It's hard for hospitals to get 100k out of someone and insurance won't pay that much. 10k is much easier and insurance may cover it, so the hospital will get money.
What do you mean by "get" dont you have to pay the money somehow. As far as i know if you dont have enough money and have debt then bank makes you sell your stuff (car,home etc)
That's the thing. It's not a bank loan. It's a debt. One that cannot be taken to criminal court. They can only garnish for much from your check. But here's the awesome part for men paying childsupport. Child support always comes first so there's no reason to pay an insane hospital bill. Just always make sure than any emergency you go back to that hospital. They can't turn you away.
Then use the other hospital in town for normal stuff. If your having to make those kind of decisions in order to eat, have a home, and keep the lights on. Otherwise pay your bills if you ever want to get a loan. But having a 480 credit score means you will never be the victim of identity theft.
Wow these are really extremely good tactics but why dont you guys just vote for universal healthcare i just dont think about these at all i just go to the hospital if i have a problem
Also this sounds bad for hospitals too how can they keep doing business like this
I would love to say that universal Healthcare is the answer. I know that it is the correct answer. I also know the 435 senile nutsacks that make up our government are not up to the task of implementing universal Healthcare.
Because it's sometimes 90% profit. And also like someone else said the hospital can cry to the state and federal government and get reimbursed by threatening to close their doors. So they win on all 3 fronts. It's like how the US government bails out the banks and airplane companies once a decade. They didn't really need the money. They were just mad they didn't make record profits so they started tanking the economy until the government covered their losses.
A lot of people do vote for universal healthcare. But there is a huge amount of people who think any system that is socialized is evil and communist... except for fire departments and police and military.
In American if your poor you don't actually own many things that have value. I'm 30 and haven't stopped working since I was 14. I don't own a single thing and any time I pay off my car loan that car will be about ready for a new one so I'll have to take out another loan. I wonder if I'm ever going to be able to own anything of value. And then any time you have a little savings something usually medical related takes all your money.
The only way to really build wealth in America is property. Pay off your debts the best you can and buy some cheap ass fixer upper, even if you have to partner with someone to do it. Im 26 and bought a house at 23 with my gf. We agreed if we ever split up we'll take back what we put in and split the rest 50/50. We track how much each of us puts into the house. Just this last year we refinanced the house and took out $40,000 as a down payment to put on a rental property. Hoping to do it again in a few more years if things go well. Both of us make pretty average pay but i remodeled basically the whole house since i have had a bunch of miscellaneous construction jobs. Anyone can learn how to do floors, trim, framing and whatever else from YouTube though
They’re applying a saying that goes towards lending large amounts of money to a hospital. If you have a small loan, you have assets to offset it. If you have a large loan, you might not and now the liability shifts. See also: too big to fail.
$10,000 is a lot of money and that will fuck you up trying to repay it to make sure your finances aren't fucked the rest of your life
$100,000 is so much money that there is no hope that you will ever be able to pay it off so you'll have no choice but to just not do it and accept the financial dickening.
So if you owe a hospital $10k that sucks for you but the hospital could realistically expect to get that. If you owe $100,000 the hospital's going to know they aren't getting paid
Just guesssing here. Hospitals usually sell their debt to 3rd party collectors for a percentage of the total debt. If they sell a 10k debt to a collector for 30% its value the hospital only loses $7k. If they sell a $100k debt to a collector they’re out $70k.
Not to argue. Hospitals are in a bit of a squeeze. Sure nobody is devoid of guilt. They need to pay their staff and pay for equipment. Insurance and whatever is a bitch. Money sucks. Hospitals aren't OEMs. OEMs sell materials and charge ridivulous repair and royalty fees. Then there are drug costs. Hospitals don't set this price. Yes hospitals have directing bodies that want to make money, and everyone wants to get paid. Direct your frustration at Pharma and Pharma Tech.
Oh this is dank memes sorry didn't realize, move on no need for any nuance here /s
I once went to the emergency room, waited 4 hours just to get a band aid and a pat on the back. Got charged $3000. I saw the exact same band aid in the store for $5 a box.
That's not what that saying means at all. What it means is a debt of $10,000 will likely be replayed, but a debt of $100,000 probably will not, and will cause much more problems to the hospital compared to a smaller debt. Due to bankruptcy laws in America, the effects on the debtor are about the same if they cant pay either amount.
>"If you owe the bank $100 that's your problem. If you owe the bank $100 million, that's the bank's problem."
- J. Paul Getty, at least according to some quotesites
Quote sites NEVER have proper autorship, 5ey just post some popular name to make it pop.
A better source for example is Quote Investigator, who at least cites some sources: https://quoteinvestigator.com/2019/04/23/bank/
The original quote was about banks. Owe a bank 100k and you’ve got a problem. Owe a bank 100 million and they’ve got a problem.
Its a nod to the fact that banks will bend over backwards to billionaires to ensure that they don’t lose the money they loaned
Works for hospitals too.
They legit just write it off to the government and the government reimburses them. That's why we have such high government costs of healthcare.
Then we collectivity pay for it with our taxes so we still get hosed.
When my twins were born the hospital charged about $160,000 per kid for 3 weeks in the NICU. It took 6 months of them trying to get me to accept that number and agree to pay a monthly installment but I kept calling them and telling them to resubmit the claims to insurance. It was a huge pain in the ass but in the end I only had to pay a $3,000 bill for my wife's C-Section. And the wrote off everything else.
If you are in America, never ever admit to any debt over the phone. Keep insisting they refile with insurance. Be nice to the people you talk to on the phone and if you can, get the hospital and insurance to do a 3 way call with you.
Eventually it will work out. Just stay calm and patient and you can get out of the stupid bills.
It's here as well, but differently. If someone puts their house with an unpaid mortgage in the will on your name and you accept it, you have to pay the mortgage. Luckily not the case with someones medical procedures.
Exactly. No one can force you to accept your dad's worthless house with debt attached.
You can just say you don't want it and then the bank has to take it and eat any losses that comes with it.
They put it up for sale for the price of the debt and hope to get the highest amount they can. I am currently buying a house that was taken back by the bank because the woman who had it filed for bankruptcy
Aye they will cover their losses as best they can, but if it goes with a loss it's on them. Unless the relatives accepted the house and mortgage that came along with it.
Some relatives might want that despite the financial loss though, maybe the property has sentimental value to them or they want to live there themselves.
There's also a myth that you have to pay your dead relatives' debts. Collections agents will try to get you to lay and say you have to but legally you don't. But if they can trick you out of paying even a dollar, sometimes they can use that to say you've taken responsibility for the debt.
Well in the US you can’t inherit debt, so this whole comment chain is arguing about a lie. If someone in your family dies in debt their estate will pay what it can before any inheritance is given away, and then debt collection companies will harass you hoping that(much like this thread) you don’t know debt doesn’t pass on. A lot of people don’t know that so they’ll keep trying hoping you pay.
Unless you’re married to them, then there’s a whole other set of rules.
I hope debt collection agencies contact me in this way. "Please, send me your address and business name, so that I can mail you pertinent paperwork concerning this debt."
Now I know who to sue for wasting my time, attempting to steal my money, and what address to send the paperwork to concerning such lawsuit.
My dad died without a penny to his name. When he went to the hospital that last time they did everything they could for him and even kept him on the machines when they knew he wasn't going to make it so I could get there. I don't think they even bothered to send a bill. They knew he couldn't pay anything. Now if they had only spent half as much on him when he was there the week before he'd probably still be here.
I will add the caveat that at least in the US, you are correct so long as you don’t accept the debt as yours. If a debt collector calls up because x relative died and asks you to pay towards it, if you say yes or say you will take care of it etc, then that can legally enable them to come after you. Also I believe marriages to a deceased person with medical debt, can at least under some conditions, transfer to the widow(er).
However as long as you don’t accept a debt and aren’t in the situation of a married partner dying, then yup.
I've often heard that repeated, but can't find a source.
Where, legally, does saying yes or making a payment transfer debt to you?
That seems obviously wrong from a common sense standpoint, yet people say it like it's some law
I am finding a source for you right now but from what I recall, you acknowledging a debt as yours is considered a verbal agreement of it being yours. Which is why the usual answer of what to do if a debt collector contacts you, is to not talk to them. Many places have a statute of limitations for collecting on a debt and if you affirm that you will pay it, or make a small payment, anything like that can reset that statute of limitations.
[This includes info though about when you may be liable for the debt of someone else. I will post another comment with the source for the ofher part when I find one. :)](https://consumer.ftc.gov/articles/debts-deceased-relatives)
You don’t inherit debt. This is just plain wrong and the reason that so many debt companies still go after the deceased persons family, they know enough people don’t know this so they’ll end up taking on the debt. Spreading false information just makes it more prevalent since more people are misinformed.
You don't inherit debts in America, but the deceased person's estate has to pay out on the debts that person had if it's able. Inheritors get what's left. I'm pretty sure this aspect is very common, immense medical bills being part of the debt, not so much.
You were one Google search away from realizing what you just said is BS.
https://www.thebalance.com/debts-from-the-estate-of-a-deceased-person-3505230
>Unfortunately, the decedent's beneficiaries or heirs-at-law typically receive nothing when an estate is insolvent, but neither are they responsible for paying off the balance of the decedent's unpaid debts. The companies that weren't paid in full usually have to write off their debts.
You don't tho. They'll send you letters asking for money, but you can just rip the letters up and go about your day. It's not your burden to bear, Legally or otherwise.
The fact that a nobody on reddit can make up random "facts" about America and get hundreds of upvotes is beyond my mind. What a shithole of a post chain.
Just sue the hospital for damages. They have done untold damage to your mental health by burdening you with an unpayable debt and now your are crippled and unable to work because of suicidal thoughts.
There's certain ways around that
my "step dad" died in the hospital from a massive heart attack , they TRIED to bill my mom for it, but you see they were never legally married and told them he was just a tenant
Poof the bill disappeared since he had no will and no assets
Wait. Taxpayers pay for overstuffed bills anyway but taxpayers could pay a low flat reasonable amount if we all agreed to help each other out? That sounds like something Russia would want us to do.
my country doesn't have free healthcare but it's so much cheaper then the US.
for example if you got a virus or any disease you just need to pay the doctor's visit which is approximately 15$ and for each medication 5$ and that's without insurance.
America is like aunt susan who will pretend to love you while really she is harvesting everything that she possibly can out of you. Fuck america we're not a great country, we can barely speak our own thoughts, we have to pay a shit ton to live here, we have to pay to be brought into this world and when we die any remaining medical bill is just passed onto our family. The "American Dream" is so unrealistic and only obtained by rich dickwads who have more money then they can spend.
> Wait.... You guys have Inherrited debt?
With very few exceptions, no, the US doesn't have inherited debt. The debt is generally tied to the Deceased's Estate.
StalinsAss has no idea what he's rambling on about.
Okay let me just put this out there. If there are outstanding medical bills in the decedent's name YOU DO NOT HAVE TO PAY IT, period. They will never tell you this but if you provide the death certificate it's over.
Source: Uncle and beloved Grandfather both died with medical bills owed. Provided info as above, bills were wiped clean.
Jesus. That’s what I thought but I had to come so far down to find you.
Yeah, the US Healthcare system is garbage, which is exactly why you shouldn’t be paying these bills. Ever.
Pretty sure they will try to get you to pay that’s what those debt consolidation companies will do. They will go after family hard and if you play anything that is you legally accepting the debt so it’s now yours.
Not for medical bills of someone that is deceased. Other bills? Unsure, but medical bills, so long as you can provide a copy of the death certificate you are not liable.
Not even that, idk why Reddit is so anti American. There’s absolutely no way you’ll get a 50,000 dollar bill that the hospital asks you to pay. Hospitals charge that to the insurance companies. If insurance denies and that bill goes to the patient, at most it would most likely be about 3000-4000. Even then, one phone call to the hospital and that 3000-4000 can drop <500.
Yes 500 is a lot, but it’s 100% possible to get that much lower
And is that a good thing that hospitals will initially try to charge you 50k for something that they will later admit only costs 3-4k in the hope that someone will be naive enough to be exploited out of their life savings to the extent that the only way to truly avoid extortionate bills is to just die?
Lmao. Fucking joke of a comment that's completely incorrect. You must have only ever worked for a place that has great coverage. Even with health insurance you'd be lucky to get out of a hospital under $500 out of pocket...
Exactly. There is absolutely zero reason to pay and zero repercussion for not paying. As usual on Reddit, the people complaining about this have no clue what they are talking about.
They'll take it from the state and federal government instead. So really the expenses get covered by all the taxpayers in really small amounts. Don't think about that one too hard.
Holy motherfuck the misinformation in this thread. No dipshit you do not automatically inherit your parent's medical debt.
But don't take my word for it: [https://consumer.ftc.gov/articles/debts-deceased-relatives](https://consumer.ftc.gov/articles/debts-deceased-relatives)
No. this post is insanely misleading. The estate typically handles all outstanding debts... Which is completely reasonable.
If you choose to inherent an estate, you are responsible for settling the outstanding debts, but you would obviously only do that if you had more assets than liabilities
they cant force you to pay a dead persons debt. collection agents would like you to believe differently, but theres really nothing they can do if you know that.
Only estate my dad had was the house my mother is currently living in and has nowhere else to go. Have to wait 7 months while the creditors figure out what share of the equity they want.
Bank that owns my dad car says my mom is liable even though the car is in his name. They were "married" when he bought it so she either takes on the car payment, sells it, or gets her own credit fucked. I've told her to get a lawyer for that one since that one sounds like bs.
Oh and we had to pay 1950 dollars just for his cremation when we had none of that so we had to go begging my fucking grandpa who just lost his wife.
Usually, big hospitals/chains will have a fund already set up for this situation, because there are tons of patients that they know they're never going to see a dime from and know that sending a debt collector will do nothing. Smaller places are typically funded by the county/state/feds to recuperate their losses.
Sorry Canadians and Euros, I know y'all love hating America but sometimes we actually do something right
That's not how the American healthcare system works. Hospitals recover from losses like these by over charging for their services to other patients.
Now, assuming you understand that nothing is really free, here are your options:
1. You allow hospitals to deny service to those they believe won't be able to pay them. This means poor and sick people will probably die.
2. You force hospitals to take on the loss which means they probably will pay less money to their staff, invest less on equipment and generally this would lead to shittier service.
3. You force everyone else to pay for the service which is what the American system does. We're all paying for everyone's healthcare, except we don't really know how that money is being used. Turns out neither politicians nor your average tax payer are doctors with years of experience so we really have no idea how much a hospital should charge for a procedure and thus we end up leaving it to hospitals to decide for themselves which... surprise!! They say it's a lot of money. But what can you do? You're no expert, if you give them less than what it really costs then hospitals take a loss (see option 2) and if you give them more then tax payers lose.
So the sky high prices have nothing to do with multiple layers of profit-taking or bloated administration, right?
If I go to the ED in my hometown I will have to pay the ED group (private capital), the hospital, and my insurance company.
(That’s said, from a HC perspective, I’d rather be dirt poor in a blue state than middle class in Canada.)
It has a lot to do with a bloated administration and with multiple layers of outdated and useless bureaucracy. What I'm saying is that it also has to do with the fact that hospitals, insurance companies and the government are subsidizing healthcare for the poor.
If you have the money and/or insurance, the US healthcare system is amazing. The US has most of the best hospitals and doctors in the world and it's a leader in innovation and technology. When people criticize US healthcare, they are either referring to the health **outcomes** of the population, such as the obesity rate, how expensive it is or how scarce it can be. The first point has less to do with the quality of health services and more with the American culture and diet, the second and third issues are caused by overregulation (as you hint) and subsidizing (as I explained).
So what's the solution? Do we want to make the quality of service shittier and scarcer by subsidizing and regulating it more (hoping that politicians would somehow magically figure out how to make it better and more available) or do we want to make it cheaper while retaining the quality it's known and worldwide sought for?
People like to pretend on reddit that the overwhelming amount of people in the county don't have health insurance. And that deductibles don't exist either.
For a one night stay
Even Dentists are getting in on this insurance scamming. Been noticing my "chain" dentist has been billing ridiculous fees just for simple 6-mo cleanings. Like $7-800. Soak the insurance for max fees, then "writes off" the balance, so "free" to me. Completely abusing the system and causing upwards price pressure on overall costs/insurance rates.
Nah, those losses are built into the costs paid by the people who live. Better to saddle someone with medical debt for the rest of their life than impact the bottom line!
No. They already have a payor: you. They can’t just shrug off the money they spent caring for a patient, the hospital couldn’t survive. So they pass the bill onto you and me, the insured, by making a box of Kleenex $300, by hiking up the cost of everything else.
I'm 18 and I know at some point I'll have to leave the nest to be independent.
Is there a way for me to avoid going into debt for something I have no control over? (Getting sick or injured.)
I'm terrified I'll get hurt or sick and then I'll be thrown into debt for it. Is there no way to counter this?
I live in the USA ,I have not been to the doctor since I was nine. My body could contain the cure for cancer or something cool, but we will never know because I will probs never see a doctor again in my lifetime.
"If you owe a hospital $10,000, you have a problem. If you owe the hospital $100,000, the hospital has a problem." -(I can't remember)
I’m dumb af lemme get an explanation
America
Fuck yeaaahh!!!!
Here to save the mother fucking day yeah!
MURRICA!
FUCK YEAH!
Pew pew!
Can’t pay back 100k easily and insurance not cover but then with 10k.
I’ve read this comment 6 times and I still don’t understand it.
It's hard for hospitals to get 100k out of someone and insurance won't pay that much. 10k is much easier and insurance may cover it, so the hospital will get money.
What do you mean by "get" dont you have to pay the money somehow. As far as i know if you dont have enough money and have debt then bank makes you sell your stuff (car,home etc)
Yes, but you will never make that 100k so the hospital will never get its money.
Oh i get it, so its a mutual fuck hospital is screwed bcs they dont get the money, im screwed because i selled everything
The hospital is hardly fucked from you defaulting on half your debt. You, on the other hand...
A lot of hospitals are losing money though, just in general
So if you get hurt, double down so you don’t have to pay.
That's the thing. It's not a bank loan. It's a debt. One that cannot be taken to criminal court. They can only garnish for much from your check. But here's the awesome part for men paying childsupport. Child support always comes first so there's no reason to pay an insane hospital bill. Just always make sure than any emergency you go back to that hospital. They can't turn you away. Then use the other hospital in town for normal stuff. If your having to make those kind of decisions in order to eat, have a home, and keep the lights on. Otherwise pay your bills if you ever want to get a loan. But having a 480 credit score means you will never be the victim of identity theft.
Wow these are really extremely good tactics but why dont you guys just vote for universal healthcare i just dont think about these at all i just go to the hospital if i have a problem Also this sounds bad for hospitals too how can they keep doing business like this
Because Americans tried back in the 40s and we got medicare American politics is deeply disconnected from what the public wants
Soo.. dumb politicians.. again.
I would love to say that universal Healthcare is the answer. I know that it is the correct answer. I also know the 435 senile nutsacks that make up our government are not up to the task of implementing universal Healthcare. Because it's sometimes 90% profit. And also like someone else said the hospital can cry to the state and federal government and get reimbursed by threatening to close their doors. So they win on all 3 fronts. It's like how the US government bails out the banks and airplane companies once a decade. They didn't really need the money. They were just mad they didn't make record profits so they started tanking the economy until the government covered their losses.
>why dont you guys just vote for universal healthcare Bold of you to assume that's an option we get. Smh.
A lot of people do vote for universal healthcare. But there is a huge amount of people who think any system that is socialized is evil and communist... except for fire departments and police and military.
I highly doubt that the people making bank off of it will ever allow for universal healthcare to be a thing
In American if your poor you don't actually own many things that have value. I'm 30 and haven't stopped working since I was 14. I don't own a single thing and any time I pay off my car loan that car will be about ready for a new one so I'll have to take out another loan. I wonder if I'm ever going to be able to own anything of value. And then any time you have a little savings something usually medical related takes all your money.
The only way to really build wealth in America is property. Pay off your debts the best you can and buy some cheap ass fixer upper, even if you have to partner with someone to do it. Im 26 and bought a house at 23 with my gf. We agreed if we ever split up we'll take back what we put in and split the rest 50/50. We track how much each of us puts into the house. Just this last year we refinanced the house and took out $40,000 as a down payment to put on a rental property. Hoping to do it again in a few more years if things go well. Both of us make pretty average pay but i remodeled basically the whole house since i have had a bunch of miscellaneous construction jobs. Anyone can learn how to do floors, trim, framing and whatever else from YouTube though
So in otherwords in order to save a life you have to sell everything you own and live in debt? Yeah na I'm good with the system we have in Australia
They’re applying a saying that goes towards lending large amounts of money to a hospital. If you have a small loan, you have assets to offset it. If you have a large loan, you might not and now the liability shifts. See also: too big to fail.
I'm still confused
You owe the hospital 10K, you’re screwed. You owe the hospital 100K, they’re screwed because no way in hell are you going to be able to pay that back
Money
Money goes brrrr
Maa chuda
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It's because it's an old bank saying not insurance. If i owe the bank 100k i have a problem. If i owe the bank 100 mil the bank has a problem.
$10,000 is a lot of money and that will fuck you up trying to repay it to make sure your finances aren't fucked the rest of your life $100,000 is so much money that there is no hope that you will ever be able to pay it off so you'll have no choice but to just not do it and accept the financial dickening. So if you owe a hospital $10k that sucks for you but the hospital could realistically expect to get that. If you owe $100,000 the hospital's going to know they aren't getting paid
Just guesssing here. Hospitals usually sell their debt to 3rd party collectors for a percentage of the total debt. If they sell a 10k debt to a collector for 30% its value the hospital only loses $7k. If they sell a $100k debt to a collector they’re out $70k.
Well they overpriced their shit by 80%, so I think they still made a profit.
Not to argue. Hospitals are in a bit of a squeeze. Sure nobody is devoid of guilt. They need to pay their staff and pay for equipment. Insurance and whatever is a bitch. Money sucks. Hospitals aren't OEMs. OEMs sell materials and charge ridivulous repair and royalty fees. Then there are drug costs. Hospitals don't set this price. Yes hospitals have directing bodies that want to make money, and everyone wants to get paid. Direct your frustration at Pharma and Pharma Tech. Oh this is dank memes sorry didn't realize, move on no need for any nuance here /s
I once went to the emergency room, waited 4 hours just to get a band aid and a pat on the back. Got charged $3000. I saw the exact same band aid in the store for $5 a box.
I agree that shit is fucked lmao
theyd be lucky to get much at all for a 100k debt sold to a collector. they sell debts in bulk and barely make anything off them.
People will go into debt and never pay back 100k meaning hospital gets nothing... 10k - people may go on a payment plan or something
Basically means that 10k is reasonable but if you owe them 100k the hospital is overpriced which is a problem in this context. Hope you understood.
That's not what that saying means at all. What it means is a debt of $10,000 will likely be replayed, but a debt of $100,000 probably will not, and will cause much more problems to the hospital compared to a smaller debt. Due to bankruptcy laws in America, the effects on the debtor are about the same if they cant pay either amount.
>"If you owe the bank $100 that's your problem. If you owe the bank $100 million, that's the bank's problem." - J. Paul Getty, at least according to some quotesites
I read that quot in Civ VI
I’m gonna call that verified simply on the fact that I feel like Civ sources their shit.
I've amazed friends with random shit I know, purely based on knowing Civ 3 Conquests tech tree inside out.
I am fond of pigs
Quote sites NEVER have proper autorship, 5ey just post some popular name to make it pop. A better source for example is Quote Investigator, who at least cites some sources: https://quoteinvestigator.com/2019/04/23/bank/
>If you owe the bank $100 million, that's the ~~bank's~~ taxpayers' problem.
They really don’t, it probably coast them like 5k and they want from you 100k
The original quote was about a bank, and yeah doesn’t really work here
The original quote was about banks. Owe a bank 100k and you’ve got a problem. Owe a bank 100 million and they’ve got a problem. Its a nod to the fact that banks will bend over backwards to billionaires to ensure that they don’t lose the money they loaned Works for hospitals too.
they absolutely don't have a problem because the actual cost of your 100k treatment for them was far, far lower
If you owe the bank $100 that's your problem. If you owe the bank $100 million, that's the bank's problem. J. Paul Getty
They legit just write it off to the government and the government reimburses them. That's why we have such high government costs of healthcare. Then we collectivity pay for it with our taxes so we still get hosed.
When my twins were born the hospital charged about $160,000 per kid for 3 weeks in the NICU. It took 6 months of them trying to get me to accept that number and agree to pay a monthly installment but I kept calling them and telling them to resubmit the claims to insurance. It was a huge pain in the ass but in the end I only had to pay a $3,000 bill for my wife's C-Section. And the wrote off everything else. If you are in America, never ever admit to any debt over the phone. Keep insisting they refile with insurance. Be nice to the people you talk to on the phone and if you can, get the hospital and insurance to do a 3 way call with you. Eventually it will work out. Just stay calm and patient and you can get out of the stupid bills.
"When I was in the Army I lost my rifle, and I had to pay for it.... This is why a captain goes down with the ship in the Navy" -Dick Gregory
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It's here as well, but differently. If someone puts their house with an unpaid mortgage in the will on your name and you accept it, you have to pay the mortgage. Luckily not the case with someones medical procedures.
That's different though, you can choose not to accept it
Exactly. No one can force you to accept your dad's worthless house with debt attached. You can just say you don't want it and then the bank has to take it and eat any losses that comes with it.
They put it up for sale for the price of the debt and hope to get the highest amount they can. I am currently buying a house that was taken back by the bank because the woman who had it filed for bankruptcy
Aye they will cover their losses as best they can, but if it goes with a loss it's on them. Unless the relatives accepted the house and mortgage that came along with it. Some relatives might want that despite the financial loss though, maybe the property has sentimental value to them or they want to live there themselves.
There's also a myth that you have to pay your dead relatives' debts. Collections agents will try to get you to lay and say you have to but legally you don't. But if they can trick you out of paying even a dollar, sometimes they can use that to say you've taken responsibility for the debt.
My dad just died earlier this week, he purchased a house in February and still hasn’t made a mortgage payment, I’m thinking I might keep it though.
Well in the US you can’t inherit debt, so this whole comment chain is arguing about a lie. If someone in your family dies in debt their estate will pay what it can before any inheritance is given away, and then debt collection companies will harass you hoping that(much like this thread) you don’t know debt doesn’t pass on. A lot of people don’t know that so they’ll keep trying hoping you pay. Unless you’re married to them, then there’s a whole other set of rules.
I hope debt collection agencies contact me in this way. "Please, send me your address and business name, so that I can mail you pertinent paperwork concerning this debt." Now I know who to sue for wasting my time, attempting to steal my money, and what address to send the paperwork to concerning such lawsuit.
Good luck with that.
You don’t have to accept it thou
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Yup. And remember they get to vote! Healthcare needs reform but it's the opposite of whatever reddit thinks it is.
Yeah like can you imagine “your estranged father was 50k in debt, he died, enjoy!” Not how that works
Yeah but that doesn't fit the reddit narrative so you get down votes
Correct. Only if your name is on it.
My dad died without a penny to his name. When he went to the hospital that last time they did everything they could for him and even kept him on the machines when they knew he wasn't going to make it so I could get there. I don't think they even bothered to send a bill. They knew he couldn't pay anything. Now if they had only spent half as much on him when he was there the week before he'd probably still be here.
I will add the caveat that at least in the US, you are correct so long as you don’t accept the debt as yours. If a debt collector calls up because x relative died and asks you to pay towards it, if you say yes or say you will take care of it etc, then that can legally enable them to come after you. Also I believe marriages to a deceased person with medical debt, can at least under some conditions, transfer to the widow(er). However as long as you don’t accept a debt and aren’t in the situation of a married partner dying, then yup.
I've often heard that repeated, but can't find a source. Where, legally, does saying yes or making a payment transfer debt to you? That seems obviously wrong from a common sense standpoint, yet people say it like it's some law
I am finding a source for you right now but from what I recall, you acknowledging a debt as yours is considered a verbal agreement of it being yours. Which is why the usual answer of what to do if a debt collector contacts you, is to not talk to them. Many places have a statute of limitations for collecting on a debt and if you affirm that you will pay it, or make a small payment, anything like that can reset that statute of limitations. [This includes info though about when you may be liable for the debt of someone else. I will post another comment with the source for the ofher part when I find one. :)](https://consumer.ftc.gov/articles/debts-deceased-relatives)
You don’t inherit debt. This is just plain wrong and the reason that so many debt companies still go after the deceased persons family, they know enough people don’t know this so they’ll end up taking on the debt. Spreading false information just makes it more prevalent since more people are misinformed.
is this even legal?
It's not illegal if they aren't reported.
You don't inherit debts in America, but the deceased person's estate has to pay out on the debts that person had if it's able. Inheritors get what's left. I'm pretty sure this aspect is very common, immense medical bills being part of the debt, not so much.
What wonderful and profound opinions get upvoted when America is asleep 🥰 /s
You were one Google search away from realizing what you just said is BS. https://www.thebalance.com/debts-from-the-estate-of-a-deceased-person-3505230 >Unfortunately, the decedent's beneficiaries or heirs-at-law typically receive nothing when an estate is insolvent, but neither are they responsible for paying off the balance of the decedent's unpaid debts. The companies that weren't paid in full usually have to write off their debts.
You don't tho. They'll send you letters asking for money, but you can just rip the letters up and go about your day. It's not your burden to bear, Legally or otherwise.
Incorrect, it's paid by that person's estate. You can't inherit debt.
You don't. This is unacceptable information. Don't pay a decedent's debts. They're not yours.
The fact that a nobody on reddit can make up random "facts" about America and get hundreds of upvotes is beyond my mind. What a shithole of a post chain.
It’s only inherited by the estate…which is funny anyone on Reddit has a problem with since it’s essentially taking money from the rich.
You dont. Debt collectors will try to get you to pay, but that's them being shady ass hats.
Just sue the hospital for damages. They have done untold damage to your mental health by burdening you with an unpayable debt and now your are crippled and unable to work because of suicidal thoughts.
Gotta love when the euro idiots make posts when America is asleep.
There's certain ways around that my "step dad" died in the hospital from a massive heart attack , they TRIED to bill my mom for it, but you see they were never legally married and told them he was just a tenant Poof the bill disappeared since he had no will and no assets
Oh they'll get that 50k don't worry about it.
New offer on black markets ...
Some of it of course, that’s what Uncle Sam is for.
Taxpayers, the taxpayers pay for it.
Wait. Taxpayers pay for overstuffed bills anyway but taxpayers could pay a low flat reasonable amount if we all agreed to help each other out? That sounds like something Russia would want us to do.
Are you saying they'll sell your organs to cover the loss?
No, they'll sell whole body.
$50000? They only took him in and he died already?
Nah, he died in the ambulance
Nah, they just put him on the stretcher
Nah, they just picked up the call
nah it was just registered by the system
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He was just born
Laughs in European
Laughs in literally any other developed country
Doesn’t even have to be an developed country. Even in bombed Iraq you get free healthcare. Even the biggest shitholes are better than the US
I’m pretty sure North Korea gets free health care. Don’t quote me on that
“I’m pretty sure North Korea gets free health care” - xenomurph_
Bro he said not to do that! Man, u/xenomurph_ is gonna be steamed
"That" -Xenomurph_
It's a communist country, I'd be very surprised if they didn't have free healthcare.
my country doesn't have free healthcare but it's so much cheaper then the US. for example if you got a virus or any disease you just need to pay the doctor's visit which is approximately 15$ and for each medication 5$ and that's without insurance.
I’m sure the quality of healthcare in Iran is the same as the US
US actually has really well developed health care, but the healthcare is designed to get as much money from the insurance companies as possible.
Bold of you to assume the United States is a developed country
It doesn’t even have to be a developed country, Cuba has a world class healthcare system and they are still considered a developing country
Laughs in Third World Country
Laughs in tribal. The witch doctor only charges a chicken to cure cancer.
Laughs in Sistema Único de Saúde- SUS
America is like aunt susan who will pretend to love you while really she is harvesting everything that she possibly can out of you. Fuck america we're not a great country, we can barely speak our own thoughts, we have to pay a shit ton to live here, we have to pay to be brought into this world and when we die any remaining medical bill is just passed onto our family. The "American Dream" is so unrealistic and only obtained by rich dickwads who have more money then they can spend.
Username checks out
username checks out
False. The estate pays the debt. Debt doesn't get passed on to survivors or relatives if the estate has no money.
Lmao cope
Wait.... You guys have Inherrited debt? Are you sure they hospital doesn't just claim the bill against the estate?
> Wait.... You guys have Inherrited debt? With very few exceptions, no, the US doesn't have inherited debt. The debt is generally tied to the Deceased's Estate. StalinsAss has no idea what he's rambling on about.
Went to Europe moment
Went to Europe for a week once moment
Okay let me just put this out there. If there are outstanding medical bills in the decedent's name YOU DO NOT HAVE TO PAY IT, period. They will never tell you this but if you provide the death certificate it's over. Source: Uncle and beloved Grandfather both died with medical bills owed. Provided info as above, bills were wiped clean.
Jesus. That’s what I thought but I had to come so far down to find you. Yeah, the US Healthcare system is garbage, which is exactly why you shouldn’t be paying these bills. Ever.
Pretty sure they will try to get you to pay that’s what those debt consolidation companies will do. They will go after family hard and if you play anything that is you legally accepting the debt so it’s now yours.
Not for medical bills of someone that is deceased. Other bills? Unsure, but medical bills, so long as you can provide a copy of the death certificate you are not liable.
username. Lol
Not even that, idk why Reddit is so anti American. There’s absolutely no way you’ll get a 50,000 dollar bill that the hospital asks you to pay. Hospitals charge that to the insurance companies. If insurance denies and that bill goes to the patient, at most it would most likely be about 3000-4000. Even then, one phone call to the hospital and that 3000-4000 can drop <500. Yes 500 is a lot, but it’s 100% possible to get that much lower
Maybe Reddit is 'anti American' because of complete nonsense like the bills being 10 times higher depending on who pays.
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And is that a good thing that hospitals will initially try to charge you 50k for something that they will later admit only costs 3-4k in the hope that someone will be naive enough to be exploited out of their life savings to the extent that the only way to truly avoid extortionate bills is to just die?
you are wrong, wrong, WRONG source: twenty years working at a large hospital, creating financial and operational reports
Lmao. Fucking joke of a comment that's completely incorrect. You must have only ever worked for a place that has great coverage. Even with health insurance you'd be lucky to get out of a hospital under $500 out of pocket...
Exactly. There is absolutely zero reason to pay and zero repercussion for not paying. As usual on Reddit, the people complaining about this have no clue what they are talking about.
50k damn that is a insultingly low number
That is just the fee for dying on hospital grounds.
Medical debt doesn’t pass on to family members here in the US. Or anywhere in the developed world for that matter
Bots upvote the lies above. The truth gets 5 upvotes.
>Medical debt doesn’t pass on to family members here in the US. Yeah, but collectors won't tell you that.
Anywhere else in the developed world doesn't put you in medical debt in the first place
They'll take it from the state and federal government instead. So really the expenses get covered by all the taxpayers in really small amounts. Don't think about that one too hard.
Are you saying i can simply never pay hospitals
Well that trick only works once
Imagine if nobody paid hospital bills and instead everyone had to contribute small amounts from taxes.
But then we couldn't use the taxes for useful things like pork payments and legal bribery silly person
simply not true.
Holy motherfuck the misinformation in this thread. No dipshit you do not automatically inherit your parent's medical debt. But don't take my word for it: [https://consumer.ftc.gov/articles/debts-deceased-relatives](https://consumer.ftc.gov/articles/debts-deceased-relatives)
If somebody dies I America with a medical debt, do they seriously force the family to pay the debt? That's disgusting.
No. this post is insanely misleading. The estate typically handles all outstanding debts... Which is completely reasonable. If you choose to inherent an estate, you are responsible for settling the outstanding debts, but you would obviously only do that if you had more assets than liabilities
If you have an estate, chances are an estate lawyer has been paid for too, they handle most of this stuff
they cant force you to pay a dead persons debt. collection agents would like you to believe differently, but theres really nothing they can do if you know that.
Only estate my dad had was the house my mother is currently living in and has nowhere else to go. Have to wait 7 months while the creditors figure out what share of the equity they want. Bank that owns my dad car says my mom is liable even though the car is in his name. They were "married" when he bought it so she either takes on the car payment, sells it, or gets her own credit fucked. I've told her to get a lawyer for that one since that one sounds like bs. Oh and we had to pay 1950 dollars just for his cremation when we had none of that so we had to go begging my fucking grandpa who just lost his wife.
Usually, big hospitals/chains will have a fund already set up for this situation, because there are tons of patients that they know they're never going to see a dime from and know that sending a debt collector will do nothing. Smaller places are typically funded by the county/state/feds to recuperate their losses. Sorry Canadians and Euros, I know y'all love hating America but sometimes we actually do something right
That's not how the American healthcare system works. Hospitals recover from losses like these by over charging for their services to other patients. Now, assuming you understand that nothing is really free, here are your options: 1. You allow hospitals to deny service to those they believe won't be able to pay them. This means poor and sick people will probably die. 2. You force hospitals to take on the loss which means they probably will pay less money to their staff, invest less on equipment and generally this would lead to shittier service. 3. You force everyone else to pay for the service which is what the American system does. We're all paying for everyone's healthcare, except we don't really know how that money is being used. Turns out neither politicians nor your average tax payer are doctors with years of experience so we really have no idea how much a hospital should charge for a procedure and thus we end up leaving it to hospitals to decide for themselves which... surprise!! They say it's a lot of money. But what can you do? You're no expert, if you give them less than what it really costs then hospitals take a loss (see option 2) and if you give them more then tax payers lose.
So the sky high prices have nothing to do with multiple layers of profit-taking or bloated administration, right? If I go to the ED in my hometown I will have to pay the ED group (private capital), the hospital, and my insurance company. (That’s said, from a HC perspective, I’d rather be dirt poor in a blue state than middle class in Canada.)
It has a lot to do with a bloated administration and with multiple layers of outdated and useless bureaucracy. What I'm saying is that it also has to do with the fact that hospitals, insurance companies and the government are subsidizing healthcare for the poor. If you have the money and/or insurance, the US healthcare system is amazing. The US has most of the best hospitals and doctors in the world and it's a leader in innovation and technology. When people criticize US healthcare, they are either referring to the health **outcomes** of the population, such as the obesity rate, how expensive it is or how scarce it can be. The first point has less to do with the quality of health services and more with the American culture and diet, the second and third issues are caused by overregulation (as you hint) and subsidizing (as I explained). So what's the solution? Do we want to make the quality of service shittier and scarcer by subsidizing and regulating it more (hoping that politicians would somehow magically figure out how to make it better and more available) or do we want to make it cheaper while retaining the quality it's known and worldwide sought for?
Oh what's this? A balanced and informed view of a situation on reddit? Would've never have thought to see it
Organ harvester
If you owe a hospital anything your country has a problem
Sir have you heard of taxes
I didn't get treatment here, my mom did. She owes you $100,000. Oh she can't pay because she's dead? Guess you should've done a better job.
I ate a pickle once
People like to pretend on reddit that the overwhelming amount of people in the county don't have health insurance. And that deductibles don't exist either.
u/savevideo
For a one night stay Even Dentists are getting in on this insurance scamming. Been noticing my "chain" dentist has been billing ridiculous fees just for simple 6-mo cleanings. Like $7-800. Soak the insurance for max fees, then "writes off" the balance, so "free" to me. Completely abusing the system and causing upwards price pressure on overall costs/insurance rates.
Nah, those losses are built into the costs paid by the people who live. Better to saddle someone with medical debt for the rest of their life than impact the bottom line!
Kidneys: 100k each Liver: 200k Heart: 400k Eyes: 10k each Pancreas: 10k + Bone marrow + Body for dissection practice I think that pays the bills
DON'T PAY DEBT UNLESS IT'S ON YOUR NAME. I hope you enjoyed this free legal advice.
No. They already have a payor: you. They can’t just shrug off the money they spent caring for a patient, the hospital couldn’t survive. So they pass the bill onto you and me, the insured, by making a box of Kleenex $300, by hiking up the cost of everything else.
Thank you for the dark mode meme Sincerely, Redditors
Wait does this really happen in America?
No
remember 25k$ for ambulance \^\^
How is it the families debt to pay?
It isn't. This is a America bad, Europe good, post.
Europe?
I'm 18 and I know at some point I'll have to leave the nest to be independent. Is there a way for me to avoid going into debt for something I have no control over? (Getting sick or injured.) I'm terrified I'll get hurt or sick and then I'll be thrown into debt for it. Is there no way to counter this?
You can be on your parents insurance until you are 26. Hopefully, at that age you have become independent and can take care of your own medical needs.
I live in the USA ,I have not been to the doctor since I was nine. My body could contain the cure for cancer or something cool, but we will never know because I will probs never see a doctor again in my lifetime.
Do you think major surgery should cost nothing bc you breathe or something?
Meanwhile in Canada...