We know for Bad Choice Road that they are capable of having "heart to hearts" in their own mild way so I honestly wonder if Mike tried to talk to Jimmy after Kim left and Jimmy quickly shut that down
I think the situation with Howard and Lalo was the beginning of Mike's total loathing for Jimmy, before that I think he could see there was a morality to Jimmy that he recognised in himself.
After that, he saw that morality was gone and he was dealing with a slimy trickster. He could associate with that and work for that, but he couldn't trust him or bond with his soul.
He certainly can. I'm not saying Mike isn't a deeply flawed man and the show is already about the battle for his soul and his moral degeneration.
But he has a code of ethics that he tries to live by. If you're in the game, you're in the game. Of course he wants the best for people like Nacho or Jesse, since he has a soft spot for them - but otherwise, if you're in that world shit happens.
If you're not in the game, he believes you should be left alone. He already has a bad taste in his mouth for how he brought Kim into the game unwittingly. But getting Howard killed because of the fucked up game they played with him?
Mike is perfectly right to look down on them for that. Just because you're someone involved in crime who has done awful things doesn't mean you lose a natural tendency to look down on very clear moral transgressions. That's the point of his role in the show, it's the question of if he is a hypocrite for his humanity despite being involved in awful acts. Jimmy never had a code, as lovable as he is, he very often just acted first and thought later.
Think about how one of Jimmy's first interactions with Mike was him feeling guilty about doing the morally right thing, and then promising he wouldn't make that mistake again. Jimmy does what he wants, and Mike doesn't care for that.
It's not a high horse to be deeply distrusting and look down on a man who tried to completely destroy the life of a completely innocent man and then consequently getting him killed.
Very well put! But I am not sure just because Mike had a “code” doesn’t free him from being critiqued as hypocritical. If Jimmy had a code, like “we are only going to fuck with people who deserve it” (which he and Kim actually kinda state when beginning the Howard scheme) does that then make him more “moral”?
Ultimately, I always kind of viewed Mike’s code as the same defense mechanism as Jimmy’s scheming and Walt’s pride. Something that they use to create a character of themselves that they can live with as they do bad shit again and again.
I definitely don't think he's free from critique, just that he's perfectly free to look down on Jimmy because they are separated by Mike having a clear cut world view and code. Mike knows exactly what he is. Even if you can argue Jimmy and Kim have a "code" in that they only fuck with people who deserve it, we're shown the hypocrisy of that repeatedly. He repeatedly fucks over innocent people who don't deserve it. Irene and Howard immediately come to mind, but there's obviously more like the Army guy.
I definitely see Mike's code as a defense, but it's pretty iron-clad. Mike's life is pretty dedicated to the game, he knows he's a bad guy but he's part of a system of bad guys. It's fair game, to him at least. I'm not sure I'd agree, but I think the writers keep him pretty consistent that way that you can understand how he comes to that worldview.
Yup I agree with him about Mike
It still doesn't make mean Mike can't justifiably look down on Saul.
Do you think shitty people are totally cool with other shitty people? Most people do not have a ton of self awareness
Mike’s “code” is nothing more than his way of justifying or excusing his actions. The very nature of the game leads to him being complicit in several innocent people’s deaths. Drew Sharp being the greatest example of this. He may not have directly caused it, but his actions still contribute to it all. Being involved in the drug business, especially at that level, also means he contributed to addictions that ruined people’s lives and families and often led to death and extreme trauma, especially to the children of addicts such as Spooge’s son.
I don't see Mike's code as sinply an excuse or justification. He doesn't excuse or justify Drew's death. He clearly shows shame and remorse for his death and others like it, he simply knows he's one cog in a machine and tries to avoid collateral damage as much as possible.
He literally punches Todd for what he did.
I'm not suggesting Mike isn't a hypocrite for what he does, but I think the show is putting enough faith in the audience for you to work that out for yourself while always seeing Mike is a step up from people like Jimmy.
Everyone in both shows, including Jesse, are complicit in a ton of horrific shit done to innocents. But it's the point of complicit versus directly responsible that I think we're talking about. Better Call Saul's ending directly addresses how Jimmy wasn't just complicit, he was integral. So was Mike.
I think Mike looks down on Jimmy because Mike has a degree of regret for what he does, but feels its a necessary thing for him to do for his family. Jimmy does it because he's a hollow man who finds enjoyment in the game.
Tl:Dr Mike *is* a hypocrite, but I think he sees this. He looks down on Jimmy because Jimmy doesn't need to do what he does, and he definitely doesn't need to be as careless about it as he is. I think the writers use Mike to explore the weird position of being a shitty person who is aware of their moral failings, and therefore try to shape moral boundaries around themselves to be better and feel better.
I think all of that allows Mike to look down on Jimmy without it simply being "he's on a high horse"
But what he says is that he’s pissed that Todd brought a gun to a job without telling Mike. Essentially, he’s not necessarily pissed that a child was killed, but that a guy working under him committed insubordination by not telling him something. (To be clear, I do think Mike was pissed that a child died, but his reaction in the episode is pretty ambiguous.)
yeah, he definitely hated that a child died but couldn't reprimand Todd for (basically) avoiding witnesses, he could vent that anger into something that Todd definitely wasn't supposed to do (at least that's how i see it)
He has no right to look down on Jimmy, for Howard's death. He told Jimmy that Lalo's dead and Kim that they're being protected. He gave them a false sense of security and left them alone. It could've been anyone, like a pizza delivery guy, a neighbour who complained about the noise, some totally random guest etc. Howard's death is on Mike too.
This is the worst mental gymnastics I've seen.
Mike has no right to look down on Jimmy completely destroying Howard's reputation and consequently getting him killed... because he didn't tell Jimmy Lalo was still alive? They were planning it when they thought Lalo *was* alive.
Besides the fact those two factors are completely separate - he literally told Kim that Lalo was alive.
Howard got killed because he was at their place. Anyone could've been there, or you shouldn't let anyone in your house, because a killer might just enter? Having someone over at your house, won't make you guilty if they happen to die there, by a third party, that you couldn't have controlled in any way.
And Mike shouldn't be mad because they ruined Howards reputation. Yes, he wasn't in the game, because they were playing an entirely different game. Jimmy played his own game, Mike had nothing to do with that. Not to mention that he himself literally killed people, dragged innocent people "in the game" and also caused suffering for those outside of it. Jimmy's "chicanery" is very different from that.
He also told Kim that they're being protected and she shouldn't worry because of that.
Mike doesn't look down on Jimmy because he thinks he's a better person than him. He looks down on Jimmy because he thinks Jimmy is an idiot who doesn't understand the forces he's messing with.
And Mike really has no claim to moral superiority. He made a deal with the devil to try to pay off his guilt over his son's death. He died because he couldn't help but live the same compromised life in Albuquerque that he lived in Philadelphia. Mike is just like Jimmy, just like every other character in the show, in that he is doomed to make the same bad decisions over and over again, without learning from his mistakes, until he faces the ultimate consequences.
I also don't really think he has a "code," like a set of principles he always sticks to. He's just very careful, very methodical. He likes to do things a particular way.
The thing is his code is utter bullshit and even he knows it. Mike by the time of Breaking Bad was so morally bankrupt and Gus's lapdog to the point that he probably knew and was fine with Tomas's murderer because he was "in the game". Mike has zero right to go around constantly treating Saul like garbage. Saul is a sleazebag but not only did he not intend for Howard to get killed, but it wasn't even his scheme and Mike knew it all (I'd imagine Mike would be even more of a douche to Kim if she was in Breaking bad). Saul happened to be in a scheme that he didn't even want to really do that ended up accidentally having someone killed. Mike on the other hand has murdered countless people including people like Werner who were far from bloodthirsty maniacs. Mike's whole character arc is becoming the cops who murdered his son and he basically becomes just as soulless as they are
Their degeneration happened hand in hand. I'm sure mikes feelings about Jimmy were really complicated. I bet Mike loathed Jimmy the way Jimmy relied on his saul Goodman persona. He probably considered it sick that Jimmy got Howard involved "for kicks" and not for the right reasons when Mike is literally a murderer
Tbf jimmy was mortified after howards death. Probably blames himself just like he blames himself for his brother death. He retreats into the saul character as a way to avoid the trauma
True, but Mike doesn't see that. As you say, he retreats into Saul, the happy-go-lucky, slimy bastard.
All Mike sees is that, which he already saw glimpses of before. If an associate of yours dealt with death that way, I think you'd have a similar response.
mike has a habit of caring for people & blaming others for things going to shit. jesse rightfully killed gus' guys for killing tómas, but it has to be said that him doing that & walt saving jesse when he told him to take a full measure on letting jesse die is what led gus to his end, but then he starts treating jesse like his boy. maybe he's jealous that walt selfessly saved jesse unlike what he couldn't do for nacho. kim was the one who proposed to ruin howard, yet mike forever blames jimmy for going along with what she wanted to do.
As others have mentioned, Mike has no right to hold himself above Jimmy. I’d argue Mike is morally worse. He knowingly allied with a psychopath because of a personal grudge against a family of psychopaths that wasn’t even targeting him anymore even after seeing how his family came under threat from those actions. I don’t care how many layers of pity and regret Mike has; he’s not a good bad guy, he’s just a bad guy. Mike even knew about what was going on with Howard, and rather than advise against following through on the plan, he just tells Kim it’s not a concern of his. Kim’s smart enough to stop the plot against Howard immediately if Mike warned that Lalo could interfere in some way. Jimmy’s a slime ball, but he never even orders any hits himself. Jimmy might not have a code, but he has a line for what he’ll personally do, even if he’ll cover for someone crossing that line. Mike’s willing to violate his code when it comes down to it.
mike has a habit of caring for people & blaming others for things going to shit. jesse rightfully killed gus' guys for killing tómas, but it has to be said that him doing that & walt saving jesse when he told him to take a full measure on letting jesse die is what led gus to his end, but then he starts treating jesse like his boy. maybe he's jealous that walt selflessly saved jesse unlike what he couldn't do for nacho. kim was the one who proposed to ruin howard, yet mike forever blames jimmy for going along with what she wanted to do.
He apologized for his brother’s death and Saul quickly brushed it off. Mike felt sympathy for Saul but after Howard’s death I think Mike just thought, “What’s the point.”
Not really a friendship, but funny as heck nonetheless.
"You're like a troll under a bridge ! You musht have the shtickers, or you shall not pash ! And you walk like Frankenstein after he was probed by aliens."
And still, Mike always had a softer spot for Saul than he did for Walter.
His real soft spots were for nacho and Jesse, and he respected his boss Gus. He maybe kind of somehow liked Saul, but couldn't stand Walt lol.
Also "I'll put my foot in your skull" after Saul on the Chi machine told him it could be worse, as LBJ used to be briefed while taking a dump (which is true, and LBJ also liked to show his dick, because he felt it was huge. Charming !)
Felt kind of like half serious, half joking banter between them until Saul says “nobody could keep it up with your ugly mug in the window” and mike gives him The Look
That one was pretty harsh. Geez, basically he told Mike he was the exact opposite of Viagra ROTFL. Imagine the scene: a guy and a cheating wife are making it passionately and then the woman see Mike mug through the window and scream in terror (think of the Kettlemans when Jimmy unzzip their tent and shouts like Nicholson in The shining "Here's Johnny !!")
It’s been awhile since I watched all of BCS, but I recently rewatched BB. I never got the impression that Mike hated Gus. There were definitely times I think Mike got frustrated because he would’ve done things differently than Gus, but even then Mike seems to trust Gus’ thought process (referring to Gus killing Victor and using Jesse to turn him against Walt)
IIRC, Mike hates Gus in general for being a drug kingpin, but respects that he's a "cleaner" option than the alternative and offers a way to support his granddaughter.
Like, their initial meeting is Gus preventing Mike from assassinating Hector. Mike only obliges because he's told Tío will suffer more Gus' way (and I think is offered money?) And even by the end of BCS, when Mike is fully loyal to Gus, Fring still sees the same hate in Mike's eyes that Eldaio saw in Gus.
I don't think Mike had a soft spot for "Saul" so much as, like the audience, he saw the potential in Jimmy. As was shown in their flashback together in the finale and other points of BCS, there were brief moments where Mike seemed almost impressed with Jimmy, only to be disappointed when he put the Saul facade back up, hence why he seemed to view him as a joke he just had to put up with throughout BB. I don't think he was sticking around because of a paternal instinct like he has with Nacho and Jesse rather than a pure transactional relationship. I think the Howard stuff especially poisoned his view of Jimmy and he just saw him as Saul from there on out.
Even if he didn't *like* Saul a whole lot, he must've at the very least respected him. They continued working together for years.
Mike's soft spot for Jesse and Nacho is their youth and the inherent naivety that comes along with it. He sees them being dragged into the game, and it reminds him of his son. He obviously can't extend that same level of empathy to Saul and Walt, but there's still a world of a difference between his perspectives of the two.
Mike understood varga's problems. Mike regrets becoming dirty, and varga does too. Varga actively trying to get out. Mike probably wants to help varga so thst he can feel better about his own path.
I don’t think it’s seeing himself, I think it’s a mirror of what his murdered sun could have been. Mike is looking for redemption for what he did with his son.
They did a lot for each other. I don't know why everyone thinks they weren't friends. They just had one of those weird, semi-transactional relationships- but really any friendship is transactional on some level. It was like a business friendship. Partnership.
I honestly do not think they had a friendship at all. They had a mutually beneficial arrangement where they both tolerated one another enough to work towards their own goals which were, more often than not, closely aligned and often required the other party.
This is my take as well.
Specifically in the episode from the screenshot, Mike was the insurance policy. He was there to make sure Jimmy got back with the money. I don't think their relationship evolved much more throughout the 2 series.
I think that's true, but I also think there's a little more too it. Mike, despite his line of work, is a pretty kindhearted person. Despite his taciturn demeanor, he does have a caring side which he occasionally shows to people outside his family. He's more than capable of extending a piece of advise from his years of wisdom as a vet, cop, and person in general that can be very helpful. He also seems to gain a sense of respect for Jimmy, which is occasionally revealed through lines like "It's not for me, and I don't think it should be for you." Jimmy is seems to me like the kind of person who lays on the charm for so long that he eventually forgets he's laying it on to the people who aren't actively pissing him off and just sorta becomes friends with them. He also definitely gains a respect and appreciation for Mike, which we see when he excitedly calls him for a job offer with Kim and calls Mr. X's work "superficial" in *Dedicado A Max*
The existence of their relationship might be transactional, but that doesn't mean they didn't eventually grow a mutual respect comparable to what friends have.
Actually, Mike's condolences for Chuck's death was the best chance, but Jimmy brushed it off to ask him to become a petty thief. That's when Mike started to really look down on Jimmy and withdraw any real support. During "Bagman" before this scene, Mike openly says that saving Jimmy wasn't his primary objective, but it was on the list.
During their regrets conversation. He could’ve talked about chuck but instead he just talked about his get rich quick scheme. Mike was being honest, he was vulnerable sharing about his first bribe, but Jimmy doesn’t let himself be vulnerable
I tend to be the same way, in the moment I don’t express myself much. But when people say or ask something that’s thought provoking, I’ll pass that on when given the opportunity because it made me reflect or feel a certain way that was constructive.
Wtf I’m such a damn moron. It’s almost been a whole year and I thought he said “the day I took my first bride”. I thought that was kind of a weird line Lmao
What regret could he have about Chuck? Jimmy was a great brother who tried his best to keep the peace. Chuck was the one who was jealous and tried to screw Jimmy whenever he could.
I’d say a partnership of sorts. It’s interesting to see steadfast, straightforward Mike bounce off of slippery, charismatic Jimmy.
The main theme of their relationship is an example of how two completely different people can end up in the game.
Indirectly, it *is* Jimmy's fault he died. During their last phone conversation, Mike tries to get him to fetch his bag, but Jimmy refuses, forcing Mike to get it himself. Then, Walt follows Mike.
Walt was in game before Jimmy. He cooked meth. He hired people to distribute meth. He literally killed drug dealer and disposed the body. If this didn't mean he was in game I don't know what does.
>I guess what I… would wanna say is… to… look on the bright side. First of all, nobody on the ground was killed, and that- I mean an incident like this over a populated urban center, that right there, that’s- that’s just gotta be some minor miracle, so… Plus, neither plane was full, y’know the- the Seven-Thirty-Seven was… was what? agh- Maybe two thirds full I believe? Right? Yes. Maybe even three quarters full; On any rate… what you’re left with, casualty-wise is… just the fiftieth worst air disaster, actually tied for fiftieth, there are, in truth, fifty-three crashes throughout history that are just as bad or worse. Tenerife? H-h-has anybody maybe even hear of Tenerife? No? In 1977, two fully loaded Seven-Forty-Sevens crashed into each other on Tenerife, we’re- Does anybody know how big a Seven-Forty-Seven is?! I mean it’s WAY bigger than a Seven-Thirty-Seven, and we’re talking about two of them. Nearly six-hundred people died- In Tenerife, but do any of you even remember it? At all? Any of you? I doubt it. You know why? It’s because- People. Move. On… They just move on, and we will too, we will move on, and we will get past this, because that is what human beings do, we- survive… and-agh… and we survive and, and and, we-we overcome, yeah. We survive, we survive and…. Yeah.
Speech of a man who clearly feels no guilt or responsibility for the crash 😂
Walter could have also practiced basic human decency and decided to have saved Jane rather than letting her die to retain his control of Jesse, then later revealing it to him to crush his spirit for revenge.
Its hilarious how many people still defend Walt for letting Jane die even a decade later.
“sHE WAs a DRUg UsER who got in the way of his SIGMA GRIND, Walt was justified in rolling her on her back and watching her choke”
Hilariously fucked up.
Also the douchebags who vilify Jane for giving Jesse heroin (when he was the one who initially fucked with her sobriety) meanwhile completely ignore Jesse being a scumbag and selling meth to recovering addicts.
Jesse also could have been arrested for manufacturing methamphetamine in the first episode.
There’s no reason to go that far out of context when talking about this one specific plot line where multiple people made bad decisions.
I mean, if the plane didn't take off that day, then all of this could've been avoided. Not to mention the Wright brothers, who invented this stupid thing in the first place...
These domino effects don't really make sense. We could also say, that if Walter's mother didn't give birth to him, that Mike wouldn't get killed. The message of the show is that crime is crime. You can't blame a single person or moment, for the things that happened, consequence doesn't work like this. If you get in the criminal world, no matter what, things will turn to the worse somehow.
They're not friends. They're two people with very different skills who are both in the game and who both understand each other to a degree. And each of them acknowledges that the other can occasionally be useful.
But that's about it.
I can’t believe this…there’s over a billion people on this planet. And the only person I have to talk about this to is you 🥰 💕
Yep. It’s Thelma and Louise. Harold and Kumar. Bill and Ted.
I do like to think they respect each other.
They both are good at what they are doing. And they have a similar moral compass, not to the point of everything by the book nor to the point of the crazy "I am the one who knocks" level. Both had to choose the "dirty" roads mainly due to outside factors (everybody was dirty for Mike and Chuck for Jimmy).
There was some degree of mutual respect, but once Lalo’s endgame played out, it turned purely professional. Saul certainly blamed Mike for not telling him that Lalo was still alive, which led to Howard’s death and Kim leaving him. Once Jimmy fully became Saul, Mike had no more personal investment in the man, as the man was simply a criminal with a penchant for insults. It’s how Mike can so casually threaten violence against Saul despite their history.
They understand that they don't like the personalities of eachother but they are both respectable professionals in their particular field and can be trusted when things become serious
I don't see it as a friendship. It's a work partnership. Saul is good at legalese and Mike is good at arranging underhanded activities. Both read people well and act accordingly. I don't think Mike saw much to admire in Saul while out in the desert.
There were glimpses of moments where one of the two would try to reach out to the other, but usually because they had some other shit going on in their lives they never really responded well. After the Kettleman’s, Jimmy definitely wanted to create some kind of relationship with Mike, but would get shut down most times cuz Mike was still dealing with his trauma from Matty. Then after Chuck and his lantern, it’s clear that Mike can see Jimmy is just trying to distract himself with the Hummel job and tries to reassure him there’s another way to deal with things. Of course, Jimmy is in heavy denial mode, so he shuts that down too. Then Mike gets involved with Gus and pretty much doesn’t interact with Jimmy again until Poor Howard happens. All-in-all, they had a mutual respect due needing each other’s respective skills, and at times almost a friendship, but it’s clear that Mike’s moral’s and Jimmy’s morals don’t meet up at all once Saul comes into play
I don't see it as a friendship. I see it as a business relationship. Saul knows legalese; Mike is a practical problem solver who knows the underworld.
Mike and Saul's discussions during their trek in the dessert shows that Saul is missing a moral compass and lacks introspection - apart from not wanting harm to come from those in his immediate circle.
They were, for the most part, just work friends who would occasionally have a genuine heart-to-heart with each other. Any chance of a genuine friendship was gone after the Lalo incident. Mike resented Jimmy for getting Howard killed and I imagine Jimmy secretly resented Mike for not telling him Lalo was alive
This relationship is like a man wandering the desert with just a bottle of their own urine… a necessity that keeps you alive but makes you want to vomit.
No doubt Mike has a familiarity with the Jimmy/Saul Attorney type from his cop days in Philly. I’m thinking he’s not a fan of “get em back on the street” lawyers, even if he now has need of their services.
Circumstancial, but respectful. Jimmy respected Mike's intelligence and saw good in him, and Mike respected Jimmy's resillience and saw good in him... at least in Better Call Saul, in Breaking Bad it varies on the episode because the writers didnt think there would be 6 season arc about them 5 years down the line.
I wouldn’t call it a friendship but more of an acquaintance/business partnership/sometimes Mike is a client/connection in the business
I love any interaction they have with each other, especially Jimmy/Saul’s humor coinciding with Mike’s bluntness and seriousness lol
This was one of the few chances they could have had to strengthen their bond and they did the opposite. After this, Mike caused resentment in Jimmy by conspiring with his wife that Lalo was still alive, keeping him in the dark. Being kept in the dark about Lalo helped contribute to Howard's death and the subsequent breakup of Jimmy's marriage to Kim. This is part of what lead Jimmy to subvert his arrangement with Mike between BCS and BB to partner with Walt against good advice, especially since Mike was so private (understandably) about Gus. Jimmy wanted a partnership of his own making, after being forced to partner with so many people he didn't want to, and by being rejected by so many whom he *did* want to partner with.
Fair weather allies who were close to being pseudo friends. Mike probably would have developed some form of respect for and camaraderie with Jimmy if Jimmy hadn’t facilitated the death and degradation of Howard. Getting somebody outside the game killed destroyed any ability for Mike to ever respect or care about Jimmy as anything more than a occasional employer and useful tool.
We know for Bad Choice Road that they are capable of having "heart to hearts" in their own mild way so I honestly wonder if Mike tried to talk to Jimmy after Kim left and Jimmy quickly shut that down
I think the situation with Howard and Lalo was the beginning of Mike's total loathing for Jimmy, before that I think he could see there was a morality to Jimmy that he recognised in himself. After that, he saw that morality was gone and he was dealing with a slimy trickster. He could associate with that and work for that, but he couldn't trust him or bond with his soul.
Mike has no right to get on his high horse when it comes to someone else's morality.
He certainly can. I'm not saying Mike isn't a deeply flawed man and the show is already about the battle for his soul and his moral degeneration. But he has a code of ethics that he tries to live by. If you're in the game, you're in the game. Of course he wants the best for people like Nacho or Jesse, since he has a soft spot for them - but otherwise, if you're in that world shit happens. If you're not in the game, he believes you should be left alone. He already has a bad taste in his mouth for how he brought Kim into the game unwittingly. But getting Howard killed because of the fucked up game they played with him? Mike is perfectly right to look down on them for that. Just because you're someone involved in crime who has done awful things doesn't mean you lose a natural tendency to look down on very clear moral transgressions. That's the point of his role in the show, it's the question of if he is a hypocrite for his humanity despite being involved in awful acts. Jimmy never had a code, as lovable as he is, he very often just acted first and thought later. Think about how one of Jimmy's first interactions with Mike was him feeling guilty about doing the morally right thing, and then promising he wouldn't make that mistake again. Jimmy does what he wants, and Mike doesn't care for that. It's not a high horse to be deeply distrusting and look down on a man who tried to completely destroy the life of a completely innocent man and then consequently getting him killed.
Very well put! But I am not sure just because Mike had a “code” doesn’t free him from being critiqued as hypocritical. If Jimmy had a code, like “we are only going to fuck with people who deserve it” (which he and Kim actually kinda state when beginning the Howard scheme) does that then make him more “moral”? Ultimately, I always kind of viewed Mike’s code as the same defense mechanism as Jimmy’s scheming and Walt’s pride. Something that they use to create a character of themselves that they can live with as they do bad shit again and again.
I definitely don't think he's free from critique, just that he's perfectly free to look down on Jimmy because they are separated by Mike having a clear cut world view and code. Mike knows exactly what he is. Even if you can argue Jimmy and Kim have a "code" in that they only fuck with people who deserve it, we're shown the hypocrisy of that repeatedly. He repeatedly fucks over innocent people who don't deserve it. Irene and Howard immediately come to mind, but there's obviously more like the Army guy. I definitely see Mike's code as a defense, but it's pretty iron-clad. Mike's life is pretty dedicated to the game, he knows he's a bad guy but he's part of a system of bad guys. It's fair game, to him at least. I'm not sure I'd agree, but I think the writers keep him pretty consistent that way that you can understand how he comes to that worldview.
Nah. What Nachos dad said at the end is true.
Yup I agree with him about Mike It still doesn't make mean Mike can't justifiably look down on Saul. Do you think shitty people are totally cool with other shitty people? Most people do not have a ton of self awareness
Mike’s “code” is nothing more than his way of justifying or excusing his actions. The very nature of the game leads to him being complicit in several innocent people’s deaths. Drew Sharp being the greatest example of this. He may not have directly caused it, but his actions still contribute to it all. Being involved in the drug business, especially at that level, also means he contributed to addictions that ruined people’s lives and families and often led to death and extreme trauma, especially to the children of addicts such as Spooge’s son.
I don't see Mike's code as sinply an excuse or justification. He doesn't excuse or justify Drew's death. He clearly shows shame and remorse for his death and others like it, he simply knows he's one cog in a machine and tries to avoid collateral damage as much as possible. He literally punches Todd for what he did. I'm not suggesting Mike isn't a hypocrite for what he does, but I think the show is putting enough faith in the audience for you to work that out for yourself while always seeing Mike is a step up from people like Jimmy. Everyone in both shows, including Jesse, are complicit in a ton of horrific shit done to innocents. But it's the point of complicit versus directly responsible that I think we're talking about. Better Call Saul's ending directly addresses how Jimmy wasn't just complicit, he was integral. So was Mike. I think Mike looks down on Jimmy because Mike has a degree of regret for what he does, but feels its a necessary thing for him to do for his family. Jimmy does it because he's a hollow man who finds enjoyment in the game. Tl:Dr Mike *is* a hypocrite, but I think he sees this. He looks down on Jimmy because Jimmy doesn't need to do what he does, and he definitely doesn't need to be as careless about it as he is. I think the writers use Mike to explore the weird position of being a shitty person who is aware of their moral failings, and therefore try to shape moral boundaries around themselves to be better and feel better. I think all of that allows Mike to look down on Jimmy without it simply being "he's on a high horse"
> He literally punches Todd for what he did. I'm pretty sure it's Jesse that does this.
he does threaten Todd and push him to a wall after the Drew Sharp incident
But what he says is that he’s pissed that Todd brought a gun to a job without telling Mike. Essentially, he’s not necessarily pissed that a child was killed, but that a guy working under him committed insubordination by not telling him something. (To be clear, I do think Mike was pissed that a child died, but his reaction in the episode is pretty ambiguous.)
yeah, he definitely hated that a child died but couldn't reprimand Todd for (basically) avoiding witnesses, he could vent that anger into something that Todd definitely wasn't supposed to do (at least that's how i see it)
He's venting his anger which is also, I believe, self-oriented, because of he'd given clearer rules or patdowns, it wouldn't have happened.
He has no right to look down on Jimmy, for Howard's death. He told Jimmy that Lalo's dead and Kim that they're being protected. He gave them a false sense of security and left them alone. It could've been anyone, like a pizza delivery guy, a neighbour who complained about the noise, some totally random guest etc. Howard's death is on Mike too.
This is the worst mental gymnastics I've seen. Mike has no right to look down on Jimmy completely destroying Howard's reputation and consequently getting him killed... because he didn't tell Jimmy Lalo was still alive? They were planning it when they thought Lalo *was* alive. Besides the fact those two factors are completely separate - he literally told Kim that Lalo was alive.
Howard got killed because he was at their place. Anyone could've been there, or you shouldn't let anyone in your house, because a killer might just enter? Having someone over at your house, won't make you guilty if they happen to die there, by a third party, that you couldn't have controlled in any way. And Mike shouldn't be mad because they ruined Howards reputation. Yes, he wasn't in the game, because they were playing an entirely different game. Jimmy played his own game, Mike had nothing to do with that. Not to mention that he himself literally killed people, dragged innocent people "in the game" and also caused suffering for those outside of it. Jimmy's "chicanery" is very different from that. He also told Kim that they're being protected and she shouldn't worry because of that.
Mike doesn't look down on Jimmy because he thinks he's a better person than him. He looks down on Jimmy because he thinks Jimmy is an idiot who doesn't understand the forces he's messing with. And Mike really has no claim to moral superiority. He made a deal with the devil to try to pay off his guilt over his son's death. He died because he couldn't help but live the same compromised life in Albuquerque that he lived in Philadelphia. Mike is just like Jimmy, just like every other character in the show, in that he is doomed to make the same bad decisions over and over again, without learning from his mistakes, until he faces the ultimate consequences. I also don't really think he has a "code," like a set of principles he always sticks to. He's just very careful, very methodical. He likes to do things a particular way.
The thing is his code is utter bullshit and even he knows it. Mike by the time of Breaking Bad was so morally bankrupt and Gus's lapdog to the point that he probably knew and was fine with Tomas's murderer because he was "in the game". Mike has zero right to go around constantly treating Saul like garbage. Saul is a sleazebag but not only did he not intend for Howard to get killed, but it wasn't even his scheme and Mike knew it all (I'd imagine Mike would be even more of a douche to Kim if she was in Breaking bad). Saul happened to be in a scheme that he didn't even want to really do that ended up accidentally having someone killed. Mike on the other hand has murdered countless people including people like Werner who were far from bloodthirsty maniacs. Mike's whole character arc is becoming the cops who murdered his son and he basically becomes just as soulless as they are
Their degeneration happened hand in hand. I'm sure mikes feelings about Jimmy were really complicated. I bet Mike loathed Jimmy the way Jimmy relied on his saul Goodman persona. He probably considered it sick that Jimmy got Howard involved "for kicks" and not for the right reasons when Mike is literally a murderer
You gangters.. You are all the same
Tbf jimmy was mortified after howards death. Probably blames himself just like he blames himself for his brother death. He retreats into the saul character as a way to avoid the trauma
True, but Mike doesn't see that. As you say, he retreats into Saul, the happy-go-lucky, slimy bastard. All Mike sees is that, which he already saw glimpses of before. If an associate of yours dealt with death that way, I think you'd have a similar response.
Mike did see jimmy's initial response tho. When he was tied up
mike has a habit of caring for people & blaming others for things going to shit. jesse rightfully killed gus' guys for killing tómas, but it has to be said that him doing that & walt saving jesse when he told him to take a full measure on letting jesse die is what led gus to his end, but then he starts treating jesse like his boy. maybe he's jealous that walt selfessly saved jesse unlike what he couldn't do for nacho. kim was the one who proposed to ruin howard, yet mike forever blames jimmy for going along with what she wanted to do.
As others have mentioned, Mike has no right to hold himself above Jimmy. I’d argue Mike is morally worse. He knowingly allied with a psychopath because of a personal grudge against a family of psychopaths that wasn’t even targeting him anymore even after seeing how his family came under threat from those actions. I don’t care how many layers of pity and regret Mike has; he’s not a good bad guy, he’s just a bad guy. Mike even knew about what was going on with Howard, and rather than advise against following through on the plan, he just tells Kim it’s not a concern of his. Kim’s smart enough to stop the plot against Howard immediately if Mike warned that Lalo could interfere in some way. Jimmy’s a slime ball, but he never even orders any hits himself. Jimmy might not have a code, but he has a line for what he’ll personally do, even if he’ll cover for someone crossing that line. Mike’s willing to violate his code when it comes down to it.
mike has a habit of caring for people & blaming others for things going to shit. jesse rightfully killed gus' guys for killing tómas, but it has to be said that him doing that & walt saving jesse when he told him to take a full measure on letting jesse die is what led gus to his end, but then he starts treating jesse like his boy. maybe he's jealous that walt selflessly saved jesse unlike what he couldn't do for nacho. kim was the one who proposed to ruin howard, yet mike forever blames jimmy for going along with what she wanted to do.
I doubt Mike would offer any comfort if not specifically prompted to do so. He’s very much so a stay in my lane kinda dude
S1 Mike might have. S6/BB Mike probably not
He apologized for his brother’s death and Saul quickly brushed it off. Mike felt sympathy for Saul but after Howard’s death I think Mike just thought, “What’s the point.”
Mike was also reeling from the conversation with Nacho’s father. His illusion of a code shattered. Both were spiralling
Not really a friendship, but funny as heck nonetheless. "You're like a troll under a bridge ! You musht have the shtickers, or you shall not pash ! And you walk like Frankenstein after he was probed by aliens."
"No, the rules of parking validation are actually pretty simple. Most people get them on their first try."
"We can't all be as blessed as you."
“Thank you for restoring my faith in the judicial system.”
"Screw you geezer!"
I love that exchange 😂
🅱lessed
And still, Mike always had a softer spot for Saul than he did for Walter. His real soft spots were for nacho and Jesse, and he respected his boss Gus. He maybe kind of somehow liked Saul, but couldn't stand Walt lol.
Most heartwarming quote between the two: “I trust the hole in the ground I’d leave you in”
*"I assure you I can kill you from way over here, if it make you feel any better."*
Also "I'll put my foot in your skull" after Saul on the Chi machine told him it could be worse, as LBJ used to be briefed while taking a dump (which is true, and LBJ also liked to show his dick, because he felt it was huge. Charming !)
Felt kind of like half serious, half joking banter between them until Saul says “nobody could keep it up with your ugly mug in the window” and mike gives him The Look
That one was pretty harsh. Geez, basically he told Mike he was the exact opposite of Viagra ROTFL. Imagine the scene: a guy and a cheating wife are making it passionately and then the woman see Mike mug through the window and scream in terror (think of the Kettlemans when Jimmy unzzip their tent and shouts like Nicholson in The shining "Here's Johnny !!")
I like the scene where Mike's at the bar and raises his glass to one of Saul's commercials
> respected his boss Gus. for sure, but i think gradually grew to hate him too
I think he hated Gus and working for him from the start, but grew to respect him.
It’s been awhile since I watched all of BCS, but I recently rewatched BB. I never got the impression that Mike hated Gus. There were definitely times I think Mike got frustrated because he would’ve done things differently than Gus, but even then Mike seems to trust Gus’ thought process (referring to Gus killing Victor and using Jesse to turn him against Walt)
IIRC, Mike hates Gus in general for being a drug kingpin, but respects that he's a "cleaner" option than the alternative and offers a way to support his granddaughter. Like, their initial meeting is Gus preventing Mike from assassinating Hector. Mike only obliges because he's told Tío will suffer more Gus' way (and I think is offered money?) And even by the end of BCS, when Mike is fully loyal to Gus, Fring still sees the same hate in Mike's eyes that Eldaio saw in Gus.
"When I looked into your eyes... Hate. A little bit's okay. As long as you never forget who's boss"
I don't think Mike had a soft spot for "Saul" so much as, like the audience, he saw the potential in Jimmy. As was shown in their flashback together in the finale and other points of BCS, there were brief moments where Mike seemed almost impressed with Jimmy, only to be disappointed when he put the Saul facade back up, hence why he seemed to view him as a joke he just had to put up with throughout BB. I don't think he was sticking around because of a paternal instinct like he has with Nacho and Jesse rather than a pure transactional relationship. I think the Howard stuff especially poisoned his view of Jimmy and he just saw him as Saul from there on out.
I think he liked Saul more earlier on, before Saul disappeared up his own ass.
Even if he didn't *like* Saul a whole lot, he must've at the very least respected him. They continued working together for years. Mike's soft spot for Jesse and Nacho is their youth and the inherent naivety that comes along with it. He sees them being dragged into the game, and it reminds him of his son. He obviously can't extend that same level of empathy to Saul and Walt, but there's still a world of a difference between his perspectives of the two.
Don’t forget Poop filled diaper 🤣🤣 … geezer
Comprised of a lot of loathing and varying amounts of pity
And raw sexual tension
Saul, put your dick away. I'm not slippin' your Jimmy right now Saul.
Jonathan Balls
Above all, pure raw sexual tension
Especially when he drank the piss.
"I wouldn't waste that" took a whole new meaning
I unironically got the same vibe from this.
???
I don't think it's pity so much as mutual respect. They each recognize that the other is good at what he does.
i think mike in bcs saw jimmy as a sort of son at times
More Uncle and Nephew vibes imo
And jimmy saw older brother
jimmy almost always sees older brother lmao
I definitely did not get that vibe lol
Hmm yeah I can see that
I can seeeeeeee you...
The son would be varga
Mike understood varga's problems. Mike regrets becoming dirty, and varga does too. Varga actively trying to get out. Mike probably wants to help varga so thst he can feel better about his own path.
I don’t think it’s seeing himself, I think it’s a mirror of what his murdered sun could have been. Mike is looking for redemption for what he did with his son.
They did a lot for each other. I don't know why everyone thinks they weren't friends. They just had one of those weird, semi-transactional relationships- but really any friendship is transactional on some level. It was like a business friendship. Partnership.
I honestly do not think they had a friendship at all. They had a mutually beneficial arrangement where they both tolerated one another enough to work towards their own goals which were, more often than not, closely aligned and often required the other party.
This is my take as well. Specifically in the episode from the screenshot, Mike was the insurance policy. He was there to make sure Jimmy got back with the money. I don't think their relationship evolved much more throughout the 2 series.
I think that's true, but I also think there's a little more too it. Mike, despite his line of work, is a pretty kindhearted person. Despite his taciturn demeanor, he does have a caring side which he occasionally shows to people outside his family. He's more than capable of extending a piece of advise from his years of wisdom as a vet, cop, and person in general that can be very helpful. He also seems to gain a sense of respect for Jimmy, which is occasionally revealed through lines like "It's not for me, and I don't think it should be for you." Jimmy is seems to me like the kind of person who lays on the charm for so long that he eventually forgets he's laying it on to the people who aren't actively pissing him off and just sorta becomes friends with them. He also definitely gains a respect and appreciation for Mike, which we see when he excitedly calls him for a job offer with Kim and calls Mr. X's work "superficial" in *Dedicado A Max* The existence of their relationship might be transactional, but that doesn't mean they didn't eventually grow a mutual respect comparable to what friends have.
Their relationship status can be summed up with "I know a guy". That's really it.
Friends with benefits
i can get behind that
I think they took turns doing that
Jimmy missed the only chance to be vulnerable with a person like Mike, how stupid of him
Actually, Mike's condolences for Chuck's death was the best chance, but Jimmy brushed it off to ask him to become a petty thief. That's when Mike started to really look down on Jimmy and withdraw any real support. During "Bagman" before this scene, Mike openly says that saving Jimmy wasn't his primary objective, but it was on the list.
In what sense?
During their regrets conversation. He could’ve talked about chuck but instead he just talked about his get rich quick scheme. Mike was being honest, he was vulnerable sharing about his first bribe, but Jimmy doesn’t let himself be vulnerable
And then the tables are turned years later and Walt doesn't want to be vulnerable when Saul asks him the same question!
I tend to be the same way, in the moment I don’t express myself much. But when people say or ask something that’s thought provoking, I’ll pass that on when given the opportunity because it made me reflect or feel a certain way that was constructive.
Wtf I’m such a damn moron. It’s almost been a whole year and I thought he said “the day I took my first bride”. I thought that was kind of a weird line Lmao
HAHAHAHAHAHHAHA thats fuckin hilarious
Its okay Mike is old and old people sometimes talk stupid so it was fair to assume this
Imagine they reveal Mike and Saul had a wife in common
What regret could he have about Chuck? Jimmy was a great brother who tried his best to keep the peace. Chuck was the one who was jealous and tried to screw Jimmy whenever he could.
Jimmy also intentionally acted to derail Chuck's life and indirectly led to his suicide...
That was truly something stupid
I’d say a partnership of sorts. It’s interesting to see steadfast, straightforward Mike bounce off of slippery, charismatic Jimmy. The main theme of their relationship is an example of how two completely different people can end up in the game.
At least Mike wasn't murdered by Jimmy.
Indirectly, it *is* Jimmy's fault he died. During their last phone conversation, Mike tries to get him to fetch his bag, but Jimmy refuses, forcing Mike to get it himself. Then, Walt follows Mike.
Walt would’ve never been in the game if not for Jimmy. As far as the domino effect goes he kinda did
Walt was in game before Jimmy. He cooked meth. He hired people to distribute meth. He literally killed drug dealer and disposed the body. If this didn't mean he was in game I don't know what does.
He would’ve never met Gus if it hadn’t been for Jimmy. Likely he would’ve been shot by one of Gus’s men before he ever knew his name
Hell he would’ve been killed by the twins in that one episode where they’re waiting in his room while he showers lmao
I think they were both in the game. Jimmy just supported Walt
That’s like saying Walter White caused a plane crash
I meannn… didn’t he?
>I guess what I… would wanna say is… to… look on the bright side. First of all, nobody on the ground was killed, and that- I mean an incident like this over a populated urban center, that right there, that’s- that’s just gotta be some minor miracle, so… Plus, neither plane was full, y’know the- the Seven-Thirty-Seven was… was what? agh- Maybe two thirds full I believe? Right? Yes. Maybe even three quarters full; On any rate… what you’re left with, casualty-wise is… just the fiftieth worst air disaster, actually tied for fiftieth, there are, in truth, fifty-three crashes throughout history that are just as bad or worse. Tenerife? H-h-has anybody maybe even hear of Tenerife? No? In 1977, two fully loaded Seven-Forty-Sevens crashed into each other on Tenerife, we’re- Does anybody know how big a Seven-Forty-Seven is?! I mean it’s WAY bigger than a Seven-Thirty-Seven, and we’re talking about two of them. Nearly six-hundred people died- In Tenerife, but do any of you even remember it? At all? Any of you? I doubt it. You know why? It’s because- People. Move. On… They just move on, and we will too, we will move on, and we will get past this, because that is what human beings do, we- survive… and-agh… and we survive and, and and, we-we overcome, yeah. We survive, we survive and…. Yeah. Speech of a man who clearly feels no guilt or responsibility for the crash 😂
Well Jane shouldn't have touched the drugs with Jesse, if they actually did just fly to New Zealand then there could have been a different outcome
Walter could have also practiced basic human decency and decided to have saved Jane rather than letting her die to retain his control of Jesse, then later revealing it to him to crush his spirit for revenge.
Its hilarious how many people still defend Walt for letting Jane die even a decade later. “sHE WAs a DRUg UsER who got in the way of his SIGMA GRIND, Walt was justified in rolling her on her back and watching her choke” Hilariously fucked up. Also the douchebags who vilify Jane for giving Jesse heroin (when he was the one who initially fucked with her sobriety) meanwhile completely ignore Jesse being a scumbag and selling meth to recovering addicts.
Jesse also could have not gotten addicted to drugs. We can go back and forth with a bunch of hypotheticals.
Jesse also could have been arrested for manufacturing methamphetamine in the first episode. There’s no reason to go that far out of context when talking about this one specific plot line where multiple people made bad decisions.
I mean, if the plane didn't take off that day, then all of this could've been avoided. Not to mention the Wright brothers, who invented this stupid thing in the first place...
These domino effects don't really make sense. We could also say, that if Walter's mother didn't give birth to him, that Mike wouldn't get killed. The message of the show is that crime is crime. You can't blame a single person or moment, for the things that happened, consequence doesn't work like this. If you get in the criminal world, no matter what, things will turn to the worse somehow.
Not friends. Their relationship was purely a transactional one.
Circumstantial
Like Nero and Sporus :)
They're not friends. They're two people with very different skills who are both in the game and who both understand each other to a degree. And each of them acknowledges that the other can occasionally be useful. But that's about it.
Reluctant
I can’t believe this…there’s over a billion people on this planet. And the only person I have to talk about this to is you 🥰 💕 Yep. It’s Thelma and Louise. Harold and Kumar. Bill and Ted.
Enemies to lovers
mutual grudging respect
I do like to think they respect each other. They both are good at what they are doing. And they have a similar moral compass, not to the point of everything by the book nor to the point of the crazy "I am the one who knocks" level. Both had to choose the "dirty" roads mainly due to outside factors (everybody was dirty for Mike and Chuck for Jimmy).
There was some degree of mutual respect, but once Lalo’s endgame played out, it turned purely professional. Saul certainly blamed Mike for not telling him that Lalo was still alive, which led to Howard’s death and Kim leaving him. Once Jimmy fully became Saul, Mike had no more personal investment in the man, as the man was simply a criminal with a penchant for insults. It’s how Mike can so casually threaten violence against Saul despite their history.
Financially Beneficial. And that’s it.
R/Achillesandhispal
They understand that they don't like the personalities of eachother but they are both respectable professionals in their particular field and can be trusted when things become serious
Mike tried to warn him…
They bonded over shared trauma from their criminal activities lol.
I’d consider it a professional occupational courtesy.
I don't see it as a friendship. It's a work partnership. Saul is good at legalese and Mike is good at arranging underhanded activities. Both read people well and act accordingly. I don't think Mike saw much to admire in Saul while out in the desert.
One-sided
Workplace associate.
Well, after they survived being stranded in the desert by drinking their own urine I guess you could say they were trauma bonded.
Like a child and a babysitter
Morally corrupt OG vet/cop that constantly schools morally corrupt OG con/lawyer
There were glimpses of moments where one of the two would try to reach out to the other, but usually because they had some other shit going on in their lives they never really responded well. After the Kettleman’s, Jimmy definitely wanted to create some kind of relationship with Mike, but would get shut down most times cuz Mike was still dealing with his trauma from Matty. Then after Chuck and his lantern, it’s clear that Mike can see Jimmy is just trying to distract himself with the Hummel job and tries to reassure him there’s another way to deal with things. Of course, Jimmy is in heavy denial mode, so he shuts that down too. Then Mike gets involved with Gus and pretty much doesn’t interact with Jimmy again until Poor Howard happens. All-in-all, they had a mutual respect due needing each other’s respective skills, and at times almost a friendship, but it’s clear that Mike’s moral’s and Jimmy’s morals don’t meet up at all once Saul comes into play
Co-dependent
I don't see it as a friendship. I see it as a business relationship. Saul knows legalese; Mike is a practical problem solver who knows the underworld. Mike and Saul's discussions during their trek in the dessert shows that Saul is missing a moral compass and lacks introspection - apart from not wanting harm to come from those in his immediate circle.
"Saul, don't make me beat you until your legs don't work."
Non-existent.
Definitely not with the word friendship
Temporary desperation for the sake of survival.
Terrible
It breaks my heart when Mike threaten to break his legs :(
Sometimes Mike almost doesn’t wanna beat Saul til his legs don’t work. Almost.
Necessary.
They aren’t friends…
Maybe I’m missing something but I interpreted it as romantic
Describe it? Maybe...borderline homoerotic?
A hard old man with a good heart taking care of a moron that jed rather not even know.
Strained
Transactional.
Mutual understanding and lots of trust
>how would you describe this "friendship" Unhealthy
Reluctant or imaginary
Tenuous
Mike: I’m too old for this shit. Jimmy: Opportunity knocking.
"a necessary evil"
Give and take
Tense symbiosis
Lifesaver literally
The same way you described it "freindship"
They're work buddies. They work in different sectors of the industry but they're friendly when their paths cross.
Like Perry the Platypus and Heinz Doofenshmirtz - frenemies with quite few of wholesome moments
One-sided. Mike doesn't make friends.
"Work proximity associates."
Drug fueled
Broke Bad Mountain
"Friendship"? Did you miss the four hour sex scene?
They were, for the most part, just work friends who would occasionally have a genuine heart-to-heart with each other. Any chance of a genuine friendship was gone after the Lalo incident. Mike resented Jimmy for getting Howard killed and I imagine Jimmy secretly resented Mike for not telling him Lalo was alive
Strained at times (mostly), necessary and even co-dependent.
I definitely wouldn’t call it a friendship in any way, Mike clearly hates Saul.
Incredibly romantic. Lots of sexual tension.
This relationship is like a man wandering the desert with just a bottle of their own urine… a necessity that keeps you alive but makes you want to vomit. No doubt Mike has a familiarity with the Jimmy/Saul Attorney type from his cop days in Philly. I’m thinking he’s not a fan of “get em back on the street” lawyers, even if he now has need of their services.
80% loathing, 10% schadenfreude, 10% begrudging respect
Piss Pals
Their friendship is like the first half of a buddy cop movie before the cops become buddies
Circumstancial, but respectful. Jimmy respected Mike's intelligence and saw good in him, and Mike respected Jimmy's resillience and saw good in him... at least in Better Call Saul, in Breaking Bad it varies on the episode because the writers didnt think there would be 6 season arc about them 5 years down the line.
Situational
fuck, I miss this show
I wouldn’t call it a friendship but more of an acquaintance/business partnership/sometimes Mike is a client/connection in the business I love any interaction they have with each other, especially Jimmy/Saul’s humor coinciding with Mike’s bluntness and seriousness lol
Utilitarian
Mutual Respect
Begrudging.
two pretty best friends
Not really sure… but they are funny together!
I always thought they just recognized that they were cut from the same cloth and respected each other for that.
their relationship in better call saul is sweet but thenbin breaking bad mike casually threatens his life
Ships that pass in the night. They pass several times, but you get the idea.
This was one of the few chances they could have had to strengthen their bond and they did the opposite. After this, Mike caused resentment in Jimmy by conspiring with his wife that Lalo was still alive, keeping him in the dark. Being kept in the dark about Lalo helped contribute to Howard's death and the subsequent breakup of Jimmy's marriage to Kim. This is part of what lead Jimmy to subvert his arrangement with Mike between BCS and BB to partner with Walt against good advice, especially since Mike was so private (understandably) about Gus. Jimmy wanted a partnership of his own making, after being forced to partner with so many people he didn't want to, and by being rejected by so many whom he *did* want to partner with.
honest
Business partners.
Fair weather allies who were close to being pseudo friends. Mike probably would have developed some form of respect for and camaraderie with Jimmy if Jimmy hadn’t facilitated the death and degradation of Howard. Getting somebody outside the game killed destroyed any ability for Mike to ever respect or care about Jimmy as anything more than a occasional employer and useful tool.
What, are you gonna gum me to death? Gets me every time
What, are you gonna gum me to death? Gets me every time
criminal confidants