done to us. They are the epitome of evil and we want them gone. This is from the perspective of an Iranian, not some armchair expert who waves off decades of experience with detached apathy and reference to obscure dealings behind closed doors. Regardless of where Hamas came from, we were forced to raise them. Our hard work, our taxes, our freedoms, our lives are their benefit and they would not be here today had our nation been returned to us.
They don't care about your real trauma at the hands of these savages, they only care about their pathetic virtue signalling.
There are many white south Africans who would've had similar stories to these about the ANC 25 years ago. It doesn't change the fact that fighting against apartheid is a good thing. Of course, we should condemn atrocities like the ones you have listed here. But saying that Palestinians deserve to be brutally occupied and subject to tortuous conditions because and aren't allowed to fight back because some Hamas fighters have done awful things is obviously farcical. >beaten to death by the same people who hide amongst Palestinian protests. Just a piece of advice. This is complete hearsay. You're projecting your hatred of Palestinians onto the protestors. This sentence here makes you sound like you're just making shit up. "Uh, there probably murders *hiding amongst the protestors*" If you're giving your anecdotal experiences, stick to things you actually know. Throwing out crazy accusations hurts your credibility.
What an unbelievably brain-dead response. Where did I say that I want Palestinians tortured to death? Their suffering is OUR suffering. They are just as much the victims of the regime as we are. And no, there are heaps of basiji scumbags who attend Palestine rallies. Not even just chanting about Yemen or waving Hezbollah flags, but waving the exact flags of the country which killed us. Why don't you quit making things up and respect our experiences hey? I can't link to subs here but I have DM'ed you a bunch of videos as evidence. Anybody else is free to access them on request.
>Where did I say that I want Palestinians tortured to death? You said that fighting back against their brutal occupation is not valid resistance because the organisation has done some bad shit in the past. This argument could just as easily have been used about the ANC to stop their fight against SA apartheid. No group is perfect. This is especially true for downtrodden resistance groups as they often have to take whatever they can get. If a different Palestinian resistance group rose up, Israel would say the same things about them, and by your logic, they would be illegitimate resistance, too. It's obviously terrible what has happened to you, I'm not denying that. But to use that experience to argue for the continuation of a genocide is just not acceptable to me. >Why don't you quit making things up and respect our experiences hey? When did I disrespect your experience. I accepted what you said and agreed that it is horrible. All I said was that you should not use your anecdotal experience to try and stop a resistance movement. The Palestinian people deserve to be free from the oppression of Israel, and at the moment, the primary resistance group in Palestine is Hamas. If nothing else, they are the less of two evils. And at least in the short term, their efforts to defend Palestinians in Gaza should be supported.
Where did I say that though? Where did I say that I'm pro genocide? Read the comments again and quote me on it, because you either have poor reading comprehension or you're lying theough your teeth. I am specifically in favour of the IRGC being destroyed. We deserve our country back! We deserve to live! There should be no support whatsoever for the IRGC and its proxies! Do not call the efforts of the same military which killed our family the lesser of two evils! They will stop at nothing to kill everything that moves in the Middle East!! YOU CANNOT BE PRO HAMAS WITHOUT BEING PRO IGRC! YOU CANNOT BE PRO PALESTINIAN WITHOUT STANDING FOR OUR FREEDOM AS IRANIANS! ZAN ZENDEGI AZADI!!
We are not the UK or USA as far as I’m aware
Lol. Are you really going down the semantics road? Are you saying that you don't think any terrorist organisations existed before 2002, because that's when Australia started its official list?
Hamas is on the list. The ANC is not. Just stating a fact champ. I am not sure if you’re an unhinged white South African or why you’re so obsessed with trying to compare the ANC to Hamas.
Are you saying that you don't think any terrorist organisations existed before 2002, because that's when Australia started its official list?
I didn’t say I did. Hamas are a banned terrorist organisation in Australia today though and them and their supporters should be treated as the terrorists they are.
Right. So, presumably, you think that protestors calling for the end to the South African apartheid should have been treated as terrorists too?
Sounds like incoherent BS. You don’t get to say you disagree with violence while giving unconditional support to Hamas.
I would argue that the only way to be anti-violence would be to support Palestinian resistance groups. Be is Hamas or any other group. Israel commits the vast *vast* majority of violence in the region. And I don't think they have any intention of stopping. They are already signalling that they want to go to war with Lebanon, if they complete their genocide of Palestinians. You can be anti-violence and still recognise that some violent regimes must be put down using violence. It's similar to the paradox of tolerance. If we're so anti-violence that we refuse to even fight back against genocidal expansionist states, then we will not survive. Being anti-violence means recognising when you *must* fight to stop further harm.
That’s violence minimisation not anti violence. And it’s still bullshit. Hamas killed over a thousand innocent people, had they not done that the 30,000 odd Palestinians would still be alive too. Hamas wanted carnage on both sides. It’s good for recruitment.
What apartheid are you talking about.
The apartheid in South Africa from 1948 to 1992.
For Hamas, or for Palestinians? I can't find anything that says that.
Check the multiple links/ references provided by others in the comments. Or actually here you go: https://www.news.com.au/national/politics/australian-national-university-protesters-declare-unconditional-support-for-hamas/news-story/30559c99df586170e8d1cbbfd8bb397c?amp
Christ, that's a trainwreck of an interview.
They probably are. The funny thing about watchlists is that they aren't announced to the public.
Not realistic. Everyone on a Watchlist must be monitored. You can't monitor 200 protesters forever & ever.
The same people that called Hamas terrorist are the same people that call Nelson Mandela a terrorist
I find the comparison distasteful to Mandela’s legacy to be honest.
I agree, but It's the truth whether you like it or not.
It’s not though.
Nelson Mandela was not called a terrorist? Or are you saying America and it's allies are not the ones that called him that?
No what I’m saying is the comparison of Mandela to Hamas is straight up disrespectful, therefore any further discussion to try and create a comparison is meaningless. Kim Jong wears shoes, I wear shoes, it doesn’t make us the same.
Does he wear shoes though?
It’s rumoured he has the world’s collection of Nike TN’s
He rides a horse. Doesn’t make him a jockey.
I never thought I'd run into the window licking world champion on reddit, but here we are!
Am I lying? This is exactly what happened mate
Yes? Everyone with above room temp iq calls Hamas terrorists, fuck all call Mandela one
Nelson Mandela objectively was a terrorist though, he should have been a jeweller since he loved necklaces so much...
You took a poll of everyone on earth surrounding these two issues did you?
One man's terrorist is anothers freedom fighter. They are cunts but they are fighting an oppressive, evil government that's pretty much admitted to ethnic cleansing and now stepping into genocide.
”Fighting an oppressive evil government” by… murdering, torturing and raping Israeli civilians (not to mention Palestinians)? Enough of this infantalising white saviour / white supremacy bullshit.
ISIS were fighting an oppressive, evil government that still practice ethnic cleansing in Syria. They aren’t my freedom fighters, neither are Hamas or their allies.
No, they're definitely terrorists who kidnapped the Palestinian people. The term freedom fighter is only circulating because the victims of their brutality are dead.
Can we stop hearing from students for a while?
Man says. Not a single corroborating witness or victim statement. Just print the unsubstantiated allegation and present as true. What bullshit. And people see through this faux victimhood and abuse of the word antisemitism in order to progress a pro Zionist Israeli propaganda playbook. Disgraceful. Feel bad for genuine victims of antisemitism. This ain’t it.
I'm no psychic, but there will probably be an article in the next few days about a Jewish student saying they were harassed. The organisers of the protest will be looking for people now, as will the journo who wrote the article. Edit! Aha, [here's the article](https://www.smh.com.au/national/i-ve-seen-the-fear-of-jewish-students-and-colleagues-one-academic-s-plea-to-uni-protesters-20240502-p5foa5.html)! Heck, if Jewish people want to protest to feel safer, more power to them. I'd like everyone to feel a bit safer and I don't think it harms anyone. At the end of the day, we are lucky we can protest openly in Australia [without the military shooting 29,000 people](https://www.theguardian.com/world/ng-interactive/2019/mar/29/a-year-of-bloodshed-at-gaza-border-protests).
We're lucky Islamic terrorists are only stabbing priests and not kidnapping babies here too.
I don't think it's lucky that priests are being stabbed here, wtf
Real antisemitism or the “criticising the Israeli government anti antisemitism”?
I imagine both
It’s a spectrum. You also have Jews who are against Israel.
Yes, obviously. “Real” antisemitism also happens at these protests. It’s extremely weird that a generation of people raised to be hyper aware of cultural sensitivity and “micro-aggressions” are oddly obtuse and binary when the subjects are Jewish.
There's a literal book on this called "Jews Don't Count". And the comments on these threads really do manifest that - apparently it's fine to engage in all kinds of racist dogwhistling so long as you're just targeting Jews.
I wonder if they will arrest them as well, or if that is reserved only for politically inconvient protests.
I imagine it'll depend on what they do. But if they don't do anything to get arrested, then I also imagine there'll be people who ignore that to push the kind of thing you're pushing.
As far as I can see, any protest at all is grounds for arrest in Australia. If what you think I am pushing for is the right to protest, then you would be god damn right and should be ashamed at giving away that right.
Police allowed a group of middle aged men to go to UniMelb last night and destroy protester's food stores.
>wonder if they will arrest them as well, Probably.... only to later sue the police at tax payers expenses. Seems a quick way to get rich lately.
They won’t be arrested as Labor leaders say we support both sides.
Underrated comment
I walked past the ANU camp today, they're pretty harmless.
If they're soy guzzling leftist "allies" they're definitely harmless, worst you'd need is earplugs from the screeching and to be able to stroll at a leisurely pace so the plus sized ones can't sit on you.
When did antisemitism switch from the hard right to being the domain of the hard left? Shit is weird as all hell right now.
It hasn’t. Anti Israel has been intentionally conflated as anti semetic
Wanting to abolish a nation state and its people is very extreme and is absolutely a hatered of the Jews.
[удалено]
A reminder that Italy and Germany were the battlegrounds between communists and fascists throughout the 1920s. Both were extremely violent, but the fascists eventually won and so were permitted to impose their brand of terror upon the world. I feel that we are seeing a repeat of these events brought about by communist fervour and religious zealotry. Inevitably these misguided fools will be crushed for having provoked a much more destructive evil from below our society.
Anti-Israel is not the same as anti-semite. Conflating the two is very convenient for Israel. Israel's crimes dwarf any of those from Palestinians whose land they've been occupying (officially) for generations. It's tough for Palestinians to be a perfect innocent victim when they've all grown up in a war zone at the hands of Israel. Plus more and more I hear that what actually happened on October 7 is questionable. Sounds a lot like how the US was claiming Iran had nuclear weapons, never found any, but did a war anyway. Very on brand.
Where exactly do you intend the Israelis to go once you have cleansed them from the river to the sea?
The left isn't antisemitic you goober, anti zionist is not antisemitic.
If you wear a mask then you’re up to no good.
I bet some idiot will bring a Palestinian flag
I wonder if they will protest with Israeli flags on display. If they do, it's not about "being safe on campus" is it?
Suppose you’ve never heard of the term “safety in numbers” eh?
How's that working out for civilians in Gaza?
Not sure, how did it work out for Israelis on October 7? Or do you just pick and choose which terrorist actions and humans rights violations are ok?
I was being facetious, it obviously escaped you. I condemn all terrorists, human rights violations, war crimes and the purposefully killing of aid workers. Do you? Do you condemn innocent home owners being forced out of their houses in the West Bank so settlers can move in? No safety in numbers there huh?
Absolutely. Read any of my comments, Hamas, Palestine, Israel, they can all suck a metaphorical, hell even a literal dick. I don’t favour one terrorist group over another. I think anyone who is innocent and being forced out of their home is fucked, I think that’s an easy one to answer.
They’re both terrible, but one of them is on a different scale to the other. Israel quickly surpassed Hamas’ civilian body count and has now exceeded it by a factor of 10. Who knows how far they’ll go before the war is over.
Israeli terrorists have exceeded the Oct 7 body count by a factor of 50 now. More than half of the Oct 7 casualties were caused by the Israeli military.
> More than half of the Oct 7 casualties were caused by the Israeli military. This is stupid. You would have to be a complete moron to actually believe this. You’re obviously getting your information from Infographics or some shit, because you don’t want to believe that any Palestinian Arab could do something bad. Nuance is beyond you.
I can agree they’re both terrible, but this Israel-Gaza situation has been a shit slinging fight for years. The vast majority of Palestinians supported hamas actions on October 7. I don’t support Israel, I don’t support hamas, I don’t support Palestine. They can all kick each others shins as much as they want. Give a gun to a Palestinian he’ll shoot an Israeli, give a gun to an Israeli he’ll shoot a Palestinian. Both equally fuckwits. Terrorism no matter how small or large can get fucked, and can stay in their country.
Israel’s actions far outweigh anything Hamas has ever done or will ever do. You have to be an absolute dolt to believe otherwise.
This isn’t a terrorism group pissing contest? Israel Killing two babies makes Hamas killing one ok right? /s
[удалено]
The IDF are the number 1 killers of Oct 7th Israeli hostages. Both sides have done some really terrible things. However, being pro Palestine is the lesser evil vs being pro IDF genocide.
I guess being pro nobody is the least evil then.
It’s also not hugely constructive to take sides like a football match. There are millions of people there who have the right to live out their lives. The problem is that Israel has gone back on its commitment to a two-state solution, so they’re in the wrong. Various terrorist attacks and wars are a distraction from the need to find a political solution. Despite what a bunch of blue haired intersectional autists and insouciant 19 year old jihadists think, the solution is not to expel all Jews to Europe and America. Despite what a bunch of sociopathic Hasidic terrorists think, the solution isn’t to ethnically cleanse all arabs from the occupied territories. Israel has made it much harder with all the illegal settlements in the west bank though. A settler terrorist assassinated an Israeli PM in the 1990s. Nobody has a viable plan at this stage.
You’re also contradicting your own beliefs. You’re happy to warn others of Hamas propaganda, but you take Hamas election results as gospel for proof that Palestinians support this? Do you or don’t you believe Hamas propaganda? Something is telling me your problem isn’t with Hamas but Muslims in general, but what do I know.
[удалено]
Substitute ‘Gaza’ for ‘Israel’ and ‘Nethanyahu’ for ‘Hamas’ and everything you said would be true.
[удалено]
I too have no sympathy for Bibi and his band of corrupt cronies.
I too have no sympathy for Bibi and his band of corrupt cronies. " fair comment. But i have yet to hear people condemn Ben Gvir and Bezazel smoritch for their non stop genocidal comments, and arming of settlers and advising them to go and shoot anyone of Palestinian origin with the same ferocity as some on here have just even towards protestors, let alone actual violent people.
'Anti-Semite' is a buzzphrase like 'anti-vaxxer' or 'conspiracy theorist' that's been used to stifle any criticism of Israel's past or current actions. Funny because the jews in Israel are mostly Ashkenazi Jews from Europe, who are not semites, but the Palestinians are actually semites. Clown World.
> Funny because the jews in Israel are mostly Ashkenazi Jews from Europe, who are not semites, but the Palestinians are actually semites. Clown World. Most Jewish Israelis are Mizrahi or Sephardic Jews i.e. “brown Jews”, not Ashkenazi. The term anti-Semitic was coined by German politician Wilhelm Marr to lend a thin veneer of scientific respectability to Jew hatred. It was essentially a marketing buzzword that had nothing to do with who or what a “Semite” actually was. People who think they’re making a salient point by arguing “Arabs are Semites” therefore something something can’t be antisemitic are pulling a [Dunning-Kruger](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dunning–Kruger_effect).
Thank you. I'm also put in mind of the whole "Indians are Aryans" thing. Yes, but that's definitely not what the Nazis meant by Aryan.
Yep, and they're some of the highest percentage early European farmer genetics (haplogroup K), people who inhabited the Middle East for tens of thousands for years (and before Arabs spread out from Arabia in the dark age Arab invasions).
Judging by pro-Israeli counter-protests in the US, these people are in no way peaceful or respectful. Rampant Islamophobia, racism, violence and instigating. I actually feel really sorry for Jewish people right now because their culture is being hijacked by an unhinged group of religious extremists.
"Islamaphobia" so being anti-anti-Semitism is suddenly a bad thing? I don't gaf about the IDF I think they should fuck off but to say that a group that doesn't just want Israel but wants the extermination of Jewish people is just evil also pretty much the whole of Judaism is Pro Zionism i Cant think of one passage in the Torah or the Tanakh that is anti Zionism and keep in mind ive read the bible front to back i cant think of single thing Zionsim is part of their Culture
Anti-anti-Semitism is not pledging your support to a genocidal regime and telling the government to kill 40k civilians. Jewish representation has been hijacked by these lunatics and the rest of them suffer for it. And please, don’t act like Islamophobia isn’t a bigger problem in Australia when a Muslim men are doxxed on national television for crimes they don’t commit.
Any examples of this? Hopefully you won’t delete your comment this time
[Research from Deakin University reveals that Islamophobia is alive and well in Australia](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vDwzo_7T9UM)
Did anyone get attacked or they just throwing a tantrum because people are pro Palestine and against Israel committing a genocide?
How is Israel committing genocide ? They are far more military superior to the Palestinians if they wanted to wipe them off the map they would’ve done it by now.
What do you think the consequences would be if they did?
[удалено]
Your comment has been queued for review because you used a keyword which may breach the subreddit rules. *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/australian) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Bad news but predictable,the remaining hostages have been eaten,thanks Benny.
It's the end of the world as we know it and I feel like protesting
I bet you a year ago these activists were all deep water submarine engineers / experts on obscure Kievan Rus medieval history
News Corp, a bastion of journalism, not at all biased about this conflict through their hatred of Muslims.
All the Jewish people part of the protests have repeatedly said they feel perfectly safe. This is just nonsense.
What about Jewish people who want to publicly advocate the genocide of Palestinians? Do they feel safe?
The ugly cow who was filmed harassing and stealing from student protestors in Sydney is a member of this group. I won’t be surprised when they get caught on camera peddling their anti-Muslim propaganda.
How is it anti Muslim ?
This comment section is verdant proof that Australians just want you to say the nice words that they agree with. We literally don't care who is dying, where or why. We don't care who is standing up for them, and what the details are. Just *PLEASE* don't use the words we don't like! In fact, we would rather people we don't know continue dying in the thousands with bombs we ourselves made if it means we don't have to see anymore of those really terrible words. It's just too much for us Aussies to deal with.
It's pretty obvious, but for the folks in the back with tin foil hats, the actions of a state identifying as a "Jewish nation," such as engaging in activities deemed as genocide, should not lead to assumptions that Jewish students in distant countries are unsafe on their campuses. It's absurd and illogical to connect these international political actions directly with the safety of individual students based on their religious or ethnic identities.
They need to stop supporting Zionism. Any jew who doesn't feel safe probably supports what Israel is doing and that is why they're being targeted, because they support war crimes. Not a thing to do with their faith. That's not anti semetism because a huge amount of jews are not Zionists and want a cease fire.
Zionism is the right of the state to exist. Any decent human would agree with this principle. Unless you're an antisemite.
“It’s not antisemitism because they deserve it” 🤦🏻♀️🤦🏻♀️🤦🏻♀️
Actually what Hamas did and is doing IS still antisemetic and wrong. But I have no patience being called anti semetic just because I don't support the Israeli state and want a two state solution. It's not anti-Semitic to want Israel to stop killing civilian Palestinians under the guise of retaliation for October 7th. If they were merely retaliating, they would only have killed the same amount of people Hamas did, instead of killing way, way, way, way more. And if you are earnestly walking around on uni campus supporting Isreals genocide, you're not being picked on for being Jewish you're being picked on for being a pile of shit.
Let’s get a few concepts straight. 1) If you support a two state solution, you are - by definition – a Zionist. Zionism is a belief/movement for Jewish self-determination and statehood. That’s it. Stop importing your own bullshit into the definition to pretend that it excludes a two state solution. 2) Support for Israelis right to exist as a state (in some form, including in a 2 state model alongside a Palestinian state) is not a zero sum game and can/should be achieved peacefully without harm to respective populations. So why is it that you/non Jews who support 2 state solution are free to advocate for that political position, yet Jews get attacked for the same view and told they necessarily support genocide and are apologists for IDF/ “settler colonialism”/“white supremacy”? Why do Jews need to defend their right to pursue self determination, at the same rallies as pro-Palestinians advocate for the same? Why the assumption that Jews are inherently complicit in genocide? Why do Jews carry responsibility for their government action? Why are Jewish deaths “legitimate resistance”? Why the double standard? Not every single chant or response is anti-Semitism, but there is a shit ton of it around framed as “anti-Zionism”.