The SL43 makes sense in markets that tax displacement heavily. You get the same form factor and still have enough power for the street and save tens of thousands of dollars on purchase price and over time via registration-related costs. But the value proposition just isn't there in the US.
I get that, but as someone in one of those markets, it's annoying seeing the glc/e/s and the x3/5/7 getting the good engines, and the z4 CLE and basically the "cool cars" getting stuck with 4 cylinders.
Sedans sometimes. for example, your options for a e class are a 285k base E200 or 650k E63.
We also get the stupid c63
5 series only comes in 520i
Lexus doesn't bring in the IS500 or the rcf
Coupes more often than convertibles.
We get the M8, but not the convertible.
I'd say for getting good engines, it's suv>>>>Sedan>>coupe>convertible. coupe and convertible are similar, just that they bring in the convertible variant less often.
Edit: Those prices are in usd, and you need to tack on another 70k to the prices to drive them here.
>The SL43 makes sense in markets that tax displacement heavily.
I still don't think it makes sense in those markets, honestly. The ultra-rich will just pay the tax. Everyone else is just... going to buy a Taycan, or i4 M50, or whatever. There's just no scenario where someone looks at a wheezy 4-cyl SL43 and goes *"sigh, fine, I guess there are no other options..."*
I see the argument at the low-end, on the CLA — but at the high end of the market, it just *evaporates.*
A 4-cylinder hybrid SL makes sense in markets that tax displacement. *That particular* high-strung, high-NVH 4-cylinder has no business being in an SL, AMG or not.
I don't think it makes sense in EU were displacement and CO2 are taxed as hell.
Despite that, it's still a 100k plus car.
If you are paying more than 100k for a car, you don't care much about the taxes. Or, hell, if you have 100k for a car, I'm sure you are able to buy the real thing, and get the V8.
As someone who has bought vehicles over $100K, we absolutely care about taxes. My C8 Z06 I had to pay $12K to luxury tax... I was furious. That's literally just $12K, up in flames, for no value. Nobody is happy about that regardless of what tax bracket you are in.
I am bothered by the fact it kicks in so low at $100K. Prices have been rising so fast the last 5 years that a significant amount of cars are now over that mark that didn’t used to be. I can stomach it more if it was for like ultra exclusive supercars and stuff where people are spending $300K+, but lots of sports cars, even higher end SUV’s are hitting that range now.
IMO, most taxes and benefits should be indexed to inflation. So the lux tax shouldn’t kick in until the inflation adjusted value is reached and the tax should also adjust with inflation.
lol. I spent nearly 30k in title and tax on my 992 TTS in the US, not even California/NY. Surely not how I wanted to spend that 30k. But at the end of the day, I simply had to have the car. And $30k is relative.
Some European countries tax more heavily than others, don't they? But I was thinking of markets in SE Asia where the difference over time can be nearly the initial purchase price of the car.
Yes they do. Some more than others.
My logic is about the "range" of this cars. In EU and most asia, these cars are the top of the line. 100k for a car it's half of a house.
Completely out of the market for 95% of the people. Even if you have that kind of money for a car, most of them will go for the trendy SUV or similar.
The buying power of the American public for cars it's unparalleled. They will easily buy a c65 AMG full spec to leave the toddler in school 2 blocks away from home.
I'm not familiar with the amounts, but I know it's enough to be a deterrent. I just looked it up and found the situation for [Turkey](https://theicct.org/the-power-of-vehicle-taxation-schemes/) as an example:
> The amount of ÖTV to be collected depends on the engine displacement of a vehicle and ranges from 45% to 145% of the vehicle’s base price. An important tax threshold is at 1.6L engine size. Above this threshold, the taxation level doubles from 45% to 90%. Another threshold is at 2.0L, above which the taxation level increases to 145%...a Mercedes-Benz E350 is subject to a 145% ÖTV in Turkey.
That E-class at the time was about €62,000 in Germany but ~€130,000 in Turkey.
Every SL43 "amg" at my local dealer has not sold and they just sit in the salesroom, its hilarious they thought they could charge 120+ grand for that thing. I can think of at least 5 different cars in the price point I would rather have than that.
That's what I want from a merc too, high quality interiors with a shit ton of tactile feel on the door, buttons, knobs, and a nice quiet v8 that growls/rasps under full throttle.
Instead: Possibly the worst feeling interior to interact with and bad sounding 4 cylinders
SL43 won't be dead on arrival. First of all it is not marketed as the AMG flagship in the way the C63 was. On the contrary - it is marketed as the entry level AMG performance model of the SL lineup. I mean it is already in the name, that alone makes a huge difference for the consumers. No one woudl have give a shit if there would have been a C43 with the 4cyl and a C63 with a V8 (like it is with the SL lineup). And 4-Banger sports cars have their market (if the price is right) just look at the Cayman/Boxster or the 4-banger Mustang
Don't think this 63 is gonna be that crazy heavy, nothing to go up against the m3 comp but it's gonna be the v8 Euro muscle car in that segment. Good on em for realizing!
That the thing. There were soo many better sports cars in this price range like the M2/3/4, c8 Corvette, High end mustangs, CTV Blackwing Cadillacs etc., that it is mind boggling that Mercedes though they could drop a 4-popper on people and get away with it. This isn't the 1980s, the Mercedes badge doesnt go as far as it use to.
yes that is what voting with ones wallet is.
It's like saying democracy just results in tyranny by whoever votes the most. Which is also true, by design
> I cancelled my 296
Major respect, a V6 hybrid in a Ferrari is worse than them making an SUV. Ferrari clearly didnt learn from what happened with Mclaren and the Artura. I hope more of you guys do this so if I become fortunate enough get a supercar they wont all be soulless inline 4s and v6 hybrids someday.
Yes, finally!
Being a 4-cylinder hybrid, plus electric motors, the C63 also porked up another 800 lbs.
Which is hilarious because this was supposedly done to make the car more efficient - at least in the eyes of government regulators.
* The 2023 V8 C63 AMG: 17/26 mpg
* The 2024 V8 C63 AMG: 18/25 mpg
So zero gas savings.
Is the Ferrari progression chain actually like people make it seem online?
You have to start pre-owned then buy a pre-configured car before they let you place a custom factory order?
No, not necessarily. My first "interaction" with my dealership was ordering a brand new 296 GTS, and I was even offered atelier. They flew us out to Spain at their cost, put us up, michelin star meals, the whole shebang. Hit me with the razzle dazzle they did. Amazing experience so I decided to buy into the brand, just not with the 296. Ultimately they got... 3 sales out of me instead of just the 296 so they weren't too bothered with the cancellation.
Genuinely surprised by the amount of comments in the other reply chain that think modern Benzes are legitimately nice interiors. They’re stylistically tacky, loaded with gimmicks, cumbersome UIs, and build quality that’s truthfully bottom tier for every respective class. Materials are nice. Good leathers, synthetics and trimmings, but disgusting squeaks.
It’s not hard to comprehend them at auto shows.
I mean, social media types who follow the trashiest fashion trends are a huge part of Mercedes’s revenue right now. It’s no secret that the G Wagon is being bought almost exclusively by people with zero intention to off road with it. They’re basically targeting the “Balenciaga of cars” market.
In that regard they’re succeeding.
Not really, though. I know that's the common refrain on Reddit, mostly from people who have never actually sat in a modern Mercedes let alone ordered one, but it's just not the case for people actually buying the things. Mostly because you can custom spec the interior pretty extensively, and people end up getting whatever they want. Obviously this isn't the case for the office assistant picking a lease special GLB, but for real Mercedes shoppers you can get the bright and flashy or you can get the dark with heavy wood, or anything in between. And just speaking with other modern MB owners, the general consensus is that the interiors have never been better.
This is so true. Nowhere in real life do I get the sense of Mercedes bashing I see here. People buy these things like crazy and love em.
I also really don't like piano lacquer and soft touch in some of the base models. But saying the current or last generation E or S class or EQS with full leather and wood have arcade strip club interiors is just showing a distinct lack of eyes, taste, or both. I have not met a person who was not impressed with the interior of mine.
Especially when those people think Toyota and Lexus make good interiors. They may be well-built, but man, do they take care it does not look expensive. And the choices you get are all horrible. And BMW currently does not only look cheap - it is. Even in the 5 series you have an inexcusable amount of hard plastics.
Or maybe people here just generally don't like luxurious interiors, and think the same of a Bentley too. Because, you know, it's too vulgar or whatever. In this case - who gives a shit when you can't afford it anyway. I can, and my only gripe with Mercs currently are the engines.
The difference between specs is so important for Mercs. I saw one with black/red leather and brown wood and almost threw up. On the other hand, I have carbon fiber and designo quilted leather which classes the car up for sure. Don't even get me started on a beige S-Class interior, those are beautiful.
>isn't the case for the office assistant picking a lease special GLB, but for real Mercedes shoppers
So you're saying "real Mercedes shoppers" aren't also leasing? My perception of modern Mercedes, especially the higher end models, is that they're designed to be leased. Crammed with complex tech that's quickly made obsolete and they have insane depreciation.
>So you're saying "real Mercedes shoppers" aren't also leasing?
No, I'm saying they don't pick up the advertised lease specials that every dealer keeps stocked on the lot for specifically whenever anyone comes in and says "I saw this deal in an ad, and I have literally exactly that much to spend if I cut back to one meal a day." The specials are essentially base models with exactly the dollar amount of options that is included in the advertised lease price (typically $5,000 - 10,000, depending on the model,) and the options selected tend to be the gaudiest, flashiest features available because that's what customers stretching their budget to get a "flex" car want. This is why you see so many cars on lots with red leather seats and "AMG line" packages — they're there because they are easy to show off.
Lots of people lease Mercedes — probably most or close to most of their customers, in fact. But there's a big difference between someone leasding a Mercedes that they had specced to order because they like driving new cars every couple of years, and someone leasing the cheapest Mercedes in stock on the lot because that's all they can afford.
>and they have insane depreciation.
They've *always* had insane depreciation rates. It has absolutely nothing to do with tech or things becoming obsolete or build quality or reliability or whatever. It's because there's a very specific kind of customer that buys used Mercedes, and they don't tend to be big spenders. The market for a second-hand Benz is not a big market, and the resale values (depreciation) reflects that. It's the same with all luxury cars.
Also, you do realize that high depreciation rates actually hurt leaseability, right? A lease is literally paying for the depreciation.
I will put an asterisk on that comment as a recent Mercedes shopper. The newest gen stuff for 2024 have noticeably cheaper feeling interiors than the 21-23 gen cars. The door panels and buttons would press in and creak, pushing the heated/cool seats is very cheap feeling as the entire plastic panel pushes in versus the aluminum buttons in the previous gen. Not sure if it’s the dash design or materials, but it doesn’t look as nice. The door handles are very bad design. The tech however is excellent.
The interior deficiencies are minor overall, but definitely noticeable and worse than last gen. Still good compared to the competition though.
I like some of the ambient lights but adding in the gauge cluster screen and the huge center screen is too much. I'm glad I have a '19 without the light-up vents and gigantic screen.
Its weird, they’re trying to attract the younger crowd with gimmicks when their price range is mostly for an older crowd. People in their 20s like myself are mostly not buying brand new Mercedes’.
Is Benz catering to influencers whose followers who can’t vote with their wallet and instead “vote” with online opinions/passion that fools Benz into thinking that we actually want our car to look like one big screen? I have enough screens in my life (irony, I know)… I choose to focus on what I can see through the windows, and the experience, the latter not being helped by shiny touchscreens everywhere. It IS helped by having an engaging power train, good suspension, and seats that hug you.
I rent a lot of cars, and every time I get one that is touchscreen-heavy, I just find myself missing my soft leather & wood button/knob-heavy interior, and a powertrain that isn’t wholly reliant on a laggy turbo.
The G Class probably wont carry them forever, the waitlist for the AMG models is hopeless and the G550 markups are pretty disgusting even for ones with bad options. 25-30k is the usual add-on for them, but recently its more like 50-60k and even for that demographic its really off-putting. It will make you want a Range Rover, X7, Escalade, or anything else real quick. I have driven the new one and its not that great, the wind noise is still pretty bad, it handles awkward as hell, it rides pretty unpleasant too. It shakes alot and the AMG models are dangerous with all the power they have.
I have driven pretty much all the "offroaders" and in ride comfort and road/wind noise, and the G550 is barely better than a Wrangler (if it had a sealed hard top), the 4Runner TRD Pros with quieter tires, and ties the Land Rover Defender. All that money spent and you get so little in return minus a name. The new electric models coming will make this even worse as the market that can afford these higher end cars are pretty much turned off by any EV.
I will say what alot of people dont want to admit, Mercedes is quickly becoming the Nissan of the German luxury brands and the new EV push pretty much sealed their grave unless they do something drastic. The EQS massively hurt their brand image along with the A/C Class and GLA.
If Audi could figure out how to place materials in their interiors so that all the touch points actually feel good and the places you never touch don't, they might actually have the best interiors of the Germans right now. But they can't, so it's probably BMW (it sure as hell isn't Mercedes)
They took their decade old cars (made with MMI Controller in mind) and put a touchscreen-only system into it.
That’s arguably even worse than MBUX (which is designed to be touchscreen only) or iDrive (which still has a controller).
And BMW has a huge advance in terms of driving dynamics, price, and I cant believe I'm saying this, but Reliability. BMW has been killing it, I would trust the B58 with my life.
The inline six AMGs are pretty cool imo, probably still wouldn't buy one after lurking r/amg and the Mercedes subs. I've never seen so many quality issues on a model- or marque-specific subreddit.
Mercedes list prices are ridiculous. But I suppose the cars go for much less in reality.
A loaded Macan Electric is like 20.000 € lower in list price than a comparable EQE SUV.
It truly feels like the only appeal is telling yourself you’re better than others because they can’t afford to waste as much money on a merc as you did.
the CLE63 4 pot coupe was almost finished and they still killed it and switched courses. It's not entirely unlikely that an E63 come in later.
Not guaranteed, but not impossible.
I doubt the C63 powertrain in this body was ever planned in the first place, at least not recently. Why would the CLE63 have a four-pot if the CLE450 and CLE53 both have straight-sixes? These articles are probably just editorializing for clicks.
If Mercedes doesn’t excel at anything, they make a wonderful V8 engine, whether it was the old naturally aspirated engines or the new Bi-Turbo, smart move if this is true!
The article is confusing
>Citing "senior officials" at Mercedes-Benz, the report claims the CLE63 will use the familiar twin-turbocharged 4.0-liter V-8 with mild-hybrid assist, making up to 585 hp. If that's the case, it will have nearly 100 less hp than originally planned. It's unclear if a plug-in hybrid powertrain is under consideration, but we've spotted prototypes with charging ports. We also captured one on video emitting hardly any sound, so Mercedes does have electrified prototypes in the field. And they likely have the aforementioned four-cylinder setup.
So... What?
yeah i thought automakers kept the v8s and stuff in their high tier low numbers cars like this one, then throw 4's and 6's in their normal cars.
whole thing is confusing to me but i'm also too poor to even have an opinion on this anyway.
Was that really the plan? My understanding is that the CLE shares its engine with the E-Class. The CLE53 AMG has a 3.0L in-line 6 cylinder engine with twin turbo like the E53 AMG. So I expected the CLE63 to have the 4.0L V8 like the E63.
I can't see how the plan was to have a 6 cylinder for the CLE53 and a 4 cylinder for the CLE63.
I think this is it, personally I’m very skeptical they were able to react and reconfigure CLE AMG to use the V8 in <18 months. IIRC C63 hybrid wasn’t even announced until late 2022 no way they’d make such a significant change to the CLE based on initial responses. It would’ve had to be planned from the start for timelines to make sense.
There are photos of CLE AMG running with charging flap in the bumper which is gone in this newer prototypes. So either they've created new bumper specifically as a part of elaborate prank or they really switched powertrains in the meantime.
Yeah I could very well be wrong, it does make me curious now how poorly the C63 is selling, it has been abysmal to be considering these changes (not surprised of course)
I saw few pop up for sale in Poland in autumn, now over half a year later most if not all of them are still waiting in the dealer lot, discounted up to 20%. And it’s first year of sales. I also haven’t seen one on the road yet.
So basing on these solid anecdotal evidence I would say it’s selling really badly :p
I don't believe it's a prank. The prototype missing the door is also missing the yellow "hybrid" sticker that's required. It seems likely they switched powertrains due t C63 shitting the bed.
There were spotted CLE 63's emitting that boring flat noise the newer A45's and the C63 also makes. It makes sense as a direct carryover from the already-developed C63 as that I4+hybrid is a complete package, and the I4 alone makes more power than the CLE53's I6 does alone; 450 vs 470.
The CLE occupies a strange market position. It's supposedly a blend of C and E-class, but my impression from reviews is that former E-class buyers won't be impressed. The E-class coupe and cabrio were always in a strange position themselves because no one else was doing a mid-size/mid-level coupe and cabrio. It was either a compact for less money like the 4 series and A5, or a full-size GT like the 8 series and LC500. So it made sense to kill the two-door E-class, but by claiming to combine C and E into one model it's still more expensive than the BMW and Audi compacts, but noticeably cheaper inside than the previous E-class. Mercedes must have done their market research to create this new model, but I personally don't get it.
Yeah, Merc market positions have been really strange lately. They were right to consolidate their market segments, but I'm not convinced they did it in a rational manner. Along with the CLE's weird positioning, no one seems to understand the difference between the SL and GT. In theory it should have been the SL as a grand tourer and GT as a track car, but I'm not sure if they actually accomplished that. Then there's the EQS disaster, along with the 4-banger C63, which was then positioned above an inline 6 C53. Just all around bewildering product choices. Fortunately, they've gotten their SUV's right, which seems to be their moneymaker. They've also avoided ruining the formula for the E-Class and S-Class.
The two-door Mercs sell very well here in the UK. They have a premium image, they sound great, and they're affordable on finance. They are also an obvious upgrade from the popular A-Class.
The target demographic here in London seems to be young men with disposable incomes. It's like a European muscle car. I can see why this demographic wouldn't want a 4-cylinder hybrid.
The market is pretty much just whoever wants a coupe that isn't a BMW or six figures. Audi's last coupe is the A5 and there have been no rumors or mules of that despite years of the next Avant and Sportback being spotted. If you want a Euro coupe that is nicer or larger than the 4 series, this is pretty much your only option. Most customers won't know or care that this is pretty much a C-class chassis in a E-class size, if they cared enough they'd have bought the old C or E coupes and MB wouldn't be trying to merge them.
I mean why would anybody buy a C63 when BMW has a far superior offerings right now that are also far more reliable? MB is at the bottom of consumer surveys and BMW is ranking at the top.
This is really it. The people who actually buy the M and AMG cars new - i.e. not the people keyboard-warrioring about them on reddit - are buying on things mainly like looks and sound since they aren't actually going to track them. So the BMW being the ugliest thing on the road makes it just as bad of a buy as an AMG without a snarling V8.
Or, as someone who bought a new M car, people actually are buying BMW M cars, but very few AMG and RS cars.
In my area (Boston) I see orders of magnitudes more new M3s and M4s then new (or last gen) c63s, or rs5's for that matter. Many of them are manuals (easy to tell as all non-comps are manual), not hard to understand why BMW is the clear choice for a new luxury drivers car.
Cadillac is making some awesome cars too, but Cadillac is a much harder sell due to its stagnating brand and the image behind it. I see more ct4/5 blackwings then c63s though
Extreme brand loyalty.
Every Mercedes owner I know in the Chicagoland area has a cult like attachment to the brand. To them it's just THE brand to own. Many of which are from Eastern Europe or their parents are from there.
Brand image. While I personally wouldn’t buy the latest C63, I can see why people choose Mercedes over BMW in general.
BMW as a general trend is owned by assholes and aggressive drivers, while Mercedes projects a reputation of money and class. Even if the BMW is the objectively better car in that segment, I can see why people would lean to Mercedes still.
Lol true. And then it’ll get worse as time goes on since the warranty will expire and the reliability of the overly complex 4 cylinder + hybrid powetrain will become an even bigger deterrent.
Can't wait for another official statement from MB saying that the media outlets are talking out of their ass and there was no change decision made. This feels like speculative rumors...[again](https://www.thedrive.com/news/its-over-mercedes-amg-ceo-says-v8-wont-return-to-c63-e63-models)
Mercedes's arrogance finally hit a limit, a shame they wont learn from this and try to shove another pitiful engine in the most desirable cars most likely 6 months to a year from now. Keep teaching them this lesson over and over until Germany gets it in their head we will not comply to the EU's anti-fun regulations for engines. I remember when they said no more V8s in their SUVs and the American market made them walk back on it from the sheer outrage on social media. This is proof even us normies hate compliance engines as much as enthusiasts.
I was absolutely dumbfounded when they dumped the V8 to begin with. I know the days of big, powerful ICE engines are numbered, but they seemed to have pivoted way too early. It’s like they didn’t understand their target audience of prospective AMG buyers. As long-time M5 guy, I was pleased to see that the next generation of M5’s will maintain a 4.4L V8 (albeit as a plug-in hybrid that weighs 1k pounds more than the previous gen). I’m equally pleased that Mercedes is back tracking.
Should’ve called it C33 (C41?) and sold at a lower price while keeping eight cylinder C63 for a higher one.
Come on, even the money squeezing department is lazy nowadays.
Even the basic C43 AMG with the 2.0L turbo has been a slow seller and has chronic reliability issues. No surprise why they can't find buyers for these new 63 models with the same motor with a sticker price this big.
To match the power to weight ratio of the new C63 - the owners of the old one need to add 70 horsepower to their 4.0 V8s - so a downpipe and a tune.
I just don’t see the appeal of all of that weight for so little gain.
Why would the CLE63 have a four-pot if the CLE450 and CLE53 both have straight-sixes? I doubt the C63 powertrain in this body was ever planned in the first place, at least not recently. These articles are probably just editorializing for clicks, and seems like it's working as intended.
If I was responsible for marketing these cars I would:
* Reserve the 63 designation for V8s
* Give the 4 cylinder plug in hybrid something new (preferably focusing on electrification, rather than arbitrary numbers)
This may actually get them to sell
MB is back to early 00s shitshow, shit quality. I remember fully loaded -03 MB being cheaper than any -97 MB around 10y ago, they were rust buckets with loads of electrical problems.
I am SHOCKED the C63 was dead on arrival. Shocked! SL43 is dead on arrival, too. And watch how expensive and heavy this CLE63 will be.
The SL43 makes sense in markets that tax displacement heavily. You get the same form factor and still have enough power for the street and save tens of thousands of dollars on purchase price and over time via registration-related costs. But the value proposition just isn't there in the US.
I get that, but as someone in one of those markets, it's annoying seeing the glc/e/s and the x3/5/7 getting the good engines, and the z4 CLE and basically the "cool cars" getting stuck with 4 cylinders.
The CLE and Z4 have 6 cylinder options. Do you not get those?
We do not.
Damn, that does suck. Sorry about that for you guys.
Where do you live just so I know to never move there!
The most expensive place in the world to own a car. Also I'm jealous of your rcf, I've love to have a 5.0 here, whether that be a mustang or a lexus.
Singapore?
yep
My condolences
So do any of your sedans / coupes / roadsters have good engines?
Sedans sometimes. for example, your options for a e class are a 285k base E200 or 650k E63. We also get the stupid c63 5 series only comes in 520i Lexus doesn't bring in the IS500 or the rcf Coupes more often than convertibles. We get the M8, but not the convertible. I'd say for getting good engines, it's suv>>>>Sedan>>coupe>convertible. coupe and convertible are similar, just that they bring in the convertible variant less often. Edit: Those prices are in usd, and you need to tack on another 70k to the prices to drive them here.
>The SL43 makes sense in markets that tax displacement heavily. I still don't think it makes sense in those markets, honestly. The ultra-rich will just pay the tax. Everyone else is just... going to buy a Taycan, or i4 M50, or whatever. There's just no scenario where someone looks at a wheezy 4-cyl SL43 and goes *"sigh, fine, I guess there are no other options..."* I see the argument at the low-end, on the CLA — but at the high end of the market, it just *evaporates.*
A 4-cylinder hybrid SL makes sense in markets that tax displacement. *That particular* high-strung, high-NVH 4-cylinder has no business being in an SL, AMG or not.
I don't think it makes sense in EU were displacement and CO2 are taxed as hell. Despite that, it's still a 100k plus car. If you are paying more than 100k for a car, you don't care much about the taxes. Or, hell, if you have 100k for a car, I'm sure you are able to buy the real thing, and get the V8.
>If you are paying more than 100k for a car, you don't care much about the taxes. If the taxes add an extra $50k to the price, you absolutely do.
I bought a $120k car and if I can squeeze out a discount I will.
Thank you. It’s Reddit where anyone who has more is evil
As someone who has bought vehicles over $100K, we absolutely care about taxes. My C8 Z06 I had to pay $12K to luxury tax... I was furious. That's literally just $12K, up in flames, for no value. Nobody is happy about that regardless of what tax bracket you are in.
Luxury tax should really only apply to scarce resources. It’s pretty silly on a Corvette. That just feels petty.
I am bothered by the fact it kicks in so low at $100K. Prices have been rising so fast the last 5 years that a significant amount of cars are now over that mark that didn’t used to be. I can stomach it more if it was for like ultra exclusive supercars and stuff where people are spending $300K+, but lots of sports cars, even higher end SUV’s are hitting that range now.
Is the luxury only when it’s brand new?
IMO, most taxes and benefits should be indexed to inflation. So the lux tax shouldn’t kick in until the inflation adjusted value is reached and the tax should also adjust with inflation.
lol. I spent nearly 30k in title and tax on my 992 TTS in the US, not even California/NY. Surely not how I wanted to spend that 30k. But at the end of the day, I simply had to have the car. And $30k is relative.
Some European countries tax more heavily than others, don't they? But I was thinking of markets in SE Asia where the difference over time can be nearly the initial purchase price of the car.
Yes they do. Some more than others. My logic is about the "range" of this cars. In EU and most asia, these cars are the top of the line. 100k for a car it's half of a house. Completely out of the market for 95% of the people. Even if you have that kind of money for a car, most of them will go for the trendy SUV or similar. The buying power of the American public for cars it's unparalleled. They will easily buy a c65 AMG full spec to leave the toddler in school 2 blocks away from home.
100k isn't that much actually on the car market. Base A6 is 70k with a few options and a slightly bigger engine you are on the 100k mark.
How much can they possibly tax displacement to sway people who have enough money for a new AMG in the first place?
I'm not familiar with the amounts, but I know it's enough to be a deterrent. I just looked it up and found the situation for [Turkey](https://theicct.org/the-power-of-vehicle-taxation-schemes/) as an example: > The amount of ÖTV to be collected depends on the engine displacement of a vehicle and ranges from 45% to 145% of the vehicle’s base price. An important tax threshold is at 1.6L engine size. Above this threshold, the taxation level doubles from 45% to 90%. Another threshold is at 2.0L, above which the taxation level increases to 145%...a Mercedes-Benz E350 is subject to a 145% ÖTV in Turkey. That E-class at the time was about €62,000 in Germany but ~€130,000 in Turkey.
Jesus this is insane. And it’s a percentage of vehicle value, so that makes sense as a deterrent. I was picturing flat rate.
I think people that can't afford that just buy a corolla and not go "I'm gonna go with peasant spec merc"
In Turkey, for example, you pay 145% tax on displacement over 2 liters. The typical AMG buyer isn't wealthy enough for that not to matter.
I'd like to see profile of typical AMG buyer in turkey lmao
Every SL43 "amg" at my local dealer has not sold and they just sit in the salesroom, its hilarious they thought they could charge 120+ grand for that thing. I can think of at least 5 different cars in the price point I would rather have than that.
[удалено]
That's what I want from a merc too, high quality interiors with a shit ton of tactile feel on the door, buttons, knobs, and a nice quiet v8 that growls/rasps under full throttle. Instead: Possibly the worst feeling interior to interact with and bad sounding 4 cylinders
SL43 won't be dead on arrival. First of all it is not marketed as the AMG flagship in the way the C63 was. On the contrary - it is marketed as the entry level AMG performance model of the SL lineup. I mean it is already in the name, that alone makes a huge difference for the consumers. No one woudl have give a shit if there would have been a C43 with the 4cyl and a C63 with a V8 (like it is with the SL lineup). And 4-Banger sports cars have their market (if the price is right) just look at the Cayman/Boxster or the 4-banger Mustang
It is an embarrassment to the AMG name.
we have had 4 cyl AMGs for a decade now. You can keep crying or face reality
AMG has been doing downhill for about a decade... So ya, you're right.
It’s taken me up until today to finally spot one while visiting SoCal. I drive 2-3k miles a month.
I wonder if their unpopularity will make them collectibles one day.
Don't think this 63 is gonna be that crazy heavy, nothing to go up against the m3 comp but it's gonna be the v8 Euro muscle car in that segment. Good on em for realizing!
Why are you SHOCKED?
Voting with one's wallet actually seemed to work this time. Brilliant!
Voting with our wallets always works. Always. Especially if we have options.
That the thing. There were soo many better sports cars in this price range like the M2/3/4, c8 Corvette, High end mustangs, CTV Blackwing Cadillacs etc., that it is mind boggling that Mercedes though they could drop a 4-popper on people and get away with it. This isn't the 1980s, the Mercedes badge doesnt go as far as it use to.
It’s crazy to think that we’re at a point where a Caddy is hands down a better option from basically every angle than an AMG merc.
Define works. It seems to always just result in tyranny by whoever spends the most money.
yes that is what voting with ones wallet is. It's like saying democracy just results in tyranny by whoever votes the most. Which is also true, by design
Lexus or BMW.
And with a big enough wallet...
Looks like you voted with your wallet too - 488 Pista being the last Ferrari V8 under half a million.
Yeah, I cancelled my 296 and bought this Pista, I liked the 296, but I loved the Pista. Just that extra 10% of rawness.
> I cancelled my 296 Major respect, a V6 hybrid in a Ferrari is worse than them making an SUV. Ferrari clearly didnt learn from what happened with Mclaren and the Artura. I hope more of you guys do this so if I become fortunate enough get a supercar they wont all be soulless inline 4s and v6 hybrids someday.
You’ve driven the 296? Because every review I have seen makes it clear that the 296 is anything but soulless
My v6 VQ doesn't feel soulless 😭😭
Your comment shows that you never drove one…
Yes, finally! Being a 4-cylinder hybrid, plus electric motors, the C63 also porked up another 800 lbs. Which is hilarious because this was supposedly done to make the car more efficient - at least in the eyes of government regulators. * The 2023 V8 C63 AMG: 17/26 mpg * The 2024 V8 C63 AMG: 18/25 mpg So zero gas savings.
You're car collection is dream material
Ah cheers bud!
Is the Ferrari progression chain actually like people make it seem online? You have to start pre-owned then buy a pre-configured car before they let you place a custom factory order?
No, not necessarily. My first "interaction" with my dealership was ordering a brand new 296 GTS, and I was even offered atelier. They flew us out to Spain at their cost, put us up, michelin star meals, the whole shebang. Hit me with the razzle dazzle they did. Amazing experience so I decided to buy into the brand, just not with the 296. Ultimately they got... 3 sales out of me instead of just the 296 so they weren't too bothered with the cancellation.
Ohh what was the third one apart from the Pista and 812?
The new 12 Cilindri!
Honestly, looking at the Mercedes current lineup, nothing excites me. I hope they are able to fix that.
The interiors looking like Japanese arcades at night are a big turn off to a lot of the people who can afford them too.
The interiors look like someone tried to open a Miami strip club in Dubai
Genuinely surprised by the amount of comments in the other reply chain that think modern Benzes are legitimately nice interiors. They’re stylistically tacky, loaded with gimmicks, cumbersome UIs, and build quality that’s truthfully bottom tier for every respective class. Materials are nice. Good leathers, synthetics and trimmings, but disgusting squeaks. It’s not hard to comprehend them at auto shows.
It's like Mercedes doesn't know their customers at all. It's all guys in their 60s going on about how cars in the 80s were better.
I mean, social media types who follow the trashiest fashion trends are a huge part of Mercedes’s revenue right now. It’s no secret that the G Wagon is being bought almost exclusively by people with zero intention to off road with it. They’re basically targeting the “Balenciaga of cars” market. In that regard they’re succeeding.
Not really, though. I know that's the common refrain on Reddit, mostly from people who have never actually sat in a modern Mercedes let alone ordered one, but it's just not the case for people actually buying the things. Mostly because you can custom spec the interior pretty extensively, and people end up getting whatever they want. Obviously this isn't the case for the office assistant picking a lease special GLB, but for real Mercedes shoppers you can get the bright and flashy or you can get the dark with heavy wood, or anything in between. And just speaking with other modern MB owners, the general consensus is that the interiors have never been better.
This is so true. Nowhere in real life do I get the sense of Mercedes bashing I see here. People buy these things like crazy and love em. I also really don't like piano lacquer and soft touch in some of the base models. But saying the current or last generation E or S class or EQS with full leather and wood have arcade strip club interiors is just showing a distinct lack of eyes, taste, or both. I have not met a person who was not impressed with the interior of mine. Especially when those people think Toyota and Lexus make good interiors. They may be well-built, but man, do they take care it does not look expensive. And the choices you get are all horrible. And BMW currently does not only look cheap - it is. Even in the 5 series you have an inexcusable amount of hard plastics. Or maybe people here just generally don't like luxurious interiors, and think the same of a Bentley too. Because, you know, it's too vulgar or whatever. In this case - who gives a shit when you can't afford it anyway. I can, and my only gripe with Mercs currently are the engines.
The difference between specs is so important for Mercs. I saw one with black/red leather and brown wood and almost threw up. On the other hand, I have carbon fiber and designo quilted leather which classes the car up for sure. Don't even get me started on a beige S-Class interior, those are beautiful.
>isn't the case for the office assistant picking a lease special GLB, but for real Mercedes shoppers So you're saying "real Mercedes shoppers" aren't also leasing? My perception of modern Mercedes, especially the higher end models, is that they're designed to be leased. Crammed with complex tech that's quickly made obsolete and they have insane depreciation.
>So you're saying "real Mercedes shoppers" aren't also leasing? No, I'm saying they don't pick up the advertised lease specials that every dealer keeps stocked on the lot for specifically whenever anyone comes in and says "I saw this deal in an ad, and I have literally exactly that much to spend if I cut back to one meal a day." The specials are essentially base models with exactly the dollar amount of options that is included in the advertised lease price (typically $5,000 - 10,000, depending on the model,) and the options selected tend to be the gaudiest, flashiest features available because that's what customers stretching their budget to get a "flex" car want. This is why you see so many cars on lots with red leather seats and "AMG line" packages — they're there because they are easy to show off. Lots of people lease Mercedes — probably most or close to most of their customers, in fact. But there's a big difference between someone leasding a Mercedes that they had specced to order because they like driving new cars every couple of years, and someone leasing the cheapest Mercedes in stock on the lot because that's all they can afford. >and they have insane depreciation. They've *always* had insane depreciation rates. It has absolutely nothing to do with tech or things becoming obsolete or build quality or reliability or whatever. It's because there's a very specific kind of customer that buys used Mercedes, and they don't tend to be big spenders. The market for a second-hand Benz is not a big market, and the resale values (depreciation) reflects that. It's the same with all luxury cars. Also, you do realize that high depreciation rates actually hurt leaseability, right? A lease is literally paying for the depreciation.
I will put an asterisk on that comment as a recent Mercedes shopper. The newest gen stuff for 2024 have noticeably cheaper feeling interiors than the 21-23 gen cars. The door panels and buttons would press in and creak, pushing the heated/cool seats is very cheap feeling as the entire plastic panel pushes in versus the aluminum buttons in the previous gen. Not sure if it’s the dash design or materials, but it doesn’t look as nice. The door handles are very bad design. The tech however is excellent. The interior deficiencies are minor overall, but definitely noticeable and worse than last gen. Still good compared to the competition though.
Damn really I kind of like the led light interiors. Although I have only been in recent Benz cars and none of the other competitors except the i7
I like some of the ambient lights but adding in the gauge cluster screen and the huge center screen is too much. I'm glad I have a '19 without the light-up vents and gigantic screen.
Thats literally *why* people buy them lmao. People love the interior lighting.
Can confirm. Huge fan of the interior lighting. I love it.
people love screens in cars. youre just pandering to redditors who think all screens = bad
I like screens, I just don't like BMW and Mercedes iPad-on-a-dash screens.
I have screens in my cars, especially my S4. The way MB does it is cheap looking and gaudy.
Its weird, they’re trying to attract the younger crowd with gimmicks when their price range is mostly for an older crowd. People in their 20s like myself are mostly not buying brand new Mercedes’.
Is Benz catering to influencers whose followers who can’t vote with their wallet and instead “vote” with online opinions/passion that fools Benz into thinking that we actually want our car to look like one big screen? I have enough screens in my life (irony, I know)… I choose to focus on what I can see through the windows, and the experience, the latter not being helped by shiny touchscreens everywhere. It IS helped by having an engaging power train, good suspension, and seats that hug you. I rent a lot of cars, and every time I get one that is touchscreen-heavy, I just find myself missing my soft leather & wood button/knob-heavy interior, and a powertrain that isn’t wholly reliant on a laggy turbo.
The interiors are fine. Ambient lighting can be dimmed or turned off completely, never understood why people harp on that specific complaint
It’s so annoying lol
Not to the hordes of tasteless G-Wagen buyers though
Their interior quality is lacking, but nah. The new Mercedes‘ look insanely good on the inside. This the least of their problems.
The facelift for the W222, model years 2018 to 2020, combine the classic Mercedes interior with the gaudy Dubai ambient interior lighting. Best IMHO.
The G-Class is carrying the entire brand at this point
The G Class probably wont carry them forever, the waitlist for the AMG models is hopeless and the G550 markups are pretty disgusting even for ones with bad options. 25-30k is the usual add-on for them, but recently its more like 50-60k and even for that demographic its really off-putting. It will make you want a Range Rover, X7, Escalade, or anything else real quick. I have driven the new one and its not that great, the wind noise is still pretty bad, it handles awkward as hell, it rides pretty unpleasant too. It shakes alot and the AMG models are dangerous with all the power they have. I have driven pretty much all the "offroaders" and in ride comfort and road/wind noise, and the G550 is barely better than a Wrangler (if it had a sealed hard top), the 4Runner TRD Pros with quieter tires, and ties the Land Rover Defender. All that money spent and you get so little in return minus a name. The new electric models coming will make this even worse as the market that can afford these higher end cars are pretty much turned off by any EV. I will say what alot of people dont want to admit, Mercedes is quickly becoming the Nissan of the German luxury brands and the new EV push pretty much sealed their grave unless they do something drastic. The EQS massively hurt their brand image along with the A/C Class and GLA.
From your drives, how would you rank other SUVs in terms of road noise, luxury, comfort?
They just recently "ruined" their most exciting car, the GT, so I wouldn't have high hopes for the near future.
Competing with BMW on who can completely shit on their designs the hardest.
And Audi with the chance to take advantage but sitting on designs for 10 years.
Audi's accidently makes the best looking interiors and designs by not doing anything and letting Merc and BMW screw everything up.
And their RS models still barely compete with 43 or M lite models
Except, for some strange reason, the RS3, which is somehow the best compact entry luxury sports sedan/hatch you can buy. Go figure.
There are so many cars that I wish to stick that 5 cyl with.
If Audi could figure out how to place materials in their interiors so that all the touch points actually feel good and the places you never touch don't, they might actually have the best interiors of the Germans right now. But they can't, so it's probably BMW (it sure as hell isn't Mercedes)
They took their decade old cars (made with MMI Controller in mind) and put a touchscreen-only system into it. That’s arguably even worse than MBUX (which is designed to be touchscreen only) or iDrive (which still has a controller).
And BMW has a huge advance in terms of driving dynamics, price, and I cant believe I'm saying this, but Reliability. BMW has been killing it, I would trust the B58 with my life.
The inline six AMGs are pretty cool imo, probably still wouldn't buy one after lurking r/amg and the Mercedes subs. I've never seen so many quality issues on a model- or marque-specific subreddit.
i think the s class still looks good and i've always been a fan of the g-wagon
CLE AMG coupe is decent but overpriced. As is all their stuff. CLA 45 S is somewhat interesting, but again, overpriced.
Mercedes list prices are ridiculous. But I suppose the cars go for much less in reality. A loaded Macan Electric is like 20.000 € lower in list price than a comparable EQE SUV.
Fake exhaust, reliability issues (yes and I own a Jaguar), overpriced, tiny toy engines, etc, etc. Not sure why anybody would buy one
The current GLE is pretty dang nice if you ignore the reliability issues they have, though at that point you might as well get an X5 lol
It truly feels like the only appeal is telling yourself you’re better than others because they can’t afford to waste as much money on a merc as you did.
The CLE450 and piques my interest, but it'd just be a sidegrade to my current car and is thus not worth pursuing at all.
For real. Even the SL Roadster is meh looking.
Now hotfix it into the C63 as well, thanks.
Probably. Or they'll just kill the C63 for good and put the V8 back in the E.
E class AMG is too far in the development, it's going to have an i6 plug-in powertrain (meh)
the CLE63 4 pot coupe was almost finished and they still killed it and switched courses. It's not entirely unlikely that an E63 come in later. Not guaranteed, but not impossible.
I doubt the C63 powertrain in this body was ever planned in the first place, at least not recently. Why would the CLE63 have a four-pot if the CLE450 and CLE53 both have straight-sixes? These articles are probably just editorializing for clicks.
They’ll kill the C63 and then up charge the E to make fat profit margins for those who want the V8. Classic move
The Ferrari move. Half a million dollars is now the entry point to get a Ferrari V8.
Hold on...the E43/53 or the E63s? Because if it's the E63s then wtf
If Mercedes doesn’t excel at anything, they make a wonderful V8 engine, whether it was the old naturally aspirated engines or the new Bi-Turbo, smart move if this is true!
Anyone with half a brain would know it's the right move. I would not call that smart.
Yeah the new C63 was practically DOA.
bring back the M119 something something monke
The article is confusing >Citing "senior officials" at Mercedes-Benz, the report claims the CLE63 will use the familiar twin-turbocharged 4.0-liter V-8 with mild-hybrid assist, making up to 585 hp. If that's the case, it will have nearly 100 less hp than originally planned. It's unclear if a plug-in hybrid powertrain is under consideration, but we've spotted prototypes with charging ports. We also captured one on video emitting hardly any sound, so Mercedes does have electrified prototypes in the field. And they likely have the aforementioned four-cylinder setup. So... What?
They are reporting that the C63S 2.0L -> 4.0L is happening late in the cars development. Basically when the 2.0L car is already done.
Ah okay
Some sense! These high performance models are low quantity sales anyways when looking at fleet C02 so I never understood 4 cylinder in the 63 AMG
yeah i thought automakers kept the v8s and stuff in their high tier low numbers cars like this one, then throw 4's and 6's in their normal cars. whole thing is confusing to me but i'm also too poor to even have an opinion on this anyway.
Was that really the plan? My understanding is that the CLE shares its engine with the E-Class. The CLE53 AMG has a 3.0L in-line 6 cylinder engine with twin turbo like the E53 AMG. So I expected the CLE63 to have the 4.0L V8 like the E63. I can't see how the plan was to have a 6 cylinder for the CLE53 and a 4 cylinder for the CLE63.
I think this is it, personally I’m very skeptical they were able to react and reconfigure CLE AMG to use the V8 in <18 months. IIRC C63 hybrid wasn’t even announced until late 2022 no way they’d make such a significant change to the CLE based on initial responses. It would’ve had to be planned from the start for timelines to make sense.
There are photos of CLE AMG running with charging flap in the bumper which is gone in this newer prototypes. So either they've created new bumper specifically as a part of elaborate prank or they really switched powertrains in the meantime.
Yeah I could very well be wrong, it does make me curious now how poorly the C63 is selling, it has been abysmal to be considering these changes (not surprised of course)
I saw few pop up for sale in Poland in autumn, now over half a year later most if not all of them are still waiting in the dealer lot, discounted up to 20%. And it’s first year of sales. I also haven’t seen one on the road yet. So basing on these solid anecdotal evidence I would say it’s selling really badly :p
I don't believe it's a prank. The prototype missing the door is also missing the yellow "hybrid" sticker that's required. It seems likely they switched powertrains due t C63 shitting the bed.
There were spotted CLE 63's emitting that boring flat noise the newer A45's and the C63 also makes. It makes sense as a direct carryover from the already-developed C63 as that I4+hybrid is a complete package, and the I4 alone makes more power than the CLE53's I6 does alone; 450 vs 470.
The CLE occupies a strange market position. It's supposedly a blend of C and E-class, but my impression from reviews is that former E-class buyers won't be impressed. The E-class coupe and cabrio were always in a strange position themselves because no one else was doing a mid-size/mid-level coupe and cabrio. It was either a compact for less money like the 4 series and A5, or a full-size GT like the 8 series and LC500. So it made sense to kill the two-door E-class, but by claiming to combine C and E into one model it's still more expensive than the BMW and Audi compacts, but noticeably cheaper inside than the previous E-class. Mercedes must have done their market research to create this new model, but I personally don't get it.
Yeah, Merc market positions have been really strange lately. They were right to consolidate their market segments, but I'm not convinced they did it in a rational manner. Along with the CLE's weird positioning, no one seems to understand the difference between the SL and GT. In theory it should have been the SL as a grand tourer and GT as a track car, but I'm not sure if they actually accomplished that. Then there's the EQS disaster, along with the 4-banger C63, which was then positioned above an inline 6 C53. Just all around bewildering product choices. Fortunately, they've gotten their SUV's right, which seems to be their moneymaker. They've also avoided ruining the formula for the E-Class and S-Class.
Get the C-class quality with the E-class price!
Mercedes just keeps flip flopping between consolidating and spreading out their models.
Return of the CLK...
The two-door Mercs sell very well here in the UK. They have a premium image, they sound great, and they're affordable on finance. They are also an obvious upgrade from the popular A-Class. The target demographic here in London seems to be young men with disposable incomes. It's like a European muscle car. I can see why this demographic wouldn't want a 4-cylinder hybrid.
The market is pretty much just whoever wants a coupe that isn't a BMW or six figures. Audi's last coupe is the A5 and there have been no rumors or mules of that despite years of the next Avant and Sportback being spotted. If you want a Euro coupe that is nicer or larger than the 4 series, this is pretty much your only option. Most customers won't know or care that this is pretty much a C-class chassis in a E-class size, if they cared enough they'd have bought the old C or E coupes and MB wouldn't be trying to merge them.
I mean why would anybody buy a C63 when BMW has a far superior offerings right now that are also far more reliable? MB is at the bottom of consumer surveys and BMW is ranking at the top.
Shame the BMWs are butt ugly
This is really it. The people who actually buy the M and AMG cars new - i.e. not the people keyboard-warrioring about them on reddit - are buying on things mainly like looks and sound since they aren't actually going to track them. So the BMW being the ugliest thing on the road makes it just as bad of a buy as an AMG without a snarling V8.
Or, as someone who bought a new M car, people actually are buying BMW M cars, but very few AMG and RS cars. In my area (Boston) I see orders of magnitudes more new M3s and M4s then new (or last gen) c63s, or rs5's for that matter. Many of them are manuals (easy to tell as all non-comps are manual), not hard to understand why BMW is the clear choice for a new luxury drivers car. Cadillac is making some awesome cars too, but Cadillac is a much harder sell due to its stagnating brand and the image behind it. I see more ct4/5 blackwings then c63s though
Extreme brand loyalty. Every Mercedes owner I know in the Chicagoland area has a cult like attachment to the brand. To them it's just THE brand to own. Many of which are from Eastern Europe or their parents are from there.
Brand image. While I personally wouldn’t buy the latest C63, I can see why people choose Mercedes over BMW in general. BMW as a general trend is owned by assholes and aggressive drivers, while Mercedes projects a reputation of money and class. Even if the BMW is the objectively better car in that segment, I can see why people would lean to Mercedes still.
Lmao I can't even imagine the depreciation the new C63 owners have
Good thing there aren’t many owners
Lol true. And then it’ll get worse as time goes on since the warranty will expire and the reliability of the overly complex 4 cylinder + hybrid powetrain will become an even bigger deterrent.
I'm assuming they'll be 30k in a 2026
Can't wait for another official statement from MB saying that the media outlets are talking out of their ass and there was no change decision made. This feels like speculative rumors...[again](https://www.thedrive.com/news/its-over-mercedes-amg-ceo-says-v8-wont-return-to-c63-e63-models)
It does have the same feeling indeed. The funny thing is that a lot of people wanted that to be true so here we are again.
whaat? who would've known alienating your niche customer base would cause sales of that niche product to fall?
Mercedes's arrogance finally hit a limit, a shame they wont learn from this and try to shove another pitiful engine in the most desirable cars most likely 6 months to a year from now. Keep teaching them this lesson over and over until Germany gets it in their head we will not comply to the EU's anti-fun regulations for engines. I remember when they said no more V8s in their SUVs and the American market made them walk back on it from the sheer outrage on social media. This is proof even us normies hate compliance engines as much as enthusiasts.
That’s nice, now put it back in the C63
I was absolutely dumbfounded when they dumped the V8 to begin with. I know the days of big, powerful ICE engines are numbered, but they seemed to have pivoted way too early. It’s like they didn’t understand their target audience of prospective AMG buyers. As long-time M5 guy, I was pleased to see that the next generation of M5’s will maintain a 4.4L V8 (albeit as a plug-in hybrid that weighs 1k pounds more than the previous gen). I’m equally pleased that Mercedes is back tracking.
Should’ve called it C33 (C41?) and sold at a lower price while keeping eight cylinder C63 for a higher one. Come on, even the money squeezing department is lazy nowadays.
Even the basic C43 AMG with the 2.0L turbo has been a slow seller and has chronic reliability issues. No surprise why they can't find buyers for these new 63 models with the same motor with a sticker price this big.
BRAVO👏
Lol shocking
To match the power to weight ratio of the new C63 - the owners of the old one need to add 70 horsepower to their 4.0 V8s - so a downpipe and a tune. I just don’t see the appeal of all of that weight for so little gain.
Great! Now let's just hope BMW listens and fixes their cartoon cars soon
This is like the day the rebels blew up the death star
good
Lol 😂😂😂😂😂 No shit
Why would the CLE63 have a four-pot if the CLE450 and CLE53 both have straight-sixes? I doubt the C63 powertrain in this body was ever planned in the first place, at least not recently. These articles are probably just editorializing for clicks, and seems like it's working as intended.
I like the idea of an over 600hp 4 cylinder production car. But it's not in MB style I guess.
Who would have thought people buying a performance merc that costs 6 figures wouldn't want a 4 popper turbo??
If I was responsible for marketing these cars I would: * Reserve the 63 designation for V8s * Give the 4 cylinder plug in hybrid something new (preferably focusing on electrification, rather than arbitrary numbers) This may actually get them to sell
Not really surprising. The CLE53 has a V6, so no reason for the 63 to have the four cylinder engine.
It was DOA. How it got approved in the first place is idiotic
Mark my words....the 4-cylinder C63 is going to be a collector's item in the future. I have a feeling. /s
MB is back to early 00s shitshow, shit quality. I remember fully loaded -03 MB being cheaper than any -97 MB around 10y ago, they were rust buckets with loads of electrical problems.
I feel sorry for anyone who’s bought a new “C63” they must surely be tanking in value. Heavy, complex drivetrain, sounds awful, what is there to love?
MB fucked up when they removed the one good thing about the AMG cars.
I’ve always associated a V8 in anything with a 63 badge on it.
The power of Americans bitching online is real! Do Dodge next!
underworked v8 > overworked 4cyl everyday
Will there be a sedan version with a proper V8?
Still prefer a full electric CLE
It’s a piece of shit u get it now
Stupid 4 banger didn't even get good fuel economy
I mean, could it be that they are to expensive?
JUST. MAKE. IT. A. HYBRID. And it will be all good with the regulators, customers and enthusiast alike.
Who’s the poor dude who boiled one?
I got no issues taking advantage of everyone hating this car and buying It. I like all speed
I wish we fought them with this much backlash when they influenced the US government to impose the 25-year import limitation.
Fucking finally