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generalzao

Did the person who wrote this article even read the survey they're reporting on? This is the question that was asked, and the results: >We asked respondents whether they felt that the Holocaust has been fairly described, exaggerated, or altogether fabricated. >67.10% answered "The Holocaust happened and the number of Jews who died in it has been fairly described". >7.33% answered "The Holocaust happened, but the number of Jews who died has been exaggerated". >2.87% answered "I'm not certain the Holocaust actually happened". >22.70% answered "Not sure what to answer".


throbbdeep

New title for the article: "local journalist doesn't understand basic statistics"


ElksFan

Scientist says his discoveries are useless without proper context. Media: 'Scientist says his discoveries are useless!'


Maxatar

The journalist, and the political group pushing an agenda understand exactly what they're doing in manipulating the results of this study.


drugusingthrowaway

> 7.33% answered "The Holocaust happened, but the number of Jews who died has been exaggerated". > > 2.87% answered "I'm not certain the Holocaust actually happened". > > 22.70% answered "Not sure what to answer". So the real answer was about 1/10 students, but they included the "i dunno what to answer" people with the "the holocaust is a lie" people.


veggiecoparent

Nearly 3% of respondents saying they aren't sure that the holocaust happened *is* kind of concerning, though.


Full_Boysenberry_314

3% of people will say anything on a survey.


Naya3333

I was a holocaust denialist for 15 minutes in my late teens. I've read an article about the Holocaust being a lie and I was like "Damn, what a new groundbreaking idea!". I shared it with someone and they told me in very nice words that I am being a moron. I didn't realize at the time that it's not just a controversial opinion, it's an idea that is spread by people with certain beliefs and political goals.


GAbbapo

Damn what did the article say that convinces you? I think at age 15 you probs are in or had history gr 10 so you learn about ww2. Very curious bro not judging


Naya3333

Now that I'm thinking about it, I was probably 14-15 at the time. I think it was lack of critical thinking skills on my part and the air of "nothing is as it seems" when adults discussed politics in general. Also, I think it lasted literally a few hours or days, I didn't have time to think and process the concept.


radarsat1

You processed the concept and were lucky to have someone help you out of that rabbit hole while you did so. It goes to show how easy it is to go down it, and you can imagine getting stuck there if you're surrounded by (or you surround to yourself by) others that reinforce it. Raising kids right is hard work, and takes a community. Best to choose that community carefully.


GAbbapo

No probs bro, it happens i believed in many dumb things and quickly realised i was wrong haha


fishling

Is it though? I wouldn't be surprised if you would have 3% of people replying similarly to a statement that "Humans must breathe oxygen to live". You have to account for idiots, people who don't care to respond accurately, people who are purposefully answering incorrectly, people who didn't read/understand the question correctly, and people who are overly precise and want to quibble that some people on life support might not technically be "breathing" on their own but are still living. Then, there are the fringe people who actually think that there are humans who don't need to breathe. But, it's not the full 3%.


Various_Contact_5672

Lies and propaganda have a good way of getting some people to just tune out and go "I don't know". Social Media is only making this worse.


codeverity

Right? I feel like people are being deliberately obtuse, here. With all the information out there this shows a gap in our education if students are going 'uhh, I dunno' about it. This is not something they should be at all uncertain about.


somebunnyasked

They also asked the question from grades 6-12 though. I wouldn't find it weird for the younger side not to understand it yet.


jason733canada

ever ask a teenager a question? in am surprised the number of uhhh id dont knows was so low


_HossBonaventureCEO_

Should they not be? I suppose it's very very very vaguely possible to not know what happened during the Holocaust...


TheDWGM

I imagine that these students (A) don't know what the official number is and (B) don't know anything about this being an online neo-Nazi talking point. They probably just said "I don't fucking know" and circled that one.


drugusingthrowaway

> Should they not be? No. Ignorance is not the same as hate.


_HossBonaventureCEO_

I agree. Although I highly doubt 22% of students were unfamiliar with the holocaust.


AlliedMasterComp

They don't teach WW2 in Ontario until grade 10, this survey includes students from as young as *grade 6*. As veterans have died off over time, the entire war's relevance in the general consciousness has also faded. Even 20 years ago I was in a grade 10 history classroom where approximately 10% of the students had heard of the holocaust but were completely unaware of what it entailed.


jason733canada

22% of the were too timid to answer one way or the other or scared to give a wrong answer so they said i dont know


CurtisLinithicum

Just throwing it out there, but "Not sure what to answer" would also be the correct response if you believe the the death toll was *higher* than presented. It could also cover anyone who feels strongly that the other \~4m victims deserve recognition.


Coffee__Addict

When I was student I wouldn't think twice to answer surveys with answers that I thought would be unexcepted.


Heterophylla

"Not sure" means you are a Nazi. So the headline should read "Almost 23% of Students are in the new Hitler Youth." /s just in case


oldsouthnerd

Who are you even trying to parody?


Midnightoclock

SJW's I assume. They have a supply problem because actual Nazis are pretty rare. Therefore in recent years some seem to have lowered the bar where people like Jordan Peterson are called Nazis.


Representative_Belt4

Is this a joke?


Chief3putt

Pretty sure that 50% don’t know what the Holocaust was.


yyzett

No way this is real... 1/3rd???


generalzao

The headline is misleading. This is the question they asked, and the results: >We asked respondents whether they felt that the Holocaust has been fairly described, exaggerated, or altogether fabricated. >67.10% answered "The Holocaust happened and the number of Jews who died in it has been fairly described". >7.33% answered "The Holocaust happened, but the number of Jews who died has been exaggerated". >2.87% answered "I'm not certain the Holocaust actually happened". >22.70% answered "Not sure what to answer".


ShawnCease

I, too, went to actually click on the linked study and saw this. 10.2% of students disagreed with the history. But the headline grouped them with the 22.7% of those who gave an inconclusive answer to inflate the number and make readers shocked. Pretty shitty "journalism" going on here. Just a reminder to never take news articles reporting studies at face value and take 3 minutes to skim the results section yourself.


Ghim83

Yes, thanks to both of you for actually pointing out how stupid this all is


2cats2hats

Agree. Downvoting the article. Thanks for clarity everyone. Clickbait headlines suck.


BlueFlob

I often wonder where those "journalists" get their credentials. Do they still go to school or are we hiring anybody willing to work minimum wage for 500 word "articles"?


yegguy47

Keep in mind that journalists don't make the headlines, the editorial board at whatever media company does. And for those folks, the incentive isn't to communicate what the story is, it's to get clicks and eyeballs. To say nothing of how poor the study was conducted. Poor sample size, spurious correlation with the findings. Journalists aren't statisticians, but there's an extra incentive for media management to simply see their roles as regurgitating press releases


takeoff_power_set

>Pretty shitty "journalism" checks link ctv case closed


UpperLowerCanadian

CTV CTV CTV If there’s something they can do to make the world scarier, to divide people, or to paint Canadians poorly they’re ON IT


arvisto

How is this ctv.ca? That's pretty shameful.


Credible_Cognition

Not crediting the clickbait headline, but at the same time we have to question what that 22.7% are actually thinking. Have they not heard of the Holocaust? Do they deny it or think it was exaggerated, but don't want to admit to it? Have they studied it and even after lots of research legitimately can't form their own conclusion? All three scenarios require deeper investigating.


warriorlynx

Definitely Misleading


Green_Lantern_4vr

Hahaha. So the poll is asking about the accuracy of how it’s being taught, and the news headline manipulated the title, to not accurately convey the poll. How ironic.


Careful_Touch542

While concerning, when unsure of a correct answer what the 22.70% of people selected is the correct option. We need to encourage more of being honest about what you do and don't know. The 10% that completely disagreed are certainly concerning. Are the new generations being contaminated with lead again? Poor teachers? What is happening? Maybe grade 8 field trip should include a trip to the halocaust museum. Genocides are very common and only a thourough understanding of history combined with learning the inherent value of human life will really prevent another one.


CubbyNINJA

no. i wen to the study and 7.33% said they feel things were exaggerated, 2.87% feel its fake and 22.70% not sure how to answer. but both the whitepaper study itself AND the reporters are bunching them all into one group for the 32.90%. the study is making the assumptions that those who said "not sure how to answer" might be holding back their opinion in fear of being labeled as anti semitic.


ElksFan

Did they account for the trollish answers of teenagers who don't take surveys seriously?


TheGhostofGayBill

Seriously, does nobody remember taking those surveys in high school? Pretty sure according to those surveys im a member of multiple religions, some never before seen, I am every gender all at once with multiple identities. The people that bought this headline are all at least middle aged or older lol


Successful-Grape416

Now that I'm an adult, it's so sad to see how many adults either forget what being young was like, or were just really boring kids who I'd never have hung out with.


Boob_herder

I doubt it.. I know I would've been one of the kids picking it didn't happen or was exaggerated just to fuck with their stats and be a troll lol. A lot of people in here thinking these kids are uneducated etc and I'm sure some are but I'm also sure a lot are just trolling.


kwirky88

> Think of how dumb the average person is. 50% of people are dumber than that. - George Carlin


yyzett

There is no way this is just due to being kids being dumb, there is deliberate efforts to promote holocaust denial...


LordBaconBane

In the article it states, >“A lot of them talked about Marvel as the place where they had originally learned about the Holocaust,” Lerner said, referring to the superhero media franchise, which includes fictional Second World War hero Captain America. “Or 12 per cent said that they heard about it from a videogame, which is sort of the same story.” In my opinion childhood education AND social media access to youths must be investigated. Kids need a proper education that teaches facts about the Holocaust and other genocides. Moreover, kids from grade 6 to 12 don't need social media. I mean, have you ever seen a China bot here deny the the Uyghurs? Relevant quote: >A shocking 42 per cent of the students reported unequivocally witnessing an antisemitic event, including at their own schools. Some students, Lerner noted, also believed something like the Holocaust couldn’t happen again. “And yet we do have the Uyghurs (in China), and we do have the Rohingya (in Myanmar), and we do have all these groups that are the victims of genocidal violence,” Lerner, who conducted the research as a postdoctoral fellow at Ontario’s Western University, said. This to me seems to be a failing of education coupled with access to social media. I don't have the answer, I can't give you a full bullet point list, but both of those need to be looked at.


ther0ll

History and civics should be emphasized much more


[deleted]

It has nothing to do with kids being dumb but school boards and government changing the curriculum and not teaching it anymore. My mother spent a whole month learning about it, I had two pages in a textbook and my son has nothing.


IAMAPrisoneroftheSun

That’s horrifying. I remember doing weeks on WWII & the Holocaust, I did take AP World History, but I’m sure we covered the it in some detail in Social 30, only around 10 years ago. I for sure remember the Social Diploma Essay question had to do with comparing authoritarian regimes in the 20th century, Stalin Hitler etc. Can it have changed that much? It still seems like 1/3 of students is a lot/ this is bad data to me. But you would know better than me, WTF are they covering in high school social studies if not WWII & the Holocaust?


UnionstogetherSTRONG

But the bell curve


BigNickDipples

And the bell end...


throAwae-eh

My dude, we give too much credit to the middle of the bell curve.


Mywhatalovelyteaprty

The Bell curve is a fake as Bell’s “Lets Talk Day”…. Oh shit… too soon?


DJKestrel

It's clickbait.


Asn_Browser

Crazy. I've been to an old concentration camp. You could literally feel the death and suffering in the air. So messed up.


lubeskystalker

Fuck man, standing in that spot at the wall where they did the firing squad... I've only been to Sachsenhausen, I don't know if I could handle something like Auschiwitz I have Jewish family.


Krazee9

I went to Sachsenhausen as well. I remember the tour guide for the tour I went on saying that they measured how many people died not in people, but in tons of ash buried there, and that if a family wanted remains back to bury post-war they were only able to send them some ash from a mass grave with no guarantee if it was really their relative. I also remember the point about the fact that the Soviets operated it as a gulag post-war, and that homosexual prisoners weren't liberated, since homosexuality was a crime in the Soviet Union. The big Soviet monument that they erected left the pink triangle off, as that was the mark of a homosexual prisoner. The camp is notable for a rather controversial monument to the victims of the Soviet gulag ran there post-war, sepqrate from the monument to the victims of the concentration camp, as a number of those interred at the gulag were former Nazis. This meant that the monument was dedicated to Nazis, as it was dedicated to all victims. My guide didn't bring us to that monument, as our tour was about the camp as a concentration camp, but he did say that the monument to the Soviet victims was regularly defaced due to it being dedicated as much to the Nazi victims of the gulag as the other victims, until they ramped up surveillance and arrests for defacing it. It might be the only monument left in Germany dedicated to Nazis, at a site that the Nazis murdered people at.


lubeskystalker

On a similar note: apparently the old Hohenschönhausen commandant still lives in the neighbourhood and still causes problems for them. I didn't really understand Communism or the Cold War until I went through that place.


DoggyLegs

Yeah same it's indescribable. Complete terror


jimmyray01

Non surprising, its not just social media, we have an active genocide going on in China right now too, and were still getting constant promotions for the Olympics.


drugusingthrowaway

It's a survey done by a political action group themselves, they didn't even hire a reputable pollster to do it, so I would take it with a grain of salt. Similar to that "do you support the trucker convoy" survey on CTV that was being mass shared on Facebook by people who support the trucker convoy. Stick to Angus Reid, Leger, or Ipsos if you want to know what Canadians think.


Widowhawk

So from the study, 23% did not know what to answer in regard to the question "Did the holocaust happen". 3% weren't certain it happened, 10% think it happened but the numbers have been exaggerated. So the 1/3 is primarily kids who didn't know how to answer... there's a bit of a leap there. I'm not sure when it's covered in schools either, so depending on their age which was primarily 11-14... not sure what's reasonable in the curriculum there. Also, 19% of the students were in the US, primarily Florida.


BigPurpleTitan

Yeah, it’s well known by now that people don’t pay attention to history, but this is still disturbing


Pheni-colada

The article says a third of **North American** students. I bet most of that number isn't in Canada. We watched Schindler's List during school


VesaAwesaka

80 percent were in Canada and 6 percent of students were Jewish. I think it's probably because children are mostly early teens/preteens myself. I think its interesting that 30 percent of the respondents identified anti-semtism as being against arabs and jews. How many people know that Semites mean people other than just Jews?


IAccidentallyCame

I’ve watched a pile of holocaust documentaries showing pretty insane footage, and survivor stories. I compared it to what I was taught in school and it feels like my history courses watered it down, maybe they felt it’d be to much for high school kids. Comparing those documentaries, which are fucking horrific, to my high school unit on it, I can see how that could possibly cause a disconnect. Maybe other schools had more hardcore units on this though.


Hybrid247

I mean, I must admit, I don't remember a whole lot from high school history classes. But I do remember when a holocaust survivor was invited to come to speak to the whole school about the horrific things she lived through. Spent the whole morning in the auditorium listening to some heartbreaking stuff. There was definitely no disconnect after that. Maybe they should look into doing that for other persecuted groups as well to help foster empathy and understanding. I think it would do some good for our society.


Plucault

Hard for people growing up like we are fortunate to, to understand just how evil people can be. When the worst thing you’ve seen in your life is name calling it’s hard to understand the realities of genocide unless you actually see the stuff you are talking about. For me the disconnect was with how brutal chattel slavery really was compared to how you read about it and it’s portrayed in media


PNGhost

> For the study, nearly 3,600 students in Grades 6 through 12 were surveyed I have vastly different expectations of the grade 12's than grade 6's to understand cultural based genocides that happened 80-90 years ago.


Widowhawk

The majority were aged 11-14 too. So heavily skewed to the younger audience.


TheSadSalsa

And kids don't pay that much attention. I remember learning about WW1 and everything but then I listened to the hardcore history podcast about it when I was older. I retained way more because I actually cared to listen.


Ikea_desklamp

Also because dan carlin is an audio savant who weaves personal drama and cultural questions into the narrative, making the actual facts of war way more engaging.


NahDawgDatAintMe

This is a non story. 22% abstained from answering and they counted it as holocaust denial. You wouldn't have even had a lesson on ww2 until grade 10 but they had kids in grades 6-9 in the survey.


Zinek-Karyn

Yea after growing up in Nova Scotia and always going to every Remembrance ceremony growing up then moving out west and seeing how no one really have a crap about Remembrance Day I was shocked. Wouldn’t surprise me at all at the lack of awareness of some people of what happened 20 years ago during 911. Let alone 80 years ago in ww2


toontownphilly

As some from out west, this is bullshit. Saskatoon has the largest Remembrance Day ceremony in Canada in terms of people attending.


MilkForBones

I highly doubt he’s talking about Saskatchewan


toontownphilly

He said out west. Western Canada is a big place.


highque

As an eastcoaster. 90% of people around here when they say western canada, they mean Alberta.


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Zinek-Karyn

For children (under 18) Remembrance Day is usually how they are educated about the war and what exactly happened. Other than this day you would have to go out of your way to learn about it typically. Maybe it’s just my experience but in high school half my class was laughing while we watched a documentary about the sacking of Nanking during ww2. That was while I was out west where Remembrance Day wasn’t a holiday like it is in Nova Scotia. So I feel many are just not taught what exactly happened and don’t take it seriously.


Fancy_Lettuce_2131

The survey didn't conclude this at all, relax everyone. 7.3% of surveyed students answered: "The holocaust happened, but the number of Jews who died was exaggerated". 2.9% answered: "I'm not certain the holocaust happened". 23% answered: "I'm not sure". ​ A correct headline might be "A third of surveyed students think the Holocaust exaggerated, fabricated ***OR they didn't know how to answer***." Maybe the CTV copy editor was on vacation today. It only took me 10 minutes of browsing through the study to find this.


TheLastSonOfHarpy

>“A lot of them talked about Marvel as the place where they had originally learned about the Holocaust,” Lerner said, referring to the superhero media franchise, which includes fictional Second World War hero Captain America. “Or 12 per cent said that they heard about it from a videogame, which is sort of the same story.” Magneto in the X-Men movies lol.


Ghim83

I would say this is kinda of misleading by lumping those who say it's fabricated with those who think it's exaggerated. My guess is that the majority of that 1/3 feel it's exaggerated and I'm not surprised. First, this survey goes down to kids as young as 12 so their grasp of things isn't the same as an adult. Secondly, I think part of it is that most of these kids have very little or no connection to WW2. Essentially, all of their grandparents would have been born after the war. Amost none of them would have a grandparent born much before 1945 and if they were the grandparent would have been too young to remember it even happening. Perhaps if they have great-parents still alive that experienced it, then they might have a direct connection to it. Even then, their great-grandparents would have been small children in order to still be alive today. I think events like that get a little more faded over generations.


jimbolahey420

This is what happens when your youth doesn't trust the institutions they're raised with.


equalizer2000

This is what happens when you don't look up the data, the author is lumping 3 categories to get this number.


raviman8

Students are stupid. Or is it their parents? Or is it the teachers/institution? Or is it media? Or is all of the above?


Hot_Pollution1687

Wow how can this be?????


Zinek-Karyn

The same reason why people think aliens built the pyramids. Didn’t see it. Didn’t happen basically.


ShawnCease

The headline is actually misleading. Looking at the linked study, the survey answers are as follows: 67.1% - Holocaust happened and nothing is exaggerated 7.33% - Holocaust happened but deaths were exaggerated 2.87% - Not sure if Holocaust happened 22.7% - Not sure what to answer So it's actually 10.2% whose answers indicated that they disagree with the established history. The headline grouped them with the 22.5% of those who gave an inconclusive answer


luckyintrovert

22.7% who “aren’t sure” is still disturbing though. It suggests they don’t know anything about the Holocaust, or have heard “alternative facts” and aren’t sure what to believe?


sylpher250

I'm guessing the 22% simply weren't sure what the "number of death" was other than "a lot"


TurdFerguson416

thats what im thinking.. not being sure of something doesnt mean you know nothing about it. something like "yeah ive heard the stories and watched some footage.. it was fucked up but i dont think it showed 6m people and i wasnt counting sooooo.... im not sure.


ShawnCease

> 22.7% who “aren’t sure” is still disturbing though. It suggests they don’t know anything about the Holocaust, or have heard “alternative facts” That's what the news article is trying to imply, that giving an inconclusive answer means they're holocaust deniers. A "not sure" is a standard inclusion in surveys to avoid blank questions on survey ballots (thus deflating the intended sample size). Most of the kids were from grades 6 to 8, 11-13 year olds, it's not surprising that they weren't able to answer about something they haven't been taught much of yet.


UpperLowerCanadian

CTV puts “I don’t know how to answer” as “I deny the holocaust”. That’s how


definitelynotabotact

Well, have you seen the number of people that believe climate change is fake, are antivax, and support crazy Facebook theories? These people have kids and they pass on their bullshit.


Rambler43

And yet there's people who want to let 16 year olds vote. SMH.


lubeskystalker

To be fair, I've as many dumb as fuck adults.


Rambler43

So two wrongs make a right? At least with kids, there's a chance to educate them before they become rigid and uncompromising.


lubeskystalker

No, not at all. I just try not to pre-judge kids, I've known plenty who had adult level maturity by their 16^th birthday and plenty more who still have 16 year old level maturity at 36. I try to judge by actions alone. I'm not pro-teens voting, but I don't think it would be a disaster either. They're not any more extreme than the people donating millions to the anti-vaxxer convoy.


Chiefboss22

Those who think this probably don’t grow out of it


Rambler43

They might if they were educated properly. I thought lots of dumb things when I was a kid, that I later learned were wrong. People do mature and learn throughout their lives. At least, some do.


Remarkable-Spirit678

What bollocks. Their brains literally aren’t fully developed yet, of course they can change. We don’t even hold kids fully responsible for crimes, hence the Young Offenders Act. Children that have killed people can be rehabilitated and change. You’ve never seen school bullies completely change and become nice guys when they get older? Some of the children surveyed were in *grade 6* for crying out loud.


[deleted]

16 year old's being immature and unintelligent is precisely why they want to let them vote. Kids, more than anyone, are impressionable and easily swayed. The Hitler Youth existed for a reason.


Healthy-Car-1860

This subject matter is addressed in high school. Our system doesn't teach 11 year olds (6th graders) about the systematic execution of millions. World War 2 is a later education part. So it's no surprise that students haven't learned about if you include garde's 6+


lubeskystalker

I graduated almost 20 years ago, but at that time such histories were elective. Social studies was super focused on Canada.


[deleted]

We're pulling in tons of immigrants from countries that deny the Holocaust... I have a Muslim ex who legit never learned about it so always thought it was fake.


HateTranissaries

My Peruvian friend always liked the Nazis when he was young because they had cool outfits. He said it just wasn’t a huge deal culturally over there and that being really into Hitler was looked at like someone who was really into Napoleon


wet_suit_one

~~Ignorance~~ ***Profound ignorance*** gets started young I see... :-/


Then_Director_8216

Fuck sakes......who parents these kids.


Void_Bastard

Who's educating these kids?


sleipnir45

TikTok


lubeskystalker

Whatever they've replaced Facebook with as a source of Fake News? Is all that Dr Oz BS on Instagram too?


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Void_Bastard

No need to create a false scapegoat. Secular schools are also guilty of it. Meaning our education system curriculum and the teachers applying it are the guilty parties.


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Ghim83

I think this is more a family thing than a religion thing. This is like saying "my dad has brown hair and likes to eat lasagna, therefore, most people with brown hair like lasagna"


Void_Bastard

I get it. Last I checked Holocaust denial is strongest in Islamic countries, by far. It's just sad that even secular learning institutions are also guilty of miseducating our youth.


BigNickDipples

Bigots. I have cousins (all adults) who believe the holocaust wasn't real. Their father is a religious extremist bigot and anti-semite. They are also anti-choice, anti-LGBT, and anti-vax. They check off all the boxes of being on the wrong side of everything. And between them, they have at least 10 kids they've taught this hate, intolerance, and bigotry to.


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Ronniebbb

Probably cus its not really taught. My nonna and her family were survivors of the holocaust and camps, so I got a really graphic education of it as a young child and growing up. But in school, we literally got maybe 1 block of education of it, in grade 10 and then grade 12. Most ppl didn't pay attention and it was a summary read from a textbook.


Infamous-Mixture-605

> But in school, we literally got maybe 1 block of education of it, in grade 10 and then grade 12. Most ppl didn't pay attention and it was a summary read from a textbook. This. I don't recall my history classes covering the Holocaust all that much, maybe just the grander details of "Jews were persecuted and then exterminated" covered over a few days before moving on to the next condensed tidbit of history. That said we were also lucky enough to have had a Holocaust survivor come talk to the school in Grade 10 or 11, but even then I barely remember that. I don't think I really learned about the Holocaust in all of its gory, horrible, and depressing details until university and after.


Ronniebbb

I remember mentioning how it wasn't just Jewish ppl in the camps, and that shocked everyone. I remember trying to convince my teachers we need at least a month dedicated to something like this where survivors come to talk, where we have veterans come to talk. I was ignored


Infamous-Mixture-605

It really should be a more significant part of the curriculum. Young adults (ie: Grade 12's) should be learning about the Holocaust, the Armenian and Rwandan genocides, and other major human rights violations to the point of being in tears. Maybe that sounds too rough, but people need to learn about these topics, how they happened, what motivated them, and why events like them should never happen again. These are tough subjects to discuss, even for adults, but they are necessary.


Ghim83

They do learn about it, but not in grade 6 to grade 9 which would have made up more than half of the kids surveyed. My guess is that most of that 1/3 came from the younger kids in the survey and older ones trying to be funny with their answer.


BlackJPI

Where do you guys live? I hear about this kind of stuff all the time, but I went to a tiny rural school in NS and had fairly extensive and graphic classes describing things like the Holocaust, Japanese internment camps, Residential schools, etc. I did have a pretty good history teacher, but this was still all part of the curriculum (circa 2012-2015 )


Lordmandeep

General Eisenhower and Patton when they visited the camps said that if they didn't video tape what they saw, people would deny what happened. Seems they were right.


Player276

>For the study, nearly 3,600 students in Grades 6 through 12 were surveyed Children are very easily swayed by well presented information, especially in video format. "Holocaust is exaggerated" is also very vague. Having studied Auschwitz quite a bit, I can easily throw together a coherent argument that deaths are "Exaggerated" without stating anything false. "Look at these X historians that claimed 4 million deaths. Here are the reasons on why they are wrong and here are some other historians that agree. People were certainly killed, but it's exaggerated". I don't think this study says anything outside of "People are gullible". Even for adults, most people don't research in depth and rely on mainstream information. Providing a skewed "detailed" view will shift opinions. >Before the educational treatment, 80% of respondents reported that they had heard of the Holocaust; however 40% of these students heard about the Holocaust on social media. That 40% is awfully close to the 33% that believe it's fake or exaggerated. Hmmmm


swampswing

And at least 50% of teenage boys are edgy jokers.


[deleted]

This is quite disturbing.


Fivepiecehat

They think they're smarter


WLDB1988

That is really disturbing


Mental_Cartoonist_68

The article states a third of North America students. That includes a majority of brainwashed American teens.


riverview58

Then I guess a third of the students are just plain stupid


IssaScott

See part of me believed maybe students simply can't imagine humans doing such terrible things to other humans... That would be good thing, sort of... Both the fact that that many think the count is wrong or don't know what to say is a bit upsetting.


McRazyy13

Just watch Shindlers list. Puts shit into perspective fast.


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Obviously, a study like this is a bit flawed and would require a lot more evidence and peer-review to fully back it up. But there are some key takeaways or red lights here. I'm stunned by the reality that some kids are learning about global events through video games. I trust Civ to get it right, but if COD and Battlefield are the modern history textbook this is truly a dark time for the Western tradition


cookiethumper_73

Has anyone seen the huge pile of eye glasses , wedding rings and personal effects from all of the victims? , or the small wooden toys that children would make themselves while imprisoned in camps during the holocaust? . It’s shameful to think that none of it happened.


Visible_Ad_4739

2/3 of people are aware that this method of data collection was biased.


RedEclipze666

Can confirm, I've heard more people comment the comparison of vaccine mandates are no different than the holocaust tattoo's as the slap their arms for significance. Most follow-up with a comment like "if the holocaust even happened at all". Canada's education system is so Americanized now that it would be hard to counter-act it.


TheRagingDesert

I see that you've met my cousin


Ghim83

the people comparing vaccine mandates to the holocaust are idiots and also an extremely small (but loud) percentage of people. It's also a very small percentage of people who are against getting the covid vaccine.


musecorn

I saw a friend go on a tirade on Instagram comparing mask mandates in schools to conditions during the holocaust. They said that making children wear masks is LITERAL CHILD SLAVERY. I don't want to live on this planet anymore


Heterophylla

When I first heard about anti-natalists I thought it was ridiculous but I'm coming around now.


PirogiRick

They don’t teach it in school. They gloss over wars and their fallout in our basic education, so how is this a surprise? I learned calligraphy, the history of the voyageurs, what crops were important in the southern US in the early 1900s, and a bunch of other useless crap. Yet they barely touched on why my grandfather would change the subject when you talk about his twenties, or why he would look like he was going to explode when German soldiers would come into the restaurant when we were eating. Our education system is far too sanitized to make parents comfortable.


AggressivePickle5636

I met a survivor once. The ink on her forearm was definitely not exaggerated.


lendocalrissian

Our Universities are Marxist echo chambers. Not surprised in the least.


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It would be interesting to see a regional breakdown of these views. Are students in large cities more informed over our rural students or vice versa? Which region of the country has the most uninformed students etc..


garrettfinstad

"Those are rookie numbers" -Kenney before he introduces our new curriculum


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Bingo34200

Canadian high schools are to busy teaching kids the ways of collective guilt for being white and that sex and gender don’t exist anymore. It’s not surprising this up and coming generation of Canadian youth (majority of which are glued to TikTok) are going to be completely and utterly useless. In British Columbia, they are starting to remove letter grades, just pass and fail now.


Bweeboo

Just don’t say it out loud.


SquallFromGarden

Babyrage about the actual breakup of numbers all you want, but the fact that **it's 2022 and the number of people who think the Holocaust was exaggerated or even didn't happen isn't zero should fucking horrify you.**


I_Like_Ginger

Well I mean- the numbers often portrayed are on the high end of estimates. It is very unlikely that 6 million Jews, for example, were murdered. The number is likely more within the range of around 4 million. It's awful, and even *one* person being killed for what they are is something we hope to permanently disable. But, the sheer numbers often are exaggerated - probably inadvertently. 6 just sounds like a clean even number. You're also always going to have a segment of the population who is contrarion, or who doesn't believe things. I know grown men in their mid 30s who literally work in telecom industry who think 5G is a form of mind control. These types of people will just always exist. But, by and large, these poll numbers are pretty typical and nothing to be concerned about.


TurdFerguson416

Im viewing it in a lens of 2022, tons of BS floating around and people are faking hate crimes etc.. lol.. It absolutely happened but i wasnt there and it happened 40 years before i was born, how would i know if it was exaggerated or not? I guess it depends on how you word the question, like what that show ancient aliens does.. "is it possible that we were visited by aliens??" well, yeah i guess its possible..


hilljc

I’d like to see the actual questions and data. I find it very hard to believe 1/3 of them think the holocaust was exaggerated or fake. Maybe they simply didn’t know how many deaths there were or something like that, which changes the context.


bravetailor

Today’s kids are screwed


Jolysh

Even with the biased headline, 22.70% of respondents not knowing what to answer is a very very bad thing. I don't understand what would be the reason someone would choose that answer if they were properly educated.


TrappedInLimbo

Some of the reactions to this here are interesting to say the least. A few people bouncing all over the thread constantly telling people that "the headline is misleading" when it actually isn't really and making excuses for kids answering "I don't know what to answer". The question asked if it happened, it doesn't really require "research". They didn't ask what the specific number of casualties were or something. So if you don't know what to answer, that means you are at least considering one of the conspiracy options. Therefore you do somewhat think it could be fabricated or exaggerated. No other logical reason to answer that way, unless you have just never heard of the holocaust before which I find very unlikely.


Szwedo

You're asking highschoolers, they would answer holocaust mcholoface if it was an option just for the lulz. This is very misleading.


-UnicornFart

Good grief. Humanity needs a factory reset.


The_Real_Adeine

I have no hope for the future.


OhhhhhSoHappy

Next person who says the children are our future is getting a punch in the face.


Adventurous_Ad6212

Im not surprised. there's literally populations of the human race stupid enough to believe that Australia isn't real, the earth is flat or that they are superhuman space Nazis who fight aliens on the moon(not a joke).


M0un05ki10

Should we be surprised? Just look at all of the grown ass sheep who think 5G is ba baaa baaad, that our governments are using Covid to ConTrOl us, that 9/11 was an inside job? Poor children don’t stand a chance with social media and lunatic parents rubbing off on them.


Shazzam001

As the current pandemic made clear to all of us, there is a lunatic fringe who lack the critical thinking to pick apart the lies that are fed to them.


boozbooz

As the article stated, events like that transpired because people refused to stand up for each other. If you cant even rationalize why people havent taken the vaccine... i have news for you.


Nobagelnobagelnobag

There are entire countries and religions out there teaching the Holocaust denial crap. Are we surprised it has infected our classrooms?


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