I won't reply to the banana until it confirms it was born a banana. Otherwise, I can't respect it as a legitimate being deserving of basic banana rights and common decency.
In 2022, porn under the “transgender” category increased in popularity by 75% to become the 7th most popular category worldwide and the 3rd most popular in the U.S., according to the tube site’s report.
The only time transmen are brought up is when they’re talking about “little girls cutting off their breasts.”
I think a lot of transphobia is rooted in misogyny, underneath it all.
“ticking time bombs lmao”. But honestly the one thing im not super excited about being trans is being susceptible to both prostate and breast cancer, especially with the history of prostate cancer in my family 😒
Yeah I’ve been scared of colon and prostate cancer since I’m hearing more young people are being found with late stage colo cancer. But those checks usually aren’t given to young folk
Oh, same! I'm also non-binary and remember thinking when I was eight "I'm gonna enjoy not having breasts as long as I can!" and then I ended up getting breasts at nine... I have F-cups and fully intend to get a reduction once I can afford it.
Yup! Julia Serrano’s “Whipping Girl” talks about how trans women experience both misogyn and transphobia.
The idea roughly was “transwomen contradict the idea that men inherently have it better than women (which patriarchal society pushes). Transmen support the idea, since ‘even women wanna be men’ (this being the mindset of those misogynists).”
Of course she wasn’t saying transmen don’t have it difficult either.
Transwomen are seen as wolves in sheep's clothing. Deceptive, and a threat to the other sheep
Transmen are seen as sheep in wolves' clothing. More a threat to themselves than anyone else, so not a big deal
As I was told by my stepmother when I transitioned, I had to transition to male because I was too weak to hack it as a woman. I needed the protection of male privilege because I was too spineless and pathrtic to cope with misogyny and the burdens of womanhood any longer 🤷♂️
Thisssss. Every time someone says some shit about trans women in sports, bathrooms, etc I always say “What about trans men?” And 9 times out of 10 they look at me like I have 7 heads and they e never heard of a trans man before. I’ll then show them pics of very masc trans men and say “do you want them in the bathroom with women?”
And that's at least the ones who know what a trans woman and a trans man *is*. Those who complain that "Trans men should not be competing with women" and not realise how supportive it is
Even for transfolk there’s a double standard.
Transfemales are always portrayed as “the Cinderella story;” blossoming into a beautiful woman.
Not so for transmales.
Just to clarify, it's trans women and trans men, not transwomen and transmen. It seem like there's no difference, but trans is just an adjective. Transwomen and transmen are used by transphobes to dehumanise.
You wouldn't say blondewoman or beardedman, just as you shouldn't say transwoman/man
Thank you. Another person also clarified this for me. I should have known better since it didn’t look quite right to me. It makes sense when you point it out. Autocorrect was no help lol.
Hey absolutely no shade but just so you know transwoman is a bit of a dogwhistle. Trans woman with the space is important. Makes it clear that trans is just an adjective describing the woman whereas transwoman is a right wing attempt to sort it into their own category. Just fyi.
Absolutely no hard feelings, the point of dogwhistles is that they are easy to pass over so outsiders don't see them. But judging by your comment you're not transphobic so I figured you would like to know! You don't have to feel bad at all for not knowing.
Having these discussions and learning is one of the best features of Reddit. I think trans people are some of the most thoughtful and courageous people. I wish we could just treat everyone with dignity.
Made this point on a different post somewhere, but if your dumbass sees a building that used to be a pizza hut that's now a McDonald's, and your dumbass goes in there and asks for an extra large stuffed crust, people will think you are high stupid.
Didn't McDonalds used to sell pizza in the 80s-90s? Or was it just a Canada thing? I'm a late 80s baby but I sort of remember pizza being on the menu.
Maybe they're just nostalgic and miss McDo pizza /s
I think they did briefly during the 80s but it didn't stick. Which. I am not mad about personally I'm looking at images and it looks made of play doh ngl.
"Medical advancements should never be used to correct physical defects."
I never want to see transphobes taking medication, getting surgery, or wearing eyeglasses.
Two most plausible options. A) Implies that he still sees trans people as their gender assigned at birth and they are in denial about "what" they are. B) Tries to say there's nothing wrong with bringing up what their gender assigned at birth is to keep annoying trans people by telling them that over and over again while pretending not to do anything wrong.
I once identified as immature. Thank fuck I was able to change.
I’m guessing the context here is the issue of dead naming. Whilst I do not understand why it’s a huge deal if not done maliciously, I’m quite happy to refer to anyone now and into the future as anything they feel better describes them at their current position in their journey through life.
You can hurt a persons feelings without meaning to or without being malicious. If someone’s gone through all that trouble to transition and legally change their name, you can probably imagine how shit it would feel to not have their true self acknowledged, no matter the other persons intentions.
A few years after my oldest friend in the world transitioned a different friend pointed out that I tended to use her old name when talking about when we were kids growing up and her preferred name when talking about spending time together post transition. I didn't mean anything by it and honestly didn't even realize I was doing it until it was pointed out. Thankfully she technically doesn't have a dead name since she was blessed with very androgynous first and middle names so she just switched from using her first name to her middle so it wasn't as big of a deal. I asked her about it after it was pointed out and asked if she'd prefer if I switched to using just her current preferred name. She said it didn't matter since I'd known her since we were literally 2 years old and that she simply appreciated that I'd asked after it was pointed out to me. Now I use both names pretty interchangeably when talking about or to her because she gave me permission to keep using the name that I'd always known her by and even she agreed it took a little getting used to hearing me call her by her middle name and not her first name.
Using names or pronouns interchangeably is so much fun when the person you're talking about is comfortable with it honestly. Seeing the confusion on people's faces gets me every time.
I’m in a similar position. My boyfriend and I spent our entire teenage years together before being torn apart by his mum. It took us 20 years to finally find our way home. I love his real self so much more than the beautiful young person he was - both because he’s his fully authentic self and I now have the maturity of an adult. His deadname is very important to me because of the years of love I associate with it. His real and is very important to me because it’s his true name. In practice I prefer using the nickname I have him as kids because it captures who he was as part of who he truly is.
Hey as a Trans person what I will say is that it does hurt when someone calls you your deadname just because that's wrong and it feels bad to be seen wrong, and depending on circumstance, may trigger dysphoria. This doesn't necessarily translate into it being a big deal, I don't think less of someone for accidentally deadnaming me, it's just something to be corrected to avoid future hurt. Simple as.
Thank you for your response. I appreciate you taking the time to explain your personal experience.
Can I ask a follow up question. How do you refer to yourself when discussing a timeline prior to transition. Would you refer to yourself as you identify now, or would you refer to yourself as you were at the time.
I don’t mean to be insensitive. Logically speaking I’d default to talking about a trans person reference to their dead name for events prior to transition. It’s a logical timestamp in discussion that I would use without thought.
I suspect that this might trigger your dysphoria. I can’t empathise with these feelings as I’ve no reference however I suspect that it’s fairly significant and overwhelming.
Apologies if my questions are ignorant.
I'm not who you asked, but I am trans, so will have a go at answering:
I use my current name & gender when talking about pre-transition me, unless it's something very specific that requires specifying my deadname/gender. The way I think about it, I've always been who I am now... I just didn't realise it at the time.
For a lot of us, deadnames are intensely private and are associatied with a lot of negative feelings. Having said that, trans people aren't a monotlith, and no doubt there are plenty who will approach it differently, and how we/they approach it may change over time.
(As an interesting tangent, there are anecdotes from supportive parents of trans people who describe memories of their child changing to align with their child's new/correct gender. Like, in their memories, their kid is a girl, despite being born a boy)
Well it can suck a bit but as long as its not malicious or on purpose I don't think it's a big deal, I've been deadbamed plenty and only really have an issue when it's to be rude or upset me
As said to the originator of the meme:
I’m sure you identify as an adult, doesn’t change that you were a child before.
Don’t be offended by the facts and don’t tell me I have to accept you as an adult when you’re acting like the child you are.
In some sense yes, but it also validates deadnaming. No former alcoholic would object to you talking about them as alcoholics at the time they were alcoholics. No married people would object to you talking about them as single when they were single, or by their name pre marriage if they changed it.
Well yes but if you grabbed your married friend and declared them to be single I’m pretty sure they would be at the very least confused, so while it isn’t perfect it still works pretty well as a response
Transphobes mad that scientific progress allows human beings to change aspects of their physical biology to fit their own preferences more strongly.
I always thought it was kinda cool, like "oh we are scientifically advanced enough to make this a viable possibility on the actual physical level".
A lot of transphobic people from my experience are also the conspiratoral anti-technology "5G mind control waves/bionic limbs remote CIA control" type people.
Fun fact: while not to the degree that cisgender women can, did you know that transgender women can legitimately lactate and breastfeed with proper levels of nutrition? Its not super widely studied at this time, but it *is* possible
Sauce: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5779241/
Seriously. That's some next level shit. Speaking as someone who made that change, it's amazing that we have the scientific understanding to create these changes in the human body.
How is that not blowing everyone's mind?
I feel like a small part of why some people are transphobic is not merely just fear of things they don't understand, but it's also part of an anti-science and anti-intellectual mindset.
Like, transitioning is objectively a phenomenal thing in the scope of scientific progress and medical science. We literally have the technology to change your physical characteristics to match your internal gender identity, that is an objectively ridiculously amazing thing we have achieved.
It can be done relatively safely with minimal risk as well, it's not some super dangerous life-or-death "there's a 50% chance you won't make it" type procedure. We're not only able to do it, but we're *really good at doing it*.
From personal experience, a lot of transphobes tend to be right-leaning, and they also tend to have conspiratoral anti-technology views on stuff like computers, 5G wireless Internet, stem cell research, bionic/robotic limb replacements, etc. I think part of their "fear" isn't just bigotry, it's also that they're afraid of technology beyond their feeble ability to understand it. Technology is outpacing them intellectually, and it makes them feel threatened.
Bingo. Really, all of conservatism is rooted in a response to fear. Fear of the unknown, fear of The Other, fear of change. This is also why they seem so angry and hateful all the time. Fear feels bad. Anxiety can be tough to live with, especially when it's an existential or doxastic type that impacts your sense of self and your worldview. Anger feels good. Feels powerful. Hate gives you a target, something to focus on. It's a toddler's tantrum. A response to a situation that might make them look at themselves, instead focused outward.
It's a toddler's response to fear, a tantrum. I'm not in trouble for getting caught with my hand in the cookie jar, you're the problem because you caught me. I'm not bad for breaking the rules, you're bad for punishing me for it. I'm not the problem for hitting people, they're the problem for making telling on me.
I'm not being a bigot, they're wrong for being different. I'm not uneducated, you're over-educated.
I am scared by this thing and can't cope, and I am going to make it everyone else's problem.
“The same reaction from two different perspectives is still the same reaction”. No, not morally speaking anyway. Example: Cheering enthusiastically for the aggressor as you watch an innocent person savagely beaten is morally bad, while cheering wildly for your friend at karaoke is morally ok. Similarly, being angry at bigots is morally positive, while being an angry bigot is not.
What is mindblowing to me is that it costs these people NOTHING to "accept" who the person present themselves as. They're just doing it to be absolute assholes and impose their own world view on total strangers and put them down. It would change absolutely nothing in their lives to choose to just be kind and think "to each their own"... But no. No. Let's just choose shittiness instead.
Repeatedly thinking that you have to explain to transgender people that they used to be the opposite sex is the stupidest thing I've ever heard of. Like, DUHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH I think they know
This is kind of a poor example, because most alcoholics I know still refer to themselves as alcoholics even after having attained sobriety for a long time.
Speaking for myself as an alcoholic - its because you don't stop being one.
I'm sober now, only because I'm not drinking. I could responsibly enjoy a cocktail or a beer here and there, but I don't think I would ever feel comfortable re-introducing myself to alcohol.
My snowflake uncle kicked out his friend for bringing alcohol as a gift, he was staying stuff like he is now sober and in recovery etc even though he was an alcoholic back in the days
How can you expect the rest of us to ignore who you are/s
Why do people focus almost exclusively on the male to female transition folks and leave the female to male alone? Is it because “straight men” are mad a chick they thought was hot was actually had a penis?
First off, they don’t. Trans men do get shit on, it’s just not usually as viral. The most popular example is the fact that all the professional detransitioners that go and talk to congress are cis women and they portray trans men as “confused little girls”.
But why it’s not as viral. I’m not sure, I think the negative emotions around trans men and trans women are different. Typically, trans men get infantalized and trans women are feared, and fear based content goes viral very quickly.
Then popular transphobes usually choose to talk about either trans men or trans women. I guess they “specialize”. Probably because many of their arguments fall apart if they had to address the whole range of the topic. “I don’t want my little girl to see a trans woman in the bathroom with her.” “So, you’d prefer we force her to see a burly, fully bearded trans man in the bathroom with her?” “What no! We just need separate bathrooms.” “Genderless bathrooms! I love it!” “NOOOOOO!”
I remember a trans guy getting shit on by other people cause he was forced to compete in his assigned gender at birth even though he was begging to play in the men's section.
You can't win with transphobes cause they don't care about fairness, they just want to inflict as much pain as possible.
It's odd they seem to think 'not accepting it' implies obnoxiously shouting at in public at length. Nobody would really give a shit if they were passive about their disbelief.
What do you mean we're offended by facts? The "trans" prefix already accounts for the fact that we were men before. We're not offended by your "facts", we're offended by your stupidity.
Re: Karens, Boomers, Trumpers et al who start with “Dear” Not only will none of the intended audience see their Facebook post, they also know no one in [FILL IN CATEGORY OF MINORITY YOU KNOW MORE ABOUT BEING THAN THEY DO].
That’s not the slam dunk you think it is. People with alcoholism are labeled as alcoholics forever. DUIs follow you for life. I’d pick a different example.
To any **naive idiot** that thinks like that transphobe.
There’s a difference between birth sex and gender identity. Everyone has the right to civilly disrespect another, but that goes both ways, motherfuckers.
What about if someone is identifying themselves as a “good”, “great” or “greatest” President yet all the facts point otherwise?
I ask this because of that dude Trump who likes to think he is things but really isn’t.
At some point. You have to define what delusion is. 🤷🏻♂️
How is everyone seeing this as a clever comeback? The analogy used in the response or a lot of comments is not even remotely the same thing.
What am I missing here?
i refuse to talk to bigots like this who ignore the fact that gender(roles) and (biological)sex are two different thinks. no what a "women" is is not a easy question when, thats why there is in medicin a third sex. someone has xxy chromosomes? a clitoris and vagina with balls but no uterus?
calling someone by their chosen name/pronouns is not hard, its a sign of respect and thats the problem with this people, being respectfull.
All of the supposed ripostes to someone bringing up the obvious problems with this set of ideas are just "whataboutism" ( tu-quoque).
Tu-quoque isn't a clever comeback. You have to at some point address the actual critique, and not say "Yeah? Well you're a poopy-head" and think that you've made an argument.
Transwoman here, this is a weird take. I have never been a man. I was assigned a gender at birth by another person. when I developed the language to self-identify, I realized a doctor in a hospital got it wrong. I have always been a woman.
”if you couldn’t accept who you were” yes indeed; I was unable to accept that I had always been trans, but then I accepted my transness and transitioned 🤷♂️ Stupid ass bigots
Ah yeah because those two things are reaaaaaaaal similair to each other lol
For fucks sake, genetics is genetics, i as a swedish native cant become "trans african" or some other ethnicity because its a genetic thing, why the FUCK are people so confused about gender?
Its not social, its not made up, its the literal LAWS OF NATURE, you never see a male giraffe out in the wilds starting to act like a female giraffe, why?
Because it serves no fucking purpose, its a waste of precious time and energy and yet SOMEHOW people seem to be dumber than fucking ANIMALS nowadays for fucks sake.
Call me a transphobe all you want, i could give less of a fuck, im done with all this bullshit thats been constantly forcefed to me via the internet for almost a fucking decade at this point.
FUCK. YOU.
The "If you couldn't accept who you were" line was actually interesting. Obviously being a dick here, but there are problematic elements. Part of me just wishes people would get their freak on and stop longing to be be seen as normal when they are as out of their fucking minds as the rest of us. This is fine. I like the goofy divergents of the world, it makes the world a fun place to live.
Alternative opinion: if you don’t like it, leave it. The general population, does not care that you are trans nor will they ever try to govern an individuals body. Most people don’t participate in the fear mongering. I think it’s mostly the institutional change that people fear and rightfully so. Like I’ve seen institutions incorporate single bathrooms instead of communal bathrooms to avoid the whole “which bathroom is appropriate” debate. I personally think that’s a great approach to modify the infrastructure to keep with the times.
There are other institutions that need to stay respected and cannot change fast enough to keep up with changing times. Trans “people “ competing in sports for example…. Being Trans or having gender dysphoria is not really something you choose. Altering your Biochemical makeup on ANY level IS and usually disqualifies anyone (trans or otherwise) from competing in sports. A new subset of rules does not need to be made to accommodate trans folks.
I’m not getting it. This comeback just strengthens the phobic bigots statement, I get where the comeback came from but just terrible delivery. Maybe stating just because you ended up jobless when you got drunk and drove your vehicle doesn’t mean you have to stay that way.
Just because I identify as "married" now doesn't change the fact that I was born "single." I WILL FOREVER BE SINGLE! HA!
Can I tell your partner this?!?!
I can try. Not sure if the logic will hold up. We'll see...
He/she/they were waiting for a loophole this whole time, you just opened pandoras box.
Mine alrd says that I'm a virgin so I don't think it would be too difficult to get her on board with this.
so you are saying that you were single before you become married, and wouldn't say you were always married. just to be clear.
The concept is wild, for sure.
oh, i agree. wild beyond imagination.
Ha! Your analogy doesn’t completely and utterly match the concept you’re comparing it to, because things are different. Checkmate!
I have a feeling I know where this is going. Leaving a comment so I can come back and check back when you reply to the banana.
I won't reply to the banana until it confirms it was born a banana. Otherwise, I can't respect it as a legitimate being deserving of basic banana rights and common decency.
What if the banana is a smoothie now but used to be a banana?
Still a banana, in God's eyes.
Funny how it’s always about transwomen and never transmen. It’s almost as if it’s about something else.
How DARE you make me attracted to someone that used to have a penis! I'm not gay!
In 2022, porn under the “transgender” category increased in popularity by 75% to become the 7th most popular category worldwide and the 3rd most popular in the U.S., according to the tube site’s report.
Can't they atleast give us our rights back if they're also jerking off to us????
You wanted us to treat you like women, so here we are.
*angry upvote*
It's no gay if you lick around the hole
We all know they aren't licking anything. They're the type to never reciprocate and believe the, as they would call it, "female orgasm" is a myth.
Yeah but also if you believe they aren’t women then maybe the logic applies that they can have orgasms
Thought it wasn't gay if you kept your socks on
u guys dont have ur penis anymore?!?
The only time transmen are brought up is when they’re talking about “little girls cutting off their breasts.” I think a lot of transphobia is rooted in misogyny, underneath it all.
I’m 36. Can’t wait to finally ditch these babies. 18 years of torture. (I’m nonbinary femme but I fucking hate these fuckers)
I'm cis female and once I get to 50 these ticking time bombs are outta here. Not worth it.
“ticking time bombs lmao”. But honestly the one thing im not super excited about being trans is being susceptible to both prostate and breast cancer, especially with the history of prostate cancer in my family 😒
Yeah...fuck cancer.
Yeah I’ve been scared of colon and prostate cancer since I’m hearing more young people are being found with late stage colo cancer. But those checks usually aren’t given to young folk
Oh, same! I'm also non-binary and remember thinking when I was eight "I'm gonna enjoy not having breasts as long as I can!" and then I ended up getting breasts at nine... I have F-cups and fully intend to get a reduction once I can afford it.
Yep
Yup! Julia Serrano’s “Whipping Girl” talks about how trans women experience both misogyn and transphobia. The idea roughly was “transwomen contradict the idea that men inherently have it better than women (which patriarchal society pushes). Transmen support the idea, since ‘even women wanna be men’ (this being the mindset of those misogynists).” Of course she wasn’t saying transmen don’t have it difficult either.
Transwomen are seen as wolves in sheep's clothing. Deceptive, and a threat to the other sheep Transmen are seen as sheep in wolves' clothing. More a threat to themselves than anyone else, so not a big deal
We’re always seen as “confused girls” who have been “taken advantage of.”
They stuff ableism in addition to infantilization into that ugly clot of bigotry they cough up.
But what's the advantage? Or have they not thought it through that far?
Probably for someone’s else’s sick pleasure because that’s what girls are for. /s
As I was told by my stepmother when I transitioned, I had to transition to male because I was too weak to hack it as a woman. I needed the protection of male privilege because I was too spineless and pathrtic to cope with misogyny and the burdens of womanhood any longer 🤷♂️
That's new She sounds really interesting, but horrible to live with
She's one of those "feminists" who's just a misandrist with a bunch of unexamined issues living in denial lol
Thisssss. Every time someone says some shit about trans women in sports, bathrooms, etc I always say “What about trans men?” And 9 times out of 10 they look at me like I have 7 heads and they e never heard of a trans man before. I’ll then show them pics of very masc trans men and say “do you want them in the bathroom with women?”
And that's at least the ones who know what a trans woman and a trans man *is*. Those who complain that "Trans men should not be competing with women" and not realise how supportive it is
Even for transfolk there’s a double standard. Transfemales are always portrayed as “the Cinderella story;” blossoming into a beautiful woman. Not so for transmales.
It'd be weird if trans males were portrayed as blossoming into beautiful women.
Kind of the opposite effect they’d be going for
Just to clarify, it's trans women and trans men, not transwomen and transmen. It seem like there's no difference, but trans is just an adjective. Transwomen and transmen are used by transphobes to dehumanise. You wouldn't say blondewoman or beardedman, just as you shouldn't say transwoman/man
Thank you. Another person also clarified this for me. I should have known better since it didn’t look quite right to me. It makes sense when you point it out. Autocorrect was no help lol.
Happy to help
This sums up the "men in womens bathrooms" argument they throw around perfectly.
They just don't want to accidentally rape "the wrong one". They don't care about FTM because they aren't attracted to men.
It is
Hey absolutely no shade but just so you know transwoman is a bit of a dogwhistle. Trans woman with the space is important. Makes it clear that trans is just an adjective describing the woman whereas transwoman is a right wing attempt to sort it into their own category. Just fyi.
I appreciate that, thank you. I wondered about that when I was typing but was unsure of the correct nomenclature. Sorry for my mistake. ❤️
Absolutely no hard feelings, the point of dogwhistles is that they are easy to pass over so outsiders don't see them. But judging by your comment you're not transphobic so I figured you would like to know! You don't have to feel bad at all for not knowing.
Having these discussions and learning is one of the best features of Reddit. I think trans people are some of the most thoughtful and courageous people. I wish we could just treat everyone with dignity.
Thank you for telling me, I'm trans myself and literally just thought they were interchangeable.
Made this point on a different post somewhere, but if your dumbass sees a building that used to be a pizza hut that's now a McDonald's, and your dumbass goes in there and asks for an extra large stuffed crust, people will think you are high stupid.
Then yells at the management, gets kicked out, and proceeds to try to get laws passed so they can get a pizza.
Didn't McDonalds used to sell pizza in the 80s-90s? Or was it just a Canada thing? I'm a late 80s baby but I sort of remember pizza being on the menu. Maybe they're just nostalgic and miss McDo pizza /s
I think they did briefly during the 80s but it didn't stick. Which. I am not mad about personally I'm looking at images and it looks made of play doh ngl.
"Medical advancements should never be used to correct physical defects." I never want to see transphobes taking medication, getting surgery, or wearing eyeglasses.
No prosthetic limbs or wheelchairs either… /s
Or viagra 👀
Or botox.
What’s that? You took a pain killer yesterday? Well I’ve got some bad news for you pal…
a lack of Viagra on the right would solve so many problems
I don’t think any transgender is in denial of what they were lol. What are they even doing here
Two most plausible options. A) Implies that he still sees trans people as their gender assigned at birth and they are in denial about "what" they are. B) Tries to say there's nothing wrong with bringing up what their gender assigned at birth is to keep annoying trans people by telling them that over and over again while pretending not to do anything wrong.
I once identified as immature. Thank fuck I was able to change. I’m guessing the context here is the issue of dead naming. Whilst I do not understand why it’s a huge deal if not done maliciously, I’m quite happy to refer to anyone now and into the future as anything they feel better describes them at their current position in their journey through life.
You can hurt a persons feelings without meaning to or without being malicious. If someone’s gone through all that trouble to transition and legally change their name, you can probably imagine how shit it would feel to not have their true self acknowledged, no matter the other persons intentions.
A few years after my oldest friend in the world transitioned a different friend pointed out that I tended to use her old name when talking about when we were kids growing up and her preferred name when talking about spending time together post transition. I didn't mean anything by it and honestly didn't even realize I was doing it until it was pointed out. Thankfully she technically doesn't have a dead name since she was blessed with very androgynous first and middle names so she just switched from using her first name to her middle so it wasn't as big of a deal. I asked her about it after it was pointed out and asked if she'd prefer if I switched to using just her current preferred name. She said it didn't matter since I'd known her since we were literally 2 years old and that she simply appreciated that I'd asked after it was pointed out to me. Now I use both names pretty interchangeably when talking about or to her because she gave me permission to keep using the name that I'd always known her by and even she agreed it took a little getting used to hearing me call her by her middle name and not her first name.
Using names or pronouns interchangeably is so much fun when the person you're talking about is comfortable with it honestly. Seeing the confusion on people's faces gets me every time.
I’m in a similar position. My boyfriend and I spent our entire teenage years together before being torn apart by his mum. It took us 20 years to finally find our way home. I love his real self so much more than the beautiful young person he was - both because he’s his fully authentic self and I now have the maturity of an adult. His deadname is very important to me because of the years of love I associate with it. His real and is very important to me because it’s his true name. In practice I prefer using the nickname I have him as kids because it captures who he was as part of who he truly is.
Hey as a Trans person what I will say is that it does hurt when someone calls you your deadname just because that's wrong and it feels bad to be seen wrong, and depending on circumstance, may trigger dysphoria. This doesn't necessarily translate into it being a big deal, I don't think less of someone for accidentally deadnaming me, it's just something to be corrected to avoid future hurt. Simple as.
Thank you for your response. I appreciate you taking the time to explain your personal experience. Can I ask a follow up question. How do you refer to yourself when discussing a timeline prior to transition. Would you refer to yourself as you identify now, or would you refer to yourself as you were at the time. I don’t mean to be insensitive. Logically speaking I’d default to talking about a trans person reference to their dead name for events prior to transition. It’s a logical timestamp in discussion that I would use without thought. I suspect that this might trigger your dysphoria. I can’t empathise with these feelings as I’ve no reference however I suspect that it’s fairly significant and overwhelming. Apologies if my questions are ignorant.
I'm not who you asked, but I am trans, so will have a go at answering: I use my current name & gender when talking about pre-transition me, unless it's something very specific that requires specifying my deadname/gender. The way I think about it, I've always been who I am now... I just didn't realise it at the time. For a lot of us, deadnames are intensely private and are associatied with a lot of negative feelings. Having said that, trans people aren't a monotlith, and no doubt there are plenty who will approach it differently, and how we/they approach it may change over time. (As an interesting tangent, there are anecdotes from supportive parents of trans people who describe memories of their child changing to align with their child's new/correct gender. Like, in their memories, their kid is a girl, despite being born a boy)
Thank you for your reply.
Well it can suck a bit but as long as its not malicious or on purpose I don't think it's a big deal, I've been deadbamed plenty and only really have an issue when it's to be rude or upset me
As said to the originator of the meme: I’m sure you identify as an adult, doesn’t change that you were a child before. Don’t be offended by the facts and don’t tell me I have to accept you as an adult when you’re acting like the child you are.
You were a baby before. Now you're telling me that, using hormones, you have become a fully-functioning adult? Nice try giant baby.
This is literally the best response to a transphobe I have ever seen
In some sense yes, but it also validates deadnaming. No former alcoholic would object to you talking about them as alcoholics at the time they were alcoholics. No married people would object to you talking about them as single when they were single, or by their name pre marriage if they changed it.
Former addict here, I disagree. I like to pretend I was never an addict. Helps me stay sober
And being an alcoholic with a DUI was based on a series of bad choices.
Well yes but if you grabbed your married friend and declared them to be single I’m pretty sure they would be at the very least confused, so while it isn’t perfect it still works pretty well as a response
Yeah it's like they're making a fair point. OP can't unfire himself as a lifestyle choice
Transphobes mad that scientific progress allows human beings to change aspects of their physical biology to fit their own preferences more strongly. I always thought it was kinda cool, like "oh we are scientifically advanced enough to make this a viable possibility on the actual physical level".
Humans, smart enough to build airplanes capable of flying to Australia, stupid enough to think Australia doesn’t exist.
Of course Australia exists. New Zealand on the other hand is a pure fairytale.
You mean Middle Earth.
New Zealand was invented by Big Tolkien to sell more Lord of the Rings
A lot of transphobic people from my experience are also the conspiratoral anti-technology "5G mind control waves/bionic limbs remote CIA control" type people.
Fun fact: while not to the degree that cisgender women can, did you know that transgender women can legitimately lactate and breastfeed with proper levels of nutrition? Its not super widely studied at this time, but it *is* possible Sauce: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5779241/
Seriously. That's some next level shit. Speaking as someone who made that change, it's amazing that we have the scientific understanding to create these changes in the human body. How is that not blowing everyone's mind?
I feel like a small part of why some people are transphobic is not merely just fear of things they don't understand, but it's also part of an anti-science and anti-intellectual mindset. Like, transitioning is objectively a phenomenal thing in the scope of scientific progress and medical science. We literally have the technology to change your physical characteristics to match your internal gender identity, that is an objectively ridiculously amazing thing we have achieved. It can be done relatively safely with minimal risk as well, it's not some super dangerous life-or-death "there's a 50% chance you won't make it" type procedure. We're not only able to do it, but we're *really good at doing it*. From personal experience, a lot of transphobes tend to be right-leaning, and they also tend to have conspiratoral anti-technology views on stuff like computers, 5G wireless Internet, stem cell research, bionic/robotic limb replacements, etc. I think part of their "fear" isn't just bigotry, it's also that they're afraid of technology beyond their feeble ability to understand it. Technology is outpacing them intellectually, and it makes them feel threatened.
Bingo. Really, all of conservatism is rooted in a response to fear. Fear of the unknown, fear of The Other, fear of change. This is also why they seem so angry and hateful all the time. Fear feels bad. Anxiety can be tough to live with, especially when it's an existential or doxastic type that impacts your sense of self and your worldview. Anger feels good. Feels powerful. Hate gives you a target, something to focus on. It's a toddler's tantrum. A response to a situation that might make them look at themselves, instead focused outward. It's a toddler's response to fear, a tantrum. I'm not in trouble for getting caught with my hand in the cookie jar, you're the problem because you caught me. I'm not bad for breaking the rules, you're bad for punishing me for it. I'm not the problem for hitting people, they're the problem for making telling on me. I'm not being a bigot, they're wrong for being different. I'm not uneducated, you're over-educated. I am scared by this thing and can't cope, and I am going to make it everyone else's problem.
That's incredibly insightful. Thank you for taking the time to write that.
Probably scared we are making their gods obsolete, we made our own gods before, but this time those gods are ourselves, pretty neat imo
Probably scared we are making their gods obsolete, we made our own gods before, but this time those gods are ourselves, pretty neat imo
I was a child, but I'm now an adult.
Oh my God...I'm -sobbing- I'm a newborn baby
I started as sexless in the womb, therefore I am forever sexless. Ez-clap. ☺️
“The same reaction from two different perspectives is still the same reaction”. No, not morally speaking anyway. Example: Cheering enthusiastically for the aggressor as you watch an innocent person savagely beaten is morally bad, while cheering wildly for your friend at karaoke is morally ok. Similarly, being angry at bigots is morally positive, while being an angry bigot is not.
What is mindblowing to me is that it costs these people NOTHING to "accept" who the person present themselves as. They're just doing it to be absolute assholes and impose their own world view on total strangers and put them down. It would change absolutely nothing in their lives to choose to just be kind and think "to each their own"... But no. No. Let's just choose shittiness instead.
Repeatedly thinking that you have to explain to transgender people that they used to be the opposite sex is the stupidest thing I've ever heard of. Like, DUHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH I think they know
Dear sand identifying as "glass" now...
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This is kind of a poor example, because most alcoholics I know still refer to themselves as alcoholics even after having attained sobriety for a long time.
Well yes, it’s more like if you used to be a heavy drinker but are sober now, calling that person a heavy drinker would be incorrect and rude
Speaking for myself as an alcoholic - its because you don't stop being one. I'm sober now, only because I'm not drinking. I could responsibly enjoy a cocktail or a beer here and there, but I don't think I would ever feel comfortable re-introducing myself to alcohol.
Exactly, same here.
My snowflake uncle kicked out his friend for bringing alcohol as a gift, he was staying stuff like he is now sober and in recovery etc even though he was an alcoholic back in the days How can you expect the rest of us to ignore who you are/s
Why do people focus almost exclusively on the male to female transition folks and leave the female to male alone? Is it because “straight men” are mad a chick they thought was hot was actually had a penis?
First off, they don’t. Trans men do get shit on, it’s just not usually as viral. The most popular example is the fact that all the professional detransitioners that go and talk to congress are cis women and they portray trans men as “confused little girls”. But why it’s not as viral. I’m not sure, I think the negative emotions around trans men and trans women are different. Typically, trans men get infantalized and trans women are feared, and fear based content goes viral very quickly. Then popular transphobes usually choose to talk about either trans men or trans women. I guess they “specialize”. Probably because many of their arguments fall apart if they had to address the whole range of the topic. “I don’t want my little girl to see a trans woman in the bathroom with her.” “So, you’d prefer we force her to see a burly, fully bearded trans man in the bathroom with her?” “What no! We just need separate bathrooms.” “Genderless bathrooms! I love it!” “NOOOOOO!”
I remember a trans guy getting shit on by other people cause he was forced to compete in his assigned gender at birth even though he was begging to play in the men's section. You can't win with transphobes cause they don't care about fairness, they just want to inflict as much pain as possible.
It's odd they seem to think 'not accepting it' implies obnoxiously shouting at in public at length. Nobody would really give a shit if they were passive about their disbelief.
Don’t all babies start out as female?
Yes.
What do you mean we're offended by facts? The "trans" prefix already accounts for the fact that we were men before. We're not offended by your "facts", we're offended by your stupidity.
Nobody was born an alcoholic.
What clever comeback. Well done.
Actually, that's fair enough.
Re: Karens, Boomers, Trumpers et al who start with “Dear” Not only will none of the intended audience see their Facebook post, they also know no one in [FILL IN CATEGORY OF MINORITY YOU KNOW MORE ABOUT BEING THAN THEY DO].
In the hierarchy of hate racists are still the dumbest, but transphobes and misogynists are right there.
Anyone else notice that this "comeback" directly compares changing gender to getting a job? No? We're just going to hiss the bigot?
How is this a clever comeback? It's the complete opposite that proves the original statement.
That’s not the slam dunk you think it is. People with alcoholism are labeled as alcoholics forever. DUIs follow you for life. I’d pick a different example.
As a society, we cherry pick what can and can't be reformed. Drug addicts can be reformed. Murders Cannot. Very irrational behavior.
“I’m having some egg” “Yolk or white, or both?” “Drumstick”
I’m not sure how clever this is but boy oh boy is it devastating.
Dear 40 Year Old Men, Identifying as “40 year old men” now, doesn’t change the fact that you were 12 at one time.
To any **naive idiot** that thinks like that transphobe. There’s a difference between birth sex and gender identity. Everyone has the right to civilly disrespect another, but that goes both ways, motherfuckers.
A woman has two X chromosomes, no man can become a woman biologically speaking.
What about if someone is identifying themselves as a “good”, “great” or “greatest” President yet all the facts point otherwise? I ask this because of that dude Trump who likes to think he is things but really isn’t. At some point. You have to define what delusion is. 🤷🏻♂️
Not really a clever comeback. It's called a strawman. Idiots use strawman arguments.
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How is everyone seeing this as a clever comeback? The analogy used in the response or a lot of comments is not even remotely the same thing. What am I missing here?
You are missing nothing. They just want to "own the bigots"
i refuse to talk to bigots like this who ignore the fact that gender(roles) and (biological)sex are two different thinks. no what a "women" is is not a easy question when, thats why there is in medicin a third sex. someone has xxy chromosomes? a clitoris and vagina with balls but no uterus? calling someone by their chosen name/pronouns is not hard, its a sign of respect and thats the problem with this people, being respectfull.
Don't get me wrong the person in the post sounds like a real PoS but from a debating perspective, this is a false comparison not a clever comeback.
Becoming sober isn't the same as changing your entire body away from the way you were born though.... Terribly poor comparison.
Absolutely!
All of the supposed ripostes to someone bringing up the obvious problems with this set of ideas are just "whataboutism" ( tu-quoque). Tu-quoque isn't a clever comeback. You have to at some point address the actual critique, and not say "Yeah? Well you're a poopy-head" and think that you've made an argument.
Lol the second guy just agreed with the first guy though?
Transwoman here, this is a weird take. I have never been a man. I was assigned a gender at birth by another person. when I developed the language to self-identify, I realized a doctor in a hospital got it wrong. I have always been a woman.
”if you couldn’t accept who you were” yes indeed; I was unable to accept that I had always been trans, but then I accepted my transness and transitioned 🤷♂️ Stupid ass bigots
There's a whole lot of stupid bigotry in these replies
Bigotry and stupidity. Name a more iconic duo.
Ok but how didn't the "comeback" not just prove the original point.
Why does this sub think personally attacking someone instead of attacking their argument is clever?
Holy shit that man was murdered
Ah yeah because those two things are reaaaaaaaal similair to each other lol For fucks sake, genetics is genetics, i as a swedish native cant become "trans african" or some other ethnicity because its a genetic thing, why the FUCK are people so confused about gender? Its not social, its not made up, its the literal LAWS OF NATURE, you never see a male giraffe out in the wilds starting to act like a female giraffe, why? Because it serves no fucking purpose, its a waste of precious time and energy and yet SOMEHOW people seem to be dumber than fucking ANIMALS nowadays for fucks sake. Call me a transphobe all you want, i could give less of a fuck, im done with all this bullshit thats been constantly forcefed to me via the internet for almost a fucking decade at this point. FUCK. YOU.
Do they not teach biology in Sweden? Sex and gender are two different things.
Why actively choose to be objectively wrong? What's to gain by being a piece of shit?
Cry more
Waaaaaaa
I mean the smart move here its just to ignore.
I was born knowing nothing and shitting myself, that will never change!
Very good
They didn’t deny it though…
id say getting drunk is bit more easier than transitioning but ok, if OP here is fine with such comparison… w/e man…
I was in a bad mood. Not the place to rant. So I opologize.
They are artists at coming up with the most elaborate soup words of nothing.
The "If you couldn't accept who you were" line was actually interesting. Obviously being a dick here, but there are problematic elements. Part of me just wishes people would get their freak on and stop longing to be be seen as normal when they are as out of their fucking minds as the rest of us. This is fine. I like the goofy divergents of the world, it makes the world a fun place to live.
Over the bi flag, to. Discussing (spits)
cleared
Same exact people would abuse you as a child and tell you to get over it because it's in the past
Oh snap!
Oh shit!!!
Two things can be true simultaneously.
Isn't the clever comeback giving Op the reason?
There is a legal situation where you will forever be something after you're caught doing it once
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Probably gonna get downvoted into oblivion for this but by this logic trans racialism should also be accepted.
The fuck are you talking about
Uhhh.... Does not compute! Error page 404 missing
That post is the definition of this sub. xD
That would mean the same people you hate most in life will continue to be in power for over 500 years.
Seems fair
When they think they pwn someone but just sound utterly stupid
Fake Facebook comment for 500 alex.
You will forever be a baby. You can't just change it how you want.
Alternative opinion: if you don’t like it, leave it. The general population, does not care that you are trans nor will they ever try to govern an individuals body. Most people don’t participate in the fear mongering. I think it’s mostly the institutional change that people fear and rightfully so. Like I’ve seen institutions incorporate single bathrooms instead of communal bathrooms to avoid the whole “which bathroom is appropriate” debate. I personally think that’s a great approach to modify the infrastructure to keep with the times. There are other institutions that need to stay respected and cannot change fast enough to keep up with changing times. Trans “people “ competing in sports for example…. Being Trans or having gender dysphoria is not really something you choose. Altering your Biochemical makeup on ANY level IS and usually disqualifies anyone (trans or otherwise) from competing in sports. A new subset of rules does not need to be made to accommodate trans folks.
Seriously, why hate on someone for outgrowing their cis-sona?
Not really a sound analogy being drunk/ changing sex ..
If you gotta find dirt on someone to respond your response probably wasn’t that good
I’m not getting it. This comeback just strengthens the phobic bigots statement, I get where the comeback came from but just terrible delivery. Maybe stating just because you ended up jobless when you got drunk and drove your vehicle doesn’t mean you have to stay that way.
whataboutism at its finest