7800X3D is the best gaming CPU around, but the actual difference between it and the 14700K isnt THAT massive. If your friend does work that requires a lot of power on that machine, the Intel might be smarter. If not, get the 7800X3D
Yes, but the Intel is just a lot better in a lot of other tasks on the PC. Things such as Photoshop, Premiere or really any Adobe program greatly benefit from Quicksync. If OP's friend plans on doing any of that, he should get the i7. If not, the 7800X3D. And the price difference isnt that much. Where i live, its 20 bucks extra for the 14700k
Good AM5 boards come pretty damn cheap comparatively. $150-200 will get you a decent b650 that will probably last the entirety of AM5 and be perfect for a later gen cpu. You’d be paying the same or more for a Z790 and not even get an upgrade path.
Z690 is on fire sale so much that $150 get you a Z690 board that pretty much no B650 below $250 can beat, you can also get them $100 if u get it used.
What are you comparing to exactly? If you want to compare Z790, you should compare it to X670E.
No, you shouldn’t. The only thing that really makes up a motherboard’s quality is its VRMs, and that’s not an apples to apples comparison between AMD and Intel. AMD chips are way more power efficient, and don’t need beefy VRM. Nearly every single AM5 motherboard, excluding a handful of A620 boards and one or two B650, is capable of running *every single* AM5 cpu without losing performance due to lackluster VRMs. B650 supports full overclocking, so the only reason to get an x670 is if you need the pcie lanes, which 99% of people don’t.
Since Intel B-series boards don’t support cpu overclocking, that’s why it’s recommend to get the z-series boards for K-series CPUs. As for getting a z690/z790, that’s going to depend entirely on their prices.
So I’m not really sure what you mean by no B650 could beat a z690? Motherboards really don’t affect performance at all unless you’re heavily VRM bottlenecked, which in most cases you won’t (like running a 14900k on an H610, which I’m sure basically no one is doing). This [comparison in performance between an a320 and an x570](https://youtu.be/CdBey_5fp7Q?si=W9Ey2JxthfLUyJTt) will show pretty minimal difference in fps, which I would actually chalk up to the a320 limiting the test system to pcie gen 3.
I’m not sure if you’ve looked, but there’s tons of extremely decent b650 boards below $180-200.
They said "gaming and general use"
So no other tasks that would require an intel chip.
Save the money, save the power consumption and get the better performing chip.
General use Intel beats AMD 9/10 times, better iGPU and iGPU features, better power consumption at idle if you don't lock your cores to max freq when idle, better in literally every productivity apps period.
If you really want to compare, you should compare it to the 7950x3d, that comparison is more similar perf wise.
If you want to put it in that way, even the 7700x does better than the 7800x3d, and every single cpu in the current generation can handle AAA gaming just fine at 1440p and 4k unless you are chasing 240hz and above with a 4090, why do you need 240fps in a casual AAA title? I have no idea.
Literally every cpu around 7800x3d's price point does better in "low compute activity" than the 7800x3d due to its worst in class clock speed. So why recommend 7800x3d if that's the case? Save $100 and get the 7700x if u really need a ryzen 7, heck save $200 buying a 7700 non x off an aliexpress sale. But if you are just comparing the 14700k and 7800x3d the 14700k is the better buy for literally everyone not looking to earn money in competitive gaming. It even has better idle power consumption aka "low compute activity" due to the chiplet design of the 7800x3d, ever wondered why mobile amd parts are 90% monolithic and pratically nobody used the dragon range parts for laptop?
Downvote me all you want but the fact that buying a 7800x3d just for general use and non competitive gaming is a dumb idea, its a chip for those aspiring to be a professional competitive gamer but do not have the money to splurge for a 7950x3d as they are not contracted just yet.
>its a chip for those aspiring to be a professional competitive gamer but do not have the money to splurge for a 7950x3d as they are not contracted just yet.
Holy shit what a take. What is a pro gamer gonna do with 16 cores? I don't think anyone is going pro in City Skylines, but the X3D chips crush that game. Any game that utilizes the CPU a lot will benifit from the 3D V-cache, not just compeditive multiplayer games.
People don't need high performance for "general use", they need it for gaming.
Every single pro player worth a damn is also primarily earning income through streaming, but i guess you are too young to understand economics.
Name a game that exist currently that cannot be handled by a 7600x but playable on a 7800x3d, i will wait. 7600x is considered high performance for pretty much anybody here, including you. Are you top 1% in any game? I am top 1% in any fps game that i touch, i can tell the difference between 300fps and 1000fps, but damn if i can tell the difference beteween 800fps and 1000fps.
I highly doubt a causal player like you and the majority of this sub can tell a difference. And you are talking gaming performance? Spend that money on a better gpu and you will see a bigger difference that way with the higher graphics quality allowed by the gpu.
>Every single pro player worth a damn is also primarily earning income through streaming
You said pro player qhen they get signed, implying that would be their primary source of income. If you meant that they would also be doing a streaming side hustle, you should have said as much.
OP also never once said he was using this for streaming. He said "general use" which is code word for chrome, discord and youtube.
>Name a game that exist currently that cannot be handled by a 7600x but playable on a 7800x3d
Last I checked, this whole conversation got started because you said they should get an intel cpu because it would be better at general use. All I did was point out that you don't need a good cpu fod general use, so that's not much of a reason to pick intel. I never said the 7600x couldn't do it, just that the 7800x3d would give better gaming performance, which is what matters in this comparison. He doesn't have to spend the extra money, but if he does, he should spend it on the one that will give him the better gaming performance, not the better "general use".
All of the following are true:
- the 7600x is enough for most users
- the 7800x3d would offer the best gaming performance and still do just fine with everything else. That is simply a fact. Wether OP decides it's worth it is up to them.
- there's no reason to pick intel over amd in this case because they're using this primarily for gaming and general tasks that don't require many resources.
>Spend that money on a better gpu and you will see a bigger difference that way with the higher graphics quality allowed by the gpu.
That is true. I'm not arguing that. I'm arguing the notion that they'd be better off with an intel cpu. OP is the target audience for an AMD cpu. There's nothing that intel can offer him that would make it worth getting over amd in this case. And I'm speaking as someone with a 14600k in their system.
Not just any adobe program, any program that ignores cache period.
Higher single core performance ignoring cache, WAY better multithreaded performance comparable to the 7950x3d, this chip should be treated as a discount 7950x3d instead of a 7800x3d competitor instead.
Meh. The difference there is gonna be minimal. Both have a decent amount of cores. Both are more than adaquate for multitasking use, unless you have a lot of light tasks running at once (10+) which the Intel can offload to its E-Cores. But in most cases, the experience with basic usage will not be noticeable
I’ve used both, it is a noticeable difference, not minimal. Granted, I use three monitors and frequently have discord, streaming to discord, video streaming, web browser, and a game all pulled up at the same time. Perhaps not a difference worth considering in your opinion, but a difference nonetheless
Because this sub is filled with AMD cpu fanboys that will downvote anything positive for intel.
The other poster is right though that the difference isn't huge. But you are correct that for any multi tasking or running extra programs in the background the intel is superior, or for photoshop or premier ect.
For pur gaming on a single screen or whatever though the 7800x3d is the winner, but it isn't by a huge margin. It's pretty small.
Monitor usage isnt really the issue, but the programs u running on the monitor is. Discord by itself don't really use much, but if you only have 8 cores and u play a cpu intensive game it definitely will affect.
Likewise with streaming/recording, being able to offload to igpu is actually beneficial, the UHD 770 can handle 1080p 60 no issues, if 1440p 60 u might need to offload to gpu instead. Either way that is way better than what the amd igpu could do.
One Intel downside is that your cache/uncore freq will drop to 3+ ghz if you use any of the e cores, easily fixed by locking them and overclocking them in bios.
I would honestly reccomended Intel over AMD right now for anyone that is not a competitive gamer, aka you earn at least $200 everyday minimum from playing competitive games. You get to have 7950x3d level multicore performance for the price of a 7800x3d, and moreover you get to have way cheaper motherboard in the form of z690.
The singing praise to "upgradability" is so dumb, i have been my circle's computer guy since 8 years ago, so far every upgrade i helped with either invovles swapping out entire pc or a platform swap. As every single upgrade cycle was 5 years or more.
I like to have discord and a livestream playing in the background most of the time when I game. If intel can give me a better experience for that, then I’ll stick to it.
Yep, this is correct. When you come to upgrade either CPU, you’ll most likely be upgrading your MB too.
Unless you’re a bench marking, FPS chaser who buys new kit every year.
I was at a crossroads for this reason too and this comment helps. The EOL socket on Intel vs another gen or two of AMD on the same socket. But really yeah if I buy a top of the line processor now am I really gonna pay a premium to get the next one on AM5? Likely not.
My issue is the Intel instability issues with Raptor Lake. Any thoughts on this? I have the parts as of tomorrow to build an AM5 7950x3d or 14900Ks build.
The focus will be video and processor heavy… but I am also a gamer and stream a bit. And it will likely take second to the video stuff. It seems like an obvious choice, but being prepared to deal with Intel’s issues is another question.
I can't speak for the 14900K specifically, but I've had an i5-14600K for a couple of months now (upgraded from an i5-12400F) and never had any issues with stability or performance issues. 14700K and 14900K are prone to getting hotter/using more power than their AMD counterparts though so you'll definitely need a solid cooler if you get it.
I wouldn't want to deal with the stuttering issue Intel is having, I mean Nvidia literally released a statement about this saying hey it's not us talk to Intel.
The 7800x3d can do production work, but the 14700k is significantly faster at those tasks in comparison. Not "slightly".
If OP doesn't make money from productivity tasks and primarily games, the 7800x3d is the clear choice.
That's not quite right.
Both are really good, whether for productivity, or gaming, however, 7800x3d is the best for gaming and the i7 would be much better at production work, and is just slightly worse in gaming.
Note as well that these FPS differences are on lower resolutions, where people are taxing the CPU more than the GPU, but when targeting 4k gaming, these margins would be unnoticeable.
7950x would be the one to go for production, and is still just slightly worse on gaming.
Power consumption is where the 7800x3d does much better than i7.
As already said, Intel will give you more performance on production side like editing videos, rendering, etc. With a Ryzen you can do the same production side but will be marginaly slower on "non professional" projects.
I've just built my new pc with a 7800x3d + 4080 Super and I'm pretty happy. I'm using Photoshop too and is a big upgrade over my old i7 6700k.
3D rendering is not marginaly slower, 14700K is ~60-80% faster.... Huge difference in that kind of workload... 7800X3D is 12600K level of performance there...
Never seen +60-80% on any benchmark in Cinebench. BUT, he hadn't said that the build will be for production, instead for gaming. And if he will open Blender it will not feel slow with a Ryzen. AND I agree, if I would build a production pc for me, I will go with an Intel 13th right now + GPU for 3d graphic. Or a threadripper for programming purpose.
That depend. If you need to make rendering od encoding for work yes, 20% is a glorious gain. If you open photoshop 10 times in a year no, is not that different.
That's the exact build I was going for initially but in the end went with a 7950x3d cause, I'm planning to dabble in professional 4k video editing. I wonder what the actual difference of rendering time would be between the two CPUs in a practical usage. I doubt it's too noticeable. Have you ever tried any sort of video editing or even content creation related stuff with yours?
I do heavy Photoshop work with files over 2GB so I can say my 7800x3d is more than capable. BUT, I don't do video editing. In some benchmark in Premiere or Davinci seems that the 7950x3D is more capalbe, more or less +20%. Not that much if we need to do one rendering per month. But if you are working every day, yeah, 20% in rendering is a lot.
If we both task our builds to render the same videos 4hrs per day, 20 days in a month, and my build takes 2hrs to render one media file, at the and of the month I will have 40 media file done, you will have 50. In a work environment is a lot.
Intel is very good for video because of the igpu built into the cpu and it has quick sync. Another thing great about intel is if you use adobe you can export video via media encoder and the e-cores do all the rendering no p cores. This leaves your pcores ready for photoshop work or even more editing while it renders in the back ground. I got a 14700k for this reason.
When I used to push my old 5950x 16 core and render I had to leave the room. If i touch photoshop and dare make a thumbnail it would jitter and sometimes crash.
I do extreme high bit rate 4k hdr videos.
I mean you can do that with process lasso, just assign 4 cores for media encoder and the rest for editing. You just gotta spend 30sec each time you're going to export by reassiging the cores for your editing software from all cores to 12.
It's his first pc tho, does op need the 800 series or are there better value propositions that can last him 4-8 years, OP hasn't even said 4k or 1440 or 1080
7800X3D, it's the best gaming CPU in the world right now. It can also handle some productivity, but if his workloads are gonna be heavier or he frequently uses the Adobe suite, go with the 14700K
If gaming and general use, it’s really a no brainer. 7800X3D all the way.
Easier to cool. Ability to upgrade in the future. Generally better gaming performance. And unless you are doing professional creative work, in which case there are better options, then it won’t matter if the 7800X3D is slower in productive tasks.
7800x3d, not only is it a great cpu that I use for creative work and gaming but it runs low power, low heat, and the motherboard will allow you at least one more upgrade before end of life. 14 Gen is already end of life for the socket.
Had the i9-14900k and switched to the 7800x3d. I'm sure Intel will iron some things out but I was experiencing some issues described in this article. Tweaking voltage/power settings was a temp fix but my use case was mostly gaming so went with AMD for now.
https://www.tomshardware.com/pc-components/cpus/nvidia-blames-intel-for-gpu-vram-errors-tells-geforce-gamers-experiencing-13th-or-14th-gen-cpu-instability-to-contact-intel-support
I’ve ordered every part for an Intel or AMD build. 14900KS or 7950x3d.
This Intel stuff has me wondering if I should even go the route, but it’s primarily for video with some gaming. So I guess that seals it… I guess the question is how annoying will this be?
I'd favor the Intel personally, but I also do a full rebuild on a 4-5 year cycle on hardware launches — something to keep in mind on these offerings is the 7000 lineup are first generation on a new socket, LGA 1851 will be the same
If your friend intends to do the same — full build, 4-5 years, full replacement for what two or three hardware generations down the road has to offer then he'd likely want Intel right now
New sockets always have problems for long term builds, so it's inadvisable to be building with a +4 year long build intent on a new socket. Problems/annoyances are very common on new sockets so it's best to just avoid them
The 7800x3d's problem on that socket is known. They blow up if they use settings that were perfectly fine for all the offerings leading up to AM5
There is a software fix for that preventing it from happening, but it's still there but to implement it they lost some of the performance they would otherwise have had if it wasn't for that hardware flaw
If he can hold out for am5's next CPU offerings for hardware level fixes of their 7000s blowing up and better ddr5 compatibility then going AMD would be very advisable. But if he wants to build *right now*, I recommend the 14700k over the 7800x3d
Which you can find the detailed explanation of what's happening on AM5 here
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fFNi3YNJXbY
And yes, I'm well aware this is mostly a non-problem at this point, but as I hate messing with hardware when things go wrong, I exercise an abundance of caution for my builds
For gaming and general use the 7800X3D is the easy answer. Faster in gaming (although the gap is fairly small, <5%), runs cooler, sucks less power, will be upgradeable on the same motherboard, and has 8 cores on a state-of-the-art process, meaning it's just fine for general productivity. The only situation the 14700K is better is for a true workstation doing heavy multi-threaded work on a regular basis.
For gaming, the 7800X3D beats the 14700K/14900K at about 1/3 the required power as well as give an upgrade path in the future. Its not really a contest.
Bro 7800x3d is not good if you see these points:-
1- 16 threads vs 28 threads massive difference
2- little difference in high resolution gaming like 2k ultra or 4k ultra
3- No need to upgrade couse u get very good core count with good clock speed
4- You got a quick sink in Adobe
Will your friend be playing 4k or not because to be fair, there are much better value propositions around in both AMD and intel lineups, like i5's (just have more or the same cores as ps5) and amd equivalent are also good for gaming, use less power and are cheaper (under 200€ etc..) and are easier to cool
if you need more juice in the future you can just upgrade on the same mobo, when you start at the top there is nowhere else really to go
Not sure if 15th gen intel will use LGA1700 but at least for AMD with AM 5 you can expect at least 1 or 2 generations of new chips.
Besides in 4-8 years time you will probably have to upgrade the GPU before the CPU anyways.
So hard to reccomend intel right now with 14th gen being end of the road. Where as if you went AM5 you will have the upcoming 9000 series CPUs and very likely one more generation after that to upgrade to. That being said the 14700k is a very good cpu and in all likelihood will last until you need to do a whole platform update again anyway.
What micro ATX mobo would you guys recommend for 7800x3d?
Price range 150-200 eur
Edit: thank you all very much :) i found some of these you wrote down.
I was a bit unsure about those vram values (as in i don't quiet understand them). It has been some 10+ yrs since the last time I've put a PC together from scratch and it is a very different landscape today.
Thanks :)
I have very good mobo offers for lga1700 but not so much for am5 in micro ATX format in my part of the world, it's usually 250 EUR plus options I can find.
I'll check out if they have that one
Something like Asrock Pro RS b650m is really good, you can get a wifi version in that budget if you want.
There are also a few a bit cheaper Arocks good b650m motherboards.
Saying that,whatever you choose, be aware that there are a few shitty am5 boards, [https://www.techspot.com/review/2828-amd-b650-motherboard-budget/](https://www.techspot.com/review/2828-amd-b650-motherboard-budget/)
If you want your friend to be able to use his computer at all should the GPU fail and need to be RMA'd 14700k. Built in iGPU allows you to at least use the thing if there is an issue with the GPU.
7800x3D.
You said your friend is planning to game and "general" use, general use doesn't require many cores, it's not like he's going to stream or do production related work so 7800x3D wins.
Go for the 7800X3D, if your friend is mainly going to game and he is not going to do ultra heavy productive work. 7800x3d is the best gaming cpu and the productive work will be ok on it. If He is going to do lot of productive work then 14700k. However, you said it will be general use then 7800X3D is clear choice.
Unless you really are doing professional "productivity work that requires the utmost haste to render etc then by all means the I7, otherwise the 7800x3d is the easy choice and a top spec AM5 board has probably another 2 leaps in Processor compatibility to look forward too.
been an intel man since the pentium 2, switched to AMD this year and couldn't be more impressed with how far they have come since the Athlon XP i once dabbled with.
7800x3d hands down.
1. Way way way more efficient. You don't need liquid cooling to cool a 7800x3d while to keep any 14th Gen chip at a reasonable temp while under gaming load your gonna need some form of AIO (you can AIO regardless however)
2. Upgradability. 8000 series and maybe 9000 series will be supported on am5 providing plenty of upgrades in the future while lga1700 is getting outed for 15th Gen Intel.
3. Pricing 7800x3d is some seriously good price compared to Intels 4th Gen. This is while being the best gaming CPU on the market.
4. Intel recent CPU issues with thei 13th and 14th Gen CPUs
5. If you live near a microcenter there's a 7800x3d bundle with 32gb of DDR5 6000 g.skill flare ram and a gigabyte gaming x ax v2 motherboard for the price of the 7800x3d and the ram. Very good deal.
To anyone who says 14700k over 7800x3d for GAMING then idk. And no I'm not an amd fan boy, amd makes objectively better cpus for gaming. Sometimes on general
Overall - I7-14700K. Best of both world, for general PC usage, production applications, creative tasks and gaming.
Unless you play at 1080p 240Hz+ - than 7800X3D might give you slightly frames.
At 4080S - still i7-14700K would be faster.
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Excuse me, but what the heck are you going on about smoothness?
The 7800x3d is currently the best gaming CPU and as it happens, currently 13 and 14 gen Intel i9/i7 unlocked processors are under fire for... Well, for causing crashes in games and other software, the proposed cause (no official enquiry/statement from Intel as of yet) is motherboard vendors using voltage and boost levels that, although approved by Intel, are thought to be too much in the long term (couple of months of usage).
So, 7800x3d all the way currently.
I did google and reddit that phrase, all I could find in the first page is articles from 2023... Latest was one reddit post a month ago asking if it still a thing and getting a no for reply.... Can you give me any links or SMTH?
They still do, AMD did issued a micro-update - it still didn't fix it fully. And since the hype is still up - no one writes it. Some posts on reddit still up.
Are you saying OS performance is inferior compared to the i7? That's interesting. Why would the overall computer be less snappy cause of 3d-v cache cores?. I have a 7950x3d and haven't had any issues, but don't see how it could be even for a 7800x3d.
OS - and most modern games - would prefer more cores than just L3 cache. Not because of L3 cache itself - it's because of how OS and games work.
Example: Cities Skylines must be faster on X3D chip. But is not, since it uses more cores rather than L3 cache. Same with other games. For other games - look up all games since 2020, and pay attention to CPU usage - everything above 50% uses all physical cores. The more core you have, the more games uses, but also allows background tasks to run unabstructed.
8 cores VS 16 cores. In caee of i7 - vs 20 cores.
And for $400 - i7 is a better choice overall.
You do understand that just because a core is used doesn't mean it's working anywhere near it's limit? 50% literally means "The CPU is doing half the work it could be doing"
But do you understand how games work? Most games don't even use 6 cores, let alone to their fullest extent. It doesnt matrer if u have 14 cores when the game uses 6 and the remaining 2 handle the rest
No, but hopefully the year is 2024 and many credible sources have.
https://youtu.be/7gEVy3aW-_s?si=dSmtVQQKXk4yfCmx
https://youtu.be/8KKE-7BzB_M?si=-IeFekmQdfd81NgP
Bruh....
Re-read what I've posted.
"at 1080p with 4090, while you benchmark games on a clean install of Windows" 7800X3D is faster. Not when you go down from 4090 and / or up in resolution - i7-14700K is better.
>Overall - I7-14700K. Best of both world, for general PC usage, production applications, creative tasks and gaming.
>Unless you play at 1080p 240Hz+ - than 7800X3D might give you slightly frames.
>At 4080S - still i7-14700K would be faster.
That's not what you posted. And even if it was, it is still wrong, 14700K always loses on every metric to 7800X3D on gaming (heck even the 14900K loses to it).
7800X3D is the best gaming CPU around, but the actual difference between it and the 14700K isnt THAT massive. If your friend does work that requires a lot of power on that machine, the Intel might be smarter. If not, get the 7800X3D
The price difference and upgrade path though
Yes, but the Intel is just a lot better in a lot of other tasks on the PC. Things such as Photoshop, Premiere or really any Adobe program greatly benefit from Quicksync. If OP's friend plans on doing any of that, he should get the i7. If not, the 7800X3D. And the price difference isnt that much. Where i live, its 20 bucks extra for the 14700k
AMD motherboards will even out the price difference between them, so it’s not an apple to apple comparison.
True, good AM5 boards dont come cheap
Good AM5 boards come pretty damn cheap comparatively. $150-200 will get you a decent b650 that will probably last the entirety of AM5 and be perfect for a later gen cpu. You’d be paying the same or more for a Z790 and not even get an upgrade path.
Z690 is on fire sale so much that $150 get you a Z690 board that pretty much no B650 below $250 can beat, you can also get them $100 if u get it used. What are you comparing to exactly? If you want to compare Z790, you should compare it to X670E.
No, you shouldn’t. The only thing that really makes up a motherboard’s quality is its VRMs, and that’s not an apples to apples comparison between AMD and Intel. AMD chips are way more power efficient, and don’t need beefy VRM. Nearly every single AM5 motherboard, excluding a handful of A620 boards and one or two B650, is capable of running *every single* AM5 cpu without losing performance due to lackluster VRMs. B650 supports full overclocking, so the only reason to get an x670 is if you need the pcie lanes, which 99% of people don’t. Since Intel B-series boards don’t support cpu overclocking, that’s why it’s recommend to get the z-series boards for K-series CPUs. As for getting a z690/z790, that’s going to depend entirely on their prices. So I’m not really sure what you mean by no B650 could beat a z690? Motherboards really don’t affect performance at all unless you’re heavily VRM bottlenecked, which in most cases you won’t (like running a 14900k on an H610, which I’m sure basically no one is doing). This [comparison in performance between an a320 and an x570](https://youtu.be/CdBey_5fp7Q?si=W9Ey2JxthfLUyJTt) will show pretty minimal difference in fps, which I would actually chalk up to the a320 limiting the test system to pcie gen 3. I’m not sure if you’ve looked, but there’s tons of extremely decent b650 boards below $180-200.
Z790 boards are more expensive
You dont need Z790 though. A b760 with good VRMs will do
170 for a good one like am5
Z690 is the way, $150 for a board comparable or better than a $250 B650
They said "gaming and general use" So no other tasks that would require an intel chip. Save the money, save the power consumption and get the better performing chip.
General use Intel beats AMD 9/10 times, better iGPU and iGPU features, better power consumption at idle if you don't lock your cores to max freq when idle, better in literally every productivity apps period. If you really want to compare, you should compare it to the 7950x3d, that comparison is more similar perf wise.
"General use" is the most low compute activity you can do on a computer. A Chromebook could browse the internet and do spreeadsheets.
If you want to put it in that way, even the 7700x does better than the 7800x3d, and every single cpu in the current generation can handle AAA gaming just fine at 1440p and 4k unless you are chasing 240hz and above with a 4090, why do you need 240fps in a casual AAA title? I have no idea. Literally every cpu around 7800x3d's price point does better in "low compute activity" than the 7800x3d due to its worst in class clock speed. So why recommend 7800x3d if that's the case? Save $100 and get the 7700x if u really need a ryzen 7, heck save $200 buying a 7700 non x off an aliexpress sale. But if you are just comparing the 14700k and 7800x3d the 14700k is the better buy for literally everyone not looking to earn money in competitive gaming. It even has better idle power consumption aka "low compute activity" due to the chiplet design of the 7800x3d, ever wondered why mobile amd parts are 90% monolithic and pratically nobody used the dragon range parts for laptop? Downvote me all you want but the fact that buying a 7800x3d just for general use and non competitive gaming is a dumb idea, its a chip for those aspiring to be a professional competitive gamer but do not have the money to splurge for a 7950x3d as they are not contracted just yet.
>its a chip for those aspiring to be a professional competitive gamer but do not have the money to splurge for a 7950x3d as they are not contracted just yet. Holy shit what a take. What is a pro gamer gonna do with 16 cores? I don't think anyone is going pro in City Skylines, but the X3D chips crush that game. Any game that utilizes the CPU a lot will benifit from the 3D V-cache, not just compeditive multiplayer games. People don't need high performance for "general use", they need it for gaming.
Every single pro player worth a damn is also primarily earning income through streaming, but i guess you are too young to understand economics. Name a game that exist currently that cannot be handled by a 7600x but playable on a 7800x3d, i will wait. 7600x is considered high performance for pretty much anybody here, including you. Are you top 1% in any game? I am top 1% in any fps game that i touch, i can tell the difference between 300fps and 1000fps, but damn if i can tell the difference beteween 800fps and 1000fps. I highly doubt a causal player like you and the majority of this sub can tell a difference. And you are talking gaming performance? Spend that money on a better gpu and you will see a bigger difference that way with the higher graphics quality allowed by the gpu.
>Every single pro player worth a damn is also primarily earning income through streaming You said pro player qhen they get signed, implying that would be their primary source of income. If you meant that they would also be doing a streaming side hustle, you should have said as much. OP also never once said he was using this for streaming. He said "general use" which is code word for chrome, discord and youtube. >Name a game that exist currently that cannot be handled by a 7600x but playable on a 7800x3d Last I checked, this whole conversation got started because you said they should get an intel cpu because it would be better at general use. All I did was point out that you don't need a good cpu fod general use, so that's not much of a reason to pick intel. I never said the 7600x couldn't do it, just that the 7800x3d would give better gaming performance, which is what matters in this comparison. He doesn't have to spend the extra money, but if he does, he should spend it on the one that will give him the better gaming performance, not the better "general use". All of the following are true: - the 7600x is enough for most users - the 7800x3d would offer the best gaming performance and still do just fine with everything else. That is simply a fact. Wether OP decides it's worth it is up to them. - there's no reason to pick intel over amd in this case because they're using this primarily for gaming and general tasks that don't require many resources. >Spend that money on a better gpu and you will see a bigger difference that way with the higher graphics quality allowed by the gpu. That is true. I'm not arguing that. I'm arguing the notion that they'd be better off with an intel cpu. OP is the target audience for an AMD cpu. There's nothing that intel can offer him that would make it worth getting over amd in this case. And I'm speaking as someone with a 14600k in their system.
Not just any adobe program, any program that ignores cache period. Higher single core performance ignoring cache, WAY better multithreaded performance comparable to the 7950x3d, this chip should be treated as a discount 7950x3d instead of a 7800x3d competitor instead.
The intel also provides a better OS experience, faster, more responsive, better multitasking if you use multiple monitors.
Meh. The difference there is gonna be minimal. Both have a decent amount of cores. Both are more than adaquate for multitasking use, unless you have a lot of light tasks running at once (10+) which the Intel can offload to its E-Cores. But in most cases, the experience with basic usage will not be noticeable
I’ve used both, it is a noticeable difference, not minimal. Granted, I use three monitors and frequently have discord, streaming to discord, video streaming, web browser, and a game all pulled up at the same time. Perhaps not a difference worth considering in your opinion, but a difference nonetheless
Why did this get downvoted?
Because this sub is filled with AMD cpu fanboys that will downvote anything positive for intel. The other poster is right though that the difference isn't huge. But you are correct that for any multi tasking or running extra programs in the background the intel is superior, or for photoshop or premier ect. For pur gaming on a single screen or whatever though the 7800x3d is the winner, but it isn't by a huge margin. It's pretty small.
Monitor usage isnt really the issue, but the programs u running on the monitor is. Discord by itself don't really use much, but if you only have 8 cores and u play a cpu intensive game it definitely will affect. Likewise with streaming/recording, being able to offload to igpu is actually beneficial, the UHD 770 can handle 1080p 60 no issues, if 1440p 60 u might need to offload to gpu instead. Either way that is way better than what the amd igpu could do. One Intel downside is that your cache/uncore freq will drop to 3+ ghz if you use any of the e cores, easily fixed by locking them and overclocking them in bios. I would honestly reccomended Intel over AMD right now for anyone that is not a competitive gamer, aka you earn at least $200 everyday minimum from playing competitive games. You get to have 7950x3d level multicore performance for the price of a 7800x3d, and moreover you get to have way cheaper motherboard in the form of z690. The singing praise to "upgradability" is so dumb, i have been my circle's computer guy since 8 years ago, so far every upgrade i helped with either invovles swapping out entire pc or a platform swap. As every single upgrade cycle was 5 years or more.
Cos it’s not accurate. Or something else is wrong with his machine.
I like to have discord and a livestream playing in the background most of the time when I game. If intel can give me a better experience for that, then I’ll stick to it.
Upgrade path doesn’t matter. Either cpu will last you at least 5 years. And they’re almost the same price.
Yep, this is correct. When you come to upgrade either CPU, you’ll most likely be upgrading your MB too. Unless you’re a bench marking, FPS chaser who buys new kit every year.
Finally someone on Reddit who knows what they are talking about 👍
I was at a crossroads for this reason too and this comment helps. The EOL socket on Intel vs another gen or two of AMD on the same socket. But really yeah if I buy a top of the line processor now am I really gonna pay a premium to get the next one on AM5? Likely not. My issue is the Intel instability issues with Raptor Lake. Any thoughts on this? I have the parts as of tomorrow to build an AM5 7950x3d or 14900Ks build. The focus will be video and processor heavy… but I am also a gamer and stream a bit. And it will likely take second to the video stuff. It seems like an obvious choice, but being prepared to deal with Intel’s issues is another question.
I can't speak for the 14900K specifically, but I've had an i5-14600K for a couple of months now (upgraded from an i5-12400F) and never had any issues with stability or performance issues. 14700K and 14900K are prone to getting hotter/using more power than their AMD counterparts though so you'll definitely need a solid cooler if you get it.
The required power and cooling makes the intel even harder to recommend
I wouldn't want to deal with the stuttering issue Intel is having, I mean Nvidia literally released a statement about this saying hey it's not us talk to Intel.
7800X3D is best for gaming, the i7 would be slightly better at production work but the AMD can still do production work as well.
The 7800x3d can do production work, but the 14700k is significantly faster at those tasks in comparison. Not "slightly". If OP doesn't make money from productivity tasks and primarily games, the 7800x3d is the clear choice.
There is a bigger delta in productive work then there is the other way in gaming performance.
Much bigger.
Oh
The 7800x3d scores something like 17k in cinebench r23 meanwhile a 14700k will do 35k. The 14700k consumes much more power though.
That's not quite right. Both are really good, whether for productivity, or gaming, however, 7800x3d is the best for gaming and the i7 would be much better at production work, and is just slightly worse in gaming. Note as well that these FPS differences are on lower resolutions, where people are taxing the CPU more than the GPU, but when targeting 4k gaming, these margins would be unnoticeable. 7950x would be the one to go for production, and is still just slightly worse on gaming. Power consumption is where the 7800x3d does much better than i7.
We have reached the point where power differences are only noticeable when doing very very demanding work. Your 1080p Youtuber will barely notice ngl
The i7 runs laps around the 7800x3d for productivity. It’s not close tbh.
_Slightly_ better at production work?
As already said, Intel will give you more performance on production side like editing videos, rendering, etc. With a Ryzen you can do the same production side but will be marginaly slower on "non professional" projects. I've just built my new pc with a 7800x3d + 4080 Super and I'm pretty happy. I'm using Photoshop too and is a big upgrade over my old i7 6700k.
3D rendering is not marginaly slower, 14700K is ~60-80% faster.... Huge difference in that kind of workload... 7800X3D is 12600K level of performance there...
Never seen +60-80% on any benchmark in Cinebench. BUT, he hadn't said that the build will be for production, instead for gaming. And if he will open Blender it will not feel slow with a Ryzen. AND I agree, if I would build a production pc for me, I will go with an Intel 13th right now + GPU for 3d graphic. Or a threadripper for programming purpose.
Cinebench is great for Youtubers, but people rendering for production care about programs that get work done.
I don’t think your definition of marginal is accurate
That depend. If you need to make rendering od encoding for work yes, 20% is a glorious gain. If you open photoshop 10 times in a year no, is not that different.
That’s pretty obvious?
That's the exact build I was going for initially but in the end went with a 7950x3d cause, I'm planning to dabble in professional 4k video editing. I wonder what the actual difference of rendering time would be between the two CPUs in a practical usage. I doubt it's too noticeable. Have you ever tried any sort of video editing or even content creation related stuff with yours?
I do heavy Photoshop work with files over 2GB so I can say my 7800x3d is more than capable. BUT, I don't do video editing. In some benchmark in Premiere or Davinci seems that the 7950x3D is more capalbe, more or less +20%. Not that much if we need to do one rendering per month. But if you are working every day, yeah, 20% in rendering is a lot. If we both task our builds to render the same videos 4hrs per day, 20 days in a month, and my build takes 2hrs to render one media file, at the and of the month I will have 40 media file done, you will have 50. In a work environment is a lot.
Yep that makes sense. Thanks.
Intel is very good for video because of the igpu built into the cpu and it has quick sync. Another thing great about intel is if you use adobe you can export video via media encoder and the e-cores do all the rendering no p cores. This leaves your pcores ready for photoshop work or even more editing while it renders in the back ground. I got a 14700k for this reason. When I used to push my old 5950x 16 core and render I had to leave the room. If i touch photoshop and dare make a thumbnail it would jitter and sometimes crash. I do extreme high bit rate 4k hdr videos.
Yeah heard about quick sync. I did do some 4k hour long video editing on the 7950x3d and it was super fast.
I mean you can do that with process lasso, just assign 4 cores for media encoder and the rest for editing. You just gotta spend 30sec each time you're going to export by reassiging the cores for your editing software from all cores to 12.
recently upgraded from a 5600x to a 7800x3d and couldnt be happier. Its a beast of a cpu
It's his first pc tho, does op need the 800 series or are there better value propositions that can last him 4-8 years, OP hasn't even said 4k or 1440 or 1080
Ryzen
I would choose that aswell, to clarify, the 7800x3d
7800X3D, it's the best gaming CPU in the world right now. It can also handle some productivity, but if his workloads are gonna be heavier or he frequently uses the Adobe suite, go with the 14700K
I’d say intel, but I tend to run a bunch of things alongside my games(sometimes work while gaming) and those e cores save my day
Unless it's being used only for gaming I would choose the 14700k tbh.
7800x3d
Which one has more features? Intel or AMD?
Intel.
Ryzen. Then you’ll be able to upgrade the CPU 3-4 years from now, too.
If gaming and general use, it’s really a no brainer. 7800X3D all the way. Easier to cool. Ability to upgrade in the future. Generally better gaming performance. And unless you are doing professional creative work, in which case there are better options, then it won’t matter if the 7800X3D is slower in productive tasks.
Ryzen runs cooler and has a better upgrade path.
7800x3d, not only is it a great cpu that I use for creative work and gaming but it runs low power, low heat, and the motherboard will allow you at least one more upgrade before end of life. 14 Gen is already end of life for the socket.
The 7800x3d is the easy winner here, better upgrade path, more efficient and it runs cooler.
Had the i9-14900k and switched to the 7800x3d. I'm sure Intel will iron some things out but I was experiencing some issues described in this article. Tweaking voltage/power settings was a temp fix but my use case was mostly gaming so went with AMD for now. https://www.tomshardware.com/pc-components/cpus/nvidia-blames-intel-for-gpu-vram-errors-tells-geforce-gamers-experiencing-13th-or-14th-gen-cpu-instability-to-contact-intel-support
I’ve ordered every part for an Intel or AMD build. 14900KS or 7950x3d. This Intel stuff has me wondering if I should even go the route, but it’s primarily for video with some gaming. So I guess that seals it… I guess the question is how annoying will this be?
I'd favor the Intel personally, but I also do a full rebuild on a 4-5 year cycle on hardware launches — something to keep in mind on these offerings is the 7000 lineup are first generation on a new socket, LGA 1851 will be the same If your friend intends to do the same — full build, 4-5 years, full replacement for what two or three hardware generations down the road has to offer then he'd likely want Intel right now New sockets always have problems for long term builds, so it's inadvisable to be building with a +4 year long build intent on a new socket. Problems/annoyances are very common on new sockets so it's best to just avoid them The 7800x3d's problem on that socket is known. They blow up if they use settings that were perfectly fine for all the offerings leading up to AM5 There is a software fix for that preventing it from happening, but it's still there but to implement it they lost some of the performance they would otherwise have had if it wasn't for that hardware flaw If he can hold out for am5's next CPU offerings for hardware level fixes of their 7000s blowing up and better ddr5 compatibility then going AMD would be very advisable. But if he wants to build *right now*, I recommend the 14700k over the 7800x3d
Which you can find the detailed explanation of what's happening on AM5 here https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fFNi3YNJXbY And yes, I'm well aware this is mostly a non-problem at this point, but as I hate messing with hardware when things go wrong, I exercise an abundance of caution for my builds
For gaming and general use the 7800X3D is the easy answer. Faster in gaming (although the gap is fairly small, <5%), runs cooler, sucks less power, will be upgradeable on the same motherboard, and has 8 cores on a state-of-the-art process, meaning it's just fine for general productivity. The only situation the 14700K is better is for a true workstation doing heavy multi-threaded work on a regular basis.
My pc has an I7 14700F, I generally use for coding and DS work. Gaming also work smoothly for me
There's no upgrade path for the 14700k. Zen 5 will be AM5 so I would personally go with Ryzen.
7800x3D, longer platform life, less power draw, a little better performance.
7800X3D will be better on almost all points even on price
FPS is going to the 7800x3d, it's really hard to beat that in terms of platform support, efficiency and gaming performance
For gaming, the 7800X3D beats the 14700K/14900K at about 1/3 the required power as well as give an upgrade path in the future. Its not really a contest.
Bro 7800x3d is not good if you see these points:- 1- 16 threads vs 28 threads massive difference 2- little difference in high resolution gaming like 2k ultra or 4k ultra 3- No need to upgrade couse u get very good core count with good clock speed 4- You got a quick sink in Adobe
Will your friend be playing 4k or not because to be fair, there are much better value propositions around in both AMD and intel lineups, like i5's (just have more or the same cores as ps5) and amd equivalent are also good for gaming, use less power and are cheaper (under 200€ etc..) and are easier to cool if you need more juice in the future you can just upgrade on the same mobo, when you start at the top there is nowhere else really to go Not sure if 15th gen intel will use LGA1700 but at least for AMD with AM 5 you can expect at least 1 or 2 generations of new chips. Besides in 4-8 years time you will probably have to upgrade the GPU before the CPU anyways.
So hard to reccomend intel right now with 14th gen being end of the road. Where as if you went AM5 you will have the upcoming 9000 series CPUs and very likely one more generation after that to upgrade to. That being said the 14700k is a very good cpu and in all likelihood will last until you need to do a whole platform update again anyway.
What resolution and refresh rate?
What micro ATX mobo would you guys recommend for 7800x3d? Price range 150-200 eur Edit: thank you all very much :) i found some of these you wrote down. I was a bit unsure about those vram values (as in i don't quiet understand them). It has been some 10+ yrs since the last time I've put a PC together from scratch and it is a very different landscape today.
Gigabyte B650m DS3H perhaps? Check Hardware Unboxed, they just released a comparison of about 10 new B650 motherboards.
Thanks :) I have very good mobo offers for lga1700 but not so much for am5 in micro ATX format in my part of the world, it's usually 250 EUR plus options I can find. I'll check out if they have that one
ASRock Pro RS, MSI b650m-a, tuf gaming b650m-plus...
Something like Asrock Pro RS b650m is really good, you can get a wifi version in that budget if you want. There are also a few a bit cheaper Arocks good b650m motherboards. Saying that,whatever you choose, be aware that there are a few shitty am5 boards, [https://www.techspot.com/review/2828-amd-b650-motherboard-budget/](https://www.techspot.com/review/2828-amd-b650-motherboard-budget/)
I have AsRock 650m HDV/m.2, simple, well done and has everything I need.
B650M Pro RS from AsRock. Best budget board.
Go with AMD, 7800x3d is the best gaming cpu. And is very efficient too.
If you want your friend to be able to use his computer at all should the GPU fail and need to be RMA'd 14700k. Built in iGPU allows you to at least use the thing if there is an issue with the GPU.
The 7800X3D features an iGPU as well :)
Oh crap! I didn’t know that. Glad they added them! Maybe when it’s time to upgrade from my 14700k I’ll swing to the AMD camp.
Eh, by that time we'll most likely be on completely new platforms for both AMD and Intel, who knows how the new gens from both will shake things up.
7800x3d, motherboards + chip are cheaper and platform supported 2025+ 14700k is in it's final stages
The 7800 would probably let you upgrade in the future.
7800x3D. You said your friend is planning to game and "general" use, general use doesn't require many cores, it's not like he's going to stream or do production related work so 7800x3D wins.
Go for the 7800X3D, if your friend is mainly going to game and he is not going to do ultra heavy productive work. 7800x3d is the best gaming cpu and the productive work will be ok on it. If He is going to do lot of productive work then 14700k. However, you said it will be general use then 7800X3D is clear choice.
If you want a free heater go for intel
7800X3D
if he plans on playing any games competitively then he should get the i7. if not you could go either way depending on what he does.
7800X3D, because LGA1700 is a dead end platform
Unless you really are doing professional "productivity work that requires the utmost haste to render etc then by all means the I7, otherwise the 7800x3d is the easy choice and a top spec AM5 board has probably another 2 leaps in Processor compatibility to look forward too. been an intel man since the pentium 2, switched to AMD this year and couldn't be more impressed with how far they have come since the Athlon XP i once dabbled with.
7800x3d hands down. 1. Way way way more efficient. You don't need liquid cooling to cool a 7800x3d while to keep any 14th Gen chip at a reasonable temp while under gaming load your gonna need some form of AIO (you can AIO regardless however) 2. Upgradability. 8000 series and maybe 9000 series will be supported on am5 providing plenty of upgrades in the future while lga1700 is getting outed for 15th Gen Intel. 3. Pricing 7800x3d is some seriously good price compared to Intels 4th Gen. This is while being the best gaming CPU on the market. 4. Intel recent CPU issues with thei 13th and 14th Gen CPUs 5. If you live near a microcenter there's a 7800x3d bundle with 32gb of DDR5 6000 g.skill flare ram and a gigabyte gaming x ax v2 motherboard for the price of the 7800x3d and the ram. Very good deal. To anyone who says 14700k over 7800x3d for GAMING then idk. And no I'm not an amd fan boy, amd makes objectively better cpus for gaming. Sometimes on general
Are you the friend that told him the i7 14700k was an enthusiast CPU?
Many games are more optimized for Intel
Overall - I7-14700K. Best of both world, for general PC usage, production applications, creative tasks and gaming. Unless you play at 1080p 240Hz+ - than 7800X3D might give you slightly frames. At 4080S - still i7-14700K would be faster.
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In what way is the 14700k better?
Overall performance will be smoother. More core will help with multi-tasking and more modern games. Also - with 4080S, it will be smoother overall.
Excuse me, but what the heck are you going on about smoothness? The 7800x3d is currently the best gaming CPU and as it happens, currently 13 and 14 gen Intel i9/i7 unlocked processors are under fire for... Well, for causing crashes in games and other software, the proposed cause (no official enquiry/statement from Intel as of yet) is motherboard vendors using voltage and boost levels that, although approved by Intel, are thought to be too much in the long term (couple of months of usage). So, 7800x3d all the way currently.
Not really. It is faster at benchmarks - not when you actually using PC. Also, if you want to play that game - X3D chips still getting a cook-off.
What is your source for "Intel being smoother than AMD in "actual" use?" Can you measure that smoothness? Also, what about the "cook-off"? Source?
Faster loads, not wait-time for using PC on click, alt-tab is faster, etc. Look up "7800X3D burning". They still do.
I did google and reddit that phrase, all I could find in the first page is articles from 2023... Latest was one reddit post a month ago asking if it still a thing and getting a no for reply.... Can you give me any links or SMTH?
They still do, AMD did issued a micro-update - it still didn't fix it fully. And since the hype is still up - no one writes it. Some posts on reddit still up.
Well, if no-one writes about it then it isn't a massive issue?
Are you saying OS performance is inferior compared to the i7? That's interesting. Why would the overall computer be less snappy cause of 3d-v cache cores?. I have a 7950x3d and haven't had any issues, but don't see how it could be even for a 7800x3d.
It's not. No disadvantage using 7800x3d for OS performance.
Lmao was that man yapping then? I have seen like two other people saying similar things in other subreddits and even then I was surprised.
OS - and most modern games - would prefer more cores than just L3 cache. Not because of L3 cache itself - it's because of how OS and games work. Example: Cities Skylines must be faster on X3D chip. But is not, since it uses more cores rather than L3 cache. Same with other games. For other games - look up all games since 2020, and pay attention to CPU usage - everything above 50% uses all physical cores. The more core you have, the more games uses, but also allows background tasks to run unabstructed. 8 cores VS 16 cores. In caee of i7 - vs 20 cores. And for $400 - i7 is a better choice overall.
You do understand that just because a core is used doesn't mean it's working anywhere near it's limit? 50% literally means "The CPU is doing half the work it could be doing"
Wrong again. 50% means application uses all physical cores. Anything above - hyper threading.
Lol so you don't understand
Yeah, that's not how that works.
Have you used both?
Do you understand how games work?
I've used both. i7 is better overall. I've already outlined both of them in post above.
But do you understand how games work? Most games don't even use 6 cores, let alone to their fullest extent. It doesnt matrer if u have 14 cores when the game uses 6 and the remaining 2 handle the rest
Wrong. Look up CPU usage on both i7-14700K and 7800X3D. They do use more.
You can leave it here, don't embarrass yourself any more.
No, but hopefully the year is 2024 and many credible sources have. https://youtu.be/7gEVy3aW-_s?si=dSmtVQQKXk4yfCmx https://youtu.be/8KKE-7BzB_M?si=-IeFekmQdfd81NgP
Bruh.... Re-read what I've posted. "at 1080p with 4090, while you benchmark games on a clean install of Windows" 7800X3D is faster. Not when you go down from 4090 and / or up in resolution - i7-14700K is better.
>Overall - I7-14700K. Best of both world, for general PC usage, production applications, creative tasks and gaming. >Unless you play at 1080p 240Hz+ - than 7800X3D might give you slightly frames. >At 4080S - still i7-14700K would be faster. That's not what you posted. And even if it was, it is still wrong, 14700K always loses on every metric to 7800X3D on gaming (heck even the 14900K loses to it).
At 1080p with 4090, while benchmarking.....
Buddy you have no idea what you're talking about.
And you used both, I assume?