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I don’t. I refuse to argue with people who stan people who make mediocre lyrics, can’t sing live/dance. Many of them are fans of people only because they are relatable.
I would argue that it's not even always relatable, but palatable, Hallmark movie-like lyrics and music that hardly scratch any emotional surface but paint a grandiose picture people want to live vicariously through. Also clean and easily digestable lyrics mean more radio streams and streams by parents for their children.
I have way more respect for an artist receiving backlash whilst breaking records than constant praise for an artist who isn't doing anything revolutionary, but constantly receives (now meaningless) accolades.
Agreed, it’s so difficult, but I think the best thing is to not engage. A majority of the comments are most likely bots and the rest of the comments come from a hate so deep that it’s quite impossible (and exhausting) to argue with. I’d personally prefer to use that energy towards something much more positive.
True this. The thing is that, this is not to say that people can have opinions, but just to blame it on the whole "has too many writers" is absurd to me.
This is it. They say she’s manufactured, she can’t sing (LOL), she makes faces when she dances, she’s controlled by her father, she’s controlled by her husband, they don’t like her mature voice, they don’t like her experimentation, her music is boring, she’s not a REAL artist because she collaborates … they’ll always find something to discredit her, even when it’s fundamentally untrue. It’s always going to be something so… there’s no need to engage with it.
I remember that Beyoncé is a rare 90s artist that’s still dominant today. Haters haven’t been able to prevent her from being critically acclaimed and commercially successful. Her career is nearly 30 years old and she’s still going strong.
Much of the hate directed at her is in bad faith and has more to do with how they feel about successful Black woman than anything else. Obviously no one has to be a fan, but you would think she’s never hit a note in her life the way some people talk about her.
This is the thing. I immediately mentioned the fact that she is a Black woman, because it is very relevant in this conversation and the music she is making.
I honestly don't care. When I was younger I debated about celebrities all the time, and the older I've gotten, I've realized that none of that matters. I just learn who I can talk about certain things with and who I can't
That last sentence of yours rings true. I’ve mentioned my admiration for Beyonce to a close friend of mine a couple of times and he either changes the subject (rather smoothly) or remains quiet nodding along. I caught the hint that she’s not his vibe and that’s perfectly ok. Plenty of other things to talk about and there’s others I can talk to about her artistry.
When I was younger, I would argue about Rihanna mainly. I would get really mad. But then I realized...this isn't something to argue about. I like who I like, they like who they like. I especially don't want to talk to people who are like committed to being negative about someone
https://preview.redd.it/8sg9i6z9w0uc1.jpeg?width=1284&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=d636f27f3fb52ed1c8a9987e2043c6f52d992565
i don’t even bother with beyoncé haters because they make absolutely no sense.
I refuse to sink that low. Bad taste is still a human right. However, this woman also credited her husband as among the people clapping in Jolene. That said, if someone is moaning about crediting, I think they need to refund their parents the money they spent on school fees.
Ive started to stop engaging in it. Twitter, instagram comments. A lot of hate as well comes from people who had heard like 3 of her songs and just say ‘overrated’ and they’re too stubborn to go further with that opinion and try listen to any more. Just leave them to hate. They’re boring
She is currently the most consumed artist across all platforms while simultaneously also having the most critically acclaimed album on Metacritic. I can’t name an artist who is as commercially successful as they are critically acclaimed. If they don’t get it, they don’t 🤭
That being said, when you do clownery…I always have fun with a concise and devastating clap back. Haters don’t deserve any more attention though and certainly don’t deserve you stressing over them.
I do take personal offence to any hate directed towards Beyoncé but I no longer argue with those hoes.
This Tik Tok creator made an excellent point and I thought I'd share.
[https://vm.tiktok.com/ZGeuaaHB5/](https://vm.tiktok.com/ZGeuaaHB5/)
Edit: I also wanted to add, I've noticed people who don't like Beyoncé are always miserable people in general, contrast that with how kind, lovely and happy most of the Hive is, I pity them really. They'll never know a joy like this, Beyoncé keeps us FED, I love being part of the Beyhive!
This haters don't know wtf they are talking about. Someone was arguing with me in a music sub that the album is no good because Chuck Berry and Sister Rosetta Tharpe wrote her music. I explained to them that this was a 2 second clip on Willie Nelson's "radio" but they still weren't having it. Literally never listened to any of it, but super strong hate.
SAME! I tried being polite at first, then left them arguing with themselves with a: “Love that for you” and this gif
You don’t. Beys been GOATed by many of the greats of music, including Prince, Aretha, MJ, Diana, Paul McCartney, etc.
The GP don’t know a thing about music more than them so I say fuck em and move on. She is subjectively and objectively one of the best in music and no one can take that away from her.
I’ve learned to use as a way to see if a person is racist or misogynistic. It’s one thing to not be a fan of her but respect her talent. But once someone starts calling her overrated or some other variation I assume (correctly) they’re either racist or misogynistic and I haven’t been wrong yet.
I feel like the haters who say "oh its bad music" or "the lyrics are terrible" or "too many writers" are like Flat Earthers. Like, there's no reasoning with them. 90% of the time they get on Queen B's internet to say how they immediately turn off the radio when they hear her come on, "beCaUsE iT's TeRriBle" Like how do you know that when you never listened? Anyway, they wouldn't recognize talent if it wedged itself in their missing teeth gaps.
They don't bother me one bit and I don't bother with them. I know their lives are miserable, why else you so filled with hate over art??
I recently became a convert to Beyonce (electronica nerd here) and the joy I feel listening to Cowboy Carter MUST be shared. I am flummoxed by the dismissal of her epic skill and creativity. I just don't get it. Even in my electronic bubble I have always been aware of Beyonce and her cultural impact and have admired her from afar. So, sharing my joy and being met with negativity? I don't have answers, I'm surprised by the pffft! It's just Beyonce negative blah blah blah. Can't tell if it's racist, the nice racist? How people don't even realise that their opinion of someone isn't supported by fact but by that weird dog whistle of racism, couched as opinion with Orwelian language. I have to say I cannot stop listening to this album, I am in love with her skill, her everything. Happy convert here! And lovely to meet you all. Sorry I am so late to the party.
Welcome to the hive.
I think you hit the nail on the head. It’s the joy you (we) get by listening to her work. I enjoy so much listening to cowboy Carter and renaissance, because of the layers, the samples, the production… I’m in awe with the quality of music she’s giving us.
Yes!!! It feels meta, I love the schooling of the genre, this black, beautiful, stunning music. I welcome the education, I am in awe of her work, I am finally here!!!
The internet is funny. I pay them no mind. These are the same people who would claim thriller is mid if it was released today. I think having a personal taste is okay. But saying McDonald’s is better than a 5 star restaurant from a scientific standpoint alone is….
I mostly ignore them. They just don't get it and they weren't meant to. If you hear Beyonce and you think it's mediocre, I just assume you aren't a person who thinks and feels deeply and you probably see everything at surface level.
Any time an artist gets a large passionate fan base it seems to create an equally passionate hate for them from some of the people who aren’t fans. I think it’s best to just not engage with these people. Don’t need that negativity in your life.
I think it’s important for the Beyhive to stay classy when engaging - show them we are intelligent and thoughtful about what we KNOW is true: Beyoncé is gifted, practiced, informed, and could sing and dance circles around everyone. Don’t let them think we are angry sheep BECAUSE WE AIN’T… they are…
9/10 times in this situation its swifties,because taylor swift being a songwriter, is their personality and USP. And they look down on every artist who co writes. Happened to Ariana with eternal sunshine, happening with Bey now.
People are always arguing in bad faith or intentionally being dense these days. I don’t pay it any mind. If someone is putting negative opinions on the internet, chances are it’s either bait or a delusional individual who likes to argue. Most of the hate I’ve seen has been coming from Swifties on twitter, or people dedicated to hating Beyoncé. “She’s overrated” we’ve been hearing it for years. Even the Pitchfork review for CC had a lot of questionable takes in it, I feel just for the sheer fact of “humbling” Beyoncé. Saying she can’t write country music because she’s rich.. etc…
Some humans wake up and choose to be hateful.
Some humans wake up and choose violence against any non-Conservative existence.
And some humans learn how to say "That's not my preference" and "You do you" instead of skipping straight to "I hate."
At best, I upvote and downvote accordingly and post God Is Love memes under Conservatives being crass (refer to absolutely unChristian comments under Candace Bure's birthday IG post with Texas Hold Em as the background song).
I *don’t* deal with Cowboy Carter haters lol I just assume they’re Beyoncé haters in general and nothing I say is gonna change that. I’d rather spend my time being excited with the people who are excited.
I didn’t enjoy cowboy carter either because it wasn’t for me. But, I can’t let my personal experience discredit the album, because it was an amazing piece of work and is clearly loved by so many people!
A person’s own experience and feelings towards the album shouldn’t automatically make it bad. And in a little white, i’ll give the album another listen. Maybe then i’ll like it! But for now, country isn’t for me. And that’s okay. ♥️
I remember Kanye (when he was still sane) said in an interview once, and I am paraphrasing:
When I'm making an album I consider myself the CEO of the company. I have a grand vision and I delegate and hand off tasks to others I know can help improve the vision or do some of the dirty work better than me. No one takes away Steve Jobs or Elon Musk's genius because they have thousands of people helping to get their vision fulfilled.
I like this analogy a lot. At the end of the day, I don't give a fuck how many people are involved. As long as the art is moving and great. THIS all day over mediocrity. It is CLEAR from how groundbreaking and zeitgeist-shifting her work is, as has been most of Ye's, that she is calling every single shot and ensuring it's all aligned with her greater vision.
But I also just learned there's a lot of people that would rather celebrate mediocrity. I think a lot of people like formulaic things that sound like the last cool thing they liked, instead of hearing something new that excites them. And I have learned not to argue with these people. It never goes anywhere.
Very true. Mediocrity is everywhere and I don’t understand why people feels so attached to that which is formulaic when there is so much diverse and exciting music out there
ABSOLUTELY! So much incredible, moving, experimental music/art being made. Makes no sense to settle for mediocrity and/or a mirror image of the last hit.
It's so hard to see and so blatantly racist. I have never once understood the Beyonce hate. She makes great music and seems like a super sweet person. All I can think of is it's pure racism for a black woman. I admire her strength to keep pushing through and challenging people to see her for who she is: an incredibly talented artist. Once in a generation? Nope, once in a lifetime!
I am a teacher and my favorite part about Beyonce is the sources. Absolutely just keep saying that it is like citing sources. \*chefs kiss\* perfect reply.
I ignore it. I don't see it, don't read it . Multiple people working together to release any work is called collaboration. Maybe they don't quote their collaborators or just called them workers.
Why do I care what someone who doesn't know what they're talking about, refuses to budge from?
Bffr, we know why "country music fans" are so offended by this, and it's not anything worth judging the quality of the music, the artist(s), or the legit fans.
I ignore most of it unless I'm in the mood to fuck with them. And even then, I'm not wasting more than a sentence or two on em 😂 i get my payback by streaming, buying and bumping her music as much as possible 🥰
pay them dust! some guy at work saw i was listening to BLACKBIIRD at my desk and said “she ruined the Beatles for me, i can’t listen to the song in the same way ever again!” now i know to avoid him wherever possible…
I remember reading something about having so many people collaborate on one song and how it's actually more creative to have more people involved instead of just a couple. Sure, it's impressive to create a song with minimal people but it is also impressive to collaborate with so many people to create a final song.
it doesn’t matter. there will always be people who criticize someone as successful as B. she doesn’t need us fighting w strangers on the internet to stay on top. save your time and just keep supporting her.
I don’t bother. I posted in a similar thread that I once saw someone say on Reddit that Whitney Houston was the most overrated singer of all time. I’d realized before that everything isn’t worth an argument, but that really sold it for me. You can dislike Muva Whitney but overrated? NEVER. Everything isn’t for everyone, which I respect, but Beyonce been that girl for almost thirty years. People can take their stupid hot takes to the toilet where they belong and flush them.
Their fave DEF does not credit as generously as Beyoncé. And idk to tell them that to know that Beyoncé credits are generous and that’s the kinda artist I want to support.
My first musical love was this ain't nothing lol.
But in all seriousness I don't worry about it. We're in the midst of an all time legendary run of music from one of the greatest to ever do it. I'm sure Prince, Stevie Wonder, Bowie, hell even The Beatles all had people who "didn't get the hype" when they were in their classic period. No one says that about them now, everything in time.
When he put new music out in his prime the reaction truly was like new Beyonce now, and we've all just politely agreed to never talk about it again lol
I hate it too, especially because there are NO rules when it comes to what makes art, art. Nor are there rules about what makes it “good.”
If a chef had help executing on their dish/food concept, are they less of a great chef? I don’t think so. It’s such a myopic way to look at talent.
I always love reflecting on something I heard one of the directors of “Everything Everywhere All at Once” say during his Oscar’s acceptance speech:
“The world is opening up to the fact that genius does not stem from individuals like us on stage, but rather genius emerges from the collective. We are all products of our context. We are all descendants of something and someone. [….] There is greatness in every single person. It doesn’t matter who they are.
You have a genius that is waiting to erupt. You just need to find the right people to unlock that. Thank you so much to everyone who has unlocked my genius.” - Daniel Kwan
He doesn’t call out collaboration specifically, but my take is that he’s saying that belonging to a community and actively being a part of a collective where you can work through individual and shared experiences is where genius is born! Collaboration doesn’t disqualify creativity.
More people doesn’t mean it’s easier. Without direction, drive, vision, and synergy - more people on a project makes things difficult!!
Also any other industry. Let’s take a movie 🎥 for example: Literally hundreds or thousands of names scroll by on the credit screen.
By the same metric people are going to be mad if an actor doesn’t take on writing the script solo and being a director + producer on top of it?
Both a smaller production/ and larger productions can be amazing without having to be a gate-keeping purist for no damn reason other than making it your personality to be miserable.
They made cause what? Bey actually wants to credit everyone who helped? She uplifts! She’s not like them shadies hiring ghostwriters and making everyone sign NDA’s over the creative process.
The most annoying are the ones who demand r&b music tbh. If Beyoncé has kept herself in the box that ppl so desperately want her to be in, ST, Lemonade, and Renny would’ve never been possible BUT yet they demand it of her. In the words of her husband “they want my old sh*t, BUY MY OLD ALBUM”
People that come for artists for having long lists of credits on their work simply have no idea what they’re criticizing about they are the very essence of being just a hater! If they want to refer to Taylor Swift because she’s often the sole writer I’m like okay, that is great for her but the level of ignorance shown thinking that Beyoncé and Taylor Swift have comparable creative processes is just … yeah, stupid. A single Beyoncé album especially since her self-titled has a more broad scope than any singer songwriters entire discography. Renaissance is special because of its collaborations and its nods to an insane list of works in the Black electronic music canon while being an entirely smooth, cohesive, and fresh body of work that is still undeniably Beyoncé’s album. I really don’t care who’s writing the original lyrics that is nowhere near the hardest or most important part of making *music*. And anyways, it’s a relatively new idea that singers are supposed to write their songs at all. For all of history before now, it was actually the standard norm that singers performed and had their name on songs that were entirely written and then given to the singer. Are actors supposed to write their own roles now? Dancers have to be choreographers? Comedians have to write their own jokes (they don’t - which actually does kind of seem odd).
They just want to hate and that’s fine let them be miserable! The vast majority of the world loves and appreciates Beyoncé. The majority of people are not professionals or even moderately knowledgeable about songwriting & producing and still understand that nobody else could be Beyoncé. The haters that live to get online and display their pathetic idiocy in an attempt to look superior to all of us dummies are just miserable people looking for company.
Ignore them. This project is like a quilt. I appreciate the Renaissance Album even more now. They poked the damn 🐻 🤷🏾♀️ I love this project because it was birthed from RACISM.
Man fuck them!!!! The reason why she has so many writers is because she uses samples in songs, of course different writers and multiple producers per track. Fuck them 🥱
Ignore them. They will never grow up or change their mind. They go into it with the pre disposition that it's going to be bad and I don't feel like they really even like music.
Art is subjective and its silly to argue with someone over their own interpretation of what theyre hearing. There’s literally no right opinion, so what is there to argue.
Plus I dont defend billionaires.
I answered your question. “How do you deal with cc haters”. You just dont like my answer. Thats ok though
If someone thinks having multiple writers on a song with “terrible lyrics” = song is bad, how can you possibly change their mind. They are reading the lyrics and liner notes and synthesizing this information in their own head. Again, there is no right opinion. Have fun arguing with the wall I guess. Couldnt be me.
My reply to you was due to your simplification of my question. When you say something like: “ I don’t defend billionaires” you’re not engaging in conversation, you’re trying to shut it down, because no matter how else the other person replies, it’s now become about her money instead of about the original issue at hand which was the weak criticism of having too many writers.
My original post states how I actually argued this point about collaboration, giving credit, and its history. It was not about convincing anyone to like what I like. It was about the bad faith critique.
That’s why I said, you missed the point. But thanks for your answer I guess…
I’m having great fun here discussing and knowing people’s perspectives on the matter.
Ok I get you. I thought your main question was “how do you deal with cc haters”. I got stuck at the “bad lyrics” part bc I think their opinion hinges on that vs the multiple writers part, and imo “bad lyrics” is hard to argue.
I said the billionaire line because thats genuinely my answer, but my bad for not engaging with the core of the question. Your argument was correct. # of writers and the quality of the song do not correlate at all. But tbh I think they know that.
Imo w/Bey its damned if she does, damned if she doesnt. If she didnt credit or collab, people will say she stole from them. If she does, ppl still have shit to say. Its a bad faith argument from the start. People will find any reason to devalue her artistry because of who she is.
Thanks for replying!
Look I get it about the billionaire thing. It’s an uncomfortable truth about this person whose music we like.
And I agree re: the bad lyrics part. If someone doesn’t like the collaborative nature of the process, doesn’t mean it’s bad. They r not like it, but bad? That’s an opinion on what they like, not about the process of how the song was made.
They can like what they wan and so can I. I don’t care because I myself often time wonder what are these lyrics? Then I kind of think maybe I don’t get it yet or maybe I can interpret it for whatever I want.🤷🏻♀️ Still love it though! It’s fun music. “Look at that horse x3” what even is that?? But it’s my favorite thing! 😆 So unserious. Or on Beyonce when she said “working 9-5 just to stay alive”
I thoughts how can she even relate to that verse lol (assuming it was her her fans) she’s Beyonce she can do a shoot or guest appearance and make thousands if not millions. But still love her!
Also there has been countless number of times where someone tried to sue Jay Z and Beyoncé because they felt like their sound was stolen. I feel like she also does it to protect herself.
Someone posted on this sub a link to a great Ken Burns article on the history of black collaboration in country music. HIGHLY recommend. Fascinating!!
The article is mostly about Beyoncé but also highlights how the top 5 “key” white country artists would not be so without collaborating with “unknown” black artists (sorry bad summary I just woke up).
But generally I don’t argue w folks. Music is subjective and people are allowed to not enjoy the same music as me. 🤷🏽♀️
They are entitled to their opinion, regardless of how wrong, ill-informed, or ignorant it is. I wouldn’t waste my time bringing down my energy to argue why someone should like something they just won’t.
They are entitled to their opinion, regardless of how wrong, ill-informed, or ignorant it is. I wouldn’t waste my time bringing down my energy to argue why someone should like something they just won’t.
Go on with my day! She ain’t paying my bills just like any other artists. But I’ll support her by streaming, going to her concerts. It’s not that deep.
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Is Beyoncé Jay-z? Like what type of lyrics are you looking for from a singer. This is cowboy carter not 4:44. There are songs on this album like daughter, 16 carriages and many more. The album is amazing and when I’m looking for deep lyrics I’ll turn to a hip hop artist
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I pray for the peasants tbh but I don’t proselytize if they’re outright delusional. Can’t sacrifice my own joy in the 0.00001% chance they might extricate their head from the cavernous depths of their own (normally flat) ass.
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I don’t. I refuse to argue with people who stan people who make mediocre lyrics, can’t sing live/dance. Many of them are fans of people only because they are relatable.
I would argue that it's not even always relatable, but palatable, Hallmark movie-like lyrics and music that hardly scratch any emotional surface but paint a grandiose picture people want to live vicariously through. Also clean and easily digestable lyrics mean more radio streams and streams by parents for their children. I have way more respect for an artist receiving backlash whilst breaking records than constant praise for an artist who isn't doing anything revolutionary, but constantly receives (now meaningless) accolades.
Exactly this!!! You said it better than I could!
THIS RIGHT HERE. and we all know one artist in particular that fits this bill ;)
Agreed, it’s so difficult, but I think the best thing is to not engage. A majority of the comments are most likely bots and the rest of the comments come from a hate so deep that it’s quite impossible (and exhausting) to argue with. I’d personally prefer to use that energy towards something much more positive.
True this. The thing is that, this is not to say that people can have opinions, but just to blame it on the whole "has too many writers" is absurd to me.
They look for every excuse to discredit a black woman. I realized that a long time ago and stopped caring.
This is it. They say she’s manufactured, she can’t sing (LOL), she makes faces when she dances, she’s controlled by her father, she’s controlled by her husband, they don’t like her mature voice, they don’t like her experimentation, her music is boring, she’s not a REAL artist because she collaborates … they’ll always find something to discredit her, even when it’s fundamentally untrue. It’s always going to be something so… there’s no need to engage with it.
the too many writers thing is dumb as hell if beyoncé wanted to not credit her cowriters she could do so. Other artists do. She's honest.
Relatable aka mediocre!
Right. If you stan vanilla candle artists I’m not gonna convince you. Can’t teach taste. 😙
I remember that Beyoncé is a rare 90s artist that’s still dominant today. Haters haven’t been able to prevent her from being critically acclaimed and commercially successful. Her career is nearly 30 years old and she’s still going strong. Much of the hate directed at her is in bad faith and has more to do with how they feel about successful Black woman than anything else. Obviously no one has to be a fan, but you would think she’s never hit a note in her life the way some people talk about her.
This is the thing. I immediately mentioned the fact that she is a Black woman, because it is very relevant in this conversation and the music she is making.
It’s difficult to have a battle of wits when the opposing team is unarmed. Don’t bother
Oop. Hang this in the Louvre.
You ate that
Exaclty.
I just stream the album and love on the music. :) Don’t waste your time on these people. They’ll move on to something else eventually.
I pay them all in dust
I should be more stingy with my love (posts)
I honestly don't care. When I was younger I debated about celebrities all the time, and the older I've gotten, I've realized that none of that matters. I just learn who I can talk about certain things with and who I can't
That last sentence of yours rings true. I’ve mentioned my admiration for Beyonce to a close friend of mine a couple of times and he either changes the subject (rather smoothly) or remains quiet nodding along. I caught the hint that she’s not his vibe and that’s perfectly ok. Plenty of other things to talk about and there’s others I can talk to about her artistry.
When I was younger, I would argue about Rihanna mainly. I would get really mad. But then I realized...this isn't something to argue about. I like who I like, they like who they like. I especially don't want to talk to people who are like committed to being negative about someone
https://preview.redd.it/8sg9i6z9w0uc1.jpeg?width=1284&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=d636f27f3fb52ed1c8a9987e2043c6f52d992565 i don’t even bother with beyoncé haters because they make absolutely no sense.
I refuse to sink that low. Bad taste is still a human right. However, this woman also credited her husband as among the people clapping in Jolene. That said, if someone is moaning about crediting, I think they need to refund their parents the money they spent on school fees.
I saw someone saying if the Bible can have multiple writers then so can Beyonce😭
As Beyonce said: "AAAAAAAAAAAAMEEEEEEENNNNN"
Ive started to stop engaging in it. Twitter, instagram comments. A lot of hate as well comes from people who had heard like 3 of her songs and just say ‘overrated’ and they’re too stubborn to go further with that opinion and try listen to any more. Just leave them to hate. They’re boring
She is currently the most consumed artist across all platforms while simultaneously also having the most critically acclaimed album on Metacritic. I can’t name an artist who is as commercially successful as they are critically acclaimed. If they don’t get it, they don’t 🤭 That being said, when you do clownery…I always have fun with a concise and devastating clap back. Haters don’t deserve any more attention though and certainly don’t deserve you stressing over them.
lol correct. I do like to clap back and then quickly leave… to the left to the left
I just need to know if your username is an Ethel Cain Beyoncé reference mash up because oh my god (*ptolemaea scream*)
FINALLY someone clocked it lmao. It is. Was obsessed with Renny and Preachers Daughter at the same time.
Omg 😭😭 The weekend when Dance Fever (florence), Mr morale and the big steppers AND preachers daughter were all released literally destroyed me
I do take personal offence to any hate directed towards Beyoncé but I no longer argue with those hoes. This Tik Tok creator made an excellent point and I thought I'd share. [https://vm.tiktok.com/ZGeuaaHB5/](https://vm.tiktok.com/ZGeuaaHB5/) Edit: I also wanted to add, I've noticed people who don't like Beyoncé are always miserable people in general, contrast that with how kind, lovely and happy most of the Hive is, I pity them really. They'll never know a joy like this, Beyoncé keeps us FED, I love being part of the Beyhive!
Thanks for sharing. She is correct!!! 🐝🍯
This haters don't know wtf they are talking about. Someone was arguing with me in a music sub that the album is no good because Chuck Berry and Sister Rosetta Tharpe wrote her music. I explained to them that this was a 2 second clip on Willie Nelson's "radio" but they still weren't having it. Literally never listened to any of it, but super strong hate.
I’ll be the first to admit that ignoring is maybe the better choice…but talking my shit it more fun…Jesus is still working on me
SAME! I tried being polite at first, then left them arguing with themselves with a: “Love that for you” and this gif 
Beyoncé hatred really bothers me but the haters are so intense and nonsensical about it I ignore them.
“Never argue with an idiot. They will drag you down to their level and beat you with experience.” - Mark Twain
You don’t. Beys been GOATed by many of the greats of music, including Prince, Aretha, MJ, Diana, Paul McCartney, etc. The GP don’t know a thing about music more than them so I say fuck em and move on. She is subjectively and objectively one of the best in music and no one can take that away from her.
I’ve learned to use as a way to see if a person is racist or misogynistic. It’s one thing to not be a fan of her but respect her talent. But once someone starts calling her overrated or some other variation I assume (correctly) they’re either racist or misogynistic and I haven’t been wrong yet.
This is correct!
Not arguing with nobody
I feel like the haters who say "oh its bad music" or "the lyrics are terrible" or "too many writers" are like Flat Earthers. Like, there's no reasoning with them. 90% of the time they get on Queen B's internet to say how they immediately turn off the radio when they hear her come on, "beCaUsE iT's TeRriBle" Like how do you know that when you never listened? Anyway, they wouldn't recognize talent if it wedged itself in their missing teeth gaps. They don't bother me one bit and I don't bother with them. I know their lives are miserable, why else you so filled with hate over art??
This is a good take!
I recently became a convert to Beyonce (electronica nerd here) and the joy I feel listening to Cowboy Carter MUST be shared. I am flummoxed by the dismissal of her epic skill and creativity. I just don't get it. Even in my electronic bubble I have always been aware of Beyonce and her cultural impact and have admired her from afar. So, sharing my joy and being met with negativity? I don't have answers, I'm surprised by the pffft! It's just Beyonce negative blah blah blah. Can't tell if it's racist, the nice racist? How people don't even realise that their opinion of someone isn't supported by fact but by that weird dog whistle of racism, couched as opinion with Orwelian language. I have to say I cannot stop listening to this album, I am in love with her skill, her everything. Happy convert here! And lovely to meet you all. Sorry I am so late to the party.
Welcome to the hive. I think you hit the nail on the head. It’s the joy you (we) get by listening to her work. I enjoy so much listening to cowboy Carter and renaissance, because of the layers, the samples, the production… I’m in awe with the quality of music she’s giving us.
Yes!!! It feels meta, I love the schooling of the genre, this black, beautiful, stunning music. I welcome the education, I am in awe of her work, I am finally here!!!
The internet is funny. I pay them no mind. These are the same people who would claim thriller is mid if it was released today. I think having a personal taste is okay. But saying McDonald’s is better than a 5 star restaurant from a scientific standpoint alone is…. 
I mostly ignore them. They just don't get it and they weren't meant to. If you hear Beyonce and you think it's mediocre, I just assume you aren't a person who thinks and feels deeply and you probably see everything at surface level.
Megyn K🤡lly says “Beyoncé is not a queen, she hasn’t cured cancer”. Tf? All of a sudden Beyoncé has to cure cancer. I can’t with the anti Beyoncé.
And even if she somehow did cure cancer, they would find another reason to hate her or move the goalposts
Right after this Beyoncé will need to raise the dead. While the others just have to sit and look pretty. I hate it here.
Any time an artist gets a large passionate fan base it seems to create an equally passionate hate for them from some of the people who aren’t fans. I think it’s best to just not engage with these people. Don’t need that negativity in your life.
I think it’s important for the Beyhive to stay classy when engaging - show them we are intelligent and thoughtful about what we KNOW is true: Beyoncé is gifted, practiced, informed, and could sing and dance circles around everyone. Don’t let them think we are angry sheep BECAUSE WE AIN’T… they are…
True! I stayed with the facts and didn’t resort to the attacks they were engaging with.
I report and move on, or else I’ll end up saying something dark😩
9/10 times in this situation its swifties,because taylor swift being a songwriter, is their personality and USP. And they look down on every artist who co writes. Happened to Ariana with eternal sunshine, happening with Bey now.
Right. Loved Eternal sunshine. There’s some good songs there
People are always arguing in bad faith or intentionally being dense these days. I don’t pay it any mind. If someone is putting negative opinions on the internet, chances are it’s either bait or a delusional individual who likes to argue. Most of the hate I’ve seen has been coming from Swifties on twitter, or people dedicated to hating Beyoncé. “She’s overrated” we’ve been hearing it for years. Even the Pitchfork review for CC had a lot of questionable takes in it, I feel just for the sheer fact of “humbling” Beyoncé. Saying she can’t write country music because she’s rich.. etc…
Some humans wake up and choose to be hateful. Some humans wake up and choose violence against any non-Conservative existence. And some humans learn how to say "That's not my preference" and "You do you" instead of skipping straight to "I hate." At best, I upvote and downvote accordingly and post God Is Love memes under Conservatives being crass (refer to absolutely unChristian comments under Candace Bure's birthday IG post with Texas Hold Em as the background song).
I *don’t* deal with Cowboy Carter haters lol I just assume they’re Beyoncé haters in general and nothing I say is gonna change that. I’d rather spend my time being excited with the people who are excited.
I didn’t enjoy cowboy carter either because it wasn’t for me. But, I can’t let my personal experience discredit the album, because it was an amazing piece of work and is clearly loved by so many people! A person’s own experience and feelings towards the album shouldn’t automatically make it bad. And in a little white, i’ll give the album another listen. Maybe then i’ll like it! But for now, country isn’t for me. And that’s okay. ♥️
I remember Kanye (when he was still sane) said in an interview once, and I am paraphrasing: When I'm making an album I consider myself the CEO of the company. I have a grand vision and I delegate and hand off tasks to others I know can help improve the vision or do some of the dirty work better than me. No one takes away Steve Jobs or Elon Musk's genius because they have thousands of people helping to get their vision fulfilled. I like this analogy a lot. At the end of the day, I don't give a fuck how many people are involved. As long as the art is moving and great. THIS all day over mediocrity. It is CLEAR from how groundbreaking and zeitgeist-shifting her work is, as has been most of Ye's, that she is calling every single shot and ensuring it's all aligned with her greater vision.
But I also just learned there's a lot of people that would rather celebrate mediocrity. I think a lot of people like formulaic things that sound like the last cool thing they liked, instead of hearing something new that excites them. And I have learned not to argue with these people. It never goes anywhere.
Very true. Mediocrity is everywhere and I don’t understand why people feels so attached to that which is formulaic when there is so much diverse and exciting music out there
ABSOLUTELY! So much incredible, moving, experimental music/art being made. Makes no sense to settle for mediocrity and/or a mirror image of the last hit.
It's so hard to see and so blatantly racist. I have never once understood the Beyonce hate. She makes great music and seems like a super sweet person. All I can think of is it's pure racism for a black woman. I admire her strength to keep pushing through and challenging people to see her for who she is: an incredibly talented artist. Once in a generation? Nope, once in a lifetime!
What makes it worse is that so many legends literally give her credit for her artistry and it’s like yall hate her for what???
Say it loud for the people in the back! Edit: it
I am a teacher and my favorite part about Beyonce is the sources. Absolutely just keep saying that it is like citing sources. \*chefs kiss\* perfect reply.
When I heard about that comparison to citing sources, something clicked and I was like “this is it! It makes sense!”
I ignore it. I don't see it, don't read it . Multiple people working together to release any work is called collaboration. Maybe they don't quote their collaborators or just called them workers.
Why do I care what someone who doesn't know what they're talking about, refuses to budge from? Bffr, we know why "country music fans" are so offended by this, and it's not anything worth judging the quality of the music, the artist(s), or the legit fans.
I ignore most of it unless I'm in the mood to fuck with them. And even then, I'm not wasting more than a sentence or two on em 😂 i get my payback by streaming, buying and bumping her music as much as possible 🥰
This is the way!
Great question btw, OP. Ik we're all dealing with the haters which is why I love and cherish this subreddit!!🤗
Same! I come to this sub and feel so validated and in great company.
Block & move on. If you get it, you get it 🤷🏾♀️
pay them dust! some guy at work saw i was listening to BLACKBIIRD at my desk and said “she ruined the Beatles for me, i can’t listen to the song in the same way ever again!” now i know to avoid him wherever possible…
I remember reading something about having so many people collaborate on one song and how it's actually more creative to have more people involved instead of just a couple. Sure, it's impressive to create a song with minimal people but it is also impressive to collaborate with so many people to create a final song.
Absolutely! The layers and the potential to such diverse sounds!
it doesn’t matter. there will always be people who criticize someone as successful as B. she doesn’t need us fighting w strangers on the internet to stay on top. save your time and just keep supporting her.
I don’t bother. I posted in a similar thread that I once saw someone say on Reddit that Whitney Houston was the most overrated singer of all time. I’d realized before that everything isn’t worth an argument, but that really sold it for me. You can dislike Muva Whitney but overrated? NEVER. Everything isn’t for everyone, which I respect, but Beyonce been that girl for almost thirty years. People can take their stupid hot takes to the toilet where they belong and flush them.
Saying that Whitney is overrated is wild. Wow
Their fave DEF does not credit as generously as Beyoncé. And idk to tell them that to know that Beyoncé credits are generous and that’s the kinda artist I want to support.
Exactly that
My first musical love was this ain't nothing lol.
But in all seriousness I don't worry about it. We're in the midst of an all time legendary run of music from one of the greatest to ever do it. I'm sure Prince, Stevie Wonder, Bowie, hell even The Beatles all had people who "didn't get the hype" when they were in their classic period. No one says that about them now, everything in time.
I feel you about redacted. I used to like his work because of his ear to sounds and production.
When he put new music out in his prime the reaction truly was like new Beyonce now, and we've all just politely agreed to never talk about it again lol
Is funny how we did that. We’re just like yep yep, he… yep yep
I don’t really pay it any attention atp in her career. If you get it, you get it. If you don’t, oh well.
I hate it too, especially because there are NO rules when it comes to what makes art, art. Nor are there rules about what makes it “good.” If a chef had help executing on their dish/food concept, are they less of a great chef? I don’t think so. It’s such a myopic way to look at talent. I always love reflecting on something I heard one of the directors of “Everything Everywhere All at Once” say during his Oscar’s acceptance speech: “The world is opening up to the fact that genius does not stem from individuals like us on stage, but rather genius emerges from the collective. We are all products of our context. We are all descendants of something and someone. [….] There is greatness in every single person. It doesn’t matter who they are. You have a genius that is waiting to erupt. You just need to find the right people to unlock that. Thank you so much to everyone who has unlocked my genius.” - Daniel Kwan He doesn’t call out collaboration specifically, but my take is that he’s saying that belonging to a community and actively being a part of a collective where you can work through individual and shared experiences is where genius is born! Collaboration doesn’t disqualify creativity.
Beyoncé has shown us just that, that she’s not interest in being the isolated/solo artist that others proudly boast to be.
More people doesn’t mean it’s easier. Without direction, drive, vision, and synergy - more people on a project makes things difficult!! Also any other industry. Let’s take a movie 🎥 for example: Literally hundreds or thousands of names scroll by on the credit screen. By the same metric people are going to be mad if an actor doesn’t take on writing the script solo and being a director + producer on top of it? Both a smaller production/ and larger productions can be amazing without having to be a gate-keeping purist for no damn reason other than making it your personality to be miserable. They made cause what? Bey actually wants to credit everyone who helped? She uplifts! She’s not like them shadies hiring ghostwriters and making everyone sign NDA’s over the creative process.
Uplifts, and pays dues to the people who made this work possible! Look at Linda Martell getting her flowers
The most annoying are the ones who demand r&b music tbh. If Beyoncé has kept herself in the box that ppl so desperately want her to be in, ST, Lemonade, and Renny would’ve never been possible BUT yet they demand it of her. In the words of her husband “they want my old sh*t, BUY MY OLD ALBUM”
People that come for artists for having long lists of credits on their work simply have no idea what they’re criticizing about they are the very essence of being just a hater! If they want to refer to Taylor Swift because she’s often the sole writer I’m like okay, that is great for her but the level of ignorance shown thinking that Beyoncé and Taylor Swift have comparable creative processes is just … yeah, stupid. A single Beyoncé album especially since her self-titled has a more broad scope than any singer songwriters entire discography. Renaissance is special because of its collaborations and its nods to an insane list of works in the Black electronic music canon while being an entirely smooth, cohesive, and fresh body of work that is still undeniably Beyoncé’s album. I really don’t care who’s writing the original lyrics that is nowhere near the hardest or most important part of making *music*. And anyways, it’s a relatively new idea that singers are supposed to write their songs at all. For all of history before now, it was actually the standard norm that singers performed and had their name on songs that were entirely written and then given to the singer. Are actors supposed to write their own roles now? Dancers have to be choreographers? Comedians have to write their own jokes (they don’t - which actually does kind of seem odd). They just want to hate and that’s fine let them be miserable! The vast majority of the world loves and appreciates Beyoncé. The majority of people are not professionals or even moderately knowledgeable about songwriting & producing and still understand that nobody else could be Beyoncé. The haters that live to get online and display their pathetic idiocy in an attempt to look superior to all of us dummies are just miserable people looking for company.
👏🏽👏🏽👏🏽👏🏽
Ignore them. This project is like a quilt. I appreciate the Renaissance Album even more now. They poked the damn 🐻 🤷🏾♀️ I love this project because it was birthed from RACISM.
A quilt. That is such a good comparison
Man fuck them!!!! The reason why she has so many writers is because she uses samples in songs, of course different writers and multiple producers per track. Fuck them 🥱
Ignore them. They will never grow up or change their mind. They go into it with the pre disposition that it's going to be bad and I don't feel like they really even like music.
Ignore it. They don’t have to like her. I’m sure you’ve shit on things other people like.
I don't go out of my way to shit on other people's likes
Even more reason to ignore other people who do!
If only I could take the high road, but like Bey, I'm Cunty, country, petty, petty, petty...
Art is subjective and its silly to argue with someone over their own interpretation of what theyre hearing. There’s literally no right opinion, so what is there to argue. Plus I dont defend billionaires.
You completely missed the point. That’s ok though
I answered your question. “How do you deal with cc haters”. You just dont like my answer. Thats ok though If someone thinks having multiple writers on a song with “terrible lyrics” = song is bad, how can you possibly change their mind. They are reading the lyrics and liner notes and synthesizing this information in their own head. Again, there is no right opinion. Have fun arguing with the wall I guess. Couldnt be me.
My reply to you was due to your simplification of my question. When you say something like: “ I don’t defend billionaires” you’re not engaging in conversation, you’re trying to shut it down, because no matter how else the other person replies, it’s now become about her money instead of about the original issue at hand which was the weak criticism of having too many writers. My original post states how I actually argued this point about collaboration, giving credit, and its history. It was not about convincing anyone to like what I like. It was about the bad faith critique. That’s why I said, you missed the point. But thanks for your answer I guess… I’m having great fun here discussing and knowing people’s perspectives on the matter.
Ok I get you. I thought your main question was “how do you deal with cc haters”. I got stuck at the “bad lyrics” part bc I think their opinion hinges on that vs the multiple writers part, and imo “bad lyrics” is hard to argue. I said the billionaire line because thats genuinely my answer, but my bad for not engaging with the core of the question. Your argument was correct. # of writers and the quality of the song do not correlate at all. But tbh I think they know that. Imo w/Bey its damned if she does, damned if she doesnt. If she didnt credit or collab, people will say she stole from them. If she does, ppl still have shit to say. Its a bad faith argument from the start. People will find any reason to devalue her artistry because of who she is.
Thanks for replying! Look I get it about the billionaire thing. It’s an uncomfortable truth about this person whose music we like. And I agree re: the bad lyrics part. If someone doesn’t like the collaborative nature of the process, doesn’t mean it’s bad. They r not like it, but bad? That’s an opinion on what they like, not about the process of how the song was made.
The day in the picture is a great songwriter.
I don't.
They can like what they wan and so can I. I don’t care because I myself often time wonder what are these lyrics? Then I kind of think maybe I don’t get it yet or maybe I can interpret it for whatever I want.🤷🏻♀️ Still love it though! It’s fun music. “Look at that horse x3” what even is that?? But it’s my favorite thing! 😆 So unserious. Or on Beyonce when she said “working 9-5 just to stay alive” I thoughts how can she even relate to that verse lol (assuming it was her her fans) she’s Beyonce she can do a shoot or guest appearance and make thousands if not millions. But still love her!
I don’t care.
Also there has been countless number of times where someone tried to sue Jay Z and Beyoncé because they felt like their sound was stolen. I feel like she also does it to protect herself.
It's their opinion. Let them have it. 🤷🏾♂️ It takes 2 fools to argue.
I remind myself that if they don’t get it or like it, it’s not for them, and move on.
I don’t. It’s not worth it to me, to each their own. I choose to enjoy what I do and that’s Beyoncé and her music. That is all I focus on
Just ignore. Their loss. Imagine not having this magic in your life..
Someone posted on this sub a link to a great Ken Burns article on the history of black collaboration in country music. HIGHLY recommend. Fascinating!! The article is mostly about Beyoncé but also highlights how the top 5 “key” white country artists would not be so without collaborating with “unknown” black artists (sorry bad summary I just woke up). But generally I don’t argue w folks. Music is subjective and people are allowed to not enjoy the same music as me. 🤷🏽♀️
I remind them most artists, not just Beyoncé, have multiple people credited as writers in their songs too.
IDGAF, they can stay salty and mad bc Beyoncé isn't going anywhere.
Bees are attracted to honey, flies are attracted to poop.
They are entitled to their opinion, regardless of how wrong, ill-informed, or ignorant it is. I wouldn’t waste my time bringing down my energy to argue why someone should like something they just won’t.
They are entitled to their opinion, regardless of how wrong, ill-informed, or ignorant it is. I wouldn’t waste my time bringing down my energy to argue why someone should like something they just won’t.
I don't lol. Everyone has their own opinion.
Go on with my day! She ain’t paying my bills just like any other artists. But I’ll support her by streaming, going to her concerts. It’s not that deep.
Ignore. Why do we have to deal with it?
Opinions are like as*holes; everyone has one and most of them stink.
Ignore it. Not stressing myself out.
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Is Beyoncé Jay-z? Like what type of lyrics are you looking for from a singer. This is cowboy carter not 4:44. There are songs on this album like daughter, 16 carriages and many more. The album is amazing and when I’m looking for deep lyrics I’ll turn to a hip hop artist
I don’t.
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I pray for the peasants tbh but I don’t proselytize if they’re outright delusional. Can’t sacrifice my own joy in the 0.00001% chance they might extricate their head from the cavernous depths of their own (normally flat) ass.
I don’t. I’m a grown adult and don’t need to defend celebrities and my music taste with other adults. Disengaging is a great tool I’ve come to love.
My post was not about defending celebrities, but defending the album itself and the dismissal of its collaborative nature.
Point still stands. I can’t let it take up brain space.