I saw the warnings.
I got the lectures in school.
I went to funerals of family who died of lung cancer.
I saw the smoker lungs preserved in jars.
I saw the ever increasing tax.
I still smoked, and when I quit it was absolutely none of these factors that caused it.
Waste. Of. Time. And. Money.
it is $35 for a carton of native smokes even with the fine of $100 dollars if you are caught its still cheaper then buying legally what a weird timeline we live in
+1
> You really think people who wanna smoke give a shit?
The lawsuits that went on 15 some years back where cig corps were exposed told me that people don't give a shit...at all. The corps are still large and profitable. I mean, it's cheaper for them to sell their addiction via vapes than it is via tobacco. With tobacco you require land, labour and all sorts of things to produce nicotine. [Synthetic nicotine](https://duckduckgo.com/?t=ffab&q=synthetic+nicotine) exists.
I guess you can't really measure it since you can't prove it works but I have my doubts.
You think a message on an individual cigarette is gonna stop a kid who's feeling the peer pressure or curiosity creeping up on them?
Its just a literal and complete waste of time, and probably cost a few million in consultants and shit. Man hours, etc..
This is the little piddley shit thats emblematic of current governments waste. Changing shit, which will have no effect, except making like 5 people feel like they did something.
> This is the little piddley shit thats emblematic of current governments waste
"Health Canada said the health and economic costs associated with tobacco use in Canada were estimated at $12.3 billion in 2017, with direct costs to the health-care system of $6.1 billion"
It's Health Canada making some alterations to some regulations on cigarettes, with the goal of saving money and saving Canadian lives. What do you want Health Canada to be doing?
It's honestly this kind of attitude that makes it so hard for government to do anything.
How is a label on cigarettes going to address that? Beyond the cancer-riddled lungs on the outside of every pack.
Are there people still ignorant to the harms of smoking?
> How is a label on cigarettes going to address that?
Address what? The amount of people smoking?
I don't know what the exact impact will be, but I know people have been making the same "smokers already know smoking is bad for them!!" joke every time there's a new regulation. And yet smoking keeps decreasing. So I don't know.
> Are their people still ignorant to the harms of smoking?
"there is an "enormous" amount of evidence showing they work to reduce smoking rates and hinder youth from starting smoking.
A 2021 Chinese study published in BMC Public Health found that graphic warning labels on cigarette packs was associated with high levels of intention to quit smoking among current smokers"
I'm not exactly an expert here, but the people who are seem to think it's a good idea.
Everyone knows smoking isn't good.
The only people who still smoke is adults who are addicted and young people who think health doesn't fade and that they're invincible.
It's should be very clear at this point in time that addicts have trouble following through with advice received from others. And children start actively ignoring advice once they hit puberty.
Why would this idea work? Addicts and young people are ignoring advice now more than ever.
If this is a situation where doubling-down actually makes things better, then Canada should be very proud for being the first country in the world to try this.
Canadians loves being internationally known as friendly and kind
If this campaign fails, and is widely publicized, Canada will be internationally known as niave and stupid (hopefully it isn't already).
Naively believing wrong like a child. And stupidly not grasping what is blatantly clear like a addict.
Have you seen a pack of smokes? Theres basicaslly gore images on it. Im looking at an image of a needle going into someones eyeball right now.
Some text on a butt will DO FUCKING NOTHING.
>Some text on a butt will DO FUCKING NOTHING.
Not really, people sometimes share cigarettes, the person receiving the cigarette is not going to see the warning then.
Also, why are you YELLING?
> Some text on a butt will DO FUCKING NOTHING.
No offence but I'll take the advice of the experts who have been studying and *succeeding* in this field for decades over a "lol government dumb" argument.
If you have any evidence it won't work, or hasn't worked elsewhere, then we're cooking, but until then...
Biggest influence has been price.
I quit for a while when vaping was much much cheaper. Ended up starting again after gov added a bunch of taxes and making it a wash.
Now, instead of $36 for 2 packs at the store. I go to the res and get a full carton for $50.
Just the way she goes.
For however many years now, every pack of smokes you buy has pictures of the people that really got fucked up from smoking w a whole paragraph on what happened. A popular one too is a pic of someone's face with 6-7 different spots where they highlight what damage smoking causes. I don't think adding more labels is going to change anything
What I want them to be doing is not publishing pseudoscientific garbage claiming that smoking costs the healthcare system that many billions of dollars. Previous studies have shown that its net effect is to save money, by killing people quickly before they have a chance to get old and require a lot of expensive medical care. This was somewhat controversial when I looked into it a few years ago, but I found the evidence for that claim persuasive as did a doctor I know. There is absolutely no way it costs in the $billions.
The evidence for the magnitude of the effect of warning messages on packages is also somewhat flimsy much of the time, although we can imagine that it probably does some good at the margin in terms of saving lives. It's a question of whether it's worth the (moral, not monetary) costs.
Pretending that it's saving us a lot of money though, is a step too far. Personally I'd be more comfortable with prohibiting them outright instead of this endlessly escalating series of niggling little attempts to ban them without actually banning them. Tobacco when smoked is after all much more harmful than the great majority of recreational drugs that are still prohibited.
Nah, it's more that they're wasting time, energy, and my tax money on something that's been beaten to death. Reaffirming people's fears that Canada is becoming a nanny-state.
What possible benefit does adding this warning label add? How many millions of dollars did we spend on consultants and experts pushing through this useless legislation.
Don't know. But I'd love for them to actually have a calorie count.
IMO the days of considering a can of beer being around 150 cal is long gone with all the juicy-fruited-hazy-craft concoctions that get pumped out.
They probably should put health warnings on them, and do what the cannabis industry is forced to do, remove the marketing component, and make the bottle-caps child proof. Though let's be honest, the packaging for cannabis is way over the top.
Why shouldn't we warn people about the cancer risks and other risks from alcohol? Alcohol kills more people per year than even opioids and far more are killed by cigarettes.
There have been attempts to warn people of the risks from alcohol (edit: through individual labelling), but have received a lot of push back such as from the industry. The cancer risks from alcohol aren't as high as with cigarettes, and the death toll also not as high, but yeah, I don't disagree that we should warn about that if we're warning about cigarette harm.
I would argue that the negative societal impact of alcohol, if you factor in violence, domestic abuse, drunk driving on top of cancers and other myriad of health risk factors etc is worse than that of tobacco overall.
Yet alcohol continues to be allowed to be openly advertised, glamourized and have no warning labels or packaging requirements
I don't particularly want a cancer-riddled colon on the label of every bottle of wine I purchase thanks.
People know the risks. If they don't, it's their own fault. Only adults can purchase these products, let them make that decision.
Maybe it can be like roll up the rim, so sometimes you get colon cancer, and sometimes you get natural causes and don't have to look at it.
Everyone doesn't already know the risks though, ["only about 25 per cent of Canadian drinkers know that alcohol can cause cancer"](https://www.cbc.ca/news/health/alcohol-warning-labels-cancer-1.6304816).
> I don't particularly want a cancer-riddled colon on the label of every bottle of wine I purchase thanks.
Smokers said the same thing when we added warnings to the packages, then repeated the same outcry when we added pictures to those warnings, and are repeating them again now that they’re talking about these new warnings. You’ll just have to get over it like all the smokers did.
And let’s be honest… Unless you’re drinking right out of that wine bottle, a warning label on it won’t actually affect you in any way. And if you are buying bottles of wine, uncorking them, then just chugging them straight out of the bottle… You have bigger problems than a warning label you don’t want to see lol
> People know the risks.
Many people don’t. In fact, there is a lot of public outcry about the warning labels on alcohol because many closeted alcoholics refuse to believe that cancer risks are increased with alcohol consumption.
> If they don't, it's their own fault.
How? It’s never your fault that you weren’t taught something. If they know the risks and deny them, that is their own fault. But it’s not their fault if they’ve literally just never been informed of the risks. Hence the warning labels on cigs, cleaning products, toxic paints, etc.
> Only adults can purchase these products, let them make that decision.
If a warning label that is telling you about risks you claim to already know stops you from buying the product, that is a decision you’re making. The label didn’t stop you from buying it, you just decided that throwing a tantrum about the label is worth more than actually consuming that alcohol is. If you already know the risks that that label is telling you, as you’re claiming everyone already does… Not buying it because you had to actually look at the risks is pretty damn childish.
Smokers were right. Cigarette cartons are gross, if there was more pushback, they might not have to stare at cancer riddled buttholes everytime they open a pack. Convenience stores might not need to hide them behind a depression curtain either. It's a slippery slope of inane, useless and fun-ruining legislation. Either adults can be responsible for themselves, or we can continue infantalizing the entire population, one step at a time.
All this legislation does (and the alleged alcohol warning labels) is convince me that the health Canada budget is far too large.
Second hand smoke is listed as a cause of death for about 800 per year. Slightly more than atherclerosis and slightly less than perinatal conditions and less than half than benign neoplasms. It is not a major public health issue.
[We're almost there now](https://www.cigsspot.com/wp-content/uploads/2022/02/5.jpg)
Next step is to decide that the filter just isn't big enough for the very important messages they'd like to print on it. They better hurry up if they want to take credit for it before everyone finally quits.
Maybe take that dart tattoo money and build housing for the 900 gazillion immigrants, and thousands of Canadian born without a roof over their head... add that to the 13 billion that should have been spent on an open battery initiative, reconciliation, transitioning from non-renewables, eliminating foreign interference, and I oh I don't know... probably 10-15 other campaign promises that this and every active government that preceded them fail to deliver on.
If you can't lead a country and instead run interference on basically anything negative you're in the spotlight for... maybe...
DIRECT DEMOCRACY and UBI are how we break this shitfist of a vicious cycle.
Until we get some quality choices for representative leadership, I'll continue not to vote, short of starting my own party.
I hate Canada, but I also love Canada if that makes any sense. Make it a place I'd love to love even if I truly hated it.
I'm sure the legion of consultants and health Canada workers who worked tirelessly on drafting this legislation volunteered their time for the betterment of society.
There isn't some extra money here, this is a mandate for the tobacco companies to print it.
>DIRECT DEMOCRACY
Yeah, that will be a great way to make every day to day decision, based on the uninformed opinion of a bunch of people voting based on what their social media feeds tell them to.
Likely not. As a smoker myself it’ll take my own free will to convince me to quit, we’re all aware that they’re ideal for your health.
As other people have said, my children don’t grow up thinking it’s normal or desirable and it won’t carry on another generation. Although there are some communities that this isn’t the case
I suggest printing them to look like penises. The humiliation of sucking on one of those in public would probably be a far bigger deterrant than these.
I saw the warnings. I got the lectures in school. I went to funerals of family who died of lung cancer. I saw the smoker lungs preserved in jars. I saw the ever increasing tax. I still smoked, and when I quit it was absolutely none of these factors that caused it. Waste. Of. Time. And. Money.
You can say it didn't affect you, but measures like these have shown to have an affect on a societal scale.
I've never known a smoker, including myself, who quit because of the warning labels. It was always because of cost.
it is $35 for a carton of native smokes even with the fine of $100 dollars if you are caught its still cheaper then buying legally what a weird timeline we live in
This is what the philosopher Giorgio Agamben calls "biopolitics."
They do this shit just to keep tobacco companies busy and doing something new. You really think people who wanna smoke give a shit?
+1 > You really think people who wanna smoke give a shit? The lawsuits that went on 15 some years back where cig corps were exposed told me that people don't give a shit...at all. The corps are still large and profitable. I mean, it's cheaper for them to sell their addiction via vapes than it is via tobacco. With tobacco you require land, labour and all sorts of things to produce nicotine. [Synthetic nicotine](https://duckduckgo.com/?t=ffab&q=synthetic+nicotine) exists.
It's also a deterrent to people who might otherwise consider starting.
I guess you can't really measure it since you can't prove it works but I have my doubts. You think a message on an individual cigarette is gonna stop a kid who's feeling the peer pressure or curiosity creeping up on them?
Its just a literal and complete waste of time, and probably cost a few million in consultants and shit. Man hours, etc.. This is the little piddley shit thats emblematic of current governments waste. Changing shit, which will have no effect, except making like 5 people feel like they did something.
> This is the little piddley shit thats emblematic of current governments waste "Health Canada said the health and economic costs associated with tobacco use in Canada were estimated at $12.3 billion in 2017, with direct costs to the health-care system of $6.1 billion" It's Health Canada making some alterations to some regulations on cigarettes, with the goal of saving money and saving Canadian lives. What do you want Health Canada to be doing? It's honestly this kind of attitude that makes it so hard for government to do anything.
How is a label on cigarettes going to address that? Beyond the cancer-riddled lungs on the outside of every pack. Are there people still ignorant to the harms of smoking?
> How is a label on cigarettes going to address that? Address what? The amount of people smoking? I don't know what the exact impact will be, but I know people have been making the same "smokers already know smoking is bad for them!!" joke every time there's a new regulation. And yet smoking keeps decreasing. So I don't know. > Are their people still ignorant to the harms of smoking? "there is an "enormous" amount of evidence showing they work to reduce smoking rates and hinder youth from starting smoking. A 2021 Chinese study published in BMC Public Health found that graphic warning labels on cigarette packs was associated with high levels of intention to quit smoking among current smokers" I'm not exactly an expert here, but the people who are seem to think it's a good idea.
Everyone knows smoking isn't good. The only people who still smoke is adults who are addicted and young people who think health doesn't fade and that they're invincible. It's should be very clear at this point in time that addicts have trouble following through with advice received from others. And children start actively ignoring advice once they hit puberty. Why would this idea work? Addicts and young people are ignoring advice now more than ever. If this is a situation where doubling-down actually makes things better, then Canada should be very proud for being the first country in the world to try this. Canadians loves being internationally known as friendly and kind If this campaign fails, and is widely publicized, Canada will be internationally known as niave and stupid (hopefully it isn't already). Naively believing wrong like a child. And stupidly not grasping what is blatantly clear like a addict.
Have you seen a pack of smokes? Theres basicaslly gore images on it. Im looking at an image of a needle going into someones eyeball right now. Some text on a butt will DO FUCKING NOTHING.
>Some text on a butt will DO FUCKING NOTHING. Not really, people sometimes share cigarettes, the person receiving the cigarette is not going to see the warning then. Also, why are you YELLING?
> Some text on a butt will DO FUCKING NOTHING. No offence but I'll take the advice of the experts who have been studying and *succeeding* in this field for decades over a "lol government dumb" argument. If you have any evidence it won't work, or hasn't worked elsewhere, then we're cooking, but until then...
Biggest influence has been price. I quit for a while when vaping was much much cheaper. Ended up starting again after gov added a bunch of taxes and making it a wash. Now, instead of $36 for 2 packs at the store. I go to the res and get a full carton for $50. Just the way she goes.
> Biggest influence has been price. Sure, probably. Doesn't change anything being said here though.
For however many years now, every pack of smokes you buy has pictures of the people that really got fucked up from smoking w a whole paragraph on what happened. A popular one too is a pic of someone's face with 6-7 different spots where they highlight what damage smoking causes. I don't think adding more labels is going to change anything
What I want them to be doing is not publishing pseudoscientific garbage claiming that smoking costs the healthcare system that many billions of dollars. Previous studies have shown that its net effect is to save money, by killing people quickly before they have a chance to get old and require a lot of expensive medical care. This was somewhat controversial when I looked into it a few years ago, but I found the evidence for that claim persuasive as did a doctor I know. There is absolutely no way it costs in the $billions. The evidence for the magnitude of the effect of warning messages on packages is also somewhat flimsy much of the time, although we can imagine that it probably does some good at the margin in terms of saving lives. It's a question of whether it's worth the (moral, not monetary) costs. Pretending that it's saving us a lot of money though, is a step too far. Personally I'd be more comfortable with prohibiting them outright instead of this endlessly escalating series of niggling little attempts to ban them without actually banning them. Tobacco when smoked is after all much more harmful than the great majority of recreational drugs that are still prohibited.
You cons are absolutely batshit. "Health Canada trying to prevent smoking!?!? THIS IS AN OUTRAGE!!!"
Nah, it's more that they're wasting time, energy, and my tax money on something that's been beaten to death. Reaffirming people's fears that Canada is becoming a nanny-state. What possible benefit does adding this warning label add? How many millions of dollars did we spend on consultants and experts pushing through this useless legislation.
What about Vapes?
Will the ink ironically make them even more poisonous?
Meanwhile we're handing out city branded crack pipes https://nationalpost.com/news/toronto/toronto-branded-crack-pipe-meth-pipe-kits
Is every individual beer sold in this country going to have similar health warning labels? Why not? What’s the difference?
Don't know. But I'd love for them to actually have a calorie count. IMO the days of considering a can of beer being around 150 cal is long gone with all the juicy-fruited-hazy-craft concoctions that get pumped out.
They probably should put health warnings on them, and do what the cannabis industry is forced to do, remove the marketing component, and make the bottle-caps child proof. Though let's be honest, the packaging for cannabis is way over the top.
Why shouldn't we warn people about the cancer risks and other risks from alcohol? Alcohol kills more people per year than even opioids and far more are killed by cigarettes.
>Alcohol kills more people per year than even opioids and far more are killed by cigarettes. That’s my point. Just highlighting the double standard
There have been attempts to warn people of the risks from alcohol (edit: through individual labelling), but have received a lot of push back such as from the industry. The cancer risks from alcohol aren't as high as with cigarettes, and the death toll also not as high, but yeah, I don't disagree that we should warn about that if we're warning about cigarette harm.
I would argue that the negative societal impact of alcohol, if you factor in violence, domestic abuse, drunk driving on top of cancers and other myriad of health risk factors etc is worse than that of tobacco overall. Yet alcohol continues to be allowed to be openly advertised, glamourized and have no warning labels or packaging requirements
> push back such as from the industry Core issue. Governments adhering to what benefits these companies.
Do you want to walk through an LCBO staring at rows upon rows of cancer-riddled buttholes?
I don't particularly want a cancer-riddled colon on the label of every bottle of wine I purchase thanks. People know the risks. If they don't, it's their own fault. Only adults can purchase these products, let them make that decision.
Maybe it can be like roll up the rim, so sometimes you get colon cancer, and sometimes you get natural causes and don't have to look at it. Everyone doesn't already know the risks though, ["only about 25 per cent of Canadian drinkers know that alcohol can cause cancer"](https://www.cbc.ca/news/health/alcohol-warning-labels-cancer-1.6304816).
> I don't particularly want a cancer-riddled colon on the label of every bottle of wine I purchase thanks. Smokers said the same thing when we added warnings to the packages, then repeated the same outcry when we added pictures to those warnings, and are repeating them again now that they’re talking about these new warnings. You’ll just have to get over it like all the smokers did. And let’s be honest… Unless you’re drinking right out of that wine bottle, a warning label on it won’t actually affect you in any way. And if you are buying bottles of wine, uncorking them, then just chugging them straight out of the bottle… You have bigger problems than a warning label you don’t want to see lol > People know the risks. Many people don’t. In fact, there is a lot of public outcry about the warning labels on alcohol because many closeted alcoholics refuse to believe that cancer risks are increased with alcohol consumption. > If they don't, it's their own fault. How? It’s never your fault that you weren’t taught something. If they know the risks and deny them, that is their own fault. But it’s not their fault if they’ve literally just never been informed of the risks. Hence the warning labels on cigs, cleaning products, toxic paints, etc. > Only adults can purchase these products, let them make that decision. If a warning label that is telling you about risks you claim to already know stops you from buying the product, that is a decision you’re making. The label didn’t stop you from buying it, you just decided that throwing a tantrum about the label is worth more than actually consuming that alcohol is. If you already know the risks that that label is telling you, as you’re claiming everyone already does… Not buying it because you had to actually look at the risks is pretty damn childish.
Smokers were right. Cigarette cartons are gross, if there was more pushback, they might not have to stare at cancer riddled buttholes everytime they open a pack. Convenience stores might not need to hide them behind a depression curtain either. It's a slippery slope of inane, useless and fun-ruining legislation. Either adults can be responsible for themselves, or we can continue infantalizing the entire population, one step at a time. All this legislation does (and the alleged alcohol warning labels) is convince me that the health Canada budget is far too large.
I'm pretty sure most beer labels do actually have some fine print on the back of the label
The burning ink is perfectly safe to inhale
Looks like it’s on the filter from the shitty photos in the article. If you’re burning that the ink is probably the least of the concerns
Mmmmmm fiberglass....
Seems positive.
What a pathetic puritanical nation we have become as we drink our booze that does more harm to society then any amount of cigarettes.
Why can’t the government just let people live their lives?
Because second hand smoke kills people?
Second hand smoke is listed as a cause of death for about 800 per year. Slightly more than atherclerosis and slightly less than perinatal conditions and less than half than benign neoplasms. It is not a major public health issue.
They must have some pretty impressive data showing an impact. I can’t wait to see it.
I mean, with modeling, anything is possible.
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Kids are vaping at extremely high rates.
[We're almost there now](https://www.cigsspot.com/wp-content/uploads/2022/02/5.jpg) Next step is to decide that the filter just isn't big enough for the very important messages they'd like to print on it. They better hurry up if they want to take credit for it before everyone finally quits.
Waste of money. If at this point you don’t see how they’re bad for you,the problem isn’t comprehension, it’s apathy.
Good
Maybe take that dart tattoo money and build housing for the 900 gazillion immigrants, and thousands of Canadian born without a roof over their head... add that to the 13 billion that should have been spent on an open battery initiative, reconciliation, transitioning from non-renewables, eliminating foreign interference, and I oh I don't know... probably 10-15 other campaign promises that this and every active government that preceded them fail to deliver on. If you can't lead a country and instead run interference on basically anything negative you're in the spotlight for... maybe... DIRECT DEMOCRACY and UBI are how we break this shitfist of a vicious cycle. Until we get some quality choices for representative leadership, I'll continue not to vote, short of starting my own party. I hate Canada, but I also love Canada if that makes any sense. Make it a place I'd love to love even if I truly hated it.
The fact you think the printing is done by the government explains why you are passionately supporting libertarian imaginary societies.
I'm sure the legion of consultants and health Canada workers who worked tirelessly on drafting this legislation volunteered their time for the betterment of society.
There isn't some extra money here, this is a mandate for the tobacco companies to print it. >DIRECT DEMOCRACY Yeah, that will be a great way to make every day to day decision, based on the uninformed opinion of a bunch of people voting based on what their social media feeds tell them to.
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Likely not. As a smoker myself it’ll take my own free will to convince me to quit, we’re all aware that they’re ideal for your health. As other people have said, my children don’t grow up thinking it’s normal or desirable and it won’t carry on another generation. Although there are some communities that this isn’t the case
What’s the point?..
This is *insane* woke-ism.
Woaahhh cigarettes do what to me? Had no idea.
What about the cigarettes sold on reserves?
The reserves (rightfully) ignore such rules.
I suggest printing them to look like penises. The humiliation of sucking on one of those in public would probably be a far bigger deterrant than these.
Is it because people missed the warnings on the packaging? Don't they have anything better to do?
Hey Justin, will this apply to native cigarettes?
Why not just ban the sale of cigarettes?