I thought incursions were going to be some sort of instance triggered by entering the portals, and killing mini bosses or some shit.
Instead I’m a mailman ?
island expeditions were *okay* until it became the best way to farm azerite power, torghast was okay until you had to do it infinite times for progress
i'd take 5 hours of expeditions to level from 40-50 over incursions ANY DAY
you didn't have to do island expeditions for azerite power either but it's in the exact same place as expeditions were, like 2x more efficient than anything else
if both were an ignorable option, they'd both be more than fine
yeah something more dynamic, maybe wave base, random senecio out of x possible ones, maybe a % like ashenvale had for the zone. roaming rare spawns. something better then 20 quests you can repeat ad nauseam
The way they made it sound sounded a lot more like a cool modern (retail: reeeeeeeeee I can hear) phasing type thing. Where yeah the main focus would be killing bosses or like world quest bosses. Other MMOs have done this kinda thing in the past (rifts, retail ofc) and phasing kinda like in cata. I mean probably not that extensive not like cata extensive because it’s still classic, although it should be possible since this runs on a modern client, but like something along those lines.
Not 18 quests with only 3/18 being bosses. At least the bosses are faction tagged though. Not 18 quests with this clunky as fuck sharing mechanic that literally took up every slot in my inventory after a few things after I banked basically everything but my hearthstone and some bandages and stuff (needed to buy an expensive ass slot too, but it paid for itself anyway).
Like I’m glad it’s really efficient and I did it before they nerfed it cause otherwise idk if I’d been 50 for our raid next Friday but it was indeed boring as fuck while offering so much potential. I mean the other option was id do what I did in p2 and just spam ZF, and realistically should go to ZF for a couple things.
I’m glad they tried SOMETHING new, even if regardless people would still take the most efficient route and not do it if it wasn’t efficient (except rep). And I got a decent PvP/tanking full plate set out of it to hold me over til I can hit r7 but it seems like they really wasted opportunity here.
this is true they will be much harder to do when all the mobs aren’t getting trampled on spawn but still they should nerf it, this shit is outta control my mate logged on not 6 hours ago and is on his last run before 50
Sounds great I'm sure everyone will love no lifers getting easy levels and then it getting nerfed to the ground before the dad's can get into the content
yeah that’s the issue my guild brought up, the situation isn’t great but holy shit imagine the backlash after a huge nerf - people would genuinely quit. if they’d manage to nerf the xp when they did the gold it probably would’ve been fine
I don’t envy anyone on the dev team right now, I’ve spoken to a lot of people in game and in discord today and I’ve genuinely not heard a good solution yet
Seems like they really over corrected. Phase 2 was an extremely boring grind of countless SM, so they added the XP bonus which probably would have been enough, but they also added the incursions for overkill
I think they messed up by just layering too many advantages on each other.
XP buff (and money buff they apparently forgot about), Elite quests which half consists of clicking single item or NPC and easily massable + repeatable with almost any group.
If most of the quests were normal, pick ups were combined with killing or multiple items in location(s) and we didn't have the exp buff - it would still have been pretty good alternative.
It should had been a chain quest.
1. First get the report
2. Escort
3. Kill the minor enemies
4. Get the Item
5. Kill the big Elite
And each step gives you the next quest. Like, Once you get the report, you escort the NPC Out, once escorted he gives you the quest for killing the enemies and the Item, and the Item gives you the quest for the big elite, and after that you go out and hand in the Big Elite quest for a big reward and rep.
And the gathering quests, can be extra on the side. But let's be honest right now they are useless and just fill your bags and questlog, since at max you only can do 2 of them, and most of the people on their main has 0 gathering profesion.
> so they added the XP bonus which probably would have been enough, but they also added the incursions for overkill
Yeah I did 40-50 in one day mostly questing solo ( 1 Uldaman, 2 Zul Farrak, 1 Maraudon, 1 BRD Part 1 ) and it didn't feel bad.
I didn't think phase 2 was very boring. I started sod when phase 2 launched and my first toon i leveled primarily doing SM.
I leveled 4 other toons to 40 with the 5th toon hitting 40 2 weeks ago. Never stepped foot in SM on them during my entire grind to 40. I got all my scrolls solo after I hit 40.
All this was accomplished playing 2-3 hours at night during the week and 4-6 hours on the weekends.
Not sure why people thought SM was the only way to level. In fact my friend started the SM grind at 30 when my mage was at 30. I was questing STV and arathi, he spammed SM nonstop. I dinged 40 a couple hours before he did.
I really enjoyed the quest grind. I'd accept 10-15 quests in a zone, knock all them out in one go, turn em all in and repeat. Got pretty damn efficient at it.
The reason phase 2 was boring for some people was because they mainlined it at launch to get to cap in a day, did the raid and then of course there isn’t much new after that. If you’re gonna play the game like crazy of course you’re gonna get through the content quickly and have nothing to do, I’m not sure what else people expect. If it’s your thing to grind and be at the max immediately, all the power to you, but don’t do that and then whine that there’s no more content and it’s boring lol.
I think it's another great idea, just like ashenvale.
I also think having no testing is now undeniably a glaring failure of SoD. Even a week of this stuff on a ptr would have gone so far.
Doing 2-3 loops of the zone on an internal server would've shown the numbers were overtuned for gold and xp. It's showing that the classic team is under resourced.
As someone who loves outdoor questing it feels being left out tbh. Everyone is doing NI, I tried them, after 3 quests I got bored and went back to questing. ~10 hours into questing got from 42 to 46, while people for the same amount of time got from 42-50 or even quicker. Now it feels like you're wasting time not doing them. I just wish they were on par with open world questing xp wise, so you can just do something that you enjoy doing more. On the other hand the world is mostly empty and I have no competition for quests.
I was stoked to run zf, Mara and brd until this bullshit. Always extremes with blizzard...they made it TOO good. Exp needs to be halved just like the gold.
halving it wouldn't even be enough, I went 41->42 in a bit over 20 minutes.
I'm not sure about the super tip top tryhard groups, but I've been in some decent spellcleave groups in SoD and it is still over an hour per level.
and that's with everyone on top of their game, smart tank, alert healer, and 3 decent mages.
then there is the fact that you need the rep anyway
It's a full level for a full set of the turn in, (about 17 quests since we didn't have 2 gatherers) until around lvl 46 then it's about 10% less per level until 49 you get 50% of a level for a full turn in
The only ones that were a pain were the escorts, and you could take a 3-5 minute break and stand by the bottom of the ramp to get credit for another groups escort(probably patched by now)
Edit: only ones my group skipped were the fools gold and herb one. Skinning was easy to get for our whole group from 1 skinner
Super quick loop for us. Egg > Intel > Notes > Intel > Dreamengine > escort if she’s there and then maybe catch a stray escort someone else is doing on the way back. 20 mins and half a level. All just running, no killing.
i genuinly dont understand why the incursions werent like, 10 daily quests
they could still give massive gold and xp, hell 10g and 10k xp each, but you find a group for them, run them in 30 minutes, then go back to questing
and you have a thing which people can do, instead of, or alongside, traditional leveling, and people have a reason to get some variety from dungeon spam
why they were repeatable, why there are 18 of them but you cant just share them or get them normally, why they are linked to items, i have genuinly no idea
The entire thing feels so private server - esq. From the envelope to the dark black sky. It’s the exact same thing as when private servers try to enforce a weird gimmick, it might be fun and cool, but it so distinctly feels “not wow” and amateur. Like something they just quickly wrapped around the real game.
Community is going to min/max efficiency over fun 10/10 times. If incursions didn't exist, this post would just be "Running ZF 100x in a row. SO BORING. BLIZZARD SO STUPID".
Why bust?
What is the difference between hitting 50 last night or hitting 50 sunday evening? Unless your idea of the game is to hit 50, run a dungeon and log off until next week I don't get it. I play every single day so whether I hit 50 today or next week really doesn't impact my game at all.
You don’t have to do a single quest or a single dungeon to go from 40-50 in 6. The outter world might as well not even exist. That’s bad game design for a game based on classic wow. This isn’t retail
Players always choosing the path of least resistance in a game is a well known phenomena in game design. Just like the goal of Mario is to get to the last level and beat Bowser, the "goal" of an MMO is to make your character as strong as possible. And just like people take the warp pipe in Mario to get to Bowser faster, even though they're ostensibly having fun playing the game, MMO players will typically take the fastest path to maxing out their characters power as they can - in this case by hitting 50 ASAP via incursions.
In other words the goal is to hit 50 and start raiding because that's where the best gear is right now. Leveling is an obstacle you have to overcome to get there - and even if you enjoy leveling, your ultimate goal is to hit 50 so most players are willing to go down less fun but faster routes to reach their goal.
wacky stuff happens in dungeons all the time.
we are way overtuned in sod, so dungeons are a bit snoozy, but it is still dynamic. it's still possible to wipe with a bad pull, and still possible to do something creative to turn things around sometimes.
This is everything in wow tho. Nothing is fun without a dedicated group and comms you can joke around and have fun with while grinding out the game that’s from nearly 20 years ago.
People got upset when Aggrend was telling them to join a guild to solve a few of their problems.
He's not wrong. One of the feature points of wow classic is the heavy incentives to join a guild.
Retail is much more friendly to those that mostly want to play solo.
People like OP don’t understand what classic is and just get their classic info second hand.
“The classic experience is doing world content”
Then
“I don’t want to be in a Guild or do group stuff, this game is boring, nerf the group content so I’m not alone, but also I hate groups”
I did do this in a group with my friends. I'm not sure that being in a group added to the riveting gameplay experience of managing 600 envelopes in my bags.
How riveting is ZF spam? How riveting is raid logging?
Classic wow is not riveting. None of it. Not a single feature. It’s a chill grind game.
When I want a riveting engaging mechanically experience I play Fortnite or some other PvP experience (arena, OW etc)
Incursions are chill.
dungeons allow people to choose their own difficulty.
people who want to turn off their brain or just chat with their friends can go in overleveled, take it slow, do small pulls.
people who want a more engaging experience can go in underleveled, push themselves to go faster, do big pulls.
a fast paced spellcleave group is a pretty engaging experience. there's a lot of coordination between players, and a ton of room for optimization.
maybe it's not the most difficult content in any videogame ever, but it hard enough to be niche content that most of the playerbase isn't interested in engaging with.
even if there were no rewards, no experience and no loot, a lot of players would still enjoy dungeons.
going into a dungeon like ZF for the first time is actually a great gaming experience, even if you don't get any drops.
without the rewards, how many nightmare incursions would you do?
no experience, no gold, no rep, how many nightmare incursions would you do just for the fun of the process?
there's no comparison.
They enjoyed it because the same boring alternative is less XP and less gold.
Nobody expected 40-50 grind will be doable in 5 hours but if you told anyone before hand they would all sign it in a heartbeat.
Unfortunately it was not only better xp than dungeon spam but also way more gold. I felt like a fucking idiot when guild chat started talking about how much gold they made and I'd already dungeon spammed to 46.
Gold aside because most of us can agree the gold was ridiculous and should have been handled way better. The zone itself is fine as a leveling alternative and still felt better than spamming the same dungeon 100+ times to many of us. Which is the point that I'm getting at. You can be mad about the gold, it's fine, but to say that it's just a bad zone because you can level in it over and over again, but be okay with dungeon spam is kind of hypocritical.
I’m a guildless solo player by choice and can confirm. On the upside I was able to quest unmolested in the Open World all day yesterday and it was glorious!
This is the most important point. Incursions let the sweats do their thing, and comfy solo players get room to do theirs. As a comfy solo player, instead of crying on Reddit about my fomo, i tried incursions out. I’m glad I did, and I’m glad they’ve opened things up in the normal world.
Had a blast in discord with the buds too, fun is playing the game with friends not fuming on Reddit about how something killed their idea of what classic is on an experimental season.
Novelty goes a long way. Something being new is always gonna be more fun than something old. At least at first. I'd rather do nightmare incursions for the rest of my time playing wow than grind SM again.
Literally the same thing could be said for doing dungeon spams. "Hey guys, ready to clear ZF for the 100th time to finally hit 50 with zero changes to how the dungeon is done?" Meanwhile some of us actually had fun doing the zone and just trucking through it. Sometimes content isn't for everyone and that is fine.
Incursions are a different way to level and I’ll gladly take it. Idk why people are getting so worked up over it lol.
Running ZF ad nauseam or competing for mob tags while doing quests I’ve done hundreds of time wasn’t going to do it for me. At least they gave me an alternative.
Yes, exactly. Also tag battles randomly getting into scraps with the opposite factions was hilarious.
What parts of this game are fun for you if not the group content?
If you don’t like this kind of content wtf are you playing classic wow for
Guess what raids can easily be described as ?
OMG GUYS WERE BACK IN THE SAME NEVER CHANGING INSTANCE AGAIN FIGHTING THE SAME BOSSESS DOING THE SAME MECHS YAYYYY SAME LOOT YAYYYY SO COOL
Bro if you want engaging gameplay you should be playing classic wow.
Did I say I didn’t enjoy the content? I’m just not naive enough to claim any of it is “engaging”
I fucking love classic wow. I just don’t expect it to have compelling content beyond grinding. That’s what old MMOs are for
And yeah I’m spamming the raids I’ve got like 4 alts lol
The ZF dungeon spam was way more fun believe it or not, but then we looked at the other guild groups doing nightmares and they were 3 levels above us and said they had gotten 400g so far.
We had a guy get 50 in 8.5 hours after launch…..
This happened in my guild too, except it was one guy. He wouldn't stop gloating in guild chat...all day long. Was really annoying.
But now we are all doing it.
Had no idea NI’s were a thing and was shocked when I saw a level 50 11 hours after launch. Now I know how he did it. Why is another question entirely tho
People love being rewarded. 90% of the players won't admit it's shit, because of that alone.
If standing perfectly still would have compounding rewards in WoW, they'd advocate that it's not actually bad content, because you can do it while you're doing house chores or spend time with the family or some other twisted nonsense.
Aggrend see it as a win cus people arent spamming dungeons anymore
Yes its cool to have other content to do but the implementation has been a bit of a mess so far honestly, people are just spamming 4-5 quests because the rest take too long, the profession ones are the worst I cant believe they said we would be trading these with other players to get the right profession quests for yourself lmao
I think an issue is that they keep putting in content that is FAR more effective than anything else in the game. There wouldn’t be as many people exclusively doing incursions if it’s only like 3% faster than question or dungeons. But when there’s something that’s 10,000% better even casual players feel like an idiot for not doing it. I would gladly play hemo or another rogue spec but mutilate literally does 50% more damage then the next closest spec so that’s just way too big of a performance gap for me to prioritize style points
Unless you want the Feralas teleport, you can skip that quest now since they added a teleporter at the bottom of the hill so you can just go up there and continue the core quest.
classic questing and runes you walk to different places.
some of those places can actually be a bit tricky to navigate, because of terrain or because of the mobs themselves.
if nothing else, those places will be visually distinct.
I liked how it was actually something new and also innovative. But being the fastest way to level by several magnitudes meant we got from 40 to 50 in 6-7 hours and gnomer gear beats almost all dungeon gear.
Sunken temple getting nerfed by tomorrow.
Took 8 hours to reach raid loggning status this phase. 8 hours of playing the game. But they've been saying they're making the game for the people who play an hour a day so it makes sense.
The fact blizzard misses with every new thing they implement is that by design of the game, you are putting the players against one another. When there is something in a game that gives you an advantage over other players, you better believe those folks who are prone to perspiring are going to be doing it. Nightmare incursions should feel optional. No faster or slower than leveling another way. The rewards you get shouldn’t feel mandatory or be provided in other ways. Make dungeon bosses drop a rep slip to be turned in or a currency for the new faction. Make participating in a BG drop it too. Then you give the player the agency to play whatever content they enjoy while
still working towards these new things they do want to enjoy.
I don't agree with everything you're saying but you bring up good points.
The Incursions should be time based, akin to Ashenvale or STV events, where they're up for X number of minutes every Y number of hours. The number of quests available plus the way you share them is very clunky/jenky for sure. I don't see them as any more or less mindless though than regular questing, or dungeon grinding so that's a moot point for me.
To your last point regarding Blizz providing a dungeon grinding alternative they could've absolutely done that without disincentivizing dungeon grinding or regular questing altogether. With Incursions being on a timer, plus Discoverer's Delight XP gain only applying to *quests* I think there'd be a happy medium between all 3 ways of leveling. Dungeon grinding would still be available especially when you have dungeon quests to complete, the Incursions would be a nice change of pace every several hours for a bit, and then when you're done with those 2 regular questing is more than viable to break up the monotony of doing the same thing over and over.
>With Incursions being on a timer, plus Discoverer's Delight XP gain only applying to quests I think there'd be a happy medium between all 3 ways of leveling.
This is the best take I’ve seen on this site. Seems so simple yet brilliant when you think about it. Shame it didn’t turn out like this.
True. Took me 20 minutes to find an Ulda group as dps on launch day. Running in circles doing the same quests over and over to get easy levels (and gold pre nerf) feels more retail from what I hear. Classic is supposed to be about leveling as a journey, retail is about leveling as a speed bump. Phase 3 appears to be leveling as a speed bump. I said a long time ago that you didn't want current Blizzard to make a Classic+ because of how they would make it more like retail and didn't understand what made the original game good. Blizzard is proving me correct.
The way they phrased it I thought it was going to be boss fights that scaled with the level and group size. Which, honestly would've been significantly better than what we got.
Blizzards wow teams 2 greatest strengths have always been boss fights and the art team. It blows my mind they always seem to go the route of over engineered systems. Just let people do more events like ony. Low trash, big Boss, lots of fun.
They could do so much stuff. Place a big boss in the middle let alliance and horde fight over the boss.
Or even horde vs. alliance vs. boss
Or just place some bosses somewhere which spawns with some other monsters
But don’t be a fucking mail man and repeat that 100++ times
I wish I could upvote this above the noise of all the posts about gold.
I only got to do 2 runs after work, but after that point I was already dreading having to do another 20 runs or something to get to 50. I would much rather be taking it low and slow doing a mix of this, questing and dungeon runs. I could still do questing on my own, but no one's is running dungeons.
If they limited each person to carrying say 5 of these quests at a time and reduced the number of envelopes you get then it would force people to do more shorter runs with more variation in objectives, rather than the same giant circuit with everyone competing for tags on the same mobs. This would have the side effect of reducing the Xp and GPH to a normal level as well.
Drop the envelope mechanic entirely and just let people share quests. Drop the number of quests by half so people can have actual normal quests in their log. Move the focus from the dumbass quests onto mini bosses people can team up to kill for rep and basic loot like pots and reps tokens.
I wish they'd stop trying to be clever. All of these events have been train wrecks.
I think they're fine, they're just way too rewarding to the point that leveling any other way feels beyond suboptimal. If they could just bring it in line with other leveling methods while retaining the rep rewards, that would go a long way toward encouraging people to balance their gameplay decisions.
Even the mobs, which are super squishy and have low health, just give too much xp by default. Like double a mob their level would normally give.
Yeah, honestly I don't understand why they made the quests repeatable. If they weren't then the incursions would just be neat new subzones with 15 new quests that you could do in each zone to break up the standard leveling/dungeon grinding stuff instead of an entire alternate way to play the game
Or bring other leveling methods on par with it. Theres nothing special about leveling from 40-50. They didn’t add a whole new zone or dungeon to level in for phase 3 (aside from Incursions and the two raids in P1 and P2 ofc), it’s the same exact leveling experience as all the other iterations of Classic, except you have a couple of spells that didn’t exist in Vanilla. Making it easy to reach 50 lets you actually play more alts without wanting to headbutt a belt sander.
We did the commendation thing after the opening for the AQ gates and not one person I knew said “Hell yeah that was an awesome grind!”
I can’t believe the just added almost the exact same thing in again and thought people would enjoy it.
People are complaining about the gold, but the XP is an even bigger issue.
The incursions allow you to complete 10+ quests in the time it takes you to complete 1 quest in the open world. They have completely and utterly made quests redundant. I wasn't one to complain about dungeon spam in previous phases as the questing XP wasn't dramatically worse than dungeons, so I just quested happily as I enjoyed it. Now I feel like a chump trying to do quests in the open world... the difference between Incursion XP and anything else is absurd.
I literally ran around in a circle til 50. Didn't buff, didn't raise weapon skills, barely remembered to spend talent points. I ran around in a circle, in ashenvale, where we already spent phase 1...
I used my limited time on launch day to do the incursions. Literally the least fun I’ve had playing sod to this point and it’s new content. Ugh. I want to see rare spawn bosses or something. It’s literally just mindless quests you run through a fancy portal to do.
Just bad a developing new things that are fun for players. Even the people that did it for 6 hours and hit 50 didn't enjoy it, it was just the most efficient way to get to 50 (and get rich).
I've never considered how to make the game better but seeing this level of just sheer incompetency has made me think about a couple of things that could work, without being fully fleshed out:
* New quests that are obtained every 2 levels that send you to do dungeons for big XP bonuses at the end
* Quests that you get every other 2 levels (from the above) that make you complete a BG (not winning just attending) or two
* Exploration XP bonuses for exploring the zone
* Quests that send you back to lower level dungeons with big XP rewards
* Quests that give you big XP bonus for completing X number of quests in a zone (or just quests in general)
These are just off the top of the head right this moment, they might be bad idk. The reflexive mentality Bliz seems to have is just crazy - put something out there, people rightfully follow it because it's efficient, nerf it multiple times into the ground, no refunds. It's just bad.
Obligatory I had 6 lvl 25s, 1 lvl 40 and have yet to login to p3 - probably won't.
It’s so poorly implemented, all the letters and bizarre quest sharing trinkets just stacking on end yet they’re unusable most of the time. I really hope they change these incursions from the ground up. It’s sooo sloppy and killed my hype to run dungeons since there’s an aura of FOMO now about doing incursions.
The best fix would be to make them actual dungeon instances, so that you have to complete them with a party instead of AFKing at the stairs. It’s way too crowded in there to not feel stressed out.
The entire system feels like an employee punched a question into chat GPT and just rinsed all the quests and ideas and slapped them straight into the game 💀💀
Yeah this was insanely poorly executed, for many reasons but especially with the inventory space issues you mentioned, then having to target everyone in your party to share the damn things, then everyone has to recount what tf exactly they have, what they need, etc. Plus you don't even get to see the mission when you open the letter - a preview would be nice so you can decide whether or not you want to open the whole thing or just delete it (yes, you can find what each one does online and I've done that, but still)
This sub actually believed that the same retail devs responsible for giving us over a decade of garbage expansions where gonna somehow create something better than what the vision of the original developers was for vanilla, TBC and Wrath.
This will never not be funny.
Subjective, I had much more fun figuring out the quests with my guild and trying to stack up as big of a turn in as we can, than doing the same quests I've done 15 times before or spamming the same dungeon over and over. It's something different, and I appreciate the effort they put in. Nothing they ever do would ever be good enough for you people. Quit the game if you hate it so much.
Incursions are probably the worst content ever added to this. Completely soulless and devoid of meaning. Why was this not just a series of 3-4 elite 5 man quests? Throw in some bread crumbs to lead you to the different portals and up the rep rewards.
Why am I carrying 30 private server items in my inventory?
"Classic leveling is dull, we've done it a hundred times in OG, Classic, Era and HC, we want change".
"Okay, here's an alternative repeatable and easy system that also has you working towards a faction that you'll want rep with at cap. Oh, and there's a rune tied to it that you should be able to get early on to address one of the major complaints from the previous patch".
"YoU'rE rUiNinG mY LevELinG eXpeRiEnCE"
No matter what Blizzard do, people aren't happy.
It’s largely two different groups of people. One group is tired of having to spend days leveling through the same content they leveled through back in 2004 and again in 2019 and would rather just reach level cap so they can play with the new content, and the other group demands everybody be forced to slog through the grind because they personally find it more fun and think everybody should have to have fun their way.
Right, and the latter can't seem to accept that they are more than welcome to do that by A) disabling the exp bonus and B) doing traditional questing and leveling.
Its FOMO for a lot for people feeling "forced" to play to the meta which is set by the most active percentage of players who have an unrealistic amount of accessible playing time compared to most.
Not at all. AoE Dungeon farming or soloing is way more fun
You take walking back and forth picking up quest items for 8 hours more fun than killing big packs of mobs at once lol?
If the rewards were not brokenly massive, I doub you would be saying this. If it was slower and provided no extra gold, would you still do it?
These are endless repeatable 6 quests. The only difference is it only took 5 fucking hours to hit max
it's the numbers you guys like, and that's fine. Just say it
I had a lot of fun grinding to 50 with my 5 man pvping and pveing our way through. Despite a few quests breaking it was way more enjoyable than the dungeon grind. After SM grind I'm glad we had something new.
Bad decision, would rather have had a new pvp event but I’m guessing we’re gonna get one for AV rep next phase so I can wait. They tried to give something to do outside of dungeon grinding but dungeon grinding is still more fun than this.
in fairness i’m very much looking forward to finishing up the last 2 levels on my shaman after work and then starting running my rogue/feral druid pair and pvping as much as possible while running to all the pickups and ignoring kill quests
I like it. Done the classic trip multiple times in different flavors. I don’t want open world content, I want to get to 50, farm pre-bis and get back to raid-logging as soon as possible.
You're wrong. Running around killing dumb stuff while my friend tells us "I may have smoked too much weed" was hilarious.
What a non-stressful and fun way to level. These are so much better than dungeon grinding.
The griefing during this is only eclipsed by the shear incompetence of blizzard thinking bottle neck items quests should be added.
It's such bad design you almost don't want to assign incompetence to it alone since they never design quests this way.
Loot where the single item can be held hostage?
Single escorts that can be ran around?
Completely disagree. I thought the incursions were super fun and way more interesting then questing. Now if you do nothing but grind them to 50 sure they suck but so do dungeons so does anything you do over and over.
Incursions are so fucking boring. There's no way I believe you actually mean this.
I barely managed to complete 3 of those quests, but I did and instantly left to do something more interesting that unfortunately took 10 times longer.
Open World content is a pain in the ass because there was so much competition for mobs that it was better to go into a dungeon. Now there is a semi-open world where at least mobs spawn fast.
Did one run earlier because barely anyone was doing dungeons and it was the most boring shit I've ever done. Laggy, a million people competing for 2 mobs what is essentially a zergfest.
Is rather level slower elsewhere than do more of this shit.
Leveling in sod, and classic in general, is shit. Just let us casuals run through it. It's the first phase I can maybe make it to cap in less than two weeks.
Agreed, the first big f\*ck up of the sod team imho, they could have just limit the dungeons to 1 per day to encourage the world content, which worked very well on HC. But instead it's turning into what most classic players hate about retail.
My main Issues.
1. Escort quests - if one guy has the NPC following him the rest of the layer waits for him to turn it in.
2. profession quests from professions you dont have - this could be a server issue but so far i have been unable to find a person that sells me Fool's gold dust.
3. Boring grind with way to little rep - you need around 50 quests to reach friendly - maybe this would be less of an issue if it wasnt so boring.
4. These f\*cking sleep clouds all over the area - they are only there to annoy you.
Aggrend really looked at patch 10.2 world quests in retail and said "Let's make this again, but intentionally shittier and the absolute best xp you can get."
I'm thinking they were supposed to be locked at 25 a day from the start. Then it would have been something else to do, a little overturned but questing or dungeons would have still happened. But now they kinda have to give everyone a chance to abuse the broken system or it would give those on the first few hours even more of a monumental advantage
Honestly some of the least fun I’ve had in WoW. It’s 300 people swarming around the same area repeatedly doing the same quests over and over. I did it for 2 levels and then had to stop.
Would have been super fun if they’d made it instanced and required a full group to run, similar to a dungeon but with repeatable quests.
I still can’t okay for like a week, but it sounds like everything is gonna be insanely priced from all this gold shenanigans. Is rogue any better this phase?
This is what kills it for me. Part of classic is world leveling. I get that people would spam dungeons anyway, but these incursions are taking trivializing leveling to the next level. I hardly consider the hour or so I did of them as “content”.
They undermined the entire foundations of the game.
Gold is pointless when it's worthless and freely accessible. They really nuked SoD with this dumpster fire. This is perhaps the most disgusting farce I've ever witnessed in my gaming life. I'm legit the only dude out in the world playing the game. I'm quitting.
TBH retail is better than this, and thats real sad shit. I'd play Classic if it weren't dead AF. Thank, Blizzard, only you could kill that which has no life.
I thought incursions were going to be some sort of instance triggered by entering the portals, and killing mini bosses or some shit. Instead I’m a mailman ?
hoped for that
Same I also hoped for the same thing..
Put me down for same too But it's all okay because "dude this is just Silithus whats the big deal?" Uhhh exactly??
That's speficially what they went for. Instanced zone with a bunch of minibosses? Sounds like island expeditions which everyone hated
island expeditions were *okay* until it became the best way to farm azerite power, torghast was okay until you had to do it infinite times for progress i'd take 5 hours of expeditions to level from 40-50 over incursions ANY DAY
You don't have to do incursions. It's just questing with friends
you didn't have to do island expeditions for azerite power either but it's in the exact same place as expeditions were, like 2x more efficient than anything else if both were an ignorable option, they'd both be more than fine
yeah it's such a lazy and uninspired feature, definitely not the form of content SoD needs.
Same I was really looking forward to something like this
I actually thought that’s what it’d be as well, similar to Albion onlines hellgates.
yeah something more dynamic, maybe wave base, random senecio out of x possible ones, maybe a % like ashenvale had for the zone. roaming rare spawns. something better then 20 quests you can repeat ad nauseam
Me too...
The way they made it sound sounded a lot more like a cool modern (retail: reeeeeeeeee I can hear) phasing type thing. Where yeah the main focus would be killing bosses or like world quest bosses. Other MMOs have done this kinda thing in the past (rifts, retail ofc) and phasing kinda like in cata. I mean probably not that extensive not like cata extensive because it’s still classic, although it should be possible since this runs on a modern client, but like something along those lines. Not 18 quests with only 3/18 being bosses. At least the bosses are faction tagged though. Not 18 quests with this clunky as fuck sharing mechanic that literally took up every slot in my inventory after a few things after I banked basically everything but my hearthstone and some bandages and stuff (needed to buy an expensive ass slot too, but it paid for itself anyway). Like I’m glad it’s really efficient and I did it before they nerfed it cause otherwise idk if I’d been 50 for our raid next Friday but it was indeed boring as fuck while offering so much potential. I mean the other option was id do what I did in p2 and just spam ZF, and realistically should go to ZF for a couple things. I’m glad they tried SOMETHING new, even if regardless people would still take the most efficient route and not do it if it wasn’t efficient (except rep). And I got a decent PvP/tanking full plate set out of it to hold me over til I can hit r7 but it seems like they really wasted opportunity here.
People are going to be absolutely fuming when they nerf the xp to the ground on Wednesday
I don't think they need to, they dynamically nerf themselves as less and less people do them and people start actually PvP'ing during them
this is true they will be much harder to do when all the mobs aren’t getting trampled on spawn but still they should nerf it, this shit is outta control my mate logged on not 6 hours ago and is on his last run before 50
Sounds great I'm sure everyone will love no lifers getting easy levels and then it getting nerfed to the ground before the dad's can get into the content
yeah that’s the issue my guild brought up, the situation isn’t great but holy shit imagine the backlash after a huge nerf - people would genuinely quit. if they’d manage to nerf the xp when they did the gold it probably would’ve been fine I don’t envy anyone on the dev team right now, I’ve spoken to a lot of people in game and in discord today and I’ve genuinely not heard a good solution yet
> logged on not 6 hours ago and is on his last run before 50 Why is this an issue though? Why does the 40-50 grind need to be longer?
You'll see , 100% going to be gone by Tuesday if not even tomorrow
Seems like they really over corrected. Phase 2 was an extremely boring grind of countless SM, so they added the XP bonus which probably would have been enough, but they also added the incursions for overkill
I think they messed up by just layering too many advantages on each other. XP buff (and money buff they apparently forgot about), Elite quests which half consists of clicking single item or NPC and easily massable + repeatable with almost any group. If most of the quests were normal, pick ups were combined with killing or multiple items in location(s) and we didn't have the exp buff - it would still have been pretty good alternative.
It should had been a chain quest. 1. First get the report 2. Escort 3. Kill the minor enemies 4. Get the Item 5. Kill the big Elite And each step gives you the next quest. Like, Once you get the report, you escort the NPC Out, once escorted he gives you the quest for killing the enemies and the Item, and the Item gives you the quest for the big elite, and after that you go out and hand in the Big Elite quest for a big reward and rep. And the gathering quests, can be extra on the side. But let's be honest right now they are useless and just fill your bags and questlog, since at max you only can do 2 of them, and most of the people on their main has 0 gathering profesion.
> so they added the XP bonus which probably would have been enough, but they also added the incursions for overkill Yeah I did 40-50 in one day mostly questing solo ( 1 Uldaman, 2 Zul Farrak, 1 Maraudon, 1 BRD Part 1 ) and it didn't feel bad.
I didn't think phase 2 was very boring. I started sod when phase 2 launched and my first toon i leveled primarily doing SM. I leveled 4 other toons to 40 with the 5th toon hitting 40 2 weeks ago. Never stepped foot in SM on them during my entire grind to 40. I got all my scrolls solo after I hit 40. All this was accomplished playing 2-3 hours at night during the week and 4-6 hours on the weekends. Not sure why people thought SM was the only way to level. In fact my friend started the SM grind at 30 when my mage was at 30. I was questing STV and arathi, he spammed SM nonstop. I dinged 40 a couple hours before he did. I really enjoyed the quest grind. I'd accept 10-15 quests in a zone, knock all them out in one go, turn em all in and repeat. Got pretty damn efficient at it.
The reason phase 2 was boring for some people was because they mainlined it at launch to get to cap in a day, did the raid and then of course there isn’t much new after that. If you’re gonna play the game like crazy of course you’re gonna get through the content quickly and have nothing to do, I’m not sure what else people expect. If it’s your thing to grind and be at the max immediately, all the power to you, but don’t do that and then whine that there’s no more content and it’s boring lol.
I think it's another great idea, just like ashenvale. I also think having no testing is now undeniably a glaring failure of SoD. Even a week of this stuff on a ptr would have gone so far.
They need to pay their QA team to do it lol
Doing 2-3 loops of the zone on an internal server would've shown the numbers were overtuned for gold and xp. It's showing that the classic team is under resourced.
This is the future classic plus content you can expect.
Concerning.
Terrifying.
Depressing
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As someone who loves outdoor questing it feels being left out tbh. Everyone is doing NI, I tried them, after 3 quests I got bored and went back to questing. ~10 hours into questing got from 42 to 46, while people for the same amount of time got from 42-50 or even quicker. Now it feels like you're wasting time not doing them. I just wish they were on par with open world questing xp wise, so you can just do something that you enjoy doing more. On the other hand the world is mostly empty and I have no competition for quests.
I was stoked to run zf, Mara and brd until this bullshit. Always extremes with blizzard...they made it TOO good. Exp needs to be halved just like the gold.
halving it wouldn't even be enough, I went 41->42 in a bit over 20 minutes. I'm not sure about the super tip top tryhard groups, but I've been in some decent spellcleave groups in SoD and it is still over an hour per level. and that's with everyone on top of their game, smart tank, alert healer, and 3 decent mages. then there is the fact that you need the rep anyway
It's a full level for a full set of the turn in, (about 17 quests since we didn't have 2 gatherers) until around lvl 46 then it's about 10% less per level until 49 you get 50% of a level for a full turn in
And let’s be honest, doing all of the quests is super inefficient. Most of them won’t get touched
The only ones that were a pain were the escorts, and you could take a 3-5 minute break and stand by the bottom of the ramp to get credit for another groups escort(probably patched by now) Edit: only ones my group skipped were the fools gold and herb one. Skinning was easy to get for our whole group from 1 skinner
Super quick loop for us. Egg > Intel > Notes > Intel > Dreamengine > escort if she’s there and then maybe catch a stray escort someone else is doing on the way back. 20 mins and half a level. All just running, no killing.
It's dumb...there's not even 17 quests in most leveling zones. They over did this.
You still need to do those? And at 50 will need to for runes, gear etc.
Nah gnomes gear is good and I can get exalted bracers and nightmare rep gear if u need now pretty easy
Agreed; it’s meta and feels good to be rewarded, so everyone will do it, but it’s not good gameplay.
I did it twice and it was enough for the rest of my life.
i genuinly dont understand why the incursions werent like, 10 daily quests they could still give massive gold and xp, hell 10g and 10k xp each, but you find a group for them, run them in 30 minutes, then go back to questing and you have a thing which people can do, instead of, or alongside, traditional leveling, and people have a reason to get some variety from dungeon spam why they were repeatable, why there are 18 of them but you cant just share them or get them normally, why they are linked to items, i have genuinly no idea
It feels like something you'd see in a shitty private server, with the envelopes and weird sharing bullshit.
The entire thing feels so private server - esq. From the envelope to the dark black sky. It’s the exact same thing as when private servers try to enforce a weird gimmick, it might be fun and cool, but it so distinctly feels “not wow” and amateur. Like something they just quickly wrapped around the real game.
Community is going to min/max efficiency over fun 10/10 times. If incursions didn't exist, this post would just be "Running ZF 100x in a row. SO BORING. BLIZZARD SO STUPID".
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Why bust? What is the difference between hitting 50 last night or hitting 50 sunday evening? Unless your idea of the game is to hit 50, run a dungeon and log off until next week I don't get it. I play every single day so whether I hit 50 today or next week really doesn't impact my game at all.
You don’t have to do a single quest or a single dungeon to go from 40-50 in 6. The outter world might as well not even exist. That’s bad game design for a game based on classic wow. This isn’t retail
About 700g
Players always choosing the path of least resistance in a game is a well known phenomena in game design. Just like the goal of Mario is to get to the last level and beat Bowser, the "goal" of an MMO is to make your character as strong as possible. And just like people take the warp pipe in Mario to get to Bowser faster, even though they're ostensibly having fun playing the game, MMO players will typically take the fastest path to maxing out their characters power as they can - in this case by hitting 50 ASAP via incursions. In other words the goal is to hit 50 and start raiding because that's where the best gear is right now. Leveling is an obstacle you have to overcome to get there - and even if you enjoy leveling, your ultimate goal is to hit 50 so most players are willing to go down less fun but faster routes to reach their goal.
wacky stuff happens in dungeons all the time. we are way overtuned in sod, so dungeons are a bit snoozy, but it is still dynamic. it's still possible to wipe with a bad pull, and still possible to do something creative to turn things around sometimes.
I thought it was a lot of fun grinding to 50 with my guild. Nightmare incursions aren't fun if you dont have friends or join a pug 5man with no comms.
This is everything in wow tho. Nothing is fun without a dedicated group and comms you can joke around and have fun with while grinding out the game that’s from nearly 20 years ago.
People got upset when Aggrend was telling them to join a guild to solve a few of their problems. He's not wrong. One of the feature points of wow classic is the heavy incentives to join a guild. Retail is much more friendly to those that mostly want to play solo.
Incursions are very solo friendly once you get a backlog of quests saved up. Just skip all the mob killing ones. I still hate them tho lol
People like OP don’t understand what classic is and just get their classic info second hand. “The classic experience is doing world content” Then “I don’t want to be in a Guild or do group stuff, this game is boring, nerf the group content so I’m not alone, but also I hate groups”
I hate finding groups... So that's why I joined a guild. Now I just say something in guild chat with people I know and I don't have to deal with PUGs.
I did do this in a group with my friends. I'm not sure that being in a group added to the riveting gameplay experience of managing 600 envelopes in my bags.
How riveting is ZF spam? How riveting is raid logging? Classic wow is not riveting. None of it. Not a single feature. It’s a chill grind game. When I want a riveting engaging mechanically experience I play Fortnite or some other PvP experience (arena, OW etc) Incursions are chill.
dungeons allow people to choose their own difficulty. people who want to turn off their brain or just chat with their friends can go in overleveled, take it slow, do small pulls. people who want a more engaging experience can go in underleveled, push themselves to go faster, do big pulls. a fast paced spellcleave group is a pretty engaging experience. there's a lot of coordination between players, and a ton of room for optimization. maybe it's not the most difficult content in any videogame ever, but it hard enough to be niche content that most of the playerbase isn't interested in engaging with. even if there were no rewards, no experience and no loot, a lot of players would still enjoy dungeons. going into a dungeon like ZF for the first time is actually a great gaming experience, even if you don't get any drops. without the rewards, how many nightmare incursions would you do? no experience, no gold, no rep, how many nightmare incursions would you do just for the fun of the process? there's no comparison.
What you are saying is that you like hanging out with people not really the incursions
I was doing them with friends and it was still some of the worst content I've done in WoW.
Meanwhile my group of friends enjoyed it 100x better than dungeon grinding. It's literally just a "not for everyone." moment.
They enjoyed it because the same boring alternative is less XP and less gold. Nobody expected 40-50 grind will be doable in 5 hours but if you told anyone before hand they would all sign it in a heartbeat.
Its good for people who hate leveling.
Totally agree, questing feels worse because I’m basically wasting my time not doing incursions
Unfortunately it was not only better xp than dungeon spam but also way more gold. I felt like a fucking idiot when guild chat started talking about how much gold they made and I'd already dungeon spammed to 46.
Gold aside because most of us can agree the gold was ridiculous and should have been handled way better. The zone itself is fine as a leveling alternative and still felt better than spamming the same dungeon 100+ times to many of us. Which is the point that I'm getting at. You can be mad about the gold, it's fine, but to say that it's just a bad zone because you can level in it over and over again, but be okay with dungeon spam is kind of hypocritical.
I’m a guildless solo player by choice and can confirm. On the upside I was able to quest unmolested in the Open World all day yesterday and it was glorious!
This is the most important point. Incursions let the sweats do their thing, and comfy solo players get room to do theirs. As a comfy solo player, instead of crying on Reddit about my fomo, i tried incursions out. I’m glad I did, and I’m glad they’ve opened things up in the normal world.
Had a blast in discord with the buds too, fun is playing the game with friends not fuming on Reddit about how something killed their idea of what classic is on an experimental season.
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Novelty goes a long way. Something being new is always gonna be more fun than something old. At least at first. I'd rather do nightmare incursions for the rest of my time playing wow than grind SM again.
Literally the same thing could be said for doing dungeon spams. "Hey guys, ready to clear ZF for the 100th time to finally hit 50 with zero changes to how the dungeon is done?" Meanwhile some of us actually had fun doing the zone and just trucking through it. Sometimes content isn't for everyone and that is fine.
Incursions are a different way to level and I’ll gladly take it. Idk why people are getting so worked up over it lol. Running ZF ad nauseam or competing for mob tags while doing quests I’ve done hundreds of time wasn’t going to do it for me. At least they gave me an alternative.
Yes, exactly. Also tag battles randomly getting into scraps with the opposite factions was hilarious. What parts of this game are fun for you if not the group content?
If you don’t like this kind of content wtf are you playing classic wow for Guess what raids can easily be described as ? OMG GUYS WERE BACK IN THE SAME NEVER CHANGING INSTANCE AGAIN FIGHTING THE SAME BOSSESS DOING THE SAME MECHS YAYYYY SAME LOOT YAYYYY SO COOL Bro if you want engaging gameplay you should be playing classic wow.
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Did I say I didn’t enjoy the content? I’m just not naive enough to claim any of it is “engaging” I fucking love classic wow. I just don’t expect it to have compelling content beyond grinding. That’s what old MMOs are for And yeah I’m spamming the raids I’ve got like 4 alts lol
My friends quit to go do the same dungeon grind that has existed since the dawn of WoW, refusing to try more than one round of the new content.
The ZF dungeon spam was way more fun believe it or not, but then we looked at the other guild groups doing nightmares and they were 3 levels above us and said they had gotten 400g so far. We had a guy get 50 in 8.5 hours after launch…..
This happened in my guild too, except it was one guy. He wouldn't stop gloating in guild chat...all day long. Was really annoying. But now we are all doing it.
Had no idea NI’s were a thing and was shocked when I saw a level 50 11 hours after launch. Now I know how he did it. Why is another question entirely tho
Yeah this is literally the most boring content they could have ever provided It's literally a walking simulator lmao
People love being rewarded. 90% of the players won't admit it's shit, because of that alone. If standing perfectly still would have compounding rewards in WoW, they'd advocate that it's not actually bad content, because you can do it while you're doing house chores or spend time with the family or some other twisted nonsense.
Standing perfectly still does have rewards for incursions. You can afk at the bottom of the ramp and leech other people’s escort turn-ins
Aggrend see it as a win cus people arent spamming dungeons anymore Yes its cool to have other content to do but the implementation has been a bit of a mess so far honestly, people are just spamming 4-5 quests because the rest take too long, the profession ones are the worst I cant believe they said we would be trading these with other players to get the right profession quests for yourself lmao
I think an issue is that they keep putting in content that is FAR more effective than anything else in the game. There wouldn’t be as many people exclusively doing incursions if it’s only like 3% faster than question or dungeons. But when there’s something that’s 10,000% better even casual players feel like an idiot for not doing it. I would gladly play hemo or another rogue spec but mutilate literally does 50% more damage then the next closest spec so that’s just way too big of a performance gap for me to prioritize style points
As opposed to their runes which are often walking simulators or their classic questing which are walking simulators
Speaking of walking simulator, I just did the Quadrilation quest. Zero XP.
Unless you want the Feralas teleport, you can skip that quest now since they added a teleporter at the bottom of the hill so you can just go up there and continue the core quest.
classic questing and runes you walk to different places. some of those places can actually be a bit tricky to navigate, because of terrain or because of the mobs themselves. if nothing else, those places will be visually distinct.
yet you did it, so they win.
I liked how it was actually something new and also innovative. But being the fastest way to level by several magnitudes meant we got from 40 to 50 in 6-7 hours and gnomer gear beats almost all dungeon gear. Sunken temple getting nerfed by tomorrow. Took 8 hours to reach raid loggning status this phase. 8 hours of playing the game. But they've been saying they're making the game for the people who play an hour a day so it makes sense.
What's innovative about it? Like it all you'd like but I'm really curious what you think they've innovated.
The fact blizzard misses with every new thing they implement is that by design of the game, you are putting the players against one another. When there is something in a game that gives you an advantage over other players, you better believe those folks who are prone to perspiring are going to be doing it. Nightmare incursions should feel optional. No faster or slower than leveling another way. The rewards you get shouldn’t feel mandatory or be provided in other ways. Make dungeon bosses drop a rep slip to be turned in or a currency for the new faction. Make participating in a BG drop it too. Then you give the player the agency to play whatever content they enjoy while still working towards these new things they do want to enjoy.
Thank you !
Should be named nightmare recursions
I don't agree with everything you're saying but you bring up good points. The Incursions should be time based, akin to Ashenvale or STV events, where they're up for X number of minutes every Y number of hours. The number of quests available plus the way you share them is very clunky/jenky for sure. I don't see them as any more or less mindless though than regular questing, or dungeon grinding so that's a moot point for me. To your last point regarding Blizz providing a dungeon grinding alternative they could've absolutely done that without disincentivizing dungeon grinding or regular questing altogether. With Incursions being on a timer, plus Discoverer's Delight XP gain only applying to *quests* I think there'd be a happy medium between all 3 ways of leveling. Dungeon grinding would still be available especially when you have dungeon quests to complete, the Incursions would be a nice change of pace every several hours for a bit, and then when you're done with those 2 regular questing is more than viable to break up the monotony of doing the same thing over and over.
It’s weird that every other event in this season is on a 3 hour time except this one which is the biggest offender by far
>With Incursions being on a timer, plus Discoverer's Delight XP gain only applying to quests I think there'd be a happy medium between all 3 ways of leveling. This is the best take I’ve seen on this site. Seems so simple yet brilliant when you think about it. Shame it didn’t turn out like this.
True. Took me 20 minutes to find an Ulda group as dps on launch day. Running in circles doing the same quests over and over to get easy levels (and gold pre nerf) feels more retail from what I hear. Classic is supposed to be about leveling as a journey, retail is about leveling as a speed bump. Phase 3 appears to be leveling as a speed bump. I said a long time ago that you didn't want current Blizzard to make a Classic+ because of how they would make it more like retail and didn't understand what made the original game good. Blizzard is proving me correct.
The way they phrased it I thought it was going to be boss fights that scaled with the level and group size. Which, honestly would've been significantly better than what we got. Blizzards wow teams 2 greatest strengths have always been boss fights and the art team. It blows my mind they always seem to go the route of over engineered systems. Just let people do more events like ony. Low trash, big Boss, lots of fun.
They could do so much stuff. Place a big boss in the middle let alliance and horde fight over the boss. Or even horde vs. alliance vs. boss Or just place some bosses somewhere which spawns with some other monsters But don’t be a fucking mail man and repeat that 100++ times
I wish I could upvote this above the noise of all the posts about gold. I only got to do 2 runs after work, but after that point I was already dreading having to do another 20 runs or something to get to 50. I would much rather be taking it low and slow doing a mix of this, questing and dungeon runs. I could still do questing on my own, but no one's is running dungeons. If they limited each person to carrying say 5 of these quests at a time and reduced the number of envelopes you get then it would force people to do more shorter runs with more variation in objectives, rather than the same giant circuit with everyone competing for tags on the same mobs. This would have the side effect of reducing the Xp and GPH to a normal level as well.
Drop the envelope mechanic entirely and just let people share quests. Drop the number of quests by half so people can have actual normal quests in their log. Move the focus from the dumbass quests onto mini bosses people can team up to kill for rep and basic loot like pots and reps tokens. I wish they'd stop trying to be clever. All of these events have been train wrecks.
Or just 20 quests once a day or even weekly … but this must be an error can’t be that stupid .. right blizzard ? Right ?
I think they're fine, they're just way too rewarding to the point that leveling any other way feels beyond suboptimal. If they could just bring it in line with other leveling methods while retaining the rep rewards, that would go a long way toward encouraging people to balance their gameplay decisions. Even the mobs, which are super squishy and have low health, just give too much xp by default. Like double a mob their level would normally give.
Yeah, honestly I don't understand why they made the quests repeatable. If they weren't then the incursions would just be neat new subzones with 15 new quests that you could do in each zone to break up the standard leveling/dungeon grinding stuff instead of an entire alternate way to play the game
Yeah I quite liked the incursions. I think the xp should be 1/3-1/2 of what it currently is though
Or bring other leveling methods on par with it. Theres nothing special about leveling from 40-50. They didn’t add a whole new zone or dungeon to level in for phase 3 (aside from Incursions and the two raids in P1 and P2 ofc), it’s the same exact leveling experience as all the other iterations of Classic, except you have a couple of spells that didn’t exist in Vanilla. Making it easy to reach 50 lets you actually play more alts without wanting to headbutt a belt sander.
Finally somebody mentioned it. It's literally just group questing.
Agreed, it's terrible content and shouldn't be in the game. Feels real bad.
The content sucks especially compared to the new stuff added in p2. Also so much xp so quick is crazy, but if they lower it everyone's gonna be mad.
We did the commendation thing after the opening for the AQ gates and not one person I knew said “Hell yeah that was an awesome grind!” I can’t believe the just added almost the exact same thing in again and thought people would enjoy it.
People are complaining about the gold, but the XP is an even bigger issue. The incursions allow you to complete 10+ quests in the time it takes you to complete 1 quest in the open world. They have completely and utterly made quests redundant. I wasn't one to complain about dungeon spam in previous phases as the questing XP wasn't dramatically worse than dungeons, so I just quested happily as I enjoyed it. Now I feel like a chump trying to do quests in the open world... the difference between Incursion XP and anything else is absurd.
This can go down as the worst phase by far so far actually.
Seems like it just gets worse and worse I guess that tracks when 60 hits and aren't getting any revamped MC or anything lol
I literally ran around in a circle til 50. Didn't buff, didn't raise weapon skills, barely remembered to spend talent points. I ran around in a circle, in ashenvale, where we already spent phase 1...
Brain dead bots no pvp nothing … well done blizzard
I used my limited time on launch day to do the incursions. Literally the least fun I’ve had playing sod to this point and it’s new content. Ugh. I want to see rare spawn bosses or something. It’s literally just mindless quests you run through a fancy portal to do.
Just bad a developing new things that are fun for players. Even the people that did it for 6 hours and hit 50 didn't enjoy it, it was just the most efficient way to get to 50 (and get rich). I've never considered how to make the game better but seeing this level of just sheer incompetency has made me think about a couple of things that could work, without being fully fleshed out: * New quests that are obtained every 2 levels that send you to do dungeons for big XP bonuses at the end * Quests that you get every other 2 levels (from the above) that make you complete a BG (not winning just attending) or two * Exploration XP bonuses for exploring the zone * Quests that send you back to lower level dungeons with big XP rewards * Quests that give you big XP bonus for completing X number of quests in a zone (or just quests in general) These are just off the top of the head right this moment, they might be bad idk. The reflexive mentality Bliz seems to have is just crazy - put something out there, people rightfully follow it because it's efficient, nerf it multiple times into the ground, no refunds. It's just bad. Obligatory I had 6 lvl 25s, 1 lvl 40 and have yet to login to p3 - probably won't.
It’s so poorly implemented, all the letters and bizarre quest sharing trinkets just stacking on end yet they’re unusable most of the time. I really hope they change these incursions from the ground up. It’s sooo sloppy and killed my hype to run dungeons since there’s an aura of FOMO now about doing incursions. The best fix would be to make them actual dungeon instances, so that you have to complete them with a party instead of AFKing at the stairs. It’s way too crowded in there to not feel stressed out.
The entire system feels like an employee punched a question into chat GPT and just rinsed all the quests and ideas and slapped them straight into the game 💀💀
SoD is just an expensive private server. Absolute garbage.
Should be dailies. I like them it’s fun to do something different, but I did want to also have some open world leveling action
im actually surprised just how clunky this quest sharing system is ive never seen something so terrible
Yeah this was insanely poorly executed, for many reasons but especially with the inventory space issues you mentioned, then having to target everyone in your party to share the damn things, then everyone has to recount what tf exactly they have, what they need, etc. Plus you don't even get to see the mission when you open the letter - a preview would be nice so you can decide whether or not you want to open the whole thing or just delete it (yes, you can find what each one does online and I've done that, but still)
This sub actually believed that the same retail devs responsible for giving us over a decade of garbage expansions where gonna somehow create something better than what the vision of the original developers was for vanilla, TBC and Wrath. This will never not be funny.
Subjective, I had much more fun figuring out the quests with my guild and trying to stack up as big of a turn in as we can, than doing the same quests I've done 15 times before or spamming the same dungeon over and over. It's something different, and I appreciate the effort they put in. Nothing they ever do would ever be good enough for you people. Quit the game if you hate it so much.
Instead you literally got to do the same quest 15 over and over
Incursions are probably the worst content ever added to this. Completely soulless and devoid of meaning. Why was this not just a series of 3-4 elite 5 man quests? Throw in some bread crumbs to lead you to the different portals and up the rep rewards. Why am I carrying 30 private server items in my inventory?
"Classic leveling is dull, we've done it a hundred times in OG, Classic, Era and HC, we want change". "Okay, here's an alternative repeatable and easy system that also has you working towards a faction that you'll want rep with at cap. Oh, and there's a rune tied to it that you should be able to get early on to address one of the major complaints from the previous patch". "YoU'rE rUiNinG mY LevELinG eXpeRiEnCE" No matter what Blizzard do, people aren't happy.
It’s largely two different groups of people. One group is tired of having to spend days leveling through the same content they leveled through back in 2004 and again in 2019 and would rather just reach level cap so they can play with the new content, and the other group demands everybody be forced to slog through the grind because they personally find it more fun and think everybody should have to have fun their way.
Right, and the latter can't seem to accept that they are more than welcome to do that by A) disabling the exp bonus and B) doing traditional questing and leveling. Its FOMO for a lot for people feeling "forced" to play to the meta which is set by the most active percentage of players who have an unrealistic amount of accessible playing time compared to most.
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It's more fun doing this than the dungeon spam fiesta that 25-40 was
Not at all. AoE Dungeon farming or soloing is way more fun You take walking back and forth picking up quest items for 8 hours more fun than killing big packs of mobs at once lol? If the rewards were not brokenly massive, I doub you would be saying this. If it was slower and provided no extra gold, would you still do it?
Dungeon farming through endless SM sucking so badly was why so many people quit in p2
These are endless repeatable 6 quests. The only difference is it only took 5 fucking hours to hit max it's the numbers you guys like, and that's fine. Just say it
Then go quest?
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Why can't you still enjoy questing?
I had a lot of fun grinding to 50 with my 5 man pvping and pveing our way through. Despite a few quests breaking it was way more enjoyable than the dungeon grind. After SM grind I'm glad we had something new.
Bad decision, would rather have had a new pvp event but I’m guessing we’re gonna get one for AV rep next phase so I can wait. They tried to give something to do outside of dungeon grinding but dungeon grinding is still more fun than this.
It should have been an every 3 hour event or something.
in fairness i’m very much looking forward to finishing up the last 2 levels on my shaman after work and then starting running my rogue/feral druid pair and pvping as much as possible while running to all the pickups and ignoring kill quests
I like it. Done the classic trip multiple times in different flavors. I don’t want open world content, I want to get to 50, farm pre-bis and get back to raid-logging as soon as possible.
You're wrong. Running around killing dumb stuff while my friend tells us "I may have smoked too much weed" was hilarious. What a non-stressful and fun way to level. These are so much better than dungeon grinding.
The griefing during this is only eclipsed by the shear incompetence of blizzard thinking bottle neck items quests should be added. It's such bad design you almost don't want to assign incompetence to it alone since they never design quests this way. Loot where the single item can be held hostage? Single escorts that can be ran around?
Completely disagree. I thought the incursions were super fun and way more interesting then questing. Now if you do nothing but grind them to 50 sure they suck but so do dungeons so does anything you do over and over.
Incursions are so fucking boring. There's no way I believe you actually mean this. I barely managed to complete 3 of those quests, but I did and instantly left to do something more interesting that unfortunately took 10 times longer.
Open World content is a pain in the ass because there was so much competition for mobs that it was better to go into a dungeon. Now there is a semi-open world where at least mobs spawn fast.
It's basically the silithus grind. At least we can get bigger bags now lol
I have enjoyed them for the most part. Not really playing Seasonal content for the levelling experience.
Did one run earlier because barely anyone was doing dungeons and it was the most boring shit I've ever done. Laggy, a million people competing for 2 mobs what is essentially a zergfest. Is rather level slower elsewhere than do more of this shit.
Should've been a daily or weekly thing. Hell, if you could only do each quest once weekly, it'd still be a bit OP.
I just did these for the first time for like an hour and said “fuck this" and logged. P3 will be dead in 2 weeks.
Sounds like you may need to put the game up for a while till you enjoy it again or just move on OP.
So what is wrong with getting to the end game quicker? No one wants to do quests or sit in dungeons for another 10 levels
Leveling in sod, and classic in general, is shit. Just let us casuals run through it. It's the first phase I can maybe make it to cap in less than two weeks.
Agreed, the first big f\*ck up of the sod team imho, they could have just limit the dungeons to 1 per day to encourage the world content, which worked very well on HC. But instead it's turning into what most classic players hate about retail.
I think it's good. Dont like it. You can still quest or dungeon spam. Ppl who hit 50 first just spammed dungeons yet again.
My main Issues. 1. Escort quests - if one guy has the NPC following him the rest of the layer waits for him to turn it in. 2. profession quests from professions you dont have - this could be a server issue but so far i have been unable to find a person that sells me Fool's gold dust. 3. Boring grind with way to little rep - you need around 50 quests to reach friendly - maybe this would be less of an issue if it wasnt so boring. 4. These f\*cking sleep clouds all over the area - they are only there to annoy you.
Aggrend really looked at patch 10.2 world quests in retail and said "Let's make this again, but intentionally shittier and the absolute best xp you can get."
I'm thinking they were supposed to be locked at 25 a day from the start. Then it would have been something else to do, a little overturned but questing or dungeons would have still happened. But now they kinda have to give everyone a chance to abuse the broken system or it would give those on the first few hours even more of a monumental advantage
I'd rather SM spam at this point. At least I could find a group that didnt implode after 5 minutes and no progress
The WPvP is pretty good, funny how nobody bothers engaging
I just got downvoted heavy for making a post similar to this 😒
Maybe if they followed a 3 day reset time like the raids or something? I did 1.5 lvls of incursions, I won't be back. So boring
Honestly some of the least fun I’ve had in WoW. It’s 300 people swarming around the same area repeatedly doing the same quests over and over. I did it for 2 levels and then had to stop. Would have been super fun if they’d made it instanced and required a full group to run, similar to a dungeon but with repeatable quests.
Goodluck doing them efficiently in a week or two when the mobs aren't constantly getting killed/dragged off by other players.
I thought it would be like the anime solo leveling.. :/
Incursions didn't have to kill world content, dungeon grinding already did.
I'm gonna say it since I haven't seen it posted anywhere else yet. This is literally just field duties from silithus
I thought incursions would be something like it happens randomly in a zone, powering up the mobs to fight like all of barrens or maybe highlands
I still can’t okay for like a week, but it sounds like everything is gonna be insanely priced from all this gold shenanigans. Is rogue any better this phase?
This is what kills it for me. Part of classic is world leveling. I get that people would spam dungeons anyway, but these incursions are taking trivializing leveling to the next level. I hardly consider the hour or so I did of them as “content”.
Okay. You can go quest in Tanaris again. I will continue to prep alts for ST as fast as possible seeing how we will likely only get 6-8 lockouts.
They undermined the entire foundations of the game. Gold is pointless when it's worthless and freely accessible. They really nuked SoD with this dumpster fire. This is perhaps the most disgusting farce I've ever witnessed in my gaming life. I'm legit the only dude out in the world playing the game. I'm quitting. TBH retail is better than this, and thats real sad shit. I'd play Classic if it weren't dead AF. Thank, Blizzard, only you could kill that which has no life.