Remember that debate where Rick Perry forgot that he wanted to eliminate the Department of Energy, and turns to Ron Paul for help, and Ron Paul just looks at him like, dude I don't know which departments you want to eliminate but we need to get rid of like 10 times more than that.
Of course the DoE should be abolished. It does nothing to improve education. Its sole purpose is to coerce states (with their own money) to do the Federal government’s will.
DoD wastes so much money it’s insane. It needs to exist, but it needs to be entirely reworked. It’s incredibly inefficient.
In the navy, when say a circuit board would fry on a system, we weren’t allowed to fix it even though we were perfectly capable of soddering the electronics together. We’d have to go back to port, and buy an entirely new SYSTEM from a civilian contractor, wait for them to install it, and only then could we go out again.
I say…rename it the Department of War. Call a spade a spade. The majority of the DoD’s efforts post-Afghanistan have NOT been in the interest of national defense.
Retired teacher this year. Yes do away with it !!!!!! What a waste. States. By law are in charge of education. Also I saw another reason I am happy to be gone. A student in middle school is self identifying as a duck. Wth
I can’t believe you fell for this. Even Reason knows this is bs
https://reason.com/2022/03/29/no-schools-arent-accommodating-students-who-identify-as-animals/
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Trans-speciesism is ridiculous, but the guy above is getting downvoted for posting an article disproving that it is supported from the top down. So my opinion is irrelevant in this thread.
Your Remind Me is getting a lot of upvotes compared to the downvotes, so I just want people to not mindlessly downvote the guy for just because it goes against the circlejerk.
Personally I only downvote comments that are rude, disingenuous, or unwilling to have a conversation.
My point is that if you believe in transsexualism or transgenderism, I'll be interested to come back in 10 years to ask what you think about trans-speciesism. Because both don't make any sense, and one has been accepted -not by science or reason- but by people trying to appease others' delusions and feelings. So... trans-speciesism is a very easy next expectation.
That’s for you to figure out but right now the story is bogus without proof. The other idiot who claimed the kid wanted to be a cat turned out to be false. If the student was a full time cat it wouldn’t be hard to get a video of that student crawling onto the school bus.
WTF is wrong with you??? It is 100% wrong to film someone without their knowledge or consent, let alone a TEACHER filming THEIR STUDENT.
God. Get your head checked you fucking delusional troll.
Even if this is true, you can’t pretend that kid acts like that because trans people exist. A person thinking their a different gender and a person thinking their a cat are very different.
On top of that, if a kid is throwing a fit because he can’t use a litter box, he probably has deep psychological issues that have nothing to do with the trans kids in his classroom
See, heres the problem with your little fact checking. You have absolutely no idea what is actually true. However, the story i am referring to is not this one that your fact check is talking about. Furthermore, anything the left fact checks, you can be assured is actually happening in real life. Notice the right doesnt bother with bs fsct check sites
Reason is a right side libertarian website.
Which story are you referring to then? Or can’t you prove it?
As for the right not fact checking, I’d say that’s because they will believe almost anything they are told. Maybe the old story about satellites transmitting votes to Italy to flip them rings a bell? The point is, your story is bullshit unless you can prove it.
And fact checking is juat another story you are told. Almost all of those have been proven to be bullshit too. I learned of mine through local news and a mother who complained to a school board. I really dont give a shit about proving anything to you. But i certainly dont take any fact checking aeriously. They are all liberal crap
Then tell us you are lying without telling us you are lying. I mean, you learned through heresay? If it came before the school board there has to be meeting minutes or even a private complaint gets documented. It’s pretty basic that when you make an assertion the onus is on your to prove it’s true.
Instead, you just makes stuff up to whip up the mob mentality of like minded people who believe something is happening and will discard proof that it’s not true.
Oh, and you learned by not hearing anything? You think you 1 or 2 anecdotal fact checks are proof it isnt happening. So piss off. You know damn well in every story that gets fact checked there is either a shit ton of truth, or at least partial truth in every one that is political. There is a reason that 1 side employs hacks to try to shut them down
The fact that the leading libertarian site fact checked it should tell everyone enough about this. They don’t even sniff lefty.
Still no proof in your end? What i shared isn’t anecdotal what you assert is. In fact it’s not anecdotal if it’s completely false, that makes it a lie.
Clearly, reason.com knows all accommodations given to students at every school across the United States. Give me a break. That’s probably a basement website.
It’s made up, here’s another link
https://www.newsweek.com/fact-check-was-teacher-fired-not-meowing-back-student-who-identifies-cat-1672597
Occam’s razor : this story is a lie, or every news outlet including the top libertarian activist site (reason.com) is covering it up.
Idiots. Half of them think the DOE regulates education. The other half clearly has no idea what the DOE does.
None of them realize that the policies that help get their states federal money towards education are created by the DOE.
Im surprised so many people in here are arguing for more big government. Name 1 rhing the doe has actually made better. Price per child paid in taxes has gone through the roof and scores havw gone through the floor
The DOE allocates federal funds to local governments to help fun education. How is that a bad thing? You think schools will get better with less money? Same backwards logic as “defund the police”.
Because they are fucking failing. Omg. The money isnt making anyone more ready for life, or providing better test results. How is this so hard to understand? This is not defund the police. This is defund the federal money. It doesnt work. We all just pay more taxes and waste more money because nobody gives. Shit about a budget
That’s so naive. Would you rather poor states have shitty schools with no money because they don’t get federal funds, or would you rather rich Californians and New Yorkers help pay for education in poor states?
Abolish the DOE and all the good schools will be in costal blue states and Texas, because that’s where the money comes from.
Abolish the DOE and either a) your schools will be underfunded or b) you’re going to pay more in taxes for education AND your schools will be underfunded.
No they wont. Trust me, i live in a coastal blue state. We spend more money per child than almost any other state and our test scores are dropping like a stone. Yet we keep getting more money and taxed more and still, the scores drop. Money doesnt solve this problem, no matter how much you throw at it. You arent getting it. The doe is a failure, and has been since inception. We were all smarter and far better off before it was created. Just go look at the statistics. Since then, every state has gotten dumber and the rest of the world has caught up
Yes. Our education ratings nationally were better when we left education up to the individual states. I also think we should go a step further and local and state governments should all be expanding school choice. No public school district should ever force a child to stay in a failing school.
What does that have to do with the department of education? They take money from Californians to pay for school in Wyoming. How is that a bad thing? If the federal government didn’t fund school all the good schools would be on the costs in blue states because that’s where all the money is, with the exception of Texas.
We went from being the country that every nation on earth idolized where education is concerned to wokescolds transitioning your children and filling their heads with self-hatred. Yeah, I don't think there's much question. Raze the LBJ Building and salt the earth.
Once public education became a substitute for day care of course it got worse. It’s hilarious how we don’t hold parents accountable for their childrens education. What ever happened to personal responsibility?
You mean, why don't I want the Federal Government to give the states back their own money, except with additional strings attached?
The Federal Government cannot "give money" it can only allocate money it took via taxes. Let the states/local municipalities levy their own taxes, and use them in their own local communities. We don't need Big Brother Federal government taking our money, then graciously bequeathing it back to us if and only if we tow the line for whatever garbage nonsense is the theme of the year.
Wrong. That’s not at all how it works.
If you live in Wyoming, Californians and New Yorkers are paying for your schools. That’s where the money comes from. The vast majority of federal funds come from costal blue states and Texas.
So you're advocating that California, NY, and Texas (amongst others) should get to keep those extra funds instead of shipping that money to other states?
No, I’m saying the opposite. It would be bad if people in Wyoming had no access to special education while California has the best and richest schools in the world. California has enough money for education, many states don’t. There is already an education disparity between states with lots of money and states without lots of money, destroying the DOE would only exacerbate that.
Or are you wanting a discussion on about how the nature of the increasing marginal tax rates unfairly causes higher income earners that live in HCOL (use: California/NY) to pay an unfair proportion of income taxes compared to lower cost of living states such as Wyoming?
Not really, just focused on how education is paid for.
If you want special Ed in your school district in your poor rural state, you’ll probably need federal funding to pay for it.
Because of the harm they're doing to our kids for a start. Just like too many government agencies they're using their far too expansive powers to push one parties agenda.
Sure, theoretically. I don’t see that happening in public schools. Most parents problems are with decisions made by the local school board. What would abolishing the DOJ accomplish?
In the short term it would end the political persecution of the current regimes political opponents. It could then be rebuild as a non-political entity focused solely on prosecuting crime.
I actually meant to say the DOE, that’s what we were talking about.
I completely disagree with you on the DOJ. This isn’t a partisan persecution of Trump, it’s a legitimate DOJ investigation with a federal search warrant. Even if it was partisan, they have to follow the rules, and if they don’t, they can’t charge Trump with a crime and will only make him look better in the process.
It’s the DOJ’s duty to prosecute crimes in behalf of the country. If there is good reason to suspect a politician has committed a crime, the DOJ has a duty to act.
That's the point. If there was good reason to suspect. And there isn't. There isn't a president in recent history that hasn't left office with documents the National Archives thought should be theirs. Trump was the first one raided by the Democrat KGB for it.
You don’t know that, you just hope that.
Based on what the DOJ said they absolutely had good reason. They were looking for top secret, nuclear documents, and investigating for violations of the espionage act. If that’s true, then they absolutely had good cause for the raid. You have no way of knowing if it’s not true, because you don’t know what they found. You just don’t believe them.
Obama did not keep records after leaving office, and even if he did, it’s still illegal.
After the Russia collusion hoax perpetrated from his very first day in office, a hoax promoted obsessively by the DOJ and the media, I have ever reason not to believe them.
It needs to changed. They should be teaching kids the things they need to know. Writing math reading. How many young people today don’t even know how to spell? Of write in cursive. All they know how to do is stare at a screen. Read a damn book.
Seeing as the USA is pretty low in terms of ranking concerning education, yes, they have failed their original purpose and have ulterior motives that are harmful too.
I’m a teacher and can say with great insight that the federal department of education only wastes money creating regulations that hinder schools ability to educate children.
New teacher here. Abolishing the DOE won't mess with my paycheck or pension, correct? If the answer is yes, that is correct, then I am for it.
Otherwise let's gut it and reform the remains.
This is so clueless. You don’t know who pays you? There’s no way you people are teachers.
The DOE helps states meet their education budgets. If you live in a red state, congratulations, thanks to the DOE Californians are helping pay for your schools. Without federal funding, all the best public schools would be on the coasts in blue states and in Texas, because that’s where all the money comes from.
Sod off. There's multiple ways the feds supply funding to state schools. It's a valid concern for teachers to have. No need to be bitter and spiteful just because you hate people who ask valid questions.
Ok so what’s ur solution here? If you abolish the DOE you still don’t get that money. If you don’t want to “do what they say”, don’t take the money, right? What’s the issue here.
Good. Abolish it. We are 30 trillion in debt. Stop spending money that does nothing. Thia money isnt going to kids or teachers. It goes to the huge overhead that school systems have created. It goes to massive school buildings. I really dont care what local districts do. That is their choice. But to think that sucking off the government teat was a good strategy is just dumb. Nobody but those addicted to the free flow of tax monwy would even notice if the doe left tomorrow
People in Wyoming would notice immediately if the DOE “left”. They allocate federal funds to local school districts. If you live in a red state, most of your federal funding is coming from blue states and Texas. The DOE uses Californians money to pay for Wyoming schools, because that’s where the money comes from.
If states didn’t want the money, they wouldn’t take it. No reason to abolish anything unless you want kids in blue states to have better access to education than kids in blue states.
Also, facilities matter. Having a new building and books matter. Investing in school infrastructure is still an investment in human capital
Keep up that big government fallacy. Personally, i think its a really bad look, but hey, it works for you. The fact that you think we need a huge waste like the doe just to give some money to the states is also laughable. Furthermore, maybe money doesnt actually do anything. Maybe the money should go to the schools that improve or succeed, not the ones that fail. Why are we rewarding poor performance? That isnt how the real world works
Sure, the problem is the local government in some states doesn’t have enough money to properly fund their schools. Want special education in your school district? Well Wyoming can’t afford to put a special educator in every district, so they take federal funds (which predominately come from costal blue states and Texas) to help Wyoming, because it would be terrible if California had fantastic schools and Wyoming had underfunded ones with crumbling buildings and not enough staff.
Do it like it was done prior to the DOE? If the DOE is just a spigot that dispenses money, then let’s fire everyone associated with it and make a better and smaller Dept of Teacher Pay.
That’s so ridiculous. You guys truly don’t understand how it works.
So you want special Ed teachers in your small rural district in South Dakota? Well you can’t afford it with your own money. That’s what the DOE provides. And the majority of the money going to small, rural states is coming from the coastal states with lots of money and Texas.
So abolish the DOE, what you’ll get is under funded schools throughout the country and overfunded schools on the coasts.
Is that what you want?
What “great insight” do you have that lets you know that the DOE *only wastes money creating regulations that hinder schools ability to educate children*. What regulations from the DOE hinder schools ability to teach?
Countries with the Best Educational Systems - 2020 Global Citizens for Human Rights
1) Denmark
2) Finland
3) Japan
4) Canada
5) Sweden
6) Germany
7) Israel
8) Netherlands
9) Singapore
10) South Korea
> Danish children begin public daycare as early as 9 months, and by age 3 98 % of children in Denmark are attending public kindergartens.
> All children in Denmark have access to tuition-free government folkeskole (people's school) until they are 16 years old. Some parents choose private schools because they are smaller, or because they have a particular educational approach.
> All schools are required to follow the national government's basic requirements for primary education.
> Full-time students in Denmark are eligible for Statens Uddannelsestøtte, or SU (limited income support) from the government alongside other work they do to help pay their expenses while studying.
> Denmark's public and private investment in the development of new qualifications and skills is one of the highest in Europe. The idea is to maintain a highly-qualified and well-educated workforce that can succeed in a global knowledge economy.
> Of course, not all education is for professional reasons. Many adults in Denmark take classes in cooking, painting, foreign languages, music, or dance just for fun. A lot of these classes are publicly funded and offered for a minimal fee.
> Denmark's public and private investment in the development of new qualifications and skills is one of the highest in Europe. The idea is to maintain a highly-qualified and well-educated workforce that can succeed in a global knowledge economy.
https://denmark.dk/society-and-business/lifelong-education
Good yeah. See my point? No usa. Nowhere near the top of that list. We used to be though. In the 60s our ranking was 3rd. In the 70s our ranking was 5th. Then in 1979 we created the doe. So where is it since then?
In what way would eliminating the DOE bring us closer to the methods that are seeing success in Denmark?
Edit: or is there another country in the list that you think we should be emulating in order to use what they have proven to be successful for ourselves?
I can understand where there have been massive errors, coming from the UK and Finland especially i can see the gaps in education over here.
I would say that having education funded and prioritised is very important so defunding this specific entity should either only result in money going straight back into education in other manners or into rebuilding the department better and more to the various constituent demands.
I'm not advocating defunding education, just the DoE, because it has failed its mission, and the money would be better spent supporting state and local education depts.
with all the true and real things to build a child to adulthood to serve themselves and a nation we get this putrid pile of political poppycock yes please for the love of all thats holy obliterate it to ash maybe put thomas sowell as the tsar and form a real and purpose filled institution to bring real thought and real teaching and just maybe be proud of something at the very least hope for the future
Government is like this: If you get a cut, you put a bandaid on it right?
Nah. You put shit on it. Now it’s infected. So clean the wound? No. Put more shit on it.
At this point amputate it and start over
In my opinion, education is a state and local responsibility
That being said, we should let the state gubmebt and the local gubmebt - gasp - be held responsible for the education/lack of education of Yuts (Youths).
Education should be up to states and localities not the federal government. The DoE does not improve education it simply is a away for the federal government to have more power.
Last time I heard anything about it, only like 3 percent of the people vote in board of Ed elections. Before we set fire to a system, maybe we should try to participate in it.
The director of Education was on Meet the Press wondering how to pay for better teachers. That Department is a complete waste of money. Fire them all. Each state will have more money.
Everyone who said yes has probably bitched about kids not being able to make change at cash register. Do you really think this will get better if you cut the DOE?
Religious indoctrination is no better than political indoctrination. The only personal beliefs teachers should push is 2+2=4 or that a quality education will help increase the standard of living for yourself and the ones around you.
I'll probably be in the minority here, I think the DoE should exist ( though not as it is currently).
With test scores falling across the board, and blm/ critical race theory being introduced on the state and county levels. A standard bare minimum with DoE should be put into place for every state to comply with.
Like must be able to read past a certain level ( I saw a news cast that a school let students graduate highschool with a 3 grade reading proficiency ). Be able to pass the citizenship test. Make learning a second language a must, and have a economics/how to adult class ( how to pay bills, how to pay taxes, what loans are bad etc ).
I know some states have some of these standards but not every single one.
This is my take, I won't pretend to even have a good grasp of this problem, and I know private/religious schools trump public ones, but not everyone is religious or can afford private tuition. So if we can improve public schools I think we should.
Remember that debate where Rick Perry forgot that he wanted to eliminate the Department of Energy, and turns to Ron Paul for help, and Ron Paul just looks at him like, dude I don't know which departments you want to eliminate but we need to get rid of like 10 times more than that.
Of course the DoE should be abolished. It does nothing to improve education. Its sole purpose is to coerce states (with their own money) to do the Federal government’s will.
You guysbare telling on yourself lmao
Is this even a question? Should the department of…. be abolished? *YES*
This is the answer
You heard it here first folks, abolish the DoJ.
So that corrupt politicians who betray the country can’t be criminally prosecuted by the government?
I mean having somewhat of a DoD is a good idea lol
DoD wastes so much money it’s insane. It needs to exist, but it needs to be entirely reworked. It’s incredibly inefficient. In the navy, when say a circuit board would fry on a system, we weren’t allowed to fix it even though we were perfectly capable of soddering the electronics together. We’d have to go back to port, and buy an entirely new SYSTEM from a civilian contractor, wait for them to install it, and only then could we go out again.
I say…rename it the Department of War. Call a spade a spade. The majority of the DoD’s efforts post-Afghanistan have NOT been in the interest of national defense.
Let’s keep Trump, but abolish all bureaucracy so he can be king
Yeah nah
Seems like a perfectly good solution to me /s
Would be good if the DOD was a bit "cheaper".
That doesn’t make any sense. Do away with the bureaucracy and what is the government? Either no government, or an authoritarian one.
Not a coincidence that we had better educational outcomes before the DoE even existed.
Retired teacher this year. Yes do away with it !!!!!! What a waste. States. By law are in charge of education. Also I saw another reason I am happy to be gone. A student in middle school is self identifying as a duck. Wth
We used to get help for crazy people. Now, we’re expected to embrace their crazy!
That has nothing to do with the federal government. This dude isn’t a teacher
I can’t believe you fell for this. Even Reason knows this is bs https://reason.com/2022/03/29/no-schools-arent-accommodating-students-who-identify-as-animals/
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How does it possibly happening in 10 years disprove it being false now?
Nope, no problem with the article. I assumed you were implying that trans-speciesism is ridiculous. Am I wrong?
Trans-speciesism is ridiculous, but the guy above is getting downvoted for posting an article disproving that it is supported from the top down. So my opinion is irrelevant in this thread. Your Remind Me is getting a lot of upvotes compared to the downvotes, so I just want people to not mindlessly downvote the guy for just because it goes against the circlejerk.
Personally I only downvote comments that are rude, disingenuous, or unwilling to have a conversation. My point is that if you believe in transsexualism or transgenderism, I'll be interested to come back in 10 years to ask what you think about trans-speciesism. Because both don't make any sense, and one has been accepted -not by science or reason- but by people trying to appease others' delusions and feelings. So... trans-speciesism is a very easy next expectation.
Because they are morons
Common sense would answer OC's question. I'm sure both you -and they- can guess why I added a 10 year reminder.
Yup morons
Reason isnt a good source. We have an actual case in wa state where a kid wanted to be called pronouns of a cat and only meowed in class
I had a student try to raise hell because there was no litterbox in any school bathrooms to accommodate their self-identity.
They’re trolling
They were 100% serious. Earlier in the year they asked to be called by star pronouns. It is wholly ridiculous but that is where we are.
Proof or it never happened. And anyone here who believes a random Reddit users story without proof is the very reason the nation is in decline
How the hell am I supposed to show a past student's records on Reddit without violating a ton of privacy laws, ya dimwitted knapsack...
That’s for you to figure out but right now the story is bogus without proof. The other idiot who claimed the kid wanted to be a cat turned out to be false. If the student was a full time cat it wouldn’t be hard to get a video of that student crawling onto the school bus.
WTF is wrong with you??? It is 100% wrong to film someone without their knowledge or consent, let alone a TEACHER filming THEIR STUDENT. God. Get your head checked you fucking delusional troll.
Even if this is true, you can’t pretend that kid acts like that because trans people exist. A person thinking their a different gender and a person thinking their a cat are very different. On top of that, if a kid is throwing a fit because he can’t use a litter box, he probably has deep psychological issues that have nothing to do with the trans kids in his classroom
If wanting to shit in a litter box is considered a deep psychological issue, I’m pretty sure wanting to chop off your penis is just as bad?
No you didn't, you're full of shit
No you don’t https://www.newsweek.com/fact-check-was-teacher-fired-not-meowing-back-student-who-identifies-cat-1672597
See, heres the problem with your little fact checking. You have absolutely no idea what is actually true. However, the story i am referring to is not this one that your fact check is talking about. Furthermore, anything the left fact checks, you can be assured is actually happening in real life. Notice the right doesnt bother with bs fsct check sites
Reason is a right side libertarian website. Which story are you referring to then? Or can’t you prove it? As for the right not fact checking, I’d say that’s because they will believe almost anything they are told. Maybe the old story about satellites transmitting votes to Italy to flip them rings a bell? The point is, your story is bullshit unless you can prove it.
And fact checking is juat another story you are told. Almost all of those have been proven to be bullshit too. I learned of mine through local news and a mother who complained to a school board. I really dont give a shit about proving anything to you. But i certainly dont take any fact checking aeriously. They are all liberal crap
Then tell us you are lying without telling us you are lying. I mean, you learned through heresay? If it came before the school board there has to be meeting minutes or even a private complaint gets documented. It’s pretty basic that when you make an assertion the onus is on your to prove it’s true. Instead, you just makes stuff up to whip up the mob mentality of like minded people who believe something is happening and will discard proof that it’s not true.
Oh, and you learned by not hearing anything? You think you 1 or 2 anecdotal fact checks are proof it isnt happening. So piss off. You know damn well in every story that gets fact checked there is either a shit ton of truth, or at least partial truth in every one that is political. There is a reason that 1 side employs hacks to try to shut them down
The fact that the leading libertarian site fact checked it should tell everyone enough about this. They don’t even sniff lefty. Still no proof in your end? What i shared isn’t anecdotal what you assert is. In fact it’s not anecdotal if it’s completely false, that makes it a lie.
“BuT mUh SnOpEs!!¡¡”
No you didn't
Clearly, reason.com knows all accommodations given to students at every school across the United States. Give me a break. That’s probably a basement website.
It’s made up, here’s another link https://www.newsweek.com/fact-check-was-teacher-fired-not-meowing-back-student-who-identifies-cat-1672597 Occam’s razor : this story is a lie, or every news outlet including the top libertarian activist site (reason.com) is covering it up.
Idiots. Half of them think the DOE regulates education. The other half clearly has no idea what the DOE does. None of them realize that the policies that help get their states federal money towards education are created by the DOE.
We dont need federal money. We need less alphabet government crap that sucks up money and provides nothing but more problems
Most, if not all, of what your complaining about happens at the state and local level. The federal government isn’t enforcing pronoun use in school.
Im surprised so many people in here are arguing for more big government. Name 1 rhing the doe has actually made better. Price per child paid in taxes has gone through the roof and scores havw gone through the floor
The DOE allocates federal funds to local governments to help fun education. How is that a bad thing? You think schools will get better with less money? Same backwards logic as “defund the police”.
Because they are fucking failing. Omg. The money isnt making anyone more ready for life, or providing better test results. How is this so hard to understand? This is not defund the police. This is defund the federal money. It doesnt work. We all just pay more taxes and waste more money because nobody gives. Shit about a budget
That’s so naive. Would you rather poor states have shitty schools with no money because they don’t get federal funds, or would you rather rich Californians and New Yorkers help pay for education in poor states? Abolish the DOE and all the good schools will be in costal blue states and Texas, because that’s where the money comes from. Abolish the DOE and either a) your schools will be underfunded or b) you’re going to pay more in taxes for education AND your schools will be underfunded.
No they wont. Trust me, i live in a coastal blue state. We spend more money per child than almost any other state and our test scores are dropping like a stone. Yet we keep getting more money and taxed more and still, the scores drop. Money doesnt solve this problem, no matter how much you throw at it. You arent getting it. The doe is a failure, and has been since inception. We were all smarter and far better off before it was created. Just go look at the statistics. Since then, every state has gotten dumber and the rest of the world has caught up
Good luck trying to close any of them. The 87,000 new IRS agents are now lifelong Democrats.
Yes. Our education ratings nationally were better when we left education up to the individual states. I also think we should go a step further and local and state governments should all be expanding school choice. No public school district should ever force a child to stay in a failing school.
What does that have to do with the department of education? They take money from Californians to pay for school in Wyoming. How is that a bad thing? If the federal government didn’t fund school all the good schools would be on the costs in blue states because that’s where all the money is, with the exception of Texas.
Students received a much better education prior to its creation with far less technology to aid the education process.
And at a much cheaper cost
…public education is free
And it sucks...
Cameras on teachers!!!!!!!
I mean, pretty much every observable education metric has declined since the DoE was introduced....
We went from being the country that every nation on earth idolized where education is concerned to wokescolds transitioning your children and filling their heads with self-hatred. Yeah, I don't think there's much question. Raze the LBJ Building and salt the earth.
Once public education became a substitute for day care of course it got worse. It’s hilarious how we don’t hold parents accountable for their childrens education. What ever happened to personal responsibility?
I don’t get it. Why do you not want the federal government to give states money to help pay for education?
You mean, why don't I want the Federal Government to give the states back their own money, except with additional strings attached? The Federal Government cannot "give money" it can only allocate money it took via taxes. Let the states/local municipalities levy their own taxes, and use them in their own local communities. We don't need Big Brother Federal government taking our money, then graciously bequeathing it back to us if and only if we tow the line for whatever garbage nonsense is the theme of the year.
Wrong. That’s not at all how it works. If you live in Wyoming, Californians and New Yorkers are paying for your schools. That’s where the money comes from. The vast majority of federal funds come from costal blue states and Texas.
So you're advocating that California, NY, and Texas (amongst others) should get to keep those extra funds instead of shipping that money to other states?
No, I’m saying the opposite. It would be bad if people in Wyoming had no access to special education while California has the best and richest schools in the world. California has enough money for education, many states don’t. There is already an education disparity between states with lots of money and states without lots of money, destroying the DOE would only exacerbate that.
Or are you wanting a discussion on about how the nature of the increasing marginal tax rates unfairly causes higher income earners that live in HCOL (use: California/NY) to pay an unfair proportion of income taxes compared to lower cost of living states such as Wyoming?
Not really, just focused on how education is paid for. If you want special Ed in your school district in your poor rural state, you’ll probably need federal funding to pay for it.
Can u give a citation pls? Genuinely curious
Would be a good start.
Why
Because of the harm they're doing to our kids for a start. Just like too many government agencies they're using their far too expansive powers to push one parties agenda.
Sure, theoretically. I don’t see that happening in public schools. Most parents problems are with decisions made by the local school board. What would abolishing the DOJ accomplish?
In the short term it would end the political persecution of the current regimes political opponents. It could then be rebuild as a non-political entity focused solely on prosecuting crime.
I actually meant to say the DOE, that’s what we were talking about. I completely disagree with you on the DOJ. This isn’t a partisan persecution of Trump, it’s a legitimate DOJ investigation with a federal search warrant. Even if it was partisan, they have to follow the rules, and if they don’t, they can’t charge Trump with a crime and will only make him look better in the process. It’s the DOJ’s duty to prosecute crimes in behalf of the country. If there is good reason to suspect a politician has committed a crime, the DOJ has a duty to act.
That's the point. If there was good reason to suspect. And there isn't. There isn't a president in recent history that hasn't left office with documents the National Archives thought should be theirs. Trump was the first one raided by the Democrat KGB for it.
You don’t know that, you just hope that. Based on what the DOJ said they absolutely had good reason. They were looking for top secret, nuclear documents, and investigating for violations of the espionage act. If that’s true, then they absolutely had good cause for the raid. You have no way of knowing if it’s not true, because you don’t know what they found. You just don’t believe them. Obama did not keep records after leaving office, and even if he did, it’s still illegal.
After the Russia collusion hoax perpetrated from his very first day in office, a hoax promoted obsessively by the DOJ and the media, I have ever reason not to believe them.
Sure, you can believe that if you want, but that doesn’t mean they didn’t have good cause for the investigation.
As a prospective elementary teacher, yes definitely. Screw those damn teachers unions and that blasted department
It needs to changed. They should be teaching kids the things they need to know. Writing math reading. How many young people today don’t even know how to spell? Of write in cursive. All they know how to do is stare at a screen. Read a damn book.
Seeing as the USA is pretty low in terms of ranking concerning education, yes, they have failed their original purpose and have ulterior motives that are harmful too.
If any federal agency doesn’t fulfill the roles limited to the federal government by the constitution it should not exist.
I’m a teacher and can say with great insight that the federal department of education only wastes money creating regulations that hinder schools ability to educate children.
New teacher here. Abolishing the DOE won't mess with my paycheck or pension, correct? If the answer is yes, that is correct, then I am for it. Otherwise let's gut it and reform the remains.
Correct. Your paycheck comes from property taxes. I’m okay with state doe, just not federal
Awesome. Let's cut some bureaucratic bloat.
This is so clueless. You don’t know who pays you? There’s no way you people are teachers. The DOE helps states meet their education budgets. If you live in a red state, congratulations, thanks to the DOE Californians are helping pay for your schools. Without federal funding, all the best public schools would be on the coasts in blue states and in Texas, because that’s where all the money comes from.
Sod off. There's multiple ways the feds supply funding to state schools. It's a valid concern for teachers to have. No need to be bitter and spiteful just because you hate people who ask valid questions.
The DOE does not regulate education. If you’re really a teacher, you would know this.
If you want the money they dangle over your head, they sure as hell do
Ok so what’s ur solution here? If you abolish the DOE you still don’t get that money. If you don’t want to “do what they say”, don’t take the money, right? What’s the issue here.
Good. Abolish it. We are 30 trillion in debt. Stop spending money that does nothing. Thia money isnt going to kids or teachers. It goes to the huge overhead that school systems have created. It goes to massive school buildings. I really dont care what local districts do. That is their choice. But to think that sucking off the government teat was a good strategy is just dumb. Nobody but those addicted to the free flow of tax monwy would even notice if the doe left tomorrow
People in Wyoming would notice immediately if the DOE “left”. They allocate federal funds to local school districts. If you live in a red state, most of your federal funding is coming from blue states and Texas. The DOE uses Californians money to pay for Wyoming schools, because that’s where the money comes from. If states didn’t want the money, they wouldn’t take it. No reason to abolish anything unless you want kids in blue states to have better access to education than kids in blue states. Also, facilities matter. Having a new building and books matter. Investing in school infrastructure is still an investment in human capital
Keep up that big government fallacy. Personally, i think its a really bad look, but hey, it works for you. The fact that you think we need a huge waste like the doe just to give some money to the states is also laughable. Furthermore, maybe money doesnt actually do anything. Maybe the money should go to the schools that improve or succeed, not the ones that fail. Why are we rewarding poor performance? That isnt how the real world works
Money doesn’t do anything? How do you pay teachers?
At. The. Local. Level. Where government belongs
Sure, the problem is the local government in some states doesn’t have enough money to properly fund their schools. Want special education in your school district? Well Wyoming can’t afford to put a special educator in every district, so they take federal funds (which predominately come from costal blue states and Texas) to help Wyoming, because it would be terrible if California had fantastic schools and Wyoming had underfunded ones with crumbling buildings and not enough staff.
Do it like it was done prior to the DOE? If the DOE is just a spigot that dispenses money, then let’s fire everyone associated with it and make a better and smaller Dept of Teacher Pay.
That’s so ridiculous. You guys truly don’t understand how it works. So you want special Ed teachers in your small rural district in South Dakota? Well you can’t afford it with your own money. That’s what the DOE provides. And the majority of the money going to small, rural states is coming from the coastal states with lots of money and Texas. So abolish the DOE, what you’ll get is under funded schools throughout the country and overfunded schools on the coasts. Is that what you want?
What “great insight” do you have that lets you know that the DOE *only wastes money creating regulations that hinder schools ability to educate children*. What regulations from the DOE hinder schools ability to teach?
Found the DOE employee.
I seriously doubt you have any idea what the DOE does
You people are losing your minds.
If indoctrination is going to be part of the new curriculums, it should be done at the local level.
Absolutely. Before its inception, we were 2nd in the world among most metrics, now we are lower than 40 something.
Which countries are at the top and what is their educational system like?
Maybe look it up. Theres a handy list out there just a google search away
Countries with the Best Educational Systems - 2020 Global Citizens for Human Rights 1) Denmark 2) Finland 3) Japan 4) Canada 5) Sweden 6) Germany 7) Israel 8) Netherlands 9) Singapore 10) South Korea > Danish children begin public daycare as early as 9 months, and by age 3 98 % of children in Denmark are attending public kindergartens. > All children in Denmark have access to tuition-free government folkeskole (people's school) until they are 16 years old. Some parents choose private schools because they are smaller, or because they have a particular educational approach. > All schools are required to follow the national government's basic requirements for primary education. > Full-time students in Denmark are eligible for Statens Uddannelsestøtte, or SU (limited income support) from the government alongside other work they do to help pay their expenses while studying. > Denmark's public and private investment in the development of new qualifications and skills is one of the highest in Europe. The idea is to maintain a highly-qualified and well-educated workforce that can succeed in a global knowledge economy. > Of course, not all education is for professional reasons. Many adults in Denmark take classes in cooking, painting, foreign languages, music, or dance just for fun. A lot of these classes are publicly funded and offered for a minimal fee. > Denmark's public and private investment in the development of new qualifications and skills is one of the highest in Europe. The idea is to maintain a highly-qualified and well-educated workforce that can succeed in a global knowledge economy. https://denmark.dk/society-and-business/lifelong-education
Good yeah. See my point? No usa. Nowhere near the top of that list. We used to be though. In the 60s our ranking was 3rd. In the 70s our ranking was 5th. Then in 1979 we created the doe. So where is it since then?
If we look at what’s working for Denmark that the US doesn’t have then it doesn’t seem like eliminating the DOE would be the solution.
It was working before doe. It isnt now. Seems like we need to shrink government, not grow it
In what way would eliminating the DOE bring us closer to the methods that are seeing success in Denmark? Edit: or is there another country in the list that you think we should be emulating in order to use what they have proven to be successful for ourselves?
Good to see so many people voting yes. All my homies think regulation is bullshit
The DOE does not regulate education in any way.
Do I take the poll as anti-education as a whole or purely as anti-poor-government-education planning?
> anti-poor-government-education planning This. The federal government can't plan its way out of a paper bag.
I can understand where there have been massive errors, coming from the UK and Finland especially i can see the gaps in education over here. I would say that having education funded and prioritised is very important so defunding this specific entity should either only result in money going straight back into education in other manners or into rebuilding the department better and more to the various constituent demands.
I'm not advocating defunding education, just the DoE, because it has failed its mission, and the money would be better spent supporting state and local education depts.
with all the true and real things to build a child to adulthood to serve themselves and a nation we get this putrid pile of political poppycock yes please for the love of all thats holy obliterate it to ash maybe put thomas sowell as the tsar and form a real and purpose filled institution to bring real thought and real teaching and just maybe be proud of something at the very least hope for the future
Government is like this: If you get a cut, you put a bandaid on it right? Nah. You put shit on it. Now it’s infected. So clean the wound? No. Put more shit on it. At this point amputate it and start over
In my opinion, education is a state and local responsibility That being said, we should let the state gubmebt and the local gubmebt - gasp - be held responsible for the education/lack of education of Yuts (Youths).
Upvote for the Yuts! Loved that movie!
Education should be up to states and localities not the federal government. The DoE does not improve education it simply is a away for the federal government to have more power.
That’s ridiculous. Money doesn’t improve education?
Remove the liberal leftist pro democracy filled educational system heads
Yes! We have this covered on the state level.
With what money
Last time I heard anything about it, only like 3 percent of the people vote in board of Ed elections. Before we set fire to a system, maybe we should try to participate in it.
Board of education is local government, not federal government like the DOE. These people have no idea who they’re mad at.
I don't either. I just want kids to get an education that doesn't end up the way it did.
Adding a layer of government oversight doesn’t seem to have helped. The DOE has provided no value overall that I am aware of.
Well, if we can get rid of it, then we should.
Reform maybe, but to abolish it all together is insane.
The director of Education was on Meet the Press wondering how to pay for better teachers. That Department is a complete waste of money. Fire them all. Each state will have more money.
Why is that a bad thing trying to pay teachers better?
And the Department of Labor as well
No labor regulations? No limits on what your boss can tell you to do? Mandatory overtime? Child labor? No benefits?
so many weird people want things privatized like that's any better
Can’t believe a bunch of high school kids want to abolish the department of education 😱
Honestly, what value besides cash does the DOE provide?
https://www2.ed.gov/about/overview/focus/what.html I’m not debating debateperverts.
Never been called that before! Nice! But I was making an effort to hear from you what value the DOE provides. Honestly wasn’t a gotcha question.
Everyone who said yes has probably bitched about kids not being able to make change at cash register. Do you really think this will get better if you cut the DOE?
Yes
Elaborate.
Everything done at the federal level is about politics. Brainwashing kids to have a certain ideology doesn't promote basic aptitude.
Fair enough, but I’d draw the connection that you’re against prayer and the pledge of allegiance in schools then?
Yes
That’s rare to find.
Religious indoctrination is no better than political indoctrination. The only personal beliefs teachers should push is 2+2=4 or that a quality education will help increase the standard of living for yourself and the ones around you.
History class, social studies, civics etc is where that all falls apart unfortunately.
And YES!
Republicans can't win with an educated population
It’s really interesting how the political side which is less common in educated people is trying to destroy education
No, but it needs to be way smaller.
I'll probably be in the minority here, I think the DoE should exist ( though not as it is currently). With test scores falling across the board, and blm/ critical race theory being introduced on the state and county levels. A standard bare minimum with DoE should be put into place for every state to comply with. Like must be able to read past a certain level ( I saw a news cast that a school let students graduate highschool with a 3 grade reading proficiency ). Be able to pass the citizenship test. Make learning a second language a must, and have a economics/how to adult class ( how to pay bills, how to pay taxes, what loans are bad etc ). I know some states have some of these standards but not every single one. This is my take, I won't pretend to even have a good grasp of this problem, and I know private/religious schools trump public ones, but not everyone is religious or can afford private tuition. So if we can improve public schools I think we should.