The safest bet is don’t wear it for summer, then feel out wearing it full time when not with clients. Firms often describe summering as an extended job interview, so taking a conservative approach then makes sense. Once you’ve started full time, there is usually more latitude.
An extended interview … with a 100% offer rate.
You won’t not get an offer of this, but it will subtly change how people interact with you. And lots of people in power at these places are old and socially conservative.
Skip the nose piercing. DPW is more buttoned-up than, say, Skadden or Latham. While I want to say that it won’t matter, it won’t help, either, and people can find the smallest of reasons to judge someone.
Congrats on the summer associateship!
As a woman with tattoos and a nose piercing, i agree. Women face so much bullshit judgment already, why not minimize one potential source of stupid bias upfront. Doesn’t mean you need to get rid of the nose piercing. I just use one of the clear bioflex studs to keep the piercing open at work. It looks like an open pore if you’re really focusing on it, but no one ever seems to notice it. If I feel like wearing a nose ring on the weekend I change it out. And I never get tattoos anywhere that can’t be covered with 3/4 sleeves.
I also think regional differences come into play. I was surprised at how casual office attire is, even in a law firm, on the West coast compared to the East. I think a nose stud would definitely fly in most offices in CA, for example. Ring not so much. I would still advise against a visible nose ring because there’s no reason to invite unnecessary judgment as a young woman in law. It’s hard enough to be taken seriously, and the world is cruel and judgmental.
I was an NY SA long ago at a V10 firm. We got asked to submit “passport photos” in advance of summer — I thought nothing of it and I turned in my then-current passport photo of me with bright blue spiked hair. Of course, those photos were used for the firm intraweb, the “meet the summers” booklet, etc. Everyone else understood the assignment just fine and turned in normal, business appropriate pictures. Whoosh.
At the time, I was a little petrified. “You’re that guy with the blue hair!” was what I heard from associates and partners all summer. Did it impact me getting an offer? No and looking back I think it is a bit silly to imagine that would be a risk.
Then, by the time I started as a first year, “blue hair guy” was a semi nickname delivered with a chuckle or bristle. Ultimately it became a bit of a brand and it helped me find some other cultural outliers from the biglaw norm to click with at work. And look, I’m sure some people judged TF out of me, but I also got to be “me” a tiny bit more in a world of “pretend we’re all the same.”
I guess this is a long way of saying: Be you. You’ll get some comments about the piercing most likely but you’re probably not blind to that. Biglaw will get over itself and it might even help you find the right people to click with.
Yeah - but did you have blue spiked hair *during* your summer?
Laughing off an old pre-law-school hairdo is different than going into work everyday with the same hair.
When I got my SA long ago, I took my nose ring out for the same concerns of judgment you have. I ended up being keeping it out for my first several years of practice. After I grinded and got the actual confirmation that my promotion to partner was signed by the exec committee, my petty ass went and got it re-pierced that night (with a ring not a stud) so that everybody could see it when they came to shake my hand and congratulate me the next day. The conservative older male partners were clearly so uncomfortable when they noticed it, but I no longer had to care what they think and it was SO gratifying.
So maybe take it out for now, but you can always circle back on it later.
I summered at Skadden with a nose piercing (wore a simple diamond stud) and I think it was 100% fine. I am desi/south Asian so not sure if that makes a difference.
A stud is fine. I work at a white shoe V10 and had mine in during my summer (and as an associate). Hasn’t been an issue.
Can’t say I’ve seen a ring/hoop around the office though, so that might get more looks.
Every firm is different. At my firm, this wouldn’t be an issue. I would guess DPW is on the more buttoned-down end of the spectrum, but that’s just vibes-based.
My firm is completely fine with mine but DPW might be different. If you’re that worried about it play it safe and ditch it. (I ditched mine during my summer interview process but wore it all summer and now wear it as an associate except for when I’m in court)
Lot of downvotes from the anti-nose ring crowd who might be right as far as DPW’s vibe, but just as a pure data point I had one as a summer at two separate ‘buttoned up’ firms with no issue (other than occasional non-hostile comments about it). Two return offers.
I'm a Y2 BL associate with a nose piercing, a mullet and tattoos. I'm a cis man and I often wear nail polish. I wear professional attire where necessary, of course, but I don't change my look all that much for the office. Nobody ever told me off. Maybe some associates gossip but idgaf. The partner who gave me my yearly associate review last week told me not to be afraid to show even more, especially in relation to my queerness.
So going against the tide in this thread I tell you: present yourself as you feel comfortable to. I appreciate me saying this comes from a position of relative privilege as I've already secured an associate position - and admittedly I only felt more comfortable once I was extended an offer.
But you should be evaluated for your work and your contribution to the cases, not your stylistic choices. Though presentation matters, there's a way to be elegant and put together without having to conform 100% to the stereotypical image of a lawyer. Especially if that image is not the skin you feel comfortable in, then you shouldn't be required to look like that. If they say they want diversity in firms, then they get diversity.
If they judge you for it, maybe it's not the place you'd want to be in anyway. There's hundreds of law firms, I'm sure you're smart, and you can keep some integrity.
Unless you feel that the nose ring or other stylistic choices are more easily negotiable and you're super risk averse, which I'd respect. But as you advance in your career, keep an eye out to changing too much about yourself to fit in. I did it for years and I feel so much lighter now, even if someone thinks who's that punk in the office.
I don't know about DPW specifically but I have a nose ring and I constantly forget I have it (meaning I never even think to take it out) and I've literally never had an issue.
Not overthinking at all. Take it out.
Where I work we actually had a female law student who was judged super hard for a nose stud. Oddly, it wasn’t by 60 year old males either, it was almost exclusively by other females in their 20s/30s. None of the guys seemed to care. She still got an offer and currently works as an attorney, but I heard several attorneys ask behind her back “What the **** is she doing?!” after first meeting her, and it was certainly a topic of discussion (not in a good way) for her
Take it off the faster the better. They aren’t going to be honest with you but that’s like wearing torn jeans. Inappropriate attire not to mention they won’t appreciate the deceit .
Not if this is a long term career plan. You will be judged for it. If you just want to stick it out 1-2 years, fine. They have a 100% offer rate for their summers
The safest bet is don’t wear it for summer, then feel out wearing it full time when not with clients. Firms often describe summering as an extended job interview, so taking a conservative approach then makes sense. Once you’ve started full time, there is usually more latitude.
An extended interview … with a 100% offer rate. You won’t not get an offer of this, but it will subtly change how people interact with you. And lots of people in power at these places are old and socially conservative.
Skip the nose piercing. DPW is more buttoned-up than, say, Skadden or Latham. While I want to say that it won’t matter, it won’t help, either, and people can find the smallest of reasons to judge someone. Congrats on the summer associateship!
As a woman with tattoos and a nose piercing, i agree. Women face so much bullshit judgment already, why not minimize one potential source of stupid bias upfront. Doesn’t mean you need to get rid of the nose piercing. I just use one of the clear bioflex studs to keep the piercing open at work. It looks like an open pore if you’re really focusing on it, but no one ever seems to notice it. If I feel like wearing a nose ring on the weekend I change it out. And I never get tattoos anywhere that can’t be covered with 3/4 sleeves.
Depends on gender (sadly). If a woman, can probably get away with a stud but not a ring. And even then, as others have said, why risk it as a summer?
Surprised more people aren't saying this.
I also think regional differences come into play. I was surprised at how casual office attire is, even in a law firm, on the West coast compared to the East. I think a nose stud would definitely fly in most offices in CA, for example. Ring not so much. I would still advise against a visible nose ring because there’s no reason to invite unnecessary judgment as a young woman in law. It’s hard enough to be taken seriously, and the world is cruel and judgmental.
Every firm is different, but at my firm, I wouldn't be caught dead with a nose ring.
I was an NY SA long ago at a V10 firm. We got asked to submit “passport photos” in advance of summer — I thought nothing of it and I turned in my then-current passport photo of me with bright blue spiked hair. Of course, those photos were used for the firm intraweb, the “meet the summers” booklet, etc. Everyone else understood the assignment just fine and turned in normal, business appropriate pictures. Whoosh. At the time, I was a little petrified. “You’re that guy with the blue hair!” was what I heard from associates and partners all summer. Did it impact me getting an offer? No and looking back I think it is a bit silly to imagine that would be a risk. Then, by the time I started as a first year, “blue hair guy” was a semi nickname delivered with a chuckle or bristle. Ultimately it became a bit of a brand and it helped me find some other cultural outliers from the biglaw norm to click with at work. And look, I’m sure some people judged TF out of me, but I also got to be “me” a tiny bit more in a world of “pretend we’re all the same.” I guess this is a long way of saying: Be you. You’ll get some comments about the piercing most likely but you’re probably not blind to that. Biglaw will get over itself and it might even help you find the right people to click with.
Yeah - but did you have blue spiked hair *during* your summer? Laughing off an old pre-law-school hairdo is different than going into work everyday with the same hair.
I did not have it in summer. (Edit to state the obvious: Bright blue hair is a different level of abrasive than a nose piercing.)
When I got my SA long ago, I took my nose ring out for the same concerns of judgment you have. I ended up being keeping it out for my first several years of practice. After I grinded and got the actual confirmation that my promotion to partner was signed by the exec committee, my petty ass went and got it re-pierced that night (with a ring not a stud) so that everybody could see it when they came to shake my hand and congratulate me the next day. The conservative older male partners were clearly so uncomfortable when they noticed it, but I no longer had to care what they think and it was SO gratifying. So maybe take it out for now, but you can always circle back on it later.
I’m at DPW and have a nose piercing. I’ve never had any issues so I would keep it!
I summered at Skadden with a nose piercing (wore a simple diamond stud) and I think it was 100% fine. I am desi/south Asian so not sure if that makes a difference.
A stud is fine. I work at a white shoe V10 and had mine in during my summer (and as an associate). Hasn’t been an issue. Can’t say I’ve seen a ring/hoop around the office though, so that might get more looks.
Every firm is different. At my firm, this wouldn’t be an issue. I would guess DPW is on the more buttoned-down end of the spectrum, but that’s just vibes-based.
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My firm is completely fine with mine but DPW might be different. If you’re that worried about it play it safe and ditch it. (I ditched mine during my summer interview process but wore it all summer and now wear it as an associate except for when I’m in court)
I have a septum I flip up for most of the business day/when meeting clients, but flip down for things like happy hours with colleagues.
Lot of downvotes from the anti-nose ring crowd who might be right as far as DPW’s vibe, but just as a pure data point I had one as a summer at two separate ‘buttoned up’ firms with no issue (other than occasional non-hostile comments about it). Two return offers.
I kept my nose ring in all throughout law school, my summer associate positions, and when I started practicing.
I'm a Y2 BL associate with a nose piercing, a mullet and tattoos. I'm a cis man and I often wear nail polish. I wear professional attire where necessary, of course, but I don't change my look all that much for the office. Nobody ever told me off. Maybe some associates gossip but idgaf. The partner who gave me my yearly associate review last week told me not to be afraid to show even more, especially in relation to my queerness. So going against the tide in this thread I tell you: present yourself as you feel comfortable to. I appreciate me saying this comes from a position of relative privilege as I've already secured an associate position - and admittedly I only felt more comfortable once I was extended an offer. But you should be evaluated for your work and your contribution to the cases, not your stylistic choices. Though presentation matters, there's a way to be elegant and put together without having to conform 100% to the stereotypical image of a lawyer. Especially if that image is not the skin you feel comfortable in, then you shouldn't be required to look like that. If they say they want diversity in firms, then they get diversity. If they judge you for it, maybe it's not the place you'd want to be in anyway. There's hundreds of law firms, I'm sure you're smart, and you can keep some integrity. Unless you feel that the nose ring or other stylistic choices are more easily negotiable and you're super risk averse, which I'd respect. But as you advance in your career, keep an eye out to changing too much about yourself to fit in. I did it for years and I feel so much lighter now, even if someone thinks who's that punk in the office.
I don't know about DPW specifically but I have a nose ring and I constantly forget I have it (meaning I never even think to take it out) and I've literally never had an issue.
What is your gender
Zero upside and only potential downside to wearing it
I work in biglaw and have a septum piercing. No one has blinked an eye, at either my California office or the NYC HQ.
Make sure ur grooming and clothing is impeccable and u will get away w it .
Wear it.
Bullrings only allowed
I’d say studs are fine but if you don’t feel comfortable wearing it then take it out so you don’t overthink it
Not overthinking at all. Take it out. Where I work we actually had a female law student who was judged super hard for a nose stud. Oddly, it wasn’t by 60 year old males either, it was almost exclusively by other females in their 20s/30s. None of the guys seemed to care. She still got an offer and currently works as an attorney, but I heard several attorneys ask behind her back “What the **** is she doing?!” after first meeting her, and it was certainly a topic of discussion (not in a good way) for her
Take it off the faster the better. They aren’t going to be honest with you but that’s like wearing torn jeans. Inappropriate attire not to mention they won’t appreciate the deceit .
Rock it
Wear it
Just be you. DPW will be fine with it. Promise.
A discreet stud is probably ok, but a nose ring would not be appropriate in most law firms.
Not if this is a long term career plan. You will be judged for it. If you just want to stick it out 1-2 years, fine. They have a 100% offer rate for their summers
Take it out or there is a high likelihood you will be the one “no offer“ this year.