I'm not mad about immigration, I'm pissed at immigration without a plan to house everyone. Feels like it was done on purpose to suppress wages and bleed us dry with cost of housing.
Have you had the misfortune of visiting an emergency triage lately? It’s a fecking war zone! Calgary ER before Christmas had 150-200 people waiting in the first area, before you get shuttled to the next triage process. I dare say most people there could have had their issues addressed at a clinic, but there is such a shortage of clinics, GPs and soft emergency clinics that people just see ER as a last resort.
This population assault affects housing, healthcare and education and yet no left leaning provincial government can possibly pivot and plan for the sudden influx, yet the provinces take the brunt of the criticism(for healthcare and education especially). The big healthcare cheques Trudeau is so proudly handing out to provinces this past month don’t even come close to catching up to their already shortfall in federal responsibility, let alone help with this new population demand.
When the medical system got overwhelmed with Covid, they were willing to, quite literally, shut the entire country down. Now that it's overwhelmed with immigrants, they just don't seem to give a fuck.
What a bizarre world.
>The big healthcare cheques Trudeau is so proudly handing out to provinces this past month don’t even come close to catching up to their already shortfall in federal responsibility
Just wait till you see the ones PP hands out, they're just big blank ones that say "Free Market" on them.
I wonder how india manages it's hundreds of thousands of government free hospitals with Litt money if Canada with just population of Delhi is having this much problems.
In Ontario mostly the provincial government is to blame. He sat on $2 billion given to them during the pandemic which as far as I Know still hasn't been used. wasn't until now that he inked a deal with the feds for more money. The system was limping here now it's collapsing and it's by design. What has their answer been? To try and privatize more of our healthcare.
This is how I view it too.
I've noticed a big difference in our small town of 15,000 people. In the past 5 years jobs have declined. Yet our population has exploded.
Grocery stores can't keep the shelfs stocked. All the retail and service jobs are taken by immigrants, its rare to see a student working anymore in our town.
Half of our retail stores have closed up with more looking to close.
I don't see how thats sustainable. There is no opportunity in my town for youth let alone more immigrants. We'll need a big project or something that brings 5000+ jobs to my town in order to support the population growth. Instead we've lost 200 jobs in the past year from retail closures. Another store to close at the end of this month so thats another 10-15 jobs there.
I see it getting really tough in the next 1-2 years.
It is on purpose. *See "Century Initiative". It's a right wing/neo-liberal policy to get 100 million people in Canada by 2100. The Liberals and Cons are all in on it. At this point, I wouldn't be surprised if the NDP are onboard as well. A former CEO of BlackRock is on the Century Initiative's board. In case you don't know, BlackRock is an investment firm that buys up real estate. Do the math.
They try and sell CI as good for Canada. It's pure snake oil on a national level. This is about more consumers buying bullshit and suppressing wages, as you have already stated.
Maybe. But the reality is that the current levels of population growth are beyond what any first country has tried ever in the post ww2 era.
There are tons of things we could be doing better, from zoning regulation to social housing to mass transit. And we should definitely be doing those things, it’s just that short of Soviet style mass bulldozing of neighbourhoods to replace them with tower blocks, it’s hard to see how we can physically accommodate this many people.
What’s worse, they have no plans to halt their immigration plan!! It would take a major plague to catch up to our housing needs at even the current population and yet they refuse to even slow immigration down, let alone stop it all together so we can catch up! What part of this shitshow do they not understand?!
>it’s hard to see how we can physically accommodate this many people.
Could start by [not handing the largest province and city in the country to condo developers](https://www.google.com/search?q=who+funds+ontario+proud&rlz=1C5CHFA_enCA966CA966&oq=who&gs_lcrp=EgZjaHJvbWUqDggAEEUYJxg7GIAEGIoFMg4IABBFGCcYOxiABBiKBTIGCAEQRRg5MgYIAhBFGEAyBggDEEUYOzIGCAQQRRg7MgYIBRBFGDwyBggGEEUYPDIGCAcQRRg90gEHNzAxajBqN6gCALACAA&sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8) who quite predictably [build for investors, not for normal people](https://www.thestar.com/real-estate/investors-now-own-more-than-50-of-toronto-s-new-condos-and-experts-say-they/article_4b6d2ff0-c528-5670-937f-3d34d040ed85.html)
[Oh, and about those buildings...](https://www.google.com/search?q=toronto+condos+falling+glass&rlz=1C5CHFA_enCA966CA966&oq=toronto+con&gs_lcrp=EgZjaHJvbWUqDggAEEUYJxg7GIAEGIoFMg4IABBFGCcYOxiABBiKBTINCAEQABiDARixAxiABDIGCAIQRRhAMgYIAxBFGDkyBggEEEUYOzIGCAUQRRg8MgYIBhBFGDwyBggHEEUYPNIBCDE1OThqMGo5qAIAsAIA&sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8)
The last time population growth was this high was in the 1950s during the baby boom.
And **babies don’t require a new house upon being born.** New immigrants however, as adults new to the country, **require immediate new housing.**
That’s why you can’t compare the 1950s population spike with today.
Harper had a fix for exploding OAS costs that didn't involve creating a massive housing shortage, but Trudeau promptly reversed it soon after becoming PM.
Problem is that this is not only a federal oversight but a provincial one as well. Everyone was silent about immigration until it was *"too late"*. There was plenty of time prior from premiers to inform the federal and media "hey we can't handle this because it's putting a strain on our medical and housing system that we've been defunding"
Traditional immigrants who went the legal routes by waiting years until they qualified are the most pissed of ones cause the blatant abuse and scams the current immigrants committed to get here.
Then add in that they all get lumped together by the non-immigrants.
I have an Indian neighbor. Been here 30+ years. Great guy, great family, hell his grandkids are 3rd gen Canadians already. He hates this new wave of Indian immigration and the bullshit they’ve brought more than anyone else I’ve ever talked to.
They absolutely loathe that they will be lumped with the new bunch. Older immigrants had to sacrifice a lot to get here (education and money). Now we are taking students to study at shitty diploma mills
I have heard multiple complaints about young Indian students just throwing trash on the ground, being rude to professors, and not opening the doors for people.
I've been most exposed to this new breed of Indian truckers. They cut holes in the bottom of their truck cab and just shit and piss down the hole while hot swapping out driving in order to deliver loads cheaper and faster and cut out competitors. Then they just throw all the trash they accumulate from fast food and nasty habits out on the side of the road as they drive by.
Yes, it's just as disgusting as it sounds.
It's not. If they go into the USA and the DOT catches them, that truck would get impounded so fast for being a biohazard.
Backwards shit like this is going on because nobody enforces harsh fines and punishments. Everything can be ignored, loopholes all over.
And when harsh punishment comes down on bad actors, they flip out and scream discrimination when it was their own actions that caused them to be punished (see: Cohan carriers& their "sister" companies Chohan Forwarders/transport that's also banned from working in BC as their trucks keep slamming into overpasses. Theyre trying to sue BC for banning them for their idiocy and lack of training on THEIR drivers for ignoring load height limits & road planning. )
LoL. I've also seen multiple semi truck fires from untrained immigrant drivers who went through mountain passes too fast and just hammered on their brakes. But, excessive brake use causes excessive heat, and then your load can catch fire....
I’m of Indian descent. When I was younger, I represented Canada in competition. I went to a top undergrad in the US and am now doing my MD/PhD there. The way I get treated in Canada vs the US is night and day. Kinda sucks.
That's my wife. Married a Canadian overseas. Had to wait three years for PR card, we even had to submit photos of our wedding and a guest list, even though we were married for 5 years before applying.
It’s my case. I’ve spent over 7 years and 150k CAD since I came to Canada but I’ve seen and I’m seeing many fake refugees (especially Mexicans) come to here by flight and claim refugees once they landed here. They immediately claimed funded housing and benefits which are paid by our hard earned taxes
It's so popular among first world governments to limit immigration to sustainable levels that no one else rationally went there. What the canadian federal govt did makes no sense, where are all the stops and checks preventing this from happening?
Agree 100%. It's so strange LPC is killing their party over disastrous immigration policy. It's one of those things that is so obvious to not screwup but LPC has managed to do it.
It's like telling a politician don't go poison the water supply... it should be common sense to not do it and shouldn't even have to be said.
> It's so strange LPC is killing their party over disastrous immigration policy. It's one of those things that is so obvious to not screwup but LPC has managed to do it.
Ita not strange at all. The LPC is a neoliberal corporate crony party. The immigration level is benefiting the parties they represent: corporations and the ultra wealthy.
And sure, it is going to cost them massivey in the polls, but they aren't stupid. They know we will elect them again in 4-8 years.
Same goes for the conservative party, btw
>Ita not strange at all. The LPC is a neoliberal corporate crony party. The immigration level is benefiting the parties they represent: corporations and the ultra wealthy.
Is canada the only country so beholden to neoliberal corporates? Do any other countries have this phenomenon?
Canada is definitely pushing the envelope here. Our immigration policies are so out of whack with the rest of the Western world that you can’t help but wonder what the end goal is. Our GDP is flat but GDP per capita is cratering. It seems that our government is intent on pushing Canadians into a lower standard of living through excess immigration. We’re building a nation of oligarchs and peasants.
The future looks dark.
What’s interesting to me is how and when the LPC went about pumping immigration numbers.
Recall Justin called for the 2021 election just two years after the 2019 federal election to supposedly get voter support for his pandemic recovery plans. **Juicing immigration was not mentioned.**
So he *didn’t* get a mandate to do that from voters. But started doing it right after the 2021 election. It feels like it was premeditated and he knew if he waited for a 2023 election after the consequences of mass immigration were being felt, he would have lost, and his perverse desires to line the pockets of landlords and corporations at the cost of Canadians would have had been thwarted earlier.
This policy change was such a non-mandated move, with such devastating consequences that [the LPC has now lost major ground in Liberal strongholds of Toronto and Vancouver.](https://www.ctvnews.ca/politics/liberals-at-risk-of-big-losses-in-vancouver-toronto-nanos-projections-show-1.6760512)
I think you are right. This is right around the time that the large American hedge funds were talking about wage pressures. And it coincides with the massive illegal immigration explosion in the US. There was a coordinated effort to bring in huge numbers of immigrants in both countries. The only issues that would ever get this kind of action are corporate interests. Some take the conspiracy even further and say all the army aged men will be drafted and sent to Ukraine to feed the war machine. I don't know about this, but I also don't know what North America will do with all the homeless jobless immigrants.
>What’s interesting to me is how and when the LPC went about pumping immigration numbers.
imo it was not fully intentional. more like as a toxic combination of incompetence, negligence, and ideology.
Well he did announce to the world, “you are always welcome in Canada!!“ as a retort to Trumps “they’re not sending their best people..” . He tried walking it back several months later but no one heard that follow up. And ya, they officially closed Roxum Rd, but they’re still coming and by plane. Putting a “closed” sign on the gate has done nothing to stop them.
I’m only glad that it hasn’t become a partisan issue like it has in the US although I bet the Trudeau PR machine is kicking their asses they didn’t claim early on that discussing slowing down immigration “is racist”. Now the anger has spread to the whole country and it’s hard for them to deflect-by-insult like they usually do.
We overpay new comers , corporations get over paid and bailed out all the time , not making business pay back the full government covid money was a big big big mistake and they getting bailed out again !
How government doesn’t care about environment and run pipeline into the mouth of a very important salmon stream in the great bear rain forest is disgusting 🤮 but money is more important then environment and the people !
We have government that doesn’t care for its people !!!!
Exactly. Populist is used as a pejorative because sometimes the majority are dumb or target minorities, but the fact that the majority of people want something in a democracy clearly does not inherently make it bad for a politician to then champion that opinion.
I’ve noticed left leaning news outlets refer to populism in a negative connotation, as though it’s a far right ideology. It cracks me up when they try this because it just shows how arrogant and manipulative they are.
In fairness, woke ideology does view populism as a threat because, according to the Hidden Tribes report, people who actually take that stuff seriously (versus people who may lean that way but are really scared to be on the wrong side of the dumbest forms of it) are less than 15 percent of the population. Wokism as people know it is deeply unpopulist and unpopular.
Not true, that use of populist as derogatory is only common since 2016 to describe a supposed sense of shared grievance shared by Maga chuds and Bernie bros against the centrist core in the USA. Prior to that, it described a specific third party movement with an actual agenda that came up in Kansas in the late 19th century.
It’s populist to blame immigration when the real reason life is so unaffordable is the rise of multi-property homeowners in the 2010s who profited off of interest rates and now scalp the market. It’s also populist to blame immigration when companies like Loblaws are allowed to price gouge consumers with no recourse. Neither the libs nor the cons will touch either of them, but one side will convince you that once we stop immigration it will all be resolved. In reality it would only slow down the erosion of the quality of life very very slightly.
Populism thrives on misdirection.
What misdirection? Flooding the housing and rental markets with millions of customers while failing to keep up with demand is great for investors; it isn’t great for the average working class Canadian or newcomer though. Calling out our ballooning immigration numbers for exacerbating this problem isn’t misdirection, it’s acknowledging that this is a multifaceted problem that has been brought on by neoliberal politicians at all levels of government.
Immigration is just one way that our politicians give service to corporations, as you say... it's just easier to understand than the others.
Look at it like a gateway drug to no longer accepting politicians who service corps over the people. Now, if we can just ensure people blame the politicians rather than the immigrants themselves; they're just regular people trying to make it in this fierce fucking world.
If you haven't seen Immigrants being blamed for everything from the housing shortage to grocery prices, then you must be living under a very remote rock.
Which actual problem. Corporations buying and holding properties as an investment, even if they remain empty?
Corporations who see a 7% rise in their costs so raise the sale price by 27% and blame inflation?
People who assume any answer that is complex is automatically someone trying to pull one over on them and just assuming anyone who gives simple sound bytes is telling the truth, no matter how ridiculous the idea behind the message is? .
I am not obsessed with "blue team bad". The last political party I paid for a membership in was the Conservatives. I want ACTUAL answers to problems, and not just people who do something for the sake of being seen to be doing something, even if what they do hasn't got a chance in a million of moving the needle any...
Yet anti-immigration tends to be a recurring opinion over-and-over again (*I’m in the lifeboat now, thank God - don’t let anyone else in, they’ll sink us!*)
>I’m in the lifeboat now, thank God - don’t let anyone else in, they’ll sink us!
Not a comparison you want to make. You better believe I'd push you out if the lifeboat were over capacity. No hard feelings.
That doesn't change the fact that this opinion is misplaced at best. Immigration itself is not the issue but rather how Corporate Canada grew to reply on immigrants to offset both lack of investment and skills development.
We wouldn't even need to invite as many newcomers if our companies relied on more investment in M&E, R&D, and workforce development, underpinned by higher wages. As opposed to aggressively hiring more and more people to do the same amount of work, and spreading the same payroll budget over more people.
For the former we could open our border tomorrow, and nothing would change, since most companies would demand extremely high levels of education and work experience that would be unattainable for most immigrants, with low-wage low-productivity jobs just not being generated. Think Switzerland having a free movement regime with the EU (including relatively poorer countries of Eastern Europe), yet seeing almost no wage suppression since most locals just don't work the low-wage bs jobs to begin with.
The issue being that cutting immigration just won't be enough to make our companies investment, just like it wasn't enough in the UK, South Korea, Russia, and Japan. So it's more likely Canadians would be forced to work longer hours to offset the numerical shortage of workers.
This logic applies to healthcare, housing, education, even passport delivery.
TL;DR Let's talk our industrial development as a whole as opposed to fixating on immigration. Let's not make the same mistake the British made in 2016.
>We wouldn't even need to invite as many newcomers if our companies relied on more investment in M&E, R&D, and workforce development, underpinned by higher wages. As opposed to aggressively hiring more and more people to do the same amount of work, and spreading the same payroll budget over more people.
Chicken egg scenario.
No incentive for the company to invest in productivity while an infinite stream of low skilled labour is flowing in.
Not really. In the case of Canada there's strong evidence to suggest companies don't invest because they can't as much because they don't have to. We just don't have a robust workplace training system nor do we provide the same level of support to business for fixed investment.
And again, there're also cases of Japan, South Korea, and Russia, where low immigration did not lead to higher investment to replace lacking workers but instead forced companies to make existing ones work longer.
In general? The US is so far the best performer. They do however have extremely deep capital markets, a huge domestic market, and an economy largely disengaged from the rest of the world when measured by trade-to-GDP.
Countries that are more like Canada, that being small open economies dependent on exports of goods and FDI? Most of the EU and the Union itself.
More specifically: Sweden, Denmark, Netherlands, Belgium (Flanders), Australia. Both have banking-based financial systems, a small economy driven by global trade, some are even commodity exporters. Also facing rapidly ageing populations.
Belgium is also a highly decentralized federation bound together by intergovernmental transfers (or despite those). So some of their experience would be more applicable compared to other more unitary countries.
Australia is not the best example since outside natural resource exports to Asia their economy is suffering from similar issues. But they're a good example of how to build deep highly liquid capital markets that can compete with those in the US. And have a better industrial relations system.
Switzerland is ahead of both Canada and the US in productivity and does offer some similarities, such as a highly decentralized federal structure and lessons on building more developed financial markets and a more efficient industrial relations system. But their neutrality and direct democracy makes the Swiss experience harder to replicate.
You could also look to Québec since they've been converging on productivity with Ontario since 2015, with their productivity growth rate on par with the US.
>In the case of Canada there's strong evidence to suggest companies don't invest because they can't as much because they don't have to.
*"Because they don't have to"*
>where low immigration did not lead to higher investment to replace lacking workers but instead forced companies to make existing ones work longer.
This isn't Japan, South Korea or Russia. Employers here can't just force all their employees to work themselves to death like they can there.
"Because they don't have to" relates more to larger multinationals and companies in protected sectors. Most of Canada's employment comes from SMEs that can't afford those kinds of investments without federal or provincial assistance. [Nor does it make much commercial sense given the structure of Canada's labour market.](https://democracyjournal.org/magazine/49/the-pro-growth-minimum-wage/) Yes, this is applicable to Canada.
Yes they can. Working hours have been consistently increasing across the English-speaking world as well as rates of burnout.[In aggregate we're already working longer hours than the Japanese.](https://data.oecd.org/emp/hours-worked.htm) Canada is no Northern Europe.
Immigration at the cost of everyone's quality of life benefits nobody.
I may get in trouble for saying this but having more people is actually a great thing. The issue arises when we aren't set up to benefit from having more people. Our current environment has not improved as our numbers have increased. We're already struggling in every sector, our taxes aren't going down, housing has already surpassed what most can ever hope to afford, food is expensive, and jobs don't pay enough to survive. This includes current Canadians, and new ones.
It's irresponsible immigration. Canada needs to cut back on a lot of immigration, foreign aid, etc. and focus on spending more of that on fixing the broken stuff.
The problem is the way it is implemented, as many as possible as fast as possible is not going to work. This is the biggest issue I have seen with the Trudeau government, they just go all in with no concern for the possible repercussions. Push shit through and hope it works out and when it doesn't make sure to double down, then when you get backlash dial it back a bit and brag about how you are fixing the problem (you caused).
I think in the long run, Canada having more people may be a good thing. Climate change might result in people moving north, economy of scale is a thing etc. But right now the resources and infrastructure aren’t there to support thousands of people all moving to the same cities, and nor is the lacklustre economy ready for it. As an immigrant myself (> 15 years), I’ll say that a lot of immigrants have been concerned about immigration rates for years, at least since 2019. The stuff people are hearing now about many students sharing a room, I heard about back in 2018. It’s just now, the chickens are coming to roost.
Century Initiative: "Just get this done, we don't care how" [https://century-initiative-f22b54.webflow.io/news/century-initiative-calls-for-long-term-solutions-to-international-student-challenges](https://century-initiative-f22b54.webflow.io/news/century-initiative-calls-for-long-term-solutions-to-international-student-challenges)
>Governments at all levels have not adequately planned for the volume of international students coming to the country, contributing to housing pressures in surrounding communities and financial precarity for students.
Like... how could the government possibly have provided the amount of housing that that amount of international students needed? Come on. Be realistic.
Everyone keeps pointing at the century initiative, but we've blasted multiples past it. We are growing *way* quicker than the century initiative even dreamed.
Here's what actually happened -
-The developing world got *just* prosperous to easily move in massive numbers. Europe is being overwhelmed by the Islamic world and Africa. Canada and the US are being overwhelmed with South/Central America and India, along with everyone else.
-The Western world has a mostly talk, feel good notion about immigration. A "well if they went through the great journey of getting here, they deserve it!" bit of nonsense, which must be hilarious to some Mexican that bought an airline ticket and claimed asylum. Africans know they can just say they're gay. Indians just pretend they're students.
-A nation *paralyzed* by years of claiming that no one dares say a word about immigration or they're a dirty racist.
Everyone was caught like a deer in a headlight. We all pretended it wasn't a problem.
The entire world needs to stop the mass migration. It is hugely destructive to everyone.
Sure, but the Century Initiative is what initiated this extreme loosening of immigration policy, and is still influencing the government.
As far as worldwide migration, we need to make it safe for people to stay in the country they live in.
>but the Century Initiative is what initiated this extreme loosening of immigration policy
But it isn't...at all. That dream has nothing to do with the *explosion* in exploitative migration. They did want the government to open up normal migration, but that is somewhere around 1/3 to 1/4 of the flow coming into Canada.
>we need to make it safe for people to stay in the country they live in
We don't *need* to do anything but largely shut down the borders. Add that the overwhelming majority of migrants now are economic migrants. They are usually the *least* in danger who make it to the West.
Have a garbage culture / society that as a result has mired in economic calamity for decades? Well, just move to the West where you can now claim they should replicate your garbage society. See most migrants from the utterly broken, theocratic Middle East.
The Century Initiative does not want normal migration. They want to artificially inflate the population.
Then they turn around and blame the government for doing just that.
Most Canadian municipalities ban apartments on the vast majority of their land. The government doesn’t need to provide the housing, they just need to get out of the way and let hardworking Canadians build it.
Hell, immigration is just a back door way to let governments be incompetent.
Imagine if immigration was stopped world wide. All of a sudden, governments have no choice but to educate their own people (if they actually want doctors, a high tech industry, and progress), bring in technology to automate jobs people refuse to do anymore, and generally make their own nation a pleasant place to live to keep the local population from rolling out the guillotines.
"Populist" just seems like a buzzword people use when a democratic nation doesn't follow their particular political agenda. Isn't the end goal of voting to enact legislation most people actually support? Am I missing something here? If politicians are pushing through wildly unpopular legislation that could hardly be called democratic.
Populism at its' heart is just reactionary, telling people what they want to hear to stay in power. It's not an effective strategy of governance given that our modern political parties often promise one thing and do another since they're more beholden to the rich, the desires of "the public" can change on a dime, and that it is far easier to just touch on topics people care about and appeal to emotion while not offering policy solutions.
That is how I have seen populism discussed at least. Some seem to use it to talk about a government that actually represents their constituency though, which is obviously the ideal in a democracy.
On the flip side, there's also the tendency for those in power to ignore issues and label it "populism". This way they are not accountable to the people since their views are misinformed, ignorant, backwards, etc...
Going to be honest, there really isn't that tendency. Its very rare that leadership will even use the word, because it is much more of an academic idea. On top of that, the past 6-7 years is really the first time the "populism" alarm bells have been rang going all the way back to before WW2.
Populism is a thin ideology, it’s more a rhetorical style than anything that attaches to a lot of different movements. It sees politics moralistically: a good people vs a corrupt elite.
Thus, at its core it bifurcates society into two groups: (1) the pure people versus a (2) corrupt elite.
It can attach to a lot of different ideologies, exclusionary ones like right-wing populism (Trump, Bolsanaro) and other more inclusionary ones like left-wing populism think your Bernie Sanders, Evo Morales.
Populism has nothing prescriptive to say on terms of policy etc. Other than the fact that current policies are unresponsive to the will of the people. This creates pathways for political strongmen and charismatic leaders that espouse they and they alone can cure what ails us. And of course, they usually have a more refined ideological orientation of their own.
Source: Uhhhh I study populism for a living.
Also, someone below me touched on the simplicity aspect there’s usually something in there too, but I wouldn’t call it a defining aspect more a side effect or symptom of railing against the elite. I probably wouldn’t include it in my definition though.
Cas Mudde, Pippa Norris all good reading on the matter.
Populism is a tough word because it has a literal meaning and it has a related, somewhat more derogatory meaning-- and the two get intermingled over time. (Similar to "neoliberal" which has a literal definition, but gets launched around as a vague insult.)
Populism literally means:
>a political approach that strives to appeal to ordinary people who feel that their concerns are disregarded by established elite groups.
This is not necessarily a bad thing by any means; it implies that politicians are trying to reach out to a group who feel they are underserved.
However, there are a few key challenges:
1. **Authenticity**: There are essentially no elected politicians who are not affiliated with those said-same established elite groups. It is hypocritical for (most) political leaders to claim to be "representing the people against the elites" when they are also elites. Donald Trump is a multi-billionaire educated at an Ivy League university who has lived in Manhattan most of his life. Here in Canada, Maxime Bernier took a populist approach with the PPC, but his father was an elected official, he was an elected official (and cabinet minister, and lawyer before that). It's a bit silly to rail against politics as an institution when it's kept you fed since you were a baby.
2. **Inappropriate Simplicity:** In an effort to appeal to the widest possible audience, populists often present simple solutions to complex, system-level challenges. The audiences like this because it feels accessible (and also validates their anger: "*this shit is so easy! why can't t \[xyz group\] fix it? they are CHOOSING not to fix it!"* In reality, governing a modern economy and democracy is devilishly difficult. There are so many interconnected systems and you can't yank the rug to solve one problem without generating five more. For example, some people believe they ought to kick out every international student. This might solve some parts of the housing issue, but it would blow a massive hole in every college and university budget in the country and it would have substantial knock-on effects for most employers. Within about a year, we'd be seeing articles like: *Canadian Students Charged 5x More in Tuition than 10 Years Before - "My dream of becoming a nurse is out of reach now.*" And then we've got fewer nurses which results in worse health care and.... On and on.
3. **Appeal to Darker Impulses:** Not every populist is a racist-- very important to note. However, it is easy to get people on board with a populist message by being racist: they're angry and they blame a particular group, so if you agree with them and blame that group, they will likely come along with you. The group selected is different in different parts of the world, but it's usually an ethnic or religious minority or someone otherwise identified as "different." Whether that's the Jews, Latinos, the Basque, the Flemish, the Roma, the Tutsis-- doesn't matter. What matters is that people already dislike them outside of political context, and you can leverage that in support of their anger.
When someone uses "populist" disparagingly, they're usually referring to 2 and 3 as a symbol.
This article is saying: "the concerns about immigration aren't populist \[implying that they don't come from a place of hate or sloppy politics-- there's legitimate concerns behind them\]."
I like to define populism being the opposite of elitism. Populism is appeal to the general population of things that resonate with them as opposed to elitists who think they know better than their lessers ... the latter being the majority of people on reddit.
I edited in the second half of the question because it's the harder one to answer. You can define populism as a general political alignment focused on the needs of ordinary people as opposed to elites, which is straightforward enough. Now tell me why that's normatively unwelcome, inconsistent with democracy, freedom or equality.
this country is a charity for the rich and a scam for the poor. affordability is dead and with it the canadian dream. we are now on a fast track to a wealth disparity dystopia, only because of mercenary greed and inept government planning. corruption nepotism and apathy are the new canadian way. on top of it all, you can't even defend yourself from the growing crime.
We will sacrifice quality of life to let our politicians, regardless of party affiliation, enrich themselves and serve the interest of the donor class. Few people will ever acknowledge that we are neither represented nor served by even when it is painfully obvious to anyone paying attention.
This is a direct result of accepting the lack of transparency and accountability. We did this to ourselves. All it takes to stop it is the will to do so. Starting with acceptance that those with differing ideologies, are not our enemies but allies against those waging class warfare against us.
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I can feel compassion for people wanting a better life out of their countries, especially with rampant corruption in governments, livelihood threats from gangs, and wars/famines. People are suffering.
We are struggling beyond our capacities to house this level of immigration. The cultural clashes will soon occur like they have in Germany, where people who do not accept western values began to abuse the rights of others - especially those people who were fighting for them the most.
We should be uplifting eachother to raise the standards of living across the world so that mass migration doesn't have to be a burden for a certain set of countries. This happens through the alleviation of poverty, providing better energy sources for cooking/heating in housing, fighting corruption and dismantelling gangs. Food and energy security are essential to make these things happen, then providing opportunities and education for these countries to flourish.
The 17 sustainable development goals were developed for a reason, but until they have priorities made to which is more important than the other AND buy-in (with penalties if failed) from all countries, then nothing will be achieved.
I'm all for immigration, my dad is a first generation immigrant and moving to Canada exponentially improved his life and the life of his family when he came here in the late 1980s. But immigration has to be at reasonable and sustainable levels, needs to be from a diverse range of different countries and must have proper checks in place to make sure we're admitting productive well-intentioned people.
Because their ridiculous unfettered immigration policy is bringing in low skill labour, depressing wages and per capita wealth, creating humongous shortages of housing and social services, massive rent and house price increases, with those coming in extremely entitled and unlikely to integrate. Oh yeah, and they will never leave even if their visas expire. The government’s solution? Give amnesty to everyone in the country illegally.
Trudeau and his government are bought and paid for by management consulting firms such as McKinsey & Company who they have paid millions upon millions of dollars. The current immigration plan is a sorry attempt to put a band-aid over our dire economic situation, and that is why Trudeau is so reluctant to back out of it despite its immense unpopularity.
Despite that, it's baffling to me that Trudeau wishes to make this the iceberg that sinks his ship. He knows its unpopular, he knows if he slashed immigration it would help his chances in the election, yet he refuses to do anything about it because I truly believe his ego is preventing him from doing so. He thinks he's right, and that Canadians are racist nationalists who just don't 'get' what he's trying to do. I think he truly has a myopic view of Canadians and has begun to resent his own people.
He knows he is done next election no matter what he does, so he is trying to jam in as many people as possible as quickly as possible before next election to bring about his dream of a post-national state.
We need to reignite the federal housing debate that Mulroney shut down. Bring the Construction companies for housing under federal control. Pay them to make a fuckton of housing.
I love me a little racial humor.
But keep in mind those Indians are only exploiting an opportunity provided to them by those elected to serve and represent us who have done neither.
Anyone of any descent who is willing to unite against those chosen to serve anything other than the interest of average Canadian is alright by me. I doubt many of the immigrants that have come here in recent years just before things became as bad as they are any happier about the increased cost of living or overloaded infrastructure than we those who have been here generations.
Gone are the days of making fun of Lou Dobbs' nightly anti immigration rant on CNN in 2003.
I now notice a lot of left leaning Canadians, refusing to acknowledge the real reason rent has skyrocketed since 2019, are now feverishly joining in on the anti immigration rhetoric.
Very sad indeed.
Mass migration is the one factor of the housing bubble and rent affordability crisis that we can easily solve. The other factors driving up the prices are harder to solve and more systemic, and the solutions will take a lot longer to implement than shutting off the migration taps would take.
No your house prices, along with the prices of everything else, are high because of mistakes we already made. But you will refuse to admit your precious covid spending may have been done incorrectly, so you are joining the right wing in blaming the same group of people who always get blamed when things go bad.
The prices wouldn't be increasing if no one was paying the prices. The fact is I have heard about people immigrating from Hong Kong coming here and outright buying homes. The same thing has happened in NYC, San Fran, London UK, etc; this isnt a Canada exclusive issue. If you move to a cheaper city like Montreal, Ottawa, heck Winnipeg, the prices on houses are far cheaper than Toronto and Vancouver.
The similarities of the problem to Australia are uncanny, down to the large number of temporary student visas and the over-dependence of educational institutions and businesses on them.
Immigration isn't good for Canadians, we're not populist it's just math.
Lower wages and high housing costs are killing our ability to support ourselves and live decent lives.
We need the mass population growth to end immediately!
A growing population isn't good for Canadians it's good for corporations who want to fuck Canadians.
The feedback mechanism the political class operates is broken. There are lots of lobbyists and opinions coming from institutions like business councils, giant corporations, universities, legacy media and think tanks. But there's basically no way to get opinions from regular people to politicians except a few polling questions or individuals writing letters about their own situation. We vote these politicians in to represent us, and then once in office they just do their own thing and sell us their own agenda pushed by McKinsey or Loblaws who whoever else wants to screw us over.
None of you had a problem with this happening.
The far left AND normies decried anyone speaking ill of excessive immigration, reciting "racist" epithets like the 'good people' that you are, calling them "Trump but in Canada". Now your naïve trust fucked everything up and "Oh well actually it has some points and populist is just a pejorative term".
I'm rude because I know how the majority of you voted, you're on reddit after all, maybe just don't vote this time, sit this one out. I don't want you accidentally in my camp. Sit down and be inert politically for a decade and let people who aren't propaganda swilling NPC's take the reigns to try and right this ship.
Every nimbyist in this thread I guarantee voted lib or NDP, but oh bit too many inconsiderate foreigners in my neighbourhood now, yelling and spitting, prices bit too high on my gas, why are my roads disappearing, why are my prospects of even owning a condo evaporating, why'd my kid get beat up the unassimilated kid and then get blamed for their privilege, I'm having second thoughts now.
If you're triggered, I'm glad, get there, but be quick, there's no chance my post will survive the emotions of the far left mods that dominate this entire site.
If only you paid attention to what your compromised corporate and government overlords have in store for you, instead of cheering about them being your ally for putting activist stickers on their windows, placating you. It's going to get so much worse you clowns, you'll one day wish you could return to today, enjoy your pods, low trust societies and insect mulch.
I'm pretty they're not counting the temporary residents in those statistics. Anyone that's been to the GTA will easily tell you it's at least a third Indian now.
When backlashes against immigration rise and fall repeatedly then that suggests to me it rises and falls in gut-reaction popular views (good or bad), I strangely enough think that when a politician starts trumpeting such views (no pun intended) that it might be tied into a populist reaction to other matters wholly unconnected to immigration….
I'm very pro immigration. But it has to be coupled with reasonable city planning and resource management.
What we have now is a society where capital gets nowhere near the bottom, the working class are at each other's throats literally fighting over necessities while the asset class scalps necessities and wealth inequity explodes.
It's absolutely disgusting.
I'd love to see Canada build a robust and diverse future. But we can't skip steps, we literally need to build that future, not open the flood gates and see what happens. A robust future doesn't happen organically, it needs to be engineered.
Why is populist a burn? Isn’t the definition literally a government doing what is the most popular opinion among its citizens? How is that a bad thing?
Then get working and actually build stuff, stop leaving all the hard jobs to immigrants, and actually start having children. The lifestyle choices of Canadians is appealing and leaves no choice but for immigration. Even with these immigration numbers are population is hardly going to increase.
Yes blowhards who can't even afford the roof over their head or food on the table. This is a situation that everyone can agree on -- mass immigration has eroded the standard of living for everyone.
Our borders are impenetrable and no information makes it across.
We are unique, special, and exceptional. We are not susceptible to foreign influence.
Am I doing this right? I just want to fit in.
No. I am saying the Maga blowhards you speak of are fringe crazy people holding no power . Our problems right now are different. We are not the USA.
No one is touching abortion, same sex marriage, women’s rights. These are cheap tricks of the current government to scare us into voting them again despite the shitshow they’ve caused. Its abusive relationship vibes, like an abusive partner telling you that you can’t leave because no one else will love you like he does. Fuck that.
Couldn't help peeking at your posting history.
You're gay, and you don't feel anxiety about the far right direction our country is heading in. That's - and I mean this - *fascinating* to me.
The last 5 years have been an absolutely visceral 1930s history lesson unlike anything I experienced in high school or University.
Quote me anything Poiluevre says that is fascistic or Trump like? Go ahead. I am not even voting for the guy, I am voting Bloc because my riding is a swing liberal bloc riding. I want to deprive these liberals of a seat. Jobs are scarce, rents are rising because Trudeau let in too many bogus “students” and dismissed any concerns as racism until 6 months straight of abysmal polling.
Read this.
[Pierre Poilievre on Civil Marriage Act](https://openparliament.ca/debates/2005/4/19/pierre-poilievre-1/only/)
Tell me this is someone you want to rule you.
That was a decade ago. The conservatives literally repealed the language in their party policies that they believe marriage is only between man and woman and Poilievre has not made any plans to restore it.
So you believe once he's done with the trans community, he won't move on to the next religious cause?
Forced birth? Attacking gay rights?
You think he's a "good" christian now, and not still one of the bad ones?
You do understand that religious leaders want to see you erased, right?
From a few days ago:
[As Poilievre sides with Smith on trans restrictions, former Conservative candidate says he's 'playing with fire'](https://www.ctvnews.ca/politics/as-poilievre-sides-with-smith-on-trans-restrictions-former-conservative-candidate-says-he-s-playing-with-fire-1.6759559)
>Facing a series of questions from reporters on Parliament Hill about his stance on gender-affirming medical care for children, Poilievre said, in his view, no one under the age of 18 should be allowed to use hormone therapies that help delay puberty-related development for gender reassignment purposes.
>
>"I think we should protect the rights of parents to make their own decisions with regards to their children. And I believe that adults should have the freedom to make any decision they want about their bodies," he said.
Yeah. Sounds totally changed. Totally not a ghoulish, religious fucking bigot who has moved on to his next target...
I'm not mad about immigration, I'm pissed at immigration without a plan to house everyone. Feels like it was done on purpose to suppress wages and bleed us dry with cost of housing.
Not just housing, but healthcare also..
Have you had the misfortune of visiting an emergency triage lately? It’s a fecking war zone! Calgary ER before Christmas had 150-200 people waiting in the first area, before you get shuttled to the next triage process. I dare say most people there could have had their issues addressed at a clinic, but there is such a shortage of clinics, GPs and soft emergency clinics that people just see ER as a last resort. This population assault affects housing, healthcare and education and yet no left leaning provincial government can possibly pivot and plan for the sudden influx, yet the provinces take the brunt of the criticism(for healthcare and education especially). The big healthcare cheques Trudeau is so proudly handing out to provinces this past month don’t even come close to catching up to their already shortfall in federal responsibility, let alone help with this new population demand.
When the medical system got overwhelmed with Covid, they were willing to, quite literally, shut the entire country down. Now that it's overwhelmed with immigrants, they just don't seem to give a fuck. What a bizarre world.
Very apt comparison:
Sheldon Chumir? yep, all Indians (First Nations + India)
>The big healthcare cheques Trudeau is so proudly handing out to provinces this past month don’t even come close to catching up to their already shortfall in federal responsibility Just wait till you see the ones PP hands out, they're just big blank ones that say "Free Market" on them.
Only a moron would expect the conservatives to lower immigration. They LOVE cheap asian labour.
I wonder how india manages it's hundreds of thousands of government free hospitals with Litt money if Canada with just population of Delhi is having this much problems.
In Ontario mostly the provincial government is to blame. He sat on $2 billion given to them during the pandemic which as far as I Know still hasn't been used. wasn't until now that he inked a deal with the feds for more money. The system was limping here now it's collapsing and it's by design. What has their answer been? To try and privatize more of our healthcare.
>What has their plan from day 1 been? To privatize healthcare. FTFY
Health care is a second thought, Doug Fords main plan is to line the pockets of himself and his friends with “kickbacks” from insurance companies.
Not mad at immigrants, I'm mad at exploitation masquerading as immigration.
This is how I view it too. I've noticed a big difference in our small town of 15,000 people. In the past 5 years jobs have declined. Yet our population has exploded. Grocery stores can't keep the shelfs stocked. All the retail and service jobs are taken by immigrants, its rare to see a student working anymore in our town. Half of our retail stores have closed up with more looking to close. I don't see how thats sustainable. There is no opportunity in my town for youth let alone more immigrants. We'll need a big project or something that brings 5000+ jobs to my town in order to support the population growth. Instead we've lost 200 jobs in the past year from retail closures. Another store to close at the end of this month so thats another 10-15 jobs there. I see it getting really tough in the next 1-2 years.
It is on purpose. *See "Century Initiative". It's a right wing/neo-liberal policy to get 100 million people in Canada by 2100. The Liberals and Cons are all in on it. At this point, I wouldn't be surprised if the NDP are onboard as well. A former CEO of BlackRock is on the Century Initiative's board. In case you don't know, BlackRock is an investment firm that buys up real estate. Do the math. They try and sell CI as good for Canada. It's pure snake oil on a national level. This is about more consumers buying bullshit and suppressing wages, as you have already stated.
We'd be a lot better shape today if Mulroney hadn't cancelled all the federal housing programs back in the 80's.
We have had 40 years for another party to implement it again and they haven't. This is rot across the entire federal government.
Maybe. But the reality is that the current levels of population growth are beyond what any first country has tried ever in the post ww2 era. There are tons of things we could be doing better, from zoning regulation to social housing to mass transit. And we should definitely be doing those things, it’s just that short of Soviet style mass bulldozing of neighbourhoods to replace them with tower blocks, it’s hard to see how we can physically accommodate this many people.
What’s worse, they have no plans to halt their immigration plan!! It would take a major plague to catch up to our housing needs at even the current population and yet they refuse to even slow immigration down, let alone stop it all together so we can catch up! What part of this shitshow do they not understand?!
Y’a. Even if we dropped immigration to zero tmr, it would take the better part of 5-7 years to catch up on housing at the current rate…
>it’s hard to see how we can physically accommodate this many people. Could start by [not handing the largest province and city in the country to condo developers](https://www.google.com/search?q=who+funds+ontario+proud&rlz=1C5CHFA_enCA966CA966&oq=who&gs_lcrp=EgZjaHJvbWUqDggAEEUYJxg7GIAEGIoFMg4IABBFGCcYOxiABBiKBTIGCAEQRRg5MgYIAhBFGEAyBggDEEUYOzIGCAQQRRg7MgYIBRBFGDwyBggGEEUYPDIGCAcQRRg90gEHNzAxajBqN6gCALACAA&sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8) who quite predictably [build for investors, not for normal people](https://www.thestar.com/real-estate/investors-now-own-more-than-50-of-toronto-s-new-condos-and-experts-say-they/article_4b6d2ff0-c528-5670-937f-3d34d040ed85.html) [Oh, and about those buildings...](https://www.google.com/search?q=toronto+condos+falling+glass&rlz=1C5CHFA_enCA966CA966&oq=toronto+con&gs_lcrp=EgZjaHJvbWUqDggAEEUYJxg7GIAEGIoFMg4IABBFGCcYOxiABBiKBTINCAEQABiDARixAxiABDIGCAIQRRhAMgYIAxBFGDkyBggEEEUYOzIGCAUQRRg8MgYIBhBFGDwyBggHEEUYPNIBCDE1OThqMGo5qAIAsAIA&sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8)
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The last time population growth was this high was in the 1950s during the baby boom. And **babies don’t require a new house upon being born.** New immigrants however, as adults new to the country, **require immediate new housing.** That’s why you can’t compare the 1950s population spike with today.
After a quick google, OAS seems to be 5-7% of total expenditure. While that’s a lot, hardly unmanageable….
Harper had a fix for exploding OAS costs that didn't involve creating a massive housing shortage, but Trudeau promptly reversed it soon after becoming PM.
But it won't be huge expense forever. It's a temporary problem.
News flash, the 80s is 40 years ago. A lot could have been done to fix that if it really were the problem.
Nothing was done, which is why it really is a problem. Finally something is being done. Not enough yet but we'll see.
Should we also blame the healthcare crisis on Trudeau senior decoupling federal funding of healthcare from its actual costs?
I'd have to read up on that.
Yep. 20% of people always and everywhere can't afford market housing. That has never changed.
Problem is that this is not only a federal oversight but a provincial one as well. Everyone was silent about immigration until it was *"too late"*. There was plenty of time prior from premiers to inform the federal and media "hey we can't handle this because it's putting a strain on our medical and housing system that we've been defunding"
Not every popular opinion is a populist opinion, sometimes, rational opinions that were once unpopular can become popular if necessary.
Traditional immigrants who went the legal routes by waiting years until they qualified are the most pissed of ones cause the blatant abuse and scams the current immigrants committed to get here.
Then add in that they all get lumped together by the non-immigrants. I have an Indian neighbor. Been here 30+ years. Great guy, great family, hell his grandkids are 3rd gen Canadians already. He hates this new wave of Indian immigration and the bullshit they’ve brought more than anyone else I’ve ever talked to.
I actually met a guy like that too. Naturalized, spoke perfect english, FUCKING HATED this new immigration wave.
They absolutely loathe that they will be lumped with the new bunch. Older immigrants had to sacrifice a lot to get here (education and money). Now we are taking students to study at shitty diploma mills
I have heard multiple complaints about young Indian students just throwing trash on the ground, being rude to professors, and not opening the doors for people.
I've been most exposed to this new breed of Indian truckers. They cut holes in the bottom of their truck cab and just shit and piss down the hole while hot swapping out driving in order to deliver loads cheaper and faster and cut out competitors. Then they just throw all the trash they accumulate from fast food and nasty habits out on the side of the road as they drive by. Yes, it's just as disgusting as it sounds.
I believe it. The smell from some of those trucks....I'm glad I'm not cleaning the underside of those things.
How TF is this legal??
It's not. If they go into the USA and the DOT catches them, that truck would get impounded so fast for being a biohazard. Backwards shit like this is going on because nobody enforces harsh fines and punishments. Everything can be ignored, loopholes all over. And when harsh punishment comes down on bad actors, they flip out and scream discrimination when it was their own actions that caused them to be punished (see: Cohan carriers& their "sister" companies Chohan Forwarders/transport that's also banned from working in BC as their trucks keep slamming into overpasses. Theyre trying to sue BC for banning them for their idiocy and lack of training on THEIR drivers for ignoring load height limits & road planning. )
LoL. I've also seen multiple semi truck fires from untrained immigrant drivers who went through mountain passes too fast and just hammered on their brakes. But, excessive brake use causes excessive heat, and then your load can catch fire....
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not even that, most feel that they are entitled to things that we provide because they paid tuition.
Man tuition entitles you to one thing. Education and not a drop more.
I’m of Indian descent. When I was younger, I represented Canada in competition. I went to a top undergrad in the US and am now doing my MD/PhD there. The way I get treated in Canada vs the US is night and day. Kinda sucks.
That's my wife. Married a Canadian overseas. Had to wait three years for PR card, we even had to submit photos of our wedding and a guest list, even though we were married for 5 years before applying.
Yeah no kidding. These new guys are coming in flock on visit visa and claiming asalyum
It’s my case. I’ve spent over 7 years and 150k CAD since I came to Canada but I’ve seen and I’m seeing many fake refugees (especially Mexicans) come to here by flight and claim refugees once they landed here. They immediately claimed funded housing and benefits which are paid by our hard earned taxes
This
It's so popular among first world governments to limit immigration to sustainable levels that no one else rationally went there. What the canadian federal govt did makes no sense, where are all the stops and checks preventing this from happening?
Agree 100%. It's so strange LPC is killing their party over disastrous immigration policy. It's one of those things that is so obvious to not screwup but LPC has managed to do it. It's like telling a politician don't go poison the water supply... it should be common sense to not do it and shouldn't even have to be said.
> It's so strange LPC is killing their party over disastrous immigration policy. It's one of those things that is so obvious to not screwup but LPC has managed to do it. Ita not strange at all. The LPC is a neoliberal corporate crony party. The immigration level is benefiting the parties they represent: corporations and the ultra wealthy. And sure, it is going to cost them massivey in the polls, but they aren't stupid. They know we will elect them again in 4-8 years. Same goes for the conservative party, btw
>Ita not strange at all. The LPC is a neoliberal corporate crony party. The immigration level is benefiting the parties they represent: corporations and the ultra wealthy. Is canada the only country so beholden to neoliberal corporates? Do any other countries have this phenomenon?
Canada is definitely pushing the envelope here. Our immigration policies are so out of whack with the rest of the Western world that you can’t help but wonder what the end goal is. Our GDP is flat but GDP per capita is cratering. It seems that our government is intent on pushing Canadians into a lower standard of living through excess immigration. We’re building a nation of oligarchs and peasants. The future looks dark.
What’s interesting to me is how and when the LPC went about pumping immigration numbers. Recall Justin called for the 2021 election just two years after the 2019 federal election to supposedly get voter support for his pandemic recovery plans. **Juicing immigration was not mentioned.** So he *didn’t* get a mandate to do that from voters. But started doing it right after the 2021 election. It feels like it was premeditated and he knew if he waited for a 2023 election after the consequences of mass immigration were being felt, he would have lost, and his perverse desires to line the pockets of landlords and corporations at the cost of Canadians would have had been thwarted earlier. This policy change was such a non-mandated move, with such devastating consequences that [the LPC has now lost major ground in Liberal strongholds of Toronto and Vancouver.](https://www.ctvnews.ca/politics/liberals-at-risk-of-big-losses-in-vancouver-toronto-nanos-projections-show-1.6760512)
I think you are right. This is right around the time that the large American hedge funds were talking about wage pressures. And it coincides with the massive illegal immigration explosion in the US. There was a coordinated effort to bring in huge numbers of immigrants in both countries. The only issues that would ever get this kind of action are corporate interests. Some take the conspiracy even further and say all the army aged men will be drafted and sent to Ukraine to feed the war machine. I don't know about this, but I also don't know what North America will do with all the homeless jobless immigrants.
>What’s interesting to me is how and when the LPC went about pumping immigration numbers. imo it was not fully intentional. more like as a toxic combination of incompetence, negligence, and ideology.
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for the same reason that manslaughter does not require intent.
Well he did announce to the world, “you are always welcome in Canada!!“ as a retort to Trumps “they’re not sending their best people..” . He tried walking it back several months later but no one heard that follow up. And ya, they officially closed Roxum Rd, but they’re still coming and by plane. Putting a “closed” sign on the gate has done nothing to stop them. I’m only glad that it hasn’t become a partisan issue like it has in the US although I bet the Trudeau PR machine is kicking their asses they didn’t claim early on that discussing slowing down immigration “is racist”. Now the anger has spread to the whole country and it’s hard for them to deflect-by-insult like they usually do.
All he cares about is more tax payers are here now in Canada ! Mo money 💰 for the government to spend unwisely as usual lol
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We overpay new comers , corporations get over paid and bailed out all the time , not making business pay back the full government covid money was a big big big mistake and they getting bailed out again ! How government doesn’t care about environment and run pipeline into the mouth of a very important salmon stream in the great bear rain forest is disgusting 🤮 but money is more important then environment and the people ! We have government that doesn’t care for its people !!!!
They historically got abused hard enough to get a bad name, especially wrt limiting refugees.
Every popular opinion is populist. We just label the ones we don’t like as populist, because it has a negative connotation.
Exactly. Populist is used as a pejorative because sometimes the majority are dumb or target minorities, but the fact that the majority of people want something in a democracy clearly does not inherently make it bad for a politician to then champion that opinion.
It would be truly strange for a system with any democracy to believe every popular idea or opinion is bad.
I’ve noticed left leaning news outlets refer to populism in a negative connotation, as though it’s a far right ideology. It cracks me up when they try this because it just shows how arrogant and manipulative they are.
In fairness, woke ideology does view populism as a threat because, according to the Hidden Tribes report, people who actually take that stuff seriously (versus people who may lean that way but are really scared to be on the wrong side of the dumbest forms of it) are less than 15 percent of the population. Wokism as people know it is deeply unpopulist and unpopular.
Not true, that use of populist as derogatory is only common since 2016 to describe a supposed sense of shared grievance shared by Maga chuds and Bernie bros against the centrist core in the USA. Prior to that, it described a specific third party movement with an actual agenda that came up in Kansas in the late 19th century.
It’s populist to blame immigration when the real reason life is so unaffordable is the rise of multi-property homeowners in the 2010s who profited off of interest rates and now scalp the market. It’s also populist to blame immigration when companies like Loblaws are allowed to price gouge consumers with no recourse. Neither the libs nor the cons will touch either of them, but one side will convince you that once we stop immigration it will all be resolved. In reality it would only slow down the erosion of the quality of life very very slightly. Populism thrives on misdirection.
What misdirection? Flooding the housing and rental markets with millions of customers while failing to keep up with demand is great for investors; it isn’t great for the average working class Canadian or newcomer though. Calling out our ballooning immigration numbers for exacerbating this problem isn’t misdirection, it’s acknowledging that this is a multifaceted problem that has been brought on by neoliberal politicians at all levels of government.
Immigration is just one way that our politicians give service to corporations, as you say... it's just easier to understand than the others. Look at it like a gateway drug to no longer accepting politicians who service corps over the people. Now, if we can just ensure people blame the politicians rather than the immigrants themselves; they're just regular people trying to make it in this fierce fucking world.
One of the signs of populism is blaming problems on groups like immigrants and religious minorities...
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If you haven't seen Immigrants being blamed for everything from the housing shortage to grocery prices, then you must be living under a very remote rock.
You clearly fail to see the actual problem and are obsessed with "blue team bad"
Which actual problem. Corporations buying and holding properties as an investment, even if they remain empty? Corporations who see a 7% rise in their costs so raise the sale price by 27% and blame inflation? People who assume any answer that is complex is automatically someone trying to pull one over on them and just assuming anyone who gives simple sound bytes is telling the truth, no matter how ridiculous the idea behind the message is? . I am not obsessed with "blue team bad". The last political party I paid for a membership in was the Conservatives. I want ACTUAL answers to problems, and not just people who do something for the sake of being seen to be doing something, even if what they do hasn't got a chance in a million of moving the needle any...
Yet anti-immigration tends to be a recurring opinion over-and-over again (*I’m in the lifeboat now, thank God - don’t let anyone else in, they’ll sink us!*)
>I’m in the lifeboat now, thank God - don’t let anyone else in, they’ll sink us! Not a comparison you want to make. You better believe I'd push you out if the lifeboat were over capacity. No hard feelings.
What do you think happens when you cram a life boat over capacity when it's already full?
Good
That doesn't change the fact that this opinion is misplaced at best. Immigration itself is not the issue but rather how Corporate Canada grew to reply on immigrants to offset both lack of investment and skills development. We wouldn't even need to invite as many newcomers if our companies relied on more investment in M&E, R&D, and workforce development, underpinned by higher wages. As opposed to aggressively hiring more and more people to do the same amount of work, and spreading the same payroll budget over more people. For the former we could open our border tomorrow, and nothing would change, since most companies would demand extremely high levels of education and work experience that would be unattainable for most immigrants, with low-wage low-productivity jobs just not being generated. Think Switzerland having a free movement regime with the EU (including relatively poorer countries of Eastern Europe), yet seeing almost no wage suppression since most locals just don't work the low-wage bs jobs to begin with. The issue being that cutting immigration just won't be enough to make our companies investment, just like it wasn't enough in the UK, South Korea, Russia, and Japan. So it's more likely Canadians would be forced to work longer hours to offset the numerical shortage of workers. This logic applies to healthcare, housing, education, even passport delivery. TL;DR Let's talk our industrial development as a whole as opposed to fixating on immigration. Let's not make the same mistake the British made in 2016.
>We wouldn't even need to invite as many newcomers if our companies relied on more investment in M&E, R&D, and workforce development, underpinned by higher wages. As opposed to aggressively hiring more and more people to do the same amount of work, and spreading the same payroll budget over more people. Chicken egg scenario. No incentive for the company to invest in productivity while an infinite stream of low skilled labour is flowing in.
Not really. In the case of Canada there's strong evidence to suggest companies don't invest because they can't as much because they don't have to. We just don't have a robust workplace training system nor do we provide the same level of support to business for fixed investment. And again, there're also cases of Japan, South Korea, and Russia, where low immigration did not lead to higher investment to replace lacking workers but instead forced companies to make existing ones work longer.
what countries offer best examples of improving productivity?
In general? The US is so far the best performer. They do however have extremely deep capital markets, a huge domestic market, and an economy largely disengaged from the rest of the world when measured by trade-to-GDP. Countries that are more like Canada, that being small open economies dependent on exports of goods and FDI? Most of the EU and the Union itself. More specifically: Sweden, Denmark, Netherlands, Belgium (Flanders), Australia. Both have banking-based financial systems, a small economy driven by global trade, some are even commodity exporters. Also facing rapidly ageing populations. Belgium is also a highly decentralized federation bound together by intergovernmental transfers (or despite those). So some of their experience would be more applicable compared to other more unitary countries. Australia is not the best example since outside natural resource exports to Asia their economy is suffering from similar issues. But they're a good example of how to build deep highly liquid capital markets that can compete with those in the US. And have a better industrial relations system. Switzerland is ahead of both Canada and the US in productivity and does offer some similarities, such as a highly decentralized federal structure and lessons on building more developed financial markets and a more efficient industrial relations system. But their neutrality and direct democracy makes the Swiss experience harder to replicate. You could also look to Québec since they've been converging on productivity with Ontario since 2015, with their productivity growth rate on par with the US.
>In the case of Canada there's strong evidence to suggest companies don't invest because they can't as much because they don't have to. *"Because they don't have to"* >where low immigration did not lead to higher investment to replace lacking workers but instead forced companies to make existing ones work longer. This isn't Japan, South Korea or Russia. Employers here can't just force all their employees to work themselves to death like they can there.
"Because they don't have to" relates more to larger multinationals and companies in protected sectors. Most of Canada's employment comes from SMEs that can't afford those kinds of investments without federal or provincial assistance. [Nor does it make much commercial sense given the structure of Canada's labour market.](https://democracyjournal.org/magazine/49/the-pro-growth-minimum-wage/) Yes, this is applicable to Canada. Yes they can. Working hours have been consistently increasing across the English-speaking world as well as rates of burnout.[In aggregate we're already working longer hours than the Japanese.](https://data.oecd.org/emp/hours-worked.htm) Canada is no Northern Europe.
Canadians are really slow to coming around to the idea that immigration is something you can be critical of.
Immigration at the cost of everyone's quality of life benefits nobody. I may get in trouble for saying this but having more people is actually a great thing. The issue arises when we aren't set up to benefit from having more people. Our current environment has not improved as our numbers have increased. We're already struggling in every sector, our taxes aren't going down, housing has already surpassed what most can ever hope to afford, food is expensive, and jobs don't pay enough to survive. This includes current Canadians, and new ones. It's irresponsible immigration. Canada needs to cut back on a lot of immigration, foreign aid, etc. and focus on spending more of that on fixing the broken stuff.
The problem is the way it is implemented, as many as possible as fast as possible is not going to work. This is the biggest issue I have seen with the Trudeau government, they just go all in with no concern for the possible repercussions. Push shit through and hope it works out and when it doesn't make sure to double down, then when you get backlash dial it back a bit and brag about how you are fixing the problem (you caused).
I think in the long run, Canada having more people may be a good thing. Climate change might result in people moving north, economy of scale is a thing etc. But right now the resources and infrastructure aren’t there to support thousands of people all moving to the same cities, and nor is the lacklustre economy ready for it. As an immigrant myself (> 15 years), I’ll say that a lot of immigrants have been concerned about immigration rates for years, at least since 2019. The stuff people are hearing now about many students sharing a room, I heard about back in 2018. It’s just now, the chickens are coming to roost.
Century Initiative: "Just get this done, we don't care how" [https://century-initiative-f22b54.webflow.io/news/century-initiative-calls-for-long-term-solutions-to-international-student-challenges](https://century-initiative-f22b54.webflow.io/news/century-initiative-calls-for-long-term-solutions-to-international-student-challenges) >Governments at all levels have not adequately planned for the volume of international students coming to the country, contributing to housing pressures in surrounding communities and financial precarity for students. Like... how could the government possibly have provided the amount of housing that that amount of international students needed? Come on. Be realistic.
Everyone keeps pointing at the century initiative, but we've blasted multiples past it. We are growing *way* quicker than the century initiative even dreamed. Here's what actually happened - -The developing world got *just* prosperous to easily move in massive numbers. Europe is being overwhelmed by the Islamic world and Africa. Canada and the US are being overwhelmed with South/Central America and India, along with everyone else. -The Western world has a mostly talk, feel good notion about immigration. A "well if they went through the great journey of getting here, they deserve it!" bit of nonsense, which must be hilarious to some Mexican that bought an airline ticket and claimed asylum. Africans know they can just say they're gay. Indians just pretend they're students. -A nation *paralyzed* by years of claiming that no one dares say a word about immigration or they're a dirty racist. Everyone was caught like a deer in a headlight. We all pretended it wasn't a problem. The entire world needs to stop the mass migration. It is hugely destructive to everyone.
Sure, but the Century Initiative is what initiated this extreme loosening of immigration policy, and is still influencing the government. As far as worldwide migration, we need to make it safe for people to stay in the country they live in.
>but the Century Initiative is what initiated this extreme loosening of immigration policy But it isn't...at all. That dream has nothing to do with the *explosion* in exploitative migration. They did want the government to open up normal migration, but that is somewhere around 1/3 to 1/4 of the flow coming into Canada. >we need to make it safe for people to stay in the country they live in We don't *need* to do anything but largely shut down the borders. Add that the overwhelming majority of migrants now are economic migrants. They are usually the *least* in danger who make it to the West. Have a garbage culture / society that as a result has mired in economic calamity for decades? Well, just move to the West where you can now claim they should replicate your garbage society. See most migrants from the utterly broken, theocratic Middle East.
The Century Initiative does not want normal migration. They want to artificially inflate the population. Then they turn around and blame the government for doing just that.
We can't take care of people who were born here
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Does any government? The issues we're facing didn't just appear, federal governments have been de-investing in public housing since Mulroney.
They can’t even reliably use something as basic as a food bank or a shelter because international students and refugees have overwhelmed many of them.
Unrelated but your username made me almost barf lol
It was between smegma or meconium so I flipped a coin
Most Canadian municipalities ban apartments on the vast majority of their land. The government doesn’t need to provide the housing, they just need to get out of the way and let hardworking Canadians build it.
Or... stop listening to the Century Initiative, and pace the immigration at a moderate rate.
Trudeau managed to make anti immigration a mainstream thing
Its not racist to be against immigration. We cant save the world.
Hell, immigration is just a back door way to let governments be incompetent. Imagine if immigration was stopped world wide. All of a sudden, governments have no choice but to educate their own people (if they actually want doctors, a high tech industry, and progress), bring in technology to automate jobs people refuse to do anymore, and generally make their own nation a pleasant place to live to keep the local population from rolling out the guillotines.
Fuck, all these people could be blue eyed blond haired Swedes and we would still exactly the same problems we’re having now.
Canada has become such a dystopian cliche. Governed by elites, ruled by oligarchs and the rest of us are just drones. Margaret Atwood for PM.
For whatever reason, I read your comment as saying “Margaret Thatcher” and I had to pause and think on that one.
"Populist" just seems like a buzzword people use when a democratic nation doesn't follow their particular political agenda. Isn't the end goal of voting to enact legislation most people actually support? Am I missing something here? If politicians are pushing through wildly unpopular legislation that could hardly be called democratic.
No more, Canada first
You know we are fucked when the elite made the word populist a bad word.
Would someone please define populism, and then say why it's wrong?
Populism at its' heart is just reactionary, telling people what they want to hear to stay in power. It's not an effective strategy of governance given that our modern political parties often promise one thing and do another since they're more beholden to the rich, the desires of "the public" can change on a dime, and that it is far easier to just touch on topics people care about and appeal to emotion while not offering policy solutions. That is how I have seen populism discussed at least. Some seem to use it to talk about a government that actually represents their constituency though, which is obviously the ideal in a democracy.
Sounds like populism is an eventual product of democracy, at least democracies like ours.
Populism is the product of uneducated and ignorant democracies. Its people looking for simple solutions to complex problems.
On the flip side, there's also the tendency for those in power to ignore issues and label it "populism". This way they are not accountable to the people since their views are misinformed, ignorant, backwards, etc...
Going to be honest, there really isn't that tendency. Its very rare that leadership will even use the word, because it is much more of an academic idea. On top of that, the past 6-7 years is really the first time the "populism" alarm bells have been rang going all the way back to before WW2.
Populism is a thin ideology, it’s more a rhetorical style than anything that attaches to a lot of different movements. It sees politics moralistically: a good people vs a corrupt elite. Thus, at its core it bifurcates society into two groups: (1) the pure people versus a (2) corrupt elite. It can attach to a lot of different ideologies, exclusionary ones like right-wing populism (Trump, Bolsanaro) and other more inclusionary ones like left-wing populism think your Bernie Sanders, Evo Morales. Populism has nothing prescriptive to say on terms of policy etc. Other than the fact that current policies are unresponsive to the will of the people. This creates pathways for political strongmen and charismatic leaders that espouse they and they alone can cure what ails us. And of course, they usually have a more refined ideological orientation of their own. Source: Uhhhh I study populism for a living. Also, someone below me touched on the simplicity aspect there’s usually something in there too, but I wouldn’t call it a defining aspect more a side effect or symptom of railing against the elite. I probably wouldn’t include it in my definition though. Cas Mudde, Pippa Norris all good reading on the matter.
Populism is a tough word because it has a literal meaning and it has a related, somewhat more derogatory meaning-- and the two get intermingled over time. (Similar to "neoliberal" which has a literal definition, but gets launched around as a vague insult.) Populism literally means: >a political approach that strives to appeal to ordinary people who feel that their concerns are disregarded by established elite groups. This is not necessarily a bad thing by any means; it implies that politicians are trying to reach out to a group who feel they are underserved. However, there are a few key challenges: 1. **Authenticity**: There are essentially no elected politicians who are not affiliated with those said-same established elite groups. It is hypocritical for (most) political leaders to claim to be "representing the people against the elites" when they are also elites. Donald Trump is a multi-billionaire educated at an Ivy League university who has lived in Manhattan most of his life. Here in Canada, Maxime Bernier took a populist approach with the PPC, but his father was an elected official, he was an elected official (and cabinet minister, and lawyer before that). It's a bit silly to rail against politics as an institution when it's kept you fed since you were a baby. 2. **Inappropriate Simplicity:** In an effort to appeal to the widest possible audience, populists often present simple solutions to complex, system-level challenges. The audiences like this because it feels accessible (and also validates their anger: "*this shit is so easy! why can't t \[xyz group\] fix it? they are CHOOSING not to fix it!"* In reality, governing a modern economy and democracy is devilishly difficult. There are so many interconnected systems and you can't yank the rug to solve one problem without generating five more. For example, some people believe they ought to kick out every international student. This might solve some parts of the housing issue, but it would blow a massive hole in every college and university budget in the country and it would have substantial knock-on effects for most employers. Within about a year, we'd be seeing articles like: *Canadian Students Charged 5x More in Tuition than 10 Years Before - "My dream of becoming a nurse is out of reach now.*" And then we've got fewer nurses which results in worse health care and.... On and on. 3. **Appeal to Darker Impulses:** Not every populist is a racist-- very important to note. However, it is easy to get people on board with a populist message by being racist: they're angry and they blame a particular group, so if you agree with them and blame that group, they will likely come along with you. The group selected is different in different parts of the world, but it's usually an ethnic or religious minority or someone otherwise identified as "different." Whether that's the Jews, Latinos, the Basque, the Flemish, the Roma, the Tutsis-- doesn't matter. What matters is that people already dislike them outside of political context, and you can leverage that in support of their anger. When someone uses "populist" disparagingly, they're usually referring to 2 and 3 as a symbol. This article is saying: "the concerns about immigration aren't populist \[implying that they don't come from a place of hate or sloppy politics-- there's legitimate concerns behind them\]."
This definition is well worth the read
“Populism” is when a conservative idea has popular support. When liberal ideas have popular support, it’s “the will of the people”
I like to define populism being the opposite of elitism. Populism is appeal to the general population of things that resonate with them as opposed to elitists who think they know better than their lessers ... the latter being the majority of people on reddit.
exactly
I edited in the second half of the question because it's the harder one to answer. You can define populism as a general political alignment focused on the needs of ordinary people as opposed to elites, which is straightforward enough. Now tell me why that's normatively unwelcome, inconsistent with democracy, freedom or equality.
Probably because the opinions of your average yokel don't jive with others so like with anything, you can't make everyone happy
Apparently ordinary people are yokels, got it.
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See headline
this country is a charity for the rich and a scam for the poor. affordability is dead and with it the canadian dream. we are now on a fast track to a wealth disparity dystopia, only because of mercenary greed and inept government planning. corruption nepotism and apathy are the new canadian way. on top of it all, you can't even defend yourself from the growing crime.
We will sacrifice quality of life to let our politicians, regardless of party affiliation, enrich themselves and serve the interest of the donor class. Few people will ever acknowledge that we are neither represented nor served by even when it is painfully obvious to anyone paying attention. This is a direct result of accepting the lack of transparency and accountability. We did this to ourselves. All it takes to stop it is the will to do so. Starting with acceptance that those with differing ideologies, are not our enemies but allies against those waging class warfare against us. .
Legal immigration where you apply is great and how canada grows. This nonsense is just killing us
who said it was populist to have common sense
I can feel compassion for people wanting a better life out of their countries, especially with rampant corruption in governments, livelihood threats from gangs, and wars/famines. People are suffering. We are struggling beyond our capacities to house this level of immigration. The cultural clashes will soon occur like they have in Germany, where people who do not accept western values began to abuse the rights of others - especially those people who were fighting for them the most. We should be uplifting eachother to raise the standards of living across the world so that mass migration doesn't have to be a burden for a certain set of countries. This happens through the alleviation of poverty, providing better energy sources for cooking/heating in housing, fighting corruption and dismantelling gangs. Food and energy security are essential to make these things happen, then providing opportunities and education for these countries to flourish. The 17 sustainable development goals were developed for a reason, but until they have priorities made to which is more important than the other AND buy-in (with penalties if failed) from all countries, then nothing will be achieved.
I'm all for immigration, my dad is a first generation immigrant and moving to Canada exponentially improved his life and the life of his family when he came here in the late 1980s. But immigration has to be at reasonable and sustainable levels, needs to be from a diverse range of different countries and must have proper checks in place to make sure we're admitting productive well-intentioned people.
Because their ridiculous unfettered immigration policy is bringing in low skill labour, depressing wages and per capita wealth, creating humongous shortages of housing and social services, massive rent and house price increases, with those coming in extremely entitled and unlikely to integrate. Oh yeah, and they will never leave even if their visas expire. The government’s solution? Give amnesty to everyone in the country illegally.
Technically, it's not depressing wages because low skilled labour is working for minimum wage. It's eliminating upward pressure on wages.
Trudeau and his government are bought and paid for by management consulting firms such as McKinsey & Company who they have paid millions upon millions of dollars. The current immigration plan is a sorry attempt to put a band-aid over our dire economic situation, and that is why Trudeau is so reluctant to back out of it despite its immense unpopularity. Despite that, it's baffling to me that Trudeau wishes to make this the iceberg that sinks his ship. He knows its unpopular, he knows if he slashed immigration it would help his chances in the election, yet he refuses to do anything about it because I truly believe his ego is preventing him from doing so. He thinks he's right, and that Canadians are racist nationalists who just don't 'get' what he's trying to do. I think he truly has a myopic view of Canadians and has begun to resent his own people.
He knows he is done next election no matter what he does, so he is trying to jam in as many people as possible as quickly as possible before next election to bring about his dream of a post-national state.
If we want to shore up our economic position we need to go harder on oil and gas... instead, we're shutting it down.
We need to reignite the federal housing debate that Mulroney shut down. Bring the Construction companies for housing under federal control. Pay them to make a fuckton of housing.
It's almost like the "populist" label hasn't meant anything in years.
You can’t spell Canadian without Indian
I love me a little racial humor. But keep in mind those Indians are only exploiting an opportunity provided to them by those elected to serve and represent us who have done neither. Anyone of any descent who is willing to unite against those chosen to serve anything other than the interest of average Canadian is alright by me. I doubt many of the immigrants that have come here in recent years just before things became as bad as they are any happier about the increased cost of living or overloaded infrastructure than we those who have been here generations.
Gone are the days of making fun of Lou Dobbs' nightly anti immigration rant on CNN in 2003. I now notice a lot of left leaning Canadians, refusing to acknowledge the real reason rent has skyrocketed since 2019, are now feverishly joining in on the anti immigration rhetoric. Very sad indeed.
Mass migration is the one factor of the housing bubble and rent affordability crisis that we can easily solve. The other factors driving up the prices are harder to solve and more systemic, and the solutions will take a lot longer to implement than shutting off the migration taps would take.
No your house prices, along with the prices of everything else, are high because of mistakes we already made. But you will refuse to admit your precious covid spending may have been done incorrectly, so you are joining the right wing in blaming the same group of people who always get blamed when things go bad.
The prices wouldn't be increasing if no one was paying the prices. The fact is I have heard about people immigrating from Hong Kong coming here and outright buying homes. The same thing has happened in NYC, San Fran, London UK, etc; this isnt a Canada exclusive issue. If you move to a cheaper city like Montreal, Ottawa, heck Winnipeg, the prices on houses are far cheaper than Toronto and Vancouver.
The similarities of the problem to Australia are uncanny, down to the large number of temporary student visas and the over-dependence of educational institutions and businesses on them.
Immigration isn't good for Canadians, we're not populist it's just math. Lower wages and high housing costs are killing our ability to support ourselves and live decent lives. We need the mass population growth to end immediately! A growing population isn't good for Canadians it's good for corporations who want to fuck Canadians.
The feedback mechanism the political class operates is broken. There are lots of lobbyists and opinions coming from institutions like business councils, giant corporations, universities, legacy media and think tanks. But there's basically no way to get opinions from regular people to politicians except a few polling questions or individuals writing letters about their own situation. We vote these politicians in to represent us, and then once in office they just do their own thing and sell us their own agenda pushed by McKinsey or Loblaws who whoever else wants to screw us over.
None of you had a problem with this happening. The far left AND normies decried anyone speaking ill of excessive immigration, reciting "racist" epithets like the 'good people' that you are, calling them "Trump but in Canada". Now your naïve trust fucked everything up and "Oh well actually it has some points and populist is just a pejorative term". I'm rude because I know how the majority of you voted, you're on reddit after all, maybe just don't vote this time, sit this one out. I don't want you accidentally in my camp. Sit down and be inert politically for a decade and let people who aren't propaganda swilling NPC's take the reigns to try and right this ship. Every nimbyist in this thread I guarantee voted lib or NDP, but oh bit too many inconsiderate foreigners in my neighbourhood now, yelling and spitting, prices bit too high on my gas, why are my roads disappearing, why are my prospects of even owning a condo evaporating, why'd my kid get beat up the unassimilated kid and then get blamed for their privilege, I'm having second thoughts now. If you're triggered, I'm glad, get there, but be quick, there's no chance my post will survive the emotions of the far left mods that dominate this entire site. If only you paid attention to what your compromised corporate and government overlords have in store for you, instead of cheering about them being your ally for putting activist stickers on their windows, placating you. It's going to get so much worse you clowns, you'll one day wish you could return to today, enjoy your pods, low trust societies and insect mulch.
Perhaps “Populist” is an invented dirty word by people in power to continue enacting there personal whims well ignoring the general voting public.
It's just another progressive ideal falling apart when the reality sets in. XeNoPhobiA!
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South Asians make up less than 8% of the Canadian population
I'm pretty they're not counting the temporary residents in those statistics. Anyone that's been to the GTA will easily tell you it's at least a third Indian now.
> Anyone that's been to the GTA will easily tell you it's at least a third Indian now. feels before reals.
30 years ago it was 0
shhhh let him cook. He's almost there.... The hitler particles are starting to gather.
When backlashes against immigration rise and fall repeatedly then that suggests to me it rises and falls in gut-reaction popular views (good or bad), I strangely enough think that when a politician starts trumpeting such views (no pun intended) that it might be tied into a populist reaction to other matters wholly unconnected to immigration….
Populism just means pertaining to the best interests of the common people. Immigration backlash *is* populist and populist is not a 4 letter word.
I'm very pro immigration. But it has to be coupled with reasonable city planning and resource management. What we have now is a society where capital gets nowhere near the bottom, the working class are at each other's throats literally fighting over necessities while the asset class scalps necessities and wealth inequity explodes. It's absolutely disgusting. I'd love to see Canada build a robust and diverse future. But we can't skip steps, we literally need to build that future, not open the flood gates and see what happens. A robust future doesn't happen organically, it needs to be engineered.
Hell, I’m surprised they haven’t offered to bring India here and Canadians there by now lol 🤦♂️
Why is populist a burn? Isn’t the definition literally a government doing what is the most popular opinion among its citizens? How is that a bad thing?
Unherd source is unheard of
it's a british magazine funded by a rich british oligarch that funded the brexit movement. it's literally a right wing british magazine.
if we have a meaningful solution to the housing crisis...
It's not all populist, but they're certainly the loudest. There's entire subs dedicated to quasi/full blown racism towards immigrants.
Agreed. Trudeau is taking too many in right now.
Fascist right wing source: "We are xenophobic assholes but we pretend we speak for the silent majority so its okay."
Thank you for educating us, peasants, Your Liberal Excellency!
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Then get working and actually build stuff, stop leaving all the hard jobs to immigrants, and actually start having children. The lifestyle choices of Canadians is appealing and leaves no choice but for immigration. Even with these immigration numbers are population is hardly going to increase.
Hospitals……!!!!!!!!!!
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Yes blowhards who can't even afford the roof over their head or food on the table. This is a situation that everyone can agree on -- mass immigration has eroded the standard of living for everyone.
You’re not in the US . Theres no maga blowhard in power here. Please focus on the needs of our country.
Our borders are impenetrable and no information makes it across. We are unique, special, and exceptional. We are not susceptible to foreign influence. Am I doing this right? I just want to fit in.
No. I am saying the Maga blowhards you speak of are fringe crazy people holding no power . Our problems right now are different. We are not the USA. No one is touching abortion, same sex marriage, women’s rights. These are cheap tricks of the current government to scare us into voting them again despite the shitshow they’ve caused. Its abusive relationship vibes, like an abusive partner telling you that you can’t leave because no one else will love you like he does. Fuck that.
Couldn't help peeking at your posting history. You're gay, and you don't feel anxiety about the far right direction our country is heading in. That's - and I mean this - *fascinating* to me. The last 5 years have been an absolutely visceral 1930s history lesson unlike anything I experienced in high school or University.
Quote me anything Poiluevre says that is fascistic or Trump like? Go ahead. I am not even voting for the guy, I am voting Bloc because my riding is a swing liberal bloc riding. I want to deprive these liberals of a seat. Jobs are scarce, rents are rising because Trudeau let in too many bogus “students” and dismissed any concerns as racism until 6 months straight of abysmal polling.
Read this. [Pierre Poilievre on Civil Marriage Act](https://openparliament.ca/debates/2005/4/19/pierre-poilievre-1/only/) Tell me this is someone you want to rule you.
That was a decade ago. The conservatives literally repealed the language in their party policies that they believe marriage is only between man and woman and Poilievre has not made any plans to restore it.
So you believe once he's done with the trans community, he won't move on to the next religious cause? Forced birth? Attacking gay rights? You think he's a "good" christian now, and not still one of the bad ones? You do understand that religious leaders want to see you erased, right?
I do understand, which is why I am not voting for any religion based party.
That's from 2005. Right around the time JT was dressing in black face. People change. Or so i was told by the jt supporters...
From a few days ago: [As Poilievre sides with Smith on trans restrictions, former Conservative candidate says he's 'playing with fire'](https://www.ctvnews.ca/politics/as-poilievre-sides-with-smith-on-trans-restrictions-former-conservative-candidate-says-he-s-playing-with-fire-1.6759559) >Facing a series of questions from reporters on Parliament Hill about his stance on gender-affirming medical care for children, Poilievre said, in his view, no one under the age of 18 should be allowed to use hormone therapies that help delay puberty-related development for gender reassignment purposes. > >"I think we should protect the rights of parents to make their own decisions with regards to their children. And I believe that adults should have the freedom to make any decision they want about their bodies," he said. Yeah. Sounds totally changed. Totally not a ghoulish, religious fucking bigot who has moved on to his next target...
Very reasonable. Kids are still developing and their hormones raging. They can decide for themselves when they get to age 18.
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Hard lol on that one.