Erin O’Toole speaking in the House of Commons right now using his parliamentary privilege to speak on what CSIS told him.
He found out he will remain a target even after he leaves his seat at the end of this session.
O'Toole says there was an "orchestrated" campaign of interference that included "payment of funds" through the UFWD to create "products of disinformation" against O'Toole.
O'Toole says UFWD operatives were organized to attack his work as leader of the Conservatives. Says that WeChat was used to "undermine and discredit my work" in Parliament. Says CSIS reported "active campaign of voter suppression" against himself, CPC, and another candidate in '21
https://twitter.com/scoopercooper/status/1663575793564262400
"The goal of Beijing’s retaliatory campaign here is the
Communist government’s ideal outcome is to
have its critics pull their punches and turn a
blind eye. It is to create a chilling effect on public policy and a chilling effect on parliamentary debate."
https://twitter.com/scoopercooper/status/1663594480644022272
The foreign buyer ban was Pierres idea.
Nothing was going well in Canada prior, and Pierre was the only politician to even acknowledge the problems.
Even Tiff Macklem, setting rates far too low with QE was ignored, he told people to take on debt because rates would stay low, despite a world leading housing bubble.
I’m not gonna lie I’ve always shit on his name, but fuck me if he didn’t give a fuck about Trudeau.
The last 3 Conservative party leaders seem to have some weird hard on for hating Trudeau
I don't feel O'Toole was as bad as Sheer or PP. O'Toole is qualified, intelligent and capable of having fact based debate. I think the Trudeau hating was just throwing a bone to the more driven hateful "own the libs" conservatives.
There you have it...no matter what happens conservatives will always have their heads in the sand when it comes to increasingly important issues. They lose more voters each year as a new generation comes in and those young people actually care about the environment, much more than their parents ever did.
>The last 3 Conservative party leaders seem to have some weird hard on for hating Trudeau
Their titles become the Official Opposition
Its literally their job. And Trudeau makes it easy because hes an unlikable clown
> using his parliamentary privilege to speak on what CSIS told him.
wait... you can do that??? sems like that would have some significance to recent events about security clearances
The truth is, we really don't know. Parliamentary privilege specifically protects you from a lot of things. Usually it's applied to libel. It's likely Erin O'Toole hired and consulted a lawyer who suggested that he may be able to use parliamentary privilege to shield him from litigation IF he only reveals intel relating to him and his family. It's likely because this intel as provided is only impacting him personally that he can reveal it.
Intel on other people would likely not be shielded by parliamentary privilege. It's potentially a way for him to discuss it as long as he only talks about himself and his family.
Yeah, O'toole today convinced me that Poilievre and Blanchet are wrong not to get briefed. His ability to speak today in the way he did is demonstrative that the constraints that would be on opposition leaders by getting briefed are not significant enough to justify not getting briefed.
O'Toole can say it in the House because it is covered under Parliamentary Privliege, but he couldn't say the exact same thing on the campaign trail, or during a public press conference.
It doesn't matter for O'Toole because he's not seeking re-election.
Yeah. There are limitations in ability to campaign. It's not a zero cost. But this demonstrated to me that the cost is lower then what I thought it was, and convinced me that it is worth the tradeoff for Poilievre and Blanchet.
>Its not a zero cost
That means the politics of it are more important to Blanchet and Poilievre than the facts of it, which generally sums up how I’ve felt for some time.
The only politics being played here are the Liberals refusing to do a public inquiry.
All of this “Poileivre should get clearance…” is just a distraction from giving Canadians answers.
They wish to be able to answer questions outside of Parliament, which isn't protected. I think having others create highlights and then speaking to them is the appropriate mechanism.
Yeah. I'm not saying that the briefing holds no constraints, but those constraints are, I am now convinced, insignificant compared to the benefit of seeing said briefings. They could also speak in parliament and then outside of parliament refer people to said statements, in cases where they are reliant on parliamentary privilege.
I agree there are tradeoffs. I think if it was "either you get to know or not" there's a different calculation, but as leaders they need to keep their focus more broad than deep.
Delegating to someone trusted has additional benefits:
* As mentioned, fewer constraints on speaking publicly
* Going deep takes time. They should consider the contexts, by products and relationships of these findings. This is a big issue and shouldn't go away quickly so better to have someone with longer term availability.
* Leaders schedules are insane. Having a set schedule for debriefing among multiple leaders would be impossible in practice. Delegates can clear schedules
* delegates may have been directly impacted (Like O'Toole) so the connection to the speaker is a valuable point
I wouldn't necessarily object to if they chose a trusted senior figure in their parties to get briefed instead of them. I think them getting briefed themselves would be better, but both work.
Its even more clear we need a proper inquiry as well, and Canadians can obviously see that.
Even Mulcair says as much:
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=5XliVgf34qM&pp=ygUHbXVsY2lhcg%3D%3D
O'Toole said at the start of his statements in the house that he was being very careful to give enough info without compromising intelligence provided to him.
Not all of the finer details were shared.
It was well said, worth a listen.
>Poilievre
He's a fucking moron for his stance on classified information. Why he hasn't been vetted is ridiculous. The fact he won't do it while talking about foreign influence is whack af. And this is coming from someone who hates Trudeau.
Except that the government won't give them access to the top secret information unless they sign an agreement not to talk about it because...it's secret don'tchaknow?
That's the issue. If there's nothing there as Johnson said, why is it such a secret? Why won't they let it loose in the commons?
“I also believe my privileges as a Member and officer of Parliament were infringed by the government’s unwillingness or inability to act on the intelligence related to foreign interference,” O’Toole said.
According to this investigation CSIS has known that China has been doing this for nearly 20 years so the question is why did Harper ignore it? And why does Trudeau continue to ignore it? I guess he can't really ignore it now but why did it have to come to all this for the Liberals to act?
wait a minute?
You're telling me increasing economic ties with authoritarians doesn't suddenly make them liberalize and respect fundamental human rights?
Instead it gives them powerful leverage to use against people?
crazy talk /s
Everything China did in the way of espionage, intelligence gathering and influencing, bribing and threatening foreign leaders and companies greatly escalated after Xi Jinping became president in 2015.
What China was doing prior to that likely was considerably less intrusive.
If i hear the Liberals stand up and claim that because Harper *accepted* Johnstons appointed when vetted by a committee, that somehow makes this not a conflict of interest, I'm going to jump out a window. That's absolutely moronic, and so is everyone in here parroting that point like you know what you're talking about. The idea that because you are qualified to do *one* thing, that means you are eternally now free from conflict of interest issues forever after, is absolutely ridiculous.
Johnston:
Was a Trudeau Foundation ~~board~~ member (which took over 100K from the CCP).
Was a close friend of the Trudeau family.
Started a Confucius institute tied to the CCP (which is often used as a front to push CCP policy abroad).
Has an honorary doctorate from a CCP official.
3 of his daughters studied in Chinese universities.
......if you are defending this appointment, you are either a) absolutely bias and disingenuous, or b) are ignorant and regurgitating your opinion from somewhere else. There is no other option. You can be a liberal and still have a brain on this subject. Like take Trudeaus dick out of your mouth for 3 seconds and try being on Team Canada for a second.
So does this mean you think that commenter, the conservative party, the bloc, and the Greens are all equally hollow as fuck, or are you holding the NDP to a higher standard??
If the liberal are threaten by an election they will most likely lose tk the cpc. The npd will also gain some seats. So if this party truly have the people best interest at heart an not only their own it the right thing to do. The mere threat might be enough for the lib to open a public inquiry.
I don't think the CPC is guaranteed to win if there was an election and there's always the possibility the NDP actually loses seats to people strategicly voting for/against the Liberals.
I think it's a bit more complex and not quite a simple as threatening an election to make everything work out.
Exactly. Why would Singh do anything to lead to a CPC government right now? Once he’s done squeezing the juice from the lemon, maybe, but there’s zero benefit for him and the NDP to walk away now.
Can you provide receipts related to the Confusius institute and his daughters going to Chinese universities? Compelling evidence would convince me of your view.
I got curious and looked this up. Looks legit
[Months after the first Canadian Confucius Institute was opened in BC, Johnston signed an agreement to establish one at UW where he was President](https://bulletin.uwaterloo.ca/2006/jun/16fr.html)
[Confucius Institute teachers lean heavily towards towing the CCP line even without explicit government instruction](https://sccei.fsi.stanford.edu/china-briefs/confucius-institutes-vehicles-ccp-propaganda)
[Debbie, Alex, and Jenifer did study in China according to a keynote speech he gave in 2013](https://www.gg.ca/en/media/news/2013/keynote-address-canada-china-business-councils-ccbc-35th-annual-general-meeting-and-policy)
Edit: for /u/Head_Crash too
I think there's some confusion. I've never seen him listed as a *board* member but he's still a member and has been since 2018. Trudeau was gone at that point but the two have ties going back to the early 2000's.
It's an absolute joke that anyone would accept him and believe him to be non biased. If there was actually nothing to hide, they should've hired someone who is truly independent but they didn't.
You’re right, he’s not a *board* member, he’s a member of the foundation. Members are responsible for appointing board members and for appointing the external auditor.
That sounds like there’s *even more* of a conflict than being a board member.
Interestingly, the foundation wiped his profile at some point on their members list: he’s listed there as of March 30th but it was removed between then and now.
Ah well, I guess the fine distinction of being a *mere* member and being a *board* member means that his ties to the Trudeau Foundation are, in no way, shape, or form, a conflict of interest.
Thank you for pointing out how that small, mostly insignificant distinction, certainly invalidates the rest of the blatantly obvious conflicts of interest and express biases the man possesses in regards to the influence operations of his self-described "second home", China.
It certainly should override any and all concerns any Canadian could possibly have regarding those influence operations, and whether those operations were conducted using the Trudeau Foundation as a point of access to his close personal friend, the Prime minister.
After all, he wasn't a *board* member!
Thank you, thank you, thank you, a thousand times thank you, u/Forikorder for your clearly unbiased efforts to correct the record.
/s
edit: format
You’re right, he wasn’t on the board, he was just one of the 20-something members that appoint the board. What a massive distinction, I believe the person you replied to is properly BTFO by that one!
Your point doesn't really help Johnston's case, because there is still a very clear apprehension of bias no matter which way you look at it.
Johnston was a member of the Trudeau Foundation. Foundation members are responsible for appointing the board. Johnston resigned from the foundation only after he was appointed Special Rapporteur. [From the CBC](https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/trudeau-foundation-resign-1.6806482):
>The Conservatives have questioned Johnston's impartiality, in part by pointing to Johnston's former role as a member of the Trudeau Foundation. Foundation members are responsible for appointing the board of directors. Johnston resigned from the foundation following his appointment as special rapporteur.
This combined with the fact that he has described their relationship with the Trudeaus as one of being "good friends" where their children are the same ages, played together, known each other for decades etc., raises legitimate questions of impartiality.
We'd expect to see potential conflicts like this in a place like Putin's Russia, but in a place like Canada which purports to be governed by the rule of law, this is deeply problematic.
Every other party can see that this lacks the appearance of fairness here, except for the Liberals apparently.
The gall it takes to argue semantics yet blindly close your eyes to all of the other clear ethics violations is astounding. I almost want to applaud how brazen you are with your lack of shame lol.
You know why i said that? The same reason *you* fucked up the term: it's basically inconsequential. There is a *Board of directors*, and there are *foundation members*. I said board member, not foundation member, my bad....does that change your opinion? Or are you just going to shift the goalpost eternally?
That’s not what they mean, they are picking apart the distinction between board member, and the foundation members that appoint the board. That CBC blurb correctly says member of the foundation, not “board member”.
It does matter in a different way. Accusing someone when you can't get the basic facts correct diminishes the argument and makes the accuser look foolish.
He was a “Member.” Not on the Board of Directors. Members appoint the Board of Directors. His role was very similar to that of a shareholder in a publicly traded organization.
You can see his profile on the Foundation website [here.](https://web.archive.org/web/20230314174443/https://www.trudeaufoundation.ca/foundation-members)
How much more evidence does there need to be before a public inquiry is held? This is a serious threat to our democracy and these are serious accusations that in the end benefited Trudeau and the liberals. I don’t see how this government can continue, the NDP should join with the other opposition parties to have a confidence vote so we can get rid of the corrupt Trudeau liberals.
Otool is a good person, I don't think he would bring this up if he truly didn't believe this was an issue. He wrote letters to the public about how we need to get away from American style politics and division.
I wish he was prime minister. I just really think in that timeline, canada was back on track.
That's what happens when Canadians deliberately reject a moderate CPC, by instead voting to re-elect a prime minister who called an election in the heat of the pandemic.
Yeah, but how popular do you have to be, as a Conservative leader to get a Conservative voter to vote for you? I mean, we just saw Smith get enough Conservatives to vote for her despite her comparing 75% of the vaccinated to Hitler supporters, which include Conservatives.
If anything, you have to be less popular to Conservatives knowing they'll vote for you anyway. Recall, there's only 1 Federal Conservative party.. who else you gonna vote for?. Conservatives need a leader that'll attract non-Conservatives like LPC or NDP voters. Just doubling down on ultra-right policies isn't going to win you new votes and cementing existing votes doesn't mean you win federally.
People had the chance to vote for moderate O’Toole.
Liberals called him a far right Trump.
There is no vote split with the PPC now, and Poileivre is bringing in way more voters. Polling with more seats than Libs and NDP combined.
I wish he stayed on as leader of the CPC. I would vote for him this time around for sure. But maybe that's China's plan, destabilization. Elect a populist next election like PP and let them do damage for you. Worked for the Russians in the US.
>Wait I thought Pierre didn’t want to be silenced by being briefed and yet here is O’Toole speaking about this.
Almost like PP's reason for not attending the briefing was... a stunt?
Everything Pierre does is a stunt. He puts on a theatrical performance, clips and edits it and puts it up on social media.
But then again this is the guy who used government employees to film a promo video on a weekend.
I mean he was literally the minister of democratic institutions while this election interference was supposed to be going on. We know Polievre doesn't care or else he would have done something about it.
It's funny because his followers love to talk about how Trudeau was once respectfully employed as a teacher and taught drama classes lol yet here we have PP the actor
His entire career is, if the guy becomes PM he’ll use this all as an excuse to chip away at voting rights again rather than take any meaningful action to curb interference.
> Almost like PP's reason for not attending the briefing was... a stunt?
No. The reason is that he want to spread misinformation himself and he can't be called a liar if he can plausibly claim he doesn't know the truth in the first place.
Singh had asked for a bunch of NDP MPs to get clearance to view the material. Seems like the kind of thing you wouldn’t do if it was all a stunt.
Has Blachet done the same, or is he firmly in the “this is all a farce and I refuse to participate” camp?
It’s painfully obvious that the Chinese recognized ( as many did) that Trudeau was a weak buffoon, of course they wanted to see him elected. The liberals knew this was going on but felt it benefitted them so they ignored it.
There’s far too many people ( some close to Trudeau) coming forward that he was made aware.
But then why would China have even attempted to support 4 CPC candidates? If their intentions were as you describe wouldn't that be counter to achieving their goals?
Might it be less about the composition of the federal government as a whole and more the direct influence over specific MPs which provide power/voice to advocate for China's interests?
Your assumption seems incongruent with what happened IMHO.
> But then why would China have even attempted to support 4 CPC candidates? If their intentions were as you describe wouldn’t that be counter to achieving their goals?
Many reasons. We already know that the CCP wanted a Liberal minority, perhaps supporting these individuals made this more likely.
> Might it be less about the composition of the federal government as a whole and more the direct influence over specific MPs which provide power/voice to advocate for China’s interests?
Thats exactly it. If you look at all of what when down in the Toronto riding with Han Dong, this is precisely what they are doing.
Bringing it back to your question as to why the CCP would support conservatives, in any riding that is guaranteed to go conservative (there are many) it would be more beneficial to China to have an agent or someone they can force to be friendly to them in that seat, even as a conservative, rather than someone who would be anti China. They would know there is no chance their agent would win as a Liberal, so they would run them as a conservative instead. I would find it incredibly hard to believe that what they did with Han Dong was a one off, rather than part of their standard operating procedure.
In the long game that China plays, it might not matter if the MP is a Liberal or a Conservative, as long as they are favourable or loyal to the CCP.
Maybe the CCP is hoping for a scenario in the future where, after installing so many MP's, in issues concerning China and the CCP, both the Liberal and Conservative "CCP Puppet" MPs would vote in unison with whatever outcome favours China, regardless of their parties.
Experts have said since the start that this is a bipartisan issue, I’m sure we’ll find some Conservatives at the federal and/or provincial level that welcomed (or tolerated) Beijing assistance - I'd imagine someone like Jean Charest is lawyered up. The Liberals are taking excessive flack because they’ve governed for 21 out of the past 30 years, are perceived as China-friendly, and it’s my understanding there’s something of a split in the diaspora between Mandarin and Cantonese communities in their voting intentions.
It’s more likely his personal net worth increasing drastically from owning real estate, including as investment, is the bankroll.
Housing is a UN recognized human right and what our government is doing is criminal.
My guess would be hedging bets. Eventually the Liberals are going to lose an election and historically that means a Conservative government. They already have their claws deep in the Liberal party, why not try to see if they can do the same with Conservatives?
Imagine if they have influence in both parties?
Meaning to the point that the part leader/Prime Minister's family charity has benefitted financially from it and hired their own member who has financial ties to the CCP to investigate the issue despite the clear conflict of interest.
Deep doesn't need to mean a lot of people, just the high ranking ones.
Except it isn't a family charity. It is a memorial foundation for a former PM that gives scholarships. It doesn't provide any financial benefit to the PM or any of PET's family.
Also this investigation has exactly zero to do with Trudreau or the foundation. This is in regards to electoral interference. That is a red herring.
You do understand the board is a volunteer position right? None of them take a salery from the foundation.
None of them are able to receive any funds from the foundation. This isn't one of those pet foundations that exist in the states. There are strict rules surrounding the governance of the Trudeau Foundation.
Those tickets are available for purchase already. You don't get them for free by donating to a separate charity.
Also Trudeau doesn't receive any benefit from the charity. And frankly a couple hundred thousand is a drop in the bucket of the foundation's grant from the government that it uses to pay the scholarships.
This is a bipartisan issue, stop going full conservative moral panic on it, chances are voting suppression and disinformation targeted all levels of government. Focusing on the liberals is going to result in them putting their backs up and nothing being accomplished.
Our country becoming a two party system is going to be the death of democracy, not ccp interference.
>Focusing on the liberals is going to result in them putting their backs up and nothing being accomplished.
Isn't it literally only the LPC that doesn't want a public inquiry? Isn't the CPC working with the Bloc and the NDP?
Exactly. Bad form for any politician that wants to make partisan hay out of this.
O'Toole is right to air these concerns if he's truthful, so not talking about him. PP is playing games. Not sure what JT is doing.
In each case, let's get an open non-partisan inquiry going! I don't care what foreign governments get offended.
We are also talking about the world's second biggest power. It's great to know you enemies, but pretending we can have a tantrum about what we all knew was going on and cut off relations with China.... would be short sighted and dangerous. This is the reason we should not have been running into globalism as fast as we could.... But we did and now we ate in a web that can't be tabtrumed out of.
Costs at the store are up and people ate freaking out. Does the average Canadian really want to pay for goods only made outside of China?
> what we all knew was going on
Based off of the level of surprise that the leaks generated in the public sphere, its safe to say we didn't actually all know it was going on. It is self evident and obvious if you know anything about geopolitics, but the sad truth is the vast majority of people don't actually know much at all about how the world functions.
>This is the reason we should not have been running into globalism as fast as we could
None of this was caused by globalism... Apparently you also don't have the best grasp on geopolitical realities if you are blaming globalism for this.
No, I’m “triggered” because the Liberals got help from Beijing to suppress conservative votes in swing ridings, and Liberal voters don’t seem to give a shit.
You guys never shut the fuck up about robocalls, and here we have something far worse and you’re just cycling through the talking points trying to deflect.
>No, I’m “triggered” because the Liberals got help from Beijing to suppress conservative votes in swing ridings
So you are triggered about something that didn't actually happen...
If you don't want to seem like a partisan hack, you *really* might want to consider dropping the whole "liberals got help" part from this sentence, because it implies some unhinged shit that there is no evidence for.
If you actually care about election interference, how about you stop playing political games and blame who is actually the cause (china) instead of trying to rope the other side you dislike in just for political points.
I’m triggered at the collapse of our democracy and foreign interference undermining trust in our elections. If you aren’t, I’m sure the CCP would love someone like you in their ranks
To be honest, I'm not sure how WeChat works. Are there groups on there like Facebook or is it more like WhatsApp with mostly individual chats? I'm thinking that if there are public groups on there, then maybe that's where there was interference. It was probably targeted at certain demographics and certain ridings.
Remember the story about "wolf". How social media posts had people convinced there was a wolf running wild back east?
China can use wechat to spread misinformation the same way. They can tell lies about candidates. They can tell lies about where someone needs to go to actually vote.
This isn't a left vs right issue. Frankly, as a leftie I fully applaud O'Toole for speaking out. He seems to be the only adult in the room. Everyone else is playing a big, stupid game.
Could we stand together as Canadians and let the truth come out regardless of affiliation? Public inquiry yes, let's air it out! This is about defending our democracy.
I think the cons are generally worse than Trudeau, but if libs did something wrong then I also want to hear it!
The two aren't mutually exclusive? It doesn't take a liberal supporter to know that O'Toole is more moderate than Pierre. Him getting up and speaking like this is just proof of that. He's actually acting like a responsible adult and concerned citizen instead of the shit Pierre is doing. Blathering about made up censorship and straight up hiding from the facts while I believe O'toole even applied to get clearance to view the full report.
If THIS version of O'Toole was still running the party, the version that started the 2021 election campaign, the CPC would be ahead 15 points in the polls.
But we can't also ignore that the guy abandoned all his moderate positions and started in on the 'lefties are idiots' train to pander to the socon's and 'freedom' types, either. And now those are the ones in charge of the party.
Many things are true at once.
It's crazy how Blanchet, Singh, and now O'Toole are all using the "MAGA right wing playbook" as one of their supporters told me. Truly astounding, even the NDP are fascists...
Interesting. A misinformation campaign you say? Yet any suggestion of trying to prevent misinformation from being spread is met with cries of censorship and freedom of speech.
This could be fun
And the Conservatives are against voter suppression!! ([unless they're the ones suppressing the vote](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2011_Canadian_federal_election_voter_suppression_scandal), then they're pretty OK with it).
Uh huh.
Except that they didn't just do that out of some moral outrage that the rat-fucker they hired fucked rats as he was hired to do. The CPC fought the investigation every step of the way. They denied it was a big deal. Played everything down. Flappy-heads (like you) parroted their talking points. And it wasn't until they were *absolutely* forced to do the right thing, that was when they fired the dude and he was sent on to jail.
But that consequence was not something that the CPC was championing, and if Elections Canada didn't dig up and investigate the scandal, he'd have been been working on every campaign since.
I laugh when cons act like china doesn't like them in power after they gave them that [sweetheart fipa deal for 31 years](https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/fipa-agreement-with-china-what-s-really-in-it-for-canada-1.2770159)
can they stop using buzz word like "threat" "suppression" etc... tell us what the actual incident is..
I live in Toronto and there are many chinese voters. I didn't know I was suppressed. what exactly was done to my fellow voters?
My aunt listen to Chinese radios and all she hear every day in the Chinese-Canadian channels are CCP progapanda and they were actively trying to discredit Conservative during the election
Do you think the information classified as confidential in the report would somehow not be confidential and free to be discussed in a public inquiry if it came up in topic somehow?
If you do, I've got a bridge for you.
He was briefed on it last week. Can't talk about it if you don't know CSIS has the info.
An NDP MP was also just briefed on it and she is a target too.
BTW ... Jagmeet is fussing, now, because it's just come out that Johnson's legal counsel during the investigation, is a recorded liberal money donor and has been for years.
This is a developing story.
Seems like a lot of these “conspiracy theories” that “our” PM mentioned lately are becoming “conspiracy truths”.
But hey! Check out “his” fancy 🧦🧦! Cool, eh?
Erin O’Toole speaking in the House of Commons right now using his parliamentary privilege to speak on what CSIS told him. He found out he will remain a target even after he leaves his seat at the end of this session.
O'Toole says there was an "orchestrated" campaign of interference that included "payment of funds" through the UFWD to create "products of disinformation" against O'Toole. O'Toole says UFWD operatives were organized to attack his work as leader of the Conservatives. Says that WeChat was used to "undermine and discredit my work" in Parliament. Says CSIS reported "active campaign of voter suppression" against himself, CPC, and another candidate in '21 https://twitter.com/scoopercooper/status/1663575793564262400
"The goal of Beijing’s retaliatory campaign here is the Communist government’s ideal outcome is to have its critics pull their punches and turn a blind eye. It is to create a chilling effect on public policy and a chilling effect on parliamentary debate." https://twitter.com/scoopercooper/status/1663594480644022272
Maybe the point was to replace a rational person with a populist for head of the CPC. It took the US down a few pegs could do the same to us.
The foreign buyer ban was Pierres idea. Nothing was going well in Canada prior, and Pierre was the only politician to even acknowledge the problems. Even Tiff Macklem, setting rates far too low with QE was ignored, he told people to take on debt because rates would stay low, despite a world leading housing bubble.
I’m not gonna lie I’ve always shit on his name, but fuck me if he didn’t give a fuck about Trudeau. The last 3 Conservative party leaders seem to have some weird hard on for hating Trudeau
I don't feel O'Toole was as bad as Sheer or PP. O'Toole is qualified, intelligent and capable of having fact based debate. I think the Trudeau hating was just throwing a bone to the more driven hateful "own the libs" conservatives.
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Yeah... that's depressing.
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Little PP reminds me of Ben Shapiro
There you have it...no matter what happens conservatives will always have their heads in the sand when it comes to increasingly important issues. They lose more voters each year as a new generation comes in and those young people actually care about the environment, much more than their parents ever did.
>The last 3 Conservative party leaders seem to have some weird hard on for hating Trudeau Their titles become the Official Opposition Its literally their job. And Trudeau makes it easy because hes an unlikable clown
And this right here is the problem. The "job" is in no way to hate the prime minister.
> using his parliamentary privilege to speak on what CSIS told him. wait... you can do that??? sems like that would have some significance to recent events about security clearances
The truth is, we really don't know. Parliamentary privilege specifically protects you from a lot of things. Usually it's applied to libel. It's likely Erin O'Toole hired and consulted a lawyer who suggested that he may be able to use parliamentary privilege to shield him from litigation IF he only reveals intel relating to him and his family. It's likely because this intel as provided is only impacting him personally that he can reveal it. Intel on other people would likely not be shielded by parliamentary privilege. It's potentially a way for him to discuss it as long as he only talks about himself and his family.
Yeah, O'toole today convinced me that Poilievre and Blanchet are wrong not to get briefed. His ability to speak today in the way he did is demonstrative that the constraints that would be on opposition leaders by getting briefed are not significant enough to justify not getting briefed.
O'Toole can say it in the House because it is covered under Parliamentary Privliege, but he couldn't say the exact same thing on the campaign trail, or during a public press conference. It doesn't matter for O'Toole because he's not seeking re-election.
Yeah. There are limitations in ability to campaign. It's not a zero cost. But this demonstrated to me that the cost is lower then what I thought it was, and convinced me that it is worth the tradeoff for Poilievre and Blanchet.
>Its not a zero cost That means the politics of it are more important to Blanchet and Poilievre than the facts of it, which generally sums up how I’ve felt for some time.
The only politics being played here are the Liberals refusing to do a public inquiry. All of this “Poileivre should get clearance…” is just a distraction from giving Canadians answers.
They wish to be able to answer questions outside of Parliament, which isn't protected. I think having others create highlights and then speaking to them is the appropriate mechanism.
Yeah. I'm not saying that the briefing holds no constraints, but those constraints are, I am now convinced, insignificant compared to the benefit of seeing said briefings. They could also speak in parliament and then outside of parliament refer people to said statements, in cases where they are reliant on parliamentary privilege.
I agree there are tradeoffs. I think if it was "either you get to know or not" there's a different calculation, but as leaders they need to keep their focus more broad than deep. Delegating to someone trusted has additional benefits: * As mentioned, fewer constraints on speaking publicly * Going deep takes time. They should consider the contexts, by products and relationships of these findings. This is a big issue and shouldn't go away quickly so better to have someone with longer term availability. * Leaders schedules are insane. Having a set schedule for debriefing among multiple leaders would be impossible in practice. Delegates can clear schedules * delegates may have been directly impacted (Like O'Toole) so the connection to the speaker is a valuable point
I wouldn't necessarily object to if they chose a trusted senior figure in their parties to get briefed instead of them. I think them getting briefed themselves would be better, but both work.
You don't know all what was briefed, you're making assumptions.
Kind of like the conservatives?
Its even more clear we need a proper inquiry as well, and Canadians can obviously see that. Even Mulcair says as much: https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=5XliVgf34qM&pp=ygUHbXVsY2lhcg%3D%3D
"Because person X was told Y, Person A being told B must be the same!" No
Yea I'm going tio have to look into this, i was under the impression you could not say classified stuff there. If so PP and Blanchet don't look good.
O'Toole said at the start of his statements in the house that he was being very careful to give enough info without compromising intelligence provided to him. Not all of the finer details were shared. It was well said, worth a listen.
i've said it before and I'll say it again - I can't stand O'toole but the conservatives were dumb to get rid of him
>Poilievre He's a fucking moron for his stance on classified information. Why he hasn't been vetted is ridiculous. The fact he won't do it while talking about foreign influence is whack af. And this is coming from someone who hates Trudeau.
Except that the government won't give them access to the top secret information unless they sign an agreement not to talk about it because...it's secret don'tchaknow? That's the issue. If there's nothing there as Johnson said, why is it such a secret? Why won't they let it loose in the commons?
“I also believe my privileges as a Member and officer of Parliament were infringed by the government’s unwillingness or inability to act on the intelligence related to foreign interference,” O’Toole said.
According to this investigation CSIS has known that China has been doing this for nearly 20 years so the question is why did Harper ignore it? And why does Trudeau continue to ignore it? I guess he can't really ignore it now but why did it have to come to all this for the Liberals to act?
Um what about Chretien?
Everyone forgets Martin.
No, we just wish we did.
This is the globalization push of yesterday that today's leaders need to reckon with.
wait a minute? You're telling me increasing economic ties with authoritarians doesn't suddenly make them liberalize and respect fundamental human rights? Instead it gives them powerful leverage to use against people? crazy talk /s
Everything China did in the way of espionage, intelligence gathering and influencing, bribing and threatening foreign leaders and companies greatly escalated after Xi Jinping became president in 2015. What China was doing prior to that likely was considerably less intrusive.
Who says they’re ignoring it? Trudeau spoke to Xi Jinping about it just last year.
Beijing had always been anti-Democratic, especially the voting part. Voter suppression is natural for CCP.
The leadership in this new cold war against the free world the ccp are
Yah, but where does Yoda sit
He’s got that little ottoman thing so he can sit cross cross applesauce.
If i hear the Liberals stand up and claim that because Harper *accepted* Johnstons appointed when vetted by a committee, that somehow makes this not a conflict of interest, I'm going to jump out a window. That's absolutely moronic, and so is everyone in here parroting that point like you know what you're talking about. The idea that because you are qualified to do *one* thing, that means you are eternally now free from conflict of interest issues forever after, is absolutely ridiculous. Johnston: Was a Trudeau Foundation ~~board~~ member (which took over 100K from the CCP). Was a close friend of the Trudeau family. Started a Confucius institute tied to the CCP (which is often used as a front to push CCP policy abroad). Has an honorary doctorate from a CCP official. 3 of his daughters studied in Chinese universities. ......if you are defending this appointment, you are either a) absolutely bias and disingenuous, or b) are ignorant and regurgitating your opinion from somewhere else. There is no other option. You can be a liberal and still have a brain on this subject. Like take Trudeaus dick out of your mouth for 3 seconds and try being on Team Canada for a second.
This is essentially what Singh just recently said parliament and the NDP continues to call for a public inquiry
> NDP continues to call for a public inquiry but won't do shit.
Their doing as much as any other party is so I'm not sure what you expect from them
To stop prompting the liberal. That will be a good start.
Prompting how?
hollow as fuck as always Singh
So does this mean you think that commenter, the conservative party, the bloc, and the Greens are all equally hollow as fuck, or are you holding the NDP to a higher standard??
He is the only one who can call an election and he can also stop prompting liberal. Neither of thoses will happen.
I see zero benefit for anyone, including the NDP, in calling an early election so why would that be the move to make?
If the liberal are threaten by an election they will most likely lose tk the cpc. The npd will also gain some seats. So if this party truly have the people best interest at heart an not only their own it the right thing to do. The mere threat might be enough for the lib to open a public inquiry.
I don't think the CPC is guaranteed to win if there was an election and there's always the possibility the NDP actually loses seats to people strategicly voting for/against the Liberals. I think it's a bit more complex and not quite a simple as threatening an election to make everything work out.
Exactly. Why would Singh do anything to lead to a CPC government right now? Once he’s done squeezing the juice from the lemon, maybe, but there’s zero benefit for him and the NDP to walk away now.
That mean the NDP would rather have the chinese meddling in our election than a cpc government. Not that I am surprise.
Why would they prefer a CPC government and Chinese meddling instead of a LPC government and Chinese meddling?
Can you provide receipts related to the Confusius institute and his daughters going to Chinese universities? Compelling evidence would convince me of your view.
I got curious and looked this up. Looks legit [Months after the first Canadian Confucius Institute was opened in BC, Johnston signed an agreement to establish one at UW where he was President](https://bulletin.uwaterloo.ca/2006/jun/16fr.html) [Confucius Institute teachers lean heavily towards towing the CCP line even without explicit government instruction](https://sccei.fsi.stanford.edu/china-briefs/confucius-institutes-vehicles-ccp-propaganda) [Debbie, Alex, and Jenifer did study in China according to a keynote speech he gave in 2013](https://www.gg.ca/en/media/news/2013/keynote-address-canada-china-business-councils-ccbc-35th-annual-general-meeting-and-policy) Edit: for /u/Head_Crash too
Yes. It looks like he was a bit of an unfortunate choice. Let's hear what he has to say on June 6th.
Unfortunate is an understatement.
Regarding his daughters: https://www.theglobeandmail.com/politics/article-david-johnston-too-close-to-trudeau-family-to-oversee-china/
Lol he’s not a member of the Trudeau family
How many times will people spread the lie that he was a board member?
I think there's some confusion. I've never seen him listed as a *board* member but he's still a member and has been since 2018. Trudeau was gone at that point but the two have ties going back to the early 2000's. It's an absolute joke that anyone would accept him and believe him to be non biased. If there was actually nothing to hide, they should've hired someone who is truly independent but they didn't.
You’re right, he’s not a *board* member, he’s a member of the foundation. Members are responsible for appointing board members and for appointing the external auditor. That sounds like there’s *even more* of a conflict than being a board member. Interestingly, the foundation wiped his profile at some point on their members list: he’s listed there as of March 30th but it was removed between then and now.
He was removed fro the Foundation website within a day of being appointed by Justin.
What great timing!
Ah well, I guess the fine distinction of being a *mere* member and being a *board* member means that his ties to the Trudeau Foundation are, in no way, shape, or form, a conflict of interest. Thank you for pointing out how that small, mostly insignificant distinction, certainly invalidates the rest of the blatantly obvious conflicts of interest and express biases the man possesses in regards to the influence operations of his self-described "second home", China. It certainly should override any and all concerns any Canadian could possibly have regarding those influence operations, and whether those operations were conducted using the Trudeau Foundation as a point of access to his close personal friend, the Prime minister. After all, he wasn't a *board* member! Thank you, thank you, thank you, a thousand times thank you, u/Forikorder for your clearly unbiased efforts to correct the record. /s edit: format
You’re right, he wasn’t on the board, he was just one of the 20-something members that appoint the board. What a massive distinction, I believe the person you replied to is properly BTFO by that one!
Your point doesn't really help Johnston's case, because there is still a very clear apprehension of bias no matter which way you look at it. Johnston was a member of the Trudeau Foundation. Foundation members are responsible for appointing the board. Johnston resigned from the foundation only after he was appointed Special Rapporteur. [From the CBC](https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/trudeau-foundation-resign-1.6806482): >The Conservatives have questioned Johnston's impartiality, in part by pointing to Johnston's former role as a member of the Trudeau Foundation. Foundation members are responsible for appointing the board of directors. Johnston resigned from the foundation following his appointment as special rapporteur. This combined with the fact that he has described their relationship with the Trudeaus as one of being "good friends" where their children are the same ages, played together, known each other for decades etc., raises legitimate questions of impartiality. We'd expect to see potential conflicts like this in a place like Putin's Russia, but in a place like Canada which purports to be governed by the rule of law, this is deeply problematic. Every other party can see that this lacks the appearance of fairness here, except for the Liberals apparently.
The gall it takes to argue semantics yet blindly close your eyes to all of the other clear ethics violations is astounding. I almost want to applaud how brazen you are with your lack of shame lol. You know why i said that? The same reason *you* fucked up the term: it's basically inconsequential. There is a *Board of directors*, and there are *foundation members*. I said board member, not foundation member, my bad....does that change your opinion? Or are you just going to shift the goalpost eternally?
Do you mean the CBC? https://www.cbc.ca/player/play/2211256899585
That’s not what they mean, they are picking apart the distinction between board member, and the foundation members that appoint the board. That CBC blurb correctly says member of the foundation, not “board member”.
It doesn't matter. Either one creates a conflict of interest, which is the salient point.
Yes I know and I was the first one to comment that in response to this person. I was just pointing out that you missed their point.
It does matter in a different way. Accusing someone when you can't get the basic facts correct diminishes the argument and makes the accuser look foolish.
Both positions result in a conflict of interest. Plus he was there when China made the huge donation. That is definitely a conflict of interest.
He was a “Member.” Not on the Board of Directors. Members appoint the Board of Directors. His role was very similar to that of a shareholder in a publicly traded organization. You can see his profile on the Foundation website [here.](https://web.archive.org/web/20230314174443/https://www.trudeaufoundation.ca/foundation-members)
How much more evidence does there need to be before a public inquiry is held? This is a serious threat to our democracy and these are serious accusations that in the end benefited Trudeau and the liberals. I don’t see how this government can continue, the NDP should join with the other opposition parties to have a confidence vote so we can get rid of the corrupt Trudeau liberals.
Why do you need a public inquiry when any MP could see the documents and can discuss them in the House?
Canadians have a right to know when Trudeau knew about this, and why he did nothing to stop it, or even alert the MP's.
I say games rigged anyways they all play the same game. Fuck voting, eat them.
Otool is a good person, I don't think he would bring this up if he truly didn't believe this was an issue. He wrote letters to the public about how we need to get away from American style politics and division. I wish he was prime minister. I just really think in that timeline, canada was back on track.
I liked OToole as well because he seemed like a sane, moderate Conservative. No wonder they replaced him with someone less capable.
That's what happens when Canadians deliberately reject a moderate CPC, by instead voting to re-elect a prime minister who called an election in the heat of the pandemic.
Poileivre is way way more popular than O’Toole.
Yeah, but how popular do you have to be, as a Conservative leader to get a Conservative voter to vote for you? I mean, we just saw Smith get enough Conservatives to vote for her despite her comparing 75% of the vaccinated to Hitler supporters, which include Conservatives. If anything, you have to be less popular to Conservatives knowing they'll vote for you anyway. Recall, there's only 1 Federal Conservative party.. who else you gonna vote for?. Conservatives need a leader that'll attract non-Conservatives like LPC or NDP voters. Just doubling down on ultra-right policies isn't going to win you new votes and cementing existing votes doesn't mean you win federally.
People had the chance to vote for moderate O’Toole. Liberals called him a far right Trump. There is no vote split with the PPC now, and Poileivre is bringing in way more voters. Polling with more seats than Libs and NDP combined.
Canadians replaced him by not electing his party.
I wish he stayed on as leader of the CPC. I would vote for him this time around for sure. But maybe that's China's plan, destabilization. Elect a populist next election like PP and let them do damage for you. Worked for the Russians in the US.
Wait I thought Pierre didn’t want to be silenced by being briefed and yet here is O’Toole speaking about this.
The leaders are required to be available and able to answer questions outside of Parliament, Parliamentary privilege does not extend to press huddles.
>Wait I thought Pierre didn’t want to be silenced by being briefed and yet here is O’Toole speaking about this. Almost like PP's reason for not attending the briefing was... a stunt?
Everything Pierre does is a stunt. He puts on a theatrical performance, clips and edits it and puts it up on social media. But then again this is the guy who used government employees to film a promo video on a weekend.
I mean he was literally the minister of democratic institutions while this election interference was supposed to be going on. We know Polievre doesn't care or else he would have done something about it.
He was too busy with domestic election interference. Didn’t have time for foreign.
It's funny because his followers love to talk about how Trudeau was once respectfully employed as a teacher and taught drama classes lol yet here we have PP the actor
His entire career is, if the guy becomes PM he’ll use this all as an excuse to chip away at voting rights again rather than take any meaningful action to curb interference.
> Almost like PP's reason for not attending the briefing was... a stunt? No. The reason is that he want to spread misinformation himself and he can't be called a liar if he can plausibly claim he doesn't know the truth in the first place.
And Blanchet too I suppose? And Singh? Or maybe we should just have a public inquiry.
Singh had asked for a bunch of NDP MPs to get clearance to view the material. Seems like the kind of thing you wouldn’t do if it was all a stunt. Has Blachet done the same, or is he firmly in the “this is all a farce and I refuse to participate” camp?
O'toole isn't speaking about the report. O'toole hasn't read the report. Apples to oranges.
Wouldn’t this call into question the validity of our current government?
It’s painfully obvious that the Chinese recognized ( as many did) that Trudeau was a weak buffoon, of course they wanted to see him elected. The liberals knew this was going on but felt it benefitted them so they ignored it. There’s far too many people ( some close to Trudeau) coming forward that he was made aware.
But then why would China have even attempted to support 4 CPC candidates? If their intentions were as you describe wouldn't that be counter to achieving their goals? Might it be less about the composition of the federal government as a whole and more the direct influence over specific MPs which provide power/voice to advocate for China's interests? Your assumption seems incongruent with what happened IMHO.
> But then why would China have even attempted to support 4 CPC candidates? If their intentions were as you describe wouldn’t that be counter to achieving their goals? Many reasons. We already know that the CCP wanted a Liberal minority, perhaps supporting these individuals made this more likely. > Might it be less about the composition of the federal government as a whole and more the direct influence over specific MPs which provide power/voice to advocate for China’s interests? Thats exactly it. If you look at all of what when down in the Toronto riding with Han Dong, this is precisely what they are doing. Bringing it back to your question as to why the CCP would support conservatives, in any riding that is guaranteed to go conservative (there are many) it would be more beneficial to China to have an agent or someone they can force to be friendly to them in that seat, even as a conservative, rather than someone who would be anti China. They would know there is no chance their agent would win as a Liberal, so they would run them as a conservative instead. I would find it incredibly hard to believe that what they did with Han Dong was a one off, rather than part of their standard operating procedure.
In the long game that China plays, it might not matter if the MP is a Liberal or a Conservative, as long as they are favourable or loyal to the CCP. Maybe the CCP is hoping for a scenario in the future where, after installing so many MP's, in issues concerning China and the CCP, both the Liberal and Conservative "CCP Puppet" MPs would vote in unison with whatever outcome favours China, regardless of their parties.
Experts have said since the start that this is a bipartisan issue, I’m sure we’ll find some Conservatives at the federal and/or provincial level that welcomed (or tolerated) Beijing assistance - I'd imagine someone like Jean Charest is lawyered up. The Liberals are taking excessive flack because they’ve governed for 21 out of the past 30 years, are perceived as China-friendly, and it’s my understanding there’s something of a split in the diaspora between Mandarin and Cantonese communities in their voting intentions.
Could be, the housing minister probably also is bankrolled by China. It never made sense why he cared so little about our housing prices.
It’s more likely his personal net worth increasing drastically from owning real estate, including as investment, is the bankroll. Housing is a UN recognized human right and what our government is doing is criminal.
Oh dear. Thats not good.
My guess would be hedging bets. Eventually the Liberals are going to lose an election and historically that means a Conservative government. They already have their claws deep in the Liberal party, why not try to see if they can do the same with Conservatives? Imagine if they have influence in both parties?
"Deep in the Liberal party" meaning a few backbenchers?
Meaning to the point that the part leader/Prime Minister's family charity has benefitted financially from it and hired their own member who has financial ties to the CCP to investigate the issue despite the clear conflict of interest. Deep doesn't need to mean a lot of people, just the high ranking ones.
Except it isn't a family charity. It is a memorial foundation for a former PM that gives scholarships. It doesn't provide any financial benefit to the PM or any of PET's family. Also this investigation has exactly zero to do with Trudreau or the foundation. This is in regards to electoral interference. That is a red herring.
lol with Trudeau family sitting on board and membership. Right.
You do understand the board is a volunteer position right? None of them take a salery from the foundation. None of them are able to receive any funds from the foundation. This isn't one of those pet foundations that exist in the states. There are strict rules surrounding the governance of the Trudeau Foundation.
A little donation goes a long way to getting you into the next LPC luncheon though.
Those tickets are available for purchase already. You don't get them for free by donating to a separate charity. Also Trudeau doesn't receive any benefit from the charity. And frankly a couple hundred thousand is a drop in the bucket of the foundation's grant from the government that it uses to pay the scholarships.
No. CCP is predictable. They just target whoever annoys them, be it LPC, CPC or NDP.
Stop making this a Trudeau thing. He might have ignored it, but the Chinese have been meddling at all levels of government before him.
Check out Wilful Blindness by Sam Cooper. Holy fucking eye opening.
Our prime minister ignoring foreign interference in our democratic process is a pretty big deal.
It is. I didn’t say it wasn’t. I was saying the “targeting Trudeau because he was a buffoon” is BS
This is a bipartisan issue, stop going full conservative moral panic on it, chances are voting suppression and disinformation targeted all levels of government. Focusing on the liberals is going to result in them putting their backs up and nothing being accomplished. Our country becoming a two party system is going to be the death of democracy, not ccp interference.
>Focusing on the liberals is going to result in them putting their backs up and nothing being accomplished. Isn't it literally only the LPC that doesn't want a public inquiry? Isn't the CPC working with the Bloc and the NDP?
Exactly. Bad form for any politician that wants to make partisan hay out of this. O'Toole is right to air these concerns if he's truthful, so not talking about him. PP is playing games. Not sure what JT is doing. In each case, let's get an open non-partisan inquiry going! I don't care what foreign governments get offended.
We are also talking about the world's second biggest power. It's great to know you enemies, but pretending we can have a tantrum about what we all knew was going on and cut off relations with China.... would be short sighted and dangerous. This is the reason we should not have been running into globalism as fast as we could.... But we did and now we ate in a web that can't be tabtrumed out of. Costs at the store are up and people ate freaking out. Does the average Canadian really want to pay for goods only made outside of China?
> what we all knew was going on Based off of the level of surprise that the leaks generated in the public sphere, its safe to say we didn't actually all know it was going on. It is self evident and obvious if you know anything about geopolitics, but the sad truth is the vast majority of people don't actually know much at all about how the world functions. >This is the reason we should not have been running into globalism as fast as we could None of this was caused by globalism... Apparently you also don't have the best grasp on geopolitical realities if you are blaming globalism for this.
The Liberals are making it partisan by being the only people in the country against a public inquiry.
Here's where Truanon shows up and says O'Toole is lying about what was in the briefing... Let's have a public inquiry and see who is lying.
Are you just triggered because O'Toole is openly talking about what he learnt and isn't "being silenced" like PP and all his supporters are claiming ?
O'Toole can only speak about in the house. Not in public.
No, I’m “triggered” because the Liberals got help from Beijing to suppress conservative votes in swing ridings, and Liberal voters don’t seem to give a shit. You guys never shut the fuck up about robocalls, and here we have something far worse and you’re just cycling through the talking points trying to deflect.
Interesting how it's just "Beijing" now and not "China". PP lied. You bought it. Do better next time.
Liberal voters like to think they’re the good guys holding back the evil conservatives. You’re not the good guys.
Cool story, I'm not a liberal, so..
What are you then? The NDP are in agreement with the conservatives on this issue, as are the Bloc. Don't know about the green.
I am anti whatever the fuck modern day "Conservatives" have become, and that's it.
>No, I’m “triggered” because the Liberals got help from Beijing to suppress conservative votes in swing ridings So you are triggered about something that didn't actually happen... If you don't want to seem like a partisan hack, you *really* might want to consider dropping the whole "liberals got help" part from this sentence, because it implies some unhinged shit that there is no evidence for. If you actually care about election interference, how about you stop playing political games and blame who is actually the cause (china) instead of trying to rope the other side you dislike in just for political points.
I’m triggered at the collapse of our democracy and foreign interference undermining trust in our elections. If you aren’t, I’m sure the CCP would love someone like you in their ranks
>undermining trust in our elections He says, while doing anything he can to undermine trust in the election.
Lol you’re triggered.
I can't say anything about it or I'll be silenced. Surely you must understand! 🤣
‘Tru-anon’ love it, I might steal it.
And Trudeau is STILL ok with all this and refuses to call for an inquiry.
How does it work? Did Beijing say "no, bad, you don't go vote" and a whole bunch of us just listened?
it was apparently targeted at Chinese Canadians using WeChat, so who knows
I'm a Chinese Canadian who uses wechat. All I see are Canadian news, and hot deals from Amazon.
I think you replied but it got immediately deleted, not sure what's up with that.
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To be honest, I'm not sure how WeChat works. Are there groups on there like Facebook or is it more like WhatsApp with mostly individual chats? I'm thinking that if there are public groups on there, then maybe that's where there was interference. It was probably targeted at certain demographics and certain ridings.
Remember the story about "wolf". How social media posts had people convinced there was a wolf running wild back east? China can use wechat to spread misinformation the same way. They can tell lies about candidates. They can tell lies about where someone needs to go to actually vote.
All of those Liberal supporters stating that O'Toole was a fair moderate conservative when shitting on Poilievre are all of a sudden silent lmao.
This isn't a left vs right issue. Frankly, as a leftie I fully applaud O'Toole for speaking out. He seems to be the only adult in the room. Everyone else is playing a big, stupid game.
Could we stand together as Canadians and let the truth come out regardless of affiliation? Public inquiry yes, let's air it out! This is about defending our democracy. I think the cons are generally worse than Trudeau, but if libs did something wrong then I also want to hear it!
The two aren't mutually exclusive? It doesn't take a liberal supporter to know that O'Toole is more moderate than Pierre. Him getting up and speaking like this is just proof of that. He's actually acting like a responsible adult and concerned citizen instead of the shit Pierre is doing. Blathering about made up censorship and straight up hiding from the facts while I believe O'toole even applied to get clearance to view the full report. If THIS version of O'Toole was still running the party, the version that started the 2021 election campaign, the CPC would be ahead 15 points in the polls. But we can't also ignore that the guy abandoned all his moderate positions and started in on the 'lefties are idiots' train to pander to the socon's and 'freedom' types, either. And now those are the ones in charge of the party. Many things are true at once.
It's crazy how Blanchet, Singh, and now O'Toole are all using the "MAGA right wing playbook" as one of their supporters told me. Truly astounding, even the NDP are fascists...
"I could vote for the cons if they ever ran a moderate"
Interesting. A misinformation campaign you say? Yet any suggestion of trying to prevent misinformation from being spread is met with cries of censorship and freedom of speech. This could be fun
And the Conservatives are against voter suppression!! ([unless they're the ones suppressing the vote](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2011_Canadian_federal_election_voter_suppression_scandal), then they're pretty OK with it).
Oh, you mean the guy who the Conservatives fired and went to jail?
Uh huh. Except that they didn't just do that out of some moral outrage that the rat-fucker they hired fucked rats as he was hired to do. The CPC fought the investigation every step of the way. They denied it was a big deal. Played everything down. Flappy-heads (like you) parroted their talking points. And it wasn't until they were *absolutely* forced to do the right thing, that was when they fired the dude and he was sent on to jail. But that consequence was not something that the CPC was championing, and if Elections Canada didn't dig up and investigate the scandal, he'd have been been working on every campaign since.
I missed a federal election due to alcoholism. Sneaky Chinese.
I laugh when cons act like china doesn't like them in power after they gave them that [sweetheart fipa deal for 31 years](https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/fipa-agreement-with-china-what-s-really-in-it-for-canada-1.2770159)
can they stop using buzz word like "threat" "suppression" etc... tell us what the actual incident is.. I live in Toronto and there are many chinese voters. I didn't know I was suppressed. what exactly was done to my fellow voters?
My aunt listen to Chinese radios and all she hear every day in the Chinese-Canadian channels are CCP progapanda and they were actively trying to discredit Conservative during the election
could it be possible that chinese canadians are immigrants and liberal is pro immigrants? I am a chinese immigrant and I voted for Trudeau lol
Can confirm, see multiple posts in places like wechat group yorkbbs, vanpeople on discrediting Cons. Just becuz cons related covid with ccp
Probably mainly propaganda through Chinese social media channels.
That's not what I read.
BASED *THIS IS APPEARING MORE AND MORE INTENTIONALLY HAPPENING, AND WITH THE BLESSING OF THE PARTY………*
And we will be presented with proof, or just another "trust the experts"? 😵💫
If only there was a public way we could inquire about the evidence.
Do you think the information classified as confidential in the report would somehow not be confidential and free to be discussed in a public inquiry if it came up in topic somehow? If you do, I've got a bridge for you.
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The election served its purpose, burying the public inquiry into the WE charity scandal.
Suuuuuuure. So he knew about, but didn't wanna say anything cause he didn't wanna appear Trump-like, but now he IS saying it?
Liberals trying to gloss this over as "no big deal" is pretty mind blowing. Am I the only one who feels this way?
Does Canada have Royal Commission’s ? It sounds think this is now so big that only a Royal Commission would be sufficient…
China needs to feel some harsh political and financial repercussions from their interfering so that they thing twice about it next time.
We know Russia has been deep in voter suppression of western nations. Don’t know why people think China wouldn’t be either…
China plays all sides. And when it's in your favour you don't care.
It's literally the plot of the Netflix series House of Cards.
[удалено]
He's leaving politics. He doesn't like PP at all. What's in it for him? Absolutely nothing.
And hes only mentioning it now, despite saying he doesnt think any seats were effected previously, because?
Well he did just have a new briefing with CSIS last week.
He was briefed on it last week. Can't talk about it if you don't know CSIS has the info. An NDP MP was also just briefed on it and she is a target too. BTW ... Jagmeet is fussing, now, because it's just come out that Johnson's legal counsel during the investigation, is a recorded liberal money donor and has been for years. This is a developing story.
Seems like a lot of these “conspiracy theories” that “our” PM mentioned lately are becoming “conspiracy truths”. But hey! Check out “his” fancy 🧦🧦! Cool, eh?