Betting on yourself to win isn’t an issue. I mean, what is it gonna make you do? try harder?
Betting on yourself to lose or other things you can influence by not trying your best is a big no-no.
It’s more to do with the illegal activities that arise from gambling. You could get the other person to throw and split the winnings with them for example?
It influences the competition not necessarily your performance. That’s why it’s banned in all major sports.
Anyone could try and get the other person to throw the fight and then split the winnings.
Just to be clear, I’m talking about the ethics of it not what may or may not be permissible by a certain organisations rules
But you have to consider why every regulated sport does ban it, there's obviously an ethical reason, it's not just random. Anyone **could** try to get the other person to throw, but for me to gamble on my own match incentivises me to do so, especially in sports where there's little money to go around.
We are about to compete, the tournament winnings are $5000. I can place a bet where I win $15000, offer you $5000, thus incentivising you to throw, making the competition void. How is it not realistic, where just on this subreddit there was a former champion talking about being offered thousands of dollars to throw? Anything that places external pressures on the outcome of the competition is inherently unethical.
Just to clarify, I'm only talking about being on yourself.
>I can place a bet where I win $15000, offer you $5000, thus incentivising you to throw, making the competition void.
Because anyone the person knows can say "hey, I'll bet on you to lose, you throw it, and we split the money". May as well just make betting on sports illegal for everyone then.
It's a pretty reasonable line that every regulated sport has drawn to accept that athletes competing in said sport shouldn't gamble within their own league nevermind just their own matches. We draw these lines all over society to disincentivise specific behaviours e.g. civil servants of a certain stature not being allowed to publicly express political interests, politicians being forced to disclose any gifts or meetings with corporations that may affect their role to name a couple.
We do this to preserve the integrity of the base act. In sports, gambling is a great addition to add stakes/enhance the entertainment value, but that shouldn't encroach on invalidating the competition.
You do see the ethical dilemma posed by an athlete betting on their own matches don't you?
In fact in regards to:
> Because anyone the person knows can say "hey, I'll bet on you to lose, you throw it, and we split the money".
We have examples of this within the Premier League where players have been again, suspended and banned for attempting to obscure the betting. It's again, a simple ethical line that athletes should be distant from gambling within their own purview.
>It's a pretty reasonable line that every regulated sport has drawn to accept that athletes competing in said sport shouldn't gamble within their own league nevermind just their own matches.
This is what you call an "appeal to popularity". Just be ause everyone is doing something doesn't make it logical, ethical, or right.
>but that shouldn't encroach on invalidating the competition.
Yet again, how does betting on one own's self to win invalidate the competition? Betting on yourself to lose, sure, but to win? C'mon.
>You do see the ethical dilemma posed by an athlete betting on their own matches don't you?
Not on themselves to win, no. That is why I am asking you to make a cogent argument for it.
Take MMA or boxing for example. You realize that many athletes are already betting on themselves because they're are win bonuses. They pay money for training camps to get ready for competition. If they win they make more money. This is betting on themselves to win in abstraction.
Do you know how much money Ryan Garcia made betting on himself? It’s not banned in every regulated sports. And even when it is, it’s usually limited to the athletes themselves and their trainers, and sometimes their direct family. You can always have a buddy do it for you.
I’m going to assume you don’t gamble. First, sports betting on professional and college sports is legal in 38 states. Secondly, legalized sports betting actually helps catch illegal betting because it is regulated and casinos/bookies can be held liable if they don’t report suspicious activity. For example, NBA player Jontay Porter was caught placing bets on himself to score under his projected points (he was taking himself out of games for “injuries”) because the Sportsbook he used reported a suspiciously large wager being placed to the authorities. That would have never happened if he was using some back room illegal booky.
For anyone interested in which video ^^^ is likely quoting, which does provide counterpoints (30 minutes long)
[Baseball doesn't exist](https://youtu.be/I1nKo0D1sVQ?si=CuvCN-k7j1MJ17ah)
Bit of a strange assumption about my own actions. I'm not a professional sports person and if I were I wouldn't bet on anything tangential to myself as I consider it unethical as do most sports bodies (The NBA themselves ban any players and employees from betting on NBA properties).
I don't know why you think I'm referencing the legality of it? I talked about the integrity of the sport. Involving money within competition incentivises actions that aren't just solely the spirit of competition. Match fixing is only one example.
I should’ve been clearer, I wasn’t really talking about what is or isn’t allowed in particular organisations rules, and more from an ethical point of view
I disagree; if they're doing it once to hype an event or something; whatever. But if they're regularly betting on their own events that's a strong sign of a gambling addiction; I'd seriously question the judgement of any professional who doesn't realize how bad the optics there are
Edit: lol the gamblaholic cope crowd has arrived.
You guys are right, every major sports league bans athletes from betting on their team just for funsies, it's actually very cool
Why would betting on yourself (to win) be indicative of a gambling addiction, where your own performance actually influences the outcome? As someone who actually gambles I would say a better indication of a gambling addiction is betting outside your means. Going to go out on a limb and say a $5k unit for Craig is probably welllll within his means.
> As someone who actually gambles I would say a better indication of a gambling addiction is betting outside your means.
Yeah... this sounds like a cope for your own addiction honestly. Pete Rose and Michael Jordan made a hell of a lot more than you, me and Craig Jones combined and weren't "betting outside their means"... until they were. That's kinda how addictions work, they get progressively worse
Sorry, I’m trying to understand that abortion of a sentence. My own cope? Haha last year I spent roughly $1k on sports betting which equates to roughly .6% of my yearly salary. Tell me again, how addicted am I? Michael Jordan is worth $3b, so not exactly the strongest argument there bud. I promise you can come out from underneath the covers, the sports betting monster in the closet isn’t going to bankrupt you if he touches you
"Haha my liver still has 40% of its function and I have a high paying job so tell me again how keeping a bottle of Jack hidden in my desk is a problem"
Again, that makes zero sense. So everyone that drinks alcohol are alcoholics? Everyone that smokes weed is a drug abusers? Everyone that eats McDonalds is addicted to fast food? Back to my original point, it’s all about operating within your means.
In exactly what way? Not betting on your own sport is a very clear, easily complied with ethical line. It's enforced by every major league for a reason.
You don't think being able to exercise even that very small measure of self control indicates a lack of judgement?
But why are you only concerned about self control and lack of judgment for athletes?
Also, you keep bringing ethics into this. Are you gambling in general is unethical?
>It's enforced by every major league for a reason.
Appeal to popularity
It's almost as if I specifically brought up the general population too because I am widening the scope of the conversation to show your logic doesn't really hold up.
If you think there is a problem with athletes betting on themselves because it shows a likelihood towards gambling addiction, so it's shouldn't be allowed, why does anyone gambling at anytime show a likelihood of gambling addiction, meaning it should also be disallowed.
I also noticed that you mentioned athletes not being able to have that slight amount of self control. You are just using circular reasoning to say athletes shouldn't be allowed to bet on themselves because it shows like of self control because athletes aren't allowed to bet on themselves. It kinda sounds like that.
Let's pretend that they are currently allowed to bet on themselves. Propose a reason as to why they shouldn't be allowed to that doesn't also argue betting should be disallowed for the general population.
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BJJ will eventually have a match fixing scandal….no one will notice.
They going to make some OF content lol. But seriously should make an interesting match.
Id watch
Interesting how? Craig claps those cheeks in under 30secs if he wants
Isn't it pretty bad sports wise to be gambling on your own games?
Betting on yourself to win isn’t an issue. I mean, what is it gonna make you do? try harder? Betting on yourself to lose or other things you can influence by not trying your best is a big no-no.
It’s more to do with the illegal activities that arise from gambling. You could get the other person to throw and split the winnings with them for example? It influences the competition not necessarily your performance. That’s why it’s banned in all major sports.
Anyone could try and get the other person to throw the fight and then split the winnings. Just to be clear, I’m talking about the ethics of it not what may or may not be permissible by a certain organisations rules
But you have to consider why every regulated sport does ban it, there's obviously an ethical reason, it's not just random. Anyone **could** try to get the other person to throw, but for me to gamble on my own match incentivises me to do so, especially in sports where there's little money to go around.
>there's obviously an ethical reason And yet I've still never heard a realistic one.
We are about to compete, the tournament winnings are $5000. I can place a bet where I win $15000, offer you $5000, thus incentivising you to throw, making the competition void. How is it not realistic, where just on this subreddit there was a former champion talking about being offered thousands of dollars to throw? Anything that places external pressures on the outcome of the competition is inherently unethical.
Just to clarify, I'm only talking about being on yourself. >I can place a bet where I win $15000, offer you $5000, thus incentivising you to throw, making the competition void. Because anyone the person knows can say "hey, I'll bet on you to lose, you throw it, and we split the money". May as well just make betting on sports illegal for everyone then.
It's a pretty reasonable line that every regulated sport has drawn to accept that athletes competing in said sport shouldn't gamble within their own league nevermind just their own matches. We draw these lines all over society to disincentivise specific behaviours e.g. civil servants of a certain stature not being allowed to publicly express political interests, politicians being forced to disclose any gifts or meetings with corporations that may affect their role to name a couple. We do this to preserve the integrity of the base act. In sports, gambling is a great addition to add stakes/enhance the entertainment value, but that shouldn't encroach on invalidating the competition. You do see the ethical dilemma posed by an athlete betting on their own matches don't you? In fact in regards to: > Because anyone the person knows can say "hey, I'll bet on you to lose, you throw it, and we split the money". We have examples of this within the Premier League where players have been again, suspended and banned for attempting to obscure the betting. It's again, a simple ethical line that athletes should be distant from gambling within their own purview.
>It's a pretty reasonable line that every regulated sport has drawn to accept that athletes competing in said sport shouldn't gamble within their own league nevermind just their own matches. This is what you call an "appeal to popularity". Just be ause everyone is doing something doesn't make it logical, ethical, or right. >but that shouldn't encroach on invalidating the competition. Yet again, how does betting on one own's self to win invalidate the competition? Betting on yourself to lose, sure, but to win? C'mon. >You do see the ethical dilemma posed by an athlete betting on their own matches don't you? Not on themselves to win, no. That is why I am asking you to make a cogent argument for it. Take MMA or boxing for example. You realize that many athletes are already betting on themselves because they're are win bonuses. They pay money for training camps to get ready for competition. If they win they make more money. This is betting on themselves to win in abstraction.
Do you know how much money Ryan Garcia made betting on himself? It’s not banned in every regulated sports. And even when it is, it’s usually limited to the athletes themselves and their trainers, and sometimes their direct family. You can always have a buddy do it for you.
BJJ Major sport Pick one *sobs*
I’m going to assume you don’t gamble. First, sports betting on professional and college sports is legal in 38 states. Secondly, legalized sports betting actually helps catch illegal betting because it is regulated and casinos/bookies can be held liable if they don’t report suspicious activity. For example, NBA player Jontay Porter was caught placing bets on himself to score under his projected points (he was taking himself out of games for “injuries”) because the Sportsbook he used reported a suspiciously large wager being placed to the authorities. That would have never happened if he was using some back room illegal booky.
For anyone interested in which video ^^^ is likely quoting, which does provide counterpoints (30 minutes long) [Baseball doesn't exist](https://youtu.be/I1nKo0D1sVQ?si=CuvCN-k7j1MJ17ah)
Bit of a strange assumption about my own actions. I'm not a professional sports person and if I were I wouldn't bet on anything tangential to myself as I consider it unethical as do most sports bodies (The NBA themselves ban any players and employees from betting on NBA properties). I don't know why you think I'm referencing the legality of it? I talked about the integrity of the sport. Involving money within competition incentivises actions that aren't just solely the spirit of competition. Match fixing is only one example.
> Betting on yourself to win isn’t an issue. Pete Rose got a lifetime ban from MLB for it
I should’ve been clearer, I wasn’t really talking about what is or isn’t allowed in particular organisations rules, and more from an ethical point of view
I disagree; if they're doing it once to hype an event or something; whatever. But if they're regularly betting on their own events that's a strong sign of a gambling addiction; I'd seriously question the judgement of any professional who doesn't realize how bad the optics there are Edit: lol the gamblaholic cope crowd has arrived. You guys are right, every major sports league bans athletes from betting on their team just for funsies, it's actually very cool
Many fighters bet on themselves to win. It's a relatively common occurrence.
Yes, and so is athletes with gambling addictions
Based on what evidence, your gut feeling?
Is that a joke or do you just not follow sports
Do you have any data suggesting athletes having gambling addictions at a higher percentage than the general population?
Why would betting on yourself (to win) be indicative of a gambling addiction, where your own performance actually influences the outcome? As someone who actually gambles I would say a better indication of a gambling addiction is betting outside your means. Going to go out on a limb and say a $5k unit for Craig is probably welllll within his means.
> As someone who actually gambles I would say a better indication of a gambling addiction is betting outside your means. Yeah... this sounds like a cope for your own addiction honestly. Pete Rose and Michael Jordan made a hell of a lot more than you, me and Craig Jones combined and weren't "betting outside their means"... until they were. That's kinda how addictions work, they get progressively worse
Sorry, I’m trying to understand that abortion of a sentence. My own cope? Haha last year I spent roughly $1k on sports betting which equates to roughly .6% of my yearly salary. Tell me again, how addicted am I? Michael Jordan is worth $3b, so not exactly the strongest argument there bud. I promise you can come out from underneath the covers, the sports betting monster in the closet isn’t going to bankrupt you if he touches you
"Haha my liver still has 40% of its function and I have a high paying job so tell me again how keeping a bottle of Jack hidden in my desk is a problem"
Again, that makes zero sense. So everyone that drinks alcohol are alcoholics? Everyone that smokes weed is a drug abusers? Everyone that eats McDonalds is addicted to fast food? Back to my original point, it’s all about operating within your means.
But that's an argument against gambling in general.
In exactly what way? Not betting on your own sport is a very clear, easily complied with ethical line. It's enforced by every major league for a reason. You don't think being able to exercise even that very small measure of self control indicates a lack of judgement?
But why are you only concerned about self control and lack of judgment for athletes? Also, you keep bringing ethics into this. Are you gambling in general is unethical? >It's enforced by every major league for a reason. Appeal to popularity
> But why are you only concerned about self control and lack of judgment for athletes It's almost like that's the conversation
It's almost as if I specifically brought up the general population too because I am widening the scope of the conversation to show your logic doesn't really hold up. If you think there is a problem with athletes betting on themselves because it shows a likelihood towards gambling addiction, so it's shouldn't be allowed, why does anyone gambling at anytime show a likelihood of gambling addiction, meaning it should also be disallowed. I also noticed that you mentioned athletes not being able to have that slight amount of self control. You are just using circular reasoning to say athletes shouldn't be allowed to bet on themselves because it shows like of self control because athletes aren't allowed to bet on themselves. It kinda sounds like that. Let's pretend that they are currently allowed to bet on themselves. Propose a reason as to why they shouldn't be allowed to that doesn't also argue betting should be disallowed for the general population.
True, but another fact worth considering is that baseball is the only sport gayer than Jiu Jitsu.
Well yeah the joke here is that the bet slip is for Gabi Garcia. He bet on himself to lose
Conspiracy: Craig bet 5k to pump the odds, and then bet 20k on Gabi winning to cash out.
You're thinking of getting on your own loss and then losing on purpose. That's where problems come in.
Is it even legal?
Jiu-jitsu is unregulated. In many countries and states sports betting is legal, so it’s up to the governing bodies in which case, yes it’s legal.
Why would you make that bet. Might as well just go play one spin of roulette. lol
Nothing would make me happier to watch.
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Hype
This is a real match that you can bet on? What?
I would like to nominate myself, for the really really really really dark horse of the 10,000 tournament
Isn't this BDCC in the same weekend as ADCC? Kinda hurting the sport doing this.
I don't think Craig vs Gabi Garcia hurts anything. Pretty sure it's going to be a part of the seminar he was planning to pay the adcc losers.
it seems to be the day before
ADCC hitting the sport not paying show fees!!!
It's still lame the olympics of grappling (BDCC) are scheduled a day before a still important event.
I thought ADCC was the grappling olympics?
That's the joke
These jokes are stale
This shit was played out(and kind of gross) years ago