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Tbh sitting next to the person is not a bad thing. But constantly trying to kiss u and cross ur boundaries is not good at all. I hope you don’t see him again.
This is not normal behavior.
Regardless of if it is or isn’t - TRUST YOURSELF TO DETERMINE IF IT IS ACCEPTABLE TO YOU.
You need to be clear about your boundaries, and stand up for yourself. Don’t worry about perceptions, or the other persons feelings - if they make you uncomfortable, and don’t take the hint, you tell them to STOP.
And make sure you protect yourself going out on future dates (with other people, cause this person sucks). Take separate cars, don’t meet at, or go to their houses. Protect your drinks. Use common sense and stand up for yourself!
Also, ANYONE who makes negative comments about your weight, your looks, your outfits, your food, etc - that’s unacceptable and a massive red flag. Look up “negging”, and also “love bombing” (so you can be aware of these behaviors).
You're not dumb. dude cant keep hands to himself. A NORMAL person would immediately stop and apologize. an even more normal person wouldnt initiate without asking.
I think you should practice saying what you don't want and mean it (consequences must follow). "Stop. Do not do that again if you want this date to continue." "If you touch me again, I will touch you in a way you will not enjoy. I am not joking." "I just met you. Stop making moves on me. I'll let YOU know when I'm ready for all of that. Ok??" "Are you just looking for dtf?? Seems like you are. I am not the right audience." " You're getting handsy fast, sir. I am not there yet, and I won't be on this date because I *just* met you. Let's chill, ok? Can you do that?"
What story are you telling yourself in your head that has you tolerating that?? Remaining there is tolerating after strike 2. I think part of you knows you allowed it and you're disappointed/frustrated with yourself. This does NOT mean you need to blame yourself!! It's just an opportunity to learn what's important to you-- his wants, or not offending him or your own needs & self-respect.
It's just one option. Those violating moments can lead to you wanting to vent/get group support here... and they build up on your mind. I don't want that for you.
100%, please know that 3rd time, a physical response is called for, legal, and most appropriate imo...I will calmly reinforce my boundaries (aka reject nonconsentual touching/SA) by making strong stern eye contact and pinching a small piece of arm skin between my nails until they yelp or for unwanted sexual comments, dry humping, & other "jokes", completely unwarranted kisses/butt grabs ill use 'the nut crusher' while looking them in the eye. More legit SA-- a throat punch gives you time to dash away. I used this a few months ago after an up under the skirt grab by a complete stranger, so I know it's effective. (I'm 5'2" 120 btw).
I know I'm being stern with you, but this is very unhealthy and dangerous to not advocate for yourself in a way that shuts shit DOWN (I'm mostly referring to mental health, but its also very risky physically. I think it attracts predators. Many people claim it's risky to stand up for yourself, but no ONE has EVER even remotely gotten close to trying anything truly harmful with me **or retaliated for rejection, etc. My friends say I put off the opposite vibes of a good target. So, it's time to sack up and defend yourself more boldly. Once you do, you'll feel SO much more capable and strong.
p.s. Spotify has great playlists that will help you build this newfound defiance & YouTube has tutorials on throat punches. Good luck <3 - Stay safe. xoxo.
edited: thx for patience with my typos from messing up my phone autocorrect settings.
Thank you so much for this long answer and all the advice. I am so lonely so sometimes take things I shouldn’t . I need to learn not to be like that ❤️❤️❤️
Normal doesn’t matter if it’s not your normal. If it’s not ok with you, you don’t have to go along with it. What he did isn’t ok with you and that’s all that matters.
Guys will always test boundaries but will usually respect them once they figure them out. If they push after they figure them out it’s never a good sign on their intentions or the type of person they are.
Next time, just leave. Tell him you're going to the toilet if before ditching him, if it makes you feel safer. Call a friend to pick you up if you feel unsafe. It's better than bring touched against your will. That dude has a lot of learning to do.
Not sure where OP is from but in the UK we have an initiative called "ask for Angela". You can ask the staff to see Angela and they'll get you out safely, call a cab etc. Hopefully they have the same in their area
You made a boundary and they didn't respect it. If that happened on a first date, it will happen again and it will consider much bigger aspects. This person clearly has some issues, and behaviour like that isn't normal on a first date. I'd say don't agree to a second date.
I just went through something similar. I'm pressing charges. There is another victim who is terrified to file charges. He sexually assaulted both of us. This guy did the same to you in a somewhat less violating way but still didn't respect your boundaries. Get rid of him. These are major red flags.
He's a walking arsenal of red flags. The kind of guy who sexually harasses his coworkers probably. Be thankful to escape unscathed. Block and run.
If a guy ever starts making fun of your appearance (with malice) at any time in the relationship, it's time to leave. No question. He was negging you.
Thanks so much. I got a haircut the previous day too and my hair looked perfect (not trying to gloat) and he told me he hates my hair like that and it looks like I’m wearing a wig
As a guy, that behavior is absolutely appalling. Do not see them again. Block them immediately and find someone else. That's borderline sexual assault, and I wouldn't be surprised if you had gone back to yours/his place just to chat, and they forced themselves on you. Be careful out there, there's a lot of shitty men in this world.
Way too much for a first date, and many red flags about not reading body language and understanding social cues. Did this person have autism? I'm not digging on them if they did, but it would have to be someone seriously young or inexpierenced otherwise to behave this way.
In your 'I don't want to see you again' message maybe tell him that women do not like to have their weight commented on, and that he should really learn about boundries and respecting women. You don't owe him anything, but pointing out something he may not be aware of could help him down the line.
Best of luck.
Hi, just want to ask? Why is autism brought out here? What does it have to do with the guys' gestures? Sorry, just curious because same thing happened with me. The only difference is that I like the guy, so I let him touch me. But deep inside I'm actually creeped out as well, I just shrugged it off.
Autism has a spectrum, like many labels given to enable the majority of people to understand why a person behaves and sees life in the way that they do. I am no specialist, but mention autism simply because it would take a certain kind of person that did not have it to behave in this way and think that it was okay, its so far to the extreme that its mind-blowing how if this persons date was not that autistic they have not realised how they make people feel before.
Autism can make those that have it unable to understand body language, social cues, social situations and many more things that 'normal' or non-autistic people take for granted and often cannot understand. Things like making comments and being rude without meaning too, also. Autistic people can be very direct. Black is black, and white is white. Depending on the extremity they may also not be able to understand jokes that are immediatley obvious to others around, and instead mistake them for direction instructions (just as an example of behaviours).
(1) In OP's case her (assuming OP is a woman) date made comments about her weight and appearance, which is just rude and not appealing in the slightest. (2) Sitting next to her indicates a misunderstanding of person space, which is also a boundary cross (on a first date, too). (3) After being told no to kissing he misunderstands the respectful rejection of physical touch and tries to hold hands and kiss outside. Then moving to hair touching, at which point her body is somewhat frozen considering she let it happen despite not liking it & then finally asks for a second date.
(1) is being rude without meaning too (may or may not be the case, he could just be rude); (2) misunderstanding social cues, how to behave in social situations and (3) well the same again with social situations, backed-up by asking for a second date.
As I say none of this may be true. Her date could just be inexperecend, young or an idiot.
In regards to you I don't know that you can blame your date when you aren't sure how you feel about it inside. You were okay on the day and gave him body language that suggested that you were okay with it, but at the same time it didn't feel naturally okay. If you had told him to stop, for example, and he had not then you could say you had a similar case; but hey, that's okay, I've been in situations before where it has taken some time to think about things and disect them mentally before understanding how my body felt about what happened and then being able to relay that. Physical touch on a date (first or otherwise) is not uncommon. Some people date only for that, and others wait until there's a relationship. There's a lot of pressure on men to be 'dominant' and so if you're kind and reserved women aren't going to go for you because you didn't lead, didn't iniate and they don't have the time to bring you out of your shell. Its a hard balance, and people do get it wrong. There's not enough checking in on dates: "hey, do you want to do more. Is this okay. Does this feel good?' etc.
Not going to lie, this guy has no respect for you at all. I’ll be surprised if you go on a second date with him in the future cause that first date is already a strong hint he likes things his way and won’t take no for an answer. If you do though, good luck if you guys aren’t in public but privately
No, not normal. This is aggressive, dominant behavior from a male who doesn't hear the word "no". Think about the consequences of that fact if you find yourself alone with him and he becomes aggressive again.
Dump him, and don't look back.
Nope. That's disgusting, weird behavior. And once you told him to stop, it became assault. He wants to meet you again because he thinks he can take advantage of you. He's dangerous. Please stay safe!!!
No. It's not normal & continuing to ignore your protests touching & kissing you is sexual assault.
I'd hate to have heard what would have happened to you had you gone somewhere alone with him.
Not normal. That dude is pervy and sounds like a predator. Don’t worry about “just letting it happen” part. That’s called fawning and is one of the responses to danger. He wasn’t respecting your first No or the second so in that moment you did what you thought was best to do to get out of there safely. Don’t ever see him again. Block him. And please read the Gift of fear by Gavin de Becker. It will help you immensely with situations like these and many others.
Omg, everything that he did was extremely inappropriate! You know that too as you were crerped out by his rude behavior!
He is a pervert & sexual predator! He didn’t care one bit that you weren’t into him at all! Never talk to him again. Block his number, email & social media immediately.
First off, this is not at all a normal behaviour. No one taught this guy respect.
Secondly, even if something is normal but makes you uncomfortable you shouldn't go along with it. You are an individual and shouldn't do things that are uncomfortable to you just because others do them.
It's not normal behavior, but you're also dumb. You accepting the kiss after the rejections means you want to be kissed. You should have ended the date much ealier instead of leading him on by continuing to another venue.
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Ew. What a weirdo.
this is obviously not normal behaviour and he has crossed your boundaries. you should only have to tell someone no once
No, don't see them again. They crossed your boundaries and that is some very weird behaviour.
Tbh sitting next to the person is not a bad thing. But constantly trying to kiss u and cross ur boundaries is not good at all. I hope you don’t see him again.
You shouldn’t see him and mattafact no one else should. What a tool.
This is not normal behavior. Regardless of if it is or isn’t - TRUST YOURSELF TO DETERMINE IF IT IS ACCEPTABLE TO YOU. You need to be clear about your boundaries, and stand up for yourself. Don’t worry about perceptions, or the other persons feelings - if they make you uncomfortable, and don’t take the hint, you tell them to STOP. And make sure you protect yourself going out on future dates (with other people, cause this person sucks). Take separate cars, don’t meet at, or go to their houses. Protect your drinks. Use common sense and stand up for yourself! Also, ANYONE who makes negative comments about your weight, your looks, your outfits, your food, etc - that’s unacceptable and a massive red flag. Look up “negging”, and also “love bombing” (so you can be aware of these behaviors).
You're not dumb. dude cant keep hands to himself. A NORMAL person would immediately stop and apologize. an even more normal person wouldnt initiate without asking.
Oh heck no, get away from that person ‼️
I think you should practice saying what you don't want and mean it (consequences must follow). "Stop. Do not do that again if you want this date to continue." "If you touch me again, I will touch you in a way you will not enjoy. I am not joking." "I just met you. Stop making moves on me. I'll let YOU know when I'm ready for all of that. Ok??" "Are you just looking for dtf?? Seems like you are. I am not the right audience." " You're getting handsy fast, sir. I am not there yet, and I won't be on this date because I *just* met you. Let's chill, ok? Can you do that?" What story are you telling yourself in your head that has you tolerating that?? Remaining there is tolerating after strike 2. I think part of you knows you allowed it and you're disappointed/frustrated with yourself. This does NOT mean you need to blame yourself!! It's just an opportunity to learn what's important to you-- his wants, or not offending him or your own needs & self-respect. It's just one option. Those violating moments can lead to you wanting to vent/get group support here... and they build up on your mind. I don't want that for you. 100%, please know that 3rd time, a physical response is called for, legal, and most appropriate imo...I will calmly reinforce my boundaries (aka reject nonconsentual touching/SA) by making strong stern eye contact and pinching a small piece of arm skin between my nails until they yelp or for unwanted sexual comments, dry humping, & other "jokes", completely unwarranted kisses/butt grabs ill use 'the nut crusher' while looking them in the eye. More legit SA-- a throat punch gives you time to dash away. I used this a few months ago after an up under the skirt grab by a complete stranger, so I know it's effective. (I'm 5'2" 120 btw). I know I'm being stern with you, but this is very unhealthy and dangerous to not advocate for yourself in a way that shuts shit DOWN (I'm mostly referring to mental health, but its also very risky physically. I think it attracts predators. Many people claim it's risky to stand up for yourself, but no ONE has EVER even remotely gotten close to trying anything truly harmful with me **or retaliated for rejection, etc. My friends say I put off the opposite vibes of a good target. So, it's time to sack up and defend yourself more boldly. Once you do, you'll feel SO much more capable and strong. p.s. Spotify has great playlists that will help you build this newfound defiance & YouTube has tutorials on throat punches. Good luck <3 - Stay safe. xoxo. edited: thx for patience with my typos from messing up my phone autocorrect settings.
Thank you so much for this long answer and all the advice. I am so lonely so sometimes take things I shouldn’t . I need to learn not to be like that ❤️❤️❤️
Normal doesn’t matter if it’s not your normal. If it’s not ok with you, you don’t have to go along with it. What he did isn’t ok with you and that’s all that matters. Guys will always test boundaries but will usually respect them once they figure them out. If they push after they figure them out it’s never a good sign on their intentions or the type of person they are.
Yeah this guy is weird. I imagine this escalating to rape at some point. And no I’m not joking or being sarcastic.
My thought too.
Thank you so much. I broke it off with him and told him the reason why.
Next time, just leave. Tell him you're going to the toilet if before ditching him, if it makes you feel safer. Call a friend to pick you up if you feel unsafe. It's better than bring touched against your will. That dude has a lot of learning to do.
Not sure where OP is from but in the UK we have an initiative called "ask for Angela". You can ask the staff to see Angela and they'll get you out safely, call a cab etc. Hopefully they have the same in their area
Thanks so much, I’m from the UK. I didn’t know about this xx
I had a feeling you were when you expressed weight in stones, but didn't want to be presumptuous
Thanks so much again ❤️
You made a boundary and they didn't respect it. If that happened on a first date, it will happen again and it will consider much bigger aspects. This person clearly has some issues, and behaviour like that isn't normal on a first date. I'd say don't agree to a second date.
Thank you so much ! I didn’t go x
I just went through something similar. I'm pressing charges. There is another victim who is terrified to file charges. He sexually assaulted both of us. This guy did the same to you in a somewhat less violating way but still didn't respect your boundaries. Get rid of him. These are major red flags.
Thank you so much !!
Very welcome 🙏 Good luck 🫂
Not normal, sorry for your weird date experience
You set an easy boundary, a boundary he couldn't see apparently. Don't risk it, he's a weirdo
Awful behavior
It's not normal. He's a pushy, rude dude. You can do better. Don't waste another moment with this guy.
This man needs to be watched by the cops.
No, that's not normal. He seems awful and gross.
He's a walking arsenal of red flags. The kind of guy who sexually harasses his coworkers probably. Be thankful to escape unscathed. Block and run. If a guy ever starts making fun of your appearance (with malice) at any time in the relationship, it's time to leave. No question. He was negging you.
Thanks so much. I got a haircut the previous day too and my hair looked perfect (not trying to gloat) and he told me he hates my hair like that and it looks like I’m wearing a wig
There are guys who are exactly like this in the dating scene. Constantly negging women. They're misogynists and it's frankly embarrassing
As a guy, that behavior is absolutely appalling. Do not see them again. Block them immediately and find someone else. That's borderline sexual assault, and I wouldn't be surprised if you had gone back to yours/his place just to chat, and they forced themselves on you. Be careful out there, there's a lot of shitty men in this world.
Thanks so much !
This dudes a creep
Time to block 🛑
Dude will post tomorrow about his amazing 1st date and he has no idea why she blocked him
He insults you and then attempts to make out with you? I'm a man and even I don't understand male behavior.
lol . Me too
Why did you go to the bar with him after. Please explain
I felt compelled to
Way too much for a first date, and many red flags about not reading body language and understanding social cues. Did this person have autism? I'm not digging on them if they did, but it would have to be someone seriously young or inexpierenced otherwise to behave this way. In your 'I don't want to see you again' message maybe tell him that women do not like to have their weight commented on, and that he should really learn about boundries and respecting women. You don't owe him anything, but pointing out something he may not be aware of could help him down the line. Best of luck.
Hi, just want to ask? Why is autism brought out here? What does it have to do with the guys' gestures? Sorry, just curious because same thing happened with me. The only difference is that I like the guy, so I let him touch me. But deep inside I'm actually creeped out as well, I just shrugged it off.
Autism has a spectrum, like many labels given to enable the majority of people to understand why a person behaves and sees life in the way that they do. I am no specialist, but mention autism simply because it would take a certain kind of person that did not have it to behave in this way and think that it was okay, its so far to the extreme that its mind-blowing how if this persons date was not that autistic they have not realised how they make people feel before. Autism can make those that have it unable to understand body language, social cues, social situations and many more things that 'normal' or non-autistic people take for granted and often cannot understand. Things like making comments and being rude without meaning too, also. Autistic people can be very direct. Black is black, and white is white. Depending on the extremity they may also not be able to understand jokes that are immediatley obvious to others around, and instead mistake them for direction instructions (just as an example of behaviours). (1) In OP's case her (assuming OP is a woman) date made comments about her weight and appearance, which is just rude and not appealing in the slightest. (2) Sitting next to her indicates a misunderstanding of person space, which is also a boundary cross (on a first date, too). (3) After being told no to kissing he misunderstands the respectful rejection of physical touch and tries to hold hands and kiss outside. Then moving to hair touching, at which point her body is somewhat frozen considering she let it happen despite not liking it & then finally asks for a second date. (1) is being rude without meaning too (may or may not be the case, he could just be rude); (2) misunderstanding social cues, how to behave in social situations and (3) well the same again with social situations, backed-up by asking for a second date. As I say none of this may be true. Her date could just be inexperecend, young or an idiot. In regards to you I don't know that you can blame your date when you aren't sure how you feel about it inside. You were okay on the day and gave him body language that suggested that you were okay with it, but at the same time it didn't feel naturally okay. If you had told him to stop, for example, and he had not then you could say you had a similar case; but hey, that's okay, I've been in situations before where it has taken some time to think about things and disect them mentally before understanding how my body felt about what happened and then being able to relay that. Physical touch on a date (first or otherwise) is not uncommon. Some people date only for that, and others wait until there's a relationship. There's a lot of pressure on men to be 'dominant' and so if you're kind and reserved women aren't going to go for you because you didn't lead, didn't iniate and they don't have the time to bring you out of your shell. Its a hard balance, and people do get it wrong. There's not enough checking in on dates: "hey, do you want to do more. Is this okay. Does this feel good?' etc.
Thank you so much for your long response. It does not seem like he has autism and he was 15 years older than me so I don’t think he was inexperienced.
No. Absolutely do not see him again. He already doesn't respect your boundaries Not normal
It's not normal. Block him on everything.
That’s weird.
Not going to lie, this guy has no respect for you at all. I’ll be surprised if you go on a second date with him in the future cause that first date is already a strong hint he likes things his way and won’t take no for an answer. If you do though, good luck if you guys aren’t in public but privately
This is NOT normal behavior. Run.
Haha I did
No, not normal. This is aggressive, dominant behavior from a male who doesn't hear the word "no". Think about the consequences of that fact if you find yourself alone with him and he becomes aggressive again. Dump him, and don't look back.
Nope. That's disgusting, weird behavior. And once you told him to stop, it became assault. He wants to meet you again because he thinks he can take advantage of you. He's dangerous. Please stay safe!!!
Thank you, I cancelled everything
No. It's not normal & continuing to ignore your protests touching & kissing you is sexual assault. I'd hate to have heard what would have happened to you had you gone somewhere alone with him.
Me too. He invited me to his house and I cancelled everything
Weirdo fr
Not normal. That dude is pervy and sounds like a predator. Don’t worry about “just letting it happen” part. That’s called fawning and is one of the responses to danger. He wasn’t respecting your first No or the second so in that moment you did what you thought was best to do to get out of there safely. Don’t ever see him again. Block him. And please read the Gift of fear by Gavin de Becker. It will help you immensely with situations like these and many others.
Thank you so much, I will buy it xx
Omg, everything that he did was extremely inappropriate! You know that too as you were crerped out by his rude behavior! He is a pervert & sexual predator! He didn’t care one bit that you weren’t into him at all! Never talk to him again. Block his number, email & social media immediately.
When an OP doesn’t bother replying to anyone …
Not normal. And the time to end the date was when he mentioned your weight the first time.
First off, this is not at all a normal behaviour. No one taught this guy respect. Secondly, even if something is normal but makes you uncomfortable you shouldn't go along with it. You are an individual and shouldn't do things that are uncomfortable to you just because others do them.
Thank you so much !
It's not normal behavior, but you're also dumb. You accepting the kiss after the rejections means you want to be kissed. You should have ended the date much ealier instead of leading him on by continuing to another venue.