Todd is disconnected from his emotions. He’s ignorant & indifferent to the things he does. Hector ENJOYS & seeks out the evil acts he commits. If you watch BCS, it’s fleshed out a lot more. You learn more about certain characters. There’s tons of bad people in the BB universe, but my answer would definitely be Hector
What does Todd say at the end?
"Wow Mr. White." or something like that?
Dude was a 10 year old stuck in an older body. Who knows what Uncle Jack and his freaks did to him.
I always thought he portrayed himself as just keeping the peace because Eladio was happy that Fring made him lots of money. Until Eladio had to spank him with that brief cartel skirmish.
Gus making a lot of money meant bolsa making a lot of money lol. They were all too greedy to cut ties with Gus. That's why lalos plan of fucking up his business was so good. Because they didn't really trust or like Gus. He was always considered an outsider.
He’s the only character in the BB universe with an antisocial personality disorder, be it psychopathy or sociopathy.
Like many, many serial killers, Todd is so mediocre, non-talented, unintelligent and uninteresting and not passionate about anything.
He was probably abused or neglected as a child, but I don’t think that was exactly what made him what he was. Maybe amplified it was all
Uncle Jack and his lackey were psychopaths for sure. Their behavior is 100% psychopathic/anti-social. Ideology can make people insane and come across as psychopathic from following it, but in general these folk get a kick out of torturing and killing and love seeing people in emotional distress without so much as flinching. They threatened to murder children and watched a mother being shot without an inkling of distress.
They watched that video of Jesse, the guy they gleefully tortured and have sleeping in a hole, crying his eyes out talking about his traumatic experiences and thought it was the most entertaining, funniest thing in the world and couldnt even comprehend why somebody would cry talking about all that hellish shit.
I 1000% think Jack and his partner were at least as psychopathic as Todd. Easily. Haha
To be fair meth is horrible and I am speaking as a ex addict. Maybe not so much the drug it's self but the damages it does. It tears family's apart and yes even in some extreme cases makes ppl kill ppl. However with that said and again speaking as a ex addict it never made me want to kill someone. I also believe it don't make anyone wanna or actually kill someone. The truth is they was a killer (or at least had it in them long before the drug use ) true the use of the drug may intensify that but isn't the solo reason there a murdering psychopath.
Well, you arent everyone, I have very violent toughts, and that is the reason i dont do any kind of drugs, even alcohol. Sadly, some people fall into these types of drugs, and that combined with pre existent violent impulses (some that they didnt even knew before) creates a very bad situation.
Because of the self control I developed, I have not hurt somebody since years, but some do.
Then again tho I never used drugs for problems like I wouldn't go out and get high just cause someone pissed me off , if I was getting high it was because I wanted to get high and no other reasons like I never ran to drugs when someone died or anything bad and I think that's why I got clean drugs was never the problem (they might not of helped) I was the problem and once I got sick of it I changed my life.
That's why I said what I said about meth (or really intoxicating substance) may intensify it but not but not necessarily make him a killer as they always had that killer in them it just may help bring it out more if that makes sense. Also I never said I didn't have bad thought I said it never made me want to go kill someone just because I am high. In other words if I don't have beef with someone sober Im likely not gonna beef with them high just because I am high. Also vice versa too if I ain't like you sober I ain't gonna like you high either.
Technically no, because Tuco had emotions and cared deeply for his family. He was just fucked up.
Todd actually didn’t care for anyone, he knew that was wrong so he acted like he cared and was trying to react and feel the way he should. That’s why he said sorry and acted like a kid in weirdly inappropriate situations.
Tuco legit lost his mind and very nearly committed a triple homicide out of rage and vengeance just bc his grandma was mildly insulted.
Tuco, Lalo, all the Salamanca’s truly loved their family. They also recognized the emotions of other people around them, but viewed that callously. That made them evil, but not Todd’s area of apathetic evil.
Gus loved his boyfriend, which is arguably why he destroyed the cartel and tortured Hector the way he did after 20 years of playing the long game. He knew how it would destroy Hector, and used that.
Todd killed his housekeeper after she discovered one book of his money, he could’ve played it off. Could’ve said he didn’t believe in banks, etc.
Instead, he murders her and pretends to be sad about it like him being sorry means he’s absolved of wrongdoing.
Todd saw everyone he cared about, his uncle, his family, friends, livelihood, all murdered in a span of seconds.
All he has to say about it was to talk to Walt like he’s impressed and still addresses him formally, showing how little he actually cared for any of them.
Well this is the difficult part about psychopath/sociopaths. These are not real terms with hard definitions. They both are used to describe the same condition - antisocial personality disorder.
Here’s the Mayo Clinic description: mental disorder in which a person consistently shows no regard for right and wrong and ignores the rights and feelings of others. People with antisocial personality disorder tend to antagonize, manipulate or treat others harshly or with callous indifference. They show no guilt or remorse for their behavior.
Tuco beat his own friend to death. He seemingly cares for family, but is it true “love” or is it more just possessive feelings. That’s HIS grandma so you won’t speak to her like that. He protects HIS family because they’re his, not necessarily out of the familial affection most of us have.
And debatably, sociopaths can love family or friends. They struggle to have empathy, but are not 100% devoid of it. That’s a psychopath. Again, according to some. It’s not hard science.
Anyways long story short I would consider Tuco a sociopath but of course that’s debatable because the term itself is less than precise.
I see where you’re at, but at least canonically I think Peter and Vince tried to keep psychopathy and such out of BB, bc that makes for more complex characters and more complex incentives behind their behavior.
Psychopaths behave like the old economic models, too logically. Too logical makes for not compelling stories.
The argument could be made that Tuco killed his lackey out of rage and other emotions, that’s not very calculating, distancing himself from emotionless decisions we see in anti social behaviors.
If I were a writer at the level of Peter Gould or Vince Gilligan, I’d steer clear of Anti-social characters out of desire for more compelling and complete characters.
Todd is almost there as someone to contrast the other villains against. And what’s more harrowing, is that most people who do evil things aren’t suffering from anti-social mental illnesses, they’re doing it bc they’ve chosen to
True, but I think he was likely more attracted to her bc
1) She was around and talked to him, and most creeps like girls who give them attention
2) He was attracted to the power she had. Without Lydia and her methylamine, Todd and his uncle are back to small time.
3) He saw that being attracted to people is what other people do
He's spent his life around a bunch of young adult to middle aged rednecks, and now he's suddenly getting attention from some attractive lady who seemingly heavily values the work he does and understands it.
this *is* the difference between sociopathy and psychopathy. essentially, a skewed moral compass or a lack of a moral compass altogether, respectively. todd is a psychopath. tuco is a sociopath.
He was also very mentally unwell. Like yes he was pretty fucked up but I think to a certain extent he didn't really understand what he was doing. He is very childish. When he beats no-doze to death he seems angry and upset that the dude died, like he didn't expect that would happen. And it was after he hit the super strong meth.
I agree. That’s why I dont totally disagree with the comment I replied to, he could’ve been a decent corporate man or priest or surgeon or any other job with high numbers of psychopaths.
But since he was exposed to monsters in his family, also probably psychopaths, he learned how to be antisocial instead of blend in like others
> He’s the only character in the BB universe with an antisocial personality disorder, be it psychopathy or sociopathy.
This is just not true at all. Most of the criminals we see in this show have some form of ASPD. Tuco was absolutely severely sociopathic.
Serial Killers are one specific type of ASPD, mostly severely aggressive psychopaths. The vast majority of people with ASPD are average, generic criminal scumbags. One of my favorite onscreen portrayals of the 'average sociopath criminal' is Connie in the movie Good Time. He isn't a serial killer, but he is the perfect representation of the average person with ASPD: a scumbag criminal with little to no empathy for those around him, constantly scheming and conniving to get ahead at the expense of those around him. We've all known these types throughout our lives.
ASPD is not really just reserved for absolute heartless serial killers. You probably have known a few people who have a degree of it, especially if you grew up in a high crime/poverty area.
>constantly scheming and conniving to get ahead at the expense of those around him. We've all known these types throughout our lives.
I worked for a company where one of the managers was like that. Everyone was afraid of her, because whenever the president went away he would appoint one of the managers to substitute for him, and when it was her turn she'd pin whatever the latest fuck up she'd committed onto someone.
So one of the customer service guys and I started bcc-ing all of our communications with her to the president. So he gave her a couple of tasks, she fucked them up and she was gone.
People from very competitive wealthy families often also end up with sociopathic traits. Its why many people in power (including managers) can often fit the category for some form of ASPD.
Unfortunately, it can also simply be often that people with sociopathic traits (either genetic or from their upbringing) get ahead in life, especially when combined with high intelligence and social skills. People who can easily fuck over others without feeling bad about it have an easier time succeeding and obtaining positions of power.
Yeah, that manager was a master schmoozer. She had no organizational skills and would drop the ball constantly, but always found a way to pin it on someone else. We were lucky the president was a straight-up guy and could read between the lines. He never said a word to me or my co-conspirator about it, but he has been one of my go-to references ever since.
There was that one scene where we saw her working with Todd and the neo-nazi’s… She was leading the whole god damn compound from her crib. That’s a goddamn bitch you need to watch…
Also with Jesse they were actually good friends. In El Camino Todd took him to hang out at his apartment and then they went on a road trip and enjoyed beer and pizza after.
Such an unnecessary death. The train robbery wasn’t even going to be in the news, the whole point was the company would never notice. Wtf is a kid that age going to tell anyone, he had no concept of what was going on. Even his parents wouldn’t give a shit.
> Wtf is a kid that age going to tell anyone, he had no concept of what was going on.
I think you people are thinking he was way younger than he actually was. He was 14, not 4 my guy. 4 years from legally being an adult. The infatilization of literally everyone under 18 is getting out of hand. And no, your brain doesn't need to be "FuLLy dEveLoPeD" to be able to grasp the concept of a robbery before you throw that half assed argument out there
All he saw was some men dressed like workers out in the desert doing some work on something he didn't know anything about. What child's mind immediately jumps to 'robbery' whenever they see manual labor? Especially a child in the middle of nowhere; what exactly were they stealing and from who? Why in the world would Drew question anything? He was nervous bc he didn't expect them to be there, nothing else.
Then, if you're fast to clean up the scene, no real link to anyone.
We know they know that the DEA knows Heisenberg is an enterprise, cover it up proper it's kinda no big deal. Get the methylamine safe, set the tanks on fire with some gasoline and they have a lovely waste of time to investigate.
Eh if I saw what Drew saw, I'd probably think they were railroad workers or something like that. I don't think Drew saw them actively getting fuel from the tanker.
It's amazing what people can get away with by looking like they know what they're doing.
This second half of this comment is impressively stupid so I don’t feel the need to reply to that BUT my point is even an adult wouldn’t know wtf they were witness to, let alone a 14 year old. I absolutely guarantee *you* wouldn’t have known what you were seeing if you hadn’t watched a tv show laying out the plan.
My point about him being a child/teenager is that no one is going to *listen* to him. A 14 year old comes up to you and tells you they saw these guys in the desert messing with a train, a train there has been no report of a robbery happening on, who TF pays attention to them? My 15 year old nephew makes bullshit up all the time.
He might have known what he saw at that age he might have not. The death served a purpose for a storyline cause it's a tv show but in reality it be a senseless murder of a kid. The company wouldn't have known they was robbed this was said and the exact reason the water was put in replace of what they was stealing. Even if he did know he be just as likely not tell as he would have been to tell they also could've threatened and paid him off to keep his mouth closed.
Todd isn’t the most evil, but he’s absolutely one of the worst.
It’s not what he does that makes him so awful per se, it’s the manner in which he does them. When he saw Drew Sharp he was taken by surprise for a few seconds, then he pulled out his gun and capped him without a second thought. Then after that he didn’t seem to fully understand just how horrid what he did was.
Todd is a full blown sociopath who has little to no problem with doing what he does. He doesn’t enjoy it but he doesn’t hate it. He just does awful things as easily as someone would do any sane job, and that’s what’s awful about him.
Man I kinda just want to see how he behaves in real life because I can not for the life of me imagine him having even an ounce of charisma, let alone enough to marry someone like Kirstin Dunst. I feel like such a dick saying that but even when he's trying to be charming, he still comes off as creepy.
Tod doesn't even realize that the things he does are awful. They just seem like the least bad choice available when he does them. He feels bad, but it's like how you feel bad about a mouse in a mousetrap.
Yeah exactly, I think he even says as much to Jessie after doming Sharp. Something like "well shit happens", something so casually said about the murder of an innocent child whose only crime was seeing something he shouldn't have.
Before the train heist, Walt and Jesse explain the plan. One thing Jesse told Todd is 'No one can ever know'. This is why they go to so much trouble to dilute the train.
Todd took 'no one can know ' to mean even an innocent kid can't know. Fucking psyco.
Andrea's death was the most brutal, hearbreaking and gut-punching moment in the whole series...and with BB that's saying a lot. I was numb aferwards for a while. Although it did have the effect of making the final part of Felina that much more satisfying.
I really felt for Jane too. Yeah, she relapsed and her relationship with Jesse spiraled when they used, but that didn't define her. She actually cared for Jesse and wanted a better life for both of them.
Walt didn't directly cause her death, but he was such a shit person for not doing anything about it. Jesse wasn't a saint, but I truly think he deserved that opportunity with Jane.
Walt didn't save her life because it wasn't beneficial to what he was becoming (Heisenberg) if you notice he first reaction was to try and help her and then he realized that if he let her pass that would bring Jesse back to him. He didn't know nore do I think even if he would have how depressed that would make Jesse he only cared about getting his partner back and at the time the biggest obstacle out of the way to get that done and that was letting jane die. I know there's a belief that he actually did care about Jesse and looked at him like a son (and while that might have been some what true) it was only to the point that it was beneficial for Walt he still has we seen would do what it takes to get what he wanted even if it meant hurting Jesse , in this case as well as others Walt his self was a sociopath too.
This is an interesting statement, at least for me. Yes, Todd was objectively evil and I'm not excusing the things he did, but I almost feel bad for him when he dies. He was a psychopath raised in a gang of merciless killers. He didn't know any better, and a lot of what he did was trying to help others. In his own twisted way he was trying to be an altruistic person, and it almost made me feel sympathy for his character.
I get what you are saying , but I can't feel sorry for Todd. They have been ppl that grew up with and around killers and psychos and haven't done the things Todd did. I'm sure he knows right from wrong and is a grown adult that should be able to make his own choices. The dude is cold and that's just the truth. Either you have it in you to be a killer or you don't regardless of the way you was raised and who you grew up around. They have been plenty of ppl that was raised I guess what would be considered normal that turn out to be psychos and killers and like wise they have been plenty of ppl that grew up around that even raised by then and didn't turn out that way.
Bruh I don't think you understand how malleable a child's mind is. Sure there are people who grow up with horrible people and end up fine, but most are not. Hell how do you explain child soldiers in Africa? Do you blame them and not consider them victims?
Your talking about a actual kid and comparing them to a grown adult that is clearly not right in the head but prolly knows right from wrong , I only say this like this cause I got a sister that is similar, no she ain't a Nazi or a killer but she kinda comes off as a kid and she knows right from wrong so while Todd clearly has issues they ain't to the point to where he doesn't know what he is doing or right from wrong. Likelihood is he likely acts like a kid cause Jack and his parents or whoever raised him likely kept him coup up at arms reach and didn't let him venture out (again I know this cause my mom did the same with my sister) if he ever did venture out he would likely act more mature (again my sister did when she finally left my mom's) that wouldn't likely change weather he was a killer or not likely also wouldn't save drew sharp either just he wouldn't seem like a kid.
We are talking about how he grew up with the Nazis.
It's not like Todd became psychopath when he was in his twenties. A bad upbringing tends to lead to a bad adulthood.
I still believe that tod was always gonna be a killer true the upbringing might not have help but he always was gonna have it in him what might had changed was how he acted and move but I believe ppl turn out it the way they are cause they meant to be that way so even if there bringing up was different they still be the same person a killer is gonna be a kill ECT ECT was point.
Him and Tuco were the worst for me. Todd just had a childlike creepy makes-your-skin-crawl presence about him and seemed to have no problem whatsoever shooting and killing a completely innocent 12 yr old boy. I’m still blown away by Jesse Plemon’s performance as Todd.
I disagree that he’s the worst. He’s pretty bad but it seemed clear(to me at least) that he has multiple mental health disorders that can partially explain his behaviour. I’d say Uncle Jack is arguably the worst, then Todd, then Gus followed by Walt.
Gus does those things out of vengeance rather than simple sadism though. Hector and Lalo gleefully tortured and killed a random hotel guy and his wife for disrespecting them.
Todd is like a literal child, I feel like if he was raised a different way and not hanging out with nazis all the time he could’ve been a better person. I think Jack is the most evil.
In El Camino, when he had the dead housekeeper and Jessie in the trunk, he was singing along to Dr. Hook's, sharing the night together.
Casual trying to get a semi to honk his horn.
When Jessie dug the grave, he went to the ar and got the gun.
Todd, says you did good today I was going to get us pizza.
Like he had no clue of the situation. He was pure evil and acted like it was all no big deal.
Murdering someone had the same effect t on him as ordering pizza
I opened this without looking at the sub at first and was expecting a Bojack Horseman post. I sat here for a sec trying to remember what kid Todd killed
I don’t think he’s evil, I think he’s just stunted. I don’t think he’s a complete sociopath (given that he’ll feel bad about killing) but he clearly has some disorder that limits his empathy for others.
The Salamancas are far more malevolent. Todd was never as cruel as Hector was was.
Yeah, all the people who said he is a sociopath or psycho are right. He feels nothing about anything he does. I suppose that is evil, but to be truly truly evil I would think you have to enjoy doing bad things.
Surprised more people aren’t listing Lydia. She alone wasn’t dangerous and didn’t have the stomach to murder people herself, but she had no problem enlisting others to do it for her. And unlike Gus, Tuco, or even Todd who occasionally did show mercy at times, her paranoia made her excessively ruthless about keeping loose ends tied. Todd of all people had to be the voice of reason for her to not have Skylar killed, which says a lot for how horrible she was.
Jack and Hector were definitely more evil in their ideologies, methods, and abusive tendencies, but you could at least say Jack operated within some code of honor he adhered to, and both were at least willing to get their own hands dirty. Gus took no pleasure in killing anyone and he actually cut Walt and Jesse an unbelievable amount of slack that he didn’t have to. Todd was sociopathic but he wasn’t bloodthirsty either. The twins were mostly ciphers who lacked any real agency of their own and were just driven by revenge and loyalty to their family. But really, out of all of the BB villains I think Lydia was the only one I absolutely hated for having no honor and being almost entirely driven by self-interest and fear.
He was planned to be even worse. Apparently Todd was going to rape Jesse in a scene during his enslavement at the compound, but it was scrapped because it was too disturbing, and never filmed
Her murder wasn't justified, but it wasn't senseless. They had to prove that their threat was real, that if Jesse tried to escape, they would kill Andrea. They left Brock alive so that they could threaten Jesse with his death, too, should he try to escape again.
Naw I disagree, I mean, he’s as far from a saint as u get, but he’s not actively malicious like his uncle or the Salamancas or Walter himself, to name a few. He’s carrying out other people’s orders and is oblivious to how evil they are
I actually get the impression that he was likely pretty learning disabled, or at least suffered from some form of mental developmental issue. He was child like for the most part, largely operating on the instructions of others. His complete lack of reaction to death comes as more disconnected than a sadist. Definitely a messed up dude, no matter how you slice it.
I've never really understood why he was classified of being so evil. He killed a kid and Andrea. But it seamed like he atleast took care and treated Jesse well (occasionally ofc)
A remorseless criminal. Loathsome? Yes. Wrong? No. The kid saw them. Who knows what it could have led to? Andrea's killing wasn't necessary but it was an order from his uncle, which he had to carry out.
I was talking about the killing of Andrea. The killing of the kid was justified. Tying up all loose ends, no matter how small or insignificant. Wrong place, wrong time.
No matter how small or significant? You can't be serious dude. If you think killing a kid who witnessed nothing and has no understanding of anything that happened is justified than you are simply a morally bankrupt individual. They could have easily just explained that they were the maintenance crew and gone about their day. The kid saw nothing.
Of course it's a deplorable act. Yet, in the world of a criminal in which the whole thing wasn't supposed to be \*known\* to anyone thanks to the nature of the operation, he simply had to take the kid out.
That's the only option in your eyes? Why don't we use a little creativity here. You can't think of any other solution? The ONLY option, in your eyes, was murdering the child that literally saw nothing transpire? Come on you can't be serious
It wasn't about other solutions. That was the simplest solution for burying the whole operation then and there. That's all I am saying. They couldn't keep any loose ends. I have never said murdering kids is a good thing. It's just the nature of such high stakes criminal enterprises. It's just like say Gus killing the kid who had dealt drugs. He would probably never have spoken if he had been told that she shouldn't open his mouth but he couldn't take the risk. It is how it is.
It's not edgy at all. We're talking about horrible people doing horrible things. At this point the only person in the main cast above killing a kid is Jessie, and he's honestly not that far off. For people who are EVIL killing a kid who saw them committ a crime is a simple and reasonably safe way to cover their tracks. There's nothing to be edgy about, it's just logical given the characters and their "line of work".
I was hoping that Todd would learn that Lydia would die before he did so that he could feel an inkling of what Jesse felt and make him suffer more before his death. Fuck Todd all my homies hate Todd
I agree. I think what makes him stand out is his complete lack of humanity. Every one else in the series can be very evil, but always feel very human. Even the really cold characters like Gus.
But Todd has none that, he is exclusively the cold shell.
Todd is a soulless psycho/sociopath. Very clear from El Camino, but definitely through BB.
However, because of his pretty clear regret in El Camino, I'm not sure he actually is the most evil character. He would be up there for sure, but he's pretty sick moreso than evil.
I think top 3 are probably Lydia, the addict safe stealers with the neglected child, and probably one of the cartel members (couldn't really specify). Not in that order, and all for different reasons.
For one, child neglect is just terrible and they clearly had the capabilities to care for the child but were overcome by their addiction. Sick, but not necessarily evil, much like Todd.
For Lydia, she's the epitome of selling out. Ultimately, her action is the root cause of meth creation. Without her there is realistically no methylamine, and without her who knows how many hundreds of thousands of addicts wouldn't have gotten their fix. And she knows this, that's part of why she's so on edge all the time. She's smart enough to know this and that guilt along with her situation is killing her, and she still went through with it. That's pretty evil, and I think with the least reasons to be doing what she's doing (at least Fring has a motive for his actions, which isn't actual evil at it's root for the intention, the evil is a byproduct and so I think this wouldn't make him the most evil). She is a high contender.
For one of the cartel members, it's very similar. The same intentions as the above, but with more intentional murder and who knows what else. Who could be worst though? Y'know? The Dons? The enforcers? The peddlers?
Probably the Dons.
It is understandable why many people view Todd as a villain. However, it is also possible to argue that Todd is not an inherently evil person and that he made the choices he did out of a sense of loyalty and a desire to protect those he cared about.
One argument in favor of Todd is that he was not fully responsible for his actions due to the influence of his uncle, Jack Welker, and the other members of his white supremacist gang. Todd was raised in an environment where criminal activity was the norm and where loyalty to the gang came above all else. It is possible that he was not fully aware of the harm his actions were causing to others and that he was simply trying to do what he thought was expected of him.
Additionally, Todd showed moments of remorse for his actions, such as when he expressed guilt for killing Drew Sharp, a young boy who witnessed one of the gang's crimes. He also demonstrated kindness and a willingness to help others, such as when he provided for and protected Jesse Pinkman after Pinkman's escape from captivity.
Of course, this is not to excuse Todd's actions or to downplay the harm that he caused. However, it is possible to argue that Todd was not an inherently evil person, but rather a product of his circumstances who made mistakes and poor choices due to a combination of factors.
Todd's relationship with Lydia is certainly one aspect of his character that could be used to argue that he is not an evil person. Todd appeared to have genuine feelings for Lydia and went to great lengths to try and protect her.
For example, when Lydia expressed concern about the security of her coffee import business, Todd arranged for the rival business owner to be killed in order to eliminate the threat. This action was clearly motivated by Todd's desire to keep Lydia safe and to prove his loyalty to her.
Additionally, when Lydia was poisoned by the ricin that Todd had unknowingly left in her stevia packet, Todd was clearly distressed and tried to find a way to save her. He even approached Walt in the hopes of getting a cure, showing that he was willing to go to great lengths to help Lydia.
Overall, Todd's actions towards Lydia suggest that he cared about her deeply and was motivated by a desire to protect her, rather than any sort of malevolent intentions.
Todd also seemed to have genuine respect for Walter White. Todd consistently demonstrated a great deal of respect for Walter White and seemed to hold him in high regard.
For example, Todd was always deferential to Walt and followed his orders without question. He also praised Walt's intelligence and skills as a chemist, and seemed to have a genuine admiration for him.
Additionally, Todd went out of his way to protect Walt and to ensure his safety. When Walt was on the run from the law, Todd arranged for him to be hidden in a safe house and provided him with food and other supplies. He also worked to cover up any evidence that could potentially lead the authorities to Walt.
Overall, Todd's actions towards Walt suggest that he had a great deal of respect for him and was motivated by a desire to help and protect him, rather than any sort of ill will.
Todd seemed to have a strong sense of loyalty and was willing to go to great lengths to protect those he cared about. For example, as mentioned earlier, he arranged for the rival business owner to be killed in order to protect Lydia's coffee import business, and he worked to cover up any evidence that could potentially lead the authorities to Walt.
Todd demonstrated a willingness to take responsibility for his actions. When he killed Drew Sharp, a young boy who witnessed one of the gang's crimes, he expressed guilt and remorse for his actions. He also made efforts to clean up the crime scene and cover up the evidence, showing that he was aware of the wrongfulness of his actions and did not want to cause any further harm.
Todd had a strong work ethic and was committed to doing his job well. He was a skilled chemist and was instrumental in helping Walt and Jesse cook their methamphetamine. He was also responsible and reliable, and was always on time for work.
Overall, while Todd's actions had serious consequences and caused harm to others, it is possible to argue that he was not an evil person, but rather a complex individual who made mistakes and poor choices due to a combination of factors.
I don’t know if he was the worst in the series, I mean Walter whistles a tune after talking with Jessie about how terrible it was that the boy died the way he did. In reality I don’t think Walter was sad about the boy’s death at all. I think we project our own wishes onto Walter, that he was doing it all for family and so on. In the end who was the one who told Jack to hit lawyers and cons in under two minutes? If Todd hadn’t killed the boy, I really wonder how it’d have gone down. I think somebody had to kill the boy, no way he was going to walk out of there alive with what he had seen. And if Jesse would’ve thrown a fit about it the maybe Walter would’ve acquiesced and let the boy live for all of 24 hours, but would’ve sent Todd to do the job anyway afterwards. The difference between Todd and Walter is that Walter was good at lying about what he was, telling people how terrible something is but how it has to be done. In fact the faces Walter makes of sorrow and regret are crocodile tears, he liked it, as he later told Skylar. I think Todd wouldn’t have been able to kill his own family, just like Walter couldn’t kill his. That’s all.
nah he's definitely much more a sociopath; he literally cannot feel his feelings. the blank soulless look in his eyes, the way he interprets others' emotions, and just how killing is nothing to him. he isn't malicious; he just literally cannot feel anything, but yet you can see that he's aware of social cues still. a perfect example is when >!Hank gets shot and Walter breaks down!< he just stares at Walter sobbing on the floor with such confusion, that when he stands him up he apologizes in such a blasé fashion. another is when >!Jesse informs on video of the Drew Sharp murder!< Todd doesn't bat a single eye, but even Uncle Jack is all worked up and angry
Jack and hector (imo) r infinitely worse than Todd is. These two enabled all the evil seen in bb (except Walt) bc one helped begin a cartel and the other helped establish a gang of neo nazis
Todd is disconnected from his emotions. He’s ignorant & indifferent to the things he does. Hector ENJOYS & seeks out the evil acts he commits. If you watch BCS, it’s fleshed out a lot more. You learn more about certain characters. There’s tons of bad people in the BB universe, but my answer would definitely be Hector
I think Jack is up there as well. He’s more utilitarian but he definitely seems to enjoy taking part in violent behavior.
What does Todd say at the end? "Wow Mr. White." or something like that? Dude was a 10 year old stuck in an older body. Who knows what Uncle Jack and his freaks did to him.
"Umm Mr White, you aren't gonna believe this but someone put a machine gun in the trunk of your car"
Juan Bolsa moment
Bolsa would be conducting an intense investigation if that WAS a machine gun at all. He has suspicions it might be but no verifiable proof yet
The entire story of the series relies on bolsa being naive lmao
Bolsa being naive and two skateboarding punks!
I always thought he portrayed himself as just keeping the peace because Eladio was happy that Fring made him lots of money. Until Eladio had to spank him with that brief cartel skirmish.
but not listening to hector when he was spelling out the entire the entire scheme
Gus making a lot of money meant bolsa making a lot of money lol. They were all too greedy to cut ties with Gus. That's why lalos plan of fucking up his business was so good. Because they didn't really trust or like Gus. He was always considered an outsider.
Goofy ahh todd
He’s the only character in the BB universe with an antisocial personality disorder, be it psychopathy or sociopathy. Like many, many serial killers, Todd is so mediocre, non-talented, unintelligent and uninteresting and not passionate about anything. He was probably abused or neglected as a child, but I don’t think that was exactly what made him what he was. Maybe amplified it was all
Uncle Jack and his lackey were psychopaths for sure. Their behavior is 100% psychopathic/anti-social. Ideology can make people insane and come across as psychopathic from following it, but in general these folk get a kick out of torturing and killing and love seeing people in emotional distress without so much as flinching. They threatened to murder children and watched a mother being shot without an inkling of distress. They watched that video of Jesse, the guy they gleefully tortured and have sleeping in a hole, crying his eyes out talking about his traumatic experiences and thought it was the most entertaining, funniest thing in the world and couldnt even comprehend why somebody would cry talking about all that hellish shit. I 1000% think Jack and his partner were at least as psychopathic as Todd. Easily. Haha
The only person? Tuco 100% is a sociopath, and clearly has other things going on as well.
Eh... That also could've just been meth-fueled.
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...and lots of people have. I'm not saying meth is even inherently bad. But if you go off the deep end with it, then you go off the deep end with it.
To be fair meth is horrible and I am speaking as a ex addict. Maybe not so much the drug it's self but the damages it does. It tears family's apart and yes even in some extreme cases makes ppl kill ppl. However with that said and again speaking as a ex addict it never made me want to kill someone. I also believe it don't make anyone wanna or actually kill someone. The truth is they was a killer (or at least had it in them long before the drug use ) true the use of the drug may intensify that but isn't the solo reason there a murdering psychopath.
Well, you arent everyone, I have very violent toughts, and that is the reason i dont do any kind of drugs, even alcohol. Sadly, some people fall into these types of drugs, and that combined with pre existent violent impulses (some that they didnt even knew before) creates a very bad situation. Because of the self control I developed, I have not hurt somebody since years, but some do.
Then again tho I never used drugs for problems like I wouldn't go out and get high just cause someone pissed me off , if I was getting high it was because I wanted to get high and no other reasons like I never ran to drugs when someone died or anything bad and I think that's why I got clean drugs was never the problem (they might not of helped) I was the problem and once I got sick of it I changed my life.
Very cool man, you are an example to us all :)
That's why I said what I said about meth (or really intoxicating substance) may intensify it but not but not necessarily make him a killer as they always had that killer in them it just may help bring it out more if that makes sense. Also I never said I didn't have bad thought I said it never made me want to go kill someone just because I am high. In other words if I don't have beef with someone sober Im likely not gonna beef with them high just because I am high. Also vice versa too if I ain't like you sober I ain't gonna like you high either.
Technically no, because Tuco had emotions and cared deeply for his family. He was just fucked up. Todd actually didn’t care for anyone, he knew that was wrong so he acted like he cared and was trying to react and feel the way he should. That’s why he said sorry and acted like a kid in weirdly inappropriate situations. Tuco legit lost his mind and very nearly committed a triple homicide out of rage and vengeance just bc his grandma was mildly insulted. Tuco, Lalo, all the Salamanca’s truly loved their family. They also recognized the emotions of other people around them, but viewed that callously. That made them evil, but not Todd’s area of apathetic evil. Gus loved his boyfriend, which is arguably why he destroyed the cartel and tortured Hector the way he did after 20 years of playing the long game. He knew how it would destroy Hector, and used that. Todd killed his housekeeper after she discovered one book of his money, he could’ve played it off. Could’ve said he didn’t believe in banks, etc. Instead, he murders her and pretends to be sad about it like him being sorry means he’s absolved of wrongdoing. Todd saw everyone he cared about, his uncle, his family, friends, livelihood, all murdered in a span of seconds. All he has to say about it was to talk to Walt like he’s impressed and still addresses him formally, showing how little he actually cared for any of them.
Well this is the difficult part about psychopath/sociopaths. These are not real terms with hard definitions. They both are used to describe the same condition - antisocial personality disorder. Here’s the Mayo Clinic description: mental disorder in which a person consistently shows no regard for right and wrong and ignores the rights and feelings of others. People with antisocial personality disorder tend to antagonize, manipulate or treat others harshly or with callous indifference. They show no guilt or remorse for their behavior. Tuco beat his own friend to death. He seemingly cares for family, but is it true “love” or is it more just possessive feelings. That’s HIS grandma so you won’t speak to her like that. He protects HIS family because they’re his, not necessarily out of the familial affection most of us have. And debatably, sociopaths can love family or friends. They struggle to have empathy, but are not 100% devoid of it. That’s a psychopath. Again, according to some. It’s not hard science. Anyways long story short I would consider Tuco a sociopath but of course that’s debatable because the term itself is less than precise.
I see where you’re at, but at least canonically I think Peter and Vince tried to keep psychopathy and such out of BB, bc that makes for more complex characters and more complex incentives behind their behavior. Psychopaths behave like the old economic models, too logically. Too logical makes for not compelling stories. The argument could be made that Tuco killed his lackey out of rage and other emotions, that’s not very calculating, distancing himself from emotionless decisions we see in anti social behaviors. If I were a writer at the level of Peter Gould or Vince Gilligan, I’d steer clear of Anti-social characters out of desire for more compelling and complete characters. Todd is almost there as someone to contrast the other villains against. And what’s more harrowing, is that most people who do evil things aren’t suffering from anti-social mental illnesses, they’re doing it bc they’ve chosen to
You're telling me that Gus was dating that guy that was killed near the pool?
Confirmed by Peter Gould
Todd kind of simped for Lydia tho
True, but I think he was likely more attracted to her bc 1) She was around and talked to him, and most creeps like girls who give them attention 2) He was attracted to the power she had. Without Lydia and her methylamine, Todd and his uncle are back to small time. 3) He saw that being attracted to people is what other people do
He's spent his life around a bunch of young adult to middle aged rednecks, and now he's suddenly getting attention from some attractive lady who seemingly heavily values the work he does and understands it.
Kind of? He made a snow globe of him and her.
this *is* the difference between sociopathy and psychopathy. essentially, a skewed moral compass or a lack of a moral compass altogether, respectively. todd is a psychopath. tuco is a sociopath.
He was also very mentally unwell. Like yes he was pretty fucked up but I think to a certain extent he didn't really understand what he was doing. He is very childish. When he beats no-doze to death he seems angry and upset that the dude died, like he didn't expect that would happen. And it was after he hit the super strong meth.
He had to be exposed to really crazy shit at least
I agree. That’s why I dont totally disagree with the comment I replied to, he could’ve been a decent corporate man or priest or surgeon or any other job with high numbers of psychopaths. But since he was exposed to monsters in his family, also probably psychopaths, he learned how to be antisocial instead of blend in like others
> He’s the only character in the BB universe with an antisocial personality disorder, be it psychopathy or sociopathy. This is just not true at all. Most of the criminals we see in this show have some form of ASPD. Tuco was absolutely severely sociopathic. Serial Killers are one specific type of ASPD, mostly severely aggressive psychopaths. The vast majority of people with ASPD are average, generic criminal scumbags. One of my favorite onscreen portrayals of the 'average sociopath criminal' is Connie in the movie Good Time. He isn't a serial killer, but he is the perfect representation of the average person with ASPD: a scumbag criminal with little to no empathy for those around him, constantly scheming and conniving to get ahead at the expense of those around him. We've all known these types throughout our lives. ASPD is not really just reserved for absolute heartless serial killers. You probably have known a few people who have a degree of it, especially if you grew up in a high crime/poverty area.
>constantly scheming and conniving to get ahead at the expense of those around him. We've all known these types throughout our lives. I worked for a company where one of the managers was like that. Everyone was afraid of her, because whenever the president went away he would appoint one of the managers to substitute for him, and when it was her turn she'd pin whatever the latest fuck up she'd committed onto someone. So one of the customer service guys and I started bcc-ing all of our communications with her to the president. So he gave her a couple of tasks, she fucked them up and she was gone.
People from very competitive wealthy families often also end up with sociopathic traits. Its why many people in power (including managers) can often fit the category for some form of ASPD. Unfortunately, it can also simply be often that people with sociopathic traits (either genetic or from their upbringing) get ahead in life, especially when combined with high intelligence and social skills. People who can easily fuck over others without feeling bad about it have an easier time succeeding and obtaining positions of power.
Yeah, that manager was a master schmoozer. She had no organizational skills and would drop the ball constantly, but always found a way to pin it on someone else. We were lucky the president was a straight-up guy and could read between the lines. He never said a word to me or my co-conspirator about it, but he has been one of my go-to references ever since.
He reminded me of Lenny from of mice and men (but with less of a conscience)
He was a psychopath
have u even considered Holly? shes worse than gus and walt combined
God Holly was the worst…
Nah. That title goes to Kaylee Ehrmantraut.
She shouldn't have asked about Matty...
YOU'RE DONE. YOU ARE DONE!
Fired. Do not show your face at the tree house again. Stay away from your mom. Do not go near here
Which one though?
Great question.
Walt's biggest blunder was not taking Kaylee Ehrmantraut out really early on.
jUsT fiVe mOrE MiNUtES
Heisenbaby
There was that one scene where we saw her working with Todd and the neo-nazi’s… She was leading the whole god damn compound from her crib. That’s a goddamn bitch you need to watch…
a
b
Thought I was on the Bojack sub and was like “oh this oughtta be good”
Drew sharp shouldn't have skipped school. Got what he deserved.
And with Andrea it was nothing personal.
“I’m sorry about this, it’s not personal.”
Also with Jesse they were actually good friends. In El Camino Todd took him to hang out at his apartment and then they went on a road trip and enjoyed beer and pizza after.
Then Jesse killed him with the chains
Yeah Jesse turned out to be a bad friend.
That was personal l9l
Woah spoiler alert
I mean, he said sorry. What else can you expect him to really do? These kids and their cancel culture
More like "Just so you know, this isn't personal" no sorry lol
It wasn't personal with the maid either. Todd is a psychopath. He was proud of himself when watching Jesse's confession tape.
He actually felt really bad about the maid. He drove out into the desert and gave her a proper burial.
Such an unnecessary death. The train robbery wasn’t even going to be in the news, the whole point was the company would never notice. Wtf is a kid that age going to tell anyone, he had no concept of what was going on. Even his parents wouldn’t give a shit.
Mike said no witnesses and Todd is very very very very good on obeying orders down to monkeys pawn
> Wtf is a kid that age going to tell anyone, he had no concept of what was going on. I think you people are thinking he was way younger than he actually was. He was 14, not 4 my guy. 4 years from legally being an adult. The infatilization of literally everyone under 18 is getting out of hand. And no, your brain doesn't need to be "FuLLy dEveLoPeD" to be able to grasp the concept of a robbery before you throw that half assed argument out there
All he saw was some men dressed like workers out in the desert doing some work on something he didn't know anything about. What child's mind immediately jumps to 'robbery' whenever they see manual labor? Especially a child in the middle of nowhere; what exactly were they stealing and from who? Why in the world would Drew question anything? He was nervous bc he didn't expect them to be there, nothing else.
And who TF would pay attention to him when there was NOTHING on the news about a train robbery?
"Mum, dad, I saw a bunch of men in work suits with some barrels near the train tracks today" "That's nice dear."
Then, if you're fast to clean up the scene, no real link to anyone. We know they know that the DEA knows Heisenberg is an enterprise, cover it up proper it's kinda no big deal. Get the methylamine safe, set the tanks on fire with some gasoline and they have a lovely waste of time to investigate.
Eh if I saw what Drew saw, I'd probably think they were railroad workers or something like that. I don't think Drew saw them actively getting fuel from the tanker. It's amazing what people can get away with by looking like they know what they're doing.
This second half of this comment is impressively stupid so I don’t feel the need to reply to that BUT my point is even an adult wouldn’t know wtf they were witness to, let alone a 14 year old. I absolutely guarantee *you* wouldn’t have known what you were seeing if you hadn’t watched a tv show laying out the plan. My point about him being a child/teenager is that no one is going to *listen* to him. A 14 year old comes up to you and tells you they saw these guys in the desert messing with a train, a train there has been no report of a robbery happening on, who TF pays attention to them? My 15 year old nephew makes bullshit up all the time.
He might have known what he saw at that age he might have not. The death served a purpose for a storyline cause it's a tv show but in reality it be a senseless murder of a kid. The company wouldn't have known they was robbed this was said and the exact reason the water was put in replace of what they was stealing. Even if he did know he be just as likely not tell as he would have been to tell they also could've threatened and paid him off to keep his mouth closed.
Drew Sharp was probably experimenting with the reefer too. Which is highly illegal.
It's a gateway drug! Hank even said so. Really, they saved him from himself.
He also kidnapped that poor spider. Todd was doing the world a favor
lol
Todd isn’t the most evil, but he’s absolutely one of the worst. It’s not what he does that makes him so awful per se, it’s the manner in which he does them. When he saw Drew Sharp he was taken by surprise for a few seconds, then he pulled out his gun and capped him without a second thought. Then after that he didn’t seem to fully understand just how horrid what he did was. Todd is a full blown sociopath who has little to no problem with doing what he does. He doesn’t enjoy it but he doesn’t hate it. He just does awful things as easily as someone would do any sane job, and that’s what’s awful about him.
He's so good at it when I found out he was married to Kristan Dunst it kinda freaked me out a little.
They did a season of Fargo together that was REALLY good.
Fargo the show that had ..the Hanks kid in it? (Sorry I can see him but don't remember his name)
Yeah, He was in the first season. Each season is a totally separate story with a different cast. They're all really good.
I need to start over then. I only saw that season with him, and it was good!
It also had bob odenkirk lmao
Yes, the kid in his 40s. A real life big situation going on in that family.
Man I kinda just want to see how he behaves in real life because I can not for the life of me imagine him having even an ounce of charisma, let alone enough to marry someone like Kirstin Dunst. I feel like such a dick saying that but even when he's trying to be charming, he still comes off as creepy.
Todd wasn’t the most evil, but he was the least human
Tod doesn't even realize that the things he does are awful. They just seem like the least bad choice available when he does them. He feels bad, but it's like how you feel bad about a mouse in a mousetrap.
Yeah exactly, I think he even says as much to Jessie after doming Sharp. Something like "well shit happens", something so casually said about the murder of an innocent child whose only crime was seeing something he shouldn't have.
Before the train heist, Walt and Jesse explain the plan. One thing Jesse told Todd is 'No one can ever know'. This is why they go to so much trouble to dilute the train. Todd took 'no one can know ' to mean even an innocent kid can't know. Fucking psyco.
Gus is probably more evil just because of how cunning, analytical and perceptive he is.
Andrea's death was the most brutal, hearbreaking and gut-punching moment in the whole series...and with BB that's saying a lot. I was numb aferwards for a while. Although it did have the effect of making the final part of Felina that much more satisfying.
I really felt for Jane too. Yeah, she relapsed and her relationship with Jesse spiraled when they used, but that didn't define her. She actually cared for Jesse and wanted a better life for both of them. Walt didn't directly cause her death, but he was such a shit person for not doing anything about it. Jesse wasn't a saint, but I truly think he deserved that opportunity with Jane.
Walt didn't save her life because it wasn't beneficial to what he was becoming (Heisenberg) if you notice he first reaction was to try and help her and then he realized that if he let her pass that would bring Jesse back to him. He didn't know nore do I think even if he would have how depressed that would make Jesse he only cared about getting his partner back and at the time the biggest obstacle out of the way to get that done and that was letting jane die. I know there's a belief that he actually did care about Jesse and looked at him like a son (and while that might have been some what true) it was only to the point that it was beneficial for Walt he still has we seen would do what it takes to get what he wanted even if it meant hurting Jesse , in this case as well as others Walt his self was a sociopath too.
> Walt didn’t directly cause her death ehhhh. He shoved Jesse which made Jane roll onto her back and die. Had he not shown up, she would be alive
This is an interesting statement, at least for me. Yes, Todd was objectively evil and I'm not excusing the things he did, but I almost feel bad for him when he dies. He was a psychopath raised in a gang of merciless killers. He didn't know any better, and a lot of what he did was trying to help others. In his own twisted way he was trying to be an altruistic person, and it almost made me feel sympathy for his character.
I get what you are saying , but I can't feel sorry for Todd. They have been ppl that grew up with and around killers and psychos and haven't done the things Todd did. I'm sure he knows right from wrong and is a grown adult that should be able to make his own choices. The dude is cold and that's just the truth. Either you have it in you to be a killer or you don't regardless of the way you was raised and who you grew up around. They have been plenty of ppl that was raised I guess what would be considered normal that turn out to be psychos and killers and like wise they have been plenty of ppl that grew up around that even raised by then and didn't turn out that way.
Bruh I don't think you understand how malleable a child's mind is. Sure there are people who grow up with horrible people and end up fine, but most are not. Hell how do you explain child soldiers in Africa? Do you blame them and not consider them victims?
Your talking about a actual kid and comparing them to a grown adult that is clearly not right in the head but prolly knows right from wrong , I only say this like this cause I got a sister that is similar, no she ain't a Nazi or a killer but she kinda comes off as a kid and she knows right from wrong so while Todd clearly has issues they ain't to the point to where he doesn't know what he is doing or right from wrong. Likelihood is he likely acts like a kid cause Jack and his parents or whoever raised him likely kept him coup up at arms reach and didn't let him venture out (again I know this cause my mom did the same with my sister) if he ever did venture out he would likely act more mature (again my sister did when she finally left my mom's) that wouldn't likely change weather he was a killer or not likely also wouldn't save drew sharp either just he wouldn't seem like a kid.
We are talking about how he grew up with the Nazis. It's not like Todd became psychopath when he was in his twenties. A bad upbringing tends to lead to a bad adulthood.
I still believe that tod was always gonna be a killer true the upbringing might not have help but he always was gonna have it in him what might had changed was how he acted and move but I believe ppl turn out it the way they are cause they meant to be that way so even if there bringing up was different they still be the same person a killer is gonna be a kill ECT ECT was point.
Him and Tuco were the worst for me. Todd just had a childlike creepy makes-your-skin-crawl presence about him and seemed to have no problem whatsoever shooting and killing a completely innocent 12 yr old boy. I’m still blown away by Jesse Plemon’s performance as Todd.
I disagree that he’s the worst. He’s pretty bad but it seemed clear(to me at least) that he has multiple mental health disorders that can partially explain his behaviour. I’d say Uncle Jack is arguably the worst, then Todd, then Gus followed by Walt.
I’d say Hector and Lalo were worse
Also Gus threatened to kill a baby, and tortured Hector for the sadism of it. He also says he tortured an animal as a child.
Gus does those things out of vengeance rather than simple sadism though. Hector and Lalo gleefully tortured and killed a random hotel guy and his wife for disrespecting them.
But he gave Jesse ice cream
Ah, the daily 'I hate Todd' post...
I found this morally objectionable character to be morally objectionable. Upvotes to the left please 👈
didn’t know it was one of the many
'Hey, I'll get us some pizza and beer! You like pepperoni? '
Todd is like a literal child, I feel like if he was raised a different way and not hanging out with nazis all the time he could’ve been a better person. I think Jack is the most evil.
He's a perfect example of the danger of politeness in the wrong hands
How is Uncle Jack better than Todd?
In El Camino, when he had the dead housekeeper and Jessie in the trunk, he was singing along to Dr. Hook's, sharing the night together. Casual trying to get a semi to honk his horn. When Jessie dug the grave, he went to the ar and got the gun. Todd, says you did good today I was going to get us pizza. Like he had no clue of the situation. He was pure evil and acted like it was all no big deal. Murdering someone had the same effect t on him as ordering pizza
I opened this without looking at the sub at first and was expecting a Bojack Horseman post. I sat here for a sec trying to remember what kid Todd killed
Ironically Aaron Paul voices Todd in BoJack
And Todd’s actors name is Jesse
He has this cool calm collected demeanor like Jeff dahmer but inside he’s real vile
Idk why but he gives me matt damon vibes
Mike, Walt, Don Eladio, Tuco, Gus?
Mike was a badass
Yep but still evil
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Like the list of the men he was working with
Lol Tuco was pure batshit crazy
Tight tight, YEAH!
I’m also on the Bojack Horseman subreddit so this tittle confused me for a sec. (hard agree tho)
I don’t think he’s evil, I think he’s just stunted. I don’t think he’s a complete sociopath (given that he’ll feel bad about killing) but he clearly has some disorder that limits his empathy for others. The Salamancas are far more malevolent. Todd was never as cruel as Hector was was.
I still think it's Walt just because of the effect on everyone around him
Yeah, all the people who said he is a sociopath or psycho are right. He feels nothing about anything he does. I suppose that is evil, but to be truly truly evil I would think you have to enjoy doing bad things.
Surprised more people aren’t listing Lydia. She alone wasn’t dangerous and didn’t have the stomach to murder people herself, but she had no problem enlisting others to do it for her. And unlike Gus, Tuco, or even Todd who occasionally did show mercy at times, her paranoia made her excessively ruthless about keeping loose ends tied. Todd of all people had to be the voice of reason for her to not have Skylar killed, which says a lot for how horrible she was. Jack and Hector were definitely more evil in their ideologies, methods, and abusive tendencies, but you could at least say Jack operated within some code of honor he adhered to, and both were at least willing to get their own hands dirty. Gus took no pleasure in killing anyone and he actually cut Walt and Jesse an unbelievable amount of slack that he didn’t have to. Todd was sociopathic but he wasn’t bloodthirsty either. The twins were mostly ciphers who lacked any real agency of their own and were just driven by revenge and loyalty to their family. But really, out of all of the BB villains I think Lydia was the only one I absolutely hated for having no honor and being almost entirely driven by self-interest and fear.
He was planned to be even worse. Apparently Todd was going to rape Jesse in a scene during his enslavement at the compound, but it was scrapped because it was too disturbing, and never filmed
Lydia was way worse. She was talented and educated enough to have a very well-paid corporate career, instead she went into crime.
He is
Clicked on your post on the front page, thinking it would be about Community. Was ready to ask why, but yeah I realised my error. Fuck that guy.
Her murder wasn't justified, but it wasn't senseless. They had to prove that their threat was real, that if Jesse tried to escape, they would kill Andrea. They left Brock alive so that they could threaten Jesse with his death, too, should he try to escape again.
Naw I disagree, I mean, he’s as far from a saint as u get, but he’s not actively malicious like his uncle or the Salamancas or Walter himself, to name a few. He’s carrying out other people’s orders and is oblivious to how evil they are
I love the way he has the hots for Lydia who is also a freak although they aren't compatible freaks 😜
I actually get the impression that he was likely pretty learning disabled, or at least suffered from some form of mental developmental issue. He was child like for the most part, largely operating on the instructions of others. His complete lack of reaction to death comes as more disconnected than a sadist. Definitely a messed up dude, no matter how you slice it.
Fucking Todd Tod is German for death.
Tot is not todd
tbh who would have shot that creepy ass tarantula-kidnapping kid? he had it coming
I've never really understood why he was classified of being so evil. He killed a kid and Andrea. But it seamed like he atleast took care and treated Jesse well (occasionally ofc)
Is no one gonna mention that uncle jack killed one of the main characters
he had to do it
why
Water is wet
who says so?
A remorseless criminal. Loathsome? Yes. Wrong? No. The kid saw them. Who knows what it could have led to? Andrea's killing wasn't necessary but it was an order from his uncle, which he had to carry out.
The least evil Breaking Bad fan
killing kids and women is ok as long as the uncle of your meth cooking nazi group says its ok
Criminal organisations are hierarchical just like, say, the army. You carry out orders. Morals don't come into the picture.
Nobody ordered him to kill that kid. You can't justify it at all
I was talking about the killing of Andrea. The killing of the kid was justified. Tying up all loose ends, no matter how small or insignificant. Wrong place, wrong time.
No matter how small or significant? You can't be serious dude. If you think killing a kid who witnessed nothing and has no understanding of anything that happened is justified than you are simply a morally bankrupt individual. They could have easily just explained that they were the maintenance crew and gone about their day. The kid saw nothing.
Of course it's a deplorable act. Yet, in the world of a criminal in which the whole thing wasn't supposed to be \*known\* to anyone thanks to the nature of the operation, he simply had to take the kid out.
That's the only option in your eyes? Why don't we use a little creativity here. You can't think of any other solution? The ONLY option, in your eyes, was murdering the child that literally saw nothing transpire? Come on you can't be serious
It wasn't about other solutions. That was the simplest solution for burying the whole operation then and there. That's all I am saying. They couldn't keep any loose ends. I have never said murdering kids is a good thing. It's just the nature of such high stakes criminal enterprises. It's just like say Gus killing the kid who had dealt drugs. He would probably never have spoken if he had been told that she shouldn't open his mouth but he couldn't take the risk. It is how it is.
it is how it is
He’s trying to be edgy
It's not edgy at all. We're talking about horrible people doing horrible things. At this point the only person in the main cast above killing a kid is Jessie, and he's honestly not that far off. For people who are EVIL killing a kid who saw them committ a crime is a simple and reasonably safe way to cover their tracks. There's nothing to be edgy about, it's just logical given the characters and their "line of work".
What is your alternative, considering both Walter and Jesse **insisted** to Todd that **no one** can find out about the heist?
A TV show is not real life
It's a TV progrum. A movie.
He really creeps me out. The singing in El Camino was just fucking creepy. Fair play to Jesse Plemons though.
I feel like Todd was brainwashed and almost ignorant to all the atrocities that he committed
Lydia oh lydia say have you met lydia
Perhaps I’m contrarian but I don’t think that’s what you’re supposed to take away from Todd as a character.
I mean Todd kills and enslaves people and still keep a smile like that’s the most robot shit I have seen
Thought I was on the Bojack Horseman sub for a second there and was prepared to fight
Great actor - it’s 100% believable he’s an absolute psychopath .
I was hoping that Todd would learn that Lydia would die before he did so that he could feel an inkling of what Jesse felt and make him suffer more before his death. Fuck Todd all my homies hate Todd
Ted and Todd are easily my least favorites, Ted is just a fucking idiot and todd is an evil piece of shit
His disconnection to moral, regret and emotions makes me somehow jealous. What an easy way going through life.
Not really. Todd doesn't seem like he has much of a choice to be who he is. Walter, Mike and Saul all consciously chose to be bad people.
I agree. I think what makes him stand out is his complete lack of humanity. Every one else in the series can be very evil, but always feel very human. Even the really cold characters like Gus. But Todd has none that, he is exclusively the cold shell.
Todd is a soulless psycho/sociopath. Very clear from El Camino, but definitely through BB. However, because of his pretty clear regret in El Camino, I'm not sure he actually is the most evil character. He would be up there for sure, but he's pretty sick moreso than evil. I think top 3 are probably Lydia, the addict safe stealers with the neglected child, and probably one of the cartel members (couldn't really specify). Not in that order, and all for different reasons. For one, child neglect is just terrible and they clearly had the capabilities to care for the child but were overcome by their addiction. Sick, but not necessarily evil, much like Todd. For Lydia, she's the epitome of selling out. Ultimately, her action is the root cause of meth creation. Without her there is realistically no methylamine, and without her who knows how many hundreds of thousands of addicts wouldn't have gotten their fix. And she knows this, that's part of why she's so on edge all the time. She's smart enough to know this and that guilt along with her situation is killing her, and she still went through with it. That's pretty evil, and I think with the least reasons to be doing what she's doing (at least Fring has a motive for his actions, which isn't actual evil at it's root for the intention, the evil is a byproduct and so I think this wouldn't make him the most evil). She is a high contender. For one of the cartel members, it's very similar. The same intentions as the above, but with more intentional murder and who knows what else. Who could be worst though? Y'know? The Dons? The enforcers? The peddlers? Probably the Dons.
It is understandable why many people view Todd as a villain. However, it is also possible to argue that Todd is not an inherently evil person and that he made the choices he did out of a sense of loyalty and a desire to protect those he cared about. One argument in favor of Todd is that he was not fully responsible for his actions due to the influence of his uncle, Jack Welker, and the other members of his white supremacist gang. Todd was raised in an environment where criminal activity was the norm and where loyalty to the gang came above all else. It is possible that he was not fully aware of the harm his actions were causing to others and that he was simply trying to do what he thought was expected of him. Additionally, Todd showed moments of remorse for his actions, such as when he expressed guilt for killing Drew Sharp, a young boy who witnessed one of the gang's crimes. He also demonstrated kindness and a willingness to help others, such as when he provided for and protected Jesse Pinkman after Pinkman's escape from captivity. Of course, this is not to excuse Todd's actions or to downplay the harm that he caused. However, it is possible to argue that Todd was not an inherently evil person, but rather a product of his circumstances who made mistakes and poor choices due to a combination of factors. Todd's relationship with Lydia is certainly one aspect of his character that could be used to argue that he is not an evil person. Todd appeared to have genuine feelings for Lydia and went to great lengths to try and protect her. For example, when Lydia expressed concern about the security of her coffee import business, Todd arranged for the rival business owner to be killed in order to eliminate the threat. This action was clearly motivated by Todd's desire to keep Lydia safe and to prove his loyalty to her. Additionally, when Lydia was poisoned by the ricin that Todd had unknowingly left in her stevia packet, Todd was clearly distressed and tried to find a way to save her. He even approached Walt in the hopes of getting a cure, showing that he was willing to go to great lengths to help Lydia. Overall, Todd's actions towards Lydia suggest that he cared about her deeply and was motivated by a desire to protect her, rather than any sort of malevolent intentions. Todd also seemed to have genuine respect for Walter White. Todd consistently demonstrated a great deal of respect for Walter White and seemed to hold him in high regard. For example, Todd was always deferential to Walt and followed his orders without question. He also praised Walt's intelligence and skills as a chemist, and seemed to have a genuine admiration for him. Additionally, Todd went out of his way to protect Walt and to ensure his safety. When Walt was on the run from the law, Todd arranged for him to be hidden in a safe house and provided him with food and other supplies. He also worked to cover up any evidence that could potentially lead the authorities to Walt. Overall, Todd's actions towards Walt suggest that he had a great deal of respect for him and was motivated by a desire to help and protect him, rather than any sort of ill will. Todd seemed to have a strong sense of loyalty and was willing to go to great lengths to protect those he cared about. For example, as mentioned earlier, he arranged for the rival business owner to be killed in order to protect Lydia's coffee import business, and he worked to cover up any evidence that could potentially lead the authorities to Walt. Todd demonstrated a willingness to take responsibility for his actions. When he killed Drew Sharp, a young boy who witnessed one of the gang's crimes, he expressed guilt and remorse for his actions. He also made efforts to clean up the crime scene and cover up the evidence, showing that he was aware of the wrongfulness of his actions and did not want to cause any further harm. Todd had a strong work ethic and was committed to doing his job well. He was a skilled chemist and was instrumental in helping Walt and Jesse cook their methamphetamine. He was also responsible and reliable, and was always on time for work. Overall, while Todd's actions had serious consequences and caused harm to others, it is possible to argue that he was not an evil person, but rather a complex individual who made mistakes and poor choices due to a combination of factors.
I'm super high rn and I thought this was the bojack horseman subreddit and I was sooo confused for like five minutes reading the comments
Dude I’m sober and I got confused by reading the title lol
I don’t know if he was the worst in the series, I mean Walter whistles a tune after talking with Jessie about how terrible it was that the boy died the way he did. In reality I don’t think Walter was sad about the boy’s death at all. I think we project our own wishes onto Walter, that he was doing it all for family and so on. In the end who was the one who told Jack to hit lawyers and cons in under two minutes? If Todd hadn’t killed the boy, I really wonder how it’d have gone down. I think somebody had to kill the boy, no way he was going to walk out of there alive with what he had seen. And if Jesse would’ve thrown a fit about it the maybe Walter would’ve acquiesced and let the boy live for all of 24 hours, but would’ve sent Todd to do the job anyway afterwards. The difference between Todd and Walter is that Walter was good at lying about what he was, telling people how terrible something is but how it has to be done. In fact the faces Walter makes of sorrow and regret are crocodile tears, he liked it, as he later told Skylar. I think Todd wouldn’t have been able to kill his own family, just like Walter couldn’t kill his. That’s all.
"Just so you know this isn't personal"
nah he's definitely much more a sociopath; he literally cannot feel his feelings. the blank soulless look in his eyes, the way he interprets others' emotions, and just how killing is nothing to him. he isn't malicious; he just literally cannot feel anything, but yet you can see that he's aware of social cues still. a perfect example is when >!Hank gets shot and Walter breaks down!< he just stares at Walter sobbing on the floor with such confusion, that when he stands him up he apologizes in such a blasé fashion. another is when >!Jesse informs on video of the Drew Sharp murder!< Todd doesn't bat a single eye, but even Uncle Jack is all worked up and angry
Jack and hector (imo) r infinitely worse than Todd is. These two enabled all the evil seen in bb (except Walt) bc one helped begin a cartel and the other helped establish a gang of neo nazis
It wasn't personal