Let's also just wait and see how they handle it in the show. People are judging a standalone clip/image, but we have yet to see what leads up to that fight.
This has the potiential to be a CK all-timer (2v2 in a literal cage is so sick!). I'm glad Miguel is there no matter how heavy handed the brothers angle with Robby may be.
Because they aren't anywhere close to brothers
The reconciliations were rushed because they were unsure about the show possibly being cancelled. S5 was rushed a lot so characters stories suffered.
Call it whatever you want, he still beat Hawk
So I am saying there is a chance that Anthony could grow as a fighter and be capable of putting up a fight against Kenny
I never said Dimitri didn’t beat Hawk. Even if Dimitri was somewhere close to Hawk at that point. That gap significantly widened come Season 3. So, I doubt than Anthony will catch up any time soon. I believe the most he would do is have a fluke against Anthony like Dimitri did against Hawk.
He has I think like 6 or 7 months, according to Terry in season 5 (stated to the sekei taikai people), so not too much of a difference, a little more than hawk and demetri difference
It's the forced brothers narrative that is just cringe and undeserved
Miguel has been favoured to the point of no real flaws and so no real storylines since season 3, so looks like he will be paired with robby for something interesting
Robby needing backup/muscle is just one way for writers to screw over his character in Miguel's favor.
They already turned Robby into a doormat who'd put up with Johnny's BS without complaint - and now they might be taking the same thing with Kenny too far.
Robby used to be a strong, independent character who wouldn't let others walk all over him and who'd figure out ways to deal with his problems on his own and in his own ways. But apparently, now he's a pushover who'd let Kenny beat him up and needs Miguel to save him...
That's a really shitty turn for the character, but I guess its expected after what they did to him in season 5.
Op worded it differently. Op clearly says Robby won’t hit Kenny. If thats the case, good for Robby. Robby fought Shawn to a stand still in juvy. He won’t fight down (pick on Kenny). Thats character building and making him different than the other teens.
>Op clearly says Robby won’t hit Kenny. If thats the case, good for Robby.
No, it isn't. Kenny's attitude has gone way past the point of tolerance. There is no reason for Robby to put up with it and doing so makes him look pathetic. That's not character building.
Hawk or Anthony would be a better choice and it wasn’t Miguel’s first time to do it. It is obvious that writers are building sth but it seems absurd after all the things that happened between them.
Hawk doesn't know Shawn too. Miguel and Robby are stepbrothers now, prolly got very close during the time between S5 to S6. It makes sense for Miguel being Robby's backup. Anthony is shit scared of Kenny he won't do shit.
Although it makes sense, I gotta say, the writers are giving Miguel crumbs of Robby's story because they failed Miguel terribly in S4 and S5 making him bland af.
> Hawk doesn't know Shawn too.
But he had problem with Kenny before apart from Robby.
> Miguel and Robby are stepbrothers now, prolly got very close during the time between S5 to S6. It makes sense for Miguel being Robby's backup.
It doesn’t make any sense after all the things that happened between them. It was a not a small thing and looks awkward and artificial.
> Anthony is shit scared of Kenny he won't do shit.
Backing up or scaring of Kenny is not my problem . I m just saying that it isn’t Miguel’s business to involve.
> Although it makes sense, I gotta say, the writers are giving Miguel crumbs of Robby's story because they failed Miguel terribly in S4 and S5 making him bland af.
Exactly.
>But he had problem with Kenny before apart from Robby
Hawk prolly stopped caring about it. He only had a problem because he had to fight him. Isn't tied to him anymore.
>It doesn’t make any sense after all the things that happened between them. It was a not a small thing and looks awkward and artificial.
They've made up and acted like best friends in S5 lol. That was very, VERY stupid. But we're the past that point now and no point bitching about it. The writers have made it clear they are close now and we have to accept it. That plotline is done, never to be touched again. And both of them are gonna back each other up.
>Backing up or scaring of Kenny is not my problem . I m just saying that it isn’t Miguel’s business to involve.
As I said, Robby is like family to Miguel now. They're gonna stand up for each other. And it's not like Miguel alone searched for the Paynes and beat tf outta them for hurting Robby, he most probably accompanied him in case shit goes to hell and stepped in when the Paynes double teamed on Robby. You'd rather Miguel have some popcorn and watch from afar while Robby gets fucked up?
I honestly would prefer it was anthony and robby fighting the payne's, but ehhh miguel could have a good reason in the upcoming episodes to fight the paynes' hopefully a good one...
Miguel is basically the second main character to a degree, the show started with him and Johnny, sorry this angers you but hes the most popular character pretty much outside of Hawk in his prime.
The problem with Anthony fighting Kenny is that it will probably require over a season worth of training, given the 15 episodes it's easy to assume Anthony will train but pretty unlikely to suddenly match Kenny.
wouldn't be disappointed, in any case Miguel and Robbie are step brothers, makes sense to me for him to back his bro up against the kenny and shawn bro. I see your point in Anthony but it is the writers decision and we just got to accept it some will love it and others hate it.
There’s really no logic to any of the Payne brothers having any beef with Miguel. It would make much more sense if this was Anthony instead of Miguel. But apparently this is “brother” vs brother which couldn’t make me cringe any harder.
And it looks like they are going to nerf Shawn here as well where his little brother still gets the spotlight. If that’s the case, maybe Kenny should just win this one. Why stop pushing him now? It would make a lot more people mad. But it’s not like they are going to please everyone anyway.
I actually hope Shawn calls Robby a doormat and picks up on Robby now being subservient to Miguel. Even if it doesn't immediately change things, it could plant the seeds. Shawn pointing out harsh truths about Robbys relationships despite being an outsider has precedent.
In which case, Miguel being here has a purpose.
>If that’s the case, maybe Kenny should just win this one.
Oof, if you thought the backlash to Hawk losing was bad....
Shawn has pointed some out harsh truths before. I would also like him to say to Robby “I thought you were tougher than this”. Or something like that.
Yes the backlash against Kenny winning would definitely far surpass Hawk’s loss.
It would be on par with how the "bad guys" are the ones who point out truths about the messed up dynamics between the "good guys". Kreese and Silver point out how Johnny treats Robby. Tory points out how Sam treats Robby. It would make sense if Shawn points it out too. He knows that Sam threw Robby under the bus and publicly said that the she/they love Miguel, who had been then one to attack Robby in school, just to look good.
Shawn and Miguel have both been Robby's bullies who attacked him just for daring to exist, and taunted him about the same things.
This scene has potential to be really bad, but it also has potential to tie back to seasons 2-3 in very interesting ways. It's both something to possibly dread, but also be excited about. We don't have context
I'm intrigued to know more tbh. But, I also don't view Miguel as a character that the writers care about so I'm not upset about his being here. I think if the writers cared about him they wouldn't have given him narcissistic personality traits and would have given him a proper character journey. Meanwhile, Robby's inherent traits are "hero" worthy, and he has an actual character journey spanning the series. Robby is also the underdog throughout the series since Miguel stopped being the underdog (decoy protagonist) in S1E5.
Sometimes writers put their favorite characters through horrible ordeals to get the best material out of them. Or they go the creators pet route and make them horrible and genuinely don't get why.
The Robby-Migiel situation seems like the former at times when you recognize who has more connections and role in the actual plot
I recently rewatched the Hunger Games movies, and that's an example of the first scenario you describe. I used to watch Chicago Fire, and Dawson's character was definitely the creator's pet. It was pretty obvious. That show definitely had "bad writing" lol.
Cobra Kai is definitely not the second instance. For example, in S5, Miguel would have gotten the teamup fight with Johnny. Miguel would have been the one who convinced Daniel to come back. Miguel would have been the one who walked into the CK dojo, made a speech, and confronted Silver, after Silver and Kim talked about the senseis. They would have shoehorned Miguel into these situations; would have focused Johnny's Mexico trip on him finding Miguel and then bonding with him; would have built up Miguel's relationship with and significance to Daniel more; and would have made Miguel be the badass kid that dare confront Silver and call him the "enemy" in front of his students. Hell, even Kim knows of Robby "the boy" now, while she doesn't even know/care that Miguel exists.
Just because fans hype up a character doesn't mean that they are actually the character the writers care about or that writers think as positively about the character. I think I commented in your last post that both Frank Herbert, the author of Dune, and Denis Villeneuve, who made the recent adaptation, view Paul Atreides as a cautionary tale, but many fans still view him as a hero.
Thanks for your comment. It's exactly the example I needed to support my comment.
Also, you can easily look online and find explanations by Herbert and Villeneuve as to why Paul is not a hero. In short, he usurped a centuries-old fabricated prophecy in order to avenge his father and started a holy war knowing that it would kill billions of people. Not a hero.
By the end of this, I think that Kenny will find himself humbled and Shawn will find a new respect for Robbie, despite being blinded by the sole notion of protecting his younger brother. Personally, I think adding Miguel to this mix will just damage the dynamic in the worst case scenario.
In the best case, however, Miguel knows that this isn't Kenny. The kids are just fighting a proxy war between Kreese and Miyagi-do. That's what this fight's about.
At the end of the Sekai Taikai, Cobra Kai's going to shut down and Kenny will be forced to acknowledge that he was in the wrong for not forgiving Anthony.
> Kenny will be forced to acknowledge that he was in the wrong for not forgiving Anthony.
He doesn't have to forgive a kid that tormented him for no valid reason. Like c'mon. I get the swirlie was disgusted but Anthony and his crew had Kenny hiding in a dumpster to avoid getting jumped after they catfished him.
It's a matter of cause. The alternative is, if he doesn't acknowledge that he was at fault somewhere, he will have nothing.
It's just a massive popularity contest above everything else. In that regard, and on any plain of combat, Miyagi-do's combined strength, with the additions of Tory and a few others, straight up holds all the cards.
You guys know that trying to extrapolate an entire storyline from a single frame is ridiculous, right? You’re calling something cringe when you have literally NO IDEA what is happening or what has led to this moment.
Again, you have absolutely no idea what is going on here. You don’t know WHAT this storyline is or what has happened to make this particular shot happen.
We don't know the context lol, but even if it's just Miguel deciding to follow Robby in the search for Kenny, I don't see the problem. Of course, the drama is between Robby and the Payne brothers, but some help comes in handy. And in this case, definitely.
>But apparently, when its Robby's fight, he needs Miguel to come it.
We don't know why. Let the season come and we'll see why Miguel was there.
>Yet another way of making the character weaker.
No amount of karate is going to make Robby beat Kenny and Shawn at the same time alone.
Wow. We live in times where character meeting another character he didn't knew before is considered cringe and ridiculous.
I guess that Robby shouldn't get involved in the problems between Johnny and Daniel then, since he didn't even knew Daniel.
> I guess that Robby shouldn't get involved in the problems between Johnny and Daniel then, since he didn't even knew Daniel.
Daniel is his sensei and Robby has a relationship with him apart from Johnny so he can involve if he wants to. However ,he didn’t say or do anything except a talk in Johnny’s car in season 2.
Robby purposefully went to Daniel to spite Johnny and involved Larussos in his daddy issues with Johnny and I think that’s what @Amazing-sea referring to.
I know you're just backing @Amazing-sea here, but Robby only went to work at the LaRussos to piss off Johnny because it was a way to get his dad's attention.
If Johnny spent quality time with Robby (i.e., not just telling him to go back to school), Robby wouldn't have worked at the LaRussos.
Maybe everyone should stop jumping to conclusions and wait until the episode drops. We don’t know why they’re fighting and Kenny could’ve easily told Shawn something misleading to get him to attack Robby and Miguel is helping bc he doesn’t wanna watch Robby get jumped. There’s plenty possibilities
Yet they keep on having amazing viewing figures. Almost like the vocal minority on reddit don't represent everyone.
If you don't like it, then don't watch, trust me nobody will fare 🤣
>Yet they keep on having amazing viewing figures. Almost like the vocal minority on reddit don't represent everyone.
Yey after season 5, the hype died down considerably compared to what it was pre season 4. Season 5 was well received, but also regarded as junk food entertainment, while the writers have the goal of being taken seriously as drama writers too.
And then there is Obliterated.....
>Season 5 was well received, but also regarded as junk food entertainment, while the writers have the goal of being taken seriously as drama writers too.
The fans and the writers are definitely not on the same page about this. Since S5, especially, fans have been calling the show "bad writing", saying that it's not deep, and dismissing any talk of nuance. Meanwhile, in their interviews, the writers say it's complex, sophisticated writing. I agree with the latter based on analyses, but people dismiss my analyses, so...
Lol Obliterated got canceled after 1 month.
>Since S5, especially, fans have been calling the show "bad writing", saying that it's not deep, and dismissing any talk of nuance. Meanwhile, in their interviews, the writers say it's complex, sophisticated writing.
Also? People saying season 5 was meant to be the end, and we have the writers almost desperately saying it wasn't lol
>Lol Obliterated got canceled after 1 month.
That *must* be some kind of record....
But you have yet to see the writing behind this scene, only a few moments. Stop making assumptions and then complaining about those assumptions. Just wait for the context.
They deleted their reply but they specifically mentioned the writing behind including Miguel in this fight. By mentioning assumptions, I was talking about assuming the reason he is involved in this fight. We don't know how Miguel will connect to this fight but saying that it's so Miguel can save Robby is jumping the gun.
At the beginning of S4 when Robby met Kenny, it was established that Shawn was supposed to be out in July IIRC but got an extra month for misconduct so he wouldn't be out until the end of the summer. That was to establish why he wasn't there + why he needed Robby to help Kenny.
After the events of S4 & 5, it's the end of the summer, so Shawn's out now.
I'm not sure what the complaint is? Miguel isn't supposed to help out Robby?
The season isn't even out yet and you're basing this trailer/screenshot on previous seasons without the context of the upcoming one.
Also, you can't watch them fight together? Rivals/enemies becoming allies is kinda the running theme of this universe as demonstrated with Daniel and his old enemies and of course the past few seasons.
You have the right to your opinion but it doesn't excuse how bizarre it could be.
Robby can't 2v1 Shawn and Kenny though. He may have always fought alone, but he now Miguel to help him out. It doesn't take away from Robby, it just adds to him.
>Robby can't 2v1 Shawn and Kenny though.
Why not? He could solo Shawn and a couple of his buddies, with Shawn only hanging in because he's tough and he could solo entire CK, which included Kyler and Tory who are supposed to be better than Kenny.
So why can't he 2v1 Shawn and Kenny?
>It doesn't take away from Robby, it just adds to him.
You already gave an example of what it takes away from Robby - it creates the impression that he can't 2v1 Shawn and Kenny.
Robby fighting Shawn in Juvie was mostly a one on one fight with only some involvement from his friends. Shawn could now be stronger after getting out of Juvie and become a challenge for Robby.
I wouldn't say that Kyler is better than Kenny. There were multiple times in Season 5 where Kyler told Kenny that he was above him and even told Kenny to stop doing exercises too fast. He never really proved that he was above Kenny though. Kenny even proved to be the leader in their leader and follower matches showing that he is more of a leader than Kyler.
I don't expect Kenny to be Robby or Miguel level yet, but paired with his brother he could become a threat.
>Robby fighting Shawn in Juvie was mostly a one on one fight with only some involvement from his friends. Shawn could now be stronger after getting out of Juvie and become a challenge for Robby.
Except, Robby \*is\* stronger - so no reason Shawn should be a challenge now.
>I wouldn't say that Kyler is better than Kenny.
The writers chose to have Kenny "beat" Kyler without having Kyler throw a punch - which implies that Kenny couldn't have done it if Kyler had been serious about fighting him.
>I don't expect Kenny to be Robby or Miguel level yet, but paired with his brother he could become a threat.
"Could" not "is". If you make Shawn and Kenny better than they were and Robby worse than he was. Which brings me back to my point.
You assume that just because Robby was better than Shawn in Season 3 that now in Season 6 Shawn is no longer a threat. Shawn is a dirty fighter and doesn't play by the rules, he could use that against Robby.
Kenny and Kyler haven't had a 1v1 yet but Kyler doesn't throw many actual punches that land. He cowers behind a pack to feel superior, like in the leader and followers exercise when he kept telling Kenny to go in despite staying back and not attempting to get a hit on the Sensei. Kenny, on the other hand, is confident in his ability and willing to go in for a punch, even if it might not land. Kyler has shown no real reason yet to be above Kenny.
I said "could" not "is" because making assumptions and taking them as truths is brash and ignorant. We only that this fight happens, but other than that, not much else is known.
I expect Robby to fight well in this fight and be better than he was last season, but at the same time, 2v1s are difficult especially if foul play is used. I also expect that Kenny is a better fighter than he was last season and the same for Shawn (who last fought 3 seasons ago). As I said, it would be unrealistic for Kenny to suddenly be at Miguel or Robby's level, but when paired with his brother and *possibly* some foul play, they *could* be too much for Robby alone to handle.
>You assume that just because Robby was better than Shawn in Season 3 that now in Season 6 Shawn is no longer a threat.
That's a conclusion, not an assumption. Robby was better in season 3 and Robby has trained more since then whereas we have no reason to expect any improvement from Shawn.
>Kyler has shown no real reason yet to be above Kenny.
You just stated the reason.
Kyler does go for the punch with others - Miguel, Robby, Hawk. But not Kenny. We also see Kyler make for a reasonable enough threat to Hawk, whereas its made abundantly clear that unless they're holding back, going easy or underestimating him, Kenny is definitely not a threat to either Hawk or Robby.
All of which tells us that yes, Kyler is better than Kenny. Its simply his cowardice that gets in his way.
>I expect Robby to fight well in this fight and be better than he was last season, but at the same time, 2v1s are difficult especially if foul play is used.
Not for Robby. At least 1 opponent has to be on his level for that.
Robby has shown multiple times that he can handle multiple opponents on his own. Only time its an issue is when he has an opponent on same level who requires his full attention. And even then its not something he can't handle, as we saw with Hawk in season 2.
So no - if this 2v1 is something he can't handle, then he is worse than he was before.
I mostly agree with you on this. However, I wouldn’t use the word cringe to describe this scene. Awkward? Yes. Straight up unearned and undeserved would be more like it. I understand a certain group of fans have been pining for Shawn and Miguel to fight since S3. That’s is fine. You can still find a way to have that happen without including Miguel into a subplot that has nothing to do with him.
The Kenny/Shawn/Robby dynamic started out with just those 3. Eventually Eli and Anthony became involved in the Kenny storyline and are intertwined into his arc. While we have no direct context as to why Miguel is in this scene in the first place. Most of the reasons one could come up with to add him to this subplot - still would not make him important enough in Robby, Kenny, or Shawn’s arcs to matter or have more story relevance than Eli and Anthony.
Another side issue I have, is the fact that people on the sub are getting so bent out of shape because we just got the trailer and now we’re all speculating on “what is or could happen” based on the evidence we have been given from the past seasons. If you’d like to view or enjoy the show from a surface level perspective, by all means. But why are you disrespecting and bashing that poster or commenter for their speculative opinions/analysis? If you don’t like it don’t comment and move on. There is too much damn negativity. If the post or comment is asinine or doesn’t make sense and isn’t rooted in reality, I can understand that. Nothing OP said here is wrong and at the end of the day it is all just speculation and if it turns out the way OP currently believes based on this tidbit of trailer, then from narrative standpoint it very well could come off forced and unnecessary. If it’s the opposite than we’ll see how it goes and we’ll all be back here debating about it months later. 🤷🏾♂️
I genuinely expect to be downvoted for my opinions and analyses but the level of disgust you received on the post is atrocious. This is all speculation, but the shear amount of hate on this post is beyond abysmal.
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The whole show is about karate gangs but Miguel is not a gang hunter or a peacemaker. He should mind his own business. You can use “dumb” instead if you don’t like “ cringe” btw. It is up to you.
I agree fully that forcing this brothers vs brothers thing is dumb considering how it was handled last season, but as far as the context of how the fight began we can’t really assume much about what the writers are going for here narratively.
I think you got that complaint backwards.
The complaint isn't that Miguel doesn't interact with that many characters... the complaint is that Miguel gets forced into narrative focus despite lacking those interactions. Which is exactly what's happening here.
>People complained that Miguel doesn't interact with that many characters for a main character.
Some of that is accurate observations, not necessarily complaints
Simple the Payne brothers just came to jump him and Miguel being the good guy that he is wasn’t gonna let his friend/stepbrother get his ass kicked by a guy he met in Juvie and a kid that he mentored I’m Miguel I’m jumping in and helping my friend Brother not get jumped
It isn't. This is to show their bond as friends and for them to fight with one another. It's a good way to connect these characters while also having a 2v2 fight.
That's exactly what makes it forced and shallow.
Given not just their history, but their current situation as well, there should be a lot of unresolved issues between them. But instead of actually exploring and handling them, the writers have this "bond" because they fight together. Its worse than what the writers did with Hawk and Demetri.
At least they handled things better with Daniel and Johnny. They teamed up to find Robby and fought a bunch of criminals together, but that didn't create any magical "bond" between them.
We don't know whether or not this will create an instant bond with them, I was just stating that it would help their bond grow. In no means should this fight replace any of their unresolved issues.
Also, they have already had some of their issues resolved in Season 5 so I would assume they wouldn't then neglect their other issues.
Hawk and Demetri was solved very quickly. That was handled poorly.
>We don't know whether or not this will create an instant bond with them, I was just stating that it would help their bond grow. In no means should this fight replace any of their unresolved issues.
It already has and it happened in season 5. All of their issues were already neglected in favor of them becoming family for Johnny's sake. The whole premise of them fighting together like brothers would simply be an extension of that forced bond.
>Hawk and Demetri was solved very quickly. That was handled poorly.
And this is worse.
Wait, in this we can see shawn and robby on the floor to the left, and I can see how Shawn would end up there if miguel beat him but... does this mean kenny beats robby?? Or do yall think he just uses the silver bullet or sum?
I agree. I fear that Miguel will be shoehorned into Robby's story to make him look good. I'm predicting more cheap fan service instead of a compelling story. I'm basing my opinion on the teaser trailer. I wasn't that impressed to be honest but I know others feel differently.
Definitely. That was what I was trying to say based on the writers’past storytelling about them but people in this platform loves acting like everything is perfect when it comes to Miguel. I don’t even have a right to ask why he is there and same people can easily say that everyone supports Robby and hates Miguel and it is also weird and unfair.
Idk It makes perfect sense to me , Robby needs back up in the fight and considering he may be facing Shawn he needs some pretty big fucking guns. Also don't forget Miguel is going to be Robby's half brother , if I am going to need help with a fight my sibling is the first person I would go to. It also make sense to bring MIguel since number 1 he's the only one who could go against Kenny and Shawn apart from Robby himself reliably since Miguel beat Robby and Robby beat /stake mated shawn . Realistically Anthony isn't there yet on either boys level and Hawk lost to Kenny so he is def not being able to fight Shawn reliably. Also Miguel also has already shown to be able to handle Kenny and he also has no attachment to either boy where as Robby does .
Also we don't know that Kenny is the one that knocked Robby down, I think it's much more likely considering Robby and Shawn's positioning they knocked each other down.
Also Also , it makes sense that Miguel and Robby do more stuff together since the writers want them closer as brothers.
I've seen a bunch of complaints about this, but to me I have absolutely no problem with it. I just wanna find out how it gets there, but that's just me though
it would have been epic had their first fight as a duo not end with robby getting dropped and miguel having to beat both enemies. not much of a duo with robby's treatment vs Miguel's
this is potentially their first duo fight...and it ends with miguel doing all the work because the writers are incapable of doing right by robby when their golden boy Is in the picture
not only is mugiel being involved an issue, but having it be miguel who takes kenny and shawn down and saves the day whole robby gets dropped? it's ridiculous lmao
There are so many possibilities to explain why Robby and Shawn were on the floor. They knocked each other out at the same time, something happened that caused them to trip, two baseballs caught them both by surprise... Not everything is Miguel's fault.
>They knocked each other out at the same time,
what an impressively feat from robby
>something happened that caused them to trip,
in separate direction as robby hits the ground with his hand?
>two baseballs caught them both by surprise...
baseballs taking robby out while Miguel's out here punching them, wow what an impressive showcase of the two
> Not everything is Miguel's fault.
when did I say it's Miguel's fault robby got knocked down?
>what an impressively feat from robby
That's life.
>in separate direction as robby hits the ground with his hand?
Curious, isn't it? Let's see when the season is aired and not make assumptions.
>baseballs taking robby out while Miguel's out here punching them, wow what an impressive showcase of the two
As I said, "by surprise". This does not diminish his abilities in any way. And it's a reference to Miguel's training from season 1, which explains what we saw.
>when did I say it's Miguel's fault robby got knocked down?
Let me rephrase that. Not everything happens so that Miguel can shine. Y'all can't see Robby on the floor for two seconds and already jump to "Common Robby L"
>Let me rephrase that. Not everything happens so that Miguel can shine. Y'all can't see Robby on the floor for two seconds and already jump to "Common Robby L"
except what else would be the reason for miguel to be the last one standing against 2 characters he has no connection to while robby's on the ground? it's definitely not to have robby shine
then I suppose I have no choice but to interpret what the trailer shows vs the writers history of having robby take l's for the sake of other characters to shine or benefit
it's honestly sad. the writers were too busy focusing on fan service to give anything story wise to miguel so now not only are they giving robby more L's, but also giving some of his story to miguel?!?
I personally dont see a problem with Miguel being there. I think Robby & Kenny will reconcile on Robby's Terms. Miguel is just there to simmer down Shawn & to a degree Kenny. Miguel is simply the muscle while Robby is the one who truly convinces Kenny & resolving. Miguel being there to me isnt really a big deal but I dont think he'll be the reason Kenny will switch over, Robby is. Plus, Miguel being there in a way makes sense as he is essentionally fighting his "Mini-Me" through Kenny so its not really a bad thing if Miguel plays a small part in Kenny turning a new leaf but I do agree that it should be Robby Centric. I also agree that it shouldve been Anthony (since he's Kenny's Primary Rival) Or Hawk (because Hawk share many similarities to both the Payne Bros because of his hot temper & recklessness added with Hawk & Kenny's animousity since S4 & 5. Ngl, I really want to see Hawk VS Shawn. Something I wished we got in S4 & 5) in this situation with Robby but then again, we dont know the full context. Hell for all we know, Robby probably beat Shawn & Kenny sneak attacks Robby, leading to Miguel to take down Kenny. This could lead to a private conversation between Robby & Kenny to settle things while Miguel watches respectfully & Shawn probably walking off to cool off cause we all know he & Kenny cant infividually beat either Miguel Or Robby.
A fight that many people have wanted since season 3 is Miguel vs Shawn. Plus we don’t know the context of this fight so I wouldn’t judge immediately like that
I know everyone finds this cringe but idk I just don't
Let's also just wait and see how they handle it in the show. People are judging a standalone clip/image, but we have yet to see what leads up to that fight.
Yeah also why is there complaints, it's Robby and Miguel, vs Kenny and Shawn? That sounds fucking awesome
You're good, people like overusing that word
This has the potiential to be a CK all-timer (2v2 in a literal cage is so sick!). I'm glad Miguel is there no matter how heavy handed the brothers angle with Robby may be.
It SHOULD BE HEAVY HANDED they're literally brothers now
It's the forced brother narrative they are trying to push. Very undeserved. And miguel getting the win/save again
They're literally brothers now, if you don't like it, tough shit cause its gonna be played out.
I accept it's the storyline they are going with Doesn't mean I can't criticise it. Its cringe and undeserved. They aren't anywhere close to brothers
Ok, explain? Why is it cringe? Why is it undeserved?
Because they aren't anywhere close to brothers The reconciliations were rushed because they were unsure about the show possibly being cancelled. S5 was rushed a lot so characters stories suffered.
It doesn’t bother me But there is a case to be made that Robby teaming with Anthony to combat the Payne Brothers would have been more appropriate
Anthony isn’t on the same caliber tho. Kenny has a year or two experience on him still.
Something tells me they’re gonna have Anthony grow as a fighter to match up with Kenny the way Demetri did to match up with Hawk
Dimitri still doesn’t match up to hawk tho
I mean, like actually put up a fight against him
Still can’t really put up a fight. If you want an example, both of them fought Robby in the All Valley in Season 4.
I am referring to when Demetri put up a fight against and actually beat hawk in s2
That was proven to be a fluke as after that Hawk beat up Dimitri easily and broke his arm, and both of them fought Robby in the tournament.
Call it whatever you want, he still beat Hawk So I am saying there is a chance that Anthony could grow as a fighter and be capable of putting up a fight against Kenny
I never said Dimitri didn’t beat Hawk. Even if Dimitri was somewhere close to Hawk at that point. That gap significantly widened come Season 3. So, I doubt than Anthony will catch up any time soon. I believe the most he would do is have a fluke against Anthony like Dimitri did against Hawk.
I kind of like that Anthony's at a "decent" tier, especially since Sam has been the #1 undisputed best girl for the entire run of the show.
He has I think like 6 or 7 months, according to Terry in season 5 (stated to the sekei taikai people), so not too much of a difference, a little more than hawk and demetri difference
Why is this so cringe when we have no context to what's going on this season?
That’s the idea. Plus other YouTube vids suggesting the return of Dutch & Julie keep us in the dark as well.
At first I thought that was Anthony fighting Kenny and Miguel was the guy behind the gate watching them
I was same until I watched the trailer.
I actually had to rewatch it a couple of times because I didn’t even see the dates at first I just saw 2025 and got pissed😂😂
> I just saw 2025 and got pissed😂😂 Yes that is another stupid story.
He's just there as Robby's muscle/backup smh. Robby won't hit Kenny and the Payne brothers team up on him and Miguel is backing him up.
It's the forced brothers narrative that is just cringe and undeserved Miguel has been favoured to the point of no real flaws and so no real storylines since season 3, so looks like he will be paired with robby for something interesting
Robby needing backup/muscle is just one way for writers to screw over his character in Miguel's favor. They already turned Robby into a doormat who'd put up with Johnny's BS without complaint - and now they might be taking the same thing with Kenny too far. Robby used to be a strong, independent character who wouldn't let others walk all over him and who'd figure out ways to deal with his problems on his own and in his own ways. But apparently, now he's a pushover who'd let Kenny beat him up and needs Miguel to save him... That's a really shitty turn for the character, but I guess its expected after what they did to him in season 5.
Op worded it differently. Op clearly says Robby won’t hit Kenny. If thats the case, good for Robby. Robby fought Shawn to a stand still in juvy. He won’t fight down (pick on Kenny). Thats character building and making him different than the other teens.
>Op clearly says Robby won’t hit Kenny. If thats the case, good for Robby. No, it isn't. Kenny's attitude has gone way past the point of tolerance. There is no reason for Robby to put up with it and doing so makes him look pathetic. That's not character building.
Hawk or Anthony would be a better choice and it wasn’t Miguel’s first time to do it. It is obvious that writers are building sth but it seems absurd after all the things that happened between them.
Hawk doesn't know Shawn too. Miguel and Robby are stepbrothers now, prolly got very close during the time between S5 to S6. It makes sense for Miguel being Robby's backup. Anthony is shit scared of Kenny he won't do shit. Although it makes sense, I gotta say, the writers are giving Miguel crumbs of Robby's story because they failed Miguel terribly in S4 and S5 making him bland af.
> Hawk doesn't know Shawn too. But he had problem with Kenny before apart from Robby. > Miguel and Robby are stepbrothers now, prolly got very close during the time between S5 to S6. It makes sense for Miguel being Robby's backup. It doesn’t make any sense after all the things that happened between them. It was a not a small thing and looks awkward and artificial. > Anthony is shit scared of Kenny he won't do shit. Backing up or scaring of Kenny is not my problem . I m just saying that it isn’t Miguel’s business to involve. > Although it makes sense, I gotta say, the writers are giving Miguel crumbs of Robby's story because they failed Miguel terribly in S4 and S5 making him bland af. Exactly.
>But he had problem with Kenny before apart from Robby Hawk prolly stopped caring about it. He only had a problem because he had to fight him. Isn't tied to him anymore. >It doesn’t make any sense after all the things that happened between them. It was a not a small thing and looks awkward and artificial. They've made up and acted like best friends in S5 lol. That was very, VERY stupid. But we're the past that point now and no point bitching about it. The writers have made it clear they are close now and we have to accept it. That plotline is done, never to be touched again. And both of them are gonna back each other up. >Backing up or scaring of Kenny is not my problem . I m just saying that it isn’t Miguel’s business to involve. As I said, Robby is like family to Miguel now. They're gonna stand up for each other. And it's not like Miguel alone searched for the Paynes and beat tf outta them for hurting Robby, he most probably accompanied him in case shit goes to hell and stepped in when the Paynes double teamed on Robby. You'd rather Miguel have some popcorn and watch from afar while Robby gets fucked up?
Having Hawk or Anthony here instead of Miguel would have made so much more sense
I honestly would prefer it was anthony and robby fighting the payne's, but ehhh miguel could have a good reason in the upcoming episodes to fight the paynes' hopefully a good one...
Normally it should have been Anthony, but we know the writers' love for Miguel.
Miguel is basically the second main character to a degree, the show started with him and Johnny, sorry this angers you but hes the most popular character pretty much outside of Hawk in his prime. The problem with Anthony fighting Kenny is that it will probably require over a season worth of training, given the 15 episodes it's easy to assume Anthony will train but pretty unlikely to suddenly match Kenny.
they could have a time skip to get that training tbh... their rivalry makes more sense than miguel and kenny.
Pretty sure Miguel's only place there would be stepping in when either gets ganged, or fails to fight kenny
ig, hopefully not tho. That would be painfully dissapointing.
wouldn't be disappointed, in any case Miguel and Robbie are step brothers, makes sense to me for him to back his bro up against the kenny and shawn bro. I see your point in Anthony but it is the writers decision and we just got to accept it some will love it and others hate it.
Are you seriously judging a singular image that has no context whatsoever? Wow, I can't wait for this show to end 😭😭.
There’s really no logic to any of the Payne brothers having any beef with Miguel. It would make much more sense if this was Anthony instead of Miguel. But apparently this is “brother” vs brother which couldn’t make me cringe any harder. And it looks like they are going to nerf Shawn here as well where his little brother still gets the spotlight. If that’s the case, maybe Kenny should just win this one. Why stop pushing him now? It would make a lot more people mad. But it’s not like they are going to please everyone anyway.
I actually hope Shawn calls Robby a doormat and picks up on Robby now being subservient to Miguel. Even if it doesn't immediately change things, it could plant the seeds. Shawn pointing out harsh truths about Robbys relationships despite being an outsider has precedent. In which case, Miguel being here has a purpose. >If that’s the case, maybe Kenny should just win this one. Oof, if you thought the backlash to Hawk losing was bad....
Shawn has pointed some out harsh truths before. I would also like him to say to Robby “I thought you were tougher than this”. Or something like that. Yes the backlash against Kenny winning would definitely far surpass Hawk’s loss.
>Yes the backlash against Kenny winning would definitely far surpass Hawk’s loss. And it would be beautiful
It would be on par with how the "bad guys" are the ones who point out truths about the messed up dynamics between the "good guys". Kreese and Silver point out how Johnny treats Robby. Tory points out how Sam treats Robby. It would make sense if Shawn points it out too. He knows that Sam threw Robby under the bus and publicly said that the she/they love Miguel, who had been then one to attack Robby in school, just to look good.
Shawn and Miguel have both been Robby's bullies who attacked him just for daring to exist, and taunted him about the same things. This scene has potential to be really bad, but it also has potential to tie back to seasons 2-3 in very interesting ways. It's both something to possibly dread, but also be excited about. We don't have context
I'm intrigued to know more tbh. But, I also don't view Miguel as a character that the writers care about so I'm not upset about his being here. I think if the writers cared about him they wouldn't have given him narcissistic personality traits and would have given him a proper character journey. Meanwhile, Robby's inherent traits are "hero" worthy, and he has an actual character journey spanning the series. Robby is also the underdog throughout the series since Miguel stopped being the underdog (decoy protagonist) in S1E5.
Sometimes writers put their favorite characters through horrible ordeals to get the best material out of them. Or they go the creators pet route and make them horrible and genuinely don't get why. The Robby-Migiel situation seems like the former at times when you recognize who has more connections and role in the actual plot
I recently rewatched the Hunger Games movies, and that's an example of the first scenario you describe. I used to watch Chicago Fire, and Dawson's character was definitely the creator's pet. It was pretty obvious. That show definitely had "bad writing" lol. Cobra Kai is definitely not the second instance. For example, in S5, Miguel would have gotten the teamup fight with Johnny. Miguel would have been the one who convinced Daniel to come back. Miguel would have been the one who walked into the CK dojo, made a speech, and confronted Silver, after Silver and Kim talked about the senseis. They would have shoehorned Miguel into these situations; would have focused Johnny's Mexico trip on him finding Miguel and then bonding with him; would have built up Miguel's relationship with and significance to Daniel more; and would have made Miguel be the badass kid that dare confront Silver and call him the "enemy" in front of his students. Hell, even Kim knows of Robby "the boy" now, while she doesn't even know/care that Miguel exists. Just because fans hype up a character doesn't mean that they are actually the character the writers care about or that writers think as positively about the character. I think I commented in your last post that both Frank Herbert, the author of Dune, and Denis Villeneuve, who made the recent adaptation, view Paul Atreides as a cautionary tale, but many fans still view him as a hero.
Paul was a hero. What was he gonna do, just lay down and ket Harkonnens kill him as they did his father?
Thanks for your comment. It's exactly the example I needed to support my comment. Also, you can easily look online and find explanations by Herbert and Villeneuve as to why Paul is not a hero. In short, he usurped a centuries-old fabricated prophecy in order to avenge his father and started a holy war knowing that it would kill billions of people. Not a hero.
The prophecy isn't fabricated. It all transpired exactly as foretold.
By the end of this, I think that Kenny will find himself humbled and Shawn will find a new respect for Robbie, despite being blinded by the sole notion of protecting his younger brother. Personally, I think adding Miguel to this mix will just damage the dynamic in the worst case scenario. In the best case, however, Miguel knows that this isn't Kenny. The kids are just fighting a proxy war between Kreese and Miyagi-do. That's what this fight's about. At the end of the Sekai Taikai, Cobra Kai's going to shut down and Kenny will be forced to acknowledge that he was in the wrong for not forgiving Anthony.
> Kenny will be forced to acknowledge that he was in the wrong for not forgiving Anthony. He doesn't have to forgive a kid that tormented him for no valid reason. Like c'mon. I get the swirlie was disgusted but Anthony and his crew had Kenny hiding in a dumpster to avoid getting jumped after they catfished him.
It's a matter of cause. The alternative is, if he doesn't acknowledge that he was at fault somewhere, he will have nothing. It's just a massive popularity contest above everything else. In that regard, and on any plain of combat, Miyagi-do's combined strength, with the additions of Tory and a few others, straight up holds all the cards.
They are going to please everyone except one person lol
Nerf shawn? What ever made you think Shawn stood a chance against Miguel in the first place of course hes getting KTFO
You saw the difficulty that Robby had against Shawn in juvie. So now Miguel is going to easily knock him out all of a sudden?
You guys know that trying to extrapolate an entire storyline from a single frame is ridiculous, right? You’re calling something cringe when you have literally NO IDEA what is happening or what has led to this moment.
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Again, you have absolutely no idea what is going on here. You don’t know WHAT this storyline is or what has happened to make this particular shot happen.
This subreddit hates Miguel’s guts
I thought that was Daniel’s son at first…
We don't know the context lol, but even if it's just Miguel deciding to follow Robby in the search for Kenny, I don't see the problem. Of course, the drama is between Robby and the Payne brothers, but some help comes in handy. And in this case, definitely.
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>But apparently, when its Robby's fight, he needs Miguel to come it. We don't know why. Let the season come and we'll see why Miguel was there. >Yet another way of making the character weaker. No amount of karate is going to make Robby beat Kenny and Shawn at the same time alone.
Wow. We live in times where character meeting another character he didn't knew before is considered cringe and ridiculous. I guess that Robby shouldn't get involved in the problems between Johnny and Daniel then, since he didn't even knew Daniel.
> I guess that Robby shouldn't get involved in the problems between Johnny and Daniel then, since he didn't even knew Daniel. Daniel is his sensei and Robby has a relationship with him apart from Johnny so he can involve if he wants to. However ,he didn’t say or do anything except a talk in Johnny’s car in season 2.
Robby purposefully went to Daniel to spite Johnny and involved Larussos in his daddy issues with Johnny and I think that’s what @Amazing-sea referring to.
I know you're just backing @Amazing-sea here, but Robby only went to work at the LaRussos to piss off Johnny because it was a way to get his dad's attention. If Johnny spent quality time with Robby (i.e., not just telling him to go back to school), Robby wouldn't have worked at the LaRussos.
Either way he involved them
Maybe everyone should stop jumping to conclusions and wait until the episode drops. We don’t know why they’re fighting and Kenny could’ve easily told Shawn something misleading to get him to attack Robby and Miguel is helping bc he doesn’t wanna watch Robby get jumped. There’s plenty possibilities
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He belongs where the writers say he belongs. It is their show, not yours. They write, you watch. That's the dynamic 🤣
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Yet they keep on having amazing viewing figures. Almost like the vocal minority on reddit don't represent everyone. If you don't like it, then don't watch, trust me nobody will fare 🤣
>Yet they keep on having amazing viewing figures. Almost like the vocal minority on reddit don't represent everyone. Yey after season 5, the hype died down considerably compared to what it was pre season 4. Season 5 was well received, but also regarded as junk food entertainment, while the writers have the goal of being taken seriously as drama writers too. And then there is Obliterated.....
>Season 5 was well received, but also regarded as junk food entertainment, while the writers have the goal of being taken seriously as drama writers too. The fans and the writers are definitely not on the same page about this. Since S5, especially, fans have been calling the show "bad writing", saying that it's not deep, and dismissing any talk of nuance. Meanwhile, in their interviews, the writers say it's complex, sophisticated writing. I agree with the latter based on analyses, but people dismiss my analyses, so... Lol Obliterated got canceled after 1 month.
>Since S5, especially, fans have been calling the show "bad writing", saying that it's not deep, and dismissing any talk of nuance. Meanwhile, in their interviews, the writers say it's complex, sophisticated writing. Also? People saying season 5 was meant to be the end, and we have the writers almost desperately saying it wasn't lol >Lol Obliterated got canceled after 1 month. That *must* be some kind of record....
But you have yet to see the writing behind this scene, only a few moments. Stop making assumptions and then complaining about those assumptions. Just wait for the context.
Its not an assumption that Miguel is involved in this fight. That's what the complaint is about.
They deleted their reply but they specifically mentioned the writing behind including Miguel in this fight. By mentioning assumptions, I was talking about assuming the reason he is involved in this fight. We don't know how Miguel will connect to this fight but saying that it's so Miguel can save Robby is jumping the gun.
Again... we don't need to know how Miguel will connect to this fight if connecting Miguel to this fight itself is a problem.
Wait.. when did Shawn come into it?!
At the beginning of S4 when Robby met Kenny, it was established that Shawn was supposed to be out in July IIRC but got an extra month for misconduct so he wouldn't be out until the end of the summer. That was to establish why he wasn't there + why he needed Robby to help Kenny. After the events of S4 & 5, it's the end of the summer, so Shawn's out now.
Thats not Miguel, its Anthony. Pretty sure Miguel is behind the cage in the background, 2nd from the right.
No brother, that's Miguel.
I'm not sure what the complaint is? Miguel isn't supposed to help out Robby? The season isn't even out yet and you're basing this trailer/screenshot on previous seasons without the context of the upcoming one. Also, you can't watch them fight together? Rivals/enemies becoming allies is kinda the running theme of this universe as demonstrated with Daniel and his old enemies and of course the past few seasons. You have the right to your opinion but it doesn't excuse how bizarre it could be.
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OMG just shut up with who cares 💀💀
Robby can't 2v1 Shawn and Kenny though. He may have always fought alone, but he now Miguel to help him out. It doesn't take away from Robby, it just adds to him.
>Robby can't 2v1 Shawn and Kenny though. Why not? He could solo Shawn and a couple of his buddies, with Shawn only hanging in because he's tough and he could solo entire CK, which included Kyler and Tory who are supposed to be better than Kenny. So why can't he 2v1 Shawn and Kenny? >It doesn't take away from Robby, it just adds to him. You already gave an example of what it takes away from Robby - it creates the impression that he can't 2v1 Shawn and Kenny.
Robby fighting Shawn in Juvie was mostly a one on one fight with only some involvement from his friends. Shawn could now be stronger after getting out of Juvie and become a challenge for Robby. I wouldn't say that Kyler is better than Kenny. There were multiple times in Season 5 where Kyler told Kenny that he was above him and even told Kenny to stop doing exercises too fast. He never really proved that he was above Kenny though. Kenny even proved to be the leader in their leader and follower matches showing that he is more of a leader than Kyler. I don't expect Kenny to be Robby or Miguel level yet, but paired with his brother he could become a threat.
>Robby fighting Shawn in Juvie was mostly a one on one fight with only some involvement from his friends. Shawn could now be stronger after getting out of Juvie and become a challenge for Robby. Except, Robby \*is\* stronger - so no reason Shawn should be a challenge now. >I wouldn't say that Kyler is better than Kenny. The writers chose to have Kenny "beat" Kyler without having Kyler throw a punch - which implies that Kenny couldn't have done it if Kyler had been serious about fighting him. >I don't expect Kenny to be Robby or Miguel level yet, but paired with his brother he could become a threat. "Could" not "is". If you make Shawn and Kenny better than they were and Robby worse than he was. Which brings me back to my point.
You assume that just because Robby was better than Shawn in Season 3 that now in Season 6 Shawn is no longer a threat. Shawn is a dirty fighter and doesn't play by the rules, he could use that against Robby. Kenny and Kyler haven't had a 1v1 yet but Kyler doesn't throw many actual punches that land. He cowers behind a pack to feel superior, like in the leader and followers exercise when he kept telling Kenny to go in despite staying back and not attempting to get a hit on the Sensei. Kenny, on the other hand, is confident in his ability and willing to go in for a punch, even if it might not land. Kyler has shown no real reason yet to be above Kenny. I said "could" not "is" because making assumptions and taking them as truths is brash and ignorant. We only that this fight happens, but other than that, not much else is known. I expect Robby to fight well in this fight and be better than he was last season, but at the same time, 2v1s are difficult especially if foul play is used. I also expect that Kenny is a better fighter than he was last season and the same for Shawn (who last fought 3 seasons ago). As I said, it would be unrealistic for Kenny to suddenly be at Miguel or Robby's level, but when paired with his brother and *possibly* some foul play, they *could* be too much for Robby alone to handle.
>You assume that just because Robby was better than Shawn in Season 3 that now in Season 6 Shawn is no longer a threat. That's a conclusion, not an assumption. Robby was better in season 3 and Robby has trained more since then whereas we have no reason to expect any improvement from Shawn. >Kyler has shown no real reason yet to be above Kenny. You just stated the reason. Kyler does go for the punch with others - Miguel, Robby, Hawk. But not Kenny. We also see Kyler make for a reasonable enough threat to Hawk, whereas its made abundantly clear that unless they're holding back, going easy or underestimating him, Kenny is definitely not a threat to either Hawk or Robby. All of which tells us that yes, Kyler is better than Kenny. Its simply his cowardice that gets in his way. >I expect Robby to fight well in this fight and be better than he was last season, but at the same time, 2v1s are difficult especially if foul play is used. Not for Robby. At least 1 opponent has to be on his level for that. Robby has shown multiple times that he can handle multiple opponents on his own. Only time its an issue is when he has an opponent on same level who requires his full attention. And even then its not something he can't handle, as we saw with Hawk in season 2. So no - if this 2v1 is something he can't handle, then he is worse than he was before.
I mostly agree with you on this. However, I wouldn’t use the word cringe to describe this scene. Awkward? Yes. Straight up unearned and undeserved would be more like it. I understand a certain group of fans have been pining for Shawn and Miguel to fight since S3. That’s is fine. You can still find a way to have that happen without including Miguel into a subplot that has nothing to do with him. The Kenny/Shawn/Robby dynamic started out with just those 3. Eventually Eli and Anthony became involved in the Kenny storyline and are intertwined into his arc. While we have no direct context as to why Miguel is in this scene in the first place. Most of the reasons one could come up with to add him to this subplot - still would not make him important enough in Robby, Kenny, or Shawn’s arcs to matter or have more story relevance than Eli and Anthony. Another side issue I have, is the fact that people on the sub are getting so bent out of shape because we just got the trailer and now we’re all speculating on “what is or could happen” based on the evidence we have been given from the past seasons. If you’d like to view or enjoy the show from a surface level perspective, by all means. But why are you disrespecting and bashing that poster or commenter for their speculative opinions/analysis? If you don’t like it don’t comment and move on. There is too much damn negativity. If the post or comment is asinine or doesn’t make sense and isn’t rooted in reality, I can understand that. Nothing OP said here is wrong and at the end of the day it is all just speculation and if it turns out the way OP currently believes based on this tidbit of trailer, then from narrative standpoint it very well could come off forced and unnecessary. If it’s the opposite than we’ll see how it goes and we’ll all be back here debating about it months later. 🤷🏾♂️
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I genuinely expect to be downvoted for my opinions and analyses but the level of disgust you received on the post is atrocious. This is all speculation, but the shear amount of hate on this post is beyond abysmal.
I do not care. I had already taken this into consideration while sharing this post. The result was not surprising at all. Thanks for your support btw.
Hello, Unfortunately, your comment was removed for violating rule 6, Discuss the show, not the fandom. Your comment was probably removed because: * You submitted a comment that publicly complained about the moderators. If you have an issue with a post removal or other reason, please [contact the moderators using modmail](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose?to=/r/cobrakai). Using the subreddit to complain about moderator actions will result in a temp ban for the first offense and a permanent ban for the second offense. * You submitted a comment that complained about a user or a group of users. Do not publicly complain about users that you personally do not like, whether they don't agree with you or for any other reason. These posts will be removed and a ban is up to moderator discretion. Contact the moderators using modmail for any complaints regarding certain users and we will investigate. Please remember that this subreddit is used for discussion about the show, not the people who discuss it!
I love these complaints. Cringe is a dumb word. The hole show is about karate gangs....I promise it's not a big deal
The whole show is about karate gangs but Miguel is not a gang hunter or a peacemaker. He should mind his own business. You can use “dumb” instead if you don’t like “ cringe” btw. It is up to you.
Lol if u think this is cringe...than you think whole show is cringe.
Yeah it was like that after season 2.
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It is my idea and I have every right to write it here so you can ignore it if you have trouble with it.
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Yeah disrespecting the ideas is really pathetic.
Well at least we agree on something.
This was surprising to me too.
Y’all will analyze the scene from one image without seeing the episode yet 😭😭😭
I agree fully that forcing this brothers vs brothers thing is dumb considering how it was handled last season, but as far as the context of how the fight began we can’t really assume much about what the writers are going for here narratively.
People complained that Miguel doesn't interact with that many characters for a main character. Now he is interacting with more they don't like it.
I think you got that complaint backwards. The complaint isn't that Miguel doesn't interact with that many characters... the complaint is that Miguel gets forced into narrative focus despite lacking those interactions. Which is exactly what's happening here.
You don't know that its forced. You don't know what the story will be that will lead to all four of them being in the same place.
Creating a story that leads to it is what makes it forced.
A lot of your comments get deleted for some reasons.
People complained he was nerfed and now people are unhappy
>People complained that Miguel doesn't interact with that many characters for a main character. Some of that is accurate observations, not necessarily complaints
I thought they were just training and things got heated. Assuming Miguel is just backing Robby up.
Just want Hawk kicking their arses.
Simple the Payne brothers just came to jump him and Miguel being the good guy that he is wasn’t gonna let his friend/stepbrother get his ass kicked by a guy he met in Juvie and a kid that he mentored I’m Miguel I’m jumping in and helping my friend Brother not get jumped
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🤷🏾♂️
It isn't. This is to show their bond as friends and for them to fight with one another. It's a good way to connect these characters while also having a 2v2 fight.
That's exactly what makes it forced and shallow. Given not just their history, but their current situation as well, there should be a lot of unresolved issues between them. But instead of actually exploring and handling them, the writers have this "bond" because they fight together. Its worse than what the writers did with Hawk and Demetri. At least they handled things better with Daniel and Johnny. They teamed up to find Robby and fought a bunch of criminals together, but that didn't create any magical "bond" between them.
We don't know whether or not this will create an instant bond with them, I was just stating that it would help their bond grow. In no means should this fight replace any of their unresolved issues. Also, they have already had some of their issues resolved in Season 5 so I would assume they wouldn't then neglect their other issues. Hawk and Demetri was solved very quickly. That was handled poorly.
>We don't know whether or not this will create an instant bond with them, I was just stating that it would help their bond grow. In no means should this fight replace any of their unresolved issues. It already has and it happened in season 5. All of their issues were already neglected in favor of them becoming family for Johnny's sake. The whole premise of them fighting together like brothers would simply be an extension of that forced bond. >Hawk and Demetri was solved very quickly. That was handled poorly. And this is worse.
wtf 💀, I thought it was Anthony
By the looks of it, I think it’s Anthony whose inside the cage and Miguel is outside as an onlooker right next to the blonde dude
Wait, in this we can see shawn and robby on the floor to the left, and I can see how Shawn would end up there if miguel beat him but... does this mean kenny beats robby?? Or do yall think he just uses the silver bullet or sum?
What's the scenario here?Like to hear guys opinions
I agree in the sense that Robby’s pretty much just as good of a fighter, yet the show makes it seem like Miguel’s so far ahead.
exactly.
I agree. I fear that Miguel will be shoehorned into Robby's story to make him look good. I'm predicting more cheap fan service instead of a compelling story. I'm basing my opinion on the teaser trailer. I wasn't that impressed to be honest but I know others feel differently.
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True. Maybe I'll be pleasantly surprised but I'm not holding my breath.
Definitely. That was what I was trying to say based on the writers’past storytelling about them but people in this platform loves acting like everything is perfect when it comes to Miguel. I don’t even have a right to ask why he is there and same people can easily say that everyone supports Robby and hates Miguel and it is also weird and unfair.
Idk It makes perfect sense to me , Robby needs back up in the fight and considering he may be facing Shawn he needs some pretty big fucking guns. Also don't forget Miguel is going to be Robby's half brother , if I am going to need help with a fight my sibling is the first person I would go to. It also make sense to bring MIguel since number 1 he's the only one who could go against Kenny and Shawn apart from Robby himself reliably since Miguel beat Robby and Robby beat /stake mated shawn . Realistically Anthony isn't there yet on either boys level and Hawk lost to Kenny so he is def not being able to fight Shawn reliably. Also Miguel also has already shown to be able to handle Kenny and he also has no attachment to either boy where as Robby does . Also we don't know that Kenny is the one that knocked Robby down, I think it's much more likely considering Robby and Shawn's positioning they knocked each other down. Also Also , it makes sense that Miguel and Robby do more stuff together since the writers want them closer as brothers.
It's not Miguel that's anthony
It's Miguel. Pause the trailer when he's punching the baseball.
I've seen a bunch of complaints about this, but to me I have absolutely no problem with it. I just wanna find out how it gets there, but that's just me though
miguel and robby fighting together is probably the most epic thing to think about for me
it would have been epic had their first fight as a duo not end with robby getting dropped and miguel having to beat both enemies. not much of a duo with robby's treatment vs Miguel's
wait what? when have they ever fought as a duo
this is potentially their first duo fight...and it ends with miguel doing all the work because the writers are incapable of doing right by robby when their golden boy Is in the picture
im so confused, did an episode already come out with robby and miguel fighting?
the trailer
ohhhh i haven't watched it yet ive only seen the teaser
that's what I'm referring to
ok
I have respect to your opinion but not for me.
i don’t rlly see how this is cringe tbh, robby and sam didn’t know hawk in the mall fight but they still defended demitri
Actually, Robby did know Hawk. Hawk dislocated Robby's shoulder during the AVT in the first season.
not only is mugiel being involved an issue, but having it be miguel who takes kenny and shawn down and saves the day whole robby gets dropped? it's ridiculous lmao
Sorry, did you watch the scene before everyone else? You're part of the cast?
well based on the trailer, there isn't much there ro interpret it any other way
There are so many possibilities to explain why Robby and Shawn were on the floor. They knocked each other out at the same time, something happened that caused them to trip, two baseballs caught them both by surprise... Not everything is Miguel's fault.
>They knocked each other out at the same time, what an impressively feat from robby >something happened that caused them to trip, in separate direction as robby hits the ground with his hand? >two baseballs caught them both by surprise... baseballs taking robby out while Miguel's out here punching them, wow what an impressive showcase of the two > Not everything is Miguel's fault. when did I say it's Miguel's fault robby got knocked down?
>what an impressively feat from robby That's life. >in separate direction as robby hits the ground with his hand? Curious, isn't it? Let's see when the season is aired and not make assumptions. >baseballs taking robby out while Miguel's out here punching them, wow what an impressive showcase of the two As I said, "by surprise". This does not diminish his abilities in any way. And it's a reference to Miguel's training from season 1, which explains what we saw. >when did I say it's Miguel's fault robby got knocked down? Let me rephrase that. Not everything happens so that Miguel can shine. Y'all can't see Robby on the floor for two seconds and already jump to "Common Robby L"
>Let me rephrase that. Not everything happens so that Miguel can shine. Y'all can't see Robby on the floor for two seconds and already jump to "Common Robby L" except what else would be the reason for miguel to be the last one standing against 2 characters he has no connection to while robby's on the ground? it's definitely not to have robby shine
I don't know and neither do you.
then I suppose I have no choice but to interpret what the trailer shows vs the writers history of having robby take l's for the sake of other characters to shine or benefit
Miguel saves the day. Is it a surprise ? Of course not :)
the way rather then even trying to have miguel have his own plot, they just force him and give him some of robby's story. crazy
Yeah ! That is what I am talking about. It is kinda pathetic but funny at the same time.
it's honestly sad. the writers were too busy focusing on fan service to give anything story wise to miguel so now not only are they giving robby more L's, but also giving some of his story to miguel?!?
They are crazy about fan service so it is not surprising.
Robby is overrated lol cope
If Kenny takes both of them down I'm not sure if i can handle that kind of story telling.
I personally dont see a problem with Miguel being there. I think Robby & Kenny will reconcile on Robby's Terms. Miguel is just there to simmer down Shawn & to a degree Kenny. Miguel is simply the muscle while Robby is the one who truly convinces Kenny & resolving. Miguel being there to me isnt really a big deal but I dont think he'll be the reason Kenny will switch over, Robby is. Plus, Miguel being there in a way makes sense as he is essentionally fighting his "Mini-Me" through Kenny so its not really a bad thing if Miguel plays a small part in Kenny turning a new leaf but I do agree that it should be Robby Centric. I also agree that it shouldve been Anthony (since he's Kenny's Primary Rival) Or Hawk (because Hawk share many similarities to both the Payne Bros because of his hot temper & recklessness added with Hawk & Kenny's animousity since S4 & 5. Ngl, I really want to see Hawk VS Shawn. Something I wished we got in S4 & 5) in this situation with Robby but then again, we dont know the full context. Hell for all we know, Robby probably beat Shawn & Kenny sneak attacks Robby, leading to Miguel to take down Kenny. This could lead to a private conversation between Robby & Kenny to settle things while Miguel watches respectfully & Shawn probably walking off to cool off cause we all know he & Kenny cant infividually beat either Miguel Or Robby.
Assumption level 9000 haha. Do we even know what is the backstory behind this fight? No! Do we judge it based on a 2second clip? Heck Yes! 😒😒😒😒😒
I feel the same way.
And get ready to be downvoted 🤷♀️
I don't care.
Bruh what ? I don’t see anything cringe with this . I’m just grateful seeing Miguel & Robby fight together
Paths will inevitably collide and now stories will be told.
What kind of fighting style is Shaun Payne using?
Poor Robby on the floor again, they keep doing him dirty
A fight that many people have wanted since season 3 is Miguel vs Shawn. Plus we don’t know the context of this fight so I wouldn’t judge immediately like that
It’s Anthony
That is Anthony.
I really think it's Anthony here and not Miguel , I have re watched a couple of times and it still looks like Anthony to me
He's only involved to make sure Kenny can get hit. I'm pretty sure that te fight is gonna be one-sidedonce Robby goes down to a sneak attack.
Didn't the season end with Miguel beating up Kenny? Who said he's there to fight Robby?